November 15, 2023 • 42 mins
This week, we dive deep into the fascinating intersection of ethnocentrism, expat life, and the exhilarating world of unconventional travel. Colby Mayes, a seasoned expat and trailblazer in the realm of Colombian exploration, shares his captivating experiences of breaking cultural barriers while leading adventurous souls through lesser-known landscapes. Tune in as he unravels the complexities of ethnocentrism, shedding light on the challenges and triumphs of navigating a foreign culture.
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(00:00):
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(00:47):
You are listening to the Globetrotter's podcast, the show dedicated to bringing you
fresh and diverse perspectives from traveling enthusiastsall over the world. I'm your host,
Max mel Gonzalez, and in ourlast episode, John spoke with Sam
good Child, a yacht racer whois competing in a solo round the world
sailing trip. If you haven't checkedout that episode, go back and give
(01:07):
it a listen. But for today'sepisode, I have someone I'm really excited
to bring a board. While backpackingin South America, I met Kobe Mays
a traveling enthusiast from Atlanta, Georgiaand expat who at the time was working
for the Salina Hostel in Cartha,Henna, Columbia. We kept in contact
once I left the hostel, andKobe was one of the first people that
really opened my eyes to the ideaof living life as an expat and more
(01:30):
importantly, what ethnocentrism in travel reallymeans. Kobe, it's great to have
you on the show. Thank you, Max, Thanks for having me and
having me on your platform. It'sa pleasure to be here. Yeah.
Man, it's always great to keepthe connection, make them and keep them
going right. Absolutely, absolutely.As I mentioned, you chose the life
of an ex pat, or maybeit was the expat life that chose you.
(01:53):
Could you clarify for our listeners whatdoes it mean to be an expat
and how did that lifestyle come ininto your life? For me, it
meant to immerse myself into a wholedifferent culture, a whole different environment setting,
and just to kind of find yourself, you know, for me personally
(02:16):
traveling, when I was starting out, when I was maybe about twelve years
old, my dad took me tothe South of Spain because My stepmother was
from Iris from Malaca, Spain,and that kind of opened mys And it
normally takes that first international trip toreally let you know that the world is
bigger than where you come from.And after that my mom started taking us
(02:40):
to Jamaica but once every two years. I was privileged to have those experiences
and going to college at Georgia StateUniversity. Actually majored in economics with a
minor in Spanish. And while Iwas going to college, I pretty much
had my own study abroad program.I was booking flys, I was booking
(03:01):
hotels, airbnbs, uh you knowthe cheap way hostels. And I went
to Cartaanna, Colombia one time andI fell in love with it. It
was cheap, the people were superfriendly. I met a I met a
beautiful woman who is now my wife. And I decided that after college,
(03:23):
I wanted to somehow work and moveto Cartagena, Colombia to enhance or master
the Spanish language. Uh So Ipacked up my bags, I left everything
behind in Atlanta, Georgia, andI did research as far as the visa
and all that good stuff there.I went to the consul in a few
(03:44):
times and uh, and the restwas history. I think there's a lot
to unpack there. Uh. Firstof all, I can't back that up
enough Carta Henna, and I meanColombia in general is just one of the
most beautiful countries. Uh, youknow, very welcoming and just were all.
It's just an experience to have ifyou're just going to backpack for you
know, a week, two weeksto eight months. You know, we've
(04:06):
all done the different lengths there.I kind of want to touch in on
that study a broad program that youpersonally put together yourself. When we previously
spoke, you mentioned that it wasactually cheaper than doing a study a broad
program through a campus or through theschool, rather that you did it yourself
and it was more beneficial. Howdid you find the motivation and what research
(04:29):
did you do to accomplish that?Well? I was motivated from previous trips
that my mom and my dad hadtaken me on. And with those whole
experiences, I kind of was privyto understanding how to book a trip,
where to look at and I hadthese different resources which I still have them,
such as secret flying and travel piratesand error affairs, things of that
(04:56):
sort, and you know, beingin class at Georgia State Universe City.
I remember having a study of broadcoordinator coming to our classroom, right and
I think it was too It mighthave been to in Italy somewhere in Europe,
and he was talking about maybe aboutI believe it's two to three thousand
dollars as far as everything included.And I'm thinking to myself, hmmm,
(05:17):
Well, when I was traveling toJamaica or with my mom or my dad,
she taught me how to find aflight for maybe about three hundred dollars,
you know at the time, uhand to uh, you know,
use these resources that I just mentioned, even if it was sky auction was
another one back then. It's it'snot as popular now where you actually bid
(05:40):
on different hotels, but we're talkingabout lodging for maybe another three or four
hundred dollars depending on your state.So I did some research and I was
able to find trips to Columbia,Cuba, went by myself, Thailand twice.
And you're talking about flights, forexample, the Thailand flight two flights.
(06:03):
I was able to find a flightfor four hundred and fifty dollars from
Houston, Texas, just had toget to Houston, Texas, you know,
and you know, you're talking aboutlodging in Thailand maybe twenty or thirty
dollars a night instead of going toItaly with your colleagues or classmates for three
thousand dollars, all right, Andas far as Cuba, going by myself,
(06:28):
I just, hey, I hadnothing to lose, you know,
I had nothing to lose. Ihad the confidence because I've been to other
places at that time, and youknow, being in the in the midst
of the minor in Spanish program atGeorgia State, it gave me a lot
more confidence because I was taking tenclasses in Georgia State University and you're talking
(06:49):
about business Spanish, you're talking aboutcritical thinking in Spanish, you're talking about
Spanish literature. So I felt prettyconfident, and you know, I just
I just went. I wasn't afraid. You know. Of course, you
got family members that say, oh, be careful, be careful, you
know, but at that point,I was only listening to anyone that went.
(07:10):
And if if you if someone toldme to be careful or it's dangerous
there and hadn't gone, you know, I was, I was telling them
or asking them, how would youknow you haven't been, you know.
So that was my attitude and it'sstill my attitude. And that was that
was that was motivating me pretty mucheverything I say that to say this,
(07:31):
I had no fear in traveling,you know, and when you're downtown Atlanta,
Georgia State, walking through the campus, walking through the vibrant city,
and it's just like the world isyours and and I know, I know
what people understand when they're when they'rein college and they have tunnel vision and
they have that fire within them,right And I had that fire within me
(07:55):
and I still do. But atthe time I had much more fire within
me. And uh hey, Ijust took risks and it has benefited me
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(08:18):
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a number of ways to become anexpat. And you spoke a bit about
how you were introduced into traveling ata young age, and I would love
(08:39):
for you, love for you towalk us through your process and why did
you choose the countries you decided tolive in and work in. So for
me, at the time, itwas twenty eighteen, I actually graduated college
August. And let's see, beforeAugust, before I even graduate, I'm
talking about March, I had startedto begin my research as far as finding
(09:01):
a job or an internship in Cartaena, Columbia. Right, so I'm on
glassdoor. Someone with a degree ineconomics were referring to revenue maximizing growth at
that point. To be honest,I would take almost not almost anything,
but you know, I would takemost things at the time. So I
did research Glassdoor. I saw Selina. I did some research. I saw
(09:26):
that they were at the time,well a pretty pretty up and coming startup
as far as hostels and hotels forthe digital nomadge your your your remote workers.
And this was before the pandemic,you know. So I took a
look at a posting on glass door. It was a revenue management intern and
(09:48):
applied and immediately got a call,had a couple of interviews with the general
manager. You know, he Iguess he liked what I was saying and
my credentials, and he hired me. Right, He's somewhat he's somewhat kind
of told me the process as faras what I needed to do to get
(10:09):
over there to actually be an internlegally in Colombia, But a lot of
it was on me as well,right. So yeah, Selena the company,
they provided some documentation or not necessarilysponsoring me, but they provided some
documentation to help me get that visa. However, on the other hand,
(10:31):
it was my responsibility to go tothe Colombian consulate in Atlanta, right,
And when I went, there wassomewhat of a disconnect between the government officials
at the consulate and what I wasbeing given from Selena, Right, So
I had to go back and fortha little bit. Actually went to the
consulate three times. By the timeI had all the documents that the consulate
(10:56):
required, right, And by thethird time I had everything they needed.
And I also had to get tobuy some insurance. I remember that as
well. For the whole entire yearI was in Cartagena, Colombia and the
insurance went that bad. I thinkit might have been about two hundred three
hundred dollars while I was out there. But that was pretty much the process
(11:18):
to get there. And once Igot there, I was supposed to kind
of register myself within the the Colombiangovernment at the time. I think I
had about two weeks to register myselfso I can get me a sedula.
