Day 7

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
His voice mail messages from.

Speaker 2 (00:03):
His tell yes, I was.

Speaker 1 (00:06):
It was the price that you undertook.

Speaker 3 (00:08):
I wrote a court order to have the PIN number
change to his voicemail account so I could access the
voicemail account.

Speaker 1 (00:16):
And what date was that?

Speaker 3 (00:17):
That would be June twenty fifth, two thousand and eight.

Speaker 1 (00:20):
And after that, what did you do? How did you
how were you able to access it?

Speaker 3 (00:24):
I called the voicemail from my desk phone and I
recorded the voicemail messages that were on his account.

Speaker 1 (00:33):
Take a look at the exhibit three sixty six.

Speaker 4 (00:36):
Are you familiar with this?

Speaker 5 (00:37):
Yes?

Speaker 6 (00:37):
I am.

Speaker 3 (00:38):
What are those two pages you're called detailed records number
eight three one four zero.

Speaker 6 (00:45):
Two one nine zero one.

Speaker 1 (00:48):
You know the name of the person that is associated
with that, right, yes, I do. And what's the name
that you believe is associated with that number?

Speaker 6 (00:56):
Jody Arius.

Speaker 4 (00:57):
And with regard to that particular number and the call.

Speaker 1 (01:00):
Of this that's involved, was there a call that you
were interested in that was on June.

Speaker 4 (01:09):
Fourth, two thousand and eight at eleven forty eight in
the East. With regard to that particular call, did that
involve eight three one four two.

Speaker 7 (01:22):
One nine oh one?

Speaker 4 (01:23):
Yes, And with regard to that call. Was there a
voicemail that you were able to obtain that was associated
with that?

Speaker 6 (01:31):
Yes, are coming to court.

Speaker 4 (01:35):
Did you have occasion to listen to Exhibit three sixty five?

Speaker 8 (01:38):
Yes?

Speaker 2 (01:38):
I did?

Speaker 4 (01:39):
And is that the voicemail I was associated with that
call that we just referenced, Yes, sir, I remember.

Speaker 1 (01:47):
The admission of the exhibit three sixty five. No objection
three sixty.

Speaker 8 (01:51):
Five is admitted.

Speaker 2 (01:55):
Very night.

Speaker 9 (01:56):
Anyway, return, you're starting to hear up. I I love
the call here that I already talked to her, So
you can call her back if you want.

Speaker 10 (02:03):
But it's not necessary.

Speaker 9 (02:05):
My phone died, so I wasn't getting back to anybody.

Speaker 11 (02:09):
And what else?

Speaker 9 (02:09):
Oh when I drove one hundred miles in the long direction,
over one hundred miles, thank you very much. So yeah,
remember New Mexico. It was a lot like that, only
you weren't here to prevent me from going into the
three digits. So fun fun, tell you all about that later. Also,
we were talking about when we were talking about your
upcoming travels my way, I was looking at the May calendar,
so I'm welcome to you. But Heather and I are

(02:31):
going to see Othello on July first, and we would
love for you to accompany us. I don't know when
Team Freedoms event is so, but you know it's on
the list, so we could do we could do Shakespeare
Creator Awake on the coast, so if you can make it.
It's not older to the coast in Creator Lake, but
let me know and I will talk to you.

Speaker 11 (02:52):
End of message. To delete this message, press seven to
save it in the archives. Press nine to a message
will be safe for Trinky Wren.

Speaker 12 (03:02):
With regard to.

Speaker 4 (03:02):
This particular message, and reviewing those telephone records.

Speaker 1 (03:06):
That do you have in front of you, were you
able to determine where the collar was when this call
was placed?

Speaker 3 (03:14):
The color would have been about forty five miles north
of Kingman and about twenty seven miles which is about
twenty seven miles south of the Nevada border approximately.

Speaker 12 (03:24):
How have you have the questions.

Speaker 13 (03:27):
Cross examination.

Speaker 2 (03:30):
The afternoon, detective sir?

Speaker 1 (03:35):
Quick questions for you, sir?

Speaker 14 (03:40):
Was that the only voicemail that was on mister Alexander's
phone when you examined it?

Speaker 6 (03:48):
Well, I didn't examine the phone.

Speaker 3 (03:49):
Those are what I downloaded from the voicemail server that
Verizon Wireless has and there was more than one voicemail
on there.

Speaker 14 (03:57):
Yes, perhaps I skud in artfully the voice you retreat
the voicemail. That wasn't the only voicemail, right, okay? And
that wasn't the only phone that or work that you
were did in this case? Is that correct? You sought
out other phone records, didn't okay? As a matter of fact?

(04:20):
And have you reviewed your police report recently?

Speaker 8 (04:23):
I have?

Speaker 14 (04:24):
Okay, You sought out the records of a Dustin Thompson.

Speaker 6 (04:29):
Do you recall that I did?

Speaker 1 (04:30):
Okay?

Speaker 14 (04:33):
And then Ashley Thompson correct?

Speaker 2 (04:34):
Yes, okay?

Speaker 14 (04:36):
And do you what is your understanding of why you
did that? Detective drawing your attention back to the cell
phone records of Dustin Thompson and Ashley Thompson, what was
your understanding of why you were asked to pull those records?

Speaker 6 (04:59):
I don't re all the specifics.

Speaker 3 (05:00):
I just know that they were named very early on
in the investigations, maybe having some.

Speaker 15 (05:05):
Knowledge of but what occurred?

Speaker 8 (05:07):
Okay?

Speaker 14 (05:08):
And based on that, and who would have directed you
to search out those records?

Speaker 3 (05:16):
It could have been one of the several people could
have been Detective Floor as my boss and the sergeant
you know there were some people working the case at
that time. As the information comes in I'm at the office,
they call and say, hey, we got some new information.

Speaker 6 (05:30):
Can you start working this?

Speaker 14 (05:31):
Okay, So you were asked by someone else to obtain
these records and sought out court orders to get them.

Speaker 9 (05:39):
Is that correct?

Speaker 14 (05:41):
And the voicemail messages, just for our understanding, did you
listen to all of them, not just the one we
heard in court?

Speaker 2 (05:50):
Correct?

Speaker 14 (05:50):
Okay, thank you, sir.

Speaker 12 (05:52):
Welcome direct.

Speaker 13 (05:55):
Any questions from the jury.

Speaker 16 (05:56):
It looks like we have one counsel please. A growth
true question is could you play the voicemail Exhibit thirty five.

Speaker 13 (06:08):
I could not hear.

Speaker 11 (06:10):
Message, Hey, what's going on all?

Speaker 9 (06:12):
Good night?

Speaker 8 (06:14):
Anyways?

Speaker 9 (06:14):
Ran about the time you're starting to hear of I know, love,
we called you, so I already talked to our so
doing call her back if you want, but it's not necessary.
My phone dies, so I wasn't getting.

Speaker 2 (06:24):
Back to anybody.

Speaker 11 (06:26):
And what else?

Speaker 9 (06:26):
Oh when I drove one hundred miles in the wrong directions,
over one hundred miles, thank you very much. So yeah,
remember New Mexico. It was a lot like that, only
you weren't here to prevent me. From going into the
three digits. So fun fun, tell y'all about that later. Also,
we were talking about when we were talking about your
upcoming travels my way, I was looking at the May calendar,
so I'm welcome to you. But Heather and I are

(06:48):
going to see a fellow on July first, and we
would love for you to accompany us. I don't know
when Team Freedoms of It is though, but you know
it's on the list, so we could do. They give
you Shakespeare, Creator Lake and the Coast, so will think.

Speaker 11 (07:04):
You if you can make it.

Speaker 9 (07:04):
If not, we'll just do the Coast in a Creator Lake.
But let me help and I will.

Speaker 17 (07:08):
Up to you.

Speaker 11 (07:10):
End of message. To delete this message, press seven to
save it in the archives. Press nine to the message
will be saved for twenty one.

Speaker 13 (07:20):
Any of the questions from the jury, any follow up council, Just.

Speaker 2 (07:27):
One quick question you teed.

Speaker 14 (07:29):
Do you know the day and time that that message
was left?

Speaker 6 (07:33):
That'll be June fourth and eleven.

Speaker 14 (07:36):
Boarding No, the phone wreck message. I don't know if
you can answer this now, but was that was that
deleted off the voicemail or was that brush.

Speaker 6 (07:48):
On the voicemail?

Speaker 3 (07:49):
The way you heard it is the way it played
on the voicemail when I access the voicemail.

Speaker 14 (07:54):
Okay, so you didn't have to go into other areas
to check deleted messages or anything.

Speaker 6 (07:58):
It was just correct, that's the way it played right there.

Speaker 14 (08:01):
Okay, but I mean, but it was just there. It
was in the box with a bunch of other messages, right, correct,
Thank you.

Speaker 13 (08:09):
You may step down. The state may call it's next witness.

Speaker 1 (08:12):
The state recalls the detective is step.

Speaker 13 (08:14):
On Sholder, Attective, you are still under oath?

Speaker 6 (08:18):
Do you understand?

Speaker 2 (08:19):
Yes?

Speaker 17 (08:20):
Your an answer, stem and sir.

Speaker 4 (08:25):
With regard to the handgunn that was used in this case,
did the police find a.

Speaker 1 (08:32):
Handguns back at mister Alexander's.

Speaker 6 (08:34):
Home, No, we did not.

Speaker 4 (08:36):
Did you attempt to find the handgun? Yes, we did,
and were you able to find the handgun?

Speaker 2 (08:44):
No?

Speaker 1 (08:46):
The knife?

Speaker 4 (08:47):
Was the knife back at the home when the police
went through the home.

Speaker 6 (08:52):
We never found a knife used.

Speaker 4 (08:53):
And the police attempt to look for the knife. Yes.

Speaker 1 (08:57):
Where did you guys attempt to look for both the
knife and the.

Speaker 6 (09:00):
Guy all through the house, around the house?

Speaker 1 (09:04):
How about outside of the house?

Speaker 6 (09:05):
Yes?

Speaker 4 (09:06):
How about in other places? Did you go to different
towns or.

Speaker 6 (09:11):
No, we did.

Speaker 18 (09:11):
Well, we went to Wuayrika and we attempted to find
it there during the search warrants that we did there.

Speaker 4 (09:17):
Did you have any idea where this knife could or
and gud could possibly be No, now, sir, we were
talking and we left off about the conversations that you
may have had with a defended.

Speaker 1 (09:28):
Back on June fifteenth of eight years that.

Speaker 4 (09:31):
Yes, and we left off where there was this issue
about photographs and you.

Speaker 9 (09:36):
Were telling her that you were going to.

Speaker 1 (09:37):
Show her some photographs.

Speaker 19 (09:39):
Correct.

Speaker 4 (09:39):
Yes, did you eventually show her some photographs?

Speaker 6 (09:42):
Yes?

Speaker 1 (09:43):
I did, And.

Speaker 4 (09:45):
Exhibit three point fifty eight describe your conversation with her
involving the photographs as you were showing them to her.

Speaker 20 (09:55):
Yeah, Rember thesion is it fifty eight.

Speaker 13 (10:06):
Three fifty eight is admitted.

Speaker 12 (10:13):
A murderer of 'em?

Speaker 8 (10:36):
Have I done?

Speaker 2 (10:36):
Is that? I'm just curious? It's a glock again.

Speaker 21 (10:41):
I just bought a gun, Yeah, Jim, I'm probably founded
by now.

Speaker 10 (10:46):
Probably was taking in some the cause were.

Speaker 2 (10:48):
Just a few photos.

Speaker 17 (10:51):
And I wanna be careful showing, not showing you certain
photos path some of them are.

Speaker 2 (10:56):
Very did I sayd you see Travis's house?

Speaker 6 (11:04):
Right?

Speaker 8 (11:06):
Remember that.

Speaker 10 (11:08):
Yeah, if Travias were here today, he would tell you that.

Speaker 8 (11:16):
If it wasn't me.

Speaker 22 (11:19):
No, my job is to speak for Travis right now,
and everything Travis is timely mean as such job.

Speaker 2 (11:27):
He didn't dis to me. Have you ever shot that
twenty five? All you ever touched.

Speaker 8 (11:36):
Him when it was stolen?

Speaker 10 (11:37):
And I've never seen it.

Speaker 12 (11:47):
When your grandpas would at least.

Speaker 8 (11:49):
Speak at twenty one.

