September 2, 2025 • 27 mins
Christian ; Follower of GOD Servant of CHRIST
Decorated Combat VeteranCorporate; U.S. Marine Corps Urban Warfare Instrictor;
S.R.T. Commander Active Shooter Response Team
Law Enforcement Los Angeles Police (L.A.P.D.) Police Officer / Fugitive Recovery
F.B.I. Instructor N.R.A Instructor
Competition Shooter; Multi Time State Rifle Pistol Champion
Hunting; Life Long Hunter Proffessional Hunter and Guide
Private Security Contractor; Several Agencies, Current.
GOD Provides / JESUS Saves
Become a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/gunfighter-life-survival-guns-tactical-hunting--4187306/support.
Have a Blessed Day
Decorated Combat VeteranCorporate; U.S. Marine Corps Urban Warfare Instrictor;
S.R.T. Commander Active Shooter Response Team
Law Enforcement Los Angeles Police (L.A.P.D.) Police Officer / Fugitive Recovery
F.B.I. Instructor N.R.A Instructor
Competition Shooter; Multi Time State Rifle Pistol Champion
Hunting; Life Long Hunter Proffessional Hunter and Guide
Private Security Contractor; Several Agencies, Current.
GOD Provides / JESUS Saves
Become a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/gunfighter-life-survival-guns-tactical-hunting--4187306/support.
Have a Blessed Day
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
The nine millimeter as a survival caliber. That's what we're
gonna talk about today. We all probably know that the
nine millimeter is the de facto standard defensive handgun caliber
of our day, really no disputing that. Like it or not,
it just is. But what about for survival in a
(00:23):
broader sense? How do we maximize the potential of the
nine millimeter to make it more versatile? That's we're gonna
talk about today On Gunfighter Life the podcast, we talk
about guns, tactics, ballistics, gun adjacent stuff the right way,
with all Mighty God at the center, Biblical Judaeo Christian values,
(00:43):
real world firsthand experience, and bless to serve you as host.
Bio bullet points in the show notes. Welcome, hopefully, welcome
back gunfighters and gun enthusiasts, maybe just gun curious. What's up?
Let's talk about the nine millimeter. Okay, you might think
(01:06):
this simple topic. It is not. I have a bunch
of notes on this, but about this quite a bit.
I if you don't know, I've talked about it before. I
moved to nine millimeter, long before it was the hot thing,
when everybody was saying you got to have a forty
and you got to have a forty five, and for
a time I fell into that caliber trap myself a
caliber warrior carrying a forty five on duty four times
(01:29):
later on where I still would for specific missions like
carrying an M forty five a one. But even back
when everybody was saying it's got to be a forty
year bigger, I started getting in competition shooting and actually
shooting on targets for time, and I thought, no, the
nine millimeter is where it is. It's the best balance,
and I moved to that. Even when I was in
(01:50):
one of my immediate circle I knew of that was
shooting nine milimeter on duty made the most sense, I think,
and this was long before the FBI went back to it.
I think that's largely what the rest of the gun
culture has seen. There's still a few caliber warriors out there,
but for the vast majority of people that they realize
nine millimeter makes the most sense, and it certainly does
(02:11):
for a general general. There are outliers so settled down
general recommendation for what a man should carry on his
hip nine millimeter semi automatic magazine fed strong side hip,
preferably with an optic A full size man size fighting
handgun for the nine millimeter shines not going to debate
(02:33):
all the different you know this versus that I'm gonna
try to get you to put down the glock cool
aid today doesn't really matter. Carrying a full sized fighting
handgun strong side hip is the best option for the
vast majority of people in modern society. You haven't been neutered,
(02:54):
so you can't carry one now for that the nine millimeter.
One of the reasons it's so good today is the
advancements in defensive handgun ammunition technology. Largely those were for
law enforcement in a full sized fighting handgun. And one
of the reasons, I one of several, but one of
the reasons is because much of the really good defensive
(03:18):
handgun ammunition of today was developed for a full sized
fighting handgun, not for a little baby hashtag me to
pocket gun, but a full size fighting handgun. That ammunition
is good, and it does well, and it does expand
most of the time, the vast majority of the time.
Nothing is one hundred percent in ballistics, but really good
(03:39):
go to defensive ammunition. So that's what we're going to
talk about. First, really good, street proven, modern hollowpoint ammunition
for a full sized fighting handgun, then whole done several
Nerd out episodes on these, but the big ones Spear Gold, Dot, Federal, HST,
Winchester Ranger. It's one of my favorite go to is
(04:01):
that in the Spear Gold, Lot, Remington, Golden Saber, Hornity,
critical Duty. Any of these really good ones, and there
are others, right, this is not an exhaustive list, but
get one that's proven, that street proven, that's used and
well known, will be able to get in a year
or two so you don't always have to constantly change
(04:21):
out your ammo. The next latest and greatest. It's a
game changer, does greame changer revolutionary. Nothing really revolutionary about
the nine milimeter. It's been around over one hundred years,
older than the forty five ACP. When you claim something
is revolutionary and a game changer, that's probably a pretty
big red flag. None of this crazy off the rails
experimental ammo, good street proven, modern hollow point designs. But
(04:46):
in that ammunition it's a good viable self defense option.
Pick one of those for your good go to fighting
handing them. That's the number one thing you're gonna use
nine millimeter for. That's the main reason nine millimeter is
so popular. And then I've pushed for a long time,
get a training round that matches point of aim, point
of impact, recoil, impulse, feeding dimensions, your defensive AMMO. Be
(05:11):
the guy that carries one hundred and forty seven grain
plus P plus P plus plus. But you shoot one
hundred and fifteen grain Winchester whitebox, nothing wrong. One hundred
and fifteen graand Winchester Whitebox is a standard range fodder.
