November 12, 2024 • 12 mins
Helping Save Spokane: Homeless By The Numbers
A NonStop Local Exclusive Podcast. NonStop Local KHQ's Sean Owsley sits down with Demetra Maragos to talk about Spokane's Homeless Crisis.
A NonStop Local Exclusive Podcast. NonStop Local KHQ's Sean Owsley sits down with Demetra Maragos to talk about Spokane's Homeless Crisis.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Use a really easy word, scary.
Speaker 2 (00:02):
Homelessness and Spokane is affecting everyone. According to the city's
most recent point in time count, there's been a fifteen
percent decrease over the last year. Good news, right, that's
so fast.
Speaker 1 (00:12):
It's not necessarily a completely accurate reflection of what's happening.
Speaker 2 (00:16):
But if officials say the numbers don't paint an accurate picture,
how do you show what's getting better?
Speaker 3 (00:21):
That is the question as we delve into homelessness by
the numbers. I'm Sean Ousley and this is a NonStop
local KHQ podcast helping save Spokane. Do I mean? Now?
Is non stop local reporter to meet Maragos who looked
into the homeless issue, talked to the city, talked to
a business owner that's been inundated by this issue. Demitri,
First of all, thanks for being with us.
Speaker 1 (00:43):
I'm so happy to be here. It's great to send
a little time with you.
Speaker 3 (00:45):
Sean.
Speaker 1 (00:45):
You don't get to do this very often.
Speaker 3 (00:46):
I know it's a kind of a different format, but
such an important topic, and you really spent a number
of days looking into the homeless crisis, the effects of it,
the long reaching impact on business owners. You got response
from the city, just big picture. What was your takeaway
from the story that you did.
Speaker 2 (01:04):
Yeah, Sean, you know, I think that when we look
into these types of stories regarding homelessness, whether it be
business owners residents in Spokane, we get a lot of
the emotional side, how is this affecting you?
Speaker 1 (01:13):
What's happening? But what we really did to the story
we flipped it a little bit. What are the numbers?
What story does that tell us?
Speaker 2 (01:20):
So what we did is we looked at the last
eight point in timecounts from twenty sixteen to twenty twenty four. Now,
what we saw from twenty twenty three to twenty twenty
four is a fifteen percent decrease in the city's homeless population.
When you talk to business owners, that doesn't necessarily resonate
with them. They say, it feels like it's actually getting worse.
Speaker 3 (01:39):
On the day to day basis. I know, the business
owner you talked to is basically get right on that
near Second and Division corridor. What she told you doesn't
align with a decrease in the numbers.
Speaker 2 (01:51):
What did she tell you so, Mimi yours she is
an amazing a train dancer, own Thrown Ballet studio. She
calls crime check a day. On a good day, that's
four hundred calls a year. Those are our resources going
to a very important issue. But for her, she's saying,
what are we missing here? When are we going to
take action to make this better? Because I have comat
there needs to be a balance between having compassion and
(02:14):
also having results because this crisis really now is embedded
not only in her business, but in her life.
Speaker 1 (02:20):
She's concerned for her safety.
Speaker 2 (02:22):
She's lost business because students don't want to go there
anymore because of the location. It's a real trickle effect
that I don't think we think about all the time.
Speaker 3 (02:29):
When we aired your report on NonStop Local Cage Q,
my takeaway just from her demeanor, her resting space, you
could since she had compassion for the issue, you could
also sense that the frustration was at an an all
time high. Was that your takeaway being in the room
with her and talking to.
Speaker 2 (02:45):
Her, Yeah, I mean, she certainly remains optimistic. She believes
that the city, you know, can better this crisis and
make it a little bit more manageable. But for her,
she's aid, I think the resounding point that she said
to me was like, why are we waiting so long,
what are we waiting for? This is affecting my bottom line.
You know, everybody has been impacted by homelessness. We all
(03:06):
know somebody you know in our in our ether. But
why why are we not doing anything right now? And
if we are doing something, maybe we need to shift course.
Speaker 3 (03:17):
I want you to pull up the numbers. I know
you have them with you right now as we talk
about them, and the statistics are important. There are a
couple of different sides saying they may not necessarily be accurate,
but just give us the numbers that you reported in
your story.