Speaker 10 (11:53):
I don't know what a twenty five looks like.

Speaker 8 (11:56):
I know what a twenty two.

Speaker 2 (11:57):
Looks like, and I know there's like a twenty two.

Speaker 8 (11:59):
Actually, well, the twenty twos that I saw kind of
looked like the ones in the Westerns where they had
the barrel on the long.

Speaker 2 (12:06):
You know.

Speaker 8 (12:10):
But there was another twenty two in this in the store,
and it looked like a toy guns what would like
in the square round like a lard hunt.

Speaker 2 (12:18):
I don't know. Pictures all show you? Was that one.

Speaker 12 (12:50):
You remember him?

Speaker 10 (12:50):
See jac It M shower?

Speaker 2 (12:54):
Yeah, yep, let's see it. This is.

Speaker 8 (13:10):
Travis would never.

Speaker 2 (13:12):
Gover that soon after you and him that secks on
his bed.

Speaker 10 (13:20):
I couldn't have been too soon.

Speaker 8 (13:21):
After an hour or so.

Speaker 2 (13:26):
The last time twelve hours?

Speaker 23 (13:28):
Name you so commeaborate, sir, copies, I'm sure.

Speaker 2 (13:49):
Follows that's you, and I wanted to cover you up.

Speaker 8 (13:54):
Because oh, that's you, all of you that looks like me.

Speaker 2 (14:00):
Let's see all right, then get out. You can look
at the rest of it if you want. There's a
few of those, a few more.

Speaker 9 (14:14):
Watch.

Speaker 24 (14:14):
I'm trying not to show you because I don't wanna
put you out there like that.

Speaker 25 (14:19):
To be.

Speaker 15 (14:26):
Let's just say, I've seen all of you, and I've
seen all of the.

Speaker 22 (14:30):
Traps, but the one that sticks in my mind of
Travis is one of the autopsy table. I'm not gonna
show you up.

Speaker 24 (14:46):
Or should I, but this one I don't know if
I should show you.

Speaker 2 (14:54):
But nothing bad, too bad. But it's just one of.

Speaker 15 (15:01):
The photos that was taken by And this is just
a small portion of it.

Speaker 2 (15:11):
That's your foot, Jody. These are your pants. No, it's
off color because they enhance it and the color kind
of changes a little bit. That's true of this.

Speaker 10 (15:23):
This is this bathroom. That's not my foot.

Speaker 12 (15:31):
These are your pants.

Speaker 17 (15:34):
It's a different color, like I said it because we
had to enhance it and the color changes.

Speaker 2 (15:39):
The zipper back.

Speaker 8 (15:40):
I have both of those pants at home if these
are the same one though I don't have a zipper
there though.

Speaker 10 (15:46):
I don't mind. And this is a black stripe and
this is white and the black goes around footing too.

Speaker 2 (15:59):
Couldn't even wreck NXE Travis. You've been there so long.

Speaker 10 (16:03):
I keep your brother has are addressed up?

Speaker 12 (16:07):
Well, this is another one.

Speaker 25 (16:08):
It's just a hoppy but it's you, same day, all
time stamped.

Speaker 12 (16:16):
All first picture were house.

Speaker 2 (16:19):
You see the date six four A eight ten five
twenty two pm. Let's when you started.

Speaker 17 (16:31):
A photo of you started, you know, the Travis's federal
but one of one thirty one forty.

Speaker 9 (16:37):
Five someone's Yeah, I don't know what kind of things
ever got.

Speaker 2 (16:44):
There?

Speaker 10 (16:44):
You see that mm's that spot?

Speaker 2 (16:48):
You see the spot's here? They little a different color
because we used the chemical to enhance this HM.

Speaker 25 (16:54):
Is that right there?

Speaker 2 (16:55):
Blood? It's a mixture of yours and he has and
that's your pump.

Speaker 12 (17:01):
Print of your left palm.

Speaker 8 (17:06):
I don't have any cats and my left pump.

Speaker 17 (17:09):
Now would he said that your cause of palm? Do
you have any recent cuts that are healed?

Speaker 8 (17:17):
Well? My cat scratches me little things.

Speaker 10 (17:21):
These are all her work.

Speaker 8 (17:22):
You could see.

Speaker 10 (17:24):
This is her dancer. I've got scars cause she's her.

Speaker 15 (17:27):
She's a paral cat.

Speaker 25 (17:29):
All thesel things are her.

Speaker 2 (17:30):
Oh end up about a cat. But why is your
pump print in blood?

Speaker 8 (17:40):
How can that be that palm print?

Speaker 2 (17:42):
Because you were there, Uss that's before we've used a chemical.
We doubt we'd get something from there.

Speaker 25 (17:56):
But this is where your palm prends hut on the wall.
I could go over and go over and over again.

Speaker 20 (18:10):
Over that over again. There's no doubt in my mind.

Speaker 2 (18:22):
That you were there. There's no doubt in my mind
that you did this none.

Speaker 15 (18:28):
So you can go and take your blue in the
face and tell me you weren't there and you had
none to do with it.

Speaker 2 (18:33):
I won't believe you. I will now believe because Travis
is telling me that you did this to him. That's
my job. My job is to speak for him. And
this is what he's telling me, and.

Speaker 12 (18:53):
I wanna know why.

Speaker 2 (18:55):
Then it's killing me inside.

Speaker 10 (18:57):
That don't really seem like there's no reason for it.

Speaker 8 (19:00):
There's no reason why. There's no reason I would ever
n want to hurt him.

Speaker 17 (19:07):
There's no way anybody else He never reaped me, nobody never,
There's no way anyone.

Speaker 15 (19:15):
Else could have loved your and the blood on that wall,
no way, get that.

Speaker 2 (19:24):
Do your hat.

Speaker 8 (19:25):
If I was going to ever try to kill somebody,
I would use gloves, if I have plenty of them.

Speaker 17 (19:33):
I would you said you were you know, you'd plan
this out perfectly. Maybe you were going there to just
talk to him, have a good time with them.

Speaker 2 (19:43):
Something got out of hand.

Speaker 10 (19:45):
Even if I were there, And even if I were
going there to.

Speaker 8 (19:48):
Just have a good time with him.

Speaker 17 (19:50):
If I'll tell you somebody to saw you there, use
a neighbor. Can you remember some of the neighbors just
stow you the that's driver.

Speaker 2 (20:02):
That's why.

Speaker 26 (20:03):
M I don't know, that's why.

Speaker 2 (20:04):
Okay, what else? Some of the neighbors across the street.

Speaker 25 (20:07):
No, I've never met them.

Speaker 15 (20:08):
Oh but you've you hung around there quite a bit
and they know you.

Speaker 8 (20:13):
Mm.

Speaker 2 (20:13):
Yeah, they've seen you there on that day.

Speaker 10 (20:16):
I wasn't there that day.

Speaker 2 (20:17):
Did roe to you were there that day?

Speaker 10 (20:20):
And even if I tryna think the M the M
the the majority of the time that I spent.

Speaker 11 (20:24):
There, I had platinum wond hair.

Speaker 8 (20:26):
So I mean I'd never once said high to them,
met them, and shift there, had met them face to
face across the street.

Speaker 10 (20:33):
When I spent time there.

Speaker 8 (20:34):
He wanted to keep it a fr on private, so
it was I spent them during the time inside, not
you know, walking around outside, except for a few times
when I took his dog for a walk.

Speaker 15 (20:50):
Would they see your car there? How would your park
it down the street?

Speaker 8 (20:56):
No, they would see it there.

Speaker 10 (20:57):
I drove an Infinity, so they would definitely recognize the car.

Speaker 8 (21:01):
I'm sure cause well, there were a lot of cars.

Speaker 15 (21:03):
There are a lot of the times we're see Infinity.

Speaker 8 (21:05):
Now.

Speaker 10 (21:06):
I gave it back to make.

Speaker 2 (21:09):
Say a ponyard somewhere.

Speaker 4 (21:11):
Hm.

Speaker 2 (21:13):
There, we haven't find any evidence in that car.

Speaker 7 (21:17):
You're free to look, now what kind of look?

Speaker 10 (21:20):
You can also look in the rental car.

Speaker 2 (21:25):
What company did you rent it from?

Speaker 8 (21:26):
I don't remember, but I can check my I can
check my my definit card record.

Speaker 12 (21:33):
I remember them.

Speaker 15 (21:34):
Making long No, we're waiting for it anyway. But you
know all the new cars at GPS is a oh factory,
not for you, or.

Speaker 8 (21:43):
That's good look for us to use if we can, well,
then that's good cause I was also gonna ask you,
I don't know I if this is something that.

Speaker 10 (21:56):
You can recall.

Speaker 8 (21:57):
But a lot of stoblets and Mason.

Speaker 12 (21:59):
Things or something. Is there any way.

Speaker 10 (22:03):
You through about that or you know if I were
going to do or going to that tunnel, is that surveillance? No,
or surveillance anywhere.

Speaker 2 (22:11):
Unless you ran a red line, unless you had conte camera.
But nothing beside stuff.

Speaker 15 (22:23):
And I have a solid case against you, and I
can present it to the judge as cold as as
as it is now, I don't know why she did it,
or I can present.

Speaker 2 (22:38):
It to the judge with your explanation, with your parents' explanation.
Have you talked to your parents about what happened?

Speaker 10 (22:49):
I told him I was worried about stuff, about what
stuff I said?

Speaker 8 (22:53):
Then, well they knew I was upset about Travis, and
I feel really bad by the way it was acting
cause it wasn't actually to tring my grandparents.

Speaker 11 (23:01):
There are a lot of times.

Speaker 15 (23:02):
Why are they not surprised that.

Speaker 2 (23:03):
You're sitting here talking to me about this?

Speaker 7 (23:09):
H What do you mean?

Speaker 2 (23:09):
They're not surprised, they're.

Speaker 15 (23:13):
Concerned, They're they're hearned. I haven't, but my other detectives have,
and they're very concerned with you.

Speaker 17 (23:25):
But they kind of suspected that you had something to
do with Proust's death as well.

Speaker 2 (23:29):
Who's parents I think about th That's.

Speaker 8 (23:32):
Cause I told them that a lot of people were
dropping my name, and I said, I'm not worried about it,
cause I didn't do it. I said, but it's very much.
It's hurting my reputation right now, and it's mad it's
casting me in a bad light.

Speaker 2 (23:44):
I wouldn't be worrying about your.

Speaker 15 (23:45):
Reputation right now, I'd be worrying about the rest of
your life.

Speaker 2 (23:49):
That means nothing, absolutely nothing.

Speaker 10 (23:54):
Well, they were My reputation will affect the rest of
my life.

Speaker 8 (24:00):
That's why I am worried.

Speaker 17 (24:00):
As you're gonna continue with the story then that you
warrant to Mays four with you warrening Travis's house.

Speaker 2 (24:12):
You didn't have sex with him that day, and you
had nothing to do with his murder.

Speaker 8 (24:19):
Those pictures are I don't know. To me, pictures are
very compelling.

Speaker 11 (24:25):
I know that they can be modified.

Speaker 8 (24:26):
I know they can be altered in Dayton timestamps.

Speaker 15 (24:29):
I don't know, but I I think they can be
can mortify anything.

Speaker 8 (24:34):
I don't think.

Speaker 4 (24:38):
Detective did you then continue to talk to her about
uh whether or not she had.

Speaker 1 (24:46):
Actually been the person.

Speaker 4 (24:47):
Who had killed just for out its hander.

Speaker 6 (24:50):
Yes, I did.

Speaker 1 (24:52):
Let me show you exhibit number three six. Is this
a portion of the same or how do your videotape where.

Speaker 4 (25:01):
She continues to deny having killed mister Leixandon?

Speaker 1 (25:13):
How would they vision that you end it enough?

Speaker 2 (25:15):
Or uh is actually happen? Switch?

Speaker 4 (25:18):
I would move three fifty nine of it, would just
slit at number thirteen?

Speaker 8 (25:23):
Any protection to three fifty nine?

Speaker 1 (25:25):
What my god?

Speaker 25 (25:26):
Hm?

Speaker 12 (25:28):
And this is detective?

Speaker 4 (25:29):
Would you also continue to discuss the photographs that came
around the air?

Speaker 6 (25:34):
Yes, I three fifty nine is a.

Speaker 17 (25:43):
Do you have something to tell me that you're you're
just so resistant. I know you're afraid, but you're already
going through it right now.

