June 9, 2025 • 24 mins
Some leadership challenges are solved within the relationship of yourself and just one coworker. Others impact entire teams. Over four episodes we'll discuss some of the bigger ones that can impact the dynamic of an entire team.
Link to article by Sam Adeyemi: https://www.forbes.com/councils/forbescoachescouncil/2024/08/30/recipes-for-workplace-recovery-4-common-leadership-problems-and-their-solutions/
Patreon Account: https://www.patreon.com/user?u=22174142
Become a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/hacking-your-leadership-podcast--4805674/support.
Link to article by Sam Adeyemi: https://www.forbes.com/councils/forbescoachescouncil/2024/08/30/recipes-for-workplace-recovery-4-common-leadership-problems-and-their-solutions/
Patreon Account: https://www.patreon.com/user?u=22174142
Become a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/hacking-your-leadership-podcast--4805674/support.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
Welcome to HAWCK Can Your Leadership.
Speaker 2 (00:02):
I'm Chris and I'm Lorenzo and Lorenzo.
Speaker 3 (00:04):
On this episode, we're continuing the discussion that we started
last Monday on an article that I saw on the
Forbes website called four common leadership Problems and their Solutions.
Speaker 1 (00:14):
Last week we talked about what would.
Speaker 3 (00:16):
Happen if your team isn't listening to each other and
what the causes of that are and what the leadership
solutions are in those situations. Great discussion. Go ahead, go
back and listen to it if you haven't yet. On
this episode, I want to talk about the second item
in the article, which is what happens when your team
is consumed by negativity? And I think this one is
a little bit different than when your team isn't listening
to each other, because negativity is it's a mindset more
(00:41):
than anything else, and they can have different causes, some
of which are can be solved by leadership training and development,
some of which have to be solved by changing the
makeup of the team or who is on the team.
And it's the responsibility of leaders to figure out where
the source or causes of this negativity lies in order
(01:02):
to effectively turn it into positivity, because just being a
positive person as a leader. While that is necessary and
it's important, that alone won't necessarily solve the problems that
arise from a team that is consumed by negativity if
if that positivity is not coupled with very specific actions
(01:24):
by the leader, where those actions are needed in order
to make it a turnaround. It's not simply you know,
there's there's almost memes of it, and plenty of like
movie tropes where you have, you know, like the cheerleader
that comes in and says.
Speaker 1 (01:36):
Hey, everybody, let's be positive, and they'll.
Speaker 3 (01:38):
Look at that that person they go look at them
like like they're an idiot. You know, you can't be
that leader. But the positivity is needed and it needs
to be you know, coupled with action, very specific action.
Speaker 2 (01:50):
Yeah, I think too. It's it's rare. It's rare that
you see entire teams kind of consumed by negativity. Typically
what you see are some real concerns, some real things
that a team needs collectively, and then you may have
a handful of people on a team that just in
general like whether they're they're over it, they're burned out,
(02:11):
they feel like you know, they they they've reached the
limit of opportunities they have, like whatever the case is.
And and maybe people are holding onto things that have
happened over the past and and again many times these
are real things that have happened, and people kind of
have a you know, like like a right to feel
that way. I think, though, you know, we've talked about
(02:34):
a lot in the podcast, like if you do feel
that way, if you had these experiences with a leader
in an organization, if things aren't getting better, the best
thing for you to do really is like leave, you
know what I'm saying, like like go, go, go somewhere
where you can have a better opportunity, Go somewhere where
you don't have to have that feeling of resentment or
whatever the case is. But but it happens. And I
(02:57):
think from a from a leadership standpoint, when you have
teams in that space, it's really important to just listen
and talk about it and and talk about the real
things that are causing some of these things. I think
sometimes to your point, like you know, maybe you don't
walk into a conversation or walk in to talk to
(03:18):
a team or your leaders and you're like the raw,
raw positivity. It's all gonna be great, it's gonna be amazing,
We're gonna do great things. Maybe you're not doing that.
But if you're not willing to go into a meeting
or have a conversation and actually share out loud what
some of the real things are that are happening, that
may be causing some of this negativity or at the
center of why the team feels that way. In essence,
(03:41):
that's kind of what you're doing. You're you're, you're you're,
You're not talking about the reality of what's happening, and
instead you're trying to like get by, get bite quickly,
or paint over it, or can we move forward or
let's let things go. Well, that sounds good in theory,
but we probably need to have a conversation about it.
And there's been many times as a leader where I've
(04:02):
walked into two small teams, big teams, different things and
had to sit down and say, hey, let's talk about
what's going on. I can sense right now right that
we're not in a good spot. I can see that
there's good work that we want to do, but there's
a lot of negativity feelings that are going on here.
So there's a couple of things that I want to
share that I've recognized or that I've observed that make
sure that you're clear that I see it. And I'm
(04:24):
going to say things like this is a lack you know,
or or just a failure of leadership. I'm going to
say things like that's unacceptable. I'm going to say things
like you know that, that's not that's not you know,
aligned with you know values, that's not aligned with the
work that we want to do. I'm going to talk
about these things and I'm going to put them out
(04:44):
there and say so. I can't go back into the
past and change this experience. What I can do is
is talk about this and and then I can talk
about where do we go from here? And how do
we move differently, how do we adjust? What are the
things that we can change within our control that allow
us to be able to move forward. And for some
(05:06):
of you that might not be possible. And I'm gonna
say that out loud. For some of you, you might
be in a space where it's like somebody's been here
before and said the same things to you and nothing's changed.