Speaker 1 (03:32):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (03:32):
So again, that big piece that I think shocked everybody
is that fifteen percent decrease in the last from twenty
twenty three to twenty twenty four. In the last eight years, though,
we've seen a one hundred and six percent rise in
the homeless population. So that's from twenty sixteen to twenty
twenty four. That's a pretty big big jump. And I
mean you can attribute some of that to Spokane has
grown a lot in the last eight years, but over
(03:54):
one hundred percent jump, that's that was pretty staggering to
look at.
Speaker 3 (03:58):
But if you travel downtown, that'll lines with kind of
visually what everybody lives here and call Spokane home is seeing.
Right now, let's go to the city, you touch space
with them. Just their response to your report to the
frustration of business owners, what was their bottom line response
to that?
Speaker 2 (04:15):
You know, I was pretty shocked by what the city
had to say, in the sense said this point incount timecount.
It's federally mandated, they have to do this. And they
said it's actually not that accurate. And they understand that
they use a different system, a homeless management information system
that gives them a fuller scope of the story, but
they only do this essentially because it's federally mandated. And
(04:38):
they said, you know, when you are relying on first
of all, when you're lying on people to do account,
it's a single snapshot. It's one night in January that
impacts that too. Doing account in January versus doing account
in July, you're going to have different numbers. There's so
many different factors that skew this information.
Speaker 3 (04:55):
They also said that people could be missed or double counted.
Speaker 1 (04:59):
Not necessarily but missed.
Speaker 2 (05:01):
They certainly could be missed because it really is a
lot of the John Kinder, who I spoke to from
the city. She told me a lot of these their
college students who do these counts. So you know, if
you may if I were in that position and I'm
doing this count, there may be certain areas that I
may not want to go to and feel unsafe going to,
so I avoid them. But obviously you want to get
(05:21):
the full scope. But there's so many different factors when
you're relying on people to collect that data.
Speaker 3 (05:26):
It does seems, you know, there's it's scattered over a
number of city blocks, and it's worked, It's worked its
way up to Shade. I've seen in Shadle Park people
are staying there. Some of the other parks, Franklin Park
up north, it's it's it's migrated its way out of
the downtown metro core, but that is where it is
hyper centered right now. The city and Dawn specifically, did
(05:48):
she give you kind of a focus of where they're
going on this issue, what they planned to do. I
know that I've reported that Mayor Brown has obviously closed
the track shelter. You're familiar with that and going to
a scattered housing model. Just from your experience bigger picture,
maybe not this specific report, but what you've been told
on that issue because I think where are we going
(06:11):
is an important.
Speaker 2 (06:11):
Question, absolutely, and that's something that Don and I talked
about briefly when I spoke to her. I mean, she
said explicitly what we have been doing is not working.
And I think also what people are missing. We are
battling here and Spokane a crisis on two fronts, a
homelessess crisis and also an opioid crisis. The homeless system
was built to deal with unsheltered people. It was not
(06:35):
built to deal with addictions. So there are two different things.
So with this scattered site model, which we did talk
about in this piece, so smaller shelters all throughout the city,
and what they do they send them to a navigation
site and they taper their needs to watch shelter because
a unhoused veteran is going to need very different things
than an unhouse mother with three kids. Those two people
cannot be treated in the same at the same shelter.
(06:58):
Or somebody dealing with addiction. This is a layered issue
that the city is really trying to combat on all fronts.
Speaker 3 (07:06):
Well, I think you hit the nail on the head there.
Every individual case of why somebody is on the streets
is without a house, without a home is different. The
factors that led them to that are different. Whether it
is being priced out of house, being priced out of
being able to afford to pay the rent much less
(07:29):
food and bills, or a path of addiction where it's fentanyl.
It's at the opioid crisis. I know that I've interviewed
members of the US District Attorney's Office of Eastern Washington saying,
we have a funnel right now that basically comes up
through Oregon, through the tri Cities, it makes its way
into Spokane, it makes its way into North Idaho of fentanyl.