Speaker 12 (25:54):
There's no backing up.

Speaker 2 (25:56):
There's no backing up to yesterday. There's no backing up
to that day.

Speaker 17 (26:01):
It's already happened, and unfortunately, you're gonna have to face
the consequences.

Speaker 8 (26:08):
I'm you know, if if I did that, I would
I'd be fully ready to face the consequences. I'm not
really for things like you know. I'm all for the
ten commandments thou shall not kill, m.

Speaker 17 (26:23):
Kay, But there's there's no evidence to show anybody else
did but none.

Speaker 8 (26:31):
Well eat, I'm just you.

Speaker 2 (26:32):
Think we'd find somebody else's finger, kind of take it down.
Possibly there's something that happens.

Speaker 15 (26:39):
You keep saying gloves, there's things that happen when.

Speaker 2 (26:42):
People wear gloves.

Speaker 15 (26:44):
Then we can actually see that, Oh, somebody wore.

Speaker 2 (26:46):
Gloves in this case. Nobody wor gloves in this case.
Well whatdy.

Speaker 8 (26:52):
Oh I would I'm just saying that if I were
to carry out something like that, I would have worn gloves.

Speaker 2 (26:56):
Nobody else, nobody else did this. There's no evidence to
show that anybody else did this, but you you were
the only one that is it?

Speaker 13 (27:10):
Exhibit three sixty seven and three sixty.

Speaker 2 (27:12):
Eight or.

Speaker 6 (27:16):
This is uh exhibit three.

Speaker 2 (27:18):
You need to do as you need to apologize to travelers.
Would you just refuse? What is it?

Speaker 20 (27:24):
I can't help you anymore if you're not gonna if you're.

Speaker 12 (27:27):
Not gonna help yourself, you ask me.

Speaker 2 (27:30):
I can't, I can't Joe anything. You can keep talking
to you blue in the face, man, I can't continue
to listen to lies. Do you have anything else that
you need to tell me?

Speaker 8 (27:46):
You you would ask me what have I been up to?
In a week since I got back. What did you
mean by that?

Speaker 16 (27:52):
Just what have you been?

Speaker 15 (27:56):
Cause I know this thing has to be weighing pretty
heavy on you.

Speaker 8 (28:01):
I've been trying to put his death behind me.

Speaker 2 (28:08):
If I.

Speaker 8 (28:12):
If I did anything that had anything to do with
his death in any way.

Speaker 15 (28:17):
It's not if to me, I wouldn't.

Speaker 10 (28:19):
It's not if.

Speaker 2 (28:20):
It's not if at all?

Speaker 8 (28:22):
Well, to me, it is, I would. I would be
more than remorseful.

Speaker 2 (28:27):
Is it maybe something you're blocking out of your head?

Speaker 10 (28:30):
I don't think so. I mean, I tend to write
everything down.

Speaker 8 (28:34):
I tend to.

Speaker 10 (28:36):
I just finished the book The World Less Traveled, and
he said.

Speaker 8 (28:40):
The true definition of sanity is dedication to reality at
all costs.

Speaker 1 (28:45):
So I think at.

Speaker 8 (28:46):
Times, you know, I may have you know, pray or
meditated upon a certain way, you know, like like me being.

Speaker 7 (28:55):
Wealthy or something like that.

Speaker 17 (28:56):
But oh, this, it's definitely reality. We are sitting here
inside of an office, the Sheriff's department. Then you are
facing first degree murder charges.

Speaker 8 (29:12):
What idea?

Speaker 2 (29:12):
Are going to be booked into jail and eventually you
will will be brought back to Arizona and you will
stand trial.

Speaker 12 (29:22):
That's the reality.

Speaker 15 (29:24):
And once you realize how I think you'll be better
for it.

Speaker 21 (29:30):
And if you really wanted to embrace reality, you would
sit here and explain to me why this happened.

Speaker 2 (29:35):
But you refuse. You refuse to embrace reality.

Speaker 8 (29:38):
I don't know why he was killed. I don't know
why I had issues with Travis.

Speaker 12 (29:45):
If anything, he.

Speaker 8 (29:46):
Had more issues with me. I've had worse issues with
other people. They're all still alive.

Speaker 10 (29:53):
I'm still friends with my ex boyfriends.

Speaker 8 (29:55):
They're all still alive.

Speaker 17 (29:56):
You know, I've been doing this a long time, and
there's one thing that I can never get out of
my head ever since the first day I talked to you.
It's there's an old saying that you know someone's just.

Speaker 7 (30:12):
Not acting right.

Speaker 2 (30:13):
Looking to it, you have not acted right from day one.

Speaker 17 (30:19):
From day one when I talk to you on that phone,
I just sense that you just you weren't acting like somebody.

Speaker 2 (30:26):
Who used to love this guy, or who still loved him.
I even as a close friend, and even now.

Speaker 15 (30:32):
When I told you that I have all this evidence
against you and.

Speaker 2 (30:38):
And that you're facing first degree in marin charges.

Speaker 8 (30:40):
You're.

Speaker 12 (30:42):
You're just not acting right, jo me.

Speaker 2 (30:44):
You're acting like somebody who's guilty.

Speaker 10 (30:48):
No, son, you tell me.

Speaker 2 (30:53):
I know because I've been doing it a long time.

Speaker 11 (30:55):
It's given me a long.

Speaker 2 (30:56):
Time to to figure it out. But within the first
thirty seconds to a minute of a conversation, I can.
I know when somebody's acting. Right, there's a certain way
people act.

Speaker 26 (31:08):
How did I act?

Speaker 8 (31:09):
It's not what I think.

Speaker 2 (31:10):
It's not like TV.

Speaker 12 (31:11):
It's not anything like that.

Speaker 2 (31:13):
It's not what you see in the movies. I see reality.

Speaker 15 (31:18):
When I accuse somebody of committing uh uh, heinous crime
or you.

Speaker 2 (31:22):
Know, something very serious, reality.

Speaker 15 (31:26):
Hits in and they definitely act a certain way.

Speaker 2 (31:30):
And that's not you. You act just like everybody else
who I accuse of doing a crime?

Speaker 12 (31:38):
Who did it?

Speaker 2 (31:40):
There's no other way to tell you?

Speaker 8 (31:42):
Is it because I'm not crying?

Speaker 23 (31:45):
No, it's not because of that.

Speaker 8 (31:48):
What is it? I mean, I'm not gonna change how
way appen.

Speaker 2 (31:51):
No, So I see you can't change it.

Speaker 12 (31:53):
What you're at, you're under I mean, I am who
I am?

Speaker 15 (31:55):
Okay, you're you're sincere in a way you're acting, but uh,
well you're just.

Speaker 2 (32:00):
You're just not telling the truth.

Speaker 12 (32:03):
How was it different?

Speaker 2 (32:04):
Well, it's not really something you need to focus on.

Speaker 8 (32:08):
Anymore.

Speaker 2 (32:08):
I think you need to focus on the truth, but
it's something that you refuse.

Speaker 17 (32:13):
So if you don't, if you don't wanna continue, then
didn't want to just move on to the next step.

Speaker 8 (32:21):
Listen, it's not that I didn't love Travis, and it's
not that I don't still love him, but I I
really needed to move on.

Speaker 2 (32:33):
And the last what prevented you from moving on? Nobody
was preventing me from moving on?

Speaker 10 (32:43):
Well, nobody person preventing me really from moving on with myself.

Speaker 8 (32:48):
And until I made that step and I moved back,
moved away, and we communicated a gradually less and less
and less. When I was fine with that, I hadn't
found the guy, the man that I want to marry,
the person I want to spend my life with. But
in my mind, Travis did, and I was happy for him,

(33:08):
and I thought, Uh, there was also a part of
me that felt if I stay, I'm gonna jeopardize that
for him as well. We both deserve to be happy,
we both deserve to have, you know, be married in
the temple, and that's where he wanted to go. So

(33:29):
I mean, I didn't know that maybe didn't feel that
way that I had never spoken to her except that church.
When I came down to Arizona was really brief, and
it was the bishop who told me that, you know,
she had essentially turned him down. And the last few.

Speaker 10 (33:46):
I mean, now that I think about it, he was really.

Speaker 15 (33:49):
Just the you know, in his in his attitude and stuff.

Speaker 8 (33:53):
And I just thought, maybe that's just cause we're just
beginning to m more distance ourselves, and you know, he
still had his trip plan to come up here.

Speaker 10 (34:03):
I just the the reason I I don't know, it's
not that I'm not remorseful that he died.

Speaker 12 (34:09):
I didn't kill him, I didn't take his life.

Speaker 7 (34:14):
Did you have anything to do with I have nothing
to tart to do with.

Speaker 8 (34:17):
His death at all at all. The reason I hesitate
is because maybe this is something that's wrong with me psychologically.
Is I think of the butterfly effect, and it's like
you could say that the guy pumping gas station could
get pumping gas down at the gas station, could have
potentially because you see all these movies, these monky movies
where it's like this affected this, which effet this, which affected.

Speaker 17 (34:38):
As if he had never done this, I know, if
you had never met that has to be a probably
would still be live.

Speaker 8 (34:42):
That's true.

Speaker 2 (34:43):
Yeah, that's because you killed him. No, Joey, you did.
I did not, Joey. You can't convince me otherwise unless
you come up with more proof that you didn't. But
I can't prove there did anybody else?

Speaker 12 (34:57):
Say no, I couldn't have w What about.

Speaker 5 (35:00):
If the car comes back that it was never even
in that area, It still doesn't negate.

Speaker 22 (35:06):
The fact that we have this other evidence.

Speaker 17 (35:12):
I mean, this is absolutely some of the best evidence
I've ever had in a case.

Speaker 2 (35:19):
And I've convicted a few people want less than this.

Speaker 10 (35:23):
Well, so I'm as good as done right with that evidence.

Speaker 1 (35:29):
Yeah, I just.

Speaker 8 (35:31):
Can't admit to something that I didn't do if it
would help, if it would help my case and give
me any easier sentence. I know that people plead guilty.

Speaker 2 (35:40):
For those things now, and I don't want you to
do that. I is the absolute last thing I want.

Speaker 17 (35:49):
Well, I know what I want to do is I
want to sit here with you, and I wanna go
over why you visited him that day, what you guys
talked about, what caused you to get so angry, and
the details on that would happen, And it's something that
you probably don't want to remember, but it's something that

(36:13):
I need because for me to finish a case completely,
I need to know not just the details, but what
was going through your mind, because I need to present
that as a full picture, because if.

Speaker 2 (36:30):
I don't, I don't feel that I've completed my job.

Speaker 15 (36:34):
Then my job is to speak for him, not anybody else.

Speaker 2 (36:39):
My job isn't to speak for you. My job isn't
to speak.

Speaker 9 (36:42):
For his family.

Speaker 2 (36:44):
It's to speak for Travis. And I know something horrible
happened that day, absolutely horrible, something that could have been upwoided.
Whether something was planned, I don't know whether you planned
it or or whether it accidentally happened or something got
out of hand. I I don't know. All I could

(37:07):
do is speculate.

Speaker 15 (37:09):
And I want to believe that you're not this cold
hearted person.

Speaker 2 (37:15):
That could just go out and do something like this
to somebody. I want to.

Speaker 27 (37:19):
Believe that, like a lot of people, things got out
of control and before you knew it, it was too late.

Speaker 15 (37:32):
That's what I wanna believe, And that's truly from my art.

Speaker 17 (37:37):
Because I sit here and I talk to you, and
and I'm talking to you now and all those conversations
we had on the phone, and I don't see a
cold hearted murderer like you could see on TV or
that I've seen before sit across from me.

Speaker 2 (37:50):
That's not what I see in you. And I men
call it begging. I'm begging you.

Speaker 15 (37:58):
To at least come clan to tell me why, because.

Speaker 20 (38:04):
I don't wanna leave here today.

Speaker 2 (38:08):
Not knowing, cause it's gonna follow me forever.

Speaker 8 (38:14):
I wish that I had answers.

Speaker 10 (38:16):
I'm sorry, I'm n.

Speaker 2 (38:25):
You need to just let the answers come out.

Speaker 10 (38:29):
There's just no reason. There's just no reason.

Speaker 2 (38:34):
There's no good reason why it's happened. There's never a
good reason why somebody dies like this.

Speaker 10 (38:40):
How many times was try to stabbed more than.

Speaker 12 (38:42):
I wanna remember.

