Fire Escape Cast #100

On the 100th episode of Fire Escape, the gang determines the greatest video game of all time.

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:09):
Hello everybody, Welcome back to the fire Escape Cast. It
is episode one hundred. About four years ago, Dan, Mary
and I said what if we got together? We started
a podcast for ninety nine episodes. We focused on video
games and catching up an odd episode one hundred, Pull
the rug out.

Speaker 2 (00:29):
I you saw. I was going, these tariffs are crazy.

Speaker 3 (00:32):
Let's dig into Yeah, Okaynada, really? What the hell?

Speaker 1 (00:35):
All our gas, much of our lumber, probably some aluminium somewhere.

Speaker 3 (00:40):
Let's dig into it.

Speaker 4 (00:41):
What the alf of America?

Speaker 3 (00:43):
Uh?

Speaker 1 (00:44):
No, Tonight we've got a fun episode planned. That's Dan,
that's Mary. You know who they are, probably if you're listening.
We figured we would do something different. We do have
games we want to talk about, but we'll probably save
that for next episode. Tonight, we have the sixty four
game Bracket tournament to decide fire Escape Cast's favorite collective
game of all time.

Speaker 5 (01:05):
No no, no, no, no no no, that's not pussy pute
this here. Yeah, it's not our favorite. This is objective science.
Were earning the best game of.

Speaker 1 (01:13):
One of us only voted from like three franchises, so
I think it is more favorite than Mary.

Speaker 4 (01:18):
It's just some real tunnel vision coming from some people.

Speaker 1 (01:25):
So we do know we generally have a good idea
of what each of us nominated.

Speaker 3 (01:28):
What did we do?

Speaker 1 (01:29):
We all nominated twenty five. We were Mary, who's seen
the bracket?

Speaker 2 (01:34):
Though? Mary, I'm pretty much just going to toss to
you from here on out.

Speaker 4 (01:36):
Sure, yeah, you we talked about doing this and I
said I would take this on, and I asked you
all to send me your top twenty five. What I
promised you was that your top fifteen would make it.
And I did that because I think, no matter what,
even if they're stupid or just incredibly dumb, worthless, I
would put your top fifteen in because they represent you.

(01:59):
After that, there is some mixing in, some matchin to
make sure that we're getting a holistic look at games.
And I even put in ones that no one put
in that I feel like are worth discussing just from
a collective generational Yes, you should at least discuss know what,

(02:20):
I just.

Speaker 2 (02:20):
Ignore Super Mario Odyssey, so I probably want to.

Speaker 3 (02:23):
Put that in.

Speaker 4 (02:23):
I can't not have some of these on here.

Speaker 3 (02:28):
Is that you're talking about one of the best games
of all time?

Speaker 1 (02:31):
Is that, sarcast No, I'm just fucking with you. I
love super Mario Otissey.

Speaker 4 (02:34):
We will there will be some fightings on this one.
But I think what's interesting about this is that I've
thought about that game we haven't started yet. I've put
all these in a bracket, so sixty four bracket, which
will give us six rounds where we essentially one against one.
I randomized it, and it is truly random. I did
not manually touch any of these. I hit random I

(02:56):
think three times to ensure that there was like no biases. Yep,
and here they are. They make me laugh. But what's
funny is that Mike and Dan have not seen this bracket.
So when I read what is our first matchup, it
will be your first time hearing these two games that

(03:16):
will go up against each other.

Speaker 5 (03:19):
To the deck, and if you, the listener, would like
to see the bracket, we will have posted it by
this point. I believe after this recording, we're going to
post them the blank bracket. Well, I mean the first
round you'll see the first round of sixty four. But yeah,
we have not seen it. In fact, right before this
recording we were like, oh, how are we going to
do present this? And it's like, no, let's we should
not know. I love the idea of it, like it's
going to be totally just chaotic thrown out there, but

(03:41):
at the end the science will all fall into place and.

Speaker 4 (03:43):
Will know that there's a bit of a march madness
to it. You can follow along if you've written your
brackets at home, you can see where.

Speaker 1 (03:50):
We did like a week ago, ask people to send
in their their madness, their theory crafted winner and bracket
and by now yes will know whether people need to
be receiving some some cool stuff. But that's neither here
nor there right now, because I'm ready to talk about
a lot of Zelda there.

Speaker 4 (04:11):
There are several and you'll also notice I don't think
this is a huge spoiler, but there was no Final
Fantasies mentioned by anyone.

Speaker 3 (04:20):
No, we're trying to games. Yeah, this is the most
overrated franchise.

Speaker 4 (04:25):
He told me. Yeah times that they think it's a
bit offensive that we do not.

Speaker 3 (04:29):
We never no, no, no, no, we're just fine. We
don't cover nerdy games. Yeah, they're fine games for ners.
We don't talk about There was.

Speaker 2 (04:37):
Like three Final Fantasies ten years ago. Who cares.

Speaker 5 (04:39):
J are basically just visual novels and I don't consider
that games so we cover games on this podcast.

Speaker 1 (04:46):
I nominated several JPGs. I believe I might be wrong,
maybe marys and matches.

Speaker 4 (04:51):
There's some good genre blending in here, and I think
people will recognize that. But there are entire categories or like,
very popular games that did not make the cup because
they're not our beloved game franchises. However, I did try
to supplement with Yo. This is a very very popular game.
It should be on here, and so I shoved it
in there. Anyway, So Mario games, there's a couple, okay,

(05:14):
and I'm happy. M hm, your Top fifteen is insane.

Speaker 5 (05:21):
I put so much thought in I did just copy
and paste my Top twenty five.

Speaker 4 (05:25):
The same game like six times.

Speaker 3 (05:28):
You're gonna hear how different.

Speaker 1 (05:29):
I'm looking forward to Dan winning an argument for a
three day times tonight.

Speaker 3 (05:36):
Very different.

Speaker 5 (05:38):
I could do a fucking ted talk about how different
every Mario game.

Speaker 4 (05:41):
Some great fucking games.

Speaker 2 (05:43):
Yeah there's some great game, but a real asshole loco, man,
a real fucking asshole of the tournament.

Speaker 4 (05:53):
All right, do you want to get started?

Speaker 6 (05:56):
Yeah?

Speaker 5 (05:57):
Way, I just want to give a quicker anecdote here
that Mike told us to play a game and I
loaded it up yesterday in case we were going to
talk about new games today, and wouldn't you know it,
it's another fucking game about rats in a fantasy environment,
show a straight road.

Speaker 3 (06:13):
What is the deal with these rat games?

Speaker 4 (06:15):
They know how to get them.

Speaker 1 (06:18):
You'll you'll come around eventually. I'm just trying to slip
it in through various genres.

Speaker 3 (06:22):
Right now.

Speaker 1 (06:22):
Okay, we should say we don't have judge Jake here.
If anything comes down to a situation, if no one
knows who Judge Jakes, we're basically tossed to a producer,
Jake Decker, for Game of the Year, to basically bang
the gavel and settle the dispute that really was not
actually getting anywhere close to a conclusion. We are going
to use the power of odd numbers tonight in extreme circumstances.
If we need to go to a vote, that will happen.

(06:44):
But we're going to let things play out as much
as humanly possible.

Speaker 5 (06:48):
And I you know this is we're all friends here,
We've done this before, We've done the debates. I will
listen to any argument. I will not try to brute
force anything through. I think we will all be gentlemen
and ladies, and and we will, we will come to
a proper conclusion.

Speaker 2 (07:01):
You're so noble for stating all that you just did.

Speaker 5 (07:03):
I didn't want to say it. You're so noble, but yeah,
thank you.

Speaker 4 (07:07):
But anyway, me, the hero and person who made the
bracket will place in the winning game after it has
been democratically decided, and then we will proceed onward from there.

Speaker 5 (07:18):
Speaking of democracy, you've got some thoughts on this new fires.

Speaker 3 (07:23):
What is going on? Uh?

Speaker 1 (07:26):
Trudeau's like, I can't get a hold of this guy, Claudia.

Speaker 3 (07:29):
Down in Mexico. It's like, what about us? It's it's
all we don't it's all mixed up, all right.

Speaker 4 (07:35):
First on the bracket, Celosi versus.

Speaker 2 (07:39):
Wait, she's still around. I don't an I wonder if
anybody game rich who's your favorite demons A predicted in
the final four?

Speaker 4 (07:57):
Okay, are we ready?

Speaker 3 (07:58):
Yes?

Speaker 4 (07:59):
All right? This is a sixty four game bracket, so
this is gonna be in. We're gonna be here for
the long haul. Our first matchup is Mike Tyson's punch out,
Oh my god versus Tetris.

Speaker 3 (08:12):
What No, you can't fucking do that. This couldn't have
been randomized. You can't do that to me. Random Look,
I fucking love Tetris, but you don't I feel about
punch Out, And that's a hard fucking argument to make
versus Tetris universally beloved.

Speaker 1 (08:32):
I think Mary and I could just sit round one
out and watch you implode. Fuck you too, I think
it's randomized. I had nothing to do with any of
this ran.

Speaker 3 (08:43):
That was that was my number one.

Speaker 5 (08:44):
Last time I did my like one hundred games of
all time, I did punch Mike Tyson's punch Out. I
don't feel that way anymore, but it's still definitely like
top five for me.

Speaker 3 (08:52):
There's not even a point why. That's why the tournament
tournament Tetriss. What are your thoughts on Tris? I've never
been asked that before.

Speaker 2 (09:05):
No, truly, I don't know how to even.

Speaker 1 (09:12):
It's just like the purest distillation of video game like
fun and strategy, and I know there's people that get
into a certain zone where you can master that.

Speaker 2 (09:24):
Yeah, there's no rats.

Speaker 4 (09:25):
It depends on how you perceive the blocks, because actually
I would say that the reason they're so nebulous, just
like there's these slight changes in style and movement. I
think you could interpret them as different animals or plants. Yeah, absolutely,
what what's a square you?

Speaker 2 (09:42):
What makes punch Out so good?

Speaker 3 (09:45):
It is? What's the point this is? We want to
waste everyone's time here.

Speaker 4 (09:52):
This is the most beautiful.

Speaker 1 (09:54):
I hate this, this punch out to get knocked out.

Speaker 5 (09:58):
This is why college wards use a seating procedure. Can't
punch out each other, not the first round, but the
first fucking match up.

Speaker 1 (10:06):
Yeah, well, speak of your mind about both games before
one of them is lost for the rest of the night.

Speaker 5 (10:11):
Mike Texas, punch Out is first folds like the best
looking game on the NES. There's giant, big ass sprites.
It fucking it's the game that is aided, the game
from that era that has aged the best. I would
say it's aged better than anything on the NES. It
is pure reflexes and skill and fun pattern recognition, reflexes.
It's just it is everything I want a video game

(10:32):
to be.

Speaker 4 (10:33):
Uh.

Speaker 5 (10:33):
It was also this weird anomaly that Nintendo made a
game with Mike Tyson as the you know, like that
that's just not the way Nintendo operates. Ever, It's uh,
it's a lot, It's fucking Tetris. Just put Tetris forward.

Speaker 4 (10:45):
Yeah, just to say, like there's no game that has
uh passed the test of time better than Tetris itself.

Speaker 2 (10:53):
Right.

Speaker 4 (10:53):
Tetris was on the n E s and it's also
on everybody's mobile phone currently. It is the game that
you go to. It's the game that old people, uh
normally aged people and babies all know what Tetris is
and can play it.

Speaker 5 (11:09):
Would I would argue that, like I've never done it
on a phone because it's just like I love Tempris
so much and it does feel so just sticky and
nice and responsive that like I've tried it before, like
when EA put out that first tepts on phones, Like,
I don't want any muddiness in my Tetris. I want
immediately fast drop all that that's all bad.

Speaker 4 (11:26):
I played it on like one of those like really
shitty phones that wasn't even a smartphone, you know, where
they could barely do anything. I played Tetris on that
bad baby all the time.

Speaker 5 (11:35):
And bonus too, it's the one they say you should
play if you like walk in on a murder scene
and you want to like have your brain process it
faster so you don't have as much PTSD, so I
don't know if anything else in the tournament has that.

Speaker 3 (11:45):
So that's another QUI have they really said that? They
say that, Like, who's they? Just they? I don't know,
doctor or scientists whatever.

Speaker 5 (11:51):
It's supposed to be a thing where it's like if
you see something traumatic, like you know, a car crash
or dead bodies or something, or encounter something super dramatic
that it it's good to like play Tetris right afterwards
because it's supposed to.

Speaker 3 (12:03):
Just kind of help your brain. Look, I can't explain it,
but like I've heard that many times.

Speaker 4 (12:07):
If you need trauma, you can play Mike Tyson's punch Out.

Speaker 3 (12:11):
It's it has injured me.

Speaker 2 (12:12):
That is too good.

Speaker 4 (12:15):
You can add trauma from punch Out. Tetris removes trauma.

Speaker 5 (12:20):
Tyson sent me to like three months of physical therapy
for my hand when I was speed running it.

Speaker 3 (12:24):
So yeah, it nurts you. It's Look, I.

Speaker 5 (12:30):
Feel like there's an argument I could make if if
you put like a Mario World against Tetris like a
but like, there's no fucking way I'm getting punch Out
pass afters right.

Speaker 3 (12:39):
No, Mary's just smiling. I liked.

Speaker 2 (12:41):
I liked punch Out quite a bit. Uh I played
it you you put it in my hands. You put
it in my hands back a few years ago at
your place in Connecticut, I believe, just to see how
I liked it, because you've had a hunch I would
like it because of my appreciation for like pattern recognition
and Dark Soul's bosses, et cetera. And I loved it,
and I like.

Speaker 1 (13:00):
I went in with Hubris thinking I would master it
that night, and then holy shit, I don't think I
got past the third enemy or fighter rather so like clearly,
that's it's really impressive that a game in the ne
e s era had that high of a skill ceiling.

Speaker 3 (13:15):
But Tetris is Tetris.

Speaker 5 (13:17):
It's Tetris timeless. I'm not going to waste anyone's time more.
But I got hosed, all right.

Speaker 4 (13:25):
That's punch Out versus Tetris. The winner is Tetris. Submitted.

Speaker 1 (13:33):
He's so excited when you heard punch Out and then
went off a cliff.

Speaker 3 (13:37):
It's like the worst thing you can a couple of these.

Speaker 4 (13:39):
There's a couple of these that I'm really excited about.

Speaker 3 (13:42):
Babies.

Speaker 4 (13:43):
Our next matchup, Breath of the wild versus the birth
of your first born. Luckily we're all barren. Dishonored too
versus Star Wars Galactic battle Ground.

Speaker 3 (14:01):
I'm gonna go see.

Speaker 5 (14:04):
Well.

Speaker 3 (14:04):
Fuck.

Speaker 2 (14:05):
Actually, no, I already know what should win this, Mary,
I don't know if you have thoughts.

Speaker 4 (14:09):
I mean, I think that Dishonored is one of the
most beloved games of modern times. Keep coming back to it.
It's very inspiring to other games. I think Star Wars
is Galactic Battlegrounds as well made, but I just don't
think it's had the impact that Dishonored two has had.
But I'm curious what you think.

Speaker 1 (14:29):
Uh No, I think Dishonored two is much better. Galactic
ballleground is super cool. I've had a lot of fun
with it. It is it's running off the Age of
Empire's engine from back in the day, but it basically
just like blew up the Star Wars universe. And as
someone who used to like play a lot of real
time strategy games and theory craft what Lord of the
Rings strategy game would look like or Star Wars, to
have that in my hands was phenomenal, especially its scenario editor.

(14:52):
I actually learned like very very basic coding and pathing
and making campaign missions in that game with Qui Gon
and Obi Wan but two, having just recently replayed it,
I will say Designer two is much better. But I
I will say Dishoner two, I think is the best
immersive sim ever made. I'm not going to go super

(15:12):
far in because I'll have to argue for it again
next round. But Dishonor two, I just played it again
two weeks ago. I'm still playing it. Rather, I started
again two weeks ago, and it holds up real well.
Since two thousand and sixteen, I believe it was so Yeah,
Dishonner two is the game there. But if you haven't,
Galactic Battlegrounds is on Steam. You can go buy the
whole collection for like twenty bucks and go check it

(15:32):
out if you like weird, huge, big budget RTS games
that no one talks about anymore. But uh, but yeah,
Dishonner two goes to the next round for sure in
my opinion.

Speaker 5 (15:42):
Can't wait for Dishonor two to get us nuts stomped
on by a T block next round?

Speaker 3 (15:46):
Oh yeah, is that is that? Yeah?

Speaker 2 (15:47):
I guess it has gone against Yeah, you'll know how all.

Speaker 4 (15:50):
Right, Now you're gonna start feeling it. I will say
that there are a couple that I think will make
Mike squirm that are coming up, but like this, some
of them are easier.

Speaker 1 (16:00):
I'm definitely I'll save the designer to true argument, not argument,
but like send off for next round rather than delay
things in the first round.

Speaker 4 (16:09):
Fantastic, Well would you like.

Speaker 1 (16:12):
Another gets out gets canceled as we're doing this argument
we find out for being racist or.

Speaker 3 (16:18):
Yeah, like the Russian it would be bad whoever made it.

Speaker 4 (16:24):
I think we got to separate here from the artist
on this one. There's still there's too many villains on
this bracket.

Speaker 1 (16:31):
Then Alexandria comes out against Gregoro.

Speaker 3 (16:38):
This is a joke for just I like it. I
appreciate it. Just I just watched that like two days ago. Okay, sorry,
Next all right?

Speaker 4 (16:46):
Next matchup Warrior where Mega micro Games versus Metroid Prime.

Speaker 1 (17:00):
Wait, I also nominated Prime. So this is either Dan
dig you as well?

Speaker 3 (17:05):
Yeah? Probably, I mean regardless, it's met fright Prime. There's
such a we're powerless.

Speaker 1 (17:14):
It's the third matchup, and there's already like a fear
that comes into Dan's eyes when he hears one of
his games.

Speaker 5 (17:21):
You start with like one of my favorite games ever,
and I'm like, oh's great, what's next?

Speaker 3 (17:24):
And now here's another one of my favorite games.

Speaker 4 (17:26):
So many like you put so many silly billies in here,
being like I like this one, Like there's real games
going again, there were no silly billies. Then fight for Warrior.
Where Mega micro games you don't go for it.

Speaker 3 (17:41):
It is, uh the game. It is the game I
probably load up the most of any video game throughout
the last twenty five years or I guess twenty.

Speaker 5 (17:52):
It probably came out in like mid two thousands. It
is the most instant fun game there is.

Speaker 3 (17:58):
Uh.

Speaker 5 (17:59):
It is the game that I put on whenever I
get all these like new handhelds and stuff, whether it's
a analog pocket or you know, the trip, all these
little gimmick things I get, I always just make sure
warri Wear is on it. And it's always the game
I play the most on it because in any circumstance
I can just pick it up, play Warrior.

Speaker 3 (18:14):
Where instant fun.

Speaker 5 (18:16):
I mean, the whole deal with the Mega microgames thing
is that it's they're like seconds long. You got to
figure out what's going on. It's funny the first time
because you're always like, what the fuck is this? So
a hot dog ran me over and then past that.
It's just actually this very kind of skillful, fun thing
to try to get your highest score. It's it's funny,
it's there's a ton of variety to it because there's

(18:36):
tons and tons of micro games. It's Yeah, I just
I adore the humor of it, the idea of Warrio
just being greedy and being like, oh, games are big,
I'm just gonna make a bunch of shitty tiny games
and then you're just playing through it, like the lore
to this like little minigame collection. Yeah, do either you

(18:57):
play Warrior Wear at all.

Speaker 1 (18:58):
I've enjoyed them like as one off experiences. I'm not
a devotee by any means.

Speaker 3 (19:03):
I actually played.

Speaker 2 (19:04):
The most I played was with you at the recent ones.

Speaker 3 (19:08):
Yeah. No, it was the first in the squats. Yeah,
and then people.

Speaker 1 (19:12):
Were like getting mad at me that I wasn't stopping you,
as if I have power over what you do with
your body.

Speaker 3 (19:19):
Yeah, I'm pro choice. It is. Yeah. I mean that's
the thing.

Speaker 5 (19:23):
I love so many old games, and I play so
many retro games. I don't load up linked to the
past or even like Mario World. As much as I
load up warriorware every single year for a couple of decades,
I'm gonna keep.

Speaker 2 (19:34):
That in my back pocket for tonight. Remember, you don't
load up Mario World or Linked to the past.

Speaker 4 (19:40):
You have the right to remain silent. But he's just
talking about a game that's already dead.

Speaker 3 (19:46):
Is there no chance here?

Speaker 2 (19:47):
It's up to you.

Speaker 1 (19:48):
I don't care one of them. Yes, I absolutely care. Sorry,
I'm yeah. I think bet My Prime is much better.

Speaker 4 (19:59):
Than Luania as a genre.

Speaker 5 (20:02):
But I think I think, wait, wait, are you saying
that Metroid Prime started Metroid Vanas, because that is not
the kicks.

Speaker 4 (20:10):
I think that Metroid has made Metroid vanias, and I
think that Metroid Prime is the best in the Metroid series.

Speaker 2 (20:20):
Yeah.

Speaker 5 (20:20):
But when I think Metroidvania, I mean, if you're giving
it the credit of like the Metroid Vania name, I
think that's typically Like there are Metroidvania elements you can
talk about, like you know Arkham Asylum in three D
games having metro Venia elements, But metroc Prime was kind
of its own thing. I think the shocking thing that
that did was that they were able to take those elements,
the Metrodvaneus stuff and turn it into a three D game,

(20:42):
and everyone was skeptical about it. Everyone's like, it's not
going to be good in first person, and they absolutely
nailed the field of Metroid So like it is really
really great, but I definitely would not give it any
added benefit in terms of like genre stuff.

Speaker 4 (20:57):
I think I think we do have the right so
to say that it advanced the genre. I do think
we have the right to say that it was revolutionary.
And this will come up in this bracket a lot,
which is not just what you like of it or
what this group thinks about of it, but what did
it do for games?

Speaker 3 (21:15):
Right?

Speaker 4 (21:15):
That's one of the reasons Tetris just destroyed Mike Tyson's
punch Out is because it was revolutionary and it really
skyrocketed games into a new era. So I just think
that's something that Metroid series does. I think that's what
Prime did very specifically, and I just don't think Warrior
Ware is like on the same caliber, even though it

(21:36):
is fun.

Speaker 1 (21:37):
Also just think you from a game design perspective, I
have to admit before you actually put Warriorware in my hands, Dan,
I was not like impressed by the quote unquote collection
of minigames reductive view. I had of it, very impressed
once I saw it all come together. I do think
it's much more impressive that Metroid Prime sustains like this

(21:58):
really potent atmospe fear. You get tools at such good
intervals when you just you think you've mastered a few
of these areas, and all of a sudden, you get
the grappling hook, you get the the morphball, all of
a sudden, You're like, holy shit, this just opened up
a lot. That game's world design is great. There are
parts where it's annoying. I still don't love the underwater
stuff in that game, but like they still did it

(22:19):
fairly well.

Speaker 3 (22:19):
Compared to a lot of others for the time.

Speaker 1 (22:22):
Yeah, I think Metroid Prime, just like I I consistently
point to that as maybe one of the most like
effective atmospheres in any game ever.

Speaker 3 (22:32):
Music lighting slowly, Yeah, it's fus Yeah.

Speaker 5 (22:37):
And here's the thing, even if it was just my list,
I'm pretty sure when I've done these in the past,
Metroid Prime has probably been above Warrior.

Speaker 3 (22:44):
Ware, or at least close.

Speaker 5 (22:45):
So like, it's hard for me to even say that
Warrior Ware is better than Metroid Prime, so like my
vote might even go to Metroid Prime.

Speaker 3 (22:52):
I think I'm just pissed.

Speaker 5 (22:53):
At Warriors, Like all my SIT's getting put up against
the toughest shit. But yeah, I mean, fuck it here,
I'll say Warrior or just so I.

Speaker 3 (23:00):
Can it can have a representative here, but have at it.

Speaker 1 (23:03):
You two go Metric Prime for sure Prime. Okay, democracy
literally just considered.

Speaker 3 (23:10):
Uh.

Speaker 1 (23:10):
I never finished the switch remaster I got. I want
to go back and just restart it.

Speaker 3 (23:14):
I've been thinking about that for what.

Speaker 1 (23:15):
Metro Prime trilogy is my every single year Christmas break
except for last year. I go back to, uh, one
and three are my favorites. Invite I haven't gone back
to yeh, all right, what's what's the next one? They're
not tested yet.

Speaker 4 (23:32):
I feel like it's coming.

Speaker 3 (23:37):
Again.

Speaker 4 (23:37):
It's random, so I wasn't able to start with my
heart breaks. Our next matchup is tomb Raider two versus
Command and conquer Red Alert.

Speaker 3 (23:50):
I'm sorry about you jump from one letch to another.

Speaker 2 (23:59):
Oh he's not when a fucking Russian blimps dropping bombs
on you.

Speaker 3 (24:02):
She's about to jump into a Tesla coil.

Speaker 4 (24:06):
Clips out of it.

Speaker 3 (24:07):
Oh is that a tree. Nope, it's a tank. You're
on fire time travel to kill Hitler.

Speaker 1 (24:13):
Fucking fucking Lara Croft just goes up against one Tanya.

Speaker 3 (24:16):
That was there's a hundred smoker. She just puts tn
T on Laura's boobs and then dead, laugh about it,
laugh about it, and swim away.

Speaker 2 (24:23):
But anyway, what's good about Tom Rader two?

Speaker 3 (24:24):
Because I haven't played that game in a while.

Speaker 4 (24:26):
So much Laura in it. She goes to Italy, fun.

Speaker 2 (24:30):
Out there, to the past, to killing Hitler.

Speaker 4 (24:38):
Hitler can't be the reason games win or not win.
We have to have more reasoning whether or not you
kill Hitler.

Speaker 3 (24:46):
Okay, fair enough, we had other things we were saying. No,
that's all.

Speaker 1 (24:50):
Did I mention that there's a woman who looks kind
of like Laura Croft who runs around and puts C
four on buildings and blows him.

Speaker 3 (24:56):
Up And she's the coolest unit in the game.

Speaker 1 (24:59):
Yeah, And you can have like as many of them
as you want if you have the resources.

Speaker 5 (25:03):
You can take out a whole enemy base if you
just swim up behind it and just set bombs on everything.

Speaker 3 (25:06):
Yeah. Cool, there's a.

Speaker 4 (25:10):
Really good platform. Stupid, this is.

Speaker 2 (25:18):
Two from the nineties, right, not Rise of the tomb Raider.

Speaker 4 (25:21):
No, it is not Rise.

Speaker 3 (25:22):
These are the ones.

Speaker 4 (25:28):
I found that the original ones, even though they had
some errors, were really motivating, especially for like female protagonists
in games. I know Metroid Prime was just on here,
but if that wasn't just before, this would have been
a really good argument for tomb Raider too, which is
unfortunate for my timing, But I think it's a really

(25:48):
good story arc as well. She goes through a lot
of ship the Again, it's just more of like the
platforming puzzles of its time were like really iconic, and
I don't know, I just think she deserved to be
on here.

Speaker 3 (26:01):
I'm in trouble, Aren't no doubt she's a cool character
at all. She's awesome.

Speaker 2 (26:05):
And I came around very hard on Rader.

Speaker 4 (26:07):
With the Jolis character in Command and Conquered Alert.

Speaker 1 (26:12):
Yeah, Tanya, there's also a dude who just commands an
entire like mind control army who can take everybody else's units.

Speaker 3 (26:19):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (26:19):
Uri the expansion, Uh, there's is there anybody on the
Russian side that's like, is.

Speaker 3 (26:24):
James Earl Jones on the on the American side, He's
in the he's in uh Red Alert one.

Speaker 5 (26:35):
I thought, okay, well either, I mean, it's not it's
definitely not the story A series of conquer big stars
is what we said. But but the thing that I think, Mike,
that we love about it is the commanding and the
conquering more so than the characters and the story. Although
it's a fun rapping for a great RTS, but I
think we'll have more of a chance to talk about
its strengths in the next round.

Speaker 4 (26:56):
Right, I'm not gonna push this one, so I'm gonna
agree that the answer and the winner here is Command
and Conquer Red Alert to. I do have like strong arguments,
probably for later, but I don't think this one is winnable.
And I also think it's not. And I also think like,
there ain't no way she's going to take on these

(27:19):
other games that are winners.

Speaker 3 (27:20):
Right wait wait, wait, is it gonna be Reddular two
versus Metroid Prime?

Speaker 4 (27:23):
Now, I'm hold on, we'll get there, we'll get there.

Speaker 3 (27:27):
But yeah, we're brutal.

Speaker 2 (27:29):
Yeah, this is what a bracket is.

Speaker 4 (27:31):
I dan, if you like brutal, let's get to our
next match. Oh god, our next game matchup totally random
Metal Gear Solid three Snake Eater versus Minecraft.

Speaker 3 (27:50):
I thought you say your Solid two.

Speaker 4 (27:52):
I mean, it could happen. Are we really not even
gonna have this discussion? Minecraft like one of the most
iconic games of modern generation. It's the number one game.
It's good, It's the number one.

Speaker 1 (28:04):
Okay, I started, I'm technically just to show my hand,
I'm for snake Eater.

Speaker 3 (28:12):
However, Dan Dan just saying.

Speaker 1 (28:15):
Minecraft It's good is the funniest tape of Minecraft I've
ever heard in my life.

Speaker 3 (28:19):
To be fair, this is our list. I know it's
Minecraft head, it's Mary.

Speaker 2 (28:26):
But outside of that, yeah, she she really does never
shut up, shuts up about him.

Speaker 3 (28:33):
She said the parties are great.

Speaker 1 (28:34):
Yeah, she was like, she's like best parties number one,
notch number two, deady number three.

Speaker 3 (28:42):
No cut that, cut that, Jake, Jake, cut that. These things.

Speaker 4 (28:47):
I think that we have to talk a little bit about, like,
you know, just the global impact that the game has,
the influence of it all. I think Minecraft has made
a lot of movement in the game in space. It's
turned the next generation of kids into gamers. It's it's
about these kids.

Speaker 3 (29:07):
Do you like remember what are your thoughts on Minecraft?

Speaker 2 (29:10):
No it's best game, not favorite. You you called me
out on that at the.

Speaker 3 (29:14):
Beginnings our list, Well, I was being sarcastic. It's our list.

Speaker 2 (29:17):
Oh I think Minecraft's more important than Snakey.

Speaker 3 (29:23):
That's what the thing is. And I know it can
be best game of all time.

Speaker 4 (29:27):
But it can come up because I don't think that
snake Eater is important.

Speaker 1 (29:34):
Oh my god, we are really fucking firing off already.
Very I don't support what you just said.

Speaker 4 (29:40):
Well, I mean, I just think comparatively Minecraft, Like, what
would the world be without Minecraft.

Speaker 3 (29:47):
I don't give a ship. What the fuck. I'm not
waiting to hear anyone here be like, here's why I
love Minecraft.

Speaker 1 (30:01):
I'm not going to it was Mary's nomination. I think
Minecraft's extremely important.

Speaker 3 (30:05):
Let me finish. I'm not saying that's the criteria. But
and I think Minecraft is.

Speaker 1 (30:11):
This like massive, Like I don't all these people who
are obsessed with making this like fucking metaverse, Like you
already have one of the coolest little digital uh like
creation hubs where people can go and just create whatever
they want. It's called Minecraft. So stop like fucking trying
to make this dumb metaverse shit a reality. When we
already have something that's infinitely cooler, especially like doing all

(30:32):
those game Spot Half Life charity streams when you would
make the room and people would come make like crazy
art and like little mini game levels while we were
doing those live streams. Minecraft is like this massive canvas
for cool shit and people have done amazing stuff with it.
I've only ever played it for like thirty hours of
my life total, I think throughout its lifespan.

Speaker 2 (30:55):
Yeah, but yeah, Snake Eater is just this like operatic
cold war fucking soap opera with the coolest characters ever
and one of the maybe the best boss fight in
all of video games. Go ahead, sorry, and yeah it's
for also at the time for the series, all of

(31:18):
a sudden to go from these tight corridors and interior
close quarters combat where it's like, oh, infiltrate this structure
and go do the shit. Oh now you're just dropped
into the wilderness during during this again like this huge
like stakes the world could end mission against all these
like rogues, gallery of incredible character design, and you have

(31:42):
to also like adapt to being outside and using camouflage
and like survival light elements. That was the first time
I truly felt like I was in an open world,
even though it's not really open world. That is the
first time I was like, oh shit, I can see
like video games in ten years from now doing some
cool stuff with this.

Speaker 4 (31:58):
And they did. It was called mind craft because it
was the ultimate place that you could actually have an
open world.

Speaker 3 (32:04):
Shit walked into that one.

Speaker 5 (32:06):
It's the perfect form of metal gear solid because it
blew everyone away in ninety eight when it was like,
oh my god, it's like a movie. It's like I'm
playing a movie, but you play it now, it doesn't
you know, the controls of stuff.

Speaker 3 (32:17):
People struggle with it. Obviously, the visuals have an age
super well. I think it looks cool, but obviously it looks.

Speaker 5 (32:22):
Old snake Eater and the two was way too complex
for a lot of people. Again, I love it, but
three was like telling this incredibly dramatic, awesome story. It
was one that didn't require a bunch of very specific
knowledge from old MSX games and you know, weird meme
theory stuff from the end of two and all that shit.
It's just a great fucking Cold war espionage story. Like

(32:43):
Mike said, one of the best boss fights of all time.
I also think it has the best ending I've ever
seen in a video game.

Speaker 1 (32:50):
Oh yeah, you fucking fight your How would you even
describe it? You fight your in a field of spoilers
for because it is about to get a remake, but.

Speaker 2 (33:00):
It Yeah, that's a good point. Yeah, it's got a
good ending.

Speaker 5 (33:02):
And her character is one of the one of the
best characters I've ever seen in a game in a
movie like and the end how that all wraps up
is just fucking incredible.

Speaker 3 (33:13):
Look.

Speaker 5 (33:14):
Minecraft, obviously, if this was the most important to the
global Gaming Ecosystem bracket, it's Minecraft. But I think if
it's us three determining ours like I mean, without a doubt,
snake eater for me.

Speaker 3 (33:28):
Yeah, I'll go snake here as well.

Speaker 4 (33:30):
What's your top uh metal gear of all time?

Speaker 3 (33:36):
It changes every time it gets asked.

Speaker 1 (33:37):
But yeah, don't answer that. She's setting you up for
failure later in the tournament.

Speaker 3 (33:43):
Minecraft.

Speaker 4 (33:45):
Oh so you are for Minecraft.

Speaker 3 (33:46):
My vote is for don't let her twist you. I'm
not doing this. I put my vote in. It's locked in.

Speaker 4 (33:53):
They're not all going to get through, Dan.

Speaker 3 (33:55):
I don't have to keep talking it already. You all
answered straight up too.

Speaker 1 (34:02):
For the record, Mary, because I don't think I actually
did not nominate him if Okay, I want to clarify.
I'd seen Dan's list and I was like, there's no
point in me adding more metal gear solids. If I
was going to add a metal gerselage in my top
twenty five, it would have been Snake Eater. Snake Eear is,
without a doubt, my favorite metal gear. I can say
that because I don't have any other horses in that race.

Speaker 4 (34:20):
Well, I'm gonna hold you to that, and I'll say,
then that makes sense democratically for it to win over Minecraft,
which is insane. So I'll that is the winner and
submit it.

Speaker 2 (34:31):
That makes sense in fire Escape logic, but I'm gonna
do it begrudgingly.

Speaker 4 (34:35):
Yeah, Metal Gears, Solid three, Snake Eater versus Minecraft, Metal Gears, Tullow.

Speaker 3 (34:40):
You got us the winner.

Speaker 1 (34:41):
You gotta realize, though, you absolutely know that no fire
Escape listener got that wrong on their bracket.

Speaker 3 (34:46):
I think they all probably guess snakes correctly. Yeah, maybe not.

Speaker 4 (34:50):
They know the sanity of this.

Speaker 5 (34:51):
I'd like to get a bulligan here because I just
looked at my top one hundred list and I've got
met for a prime A forty eight and Warrior were
at twenty six.

Speaker 3 (34:58):
So I've made a grave error, that's Dan.

Speaker 1 (35:01):
Oh wait, Mary, me and you had a little converse.
Is this when we bring it up? Or do we
wait till next episode?

Speaker 3 (35:05):
What are you doing now? You have to bring it up?
There's that for next episode.

Speaker 4 (35:09):
No, it's like a good time.

Speaker 3 (35:11):
No.

Speaker 2 (35:11):
Dan's talking about how his opinions change over time.