It's probably not gonna shoot the same point of aim,
point of impact as you're one hundred and forty seven
grain plus P plus plus. Right, get and the whole
(05:33):
point of shooting is to hit where you're aiming at,
hopefully not just to make noise. Your practice AMMO needs
to match your training AMO. I'm not gonna say for
everything all the time. Right, if you're practicing TQB tactics
at you know, inside of three yards, the difference is academic.
But if you're actually doing like well aimed fire, it's
not academic. You need to hit where you're aiming. Talked
(05:53):
about this at nausea. But if you don't think it's
important to hit where you're aiming, you're probably listening to
the wrong podcast. Get a training am that matches your
defensive AMMO, point of am point of impact, feeding dimensions,
so you know that it actually works in your gun.
You can have a really good, high quality gun and
a really good, high quality hollow point that doesn't feed
in that gun. Another wrong with the gun, that's wrong
with the AMMO. It just doesn't pair well. Just like relationships,
(06:16):
you could have a decent, high quality good woman and
a good, you know, moral based Christian man. That doesn't
mean that they're gonna go well together. If there's anything
inherently other than the relation of the fall wrong with
either person, they just they're just not a good match.
(06:36):
The same can happen with handguns and holow points or
handguns and certain kinds of ammunition. So make sure it matches,
make sure it feeds, make sure it hits where you're aiming.
That's the big bulk of the things that I millimeter.
I've talked about that at nausea. This is just a
brief flyover of that that's important. Now, this is about survival. Now,
that is part of survival, right, protecting yourself and others.
(06:58):
You shall love your neighbor as yourself. If you would
protect your own life. Want to feel the same conviction
to defend your neighbor's life. Right? All these people are like, oh,
I just carry on for me. If there's a mas shooting,
I'm just gonna leave. I'm not going to sit here.
And that's not me. I'm a man. I've made kind
(07:21):
of lifelong careers out of protecting myself and others. I'm
not that dude. You're in a movie theater, somebody starts shooting,
dropping old ladies, little kids, and like, well, I'm just
gonna leave. It's not Are you your brother's keeper? Right?
You should be willing to defend other people's lives at
the risk of your own life. Right. If that's not you, again,
(07:43):
you're probably listening to the wrong podcast. Jesus laid down
his life even for people that hated him, reviled him,
and spit on him. Willing to put your life on
the line for other people? Go listen to another podcast, anyway.
That was just a tangent. I don't know where that anyway,
Let's get back on topic. Just not a big fan
of cowardly men. Where was I? Oh, the duality of survival.
(08:07):
I've talked about this before. There's two parts of survival, right,
protecting yourself and providing for yourself and others. You look
at my bio in the show notes military decorated combat
veteran a few times over two branch to the Armed Service,
LAPD work in some of the crazy assignments and some
of the nastiest streets in the country, private contracting. I've
(08:32):
been in quite a few violent encounters where life was
on the line, mine and other people's, as you might imagine,
take me a while to tally those up, and to
be honest, I don't want to, but even that over
twenty years in doing those sort of things, not shying
away from risky situations, in fact, oftentimes putting myself in them,
(08:54):
it pales in comparison to the number of times I've
had to eat period. I also do quite a bit
of hunting. I've been a professional guide, professional hunter. What
is a professional hunter, just like anything else professional, Well,
a hobbyist hunter pays to go hunting. A professional hunter
gets paid to go hunting, calling animals, maintaining herds, guiding
(09:18):
other people. I've been blessed to do all that. That
is part of survival. Now, normally you go to the
store and get food. That's great. I go to the
store and get food. But just picking a part of
chicken carcass we got, I don't know some store like
when you buy the whole chickens. It's easy, it's convenient,
(09:38):
I get it. But what if go with me here?
What if you can't? What if there are no stores open?
What if there is no food at the store. But
about a world like that, can you put food on
the table. That's part of survival. Now, I'm here to
(10:00):
tell you nine millimeter is not great for that. It's
not great for that. It's not great for that. I
don't care who says that it is. It's not. And
this is coming from somebody that has done been blessed
to do a ton of handgun hunting. I do that
because it's a challenge to do that, because it's hard
to do that, because it's a personal test of my
skill that makes it way harder than hunting with a
rifle or a shotgun. I would consider it more a challenge.
(10:25):
That's not what I want when I'm in a survival scenario.
I have been blessed to take deer with an all
manner of game with nine forty forty five and I can't.
I've certainly and dropped a bunch of nison with nine
millimeter forty forty five. I've also taken small game squirrel, rabbit,
(10:48):
beaver with nine millimeter. It's hard, though it will work,
it's hard. It's not ideal for that I'm talking about
in a handgun. I often tell people, whatever caliber you
have within reason right, whatever distance you can reliably put
that round in like a paper plate, that's your ethical
(11:09):
distance for a nine millimeter for something like a deer,
I would not say a pipeplate. I would say something
like a silver dollar. For those of you that are young,
I have never seen a silver dollar picture up a
teat lady's bald fist about that size. It's about the size.
I think it's ethical with a nine millimeters with a handgun.
For deer, you can spot and stalk up behind them.
(11:30):
They don't know you're there, and you shoot them right
worthy spine meets the base of the skull. That's a
tiny target. You shoot them other places and they will die.
But the whole point you're shooting them is to eat them.
A survival situation, you might not have two days to
track a wounded deer, so you may expend more calories
than you have and you may die in the process.
So nine milimeters in a hang on not ideal for that. Now,
(11:52):
I'm not here to tell you have to pick one
forty seven grains. I personally like one forty seven grains,
and it's partially for this reason. Partially because going back
to earlier, no matter how great and fancy new technology
hollow points are, they don't always expand weird things can happen.
I get hit a bone in a weird random angle
and start a tumble or whatever, and if it's pre
clogged with some kind of elastomer or plastic or polymer tip,
(12:13):
something could happen where it doesn't expand in that case,
I think truncated cone bullets, flat pointed truncated cones do
better ballistically even when they don't expand, similar to an
old semi wad cutter. Think that's a better design than
a round nose bullet for terminal performance, the performance inside
the target. For that reason, I generally standardize on one
(12:35):
forty sevens now. Again, going back to that training amo
point of a point of impact a heavy for caliber
truncated cone, flat pointed bullet is not the worst for this.