Some of you, like there might be too much resentment
or too much negativity or too much feeling of like
how things used to be to how they are, whatever
that might be. That might be too much for you,
And that's okay as well. And if this is not
(05:28):
the place, this is not the work that you want
to do, you don't want to put forth the effort
to help us get into a positive place, then I'm okay.
If you tell me that, I would rather you let
me know kind of how you feel and where you're
at so we can help you do what you want
to do and kind of move on. What we're not
going to allow or stand for is that continual element
of negativity or pushing back against the rest of the
(05:49):
team trying to do great work. So I think like
conversations like that are critical if in fact you're walking
into a team that is consumed my negativity.
Speaker 3 (05:57):
Sure, sure, if a person is negative, if if have
a negative outlook and you say things like what we're
not going to allow us for the continued negativity, then
you know that what that means basically is if you're
saying you can come to me with anything, if you
if you have a feeling, if you're feeling negative about
this role or this job or these expectations or this workload,
(06:18):
whatever it is, I want you to talk to me
about it, and I want to try to go through
some things that can happen that we can do to
make it, to make it more realistic for you to
or to help you along on this journey. But if
a person is doing that, that assumes that they don't
want to feel negative either. They want to feel positive
about it, and that is inherently a good thing. That
means that it might be possible to salvage that relationship
(06:42):
between the person and the job they have. But but
sometimes it's not. And when it's not, it doesn't necessarily
mean that what the expectations are now are are not
realistic or you know, they're that they're that they're not good,
or that somebody is doing something wrong. Sometimes when a
(07:02):
job description changes, or when the expectations change over time,
because you know, obviously companies that don't change those things
over time are the ones that will die. You need
to change your expectations over time because the market changes,
and the customers change, and the you know, the economy changes.
All these things change and the company has to adapt
to that. And it might be that a role migrates
(07:25):
from one thing to another slowly or quickly, and the
people in that role are no longer a fit for
that role because the expectations have changed, and sometimes they
can come along for the journey. Sometimes they can change
to fit, but the anxiety that they feel on whether
or not they can change is something that can lead
(07:45):
to that negativity. So if they want to be able
to fit into the expectations that they want to be
able to do their job correctly and well and to
the best of their ability, but they are unable to
this is when leadership has to stay in and decide
can this person be taught these things? Can this person
get these skills, because in the absence of the skills,
(08:09):
while the job description or the expectations continue to change,
you're only going to have that negativity continue to grow
from that person because they either a will never be
able to get on board or they want to get
on board but they can't because they don't have the skills.
Speaker 1 (08:23):
And if you don't.
Speaker 3 (08:24):
Address those things, that negativity is what spreads. But if
you have one or two or three people on a
team that have these feelings and that they they start,
you know, kind of spouting negative things here and there
to their teammates. It's insidious because it starts with little comments, oh,
you know, something happens, and they go, there's a surprise,
you know, like like those little things.
Speaker 1 (08:46):
But they but they are seeds that.
Speaker 3 (08:48):
Get planted in the minds of the teammates that they
work with, and those seeds can grow in the absence
of a leader that comes in and stomps it out.
And the people who the people who are able to
be turned negative, who were normally positive or at least neutral,
those people can be turned around back into the positive again,
(09:10):
but only in the absence of the negative seed that
was there to begin with. And so if you're a leader,
you need to figure out a where this negativity is
stemming from. And if if you have a team of
fifteen people and ten of the fifteen people seem to
be doing their job perfectly fine and getting everything done
and exactly what they're supposed to do, then it's very
(09:32):
unlikely that the expectations of the job are unrealistic. It's
very unlikely that the workload is unrealistic. It's very unlikely
that there's an expectation that is not realistic. It's more
likely that the people who are unable to do it
either don't have the skills or they don't have the desire.
And but if you have a team of fifteen people
and all fifteen of them are not able to get
(09:53):
everything anything done, or they all have a negative outlook
and you're not seeing results out of any of them,
then it is very possible that the workload is unrealistic.
And then you have to look at what that workloader,
that those expectations are and and kind of dial it
back or address it to be able to keep the
team you know, with you as you move through the
journey together or you or it means getting rid of
(10:15):
the entire team. That typically is not the right way
to go. So you really have to figure out whether
it's kind of localized to a few people. And you
know when you have a when you have like a
spasm in your back, and by the at the beginning
of the day, you know exactly where it's coming from.
It's that one little spot behind your shoulder blade, and
you feel that's exactly where it is. By the end
of the day, it's just like, oh, my whole back
(10:36):
is hurting, and it's because that that little pain point
has kind of radiated out and it's affecting other things too,
and you kind of lose the ability to know where
that pain is actually coming from because of how long
it's been there, it's affecting everything else. You have to
get it back to localized again. You have to go
back to where the actual source is. And oftentimes it's
one or two or three people that are affecting the
(10:56):
entire team.
Speaker 2 (10:57):
Yeah, And I want to underline as well, like there's probably, uh,
to your point, a couple of people that really kind
of guide and influence negativity many times, many times I
found out, you know, and that their experience has led
(11:17):
them into that space, right, And like, like something that
happened a lack of leadership. It's very rare that somebody's
just negative and they've always been negative and they haven't
cared before, Like that's.
Speaker 1 (11:27):
They probably wouldn't have gotten the job to begin.