Speaker 4 (35:14):
They do tend to change over time.

Speaker 3 (35:17):
That's a natural part of humanity.

Speaker 1 (35:18):
Yeah, of course, But like then the time span that
I'm talking about, it's pretty funny how drastically it changed.

Speaker 4 (35:25):
Like in general, what we're saying is is that when
you fight really hard for a game like Snake Eater
and you're like, this is like my most number one
game of all time. Will also remind everybody that in
twenty nineteen, Dan had Links Awakening at number six of
his Game of the Year list and said, and I quote, yeah,

(35:45):
one of the best top down Zelda games. End quote.

Speaker 3 (35:50):
Yeah, talk about the remake. The remake is fine. I
don't hate the remake.

Speaker 4 (35:53):
Fucking piece of shit.

Speaker 3 (35:54):
No no, no, no, no, no no no no no
no no no.

Speaker 2 (35:56):
Mary, read the whole quote. Read the whole quote.

Speaker 4 (36:01):
One of the best games ever made.

Speaker 2 (36:03):
Oh, which read when you said it's one of the
best top down zelding, I don't have the copy.

Speaker 4 (36:08):
That's the quote you sent it to me.

Speaker 2 (36:10):
Oh, it's on It's Giant Bombs twenty nineteen Dan's list.

Speaker 3 (36:15):
You said, blah blah blah.

Speaker 4 (36:18):
The Switchek remake fixed any problems I previously had with this,
and now I can properly enjoy one of the best
top down Zelda games.

Speaker 3 (36:26):
Yeah. Oh, I think that's fair, Like I think the
remake it did fix a lot of my problems with it. Okay,
that's the one I played. That's what it's still like.
Not one of the best, not what I would have recommended,
but it is the better.

Speaker 2 (36:37):
Version, one of the best zeld Yeah, the copies that
you called it one of the one of the best
Selda games top down.

Speaker 3 (36:45):
That's fine, that's not a creezy.

Speaker 2 (36:48):
Well we'll say that later. We'll take into this at
a later point in time.

Speaker 4 (36:53):
Inconsistent at best.

Speaker 3 (36:55):
I'm just a man. Who of all, I'm just a man.

Speaker 4 (36:59):
No youd evolved because you have the rhyme opinion and
then changed it to be worse.

Speaker 2 (37:06):
Okay, So, uh so Minecraft is.

Speaker 4 (37:12):
Lost to fucking snake Eater.

Speaker 3 (37:13):
Next it got eaten.

Speaker 4 (37:16):
Stardoo Valley. Oh God versus x Calm two.

Speaker 3 (37:22):
We're gonna hurt Mike with this one. Me. God damn it.
That's one of my top five games of all time.
This feels good, all right. Let me just fucking eulogize
this thing. Mary. We don't have to say ship, you

(37:43):
get a horse.

Speaker 4 (37:44):
It's so much fun.

Speaker 3 (37:45):
Let's just watch a man die for a little bit
of here.

Speaker 4 (37:49):
You can actually pinpoint. The second is Heartbreaks in half.

Speaker 3 (37:53):
And I love Starduo Valley.

Speaker 1 (37:54):
So I'm not gonna like be too upset, but I
am one of my top five games of all time.
That doesn't really matter. What I will say is I
just played, and I'm toward the end of a long
War of the Chosen campaign. As of recently, game is
still absolutely incredible. I've been attached to characters in that game, which,
for those who may not know, they're all procedurally generated.

(38:16):
You just form bonds with them through the gameplay, what
they do with their what you choose to do with
them with their skills. They have all this Snipers is
assault Specialists. The mission designs incredible war that Chosen is,
in my opinion, the best expansion in any genre ever.

Speaker 2 (38:36):
Xcom two, I think was phenomenal.

Speaker 1 (38:37):
I think War of a Chosen came along and just
blew me away with how they messed with the xcomp
formula of building out the squad of procedurally generated characters
hunting these different bosses throughout incredible missions. They added the
loss of these zombies that you were fighting, so there's
like three warring factions basically outfitting these soldiers, getting attached
to them, sending them on missions, dreading sending your best

(39:00):
ones on like mission impossible type scenarios. Either they die
and you remember it for a week and it hurts,
Like genuinely, I don't give a shit when fucking Sepharroth
kills Erith or whatever the fuck, but I genuinely care when,
like my Brazilian sniper who I named Gie Santo's after

(39:20):
a basketball I like dies, it hurts and.

Speaker 2 (39:24):
Or they pull or they come out of it and
then yeah, or you come out. They come out of
it and they're just it's the most badass heroic shit
ever because they you kept them behind on the map
and to let every save everybody else and they escape
it's just like in terms of being this emergent story machine,
this like empathy for these characters engine It's incredible and

(39:46):
I haven't even I'm not even gonna like dig into
like how good the turn based systems are designed, and
the enemy variety and all the different risk reward scenarios
you have to consider throughout any given mission and any
given campaign strategy layer, and in the turn based battles
of life, it's uh, it's I think my favorite strategy
game of all time and I still play it to
this day and it gives me joy even if it's

(40:07):
not going to move forward in the tournament.

Speaker 3 (40:09):
I vote for Start Valley. Yeah, that's fine, Mary, I'm
up for that.

Speaker 4 (40:14):
I vote for Stardoo Valley. It had to happen, yea, Chris, Okay,
everybody's gonna eat it on the nobody.

Speaker 3 (40:29):
Hear that. Yeah, goddamn it.

Speaker 4 (40:35):
It's a good one.

Speaker 2 (40:36):
A couple of versus Stone Cold? What what's the next round?
I vote for Stone Which one.

Speaker 3 (40:46):
Is starting with this starting?

Speaker 4 (40:51):
The next game in the bracket is Halo Combat Evolved
versus Gears of War?

Speaker 3 (41:01):
Oh oh oh, the old thoughts is actually a really
interesting one.

Speaker 1 (41:05):
The Xbox matchup. My nomination was Halo. For the record,
I also really like Gears of.

Speaker 4 (41:10):
War obviously excellent and revolutionary and so important for the
Xbox's history. I just think only one of them has
like a sick chainsaw gun, you know what I mean.

Speaker 1 (41:25):
Laser Actually, yeah, if we're talking, if we're talking, if
we're talking importance to Xbox's history, Halo is way more important.

Speaker 3 (41:36):
Well.

Speaker 5 (41:36):
It's tough though, because like that, I was kind of
prepping my argument in my head here, and I was
trying to think of, like, oh, well, Gears has been
the more consistent series throughout, where's Halo had more down
swings and stuff. But we are to be clear, this
is about Halo one versus Gears of War one. Yes, right, yes,
with that uh man, that co op you know, we

(41:59):
take it for granted now co op campaigns, and obviously
there's co op games on you know nes, but on
the level of this huge shooter campaign, this big budget
cool thing that was like built for co op where
it's party obviously like Dom go this way, Mark.

Speaker 1 (42:14):
Oh, I thought you could just as easily have been
talking about Combed Evolved up to that point.

Speaker 5 (42:17):
For the record, sure, yeah, I mean out of all
this fucking awesome co op too, like the whole Halo series,
but it.

Speaker 2 (42:22):
Doesn't have the branching paths.

Speaker 4 (42:23):
It doesn't have the branching paths.

Speaker 5 (42:25):
It was built for it in a way that like Halos,
it's not like it was an afterthought. Like obviously it
doesn't by accident be a great game.

Speaker 4 (42:31):
You don't have to, but it is. It is like
beneficial to play with an additional player when you play Gears,
because you can like you can snipe while the other
person is like down on the ground. It's really sick
to save your buddy like that.

Speaker 5 (42:44):
Yeah, And I feel like I could see myself playing
Halo campaigns and I think I have playing them solo.
But for me Gears, I think every single one of
those games. The first time I went through all those campaigns,
I made a point till I remember when three came out,
Me and three friends, we went to the game and
Former office over weekend. We all just like sat in
the same room and played through four player co op
campaign again, that's three one was increased.

Speaker 3 (43:06):
That's three two.

Speaker 1 (43:07):
But why is the co op inherently in this argument
you're making. It's like you're making co op inherently better
than single player.

Speaker 3 (43:12):
Why is that the case?

Speaker 2 (43:14):
That's I'm genuinely interested.

Speaker 5 (43:15):
I just because in terms of just memories of good
memories of those two games, I remember just a lot
more fun and laughing and kind of team strategy stuff
going on when I was playing Gears one versus I mean,
it's great in Halo one too, because like that Enemy
AI was way ahead of its sign back then.

Speaker 1 (43:32):
Yeah, in terms of communal experiences, I would say one
of my favorite memories in any video game is the
land parties that I had with Halo Commet Evolved, which
is not co op, but you were cooperating with the
people on your team to take out other humans on
in four v four matches.

Speaker 5 (43:46):
And which is so fucking good that you'd get a
bunch of fore you get sixteen friends in one place,
all looking CRTs around in xboxes because it was that
fucking good And.

Speaker 3 (43:55):
There's no no solid factor to that.

Speaker 1 (43:57):
But like I still genuine to this day, I don't
know when the last time many people have played Combat Evolved.
Is that game is still my favorite in the whole series.
If we're being my opic, I'm gonna really hone in
on that I think there are really good Halo's.

Speaker 3 (44:10):
Outside of that.

Speaker 1 (44:11):
I'd say Halo as a whole package reached its peak
with three probably, However, Halo County evolved still to this day,
is one of the best shooter stories told. The way
they build up the mystery and they use these like
themes from Alien, like Ridley Scott's all over Halo one,
aliens from Alien. Really Scott's Alien nineteen eighty nine? Was

(44:32):
it earlier than that seventy nine Alien? Ye seventy I
The way they build up mystery and it's it's it's
in the like counter or half life vein of storytelling
where it's like, okay, maybe there's a quick cutscene, but
all of a sudden, like they're telling a lot of
the story while you're still in the driver's seat. Through
the first like whole half of that game is some

(44:53):
of the best shooter missions in any game. Then you
have the Silent Cartographer is almost like an open world
farcry game. Outside, it's just the variety there up front.
The weapon design, best pistol, best gun in video games,
I'd argue maybe the top three. I I love Gears
of War and what they did with that movement system

(45:14):
and the third person the roadie running and the chainsawing
and the like the crawling. It's impressive Halo to me.
And obviously Halo's controls when it first came out on
the Big Boy Xbox controller where they tweaked, they had
to tweak those, but Halo just proved dual analog shooters
could exist, which was crazy.

Speaker 3 (45:35):
Anyone.

Speaker 1 (45:36):
It's second nature today now because Halo did so much
of that. But like I also just the multiplayer in
that game is the co op, the single player, the environments,
what cool of cool fucking universe they designed from scratch.
We take it for granted now that the Halo universe
is a thing with a fucking streaming show, But like

(45:57):
that video game was just any form of entertainment that
was a cool world, a cool story. It just happened
to be in a fucking like, really fun, badass video game.
And I don't know I've talked about it enough, but
Halo Commet of All is still one of my favorite
shooters of all time.

Speaker 5 (46:12):
Ever, everything you said is correct, and I think this
is the first one on this bracket that I think
it seems like all of us are like, yeah, they're
both looking great.

Speaker 3 (46:20):
There's not a clear winner here.

Speaker 1 (46:21):
Yeah, and Gear for the also last thing, I'll say
Gears of the Gears of War, I agree, has been
more more consistent as a series. I do not think
one is my favorite game by a long shot in
that series, but but it absolutely brought a huge new
vibe to shooters in video games, and like, at first
the macho stuff annoyed me, but looking back, I was like, no,

(46:43):
that's that's part of like the that's part of it,
that's part of the tone.

Speaker 3 (46:46):
They were just it was it.

Speaker 5 (46:50):
Yeah, Okay, So anyway, I will just say, because Mary,
I know you've got a lot of thoughts on Gears,
so I'll just say quickly that I think they're both great.
I was annoyed at times from the halo'saign. I feel
like it's a little more prone to just be like,
where are we going now, what's next, like especially like
the library and stuff like that. I think there are
some some dips, like the levels that aren't amazing. But
I played through both them co op. I played through

(47:12):
Halo one with Bonk right before the pandemic, and I
played through Gears one with my sister Kayla. A couple
of years ago, and they're both great still. They're both
incredible co op experiences. But I think I do remember
as a game Gears being I think my vote's going
to go with Gears. I think I like that game more.

Speaker 4 (47:33):
I mean, ultimately, like as Dana said a lot, this
is our list, and so it's really like our experiences
that will determine what this is. Gears was extraordinarily influential
to me personally and got me into shooters when I
actually didn't think that that was a genre of game
that I could play, or that I wasn't good enough
to play. There was something about the cover based shooting

(47:57):
where I was like, oh, I can handle this. It
was bit of a blend between shooting and also strategy
that I felt like I could wrap my head around
and UH and get into shooters for the first time.
I also think it did some innovative things with UH
with combat, like maid tagging. It had some really iconic

(48:18):
guns torque Bow, which allowed you to explode enemies from back.

Speaker 1 (48:27):
Yeah nice, I know, you just walk up and punch
them with it too, and then yeah cool like world
building design thing.

Speaker 3 (48:39):
I agree.

Speaker 4 (48:40):
I mean, I think they're they're both great worlds honestly
because uh uh d Day or like Immersion Day for
Gears was also very iconic, and they had a really
interesting worldview of our world, like a you know, our
universe that was destroyed by aliens that were underground the
whole time.

Speaker 3 (49:00):
And.

Speaker 2 (49:02):
You get.

Speaker 3 (49:04):
That's episode.

Speaker 4 (49:05):
Yeah, that's actually how it started. Yeah, and uh you
you fight inside of a bug.

Speaker 3 (49:12):
I don't know.

Speaker 4 (49:12):
There's just like so many wonderful levels that I'm like,
this is so iconic, and even though I do agree
it's not, it's not actually like my favorite, but I
think it is just such an important game in the series,
and I think it's the one that kind of changed
my life. So I personally have to go with Gears,
but I have I have a fond respect for Halo,
and I know that Halo generally, I think might be

(49:33):
more beloved as a franchise.

Speaker 3 (49:34):
But for me personally these days, Halo's got up some
stains on it, but it does where it's like Gears.

Speaker 1 (49:40):
I'm sure Gears, I think people just kind of are
apathetic these days. Emergence Day could maybe turn around, but
I'm not super I like Gears five a whole bunch
the Hord mode in Gears five is incredible.

Speaker 5 (49:51):
Well, I just feel like Gears has been a less
polarizing series over there.

Speaker 3 (49:55):
Like, you know, I played through every.

Speaker 5 (49:56):
Gears campaign with Kayla, like in a row, back to
back to back, and it's not like, oh ship, we
got to this one. I know, you know, Judgment is
kind of a different thing, and I actually don't even
just like Judgment. But I think Halo has more, especially
post Bungee, you know, post three. I had a little
rock year of a history there. But again, it's not
about the series. I think Hammer of Don was that
in the first one. Mary, Yeah, okay, my vogue goes

(50:17):
two years of war.

Speaker 4 (50:20):
Okay, all right. Democratically, I think it's done. Might give anything.

Speaker 3 (50:26):
I said what I say.

Speaker 2 (50:27):
I think they're more polarizing because people care more about Halo.

Speaker 4 (50:30):
But's Halo versus Gears. Gears wins nice, all right. The
next one. In addition to Dan's heater, which.

Speaker 3 (50:42):
Is now on, I got a rug.

Speaker 4 (50:50):
Look that is so small?

Speaker 3 (50:52):
What is that? Oh my god? Now for a for
a smaller room.

Speaker 4 (51:02):
The bathroom, Matt, there's nothing else.

Speaker 3 (51:06):
Get a rug, Dan, I promise you. Dan.

Speaker 1 (51:08):
Everybody watching this can say definitively, a bigger rug would
fit in that room.

Speaker 3 (51:13):
This is how space works.

Speaker 4 (51:15):
Stupid, stupid man.

Speaker 3 (51:19):
He's trying to He's trying to use up our energy
of argument on the.

Speaker 4 (51:24):
Save it for this one. The next one is World
of Warcraft versus Super Mario Odyssey.

Speaker 3 (51:31):
Come on, Mario Mario Odyssey, charge you every fucking month
to play it? Case closed, I'll.

Speaker 1 (51:40):
Save the big is World of Warcraft there because you
nominated or because you thought it was something we should
talk about.

Speaker 4 (51:45):
I think it's something that we should talk about, and I,
upon retrospect, realize that Odyssey is going to destroy this game.
But it is a very important game and the best.

Speaker 2 (51:55):
Three D platformer of all time.

Speaker 3 (51:57):
But versus the game, the charges you have a month
to play it. I like World of Warcraft just fine.
I paid the subscription bay fine.

Speaker 4 (52:05):
I like it just fine. Do you sound like a
Southern defense attorney. I like World to war Craft. It's
just fine.

Speaker 2 (52:13):
It is, But well, what you've got like a Florida
Panhandle thing going on when really what you want is Savannah,
which is lock Molesses spilling out of your mouth.

Speaker 1 (52:25):
I World of Warcraft was cool. I liked my Dwarf
Hunter and my elf Gnome and my.

Speaker 3 (52:34):
Out of here argument.

Speaker 4 (52:35):
All right, this is not this is not an argument.

Speaker 3 (52:37):
I'm moving on.

Speaker 4 (52:40):
That's phenomenal.

Speaker 2 (52:42):
Fuck Ukon versus Texas Tech.

Speaker 3 (52:44):
So I was thinking, yeah, next.

Speaker 4 (52:47):
Matchup, Super Mario World versus Call of Duty four.

Speaker 3 (52:53):
Oh God, that sucks.

Speaker 2 (52:56):
Did you who nominated Call Duty four?

Speaker 3 (52:58):
Did just that? Is that just on there? It should
that would have been actually just on there.

Speaker 4 (53:03):
It might have been in Dan's top twenty five. But
as I said, I did, yeah, no, it should be
stop adding them after about fifteen to twenty.

Speaker 5 (53:10):
It's my forty seven on the last time I did this,
I don't give a shit, but this belongs here.

Speaker 3 (53:15):
This belongs here, y Yeah. Yeah, Like.

Speaker 5 (53:19):
Mario World is one of the like four or five
games in history that I would consider a perfect video game.
Nothing should change, and it's aged. It's just as fun
to play now as it was in nineteen ninety one.
It is the peak of two D Mario, and I
would argue maybe maybe even the best Mario game. It's

(53:40):
kind of between like that and Odyssey. I would say, yeah,
it is untouchable to me, it is touchable. Yeah, it's
it was my top ten. It's my number five game
of all time. Yeah, it's It's a perfect video game,
absolutely perfect.

Speaker 3 (53:56):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (53:56):
I mean, I'm not going to argue to Mario World
over Call Duty, but Call Duty four or I will say,
it's no question that we're still enthrall to how successful
in groundbreaking It's multiplayer was.

Speaker 2 (54:06):
Campaign still holds up really well.

Speaker 1 (54:08):
I played it recently, but like it's that multiplayer just
absolutely changed the game in a way that, for better
and worse, these days, people are still emulating.

Speaker 3 (54:18):
I played that. I think I prestiged the eighth prestige
in that game.

Speaker 2 (54:22):
Yeah, and I played Two War.

Speaker 1 (54:24):
Yeah, but I'm not gonna I don't care enough about
it to say it over Mario World though, Soup Mario World.
I like to Mario World a whole bunch, but I'm
kind of apathetic about both of them in a way
that I'm not gonna.

Speaker 4 (54:38):
Well, you have to, sorry, where's your vote? I'm confused.

Speaker 3 (54:41):
I'll go to Mario World.

Speaker 1 (54:43):
Okay, Okay, so Mary, if you care enough about Call
of Duty, then I could be tie breaker because I
don't right now care about either of these enough to
like really argue.

Speaker 4 (54:51):
So I'm also a bit apathetic to these, and so
I was going to kind of bow out and see
how you feel about both of them. I've played both
of them. I think they're both solid games. They neither
of them are in my top ten of all time
or like a game where I would like fight tooth
and nail for. Call of Duty was also like pretty
monumental for me. Is like I think COD four was
my first time playing a COD I didn't play a

(55:12):
COD before that, so that was a big deal for me.
Campaigns great like it's it's a it's a it's a
solid game. Super Mario World is iconic and beloved and
a fantastic fucking game to play with your siblings, And
so I guess I could lean more towards super Mario World,
but I wouldn't. I wouldn't fight for either of them.

Speaker 3 (55:34):
Yeah, I love both of them.

Speaker 4 (55:35):
More passionate person should fight this one.

Speaker 3 (55:37):
Yeah, I mean I do love both of them.

Speaker 5 (55:39):
I've spent so much time with four and undeniably is
super important. It seems like we all respect it quite
a bit. But yeah, I mean, you could put fucking
Metal Year Solid against Mario World, and I would have Uh,
I might go Mario World. You know, like, that's how
much I love Mario World. So what's that merry.

Speaker 4 (55:55):
I'm just making sure I heard you that Super Mario
World is more then.

Speaker 3 (56:02):
I did not say that Metal Gear, and I would
not say that, And I don't know if I'm gonna
have to say that right now. All I have to
say is that's the.

Speaker 4 (56:09):
Beauty of brackets. You absolutely the fuck will have to
say that at some point. It's just a matter of time.

Speaker 5 (56:15):
I will cross that bridge when I come to it.
The bridge right now is Mario World beats Call of
Duty four.

Speaker 4 (56:21):
Okay, sounds like there's no grave oppositions to this, so
we're gonna go with Super Mario World winning over Call
of Duty four. Right next? Total war war Hammer three.

Speaker 2 (56:37):
Yeah, I don't give a fuck what's next.

Speaker 4 (56:39):
I'm going Red Dead Redemption two.

Speaker 5 (56:42):
Fuck me, God damn it, this is funny. I'm going
Red Dead too. I've always loved that game.

Speaker 4 (56:47):
It's really funny.

Speaker 5 (56:49):
That's a good one for Mikey. Lock me in for
Red Dead Redemption two. I was playing it today.

Speaker 1 (56:55):
God damn it, Mike Clear, I'm not wasting breath talking
about Total War war Hammer three to either of you.

Speaker 2 (57:03):
Anymore. I've made that vow and I have any to
play it with now.

Speaker 3 (57:07):
But yeah, I can't. I can't say he's.

Speaker 4 (57:11):
Not on this podcast. He'sn't get a fucking vote. Which
one do you want?

Speaker 3 (57:14):
Oh? Fuck? I?

Speaker 2 (57:22):
Oh god, I don't know. I feel like I don't.
I feel like I have to talk myself into both
of them.

Speaker 3 (57:26):
Why were they going married? Do you have a vote?

Speaker 4 (57:28):
I would probably because I know this is this is
Michael's Sophie's choice, So I think, like, based on what
Mike thinks, I'll probably support him in it. I played
both of these.

Speaker 3 (57:40):
When did you play Total War war Hammer three?

Speaker 4 (57:42):
I skimmed it.

Speaker 7 (57:43):
No, you didn't fuck up, you liar, you didn't know.
You didn't win the war. Skimmed it's so total. Yeah,
for the third time, it's crazy.

Speaker 2 (57:56):
You're gonna be You're gonna be eating your words.

Speaker 1 (58:00):
The show blows up, and that gets syndicated when we
when when Peacock wants the show on its streaming and
you guys don't get a penny.

Speaker 3 (58:08):
I don't even know how that works.

Speaker 4 (58:11):
I'm just saying I think I think you should probably
get a heavier, heftier saying, yeah, I know, I'm just.

Speaker 3 (58:18):
Trying to figure out how to.

Speaker 2 (58:21):
I've played Total Warhammer three much much, much more than
Red Dead Redemption two. But you know what, Total war
Warhammer three I already said x Com two is my
favorite strategy game of all time. Total war Warmer three

(58:41):
is right behind it.

Speaker 1 (58:42):
The tough thing with Total war war HEMM three is
you're kind of talking about all three games because of
the Immortal Empires mode.

Speaker 2 (58:47):
But Red Dead Redemption two.

Speaker 1 (58:51):
Just one of the most impressive video games ever in
it's world design, it's writing, it's it's absolutely replete with flaws,
of course, but everything else is just so strong.

Speaker 2 (59:05):
It's it's a monumental game.

Speaker 1 (59:07):
Total Warhammer three is not better than Red Redemption two,
but I right now would rather play Total war Warhammer
three for what it's worth.

Speaker 3 (59:17):
But I.

Speaker 4 (59:20):
I just said, you just keep sucking that Warhammer and
I can't.

Speaker 8 (59:27):
Do.

Speaker 3 (59:29):
You know what, it's Red Deredemption two.

Speaker 1 (59:32):
I've talked enough about Warhammer three with my past soliloquies
about it, have not gotten be able to fucking play it.
I'm not gonna right now, So Red two is my vote?

Speaker 3 (59:43):
Did Yeah, Red.

Speaker 4 (59:45):
Dead Redemption two wins over Total war Warhammer three.

Speaker 3 (59:51):
I'm with Dan. I got some conspiracy theories going on
about whether this is how random this was, she had
to make any bad choices here.

Speaker 4 (59:58):
I also want to say, there's been uh, well I
lost tomb Raider, there's been, Yeah, there's I prioritized a
lot of your guys' games because you guys felt so strongly.
I also want to say that when it comes to
the bracket, who got the most games in? Mike did,
because more games.

Speaker 2 (01:00:18):
In probably had more outliers than you two right.

Speaker 4 (01:00:22):
Ones that I think are like also just universally liked.
So it's like you put games in yours where I
was like, this is a game that the world we.

Speaker 3 (01:00:30):
Should talk about. Okay, I got, yeah, that we should
talk about.

Speaker 2 (01:00:33):
Yeah, like RPGA a little.

Speaker 4 (01:00:35):
Bit more obscure. I put in as many as I could, Dan,
but I couldn't put in all of your fucking crap.

Speaker 1 (01:00:40):
Well, yeah, I had to balance out Galactic Battlegrounds with
an RPG because Dan wasn't about to put an RPG.

Speaker 3 (01:00:45):
On his list.

Speaker 4 (01:00:46):
Yeah, okay, next the next one?

Speaker 3 (01:00:54):
Wait?

Speaker 2 (01:00:54):
Sorry, how many have we done so far?

Speaker 3 (01:00:56):
How many? Like? I don't know? Bracket is weird?

Speaker 4 (01:01:00):
One two, three, four, five, six, seven, eight.

Speaker 3 (01:01:05):
Nine, ten.

Speaker 4 (01:01:06):
We've done ten matchups twenty games.

Speaker 2 (01:01:08):
I guess there were a few.

Speaker 4 (01:01:10):
We have a long way to go. Yeah, sorry, all right,
next matchup the legend of Zelda Majora's Mask versus Borderlands Too, Joe.

Speaker 3 (01:01:26):
Is the best game ever made. What do we do it?
It's so fucking cool.

Speaker 4 (01:01:28):
But you had to be there at certain times of day.

Speaker 3 (01:01:35):
That's cool.

Speaker 4 (01:01:36):
Borderlands you just get to play and shoot.

Speaker 2 (01:01:37):
Stop you nominate Borderlands too, There's Guns is a great game.

Speaker 3 (01:01:44):
I love that. I got it like a nine high,
but yeah, it's too high. I regret that score. But yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:01:52):
The first words Dan ever said to me in my
life were when he said or he even say it
to me. I heard him across the room say that
in turn keeps dying a lot when he had a
level forty character and I had just started mine at
Charity a children's hospital.

Speaker 2 (01:02:08):
Anyway, Yeah, I think Borderlands was a phenomenal game.

Speaker 1 (01:02:12):
It's the best Borderlands, but also Majors Mask is just
this intricate puzzle box of Azelda that absolutely flew too
close to the sun in its N sixty four version,
but in its three DS remake and now you can
play it on the switch.

Speaker 2 (01:02:28):
They must.

Speaker 1 (01:02:28):
They iron out like the two biggest problems it had.
And now I think people appreciate it for how brilliant
it's time loop structure was and how it was.

Speaker 3 (01:02:36):
It was brilliant back then, but it was.

Speaker 2 (01:02:38):
Yes, I think it's more accessible. Yeah, yeah, series that's
always been in a series, that game. Yeah, aged perfectly, Randy.

Speaker 1 (01:02:53):
She's got that Randy pitch in her pocket right Now'randy
Pittsford and Andrew Reiner pulling Mary very.

Speaker 4 (01:03:01):
I think this is a losing battle.

Speaker 3 (01:03:03):
It is just objectively, you've already lost.

Speaker 2 (01:03:07):
I would happily play Borderlines too with you at some point.

Speaker 3 (01:03:10):
Yeah, no, you don't deserve boxes d.

Speaker 4 (01:03:16):
The winner. The winner is the legend of Zelda Majora's
mouth sick. Cool Okay. The next matchup GTA five versus
elden Ring elden Ring.

Speaker 5 (01:03:33):
I mean, look again, if this was like impact, like
mainstream impacts of like GTA the online part of five,
way bigger than I think anybody would expect it. But look,
I like GTA five a lot. I think it's a
great fucking video game. Uh, one of the better GTAs,
I would say, Uh, elden Ring Is. There's just nothing

(01:03:55):
like it. I mean, we gave a game of the
Year and didn't give it a second thought. It seems
you know, it's a well.

Speaker 1 (01:04:00):
You gave it a second thought. You were trying to
push Vampire Survivors over. I had to talk about how
one was seation.

Speaker 4 (01:04:07):
No, you didn't even put it in your top fifteen
Elton Ring Vampire Survivors.

Speaker 3 (01:04:16):
Oh oh well no, no, it's just elden Ring is.

Speaker 4 (01:04:20):
Oh, I've changed my mind. That was just silly lollygagging.
And now this is serious game time and elden Ring
is important.

Speaker 2 (01:04:28):
It is.

Speaker 4 (01:04:31):
Is iconic, it is revolutionary, and like to this day,
there are people who make a living playing GTA role
playing as a job. It's so crazy that you can
do that. I find it just wild to me, the
intricacies and the amount of world building in GTA that
you can have your own mansions, You can play as

(01:04:51):
a cop if you want to, You can role play
as all these different characters. You can just play the
damn game, but you can also play online with all
these different mini games. The The Heists and GTA five
are god tier. Getting four people together and being like
we're gonna we are going to take this bank down
as a group and then run from the cops. Is

(01:05:12):
It is just so much fun And I would rather
play GTA five bank heists than I would elden Ring
Right now.

Speaker 3 (01:05:20):
I'm GTA Mike.

Speaker 5 (01:05:23):
I feel like you, being smarter than me, would be
better at explaining because I'm kind of coming because I
feel like elden Ring has been talking about so much
for so many years, including by us, that I would
trust you to make this argument here.

Speaker 1 (01:05:41):
Yeah, if it was Red Dead two versus elden Ring,
I would go Red Dead two. And GTA five is
undoubtedly phenomenal. The just sheer achievement wise, being able to
zoom out and then go across the map and zoom
in on a new character that they've fully written character
in an open world was incredible, but still nothing like

(01:06:02):
that has been done since it's GTA online. That is
truly the impressive thing to me as someone who went
into the one of their careers to do like a
biker gang and like how you can move up the
ranks and assign your friends.

Speaker 2 (01:06:16):
Yeah, Mary's right.

Speaker 1 (01:06:17):
Honestly, one of the best role playing games you could
play today is GTI online, but elden Rings how they
took their craft at pattern recognition based combat of challenge,
of overcoming it, of the sheer number of character builds
that are viable, and elden Ring in a world that

(01:06:39):
has biomes as different as a place where you basically
can just get poisoned from walking around to a place
where they're just it's built to house giants, so you
have to worry about fighting giants left and right, and
then your build might not even work to account for
all the things they did in elden Ring, I think
is more impressive than the undoubtedly extremely deep detail in

(01:07:05):
uh Los Santos. There's still stuff in Los Aantos that
people are have not figured out yet, Like Rockstar. There's
alien stuff, there's big foot stuff that people are still
finding new clues to today. But I still think elden
Ring it's how it's paced with its boss fights, just
the fact that you can go into a side dungeon
that not everybody has seen, and it's just one of
the most intricately designed labyrinths of a Some are like

(01:07:29):
more puzzle box oriented, others are just more about funneling
you toward this incredible boss fight that again, like I
might have seen bosses that you two haven't even fought.
And again, just the ease with which you can switch
between character builds. But the fact that there's such a
high skill ceiling for like sixteen different viable builds. That's

(01:07:50):
a like a that's something that like even character action
action games, most of them haven't achieved the fact that
it works in such a huge, vast world of that
scope where you can eventually climb on top of these
walking cathedrals and then go talk to a turtle with
a popat to respect. And there's there's something about Elden

(01:08:12):
World's Elden Rings World that they took dark Souls, and
if you've seen those maps of Dark Souls, it's really
about just moving downward gradually. But the way that they
achieve that without you really realizing how far down you're moving.
There's that certain subtlety to Elden Rings World design that,
after like twenty hours of playing, you step back and
be like, holy shit, I've been underground. I've been underground

(01:08:32):
in this underground map that's basically as big as the
surface for ten hours now, and it's just as nuanced
as any far Cry game.

Speaker 2 (01:08:41):
That I've ever played. Elder Ring to me is more
more impressive.

Speaker 3 (01:08:46):
Yeah, let me ask this.

Speaker 5 (01:08:48):
You know, undeniably, the GTA online stuff is huge, and
you know, Mary, you bring up the role play stuff
and that's fascinating that, Yes, people can do that, and
there's a whole it's so detailed and there's so much
going on in Los Santo's that like, holy shit, that
can be a whole or game if you want to
make it that.

Speaker 3 (01:09:02):
But do any of us do that. I don't know
if we do, Like, are any of us doing GTA
rob But I did for a long time.

Speaker 4 (01:09:09):
I mean, it is an older game, so I have
to also like give it credit. We're talking when we
talk about us internally, GTA was very monumental to me
and my time at game Spot, and I played it
weekly in a series where every week we would come
up with some bullshit that was so much fun. I

(01:09:29):
have laughed myself to tears playing GTA five. It is
so immersive and so goddamn funny. Eldin Ering only really
produces like one emotion out of me, and it's usually
like extraordinary stress because I am trying to live in
this anxiety fueled death World. Yes, it's very good at that,
but I just had so many more ranges of emotions

(01:09:53):
playing GTA.

Speaker 3 (01:09:54):
I laughed, I.

Speaker 4 (01:09:55):
Cried, I screamed, I got angry. I mean, I really
went through it with GTA, and I just also, I
think generally speaking, I just had more fun. Whereas elden Ring,
I do agree. I actually think it's more impressive. I
think it is. I think it is perfectly executed. But
we're just talking about often what it is that brings

(01:10:15):
us joy to play, like we get excited about. And
while I think elden Ring is expertly constructed and genius,
I think GTA is the sandbox I wish to play
in all the time, and I just think it's it's incredible.
So I unfortunately I don't think I'm going to survive this,
but GTA is the game for me.

Speaker 3 (01:10:34):
Yeah, yeah, I mean it's and I get the argument
it's it's one of the greats, but yeah, I'm going
with elden Ring for mine.

Speaker 2 (01:10:42):
Michael elden Ring as well. GA GTA online especially is
fucking red.

Speaker 4 (01:10:49):
Elden Ring wins over GTA five next Super Mario Galaxy
two versus Rocket League.

Speaker 2 (01:11:00):
Oh did you also know this is a genuine question.
Is this the only galaxy here?

Speaker 3 (01:11:08):
Did you do both? I probably put Galaxy one on it?

Speaker 2 (01:11:12):
Okay, because I'm just curious. Okay, yeah, go go for it.

Speaker 3 (01:11:16):
Okay, look, Mike, what are you voting? Rocket League? Okay,
I'm not gonna breath. Rocket League wins the whole tournament. No,
it just joking.

Speaker 5 (01:11:24):
I doned to talk about other Mario games. Yeah, I'm
not gonna waste my breath. Put Rocket League forward. Galaxy
two is great, takes all the things that were great
about one, as a nice overworld system and everything. I
think it as less of the motion bullshit that the
first one had. Uh, it's great, but I don't need
to I don't need to think it's praises, It's it's fine.

Speaker 3 (01:11:43):
Rocket League's very good too.

Speaker 4 (01:11:46):
The winner is Rocket League. You did not put Super
Mario Galaxy one on here. This is the only Super
Mario Galaxy.

Speaker 3 (01:11:53):
But there are other Mario games. Yes, No, that's it.
We're out. I just Rocket League. There's no use. Just
put it forward.

Speaker 4 (01:12:02):
Next Team Fortress two versus Mario Party two.

Speaker 5 (01:12:09):
I tried to get Team Fortress two to run on
my computer for so long it seems so fun and
it wouldn't run on my E machines.

Speaker 3 (01:12:17):
So Mario Party two.

Speaker 4 (01:12:18):
It's not my fault.