Speaker 2 (38:45):
And I'm not gonna sit here and.

Speaker 15 (38:48):
Show you pictures of him after the fact.

Speaker 8 (38:51):
I don't do that.

Speaker 2 (38:52):
That's not how I work, That is not for me
to But eventually those photos come out.

Speaker 17 (39:06):
Joy, Joey, we're here now, all right here. I think
you're feeling the reality in the moment now.

Speaker 10 (39:31):
No, I'm just feeling all of the things that I'm
going to potentially.

Speaker 7 (39:37):
Miss missed out on with my family and I think
of all.

Speaker 8 (39:41):
The things that draws his family sound on.

Speaker 28 (39:49):
Any brothers and sisters, and I have brothers and sisters, anyh.

Speaker 8 (40:00):
It is not fair.

Speaker 2 (40:07):
It's not fair.

Speaker 15 (40:08):
But this is where we are.

Speaker 10 (40:09):
I mean, I know that he's in a good place,
and I know that he's fine. I know that he's
doing great. But what about all of his friends, all
of his family that are here.

Speaker 8 (40:22):
And they're just going through all of this, And I
know it it's temporary, but it's so very much right now.

Speaker 10 (40:33):
There's just no reason I would ever want to hurt him.

Speaker 2 (40:40):
Whether you wanted to is a different question.

Speaker 15 (40:44):
I'm just saying I don't think you wanted to.

Speaker 2 (40:48):
I really don't think you wanted to. This speaks for itself.

Speaker 1 (41:03):
Take a look at Exhibit three sixty eight.

Speaker 29 (41:10):
I have to mean, kinlay, I can't admit to doing
something that I haven't done.

Speaker 10 (41:17):
There's any part of me wants to cop out and
say it.

Speaker 17 (41:22):
No, Well, if you're gonna cop out, it's because you're
telling the truth.

Speaker 8 (41:28):
Well that's not really caught you. Now.

Speaker 15 (41:31):
Yeah, I don't want you to sit here and tell
me a lie to appease me.

Speaker 2 (41:37):
That is the worst thing.

Speaker 17 (41:41):
But back there in that mind of yours is somebody
screaming to get out and.

Speaker 2 (41:46):
Tell me what happened, but you just came out up.

Speaker 8 (41:55):
He has did nothing. But I mean, except for some
mean words, decent people have said worse to me or
just as bad. Except for that, he's.

Speaker 10 (42:05):
Never He's helped me, he's given me money. He was
selling me his car on the easiest waves. Ever, there's
no reason why it just happened.

Speaker 4 (42:21):
Sir, after this conversation, did you then have another conversation
with it defendant?

Speaker 1 (42:26):
After that day?

Speaker 8 (42:27):
Yes?

Speaker 2 (42:27):
I did.

Speaker 1 (42:28):
What day was that?

Speaker 6 (42:29):
It's the following day?

Speaker 15 (42:32):
Was it at her request or was it at your request?

Speaker 6 (42:35):
I contacted her uh A.

Speaker 18 (42:38):
At the end of this conversation we had on this day,
I asked if she wanted to continue the conversation at
a later time.

Speaker 6 (42:45):
And she agreed, and the later time was the next day.

Speaker 4 (42:49):
Yes, it was. Did you actually then speak to her
or was it somebody else that actually began to speak
with her?

Speaker 6 (42:57):
Another detective spoke with him?

Speaker 4 (42:59):
And this detective which jurisdiction was this detective?

Speaker 6 (43:04):
Uh sh She worked for the Siscu County Sheriff's Department.

Speaker 2 (43:08):
What was his or her name?

Speaker 8 (43:11):
Uh?

Speaker 6 (43:12):
Miss Blaney Detective Blaney at the time.

Speaker 1 (43:16):
Take a look at some of the UH snippets involved
in that particular.

Speaker 8 (43:27):
U was you doing that.

Speaker 2 (43:29):
Exhibit number three sixty two.

Speaker 4 (43:37):
Do you see this entry up here at June fourth,
two thousand and eight, at eleven forty eight pm.

Speaker 13 (43:42):
Do you see that?

Speaker 6 (43:43):
Yes?

Speaker 8 (43:43):
I do.

Speaker 4 (43:45):
Is that entry or is that time before or after
what we see.

Speaker 6 (43:50):
In exhibit one sixty two If you want, I'll give
you the I can see it.

Speaker 2 (43:56):
It is after.

Speaker 4 (43:58):
So that call was made after this incident here in.

Speaker 6 (44:01):
The photograph was after Travis's dad.

Speaker 4 (44:04):
There was another detective that conducted the the UH questioning
were you present for it?

Speaker 6 (44:11):
Yes?

Speaker 2 (44:11):
I was around the whole thing.

Speaker 6 (44:13):
Yes, going to show you exhibit.

Speaker 27 (44:19):
Was the.

Speaker 4 (44:21):
Suspect this area's advised of her random warnings the second day?

Speaker 9 (44:27):
Yes she was?

Speaker 1 (44:28):
And does that contain the warning?

Speaker 13 (44:30):
Yes?

Speaker 1 (44:32):
M Does your mony.

Speaker 9 (44:35):
Approach get an In fact, you asked a question about
when it happened?

Speaker 10 (44:42):
Right?

Speaker 6 (44:43):
Yes, yes, and you provided you responses right yes.

Speaker 1 (44:54):
Take a look at UH this other exhibit. Does this
contain another version of events?

Speaker 11 (45:01):
This is his exhibit three eighty one.

Speaker 1 (45:02):
But the defendant gave you as to what had happened
involving mister Alexander.

Speaker 6 (45:09):
Yes it does.

Speaker 1 (45:13):
Remember do you miss an exhibit three eighty one?

Speaker 12 (45:21):
Remembu me.

Speaker 13 (45:26):
Is there A three eighty one is admitted.

Speaker 17 (45:29):
He canceled on you even coming up here in the
first part of June, right, Why did you end up
going there?

Speaker 2 (45:35):
Then? Is it because he couldn't go and you guys
still wanted to see you?

Speaker 8 (45:41):
Well, when he's the trip the second time got postponed,
it was probably last week of me that I then,
you know, it was kind of obviously he wasn't gonna
come in, but he said, listen, after Cancuon, I have like,
I have like two weeks that I have nothing going

(46:02):
on before I go to DC, and he's like, I
think that's the best time. He's like, I'm gonna see
if it works out from my friends at North which
would have been Chad Perkins's friend and bious life, and
we can do it all then, And I said, alright.

Speaker 10 (46:17):
But at that time I was like, whatever, we'll see.

Speaker 8 (46:20):
I might just not see it til I go back
to Utah where everyone convenes it and you there, which
everyone's gonna do at the end of the month.

Speaker 20 (46:27):
So did he know you were coming time.

Speaker 8 (46:30):
I wasn't even like I had been talking with Ryan
at this point, and obviously there's a distance there and
that was difficult. And he really wanted to spend time
with me, and I really wanted to spend time with him,
and it just seemed like he had made a few
comments I should and when am I gonna come out there?
And you know, I was like, as as soon as
you want, you know, but I didn't think he was serious.

(46:51):
And that Ryan we talked about Ryan Birds.

Speaker 10 (46:55):
So finally.

Speaker 8 (46:57):
Things began to work out at Cosaremos with my schedule
go just the Mexican resta home and they, uh, I
have a three D weekend there, So I thought I'll
make this, take this opportunity and go see Ryan, and
that was my intention.

Speaker 12 (47:14):
I what happened when you loved?

Speaker 2 (47:16):
Why did you go the other way? That's my question?

Speaker 17 (47:24):
You know, why why go to see Travis if you're
going to see Ryan as well?

Speaker 2 (47:33):
And did did Travis know where you were coming?

Speaker 8 (47:37):
He knew?

Speaker 2 (47:40):
I saw you kind of shake your head.

Speaker 8 (47:41):
A little bit at all.

Speaker 2 (47:43):
This is hard, It's okay. Did he know you were coming?
Did you guys talk on the phone?

Speaker 12 (47:54):
Oh?

Speaker 2 (47:56):
What was the discussion about.

Speaker 8 (48:00):
Accordinating the mostly the.

Speaker 2 (48:02):
Last conversation you had, the last long one.

Speaker 8 (48:05):
We talked a little bit prior to.

Speaker 2 (48:06):
Did you guys talk when you were when you were
en route to to Phoenix?

Speaker 8 (48:12):
Yeah, just briefly un til my phone was dying, which
is true. I thought I left my charger in Monterey
with Matt. I really honestly thought that I left my
charger there, and I had been talking all day between U,
just on the phone. I take lots of pictures of myself.

Speaker 2 (48:35):
And I guess I noticed, ah.

Speaker 8 (48:40):
Cause I I'm kind of picky about it, and I
guess I take 'em and I like delete delete the lead.

Speaker 19 (48:45):
I will take like twenty'll and I like delete delete
the lead. Keep one, Yeah, I keep two or three
or one or none, depending And uh so I talked
a little bit with John Dixon, who I was in
May Begin to.

Speaker 2 (48:57):
Go to San Diego.

Speaker 8 (48:59):
There's no there was a place on the list thereteen
that was.

Speaker 2 (49:01):
In the same trip.

Speaker 8 (49:02):
Yeah, it's a little ambitious that I thought, as.

Speaker 15 (49:05):
That's like twenty five twenty hundred mile and it.

Speaker 8 (49:08):
Doesn't bother me.

Speaker 10 (49:09):
Ex I think I pluayed like twenty four miles in
a car.

Speaker 2 (49:11):
I can't stay after driving. Yeah, forty five minutes somewhere.

Speaker 10 (49:16):
Yeah, where are you flying out of uh organ effort?

Speaker 8 (49:21):
Yeah, that's a good one. Just about an hour.

Speaker 12 (49:24):
Oh anyways to pretty drive.

Speaker 8 (49:26):
So I it was a little ambitious, but I like
road trips and sometimes I have a realistic view of things,
unrealistic about how about my time?

Speaker 10 (49:35):
And I tend to show up a little later than expected.

Speaker 23 (49:39):
Which is not unusual for me.

Speaker 17 (49:40):
But so he knew you were coming and he was
expecting you. Obviously, you guys have an a little encounter.
And is that wheen of those pictures were taking? Did
he can show you those pictures?

Speaker 2 (50:01):
It's gonna be hard, jo'em.

Speaker 10 (50:07):
I feel really powerless in here.

Speaker 8 (50:09):
Do you know what my family is doing today? Do
you know if they're good or.

Speaker 2 (50:18):
I haven't talked to them today.

Speaker 17 (50:22):
I don't know.

Speaker 15 (50:22):
They're worried about you.

Speaker 2 (50:23):
Everybody's just kind of in limbo right now.

Speaker 17 (50:31):
It's saying, so obviously there was nobody else at the
house when you got there.

Speaker 2 (50:37):
His roommates were gone. Well there was Napoleon, but.

Speaker 8 (50:43):
He's the person too.

Speaker 2 (50:45):
Yeah, I got to meet Napoleon. It's so awesome, But
nobody else was there.

Speaker 8 (50:52):
I think his roommates were there.

Speaker 2 (50:54):
You think his roommates were them?

Speaker 17 (50:57):
Were their cards there? You would have had to have
seen their cars. You parked in the driveway, right, Yeah.
One roommate parks sitting in the garage and the other
one parks outside.

Speaker 10 (51:11):
Alenehsac would park on the.

Speaker 11 (51:13):
Street a lot when.

Speaker 8 (51:14):
I lived there before, and he pulled his car into
the garage whenever he would work on it.

Speaker 2 (51:18):
What makes you think his roommates were there? I asked him,
What did you saying? Who's home?

Speaker 10 (51:28):
Said they were there?

Speaker 8 (51:29):
But I don't know who. The reason I asked, because
it's kind of an indication about quiet, we have to speak.

Speaker 15 (51:35):
What time was out?

Speaker 2 (51:39):
Do you remember what time you rolled in.

Speaker 8 (51:42):
M three and it still dark?

Speaker 2 (51:48):
Wednesday?

Speaker 23 (51:49):
Went hm?

Speaker 8 (51:51):
I think.

Speaker 2 (51:54):
If that makes sense, you're pretty sneaky. All there roommates
of them?

Speaker 8 (52:01):
Now?

Speaker 7 (52:01):
Either?

Speaker 23 (52:02):
Is do that?

Speaker 8 (52:02):
Many many many nights?

