The Ben Wallace Interview

Lance Caporossi and Andrew Clements sit down with NBA Hall of Famer Ben Wallace. Ben Wallace talks about his partnership with Green Door Distilling Co. in Kalamazoo and his licensing agreement with Rair Cannabis Co. where he discusses his own cannabis line, Undraft. We also get into his legendary career with the Detroit Pistons.

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Episode Transcript

(00:06):
Welcome to the Everything Pistons Podcast,where we only talk about the Detroit Pistons.
I'm Lance cap Rosy. Follow meon Twitter at Lanscaprosy. Before I
turn it over to my co host, you guys need to subscribe to the
Everything Pistons Podcast, drop a comment, leave a review, and more importantly,
tell a Pistons fan. Now here'smy co host. Hey man,

(00:27):
I'm Andrew Clements, creator of theEverything Pistons Instagram page. You can follow
me there on Instagram and Facebook atEverything Pistons Podcast, on Twitter at e
Pistons Pod, and always email theshow directly at E Pistons Pod at gmail
dot com. Lance Today, todayis a special day. It's a very

(00:49):
special day. Sometimes we throw itover to some friends. Sometimes we land
the big one, and I'm notjust turning it over to anyone. Today,
We're welcome Hall of Famer, fourtime All Star, two time rebound
Champ, O one O two blockchamp we all know, two thousand and
four champion, five time All Star, NBA, six time All Defensive Player,

(01:15):
four time Defensive Player of the Yearaward winner Ben Wallace. Hell,
Hey, what's up? Thanks forhaving me? Absolutely man, Thanks for
coming on and you got some yougot some big news to drop by here.
Oh yeah, oh yeah, doingthe news, doing a couple of
things different than just playing basketball nowadays. Yeah, gotta diversify the portfolio.

(01:42):
So Ben, let's look introduce thelisteners to what you got going on.
You're working with Green Door Distillery inKalamazoo. We want to know how'd you
get involved with those guys? Well, the relationship was made from my time
with the Grand Rapid Drive, youknow, from my time with working with
those guys. You know, webuilt a relationship and they called me and

(02:07):
said they had something and working andyou know I went up to check it
out and thought it was something thatI would you know, enjoy being a
part of. And um, wetook it from there. So so what
stood out to you about your visitto the Green Door Distillery that you said
that this is what Big Ban isgonna put his name on. Um,

(02:30):
the fact that it was it wassomething different, you know, it different
than than the norm of a youknow, professional athlete, you know,
and then it's retirement days. Youknow, have an opportunity to walk in
a distillery and actually you know,watch and learn, you know how to
brew your own liquor. You know, it's you know it it really caught

(02:53):
my interests and I said that wasyou know, that's something that that I
would love to do the fact thatyou know, you could be as involved
in in the process if you want. So, how involved will you be
when working with Green Door Distillery?I'm be very involved, very involved,
you know. I think I thinkthat's what it's all about. You know,

(03:13):
I think the days and the timesit's just learning your face to a
brand or a product, and youknow, saying you're a part of it.
I think those are done. Ithink it's it's really now, you
know, guys are actually getting involvedinto what they're learning their time and their
face too. So for me,it's it's amazing to have a chance to
go in and you know, sortof come up with your own brew,

(03:36):
you know, taste it, youknow, um, do it again,
taste it again, over and overuntil you figure out what's what worked best
for you. So are we gonnaget like some Is it gonna be with
your name, image and likeness onthe bottles? Are we gonna get like
Fear the Fro alcohol drink or twothousand and four Vintage bottle. Um,

(03:57):
well, we're going away from thefear the frow. We all want you
to the frow. We want youto come celebrate the throw now, okay,
yeah, so so yeah, we'regonna have you know, my name
is gonna be on it. Whenwhen, um, whenever we get the
right brew you know names going onit. You know, I'm gonna stand
behind it, gonna market it,you know, and hopefully we get some

(04:17):
you know, some people to youknow carry or you know like it or
you know, till with us beinga Detroit transplant living in North Carolina.
Probably the most important question I'll askyou on this podcast. How do I
get my hands on a bottom?Well, you know, since you um,

(04:38):
you have you're having with marketing rightnow, you have getting the word
around. So so when we havewhen we come up with the right strand
and in the right marketing technique,you know, you definitely, you know,
you're definitely gonna get your body yourown personal bottom, Big Ben,
I feel blessed. So, BenWallace, I got an important question.
I'm pretty sure the listeners want toknow what's in your glass at the end

(05:00):
of the night after a long,hard day of work. What are you
drinking the end of the day.Hopefully it's gonna be some now some Ben
Waller's lit curve. So hopefully that'sgonna change within the next you know,
month or so. Awesome, man, We're glad to hear it. So
are you gonna be making like appearancesin Kalamazoo to help push the Green Door

(05:24):
Distillery? Yes, I was justsaying to kalama Zoo this past weekend.
You know, we was out therein the distiller red you know, we
was, we was back in thedistiller rented back and we was you know,
coming up with some samples and youknow, doing a couple of things
back there. So so I alreadymade one appearance, So I'm definitely gonna
be, you know, hands oninvolved in trying to get this out to

(05:45):
the public. So I heard whenyou were in Kalamazoo you played a game
of cornhole. How'd that go foryou? Um? Corn hole? Core
hole? You know had It's notphysical enough, not no contacts. So
I'm not that great at it,man. You know how I play,
I shoot like I shoot overhand,like I'm shooting like a jumper or a

(06:08):
free throw or something like that.I don't do the underhand thing I shoot
like I'm taking a jump shot.That might be the ticket for you to
bring basketball to the game of cornhole. I might. I might have to
try to admit that big ben manbefore we really get into like the meet
and potatoes of the interview. Igot a story that I gotta share with
you. I've shared it a coupletimes on the podcast, and it involves

(06:30):
you, and it involves two thousandand four Eastern Conference Finals in Indiana.
At that time, my dad workedfor the team. He was an audio
engineer, and every now and thenwe would travel with the team if the
team you guys were playing didn't havethe guy they needed. In Indiana,

(06:51):
we actually ended up staying in thesame hotel as you and meeting you.
I can only describe it as mewatching you watch an NBA playoff game in
the lobby, and and once younoticed me, I introduced myself and I
had a big three shaved in theback of my head. And anytime you

(07:12):
saw me during that series out andabout, you would always pull me,
pull me over and show the otherguys. So as a little kid,
never really getting to fully thank youfor that experience, and now sitting here
as a grown adult being able totalk to you man that I talk about
that to this day to anybody thatwill listen. Best experience I've ever had.