Is that a visa? Like aright? Right? The sedula? It's
a it's an ID gotcha, okay, right, it's it's like you're yeah,
(11:39):
they call it a sula, Andbut I was. I had immersed
myself so much into the culture,into the word, and I ended up
not registering myself. I mean therewere no problems or anything. I just
ended up not getting a seeduler.But yeah, that pretty much was my
experience. Like I said, ittook three times to go to the consulate
(12:00):
and I use that documentation from Selenafor them to give me a visa inside
my passport. It's totally relatable hearingyou talk about having to go to the
consulate three different times because I hadvisa issues as well when I was there,
partially my fault, but also youknow, there were protests going on.
There was a whole ordeal, andI overstayed my visa and I had
(12:20):
to go back and forth to itwasn't the consulate, but some government officials.
I had to go back and fortha few times in order for them
to get it straightened out. Andeach time it was like, oh,
you forgot this paperwork. And it'slike, well, you didn't tell me
to bring that paperwork. And they'relike, all right, well you forgot
this one this time. And I'mlike, you could have just told me
all of them in the beginning andI would have brought all of them,
right. That's hilarious. So itsounds like you kind of got into the
(12:43):
Colombian pace pretty quickly. I mean, I feel like that's kind of how
they do things, and I feellike that's a great little I don't I
don't like to say the word,but segue into the next topic I wanted
to cover, you know, steeringaway from the expat life. We previously
chatted about your travels and ethnocentrism isa very important aspect of travel that continues
(13:07):
to surface, and I want tohear your thoughts on why it's so important
to you and how ethnocentrism shapes yourperspective while traveling. And I can clarify
for our listeners, ethnocentrism is theevaluation of other cultures by comparing them to
your own culture or customs, andso in that sense, it's really in
(13:28):
short, becoming immersed and really acceptinga culture when traveling. Absolutely, And
what ethnocentrism means to me is it'spretty much the belief that your own culture
is correct in normal and all othercultures are maybe indifferent or strange, right,
and ethnocentris excuse me, ethno centrismis to me, it's it's mindfulness,
(13:52):
it's it's awareness when you're traveling.And a lot of times, especially
for those that might have been livingin the US for almost all their lives,
uh, it may not come acrossuh you know, because you've been
so accustomed to certain customs and anduh in different societal norms in your particular
country that you might not think aboutit. But I think it's really important
(14:16):
when you do travel internationally, especiallythat you you kind of come with a
clean slate, right, because you'rein a different setting with different rules,
different lifestyle, and if you tryto bring your own customs and and especially
thinking that they're they're they're normal,and any other customer is wrong. You
(14:39):
may not have a great experience andand it may be some sort of disrespect
towards those the locals, uh,you know where you are. And for
me, for example, when Ifirst got into Cartagena, Colombian, I'm
guilty of ethnocentrism. Uh, you'reyou know, I'm wearing my jewelry.
I'm I'm I'm talking about my necklace. I'm not I'm not you know,
(15:00):
no, you know, going crazywith you know, dimons or anything like
that. I'm talking about a simplesilver necklace, you know, or a
watch and then Victor watch. Youknow, I'm wearing that in the streets.
And my girlfriend at the time,she's telling me, oh, you
know, make sure you take thatoff once we get out the tourist areas.
And my ethno centrism at the timetold me, man, nobody's gonna
(15:24):
mess with me. Man, nobody'sgonna mess with me. It's okay,
you know, I wear this alltime. Anyone's gonna mess with me,
you know. And then as Istarted to live there a little bit longer,
I understood what my girlfriend was talkingabout. And eventually I did start
to take that watch off or thatsilver necklace off. And another example is
having your phone out. Right now, you may know this too, Max,
(15:45):
I'm not talking about just in thetourists area, but outside the tourist
area, excuse me, outside thetourists areas of Latin American countries, not
not just Colombia, but we're talkingall over. Having your phone out is
a danger. It's a big danger, right. No matter how accustomed you
are of having your phone in thestreets of you know, here in the
(16:07):
US for fifteen something years, youknow, it's it's very dangerous and you
could have yourself in a sticky situationif you have your phone out, you
know you here, well not here, but in Colombia they say there's a
there's a phrase, and I'm sureyou've heard of this. It's called no
dara papaya, right, and prettymuch it means don't get don't put a
(16:29):
target on your back, you know. So overall, ethnocentrism is, you
know, you should leave that athome before you come to the country,
and before you come to that particularcountry and have a new kind of perspective
and you know what, it's abenefit because when you come back home to
the US, I mean, you'reas humble as can be. And if
(16:53):
you stay long enough in that particularcountry, it'll almost be like reverse culture
shock, you know, because yousee, oh my god, this is
how we are in the US,you know, because things are so simple
in these Latin American countries, especiallyCarthaenna, Colombia, you know. And
by simple I mean that locals thatyou know are Carthagen Netto's. They may
(17:14):
be all right with a plastic shareoutside with a with a crew Columbia beer
and some music, and they're havingthe time of their lives right uh.
And I say that to say this. One thing that I really admired from
my time and being in Cartagena asfar as the people, is that they
were super happy with less right AndI really admired that and that and that
(17:38):
really brings the true human spirit thatwe often lose track of here in the
US because it's so much of ago go, go do do do type
of society here that we we forget, uh that we're human and and and
to just relax, uh and behuman to others and be kind to others.
You know, when you get intoa TAXI always said Buenos da Is.
(18:02):
When I started this, I learnedthat in Cartagena when you get into
a are you when you're sitting downat a medical waiting room and there's other
people there, you say one Othe when of stars. So when I
came back and visited the US,while I was living out there, living
in Cartagena and came to visit family, you know, I believe I was
in a barber shop and I said, you know, I walked in,
said good morning, and there wasa couple people that looked at me strange.
(18:26):
You know. So those are someexamples of, you know, things
that I picked up in the humilitythat I picked up in Cartagena, Colombia.
Because honestly, my year in Cartagena, Colombia it made me more human
and I try to keep that withme U forever forever. One thing you
said I think that really hits homeis when you say, uh, you
(18:48):
know, going to another country andyou know, you hear it a million
times. People want to immerse inthe culture, and they want to learn
from the culture, and they wantto kind of pick up all these little
differences. I mean, that's that'sbeautiful, but going in with the blank
slate is also a great way toput it, a great way to really
go in there and be open toany changes that might come when you visit
(19:11):
this country. And so I thinkthat's a beautiful thing. I guess like
a follow up is, you know, traveling, especially solo travel, it's
not super common for people of colorin the US to do that. That's
something that we hear very frequently.You know that, you know for a
lot of reasons why it's very understanding. It's not as easily accessible. There
(19:33):
hasn't been that I want to say, that big of a priority in that
in that culture, and so it'svery important for people to have these experiences
to grow as a person, andit could be difficult when they don't have
the right plans to put those intoaction, right, So, do you
have any thoughts on that subject anddo you maybe do you have any advice
or words of encouragement to help otherpeople of color that you know so that
(19:56):
they can share these similar traveling experiencesthat you have had. Absolutely, it's
uh, you know, it's toughbecause first off, you have to be
exposed to travel to to really understandthe importance of travel, and I was
privileged to have my mom and dadexpose that to me. But as far
(20:17):
as people of color and especially AfricanAmericans, I mean, I have fans,
I have uncles that are just lastweek. I'm like, you know,
when are you getting your passport?And we've been talking about this for
years, you know, Uh,And you know I hate to say this,
but you can't. You can andI've heard I know you know the
same. I mean, you cantake a horse to the pond, but
(20:41):
you can't make them drink the water. You can, you can hype up
a country, you can hype upthe experience of travel. Uh. You
can provide illustrations, you can youcan show them filter photos, you can
show them videos of your trips,you can show them vlogs of your trips.