Speaker 3 (01:12:19):
You were like.

Speaker 4 (01:12:22):
Team Fortress too. It is one of the latest games
of all time.

Speaker 2 (01:12:28):
Yeah, it's such a good going to maybe go to
bat for Mario Party two.

Speaker 5 (01:12:36):
I just don't really hear you talk about Team I
don't think you've ever talked about Team Fortress.

Speaker 3 (01:12:40):
He was a child.

Speaker 2 (01:12:42):
I play a lot of teas. I abolutely love Team
Fortress too.

Speaker 1 (01:12:44):
It's just there are better variations of Team forts two
in my opinion now, but they exist because Team Fortress
two laid the foundation first.

Speaker 3 (01:12:51):
Yeah.

Speaker 4 (01:12:52):
Yeah, yah, yeah, yeah yeah.

Speaker 5 (01:12:53):
Mario Party two is the best Mario Party Cool. There's
plenty on the Internet. There's plenty on the Internet of
me doing Mario. You move your little little whatever game forward.
That's fine with your computers and your internet.

Speaker 2 (01:13:09):
Yeah, there's no internet outside of Kansas City.

Speaker 4 (01:13:13):
I believe that your reason for liking another game is
that you just couldn't play Team Fortress too, and so
you like looked through your blinds of all the other
kids having fun and couldn't play.

Speaker 5 (01:13:24):
I basically hated PC games until I actually had a
PC that could run stuff.

Speaker 4 (01:13:27):
So it's so good. Fantastic Team Fortress to wallops, Mario
Party two to win.

Speaker 3 (01:13:36):
She's really just driving the nails in matchup.

Speaker 4 (01:13:42):
She's coming whatever wins is the sheet Hitman World of
Assassination versus Fire Emblem three Houses.

Speaker 1 (01:13:56):
Come, Yeah, I love Fire through House. I'm not I'm
drowning that child? If wait, is that what happened in
Sophie's Choice? Probably I never saw. Did they drown her
in million? What's the one where they drowned?

Speaker 3 (01:14:11):
The one? I can't see it?

Speaker 2 (01:14:12):
Am I making this up? Did I dream about this?

Speaker 3 (01:14:14):
I've never seen a baby drown I mean neither outside
of a movie.

Speaker 4 (01:14:20):
Dan, Why would you even say that?

Speaker 3 (01:14:22):
I have never seen I'm thinking of the Nirvana album cover.
Oh I was just swimming for money? Yeah? Uh no,
I absolutely.

Speaker 1 (01:14:33):
I think love Fire three Houses, but I love Hitman
World asassination. Hitman World Assassination is like, if you want
do you want to see what like good game design is?

Speaker 3 (01:14:44):
Just play those games. If three Houses want to.

Speaker 2 (01:14:47):
Know what we're capable of, just show them what Io
has made.

Speaker 5 (01:14:50):
Yeah, Three Houses is good, but it had way too
much of that bullshit in between missions. I thought it works,
but Awakening would have been the one that even that,
like there's Awakening was awesome to make.

Speaker 3 (01:15:00):
Stuff in between the good stuff. But hit Man definitely
hit Man. Yeah, agreed, I don't this will.

Speaker 4 (01:15:06):
Be our last before the break okay?

Speaker 3 (01:15:09):
O god?

Speaker 4 (01:15:10):
Oh and just to be clear, Man World of Assassination
wins over Fire Emblems.

Speaker 2 (01:15:16):
Assuming everybody knows this.

Speaker 1 (01:15:18):
Listen, Yes, I'm assuming everybody knows this, but if you're listening,
hit Man World Assassination is what they rebranded the whole
trilogy into as one big package, just so people know.

Speaker 4 (01:15:25):
It's so nice that way, you don't have to make
a choice, you just get Oh.

Speaker 2 (01:15:29):
I thought you was saying I was nice for explaining it.
It was like, I'm just letting them know.

Speaker 4 (01:15:34):
You, you idiot.

Speaker 3 (01:15:36):
It takes a lot so thoughtful Mike, all right.

Speaker 4 (01:15:41):
Witcher three Wild Hunt versus Metal Gear Solid.

Speaker 3 (01:15:46):
You motherfuckers better not screw me on this.

Speaker 4 (01:15:50):
Oh random?

Speaker 2 (01:15:51):
Oh Actually, honestly, I think this is going to be
hardest for me.

Speaker 3 (01:15:55):
Okay, Mike, I didn't put.

Speaker 1 (01:15:57):
What your three on there for the record. I think
Mary might have put it there because we do need
to talk about it.

Speaker 3 (01:16:00):
But like I acknowledged the Witcher three is a very
good game. Stop I'm saying that.

Speaker 4 (01:16:05):
Everyone keeps saying it's a very good game. Making the
bracket is an honor.

Speaker 3 (01:16:10):
I'll say this, it is getting.

Speaker 5 (01:16:15):
Despite that, a lot of like I know, the narrative stuff,
like there are a lot of things that it does
more than your standard like action RPG thing like you know,
like a side question Witcher three do really matter, and
a lot of them, like some of the best stories
in the game I know are in these quote unquote
side quests. But there's a level of care and thought
that goes into that game that I can't just be like, oh,
there's a million of these type of games. It is

(01:16:37):
in its own league with that stuff. But Medal Year
Solid one was a see change for video games. It
was in nineteen ninety eight. You did not see things
on that level that were everybody. Everybody was like, holy shit,
it's like we are playing a movie. I was reading
a preview, a magazine preview of Metal Year Solid and
they had to explain that, like you'll see the camera

(01:16:59):
change like an a movie, and the camera the quote
unquote camera will be in different positions, and it's it's
got voice acting. It's like the idea of a game
being cinematic did not exist on that level until the
first Metal Gear Solid. It changed everything. That level of
voice acting, the quality of voice acting, the story itself,
the gameplay. It was ambitious in a way that nothing

(01:17:20):
before it had been in that type of genre, and
I think it changed. Like we're talking about storytelling, you know.
I brought up the storytelling in Witcher three and the
narrative and stuff.

Speaker 3 (01:17:29):
It's great.

Speaker 5 (01:17:30):
Metal Gear Solid laid the groundwork for modern cinematic video
game experiences.

Speaker 3 (01:17:36):
I agree.

Speaker 4 (01:17:37):
Metal Gear walked so that Witcher three could run, and
it really.

Speaker 1 (01:17:41):
Metal Gear walks so Witcher three could jump in a
jet and fly.

Speaker 4 (01:17:46):
Like it's true, Dan, I.

Speaker 2 (01:17:50):
I I love Metal Gear Solid.

Speaker 1 (01:17:51):
The first one I used to I used to say
the games were in this ascending order, my favorite. So
one was my favorite, and then two and then three.
But that's all changed. Like, I think you're under selling
a bit how impact. I know you said the Witcher
was impactful, but like I don't, I really don't care anymore.
If a game is like a movie, I get what
you're saying. The presentation was such that he was Kojima,

(01:18:13):
who has basically just always wanted to be a movie director,
was making a game to look more cinematic, to be
more immersive for the player. Presentation wise, Witcher three was
not concerned with seeming like a movie. It wanted to
be a really fucking good role playing game where you're
immersing the world.

Speaker 4 (01:18:29):
Yeah, it's a really good fucking video game. You know
the debate we're having.

Speaker 2 (01:18:36):
Uh yeah, no, Witchard three.

Speaker 1 (01:18:40):
Like like you say, like there's there's some side quests
that were interesting, but like other games are doing that
they for you might know, Your Solid absolutely did things
before a lot of other games, any other game did things.
But Witcher three did the thing that every other video
game up until then was trying to do. And it's like,
here's how you do it. And I think other games

(01:19:01):
since have been better in terms.

Speaker 3 (01:19:03):
Of open world RPGs.

Speaker 1 (01:19:05):
But yeah, which your three, the scale, the quality of
its writing, characterization, the choices you can make, the world itself,
the design, how they how alive it feels when you're
just moving through it. It's apples and oranges, open world
versus very confined, meticulous space. Also, someone who came to
meddle Your Solid in like two thousand and twelve for

(01:19:28):
the first time. I think the controls had already really
aged out by then.

Speaker 5 (01:19:32):
I'm not denying that, And it's not about which one
has aged better, because.

Speaker 2 (01:19:36):
That's right, that fairly Okay, Sure, I rescind that small
part of what I just said, then.

Speaker 4 (01:19:43):
Will strike the last sentence from your incredible statement.

Speaker 5 (01:19:46):
Jay cut that I feel like it's like we're comparing
like Meddle their Solid is apocalypse now compared.

Speaker 2 (01:19:53):
To like I understand. That's what's that's what's fucked about
this this format, and that's why it hurts.

Speaker 4 (01:20:01):
That's why it hurts so much.

Speaker 3 (01:20:03):
Wait, what's Dragonheart? It was this bad CG Dragon. I
think Sean Connery was the voice.

Speaker 4 (01:20:09):
It's they shared a heart one.

Speaker 5 (01:20:10):
No one's like Dragon Heart sucks ass. But it's just like, look,
which I do not do the thing where I diminish
the Witcher. I don't love the Witcher.

Speaker 4 (01:20:18):
You can't.

Speaker 3 (01:20:19):
Yeah, it doesn't. It does not need your approval.

Speaker 5 (01:20:22):
I know, I know, but it's just it cannot be
overstated how much of a monumental moment for the medium
that metal year Solid in nineteen ninety eight was the
Witcher three is very fucking good, and it improved upon
the things Witcher one and two did, but it was
nothing on the level like I mean, Metal Your Solid

(01:20:42):
one was like Mario sixty four levels of like everything's
different now because we didn't know it was possible.

Speaker 4 (01:20:48):
Are you talking about? Three had an entire micro game
within it that became its own game as a result
of it, people didn't like put money games and became
outside of it.

Speaker 3 (01:20:58):
That shit. That's I'm talking like changing shit.

Speaker 2 (01:21:04):
I what was what did Minecraft go up against?

Speaker 3 (01:21:08):
Dan?

Speaker 1 (01:21:09):
You're doing a thing you do where you tell Mary
that an argument is not valid because we're trying to
get our favorite game are what we think is the
best game.

Speaker 4 (01:21:16):
Mine versus Metal Gear Solid three Sneak Eater.

Speaker 1 (01:21:19):
We're talking about impact, like Mary talked about Minecraft impact
and we kind of like shoot that away.

Speaker 5 (01:21:24):
I'm also like, I'm not saying just on the industry.
I am saying I'm also extrapolating that to be impact
on me as a gamer at that time, and we've taken.

Speaker 4 (01:21:33):
That into account as we've decided that it's not as important.

Speaker 1 (01:21:37):
Oh, I think I think Metal Your Solid was. If
we're arguing what's more important it's tough, metal gear solid
I think is more important for video games. Yeah, I'll
give them that.

Speaker 4 (01:21:48):
I agree, I think I think it's a very monumental one.
I think that the Witcher three is just an incredible experience.
And he's also talking about like how cinematic it is.
I mean, do you remember this nomadic cut scenes in
which Er three after you had just like killed so
many people and then you sat down and heard someone
sing a very sad song and how much it made

(01:22:09):
people feel in that moment, and then you got to
dead a sick lady. I mean, that game gave you
all the emotions.

Speaker 3 (01:22:16):
It was like a movie.

Speaker 5 (01:22:18):
Shoot sniper Wolf in the face while ancon watched and cried.

Speaker 1 (01:22:21):
Otocon's a little puss, but like he's supposed to be. Yeah,
I honestly this is hurting me more than I'm letting on.
I'm just enjoying poking Dan in the ribs because mental
YOURSELD is incredible and it's important.

Speaker 2 (01:22:35):
It absolutely changed things. I was not around when it did,
but I understand in the context of video game history
how it did.

Speaker 1 (01:22:42):
Uh, it's apples and origes. In the sense of what
I said earlier, one impacted things coming after it. One
did everything better than everything Buddy had been trying to do. Sure,
I don't know. Personally, I don't know. I honestly don't
know which I value more. I will just say the
overall response I had to the Witcher three, which I

(01:23:03):
played at the time it came out, So again, it's.

Speaker 2 (01:23:06):
Hard for me to compare it to Meddle. Your Solid
was more profound in many ways.

Speaker 5 (01:23:12):
I will say this, my first time playing Middle Year
Solid is probably, no joke, the most memorable and impactful
moment I.

Speaker 3 (01:23:21):
Have ever had playing video games. That's how strongly I
feel about it.

Speaker 5 (01:23:25):
Like there are a lot of games that I played
and it's like, Wow, this immediately feels really good.

Speaker 3 (01:23:29):
Wow, I fucking love this game. This is great.

Speaker 5 (01:23:30):
Meddle Year Solid is the number one as far as
like impactful moments on my life in a game that's nice.

Speaker 3 (01:23:40):
I appreciate it so nice.

Speaker 1 (01:23:42):
I would say the same thing to Mary, like, if
you're trying to sway me, I don't give a shit
what something meant to you personally. For the record, yeah,
I'm not poopooing your experience. I have X com two
experiences that I like, you could easily tell me, like
shut up.

Speaker 3 (01:23:55):
That's the part of this format, is I truly like
the more I.

Speaker 2 (01:23:58):
Think about it, the more I'm second guessing because I autely.

Speaker 3 (01:24:03):
Like h I mean, ultimately, I do think it is
going to come down to Mike here, because, like you know, I.

Speaker 4 (01:24:09):
Agree, I just want to express like a little bit,
because there was a lot of heavy push for metal gear,
and I just want to express like the vastness of
the world of the Witcher three, the Wild Hunt, and
how much fun each individual space is. In that game,
you were working with kings and you were discovering that

(01:24:29):
they were like pieces of shit, and you were like
solving crimes and people were getting killed by these like
crazy monsters in bogs, and you got to like find
lots and lots all the side quests that you got
to do in Witcher three where you were finding out
all these different people that needed you, and you were
just like ultimately the badass dude that came in there

(01:24:49):
and solved those crimes. Sometimes the people who hired you
were actually the bad person, and you got to kind
of discover that and figure it out. The storytelling, the
immergi siveness of that environment. Oh Man, the fucking game
system of having two swords and building up your play style,
and you were like, I need to have this exact

(01:25:10):
different spice concoction before I can take on this rock monster,
which was so dope the first time you experienced those
giant tree bosses or those rock monsters. I mean just
so many moments where you would actually say out loud,
that's sick. I cannot believe this happened. The Roach travel system,
and you would often not even like fast travel. You

(01:25:33):
would just let Roach run and the music would turn
up and you would vibe to the fact that you
were the Witcher. Role playing is the Witcher was so
much fun. God damn, that's such a solid game. And like,
when I think back on it.

Speaker 3 (01:25:48):
I don't.

Speaker 2 (01:25:49):
I don't think there's any right answer for me because
I wasn't.

Speaker 1 (01:25:53):
I will say if I was, if I was there,
what year was this ninety eight?

Speaker 3 (01:25:59):
If I was there in.

Speaker 2 (01:25:59):
Ny eight fucking.

Speaker 1 (01:26:02):
Swirling a Surrah when Psychomantis like fucking read my memory card,
I would have fucking shipped my high brow pants.

Speaker 3 (01:26:11):
Yeah, and when you have to unplug the control, it's
impossible all time.

Speaker 5 (01:26:16):
Let me say this too, is that as good as
the Witcher is that everything it's doing, it is a
matter of it refining and improving a lot of things
to a certain degree. Like, but the leap from things
in that genre before it to the Witcher three is
nowhere fucking near the leap between what came before Metal

(01:26:36):
Year and Metal Year.

Speaker 1 (01:26:38):
Sure, but I would still say Apocalypse Now is a
better movie than Citizen Kane.

Speaker 2 (01:26:41):
I'm sorry to say.

Speaker 3 (01:26:42):
Yeah, So that's that's what I'm saying. I still think,
like sitting in a vacuum.

Speaker 4 (01:26:52):
Man, Apocalypse Now is such a fucking sick film. Sweet
Ultimately we all agree Apocalypse.

Speaker 1 (01:26:57):
It's also like it's also we're doing like a U
Magic Johnson versus Steph Curry thing here. There's a there's
probably a more clear answer there, but like it's different
eras times like the impact of one can be outweighed
by just the sheer quality other. I do think I
have to give it to the Witcher three, though I
do think it's a better game, even even though Metal

(01:27:18):
Gear Solid absolutely deserves It's it's.

Speaker 4 (01:27:22):
The brackets spoken. The Witcher three Wild Hunt knocks out
Metal Gear Solid into the loser bracket Submit score.

Speaker 5 (01:27:31):
Why couldn't that have been temperious. I kind of don't
like Witcher three. Couldn't it have been something I really love?

Speaker 3 (01:27:38):
Wait?

Speaker 2 (01:27:38):
Wait wait wait, wait couldn't couldn't What do you mean?

Speaker 3 (01:27:40):
Couldn't there something I had to take out fucking metal
gear in the first round, something I liked a lot.
I kind of don't like what three.

Speaker 5 (01:27:49):
I know, I know, after the seventh hour of chasing
fucking flower pants around the continent.

Speaker 3 (01:27:55):
Whatever the dandelion flower, you got it right when you
actually thought on yes, thought about it for two seconds.
You got it right.

Speaker 2 (01:28:02):
All right, I'm gonna go to the bathroom and.

Speaker 4 (01:28:06):
We'll be back. Ye, I calling you, Michael.

Speaker 2 (01:28:09):
Now, I know that's what you have done that, Michael Moore.

Speaker 4 (01:28:11):
Amanda does it and I think it's funny.

Speaker 3 (01:28:13):
Yeah, does she does it with love?

Speaker 4 (01:28:15):
I kind of do it like a bit of a spice.

Speaker 3 (01:28:16):
And yeah, you're Michael, you do it.

Speaker 4 (01:28:18):
You take out the trash man.

Speaker 2 (01:28:21):
Coming back to you, Sexy Hark and oh the fires
sixty Hark all times just got fucking walloped by the
Witcher three.

Speaker 3 (01:28:32):
Turns out we made the right choice there. I don't know.
I just involuntarily shivered when you said that. I'm not kidding.
My body rejected that. Oh, Dan and Ben Hans are
gonna be so disappointed. I'm just shouting out, Ben, You're
just both wrong. Hands.

Speaker 1 (01:28:49):
Hanson's face flashed through my head when I went on
the break, because, like, I feel like he's gonna be
really pissed at us.

Speaker 3 (01:28:54):
First, he loves Memory. I don't know how he feels
about Winter, but I know.

Speaker 1 (01:28:59):
But he's also a like, really really knowledgeable video game
history so I feel like he's going to be I think, yeah,
I agreed.

Speaker 4 (01:29:06):
Anyway, it's not a video game history bracket. It's Fire
Escapes Best Game of All Time bracket. And as we
just mentioned, metal Gear Solid was just removed in round
one by the Witcher three Wild Hunt. Our next matchup
the Legend of Zelda Linked to the Past. This versus

(01:29:31):
say something stupid Skyrim.

Speaker 3 (01:29:34):
Oh we're cool? Are we cool?

Speaker 2 (01:29:37):
Yeah?

Speaker 4 (01:29:37):
Are we cool? I have a lot of good things
to say about Skyrim.

Speaker 3 (01:29:48):
Link to the Past is it's.

Speaker 2 (01:29:51):
Also, I don't I don't think we need to expound
on what makes Skyrim great.

Speaker 3 (01:29:53):
It's a great game.

Speaker 1 (01:29:54):
It's it's incredible. People keep buying it because it holds up.
But like Link to the Past is one.

Speaker 5 (01:29:59):
Of if I lost metal years solid at the link
of the Past back to back, I'm just quitting the.

Speaker 1 (01:30:04):
You made it one hundred I can't talk to you
to Yeah, the Past is just one of the most
well designed things ever game or otherwise. Yeah, Dan's I
feel like all of Dan's games get mentioned first.

Speaker 3 (01:30:22):
So then he's like, it's.

Speaker 4 (01:30:23):
Random, random, can't and some of these I do think
some of them coming up. I do think like you'll
see some of his second So it does, it does happen,
but yeah, it's just so, it just so happens that
all of his weird ones have been first.

Speaker 3 (01:30:39):
So far.

Speaker 5 (01:30:40):
We're next time Solids, my weird niche Chase.

Speaker 4 (01:30:46):
Now I'm just old.

Speaker 3 (01:30:48):
Yeah, we've got different eras.

Speaker 4 (01:30:50):
This would not be a Shakespeast at Cloud.

Speaker 1 (01:30:53):
I feel like we did represent some like different generations
of gamer here.

Speaker 4 (01:30:59):
Yeah, we have for like a well and for the record,
like a lot of these like additional games to get
us a bit more full circle were ones I came
up with which I was like, well, we have to have. Well,
it'll be weird if we didn't, right, I think it'll
be weird if we didn't have. And a lot of
the weird niche indie ones that will come up. I

(01:31:19):
also know we'll probably not survive, so like, I will
see how we go. But it was an honor to
get started through the first round.

Speaker 5 (01:31:27):
It's so weird though, because it's like, yeah, we are
kind of from slightly different you know, age right, Yeah,
but also we have wildly different tastes in games, so
this is just a crazy Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:31:37):
Sure, I don't mean to paint it like I'm like
twenty years younger than you. I think I just came up,
bab I came up at a time. I'm kind of
envious that. Again, you were there for shit like metal.

Speaker 2 (01:31:47):
You're solid.

Speaker 1 (01:31:47):
I mean I was seven. I wouldn't have gotten that
when I was seven. Like I also wouldn't have been allowed.

Speaker 4 (01:31:52):
To pl your parents were really cool.

Speaker 2 (01:31:54):
Yeah yeah no, I mean gotten it, understood it, or yes,
been allowed to play it. But like but I yeah, yeah,
you get what I'm saying.

Speaker 3 (01:32:01):
It was a good times I was born.

Speaker 2 (01:32:03):
It's a really fucking good time.

Speaker 4 (01:32:05):
Our next game matchup is Rainbow six Rogue Spear Versus
had half Life two.

Speaker 3 (01:32:16):
Ah, that's fine, put half Life through.

Speaker 1 (01:32:21):
I had I had half Life on my listen, those
are both mine, But I know Mary had Half Life
at number one.

Speaker 4 (01:32:26):
I mean half Life is like, it's the second message monumental,
is it the first?

Speaker 3 (01:32:32):
Is it the Is this still the best first person shooter?

Speaker 8 (01:32:35):
Mm?

Speaker 2 (01:32:38):
It's between that Halo one for me. I don't need
to get into the whole list.

Speaker 1 (01:32:44):
Yeah, Rainbow Rogue Spear is still like the peak of
the previous era of Rainbow six where you're actually planning
out these incredibly tense, complex tactical insertions with different team members,
and that game still does not get enough love for
how new it's systems were in terms of planning, how
you can have four squads of AI, the AI for

(01:33:04):
your co op teammates or not even co op your
teammates was incredible, some awesome maps for terrorist un and
for single player varied objectives just all around, probably the
best like spec ops type game ever before it went
to the Siege era, which I absolutely love. But uh yeah,
Rokeespier is one of my favorite games of all time,
and I have fond memories playing with my brothers. But

(01:33:26):
now Half Life two is maybe still the best shooter.

Speaker 3 (01:33:30):
Of all time.

Speaker 4 (01:33:32):
Maybe it's gotta be half Life.

Speaker 2 (01:33:33):
Take that with the greatest seal because I can't think
of it.

Speaker 4 (01:33:35):
It's gotta be. But yeah, I have a lot of
good memories playing Rainbow six. I actually don't think I played.
I played Siege.

Speaker 3 (01:33:42):
I think.

Speaker 1 (01:33:45):
First to say this one was kind of my like
cool guy, I vote, like, oh this is my off
the radar.

Speaker 3 (01:33:50):
Fuck I suck sometimes.

Speaker 4 (01:33:53):
Yeah, Okay, you went for the underdog and it went
up against Half Life two and now it's dead. So
I hope you're happy with yourself. Half Life to win
against Rainbow six Rogue Cheddar, and now we are on
to our next matchup. It's just a weird name. Spear.

Speaker 3 (01:34:13):
It's a weapon, but it's rogue, but it's but it's
a dewey star. Yeah, it's a rogue spear.

Speaker 4 (01:34:22):
I find that a strange name. Our next matchup is
I don't have any response.

Speaker 3 (01:34:29):
It's not.

Speaker 2 (01:34:31):
Fairly common couple. That's what military operations to do.

Speaker 3 (01:34:36):
They take two.

Speaker 2 (01:34:36):
It's like modern cocktail bars.

Speaker 1 (01:34:38):
It's like, oh, Gurney and sons, Like they just combined
two random unrelated.

Speaker 4 (01:34:42):
Nouns Rainbow six, Gurnie and sons.

Speaker 1 (01:34:46):
Yeah, like as every new restaurant in New York or
bar is like two words that make no sense together, Wolf.

Speaker 3 (01:34:54):
And tenor.

Speaker 4 (01:34:56):
Uncharted Tonic.

Speaker 3 (01:34:58):
Yes, that's my second favorite charged game.

Speaker 4 (01:35:04):
The next next matchup, Fallout three versus Divinity Original.

Speaker 3 (01:35:13):
Sin To, This is going to be completely divinity.

Speaker 1 (01:35:23):
I feel like I have the most where I have
what's the what's the horse in both races? But like
I know, Mary's divinity Original sin To. Absolutely she never
shuts up about it. I absolutely adore that game.

Speaker 2 (01:35:38):
But Fallout three is my favorite, one of my favorite
open world games.

Speaker 3 (01:35:42):
Let's let's do it.

Speaker 2 (01:35:43):
Go somebody, Mary.

Speaker 3 (01:35:45):
I don't even know what the divinity really is serious
Larry previous game.

Speaker 2 (01:35:52):
I'm sure it's Larry Studios game before balters Gate three.

Speaker 3 (01:35:55):
It's one of the best.

Speaker 4 (01:35:59):
Jesus Divinity Original Sin Too really paved the way for
RPG storytelling. You're basically like on this Sick Journey. You
can play it with friends, you can also play this solo.
The storytelling and dynamics at play here so that when
you meet a character and you tell them that they're

(01:36:21):
a really good thief, they can come back later and
rob you. I mean, you are building people over time
that will impact hours and hours and hours later. Down
in this game, and you put a lot of time
into building these characters and watching them develop and interact
with the world, and you are truly actually developing the
world as you play Divinity Original Sin. The amount of

(01:36:42):
different types of characters you can play as. Whether you
want to be a rogue or you want to be
a witch that does massive AoE spells, it's the world
is your oyster, and so being able to play around
with the environment, do environmental based kills. This is all
turned combat, so you get to kind of really think
and strategize about how you want to kill your opponents.

(01:37:06):
It's methodical and it's extraordinarily intricate. It's crazy the things
that you can concoct. And again, this is the kind
of stuff that like made boulders Gate is infamous as
it is. But I actually the reason I put Divinity
Original Sin in here is because I just think for
me personally, Divinity was all about that world building and
that stunning storytelling that allows you to say, I am

(01:37:29):
a witch with a heart of gold. I work hand
in hand with my sorceress friend and we play lone
wolf style and we just kind of burn the house
down in our way. Well, so in Divinity Original Sin,
you're supposed to you're supposed to play as four people,
but in Lone Wolf you can play as two people

(01:37:50):
that get one additional skill, so it's actually a place.
So but lone Wolf style is like here, instead of
playing with a pack of four, your playing with like
two or less people, so that you can actually get
through everything in a meaningful way. Key's finding secret doors
and hidden passageways. I mean they were kind of like
this is kind of the pinnacle of that design as well.

(01:38:12):
So like you might you might meet someone and they'll say,
we got to get into this old dungeon, but we
can't find an entrance. There's like ten different ways to
get in it. So how I get into this dungeon
and and win will be completely different to the way
Mike has done it. And they're both valid and really

(01:38:32):
interesting and engaging ways of telling a story, and they're
unique to us. I might have found a key in
a bush because I killed like somebody and they led
me to this like secret X on a map, and
so I found this like hidden back passageway. Mike might
have found c Ford exploded his way into the front
and then killed everybody who got in his way. It's
so awesome how unique every person's story is in Divinity,

(01:38:56):
and so it's really fun not just playing Divinity, but
talking to each other about how they actually got through
the same area, how different they are. But they're all
really fun. And Divinity is like such a joy to play,
you guys, I mean it's it's it's brilliant in terms
of game design, how how everybody can play it differently.

Speaker 3 (01:39:13):
Come out twenty seventeen, I believe.

Speaker 5 (01:39:16):
Yeah, Okay, I was gonna say, this is the first
I've heard about it, and I was like, that's that
cannot be coming from Giant. The name Divinity original set,
I'm shocked to But that's sure whatever like that the
name of this game.

Speaker 2 (01:39:30):
Did you think Larian just came out of nowhere with
Ballerskate three?

Speaker 3 (01:39:33):
I literally when I went to Belgium to go to
Larian to cover Balder's Gate three.

Speaker 5 (01:39:38):
This is somebody should miss as somebody something about like
you're Larian contact will be just like, what the fuck
is a Laryan contact?

Speaker 3 (01:39:47):
And I never heard of Larryan before this. Dan, don't
you should cut this? No, don't. I don't have anything.
It's just I don't know this is not not.

Speaker 1 (01:39:54):
Deserve what to play Baller's Gate three, and you didn't
things to look up what the studio has.

Speaker 3 (01:39:58):
Worked on in the past. I probably would have gotten
around to it. You did it. We're just gonna didn't
get around to travelog stuff. I don't need to know
anything for that.

Speaker 4 (01:40:07):
That's a ball gate.

Speaker 3 (01:40:09):
That's beside the point.

Speaker 4 (01:40:10):
Anyway, I'll be the one that goes to that. Europe.

Speaker 3 (01:40:14):
They're very nice, Larry and studios. Everyone there was awesome.
Natun it.

Speaker 4 (01:40:19):
This isn't the very nice awards. This is the fucking best.

Speaker 5 (01:40:21):
Game of right, No, noreat. You can watch their head
to blow up and slow.

Speaker 3 (01:40:26):
It's great.

Speaker 2 (01:40:27):
No so followed three was my vote.

Speaker 3 (01:40:29):
However, I.

Speaker 1 (01:40:33):
Don't care about it as much as you care about
Divinity Original Sin Too. Followed three was, But I love
Divinity Original Sin too. I think I like Balder's Gate
three bit more. However, I haven't gone back to it
since I last played. Me and Jake were doing a
co op campaign. I'd be fine with Divinity Original Sin
Too going up. I do think Fallout three is the
whole conversation about Fallout three versus New Vegas gets heated.

Speaker 3 (01:40:56):
I think fallow three is better.

Speaker 2 (01:40:58):
I don't.

Speaker 3 (01:40:59):
I like.

Speaker 2 (01:41:01):
People talk about how New Vegas.

Speaker 3 (01:41:02):
Can have those.

Speaker 4 (01:41:03):
What divinity is? It's not that you like one better, no.

Speaker 3 (01:41:07):
Better than New Vegas. Yeah, yeah, oh that's allowed it. Yes,
follow follow three.

Speaker 1 (01:41:12):
I think I'll say this before I agree with Mary
about divinity originals in two. Fallout three I think was
really impressive. It almost had a if it wasn't for
the elder scrolls. Uh for Oblivion doing the open world
RPG really ba basically like Bethesda putting it, debuting their
new style of game that carried through Skyrim, Fallout for

(01:41:34):
New Vegas, Starfield now sort of to a lesser extent,
but that open world go Anywhere RPG. It took Oblivion
and ran with it. In this post apocalyptic sci fi
world where there's a fucking city built on a decrepit
aircraft carrier. Talk about changing the world. You can go
find this town built around a dodge what you think

(01:41:54):
is a doudgshell of a nuke stuck halfway in the ground,
and there's a cult worshiping it and they're radiated, and
they're some ghouls that got outcasts, and you start to
learn the fucking story about different people going in and
out of that town is just some of the some
incredible RPG writing. And then you get faced with the
choice of whether you want to blow it up or not.
Later you can change the world in that regard, and
then the closer you get toward like the mall and

(01:42:17):
the Capitol.

Speaker 2 (01:42:18):
Building, the more urban it becomes.

Speaker 1 (01:42:20):
It's you could spend like hours an hours scavenging out
in the wastes in like in Bethesda or fox Chase
or whatever, Chevy Chase or whatever the neighborhoods are. That
That's still one of my favorite open world Bethesda games.
But but yeah, Divinity Original Sin Too and the quality
of its writing and the the just sheer number of

(01:42:41):
things you can stumble on that have unforeseen repercussions like
hours later is like I would even say Larian's work
kind of outpaces the Witcher or CD project in that regard,
which is saying a lot as we've discovered.

Speaker 3 (01:42:54):
So are we retconning the Metal year thing? No, I'm
fine with Original Sin Too.

Speaker 4 (01:43:02):
Racket has spoken tan.

Speaker 1 (01:43:03):
Original Sin Too and Balder's K three are probably two
of the the two best CRPGs ever made, and one
studio made both of them, which is just crazy. That's
neither here nor there, I guess. But yeah, Larryan makes
really good video games. If we did this, if we
did this episode in another like five years, I probably
put Baller's Gate three on there. Yeah, it hasn't settled yet.

Speaker 4 (01:43:24):
It hasn't. I haven't actually had enough time to finish it.
It's just a really long experience. But I absolutely like
I was just so moved by Divinity by the end
of it, and it's just a kind of an iconic
part of my life I think of it. I also
know it's around nine years old because I was playing
it when I got the call that Simon needed a home,

(01:43:47):
and so I know that it's around that time because
I had all my snacks ready and I had my
pillows on the floor and I was getting ready to
play Divinity Original Sin when I got the call saying, hey,
can you come get them? And I said yeah, and
I put all my way and I got my dog instead.

Speaker 2 (01:44:01):
He farted his way into your campaign.

Speaker 4 (01:44:03):
Farted his way into my heart.

Speaker 3 (01:44:05):
Yeah. No, diminitting Originals in two is awesome.

Speaker 5 (01:44:08):
I'd fight Herder for Fallout three. I liked it a
lot back then. I thought the DLC, especially for that era,
was like, oh yeah, really really good.

Speaker 4 (01:44:14):
Follow It is also I think the Maryland so beloved
in terms of like just globally. I thought I would lose,
and so I am.

Speaker 2 (01:44:21):
I'm not sure how I thought.

Speaker 1 (01:44:23):
I actually Fallout three is still one of my personal
top fifteen games of all time. I have really fond
memories of it. That was my first I didn't play
Oblivion until I played Fallout three, so that to that
open world. But that's that we all know what I'm
talking about, to literally go anywhere, spend hours wandering kind
of bethest open world. That was my first exposure to it.

(01:44:44):
I went back to Oblivion and it had already started
to age by then, and then by the time Skyrim
came out, I was, you know, in awe of that.
But No Divinity Originals in two was just so brilliantly engineered.

Speaker 5 (01:44:55):
I think something that hurts my memory of Fallout three
is that I look back and it was so emblematic
of that period where it was just like very much
this like kind of monochrome thing. It was just a
lot of just drabby apocalypse drab stuff. Like when I
think back, like something on the aesthetic now is Okay,
it's just kind of that one note.

Speaker 3 (01:45:12):
I mean it should be. It's about the apocalypse, but
it's apocalyptic, yeah, interspersed with all the grays and the Browns. Yeah.

Speaker 4 (01:45:20):
But had a good world building too. I mean it
had a show made after it. I mean it's it's
really made its way into pop culture now and the
Fallout universe is quite interesting. So I think this is
a tough matchup, and I think that they're both just
really solid. So I just have to go with the
one that is more meaningful to me. But I think
they're both great games. Where are we at then? What's happening?

Speaker 3 (01:45:43):
I will go to Divinity, Okay, I mean my vote
will go fall Out.

Speaker 4 (01:45:46):
But it's fine, Okay, you are not Your heart isn't
broken on that one.

Speaker 3 (01:45:53):
It's good, okay. Yeah.

Speaker 4 (01:45:54):
Our next matchup, Splunky versus is Tony Hawk's pro Skater three.

Speaker 3 (01:46:03):
Oh okay, all right, all right, look, Splunky is a
very good rogue light.

Speaker 4 (01:46:09):
Would you be a little Splunky? It's so important, It's
like one of the best rogue lights.

Speaker 3 (01:46:15):
Yeah.

Speaker 5 (01:46:16):
I didn't play it until like five years. I want
to say, like, when did they come out? I didn't
play during the pandemic, or I didn't play it until
the pandemic.

Speaker 4 (01:46:23):
It was during Game Spots Era, soe twenty fourteen, it
is going to be my guest well with my game
spot Era sorry not game Spots Existence.

Speaker 3 (01:46:32):
Yeah.