(07:35):
Yeah, I mean, that's whatit's all about. Man. You
know, that's the type of experiencewe want our fans walk away, Heather,
you know, is it's a lotof time they look at us on
the floor like we just out theretoo, you know, beat each other
down and you know, do whatevertake for a win. But you know,

(07:55):
at the end of the day,we're human, and you know,
that's the type of experience that Iwon't fan to have when they have a
chance to meet. You know,some of these guys, you know,
it's not all were about. Youknow, you a bomb. I'm better
than you. I can do thisbetter than you. And sometimes when you
let things happen organically, it alwaysturned out for the best, you know.

(08:16):
And when you don't force things ortry to force a conversation by calling
the guy out and saying what hecan and can't do, and let it
happen, you know naturally, youknow, that usually make for a lifetime
experience and a memory at last,a lifetime. Yeah, yeah, man,
man beautifully said Big Ben. I, Man, those were great words

(08:37):
right there. I think you putthat into a great perspective. But we
gotta get out with this interview.Man, We're gonna talk a little bit
about your career. Everybody knows yourstory. We all know that you went
undrafted, you made it to theHall of Fame. But can you take
us back to draft night? Anddid any teams promise to draft you going
into that? I mean in draftnight. You know I'm I'm a true,

(09:01):
true student of the game and Uand on draft night, I knew
I knew everybody that was going intothat draft. I knew everybody's stats.
I knew everybody, you know,where they where they came from, their
story and how they got there.And and to be quite honest, I
wasn't I wasn't really that gun holeabout me being drafted. You know,

(09:24):
that was a ninety six. Wasa man. That was a thick draft
class from top to bottom. Andyou know, I sort of looked at
that draft class and figured, ifif I was gonna make my mark,
if I was gonna able to crack, you know, make my way into
the NBA and crack these lineups,I was gonna have to make a team

(09:46):
I didn't. I didn't really thinkI was gonna get drafted, but you
know, it was. It wasa couple of teams that that said if
I was around late second round,that they might take a chance on me.
But you know, I never reallyhung my head on that, because
man, that was that's a toughdraft class. If they were to do
a redraft of the nineteen ninety sixdraft class today, where do you think

(10:07):
you would go? No, Lordin five I was gonna say, hey,
yes sir, yes, sir.But as we know, after the
draft you go over to Italy,how different was adjusting to that game?
Because we see how how basketball inthe NBA has moved towards a more offensive,

(10:30):
drimmed and you know kind of refereecalling the game versus back in the
day when you played it was itwas rough and rugged. How different was
the the Italian game versus here?Um? The game was? The game
was different? You know, forme, it was. It was a
lot different. For me. Mylearning curve was was was leaps and bounds.

(10:54):
You know, for the simple factthat you know, all my life
I played around at basket and beingable to time the ball and stay patient
until the ball roll off the rimand to go to Italy and play European
style of basketball. Well, whenthe ball take one bouncing, it's a
live ball. You don't have towait to come off the rim. There's

(11:16):
no such thing as gold to it. And once it takes on, it's
Once it take on one bounce,you can literally guide the ball in the
basket. So for me it wasit was a crazy learning curve. Did
you I mean, with those rules, did you average eighty seven rebounds and
fifty six points per dame? Actuallythe rebounds actually the rebounds goes down.

(11:39):
Oh, you have to be youknow what naturally has come to me is
box out to the ball come offthe basket, right, So it would
be time when I was boxing outand wait for the ball come off the
basket. You know it could bemy own teammate that that would tap it
and try to tap it back in. It was like, you can get
it, you can get it.And I think for me trying to figure

(12:00):
out that part of the game,it wasn't going so well. It wasn't
going so well. I just itwasn't going well and h and my rebounding
stat went down instead of up.So what kind of player were you Overseas?
Were you more of a scorer?Were you still like the defensive anchor
that we saw in Detroit? Well, don't let them food. You're always
gonna score. I've gonna score.You know. I played um I played

(12:28):
at a at a community college whereIver was twenty six points and came to
Union. I I was, youknow, fourteen fifteen point. It went
Overseas, I was, you know, sixteen eighteen points. You know,
but in the NBA it was amatter of what the team needed, right.
So my first first year in Washington, you know West Unseale, you

(12:48):
know, the late grade West Unsealepulled me to the side and say,
you know, we gotta turn theguys that can score a basketball. We
need somebody who's who's not afraid togo out there and do the dirty work
and not afraid to knock somebody onthe ass. That was my caller.
So you said, you said somethinginteresting, and it struck a memory with

(13:09):
me. As I've already said,my dad worked for the team, So
I had a little inside info growingup. And now I just have to
ask you if it's true you saidyou were a score I heard through the
grape Vine that in practice you andRashid used to shoot like three pointers and
have three point and a half courtcompetitions and there may or may not have

(13:30):
been some money out there. Who'sto say, but is that true?
You guys used to just be cashingthrees out there? Oh yeah, we
shoot the ball from from half court? That yeah, you know, I
mean, Steph just broken into gamegames. Yeah, you know we was
doing it. But but being coachedby Larry Brown, Larry Brown wouldn't gone

(13:52):
for those type of shots in thegame, no, So you know,
just just what was playing and messingaround like, yeah, I could shoot
the ball from half quote with noproduct. So I know, after you
go on drafted and before you headoverseas, I believe Boston brought you in
for a tryout, but they wantedyou to play on the perimeter. Do
you think you could have like wouldwould you think you could have done that