(07:52):
And that fentanyl is it's mixed down there by the
drug cartels and a vat, so you can have a
hot shot pill that can be fatal another one that
has no trace of fentanyl. How do you know? They say,
it's basically roulette with your life. So the fentanyl issue,
on the poverty issue or lack of affordability issue are
a couple of things. And I think for me, my
(08:14):
takeaway from the numerous interviews and conversations that I've had
is when every case is different, how do you help
somebody get that step in the right direction. First of all,
I it's addiction. They've got to want to come out
of that. Until they do, you can connect them them
(08:34):
as many services. If they're not going to embrace that,
it's not going to be successful. You're going to be
right back at square one. Just your bottom line takeaway
on that piece of this complicated puzzle.
Speaker 2 (08:44):
Yeah, I think what the city's doing with that, from
my understanding after having conversations with them, is they're hoping
by having this navigation site and being able to tailor
this process for everybody is going to make that difference.
So if you are battling addiction, Okay, here's a safe
house for you to go to if you are. You know,
I spoke to a veteran who was not battling addiction,
but they had worked on a farm since the early
(09:05):
nineties and it was sold from under them.
Speaker 1 (09:07):
They had nowhere to go.
Speaker 2 (09:08):
They're at the Cannon Shelter and they said, you know,
everything that I need is here.
Speaker 1 (09:13):
Every day.
Speaker 2 (09:13):
Somebody is working to get me housing. Because for him,
he was like, I don't know, I don't know what
these processes are complicated, I don't know where to go.
Versus having this all these resources under one roof enables
me to be housed quicker. And I think that was
like a huge eye opener.
Speaker 3 (09:31):
I want to expand on that and the veterans specifically
that you talked to. That's stunning to me. You going
from owning a farm, having a farm, working on a farm,
to homeless. It shows you the fine line from being housed,
being warm, and being on the streets. His mindset. Was
he optimistic that he could come out of it? Where
(09:53):
was he in the journey?
Speaker 1 (09:54):
Yeah, he was incredibly optimistic.
Speaker 2 (09:55):
He was actually a track before and he said that
facility was traumatic, but it was not somewhere he wanted
to be. And so moving to the Cannon Street shelter,
which is now the main navigation site, he said, you know, clothes.
Speaker 1 (10:10):
Mouths don't get fed.
Speaker 2 (10:11):
If I ask for something, it happens again, like I
said earlier, every day somebody is working for me to
get house. I'm confident that that is going to happen
for me more than I was three weeks ago, four
months ago.
Speaker 1 (10:23):
You know, being in this situation.
Speaker 3 (10:26):
It is a lot of information for people to digest.
It is, I say, the pre eminent issue of our
city and of our time right now, and it's so
complicated because the backstory that we just laid out, people
come from all different areas. People are dealing with so
many different complex issues that they end up on the streets,
(10:47):
they end up homeless. People have compassion, but if you're
inundated with it over and over, I've seen people just
get their frustrations boiling over. You tell you put all
those things in the rest. It is a complex issue
to solve. Your bottom line takeaway from what you learned
as you researched your story that we aired on NonStop
(11:08):
Local KHQ, what's your bottom line on this? Jshon.
Speaker 4 (11:11):
I think what my takeaway from this is that if
you feel like the situation is getting worse, you're not alone.
And the numbers that we receive from this point in
time count really don't paint a full picture not only
of the crisis, but how the system.
Speaker 2 (11:26):
Is working and the city is. You know, they're changing course,
they're working on, you know, finding different pathways to help
assist with resolving this crisis, but it's going to take time.
This is not an overnight fix, and the timeline of that,
I think is what is incredibly frustrating for people.
Speaker 3 (11:47):
Well, obviously they are shifting strategy right now. I'll be
interviewing Mayor Brown later this month in depth on that strategy,
why she thinks it will be successful, and why they're
implementing that. Also looking at some other cities that have
had success in that, and we'll flush that out at
a later date. But Demitra Keen insight on an issue
(12:08):
that is such a challenge for our region, for the
people that love it here, that call it home. But
you know, there are a lot of challenges for business owners,
for people that just want to go downtown, for city leaders.