Speaker 4 (01:46:33):
I remember Carolyn Pettitt was raving about Splunky and that's
actually why I picked it up. And my god, did
I put so many hours into Splunky at the time.
I yeah, it's a really, really really solid game, expertly crafted,
and god it was kind of like everybody wanted to

(01:46:57):
talk about it at the time. I think it's gonna
be a tough cell depending on how big everyone is
into Tony Hawk's Pro Skater three, which I also played,
I had one of the best soundtracks.

Speaker 2 (01:47:07):
All right, not to offend everybody.

Speaker 1 (01:47:10):
I know two of course, but like which I have
a hard time differentiating Tony Hawks.

Speaker 3 (01:47:15):
So I can tell you all of it.

Speaker 5 (01:47:17):
It's three is I think the best Tony Hawk because
it is the one that like one kicked ass and
then two introduced the manual, so then all of a
sudden you can chain things together. Yes, I know, man
that really opens things up. But three was the one
that added the revert, which was the last step you needed.
Where it's like, if you're doing a vert trick as
you land, you hit R two and you can kind
of spin around into a manual. So at that point

(01:47:39):
you can basically just go the whole two minute run
and then some by just chaining a million things together.
So if you got good at that game, and that
is one of the few games were talking about punched
out earlier. I injured my my thumb fucking turned black
from just digging in so hard on this game, because
it really rewarded you getting into that flow state and
knowing how to change your flip tricks to your grinds,

(01:48:01):
to your verts, to your manuals and reverts and everything.
The levels are fantastic.

Speaker 2 (01:48:06):
It is.

Speaker 5 (01:48:06):
It is the peak of one of the all time
great franchises. It's also i think maybe just like it
rivals the best marios with like the best feeling games
of all time to play. You feel fucking awesome when
you're pulling stuff off in that game.

Speaker 4 (01:48:21):
To this day, it's a tough.

Speaker 2 (01:48:26):
Yeah, that's nodding my head.

Speaker 3 (01:48:28):
For those who don't who are just listening, it's.

Speaker 4 (01:48:30):
Just such a solid it's a solid game. I mean,
I I also enjoyed playing this. I don't think I
had the childhood experiences playing it old people have, but
I I did.

Speaker 3 (01:48:44):
You were younger than me.

Speaker 4 (01:48:45):
Had I had friends who played this game, and that
I would go over to their house and we would
play together. And it is just like a really iconic
and seamless experience, and it was a cool person's game.
Everyone who was cool had this in their house. I
think it's kind of iconic to its time, and I
think I actually I don't think I would fight that

(01:49:05):
hard for Splunky over it.

Speaker 3 (01:49:06):
I think I think this is awesome.

Speaker 5 (01:49:08):
It's really good, and there's some similarities here too, because
I really do think Spilunky will be one of those
games that ten twenty years from now, just by nature
of the design and what that game is, I think
that will feel really good to play eternally. I think
if there's anything that might be dated with it, I
kind of think the art style is a little kind
of of its era.

Speaker 3 (01:49:27):
I don't love the art styles Plunky.

Speaker 5 (01:49:29):
You know, Tony Hawk three doesn't look modern or anything,
but that was more of a technological limitations.

Speaker 3 (01:49:34):
I just and maybe it's subjective.

Speaker 5 (01:49:36):
I just don't love this flunky art style, but I
think it will play great ten twenty thirty years from now.

Speaker 4 (01:49:41):
Yeah, it was really solid, Mike. I'm curious where you're
at here. I'm like, I'm not going to like die
on this hill.

Speaker 2 (01:49:48):
But yeah, uh, I can't split the decision between those two.

Speaker 1 (01:49:52):
So again, I barely remember Tony Hawk pro Skater three
as its own individual entity. I will say I I
have only ever played I say only. I think I've
probably put being honest fifty hours into Spelunky. I've played
more two, and Spelunkie two, in my opinion, is like

(01:50:13):
one of those games that's close to perfect. I the
first Pelunkie was the first time as an adult. I
think that I felt the same sense of discovery and
mystery and what the fuck's gonna happen next? And all right,
there's a lot of complex rules I need to learn
through trial and error. I'm not going to read a guide.

(01:50:33):
Oh this warps me to hear. Oh this pisses him
off if I use this item. Let's not mess with
this prospector Oh okay, now he's got a shotgun. This
is great, turns out the shot and can really fuck
you over in certain areas. Wait a minute, there's a
whole new biome I didn't even know about. Uh, Spelunky
reminded me why I loved video games to begin with.
That's a very personal thing, but I just think it
was built.

Speaker 2 (01:50:54):
Spelunky's like the most video game ass video game ever,
And in this argument, it's going up against Tony Hawks
pro Skater three, which is one of the from what
you've told me, if it's anything like Tony Hawk's pro
Skater two, which I played the shit out of, one
of the most video game as video games ever, I
don't particularly care that much for each one. I can
see myself going back to Spelunky two in like a
year or two, and that's all I talk about. But

(01:51:16):
at this point in time right now, I'm I'm kind
of differing on this.

Speaker 3 (01:51:21):
One right now.

Speaker 5 (01:51:22):
It's funny I made the argument earlier about how I
still load up, you know, warrior ware every time I'm
setting up an analog pocket or something like that, and
some of them, like a lot of them, they will
only play like two D games and maybe up to
like you know, PS one, and whenever I get one,
it's like, oh, okay, steam Deck. I heard that's good,
like you know PS two or the Rock Ally or
something that the one I always go to to test

(01:51:43):
how good something is with PS two stuff is Tony
Hawk three, just because you go to the Foundry, you
just drop right in and you're instantly like if something
is even the slightest bit off with that game, you know,
because that game controlled so fucking tightly. So that is
my go to all the time with anything from that
PS two era, and I do think it holds up
incredibly well. I'm sure if somebody came to it now
for the first time and you know, and didn't play

(01:52:05):
all of the series leading up to it, it might
be a bit much. But yeah, you know, Mary mentioned
the music too, starting out with Asa Spades, and I
think that one had the Dell, the funky Homo Sapien,
a bunch of great stuff on there. Like it's just
it's it's an iconic fucking game, iconic series, and this
is the height of the series.

Speaker 4 (01:52:26):
Dude's Blunky had so many fucking sick moments where you
were just.

Speaker 6 (01:52:29):
Like, there's no way I'm gonna make it out of this,
and then you fucking did, and you'd be like, yes,
I am the greatest gamer alive, and then you would
get hit by a fucking snake, and then and then
you would just get hit three more times before you
hit there he was dead.

Speaker 4 (01:52:42):
He was so beautiful that game humbled the shit out
of you.

Speaker 3 (01:52:45):
Oh yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:52:46):
It's also like it's up there with GTA five in
the sense that why the fuck did the developer spend
that much time making this ending quote unquote ending and
it Spelunky it's not really a thing which the I've
never seen it, but there's criteria to reach a certain ending.
It's like, I don't I genuine don't understand how anybody
discovered this, let alone achieve this, and they probably spent

(01:53:07):
I don't know. I don't design games, but it must
have been a sizable chunk of the fucking time it
made to make that game, just so maybe one person
could see it and then tell their friends at the
water cooler, which is the really cool shit about most
of my favorite video games. Again, I'm sure like I'll
come around to Spelunky two again more in the future,
game which I loved but always was just comparing it

(01:53:29):
to the first game, which I SPLUNKI one was one
of those games that always impressed the hell out of
me more than I genuinely got attached to. Yeah, I'm
I don't know, am Am I the deciding vote right
now or Mary or you kind of.

Speaker 4 (01:53:48):
Yeah, I think that I put Splunky on here, so
I lean towards Splunky, but I'm not gonna this is
This is a tougher sell for me, but I will.

Speaker 2 (01:53:58):
Say I will say Dan had swayed me more than
me too.

Speaker 3 (01:54:04):
Yeah, I think.

Speaker 4 (01:54:06):
I think it was very important to you, and I
do think Splunky was important to me. But I don't
think that I see Splunky getting very far in this bracket,
and I just think which I think.

Speaker 1 (01:54:17):
It should, but I don't think I have put enough
time and like into it. But that's again, that's just
doesn't matter.

Speaker 4 (01:54:25):
Okay, Tony Hawk pro skater three winds over Splunky.

Speaker 2 (01:54:31):
Chris Plants rolling in his bed.

Speaker 4 (01:54:37):
It's a fire escape.

Speaker 2 (01:54:39):
Yeah, yeah, no, he listens poops just joking in bed. Yep,
did you guys not know this about Chris Plant?

Speaker 3 (01:54:47):
No? No, that's thing.

Speaker 4 (01:54:48):
Yeah, yeah, he's got new fandangle toilet beds.

Speaker 3 (01:54:52):
Look, that's what we did in Kansas City growing up.

Speaker 1 (01:54:53):
He's from there can Sands and there poop beds. What
we call ourselves too could never fall as you po
into Dreamland.

Speaker 4 (01:55:02):
Next matchup super Mario Bros.

Speaker 3 (01:55:06):
Three.

Speaker 4 (01:55:08):
Would you like me to say brothers super Mario Brothers three?

Speaker 3 (01:55:11):
I usually just say Mario three.

Speaker 4 (01:55:13):
Yeah, yeah, versus the Last of Us?

Speaker 3 (01:55:23):
This is like the okay Corral, let's look at it.

Speaker 4 (01:55:28):
Yeah, you don't see it. It's like twelve angry men,
but there's only three of us. But we're all kind
of like looking at each other.

Speaker 3 (01:55:33):
I when you start, I think I was the last
of us.

Speaker 4 (01:55:38):
I was also the last of us. That's a joint.

Speaker 1 (01:55:41):
Hey, I swayed my Mary swayed me on divinity. You
got me an, Tony Hawk. I'm not rigid.

Speaker 2 (01:55:46):
I mean I'm very hard right now, but I'm not
like stubborn.

Speaker 4 (01:55:51):
I mean, come on, the last of Us is like
this iconic storyline.

Speaker 3 (01:55:56):
Did Mario three ever changed?

Speaker 2 (01:55:58):
Yeah?

Speaker 4 (01:55:59):
That you for anybody?

Speaker 2 (01:56:02):
No, I I this is not a matchup. I anticipated
I was.

Speaker 5 (01:56:05):
About to say it was the last of us in
a movie. They made a whole series.

Speaker 4 (01:56:10):
Basically, Yeah, they sure did. It's HBO series and it's extremely.

Speaker 3 (01:56:16):
If I'm not gonna win, like do I do?

Speaker 2 (01:56:18):
I waste I know, yes, please, because I'm open to
being swayed.

Speaker 4 (01:56:22):
Can't waste your breath.

Speaker 3 (01:56:23):
I love it. But I feel like this is like
a metal your solid thing of two words. So I'm
going into old man like you had to be there.
You did have to be there. So Mario, fucking Mario,
you both understand. How great guy? Yeah?

Speaker 5 (01:56:38):
If you're a fucking four or five year old like
I was in the late eighties, obsessed with fucking Mario.

Speaker 3 (01:56:45):
All right, but what what you were obsessed with? Whatting him? Oh?
Having sex with Mario?

Speaker 2 (01:56:52):
Yes?

Speaker 3 (01:56:52):
No, that did it? Sounded weird now that I think
about it. Okay, no Mario, Okay, when you're obsessed with
fornicating with Mario like I was as a four year old,
like I am.

Speaker 5 (01:57:02):
Yeah, yeah, as a four year old, Mario was everything.
Mario was the entire world. It was the only thing
that mattered. I didn't know pro wrestling existed for another
five years.

Speaker 3 (01:57:13):
Mario was the world. And then two comes out. I
loved I mean the US too. I love that.

Speaker 5 (01:57:18):
I'm not gonna do a whole history thing here anyway.
Three starts getting hyped up like crazy, and this is
around the time, you know, I'm five or six, I'm
starting to give video game magazines and shit, I'm seeing
screenshots of like Mario three. Oh my god, he's got
a raccoon tail, He's got all that. Oh it looks
so fucking good. And then the Wiz comes out that
movie where they showed that do not know this. It
was just an old guy thing.

Speaker 2 (01:57:39):
Wiz a Seinfeld character for me.

Speaker 5 (01:57:41):
Oh wow, okay. Well, at the the climax of the
Whiz was they goat. It was like a thing in
conjunction with Nintendo. This movie was made but released in theaters.
And at the end they go to this like video
game competition where somehow they turn Mario three into a
thing and they're doing the bonus games as a competition. Anyway,
all the matters was it. It was kind of the
debut of Mario three. The way they would do it

(01:58:02):
Nintendo Direct now to show off the new Mario. It's like, oh,
if you want to see Mario three before it comes out,
we're gonna show parts of it. And the Whiz it
was the Wizard. I think it's called The Wizard. Yeah,
And so people literally like the hype was so crazy
that you would go buy a fucking ticket to go
see this movie to get a glimpse of a new
video game instead of watching it on an E three
stream or a YouTube video or something like that.

Speaker 3 (01:58:26):
That's how off the charts the hype was.

Speaker 5 (01:58:29):
And I think where it falls off for me in
terms of being able to make a major argument here
is it was not necessarily a meddle year solid moment
where it's like this changes everything. It was more of
a Zelda one to link to the past situation, where
it's like it is taking the framework of the original.
This is what that greatly improved, even though this was

(01:58:51):
actually on the same system Zelda went from SNS. This
is on the same system. It was just that Mario
three was leaps and bounds ahead of everything one and two?

Speaker 3 (01:59:00):
Did I mean? I fucking love two?

Speaker 5 (01:59:01):
But three is three is right behind Mario World in
terms of just like this is a perfect video game.

Speaker 1 (01:59:06):
So I have not played much Mario World, Burrows three,
three different games, World Barrows three, Super Mario Bros.

Speaker 3 (01:59:20):
Three. Okay, oh is that what we're talking about.

Speaker 1 (01:59:23):
Yes, I've played. I played it back in the day.
I've not played much since I was young. It's incredible still,
it's game design like game design, what what is it?
Is it what makes the platform and good level design?

Speaker 8 (01:59:33):
You know.

Speaker 5 (01:59:33):
It was the first one to have that overworld, you know,
whereas like you know, one, you just go from thing
to thing, and and two you go from the level
of the level, and there were warps and stuff like
that and one and two, but with three you had
the overworld where you could decide, like, I fucking hate
this auto scroll level. Uh you know, I know if
I don't beat it, I can't get to this toad house.
But I can just go do this level instead of
that one. I can still get to the fortress, you

(01:59:54):
know that type of stuff. And then the skips and
stuff were like you'd find the warp whistle. There three
warp whistles hidden throughout the eight worlds and everything. Each
world had a fun gimmick. It was the first sight
seeing to do like the big small world where you know,
you go into one like the Goombazzer Giant and like,
you know, fun gimmicks like that. The power ups were incredible.
It's the one that introduced the raccoon tail. So it's
the first one where Mario's like flying, which was a

(02:00:17):
last and that opens up like as soon as like
you open up the ability where Mario can fucking fly.
There are all these moments where it's like, yeah, but
you need to get a run up to fly, So
certain parts of levels you oh, I could fly right now,
And there's always that mystery of like what is above
the screen right now? You know, if I were to
fly right now. A lot of times you go up
there and it's like, oh shit, there's all these clouds

(02:00:38):
and question mark blocks, and there's a fucking pipe there
that takes them to this bonus area. So even though
it was just a side scrolling platform or there was
always this mystery of like what's just out of sight?
Or weird fucking things like if you duck on a
white block for six seconds, it puts you behind the stage,
like it puts you behind the background elements, and you
can run behind things and warp to other areas and stuff.

(02:01:01):
It's just so filled with secrets that felt nothing short
of magical back then. You know, the previous Mario one
and two had you know, some warps and things like that,
but three just was the most mysterious and fascinating thing
I could fucking imagine in you know, late eighties early nineties.

Speaker 3 (02:01:20):
Okay, it's incredible and it holds up today.

Speaker 5 (02:01:22):
It plays like you know, Mario one was very important
to me, doesn't play amazing these days.

Speaker 3 (02:01:26):
Mario three. I play it now and I fucking love
every second of it.

Speaker 8 (02:01:32):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (02:01:32):
I replayed the Last of Us the Remastered recently, and
I like the Last of Us Part two.

Speaker 3 (02:01:40):
I think it's way too long. I think a lot
of it was bloated.

Speaker 1 (02:01:43):
Last of Us Part one is still one of the
most incredibly paced games a just the cross country post
apocalypt It's like the best road trip game ever, and
I think people forget that it's a road trip game.
You're trying to get to Saltly City or no, you're
originally trying to get to You go through Pittsburgh Northwest.

Speaker 2 (02:02:05):
That's where Part two eventually they get to. But there
you get to Salt Lake City. That's where you see
the giraffes in that moment, which.

Speaker 1 (02:02:10):
I guess like cliche is that moment has become now
that actually was really fucking cool to like be in
this really grim world for that long and you're doing
some fucked up shit as Joel, and I also don't
think that game gets enough credit for how good its
combat is, and I think last part last was part two.
Is roguelike Mode actually showcases the combat in a way
that I'm like, yes, this is last part one. It's

(02:02:34):
very much about like, what the fuck is in my
immediate vicinity that I can just smash someone over the
head with quick Okay, I don't have any other choice.
I'm just gonna kick him a few times, punch him,
and then there's another guy coming at me. I've got
one rifle bullet left, but I don't want that guy
to kill me. So like the way that that game's
combat captures the heat of the moment decision making that

(02:02:54):
many games kind of trivialize grounds that combat in a
way that works for that world. So well, I'm not
gonna sit here and say that that game was what's
the phrase I'm looking for. I think a lot of
people say, oh, it's grim. It was like really it
was violent, it was dark. Like, I still love playing
the game. I have a lot of fun playing it.
I think it feels great. I think the remaster helped.

(02:03:16):
I also, like, I know the weapons sway got criticized
because it just didn't feel great. It was like I
don't think it's supposed to. Joel's not a soldier, he's
his dad. That like shit went south, But holy shit,
it's up there with Half Life two. Half Life two
is City seventeen, opening off the train and then running
escaping through the hallways, like the intro to the Last
of Us when Sarah, your daughter dies, When you're escaping

(02:03:38):
the military and you're kind of controlling things.

Speaker 3 (02:03:40):
You're not.

Speaker 1 (02:03:41):
It's very naughty Dog set piece cinematic, but you're sort
of controlling it, which they're very good at. It turns
out all the way straight through to again. I think
people have looked. I think Last gets that BioShock infinite
treatment where there absolutely are big flaws and it's thematic storytelling.
I'll I'm right there with people. I also think people

(02:04:01):
look back and kind of diminish the impact certain moments
had at the time that last line and Last was
Part one. I replaying it recently, is still we all
know the implications it has for Part two.

Speaker 3 (02:04:13):
The fact that.

Speaker 2 (02:04:16):
Going back to the game, that script led up.

Speaker 1 (02:04:19):
To that moment so fucking expertly that I didn't I
reviewed that game for Gaming Nexus back in twenty thirteen.
I had to run Rush Home from E three. Jump
into that game, start playing it, and as I was
playing it was like, oh my god, what is how
has Naughty Dog done this? You know they came off
of Uncharted three before they did this. That was just
like a studio flexing its design chops, showing hey, we

(02:04:42):
can do this as well. That Joel Ellie relationship there
are those two characters are just so fleshed out, so real.
I hate the phrase lived in, but they you know,
it was what Troy Baker.

Speaker 3 (02:04:55):
And uh from Mass Effect.

Speaker 7 (02:04:59):
I don't know the girls, Yeah, it's I really should
look but like, yeah, they killed those parts and.

Speaker 1 (02:05:05):
Like that relationship, and you learn more about Ellie and
you're like, oh, okay, Ellie's the central character here, but
like the the you know, Joel using her as a yeah,
and you all of a sudden talk.

Speaker 4 (02:05:17):
About Ryan and everyone's like what the fuck?

Speaker 3 (02:05:20):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (02:05:22):
But again, replaying it, I forgot how well that was handled.
Because Joel gets he falls off a balcony in the
campus where they think there might be something they need
in Colorado.

Speaker 2 (02:05:32):
He falls off, piece of rebar goes through him. He's like,
that's through his kidney.

Speaker 3 (02:05:35):
He's fucked. She gets him back on the horse basically,
and then it cuts.

Speaker 1 (02:05:40):
And for those who don't remember, the game is structured
into each each of the four seasons, so that was fall, fall,
and then all of a sudden it cuts and it's
just winter. It's the close up on that rabbit, just
like kind of like being cute in the woods, and
all of a sudden arrow hits it. There's that famous
like stream clip of the girl, the woman who is
like streaming that she sees it surprise, and all of

(02:06:00):
a sudden, you're like, holy shit, I'm playing as Ellie.
It was like a yeah, it was like ride in
the way. The camera came behind her and you realize,
oh my god, it's going in a position. I'm going
to play as her. They don't tell you that Joel
is in a basement in this house in this random
suburb in the cold, because they couldn't put him anywhere else.
Like the the restraint that game shows in many moments,

(02:06:23):
and how it ties that the impact of its big
storytelling moments into the gameplay. When all of a sudden,
like when Ellie sees Nolan North's character David, who is
like there's something off about him, but he's really charming
and charismatic. Turns out no, he's a cannibal cult leader
and he killed that performance as well. It's Nolan North,
But I'm as the control goes back to you, as Ellie,

(02:06:46):
You're like, I really am in a dire situation.

Speaker 2 (02:06:49):
This dude is creepy and dangerous. I need to get
the fuck out of here.

Speaker 1 (02:06:51):
The way that game flits between Okay, here's the story
we want to tell his Naughty Dog, But then when
the control goes back to your hands, the way that
they can kind of transfer the momentum of the emotion
from that cut scene into your controller is just fucking like.
Part two doesn't get anywhere close to Part one in
that regard. And you know that, I think Last of
Us is Naughty Dog at its peak. They have not

(02:07:14):
surpassed it yet.

Speaker 3 (02:07:15):
And I that that.

Speaker 1 (02:07:17):
I'm so happy I replayed that game recently because it's
still really fucking holds up. It's just also paced really well.
The mission variety mission not mission, but like level variety.
The situations you're in, this fucking gang that's abducting people
in Pittsburgh. I need to sneak and then all of
a sudden oh stelt Steltz fucked.

Speaker 2 (02:07:31):
I gotta go loud and just try to kill people
however I can to protect Ellie's love it.

Speaker 4 (02:07:36):
It's it's a really tough comparison as well. This is like,
uh Apocalypse Now Versus Paddington Bear two, Like they're both
really excellent, but like, holy shit, one is annihilating and
stressful and just will gut you. I do think Super
Mario Bros. Three is a fantastic, fantastic childhood experience, and

(02:08:01):
I you know, we've been doing a lot of this
is like which one would you play? Which one do
you enjoy play more? And it's like, really, it depends
on my vibe because I would not play the last
of Us on a whim. It is stressful and chaotic
and like really hard to get through in some parts,
not because it's bad, but because it's so gut wrenching
on my soul, whereas like Super Mario Bros. Is the light,

(02:08:24):
It is ice cream baby, It is like yes, please
all the time. You could play that game at any
moment and it will bring you joy.

Speaker 2 (02:08:31):
So they're just really really really quick response to that, Mary,
I agree, but I also think there are moments of
joy throughout the Last of Us that you forget about
that just of course get overshadowed by how grim the
rest of it is.

Speaker 1 (02:08:42):
But like they really earn those like giraffe moments, so
to speak. But anyway, sorry, someone who get killed, go
ahead down, yeah.

Speaker 5 (02:08:49):
Yeah, I mean, you know how I am with Mario
and how I love it. Obviously my boat will go
to Mario three. I played it like three days ago
and we so fun. But I don't think of The
Last of Us often, frankly, and I don't think of
it as like one of my favorite games. But you know,
as we talk about it, and I am kind of
brought back to my time with it. I'm not a

(02:09:10):
I don't like playing stealthily. I don't like playing stealth games.
I like Metal Gear for the story. I don't like
sneaking around because I'm bad at it, and the Last
of Us I don't consider a stealth game. But like
what Mike was saying about, like the stealth mechanics and everything,
I think the actual stealth gameplay is better in the
Last of Us than I have seen in Metal Gear
or Splinter Cell or Assassin's Screed.

Speaker 3 (02:09:31):
It's fucking awesome.

Speaker 5 (02:09:32):
For that sun and I also don't consider myself someone
who likes stories in video games for the most part,
and the Last of Us specifically that first one. Actually
I like two as well, but that first one especially,
I remember being like invested. You know, normally cut se
time is like all right, I'm like half paying attention
with most games. This one I was like by the end,
I was like god damn, and yeah that last line

(02:09:53):
and going to credits is just like, would you say it's.

Speaker 4 (02:09:55):
A more gripping story than a metal Gear No, let's.

Speaker 3 (02:09:59):
Say absolutely not.

Speaker 1 (02:10:01):
I think it's more grounded than a metal gear literally
by definitely, like metal gear is just such more like
big scale and like it's.

Speaker 4 (02:10:08):
President Baby is winking at me. Yeah there's like.

Speaker 3 (02:10:13):
Yeah, yeah, whatever, I mean it not.

Speaker 4 (02:10:17):
On this list.

Speaker 5 (02:10:19):
I do think Middle Yourselid is the best story ever
told across any medium. I do believe that Mike's eyes
just about popped out of his head. But like, yes,
I do think it is the best story in the
history of.

Speaker 3 (02:10:31):
In his grave.

Speaker 2 (02:10:34):
Yeah story ever, yeah, yeah, to your point last yeah, no, no, no,
it's all the same.

Speaker 3 (02:10:41):
Like I I do really respect the Last of Us.
I did really enjoy it.

Speaker 5 (02:10:45):
And I don't think the winner of this should be like,
you know, just because I go back to Mario three
like twice a month for my entire life doesn't necessarily
mean it's better or worse than a game that I
played in twenty thirteen and haven't thought about that much
since it's not about replayability. And I'm also not saying
that the House is better than Mario. It helps, you know,

(02:11:05):
my vote is Mario three for the record, but it's.

Speaker 3 (02:11:08):
All to say we know, we've heard you. Yeah, I'm
not going to put up a stink about Last of
Us if that's where this goes.

Speaker 1 (02:11:14):
I love the stealth in the Last of Us because
it actually feels it's not a lot of games are like, oh,
you have the option to go stealth. The option to
go allows like no Last of Us is like stealth
is a necessity until it's not an option anymore.

Speaker 5 (02:11:24):
And then the way it transitions into like oh ship
that caught me, like here's a brick, fuck you, it
was really good.

Speaker 1 (02:11:30):
Yeah yeah, Or here's a Molotov cocktail. His friend's on
fire and now he's freaking out even though yeah it's
fucking good.

Speaker 4 (02:11:38):
Yeah, Well we're gonna need to make a call. So
I'm going to say, okay, I'm going to say the
Last of.

Speaker 3 (02:11:46):
Us all right, fair enough.

Speaker 1 (02:11:50):
If that was the last most Part two versus well,
I didn't nominate it, but like if it came, I wouldn't.

Speaker 2 (02:11:54):
I would have gone Mario. But last week I agree
so much better.

Speaker 4 (02:11:57):
Part two is like so stressful Part one or Last of.

Speaker 2 (02:12:01):
Us too long.

Speaker 1 (02:12:02):
I also don't think they should have so exhausted Gears
five like those Open World Last.

Speaker 4 (02:12:11):
Of Us wins against Super Mario Brothers three. Our next matchup,
Left for Dead two versus Resident Evil remake, Oh fun,
this one, This one is my sadness. Left for Dead
two is extremely important to me. It is absolutely like,

(02:12:33):
when it comes to horror genre, the best multiplayer like
stress them zombie game I've ever played. And I didn't
play Resident Evil until later in my life. So my
experiences with what's the perfect zombie game, it's It's Left
for Dead too, and it always is Left for Dead too.
It is just this iconic team based zombie game. It

(02:12:57):
stresses you out. There's so many good moments of camaraderie
figuring out, like going against your first witch, hitting your
first parked car and having the alarm go off, getting
all the gas canisters in the mall while things are
absolutely going to shit really hype you up. And I feel,
really this is a really tough one for me. I

(02:13:20):
feel really strongly about Left for Dead two, but I
mean I Resident Evil remake.

Speaker 3 (02:13:25):
How did the two zombie games?

Speaker 2 (02:13:27):
Yeah, Left four Dead and Left for Dead two is
a the director.

Speaker 1 (02:13:33):
The AI system they use to control the flow of
things is just still no idea. How the fuck you
even make something like that?

Speaker 3 (02:13:40):
And two?

Speaker 1 (02:13:42):
Left for Dead and one and two, which kind of
might as well be one thing, are like the most
difficult games to talk about what makes them feel so
good because they're so simple on the surface and the
immediate moment to moment gameplay is so seems simple. But
people are still modding Left for Dead too, A shit

(02:14:03):
ton of people still play that game over Back for Blood,
and there's like videos you could see the comparisons, like
here's why that minu shaw matters in how you can
destroy things in a room and Left for Dead and
why the bullets hitting a zombie this way make it
feel just satisfying to play, and how ducking and shooting
just over characters head. It's it's really hard to put
into words, and I'm clearly not good at it, but

(02:14:25):
that game is just still even like Zombie aside from
Zombies and co op, it's just one of the best
feeling shooters ever.

Speaker 3 (02:14:34):
It's I truly want I want to see like a video.

Speaker 1 (02:14:38):
I say that breaks down what makes it so good
on a you know, on a nuanced level, because I
don't fully understand it, but it still feels amazing to
jump back into today.

Speaker 3 (02:14:47):
But Resume Will Remake, Oh my god.

Speaker 4 (02:14:49):
Yeah, Dan, I'm curious where you are. Yeah, I put
Left for Dead and you put Resident Evil Remake. I'm
with you on another Resident Evil, but REMA is still
a little rough for me. It's obviously phenomenal, but it
actually I think it was my favorite of all the
Resident Evils.

Speaker 3 (02:15:08):
Which kind of funny.

Speaker 4 (02:15:09):
I think I'm backtracking a little bit. Resident Evil is
like Remake specifically, is like very iconic and very important.

Speaker 3 (02:15:16):
I think I just have.

Speaker 4 (02:15:18):
This is really hard. The Left for Dead. I have
like a lot of good memories with Mike and I
have some of the best memories at my time at
game Spot and beyond playing Resident Evil, so I would
be really happy with both of these, and it guts
me that one of these won't get through. I'm curious, Dan,
like where you are on this.

Speaker 5 (02:15:34):
I'm I'm coming from the place where it's like, I
was never a big zombie game guy, but like I
did like Resident Evil quite a bit, and I did, like,
I think there's two games that I liked a lot,
and I've played both of these games a lot. I
was never a fanatic about either of them. I think
my appreciation for ARI grew over time, and my first

(02:15:54):
time actually playing through the remake was they you know,
probably like fifteen twenty sixteen, they put it on Steam. Like,
I actually like tank controls. I was never an anti
tank control person, but I just say that it was
the remake where they took that, they made that an
option to do normal stuff, and I did that once.
Then I was like, oh wait, I totally see why
they do tank controls going back to that. But I

(02:16:15):
think that is, you know, until the last five years,
I think it was a no brainer for the best
remake of all time as far as that Ari remake
and the fact that that first time they put it
out in what O two or whatever, which was a
few year, like what ninety six to two, not that
much time between it, because like, yeah, Ari one came
out ninety six set to ninety eighty one, Yeah, and

(02:16:35):
the GameCube Ari remake was two in that time. I'm
reer seeing screenshots of it in magazines and being like,
that's not possible.

Speaker 3 (02:16:42):
There's no way.

Speaker 5 (02:16:43):
The fucking candles looked that good, Like the lighting, like
it just looked insane. And it was so faithful to
all of the things that made the original one just
six years prior so great and just objectively made everything
so much better, and not just it's not just the
remaster treatment. It is the fully like we are changing puzzles,

(02:17:04):
we are adding entire parts of this game that were
not there before that we're maybe alluded to in a
note or something with Lisa.

Speaker 3 (02:17:11):
That shit was awesome. It was like Left for Dead.

Speaker 5 (02:17:14):
I think was a very impressive, especially for its time
online co op game where you didn't see a lot
of stuff doing what it was doing. Mike, you mentioned
the director tech and like that really was like, holy shit.
For a game where you only have a limited amount
of kind of space and objectives and stuff, that's how
you keep it fresh, is like each play through is
different because it is throwing different stuff at you every time.

Speaker 3 (02:17:36):
That was brilliant. So but ultimately, I I think I
have to go with remake. I think it was just such.

Speaker 5 (02:17:41):
It is one of the best remakes of all time
and even just standing on its own, uh what a
what a tremendous achievement.

Speaker 2 (02:17:49):
I think it's one of the best remakes all time
until two.

Speaker 1 (02:17:52):
Yeah, and for the series is really caking games.

Speaker 2 (02:17:58):
Yeah yeah, I mentioned met Oh wait are we is
this decided?

Speaker 3 (02:18:03):
Or Mary?

Speaker 1 (02:18:03):
You're still fighting Left for Dead. I'm not going to
fight that, Okay, cool, I'll save this for the Sweet sixteen.

Speaker 4 (02:18:09):
Then Resident and Evil remake wins Over Left for Dead too.
I think the reason is is because like this is
very justified to me, Like all of the arguments so far,
it's like I just can't I can't argue with any
of these things. So yeah, I also think it's a
two v one already, so it's like it is what
it is. Resident Evil Remake wins Over Left for Dead. Next,

(02:18:32):
this one's for you, Mike, Bloodborne versus Ratchet and Clank
going Commando.

Speaker 1 (02:18:43):
I'll go blood Born, but I've got I've gotta go
blood Born, but I've dan I think you might be interested.
I think most of the time me and you talked
about our favorite Wratchet Clank James, it was up your.

Speaker 3 (02:18:54):
Arsenal was up.

Speaker 1 (02:18:55):
Your arsenal was my mine was forever two and I
went back and replayed them all like two years ago,
three years ago. I think Going Commando is actually the
sweet spot between that more traditional three D platformer over
world design and you're still kind of plaffering up your
arsenal has a lot of that, like they were almost
trying to go more shooter. You pick a mission, you
drop in, and then you fight through some stuff. Going Commando,

(02:19:18):
I think is I honestly think the peak would maybe
be the PS three trilogy Crack and Time, Tools and
Distructions and Destruction. Yeah, there's only two, and then there
was there was something Booty.

Speaker 3 (02:19:34):
Question for Booty.

Speaker 1 (02:19:35):
They're all there, a lot of them are innuendo. But
Going Commando, I think is my h like I said,
my sweet spot for like the old and new Ratchet
and Clank direction and Rift Apart was awesome on PS
five a couple of years ago, but no, Going Demando
is the weapon design, like how creative Insomniac got and

(02:19:55):
the world design, how it blended the platforming and the
exploration and the gunplay. It took me, Oh, this is
actually I told you an answer for that email we
got where I wouldn't remember, we couldn't remember some little
feature in a game that made us completely play it
differently that someone like to tell us about. My cousin
told me there was a whole other targeting aiming set

(02:20:19):
up in Going Commando that was not default, because Going
Commando used the free aim like you shot whichever direction
Ratchet was aiming of the first game, but there was
an option that actually made it more like up your
arsenal before up your Arsenal came out, where it was
more traditional you aim, he aims where the camera's looking,
if that makes any sense.

Speaker 2 (02:20:40):
So it was way easier to aim and shoot, and
that change how I play the game. But yeah, no,
I'm going Bloodborne.

Speaker 1 (02:20:46):
I don't even I don't necessarily unless anybody else objects
to Bloodborne.

Speaker 5 (02:20:50):
I I've definitely spent more time thinking about and playing
ratching clank games, and I Bloodborne was the first Rumsoft
game I actually beat, you know, like I respected Dark
Souls and Damon Souls from Afar, but like I would
play like five ten hours and be like, ah, I'm good.
I don't really know what I'm doing here.

Speaker 3 (02:21:08):
Uh. Bloodborne was like, oh shit, okay, this one was
so luch.

Speaker 4 (02:21:12):
Like for me too. It's the first one where I
was like, I get how these games are meant to
make you feel.

Speaker 5 (02:21:18):
Yeah, it was undeniable, and I do feel like that
has been on my shortlist of games I want to
go back to because I think when I did play it,
I just didn't really have that language of how those
games work. But now that I've spent so much time
playing like elden Ring and even like you know, Armored
Core or whatever you know, or Secio, I think if
I went back to Bloodborne now, I would just because
I understand from games more than I did back then.

Speaker 3 (02:21:40):
I think I'd enjoy it more.

Speaker 5 (02:21:42):
I just think there's more going on there, like ratting
You know you said ice cream earlier when it comes
to Mario Mary and Uh, I think ratching Klink is
fantastic ice cream.