But sometimes people are just living intheir own world, and it's it's
sad to say it. And forexample, my like I told you my
(21:03):
uncle, he hasn't had his passportever in his life and he might be
what fifty two years old. Youknow, he was in the army,
went to Germany, so it's notlike he hasn't experienced it. It's just,
you know, sometimes it's just procrastination. And I say this to a
lot of fellow travelers and and andyou know buddies that I do have that
(21:25):
do travel with me, like ittakes that one time to really open your
eyes right right, and uh andhere here's another good example here. So
when I was in Cartaena, Colombia, you know, I had friends visiting
me, I had mom visiting me. So I was I was successful to
h kind of entice or persuade myfather to come visit me. Right,
(21:48):
he hadn't been he hadn't been inan international or foreign country. Uh and
maybe over maybe about twenty years sincehe was in the navy, right,
So I was able to persuade himto come, right, and I'm talking
about immersing him as well into theculture. I gave him that that that
true cart cart hinetto experience, right, and he loved it. And he
(22:11):
came back about three months later tovisit me again. And you know where
my dad is right now visiting He'sin Cartehen right now, this is probably
a life, right. He knowspeople out there, people know him out
there now, you know. Soit takes that, It takes that first
trip and again earlier, I wastalking about fear, right, and a
(22:32):
lot of times when you when youpress that that mouse, you know,
as far as paying for your flightor paying for that that airbnb, you
can't be afraid, you know,you have you have to have what what
do I have to lose? Youknow, what do I have to lose?
And speaking on fears, uh,you mentioned it as well, some
may think that, and I'm talkingabout everyone. Some may have a fear
(22:53):
of danger, especially these developing countries. Uh. Some may not known better,
you know, Some may don't somemay not want to go through the
process of researching, in booking flagsand in organizing their trip, you know,
and some some are just comfortable livingwhere they are, you know,
(23:15):
in their own world sometimes and that'sokay, that's okay. But for those
that would definitely see it, seethat there's more of a world than where
they are, it takes that exposure, uh to do that, and it
takes that first trip. First off, you brought up an interesting point.
It's kind of a gamble for peoplewho haven't had those experiences, for those
(23:38):
who don't know what they're actually missingout on. It is a lot of
effort to put in that planning tospend that money to take the time and
again that gamble to go out therefor Hey, I might I might have
a great time doing this. HeyI might, I might not. I
don't know. I could just bemore comfortable at home or you know,
going out in the area for theweekend instead, Right, I think that's
(24:00):
interesting point that I don't think I'veactually considered people actually just being scared to
risk all that time and energy toplan in order to go the authentic Columbia
experience. I remember you mentioning howyou were actually doing your own personal tours
throughout Columbia or throughout KRT Theahenna,so people could actually experience it, you
know, to the fullest, towhat you would consider the fullest. Can
(24:22):
you tell us a bit about that, Yeah, absolutely so. Normally,
when there were groups of about threeor more people, and keep in mind
we're talking about cart de Hanna,where we I remember having a lot of
Dutch or a lot of yeah,a lot of Dutch, a lot of
Germans, a lot of Americans aswell, so from all over the world.
(24:45):
So if I see a group ofthree or more, I wanted to
give them that real experience, rightfirst, off, I was a revenue
management intern and I wanted to growrevenue, whether it be short term or
long term. So as far asgrowing revenue, uh, you know,
you want to provide that experience wherea uh, someone that's against of ours
(25:08):
may come back, or they mayvery well tell their family or their friends,
you know, come to this Selinaand Cartagena. You know, that's
long term revenue right there, oror might may write a nice comment on
trip Advisor to bring somebody else tous, you know, So I would,
I would, So first off,I would take them on a nice
tour for the essentials that you mightcome to Cartagena and miss if you didn't,
(25:33):
if you didn't know, right,So first thing I would, I
would take them through the heads inmy Knee neighborhood, which is where Cardohona
is, but I'm talking about thepicturesque heads in my Knee neighborhood. So
we went round this this this picturesquealley that has beautiful murals, and I
think there's a mural there was atleast of Joe at Oyle, which is
(25:56):
a famous uh Cartagenato salsa singer know, and we went down there. We
also went and it led us tothe Plaza de Right or Trendidat Plaza,
which it's an open space. There'sstreet there's street food there, there's dancers
there, there's a there's a MichaelJackson that that doesn't Michael Jackson impressing there
(26:18):
all all the time. You canget a little yeah, yes he is,
yes he is. You get littleI mean it has that feel,
right, You get little cups ofbeer and plastic for maybe at the time
it was about fifty cents, youknow, on the streets. And then
you go down even further you seethe the street with the flags, and
it's it's even more picturesque. Yousee the famous South Side Havana or the
(26:40):
famous club Havana, which is there. So I take them through there,
and this is normally during the daytime. Uh. And then I also take
them to after that, I takehim to Parker Cindinnadio, which is pretty
much Centenario Park. And at thispark there are sloths, there are monkeys,
there are iguanas, and there arebright red or bright brown reddish squirrels
(27:04):
there. And I knew a guy, he was an unofficial guy. He
didn't work there, you know,just kind of ran across across from one
time. But his name was Roberta, right, So I would always take
my group to the park, andwhen we get to the park, I
yell Roberta, and I would yellout his name because he knew where all
the animals were, right and hehad the food to feed the animals.
(27:25):
So I would call out Robert.I wouldn't eve see him. I would
just call his name out, Robertthough. He would come out of the
woodwork, and he would take meand my group UH to feed and feed
the monkeys, uh, the squirrels, to see the iguanas, UH to
to see the sloughs as well.And you know what, oftentimes my group
would tip Roberto, you know.So it was it was it was somewhat
(27:48):
of supporting the local economy as well. And after we we went to that
park, I would also take UHand I said students. I would also
take guests through the cities, throughthe a couple of different plazas and we
would make our make our way toCafe del Mar, which is very scenic.
It is actually on a four hundredyear old wall built by the Spaniards
(28:11):
and it faces the ocean. Andif you know Carthagena, you know that
sunset is right on that ocean,and uh, you know, they're playing
nice sauside. It's they have nicedrains, good food. It's very picturesque,
you know. It's it's very romanticas well. And so we would
go there and we would walk upafter we were done sitting there having a
(28:33):
beer. And by the way,my guess, they would always take care
of beers if you know, No, Kobe, you did a lot for
us. Man, We're gonna getthis beer for you, you know,
So that that always happened. Iwas complaining about it. So we all
after that, we walked along thewall and made our way back. On
the way back, I took themto a couple more plazas, you know,
(28:55):
where they have dancing and especially themain plaza over the clock tower.
You know, it's a lot ofaction going on and it's super vibrant there.
And then make our way to Selena, you know, and and to
this day, if you go totrip Advisor, uh for Cardohenah Selena,
and you know, under the reviews, if you if you go in the
search box and the reviews, ifyou type in kolbe c O l b
(29:19):
Y, you can actually read someof those experiences they're still online. So
yeah, so that was the tour. And you know, I can imagine,
you know, our guests or thosethat I've toured around card Deogenna,
they remember this for the rest oftheir lives as well, and I know
I do, and I want toI want to share one thing too that
(29:40):
I remember. I was doing somany tours right that actual tour guides in
certain plazas, they were getting madat me. Man, they were getting
mad at me, you know.And I remember one guy he was like,
oh, you know, you don'thave a license to be a guy.
You don't have a license to bea guy. And I'm just like,
this is you know, this isinformal. You know, this is
informal, right, right, I'mnot trying to be a tour guy.
(30:02):
You don't have to worry about mebeing in a competition. But I do
remember that. But yeah, Iwanted to provide a real experience on day
one for groups of three or more. That way they have an awesome experience.
Uh and one of those one ofthose memories that they will never forget.
With Selena at the time in Cartagena, Colombia as well. So yeah,
(30:26):
very memorable. For me too.And and you know you kind of
took me back to memory lane bybringing that up. Yeah, man,
right back at you. Just hearingyou talk about the streets of Cartha Henna
like it's it's taken me back.I'm sure my listeners have heard me express
this plenty of times. But Colombiais my favorite country I've ever been to,
and I just I always recommended ifyou have a chance to go,
(30:49):
do it. I am a littlebummed that I didn't get to go on
one of your tours when I wasthere. Uh, not sure about that,
Kobe, but maybe we'll have togo back. I'll get one of
your walking toys. Right Hey,Cartagena isn't going anywhere. That's true,
man, that's awesome. I haveto ask, are you a Club Columbia
guy? Are you a poker guy? Or you a Gila guy. I'm
(31:11):
gonna tell you what. I'm definitelynot a poker guy. You know,
I'll tell you that it's not bad. Man. It took it took a
second, but I liked It's it'snot bad. I like all of them,
but Club Columbia is my favorite.You know what I'm I haven't I
have something else that I learned aboutor I was introduced to as far as
the beer, probably in the middleof my year being there. And you
(31:32):
might have seen this, but Iactually like Andina more so than Clu Colombia.
