April 29, 2024 • 32 mins
Prepare to be inspired by the remarkable journey of Bonnie-Jill Laflin - a true trailblazer who has shattered glass ceilings and left an indelible mark on the sports industry. From becoming the first female NBA scout to earning multiple championship rings, Bonnie-Jill's unwavering passion and determination have propelled her to unprecedented heights.
As a pioneering sports broadcaster, philanthropist, and TV personality, she has captivated audiences with her charismatic personality and unparalleled expertise. Bonnie-Jill's remarkable accomplishments, including being the first woman to dance professionally for three teams in two sports, serve as a testament to the power of following your dreams and breaking down barriers.
Join Kate, Megan, and Bonnie-Jill as they delve into her inspiring story, exploring the challenges she has overcome and the milestones she has achieved. Prepare to be motivated and empowered by Bonnie-Jill's trailblazing journey, and discover how her unwavering spirit can inspire us all to reach for the stars.
As a pioneering sports broadcaster, philanthropist, and TV personality, she has captivated audiences with her charismatic personality and unparalleled expertise. Bonnie-Jill's remarkable accomplishments, including being the first woman to dance professionally for three teams in two sports, serve as a testament to the power of following your dreams and breaking down barriers.
Join Kate, Megan, and Bonnie-Jill as they delve into her inspiring story, exploring the challenges she has overcome and the milestones she has achieved. Prepare to be motivated and empowered by Bonnie-Jill's trailblazing journey, and discover how her unwavering spirit can inspire us all to reach for the stars.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
Hey y'all, Bonnie Dill, Laughlin here.
(00:03):
First and only she knows scout in the NBA,
and current sports reporter, and host,
and this is her cable.
Now you see her.
(upbeat music)
You are magnificent!
(upbeat music)
Welcome to her tape,
the podcast that shines a spotlight
on the badass women who are redefining the game.
Join hosts, Kate Foley, and Megan Martinez
(00:25):
as Payon Locke, the Secrets of Success
of the brightest female pioneers in the industry.
Welcome back to her table.
We are so excited to welcome Bonnie Dill,
Laughlin to the show today.
Bonnie was one of the first and only female NBA scouts
where she held a front office executive position
with the Los Angeles Lakers.
She holds so many firsts,
like which is the first first, Megan?
(00:46):
I don't know, which is the first first,
but she was the first female
to be awarded six championship rings
in two professional sports,
earning a Super Bowl ring during her time
with the 49ers.
And five, that's right ladies and gentlemen,
five NBA championship rings
as an executive for the Los Angeles Lakers.
Beyond her accomplishments in sports,
(01:07):
Bonnie Dill also ventured into the world of broadcasting.
She has worked as a reporter and host
for various high profile networks,
including ESPN and Fox Sports.
What hasn't she done?
I came in to learn more about Bonnie Dill,
so let's get started.
Welcome to her table.
(upbeat music)
Bonnie Dill, I'm so excited to have you on her table today.
(01:27):
Thanks for joining us.
- Thank you, it's excited when you all reached out.
I love what Jotter Dillin and Powering Women in Sports
right at my alley, so thanks for having me all.
- Yes.
- It's just you all, Megan.
It's another girl.
I love me.
I say you all all the time, so I feel yes.
- We're good.
Yeah, I say you all the time, fix them.
I just, sometimes I can't help it.
Not on hair, like, second show, like producers,
(01:49):
when I've said you all up by accident,
like what, you're not in the cell right now.
We're in the cell, we're in the cell.
And I'm like, sorry.
(laughing)
That's amazing.
Bonnie Dill, you have done so much in your career.
You're still doing so much.
We talked briefly about you writing a book
and we'll get into that.
But I want to talk about how you were the first
and only MBA scout for the Lakers.
(02:10):
Let's do a deep dive into that
'cause I'm so excited to hear about it.
- Yeah, so being the first female scout
with the Lakers, it was crazy because when I first started,
I was actually doing a pre-imposed game for the Lakers.
So it was K-Cal K-PBS, which is a flagship for the Lakers.
And they love how I can break down the triangle offense
and Phil Jackson liked how they saw that I for talent.
(02:32):
And they're like, if you're about about scouting
and I'm like, no, I mean, I love talk about players,
but I haven't really thought about that
because there's no other female.
So you don't even, you don't even need at that point.
You didn't really think about that, which is, you know,
it's kind of inherent, but at the same time,
you're just not thinking, you know, the big scope of things.
So they said, well, why don't you scout for us
for, you know, this season and see how it goes.
And it was pack 10 at the time, which is actually,
(02:54):
you know, nope, there's no pack 10, there's no back 12,
there's nothing.
But, and big 12 conferences, and they tried me out for a year.
I wasn't getting paid.
It was kind of like the intern, the shift sort of speak.
And I proved myself, which was fine.
I like always prove myself.
And they liked my scat of reports and saw that I did have
that I for talent.
And they sent me to a five year deal, five year deal.
(03:14):
And it been with the Lakers at 13 years.
I got five championship rings with them.
And it was some of the best memories.
They also end up deciding me to be in the assistant
GM for our Julie team, Los Angeles defenders.
And so I was able to go through CBA contracts.