Speaker 2 (11:28):
With, exactly, Like, there's been something that has happened, and
and I think addressing that something and talking through that
and and asking if they feel that they're capable of
moving on and working through it, Like that's a really
important thing to do and a really important conversation to
(11:49):
have because it's really easy to just walk in and
be like, well, so soo's negative. Nobody likes them. They
always have a problem, it's always an issue, it's always
an issue, blah blah blah blah blah. And then you
talk to them you realize like, well, wait a minute,
like I'm not I can see where they have concerns,
but I'm not picking up this massive negative energy. And
maybe some of it is masking because you're the leader,
you're the new leader, whatever. But I think many times
(12:11):
because of that defensive element they've put up and over
time they've pushed people away that nobody's willing to have
a real conversation with them about their experience, what happened
where we're at, and then asking them like is this
worth it? Like like are you are you able to
work through this? Is there is there a space in
the future where you figure like you can let these
(12:31):
things go and we can move forward, because and if not,
that's okay, Like we still need to talk about it,
because then this probably is not the right place for you,
right right, Like those conversations have to happen if you're
serious about not only helping the larger team, but then
building skill and capability as a leader, because yeah, the
the easier thing to do is like, well then just
(12:53):
start over, right, just walk in and be like that
it's negative team, a lot of negativity. Let's just start over. Well, okay,
But that then assumes that you believe that there's no
way that you can move forward in a lot of ways.
Where the trap that sometimes people can fall into and
leaders can fall into, though, is like, well, if you've
got this person and Chris was their leader, and they
(13:14):
tried and put forth an effort and they weren't able
to change this person or get them to a right
good spot, then Lorenzo tried and he did his thing,
and this person's still here, but they still have these
ongoing issues or situations or negativity right right now. If
it's the third person, well, now is this about your
ego or about the belief that these other leaders have
also attempted to do this work, like, oh, I can
(13:36):
be the one to fix them, I can get nah. Like,
at what point do you then say, We've had plenty
of opportunities here for this person to show up in
this space and they're just continuing not to in regardless
of what they know. How long they've been here, how
much they sell, how good they are at what they do,
like all those things. We've talked about it a million times.
(13:58):
No matter how good they are at something, if they
are a negative element of the team, it's not good
for the team. It's not good for your business. You've
got to figure something else out.
Speaker 1 (14:07):
Oh for sure. The number of time.
Speaker 3 (14:10):
First of all, when I see that happen to me,
that implies there is a lack of skill in the
rest of the team. And so here's what I mean
by that. If you have a person who is a
generally negative person, but they do this one thing really well.
They do their job well, like they're the best at
doing their job, but they're a negative person and they
bring the rest of the team down a lack of
(14:31):
desire or willingness to put expectations in place, that that
person changes their attitude and becomes a more positive influence
on the team. When that happens, it implies a If
it's the same leader, it implies that it was the
leader's fault that the person became negative to begin with,
(14:52):
and now that leader doesn't want to look at themselves
in the mirror to address it. Their own shortcomings if
you're a new leader coming onto a team and you
can't make that happen for that person, that implies that
you don't have confidence in the skills and ability of
the rest of the team to the point where you
think you will be negatively hurting the team by that
(15:12):
person's skills going away like.
Speaker 1 (15:14):
They they're not able to do. They're the best at
this job.
Speaker 3 (15:17):
If we lose them, then we're gonna be you know,
we're gonna be doing a disservice to ourselves.
Speaker 1 (15:22):
So we're gonna deal with the negativity. We're gonna we're gonna.
Speaker 3 (15:25):
Cope with it or live with it because of the
positive aspects of the of the job performance as person brings,
and you know, it might be the kind of thing
where the work that you do as a leader is
in the background training up other people to make sure
that job is done over the course of one or
two or three months, so that at the same time
that you're coaching this person and saying this negativity has
(15:46):
to stop and you have to change your mindset. Sometime
at some point in time, that person will either leave
on their own because they're tired of being talked to
about their attitude or you will have to separate them
from the organization because you are tired of their adud
And if you're not in the background making sure that
the rest of the team is able to do the
work that that person is going to be leaving behind,
(16:08):
that you don't have somebody to kind of jump into
that spot and do that role, then of course it's
going to be daunting to think about that person going away.
But that doesn't mean it's not your responsibility. It just
means that you are You're giving yourself a false dichotomy. Oh,
I'm either going to lose these skills or might have
to deal with the negativity. No, if you're a leader,
it's neither. You don't have to do either. The solution
(16:29):
is give the person a reasonable but very fast chance
to change their attitude while you're developing the skills of
the rest of the team. Because I promise you, the
person who is negative and continuing to do their job
because they do their job well, they know that they're
the only person who can do their job. They know
that they're the best at doing their job, and they
look at that as a cloak of invincibility, so to speak,
(16:51):
that they can take with them and allow them to
get away with the things that they shouldn't be getting
away with. If they start to see that the rest
of the team can do the job as well as
they can, that that fact alone might cause them to
change their attitude because they don't feel like they're you know,
kind of separated or kind of above everybody else because
of the skills that they have. If you don't have that,
(17:13):
then then that will continue. And you know what, if
it's negative enough, then sometimes the right thing to do
is to get rid of them even before you have
the skills, and the skills get taught on the fly.
In the moment, you might have to jump in as
a leader and help out temporarily. But if the person
is negative enough, the spread from that negativity from that
one person to the rest of the team that could
(17:34):
be causing so much damage in the meantime, then it
might not even be worth waiting until you have the
skills developed on the team to take care of what
they're going to be leaving behind, and you have to
just to deal with it, because again, it's easy to
teach skills. It's a lot harder to teach positivity to
a person who is just kind of hell bent on
being negative because whatever they've gone through, they're.