Speaker 2 (52:04):
How did they not see your car?

Speaker 8 (52:09):
I don't know?

Speaker 10 (52:10):
I was parting, Oh you know what?

Speaker 2 (52:12):
Zach was the house sitting for his girlfriend. His girlfriend
was on a trip with UH, on a cruise with
her parents, and he was staying unighted. I think he
stayed unighted.

Speaker 8 (52:24):
Uh, that makes sense because I wanna say that her roommate.
He said his roommate was home, but I don't remember,
but I think he said.

Speaker 2 (52:30):
One one roommates, kid and Rique.

Speaker 8 (52:33):
He gets up about five and he and y k
Is has the room that shares the wall of Travis's room,
which is like, yes, and you know.

Speaker 10 (52:42):
It's a Cavy home, drives do I says the walls.

Speaker 15 (52:44):
Are really really yes, I s can bomb that part.

Speaker 8 (52:50):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (52:50):
So when Rie Kay was home too, and about two
or three in the morning, but.

Speaker 17 (52:54):
He gets up about six, and no, he leaves the
house about six, and he didn't notice anything different. Do
you guys spend the whole day together that that following
day that you guys go anywhere, stay in the house, slept.

Speaker 2 (53:11):
Oh, after a long trip, I'd sleep two.

Speaker 8 (53:15):
Tryna stay that whole night waiting. He was watching something
on YouTube. It's some stupid video. He's like, you gotta
see this, and I'm watching.

Speaker 11 (53:25):
And I'm like this is so boring.

Speaker 29 (53:28):
I'm like, what's the point of that? And he's like,
just stupid pointless stuff. I'm like, Okay, I mean, I
guess everyone's gonna have their time to bench out being
so driven and de PsyS porchasing Solfay.

Speaker 10 (53:41):
It's just funny that he watches stuff like that.

Speaker 8 (53:44):
It wasn't anything profane or that old girl. It's just
like people like dancing. But they had like boxes of
oil on their head and it was just like huh weird,
like real live.

Speaker 2 (53:56):
Kind of music.

Speaker 17 (53:57):
The pictures that I showed you of you lying on
the beds st is that when those were.

Speaker 2 (54:01):
Taken that day, we also made a video. We do
it video on the end. Uh, I'm just kid on
that camera?

Speaker 15 (54:10):
Did he get videos?

Speaker 2 (54:11):
Or videos are hard to get Once there? He raised
take up so much room and uh, where's pictures are
a little bit? Wow?

Speaker 12 (54:22):
What happened after that?

Speaker 2 (54:24):
What?

Speaker 12 (54:24):
But what went wrong?

Speaker 8 (54:25):
I know that.

Speaker 17 (54:28):
The last photos of him were taken about five twenty
five thirty And you said he doesn't like uh, he
doesn't like you to take.

Speaker 2 (54:35):
Pictures of him and stuff.

Speaker 15 (54:37):
He was very private about the shower, like we is
that why you were taking pictures of him the shower?

Speaker 2 (54:42):
No? No, I try to get back at him.

Speaker 12 (54:45):
No, and I surprise he a surprise.

Speaker 2 (54:49):
He allowed you to take pictures of him in shower.
The first few looked like he wasn't too comfortable, but
obviously whatever you were saying to made 'em more and
more comfortable.

Speaker 8 (55:03):
I very clear.

Speaker 2 (55:06):
Do you remember that?

Speaker 12 (55:08):
What went wrong? Did he say something to you?

Speaker 2 (55:15):
Were you angry about something? Were you frustrated?

Speaker 8 (55:22):
What was it?

Speaker 2 (55:35):
Something happened at that point, and I don't know.

Speaker 8 (55:39):
What it was. What do you can do with the
rental car? The end right here?

Speaker 2 (55:45):
Hm?

Speaker 17 (55:49):
There were several photos of him and the last one
that we have the same sitting in the shop, and
that's when I think it happened.

Speaker 2 (56:00):
He was sitting down looking up at you. What did
you do?

Speaker 23 (56:14):
What happened?

Speaker 12 (56:15):
Joey Ganda?

Speaker 15 (56:18):
Did you plan on doing that the whole time?

Speaker 8 (56:29):
Then? Why?

Speaker 2 (56:31):
I don't believe you planned it? But then I don't
understand why? Why why you took a gun with you?

Speaker 8 (56:40):
Oh? I didn't.

Speaker 2 (56:42):
Where does that come from?

Speaker 8 (56:43):
Then?

Speaker 2 (56:43):
Where did you get it? Everybody says he didn't have
one or did you get it? If you didn't take
did he have one?

Speaker 4 (56:59):
And how.

Speaker 12 (57:02):
You went?

Speaker 8 (57:02):
To my knowledge?

Speaker 2 (57:05):
Then where did you get it? Did you bring it
with you? Did you get it there in Arizona?

Speaker 8 (57:16):
I didn't diver have it actually in like hab it
in my possession?

Speaker 2 (57:23):
Then who had it? If you had it and Travis
didn't have it, then who had it? Jody?

Speaker 26 (57:32):
Please?

Speaker 2 (57:32):
I can't Why not? Are you protecting somebody else? Why
would somebody else do this? I don't know. Did someone
catch you there? Someone not expecting you to be there?

Speaker 8 (57:59):
Don't seem like good?

Speaker 2 (58:04):
Then who was.

Speaker 25 (58:10):
There?

Speaker 2 (58:14):
Sin?

Speaker 8 (58:14):
Why you wanna? I can tell you.

Speaker 10 (58:21):
I can tell you everything that I know or that
I remember.

Speaker 2 (58:24):
Okay, what do you remember.

Speaker 15 (58:28):
From the time you were taking a picture, at the
time you left?

Speaker 12 (58:34):
What happened?

Speaker 2 (58:37):
What happened after that last picture was taken? You have
to tell if you want me to believe that somebody
else was there, or you have to show me. You
have to explain to me what happened. Otherwise it was

(58:59):
true it's you. And if that's the case, that's okay.
That's okay as well.

Speaker 10 (59:10):
It's better if if if, or would be said, if
everyone thinks that.

Speaker 8 (59:17):
It was just you, no, it's not, it is really
you have no idea.

Speaker 2 (59:23):
I do have no idea? What idea? You're going through
your own things right now.

Speaker 17 (59:38):
If somebody else was there with you, we need to
know that. Why would somebody do that just because you're
there with Travis.

Speaker 8 (59:49):
We did say mm, he didn't say.

Speaker 2 (59:52):
He didn't say hey bye. What was the first thing
they did to him? M? You were there, you saw it?

Speaker 8 (01:00:07):
What was the first I actually didn't see it. I
heard it.

Speaker 2 (01:00:11):
First. Is there an argument?

Speaker 8 (01:00:13):
No, not between traps and.

Speaker 2 (01:00:18):
Any argument between anybody?

Speaker 10 (01:00:21):
Is there any way I can see those pictures?

Speaker 2 (01:00:25):
I just no, not right now?

Speaker 8 (01:00:27):
Can I see 'em? Soon? I will not.

Speaker 2 (01:00:32):
You need to start letting me know what happened.

Speaker 11 (01:00:34):
And you're telling me that some other.

Speaker 2 (01:00:36):
People were there.

Speaker 8 (01:00:37):
You know that?

Speaker 2 (01:00:38):
How much that concerns me?

Speaker 8 (01:00:40):
I don't know who they, but they.

Speaker 10 (01:00:45):
Know where I live, or they know where my parents
saw any boards.

Speaker 8 (01:00:49):
I don't know if they know where my grandparents are,
but they got my address and they know where my
family is.

Speaker 15 (01:00:58):
Sorry, So you're trying to say you're doing this to
protect your family.

Speaker 2 (01:01:06):
Why would someone do this to you and to him?

Speaker 8 (01:01:10):
I don't think they really intended to do anything to me.

Speaker 2 (01:01:15):
You're saying somebody followed you all the way to Arizona.

Speaker 8 (01:01:17):
From here, Yeah, I don't think. I think I was
an element of surprise for them.

Speaker 17 (01:01:24):
You were an element of surprise, so they didn't expect
you can't see I I don't think so.

Speaker 15 (01:01:30):
They didn't expect you to be there, I mean, and
they'd had to see what coming?

Speaker 2 (01:01:36):
Is it? Someone who lives in masa local?

Speaker 10 (01:01:38):
I didn't recognize in you.

Speaker 12 (01:01:42):
Well, you have to give me a moto.

Speaker 15 (01:01:44):
Why would they do this? Were they going after Travis.

Speaker 2 (01:01:52):
For what reason? You tell me this, but you give
me no reason.

Speaker 8 (01:01:56):
They didn't discuss much.

Speaker 2 (01:01:57):
He just argued about what about whether don't.

Speaker 8 (01:02:00):
Kill me for what?

Speaker 11 (01:02:02):
Were you said?

Speaker 17 (01:02:02):
Cause I'm a witness, a witness of what him of Travis,
of Travis's murder?

Speaker 10 (01:02:10):
Yeah, but I didn't really witness it. I didn't see
my actuables.

Speaker 6 (01:02:15):
Kay?

Speaker 17 (01:02:16):
Or just oh, do you need to make this believable
because it is not believable to me right now?

Speaker 2 (01:02:23):
Do you need to give me something?

Speaker 8 (01:02:27):
Hm?

Speaker 10 (01:02:27):
Okay, I just listen.

Speaker 2 (01:02:31):
I am listening Coty, and I am listening, and it
doesn't make any sense to me.

Speaker 10 (01:02:36):
It's fine because my family will, uh.

Speaker 2 (01:02:38):
Well, help us protect your family if that's the case.

Speaker 8 (01:02:43):
You got the read in my driver's lecense s has
it peologs on it, and they weren't got my registration
out of my purse which was in the person that
I was using at the time and has my parents
at her.

Speaker 15 (01:03:02):
Why would they do this, you see where I'm coming from.

Speaker 2 (01:03:08):
Why what kind of beef did they have with him?

Speaker 8 (01:03:15):
Or was it with you?

Speaker 2 (01:03:16):
Or is there you need to make this believable.

Speaker 15 (01:03:22):
People just don't go in somewhere and kill somebody for.

Speaker 2 (01:03:25):
No reason and then let a witness go.

Speaker 12 (01:03:28):
That doesn't happen.

Speaker 2 (01:03:30):
They've already killed one person, why not just take care
of the other. What yet, you know who they are?

Speaker 15 (01:03:36):
If if you're telling me the truth, I don't know them, dah.

Speaker 2 (01:03:42):
I don't believe you either that I can't. You can't
expect me to hy uh, Usually I want to.

Speaker 10 (01:03:53):
I wasn't planning on going to Travis's house. I was
gonna go to Santa Cruz.

Speaker 8 (01:03:57):
Well, I was gonna planning to go to Santa Cruz,
you know, to Motorway.

Speaker 12 (01:04:00):
By the time I called Matt, He's like, Borton, Santagreez, meet.

Speaker 8 (01:04:02):
Us here, and I said, okay, So I'm reach of
the red room there just will kind of hang out
for the locals. So many younger kids our age, sort
of twenty seams and thirty somethings and I stayed the
night in Monterey that night, got up the next morning
and visited with Darryl and his son before he went
to school. Drove this is Tuesday, the fifth third, and

(01:04:34):
I'd drive into La. Hadn't heard back fro Laura yet,
But that's what it was.

Speaker 10 (01:04:39):
It wasn't until I got to La where I thought
I was looking at.

Speaker 8 (01:04:42):
My map in Utah wasn't really on there, but I
mean Arizona. But cause it was to Utah the mad
quest directions I printed.

Speaker 12 (01:04:53):
Okay, I just.

Speaker 10 (01:04:56):
I just see, like I've seen.

Speaker 8 (01:04:58):
The Sopranos, and they're not mafia or anything. But you know,
I just I honestly, there's a part of me inside
that thinks they're never gonna come after my fee.

Speaker 17 (01:05:09):
Well, from what you're telling me, and from what I
know about Travis and all his dealings, there's no reason
anybody would go after him.

Speaker 2 (01:05:19):
Nothing. So what you're telling me about two people coming
in or however many people coming in and taking care
of him and letting you go, it is just so
far fetched. I can't believe it.

Speaker 15 (01:05:29):
Why would they do this town, What were they arguing about?

Speaker 2 (01:05:32):
What did they say? Their details?

Speaker 10 (01:05:37):
They didn't say a lot.