Back to one of the best choices for this. So
if you settle on one forty seven four defense and
you practice with one forty seven's like a something I
commonly do, a one forty seven grain spear Lawman and
a one forty seven grain spear gold Lot or gold
(12:56):
Dot G two, it's a pretty good pairing and four hunting,
let's say small medium game. You're not going to destroy
a bunch of meat with a one forty seven grain
truncated cone, and you're also not going to suffer from
lack of penetration you might with some lighter options one
(13:19):
hundred and forty seven grain truncated cone if you're hunting
it's a medium sized game. Again, it's not great, but
for a nine millimeter it's probably one of the best.
One of the reasons I prefer. Now, I'm not telling
you if you want to carry one fifteen's all the time,
you're wrong. You certainly can't, and they're certainly generally more
available and affordable. Nine millimeter is available in more platforms
(13:42):
than just handguns. Especially recently, there has been a cornucopia
of nine millimeter pccs on the market pistol caliber car
beans and also pdw's personal defense weapons like the braced
pistols are you know, what we would call an SBR
but legally they're not. But the little brace pistols like
(14:05):
the Flux Raider and things like it. Glock conversion, sig conversions,
there's a bunch of those on the market. You'll also
gain some velocity out of a PCC. Now you might
think great, this is great, Well not always. Again, remember
talked about that hollow point and technology and how far
it's come and how good the modern hollow points are
(14:27):
in a fighting handgun sized barrel. Now, if you go
shorter than that, they may not expand because they're going
too slow. And if you put them in a PCC,
they may over expand you might think over expand, how
is that? That's not a thing. A bullet's penetration is
directly related to its surface area presented at the when
(14:47):
it hits the target and going through the target. So
the more that bullet expands, the less it is going
to penetrate. That's how that works. May expand too much
too rapidly and actually penetrate less. It opens up so white.
It has such a large service area it fails to penetrate.
You may run into this with a PCC. This is
(15:09):
something to be aware of and there's much less testing
in So you're nine millimeters round that may be great
out of your handgun may be abysmal out of your
car being. So this is something to be aware of
talking about it for hunting, and you may be better
(15:29):
off with a truncated cone type bullet and a PCC.
Depending on what you're hunting. You may find a round
that gives you sufficient expansion and penetration out of a
car being may want to use on something if you
stuck to, like a broadside shot on a deer. Again,
this is not the best COLP, but we're talking about
how do we maximize it. I'm not saying that you
should put away you're thirty o six and take your
(15:51):
nine millimeters PCC deer hunting, it's a horrible choice, but
in a survival suit situation where you have it, or
let's say it's your truck gun, you have a you
know Tech sub two thousand, or you have a flux
Raider because it's what you can have in your laptop
bag carrying it to working back and you find yourself
in a survival situation. We're trying to maximize the nine
(16:13):
millimeter for survival, realizing it's a horrible choice. I love
the nine milimeter four defensive handgun on my hip against people.
I've done quite a bit of hunting with it. I
do that because it's really challenging. It's not great. It's
not a great choice. So I've said that already in
this episode, but I don't want people to think that
I'm telling you that it's a good choice. It is
not a good choice. We're making the best of what
(16:34):
we have. So if you have a nine milimeter, these
are things to think about. We talk about the PCC
for four hunting, but the PCC most people have those
four defense against people, right, and that makes sense, but
a lot of people are There's not that it's not
a thing. It is a thing, but it's way over
romanticized and overhap. I can use the same magazines from
(16:55):
my handgun in my PCC and vice versa. I'm the
gonna be, you know, pulling mags out of my war
belt and taking them out of the my this gun
and put them in this gun. Generally, gunfights don't happen
like that. They're way too fast and dirty, right, And
going back to the AMO selection, Yeah, they might both
shoot nine milimeter, but the rounds that do well out
of your car being probably aren't the rounds that are
(17:16):
gonna do get out of your handgun, and vice versa.
So I think that's a bit overplayed. So I wouldn't
worry so much about that. I would pick the best
rounds that perform well out of your car being and
out of your handgun. You could even have three guns
with that same caliber. You could have more, but like
(17:36):
you could have a little teeny pocket gun, which I
don't advocate carrying day to day, but there's just certain
situations where you do have to carry one. It's your
best option. A little teeny pocket gun in nine milimeter,
a full sized fighting handgun in a nine milimeter, and
a PCC a nine milimeter. They're almost certainly not gonna
have the same AMMO or use the same AMMO. They
can use it meaning you pull the trigger and it
(17:57):
makes noise and sends rounds in a general direction but
hitting what you're aiming at good terminal performance. I'm not
telling you that's a good idea to carry the same MO.
Won all three one of the good things that I
didn't talk about in the beginning I probably should have
about the nine millimeter is economy of scale. Four center
fire rounds. It's like the cheapest one was economy of scale.
(18:20):
Find some crazy deal on something else. Generally, center fire
AMMO nine milimeter is going to be cheaper. That's if
people are being honest. That's a big reason they get
a PCC because a lot of the pccs we look
at them like, and these are probably good guns of
Ruger PC Carbin Smith and Wesson Folding Carben, They're weigh
as much as an M four. That's why I don't
own one. I'm gonna carry a gun that heavy. I'm
(18:41):
going to carry an M four. I don't care that
it'll swap mags with my handgun of a proper fighting rifle,
not a PCC. AMO is cheap and more affordable if
you're going to practice with it more if you've got
a budget of let's say, one hundred rounds or one
hundred dollars a month, rather for practice for AMMO, A
(19:03):
train with the gun that's your truck gun, that your
carry gun, your handgun. Nine millimeter is where it's at.
It's one of the bigg reasons I switched to it
way back in the day, Right, I can train more
with it and more important to be able to hit
what I'm shooting at. And you know what does that
training and practice, so that that's a big attribute of it.