Speaker 2 (17:56):
Kind of past the point of no return absolutely, and
with that brings us This episode is one minute hack.
But first a few words from our sponsors.
Speaker 3 (18:03):
All Right, if you're leader of people and you're trying
to solve an issue of negativity on your team, once
you've determined where the negativity is coming from, the one
or two or three people that is kind of spreading
from there, the first thing to do is to have
conversations with each of them and set very very realistic,
almost baby step expectations on what the expectations are from
(18:25):
you going forward from an attitude standpoint.
Speaker 1 (18:27):
And the reason why they.
Speaker 3 (18:28):
Have to be really baby steps is because all you're
trying to do in this first interaction is determined whether
or not the person has the desire to change. If
you start out with what all of the expectations are,
then it's possible that because of the person's experience, because
of the lack of skills or lack of learnings or
lack of leadership they've had in the past, it's possible
(18:49):
they won't be able to meet all those expectations right away,
and then you could falsely attribute their failure to attitude
when it's actually something else. But if you start with
an expectation that is very small, that that will allow
you to determine whether or not that person actually has
the desire to change, then you will know where your
(19:10):
effort should be should be put and how much effort
should be put into developing them. So if if you
can determine that they do have the desire to change,
that sets your road differently on what the course of
action is with them. They need more time necessary, you know,
potentially with you, they need more one on ones with
you to kind of level set and and and talk
out what the what the expectations are and what the
(19:31):
progress is. And you can ask them to give you
specifics about what they've done that they saw as a
positive and you can give them specifics once you've determined
that they do want to make the change and to
become a more positive person. And that's that's actually very
meaningful work to do if you can determine that that's
where a person is in their own head. But if
at that after that first interaction you determine that they
(19:52):
don't have the ability to move past even this one
baby step, then first it allows you to put your
effort towards make making sure that they kind of either
leave the team you know, with grace and dignity, or
leave their team involuntarily if they're unable to make those changes,
you know, very quickly, and put your effort and focus
of you know, leadership and development and training into the
(20:13):
people who actually want it and who will actually get
something from it, as opposed to somebody where where it's
kind of you know, falling on deaf ears and so
determining the motivation of the person first is key to
making sure that the effort you're putting in is actually
fruitful effort and and not you know, you know, wasted time.
Speaker 2 (20:30):
Yeah, I think it's such an important part is people
people have to be open and willing to want to
change and be a part of wherever the team is going.
And that's not to say that you don't put any
effort in. I think to your point, like, you have
to put some effort in, right, but then it has
to be matched, and it has to be matched quickly.
It's like, if I'm going to put forth this effort
(20:51):
to help us move forward, and I'm not asking for
all of the effort right now, but I am asking
for some and I need to see that reciprocated. And
I think that's the point around saying, well, this is
what I need to see from you, but also here's
what we're not going to stand for anymore, Like we're
not going to allow this type of behavior. So even
if it's not this out of the gate, somebody's running like, okay,
(21:13):
now I was I was negative, now I'm super positive. No, No,
that's not realistic. In a lot of instances. What is
realistic is to say like, hey, maybe I'm not super
positive yet, but I'm not going to do these negative
things anymore. And that to me is a step in
the right direction. And that allows for an opportunity to say, Okay,
now I'm willing to invest a little bit more. And
(21:34):
again I can't can't walk into the investment and put
all my chips in right like and and but that's
that's a conversation to have to say, like, I'm willing
to continue to invest as you also invest. But the
minute that you stop investing, the minute that you fall
back into negative behaviors, the minute that you feel like
you know you're going to push back on the places
that we're going we're going to have another conversation about it.
(21:55):
So you're kind of also laying out you know what
this looks like, and you know, to your point, like
the choice they have in front of them to do
what's best and to make a decision that's going to
help them be more successful in the future.
Speaker 3 (22:08):
Right, and as a leader, what you can also do
too that might help this, because yeah, it's it's hard
for a person who is negative in general to change
their own mindset overnight. So if the expectation is what
is more along the lines of what they're allowed to
say and do around other people, then that that is
(22:28):
a real realistic expectation what they're allowed to say and
do around other people. It might not be as realistic
to tell them you have to change the way your
mind thinks about this and you have to be more
positive in your mind. You can't help the way you feel,
and the way you feel is a result of all
the experiences that you've had. But as a leader, you
can say to that person, hey, you know what, anytime
you're feeling this way, something triggered it, something happened.
Speaker 1 (22:51):
That made you feel this way.
Speaker 3 (22:53):
And if you have the ability to bite your tongue
for a minute and not you know, spread that negativity
to your teammates and other people.
Speaker 1 (23:00):
People.
Speaker 3 (23:00):
What I would love for you is to come invent
to me as your leader. Come invent to me all
you can tell me. I'll sit there while you while
you yell and scream and kind of about what's going
on that is bothering you or that, and I might.
Speaker 1 (23:12):
Be able to solve that.
Speaker 3 (23:12):
I might be able to tell you where what information
you're missing that might have led you to this conclusion
that isn't necessarily true. Or I'll vent with you and say,
you know what, that that sucks. I can understand why
that will be frustrating. It's frustrating for me too. Let
me tell you how I get through it, and let's
see if that helps you. And So, if a person
is willing to do that, at the very least, it
(23:32):
shows they want something to change. And as long as
they're willing to not spread their negativity to others and
you can help them through this, you're you're already on
the road to you know, kind of saving that relationship
or saving that person. It's when they're unable to do
those little things like come to you, when they have
an issue that they want to vent about, like you know,
being unable to bite their tongue when it comes to
(23:53):
how they talk to other employees, or how they how
they position, what the what the company or leadership expectation
are two other employees. It's when they're doing those things
and that doesn't stop, that's when you can kind of
say that the desire to change isn't there, and now
it's just miseres looking for.