It's so complex. Thanks for being with us here on
the podcast.
Speaker 1 (12:22):
Thanks for having me.
Speaker 3 (12:24):
Saving Spokane Finding Solutions to the Homeless Crisis, a NonStop,
local exclusive podcast
Use a really easy word, scary.
Speaker 2 (00:02):
Homelessness and Spokane is affecting everyone. According to the city's
most recent point in time count, there's been a fifteen
percent decrease over the last year. Good news, right, that's
so fast.
Speaker 1 (00:12):
It's not necessarily a completely accurate reflection of what's happening.
Speaker 2 (00:16):
But if officials say the numbers don't paint an accurate picture,
how do you show what's getting better?
Speaker 3 (00:21):
That is the question as we delve into homelessness by
the numbers. I'm Sean Ousley and this is a NonStop
local KHQ podcast helping save Spokane. Do I mean? Now?
Is non stop local reporter to meet Maragos who looked
into the homeless issue, talked to the city, talked to
a business owner that's been inundated by this issue. Demitri,
First of all, thanks for being with us.
Speaker 1 (00:43):
I'm so happy to be here. It's great to send
a little time with you.
Speaker 3 (00:45):
Sean.
Speaker 1 (00:45):
You don't get to do this very often.
Speaker 3 (00:46):
I know it's a kind of a different format, but
such an important topic, and you really spent a number
of days looking into the homeless crisis, the effects of it,
the long reaching impact on business owners. You got response
from the city, just big picture. What was your takeaway
from the story that you did.
Speaker 2 (01:04):
Yeah, Sean, you know, I think that when we look
into these types of stories regarding homelessness, whether it be
business owners residents in Spokane, we get a lot of
the emotional side, how is this affecting you?
Speaker 1 (01:13):
What's happening? But what we really did to the story
we flipped it a little bit. What are the numbers?
What story does that tell us?
Speaker 2 (01:20):
So what we did is we looked at the last
eight point in timecounts from twenty sixteen to twenty twenty four. Now,
what we saw from twenty twenty three to twenty twenty
four is a fifteen percent decrease in the city's homeless population.
When you talk to business owners, that doesn't necessarily resonate
with them. They say, it feels like it's actually getting worse.
Speaker 3 (01:39):
On the day to day basis. I know, the business
owner you talked to is basically get right on that
near Second and Division corridor. What she told you doesn't
align with a decrease in the numbers.
Speaker 2 (01:51):
What did she tell you so, Mimi yours she is
an amazing a train dancer, own Thrown Ballet studio. She
calls crime check a day. On a good day, that's
four hundred calls a year. Those are our resources going
to a very important issue. But for her, she's saying,
what are we missing here? When are we going to
take action to make this better? Because I have comat
there needs to be a balance between having compassion and
(02:14):
also having results because this crisis really now is embedded
not only in her business, but in her life.
Speaker 1 (02:20):
She's concerned for her safety.
Speaker 2 (02:22):
She's lost business because students don't want to go there
anymore because of the location. It's a real trickle effect
that I don't think we think about all the time.
Speaker 3 (02:29):
When we aired your report on NonStop Local Cage Q,
my takeaway just from her demeanor, her resting space, you
could since she had compassion for the issue, you could
also sense that the frustration was at an an all
time high. Was that your takeaway being in the room
with her and talking to.
Speaker 2 (02:45):
Her, Yeah, I mean, she certainly remains optimistic. She believes
that the city, you know, can better this crisis and
make it a little bit more manageable. But for her,
she's aid, I think the resounding point that she said
to me was like, why are we waiting so long,
what are we waiting for? This is affecting my bottom line.
You know, everybody has been impacted by homelessness. We all
(03:06):
know somebody you know in our in our ether. But
why why are we not doing anything right now? And
if we are doing something, maybe we need to shift course.
Speaker 3 (03:17):
I want you to pull up the numbers. I know
you have them with you right now as we talk
about them, and the statistics are important. There are a
couple of different sides saying they may not necessarily be accurate,
but just give us the numbers that you reported in
your story.