The other one is recoil. Now, this one's tricky because
a lot of these cheap pccs they're gonna recoil more
(19:24):
than an M four. They're gonna recoil more than an
air fifteen. How can that be, Well, it's just how
the system operates. No. Two, two three is far more powerful.
Most even your basic M four is gonna have that
direct impingement delayed unlocking of the system, so you're not
getting all that recoil at once. It's more spread out.
(19:45):
A lot of the cheaper pccs are direct blowback, like
a high point PCC or the ones I talked about earlier,
they're gonna have that's a big The way they do
that cheaply is they have a big, heavy bolt that
basically slams back and forth. That's not conducive to recoil impulse. Now,
is it prohibitively bad, No, but it's probably as bad
or worse than an M four, So again doesn't make
sense there. But if you're looking for one where you
(20:08):
can shoot a bunch and have less recoil, I would
look towards some kind of delayed action, a roller delayed action. Uh.
The CMMG Banshee has like a radial delayed action. There
are others, but something other than a direct blowback. Not
direct blowback, fine, but realize you're probably getting that because
(20:28):
it's cheap, not because it's good, but getting back to
the cheap economy of scale the amo. Practice with it,
Practice with your PCC, practice with your go to fighting handgun.
Practice with it, and find out what ammo you're gun
likes when you shoot it. Find out what shoots point
(20:50):
of any point of impact as far as a training
round than a defensive round. Also talking about a survival attribute,
now it's not really I don't think any lighter than
two twenty three. It's smaller, but if you're talking about
like a fifty five to a sixty two grain, the
heavy part of the ammunition is the bullet. A nine
(21:11):
millimeter is gonna be generally between one hundred and fifteen
grain and a hundred and forty seven grain. I know
there's outliers, but those are the main spectrum there. It's
gonna weigh as much or more as you're two two three,
gonna weigh as much as the three aweight. But the
main thing is it's smaller. So loaded magazines. You're talking
about going back to that laptop bag, are you gonna
(21:34):
be able to carry a lot more AMMO in there
for the for the size. Maybe not the weight, but
the size is important too. If you're talking about carrying
a pack, carrying it in a bag a man portable system,
that's kind of important. There are some other ammunition I'd
like to talk about maximizing for survival. These should not
be your go to I'm not saying these are great
(21:55):
for home defense because of I don't want overpenetration. Stop
stop stop with that. I hear that. So it's so ridiculous.
Anything that's going to stop a person reliably is going
to go through drywall. Case in point, I can go
punch a hole in drywall. I cannot punch a hole
through you or through really any attacker. I can punch
(22:15):
a hole through drywall. I'm pretty easily get through an
interior door on most houses, and I'm not some hulk
of a man, and it's going to stop. A person
is going to go through drywall. Hit your target. That's
a solution to that. Stop worrying about overpenetration. It's ridiculous
the internet forum thing. Get the good ammunition that's going
(22:35):
to stop the threat or put meat on the table.
Stop worrying about overpenetration. He should not be your go to,
very limited application, but not for defense against people. But
there are super high velocity, lightweight rounds, something like frangible
ammo now very limited, but we're talking about maximizing a
(22:56):
nine millimeter for survival. If you're talking about on a
homestead or things where varmints are a big deal and
you don't want to damage farm equipment, tractor equipment, shooting
inside a barn, things like that, Frangible ammunition if you
want to get any kind of range for varmints can
be devastating. I'm talking about shooting it to eat. I'm
(23:17):
talking about shooting it to get rid of it, like
you got rats in your feed, or the old saying
the fox in the henhouse. The frangible ammo good for that.
If you study, you're going on with it and you
can hit what you're aiming with it. I'm not saying
these next ones have no applicability, but don't think that
(23:40):
the bird shot rounds for your nine milimeter, which they
do make, is going to turn you and your nine
milimeter into a twelve gage or twenty gage or even
a four to ten. They are super super limited, very
very close range I'm talking about measured in feet, can
do things like take out a snake that's a problem
or very very very small game are very limiting talking
(24:05):
about maximizings forravel. You've got that laptop bag, maybe have
a few of those in there for those certain situations.
Don't think you're gonna load up your PCC with the
shot shells, the nine milimeters birdshot and it's going to
turn it into a four to ten. It's not even close.
It's kind of comical how bad those rounds can be.
But in very certain niche applications they can be applicable.
(24:30):
Remember in gum fighting, in defense, and in hunting, what's
actually important getting a hit in the acceptable area quickly
with an ammunition that will do the job that you
want it to do. I hope this has been a good,
thoughtful episode for you guys out there. So many people
(24:52):
use a nine milimeter and I'm a fan of the
nine millimeter four a defensive handgun on your hip. Think
it's the best choice the vast majority of the time.
I'm not gonna try and use unequal weights and measures
and tell you it's the best survival caliber or even
a good survival caliber. But if it's what you have
and you want to maximize it for survival, there are
things you can do and things you should think about
and the limitations that you should be aware of and
(25:14):
not'll make it some fantasy. It's just as good as
a twelve cage, it's not. It's equal to an AR fifteen,
it's not. But if it's what you have, there are
ways that you can leverage it to get the most
out of it. And hopefully this was a helpful episode
for that. I appreciate you guys. I appreciate all that
(25:34):
you do. It's been a while since I've done a
tactical tip that I was putting on my holster today
at the gym and it got me thinking, I'm a
big fan of again, full sized fighting handgun on the
strong side hip outside the waistband one of my favorite
go tos for holsters, whatever holster it is, is those
techlocks or something like a techlock. I think techlock is
a brand name by Blade Tech could be wrong, but
(25:55):
something like a techlock where you press the sides or
the bottom and it unlocks and you can take it
on and off your belt and sometimes I just going
to slide around on your belt. My tactical tip is,
take a couple of rubber bands, one, two, three, whatever
it takes. Just wrap those on the side of the techlock.