Speaker 8 (01:05:38):
They were white Americans from what I could tell.

Speaker 10 (01:05:40):
They had they call.

Speaker 8 (01:05:45):
Those things, you know, like beanies, but they cover your
whole face, thank God, like holes for your nose and
in your or if you can, your mount in your eyes.
And they were the one was black.

Speaker 10 (01:05:59):
I think we were both black, or maybe dark blue
or something.

Speaker 8 (01:06:04):
Anyway, it wasn't until I was in LA and Laura
wasn't getting back to me, and it was already like
nine something, but I was like, maybe I will just
go see Travis briefly.

Speaker 10 (01:06:12):
And I called Ryan and said my phone.

Speaker 11 (01:06:15):
Was about to die, and.

Speaker 8 (01:06:21):
I tried getting hold of Matt. I got his voicemail.

Speaker 10 (01:06:23):
I was gonna ask him if my charger was there
and if he could save it or mail it or something.

Speaker 8 (01:06:28):
So I just.

Speaker 10 (01:06:32):
I had a a wall charger, I think.

Speaker 8 (01:06:34):
And I was just gonna charge it later, I guess.

Speaker 2 (01:06:38):
When I got somewhere.

Speaker 8 (01:06:39):
Anyway, I did call Travis and and I said guess what,
and he said what. I said, I'm coming to Arizona tonight,
and there were silence, and he goes really, And I said, yeah,
well it made you change your mind? And I just said.

Speaker 10 (01:06:55):
I just.

Speaker 8 (01:06:58):
Cause I think I just told him I miss him
or something, but I I would have said, cause you're
too compelling, but like he's too he's.

Speaker 11 (01:07:06):
Already got big in a pet and all that stuff.

Speaker 8 (01:07:10):
So I showed up and he was watching YouTube on
his computer on his laptop in the office. He we
watched that for a little while, and he.

Speaker 10 (01:07:24):
Was very happy to see me, and Polly embarked, but
he always barking.

Speaker 8 (01:07:27):
Somebody walks in and then he Polan was really obvious me.

Speaker 1 (01:07:30):
He he gets so.

Speaker 8 (01:07:31):
Excited as he jiggles too, and I just do this
singe his butt where he just kind of pushed him
on the side and he goes around and circles over
and over and ever until he realizes, hey, he's talk
with me through. So it was some good reunion.

Speaker 26 (01:07:45):
And and uh.

Speaker 8 (01:07:51):
We went. I mean, I told him I was tired,
I think cause I I don't know what he was,
what his intentions were, or what he thought my intentions.

Speaker 10 (01:07:57):
Were at the time, like I'm we're gonna do anything,
but I was very.

Speaker 8 (01:08:00):
Exhausted from the trip, and I just said, but I
think I'm just gonna sleep for a little while, and
he said that's fine. So I it slept pretty well
the day before, but I was tired of driving a
light so I slept and he slept in the way.

Speaker 7 (01:08:12):
He must to slept till about one, yeah afternoon, Yeah, must.

Speaker 8 (01:08:22):
Have been around then.

Speaker 10 (01:08:25):
TH's rooming was home when I got there. I have
never see his roommate though.

Speaker 8 (01:08:29):
I think I was asleep by the time he thought
I've been left. Okay, if if you don't believe me,
that's okay.

Speaker 2 (01:08:38):
I'm trying to I'm trying.

Speaker 8 (01:08:39):
I'm just saying that, you know, it sounds to me
like like I'm already in the system pretty far in.
I'm not getting out anytime soon.

Speaker 10 (01:08:49):
And as long as the wrap falls on me, I
think that it's not good.

Speaker 2 (01:08:53):
I don't do that.

Speaker 10 (01:08:54):
Yeah, I'm just saying I think that as long as
that is, it's there's there's less of.

Speaker 8 (01:08:58):
A chance that my little brother is gonna be hurt,
or my mom or my dad or my sister that
lived there.

Speaker 2 (01:09:07):
Okay, we'll continue with the story.

Speaker 12 (01:09:11):
Anyway.

Speaker 2 (01:09:11):
About one o'clock.

Speaker 8 (01:09:13):
Yeah, we young had sex a couple of times. Once
was in his bed and once was again downstairs in
his office, and uh, he.

Speaker 11 (01:09:30):
I don't know what he was looking at.

Speaker 8 (01:09:32):
Some pictures that I brought for him. But he has
a virus on his computer. So you click the start
menu on Windows xper when you were with two thousand
or whatever, you have like my music, my picture's my computer. Yeah,
you can usually cook on my computer and then go
to the D disk drive and open he c Like,

(01:09:52):
you click the windows and it would come up, but
none of those my music, computer's picture that would none
that would come up. So he has some kind of
virus he was dealing with. And then his screensaver was
a bunch of little bugs eating of his screen. It
was just weird, and he said that was from the
virus too. I thought, I was like, that's a cute screensaver.
It's like, yeah, it's my stupid virus. So for some

(01:10:15):
reason that was frustrating for both of us cause we
couldn't look at the pictures and they were from art
a lot of our church history trips which are on
my other external drive, which uh why I haven't been
able to access for a long since after Christmas cause
it just quit and I just haven't.

Speaker 10 (01:10:31):
Enough the money to spend to get.

Speaker 8 (01:10:32):
All that and stuff back.

Speaker 2 (01:10:34):
So you guys worked with that for a while.

Speaker 8 (01:10:36):
Or yeah, we had three discs. I think, okay, ye
had three, and.

Speaker 2 (01:10:43):
So all what time is this now, you guys there
that's on the computer.

Speaker 8 (01:10:47):
I don't really remember. It was after every after we.

Speaker 2 (01:10:50):
Had done a couple hours or four.

Speaker 7 (01:10:54):
Or so later.

Speaker 10 (01:10:54):
Yeah, maybe okay, afternoon.

Speaker 8 (01:10:56):
I I just you know, he had been cleaning his house,
so I couldn't and I wasn't sitting on the couch
usually I was just chilling the couch downstairs, you know,
if no one was home. But he had like chairs
and all that stuff all over the couch like he

(01:11:16):
was cleaning the floor or something.

Speaker 10 (01:11:19):
Uh been Napoleon.

Speaker 8 (01:11:22):
I don't know if he made phone calls or not,
or what he was doing on the internet, but well,
funny he was gonna go up and take a shower
and took a lot of convincing prior when he was shaving.
I was like, I got some ideas and they didn't.

Speaker 10 (01:11:33):
Turn out good at all, not like I wanted to.

Speaker 11 (01:11:36):
But I thought that I.

Speaker 10 (01:11:37):
Could get some cool pictures of him shaving. So cause
he does the whole old fashioned thing with.

Speaker 11 (01:11:42):
Like this little I don't know how it works.

Speaker 8 (01:11:46):
He liked it though, apparently, cause he used it first
profile picture on my space, so those in drums goes
and I do that again later. But I said, I
asked him I could do pictures of him the shower, and.

Speaker 11 (01:11:58):
He's like no, and I was like, I just have
an idea.

Speaker 8 (01:12:03):
I have a couple of ideas. And he's like, cool,
what do you mean?

Speaker 11 (01:12:06):
And I was like, I said, I have this.

Speaker 8 (01:12:08):
I I saw this thing in a countin Klein at
once that looked really good.

Speaker 10 (01:12:12):
And so he was, You're right. He wasn't very comfortable
at first. He was He's standing there and he's all,
I feel gay.

Speaker 2 (01:12:22):
He does that look ah us very so.

Speaker 10 (01:12:25):
So, so I deleted and I I'm taking.

Speaker 8 (01:12:31):
And some he looked really good.

Speaker 10 (01:12:33):
I thought the one that you showed me yesterday with
him looking right.

Speaker 8 (01:12:36):
At you, I feel it's a great picture.

Speaker 10 (01:12:38):
That's what's it.

Speaker 15 (01:12:40):
What he hates about that.

Speaker 8 (01:12:41):
I think it's a very good picture of that. So
you were taking pictures and showing him, yeah, yeah, he's
all seeing you don't show him. His shower was open
and it's his water pressure and that shower isn't that great,
so it's not.

Speaker 12 (01:12:55):
Like water was going everywhere.

Speaker 8 (01:13:00):
What happened when the last.

Speaker 2 (01:13:01):
Picture was taken out.

Speaker 10 (01:13:07):
He was kneeling down in the shower.

Speaker 8 (01:13:11):
I don't remember him. If you like, if this is
his shower and the sink is over here, I was
like right here taking pictures. And I don't really know
what happened after that exactly, except I think he was shot.

Speaker 2 (01:13:30):
Where were you.

Speaker 8 (01:13:33):
If this is his shower, if he was sitting here,
I was like, well, if this is his shower, I'm
sitting here. I was like right here on my knees
in his bets. I was right here, and I was
taking him here, and I was just going through the
pictures and I heard this loud ring and I don't really.

Speaker 10 (01:13:57):
Remember except Travis was screaming. I think I got knocked.

Speaker 8 (01:14:02):
Out, but I don't think I was out long. I
know I got knocked in the head, and I've i'd
gotten knocked in the head once by my dad when
he was just really mad, and it wasn't like actually
it wasn't. He didn't knock me in the head. He
just pushed me against the wall and I hit my
head and I felt but he in this case, I
think it was similar because he uh was screaming and
I was by the back to the and he was

(01:14:26):
holding his head, and there were two people there, and.

Speaker 2 (01:14:36):
What'd you say?

Speaker 8 (01:14:39):
I remember putting my hand on his back cause he
was on his all four of his knees. He was
like on his knees like this doing something out of
this or something like I don't know. And I it's like,
I was like.

Speaker 10 (01:14:54):
Alright, or okay, what's going on?

Speaker 8 (01:14:56):
What's going on? He's like, go get help, go get help?

Speaker 10 (01:14:59):
And I said okay, and.

Speaker 8 (01:15:03):
I turned around. There are two people there. One was
a guy and one was a girl. I I could
t couldn't, I'll bet at first, but I could just
see one was a girl, and I assume the other
was a guy cause they're build. And then their voices.

(01:15:24):
Remember if they were wearing.

Speaker 10 (01:15:25):
Like maybe jeans.

Speaker 2 (01:15:30):
What did they say?

Speaker 10 (01:15:31):
One was in all black, one was in jeans.

Speaker 2 (01:15:34):
I don't say anything.

Speaker 8 (01:15:39):
Yeah, girl wanted to kill me?

Speaker 11 (01:15:40):
Two what did she say?

Speaker 8 (01:15:45):
Just like what words did you hear?

Speaker 2 (01:15:49):
What phrases?

Speaker 8 (01:15:51):
Who is that?

Speaker 10 (01:15:53):
Who is that?

Speaker 8 (01:15:54):
I thought he was by himself or alone or something,
and and he was like shut out and just finish it.
And and Travis was screaming the whole time. He wasn't
screaming like a girl. He was just like like he
was in pain, like he was like shocked, like ah,

(01:16:16):
you know who wasn't really moving though, he was just
standing staying kind of still on the floor.

Speaker 20 (01:16:25):
Then what happened?

Speaker 10 (01:16:28):
Well, as soon as he said go get help, and
I turned around and then I s they were there and.

Speaker 2 (01:16:33):
Where were they?

Speaker 17 (01:16:35):
They were in the bathroom where abouts room not all
the way or like the bouts room.

Speaker 8 (01:16:39):
The girl was in the hallway kind of.

Speaker 26 (01:16:45):
And the guy was more.

Speaker 8 (01:16:46):
Toward in the bedroom, but like still in the bathroom,
like gotten on the tile carpet area right there where
he starts.

Speaker 2 (01:16:52):
Kay and m.

Speaker 10 (01:17:01):
He started coming in toward the bath room too, and I.

Speaker 2 (01:17:05):
What you did?

Speaker 12 (01:17:10):
It was what happened? What happened?

Speaker 7 (01:17:13):
Joni?

Speaker 2 (01:17:16):
What did you see.

Speaker 8 (01:17:21):
Out my God on page?

Speaker 2 (01:17:25):
He took off?

Speaker 11 (01:17:27):
I ran and he.

Speaker 8 (01:17:29):
Stopped me way.

Speaker 2 (01:17:32):
And he stopped you.

Speaker 8 (01:17:34):
Oh jos, he was a oh.

Speaker 10 (01:17:40):
He was still like conscious and was still alive.

Speaker 2 (01:17:43):
And I just loved him there No.