Speaker 2 (24:09):
Company absolutely and what that b exsists at the end
of this episode, this is hacking leadership. I'm Lorenzo and
I'm Chris, and we'll talk to you all next time.
Welcome to HAWCK Can Your Leadership.
Speaker 2 (00:02):
I'm Chris and I'm Lorenzo and Lorenzo.
Speaker 3 (00:04):
On this episode, we're continuing the discussion that we started
last Monday on an article that I saw on the
Forbes website called four common leadership Problems and their Solutions.
Speaker 1 (00:14):
Last week we talked about what would.
Speaker 3 (00:16):
Happen if your team isn't listening to each other and
what the causes of that are and what the leadership
solutions are in those situations. Great discussion. Go ahead, go
back and listen to it if you haven't yet. On
this episode, I want to talk about the second item
in the article, which is what happens when your team
is consumed by negativity? And I think this one is
a little bit different than when your team isn't listening
to each other, because negativity is it's a mindset more
(00:41):
than anything else, and they can have different causes, some
of which are can be solved by leadership training and development,
some of which have to be solved by changing the
makeup of the team or who is on the team.
And it's the responsibility of leaders to figure out where
the source or causes of this negativity lies in order
(01:02):
to effectively turn it into positivity, because just being a
positive person as a leader. While that is necessary and
it's important, that alone won't necessarily solve the problems that
arise from a team that is consumed by negativity if
if that positivity is not coupled with very specific actions
(01:24):
by the leader, where those actions are needed in order
to make it a turnaround. It's not simply you know,
there's there's almost memes of it, and plenty of like
movie tropes where you have, you know, like the cheerleader
that comes in and says.
Speaker 1 (01:36):
Hey, everybody, let's be positive, and they'll.
Speaker 3 (01:38):
Look at that that person they go look at them
like like they're an idiot. You know, you can't be
that leader. But the positivity is needed and it needs
to be you know, coupled with action, very specific action.
Speaker 2 (01:50):
Yeah, I think too. It's it's rare. It's rare that
you see entire teams kind of consumed by negativity. Typically
what you see are some real concerns, some real things
that a team needs collectively, and then you may have
a handful of people on a team that just in
general like whether they're they're over it, they're burned out,
(02:11):
they feel like you know, they they they've reached the
limit of opportunities they have, like whatever the case is.
And and maybe people are holding onto things that have
happened over the past and and again many times these
are real things that have happened, and people kind of
have a you know, like like a right to feel
that way. I think, though, you know, we've talked about
(02:34):
a lot in the podcast, like if you do feel
that way, if you had these experiences with a leader
in an organization, if things aren't getting better, the best
thing for you to do really is like leave, you
know what I'm saying, like like go, go, go somewhere
where you can have a better opportunity, Go somewhere where
you don't have to have that feeling of resentment or
whatever the case is. But but it happens. And I
(02:57):
think from a from a leadership standpoint, when you have
teams in that space, it's really important to just listen
and talk about it and and talk about the real
things that are causing some of these things. I think
sometimes to your point, like you know, maybe you don't
walk into a conversation or walk in to talk to
(03:18):
a team or your leaders and you're like the raw,
raw positivity. It's all gonna be great, it's gonna be amazing,
We're gonna do great things. Maybe you're not doing that.
But if you're not willing to go into a meeting
or have a conversation and actually share out loud what
some of the real things are that are happening, that
may be causing some of this negativity or at the
center of why the team feels that way. In essence,
(03:41):
that's kind of what you're doing. You're you're, you're you're,
You're not talking about the reality of what's happening, and
instead you're trying to like get by, get bite quickly,
or paint over it, or can we move forward or
let's let things go. Well, that sounds good in theory,
but we probably need to have a conversation about it.
And there's been many times as a leader where I've
(04:02):
walked into two small teams, big teams, different things and
had to sit down and say, hey, let's talk about
what's going on. I can sense right now right that
we're not in a good spot. I can see that
there's good work that we want to do, but there's
a lot of negativity feelings that are going on here.
So there's a couple of things that I want to
share that I've recognized or that I've observed that make
sure that you're clear that I see it. And I'm
(04:24):
going to say things like this is a lack you know,
or or just a failure of leadership. I'm going to
say things like that's unacceptable. I'm going to say things
like you know that, that's not that's not you know,
aligned with you know values, that's not aligned with the
work that we want to do. I'm going to talk
about these things and I'm going to put them out
(04:44):
there and say so. I can't go back into the
past and change this experience. What I can do is
is talk about this and and then I can talk
about where do we go from here? And how do
we move differently, how do we adjust? What are the
things that we can change within our control that allow
us to be able to move forward. And for some
(05:06):
of you that might not be possible. And I'm gonna
say that out loud. For some of you, you might
be in a space where it's like somebody's been here
before and said the same things to you and nothing's changed.
Some of you, like there might be too much resentment
or too much negativity or too much feeling of like
how things used to be to how they are, whatever
that might be. That might be too much for you,
And that's okay as well. And if this is not
(05:28):
the place, this is not the work that you want
to do, you don't want to put forth the effort
to help us get into a positive place, then I'm okay.