Speaker 3 (02:21:52):
I think Bloodborne is a Mike say a fancy wine.

Speaker 2 (02:21:58):
U Bloodborne, I'd say it's like an arm.

Speaker 5 (02:22:03):
I take it back all right, Bloodborne's really good. I'll
vote for Bloodborne.

Speaker 4 (02:22:07):
All right, Bloodborne wins over Ratchet and Clank going Commando,
I will agree. I think that is a fair cool. Okay, uh,
this next one, are.

Speaker 3 (02:22:17):
We out of the first round yet? No? No, although
it goes much faster because like a lot of arguments,
a lot.

Speaker 4 (02:22:24):
Of arguments have been made.

Speaker 3 (02:22:25):
But we'll see.

Speaker 4 (02:22:26):
Because this yeah, we still have like ten more games,
and you.

Speaker 3 (02:22:29):
Already killed Metal Year, which is the one I'd be
talking about the most. So yeah, and there's no more
Metal games.

Speaker 4 (02:22:34):
It was a beautiful victory. Actually, think we have like
eight more matchups. Okay, Uncharted Too versus Soul Caliber.

Speaker 3 (02:22:43):
Fuck all right, Look when.

Speaker 5 (02:22:45):
You said Uncharted too, I was like, great, I can
be the champion for this game that I think people
forgot about how fucking good.

Speaker 3 (02:22:54):
A lot of people did.

Speaker 5 (02:22:55):
People don't give the credit. Uncharted two came out with
twenty ten or whatever. It was ridiculu, especially for someone
who loves like, you know, y octane action bullshit. The
train sequence and everything just unmatched the time. So I
was ready to go to bat and be like I'm
gonna champion on Turn It two. But then you said
soul Caliber. Fuck everything else, my vote soul Caliber.

Speaker 4 (02:23:15):
Okay, do you have anything else to add to why
soul Caliber?

Speaker 3 (02:23:19):
Yes?

Speaker 5 (02:23:19):
It is a because I like fighting games a lot,
but I've never been like competitive in terms of like, like,
you know, I like Moral Combat because the characters and
special moves and fatalities are all cool. I like Street
Fighter because it's a fun thing to do with your friends.
I never wanted to be like, oh, let's really seriously
learn this and get competitive and go to EVO or
rank up online with fighting games. Uh So, soul Caliber

(02:23:41):
was the one where it's like, god damn, it was
so good. If you wanted to be that competitive level player,
you could dig super deep into the training mode and
command lists and all that stuff and learn each character.
But also if you wanted to play way more casually,
which is the way I typically played fighting games, you
could go in there and it was the king of like,
you know, you jam on X and Y a little bit,

(02:24:02):
you block some things, and you're gonna do some really
cool looking shit and it feels awesome. It feels like
it's not playing for you, but you could just do
a lot more cool shit by kind of hitting buttons
than you could in a street fighter or something like that.
But I loved it so much that I wanted to
go the extra step, and so I went in and
like every single fucking character in Soul Caliber, I went

(02:24:24):
move by move in the command list and learned every
single thing. It is the game I have played the
most in my entire life. I've our count out. Soul
Caliber is number one for me, without a doubt, and
I didn't expect that because again, it was never competitive
level fighting game player. But it was just so good
and so fun that it's like I want to learn
every fucking character. And there was such a ride with

(02:24:45):
that where it's like, oh, at first Keelick was my guy,
but then I start really learning like Mitsurugi or Taki
or a Nightmare, and it's like the depth matters, Like yeah, yeah,
I what's the what's the phrase? It's it's something something deep,
something wide, whatever it is. It can be as shallow
or as deep as you want it to be. It
can be no, baby, wow, that's all that's Jesus.

Speaker 3 (02:25:07):
As deep as you're willing to go.

Speaker 5 (02:25:09):
You can be drunk in a dorm room, mashed on
the Dreamcast controller and having a great time, or.

Speaker 4 (02:25:16):
We didn't buy shallow dish dot com.

Speaker 3 (02:25:19):
Or you can.

Speaker 5 (02:25:20):
You can spend hundred hours learning every character and it's
like any level in between. You were gonna have a
great time with that game. And another one of those
that I will pick up and play anytime. When we
did Extra Life recently, me and Manati just played a
good amount of it, and it's like, wow, this is
still like the best fighting game ever, like not even
just nostalgia wise, it's just no, no fighting game has

(02:25:41):
ever been nearly this good.

Speaker 1 (02:25:42):
I think, right you put you went into your basement
and we had the controller. You went into your basement
under your studio in Connecticut, and you played me blind
basically while I was actually seeing the TV upstairs, and
you beat me. Or tonight it was like best three
out of five and I think I might have just
barely beat you and you're in your basement with the

(02:26:03):
remote controller.

Speaker 5 (02:26:03):
Not seeing the television. Yeah, just yeah, it's man, what
a tremendous fucking game. Yeah, every day It's one of
those games. Every time I think about Soul Caliber, I
want to be playing Soul Caliber right now.

Speaker 4 (02:26:14):
Aw, that's really moving. I have to say, Like when
it comes to like our list. That's a very endearing
pitch and I loved it fine by me, all right, yeah,
Soul Caliber, I mean you won me over Bud.

Speaker 5 (02:26:32):
I'm such a psycho about that game that I had
like two hundred and fifty hours on my playtime and
I was so like, wow, I played this game a lot,
and then my VMU died my memory thing, and so
when I got a new one, I left it like
on a pause screen or in a level for two
hundred and fifty hours so it would be accurate.

Speaker 3 (02:26:48):
Again. Wow, that's just me being an insane person. But yeah,
yeah it's a great game. Yeah.

Speaker 4 (02:26:56):
Okay, Soul Caliber wins under over Uncharted two. Our next
matchup the Legend of Zelda Ocarina of Time versus Halo two.

Speaker 3 (02:27:11):
Okay, let's talk Halo two first.

Speaker 5 (02:27:13):
I think the big Halo two is Xbox Live, and
I think at least for me, I don't know if
it was the same with both of you, but like,
that was that first like, oh shit, online multiplayer. You know,
I never had PC online multiplayers, so to me it
was a revelation.

Speaker 2 (02:27:28):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (02:27:28):
A lot of late nights in college.

Speaker 2 (02:27:31):
Parties with people in fucking China.

Speaker 3 (02:27:33):
Yeah, that's what it felt like. I was like, this
is the future. It was tremendous. It was fucking tremendous.

Speaker 5 (02:27:38):
I know the campaign was very polarizing at the time
and not the best ending and things like that, but
it is very very good.

Speaker 3 (02:27:44):
Still a good campaign. I love that campaign still. It is.
It's fun, it's messy, but it's yeah, but Aina, it's Ackerina,
that's my vote.

Speaker 4 (02:27:57):
Wow, what a good pitchna, Dan, do you oppose?

Speaker 3 (02:28:02):
No?

Speaker 5 (02:28:04):
At least some flowers to Halo two before Okarina trampled it.

Speaker 4 (02:28:07):
I put Halo two because it is upwards of one
of the most beloved games of all time, like globally,
so I filled in a gap.

Speaker 5 (02:28:17):
Sure, sure, good call. Okay, but Acker well, we'll probably
talk about Okerna more when we need to.

Speaker 3 (02:28:24):
But I don't know if it's gonna make it that far. Well,
oh my god, I don't know. I'm joking, but maybe
it won't. I next round at.

Speaker 4 (02:28:32):
Least next one. Uh, Hollow Night versus Shadow of the Colossus.

Speaker 3 (02:28:43):
That's an interesting one. Okay.

Speaker 8 (02:28:46):
Wow?

Speaker 3 (02:28:48):
Can I go to Can I go?

Speaker 2 (02:28:49):
Can I take a break before this because I really
use the bathroom? Sure, that's that's our that's our tease.
Okay break yeah, yeah, are and we're back for Hollow
Night versus Shadow of the Colossus.

Speaker 3 (02:29:03):
That Shadow classis was my nomination.

Speaker 4 (02:29:07):
This is not fair. I think that this is really
hard because they actually, shockingly they.

Speaker 3 (02:29:12):
Really do have a lot in common in terms of like.

Speaker 4 (02:29:14):
Being extremely innovative, where other people have like duplicated elements
of both of these games, the story elements, the surprise,
the ability to take on just incredible feats and feeling
so powerful by the time you're done with it. And
I I really also I have a massive fondness for
Shadow of the Classes. So this is like kind of

(02:29:37):
gutting for me as well. We all know where my
heart is going to go here. I just want to say,
when it comes to a game I would pick up
and play right now to the end of the time,
it's Hollow Night, because there's so much to explore in
that game. My only like one thing about Shadow of
the Colossus that I think is limiting is that there's

(02:29:57):
only so many COLOSSI and I I have seen them
and I have experienced them. But every time I go
into a new avenue of Hollow Night, I'm like, I
can't believe that there's a whole fucking beehive in this wall,
and that is so sick that they just keep They
surprise me consistently and way more than I was surprised
in Shadow of the Colossus. The depth of Hollow Night

(02:30:19):
and how much they packed into that world and each
area is fascinating. There's no boring area of Hollow Night.
It's all it's all fucking sick. The scope of that
game is why I have to give it to Hollow Night.
I can proceed, but I will stop there for now.

Speaker 3 (02:30:34):
I do.

Speaker 5 (02:30:34):
I think you're right about like the scope and the
variety and things that Hollowen has the edge over Shadow
of the Clauses for sure, and there are similarities. I
think they both do a lot of show don't tell
you know, as far as the world building, and you know,
even like the vibe of the games is kind of
just like vaguely sad and.

Speaker 4 (02:30:55):
Yeah, yeah, yeah decrepit world or like maybe like once
was has collapsed now you're seeing the ruins of it. Yeah,
they have a lot and it's weird. They actually have
a lot in.

Speaker 5 (02:31:04):
Common, even though yeah, the games themselves where it's like
Hollow Night is a Metroidvaniace. Shadow of Glosses is like
I always compared Chat of the Classes to punch Out,
where it's like.

Speaker 3 (02:31:13):
It's like Boss Rush sixteen boss fights. Not a rush,
but like boss yeah, sixteen boss.

Speaker 4 (02:31:17):
It's true, but the traveling to the bosses is so
poetic and it's deep. You think and and a lot
about yourself. You bond with your horse and develop a
relationship with your horse, which comes into play, like I think.

Speaker 5 (02:31:32):
The most interesting video game character of all time according
to Ben Hanson, Agro the Horse. Yes, he believes Agro
the Horse is the most interesting video game character of
all time.

Speaker 3 (02:31:41):
But we don't need to unpack that.

Speaker 4 (02:31:44):
Has he met Roach?

Speaker 3 (02:31:46):
No, it's Agro. Yeah, ever a big boss and everyone there's.

Speaker 4 (02:31:50):
Weird, like not even characters. There's more interesting horses in games.

Speaker 3 (02:31:54):
Oh I I'm with you.

Speaker 1 (02:31:56):
Yeah, I you were talking about how poetic it can be.
Just get from play is the place in that you
come up to some bosses. The more the more bosses
you fell, the more you come up and you're like.

Speaker 2 (02:32:07):
This fucking bird was just like minding its own business
in this lake, in this gorgeous forlorn lonely place and
I'm kind of come in and just kill him because my.

Speaker 3 (02:32:20):
Little human.

Speaker 2 (02:32:23):
Needs needs the Colossus souls. But yeah, god, you get
to some of those environments, it's just like it feel
it truly feels like no one has set foot in
that temple where you fight the monkey boss in like Millennia,
that game I mentioned Metroid Prime and then Resuvill Remake

(02:32:45):
and Shadow the Colossus, three games that just they they
understand how to create atmosphere in a way that no
other games do, and there's got like it's it's feels
so weird to say Shadow the Colossus is some of
the best boss fights ever because of course it's it's
built around it. It's you know, it's it's Ueida doing
Uda and co.

Speaker 3 (02:33:05):
Doing their thing.

Speaker 2 (02:33:06):
But like.

Speaker 1 (02:33:08):
The Bird, especially when you first realize, like, oh man,
he's swooping right down over that platform, there's no way,
Oh he's got fur on his shoulders like above the
w am I gonna just get pulverized if I try it.
And then you jump and you grab the fur and
it starts soaring up and you're holding out for deer
life and your music.

Speaker 3 (02:33:23):
Yeah, the music, like.

Speaker 1 (02:33:24):
Crescendos even that, and that's one of sixteen. There are
a couple in there that I actually I replayed with
the remaster. I'm like, those were not great, but the
fact that they tried that in I don't I'm pretty
sure I could be mistaken. I think the first God
of War came out not far from Shadow of the Colossus.

Speaker 3 (02:33:43):
Oh five yeah, Yeah? Were they both? Five? Yeah?

Speaker 2 (02:33:48):
And I played both of those in like back to
back weeks, and like, holy shit, you cannot have two
more different games. The fact that it is empty is
almost like more impressive to me than if they stuffed
it chock full of things like a lot of Ubisoft
games feel the need to do now or the last
fifteen years have but like yeah, and also yeah, showed
out and tell is spot on because like you understand

(02:34:11):
what the story is telling you, even though they are
not the only words you hear for a while, or
like the chanting of that like godlike thing that's narrating God.
The architecture and in Shadow of the Colossus is just
some of the best ever.

Speaker 3 (02:34:25):
That game world is so unique.

Speaker 5 (02:34:27):
I think it might be the most beautiful game I've
ever played. Yeah, graphical fidelity I'm just talking everything.

Speaker 2 (02:34:33):
It's back when I cared about this kind of thing
that was always the game. I was like, oh, Ebert
needs to play Shadow to Colossus. But like that's leaving
aside the fact that it really does just have these
badass boss fights that are on a scale of like
you really don't see much unless it's like a like

(02:34:54):
an anime inspired game that's like, okay, you're like armored
cores or something, you're flitting around, but this is just
a little puny, like what seems like a teenage dude
trying to kill these giants.

Speaker 4 (02:35:06):
And the animation of them as well, showing him fall
and stumble. The animation makes him feel so fallible again,
comparing to like an Assassin's Creed, where it's like when
you get hurt, he just kind of like jukes back
into position, but you get tossed around like a frisbee.
And Shadow of the Colossus. They want you to feel weak,
and I think it's a masterclass in character design and

(02:35:31):
character animation as well.

Speaker 2 (02:35:33):
You feel weak and then you feel triumphant when you
kill it, but then it's like.

Speaker 4 (02:35:38):
I feel like a bad buy. You weren't supposed to
do that.

Speaker 5 (02:35:43):
Game where I reviewed that back in the day, and
I remember thinking that, like I remember in the review
just focusing on like these boss fights are so clever
and they're huge, and it's so you get to climb
up this whole thing, this platform am his boss fights,
and I don't think I put much thought into like
what was happening or the world or the story or anything.
And then I played the remake as an older wiser
man and I was like, oh, wait, okay, this is
actually like on a different level, Like it was kind

(02:36:04):
of hitting me the like oh got it. Yeah, I'm
just killing these fucking peaceful, beautiful creatures.

Speaker 1 (02:36:09):
You know, like in this literally by definition you assume
they're all endangered because there's.

Speaker 3 (02:36:15):
One of them.

Speaker 1 (02:36:15):
You're just slaughtering all of them because you want to
save what you're like the princess, like.

Speaker 5 (02:36:21):
Just elegant shit of just like the way you find
it is just hold your sword up with a circle
button and it's the beam of light and so beautiful
and for And that was in that post GTA three
world too, where it's like everything was trying to do that,
Like we weren't full Ubisoft Matt Barf Open World yet,
but everything was just like, we need a million side questions,
a million things, collectibles and all this stuff. And it

(02:36:43):
was kind of bold enough to be like, no, it's
it's open, you can go wherever you want, but like
it is desolate. Yeah, and that that lends itself to
the vibe of that game. Yeah, Oh it's so good.

Speaker 4 (02:36:56):
Hollan I also has these like moments of desolation where
it's just like you've seen nothing. The Kingdom I think
it's called like the Kingdom of Tears or whatever. It's
just like this dead kingdom. Everything has gone from it.
The halls are empty, everything has died and moved on. Yes,
there are bad guys there, but like, ultimately you're walking

(02:37:18):
around this hollowed out town and there's so many stories
left untold. What were the kings of this place? What
were the people?

Speaker 3 (02:37:27):
Like?

Speaker 4 (02:37:27):
Why is it abandoned? What happened here? I asked myself
that in so many areas of Hollow Night, it was
telling me a lot without telling me anything, just watching
all the death and destruction and Hollow Night. And I
am here killing a lot and trying to get through
it to what purpose I don't even fucking know, But

(02:37:50):
you want to kind of investigate these terrifying and really sad,
sad spaces. Every once in a while you will come
across and who's singing or a person who is alone
and they're telling you they're really sad story and it's
pretty brutal. The world building of Hollow Night and just
what a what a cold environment it sets you out

(02:38:12):
to be and you're not a hero. I think it's
made that kind of clear. You're not bad nor good
in that game. You're just kind of trudging along in it.
I think that's also meaningful because you can kind of
make that call as the player of like what kind
of person you think you are in this environment? But
you are certainly a murderer trying to get through. I
think it's I think it's just meaningful to give your

(02:38:35):
the player agency in that space. I think both games
do this quite well to let you decide are you
bad or good? Shadow of the Classes does that extraordinarily
as well. You know, you are fighting for a girl,
right you are. You are fighting for the health of
someone that you love, and that is valid, but you're
also destroying beautiful Colossi and they weren't fucking doing anything,

(02:39:00):
like Mike said, like It's not like they were destroying
a town. They were like hanging out, having a little nap.

Speaker 2 (02:39:06):
It was like a religious prophecy that told me to
do it, if memory.

Speaker 4 (02:39:09):
Serves Yeah, And so it's just kind of they're they're
both pretty gutting games in that in that space. But
I do absolutely love the agency of determining, like what
kind of person I think I am in this world.
Hollow Night feels so sad and so alone in so
many ways, and it's often like raining in a lot

(02:39:30):
of the spaces, and I think it's just kind of
adding to the environment that you are alone and you
are going to go through some shit to get where
you want to be. I think it feels great when
you're able to get into these spaces. And I still
like to this day, like I will just travel around
Hollow Night because the music and the world building and
the visuals are so stunning. I love visiting those spaces.

(02:39:52):
I like that is like still the game that I
play when I just like want to like immerse myself
in an environment that I love so much.

Speaker 2 (02:40:01):
Yeah, I love Hollow Night, But like Shout of the
Colosses to me is is uh, you.

Speaker 4 (02:40:11):
Want to play it? Which one would you play more?

Speaker 3 (02:40:14):
Now? Off, Dan, I'm not trying to be antagonistic. I
just I came around it really is.

Speaker 2 (02:40:24):
It really is a kind of a perfect but also
a terrible matchup. Like, yeah, so brutal similar. I hate
to say it because I know how much Hollow Night
means to you, Mary, But like.

Speaker 4 (02:40:36):
Guys, there is like not even that many CLASSI like,
they don't even do anything.

Speaker 3 (02:40:43):
It's yeah, like you don't.

Speaker 4 (02:40:47):
Have to learn their moves, you just jump on.

Speaker 3 (02:40:49):
You absolutely need to learn their moves. There's a bunch
of them that are agile. I know, you know it's
really good. She's like, I know, it's a tough one.

Speaker 1 (02:41:00):
Yeah, it's honestly, like it would have been easier to
pick holl And Night Over like an Arcadie game than
another artistic Yeah, and it's.

Speaker 5 (02:41:07):
Just happened to go against one of the most beautiful
games ever made that also holds up really well.

Speaker 3 (02:41:13):
And yeah, I have to go shadow the Classes. I'm sorry,
I feel bad.

Speaker 4 (02:41:19):
I have to go Shadow the Classes is funny, stupid,
not like you know, with valid reasons. This is really hard.

Speaker 3 (02:41:36):
I think we sold that argument really well. Shadow. Okay,
at least you lost to something better than the Wincher three. Yeah,
you died with dignity, Yeah.

Speaker 4 (02:41:54):
There is dignity and losing to Shadow the Classes one
of the most loved games of all time.

Speaker 5 (02:41:58):
All right, fine, honestly I have pushed for Hollow Night
if circumstances were different.

Speaker 3 (02:42:03):
Fine.

Speaker 4 (02:42:07):
Our next matchup is Titan Fall two versus Portal Oh fuck.

Speaker 3 (02:42:15):
Me, that's an interesting one. Was you were you Portal Mary?

Speaker 4 (02:42:19):
I am Portal Yeah did you do?

Speaker 2 (02:42:20):
You did Portal over Portal two just to claim?

Speaker 4 (02:42:22):
So this is an interesting one, and I think it
could come back to haunt me.

Speaker 2 (02:42:26):
I do.

Speaker 4 (02:42:26):
I do think that Portal two is like the more
enjoyable fundamental game, right, Like it's the one you can
play with another person. It has extraordinarily good puzzles, and
I think, uh, the world the listeners might be like,
why didn't you do Portal two?

Speaker 3 (02:42:44):
You suck?

Speaker 4 (02:42:46):
I did choose Portal one because I think this is
our list and even though I think Portal two is
the better game, So this might come back to bite
me in the butt. Portal original is like the quintess
essential world building that needed to exist for Portal two
to be as good as it is. It's the one
that invents Gladys. It's the one that gives you this

(02:43:11):
incredible skepticism of the world that you're in. Right in
Portal two, you know your person is bad, right, like
you know Gladys is not good, and you have to
deal with them. But in Portal one, the game actually
sets you up where you're supposed to kind of like
Gladys and like you're supposed to kind of enjoy them,
and they're telling you that you get cake at the end.
And so when there's that twist in the game, which

(02:43:33):
is I think almost a trope now, but at the time,
the first time you recognize that the game is going
to kill you unless you break the wall and get through,
blew my fucking mind. And I think that that's the
first time that I recognized that a game designer could
get me to I thought I was like breaking the game, right,

(02:43:54):
but it was all designed. But that was the first
time that I was tricked into believe that I was
like cheating the game and kind of solving this amazing mystery,
uh and trying to like compare it to something else
that I can't. I just think it was so brilliant,
how it it tricked me as a player to to think, Wow,
I'm going to go against what this game wants me

(02:44:16):
to do. I'm going to do my own thing, and
and how that built. I also think the ending is
is magnificent. It is a wonderful story from beginning to end.
Oh my god. And the puzzles in one are also awesome.
So this might come back to haunt me, but I
just like One the most.

Speaker 3 (02:44:34):
Yeah, Mary, I'm with you.

Speaker 5 (02:44:35):
I think One is the way to go here because
you know, because the way it was released, it didn't
really have to sell itself because like you're gonna buy
the Orange Box based on like, oh, here's Saint Fortre's,
here's Half Life and the episodes and everything. It's like, oh,
here's this bonus little thing. So like this bonus little
weird thing, little puzzle game. Me, Oh cool making portals,
that's cool. And then it just blew everyone away. And
you know, in a time where people didn't really say

(02:44:56):
meme as much, you launched a million memes and everything dah.
And then so I feel like with two, it was
almost kind of that like Wayne's World two or Austin
Powers two thing where it's just like, Okay, we're gonna
do like we're gonna have a little song at the end.
We know, we're gonna have a bunch of goofy you know,
fun jokes and stuff in the middle. Whereas, like I
thought it was a little more endearing in the first
one when I didn't expect it, when it was like, oh,

(02:45:17):
this game's like silly and weird and it's kind of
like breaking the fourth wall a little bit, and oh
there's this weird song at the end. Where's like the
second one was like, well, yeah, of course they're gonna
do this, like that's the this is the tone, this
fits with the tone, whereas the first one you didn't
know the tone yet, and it was more kind of
surprising to learn that stuff. So yeah, like maybe as
a whole, Portal two might be a better game, but

(02:45:38):
I remember one more finally, you know.

Speaker 2 (02:45:41):
Yeah, yeah, Titan Fall two is mine.

Speaker 3 (02:45:45):
I believe.

Speaker 1 (02:45:49):
I still I still think about that multiplayer often, especially
how well they employed like fighting game recognition. It's incredible.
But like the multiplayer, the way you can recognize a
a scorch from a distance as opposed to a monarch
and know that you're gonna have to counter them a

(02:46:09):
certain way, and there's certain their weaknesses. When they call
down the mex it's still such a fucking thrill to
call down a mech from space, jump into it, and
then you're pilots in it. All of a sudden, you're
launching like shoulder mounted flames and then just shooting explosives
at tiny little pilots near you.

Speaker 2 (02:46:25):
Yeah, the campaign is just one of the most I
don't want to say underrated.

Speaker 1 (02:46:29):
Anybody who's played it knows it's really good, but it's
like overlooked often in the face of other shooters. I
sometimes forget it compared to Halo, Half Life, Two, Gears
of War, et cetera. But like, yeah, the the interplay
between how good it feels to be a pilot but
also how good and powerful it feels to be in
a Titan is incredible.

Speaker 3 (02:46:49):
The mobility is insane too, it is. The mobility is
so fucking good.

Speaker 4 (02:46:53):
Yeah, fast you could be and how strong you can
be depending on the titan you choose.

Speaker 5 (02:46:57):
So fun person and stuff where's like you're wall running
and the like stick knipe into the wall and like
snipe down like shit.

Speaker 1 (02:47:03):
Hell yeah, and for like for Vince Ampela and the
people who made call Duty four to go over and
do that. But add the other layer of you're not
just prestiging, and you're not prestige like you're not just
ranking up all these individual pilot handheld weapons and the
pilot perks and the equipment. You're also doing it for
all six of these Titans that all have very different
there they might as well. It might as well be

(02:47:23):
a hero shooter once you get into them, or again
a fighting game you see a scorch monarch. I'm forgetting
some of the uh, some of the other names right now,
but the one with the more like semi automatic rifle
or the sniper rifle, and you're ranking them up individually
and whatnot. You can customize them their look. You can
put your stamp on them as well, in a way
that you couldn't call Duty four. So for them to

(02:47:44):
come over and make that was great. But like I'm
not going to sit here and say it's better than
Portal by any means, But Titan Fall two is still
When they brought the servers back online a few years ago,
I was me and Rob Hanleery were I don't know
anybody in the world more like happier than us two.

Speaker 3 (02:48:02):
That day we jumped in and it was it was
fucking really good. It holds up like crazy.

Speaker 5 (02:48:07):
We don't stream like a year ago on Giant Bomb
and we're all like, holy shit, why are we not
playing this all the time?

Speaker 2 (02:48:12):
Like I had my favorite titan I was a scorch
Maine Rob.

Speaker 3 (02:48:16):
Rob had his man I I had. Yeah, I was
getting double XP codes.

Speaker 2 (02:48:22):
Yeah, but uh but no, Portal Portal deserves that spot
as well.

Speaker 4 (02:48:27):
Yeah, okay, agreed, Portal wins over Titan Fall two. Uh,
the next one.

Speaker 3 (02:48:36):
Why she's smiling? Why she grinning?

Speaker 4 (02:48:39):
Haites versus Metal Gear Solid two Sons of Liberty.

Speaker 3 (02:48:47):
Wait, what Haes is that you? I did? Yeah? No,
I mean yeah, oh fuck.

Speaker 2 (02:48:56):
Haes is like because he likes like haities more than
we do.

Speaker 4 (02:49:01):
Haties was our game of the year.

Speaker 2 (02:49:03):
We did not talk about it. That was our first
game of the year.

Speaker 4 (02:49:06):
It was It was the one that kind of actually
launched us as a podcast, so I think it's internally
valuable to each one of us. It's also hilariously the
one we didn't discuss. So we did Game of the
Year originally and we debated very intensely our first ten
through number two, and it just never we actually, like

(02:49:29):
famously just forgot to talk about Hades, or maybe we
just didn't remember. By the end, it was so renowned
and we just we spent so many hours in it,
and I think we still look very fondly on Hades.

Speaker 2 (02:49:43):
So yeah, id on here.

Speaker 3 (02:49:45):
It, Yeah, needed to be on here.

Speaker 2 (02:49:47):
I did not put it on mine.

Speaker 1 (02:49:49):
Kind of maybe strategic's the wrong word, but like I figured,
I thought Dan had it on there.

Speaker 3 (02:49:55):
Honestly, I like it a lot.

Speaker 2 (02:49:57):
He did it.

Speaker 3 (02:49:57):
I fucking love Hades.

Speaker 2 (02:50:01):
I'm willing to be swayed to metal Gear, but like, Okay,
god damn Haites.

Speaker 3 (02:50:06):
Still it's Hades.

Speaker 1 (02:50:07):
Haiti's one of the top five games I want to
play right now that I wasn't even thinking about until
right now.

Speaker 5 (02:50:13):
I put a lot of stock into anything, games, movies,
anything with people that are just unlike anything else, and
Meddle Year Solid two, even in this series of Middle
Year Solid is unlike anything else I've seen. First of all,
the marketing was the craziest shit ever, because you're coming
off Middle Year Solid one, which I made the argument
for that earlier, and how it just was a giant

(02:50:33):
shift in what people expected from games. And then just
three years later, they're coming out with this game because
it's on PS two that looks it looked like Witchcraft.
When you saw that E three trailer, it's like, how
could games possibly look this fucking good? Then they put
out a demo on Zona the enders and people can
play it, and we're playing that demo over and over
and again.

Speaker 3 (02:50:53):
Witchcraft.

Speaker 5 (02:50:53):
It was just insane, the amount of detail, graphical prowess,
all this stuff, and they're setting up this very intriguing
story and then you play it and it does maybe
the boldest thing a video game has ever done, where
you take this universally beloved character of Solid Snake, you
promote this game as like Solid Snake's Next Adventure, and

(02:51:14):
it's like, holy shit, you liked them back then check them.
Now everything's fucking cooler, Now, bigger steaks, all this shit,
you're Solid Snake again. And then to take this beloved
fucking character and then a couple hours in be like, nope, sorry,
you're not him. You're this weave that everyone hates.

Speaker 3 (02:51:30):
And they fucking mark the mark.

Speaker 5 (02:51:33):
The trailers they lied, they straight up lied, and the
trailers showing scenes that don't happen, to make people think
that they're Solid Snake the whole time, and it's not
just a cheap gotcha thing.

Speaker 3 (02:51:45):
It play.

Speaker 5 (02:51:45):
I'm not gonna spend I could spend hours talking about
the themes and stuff that this game is doing, but
the idea of the player's relationship to the character and
things like that and just the nature of video games
and stuff, it all plays into that. Uh, And it
plays beautifully into the story way that I fucking hated
back then because every I don't think anyone was ready
for that game back then, because it's just like, what
the fuck, why aren't we Solid Snake? And it took

(02:52:08):
me years of replaying it and reading about it and
talking on forums about this to understand what Kajemo is
trying to do with this, and it's it's very complex,
and again, like I don't know how like I could
if you want to.

Speaker 3 (02:52:22):
See trying to do more importantly sequels and it's riding.

Speaker 5 (02:52:31):
Is this player surrogate where he has basically played a
Solid Snake through the VR. There's no short way to
do this. It is unbelievably complex. But to be so
bold to take like it would be bold if this
was an indie project and they did this, but like
middle year, solid was the biggest fucking thing. And then
a few years later to just throw all of it

(02:52:52):
on its head and take such a risk, the likes
of which people still.

Speaker 3 (02:52:55):
Haven't done since.

Speaker 5 (02:52:56):
And then even with the narrative itself to nowadays, you know,
we're talking about four social media, you know, two thousand
and one, A lot of these codecs and stuff in
these conversations you'll see people repost nowadays because it's insanely
prescient the stuff that they were saying about. What I mean,
that was the first time I ever heard the word meme.
I mean this is four years before I had heard
a Facebook, you know, and them talking about how the

(02:53:19):
proliferation of memes and online culture and divisions kind of
splintering off and echo chambers and stuff and the effect
that's going to have on the world and human interaction
and stuff, which at the time, every review and everybody.

Speaker 3 (02:53:30):
I talked to was just loll, Kajima is crazy. What's
he talking about?

Speaker 5 (02:53:34):
And then you go back and you look at this
shit in twenty twenty five, and it's like, oh, my
fucking god, how did this happen? In two thousand and one,
while at the same time remaining an incredibly engaging video game.
Like you know, there are criticisms I would have. I
don't think the selection of boss fights and everything in
characters is as strong as one or three. But in

(02:53:55):
terms of just a fascinating, forward thinking, bold, unlike anything
else experiment, uh, there is nothing like it in entertainment,
I think.

Speaker 3 (02:54:07):
So, I don't know, it's uh I put it. It's
probably number two.

Speaker 5 (02:54:11):
When I was I was putting over you know, middle
of your Solid one as the like number one impactful
thing it ever felt in games. This is right, This
is like one b you know, and I think it
is probably the game. You know, we always have a
game's aging well or whatever, and that like it so
feels good. Mario World feels good to play Metal You're
Solid two ages so well because you look back and
you just are more impressed at the shit he was

(02:54:33):
trying to do with that game, and it just feels
better as time goes on.

Speaker 4 (02:54:40):
Now, you did say that the boss fights weren't perfect.

Speaker 8 (02:54:44):
I'm not.

Speaker 3 (02:54:44):
Oh, it is not a perfect game. Great.

Speaker 4 (02:54:46):
I just wanted to rehash that point because I believe
that Hades is one of the most perfectly designed games
of all time. I think the boss fights are so
so intricate and wonderful to replay, and it is a
really awesome experience to have a unique build as a player,
right you will, you're forced to play it differently each

(02:55:09):
time because of the way that game is designed. You
cannot play the same build each time. You can't make yourself.
The game will push you into new builds. So playing
that game and facing each of those bosses with a
different loadout making you rethink how you can fight each
of those bosses with your unique builds. It's fresh each

(02:55:33):
and every time, and the boss fights are incredible, especially
the final one where you take on Zeus. Goddamn, what
a finale. To even get to Zeus is such a marvel.
But when you actually have that vibe that you think
you can beat Zeus, and then they're like, bitch, now
it's just new game. Plus, like, this game was expertly crafted.

(02:55:59):
It is the best of Super Giant Man.

Speaker 2 (02:56:01):
It was Hades, right, just yeah, you said Zeus, what
does he fight? He fights his dad, Hades.

Speaker 4 (02:56:11):
Oh, who's Zeus?

Speaker 3 (02:56:14):
I don't think Zeus is in the game, Like you're Hades.

Speaker 4 (02:56:16):
The player is Hades.

Speaker 3 (02:56:17):
No, you're they made up, Zach.

Speaker 8 (02:56:21):
You're right.

Speaker 2 (02:56:26):
Now, your dad is Hades, the guy of the Underworld.

Speaker 4 (02:56:27):
But who's Zeus. I think he does Zeus like things.

Speaker 2 (02:56:33):
Yeah, no, I'm just clarifying for You're right.

Speaker 4 (02:56:36):
I guess I thought that Zaggreous. You fight, you fight
Hades cow, and that's a really tough final boss fight.
I guess I thought it was Zeus.

Speaker 1 (02:56:49):
He's kind of the brilliance of it is it can
sometimes be semi easy because you built your the you
can agree so fucking well, which is cool, like.

Speaker 3 (02:56:58):
A great rogue light.

Speaker 5 (02:56:59):
I feel like, you know, dead Sales Hades, like you
can break it, and that's part of the joy, is like, oh,
this build is fucked up.

Speaker 3 (02:57:05):
I love this.

Speaker 4 (02:57:05):
It was kind of before that was a thing too,
Like Hades was before Breath of the Wild, where it
was like, oh shit, are you like allowed to do this? Oh,
it wouldn't fuck I'm gonna sell make seventeen as.

Speaker 2 (02:57:19):
It was before, like Blatro though, Like Blatro is definitely
like ropelike in that.

Speaker 4 (02:57:23):
Felt like crazy when you were able to break the game,
but it was designed for you to be able to
do that.

Speaker 2 (02:57:32):
No, wait, you're right Breath of the Wild came out.
Oh yeah, Breath came out, was like twenty twenty.

Speaker 3 (02:57:37):
Okay, gotcha.

Speaker 5 (02:57:38):
Although technically I guess Hades might have been in like
early Access or something.

Speaker 3 (02:57:42):
But yeah, oh, just to.

Speaker 1 (02:57:48):
Give you where my head's at. I like Hades more,
but I do think Dan had a stronger argument.

Speaker 4 (02:57:55):
Yeah, but he has a strong argument about all of
these fucking games. Sure, yeah, Hades is like he did
this before with Snake Eater and.

Speaker 2 (02:58:04):
Was like, no, I vote for Snake Eater, I just
because I like Snake.

Speaker 4 (02:58:07):
I know, I'm just saying they can't all get in,
you know what I mean, Like, there's not six hollow
nights that I get to fucking cry over, but He's
cried over each one of these little bad babies, and
I just think like, at some point they're not all
getting in.