Inula, it's called Andena and it'scolorful. I believe it's a blue
can and there's like a pre Columbianastatue or figure. I think it's like
a bird or phoenix on it.It's very smooth. It has a little
bit of crisp to it. Ilike crispy beers, however, I do
(31:55):
like Clue Columbia's. And you knowwhat, if you go to those bodios.
I don't know if you know aboutthis little cheeky deep got beer,
but there's a there's a beer calledIt's uh it might be it might be
about an eight ounce beer, right, and it may be even six.
But they come in green little bottles. You normally only get them in the
neighborhoods, right, and they're verycrisp. I think they're arguing about at
(32:19):
the time they were about thirty centsthirty forty cents. They don't sell those
in their main tourist areas. Youhave to go to like a little T
and D, that little store inthe corner in a neighborhood outside of the
tourist areas. But those coasts they'rereally good too, and I highly suggest
having one if you're able, ifyou're ever outside of the tourist area.
(32:40):
Yeah, man, I mean Igotta go back, and definitely when I
do. Actually, i'll be back, possibly in January, but definitely in
March for a wedding, so I'llactually circle back with you then, you
know, off the mic and we'lljust chat about that a bit. Sounds
good. I'm supposed to be outthere in spring, so I may meet
you out there March April. Ohdude, don't even play. Let's do
it. You know to ride amotorcycle? Yeah, absolutely, absolutely,
(33:06):
let's go. Man, all right, it's good you can. You can
definitely roll with us. Then areyou in California? Need to have a
cold one asap? If so?Oak Park Brewing Company has you covered.
Located at fifteen fourteen Broadway in Sacramento, OPB is all about their ABC's art,
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so stop by if you're in Sacramentoand order one online. If you're in
(33:28):
California. To learn more about OPB, check out their website www dot opbrewco
dot com and on Instagram at Opbrewco. Cheers. Uh sweet, Okay,
So this part is for John.It's grown on me this little segment.
Because this is a travel show,we do like to set off a little
(33:49):
like rapid fire, a rapid firesegment for our listeners. There's five travel
related questions and quick succession. Answerthem to your your truestability. You ready,
all right, best dish you've everhad in a foreign country? And
what is it? All right?You know, since we're speaking to Cartaon
of Columbia, you know I lovebands. Right. It's has the it
(34:13):
has the rice, it has theground beef, it has the the chichat
own, which is porkskin. Ithas the beans, it has the maduro,
the sweet plantain. Oftentimes it alsohas a piece of I say aguacata,
but avocado. And it is justhardy. It is fulfilling, it
(34:36):
is satisfying. Uh. And youknow that's that's one of my favorite dishes
as far as internationally. I mustsay, yeah, man, the Colombian
breakfast too with the potato soup.Oh yeah, Manuela, Oh yeah,
oh yeah, let's go all right, Favorite country you've already sorry, Favorite
country that you have visited? Andwhy I'm guessing I know the answer to
this one. Okay, it ismy surprise, you actually so, favorite
(34:59):
country that I visited and why?You know what? Man, I love
Thailand. You know, I wenttwice. I went twice within seven month
span. I went in December oftwenty sixteen, and I also went back
in June of twenty seventeen. Andwhy is because, man, the people
are super friendly there. I mean, when I was walking in my hotel,
(35:22):
the receptionist status as soon as Iwalk into I could barely get in
the door. And you know,they're like sad ka sadko with the brightest,
genuine smile I've ever seen, nomatter how many times I came and
went in that hotel, and everybodywas just super helpful. And the vibrancy
of Thailand. And I know I'mspeaking generally, but I'm speaking right now
(35:45):
as far as Bangkok. I alsowent to Chang my in Bangsan Beach as
well. But the people they're justsuper friendly, you know, and it's
it's it's like a friendliness that Ihave at that point I had never seen
in my life. You know,I'm from the South, so here here
here in southern United States, wehave that Southern hospitality, but this was
(36:07):
beyond that and it made my heartfeel good and you put a smile on
my face as I was walking downthe street. You know, So I
must say Thailand. Of course,Columbia comes at a at a close to
you know pretty much too. Butyeah, to answer your question, there,
Thailand there, Max, Uh,Yeah, that was unexpected. I
thought you were just going to hitit home with Columbia. There the country
(36:30):
you would like to visit the mostthat you haven't been to, you know,
right now, I've been doing researchand kind of thinking about going to
Japan right now, and the reasonbeing is that the culture is so different
from ours, right and the historyis pretty rich as well. And I
(36:53):
don't know too many people that isthat have gone to Japan, especially,
I mean only if they were maybein a military, you know, and
and if that it might have beena few that can count on my on
my fingers, best local drink alcoholicotherwise in any country that you have visited,
you know what, I'm in lovewith Aguaanella. You know what I
(37:13):
mean. It's that it's that wateror juice from like brown sugar. I
love that they make it in Colombia, you know. And and most of
the time though, they'll make itif you go to a kind of a
neighborhood restaurant and they do the likea lunch, like a fast lunch special.
I think they call it a morsucorrientes where it comes with aella,
(37:37):
it comes with like a soup,and it also comes with the entree.
You know that that man that aganellais man is off the chain, especially
when it has the right amount oflemon. Yeah, yeah, that's I
would say I'm missing that right now. Yeah. I just love their juices
in general, dude. All right, last and most adrenaline field experience you've
(38:01):
had abroad. I know exactly whichone I have in mind, because I
think about it all the time andI'm like, WHOA, did I really
do that? So one time actually, yeah, one time in can Kun.
This was two thousand and eleven.All right, we went on the
family trip New Year's Eve and Iwent with my mom, my mom's fiance,
(38:25):
and my two brothers. Right,so we went to we did the
ATV sinote excursion. Right, Sothere were a couple there were about three
different sinots. Actually there was asmall one, a medium one, and
then a giant one, which Ithink might have been about one hundred feet
(38:46):
No, one hundred feet or more? Right, are you a one hundred
feet off the ground or one hundredfeet? Like? Why one hundred feet
from the water from the sinote fromthe gocha. So I'm twenty one at
the time, and my mom's fianceit was a thrill seeker and still is
a thrill seeker doing crazy stuff,right, and uh, you know,
(39:07):
of course I did the small sinoe, I did the medium sinoe. But
man, I was looking up thinkingabout this long this large sonote, this
long snoe there was one hundred feetor more from the water, Like do
I really want to do this?Right? So my mom's fiance egging me
on, you know, uh,and you know what I said, and
(39:29):
he went he went, you know, and and and then there was another
pro professional diver that went to Itwas only those two that went right.
So he's talking all this job like, oh, come on, man,
come on, you don't come allthis way. You didn't even do You're
not even gonna do this. SoI said, you know what, I'm
going to do it, you know. So I did it, and I
tell you what, Max, WhenI jumped, it felt like I would
never touch the water. It wasalmost like I died three times on the
(39:52):
way there, right, and it'son it's on video. I think the
video got deleted from a phone.But I'm telling you I screamed like I'd
never screamed before, the whole wayright and then, and of course I
would never do it again. Butyeah, that's that's the one right there.
It was one hundred and something feetfrom the sinoe and I went straight
down and having my you know,waving my hands as water. You know,
(40:16):
but I'm not going to do thatagain. That was in my early
twenties. I'm late my early thirtiesnow, so a different story nowadays.
I'm sure that I'm sure that videomysteriously got Yes it did. I'm not
sure what happened. Yeah, Ithink it was somebody first, like the
audio, than the whole thing,right exactly, somebody storage not even sure.
Awesome, Kobe uh Man, Iyou covered a lot. I really
(40:39):
appreciate it. It was great havingyou on the show. If our listeners
want to learn a bit more aboutyou, Where can they find you possibly
follow you? Most definitely they canfind me on Instagram the og x pat
t h e O g e xp A T. I also having the
og xpact YouTube channel. I haven'tbeen I haven't been on it a while,
(41:01):
but it does have some good contentwhen I was out there. I'm
talking about videos, so you guyscan find me there. If you have
any questions, feel free to sendme a d M. If you have
any If you're somebody, if you'relooking to go to Cartaanna, Columbia and
just you know, have some questionsspecifically about Cartaana or even Colombia in general,
feel free to reach out and I'llbe happy to help. Love it
(41:25):
And if you'd like to find outa little more about us, you could
do that by visiting our website,which is www dot g t spodcast dot
com. You can find us onInstagram or Facebook at Globetrotter's Podcast, on
Twitter at globetrot pod. Make sureyou drop us a review on Apple Podcasts
or Spotify, and if you enjoyedlistening, feel free to shoot us at
(41:47):
email Hello at gtspodcast dot com.Editing on This podcast was done by Jonathan
Otero. Thanks for listening. Untilnext time.