If you tell me that, I would rather you let
me know kind of how you feel and where you're
at so we can help you do what you want
to do and kind of move on. What we're not
going to allow or stand for is that continual element
of negativity or pushing back against the rest of the
(05:49):
team trying to do great work. So I think like
conversations like that are critical if in fact you're walking
into a team that is consumed my negativity.
Speaker 3 (05:57):
Sure, sure, if a person is negative, if if have
a negative outlook and you say things like what we're
not going to allow us for the continued negativity, then
you know that what that means basically is if you're
saying you can come to me with anything, if you
if you have a feeling, if you're feeling negative about
this role or this job or these expectations or this workload,
(06:18):
whatever it is, I want you to talk to me
about it, and I want to try to go through
some things that can happen that we can do to
make it, to make it more realistic for you to
or to help you along on this journey. But if
a person is doing that, that assumes that they don't
want to feel negative either. They want to feel positive
about it, and that is inherently a good thing. That
means that it might be possible to salvage that relationship
(06:42):
between the person and the job they have. But but
sometimes it's not. And when it's not, it doesn't necessarily
mean that what the expectations are now are are not
realistic or you know, they're that they're that they're not good,
or that somebody is doing something wrong. Sometimes when a
(07:02):
job description changes, or when the expectations change over time,
because you know, obviously companies that don't change those things
over time are the ones that will die. You need
to change your expectations over time because the market changes,
and the customers change, and the you know, the economy changes.
All these things change and the company has to adapt
to that. And it might be that a role migrates
(07:25):
from one thing to another slowly or quickly, and the
people in that role are no longer a fit for
that role because the expectations have changed, and sometimes they
can come along for the journey. Sometimes they can change
to fit, but the anxiety that they feel on whether
or not they can change is something that can lead
(07:45):
to that negativity. So if they want to be able
to fit into the expectations that they want to be
able to do their job correctly and well and to
the best of their ability, but they are unable to
this is when leadership has to stay in and decide
can this person be taught these things? Can this person
get these skills, because in the absence of the skills,
(08:09):
while the job description or the expectations continue to change,
you're only going to have that negativity continue to grow
from that person because they either a will never be
able to get on board or they want to get
on board but they can't because they don't have the skills.
Speaker 1 (08:23):
And if you don't.
Speaker 3 (08:24):
Address those things, that negativity is what spreads. But if
you have one or two or three people on a
team that have these feelings and that they they start,
you know, kind of spouting negative things here and there
to their teammates. It's insidious because it starts with little comments, oh,
you know, something happens, and they go, there's a surprise,
you know, like like those little things.
Speaker 1 (08:46):
But they but they are seeds that.
Speaker 3 (08:48):
Get planted in the minds of the teammates that they
work with, and those seeds can grow in the absence
of a leader that comes in and stomps it out.
And the people who the people who are able to
be turned negative, who were normally positive or at least neutral,
those people can be turned around back into the positive again,
(09:10):
but only in the absence of the negative seed that
was there to begin with. And so if you're a leader,
you need to figure out a where this negativity is
stemming from. And if if you have a team of
fifteen people and ten of the fifteen people seem to
be doing their job perfectly fine and getting everything done
and exactly what they're supposed to do, then it's very
(09:32):
unlikely that the expectations of the job are unrealistic. It's
very unlikely that the workload is unrealistic. It's very unlikely
that there's an expectation that is not realistic. It's more
likely that the people who are unable to do it
either don't have the skills or they don't have the desire.
And but if you have a team of fifteen people
and all fifteen of them are not able to get
(09:53):
everything anything done, or they all have a negative outlook
and you're not seeing results out of any of them,
then it is very possible that the workload is unrealistic.
And then you have to look at what that workloader,
that those expectations are and and kind of dial it
back or address it to be able to keep the
team you know, with you as you move through the
journey together or you or it means getting rid of
(10:15):
the entire team. That typically is not the right way
to go. So you really have to figure out whether
it's kind of localized to a few people. And you
know when you have a when you have like a
spasm in your back, and by the at the beginning
of the day, you know exactly where it's coming from.
It's that one little spot behind your shoulder blade, and
you feel that's exactly where it is. By the end
of the day, it's just like, oh, my whole back
(10:36):
is hurting, and it's because that that little pain point
has kind of radiated out and it's affecting other things too,
and you kind of lose the ability to know where
that pain is actually coming from because of how long
it's been there, it's affecting everything else. You have to
get it back to localized again. You have to go
back to where the actual source is. And oftentimes it's
one or two or three people that are affecting the
(10:56):
entire team.
Speaker 2 (10:57):
Yeah, And I want to underline as well, like there's probably, uh,
to your point, a couple of people that really kind
of guide and influence negativity many times, many times I
found out, you know, and that their experience has led
(11:17):
them into that space, right, And like, like something that
happened a lack of leadership. It's very rare that somebody's
just negative and they've always been negative and they haven't
cared before, Like that's.
Speaker 1 (11:27):
They probably wouldn't have gotten the job to begin.