Speaker 8 (01:17:46):
I I ran into the closet cause I there's two doors,
and they were sort of in the hallway already, and
he stopped me and he didn't touch me.

Speaker 10 (01:17:55):
He was just held the gun to my head and
he was like you don't go anywhere, and he told
D you called the other girls finished it. I didn't see,
but he was like, I didn't think he was saying
a lot.

Speaker 9 (01:18:16):
But what happened?

Speaker 8 (01:18:20):
He told me to stay there and not to move.

Speaker 2 (01:18:23):
Then what was that in the closet? No, it was
I was, I guess sorry.

Speaker 10 (01:18:34):
There this that room?

Speaker 2 (01:18:40):
Kay? And then he had the long holliway to his bathroom.
Let's seek and yeah, the closet here.

Speaker 25 (01:18:51):
And now I had a shower, and then about time
there and then there stayed.

Speaker 2 (01:19:00):
Right there.

Speaker 22 (01:19:00):
My sister to sink did his bedroom in this wanna
tras closet door there?

Speaker 8 (01:19:08):
M that's d Yeah exactly, he's in this closet.

Speaker 11 (01:19:13):
I don't like this close.

Speaker 8 (01:19:15):
So I ran this way cause they were. He was
walking this way and she was already right here. And
then he stopped me here and he said, don't move.
And Travis was here or somewhere around the.

Speaker 10 (01:19:35):
Bouts and he left the room for a minute.

Speaker 5 (01:19:39):
And I didn't have my stupid phone cause it wasn't charged,
and Travis's.

Speaker 8 (01:19:46):
Phone was downstairs, and I didn't know his roommates I
didn't think were home at the time, So like I
was just trying to think of there's any way I
could call even when one or call or or get
out of the house.

Speaker 10 (01:20:00):
There's no way out except downstairs. His windows are there
are two stories for one, and they're just they.

Speaker 15 (01:20:06):
Were hard to get to.

Speaker 7 (01:20:07):
He had stuff here and stuff here.

Speaker 8 (01:20:08):
And blinds and screens and window coverings and I mean
from the outside, and he could.

Speaker 9 (01:20:15):
I just.

Speaker 10 (01:20:17):
She was over him, and I just rushed her and
I pushed her and.

Speaker 8 (01:20:24):
There was.

Speaker 2 (01:20:28):
Creus what.

Speaker 8 (01:20:30):
Tendus was bleeding everywhere?

Speaker 2 (01:20:35):
What was she doing to cause he'd been shot at
this timeline?

Speaker 25 (01:20:41):
Yeah, but he was still alive.

Speaker 10 (01:20:44):
He was conscious even like you're still talking.

Speaker 8 (01:20:48):
Oh, he was talking or saying much. I could tell
he was breathing. He seemed like he was wreathing calmly.
I think he wasn't like he was just there.

Speaker 2 (01:20:56):
I earlier.

Speaker 10 (01:20:56):
Remember it's such a layer. Okay, and so were you?

Speaker 2 (01:21:00):
You did one?

Speaker 12 (01:21:01):
Now you pushed her?

Speaker 8 (01:21:03):
Mm.

Speaker 10 (01:21:05):
She she's a bigger a little bit bigger than me,
not really in size but hight.

Speaker 15 (01:21:15):
And what happened, Oh, I didn't really deter her.

Speaker 2 (01:21:22):
Did she have any weapons on her at all? Uh? Yeah,
what'd she have? She?

Speaker 8 (01:21:27):
I thought she was the one with the gun.

Speaker 10 (01:21:29):
But maybe she had the gun, but he had a gun.

Speaker 8 (01:21:33):
So there they were two guns or they were one gun.
I don't know.

Speaker 2 (01:21:37):
Oh, she's the one who shot him in the right.

Speaker 7 (01:21:39):
She was the one here.

Speaker 2 (01:21:40):
He was back here at that time when you saw.

Speaker 10 (01:21:42):
Them, I would think so, because I mean, I do I.

Speaker 11 (01:21:50):
I don't know.

Speaker 8 (01:21:50):
I got hit here somewhere. It w I just I
don't know, cause when I was when I woke up,
he was screaming. And I saw her at this point,
like right here and walking by your back. She must
have been walking back this way, and I saw him
sort of falling, and that's when he's like finished, and

(01:22:15):
and I started running this way and he stopped me,
and then he left the room for a couple of minutes.

Speaker 2 (01:22:19):
Why did he late?

Speaker 10 (01:22:21):
Maybe his I don't know.

Speaker 9 (01:22:23):
I don't know.

Speaker 5 (01:22:24):
Sofors I I got Travis, and he wasn't like standing
up really, he wasn't really doing much, and I was
and he was w I was.

Speaker 26 (01:22:38):
Trying to get him, and she came back and got
him kind of far like right here. She came back,
and uh, I d do he was just.

Speaker 10 (01:22:56):
He was starting to just get weaker and weaker, and
this guy came back in.

Speaker 8 (01:23:05):
And she said that she said they they needed to
they do me too, because because it was.

Speaker 10 (01:23:16):
There, And he's like, no, that's not why we're here.

Speaker 8 (01:23:22):
Yeah, he had a purse.

Speaker 10 (01:23:30):
Which I had on the dresser here prior summer.

Speaker 2 (01:23:36):
And what did they do after this? After you guys
reached this just tried to stick with the incidents.

Speaker 11 (01:23:43):
Off on what was going on.

Speaker 10 (01:23:50):
She came after me and he stopped her, okay, and
she didn't.

Speaker 8 (01:23:58):
Give me.

Speaker 2 (01:24:00):
How was she gonna get your Does she have a weapon?

Speaker 8 (01:24:02):
She had a knife okay?

Speaker 2 (01:24:08):
Who said she had a gun before?

Speaker 8 (01:24:10):
I don't know if she had a gun, i'd I think,
cause I am guessing. I'm I know the heat. I
don't know if she had a gun or life.

Speaker 2 (01:24:23):
So she was basically the aggressor.

Speaker 8 (01:24:27):
Yeah, unless he took a shot too, I don't know,
but it seemed like from what you're telling her that
she was the aggressive one.

Speaker 2 (01:24:33):
And he was the more passive.

Speaker 8 (01:24:36):
Yeah, I mean, there was definitely a aggression as far
as I mean, I don't know what you define aggression
by it, Like if I was there was a definitely
a stern ness and I wasn't like just free to
walk out of there like hey.

Speaker 10 (01:24:54):
It's cool, it's cool, you know, And it wasn't anything
like that.

Speaker 2 (01:24:57):
Then what happened?

Speaker 8 (01:25:00):
They had a marketing back and forth and she wanted
to and he didn't.

Speaker 2 (01:25:07):
Why why didn't they kill you?

Speaker 10 (01:25:11):
Just because he said, he it's he said, that's not
what we're here for.

Speaker 2 (01:25:15):
Did they say why they were there?

Speaker 8 (01:25:18):
No, it was obvious they were there for him.

Speaker 11 (01:25:22):
I didn't.

Speaker 8 (01:25:23):
They didn't say why.

Speaker 15 (01:25:24):
So it seemed like they knew him obviously, Yeah, but.

Speaker 10 (01:25:28):
He didn't seem to know them. I mean, uh, he
was a little out of it.

Speaker 8 (01:25:31):
Plus they had masks on anyway, but he didn't express
any kind of recognition.

Speaker 7 (01:25:38):
I could talk, he was able to say, go get help,
and at.

Speaker 10 (01:25:44):
One point he said, go to my neighbor's house. Go
to my neighbor's house, so that if you didn't, I'd there.

Speaker 8 (01:25:54):
Was just like there was just no way.

Speaker 2 (01:25:56):
Didn't you see them hurt him anymore? Has it been
a good shock?

Speaker 8 (01:26:04):
She had a knife and I didn't. I don't know.
He was bleeding everywhere. It was like when she r
rushed me afterward, or she came back, I rushed her,
but she kind of came back at me.

Speaker 2 (01:26:22):
Why didn't she try?

Speaker 11 (01:26:23):
Ton't never ride about here?

Speaker 10 (01:26:25):
Maybe I don't.

Speaker 8 (01:26:26):
Halfway, I don't know. And there was a little bit
of a struggle with her, and I I was so scared.
I'm not a person who fights.

Speaker 23 (01:26:41):
I'm not.

Speaker 8 (01:26:43):
A person who knows really.

Speaker 10 (01:26:46):
About self defense. I took some classes once, but it
was like eight years ago.

Speaker 8 (01:26:50):
I had never been consistent with it, okay, so I
wasn't sure.

Speaker 10 (01:26:56):
I just knew I had to hold onto her hands
because she had a knife.

Speaker 2 (01:27:01):
What happened to happen?

Speaker 10 (01:27:02):
She she had it in his hand, but a little
we're right, I guess, so right?

Speaker 2 (01:27:14):
What happened? So you didn't see her hurt him anymore?

Speaker 8 (01:27:19):
He was just bleeding.

Speaker 1 (01:27:22):
Where did he hand do?

Speaker 8 (01:27:23):
Yeah? I when I tried getting him here, he said,
go get help. And when I cr tried, I came
back this way, pushed her, and he said, go go
to my neighbors.

Speaker 2 (01:27:34):
Go to my neighbors.

Speaker 8 (01:27:36):
And I wasn't like no, but I wasn't gonna leave.

Speaker 10 (01:27:38):
If I couldn't leave without him, I was trung. I
felt stupid already for.

Speaker 8 (01:27:44):
Trying to run this way. Was gonna go to a phone,
and he was like, I just said, come on, come on.
You know he was naked, but I didn't care, just
come on, and he's like I can't. I said, come on.
He's like I can't fill my legs and they wouldn't

(01:28:06):
let me be by him.

Speaker 2 (01:28:07):
Were you were you clothed at that time? Or were
you also there that?

Speaker 10 (01:28:11):
Yeah, it was closed.

Speaker 2 (01:28:14):
Those of the pants that I showed you the other.

Speaker 17 (01:28:15):
Day on that camera.

Speaker 10 (01:28:17):
I I don't think they had pants like that.

Speaker 8 (01:28:20):
I don't know.

Speaker 10 (01:28:21):
I've got a lot of clothes and trying to remember
the clothes that I took to that trip.

Speaker 8 (01:28:28):
Oh, I do have another pair of striped pants and
they're they're gray though with a black stripe. I don't
think they were that. I don't know.

Speaker 2 (01:28:36):
Okay, So what happened after that? Did they have a
conversation about killing you two and you and then they
decided not to?

Speaker 10 (01:28:50):
She really really really wanted to what happened then?

Speaker 8 (01:28:54):
From there they were s I was here like I
cause or more or whatever it's called, when this TV
was here and I was right here and I had
to stay here, and I was calling his name and
they were like, shut the hell up, and I was
just I don't know if I was crying. It was

(01:29:16):
all just like I it was so weird. He was
going through my purse and he pulled out my wallet
and he just took some cash I had though my
cash stashed in the jeans I had worn like a

(01:29:38):
good chunk of it. I don't like eighty bucks stashed
in in four twenties in the back of my jeans
pockets which were in my backpack, But I had some
cash in here, not all of it though, Okay, So
he took that and.

Speaker 25 (01:29:57):
I WoT up.

Speaker 2 (01:29:59):
He what was she doing? She was like right here
at time doing what.

Speaker 15 (01:30:09):
He's over here taking stuff from your wallet?

Speaker 2 (01:30:11):
Uh, think of perish, you're a year she's down the hall.

Speaker 8 (01:30:15):
She yeah, she wasn't far. It's not a far distance.
I'm there was part of me. I think that was
just I was sitting and I was just like, I
didn't know what to say.

Speaker 10 (01:30:25):
Who do you beg for your life? Do you do
you say?

Speaker 8 (01:30:28):
Who are you guys?

Speaker 10 (01:30:29):
I'm powerless because I don't have put any way to
stop it at me.

Speaker 2 (01:30:34):
They were just more powerful. Oh, such stuff from there?
What did he do? She w?

Speaker 12 (01:30:43):
She was I don't know what she was doing.

Speaker 8 (01:30:44):
But she was arguing with him and talking with him
and saying, what what they saying? She's like, it wasn't
like super young.

Speaker 10 (01:30:52):
It was kind of like hushed but intense, like you
Needa da da shut up cause not we were here.

Speaker 8 (01:30:59):
Things like that, and.