Speaker 3 (02:58:21):
Sure, I I don't know, I don't shoving so many
in the door.

Speaker 4 (02:58:27):
We can't stop them all.

Speaker 3 (02:58:29):
I just think.

Speaker 1 (02:58:32):
Hades is an undeniably good game, and I don't remember
a single moment in Hades where I wasn't enjoying it.
Medlic your solid too, I absolutely love and it's loftier
in its goals and uneven, not even for sure, And
again it comes down to like do I do I

(02:58:53):
value the peaks of metal gar Salad two more or
this the consistent greatness of Hades, And like.

Speaker 5 (02:59:01):
Oh man, I would almost make the argument that, like,
you know, we've brought up the ice cream thing several
times and I'm usually missed her ice cream when it
comes to games just instant, you know, gratification everything, And
in this rare circumstance, I think Hades is the ice
cream and I'm arguing against it because I feel like
midagor sell it too is such an anomaly and I
feel like it's important but industry and the history of games.

Speaker 1 (02:59:24):
Of the two sure, But I would say, like calling
Hades ice cream is kind of underselling how genius a
lot of it is, like I shouldn't a genius, but like, no,
it's close to perfect on the level of like Spilunky
how I was talking about, and like.

Speaker 2 (02:59:39):
The way they can balance even like the weak builds
are interesting because you're like, Okay, this doesn't synergize with that.
I think I've probably put like all of us at
least one hundred hours into Hades at this point, and
I I think I would still learn something new if
I played an hour tonight, which is just incredible to me.

(03:00:02):
I I I think Hades is mine as well. Your
argument for Metal, Your Solid two was very good. It
was better than your MGS one.

Speaker 5 (03:00:10):
Well, and that's the things less than like, you know,
because I love Hades. Yeah, I didn't like the Witcher. Yeah,
this thing's less. It still hurts, but hey, I still
got three is alive?

Speaker 3 (03:00:23):
Right yeah, oh yeah.

Speaker 2 (03:00:26):
There no, but yeah, Hades is just like Hades is
just one of the best video kides.

Speaker 3 (03:00:33):
It's really I think intent.

Speaker 1 (03:00:35):
I think five years from now we're going to start
like putting it up there with I mean, we already
are talking about it in the breath of some of
the best games ever.

Speaker 3 (03:00:41):
But like you just put a middle year two. Yeah, true, Yeah,
this is it. This is when it fully shines. Okay.

Speaker 2 (03:00:48):
I it is a battle not to try to in
early access, but I really just want to wait until
day one.

Speaker 3 (03:00:53):
I haven't. Yeah, I missed around for like an hour
or two.

Speaker 2 (03:00:55):
And hearing I'm hearing good things about how she plays
differently than Graya, so looking forward to it.

Speaker 4 (03:01:01):
I I'm glad to hear that we have concluded that
Hades beats out Metal Cure Solid two Sons of Liberty.
We still have four more.

Speaker 3 (03:01:14):
Okay, and then that's a podcast.

Speaker 4 (03:01:16):
That's round one.

Speaker 3 (03:01:17):
Oh ship. Yeah.

Speaker 4 (03:01:20):
Our next matchup GoldenEye double oh seven versus Silent Hill two.

Speaker 3 (03:01:28):
Oh, Golden Eye. You didn't think about it.

Speaker 5 (03:01:33):
It's Golden Yeah, I know that's that's easy. Look, I
respect Iron Hill too, good job. It's a nice sad game.
Golden Eyes fucking gold remember that.

Speaker 3 (03:01:41):
Exactly, nice sad game. And then all of a sudden,
this Vince McMahon comes out, Golden Eye, Gold. He's gonna
golden He's got a I mean go because I mean,

(03:02:04):
I'm not even gold and gold.

Speaker 1 (03:02:08):
You're gonna have to fight for this because I uh,
Golden I was on my list as well.

Speaker 8 (03:02:13):
I think.

Speaker 3 (03:02:15):
Which one has the auto top?

Speaker 2 (03:02:19):
Good?

Speaker 4 (03:02:20):
Also have sexy ladies. Maria is in it. She's trying
to get up all in that butt.

Speaker 1 (03:02:25):
I mean, Tokyo also has an Eiffel Tower. But which
one do we talk about?

Speaker 3 (03:02:38):
Sorry?

Speaker 4 (03:02:38):
Continue, No, I'm losing.

Speaker 3 (03:02:44):
You're up against Okay.

Speaker 4 (03:02:47):
Dan talks about the story and like how powerful the
story is. There's probably no other story that's talked about more.
When it comes to the horror genre in games than
Silent Hill too. It's the most iconic story where you
the prog and I'm gonna it's like, how do I
do this out spoiling it?

Speaker 2 (03:03:04):
Like?

Speaker 4 (03:03:04):
The point is is that you are slowly descending into
hell and learning over time while you're killing all of
these terrible beasts and like monsters and discovering terrible things
about the other people who are in Silent Hill for
awful reasons. You are slowly coming to the realization that
you are not a good person and that Silent Hill

(03:03:25):
is your health. And I think it's one of the
first games that I played where I, over the course
of the story, really recognized and loathed my own character.
You still play as them, and you kind of still
solve it. It is beloved in terms of game storytelling
that the way that you play this game will ultimately

(03:03:48):
determine your ending. How much time you spend with Maria
can actually give you a better ending. Whether or not
you kill the final boss, you actually can choose not
to and take pity on them and be there for them.
All of that actually impacts the type of outcome for

(03:04:10):
your character, which is so fascinating. And why all of
the alternate endings for Silent Hill get mass amounts of views,
because it's really interesting to see how you choose to
play this out in this just dark and desolate and
despicable world it is. It is evil, and it really
deals with some dark shit. There are children. There are

(03:04:32):
very mature themes in this game that I didn't think
you could fucking do in video games and get away with.
Very serious topics are are in Silent Hill too, and
I think they're done with grace. I mean that, like
honestly in the sense like some of these things you
might like laugh at or scoff at, and you don't
laugh at what they're talking about in Silent Hell, like

(03:04:52):
very serious, intense topics. But somehow, even though you're like
switching between your shotgun and your uh, you know, your
sniper rifle or whatever it is that you have, you
are taking the situation very seriously. I think it does
it with grace and dignity for these characters, and so
I think it's a monumental achievement in story and character

(03:05:13):
design that Golden Night doesn't have any of that shit.
It's just really fun to play.

Speaker 5 (03:05:19):
Well, No, I mean if you're an odd job, and
multiplayer you can chop dudes in the nuts and it's
very annoying for your friends.

Speaker 2 (03:05:25):
If you throw a knife straight, it goes right in
the jaws.

Speaker 3 (03:05:28):
Is nuts too. Yeah, that's a good time. Yeah slippers only. Yeah,
like I like a lot, but like.

Speaker 4 (03:05:40):
I don't want to. You be really careful with how
you what you say next, because your next words are
gonna be muffled by your own cold night.

Speaker 2 (03:05:47):
Gold Knight created a genre.

Speaker 3 (03:05:50):
Yeah, it was the first first person shooter. Everyone knows this.

Speaker 2 (03:05:53):
No, it brought the PC shooter's Doom, Wolfenstein Quake two consoles,
which nobody thought was possible at the time. But also
just you were talking communal experiences, like how hard that
game went on split screen. I mean, it didn't have
a choice to go anything but split screen in terms
of multiplayer at the time. But like the map variety

(03:06:16):
for its multiplayer, the picking between characters getting fucking pissed
when someone went odd job because they were shorter than
everybody else you couldn't shoot them. But like, yeah, I
don't know, it was it was a communal It was
a communal experience on par with like a precursor to
combat of all of land parties.

Speaker 3 (03:06:33):
Which I mean more personal experience.

Speaker 5 (03:06:34):
But yeah, but just speaking of personal experiences, like you
know how much I love Mario and did as a
you know, little child and stuff, and I still didn't
get a sixty four When it came out four launched
with Mario sixty four. I played at Target Kiosk and
was like, this is the craziest shit I've ever seen.
But I still, like, realistically could not afford it. You know,
there's just not like I was not able to play

(03:06:55):
it outside of a Target Kiosk or a friend's place.
Mario Kart came out. I love Mario Kart, I can't
There's no way I can get a sixty four. I
can't afford this thing. I played GoldenEye, and I went
to a couple of friends places after sixth grade and
played GoldenEye, and I was like.

Speaker 3 (03:07:07):
I need to find a way to make this happen.

Speaker 5 (03:07:11):
And I don't remember if that was mowing lawns or
selling a bunch of old games or something, but it
was like, you know, at a time where resources were
limited in terms of like my money and my resources,
I was like, whatever it takes, I have to have
this game in my house. So I held off Mario
love and ass that I was on in sixty four
until I played GoldenEye, and I was like, well, there's

(03:07:32):
not a choice anymore.

Speaker 3 (03:07:33):
This is the coolest shit.

Speaker 5 (03:07:35):
And especially like I again you talk about first personal
Trutters and Doom and all that stuff. I had these
shitty computers. I was not part of that FPS, you know,
the early days of that. I did play some Doom
in Wolfenstein, but in terms of like having something on
that level, like when it's new and relevant, GoldenEye was
the one where it's I have to have this, whatever
the cost, I have to and it was so much

(03:07:55):
fucking fun campaign multiplayer.

Speaker 3 (03:07:58):
It just was the full package.

Speaker 2 (03:08:00):
Yeah, and I love Doom and Wolfenstein, but I don't
think shooters would not be nearly as big as they
are today if it wasn't for GoldenEye.

Speaker 3 (03:08:10):
Golden I is the predecessor of Halo to Call of
Duty to yeah.

Speaker 1 (03:08:13):
Yeah, and also like the main missions, the campaign missions
for how they adapted the movie, and I didn't see
that movie.

Speaker 2 (03:08:20):
For years after I had played the game many many times.

Speaker 1 (03:08:22):
But like, not all of it is aged well, but
there's some really cool objective stuff where it's like the
train yard. It's like, all right, I gotta find the
black box, but that won't trigger Trevellian until I get
to this area and then all of a sudden, I'm
surrounded by guys on the edge of this area in
the dark that I didn't see. And you know, a
lot of this is through rose tinted glasses, of course
because it's the N sixty four, but so much of

(03:08:44):
the storytelling they got across in that in the mission
design was really impressive.

Speaker 3 (03:08:49):
For ninety seven. Yeah, and also like the difficulty stuff.

Speaker 5 (03:08:55):
Every game's difficulty settings was typically like the enemies have
more health and they hit you more and you take
more damage. This was between Agent Secret as Double Agent.
It was like the difference between on the dam, you
just run to the dam and jump off to Oh
I need to go here and go into this whole
area I didn't have to go to before, and I
had to disable these alarms like you see parts the
level and do things that you wouldn't do if you're

(03:09:17):
playing on a lower difficulty. So there was so much
depth to the campaign.

Speaker 3 (03:09:19):
Yeah, they did that in Time Twitters two again. Yeah.

Speaker 5 (03:09:21):
Yeah, no pre radical and all that stuff. Like they
were fantastic of that shit, and uh not that I
even mention the multiplayer, which was maybe the thing that's
most known for. Yeah yeah, Goldenn is the top ten
gold ye yeah, Golden Knye.

Speaker 4 (03:09:35):
Okay, Golden Knye winds over Silent Hill too. Our next matchup,
Diablo two versus Super Mario sixty four.

Speaker 3 (03:09:47):
Oh, come on, now, come on, now, let's not be silly.

Speaker 2 (03:09:55):
Can I I don't think I don't need a full break.
I just want to run to the I think this
is you two.

Speaker 5 (03:10:03):
Oh as far as the argument, do you have a horse? Yeah, oh,
then it's winning, Okay. I like we don't even talk
about it.

Speaker 3 (03:10:12):
Diabo to quite a bit, but Mary, if you want
to a nice concession speech for Diablo.

Speaker 4 (03:10:20):
I mean, one of the greatest stories ever told of
what the devil you are? You become the devil, you
fucking dickhead. You would know?

Speaker 2 (03:10:31):
Yeah, who would have thought you would have talked that
definitively about loser.

Speaker 4 (03:10:36):
I this is like an iconic game.

Speaker 3 (03:10:42):
You furnest is going off every time you talk.

Speaker 4 (03:10:45):
You know, every time, just like a little teapot is
boiling behind his stupid head. I mean, I think it's
this is silly. I think like we were just like
fighting about like how iconic Golden Eye was and like
how how it was like the Pinnacle like inspired all
these games. Yablo was like the ultimate of its time
as well of being able to I don't know, just

(03:11:10):
mass kill mass hordes of the undead for its time
in lots of different ways, and being able to like
compile different types of fighting styles. Uh, deciding your character
first of all was very iconic and important, but then
adding to your weapon. This is like a game I played.

(03:11:33):
You like played this obsessively in your basement. You played
this with your friends, and everyone talked about what happened.
You played this with your dad, or like with your parents,
or like with your older brother. This is like the
fucking game that everybody in their family households, like talked
about with each other. This game is iconic. I think
it's more iconic than Super Mario sixty four. I think

(03:11:55):
that it's more important. What I said, I actually think.

Speaker 3 (03:12:04):
I think I think important to.

Speaker 2 (03:12:07):
But yeah, Mario sixty four like proved three D could work.

Speaker 3 (03:12:11):
Yeah, it's like the single biggest technological leap in the
history of the industry.

Speaker 2 (03:12:16):
I mean.

Speaker 4 (03:12:19):
Like, okay, like there's another one of him. There's more.
There's a mention Diablo was like iconic for its time.
It like changed the way we perceived like the depth
of these styles of video games, plus the story.

Speaker 3 (03:12:39):
Six more literally added a D.

Speaker 4 (03:12:42):
Yeah, that's like one that's just like one that's so
superficial one D.

Speaker 3 (03:12:47):
Mary.

Speaker 1 (03:12:47):
I love you so much and I any I would
follow your Diablo too, But I feel like you're just like.

Speaker 3 (03:12:55):
Willfully. I think it's like the worst possible game you
could be going against with this argument.

Speaker 4 (03:13:04):
I just disagree. I don't think I never played this
stupid game. Mario drown.

Speaker 3 (03:13:16):
Just trying to kill him is what you're doing. What? Yeah,
I I.

Speaker 1 (03:13:26):
Feel like you've gotten a few bad ones in a row,
Mary with your matchups, But like I, this one was
da I think.

Speaker 5 (03:13:33):
Oh yeah, there's many games on this list you could
have had an argument with Diablo Mario's sixty four.

Speaker 3 (03:13:44):
Okay, there's anything left to be said about Diablo. Feel free.
The stage is yours.

Speaker 4 (03:13:52):
I think it's a better game, and you can go
fuck yourself. Mario Super sixty four beats Diablo too, fine,
all right, we have two more mashups?

Speaker 3 (03:14:06):
Do you need to Yeah, I need to.

Speaker 4 (03:14:11):
Gather my tears.

Speaker 3 (03:14:13):
All right, we're back.

Speaker 1 (03:14:15):
We have two more matchups in the first round. In
the first round, is this like potentially a part one
and two things.

Speaker 4 (03:14:22):
Or it might be We're gonna have to see how
we go here?

Speaker 3 (03:14:24):
Move fast one.

Speaker 5 (03:14:26):
Keep in mind, I think after this first round, I
think in terms of the matchups, we are like half
done before and I think it's like sixty five matchups
for sixty four entrants.

Speaker 4 (03:14:36):
We'll see how you feel because some of the secondary
matchups are gonna be bret but these are.

Speaker 3 (03:14:40):
Gonna be that's gonna be like majora versus Like, these
are gonna be a game. We really we've laid the
groundwork for why they We'll see.

Speaker 2 (03:14:48):
Yeah, let's readdress after the next round.

Speaker 4 (03:14:50):
Okay, So the next one is Resident Evil to remake
versus Metro Last Light.

Speaker 2 (03:15:00):
I mean I can speed they both are. I can
speed this one along. It's resuable to remake.

Speaker 4 (03:15:07):
I won't fight that at all.

Speaker 2 (03:15:08):
Possibly the honestly the best.

Speaker 3 (03:15:10):
Remake of all time.

Speaker 1 (03:15:11):
I think over a resumeable one remake, I would have
to say Metro Last Light. If you're looking for if
you love half life, two and you a lot of
shooters just aren't doing it for you, and you're looking
for like the true spiritual successor.

Speaker 2 (03:15:23):
I've said this for a long time. Metro Last Light
is the actual spiritual successor to Half Life two. It's
the best thing you could play as a shooter, and
before Half Life three comes out, if it ever comes out,
it's it's the first Metro twenty to thirty three, really
rough around the edges. Metro Last Light.

Speaker 1 (03:15:40):
Incredible linear, but then there's these open ended sequences you're
also managing, like Survival Light elements in incredibly atmospheric, underground
and above ground, post apocalyptic wasteland in Russia.

Speaker 3 (03:15:54):
Exit.

Speaker 1 (03:15:54):
This is great, but I feel like it definitely lost
something of the craft when it went away from the
linear already of Last Light.

Speaker 2 (03:16:01):
But yeah, God resume to remake. I'll save everything I
want to say for next round.

Speaker 3 (03:16:05):
But it's.

Speaker 5 (03:16:07):
Yeah, if you liked Half Life two but you wish
you had to press the button every five minutes Gordon
Freeman wipe his glasses off, then you love Metro exactly.

Speaker 3 (03:16:14):
Yes, yes, yes, okay, the second one. I hated every
Metro I've ever played.

Speaker 4 (03:16:22):
Great Resident Evil to remake wins over Metro Last Light
our final.

Speaker 3 (03:16:28):
I know one game that's going to be in this,
it has not come up yet.

Speaker 4 (03:16:31):
Our final matchup is I haven't heard Mario enough. Doom
versus the Legend of Zelda, Breath of the Wild.

Speaker 2 (03:16:39):
It was Breath of the Wild. We haven't talked about
Breath the Wild.

Speaker 3 (03:16:41):
Wow, a little weird. The dirty draw for Doom shit
twenty sixteen Doom. Yeah, and you put that in there.
Uh No, I did not.

Speaker 4 (03:16:51):
No, I did that based on I did I did
that based on popular demand, and I actually was thinking
it should be the original because it was pretty fucking important.

Speaker 3 (03:17:00):
It's incredibly important. Yeah, yeah, yeah, what are you going
to say?

Speaker 4 (03:17:05):
Though I know, I know it got it got a
dirty draw. I think it actually would have won over
some other games just because it is. It has a
very important origin, and uh, it was kind of timeless,
much like Diablo. I would say, like this was the
game that, like when I walked into my cousin's room
and they were playing this, everybody shut the fuck up

(03:17:27):
and watched them play Doom like Doom was fucking sick.
It did a lot. It was very important. It is
so hard to come up against Breath of the Wild, though.

Speaker 2 (03:17:36):
So exist without due.

Speaker 4 (03:17:40):
I know in many ways should have put GoldenEye against
Doom instead of Silent Hill One would say, Okay, you
guys are ready for round two.

Speaker 3 (03:17:51):
That's it.

Speaker 4 (03:17:53):
There were some games that didn't make it. I don't
know if you want to do any honorable mentions. If
you were like I would, I'm like, so sad weren't there.

Speaker 5 (03:18:00):
Mario, ma Sunshine, Marie Galaxy One, Yep, Mari Pretty World.

Speaker 4 (03:18:06):
I promised I would do up to fifteen, and I
did as many as I could, Like I think I got.

Speaker 2 (03:18:11):
Up to like teen.

Speaker 3 (03:18:12):
For most of us we talked about.

Speaker 4 (03:18:14):
Twisted Metal two didn't make it, Castlevania Symphony of the
Night didn't make it, Mortal Kombat two didn't make it,
Batman Arkham Astylum, Kingdom Hearts, wor Frame.

Speaker 3 (03:18:28):
Kingdom Heart was my honorable mention. I love the first game.

Speaker 4 (03:18:32):
I wanted to put Outer Wild, but I killed off
my own baby.

Speaker 3 (03:18:37):
God for you when I said that, Ah, the idea
of you playing you're way too cool. I don't.

Speaker 1 (03:18:41):
I don't like any of them except for the first game,
and it's all nostalgia. It's all nostalgia.

Speaker 4 (03:18:46):
I think that was a tough one.

Speaker 3 (03:18:49):
Mass Effect two is oh yeah, Massfect two is really fun.

Speaker 4 (03:18:52):
No, it's fine, I know, but it didn't even hit
your twenty. So to me, I was like, it can't
be that important if it didn't hit any of our
top twenty.

Speaker 3 (03:19:00):
But I don't know what the hottest take is tonight.

Speaker 1 (03:19:04):
That Diablo two is more important than Mario sixty four
or Dan saying men on your solid is the best
story in any medium ever.

Speaker 3 (03:19:13):
I will I will die on that hill.

Speaker 2 (03:19:15):
You're gonna die.

Speaker 4 (03:19:16):
Also, you're gonna die on a hill.

Speaker 3 (03:19:17):
Keep in mind, I know, like fourteen storms, what are
you gonna do? Shoot me?

Speaker 4 (03:19:22):
Said man right before he was shot.

Speaker 1 (03:19:25):
Anyway, Okay, yeah, times Twitters two would have been fun,
but I yeah, anyway, all right.

Speaker 4 (03:19:30):
Okay, cool, I'm moving on, uh to round two, Round
two start. I'm going to just start back at the
top so these won't shock you, because these are the winners.
Tetris versus Dishonored two.

Speaker 3 (03:19:54):
We're gathering here bridge no dishonor to so of the best.

Speaker 1 (03:20:00):
I mean, it's up there with hit Man World assassination,
like level design, holy shit, cracking the slab and the
clockwork mansion are I still don't know how Arcane pulled
it off. Arkane is one of the most underappreciated developers
around today period. Even with all the critical adoration, death
Loop got Dishonored two being able to play both Corvo

(03:20:21):
and Emily in one of the most unique video game
worlds established by Dishonor one, with like the whaling industry
and this steampunk meets Victorian meets supernatural. I absolutely think
Dishonor two is the best immersive sim ever, still, unless
you count hit Man World Assassination as immersed sim, which
I kind of do.

Speaker 2 (03:20:42):
It's phenomenal, but it's not Tetris. It still holds up
really well. I just like I said, I played it
a couple of weeks I started a new campaign a
couple of weeks ago.

Speaker 4 (03:20:51):
Tetris, Tetristris, Tetris, you bad bitch. You go against Dishonored
in win. Tetris wins against Dishonored too.

Speaker 5 (03:21:03):
You know, I've read and heard so many bad takes
about video games over the years. I still have yet
to see the earnest, Like, let me tell you why
Tetris is bad.

Speaker 2 (03:21:12):
I could think of a few people who would write
it and try to. Yeah, I think we know some folks,
but yeah, god, I want what if I like, I'm
not gonna do this, but what if I broke off
and like started my own Patreon and that was my
first article, Like Tetris is fucking terrible.

Speaker 3 (03:21:27):
Bad is bad.

Speaker 4 (03:21:28):
Actually, if you like Tetris, you're bad at games.

Speaker 2 (03:21:33):
If you're like Tetris, then you're a fucking.

Speaker 4 (03:21:37):
Communist. I was gonna say some kind of like nonsensical
argument that really heats them up.

Speaker 3 (03:21:47):
Yeah, like commy stuff, I shouldn't do voices.

Speaker 2 (03:21:51):
What's the next matchup? The next matchup is what's going
to match up against Tetris next round?

Speaker 3 (03:21:57):
Oh yeah, what's gonna die?

Speaker 4 (03:21:58):
Metroid Prime versus Command and Conquer Red Alert to Oh.

Speaker 3 (03:22:06):
Fuck, which one has a better chance to? No, I'm
not I shouldn't think ahead, Look, gal, it's not like ahead.
I think in the short term.

Speaker 5 (03:22:14):
I know, for this podcast specifically, there is some serious
love for Red Alert too.

Speaker 1 (03:22:20):
I yeah, that's my vote. I care so much more
about it than Metroid Prime. I think Metroid Prime is
fucking rad.

Speaker 3 (03:22:26):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (03:22:27):
Red Alert two is the gift that keeps on giving
incredible one on one multiplayer just I Also one thing
we didn't talk about first round. So many strategy games
are so overly concerned with balance, and I know it's
a I'm not I don't mean to say this game
is in balance, but it really fucking is. There's no
population there's no population cap, meaning you can make as

(03:22:48):
big of an army as your computer can handle, which at.

Speaker 3 (03:22:51):
The time rocketeers yep.

Speaker 2 (03:22:54):
That that game is just like g I Joe bullshit,
like we can you can make whatever the fuck you want.
If you can make it bigger and faster than your enemy,
you're probably gonna win. But also they might have laser
anti air towers that can fuck you up, and there's
gonna be.

Speaker 3 (03:23:07):
Made a bunch of blimps. Yeah uh yeah.

Speaker 2 (03:23:12):
Al for me, it wasn't even going against Metro Prime Primecredible.

Speaker 5 (03:23:20):
We're at that point where every game that is coming up,
we're probably all gonna be like, yeah, that game is
fucking incredible.

Speaker 3 (03:23:25):
Yeah, but alert.

Speaker 5 (03:23:33):
Okay, I don't think go play Prime. If you haven't
played Prime, there's remastered right there. I want to replay Metrics.

Speaker 3 (03:23:41):
It's phenomenal.

Speaker 4 (03:23:43):
The map is fucking insane, like you'll lose your ship
when you look at the map at the end of
this game. All right, red Alert two wins over. You
guys are breaking my soul.

Speaker 3 (03:23:57):
We have to do the funniest thing.

Speaker 4 (03:23:58):
Yeah, no, no, no agendas being reasonable. Sorry, I just
I think you guys are laughing too much. Metal Gear
Solid three Snake Eater versus Stardew Valley.

Speaker 3 (03:24:12):
Oh look, I like starting a lot. Okay, let's be really.
You know what I am.

Speaker 2 (03:24:19):
Actually I think I'm swayable on this one. I love
metal Gear to a point.

Speaker 5 (03:24:24):
Okay, here's okay. Starty Valley was my game of the
Year twenty fifteen. The big hit I would give against it,
which did not impact my enjoyment of the game in
the least, was that it was intentionally and unapologetically this
isn't a bad thing derivative of Harvest Moon. So all

(03:24:45):
the things I loved about it when I played it.
If I had just been introduced to Harvest Moon or
given it a chance ten fifteen years before, I probably
would have fucking loved it. But it just just so
happened to be my first farming sin and it does
you know, from people who played more games than that
genre than me, it does seem to be an incredible
one of those and one of the best, if not

(03:25:06):
the best, but it was it had other games had
laid the groundwork, whereas Snake Eater was the first snake eater,
the first thing on that level. So that that is
if I had to kind of kill one of my
babies here, that's what I would say about Stardu.

Speaker 4 (03:25:24):
What do you mean it was the first snake eater.
Stardu was the first Stardo, like Snake Eater is first,
like you know, uh, I don't know. Whatever fucking stupid
game it is where it's like a describe what makes
it so innovative because it's it's.

Speaker 3 (03:25:42):
Third in it Outdoor Stealth was huge at the time.

Speaker 4 (03:25:45):
It's the third in a metal gear.

Speaker 3 (03:25:47):
But it's it's it's very unlike one and two.

Speaker 2 (03:25:50):
It's my favorite, but it's not.

Speaker 4 (03:25:51):
But it's this isn't Harvest Moon three. This is the
first Stardo. This is the first in its universe.

Speaker 3 (03:25:56):
Right, But like the format and what you're doing is
incredibly finiscent of what you do in Harvest.

Speaker 4 (03:26:01):
Moon, where it's not incredibly reminiscent of what you do
in Metal Gear.

Speaker 5 (03:26:05):
I mean you are sneaking around, you are killing guys
and stuff like that. But the setting, the way the
story is laid out, the time frame and effort like
there is, there's a lot that Snake Eater does to
differentiate itself from Metal Gear Solid one and two for sure,
Like there's I can't think of a game before Snake
Eater that feels just like Snake Eater, whereas Harvest Moons
are incredibly similar to Stardy Valley from look to gameplay

(03:26:30):
to format. Absolutely, But it's not about innovative. It is
about our favorite and that's what it comes down to.
And I just think Snake Eater, h No the best game. Yes, yes,
I started Valley is very very, very very good.

Speaker 3 (03:26:47):
I love that game. Meddle Year Solid three. The moments
of gameplay, moments I had will stick with me.

Speaker 5 (03:26:54):
And then the story itself is as much as I say, like, Oh,
Medal Year is the best story ever, these stories, specifically
of Snake Eater is the best story I've ever seen.

Speaker 3 (03:27:03):
In a game.

Speaker 1 (03:27:04):
Mary, For the record, I'm not like decided. I love
Metal Gear. Snake Eater is my favorite, but I like
Metal Gear to a point, I don't adore it as
much as Dan does.

Speaker 3 (03:27:15):
I love Stardoo as well.

Speaker 4 (03:27:17):
I think every metal gear has its little foibles, right,
They're not perfect games, and they have like flaws. Stardo
is quintessential. It is just one of these iconic games
that doesn't really have any issues. You can spend your
day fishing. You can spend it in the Minds. You
can spend it romancing people. You can spend it trying

(03:27:41):
to get a unique item that you can fill your
rolodex with. I love getting the Minds and opening up
a geode and seeing what you can discover with it,
plus the romance options. This game continues to be updated.
It is insane how many updates this game has had

(03:28:01):
over the last ten years. The guy just keeps adding
to it. And it is so intricate that no matter
how you choose to spend your day, you have a
great day. This game is peaceful, it is calming. It
will lower your blood pressure. This game is designed to
just give you pure endorphin rushes and make you feel

(03:28:24):
the It's like game serotonin. It is so delightful and whimsical,
and the music, the visuals, it's all expertly designed to
get you to just enjoy your day and start you.

Speaker 1 (03:28:38):
Yeah, but also if you want to fucking minmax shit
and be a psychopath who can make those crazy farms
by like day fourteen, the underlying intricate systems are there
for you to have this fucking hydro farm in two weeks, just.

Speaker 2 (03:28:55):
Not to build onut what you're saying. It's also can
be pretty hardcore.

Speaker 3 (03:28:58):
If you want it to be.

Speaker 4 (03:28:59):
It's true. My friend Josh plays it totally different than me,
and like he plays it like Factorio and it's kind
of insane to watch because I don't play it like
that at all. I play it to like romance people
and make as many friends as I can, and also
I do like to make at least some money, but
ultimately I just kind of like want to win best

(03:29:21):
prize at the fair because it feels good, and I
like to complete the Rolodex, like I want to complete
all the different items that are you know, in the
museum and things like that, so you can play it
however you want and still have the best time. I
really do think it's also universal. I think everybody who
plays that game similarly to Tetris, I just don't see

(03:29:43):
a lot of people saying Stardu sucks, Like it's just
not something people tend to criticize it's just too wholesome.

Speaker 5 (03:29:50):
You're right in that started that does not have many flaws.
In fact, I'm struggling to kind of think of one.
But in terms of you know, you're asking about like, oh,
what a's snaky, or do it was different than one
or two or game support or something. I'd like to
just narrow win on one specific part of that game.
Leading up to the middle of that game, you have
been taught basic things like you've got these goggles that

(03:30:13):
are thermal, You've got these things that you should pay
attention to in the environment. You've got these binoculars and
stuff like that, whatever, so you know how to use
this stuff. And then suddenly you are thrust into a
thing where you were in a larger area and there
is a sniper. There is an older sniper that is
it's like a one hundred years old It is this
ancient dude that's trying to kill you, and you have
to take everything the game has taught you leading up

(03:30:35):
to that point to be like, what do I fucking
do here? I can't see this guy. He's not like, Okay,
I'll turn on my radar thing here, But it's picking
up all these birds, and shit, I don't know which
one he is. Turn on the thermal things, I can't see. Oh,
maybe there's some fresh footprints there. But then how it
rains it gets cold, I can't tell there. And so
you're just kind of like walking around very uneasy. Occasionally
you're hearing him kind of like bark out at you

(03:30:56):
or taunt you or whatever, or his fucking birds yelling
at you or something. And it can be what's that
he's got, like a parrot, and you can there's so
many different paths to get this guy. You could kill
his parrot and he's mourning the parrot, and you sneak
up on him and steel his fucking closed and his
gun and everything and choke him out or whatever. Or
you can just kind of be like, you know, sitting
in a bush scanning with binoculars and you see the

(03:31:18):
glint of his scope and you can just shoot this
motherfucker in the head. You can fucking save the game
in the middle and come back a week later and
he dies of old age. You could you could have
ye two scenes before that, after a cutscene he's in
a wheelchair, and after the cutscene ends. If you zoom
in with your sniper rifle, you can catch him. There's

(03:31:39):
like a brief little window where you see the boss
wheel your new house. You can shoot him in his
wheelchair and he fucking explodes and dies and you don't
have to do the hour long boss fight.

Speaker 1 (03:31:49):
Or like Drew Scanlon did a Melgar salad and just
like freak out and panic and throwd that just actually
landed next to him in the jungle.

Speaker 3 (03:31:56):
Yeah.

Speaker 5 (03:31:57):
Yeah, It's like, you know, Meddleger's Solid three is not
on a imercive sim but I feel like it's one
of those everyone's got their stories of like, oh here's
how I did it, you know, and what a remark
like you talk about what differentiates it from like one
and two. There's nothing like the end fight in Middleger
Solid one or two. Like there's very few things in
games since that are like that fight, and that is

(03:32:20):
the extreme example in three, But there are just so
many different things where it's like if you do this,
this weird thing will happen. All these things that I
saw that Mike didn't play while he's playing through. On
top of it just being a killer story from ginning
to end, incredible setting, it's just like it's it's unmatched.

Speaker 1 (03:32:37):
Yeah, Mary, I'm sorry. I think I've a few in
a row. I feel like you're getting bad matchups. But
Snakier is the one male your solid. I'll go to
bat far and like just thinking about.

Speaker 4 (03:32:50):
The same for your wife.

Speaker 3 (03:32:52):
Yeah, to finds in the mud. She has a parrot.
She does hide in the jungle often. She's one hundred.

Speaker 4 (03:33:04):
Yeah, keep little gear Solid three. Snake Eater wins over
Stardeo Valley.

Speaker 3 (03:33:12):
That was a weird matchup.

Speaker 4 (03:33:14):
Yeah, all right. Next matchup Years of War versus Super
Mario Odyssey. I am taking so many els and I
feel like my deck I'm just gonna literally do I
know Odyssey is gonna win?

Speaker 3 (03:33:29):
This is a question.

Speaker 4 (03:33:31):
I know that we all know that everyone's time dragged
through the fucking every goddamn matchup.

Speaker 3 (03:33:39):
Yeah, I love gears. I love gears.

Speaker 4 (03:33:41):
Shut up. The next matchup, Super Mario World versus Red
Dead Redemption two.

Speaker 3 (03:33:53):
This is gonna be bad. That's an insane This is
gonna get the most video game.

Speaker 5 (03:34:01):
To nineteen ninety one versus Yeah, we're gonna have to
talk in circles for an hour to get to.

Speaker 3 (03:34:07):
The end of this one that's not Let's let's figure
this out.

Speaker 1 (03:34:09):
How we do this, Mary, where just give us a
barometer before we make our like opening and closing arguments?

Speaker 3 (03:34:17):
Where what are you leaning toward? Or are you or
do you? Literally have no clue because this is just stupid.
It's the most opposite.

Speaker 4 (03:34:25):
I've played both of them, and they're both fine, and
I love either.

Speaker 3 (03:34:30):
That's not what I expected you to say. Okay, that's fine,
though I can about this matchup.

Speaker 5 (03:34:38):
The things I love about Mario World were it's just
the most dewey ass I press this button, have fun
game ever and instantly reacts. Everything's all the shit I
didn't like about Red Dead two, where it's I hit
the button and then I wait for it to happen.
It's just so polar opposite my brain. Even though I
have come around on Red Dead to appreciate what it
does very well, it is so opposite to me. And like,

(03:35:00):
obviously I'm going to go Mario World. Obviously, that's my
obviously the craziest matchup.

Speaker 3 (03:35:08):
I don't even know where to begin, like to compare them. No,
I never had to make this decision.

Speaker 4 (03:35:15):
Nobody has ever been here before.

Speaker 2 (03:35:19):
Okay, this is Super Mario World. Yeah, Mario Bros.

Speaker 3 (03:35:23):
Three. Okay, No, I have a hard time. This is
the best one. This is the second game ever. Right,
it's either this or Odyssey.

Speaker 2 (03:35:29):
It's the second or third Mario game ever.

Speaker 3 (03:35:31):
Fourth, Well, Mario, do you want to count fifth? I
don't know.

Speaker 4 (03:35:35):
I do struggle though, because we just had Super Mario Odyssey.