(14:15):
in the NBA played on the perimeterearly on in your career or were you
always a big man? Um?I mean, even with going to Boston
and being asked to play on theperimeter. Jackie Kazam on the perimeter,
I don't mean I'm not gonna dowhat rebounders and shot blockers and defendives.
Do you know that those things justcame natural with me. Rebound the basketball,

(14:37):
you know, blocking the blocking shots, protecting the rim. It just
came natural. So even as Iworked out with the Boston Celtics, and
you know, I played and playedin that summer League, even though they
was asking me they played the twothree on the perimeter, I still led
the league, led the team andrebounds and blocks. So just come natural.
So what was your welcome to theNBA moment or your holy crap,

(15:03):
I can't believe I'm on the floorwith this guy moment. I think my
welcome to the NBA moment was wasmy first year in the Orlando first day
of training count. You know,Doc Rivers coming in a rookie coach.
He comes in and and takes allthe balls off the ball rack and say,

(15:26):
nobody have a position. Everybody gotto earn it. And that's when
I was like, Wow, it'sreal, it's real, Like give like
this is my chance, it's myopportunity. You know, it ain't known
or were paying this guy X amountof dollars, so we have to pay
him, and it's like, no, nobody have a spot. Everybody got

(15:46):
to earn their keep. And Iwas like, I was blown away by
that, because you know, aprofessional league like NBA, you know,
somebody got to have a spot.You know, you're drafting guys, you
know, making promises. But thatshowed me right there if I was willing
to put it into work, thatthe sky was a living. So every

(16:07):
Pistons fan's favorite highlight of yours isthe block that you had on Shack when
he was in Miami. I believeit was five oh six somewhere around there.
But what is your favorite block thatyou had in the NBA? Um,
my favorite block wasn't my block?Okay, who wasn't? My favorite
block was Tayshawn and Prince block,the chase down. That was my favorite

(16:34):
block. Do you think about thatevery time you see Reggie Miller, because
every time he is on the TVmaking a call in the NBA, I
think about that. Yeah, Imean it's you know, it's just one
of those things that plays in yourmind. You know, when people started
talking about the Pacer and the Pistons, you know, rivalry, you know,
that's the one play that sticks outin my mind without that play.

(16:59):
Who knows how that season would haveended up. Don't you still find it
kind of like unbelievable how he wasable to catch up to Reggie Miller and
make that play because he was sofar back behind the half court line when
you know that play was in motion. Um, yeah, I mean it
was a long shot play, butI think it, Uh, it spoke

(17:22):
volume to what type of team wewas. You know, we always talked
about being defensive minded and getting outthere for forty eight minutes. Well that
was that last That was that lastsecond with the game on the line.
You know, are you true aboutgetting out there for forty eight minutes or
you just talking talk? You know? I think Tayshawn proved that we were

(17:45):
really dedicated for forty eight minutes,going out trying to get a win.
Yeah, Larry Brown's famous words,do it the right way exactly. So
who's your favorite player to you know, go to to go up against in
the NBA? Um, I don'tknow. I don't think I had no
one favorite player, you know.Um, you know I enjoyed playing against

(18:07):
Philly with Ai you know, outfront heading the ball, you know,
trying to figure out you know thatthat match up how I was gonna get
a win, you know, withwith aim you know Kobe, you know,
Kobe always did his day, youknow, just just trying to figure
out how you can get a winwith that Kobe and shot team. You

(18:27):
know, I think it was moreteams and more moments than just you know
players. I want to take itto two thousand and four now, and
at what point in the season didyou guys say, like we can actually
do something here, Like what pointdid you know the finals and a championship

(18:48):
was a real possibility. Um,we figured that out in two thousand and
three. Okay, I know that, Um, from the way that the
season winning two thousand and three,we had said coming back, you know
the next year, you know thatwe have a serious chance of winning it
all. And m and as theseason started with Larry Brown's coming in and

(19:12):
the way he was able to comein and coach the team, you know,
it's gave us a little a littlemore hope. And then we made
the treat that the trade for Rashid. Rashid came in and by him being
vocal and coming in the way hecame in, man, it just it
just helped put us over the top, So the entire did you guys think

(19:33):
that you were just missing a playerlike Rashid Wallace on your way to the
championship, Like maybe you guys sawit. Man, if we just had
one more guy that can go outand get us a bucket or a guy
that can get a stop, weneed him. Was there anybody else maybe
on your list that you thought thatcould help catapult you into the championship cat
championship territory? I think I thinkwith the development and in the outcome out,

(20:00):
the outcome and played of Tayshawn Princeis what really, you know,
put us on that path, youknow, to becoming a great team and
a championship caliber team. You know, I think I think we was on
pace before we got Rushi, Butwhen we got Rushi, it just put

(20:21):
everybody on notice that this is whatwe're trying to do. This is our
intention, we feel, you know, either win a bus right now.
But before she Rushi got to Detroit, we was on pace, you know,
with with a young memital core.You know, we played who can
play similar style of basketballs Rushi played. We was on pace to compete for

(20:45):
a championship. But when we gotRushi, I think it pushed us over
the top because now we was ableto go out and let team know and
put him on notice that this isour intention. So you know, if
anybody want to stop us, youben come down. Did did Rashid really
earn all those technicals out there ordid he just kind of have a reputation
and he started getting them for tickattack things? I mean, well,

(21:08):
if you got a reputation is youyou're right? You're right? So I
mean, see, is a guythat's passionate about basketball man, Yes,
sir, And if things not goinghis way or if he thinks, you
know, the calls are favoring opposingteam, opposing player, he's gonna speak
on it. So no, that'swhat we love about she. Yep,

(21:32):
was Rashid Wallace the best trash talkaround the four team? Or was there
somebody else? Now? She notrash talk? Really? Yeah? Wow?
Probably the biggest trash talker was Rep. I could see that. Is
there anything that comes to your mindwhere like maybe he said something that just

(21:52):
sticks with you all these years later? Um. Rep says a lot of
things. It probably it probably alot that's stuck with with our opponents versus
sticking with me, but with oneof those guys figured out the numbers.
You know, I got being inRussie standing behind me, so I can
say whatever I want to say anybody. Yeah, guys got my back.