If you haven't heard about Oak ParkBrewing Company, let me tell you a
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(00:21):
and they ship their four packs allthroughout California. Check out their website for
more information at www dot opbrewco dotcom and on Instagram at Opbrewco. Cheers.
(00:47):
You are listening to the Globetrotter's podcast, the show dedicated to bringing you
fresh and diverse perspectives from traveling enthusiastsall over the world. I'm your host,
Max mel Gonzalez, and in ourlast episode, John spoke with Sam
good Child, a yacht racer whois competing in a solo round the world
sailing trip. If you haven't checkedout that episode, go back and give
(01:07):
it a listen. But for today'sepisode, I have someone I'm really excited
to bring a board. While backpackingin South America, I met Kobe Mays
a traveling enthusiast from Atlanta, Georgiaand expat who at the time was working
for the Salina Hostel in Cartha,Henna, Columbia. We kept in contact
once I left the hostel, andKobe was one of the first people that
really opened my eyes to the ideaof living life as an expat and more
(01:30):
importantly, what ethnocentrism in travel reallymeans. Kobe, it's great to have
you on the show. Thank you, Max, Thanks for having me and
having me on your platform. It'sa pleasure to be here. Yeah.
Man, it's always great to keepthe connection, make them and keep them
going right. Absolutely, absolutely.As I mentioned, you chose the life
of an ex pat, or maybeit was the expat life that chose you.
(01:53):
Could you clarify for our listeners whatdoes it mean to be an expat
and how did that lifestyle come ininto your life? For me, it
meant to immerse myself into a wholedifferent culture, a whole different environment setting,
and just to kind of find yourself, you know, for me personally
(02:16):
traveling, when I was starting out, when I was maybe about twelve years
old, my dad took me tothe South of Spain because My stepmother was
from Iris from Malaca, Spain,and that kind of opened mys And it
normally takes that first international trip toreally let you know that the world is
bigger than where you come from.And after that my mom started taking us
(02:40):
to Jamaica but once every two years. I was privileged to have those experiences
and going to college at Georgia StateUniversity. Actually majored in economics with a
minor in Spanish. And while Iwas going to college, I pretty much
had my own study abroad program.I was booking flys, I was booking
(03:01):
hotels, airbnbs, uh you knowthe cheap way hostels. And I went
to Cartaanna, Colombia one time andI fell in love with it. It
was cheap, the people were superfriendly. I met a I met a
beautiful woman who is now my wife. And I decided that after college,
(03:23):
I wanted to somehow work and moveto Cartagena, Colombia to enhance or master
the Spanish language. Uh So Ipacked up my bags, I left everything
behind in Atlanta, Georgia, andI did research as far as the visa
and all that good stuff there.I went to the consul in a few
(03:44):
times and uh, and the restwas history. I think there's a lot
to unpack there. Uh. Firstof all, I can't back that up
enough Carta Henna, and I meanColombia in general is just one of the
most beautiful countries. Uh, youknow, very welcoming and just were all.
It's just an experience to have ifyou're just going to backpack for you
know, a week, two weeksto eight months. You know, we've
(04:06):
all done the different lengths there.I kind of want to touch in on
that study a broad program that youpersonally put together yourself. When we previously
spoke, you mentioned that it wasactually cheaper than doing a study a broad
program through a campus or through theschool, rather that you did it yourself
and it was more beneficial. Howdid you find the motivation and what research
(04:29):
did you do to accomplish that?Well? I was motivated from previous trips
that my mom and my dad hadtaken me on. And with those whole
experiences, I kind of was privyto understanding how to book a trip,
where to look at and I hadthese different resources which I still have them,
such as secret flying and travel piratesand error affairs, things of that
(04:56):
sort, and you know, beingin class at Georgia State Universe City.
I remember having a study of broadcoordinator coming to our classroom, right and
I think it was too It mighthave been to in Italy somewhere in Europe,
and he was talking about maybe aboutI believe it's two to three thousand
dollars as far as everything included.And I'm thinking to myself, hmmm,
(05:17):
Well, when I was traveling toJamaica or with my mom or my dad,
she taught me how to find aflight for maybe about three hundred dollars,
you know at the time, uhand to uh, you know,
use these resources that I just mentioned, even if it was sky auction was
another one back then. It's it'snot as popular now where you actually bid
(05:40):
on different hotels, but we're talkingabout lodging for maybe another three or four
hundred dollars depending on your state.So I did some research and I was
able to find trips to Columbia,Cuba, went by myself, Thailand twice.
And you're talking about flights, forexample, the Thailand flight two flights.
(06:03):
I was able to find a flightfor four hundred and fifty dollars from
Houston, Texas, just had toget to Houston, Texas, you know,
and you know, you're talking aboutlodging in Thailand maybe twenty or thirty
dollars a night instead of going toItaly with your colleagues or classmates for three
thousand dollars, all right, Andas far as Cuba, going by myself,
(06:28):
I just, hey, I hadnothing to lose, you know,
I had nothing to lose. Ihad the confidence because I've been to other
places at that time, and youknow, being in the in the midst
of the minor in Spanish program atGeorgia State, it gave me a lot
more confidence because I was taking tenclasses in Georgia State University and you're talking
(06:49):
about business Spanish, you're talking aboutcritical thinking in Spanish, you're talking about
Spanish literature. So I felt prettyconfident, and you know, I just
I just went. I wasn't afraid. You know. Of course, you
got family members that say, oh, be careful, be careful, you
know, but at that point,I was only listening to anyone that went.
(07:10):
And if if you if someone toldme to be careful or it's dangerous
there and hadn't gone, you know, I was, I was telling them
or asking them, how would youknow you haven't been, you know.
So that was my attitude and it'sstill my attitude. And that was that
was that was motivating me pretty mucheverything I say that to say this,
(07:31):
I had no fear in traveling,you know, and when you're downtown Atlanta,
Georgia State, walking through the campus, walking through the vibrant city,
and it's just like the world isyours and and I know, I know
what people understand when they're when they'rein college and they have tunnel vision and
they have that fire within them,right And I had that fire within me
(07:55):
and I still do. But atthe time I had much more fire within
me. And uh hey, Ijust took risks and it has benefited me
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(08:18):
their four packs all throughout California.To learn more, check out their website
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a number of ways to become anexpat. And you spoke a bit about
how you were introduced into traveling ata young age, and I would love
(08:39):
for you, love for you towalk us through your process and why did
you choose the countries you decided tolive in and work in. So for
me, at the time, itwas twenty eighteen, I actually graduated college
August. And let's see, beforeAugust, before I even graduate, I'm
talking about March, I had startedto begin my research as far as finding
(09:01):
a job or an internship in Cartaena, Columbia. Right, so I'm on
glassdoor. Someone with a degree ineconomics were referring to revenue maximizing growth at
that point. To be honest,I would take almost not almost anything,
but you know, I would takemost things at the time. So I
did research Glassdoor. I saw Selina. I did some research. I saw
(09:26):
that they were at the time,well a pretty pretty up and coming startup
as far as hostels and hotels forthe digital nomadge your your your remote workers.
And this was before the pandemic,you know. So I took a
look at a posting on glass door. It was a revenue management intern and
(09:48):
applied and immediately got a call,had a couple of interviews with the general
manager. You know, he Iguess he liked what I was saying and
my credentials, and he hired me. Right, He's somewhat he's somewhat kind
of told me the process as faras what I needed to do to get
(10:09):
over there to actually be an internlegally in Colombia, But a lot of
it was on me as well,right. So yeah, Selena the company,
they provided some documentation or not necessarilysponsoring me, but they provided some
documentation to help me get that visa. However, on the other hand,
(10:31):
it was my responsibility to go tothe Colombian consulate in Atlanta, right,
And when I went, there wassomewhat of a disconnect between the government officials
at the consulate and what I wasbeing given from Selena, Right, So
I had to go back and fortha little bit. Actually went to the
consulate three times. By the timeI had all the documents that the consulate
(10:56):
required, right, And by thethird time I had everything they needed.
And I also had to get tobuy some insurance. I remember that as
well. For the whole entire yearI was in Cartagena, Colombia and the
insurance went that bad. I thinkit might have been about two hundred three
hundred dollars while I was out there. But that was pretty much the process
(11:18):
to get there. And once Igot there, I was supposed to kind
of register myself within the the Colombiangovernment at the time. I think I
had about two weeks to register myselfso I can get me a sedula.