Speaker 2 (11:28):
With, exactly, Like, there's been something that has happened, and
and I think addressing that something and talking through that
and and asking if they feel that they're capable of
moving on and working through it, Like that's a really
important thing to do and a really important conversation to
(11:49):
have because it's really easy to just walk in and
be like, well, so soo's negative. Nobody likes them. They
always have a problem, it's always an issue, it's always
an issue, blah blah blah blah blah. And then you
talk to them you realize like, well, wait a minute,
like I'm not I can see where they have concerns,
but I'm not picking up this massive negative energy. And
maybe some of it is masking because you're the leader,
you're the new leader, whatever. But I think many times
(12:11):
because of that defensive element they've put up and over
time they've pushed people away that nobody's willing to have
a real conversation with them about their experience, what happened
where we're at, and then asking them like is this
worth it? Like like are you are you able to
work through this? Is there is there a space in
the future where you figure like you can let these
(12:31):
things go and we can move forward, because and if not,
that's okay, Like we still need to talk about it,
because then this probably is not the right place for you,
right right, Like those conversations have to happen if you're
serious about not only helping the larger team, but then
building skill and capability as a leader, because yeah, the
the easier thing to do is like, well then just
(12:53):
start over, right, just walk in and be like that
it's negative team, a lot of negativity. Let's just start over. Well, okay,
But that then assumes that you believe that there's no
way that you can move forward in a lot of ways.
Where the trap that sometimes people can fall into and
leaders can fall into, though, is like, well, if you've
got this person and Chris was their leader, and they
(13:14):
tried and put forth an effort and they weren't able
to change this person or get them to a right
good spot, then Lorenzo tried and he did his thing,
and this person's still here, but they still have these
ongoing issues or situations or negativity right right now. If
it's the third person, well, now is this about your
ego or about the belief that these other leaders have
also attempted to do this work, like, oh, I can
(13:36):
be the one to fix them, I can get nah. Like,
at what point do you then say, We've had plenty
of opportunities here for this person to show up in
this space and they're just continuing not to in regardless
of what they know. How long they've been here, how
much they sell, how good they are at what they do,
like all those things. We've talked about it a million times.
(13:58):
No matter how good they are at something, if they
are a negative element of the team, it's not good
for the team. It's not good for your business. You've
got to figure something else out.
Speaker 1 (14:07):
Oh for sure. The number of time.
Speaker 3 (14:10):
First of all, when I see that happen to me,
that implies there is a lack of skill in the
rest of the team. And so here's what I mean
by that. If you have a person who is a
generally negative person, but they do this one thing really well.
They do their job well, like they're the best at
doing their job, but they're a negative person and they
bring the rest of the team down a lack of
(14:31):
desire or willingness to put expectations in place, that that
person changes their attitude and becomes a more positive influence
on the team. When that happens, it implies a If
it's the same leader, it implies that it was the
leader's fault that the person became negative to begin with,
(14:52):
and now that leader doesn't want to look at themselves
in the mirror to address it. Their own shortcomings if
you're a new leader coming onto a team and you
can't make that happen for that person, that implies that
you don't have confidence in the skills and ability of
the rest of the team to the point where you
think you will be negatively hurting the team by that
(15:12):
person's skills going away like.
Speaker 1 (15:14):
They they're not able to do. They're the best at
this job.
Speaker 3 (15:17):
If we lose them, then we're gonna be you know,
we're gonna be doing a disservice to ourselves.
Speaker 1 (15:22):
So we're gonna deal with the negativity. We're gonna we're gonna.
Speaker 3 (15:25):
Cope with it or live with it because of the
positive aspects of the of the job performance as person brings,
and you know, it might be the kind of thing
where the work that you do as a leader is
in the background training up other people to make sure
that job is done over the course of one or
two or three months, so that at the same time
that you're coaching this person and saying this negativity has
(15:46):
to stop and you have to change your mindset. Sometime
at some point in time, that person will either leave
on their own because they're tired of being talked to
about their attitude or you will have to separate them
from the organization because you are tired of their adud
And if you're not in the background making sure that
the rest of the team is able to do the
work that that person is going to be leaving behind,
(16:08):
that you don't have somebody to kind of jump into
that spot and do that role, then of course it's
going to be daunting to think about that person going away.
But that doesn't mean it's not your responsibility. It just
means that you are You're giving yourself a false dichotomy. Oh,
I'm either going to lose these skills or might have
to deal with the negativity. No, if you're a leader,
it's neither. You don't have to do either. The solution
(16:29):
is give the person a reasonable but very fast chance
to change their attitude while you're developing the skills of
the rest of the team. Because I promise you, the
person who is negative and continuing to do their job
because they do their job well, they know that they're
the only person who can do their job. They know
that they're the best at doing their job, and they
look at that as a cloak of invincibility, so to speak,
(16:51):
that they can take with them and allow them to
get away with the things that they shouldn't be getting
away with. If they start to see that the rest
of the team can do the job as well as
they can, that that fact alone might cause them to
change their attitude because they don't feel like they're you know,
kind of separated or kind of above everybody else because
of the skills that they have. If you don't have that,
(17:13):
then then that will continue. And you know what, if
it's negative enough, then sometimes the right thing to do
is to get rid of them even before you have
the skills, and the skills get taught on the fly.
In the moment, you might have to jump in as
a leader and help out temporarily. But if the person
is negative enough, the spread from that negativity from that
one person to the rest of the team that could
(17:34):
be causing so much damage in the meantime, then it
might not even be worth waiting until you have the
skills developed on the team to take care of what
they're going to be leaving behind, and you have to
just to deal with it, because again, it's easy to
teach skills. It's a lot harder to teach positivity to
a person who is just kind of hell bent on
being negative because whatever they've gone through, they're.
Speaker 2 (17:56):
Kind of past the point of no return absolutely, and
with that brings us This episode is one minute hack.
But first a few words from our sponsors.
Speaker 3 (18:03):
All Right, if you're leader of people and you're trying
to solve an issue of negativity on your team, once
you've determined where the negativity is coming from, the one
or two or three people that is kind of spreading
from there, the first thing to do is to have
conversations with each of them and set very very realistic,
almost baby step expectations on what the expectations are from
(18:25):
you going forward from an attitude standpoint.