(22:18):
What a good two bodyguards to have. I'm sure you I'm sure you hate
being asked this question, but Ihave to ask this question when it comes
to the H three draft. Ifyou could with the number two pick Carmelo
or Dwayne Wade, if you hadto pick out of those two. Um,

(22:40):
I mean in OH three draft,if if I had to pick,
you know, I would have pickedI would have picked Mello. How do
you how do you think he wouldhave fit in with that O four team
though? But that's the strangest thing. How would he have fit in?
You know? You know that's whyI get a lot of people want to
talk about, you know, themellow and darko. You know what I'm

(23:02):
saying. Yeah, I keep Ikeep saying that. You know, it's
not a mellow or darko. Rightwhen it comes to us winning a championship,
it's a mellow darko as far aswho get drafted first. So right
with with Mellow a part of ourteam, what it has with mellow the

(23:25):
growth of Melo. Would it havestunt the growth of Tayshawn Prince or on
the team or what we what wehave been able to require Rashid, while
if we had Melo on the team, I don't think so. So real
quick, I just have two schoolsof thought, real quick, Like I
always said, if you guys wereplaying in more of like the modern NBA

(23:48):
today, Carmelo Anthony, you couldhave put him right in at the fourth
spot, had you at the five, still had Tayshaun Prince at the three.
But you guys didn't win it inthe modern day. So my second
school of thought is that number twopick. I kind of wish the Pistons
would have drafted Dwayne Wade because Ithink that's a guy that fit what you
guys were trying to do in Detroit. He's a guy that would buy in.
And I'm talking about when he wonthe gold medal in O eight where

(24:11):
he willingly came off the bench onthat team. I think he would have
been a super six man for likemaybe two years for you guys if you
had drafted him at that spot,maybe even potentially keeping that championship point to
open for a few more years.I mean, does any of that make
sense to you? Do you agree, disagree with me? Or yeah?
I mean I agree, I agreewith a lot. You know a lot

(24:32):
of things that you're saying. Iagree with a lot of things that other
people say, you know, butit's also has sight twenty twenty. Yeah,
exactly. And regarding the Mellow thing, what I don't hear a lot
in what I've said before is,and you can attest to, I hope
Mellow wouldn't have had the same careerhe had this day being on the pistons.

(24:56):
He wouldn't have got on the floornot playing defense for Larry Am I
correct? Yeah, you correct onthat right, So so we wouldn't have
had the same Mellow. It wouldhave been a completely different Carmelo Anthony under
under Larry Brown, right, Imean coaches, you know, coaches,
system, coaches style, you know, it can it can make a break

(25:18):
a young especially a young player.Right. We look at um, we
look at Mellow and Dwayne Wade andhelp people teams and forgive by Chris Boss.
I think Box would have been abetter fit than any of those guys.
But yeah, you would have beengreat. You would have been great.
Yeah, but you look at thosethree guys, well you look at

(25:38):
the top, what five pick withBroun, Darko Mellow, d Wade,
Chris Boss. Four of those guyswent on to inherit their own team what
they was given the keys and saygo out there and get me wins John
Fellow. All right, Darco cameinto a sixty where the pieces was already

(26:03):
in place. We was gonna wina championship whether we had Darker or not.
Just so yep. But because wehad dark Woo, we was able
to make sorry moves that that theteams in the league, around the league
allowed us to make because they didn'tthink that we had what we needed to

(26:25):
win a championship. Now with ChrisBias, the Wayne Wade, a Mellow,
I would have thinked to make thattrade for Rashid. Teams would have
wanted a little bit more in return, and still of just letting us walk
away with sheet the way we did, that makes sense. That's an interesting
point of view on that that Ireally liked that point of view because I

(26:48):
think you're right too, Like,if you get an outstanding rookie like one
of those three that we've been talkingabout, you're right, teams are just
saying, no, these guys area little bit more. You know,
they're real contender right now. Wecan't just let the have Rasheeed Wallace for
Bob. Sure, you know weneed more. So yeah, I think
you're right. That's a great point. But people look at people look at
these guys career after their career isover and their Hall of Fame type players.

(27:15):
Of course you could say, oh, put mellow on that team,
Oh put the weight on that team. Of course you can say that.
But during that time, it wasthose guys first year in the league,
we didn't see Hall of fame.That's something they had to work at.
They inherit their own team and theywas able to become Hall of Fame type
players. And for that, I'mpretty sure they wouldn't trade. You wouldn't

(27:37):
trade a Hall of Fame career foran opportunity to win a championship, just
like we wouldn't give back our championshipand say give us, give us one
of those guys and maybe we canwin two. One in your hand is
better than two in the bush.Always. I like that. I like
that a lot too. So doyou think the Pistons could have had another

(27:59):
finals with Larry Brown as the headcoach. Uh yeah, I think so,
you know, But it was justone of those things, man like
we was. We wasn't a youngteam anymore. We was we was older
and you know we was we wasCAZy veterans, and we was winning more

(28:19):
of experience than just natural talent.So if Larry Brown was here, maybe
maybe we could have made another playoffchampionship appearance. I was just gonna say,
and maybe that was part of youranswer, But I have to heal
now some some childhood trauma now thatthe butterflies are out of my stomach from

(28:41):
talking to you and all that.You don't have to answer if you don't
want to. But is there somebehind the scenes reason why you ended up
leaving Detroit for those few years?Um? No, no, behind the
scene, um reason. You know, everything idea was was pretty much out

(29:03):
front, you know, it waswas was vocal. You know, I
was in constant you know, communicationwith with my teammates, constant communication with
with with Joe. You know,I just think it was it was just
one of those things that had tohappen. Like it's not. It wasn't
I'm leaving because I ain't like theteam, or I ain't like the city,
or I ain't like the way weplayed or whatever. It was just

(29:23):
one of those things where I feellike I had put the work in and
uh, and it was it wasmy opportunity and it was my time to
to go out and test the market. And and not to mention that it
was a it was a ton ofother young you know, UM athletic bigs

(29:44):
that was coming up behind me thatalso benefit benefited from the move that I
made. Yeah. So what wasthe difference between Larry Brown's coaching style and
Flip saunders coaching style? Um,Larry Brown was more defensive minded, Flip
was more offensive minded. Okay,So I mean I was reading I forget

(30:10):
what, I forget what interview youdid. I think it was a number
of years ago, but you werekind of talking about Flip saunders coaching style
where he would take you and ripout a little earlier in the first quarter
versus Larry Brown, and then hewould kind of ride Chauncey Rashid and Tayshaun
Prince. Did that have any effectiveyou wanting to leave Detroit for another team?