Speaker 1 (03:32):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (03:32):
So again, that big piece that I think shocked everybody
is that fifteen percent decrease in the last from twenty
twenty three to twenty twenty four. In the last eight years, though,
we've seen a one hundred and six percent rise in
the homeless population. So that's from twenty sixteen to twenty
twenty four. That's a pretty big big jump. And I
mean you can attribute some of that to Spokane has
grown a lot in the last eight years, but over
(03:54):
one hundred percent jump, that's that was pretty staggering to
look at.
Speaker 3 (03:58):
But if you travel downtown, that'll lines with kind of
visually what everybody lives here and call Spokane home is seeing.
Right now, let's go to the city, you touch space
with them. Just their response to your report to the
frustration of business owners, what was their bottom line response
to that?
Speaker 2 (04:15):
You know, I was pretty shocked by what the city
had to say, in the sense said this point incount timecount.
It's federally mandated, they have to do this. And they
said it's actually not that accurate. And they understand that
they use a different system, a homeless management information system
that gives them a fuller scope of the story, but
they only do this essentially because it's federally mandated. And
(04:38):
they said, you know, when you are relying on first
of all, when you're lying on people to do account,
it's a single snapshot. It's one night in January that
impacts that too. Doing account in January versus doing account
in July, you're going to have different numbers. There's so
many different factors that skew this information.
Speaker 3 (04:55):
They also said that people could be missed or double counted.
Speaker 1 (04:59):
Not necessarily but missed.
Speaker 2 (05:01):
They certainly could be missed because it really is a
lot of the John Kinder, who I spoke to from
the city. She told me a lot of these their
college students who do these counts. So you know, if
you may if I were in that position and I'm
doing this count, there may be certain areas that I
may not want to go to and feel unsafe going to,
so I avoid them. But obviously you want to get
(05:21):
the full scope. But there's so many different factors when
you're relying on people to collect that data.
Speaker 3 (05:26):
It does seems, you know, there's it's scattered over a
number of city blocks, and it's worked, It's worked its
way up to Shade. I've seen in Shadle Park people
are staying there. Some of the other parks, Franklin Park
up north, it's it's it's migrated its way out of
the downtown metro core, but that is where it is
hyper centered right now. The city and Dawn specifically, did
(05:48):
she give you kind of a focus of where they're
going on this issue, what they planned to do. I
know that I've reported that Mayor Brown has obviously closed
the track shelter. You're familiar with that and going to
a scattered housing model. Just from your experience bigger picture,
maybe not this specific report, but what you've been told
on that issue because I think where are we going
(06:11):
is an important.
Speaker 2 (06:11):
Question, absolutely, and that's something that Don and I talked
about briefly when I spoke to her. I mean, she
said explicitly what we have been doing is not working.
And I think also what people are missing. We are
battling here and Spokane a crisis on two fronts, a
homelessess crisis and also an opioid crisis. The homeless system
was built to deal with unsheltered people. It was not
(06:35):
built to deal with addictions. So there are two different things.
So with this scattered site model, which we did talk
about in this piece, so smaller shelters all throughout the city,
and what they do they send them to a navigation
site and they taper their needs to watch shelter because
a unhoused veteran is going to need very different things
than an unhouse mother with three kids. Those two people
cannot be treated in the same at the same shelter.
(06:58):
Or somebody dealing with addiction. This is a layered issue
that the city is really trying to combat on all fronts.
Speaker 3 (07:06):
Well, I think you hit the nail on the head there.
Every individual case of why somebody is on the streets
is without a house, without a home is different. The
factors that led them to that are different. Whether it
is being priced out of house, being priced out of
being able to afford to pay the rent much less
(07:29):
food and bills, or a path of addiction where it's fentanyl.
It's at the opioid crisis. I know that I've interviewed
members of the US District Attorney's Office of Eastern Washington saying,
we have a funnel right now that basically comes up
through Oregon, through the tri Cities, it makes its way
into Spokane, it makes its way into North Idaho of fentanyl.