Just simply slop. Stop that holster from moving back and
(26:16):
forth on your hip when you're running, when you're bending over,
when you're doing stuff. Just simple rubber bands. Well they
last forever, No, but you know, every couple of months
you just put a new rubber band on that right
what You've probably got spare rubber bands laying around somewhere.
It's a good use for him. That's your tactical tip
of the day. Your tactical verse of the day classic,
be strong and of good courage. We'll back up a
(26:39):
little bit. No man, this is from first Joshua. If
you're not aware, no man shall be able to stand
before you all the days of your life. As I
was with Moses, so I will be with you. I
will not leave you, nor forshake you. Be strong enough,
good courage. Thanks men, and have a blessed day.
The nine millimeter as a survival caliber. That's what we're
gonna talk about today. We all probably know that the
nine millimeter is the de facto standard defensive handgun caliber
of our day, really no disputing that. Like it or not,
it just is. But what about for survival in a
(00:23):
broader sense? How do we maximize the potential of the
nine millimeter to make it more versatile? That's we're gonna
talk about today On Gunfighter Life the podcast, we talk
about guns, tactics, ballistics, gun adjacent stuff the right way,
with all Mighty God at the center, Biblical Judaeo Christian values,
(00:43):
real world firsthand experience, and bless to serve you as host.
Bio bullet points in the show notes. Welcome, hopefully, welcome
back gunfighters and gun enthusiasts, maybe just gun curious. What's up?
Let's talk about the nine millimeter. Okay, you might think
(01:06):
this simple topic. It is not. I have a bunch
of notes on this, but about this quite a bit.
I if you don't know, I've talked about it before. I
moved to nine millimeter, long before it was the hot thing,
when everybody was saying you got to have a forty
and you got to have a forty five, and for
a time I fell into that caliber trap myself a
caliber warrior carrying a forty five on duty four times
(01:29):
later on where I still would for specific missions like
carrying an M forty five a one. But even back
when everybody was saying it's got to be a forty
year bigger, I started getting in competition shooting and actually
shooting on targets for time, and I thought, no, the
nine millimeter is where it is. It's the best balance,
and I moved to that. Even when I was in
(01:50):
one of my immediate circle I knew of that was
shooting nine milimeter on duty made the most sense, I think,
and this was long before the FBI went back to it.
I think that's largely what the rest of the gun
culture has seen. There's still a few caliber warriors out there,
but for the vast majority of people that they realize
nine millimeter makes the most sense, and it certainly does
(02:11):
for a general general. There are outliers so settled down
general recommendation for what a man should carry on his
hip nine millimeter semi automatic magazine fed strong side hip,
preferably with an optic A full size man size fighting
handgun for the nine millimeter shines not going to debate
(02:33):
all the different you know this versus that I'm gonna
try to get you to put down the glock cool
aid today doesn't really matter. Carrying a full sized fighting
handgun strong side hip is the best option for the
vast majority of people in modern society. You haven't been neutered,
(02:54):
so you can't carry one now for that the nine millimeter.
One of the reasons it's so good today is the
advancements in defensive handgun ammunition technology. Largely those were for
law enforcement in a full sized fighting handgun. And one
of the reasons, I one of several, but one of
the reasons is because much of the really good defensive
(03:18):
handgun ammunition of today was developed for a full sized
fighting handgun, not for a little baby hashtag me to
pocket gun, but a full size fighting handgun. That ammunition
is good, and it does well, and it does expand
most of the time, the vast majority of the time.
Nothing is one hundred percent in ballistics, but really good
(03:39):
go to defensive ammunition. So that's what we're going to
talk about. First, really good, street proven, modern hollowpoint ammunition
for a full sized fighting handgun, then whole done several
Nerd out episodes on these, but the big ones Spear Gold, Dot, Federal, HST,
Winchester Ranger. It's one of my favorite go to is
(04:01):
that in the Spear Gold, Lot, Remington, Golden Saber, Hornity,
critical Duty. Any of these really good ones, and there
are others, right, this is not an exhaustive list, but
get one that's proven, that street proven, that's used and
well known, will be able to get in a year
or two so you don't always have to constantly change
(04:21):
out your ammo. The next latest and greatest. It's a
game changer, does greame changer revolutionary. Nothing really revolutionary about
the nine milimeter. It's been around over one hundred years,
older than the forty five ACP. When you claim something
is revolutionary and a game changer, that's probably a pretty
big red flag. None of this crazy off the rails
experimental ammo, good street proven, modern hollow point designs. But
(04:46):
in that ammunition it's a good viable self defense option.
Pick one of those for your good go to fighting
handing them. That's the number one thing you're gonna use
nine millimeter for. That's the main reason nine millimeter is
so popular. And then I've pushed for a long time,
get a training round that matches point of aim, point
of impact, recoil, impulse, feeding dimensions, your defensive AMMO. Be
(05:11):
the guy that carries one hundred and forty seven grain
plus P plus P plus plus. But you shoot one
hundred and fifteen grain Winchester whitebox, nothing wrong. One hundred
and fifteen graand Winchester Whitebox is a standard range fodder.
It's probably not gonna shoot the same point of aim,
point of impact as you're one hundred and forty seven
grain plus P plus plus. Right, get and the whole
(05:33):
point of shooting is to hit where you're aiming at,
hopefully not just to make noise. Your practice AMMO needs
to match your training AMO. I'm not gonna say for
everything all the time. Right, if you're practicing TQB tactics
at you know, inside of three yards, the difference is academic.
But if you're actually doing like well aimed fire, it's
not academic. You need to hit where you're aiming. Talked
(05:53):
about this at nausea. But if you don't think it's
important to hit where you're aiming, you're probably listening to
the wrong podcast. Get a training am that matches your
defensive AMMO, point of am point of impact, feeding dimensions,
so you know that it actually works in your gun.