(30:32):
No? No, no, Imean nothing we did on the floor
basketball wise affected you know, mightdecision the league. You know that was
that was typically just a business decision. That was that was that worked out
for me and worked out for alot of guys around the league. You

(30:52):
know, it was it was Itwas strictly business. You know, none
of it was personally. You know, I talked to Joe the day before
I left to go to Chicago.You know, I came back off my
visit talked to Joe again. Likeit wasn't one of those things where you
know, I'm pissed off, soI'm leaving or team you know once you

(31:14):
know, so get out of here. You know, it was it was
just one of those things that youknow, I talked to Chance, that
I talked to Rib, I talkedto she Tayshaw. You know, I
talked to all my guys before Imade a movie. But what about that
Chicago Bulls team made you want tosign with them? Like? What did
you like about that team and whatthey were doing in Chicago? Um,
there was a young, scrappy team. You know, it was being coached

(31:36):
by Scott Scots. You know,hard those coaches and the guys came out
and they play it hard. Youknow, night in and night out,
and you know, there was ayoung scrappy team that um that I thought
that I could help you know,develop and um and and and bring them
on, bring them on in theircareer a little bit farther, a little
bit faster. UM. I gota question for you on and know how

(31:59):
you answer this. So Rashid Wallace, I believe he went on the jump.
I think it might have been likea year or two ago and he
said that the O four Pistons couldbeat the twenty seventeen Golden State Warriors.
What are your thoughts on that?Do you agree with Rashid Wallace or do
you think he's you know, he'sjust Rashid and just you know, talking
a little too much. I thinkwe would have beat eighteen, Yes,

(32:20):
sir, any team man, Imean if you go back and look at
that team, like team wasn't scoredseventy points on us man, No,
so you could plug that team intoany era against any championship team. If
you can't score seventy points, you'renot gonna win the game. So it's

(32:43):
just that defense wins championships. Man. We've we've mentioned a few times Chauncey
shed ripped Tay And obviously we're talkingto you Big Ben, the best five
alive. We know you guys talkall the time, but how many times
a year would you say that youguys actually get to get together. Um,
I say when all of us gettogether, maybe twice a year.

(33:07):
But that's awesome by all of usstill being pretty much involved in basketball and
one way form of another. Youknow, it's it's pretty frequent that you
know, one or two of twoof us, you know, get to
hang out with each other. Yeah, you know what I'm saying. So,
you know, it's just good tosee Chauncey and and basketball tation in

(33:28):
basketball, you know, RiPP doingthis commentating thing, you know, myself
working with the Pistons, you know, she was with Memphis, you know,
and doing this college thing. Man. And I think that's one of
the that's one of the things thatI'm most proud of, you know,
post career. It's the fact thatthe guys and still involved in the game
and still making, you know,making an impact on the game and change

(33:49):
the lives. I just want togo back real quick to the twenty seventeen
Golden State Warriors. Who would youwhat player would you want to guard on
that team, Like, what playerwould you think would be more of a
challenge Kevin Durant or Steph Curry?Who would you have more fun defending?
Um, I would have guarded allof them. We're switching all of it.

(34:12):
Yeah, were switching all of it. You know. I think Cavin
Durant and Steph Curry. I thinkthose two of the guys that has put
their name in a category that nobodywould never enjoy Garden. I wouldn't say
it would be enjoyable, but Iwould have had to swiss out on both
of those guys. Well, whendo you have like the challenge though,

(34:32):
of you know, defending both ofthose guys. I mean, because in
my opinion, you're one of thegreatest defensive players to ever play the game.
So I gotta think, like inyour mind where you see these two
great scores, You're like, Iwant the challenge of shutting these guys down.
Oh yeah, I definite would havetook the challenge, you know,
definitely. You know, like Isaid, that was one of my things,
you know, watching Ai and Kobe. You know I knew it at

(34:57):
some point in that game, youknow, some point doing the course of
that game. I'm gonna I'm gonnaget caught on that album with them guys,
and and I'm gonna have to figureout, you know, how to
stop them or they're gonna have tofigure out how to get a bucket on
me. So you know, it'salways one of those things. Man.
You love to see guys out there, you know, capable of going for
the big numbers. But as adefender, you love to match up against

(35:19):
those guys and see how well youmatch up against their style play. So
do you keep up with the currentNBA? Are you watching games pretty regularly?
Yeah? I watched a lot ofgames. So can you give me
five defensive players you like watching inthe NBA today? Oh? Wow?
Five? M see the thing.On the Everything Pistons podcast, we always

(35:42):
say when we do we ask questionslike this, we want to keep it
the best five alive. So wealways want five answers for questions like that,
you know, and in fives forthe best five alive. Oh okay,
all right, let me see godfive. Um, I'll go with
one, but um beverly love him. Um. Current Defensive Player of the

(36:04):
Year Marco smart Yea the sep WIclaim Best defender that ever lived, Draymond
Green little Uh, he's kind ofundersized on this list. Ain't he's seth
will play, he plays. SoI'm making rared um um really Goldbert.