Is that a visa? Like aright? Right? The sedula? It's
a it's an ID gotcha, okay, right, it's it's like you're yeah,
(11:39):
they call it a sula, Andbut I was. I had immersed
myself so much into the culture,into the word, and I ended up
not registering myself. I mean therewere no problems or anything. I just
ended up not getting a seeduler.But yeah, that pretty much was my
experience. Like I said, ittook three times to go to the consulate
(12:00):
and I use that documentation from Selenafor them to give me a visa inside
my passport. It's totally relatable hearingyou talk about having to go to the
consulate three different times because I hadvisa issues as well when I was there,
partially my fault, but also youknow, there were protests going on.
There was a whole ordeal, andI overstayed my visa and I had
(12:20):
to go back and forth to itwasn't the consulate, but some government officials.
I had to go back and fortha few times in order for them
to get it straightened out. Andeach time it was like, oh,
you forgot this paperwork. And it'slike, well, you didn't tell me
to bring that paperwork. And they'relike, all right, well you forgot
this one this time. And I'mlike, you could have just told me
all of them in the beginning andI would have brought all of them,
right. That's hilarious. So itsounds like you kind of got into the
(12:43):
Colombian pace pretty quickly. I mean, I feel like that's kind of how
they do things, and I feellike that's a great little I don't I
don't like to say the word,but segue into the next topic I wanted
to cover, you know, steeringaway from the expat life. We previously
chatted about your travels and ethnocentrism isa very important aspect of travel that continues
(13:07):
to surface, and I want tohear your thoughts on why it's so important
to you and how ethnocentrism shapes yourperspective while traveling. And I can clarify
for our listeners, ethnocentrism is theevaluation of other cultures by comparing them to
your own culture or customs, andso in that sense, it's really in
(13:28):
short, becoming immersed and really acceptinga culture when traveling. Absolutely, And
what ethnocentrism means to me is it'spretty much the belief that your own culture
is correct in normal and all othercultures are maybe indifferent or strange, right,
and ethnocentris excuse me, ethno centrismis to me, it's it's mindfulness,
(13:52):
it's it's awareness when you're traveling.And a lot of times, especially
for those that might have been livingin the US for almost all their lives,
uh, it may not come acrossuh you know, because you've been
so accustomed to certain customs and anduh in different societal norms in your particular
country that you might not think aboutit. But I think it's really important
(14:16):
when you do travel internationally, especiallythat you you kind of come with a
clean slate, right, because you'rein a different setting with different rules,
different lifestyle, and if you tryto bring your own customs and and especially
thinking that they're they're they're normal,and any other customer is wrong. You
(14:39):
may not have a great experience andand it may be some sort of disrespect
towards those the locals, uh,you know where you are. And for
me, for example, when Ifirst got into Cartagena, Colombian, I'm
guilty of ethnocentrism. Uh, you'reyou know, I'm wearing my jewelry.
I'm I'm I'm talking about my necklace. I'm not I'm not you know,
(15:00):
no, you know, going crazywith you know, dimons or anything like
that. I'm talking about a simplesilver necklace, you know, or a
watch and then Victor watch. Youknow, I'm wearing that in the streets.
And my girlfriend at the time,she's telling me, oh, you
know, make sure you take thatoff once we get out the tourist areas.
And my ethno centrism at the timetold me, man, nobody's gonna
(15:24):
mess with me. Man, nobody'sgonna mess with me. It's okay,
you know, I wear this alltime. Anyone's gonna mess with me,
you know. And then as Istarted to live there a little bit longer,
I understood what my girlfriend was talkingabout. And eventually I did start
to take that watch off or thatsilver necklace off. And another example is
having your phone out. Right now, you may know this too, Max,
(15:45):
I'm not talking about just in thetourists area, but outside the tourist
area, excuse me, outside thetourists areas of Latin American countries, not
not just Colombia, but we're talkingall over. Having your phone out is
a danger. It's a big danger, right. No matter how accustomed you
are of having your phone in thestreets of you know, here in the
(16:07):
US for fifteen something years, youknow, it's it's very dangerous and you
could have yourself in a sticky situationif you have your phone out, you
know you here, well not here, but in Colombia they say there's a
there's a phrase, and I'm sureyou've heard of this. It's called no
dara papaya, right, and prettymuch it means don't get don't put a
(16:29):
target on your back, you know. So overall, ethnocentrism is, you
know, you should leave that athome before you come to the country,
and before you come to that particularcountry and have a new kind of perspective
and you know what, it's abenefit because when you come back home to
the US, I mean, you'reas humble as can be. And if
(16:53):
you stay long enough in that particularcountry, it'll almost be like reverse culture
shock, you know, because yousee, oh my god, this is
how we are in the US,you know, because things are so simple
in these Latin American countries, especiallyCarthaenna, Colombia, you know. And
by simple I mean that locals thatyou know are Carthagen Netto's. They may
(17:14):
be all right with a plastic shareoutside with a with a crew Columbia beer
and some music, and they're havingthe time of their lives right uh.
And I say that to say this. One thing that I really admired from
my time and being in Cartagena asfar as the people, is that they
were super happy with less right AndI really admired that and that and that
(17:38):
really brings the true human spirit thatwe often lose track of here in the
US because it's so much of ago go, go do do do type
of society here that we we forget, uh that we're human and and and
to just relax, uh and behuman to others and be kind to others.
You know, when you get intoa TAXI always said Buenos da Is.
(18:02):
When I started this, I learnedthat in Cartagena when you get into
a are you when you're sitting downat a medical waiting room and there's other
people there, you say one Othe when of stars. So when I
came back and visited the US,while I was living out there, living
in Cartagena and came to visit family, you know, I believe I was
in a barber shop and I said, you know, I walked in,
said good morning, and there wasa couple people that looked at me strange.
(18:26):
You know. So those are someexamples of, you know, things
that I picked up in the humilitythat I picked up in Cartagena, Colombia.
Because honestly, my year in Cartagena, Colombia it made me more human
and I try to keep that withme U forever forever. One thing you
said I think that really hits homeis when you say, uh, you
(18:48):
know, going to another country andyou know, you hear it a million
times. People want to immerse inthe culture, and they want to learn
from the culture, and they wantto kind of pick up all these little
differences. I mean, that's that'sbeautiful, but going in with the blank
slate is also a great way toput it, a great way to really
go in there and be open toany changes that might come when you visit
(19:11):
this country. And so I thinkthat's a beautiful thing. I guess like
a follow up is, you know, traveling, especially solo travel, it's
not super common for people of colorin the US to do that. That's
something that we hear very frequently.You know that, you know for a
lot of reasons why it's very understanding. It's not as easily accessible. There
(19:33):
hasn't been that I want to say, that big of a priority in that
in that culture, and so it'svery important for people to have these experiences
to grow as a person, andit could be difficult when they don't have
the right plans to put those intoaction, right, So, do you
have any thoughts on that subject anddo you maybe do you have any advice
or words of encouragement to help otherpeople of color that you know so that
(19:56):
they can share these similar traveling experiencesthat you have had. Absolutely, it's
uh, you know, it's toughbecause first off, you have to be
exposed to travel to to really understandthe importance of travel, and I was
privileged to have my mom and dadexpose that to me. But as far
(20:17):
as people of color and especially AfricanAmericans, I mean, I have fans,
I have uncles that are just lastweek. I'm like, you know,
when are you getting your passport?And we've been talking about this for
years, you know, Uh,And you know I hate to say this,
but you can't. You can andI've heard I know you know the
same. I mean, you cantake a horse to the pond, but
(20:41):
you can't make them drink the water. You can, you can hype up
a country, you can hype upthe experience of travel. Uh. You
can provide illustrations, you can youcan show them filter photos, you can
show them videos of your trips,you can show them vlogs of your trips.
But sometimes people are just living intheir own world, and it's it's
sad to say it. And forexample, my like I told you my
(21:03):
uncle, he hasn't had his passportever in his life and he might be
what fifty two years old. Youknow, he was in the army,
went to Germany, so it's notlike he hasn't experienced it. It's just,
you know, sometimes it's just procrastination. And I say this to a
lot of fellow travelers and and andyou know buddies that I do have that
(21:25):
do travel with me, like ittakes that one time to really open your
eyes right right, and uh andhere here's another good example here. So
when I was in Cartaena, Colombia, you know, I had friends visiting
me, I had mom visiting me. So I was I was successful to
h kind of entice or persuade myfather to come visit me. Right,
(21:48):
he hadn't been he hadn't been inan international or foreign country. Uh and
maybe over maybe about twenty years sincehe was in the navy, right,
So I was able to persuade himto come, right, and I'm talking
about immersing him as well into theculture. I gave him that that that
true cart cart hinetto experience, right, and he loved it. And he
(22:11):
came back about three months later tovisit me again. And you know where
my dad is right now visiting He'sin Cartehen right now, this is probably
a life, right. He knowspeople out there, people know him out
there now, you know. Soit takes that, It takes that first
trip and again earlier, I wastalking about fear, right, and a
(22:32):
lot of times when you when youpress that that mouse, you know,
as far as paying for your flightor paying for that that airbnb, you
can't be afraid, you know,you have you have to have what what
do I have to lose? Youknow, what do I have to lose?