(07:52):
And that fentanyl is it's mixed down there by the
drug cartels and a vat, so you can have a
hot shot pill that can be fatal another one that
has no trace of fentanyl. How do you know? They say,
it's basically roulette with your life. So the fentanyl issue,
on the poverty issue or lack of affordability issue are
a couple of things. And I think for me, my
(08:14):
takeaway from the numerous interviews and conversations that I've had
is when every case is different, how do you help
somebody get that step in the right direction. First of all,
I it's addiction. They've got to want to come out
of that. Until they do, you can connect them them
(08:34):
as many services. If they're not going to embrace that,
it's not going to be successful. You're going to be
right back at square one. Just your bottom line takeaway
on that piece of this complicated puzzle.
Speaker 2 (08:44):
Yeah, I think what the city's doing with that, from
my understanding after having conversations with them, is they're hoping
by having this navigation site and being able to tailor
this process for everybody is going to make that difference.
So if you are battling addiction, Okay, here's a safe
house for you to go to if you are. You know,
I spoke to a veteran who was not battling addiction,
but they had worked on a farm since the early
(09:05):
nineties and it was sold from under them.
Speaker 1 (09:07):
They had nowhere to go.
Speaker 2 (09:08):
They're at the Cannon Shelter and they said, you know,
everything that I need is here.
Speaker 1 (09:13):
Every day.
Speaker 2 (09:13):
Somebody is working to get me housing. Because for him,
he was like, I don't know, I don't know what
these processes are complicated, I don't know where to go.
Versus having this all these resources under one roof enables
me to be housed quicker. And I think that was
like a huge eye opener.
Speaker 3 (09:31):
I want to expand on that and the veterans specifically
that you talked to. That's stunning to me. You going
from owning a farm, having a farm, working on a farm,
to homeless. It shows you the fine line from being housed,
being warm, and being on the streets. His mindset. Was
he optimistic that he could come out of it? Where
(09:53):
was he in the journey?
Speaker 1 (09:54):
Yeah, he was incredibly optimistic.
Speaker 2 (09:55):
He was actually a track before and he said that
facility was traumatic, but it was not somewhere he wanted
to be. And so moving to the Cannon Street shelter,
which is now the main navigation site, he said, you know, clothes.
Speaker 1 (10:10):
Mouths don't get fed.
Speaker 2 (10:11):
If I ask for something, it happens again, like I
said earlier, every day somebody is working for me to
get house. I'm confident that that is going to happen
for me more than I was three weeks ago, four
months ago.
Speaker 1 (10:23):
You know, being in this situation.
Speaker 3 (10:26):
It is a lot of information for people to digest.
It is, I say, the pre eminent issue of our
city and of our time right now, and it's so
complicated because the backstory that we just laid out, people
come from all different areas. People are dealing with so
many different complex issues that they end up on the streets,
(10:47):
they end up homeless. People have compassion, but if you're
inundated with it over and over, I've seen people just
get their frustrations boiling over. You tell you put all
those things in the rest. It is a complex issue
to solve. Your bottom line takeaway from what you learned
as you researched your story that we aired on NonStop
(11:08):
Local KHQ, what's your bottom line on this? Jshon.
Speaker 4 (11:11):
I think what my takeaway from this is that if
you feel like the situation is getting worse, you're not alone.
And the numbers that we receive from this point in
time count really don't paint a full picture not only
of the crisis, but how the system.
Speaker 2 (11:26):
Is working and the city is. You know, they're changing course,
they're working on, you know, finding different pathways to help
assist with resolving this crisis, but it's going to take time.
This is not an overnight fix, and the timeline of that,
I think is what is incredibly frustrating for people.
Speaker 3 (11:47):
Well, obviously they are shifting strategy right now. I'll be
interviewing Mayor Brown later this month in depth on that strategy,
why she thinks it will be successful, and why they're
implementing that. Also looking at some other cities that have
had success in that, and we'll flush that out at
a later date. But Demitra Keen insight on an issue
(12:08):
that is such a challenge for our region, for the
people that love it here, that call it home. But
you know, there are a lot of challenges for business owners,
for people that just want to go downtown, for city leaders.
It's so complex. Thanks for being with us here on
the podcast.
Speaker 1 (12:22):
Thanks for having me.
Speaker 3 (12:24):
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