Speaker 3 (03:35:38):
I mean that there's a reason he's fucking Mario.

Speaker 1 (03:35:42):
It's the early Yeah, yeah, there's the early Mario Mario bros.

Speaker 5 (03:35:49):
Is Well, there was Mario Bros. Well, we're not gonna
dunk Super Mario Brothers. Super Mario Brothers two in Japan,
which was the Lost Levels here, So that's two different
games there. There's Super Mario Brothers three and then World
was the day debut for the Superintendo.

Speaker 2 (03:36:02):
Yes, and World is where it really came into its own.

Speaker 3 (03:36:04):
She's debut looks fuck awes on the Yellow Cape. Yeah.

Speaker 4 (03:36:10):
Oh yeah, this is a good one.

Speaker 3 (03:36:12):
Yeah. I don't know, I can, I can like, what
do I do? What do you do? What do we?
What are we talking about?

Speaker 2 (03:36:20):
You?

Speaker 3 (03:36:21):
How do we? What do we? It's definitely Mario World.
To me, I'm not gonna be anti red Dead guy.

Speaker 2 (03:36:26):
I'm not gonna be anti Mario, but it's definitely Red
Dead for me.

Speaker 3 (03:36:30):
I just I don't know. Red Dead two is one
of the.

Speaker 2 (03:36:37):
I think it's my favorite Western.

Speaker 3 (03:36:41):
In anything. Mine's the Mario party to Western Land? Yeah?

Speaker 4 (03:36:47):
Stick fuck? What's your favorite sci fi? Why it's Mario's.

Speaker 3 (03:36:58):
Yeah, I don't know.

Speaker 1 (03:36:59):
Everything I'm saying is not a distraction from whatever Mario
game we're talking about, but Super Mario World I'm joking, okay,
But at the same time, I totally understand that, in
its moment to moment gameplay read that Redemption two can
get frustrating. Of course, it absolutely can. But also, I

(03:37:21):
just don't think we talk often enough about how many
different systems in that game need to coalesce in order
for you just to get back to camp. And then
Charles be like, oh, there you are, I need let's go.
Let's go, like we got to go defend these buffalo
The people are hunting. If you stay out away from
Camp too long, the AI. The game is like good
enough for the AI to come find you, and Bill

(03:37:43):
be like, hey, Dutch is.

Speaker 3 (03:37:45):
Wondering where you are?

Speaker 1 (03:37:46):
Like Dutch is already the character is worried about Arthur's
loyalty that is expressed in these systems that work across
this massive open world wilderness. You could be camped out
in the fucking snowy mountains and then Bill sees you
when you come down out.

Speaker 3 (03:37:59):
Of the slopes.

Speaker 2 (03:38:01):
He's like, dude, we've been looking for you. Why the
fuck have you not been back in a while. When
that happened, that was like, oh my god. The game
is actually like I was away in the wilderness. I
thought I thought I was alone and I was from
all the other characters, but the game is like, Okay,
he's off doing his own thing, camping and he can't.
I went up there because I was doing that gunslinger

(03:38:21):
quest with the journalist and I was doing the shootout
to prove I was the faster gun I came back out,
and the game like new we're talking about Lefferded two's
director whatever the fuck Magic Rockstar employed there knew that
I came out after in game week away or whatever
it was. And then there's someone like chastising me being
like that also told me talk about show don't tell.

(03:38:45):
It's like that showed me that Dutch was already worried
about Arthur's loyalty and.

Speaker 1 (03:38:52):
Then for you to go back to the camp. The
number of quests that can also trigger is just astounding,
because Charles could come up, and then Bill could come up,
and then Josiah could come up and say, Hey, I
want to go talk to you about this. And it's
not like you have every single option of valuable available
to you at any given moment. It's there are just

(03:39:12):
numerous factors of what you just did in Valentine in town,
or what you just what your morality check out was
on that past decision, or maybe you just want to
fuck off and watch how you can shoot a barrel
in the back of your wagon and then light the
trail on fire and drive the barrel into an enemy
or into a like a cowboy ambush like you can
in like Far Cry. There's so many things to talk

(03:39:35):
about with Red devordemp Shi too, but I think for
now it's just it's I think the best way I
can start is just like I don't know any other
game that can combine that many systems into this like
believable simulation that just continuously can like I can feel like,
I don't know, it's just invelable.

Speaker 5 (03:39:57):
But it's an impossible argument to have that everything you
just said is one hundred percent accurate, Like that is
all the stuff that makes Red Dead Redemption too beautiful
and impressive and everything, And with Mario World, it's like,
what am I gonna to counter that with? Like, oh man,
the secret exit and Donut Planes is pretty cool. Yeah,
it's a much simpler but also super elegant in an
awesome game in ways.

Speaker 3 (03:40:18):
That are so fucking different. Yeah, but it's just it's
such a different like it could be.

Speaker 5 (03:40:23):
It could have come out this year and it would
still kick ass, but it's in such different ways than
Red Dead Redemption two is impressive.

Speaker 1 (03:40:30):
So it's just this is a matter of Mario's minutia
and like moment to moment just absolute like chemical cause
and effect in your brain, Red Dad's Big Picture an
orchestra as opposed to that single really good violinist.

Speaker 5 (03:40:47):
I will not play Red Dead Redemption two unless I
have a few hours that are open and it's like
I want to sit down.

Speaker 3 (03:40:53):
I want to so I want to like get lost
in this world.

Speaker 5 (03:40:56):
I cannot tell you how many hundreds of times in
my life I've just been like, I'm going to load
up Mario World and play a level for four minutes
and I'm going to have a great time, you know
where It's like, it's just such a polar opposite gaming experience,
Like where do we even be get? Like obviously I'm
going Mario World, but yeah, I.

Speaker 4 (03:41:12):
Feel like playing Red Dead Redemption two, like that is
a gutting space to be in. But I will say
when it, when it hits, I think the highs a higher.

Speaker 3 (03:41:21):
Yeah, I I I.

Speaker 1 (03:41:24):
I guess I could say this about many games, not
just Super Mario World, but like it's it's fucking awesome
when a game just feels incredible to play and it
triggers that joyful response and that fun thing and that
like that thing you can go back to. But like
up there with things like The Last of Us or
even Shadow of the Colossus, Red Deredempty two is up

(03:41:46):
there with like the range of emotions that game can
evoke is yeah, fucking vast uh, which again it doesn't
really help compare it to Super Mario World, but well
one of them.

Speaker 4 (03:41:59):
Has to be best.

Speaker 3 (03:42:00):
I mean, you know, my vote, my vote.

Speaker 4 (03:42:05):
I really I feel this deeply. And it's obviously you're
both extremely passionate about each other's games, uh, for your
own reasons as well, but something has to be the
victor here. I just think that there is something untouchable
about the mechanisms that Red Dead is put into place

(03:42:29):
that make everything so distinct, and the fact that you
can play it in so many different ways, and how
intricate what they made was. I do think it's a
modern marvel. I will agree that Mario is probably the
funner one to play, right like, that's the one I
grew up playing. But I think we're here to kind
of just determine which one we think is like in

(03:42:50):
this matchup. I think Red Dead is, like it's a
modern marvel. It's just incredible what they were able to
accomplish with it.

Speaker 5 (03:42:57):
Sorry, well, no, no, I get it. It's like Mario
World Courses through my veins. It feels like it's part
of my DNA, Whereas like Red Dead Redemption two is
something that I had to kind of like really sit
down and intentionally force myself to appreciate.

Speaker 3 (03:43:13):
And I do, and I really do.

Speaker 5 (03:43:15):
I I'm not suddenly like, oh, it's my favorite game
of all time, but I'm really enjoying playing through it
again right now again. I was doing it right before
this podcast and it's like, man, this game. Yeah, it's
an unbelievably impressive game. And so I'm not gonna like
again not a Metal Gear Solid versus the Witcher three situation,
which is the worst thing that's ever happened.

Speaker 3 (03:43:38):
I really think he's.

Speaker 5 (03:43:44):
There's I've done so many Games of the Year arguments
and ship like that where my babies don't win and
stuff like that, and it's like.

Speaker 3 (03:43:50):
They don't matter.

Speaker 5 (03:43:52):
I don't get mad about it and I don't really
nothing matters, and this what Yeah, it's really it's all cool.

Speaker 3 (03:44:02):
It's all coolie. Yeah, that's cool.

Speaker 4 (03:44:08):
Well, save your energy for this next one. Our next
matchup is the Legend of Zelda, Majora's Mask versus Elden Ring.

Speaker 3 (03:44:20):
Wow, that's crazy.

Speaker 2 (03:44:25):
Really, are you sure it's my favorite game of all time?

Speaker 3 (03:44:32):
Okay?

Speaker 5 (03:44:33):
Yeah, there's certain ones here, like Majora's Mask and Riddler
two where it's like, you know, there's the the like
the Blue Wall they talk about and like the it's
just like and Dan's like Michigan.

Speaker 3 (03:44:45):
But and I have our Arizonas and whatnot.

Speaker 1 (03:44:50):
But yeah, but those those proved shakable Uh god, these tariffs.

Speaker 2 (03:44:56):
What do you guys think.

Speaker 3 (03:45:00):
Tarriffs? I just say that. I just don't like the tariffs,
is my thought. What about the chips They're going to
be expensive or eggs or something. Yeah, I'm worried about you, guys.
I'm worried about the world stage. Shut up.

Speaker 2 (03:45:17):
Let's put coachma on it. Let's have him figure it out.

Speaker 3 (03:45:21):
President, Okay, majora. Eldon. I'm just waiting to see whether
I need to make an argument. That's the thing I
don't like. Mary. Are you firmly elden Ring?

Speaker 4 (03:45:32):
I think that elden Ring is the people's choice. Yeah,
I think it is your. Yes, what's your I'm the people.

Speaker 3 (03:45:42):
You're a tiebreaker? Wow, Okay, this is the first I've
done that. It is the first you've done that. Mary
and I are usually I feel like I'm usually.

Speaker 4 (03:45:50):
You're usually the one that we're trying to sway.

Speaker 3 (03:45:53):
Yeah, yeah, I'm a peacekeeper usually.

Speaker 4 (03:45:56):
Anyway, go ahead, Dan, where are you at?

Speaker 5 (03:45:58):
Elden Ring is one of the absolute best game And
it is like, you know, when I thought Breath of
the Wiles, like, I didn't think I could feel like
this again with games as a you know, forty year
old man. Eldon made me feel it again and it's like,
holy shit, we're a great time for video games. That said, uh,
that moon looked really crazy when he looked up. That

(03:46:23):
was real fucked up when he looked up. And there's
nothing fucked up in Elden Ring.

Speaker 3 (03:46:29):
There's a giant it's all cute. Yeah, it's real fucked up.
Oh god, that's tough.

Speaker 5 (03:46:36):
Should should I look back at my top hundred for reference?
Or is it better if I don't know to make it?

Speaker 4 (03:46:42):
You have to make it with your.

Speaker 2 (03:46:43):
Make an argument, or I could like talk about MAJORA.

Speaker 4 (03:46:46):
I think ultimately Dan knows all those arguments, though, I
think I think to me, it's just like which one's bester.
I mean, look, I this is Sophie's choice. Make the call.

Speaker 2 (03:46:59):
Yeah, drowned the kid.

Speaker 4 (03:47:01):
It's actually worse than that, just so you know what happened.
It's a gas chamber of situation.

Speaker 3 (03:47:08):
What is Christ?

Speaker 2 (03:47:09):
What do you mean like you had to choose a
kid to not go to the Jesus Christ.

Speaker 3 (03:47:14):
I should stop saying that.

Speaker 4 (03:47:15):
Then we comedically it's kind of it's kind of evolved
past that as like Sophie's choice here, but yes it is.

Speaker 3 (03:47:24):
That's the origin. Yeah, oh my god, we should stop
using that collectively.

Speaker 5 (03:47:30):
Man I okay, So I was just trying to form
an argument in my head about like, oh, Major's Mask
being so weird and surreal and just the playing with
the format of like you know, the time and all that.
But then I think about like Eldon Ring, Like Elton
Ring wasn't a game that like played it safe.

Speaker 3 (03:47:44):
Elton Rings crazy and weird, nychotic. Yeah, like the ship
where it's like the map's that big.

Speaker 2 (03:47:50):
Structurally, I would say Majors Mask.

Speaker 3 (03:47:52):
Is bolder, but that the time stuff yeah times yeah,
but no, the scale. I like the mask stuff a ton.
That's a fun thing. The Bomber's note.

Speaker 4 (03:48:07):
What about the ring?

Speaker 3 (03:48:08):
What about the Eldon I don't even know what the
ring is?

Speaker 1 (03:48:15):
The ring and Elden Ring a ring ring the shattered
in the past and it represented the family and they
were trying to Marget had one of the pieces.

Speaker 3 (03:48:24):
And like they I don't know a single character in
Eldon Ring. Uh fuck, I'm gonna say Elden Ring, I'm fine.
If I had to lose, I'm fine.

Speaker 5 (03:48:38):
So that was tough because like I'm such a Zelda
Nintendo mark, but like, yeah, finds pretty undeniable.

Speaker 2 (03:48:44):
I don't even think Majora's Mask is the best Zelda game.
It's just my favorite game of all time.

Speaker 5 (03:48:49):
It's just so fucking interesting, and that's why it sucks
that it went up against the game that was also
incredibly interesting.

Speaker 4 (03:48:54):
And that's where we're at right now.

Speaker 3 (03:48:56):
That was like a kryptonite for Majora. It's like, well,
I've got some.

Speaker 1 (03:49:00):
Stuff to say about elden Ring, but I think I'll
save it for the next whatever the next matchup is,
because I don't I agree.

Speaker 2 (03:49:06):
I think it's a I'm fine with that beating.

Speaker 4 (03:49:09):
Yeah, I can't believe elden Ring Legend of Zelda, Majora's Mask.
Our next matchup, Rocket League versus Team Fortress too.

Speaker 3 (03:49:21):
That's a weird one.

Speaker 4 (03:49:22):
It is a weird one. I'm gonna I'm just gonna
say Rocket League. I think it is like the game
I would rather play, No easy.

Speaker 3 (03:49:34):
Market.

Speaker 4 (03:49:35):
Okay, Rocket League wins?

Speaker 3 (03:49:37):
Uh next market.

Speaker 4 (03:49:39):
Hit Man World Assassination versus Witch Your Three Wild Hunts.

Speaker 1 (03:49:46):
People are laughing. Damn sorry, Mary start Over. I told
a really funny joke. I guarantee there's some.

Speaker 2 (03:49:52):
Of the.

Speaker 3 (03:49:54):
There's people in there.

Speaker 4 (03:49:56):
Let it die down. Hit Man World of Assassination versus
Witcher three, Wild Hunt.

Speaker 1 (03:50:05):
Oh hit Man, the Wincher three did its job, killed job,
it got rid of medal.

Speaker 3 (03:50:15):
Here put that dog out of it. Ad Yeah, oh god,
I love the Witcher three.

Speaker 4 (03:50:23):
I love what would you have picked over hit Man?
World of Assassination h and Metal Gear Solid.

Speaker 5 (03:50:30):
Across the whole tournament of those two? Oh if it
was Oh you're saying, if it was hit Man versus
Middle Year. Yeah, Oh, okay, not I'm close. Yeah, well
I just never got.

Speaker 4 (03:50:43):
There, all right. Our next matchup is the Legend of
Zelda A Link to the Past against Half Life two.

Speaker 3 (03:50:55):
Oh, this is gonna be rough.

Speaker 4 (03:50:57):
I'm gonna ruffle some feathers.

Speaker 5 (03:50:59):
I'm gonna I'll say. Let me start by saying I
probably beat Linked in the Past one.

Speaker 3 (03:51:05):
It's about your personal experience with the game. That's what
we're doing.

Speaker 2 (03:51:08):
No, it doesn't sway us though, when you just talk
about how deep your connection is to a game, like
why is the game better? I'm telling you this because
I want it to win. But Half Life two is
really really fucking good.

Speaker 3 (03:51:20):
I'm sorry.

Speaker 2 (03:51:21):
I didn't mean a shit on it. I shouldn't have
done that. That was me, Dan, You beat it fifty
times continue and.

Speaker 3 (03:51:26):
I've never beat Half Life two because near the end
they've just kind of got tired of it. That's why
you said that, to be apologize for that. To be fair, I.

Speaker 5 (03:51:34):
Didn't play Half Life two until the Orange Box, which
was like what five six years November three years, three
years was already news.

Speaker 4 (03:51:45):
Like afford to play the best game of its time.

Speaker 5 (03:51:48):
That is also yes, because my computer couldn't run it.
So that's why linked the past is better.

Speaker 4 (03:51:53):
You shouldn't. That's a bad argument. I mean, I would
say Half Life is uh a good one too, one
of the what like the best first person shooter of
its time that like completely gets you to scale in
insane way. What you're able to accomplish towards the end
of it with the gravity gun fucking nuts. I also
just want to express, when it comes to like enemy

(03:52:15):
to friend design, which I had never seen in a
game before Half Life, the idea that you would like
be so afraid of these I call them sand spiders.
Somebody else might call them something else, but they're like
these like scary little guys that like kill you, but
then you get an item and they become your friends,
and you could utilize them to your advantage. So fucking sick,
like really satisfying storytelling through game design. And this is

(03:52:40):
important because it might come up later. It's not just
about whether or not it tells a good story. It's
the fact that it's telling a good story through our medium. Well,
it's game design story mechanics that is so brilliant about
Half Life two. It is a stunning achievement for video games.
And yeah, it is better than a Link.

Speaker 3 (03:53:01):
To the past. Have you played through Link to the Past?

Speaker 4 (03:53:04):
Yes, I played it on a CRT, so I played
it in its authentic vibe as well, and it is
very fucking good. And I won't be mad about this,
Like I won't cry about this one because a link
to the past is phenomenal. I just think Half Life is,
like it deserves its fucking due. That's what I think.

Speaker 5 (03:53:22):
God it's tough, Like, well it's not tough for me,
I know what mine is. But like this is like
we're at the point where, like all the competitions, these
are all.

Speaker 4 (03:53:31):
Good, they're all winners. And I will not be sad.
Link to the past is phenomenal. I can't I can't
argue that it's not phenomenal. What I'm saying is that
Half Life two is extraordinary and there's just not too
many for like first person shooters that did what this
game fucking did also in its time, and it has
a fucking killer ass story.

Speaker 1 (03:53:52):
I mean even today, there's still shooters that don't understand
how how they it just misses the mark.

Speaker 2 (03:53:57):
They miss the mark when it comes to like how
oh god, the mission pacing the fucking Every time I
think about that game, it's one of those things where
I think about a new section or a new mission,
or I'm like, no, that was the best mission.

Speaker 1 (03:54:09):
It's like, okay, well Raven Home. Oh no, there's the
whole underbridge section. Oh no, there's the whole Uh there's
the whole sequence with the the caves and the actual
like go kart hovercraft.

Speaker 3 (03:54:21):
That far.

Speaker 4 (03:54:22):
I was so sick. You can break it too, Like
I think, am.

Speaker 2 (03:54:25):
I reading this correctly? It's down to me.

Speaker 4 (03:54:27):
Yeah, Dan will never budge God.

Speaker 5 (03:54:31):
I want to say one of them is my favorite
game ever at the other is I think, fine, I'm
not gonna.

Speaker 2 (03:54:36):
Budge Two's not fine, let me say that, but.

Speaker 3 (03:54:38):
Like, no, it is one of the great cities. One
it hurts, I do have to.

Speaker 1 (03:54:43):
Go Link to the past. Though Link the Pass is
linked to the past. This Link of the Past is
still like a perfect video game.

Speaker 4 (03:54:49):
I'm not mad about it. I think a Link to
the Past is iconic and I absolutely loved playing. I
played it through on a Christmas break and god, that
was really cool playing it on like waking up Christmas
morning and Link the Past really really really fun.

Speaker 2 (03:55:02):
Yeah at game was that ninety one?

Speaker 3 (03:55:06):
Uh? That was? What what month do you remember? I
don't remember. I remember Japanese. I got it for Christmas.
I was born.

Speaker 2 (03:55:15):
See, so I'm as old as that game.

Speaker 3 (03:55:18):
Wow.

Speaker 4 (03:55:20):
All right, Legend of Zelda Link to the Past wins
against Half Life two. Our next matchup is Divinity Original
Sin to against Tony Hawk pro Skater three.

Speaker 3 (03:55:33):
You motherfuckers.

Speaker 4 (03:55:37):
I mean, come on, like the storytelling and Divinity Original
Sin is like it's breathtaking and like in Tony Hawk,
Dan was like, you can like add another way to
add to your combo.

Speaker 3 (03:55:49):
He did say that that's a quote, But Dad, what
that game? God, that's it's so important for what that was?

Speaker 4 (03:55:55):
My combo.

Speaker 3 (03:55:58):
Combos are very important Tony Hawk. Yeah, Oh man, why
the fuck do I have to keep doing this. Uh ship.

Speaker 4 (03:56:12):
Do the thing, Mike?

Speaker 3 (03:56:17):
Does it sway you that no one has heard of Divinity?

Speaker 1 (03:56:21):
That's that's demonstrably false. Just because you said that, I'm
gonna walk around to Okay, I have to go Divinity
and too, Dan. I love good c RPGs so much,
And that is the second they are. You know, that's
the second best one ever made.

Speaker 4 (03:56:40):
We just like, keep fucking placating this guy who cannot read.

Speaker 3 (03:56:45):
You can read. The codex took too long, so I
hit extra. You're supporting what she just said, don't do it?
What was Divinity against Tony three? Oh god?

Speaker 2 (03:56:57):
Did you? Did you just realize how little of the
flight you put up? Do you want to try to
sway me?

Speaker 4 (03:57:01):
Noo?

Speaker 3 (03:57:03):
But yeah, I think you're more of a defendity guys lost.
But that's just a tragedy. Yeah, you got a video
game ass video game versus a visual novel.

Speaker 2 (03:57:11):
I like video game ass video games every once in
a while, But Divinity Yet, Divinity Original Sin two is
a video game ass video game.

Speaker 3 (03:57:16):
Let's not. I don't get that wrong.

Speaker 2 (03:57:18):
You can, you can, You're you're If you pick a
skeleton for a character, people get are afraid of you
and won't talk to you unless you put a bucket
over your head and you walk around half the game
with a bucket over your and they're like, alright, I
guess I'll talk to you.

Speaker 3 (03:57:30):
Okay, it looks so dumb.

Speaker 2 (03:57:32):
It's it's a very video game.

Speaker 3 (03:57:33):
Ass video game. That's fine. I like that idea anyway.

Speaker 4 (03:57:37):
Divinity Original Sin two wins, knocking out Tony Hawk's pro
Skater three just on.

Speaker 3 (03:57:43):
A mission to push console games forward every round. I
know he's anti I'm still bitter about PC games. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (03:57:50):
So the guy with a fucking bo Jangles, No, that's
an Xbox. You have a fucking Wendy numerous forty nineties. Here,
give a Burger king forty ninety.

Speaker 3 (03:58:01):
I should talk to him, all right. What's the next
match up?

Speaker 4 (03:58:06):
The Last of Us versus Resident Evil Remake? Zombies, Old Vernon,
Old v New.

Speaker 2 (03:58:17):
I fought Harvard the Last of Us and I love
the Last of Us.

Speaker 3 (03:58:20):
It's incredible. Yeah.

Speaker 2 (03:58:21):
I like RESL remake more.

Speaker 4 (03:58:24):
I think Resident Evil Remake is just more genius in
terms of it's like design, Okay, cool, easy. The story
I think of the Last of Us is very important.

Speaker 2 (03:58:38):
Here's why you're in this mansion?

Speaker 4 (03:58:40):
Surviveh okay, Bloodborn versus Soul Caliber?

Speaker 2 (03:58:44):
Oh god, damn it, this is I gotta go to
the bathroom. I'll be You can keep talking because we
got swam marriages, so Dan, you can try. Yeah you want,
I'll be right back.

Speaker 4 (03:58:55):
Don't I feel like you should be here.

Speaker 1 (03:59:00):
I I've been drinking so much water. I can be
back in like thirty seconds if you guys came camp.

Speaker 3 (03:59:05):
Okay, do it. Yeah, I've been drinking a lot of
beer and whiskey.

Speaker 4 (03:59:09):
Do I like fighting games? I like tech in.

Speaker 3 (03:59:13):
Okay, Okay, that's nam Okay, you know Yoshi mits you?

Speaker 2 (03:59:16):
Yeah?

Speaker 3 (03:59:17):
Is sol Calval? You know? Hey, Hachi? Yeahs than a
sol Caliber? Yeah about that?

Speaker 4 (03:59:23):
How important is this to you?

Speaker 3 (03:59:25):
Soul Caliber?

Speaker 4 (03:59:26):
Yeah?

Speaker 3 (03:59:26):
Uh? Top five game of all time? Well?

Speaker 4 (03:59:29):
Did you play Bloodborne? Though you liked Bloodborn?

Speaker 3 (03:59:32):
Yeah? It was the first from soft game I ever been.

Speaker 4 (03:59:34):
Yeah, you just don't think it's so calib material.

Speaker 5 (03:59:38):
No, Bloodborne didn't make my top hundred. I didn't even
consider for my top hundred. Soul Calber is like, yeah,
like top five probably, Yeah, Soul Colored. That was the
one I was telling him about how it's the most
I've ever played a video game.

Speaker 4 (03:59:51):
Yeah, it's surprising too, because you just don't talk about
fighting games that much generally.

Speaker 5 (03:59:56):
No, but that was it was unbelievable because, like it was,
I bought the Dreamcast and it was one of the
launch games, and I didn't know anything about There were
a couple, you know before Soul Caliber, and I didn't
care about it, but it got straight tens in EGM,
and when that happened, I would be like, okay, if
we got four tens, I got yeah, your solid. So
I bought soul calber fell in love with it. It
became a thing me and my stepdad played like every day.

(04:00:18):
We were obsessed with it. And then so that was
like ninety nine. I went to college in O two.
By that point, three years later, I'm still fucking playing
it every day. It became a nightly thing in the
dorms where it's like it was our like pre bar ritual,
it was our just every night if we weren't going
to the bars thing, we're just playing eight on eight
Soul Caliber. We had a Lizardman Shots thing where it
was eight on eight random team battle and if you
get Lizardman for every guy you kill with Lizardman, the

(04:00:40):
guy you beat has to take a shot. So, like
there were nights we couldn't even go to the bar
because we were just like having so much fun playing
Soul Caliber and like so this is we're like years
and years and years even past Soul Caliber two and
three coming out, we just kept going to one. I
was arranging tournaments in the dorms.

Speaker 3 (04:00:56):
And stuff like that.

Speaker 5 (04:00:56):
It was just like such an incredible important game in
my life, even though like I'm not a huge fighting
game guy. It was so much fun and to this
day is so fun that it is on the short, short,
short short list of my absolute favorite.

Speaker 3 (04:01:12):
Games of all time.

Speaker 4 (04:01:16):
Mike, have you played Soul Caliber?

Speaker 3 (04:01:18):
Yeah? I like two of the most. I think is
that heresy to say no, A lot a lot of
people do, and two is very good. I just prefer one.
I like too.

Speaker 2 (04:01:27):
I played two on every platform because I liked playing
the different characters.

Speaker 3 (04:01:31):
Link and ha ha ha shu Spawn.

Speaker 5 (04:01:34):
Yeah, that's the one that got me to buy an Xbox,
just because it was the closest controller to drink guest.

Speaker 4 (04:01:40):
I think if I can just say this, I mean
I'm happy to hear more but I've heard a lot
about soul Caliber, and I've heard a lot about Bloodborne previously,
and I think that soul Caliber has come a long
way on this bracket, and I think soule Caliber has
done very good for soul Caliber.

Speaker 3 (04:02:02):
I see where this is going.

Speaker 5 (04:02:03):
I would argue we do have frum soft representations us
putting it doesn't vote the bracket. We Majora's Mask, one
of our absolute favorites. We have no fighting and representation.

Speaker 3 (04:02:17):
I think you know we.

Speaker 4 (04:02:18):
Don't have any final Fantasy representation too, and you laughed
about that.

Speaker 3 (04:02:22):
Oh, it's the brackets.

Speaker 1 (04:02:24):
Randomized representations doesn't matter when it's randomized, like we don't
have I think we least all of our metro veneas
didn't We think you should be very proud.

Speaker 3 (04:02:31):
Don't even have Symphony? Yeah?

Speaker 2 (04:02:33):
No, Uh do you want me to do blood Worm?
Marry you voting for blood Born?

Speaker 4 (04:02:38):
I'm gonna vote for Bloodborn, Okay, but I do. I
do respect Dan's fondness and appreciation for soul Caliber, and
I kind of want to play it.

Speaker 3 (04:02:45):
It's so fun.

Speaker 4 (04:02:47):
Bloodborn wins over soul Caliber. Next matchup, the Legend of
Zelda Ocarina of Time versus Shadow of the colosso.

Speaker 5 (04:02:57):
Oh, nocked up. I mean it's Acrena, but yeah, that's Akara.

Speaker 3 (04:03:02):
But this just sucks. I don't want to kill Shadow
that it is, that's.

Speaker 2 (04:03:08):
The seventeenth Colossus.

Speaker 3 (04:03:09):
Is this argument?

Speaker 4 (04:03:11):
Okay? I think I am in agreement with that as well.

Speaker 3 (04:03:15):
Yeah, okay, I think we did. We did a good
job with the Shadow talking about it alright at the Behemoth.
You know what this is. That's a.

Speaker 5 (04:03:23):
Hatey situation where just one game of the year, we
didn't have to talk about it. We have not even
had to argue for Yeah, because it's so good, you know.

Speaker 4 (04:03:32):
Okay, next one, just to close that out, Okarina of
Time wins against Shadow the Colossus, knocking it out. Our
next one, Portal versus Haites.

Speaker 3 (04:03:46):
That's interesting.

Speaker 4 (04:03:48):
This one's a tough one for me personally because these
are both really beloved and I I deeply love both
of these games very much for very different reasons. So
I'm really curious for you guys, land on this one.

Speaker 3 (04:04:03):
This is the first one where I think I'm torn.

Speaker 4 (04:04:05):
I am a little torn too. I was kind of
wondering if someone felt strong but why.

Speaker 1 (04:04:10):
Over to the other if you'd ask me an hour
ago before we talked about Haites more, I think I
would have leaned Portal. But now that we've talked about Hades,
the more I'm realizing, it's like God that that game
is barely not even five years old yet in terms
of not counting early access, and it's already like one
of the few games that was we could instantly call

(04:04:31):
a classic. It was game of the Year that year
and we were already using the or No, we didn't
talk about it, but then the next year it was like,
Haities really is just a fucking marvel.

Speaker 4 (04:04:41):
I'm happy with Hades. I think Haities is a phenomenal
game and it's earned its spot.

Speaker 5 (04:04:46):
So yes, yeah, and just to say, like I think Portal,
you know, a lot of it is just a fantastic game,
like the moment to moment, like test chambers and stuff
are so good and clever, and it's a good puzzle game.
But I do feel like a lot of the wrappings
of it are are kind of gimmicky in a way
that will feel dated, where it's like, yeah, we've heard
the cake is a lie thing a million times and

(04:05:06):
song and everything.

Speaker 4 (04:05:07):
Yeah, yeah, we've evolved a little bit whereas Hades.

Speaker 5 (04:05:12):
I don't think there's any real gimmicky stuff in Hades.
I think Hades is one of those Mario World type
games that you know, twenty years from now you could play,
and I don't think it's going to feel dated. I
think that art style is going to be great. I
think that gameplay is going to be great. Yeah, I'll
go Hades.

Speaker 4 (04:05:27):
Okay, by unanimous decision, Haites over Portal two more for
this round. The next one is GoldenEye versus Super Mario
sixty four. What really the bracket half spoken.

Speaker 3 (04:05:47):
That's the worst one yet. I think the N sixty
four titans are clashing. I will say my.

Speaker 2 (04:06:00):
Soul really did lean very slightly toward one of them,
but that I'm not.

Speaker 3 (04:06:06):
Okay, let me make my I think I've got a
coherent thing here.

Speaker 5 (04:06:11):
I was talking earlier about as once as I love Mario,
I didn't and you know, just do everything possible to
get it and sixty four. When Mario sixty four came out,
it wasn't until GoldenEye that I determined it was needed.
It was I needed to get it for GoldenEye. So
that's in the Golden Eye bucket. But then also I've
gone back and I've played both these games a lot.
I think beating both these games a couple times a

(04:06:33):
year forever. And there are always those times in Mario
sixty four where it's like, yeah, you start off, oh
you have a bomb battlefield, this is great, the penguin race,
that's fun, and then you get the hazy maze cave
or some of these later levels. I don't want to
do this er, it's like just like more obnoxious stars
to get. I'm never really annoyed in GoldenEye. I feel

(04:06:54):
like with GoldenEye, I'm always like fuck yeah, Like every
part of that campaign on all that dif and difficulties
on a multiplayer Goldeny is like only positive. Like if
you're talking to impact on the industry and all that stuff, yes,
Golden I brought FPS to console and all that in
a serious way, but Mario sixty four has the bigger

(04:07:15):
impact from just the three D stuff.

Speaker 4 (04:07:17):
Sorry, who are you voting for because you're all over
the place.

Speaker 3 (04:07:20):
Yeah yeah, but I am leaning GoldenEye. I am leaning GoldenEye.
Yeah yeah.

Speaker 1 (04:07:33):
Anytime I think of how good Mario sixty four was
still is good, that's not That's not what I'm trying
to say. I also think it's like, oh, the first
five worlds, I'm like, oh my god, I missed this,
and then I was like, yeah, it's hazy mased cave.

Speaker 3 (04:07:49):
It's the.

Speaker 1 (04:07:51):
It's the one where you have to depending on the
level on the level, you jump into the frame and
it will raise the water level. That is a cool
concept that quickly is like, what the fuck is this world?
It's like it just looks like a level editor, like
a Golden eight.

Speaker 2 (04:08:04):
To me is also like, it's also just it's got
the whole package, multiplayer campaign.

Speaker 3 (04:08:10):
Xenia Xenia. Imagine Xenia just strangling Peach with her I
gotta go Golden Nye too.

Speaker 4 (04:08:22):
Okay, I won't fight this.

Speaker 3 (04:08:23):
I think.

Speaker 4 (04:08:27):
I think this is fine. Okay, I agree Golden Night,
Golden Eye wins over Super Mario sixty four and the
final one for this round, Resident Evil to remake versus
The Legend of Zelda Breath of the Wild.

Speaker 1 (04:08:47):
It's got I think it's the best remake of I
cannot think of a better.

Speaker 3 (04:08:56):
Brutal and not just as a remake, it's just one
of the best, amazing, it's amazing game. I'm just saying like,
of all the good remakers, you're up against the best game. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yep.

Speaker 4 (04:09:10):
Okay, that's the end of this round. If you want,
I might go to the bathroom and take.

Speaker 3 (04:09:15):
Yeah okay, and how many are left?

Speaker 2 (04:09:18):
Sweet sixteen?

Speaker 3 (04:09:18):
Now? Sixteen? Yeah? Boy? Okay? Wait what happened to Mario Ottisy?
Was that earlier that round? Think it's still in right?

Speaker 4 (04:09:27):
Yeah?

Speaker 3 (04:09:28):
Okay?

Speaker 2 (04:09:30):
I would you want to marry his game against boy?

Speaker 8 (04:09:33):
Yeah?

Speaker 3 (04:09:35):
No, sorry, come on, yeah, okay, it'll be back. Yeah,
all right, and we're back. We are now officially into
the Sweet sixteen. Uh.

Speaker 1 (04:09:47):
If you your brackets are intact at this point, I
commend you. I think there's been some surprises. I don't
I don't think we have as a group have talked
about the Witchard three mouch before, so that might have
caught people off guard.

Speaker 3 (04:09:58):
Uh what did it beat? Oh? Melg solid.

Speaker 2 (04:10:02):
I also think Divinity Originals in two might have been
a little uh what's the word?

Speaker 1 (04:10:06):
Like a underdog coming up. So kudos to you if
your brackets intact. Okary, we're out of the Sweet sixteen.

Speaker 4 (04:10:16):
Our next matchup is Tetris versus Command and conquer Red
Alert too.

Speaker 3 (04:10:24):
Mike, Mike, can we just do it?

Speaker 1 (04:10:28):
I truly, I'm not doing this as a bit. I
actually I have my My heart is made of command
of Conquer, Red Alert, Tetris, Tetris.

Speaker 3 (04:10:38):
I don't I blow it up, blow up history. I
don't want to be that. Uh.

Speaker 5 (04:10:44):
I love Tetris. Tetris is fantastic, but my heart is
also with Redular two.