And speaking on fears, uh,you mentioned it as well, some
may think that, and I'm talkingabout everyone. Some may have a fear
(22:53):
of danger, especially these developing countries. Uh. Some may not known better,
you know, Some may don't somemay not want to go through the
process of researching, in booking flagsand in organizing their trip, you know,
and some some are just comfortable livingwhere they are, you know,
(23:15):
in their own world sometimes and that'sokay, that's okay. But for those
that would definitely see it, seethat there's more of a world than where
they are, it takes that exposure, uh to do that, and it
takes that first trip. First off, you brought up an interesting point.
It's kind of a gamble for peoplewho haven't had those experiences, for those
(23:38):
who don't know what they're actually missingout on. It is a lot of
effort to put in that planning tospend that money to take the time and
again that gamble to go out therefor Hey, I might I might have
a great time doing this. HeyI might, I might not. I
don't know. I could just bemore comfortable at home or you know,
going out in the area for theweekend instead, Right, I think that's
(24:00):
interesting point that I don't think I'veactually considered people actually just being scared to
risk all that time and energy toplan in order to go the authentic Columbia
experience. I remember you mentioning howyou were actually doing your own personal tours
throughout Columbia or throughout KRT Theahenna,so people could actually experience it, you
know, to the fullest, towhat you would consider the fullest. Can
(24:22):
you tell us a bit about that, Yeah, absolutely so. Normally,
when there were groups of about threeor more people, and keep in mind
we're talking about cart de Hanna,where we I remember having a lot of
Dutch or a lot of yeah,a lot of Dutch, a lot of
Germans, a lot of Americans aswell, so from all over the world.
(24:45):
So if I see a group ofthree or more, I wanted to
give them that real experience, rightfirst, off, I was a revenue
management intern and I wanted to growrevenue, whether it be short term or
long term. So as far asgrowing revenue, uh, you know,
you want to provide that experience wherea uh, someone that's against of ours
(25:08):
may come back, or they mayvery well tell their family or their friends,
you know, come to this Selinaand Cartagena. You know, that's
long term revenue right there, oror might may write a nice comment on
trip Advisor to bring somebody else tous, you know, So I would,
I would, So first off,I would take them on a nice
tour for the essentials that you mightcome to Cartagena and miss if you didn't,
(25:33):
if you didn't know, right,So first thing I would, I
would take them through the heads inmy Knee neighborhood, which is where Cardohona
is, but I'm talking about thepicturesque heads in my Knee neighborhood. So
we went round this this this picturesquealley that has beautiful murals, and I
think there's a mural there was atleast of Joe at Oyle, which is
(25:56):
a famous uh Cartagenato salsa singer know, and we went down there. We
also went and it led us tothe Plaza de Right or Trendidat Plaza,
which it's an open space. There'sstreet there's street food there, there's dancers
there, there's a there's a MichaelJackson that that doesn't Michael Jackson impressing there
(26:18):
all all the time. You canget a little yeah, yes he is,
yes he is. You get littleI mean it has that feel,
right, You get little cups ofbeer and plastic for maybe at the time
it was about fifty cents, youknow, on the streets. And then
you go down even further you seethe the street with the flags, and
it's it's even more picturesque. Yousee the famous South Side Havana or the
(26:40):
famous club Havana, which is there. So I take them through there,
and this is normally during the daytime. Uh. And then I also take
them to after that, I takehim to Parker Cindinnadio, which is pretty
much Centenario Park. And at thispark there are sloths, there are monkeys,
there are iguanas, and there arebright red or bright brown reddish squirrels
(27:04):
there. And I knew a guy, he was an unofficial guy. He
didn't work there, you know,just kind of ran across across from one
time. But his name was Roberta, right, So I would always take
my group to the park, andwhen we get to the park, I
yell Roberta, and I would yellout his name because he knew where all
the animals were, right and hehad the food to feed the animals.
(27:25):
So I would call out Robert.I wouldn't eve see him. I would
just call his name out, Robertthough. He would come out of the
woodwork, and he would take meand my group UH to feed and feed
the monkeys, uh, the squirrels, to see the iguanas, UH to
to see the sloughs as well.And you know what, oftentimes my group
would tip Roberto, you know.So it was it was it was somewhat
(27:48):
of supporting the local economy as well. And after we we went to that
park, I would also take UHand I said students. I would also
take guests through the cities, throughthe a couple of different plazas and we
would make our make our way toCafe del Mar, which is very scenic.
It is actually on a four hundredyear old wall built by the Spaniards
(28:11):
and it faces the ocean. Andif you know Carthagena, you know that
sunset is right on that ocean,and uh, you know, they're playing
nice sauside. It's they have nicedrains, good food. It's very picturesque,
you know. It's it's very romanticas well. And so we would
go there and we would walk upafter we were done sitting there having a
(28:33):
beer. And by the way,my guess, they would always take care
of beers if you know, No, Kobe, you did a lot for
us. Man, We're gonna getthis beer for you, you know,
So that that always happened. Iwas complaining about it. So we all
after that, we walked along thewall and made our way back. On
the way back, I took themto a couple more plazas, you know,
(28:55):
where they have dancing and especially themain plaza over the clock tower.
You know, it's a lot ofaction going on and it's super vibrant there.
And then make our way to Selena, you know, and and to
this day, if you go totrip Advisor, uh for Cardohenah Selena,
and you know, under the reviews, if you if you go in the
search box and the reviews, ifyou type in kolbe c O l b
(29:19):
Y, you can actually read someof those experiences they're still online. So
yeah, so that was the tour. And you know, I can imagine,
you know, our guests or thosethat I've toured around card Deogenna,
they remember this for the rest oftheir lives as well, and I know
I do, and I want toI want to share one thing too that
(29:40):
I remember. I was doing somany tours right that actual tour guides in
certain plazas, they were getting madat me. Man, they were getting
mad at me, you know.And I remember one guy he was like,
oh, you know, you don'thave a license to be a guy.
You don't have a license to bea guy. And I'm just like,
this is you know, this isinformal. You know, this is
informal, right, right, I'mnot trying to be a tour guy.
(30:02):
You don't have to worry about mebeing in a competition. But I do
remember that. But yeah, Iwanted to provide a real experience on day
one for groups of three or more. That way they have an awesome experience.
Uh and one of those one ofthose memories that they will never forget.
With Selena at the time in Cartagena, Colombia as well. So yeah,
(30:26):
very memorable. For me too.And and you know you kind of
took me back to memory lane bybringing that up. Yeah, man,
right back at you. Just hearingyou talk about the streets of Cartha Henna
like it's it's taken me back.I'm sure my listeners have heard me express
this plenty of times. But Colombiais my favorite country I've ever been to,
and I just I always recommended ifyou have a chance to go,
(30:49):
do it. I am a littlebummed that I didn't get to go on
one of your tours when I wasthere. Uh, not sure about that,
Kobe, but maybe we'll have togo back. I'll get one of
your walking toys. Right Hey,Cartagena isn't going anywhere. That's true,
man, that's awesome. I haveto ask, are you a Club Columbia
guy? Are you a poker guy? Or you a Gila guy. I'm
(31:11):
gonna tell you what. I'm definitelynot a poker guy. You know,
I'll tell you that it's not bad. Man. It took it took a
second, but I liked It's it'snot bad. I like all of them,
but Club Columbia is my favorite.You know what I'm I haven't I
have something else that I learned aboutor I was introduced to as far as
the beer, probably in the middleof my year being there. And you
(31:32):
might have seen this, but Iactually like Andina more so than Clu Colombia.
Inula, it's called Andena and it'scolorful. I believe it's a blue
can and there's like a pre Columbianastatue or figure. I think it's like
a bird or phoenix on it.It's very smooth. It has a little
bit of crisp to it. Ilike crispy beers, however, I do
(31:55):
like Clue Columbia's. And you knowwhat, if you go to those bodios.