Speaker 1 (18:27):
And the reason why they.
Speaker 3 (18:28):
Have to be really baby steps is because all you're
trying to do in this first interaction is determined whether
or not the person has the desire to change. If
you start out with what all of the expectations are,
then it's possible that because of the person's experience, because
of the lack of skills or lack of learnings or
lack of leadership they've had in the past, it's possible
(18:49):
they won't be able to meet all those expectations right away,
and then you could falsely attribute their failure to attitude
when it's actually something else. But if you start with
an expectation that is very small, that that will allow
you to determine whether or not that person actually has
the desire to change, then you will know where your
(19:10):
effort should be should be put and how much effort
should be put into developing them. So if if you
can determine that they do have the desire to change,
that sets your road differently on what the course of
action is with them. They need more time necessary, you know,
potentially with you, they need more one on ones with
you to kind of level set and and and talk
out what the what the expectations are and what the
(19:31):
progress is. And you can ask them to give you
specifics about what they've done that they saw as a
positive and you can give them specifics once you've determined
that they do want to make the change and to
become a more positive person. And that's that's actually very
meaningful work to do if you can determine that that's
where a person is in their own head. But if
at that after that first interaction you determine that they
(19:52):
don't have the ability to move past even this one
baby step, then first it allows you to put your
effort towards make making sure that they kind of either
leave the team you know, with grace and dignity, or
leave their team involuntarily if they're unable to make those changes,
you know, very quickly, and put your effort and focus
of you know, leadership and development and training into the
(20:13):
people who actually want it and who will actually get
something from it, as opposed to somebody where where it's
kind of you know, falling on deaf ears and so
determining the motivation of the person first is key to
making sure that the effort you're putting in is actually
fruitful effort and and not you know, you know, wasted time.
Speaker 2 (20:30):
Yeah, I think it's such an important part is people
people have to be open and willing to want to
change and be a part of wherever the team is going.
And that's not to say that you don't put any
effort in. I think to your point, like, you have
to put some effort in, right, but then it has
to be matched, and it has to be matched quickly.
It's like, if I'm going to put forth this effort
(20:51):
to help us move forward, and I'm not asking for
all of the effort right now, but I am asking
for some and I need to see that reciprocated. And
I think that's the point around saying, well, this is
what I need to see from you, but also here's
what we're not going to stand for anymore, Like we're
not going to allow this type of behavior. So even
if it's not this out of the gate, somebody's running like, okay,
(21:13):
now I was I was negative, now I'm super positive. No, No,
that's not realistic. In a lot of instances. What is
realistic is to say like, hey, maybe I'm not super
positive yet, but I'm not going to do these negative
things anymore. And that to me is a step in
the right direction. And that allows for an opportunity to say, Okay,
now I'm willing to invest a little bit more. And
(21:34):
again I can't can't walk into the investment and put
all my chips in right like and and but that's
that's a conversation to have to say, like, I'm willing
to continue to invest as you also invest. But the
minute that you stop investing, the minute that you fall
back into negative behaviors, the minute that you feel like
you know you're going to push back on the places
that we're going we're going to have another conversation about it.
(21:55):
So you're kind of also laying out you know what
this looks like, and you know, to your point, like
the choice they have in front of them to do
what's best and to make a decision that's going to
help them be more successful in the future.
Speaker 3 (22:08):
Right, and as a leader, what you can also do
too that might help this, because yeah, it's it's hard
for a person who is negative in general to change
their own mindset overnight. So if the expectation is what
is more along the lines of what they're allowed to
say and do around other people, then that that is
(22:28):
a real realistic expectation what they're allowed to say and
do around other people. It might not be as realistic
to tell them you have to change the way your
mind thinks about this and you have to be more
positive in your mind. You can't help the way you feel,
and the way you feel is a result of all
the experiences that you've had. But as a leader, you
can say to that person, hey, you know what, anytime
you're feeling this way, something triggered it, something happened.
Speaker 1 (22:51):
That made you feel this way.
Speaker 3 (22:53):
And if you have the ability to bite your tongue
for a minute and not you know, spread that negativity
to your teammates and other people.
Speaker 1 (23:00):
People.
Speaker 3 (23:00):
What I would love for you is to come invent
to me as your leader. Come invent to me all
you can tell me. I'll sit there while you while
you yell and scream and kind of about what's going
on that is bothering you or that, and I might.
Speaker 1 (23:12):
Be able to solve that.
Speaker 3 (23:12):
I might be able to tell you where what information
you're missing that might have led you to this conclusion
that isn't necessarily true. Or I'll vent with you and say,
you know what, that that sucks. I can understand why
that will be frustrating. It's frustrating for me too. Let
me tell you how I get through it, and let's
see if that helps you. And So, if a person
is willing to do that, at the very least, it
(23:32):
shows they want something to change. And as long as
they're willing to not spread their negativity to others and
you can help them through this, you're you're already on
the road to you know, kind of saving that relationship
or saving that person. It's when they're unable to do
those little things like come to you, when they have
an issue that they want to vent about, like you know,
being unable to bite their tongue when it comes to
(23:53):
how they talk to other employees, or how they how
they position, what the what the company or leadership expectation
are two other employees. It's when they're doing those things
and that doesn't stop, that's when you can kind of
say that the desire to change isn't there, and now
it's just miseres looking for.
Speaker 2 (24:09):
Company absolutely and what that b exsists at the end
of this episode, this is hacking leadership. I'm Lorenzo and
I'm Chris, and we'll talk to you all next time.
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