Speaker 2 (04:10:49):
Tetris effect is probably the best version of Tetris ever.

Speaker 3 (04:10:53):
And I love Tutus effect.

Speaker 1 (04:10:54):
It is fucking ethereal and otherworldly and it's affecting. But
oh my god, Red Alert two one of the best
strategy games. It's the best strategy game ever, I think.

Speaker 2 (04:11:02):
And uh yep, okay done.

Speaker 4 (04:11:06):
I think this isn't our best list for like historical accuracy.
This is our list. So if that's the one that
you're you have, you know, the biggest boner for, then
that's the one that you get.

Speaker 3 (04:11:17):
My dick is so huge for alert To, all.

Speaker 4 (04:11:20):
Right, Red Alert To wins against Tetris.

Speaker 8 (04:11:26):
It's really not a big it's not it's not a bit,
but it is funny like oh yes, respect, yeah, oh god,
I really am kind of hard, all right.

Speaker 4 (04:11:44):
Our next one, Metal Gear Solid three Snake Eater versus
Super Mario Odyssey.

Speaker 3 (04:12:00):
Yeah, your Solid three, dude, Odyssey is fucking awesome.

Speaker 2 (04:12:13):
Is the best Mario game.

Speaker 4 (04:12:15):
I agree. It's one of the reasons why I like why.
I was like, well, I mean Super Mario Odyssey. Like
Odyssey is like the pinnacle.

Speaker 5 (04:12:25):
It's best Metal Year versus best Mario from When you
put it that way, those are my two favorite series.
That's my holy trinity is Metal Here Mario Zelda, but
like Metal Gear probably one and two.

Speaker 3 (04:12:36):
I think I go Snake Eater.

Speaker 4 (04:12:38):
I'm gonna be Odyssey. Obviously. It's the It's the best Mario.
It's fucking insane.

Speaker 3 (04:12:45):
It's it's pure joy beginning the end.

Speaker 4 (04:12:48):
It's pure happiness incarnate.

Speaker 3 (04:12:53):
But can you beat a boss by saving the game
and leaving for a week and then he just dies
of old age? Fucking cool, It's really cool.

Speaker 2 (04:13:04):
It's tough because then you think about Odyssey, it's like
my mind's going to like, okay, well, maybe there's a
higher skill ceiling in.

Speaker 3 (04:13:10):
One and Odyssey. You can chain together all the hat
throws and jumps and shit.

Speaker 5 (04:13:14):
Oh if you want to speed run and stuff like, yeah,
odysty is way more interesting, and I'm getting I got
every single moon in that and did all the super
crazy bonus endings and all it's it's incredible. It's a
fucking perfect game. But I will remember Middle of Your
Solid three forever. I mean, same with Odyssey.

Speaker 1 (04:13:32):
But yeah, I really, really really like Super Mario Odyssey.
It is my favorite Mario game. But Snake Eater is
just has so many fucking colossal moments that are are
too good to ignore, right, I gotta go Snake Eater.

Speaker 4 (04:13:50):
Okay, I'm blown away.

Speaker 2 (04:13:53):
I'm surprised that was that easy for you. Dan, Not
that it was easy, but like, I'm shook it.

Speaker 3 (04:13:56):
I mean, snaky fucking cool.

Speaker 2 (04:13:59):
Yeah, it's good, all right, Okay.

Speaker 4 (04:14:02):
Snake Eater bumped out Super Mario odysty I didn't see
that coming. I wonder how this one will go. Red
Dead Redemption two versus eldin Ring.

Speaker 5 (04:14:13):
Okay, Red Dead had a nice ride. I would have
put it before, but strongly elden Ring here.

Speaker 4 (04:14:22):
Yeah, I agree, I mean I think elden Ring. So
the reason we like fought for Red Dead and it
got as far as it did was because it was
so intricate and because it was so well designed. Elden
Ring is so intricate and so well designed on the
scale is incredible.

Speaker 3 (04:14:38):
When we're freedom, I'm not I'm not gonna fight that.

Speaker 1 (04:14:41):
Sure, Yes, elden Ring wins. I think I don't even
think elden Ring's world is on the same. No, other
Ring's really.

Speaker 5 (04:14:51):
Good by the moment when you get past storm Bail
and it's like you're already like fifteen hours in and
then you see all that shit.

Speaker 3 (04:14:58):
Oh it was fucking real for me a while.

Speaker 1 (04:15:04):
It was it was the the subterranean, the fact that
that whole thing was under you the whole time, which
tears the kingdom also.

Speaker 3 (04:15:12):
Did, but like I was more interesting, Yeah for sure. Yeah, no,
that's fine, Okay.

Speaker 4 (04:15:18):
Rocket League bumps out red Dead Redemption two.

Speaker 3 (04:15:22):
Wait no, we didn't talk about Rocket League yet.

Speaker 4 (04:15:24):
Sorry, elden Ring bumps. Sorry, I was reading.

Speaker 2 (04:15:27):
Ahead Clandestine Ship to get Rocket League for fucket.

Speaker 4 (04:15:32):
League won our best game. Our next matchup is Rocket
League versus hit Man World of Assassination. I do think
this is gonna probably. I mean, I I love both
of these games very much.

Speaker 3 (04:15:49):
I would be.

Speaker 4 (04:15:52):
Shocked if Rocket League survived this. It just doesn't seem
like it will.

Speaker 3 (04:15:57):
I mean, I was just saying, I'm firmly hit Man.
I'm yeah, you're Oh wait, you're on you're hit Man
as well. Mary. I I think.

Speaker 4 (04:16:09):
I have I have more fun with Rocket League, but
I respect and love hit Man, so I'm fine with
hit Man.

Speaker 8 (04:16:17):
Yeah.

Speaker 4 (04:16:17):
Here, I thought that was there's no losers in this,
but I mean, I personally love Rocket League more.

Speaker 2 (04:16:24):
I thought you were going to go Rocket League, and
I would have to figure that out because I truly
don't know how I would pick.

Speaker 3 (04:16:29):
But yeah, hit Man.

Speaker 1 (04:16:31):
I would have picked Hitman eventually, let's be honest. But
I think I think you would have to hit Man
or Rocket League.

Speaker 4 (04:16:37):
Rock League is sick, feeling crazy League is.

Speaker 2 (04:16:41):
Crazy feeling made they yeah, yeah, okay, well.

Speaker 4 (04:16:47):
Then hit Man beats rocket League. Next legend of Zelda.
A link to the past versus Divinity Original Sin too. Shit,
I think this is probably where Divinity stops. I think
that's it for me. A link to the past is

(04:17:07):
like really hard to argue against, and that's really good.

Speaker 3 (04:17:10):
So yeah, I'm with that is why this is why
we're friends. Yeah, I didn't expect that. Okay, yeah, okay, okay, okay.

Speaker 6 (04:17:21):
Uh.

Speaker 4 (04:17:21):
A link to the past bumps out Divinity original sintwo uh.
Next Resident Evil remake versus Bloodborn, God damn interesting one.

Speaker 2 (04:17:36):
I still have to go blood Born.

Speaker 4 (04:17:38):
I'm gonna go remake.

Speaker 3 (04:17:40):
Oh no, I'm torn, I do.

Speaker 4 (04:17:44):
I just think Resident Evil remake is so fucking insane.
It's so cool, like the game, the level design, it's
so cool, and like, I know, Bloodborne actually also has
good level design, but like, oh well, well, well.

Speaker 1 (04:17:55):
Yeah, okay, well actually if dan If are you swayable
or you are.

Speaker 3 (04:17:59):
You, I'm not gonna labor this Resident Evil.

Speaker 2 (04:18:03):
Sulright, that's fine, Yeah, all right, that's fine.

Speaker 3 (04:18:06):
They're both great. But when I think Ari remake, I'm like,
oh yeah, that's hell yeah, and Bloodborne I'm like, oh yeah,
I should go back to that. But like Ari remake, okay, yeah,
it's it's so good.

Speaker 1 (04:18:17):
Okay, I think comparing Resume remakes level designed to bloodborns
is asenine, But that's fine.

Speaker 3 (04:18:24):
Saying at break in here and kick my ass, yeah,
will be there. I'll hold him while he kicks you.

Speaker 1 (04:18:30):
I don't know how that would work, but the dooms
do not let him know that that. Okay, No, Resume
Will remake is great, It's phenomenal.

Speaker 3 (04:18:35):
I love it.

Speaker 4 (04:18:36):
Okay, uh Resident Evil Remake, Bumps Bloodborne. I'm amazed with
how quick that went.

Speaker 3 (04:18:43):
Too.

Speaker 4 (04:18:44):
Legend of Zelda Ocarina of Time versus Hades.

Speaker 3 (04:18:51):
You had had, yeah matchup, we're hurtling towards everybody else.

Speaker 2 (04:19:00):
Yeah, notice this, I think the final four from what
I'm I'm a lot of at that. Let's not get
that far.

Speaker 3 (04:19:07):
I think the final four is.

Speaker 1 (04:19:08):
Going to be two really really rough matchups. Yeah, it's
it's got to be Akarina.

Speaker 4 (04:19:13):
Okay, so Akarina Bumps out Haites. Next, GoldenEye versus Breadth
of the Wild.

Speaker 3 (04:19:23):
Ah man, all right, I fucking love Golden Eye. But whatever,
Yeah it happened.

Speaker 4 (04:19:30):
Yeah, yep, all right, sick. That was the sixteen. So
we're really down now we're down to uh.

Speaker 3 (04:19:40):
Was that sixteen or eight? Eight?

Speaker 4 (04:19:43):
Now we have eight?

Speaker 3 (04:19:44):
Now we have eight? Okay eight, this is the Elite eight. Okay, yeah,
this is the Elite eight.

Speaker 4 (04:19:48):
Are you ready?

Speaker 3 (04:19:49):
Oh?

Speaker 2 (04:19:49):
Yeah, the one we just created is gonna Okay.

Speaker 4 (04:19:52):
Command and Conquer Red Alert two versus Metal Gears, Hulid three,
Snake Eater.

Speaker 3 (04:19:57):
Oh that's where it has been fun that we push
we made Command of Conquer. I'm still I'm still riding
Reddler too, but it was good while we were there.
We this is your stop. I'm fine with that.

Speaker 2 (04:20:20):
I'm not I'm gonna get off again.

Speaker 3 (04:20:25):
With Reddler too. You know you got to get off.

Speaker 2 (04:20:30):
Hold on, hold on, hold on, let me know, let
me actually like think about this for a second. That
was just kind of pure did going.

Speaker 3 (04:20:39):
Nope, I'm going Reddler to respect it. I respect I
got it? Yeah for me? Have you heard enough about
both of these merry or do we.

Speaker 4 (04:20:51):
Really talked a lot about both of these games? Can
you do like, because you've talked exhaustively, can you just
give me a nice like listen, this is my final
pitch and it should be short.

Speaker 3 (04:21:08):
Metal Ear Solid three is the best story in the
middle Gear Solid series. It is, no, no, no.

Speaker 2 (04:21:15):
I wanted you to save that for potentially next round
because the more I think about them, like, what am
I doing?

Speaker 3 (04:21:26):
It's come.

Speaker 2 (04:21:28):
It took me.

Speaker 3 (04:21:29):
I'm sorry it took me so long, but yeah, it's okay, yep, okay.

Speaker 4 (04:21:33):
All right next. Oh and just to clarify, uh, metal
Gear Solid three wins against Command and Conquer red alert
to our next matchup is elden Ring versus hit Man
World of Assassination.

Speaker 3 (04:21:51):
This time I'm going to hit Man.

Speaker 4 (04:21:54):
I'm I think, oh, i'm.

Speaker 3 (04:21:59):
Uh uh.

Speaker 4 (04:22:02):
Different ways they're like so important.

Speaker 3 (04:22:04):
I think hit Man's more uneven. I think there are
levels that are not great.

Speaker 5 (04:22:08):
I think, especially in three near the end, like the
train level and stuff, it started thinking like we cared
more about the story and the lore of forty seven
than we do.

Speaker 3 (04:22:18):
Sure, yeah, that's true.

Speaker 1 (04:22:21):
I will say also, I don't see many people talking
about I think elden Ring can actually get really fucking
boring in the open world. Sometimes it's not I'm not
saying it needs to be densely as I don't. I
don't want it to be more ubisofted, but I still
think there are vast stretches of that open world that
it can't even I'm not I'm already trying to compare

(04:22:44):
it to another open world game that does so many
things better.

Speaker 3 (04:22:46):
But like.

Speaker 1 (04:22:49):
My point being, I totally agree with you with hit
Man three, and like I think they went way too
story focused with some of the stuff in three, even
though that also has some of my favorite maps.

Speaker 3 (04:22:57):
Berlin great maps. Yeah is Real.

Speaker 2 (04:23:01):
Is incredible but like.

Speaker 1 (04:23:04):
I also do think elden Ring has some of those
throwaway dungeons where it's like, oh, this is just a
cut and paste of that mini boss, that cat one
that swipes downward at you.

Speaker 5 (04:23:13):
It's all you know, gray and stepping on switches and yeah,
definitely that Catos.

Speaker 3 (04:23:17):
That's that's.

Speaker 2 (04:23:18):
That's all I'm saying is like, I think I think elden.

Speaker 4 (04:23:20):
Ring can be on even as well, but like I
think I'm leaning towards elden Ring.

Speaker 1 (04:23:25):
That's fine again, It's just I'm totally fine with that.
I mean, Hetman was Elite eight that I think it's
where it deserves to be.

Speaker 4 (04:23:33):
Okay, elden Ring beats hit Man. Next legend of Zelda
Link to the Past against Resident Evil remake.

Speaker 2 (04:23:43):
Ship.

Speaker 4 (04:23:43):
I mean, I don't think too many of us are
probably gonna argue with Linked in the Past.

Speaker 1 (04:23:48):
So yeah, okay, it's okay, my my, my trifecta Zelda
Resident Evil and I used to say Ratchet and Clank, Yeah,
but I think it's probably Halo. These're all very good
serious anyway, Yeah, Linked in the Past.

Speaker 4 (04:24:14):
I thought you're gonna say two games and then.

Speaker 3 (04:24:18):
That would have been really god. I wish I was God.

Speaker 2 (04:24:21):
I wish I was as funny as Mary. I would
have said that would have been Goodfecta is Zelda and
Resident Evil and Zenya.

Speaker 4 (04:24:30):
Okay, so uh linked to the past wins of a
Resident Evil, our last one Legend of Zelda Ocarina of
Time versus Legend of Zelda, Breath of the Wild Man.

Speaker 3 (04:24:43):
All right, it's it's Breath of the Wild.

Speaker 2 (04:24:47):
Yeah, but also like that's the best Zelda game versus
the second best Selda.

Speaker 5 (04:24:53):
Right, well, I disagree with that, but like, I do
think that Okarina. Part of what's so magical about that
is that it was their first swing at three D,
same way that Mario sixty four was, Like, how the
fuck is it that? Like, we didn't have three D
games before, and then Nintendo on their first swing their
two biggest franchises, they super knocked it out of the park.

(04:25:14):
And not just like, oh it was good for early
three D. No, Akarna is still one of the best
games of all time. I still play through that and
I'm in awe of how fucking good that game is.
But Breath of the Wild is on a different level.

Speaker 2 (04:25:27):
Yeah, and.

Speaker 3 (04:25:29):
It's yeah, it's breath the while for me same.

Speaker 4 (04:25:32):
The bracket has spoken. We are at top four. You ready?

Speaker 3 (04:25:35):
Oh boy?

Speaker 4 (04:25:37):
Okay, Metal Gear Solid three Snake Eater versus Eldon Ring.

Speaker 3 (04:25:43):
Oh I mean I'm snake Eater.

Speaker 4 (04:25:49):
Sorry, Bud, I'm elden Ring.

Speaker 5 (04:25:51):
God, all right, Mike, this is a big one, elden Ring.
Remember the b man that makes a Tommy gun out
of bees and shoot.

Speaker 3 (04:26:02):
Bees in the up.

Speaker 5 (04:26:05):
Remember the long Predator sequence with a tall letter. Remember
the Spirit river God?

Speaker 3 (04:26:13):
Cool? Yeah, Lightning Man.

Speaker 1 (04:26:16):
Let me at least say this snake here is the
cooler game. Yeah, but that's mm hmmm.

Speaker 3 (04:26:26):
But is it?

Speaker 4 (04:26:27):
Bester? Like the boss fights?

Speaker 2 (04:26:30):
My god, some of the best boss fights or the
best boss fight ever?

Speaker 4 (04:26:37):
The character?

Speaker 1 (04:26:41):
Can you put your p S five on sleep and
go away and then you come back and read On's
Dead of old age?

Speaker 2 (04:26:46):
No?

Speaker 3 (04:26:48):
You can you eat twenty mushrooms and spin around a
bunch of puke. Not fuck huge pro sack. So you
canna have sex and snake Eater on a bear? You
know you know what's rough?

Speaker 2 (04:27:03):
I actually I I don't. I'm not it's it's here.
I'm not complaining. All I'm saying is I don't think
elden Ring should be in our in in a final four,
but it is, and it's it's a fucking phenomenal game.

Speaker 3 (04:27:15):
I think I just.

Speaker 1 (04:27:18):
A lot of people like elden Ring more than I do,
but I also know it's it's like monumental, It's fucking awesome.
I love it, oh, I I honestly, I think I

(04:27:41):
have to go snake eater. I I love elden Ring,
but like, h like fucking cool ship cool ship per minute.

Speaker 2 (04:27:52):
Like ye.

Speaker 3 (04:27:55):
To us? Yeah, but also like I I how did
we get here? Yeah?

Speaker 1 (04:28:02):
I stand by that. I'm elden Ring is a great game.
I haven't I have qualms with it that I think
it got farther than the should have.

Speaker 4 (04:28:15):
That's fine, Okay, somehow Metal Gear Solid three one over
elden Ring, and now we are at Legend of Zelda
Link to the Past versus Legend of Zelda Breath of
a Wild.

Speaker 3 (04:28:33):
I can't lose. I just realized that way, what's still
there even if all of my favorite games.

Speaker 2 (04:28:41):
Even if elden Ring had won, though, yeah, but this
is three of my favorite games.

Speaker 3 (04:28:46):
This is two of Fary's.

Speaker 2 (04:28:47):
I think, like, yeah, yeah, I think we all win,
which is good.

Speaker 3 (04:28:51):
The Wild Yeah, that's the hardest decision I could ever make.

Speaker 4 (04:28:56):
I think that's very very very very very very difficult.

Speaker 3 (04:29:03):
All Right.

Speaker 4 (04:29:04):
The Past is like pretty expertly designed.

Speaker 5 (04:29:08):
Oh it's way more replayable. I have, like I said,
played that probably fifty times. Breath the Wild. I haven't
gone back to since the first time, just because I
feel like you can't. Really is the exploration in the
discovery that was so huge with Breath the Wild more
than the moment to moment, Like I understand the complaints

(04:29:28):
about the breakable weapons and all that stuff, and I
wonder if that would be worse on subsequent playthroughs and
like linked to the Past kind of has the edge
and like more dungeons and traditional dungeons, because that was
one of the complaints about Breath the Wild was that,
like it's got four kind of dungeons.

Speaker 3 (04:29:45):
I think the Past has a shit ton and the
light world dark world stuff.

Speaker 8 (04:29:50):
Uh.

Speaker 5 (04:29:51):
I go back and forth between these two of my
favorite end of all time, And I still don't know
the answer.

Speaker 3 (04:30:01):
Mary, Are you leaning anyway so slightly?

Speaker 4 (04:30:05):
I'm suffering.

Speaker 2 (04:30:08):
I am leaning one way if.

Speaker 1 (04:30:09):
If it makes it easier on you, I can tell
you where I'm leaning and I don't think you're a
surprised I'm leaning Breath.

Speaker 2 (04:30:14):
Of the Wild.

Speaker 4 (04:30:15):
Breath of the Wild.

Speaker 1 (04:30:16):
Yeah, I think Breath of the Wild is what video
games were building towards since they fucking started.

Speaker 4 (04:30:22):
Yea, elements of it are just so wild.

Speaker 1 (04:30:27):
Yeah, it's comparing a fucking like I'm not enough of
an expert to understand whether this is a good metaphor,
but it's like comparing link to the Past.

Speaker 2 (04:30:39):
Is this really fucking intricate, really.

Speaker 1 (04:30:41):
Well made, ornate watch, Breath the Wild is the fucking
Grandfather Clock Like, it's they're so.

Speaker 2 (04:30:50):
I have never played a game.

Speaker 1 (04:30:54):
With the sense of discovery is just so potent, even
after one hundred and twenty hours and Breath of the
Wild and that's there's absolutely nothing. I I think if
you're if you're talking about lack of flaws, then Linked
to the Past wins every single fucking day over any
video game ever made. It's I think it's the It's
the only game I would call perfect.

Speaker 3 (04:31:14):
It's like that in Mario World for me.

Speaker 1 (04:31:15):
Yeah, there there are very few, but like, Breath of
the Wild is just it's weird too, because I also
I also think.

Speaker 3 (04:31:24):
M no, I'm I'm sold. It's Breath the While for me.

Speaker 4 (04:31:27):
Breath of the Wild. Yeah, just so incredible, the way
it makes you feel, the story where you go, I yeah,
it's beautiful, the way.

Speaker 1 (04:31:37):
The way you can have You can you can jump
in for five minutes and have a memorable mini adventures time.
You can jump in for an entire Sunday and like
just see ship for twelve hours straight. That you just
there's there's stuff in there that no one. People don't
talk about because there's so much. But like all of
a sudden, you're paragliding over this cycliff and all of
a sudden there's this little beach village. You had no

(04:31:58):
idea existed. That ship ton of NPCs. There aren't even
that many side quests to pursue from there. It's just
this whole community living down there. That's like, oh no,
we're fishermen. We just found this little inlet's protected from
the wind. Like, oh cool, good for you. I gotta
go fucking build this village.

Speaker 4 (04:32:14):
Yeah, that's a sick.

Speaker 5 (04:32:18):
You can do stupid shit that you're not even ready for.
Where it's like, oh, I wonder if I can get
on the other side of this mountain during a thunderstorm,
and even though you don't have nearly enough stamina or anything,
you can just kind of like I'm gonna get my
stand on the back, I'm gonna try to crawl and
jump over there and like it to what end. It's
not even for like a mission. It's just like you're
climbing a mountain to see if you can, and it's rewarding.

Speaker 3 (04:32:38):
It's ye.

Speaker 1 (04:32:38):
Also, I fucking was very wrong earlier. I said this
on or two is the best immersive sim ever, maybe
Hit Man. It's Breath of the Wild Tiers of the Kingdom.
But Breath of the Wild especially like in the debate
between Breath of the Wild Tiers of the Kingdom, it's
like even now, and I said at the time it
came out, it's like Tiers of Kingdom is a better
game technically.

Speaker 2 (04:32:57):
I I think I was wrong. I Breath of the
Wild just.

Speaker 3 (04:33:04):
It changed. It's hard to say it changed.

Speaker 1 (04:33:06):
Everything because I don't think anybody else can do that. Again,
it's not something people can emulate, so it's not like
the closest. The closest anybody got was from software being
like okay, well let's try to do a similar open
world that we put our combat in. But even if
it was breatha while versus elden Ring, I still ten
times out of ten would go breath of the wild.

(04:33:27):
Me too, truly really hit me the first time I
was in a thunderstor storm and all of a sudden
that you hear lightning in the distance, and all of
a sudden, the sword you're holding starts sparking.

Speaker 4 (04:33:41):
Such an awesome moment.

Speaker 3 (04:33:43):
There's those layers.

Speaker 1 (04:33:44):
Shit, sorry, I hit my microphone. There's layers where it's like, oh,
there's a storm, weather patterns, it's random.

Speaker 2 (04:33:50):
This is awesome. Why is my sword sparking? You then
maybe get hit by lightning.

Speaker 1 (04:33:56):
You're like, that was fucking awesome, even though I have
half a heart left and there's like the bit it
bit it low health. Once you then figure out you
can throw the sword at an enemy to get them
struck by lightning.

Speaker 2 (04:34:09):
That's like the definition of immersive sim. It's like causing.

Speaker 3 (04:34:12):
Effects all the different things.

Speaker 1 (04:34:15):
You can put it to their chest and sneak up
to their face before they wake up, and just steal
the weapons off their neck.

Speaker 4 (04:34:20):
Right without fighting them.

Speaker 2 (04:34:24):
Then all of a sudden you go to the desert
and you can fucking wakeboard around on sand seals.

Speaker 3 (04:34:30):
You don't have to do that at all. It's breath
the wild. There's always a fucking shrine in view that
you can go do and those are just phenomenal.

Speaker 4 (04:34:39):
And like the shrines are all so good and there's
so many.

Speaker 2 (04:34:44):
Of them, and they become fast travel points.

Speaker 4 (04:34:46):
What you're done, yep, smart, elegant, elegant. Yeah, that's using
the towers for uh uh. They were just like really
wonderful ways for you to see the aggression in your
stamina meter over time.

Speaker 5 (04:35:04):
And before that, like you know, stamping maps and stuff
was the thing you saw at the time in open
world games. Like the fact that you could like you
had the five beacons you could put from your binoculars
like oh, I see a thing, but then you can
also check them in and be like, oh here's the thing.

Speaker 3 (04:35:15):
I could probably come back once I have this, and yeah,
holy shit, like yeah.

Speaker 2 (04:35:21):
Also the way they made survival light shit kind of accessible.
It's like you go into the cold stuff, you see
the thermometers start to drop.

Speaker 3 (04:35:27):
You're like, well, what the fuck am I supposed to do?

Speaker 1 (04:35:29):
It's like, well, you can't go there yet, go get
some warm clothes, you fucking idiot, and then eat some peppers. Yeah,
or get this ability to fucking freeze a block of
river so you can jump across. Also, the amount of
ways that those the physics of those seemingly simple four
abilities can I won't put them on the same level
as the Zone ieabilities Tiers of the Kingdom, but I

(04:35:50):
do think they they're less like tires the Kingdom. Those
the zone iabilities were kind of like superpower ass shit,
which is great.

Speaker 3 (04:36:00):
Kind of mess.

Speaker 5 (04:36:02):
There's more you could do, but it did require a
little more kind of like fiddling and stuff like that.
Or it's like Breath the wild. Yeah, I don't like
the powers as much as Here's the Kingdom, but I
like the fact that I'm not constantly trying like, okay,
let me rotate this the right way and stick it
over here.

Speaker 1 (04:36:17):
And you know, also, oh my god, there, that's like
my favorite game to watch. Like GDC talks about where
they're like, oh, here's how we set up. No matter
where you are in the world, there's always going to
be the triangle rule, which is we want something in
the foreground to show you the scale. We want something
in the back to show you what you.

Speaker 2 (04:36:36):
Can climb around, go around this for but also keep
in mind you can climb basically anything in this game,
so we also want you to consider whether it's worth
going over something. But then it might rain and then
you're slipping, and then there's always those like hair like
skin of your teeth and get.

Speaker 3 (04:36:56):
Over the edge, like just keep pressing the analystic forward
just or do I do it that last.

Speaker 2 (04:37:00):
Jump with the B button that will then send me
to my death if I funk up, or just the
little flutters of a flute.

Speaker 3 (04:37:08):
The music in that game, the way it plays organically
into like when a breeze hits the trees. Oh my god.

Speaker 2 (04:37:13):
Yeah, we could talk forever about it. I just wanted
to at least be like, well.

Speaker 4 (04:37:19):
You have to keep talking about it, because if Breath
of the Wild is winning over linked to the Past,
then our final matchup is fuck Solid three Snake Eater
versus Legends and Breath of the Wild.

Speaker 3 (04:37:33):
I thought we were yeah, sorry, I thought we were.

Speaker 4 (04:37:36):
That was that was the top four.

Speaker 3 (04:37:41):
Yeah, so now it's two two and I'm fully I
think the Wild.

Speaker 2 (04:37:45):
Yeah sorry, I thought we were done with the episode.

Speaker 3 (04:37:50):
I was like, let's just.

Speaker 1 (04:37:53):
Now it's it's Breath of the Wild versus Snake Ear, Yeah,
which is a cool matchup.

Speaker 3 (04:37:57):
That's a really good matchup, but also like love it. Yeah,
it's it's breath the while, it's bread Yeah, yep, yep. Terrytown.

Speaker 1 (04:38:08):
You're building up the village and like each person brings
their instrument, which is a very good ode to the
series past, where the central conceit of every game was
an instrument.

Speaker 2 (04:38:17):
He was playing to manipulate ship.

Speaker 3 (04:38:21):
There's just a million, dude.

Speaker 4 (04:38:22):
The moment you see the giant maze in the distance
and you're like, I wonder if like.

Speaker 3 (04:38:28):
Several four right, yeah, and the Lost Wood stuff.

Speaker 5 (04:38:34):
Psycho all the times, just a random fucking Bocablan camp
and you're just fucking I wonder if I can roll
this bomb down here?

Speaker 3 (04:38:41):
And then like man, I guess you can. Yeah.

Speaker 4 (04:38:44):
Game, what a game?

Speaker 1 (04:38:46):
I like as send in Tears of the Kingdom, I
like Ultra hand m hmm, I like what is the
I know there's fuse. Fuse is the one. Fuse is
the one I went back to Breath of the Wild.
Not being able to combine all those items into weapons
is the one I do miss when I come back

(04:39:06):
from Tiers of the Kingdom.

Speaker 3 (04:39:07):
What's the fourth zone? I ability I'm missing.

Speaker 1 (04:39:10):
Oh, reverse time, which actually becomes like the really overpowered one.

Speaker 3 (04:39:14):
If you know how to use it. But yeah, sure, yeah,
Breath of the Wild is just.

Speaker 1 (04:39:19):
Yeah, I think I've still seen only like thirty five
percent of that game. That's probably under selling it. Fifty
five percent of that game. There's a lot in that game.

Speaker 3 (04:39:29):
Yeah, I'll never forget.

Speaker 5 (04:39:30):
I was with Bianca and I was I got the
Switch and Breath the Wild a few weeks before it
came out, and I was playing it. It's one of
those things where I'm losing my mind playing it, and
I'm wondering, like I need to talk to someone who's
been playing this, and uh, you know my message friends
and stuff are is this?

Speaker 3 (04:39:46):
This is like one of the best games of all time?

Speaker 2 (04:39:47):
Right? You see this?

Speaker 3 (04:39:48):
Did you see this? Holy shit?

Speaker 5 (04:39:50):
Even Tight Island all that stuff and Bonk and I
went out like while I was halfway through the game
to some Greek plays and we were just in the
middle of eating and she was like, oh, yeah, so
how was Zelda? And I found myself just ranting and
raving about like how fucking incredible this was? And I
found myself tearing up and thinking like I did not
know video games could still make me feel this magic.

(04:40:12):
I mean, I still love video games, but like that
level of magic of like how open this world is
and the possibilities and exploration and rewarding you for trying things.
And I just couldn't stop talking about it. I felt
myself getting emotional. It's like, holy shit, I've been talking
about video games my higher life and I can't tell you,
as an adult that I've ever felt that emotional just

(04:40:33):
being like this is magic.

Speaker 2 (04:40:35):
I think there's an assumption like every I think there's
an assumption at any age, but especially like when you've
seen played as many video games as all three of
us have individually and collectively, you've played the best game.

Speaker 3 (04:40:46):
You're ever going to play. But for that child's a
feeling again, for that's.

Speaker 1 (04:40:51):
Come along in twenty seventeen, and I kind of know
it fifty hours in. Honestly, Like the farther I get
from that game, the more I'm like, yeah, those feelings
were all correct. It's that's crazy. And also, speaking of
the Witcher three doing things that, like a lot of games,
have been trying. Breath of the Wild makes the Witcher
three look like fucking intro course, like, thank you. So

(04:41:13):
many games had been trying open worlds had been trying
immersies and elements had been trying it, just like I don't,
I truly don't know how it was done.

Speaker 4 (04:41:21):
It doesn't change that it beat Metal Gear Solid in
the first round of our game deliberation.

Speaker 2 (04:41:28):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (04:41:29):
Yeah, but hey, everything worked out in the end, didn't it.

Speaker 4 (04:41:31):
It did work out in the end. So uh, fire
Escape's best game of all time is Legend of Zelda
Breath of the Wild. Your job, everybody.

Speaker 1 (04:41:42):
In like a month, it'll be eight years old, right,
March twenty twenty seventeen. Wow, yeah, I think it was March.

Speaker 3 (04:41:49):
Yeah, it was March twenty seventeen.

Speaker 2 (04:41:51):
Because Horizon was February.

Speaker 1 (04:41:56):
No, Horizon was like two weeks before the first Zero
Dawn was two weeks before it was Forbidden West.

Speaker 3 (04:42:02):
There was like a month before Tiers at Kingdom.

Speaker 5 (04:42:04):
Oh, it was right for elden Ring. It was right
for elden Ring, correct, Yes, yeah, yeah, yeah, yep. Another
really something special yep.

Speaker 1 (04:42:14):
Uh And on a even in twenty seventeen, a pretty
underpowered console, no less like when you go into the
Lost Woods.

Speaker 3 (04:42:21):
It was a launch game and it was underpowered. Yeah. Yeah, man,
imagine the tea. What a game. Yep.

Speaker 4 (04:42:31):
Well, wonderful to have one hundred episodes with you guys.
Congratulations for one hundred episodes.

Speaker 3 (04:42:39):
Yeah, four four years ago now April twenty twenty one.

Speaker 5 (04:42:44):
On four years Wow, will always be like, we're going
to start a podcast and they do three or four episodes,
then then they stopt us.

Speaker 1 (04:42:52):
I said that to Amanda tonight and we were making dinner.
H're recording this on a like a Sunday night, and
I was like, I was like, as much as like
when I first met her, she's you know, there's there's
a joke that's like, oh, every fucking every guy has
a podcast, And I was like, I held off for
like six dates telling her it wasn't sick. She discovered

(04:43:14):
it before that, but I was like, I'm not going
to tell around our an early date that I have
a podcast because every fucking guy does and it's probably
not just guys, but like, I think, I know that's
like the meme kind of thing.

Speaker 3 (04:43:25):
And then tonight, at that time, it was like pandemic times.

Speaker 4 (04:43:29):
Yeah, that's the only way you could talk to people
right too, and I think, actually it is how we
talk to each other and like still communicate and spend
time together, so it does do those things well.

Speaker 1 (04:43:40):
Tonight at dinner, I was like, I was like to
be to be completely honest, I was like, oh, okay,
it's Sunday. It's like I got some other things I
gotta worry about tomorrow. I was like, ah, we gotta
do this best game of all time recording tonight. And
then like as I started thinking about it more, I
was like Jesus Christ one hundred episodes, Like I could
I commit to stuff pretty easily in my life, but
like this four years is like it has flown like

(04:44:04):
and I it, Yeah, I don't know. I never once
doubted that we would get far into it, but it's
like it it hit me today how much of like
a commitment it has been, because like there's been.

Speaker 2 (04:44:15):
Times we were all really, I guess we will record
this before I fly across the world in like eight hours.

Speaker 5 (04:44:22):
But like surgeries and yeah, all sorts of just like
yea GODI.

Speaker 4 (04:44:27):
Was a race to the finish last year, like finding
with all of our busy schedules. So but we make
it work. And I'm like that we have it.

Speaker 5 (04:44:36):
Yeah, yes, maybe occasionally have to get a substitute or something,
but like now we're.

Speaker 1 (04:44:39):
Not episode No, it's been wonderful. I love you too,
love all our listeners for being with us for a
hundred episodes. We'll be back to our normal as scheduled
programming next episode one hundred and one. We're into the
triple digits now officially politics. Now, yeah, it's all politics.

Speaker 2 (04:44:59):
So we'll talk about the tariffs, we'll talk about we'll
talk about potential for partnerships with various countries, and we'll
kind of theory craft different trade agreements in the coming
trade why it will be great Greenland.

Speaker 3 (04:45:10):
We've got a lot of thoughts on Greenland. I'm geting
my notes together.

Speaker 1 (04:45:12):
We're pretty sure if Xi Jinping just plays Breath of
the Wild, then he might come around on a bunch
of American ideas.

Speaker 3 (04:45:18):
We'll see, even though it's not an American game. We'll
just tell him we made it.

Speaker 2 (04:45:23):
Yeah, we'll be back in two weeks and we'll be
talking about some modern new games. I'm sure a lot
of actually.

Speaker 3 (04:45:32):
Fun ton of games we could be talking about next episodes.
That'll be fun. All right, Well, thank you as always everybody,
Thank you Mary, thank you Dan.

Speaker 2 (04:45:40):
We'll be back in episode one oh one.

Speaker 4 (04:45:43):
Thanks for listening, guys.

Speaker 3 (04:45:45):
Thanks everyone,