I don't know if you know aboutthis little cheeky deep got beer,
but there's a there's a beer calledIt's uh it might be it might be
about an eight ounce beer, right, and it may be even six.
But they come in green little bottles. You normally only get them in the
neighborhoods, right, and they're verycrisp. I think they're arguing about at
(32:19):
the time they were about thirty centsthirty forty cents. They don't sell those
in their main tourist areas. Youhave to go to like a little T
and D, that little store inthe corner in a neighborhood outside of the
tourist areas. But those coasts they'rereally good too, and I highly suggest
having one if you're able, ifyou're ever outside of the tourist area.
(32:40):
Yeah, man, I mean Igotta go back, and definitely when I
do. Actually, i'll be back, possibly in January, but definitely in
March for a wedding, so I'llactually circle back with you then, you
know, off the mic and we'lljust chat about that a bit. Sounds
good. I'm supposed to be outthere in spring, so I may meet
you out there March April. Ohdude, don't even play. Let's do
it. You know to ride amotorcycle? Yeah, absolutely, absolutely,
(33:06):
let's go. Man, all right, it's good you can. You can
definitely roll with us. Then areyou in California? Need to have a
cold one asap? If so?Oak Park Brewing Company has you covered.
Located at fifteen fourteen Broadway in Sacramento, OPB is all about their ABC's art,
beer and community. They also shiptheir four packs all throughout California,
so stop by if you're in Sacramentoand order one online. If you're in
(33:28):
California. To learn more about OPB, check out their website www dot opbrewco
dot com and on Instagram at Opbrewco. Cheers. Uh sweet, Okay,
So this part is for John.It's grown on me this little segment.
Because this is a travel show,we do like to set off a little
(33:49):
like rapid fire, a rapid firesegment for our listeners. There's five travel
related questions and quick succession. Answerthem to your your truestability. You ready,
all right, best dish you've everhad in a foreign country? And
what is it? All right?You know, since we're speaking to Cartaon
of Columbia, you know I lovebands. Right. It's has the it
(34:13):
has the rice, it has theground beef, it has the the chichat
own, which is porkskin. Ithas the beans, it has the maduro,
the sweet plantain. Oftentimes it alsohas a piece of I say aguacata,
but avocado. And it is justhardy. It is fulfilling, it
(34:36):
is satisfying. Uh. And youknow that's that's one of my favorite dishes
as far as internationally. I mustsay, yeah, man, the Colombian
breakfast too with the potato soup.Oh yeah, Manuela, Oh yeah,
oh yeah, let's go all right, Favorite country you've already sorry, Favorite
country that you have visited? Andwhy I'm guessing I know the answer to
this one. Okay, it ismy surprise, you actually so, favorite
(34:59):
country that I visited and why?You know what? Man, I love
Thailand. You know, I wenttwice. I went twice within seven month
span. I went in December oftwenty sixteen, and I also went back
in June of twenty seventeen. Andwhy is because, man, the people
are super friendly there. I mean, when I was walking in my hotel,
(35:22):
the receptionist status as soon as Iwalk into I could barely get in
the door. And you know,they're like sad ka sadko with the brightest,
genuine smile I've ever seen, nomatter how many times I came and
went in that hotel, and everybodywas just super helpful. And the vibrancy
of Thailand. And I know I'mspeaking generally, but I'm speaking right now
(35:45):
as far as Bangkok. I alsowent to Chang my in Bangsan Beach as
well. But the people they're justsuper friendly, you know, and it's
it's it's like a friendliness that Ihave at that point I had never seen
in my life. You know,I'm from the South, so here here
here in southern United States, wehave that Southern hospitality, but this was
(36:07):
beyond that and it made my heartfeel good and you put a smile on
my face as I was walking downthe street. You know, So I
must say Thailand. Of course,Columbia comes at a at a close to
you know pretty much too. Butyeah, to answer your question, there,
Thailand there, Max, Uh,Yeah, that was unexpected. I
thought you were just going to hitit home with Columbia. There the country
(36:30):
you would like to visit the mostthat you haven't been to, you know,
right now, I've been doing researchand kind of thinking about going to
Japan right now, and the reasonbeing is that the culture is so different
from ours, right and the historyis pretty rich as well. And I
(36:53):
don't know too many people that isthat have gone to Japan, especially,
I mean only if they were maybein a military, you know, and
and if that it might have beena few that can count on my on
my fingers, best local drink alcoholicotherwise in any country that you have visited,
you know what, I'm in lovewith Aguaanella. You know what I
(37:13):
mean. It's that it's that wateror juice from like brown sugar. I
love that they make it in Colombia, you know. And and most of
the time though, they'll make itif you go to a kind of a
neighborhood restaurant and they do the likea lunch, like a fast lunch special.
I think they call it a morsucorrientes where it comes with aella,
(37:37):
it comes with like a soup,and it also comes with the entree.
You know that that man that aganellais man is off the chain, especially
when it has the right amount oflemon. Yeah, yeah, that's I
would say I'm missing that right now. Yeah. I just love their juices
in general, dude. All right, last and most adrenaline field experience you've
(38:01):
had abroad. I know exactly whichone I have in mind, because I
think about it all the time andI'm like, WHOA, did I really
do that? So one time actually, yeah, one time in can Kun.
This was two thousand and eleven.All right, we went on the
family trip New Year's Eve and Iwent with my mom, my mom's fiance,
(38:25):
and my two brothers. Right,so we went to we did the
ATV sinote excursion. Right, Sothere were a couple there were about three
different sinots. Actually there was asmall one, a medium one, and
then a giant one, which Ithink might have been about one hundred feet
(38:46):
No, one hundred feet or more? Right, are you a one hundred
feet off the ground or one hundredfeet? Like? Why one hundred feet
from the water from the sinote fromthe gocha. So I'm twenty one at
the time, and my mom's fianceit was a thrill seeker and still is
a thrill seeker doing crazy stuff,right, and uh, you know,
(39:07):
of course I did the small sinoe, I did the medium sinoe. But
man, I was looking up thinkingabout this long this large sonote, this
long snoe there was one hundred feetor more from the water, Like do
I really want to do this?Right? So my mom's fiance egging me
on, you know, uh,and you know what I said, and
(39:29):
he went he went, you know, and and and then there was another
pro professional diver that went to Itwas only those two that went right.
So he's talking all this job like, oh, come on, man,
come on, you don't come allthis way. You didn't even do You're
not even gonna do this. SoI said, you know what, I'm
going to do it, you know. So I did it, and I
tell you what, Max, WhenI jumped, it felt like I would
never touch the water. It wasalmost like I died three times on the
(39:52):
way there, right, and it'son it's on video. I think the
video got deleted from a phone.But I'm telling you I screamed like I'd
never screamed before, the whole wayright and then, and of course I
would never do it again. Butyeah, that's that's the one right there.
It was one hundred and something feetfrom the sinoe and I went straight
down and having my you know,waving my hands as water. You know,
(40:16):
but I'm not going to do thatagain. That was in my early
twenties. I'm late my early thirtiesnow, so a different story nowadays.
I'm sure that I'm sure that videomysteriously got Yes it did. I'm not
sure what happened. Yeah, Ithink it was somebody first, like the
audio, than the whole thing,right exactly, somebody storage not even sure.
Awesome, Kobe uh Man, Iyou covered a lot. I really
(40:39):
appreciate it. It was great havingyou on the show. If our listeners
want to learn a bit more aboutyou, Where can they find you possibly
follow you? Most definitely they canfind me on Instagram the og x pat
t h e O g e xp A T. I also having the
og xpact YouTube channel. I haven'tbeen I haven't been on it a while,
(41:01):
but it does have some good contentwhen I was out there. I'm
talking about videos, so you guyscan find me there. If you have
any questions, feel free to sendme a d M. If you have
any If you're somebody, if you'relooking to go to Cartaanna, Columbia and
just you know, have some questionsspecifically about Cartaana or even Colombia in general,
feel free to reach out and I'llbe happy to help. Love it
(41:25):
And if you'd like to find outa little more about us, you could
do that by visiting our website,which is www dot g t spodcast dot
com. You can find us onInstagram or Facebook at Globetrotter's Podcast, on
Twitter at globetrot pod. Make sureyou drop us a review on Apple Podcasts
or Spotify, and if you enjoyedlistening, feel free to shoot us at
(41:47):
email Hello at gtspodcast dot com.Editing on This podcast was done by Jonathan
Otero. Thanks for listening. Untilnext time.
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