You can have a really good, high quality gun and
a really good, high quality hollow point that doesn't feed
in that gun. Another wrong with the gun, that's wrong
with the AMMO. It just doesn't pair well. Just like relationships,
(06:16):
you could have a decent, high quality good woman and
a good, you know, moral based Christian man. That doesn't
mean that they're gonna go well together. If there's anything
inherently other than the relation of the fall wrong with
either person, they just they're just not a good match.
(06:36):
The same can happen with handguns and holow points or
handguns and certain kinds of ammunition. So make sure it matches,
make sure it feeds, make sure it hits where you're aiming.
That's the big bulk of the things that I millimeter.
I've talked about that at nausea. This is just a
brief flyover of that that's important. Now, this is about survival. Now,
that is part of survival, right, protecting yourself and others.
(06:58):
You shall love your neighbor as yourself. If you would
protect your own life. Want to feel the same conviction
to defend your neighbor's life. Right? All these people are like, oh,
I just carry on for me. If there's a mas shooting,
I'm just gonna leave. I'm not going to sit here.
And that's not me. I'm a man. I've made kind
(07:21):
of lifelong careers out of protecting myself and others. I'm
not that dude. You're in a movie theater, somebody starts shooting,
dropping old ladies, little kids, and like, well, I'm just
gonna leave. It's not Are you your brother's keeper? Right?
You should be willing to defend other people's lives at
the risk of your own life. Right. If that's not you, again,
(07:43):
you're probably listening to the wrong podcast. Jesus laid down
his life even for people that hated him, reviled him,
and spit on him. Willing to put your life on
the line for other people? Go listen to another podcast, anyway.
That was just a tangent. I don't know where that anyway,
Let's get back on topic. Just not a big fan
of cowardly men. Where was I? Oh, the duality of survival.
(08:07):
I've talked about this before. There's two parts of survival, right,
protecting yourself and providing for yourself and others. You look
at my bio in the show notes military decorated combat
veteran a few times over two branch to the Armed Service,
LAPD work in some of the crazy assignments and some
of the nastiest streets in the country, private contracting. I've
(08:32):
been in quite a few violent encounters where life was
on the line, mine and other people's, as you might imagine,
take me a while to tally those up, and to
be honest, I don't want to, but even that over
twenty years in doing those sort of things, not shying
away from risky situations, in fact, oftentimes putting myself in them,
(08:54):
it pales in comparison to the number of times I've
had to eat period. I also do quite a bit
of hunting. I've been a professional guide, professional hunter. What
is a professional hunter, just like anything else professional, Well,
a hobbyist hunter pays to go hunting. A professional hunter
gets paid to go hunting, calling animals, maintaining herds, guiding
(09:18):
other people. I've been blessed to do all that. That
is part of survival. Now, normally you go to the
store and get food. That's great. I go to the
store and get food. But just picking a part of
chicken carcass we got, I don't know some store like
when you buy the whole chickens. It's easy, it's convenient,
(09:38):
I get it. But what if go with me here?
What if you can't? What if there are no stores open?
What if there is no food at the store. But
about a world like that, can you put food on
the table. That's part of survival. Now, I'm here to
(10:00):
tell you nine millimeter is not great for that. It's
not great for that. It's not great for that. I
don't care who says that it is. It's not. And
this is coming from somebody that has done been blessed
to do a ton of handgun hunting. I do that
because it's a challenge to do that, because it's hard
to do that, because it's a personal test of my
skill that makes it way harder than hunting with a
rifle or a shotgun. I would consider it more a challenge.
(10:25):
That's not what I want when I'm in a survival scenario.
I have been blessed to take deer with an all
manner of game with nine forty forty five and I can't.
I've certainly and dropped a bunch of nison with nine
millimeter forty forty five. I've also taken small game squirrel, rabbit,
(10:48):
beaver with nine millimeter. It's hard, though it will work,
it's hard. It's not ideal for that I'm talking about
in a handgun. I often tell people, whatever caliber you
have within reason right, whatever distance you can reliably put
that round in like a paper plate, that's your ethical
(11:09):
distance for a nine millimeter for something like a deer,
I would not say a pipeplate. I would say something
like a silver dollar. For those of you that are young,
I have never seen a silver dollar picture up a
teat lady's bald fist about that size. It's about the size.
I think it's ethical with a nine millimeters with a handgun.
For deer, you can spot and stalk up behind them.
(11:30):
They don't know you're there, and you shoot them right
worthy spine meets the base of the skull. That's a
tiny target. You shoot them other places and they will die.
But the whole point you're shooting them is to eat them.
A survival situation, you might not have two days to
track a wounded deer, so you may expend more calories
than you have and you may die in the process.
So nine milimeters in a hang on not ideal for that. Now,
(11:52):
I'm not here to tell you have to pick one
forty seven grains. I personally like one forty seven grains,
and it's partially for this reason. Partially because going back
to earlier, no matter how great and fancy new technology
hollow points are, they don't always expand weird things can happen.
I get hit a bone in a weird random angle
and start a tumble or whatever, and if it's pre
clogged with some kind of elastomer or plastic or polymer tip,
(12:13):
something could happen where it doesn't expand in that case,
I think truncated cone bullets, flat pointed truncated cones do
better ballistically even when they don't expand, similar to an
old semi wad cutter. Think that's a better design than
a round nose bullet for terminal performance, the performance inside
the target. For that reason, I generally standardize on one
(12:35):
forty sevens now. Again, going back to that training amo
point of a point of impact a heavy for caliber
truncated cone, flat pointed bullet is not the worst for this.
Back to one of the best choices for this. So
if you settle on one forty seven four defense and
you practice with one forty seven's like a something I
commonly do, a one forty seven grain spear Lawman and
a one forty seven grain spear gold Lot or gold
(12:56):
Dot G two, it's a pretty good pairing and four hunting,
let's say small medium game. You're not going to destroy
a bunch of meat with a one forty seven grain
truncated cone, and you're also not going to suffer from
lack of penetration you might with some lighter options one
(13:19):
hundred and forty seven grain truncated cone if you're hunting
it's a medium sized game. Again, it's not great, but
for a nine millimeter it's probably one of the best.