(36:30):
It's a good name. Yeah.And fifth months, someone's gonna get left
off here, man, somebody's gonnaget left off. But I mean you
got Kawhi Quiet, Ain't you know? Quiet? On the jury list?
You got mcaal Bridges and Phoenix.He's pretty solid from what I've seen,

(36:52):
right, I mean, I like, I like the job that Chris Paul
is doing it in Phoenix the floor, So I have to go with those
five. That's a good listen,right, I like that. So I
got a question for you though,Man, you're working with the Detroit Pistons
organization right now. What are yourthoughts on this young core of Pistons and
how far do you think they cango if they keep that core intact?

(37:14):
Um. I like, I likethe core group of guys. You know,
I think the skuys a limit forthe guys, you know, if
they could continue to to learn thatthe modern day style of basketball, continue
to get bell, continue to putthat work in. You know, I
think the guys a limit for thoseguys, man, you know, they
ask the right questions, they putin the work. You know, they

(37:35):
come early, they stay late,you know, and they they hungry and
excited about playing NBA basketball. SoI like I like the group of guys.
I like them too, man,They're they're fun. I've I've I've
been to a few games this yearand they they I feel like they got
something. There's a couple of piecesaway from really competing and making it to
the playoffs. But I do gota question for you. I say this

(37:55):
to a lot of people. Youwent undrafted, but how does it feel
to have guys that are coming intothe NBA being compared to you? I
remember Jalen Rose during the NBA draftwas talking about Kenneth Freed, and I
just thought that was kind of thecoolest thing because here you are, you're
undrafted, you did not get drafted, but then you have guys getting drafted

(38:15):
in the top fifteen, top twenty, even in the top ten, being
compared to you. How does thatmake you feel? It made me feel
great, you know. It makesme feel I feel like I'm a part
of something. You know. Itmakes me feel as though what I set

(38:37):
out to do it work. Peopleare taking notice. You know, it
makes me feel like that that thatthe basketball world realized that they made a
mistake on my draft and they trynot to make that same mistake. So
it definitely makes me feel good andmake me feel like I'm a part of
the league. That's awesome. Man. I got one more question about you

(39:01):
know, just you playing basketball.You answered it before we started recording,
though, but let's go back.Like I remember during the broadcast, you
were shooting free throws and they weretalking about an old football injury you had
on your wrist and that when youwould shoot the ball, your wrist would
pop out of place. Can youcan confirm or deny that rumor? Um,

(39:21):
not a rumors, It's true.You know, I say, my
third of third third, like fourthyear in the league. Um, the
doctors, the doctors found, youknow that most of my ligaments in my
wrist was was was torn, waswas was disconnected, and they wanted to

(39:42):
do you know, reconstruction, reconstructivesurgery on my wrist to reconnect those ligaments.
And but my thing was, Ifound my knis in the league and
it's not scored, it's rebounded anddefending So I'm gona keep this risk as
it is, and I'm gonna goout here and block some shots with it

(40:04):
instead of scoring some bucks. That'sfunny, you said you you found your
niche, and I'm about to leadus right into you riding your niche all
the way into the Hall of Fame. Man. I know people have probably
asked you over and over and oversince being inducted, but just what does
that mean to you? Because Iknow what it means to me as just

(40:25):
a fan of yours and a fanof the Detroit Pistons basketball. But what
does it mean to the player?I mean, it means a lot.
And for me, you know,it's hard to explain. You know,
people never really gonna understand, youknow, exactly what it means to me,

(40:45):
because my path and my journey wasso different, man, that I
could have gave up and people wouldn'tdo anything about me long before I made
it to the NBA loan, beforeI became a Hall of Fame. But
to become a Hall of Famer,you know, it just says that the
work that I put in was worthit, you know too, to come

(41:08):
from or basically a community college.Yeah, NBA champion you know, Nate
Smith Basketball Hall of Famer. Youknow, it speaks volume because so often,
you know, we look for thatbig Division one school that's going to

(41:29):
be on TV, you know,twice, and and sometimes we sell ourselves
short thing that we can't make itif we don't fall up on one of
those situations. You know, Ijust think, you know my journey,
my process, say that if ifyou have a dream man, and if
if you're willing to go out andput that work in anything that's possible.

(41:50):
You know I was, I wasat first, but hopefully of not the
lands. You know, hopefully everybodythat's coming up behind me see that it
don't matter where you go. Youcan be at a Division one school,
get played on TV and callege,get seen, be the first, the
number one draft pick overall or whatever. You still got to put to work,
you know. Yeah, do youhave like undrafted guys, have you

(42:16):
mentored them coming up or eat?I mean even drafted guys. Do guys
come to you and look for advice? Yeah? A lot of guys come
to me and look for advice.You know, if they if they feel
like they're not gonna get drafted.You know, they like you know,
what should I do? You know, that was one of the conversations you

(42:37):
know, I had with a youngDraymond Greene who didn't think he was going
to get drafted, And yeah,you know, I was just explaining to
him, like, sometimes when youdon't get drafted, it works out of
your favor because nobody owned your rights. Sometimes you get drafted, team own

(42:59):
your rights, and if you don'tmake that team, you don't get a
chance to work out for another team. I say, for me, being
undrafted meant that I could work literallywork out for every team in the league,
anybody that called me. I canwork out for this because nobody to
own my rights. So I havethat conversation with people with guys who think
they're not going to get drafted,and I just I just keep telling them,

(43:20):
man, like, you know,you're not getting drafted. Your name
not being called it, don't sayyou're not You're not an NBA caliber player,
you know, And it is notstarting over, you know. It
is just recalibrating your game and justknowing that you don't have to work a
little bit harder than everybody else.Yeah, so much of being a good
player in the NBA is by chanceon draft night and being put in the

(43:45):
right situation. Right, Like,there's a lot of NBA talent out there
that just didn't fall into the rightsituation for them and are currently in the
G League or or playing overseas seaslike you did, And it's just it's
just a lot about the situation you'rebeing brought into. Yeah, I meant

(44:07):
a lot about the situation. Youknow, you can, like you said,
you can get drafted first round,first pick overall, and after situation
and the system don't don't match yourability, and you know you still constructed.
So a lot of the time,it's just about finding the right situation,
and more more than not, it'sabout being ready and prepared for any