Speaker 10 (01:31:05):
And uh, he grabbed my wallet and.

Speaker 8 (01:31:12):
He was looking through it. He just did the cash
put it in his pocket. He he got my registration
out and my wallet and.

Speaker 12 (01:31:23):
He said, what do you say?

Speaker 10 (01:31:30):
He said, you must be that bitch from California.

Speaker 2 (01:31:34):
Hm.

Speaker 8 (01:31:35):
And he was calling like this with my registration and he.

Speaker 10 (01:31:40):
Said, he said, you ever ever ever say anything about it?

Speaker 8 (01:31:56):
He said, they'll do to my family, say and me,
And I didn't care so much about me at that point.

Speaker 10 (01:32:05):
He said, you need to leave, and don't you call.

Speaker 8 (01:32:10):
Anybody, you know, you say anything, you know, you act
like anything happened. He's getting you one chance. And she
said she's gonna rat us off or she's gonna say something.
And he was like, shut up.

Speaker 11 (01:32:27):
He was like, you get one chance.

Speaker 2 (01:32:32):
What's that?

Speaker 8 (01:32:33):
When you left, said leave now, And part of me
didn't wanna leave.

Speaker 10 (01:32:42):
Travis wasn't.

Speaker 7 (01:32:43):
It was still a lot.

Speaker 11 (01:32:45):
He was still.

Speaker 10 (01:32:47):
I could s he wasn't moving a lot, but he
was still alive.

Speaker 7 (01:32:50):
I could see that he was still.

Speaker 2 (01:32:53):
Did you leave at that point?

Speaker 12 (01:32:56):
I left the room.

Speaker 2 (01:32:57):
And where did you go? I?

Speaker 8 (01:33:00):
Yeah, went downstairs. But I didn't have all my clothes.

Speaker 17 (01:33:06):
What did you leave?

Speaker 2 (01:33:06):
Then?

Speaker 8 (01:33:07):
Well, trevisa that I had some stuff there.

Speaker 10 (01:33:10):
I didn't see what it was.

Speaker 8 (01:33:11):
He said it was in his closet, since they.

Speaker 2 (01:33:14):
Were clothes in wine.

Speaker 8 (01:33:16):
But all I had was my person in my backpack.

Speaker 1 (01:33:21):
I left those and.

Speaker 8 (01:33:26):
And I went outside, and that what you do? I
wanted to get help, I was.

Speaker 7 (01:33:43):
I just wanted to get out.

Speaker 8 (01:33:47):
He told me that if I didn't see anything, that
I would be.

Speaker 10 (01:33:52):
That I wouldn't that I wouldn't even live to regret it,
but that I.

Speaker 8 (01:33:55):
Would regret it.

Speaker 2 (01:34:00):
No idea why they did this town, You have to.

Speaker 10 (01:34:04):
Know something about trying to think what else was said?

Speaker 2 (01:34:09):
Anything that clipped in your mind? Cause why would anybody
do this?

Speaker 8 (01:34:16):
Down?

Speaker 2 (01:34:17):
He does nothing about help people. Everybody likes him. Doesn't
help people money, help people like that anyway.

Speaker 15 (01:34:27):
No, he doesn't get involved in things he's not supposed
to get involved in.

Speaker 2 (01:34:32):
He's doesn't do draw. It doesn't seem like a robbery.

Speaker 8 (01:34:35):
No, it doesn't.

Speaker 10 (01:34:36):
I was wondering if they took my stone to make
him look that way.

Speaker 8 (01:34:39):
And he told me to leave, and you know, try
this usually.

Speaker 2 (01:34:46):
Keeps his cash and as callet, so he didn't see
what happened to him.

Speaker 12 (01:34:50):
Then I just saw that.

Speaker 2 (01:34:55):
Did you get hurt at all? You said you were
fighting with her?

Speaker 12 (01:34:58):
Yeah?

Speaker 2 (01:34:59):
What happened to you? She cut me where?

Speaker 20 (01:35:02):
I yea, let me see where at you?

Speaker 8 (01:35:06):
She can't see it if you look at my finger
isn't the same though, I was.

Speaker 2 (01:35:12):
I'm sure what she woorst the word?

Speaker 1 (01:35:15):
Did it get cut?

Speaker 2 (01:35:17):
It was co it conveniently it was right on the crease,
right there on the crease.

Speaker 8 (01:35:22):
Can you see, Well, it's kind of a purple or color.

Speaker 2 (01:35:24):
I guess this one here here right on the crease.

Speaker 8 (01:35:29):
Well, there's a vein on this one. Maybe I don't know.

Speaker 2 (01:35:32):
It's this one here.

Speaker 15 (01:35:34):
Yeah, it's a slice there, Yeah, just a small one.

Speaker 2 (01:35:40):
Was it pretty deep?

Speaker 8 (01:35:41):
I don't know how deep it was?

Speaker 10 (01:35:42):
But my finger hurt for a while for a while.

Speaker 15 (01:35:45):
Kay, So like right in that crease that you right
across both of 'em.

Speaker 8 (01:35:50):
Uh, not my middle finger. And it cut this one
a little, but not as much. This is where it
really went.

Speaker 10 (01:35:55):
I don't know how it happened that all these other fingers.

Speaker 26 (01:35:57):
Were missed, but this one.

Speaker 17 (01:35:59):
Yeah, I don't know this one.

Speaker 10 (01:36:02):
Like I still can't close this finger all the way.

Speaker 11 (01:36:04):
It's as close as it goes.

Speaker 8 (01:36:05):
Or is this one goes like that?

Speaker 2 (01:36:07):
Ah?

Speaker 8 (01:36:08):
So my CTR ring used to fit both fingers, and
I can't get it on the stinger anywhere?

Speaker 15 (01:36:11):
So does that it cut pretty deep time?

Speaker 8 (01:36:13):
I guess if you feel it squeeze, it just feels
like bone, like there's nothing unnormal there. But again, like
my CTR ring slides right on this finger.

Speaker 12 (01:36:22):
I used to slide right and off this finger.

Speaker 8 (01:36:23):
And I just can't fit a ring on your Okay,
it's a bigger size.

Speaker 2 (01:36:26):
Now I left this hair. What's up though, nest?

Speaker 8 (01:36:31):
Like?

Speaker 10 (01:36:32):
Okay, I'm pretty sure she surprises me that.

Speaker 2 (01:36:35):
So when you were told any of you left, did
you get in a car and drive away?

Speaker 8 (01:36:42):
I always have my sings my keys around how a
little clip on the I I do that because I'm
very very spacy.

Speaker 2 (01:36:49):
Did you see any other cars and driveway or up
the street? Any vehicles tramations? You can go us? Uh?

Speaker 10 (01:36:55):
No, not that, ikay, not that I real.

Speaker 8 (01:36:58):
Not that I I don't think it's from wow.

Speaker 2 (01:37:02):
I mean you just left. You didn't run to the neighbors.

Speaker 15 (01:37:06):
You did try calling, you knew they were in a house.

Speaker 2 (01:37:11):
If you had time to run to the neighborhood, did
you do that?

Speaker 7 (01:37:15):
I was really scared.

Speaker 8 (01:37:16):
Okay, it's really freaked out of my mind.

Speaker 2 (01:37:22):
Kay, I don't believe you.

Speaker 17 (01:37:30):
When I came in here open that you would tell
me the truth. And this is not the truth, joking,
this is calling. Now, this does not make any sense.

Speaker 12 (01:37:39):
Does not make any sense.

Speaker 8 (01:37:41):
Ah, I Now.

Speaker 2 (01:37:46):
Nothing changes for me.

Speaker 10 (01:37:51):
I didn't think it would. The responsible was I killed
that I could have done that. I feel like you
should have gotten out.

Speaker 8 (01:38:03):
I feel that I should have been stronger.

Speaker 15 (01:38:09):
You feel responsible because you did this.

Speaker 8 (01:38:13):
You did not join each f you did.

Speaker 2 (01:38:16):
You did, and there's nothing you can say that'll change
my mind at this point. This is an elaborate story
which does not make any sense.

Speaker 17 (01:38:28):
Two of two people come in first, two white males,
and then that later you change it too.

Speaker 2 (01:38:32):
H Oh.

Speaker 10 (01:38:33):
I don't think I ever said way, Yes you did when.

Speaker 2 (01:38:36):
At the beginning of the story, who was one?

Speaker 20 (01:38:39):
I mean you change it all?

Speaker 17 (01:38:40):
Now, when's a female seen a little time.

Speaker 8 (01:38:42):
I said, I wasn't sure at first, but you could tell.

Speaker 12 (01:38:44):
When they're built.

Speaker 21 (01:38:45):
Okay, it doesn't make any sense to me, And there's
no reason anybody would go after him.

Speaker 2 (01:38:57):
There's nothing in his past, nothing that was in him
at that time that he was going through that he
cast him wody to do that to him. And the
fact that they left you alive, let you go, That
never happens. Why would anybody do that? Why would somebody
rest the chance of getting.

Speaker 15 (01:39:16):
Caught just letting you run out the front door when they're.

Speaker 2 (01:39:20):
Upstairs in his house.

Speaker 17 (01:39:23):
Killing somebody, knowing that you would just run across the
street and tell somebody.

Speaker 25 (01:39:29):
It doesn't make any sense.

Speaker 2 (01:39:31):
Does it make any sense to you?

Speaker 12 (01:39:34):
It doesn't.

Speaker 8 (01:39:34):
Doesn't. Now do you argue about it doesn't make sense?
I thought for sure I was dead.

Speaker 2 (01:39:47):
I was hoping that you were gonna be completely truthful
with me today. Obviously that's not the piece.

Speaker 17 (01:39:56):
I know you were there, I know you you you
had some situation go on with him that got out
of control. And the cuts that you're showing me there,
that's pretty it's pretty obvious how that happen. I've seen
them before that happens when a knife slips through someone's hand.

Speaker 2 (01:40:18):
Because of blood. That's slip bread and it cuts. That's
what that is.

Speaker 17 (01:40:28):
I've done this for a long time and this is
the most part fetched story I've ever heard, and it's
not gonna help you.

Speaker 20 (01:40:38):
It's not how you wanna leave this.

Speaker 8 (01:40:40):
And they still leave them in here.

Speaker 12 (01:40:42):
Your family will not get hurt.

Speaker 17 (01:40:46):
They will not get.

Speaker 2 (01:40:47):
Hurt the way you're hurting. Your families might not coming
forward and telling me the truth. There is a reason
why you.

Speaker 8 (01:40:57):
Did this thing.

Speaker 2 (01:40:58):
You just refused to tell me, Maybe because you are cold.
Be calculate.

Speaker 13 (01:41:06):
All right, ladies and gentlemen, we are going to take
the evening recess at this time. Please remember the admonition.
Tomorrow morning, and starting tomorrow and every day that you
come to court, I'm going to ask that you assemble
downstairs in the jury room and meeting Room A. It
is being reserved for you, so that is where you

(01:41:26):
will stay. The bailiff will come and bring you upstairs
when we're ready to start. Are there any questions, Please
remember the admonition. Have a nice evening. Tomorrow ten thirty

(01:41:52):
you can step down. The record will show the jury's
left the courtment.

Speaker 8 (01:41:55):
Mister Martinez, this is two pages from your transcript.

Speaker 9 (01:42:00):
Three one that you were playing.

Speaker 1 (01:42:01):
I like h even in the ring pull it out
that end up going to the beginning.

Speaker 4 (01:42:08):
So I'm also gonna leave the deep DVD player on
if that's all.

Speaker 2 (01:42:12):
Is there any where we can make a no of
where it's at it?

Speaker 1 (01:42:17):
Uh with left off with a DVD player?

Speaker 2 (01:42:22):
No, I don't know.

Speaker 1 (01:42:22):
I just don't let h she said.

Speaker 4 (01:42:25):
I just don't want that badly to get hurt and
then do the text your smile into your bad Rea.

Speaker 10 (01:42:30):
Alright, you can leave it there.

Speaker 8 (01:42:31):
The machine will be turned off.

Speaker 13 (01:42:32):
I don't know if that will make a difference, but
the power will will go off at some point.

Speaker 4 (01:42:38):
Right right, But the machine, the DVD player will stay on,
but the machine that runs it will turn off right correct?

Speaker 8 (01:42:44):
Okay, are anything else?

Speaker 2 (01:42:48):
Its alright?

Speaker 8 (01:42:49):
Seemorrow