One of the reasons I prefer. Now, I'm not telling
you if you want to carry one fifteen's all the time,
you're wrong. You certainly can't, and they're certainly generally more
available and affordable. Nine millimeter is available in more platforms
(13:42):
than just handguns. Especially recently, there has been a cornucopia
of nine millimeter pccs on the market pistol caliber car
beans and also pdw's personal defense weapons like the braced
pistols are you know, what we would call an SBR
but legally they're not. But the little brace pistols like
(14:05):
the Flux Raider and things like it. Glock conversion, sig conversions,
there's a bunch of those on the market. You'll also
gain some velocity out of a PCC. Now you might
think great, this is great, Well not always. Again, remember
talked about that hollow point and technology and how far
it's come and how good the modern hollow points are
(14:27):
in a fighting handgun sized barrel. Now, if you go
shorter than that, they may not expand because they're going
too slow. And if you put them in a PCC,
they may over expand you might think over expand, how
is that? That's not a thing. A bullet's penetration is
directly related to its surface area presented at the when
(14:47):
it hits the target and going through the target. So
the more that bullet expands, the less it is going
to penetrate. That's how that works. May expand too much
too rapidly and actually penetrate less. It opens up so white.
It has such a large service area it fails to penetrate.
You may run into this with a PCC. This is
(15:09):
something to be aware of and there's much less testing
in So you're nine millimeters round that may be great
out of your handgun may be abysmal out of your
car being. So this is something to be aware of
talking about it for hunting, and you may be better
(15:29):
off with a truncated cone type bullet and a PCC.
Depending on what you're hunting. You may find a round
that gives you sufficient expansion and penetration out of a
car being may want to use on something if you
stuck to, like a broadside shot on a deer. Again,
this is not the best COLP, but we're talking about
how do we maximize it. I'm not saying that you
should put away you're thirty o six and take your
(15:51):
nine millimeters PCC deer hunting, it's a horrible choice, but
in a survival suit situation where you have it, or
let's say it's your truck gun, you have a you
know Tech sub two thousand, or you have a flux
Raider because it's what you can have in your laptop
bag carrying it to working back and you find yourself
in a survival situation. We're trying to maximize the nine
(16:13):
millimeter for survival, realizing it's a horrible choice. I love
the nine milimeter four defensive handgun on my hip against people.
I've done quite a bit of hunting with it. I
do that because it's really challenging. It's not great. It's
not a great choice. So I've said that already in
this episode, but I don't want people to think that
I'm telling you that it's a good choice. It is
not a good choice. We're making the best of what
(16:34):
we have. So if you have a nine milimeter, these
are things to think about. We talk about the PCC
for four hunting, but the PCC most people have those
four defense against people, right, and that makes sense, but
a lot of people are There's not that it's not
a thing. It is a thing, but it's way over
romanticized and overhap. I can use the same magazines from
(16:55):
my handgun in my PCC and vice versa. I'm the
gonna be, you know, pulling mags out of my war
belt and taking them out of the my this gun
and put them in this gun. Generally, gunfights don't happen
like that. They're way too fast and dirty, right, And
going back to the AMO selection, Yeah, they might both
shoot nine milimeter, but the rounds that do well out
of your car being probably aren't the rounds that are
(17:16):
gonna do get out of your handgun, and vice versa.
So I think that's a bit overplayed. So I wouldn't
worry so much about that. I would pick the best
rounds that perform well out of your car being and
out of your handgun. You could even have three guns
with that same caliber. You could have more, but like
(17:36):
you could have a little teeny pocket gun, which I
don't advocate carrying day to day, but there's just certain
situations where you do have to carry one. It's your
best option. A little teeny pocket gun in nine milimeter,
a full sized fighting handgun in a nine milimeter, and
a PCC a nine milimeter. They're almost certainly not gonna
have the same AMMO or use the same AMMO. They
can use it meaning you pull the trigger and it
(17:57):
makes noise and sends rounds in a general direction but
hitting what you're aiming at good terminal performance. I'm not
telling you that's a good idea to carry the same MO.
Won all three one of the good things that I
didn't talk about in the beginning I probably should have
about the nine millimeter is economy of scale. Four center
fire rounds. It's like the cheapest one was economy of scale.
(18:20):
Find some crazy deal on something else. Generally, center fire
AMMO nine milimeter is going to be cheaper. That's if
people are being honest. That's a big reason they get
a PCC because a lot of the pccs we look
at them like, and these are probably good guns of
Ruger PC Carbin Smith and Wesson Folding Carben, They're weigh
as much as an M four. That's why I don't
own one. I'm gonna carry a gun that heavy. I'm
(18:41):
going to carry an M four. I don't care that
it'll swap mags with my handgun of a proper fighting rifle,
not a PCC. AMO is cheap and more affordable if
you're going to practice with it more if you've got
a budget of let's say, one hundred rounds or one
hundred dollars a month, rather for practice for AMMO, A
(19:03):
train with the gun that's your truck gun, that your
carry gun, your handgun. Nine millimeter is where it's at.
It's one of the bigg reasons I switched to it
way back in the day, Right, I can train more
with it and more important to be able to hit
what I'm shooting at. And you know what does that
training and practice, so that that's a big attribute of it.
The other one is recoil. Now, this one's tricky because
a lot of these cheap pccs they're gonna recoil more
(19:24):
than an M four. They're gonna recoil more than an
air fifteen. How can that be, Well, it's just how
the system operates. No. Two, two three is far more powerful.
Most even your basic M four is gonna have that
direct impingement delayed unlocking of the system, so you're not
getting all that recoil at once. It's more spread out.