(44:30):
situation. So that was one ofthe things I was I hugged my head
on when I didn't get drafted,I hit the gym. I was prepared
for any situation. So when Bostonasked me to play the two, even
though I ain't think I was goingto be a Hall of Fame two guard
or or a small forward, Iknew I could play those positions because I
worked on So when you like andI knew you're talking a little bit about

(44:54):
um, you're talking about Boston andbeing undrafted, and you're giving some great
advice for people that are going tolisten to this about you know, just
kind of pushing forward. I justhave one. It's kind of a random
question. I just thought about it. But when you were undrafted, did
you ever think about like taking yourtalents to the NFL? Because I know
you're good. I know you werea good football player. It was it

(45:16):
was always often I thought about takingmy talents to the NFL. I needed
one position, d end I wasthinking maybe linebacker, tight end, d
n my spots. That's hilarious,man, that's us. You know.
The thing that I always kept meoff the football field is, you know,

(45:37):
I had some success playing in highschool, and I was kind of
sold out to as a high schoolplayer. But my thing was I knew
the game of football, and Iloved the game of football, and I
had way too much, too muchrespect for the game of football. Then
to take you know, three orfour years off and go back on that
football field, I think I wasgoing to be the same player. Hey,

(45:58):
man, Antonio Gates, did itlike yeah, yeah, yeah,
you were being recruited by Auburn,weren't you as a football player. Yeah,
I mean I would being recruited bya couple of you know, a
couple of schools coming out of highschool. Man. But you know,
Alburn was one of those schools whereyou know, we would go to like
summer camps and stuff that Alburn Healsand stuff like that. So so that

(46:22):
was that was one of the schoolsthat that was definitely on my radar and
I was looking forward to, youknow, having a chance to to to
go there. But unfortunately, comeof things, having my senior year,
a couple of injury and you know, doctors told me that football career was
done. Oh okay, I didnot know that. So what was the

(46:45):
decision to go to Virginia Union University? Like, I know, you kind
of have a relationship with Charles Oakley. I heard he beat up on you
a little bit at a basketball campwhen you were a kid. But um,
was he the finding factor for youto go to Virginia Union University?
Yeah, he was definitely one ofthe factors, you know. But but

(47:06):
my thing always been, my thingalways been, was I knocked on all
those doors and I put all thosecalls in myself. You know, I
had guys, you know, likeOpley, you know, help mentor me
and saw the guy me in theright direction. But when it came down
to those to the action, youknow, I was doing all those things
myself. I was making those phonecalled, I was knocking on those doors.

(47:28):
I was taking those businesses and uhand I was trying to make it
happen. And you know, justso have an open POINTIM in a right
direction, and it worked out forme. I was your guys' relationship today.
Um, still the same, youknow, still the same. You
know, that's that's still that's stillmy guy. You know often time,
you know, tell people that ifthat if I was in the in the

(47:51):
garden when they when they when theyushered them out of there, they would
have had the user to do.I hope they got some silver back guerrillas
or some lions back there to getyou two out of that arena. Yeah.
But now, oh, it's agreat guy man, always have been,
always been a man at his work, you know, so I definitely

(48:13):
respect him for that. He wason a podcast recently and he he mentioned
something where he said the bad Boysweren't the bad boys until he left Chicago.
How true do you think that is? Do you think the bad boys
were just waiting for him to getout of Chicago before they could go after
Jordan or do you think they werealways bad? I think there was always
bad. They always bad. That'sthat's great, man. So so we

(48:39):
started the interview with you know,something you had going on. Then we
got to early career and pistons andwe want to We really pride ourselves when
we have guests on it is gettingto know them as as people outside of
just basketball. And you have someother objects going around. You're dabbling in

(49:01):
the marijuana industry. Can you talkabout that a little bit. Yeah,
I'm working with this this group that'scalled Rare and and we we're collaborating on
me coming up my own strand ofmarijuana called Undrafted you know, go figure,

(49:23):
yes, sir, And you knowright now we're just traveling around to
different locations, you know, makea different appearance, you know, to
promote the brand and get it outthere to the public and let people know
what, you know, the typeof things that we're doing. You know,
now hire basketball, with the kindof national view on marijuana starting to

(49:45):
shift and people opening their eyes tothe benefits of this plant, did you
ever use marijuana while you were playingto recover from injuries. I never used
marijuana while I was playing. Okay, you know my my introduction to marijuana
was was a post career you know, once I once I retired, you

(50:08):
know, to to try something differentthan than what I was doing with the
with the pharmacuit suit coast and uh. And I tried it and it really
worked for me. So it wasone of those things where you know,
I decided to stick with it andand it worked for me. And a
lot of other guys try to workfor them, and a couple of grandmothers

(50:31):
and grandfather tried to work for them. So it's like, let's get it
out there. I got one morebefore I turn it over to Lands and
whatever he wants to ask, isBig Ben Wallace a roll up guy?
Are you an edible guy? Agummies and candy guy? I need to
know, Well, looking at theway I played, you know I do

(50:52):
a little bit of all of it. He said, we're switching on the
court and on the marijuana. Soare you are you more of a sativa
or indica guy? What's your scream? Gonna be a more sativa? Same
same? I love sativas. Ireally do. So why do you think

(51:14):
the n the NBA and other professionalsports have been against athletes using cannabis.
I just think the knowledge of it, you know. I think I think
nowadays, day and age, youknow, I think people are really taking
the time to educate themselves on itand um and I think I think it's
easy to look at it and thinkthat it's a black It was a black

(51:36):
thing, you know, because wewas we was we was unproportionately getting locked
up for marionea or whatever. Andand now actually doing the research, you
know, it's a it's a lotof it's a lot of other people that's
that's vouched forward and and and youknow, and speaking out about it.