(19:45):
A lot of the cheaper pccs are direct blowback, like
a high point PCC or the ones I talked about earlier,
they're gonna have that's a big The way they do
that cheaply is they have a big, heavy bolt that
basically slams back and forth. That's not conducive to recoil impulse. Now,
is it prohibitively bad, No, but it's probably as bad
or worse than an M four, So again doesn't make
sense there. But if you're looking for one where you
(20:08):
can shoot a bunch and have less recoil, I would
look towards some kind of delayed action, a roller delayed action. Uh.
The CMMG Banshee has like a radial delayed action. There
are others, but something other than a direct blowback. Not
direct blowback, fine, but realize you're probably getting that because
(20:28):
it's cheap, not because it's good, but getting back to
the cheap economy of scale the amo. Practice with it,
Practice with your PCC, practice with your go to fighting handgun.
Practice with it, and find out what ammo you're gun
likes when you shoot it. Find out what shoots point
(20:50):
of any point of impact as far as a training
round than a defensive round. Also talking about a survival attribute,
now it's not really I don't think any lighter than
two twenty three. It's smaller, but if you're talking about
like a fifty five to a sixty two grain, the
heavy part of the ammunition is the bullet. A nine
(21:11):
millimeter is gonna be generally between one hundred and fifteen
grain and a hundred and forty seven grain. I know
there's outliers, but those are the main spectrum there. It's
gonna weigh as much or more as you're two two three,
gonna weigh as much as the three aweight. But the
main thing is it's smaller. So loaded magazines. You're talking
about going back to that laptop bag, are you gonna
(21:34):
be able to carry a lot more AMMO in there
for the for the size. Maybe not the weight, but
the size is important too. If you're talking about carrying
a pack, carrying it in a bag a man portable system,
that's kind of important. There are some other ammunition I'd
like to talk about maximizing for survival. These should not
be your go to I'm not saying these are great
(21:55):
for home defense because of I don't want overpenetration. Stop
stop stop with that. I hear that. So it's so ridiculous.
Anything that's going to stop a person reliably is going
to go through drywall. Case in point, I can go
punch a hole in drywall. I cannot punch a hole
through you or through really any attacker. I can punch
(22:15):
a hole through drywall. I'm pretty easily get through an
interior door on most houses, and I'm not some hulk
of a man, and it's going to stop. A person
is going to go through drywall. Hit your target. That's
a solution to that. Stop worrying about overpenetration. It's ridiculous
the internet forum thing. Get the good ammunition that's going
(22:35):
to stop the threat or put meat on the table.
Stop worrying about overpenetration. He should not be your go to,
very limited application, but not for defense against people. But
there are super high velocity, lightweight rounds, something like frangible
ammo now very limited, but we're talking about maximizing a
(22:56):
nine millimeter for survival. If you're talking about on a
homestead or things where varmints are a big deal and
you don't want to damage farm equipment, tractor equipment, shooting
inside a barn, things like that, Frangible ammunition if you
want to get any kind of range for varmints can
be devastating. I'm talking about shooting it to eat. I'm
(23:17):
talking about shooting it to get rid of it, like
you got rats in your feed, or the old saying
the fox in the henhouse. The frangible ammo good for that.
If you study, you're going on with it and you
can hit what you're aiming with it. I'm not saying
these next ones have no applicability, but don't think that
(23:40):
the bird shot rounds for your nine milimeter, which they
do make, is going to turn you and your nine
milimeter into a twelve gage or twenty gage or even
a four to ten. They are super super limited, very
very close range I'm talking about measured in feet, can
do things like take out a snake that's a problem
or very very very small game are very limiting talking
(24:05):
about maximizings forravel. You've got that laptop bag, maybe have
a few of those in there for those certain situations.
Don't think you're gonna load up your PCC with the
shot shells, the nine milimeters birdshot and it's going to
turn it into a four to ten. It's not even close.
It's kind of comical how bad those rounds can be.
But in very certain niche applications they can be applicable.
(24:30):
Remember in gum fighting, in defense, and in hunting, what's
actually important getting a hit in the acceptable area quickly
with an ammunition that will do the job that you
want it to do. I hope this has been a good,
thoughtful episode for you guys out there. So many people
(24:52):
use a nine milimeter and I'm a fan of the
nine millimeter four a defensive handgun on your hip. Think
it's the best choice the vast majority of the time.
I'm not gonna try and use unequal weights and measures
and tell you it's the best survival caliber or even
a good survival caliber. But if it's what you have
and you want to maximize it for survival, there are
things you can do and things you should think about
and the limitations that you should be aware of and
(25:14):
not'll make it some fantasy. It's just as good as
a twelve cage, it's not. It's equal to an AR fifteen,
it's not. But if it's what you have, there are
ways that you can leverage it to get the most
out of it. And hopefully this was a helpful episode
for that. I appreciate you guys. I appreciate all that
(25:34):
you do. It's been a while since I've done a
tactical tip that I was putting on my holster today
at the gym and it got me thinking, I'm a
big fan of again, full sized fighting handgun on the
strong side hip outside the waistband one of my favorite
go tos for holsters, whatever holster it is, is those
techlocks or something like a techlock. I think techlock is
a brand name by Blade Tech could be wrong, but
(25:55):
something like a techlock where you press the sides or
the bottom and it unlocks and you can take it
on and off your belt and sometimes I just going
to slide around on your belt. My tactical tip is,
take a couple of rubber bands, one, two, three, whatever
it takes. Just wrap those on the side of the techlock.
Just simply slop. Stop that holster from moving back and
(26:16):
forth on your hip when you're running, when you're bending over,
when you're doing stuff. Just simple rubber bands. Well they
last forever, No, but you know, every couple of months
you just put a new rubber band on that right
what You've probably got spare rubber bands laying around somewhere.
It's a good use for him. That's your tactical tip
of the day. Your tactical verse of the day classic,
be strong and of good courage. We'll back up a
(26:39):
little bit. No man, this is from first Joshua. If
you're not aware, no man shall be able to stand
before you all the days of your life. As I
was with Moses, so I will be with you. I
will not leave you, nor forshake you. Be strong enough,
good courage. Thanks men, and have a blessed day.
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