(51:58):
You know, we had a coupleof coaches, you know that was that
was going through chronic pain who triedman and it really worked and changed their
life. And you know, wegotta, I think right now, we
got to continue to educate ourselves onit and understand that it's it's been labeled
as a drug, But how canyou call it a drug when there's nothing

(52:22):
artificially added to it? Right,just rotor plant and smoke of the way
it is without adding anything to it. So I think I think people are
better educating ourselves on marijuana right now, and I think this is the reason
that it's um it's being legalized nowin our country and opportunity. Are we

(52:42):
gonna get a maybe Matt Barnes andStephen Jackson Ben Wallace collaboration and maybe you
can speak on how important those twox NBA players are to the marijuana community,
being so outspoken about their time inthe NBA and how how the plant
helped them and them using it torecover from injuries. Uh. Yeah,

(53:06):
I wouldn't be opposed to doing ayou know, interview with with Jack and
UM and Matt. You know,I think the more we can educate the
public about it, I think thebetter office is going to be, you
know, because a lot of peoplestill look at it like, you know,
like it's a drug and like you'redoing something completely totally illegal. Right,

(53:28):
So five NBA guys pastor present youwould want to light up with?
I mean I don't know, Imean pants of present man, you know
what, I don't really know whowho really smoking? We are not smoking.

(53:50):
I would have I would have lovedit, had a conversation with a
with a buzz skimp, you knowwhat I mean? You know, a
brain man. He I mean,he the rain man. He can make
it rain. So I would haveloved to have some of those conversations,
you know, of course she youknow, yeah, yeah, first and

(54:14):
foremost. Um. But yeah,I don't really know. You know,
how many of these guys really reallysmoke? You know, I got I
got Sometimes guys get it. Sometimesguys get a little different when they smoke,
you know what I mean? That'strue. What about like any artists
or like any other celebrities like yougot any more guys really trying to get
that five I'm really I mean,of course you want to blow with uncle

(54:38):
snoop, okay, just doing alittle recreation, you know. Um,
I see Mike Tyson is into it. I don't know I would how much
I would want to smoke with Mikeand Mike start having flash back, especially
after that plane incident just the otherday. Yeah, yeah, I don't

(54:58):
understand what that guy was thinking.No, no, dude, dude,
smoke man wanted and he get paidto beat up guys for a living.
Why what what? What? What? What are you doing the air Marshall
went blind on that when that startedit happening. He didn't see nothing,
you know. Yeah, I don'tget why anybody would attack Nize Mike Tyson.
I mean, the dude still practicesand fights like he hits harder than

(55:20):
life like he is. Man,it's I don't know why anybody want to
get into a fight with him forany reason? Big man? When when
can we get the undrafted in stores? Um? The undrafted is actually out
now, you know, a promotiontour we're going around to you know,
our the special reason um letting peopleknow that that the strand is out.

(55:44):
You know it's called undrafted. Youknow you can pick it up at um
at rare. That's r E Rthe special reason. You know, across
across the state of mission, arethere any of this? Are there any
rare dispensaries in Calama Zoo? Iknow a few different dispensaries in Calama Zoo,
But are they is undrafted here inthis area? Or yeah, it's

(56:07):
one in Canada Zoo mosquegan and andwe gotta coverle we gotta cover more.
That's that's open enough that we're goingto be announcement within the near future.
Are you so? Are your farms? We you know kind of going back
to talking about the distillery and nowthe marijuana company. Are your farm's gonna

(56:29):
be like a local to Detroit ora local to a Michigan type thing.
Um, No, we're looking.We're looking to move around, to spread
around a little bit. I thinkthe one thing that we really have on
outside is is that is the nameof the company is rare, and you
know, and with me coming onboard, I'm a rare breed in myself

(56:52):
to go from undrafted to a hallof fame. And the way and the
way that they grow, the waythey grow and the way they worked at
grow houses is very different and veryrare where we don't use all at all.
M So, so the water that'srunning, you know, we got

(57:13):
the water running, you know,constantly twenty four hours and it's and it's
ninety five percent ninety five ninety sixpercent recycling everything that we use. Wow.
So so that growth process is thatwhat sets your undrafted and rare above
all else? Yes, I thinkso awesome. Out of doubt we're gonna

(57:37):
get any more. Ben Wallace strandslater down the line outside of undrafted.
Oh yeah, we're gonna keep thisthing going. We're gonna we're gonna keep
it going. I know we gotum, we got a one that's that's
um the bud don't lie like that'sawesome and that it's funny. Well got

(58:01):
another strand called the block Party.Oh I like that. Yes, say,
we're gonna have a little fun withit, man, and you know,
to put it idea so people canenjoy it and no hell themselves.
Hopefully it becomes legal in North Carolinasoon. I'll take you up on that
bottle of alcohol. But I can'tjust take you up on that yet.

(58:22):
But I can't wait. Man,Okay, cool, big Ben. I
appreciate you coming on the podcast.I seriously feel like I could talk to
you for hours. Man, You'rean easy person to talk to. You
got a lot of great stories aboutyour time in Detroit in the NBA.
I love where your career is heading. Now get into the liquor game,
get into the cannabis game. Man. It's you got a lot of things

(58:44):
ahead for you. Again, andI do appreciate you coming on the podcast,
but unfortunately I have to end it. That is the show, guys.
I'm Lanz Caprosi follow me on Twitterat Lanscaprosy. Andrew where can they
follow you Instagram, Everything Pistons Podcaston Twitter, E Pistons Pod. You
can always check us out on Facebookand always email the show directly at E

(59:05):
Pistons Pod at gmail dot com.Mister big Ben. Anything you want to
plug to end the show, pleasedo it. Um now, I just
want to say, man, Iappreciate ll thanks for giving me the opportunity
to come in and you know,talk about a couple of brands that we're
working on and with the mayor.I want to undrafted, you know,
give you a chef, give yourselfa chance, try it out. You

(59:27):
know we got the distiller reason withthe with the green door. You know,
let's just let's just hope I canpick a man. I want to
strand and and pick out a goodbourbon better than I can shoot free though,
So oh man, you don't keepthat roading. Thanks again, Thank
you man, Thanks from the bottomof my hearty thank you, Thank you

(59:52):
guys for listening. Don't forget tosubscribe, rate us, drop a comment,
more importantly, tell a Pistons san