Kate, what you know, you know, so many things,
cutting players running practices.
I mean, you name it, they had me doing it, which was great,
(03:37):
because I feel like in sports, it's very important
to be multifaceted if you want to have longevity.
You know, otherwise, sometimes if you can only do one thing,
that's it, right?
So it's like for me, like even in media, like I've always
just felt like it's great to be multifaceted
and have different layers of your career.
And so I was lucky to be a assistant
GM for Julie team and also a scout.
(03:58):
And like I said, it was a tough path.
A lot of hoops and hurdles and definitely not as glamorous
as you people think are like, oh, you were a scout for the Lakers.
I'm like, what do you think we're doing?
I'm like, I'm getting like on red eyed flights driving
this rental car in the middle of like nowhere.
Like I don't even know if you like some behind me's following
and they kill me.
Then checking into a hotel that I super diced
(04:20):
sometime because they don't sometimes have
a four seasons or a red.
So yeah, and then I'm dressing like a guy to be accepted.
So no, it's not glamorous at all.
Like it's not what you think.
And they see that I got five rings and you know,
that I'm good friends with, you know, certain people
in the league.
So they think it's glamorous, but it's not, you know.
So it's a, it's funny how there's that whole scene
(04:42):
of quote before that people don't realize
which you win through to get where you're at now.
And so they see, they don't see all of the blood
soine tears, I should say, sort of speak before you get
to the point where you're happy.
And maybe not even that because with me,
I never liked the videocracy or never being complacent.
So it's always, you know, going to the next level
and striving to be better.
But that wasn't the long answer, but kind of a lot of the
(05:05):
idea.
You missed that.
You missed the hot dogs.
I went through this this weekend with the final four here
in Phoenix.
I was like, if I have to eat one more hot dog, French fry,
you know, they're taking the water top off my waters.
And I'm just like, I'm just annoyed at this point.
I just want like to be regular.
So it's after you sit in these gyms, and it's funny
(05:26):
because we were doing a player appearance with one of our clients.
And we're in the back of the house going through all the boxes
are, like it's not glamorous.
Then you come out behind a curtain and it's a beautiful fan
fest.
But for us to get there was like, you know, the trashes on the side,
the boxes are on the side.
And it's I feel like TV shows, Bonnie Jill, have made like the
glamorous side of sports.
(05:47):
And there is.
I'm not saying there is no.
Because I've been on the big old lady's world.
Yeah, they see a stressed out for heels and fun.
But like they just see like anything else.
And you made such a great point, Kate, because I am so into like my
workouts and my trying to eat healthy.
I mean, I'm sure.
I mean, I love Sarah Patch Kids.
That's like my little thing.
I go to him in the mornings, I don't drink coffee like Megan
(06:09):
knows.
But it's like you're trying to be like on a routine.
It is everything but a routine because you can't with our schedules
everything's different.
It's like people say, what's your day to day life?
Like there's no such thing, right?
Because it's different all the time.
So when you're on the road, like trying to work out in one of the
gyms, we're like, you know what I mean?
It's like you're on a, like, it's just hard.
It's just, you know, there's no time to like be able to set your
(06:31):
schedule.
So it makes you kind of crazy at time.
Well, even if you set it, it's always the intangibles.
Your flight's delayed.
There's a game.
I mean, it's, it's you have to be very like flexible and in a
war.
It's funny.
It's a sportsman with self structured, but you yourself have to be
flexible.
Oh, so close.
Of course my room's not ready.
(06:51):
Sure.
I'll take this room and so on.
You know, I mean, like you just have to be ready.
We'll take your back.
I think that's awesome.
But I have no makeup on it.
I look like a cheesy monster right now.
I'm on a red.
I would like to like take a shower and get ready.
Like, well, you could get ready in our, oh, oh, when the hotel
lobby about things.
Sure.
I would like a homeless person, but okay, I'll do that for now.
(07:11):
So it's like, you know, it's like, and then you have to be all like, I
don't know, on your game.
And as a woman, you know, there's always so much scrutiny, you know, already.
So it's like trying to make sure that you're just perfect.
If that makes sense, like, so it's tough.
It's a part of me, perfect all the time.
But yet, we try to achieve that.
Why do you think that is?
It's funny.
(07:32):
I asked myself this question of like, why do I put this pressure on
myself?
I went to the gym last night and a full sweat outfit and they
thought something goes wrong with me.
Because it's so funny.
And they're like, oh, are you okay?
And I'm like, what?
I'm just in a full black sweat outfit and tennis shoes.
It's 10 o'clock at night.
It's like, I'm over this right now.
And they're like, yeah, you know, I think that the pressure being, you know, in
the public eye, being on camera, being like, I was dual-girled.
(07:55):
My mom had me in Patience, like I was three years old with like, you
know, extensions and fake eyelashes winking at like six-year-old men.
You know what I mean?
So it's like, yeah, that's weird, right?
Now, really weird.
You know, but I've been talking to his normal.
And so it's like doing that and then going to with my horses and play stop-baw and
basketball.
I was doing so many things and I felt like you wanted to perfect everything you
(08:17):
did.
And then as you grow into, especially me being in the entertainment industry as
well, it's like, you've got this pressure to have a certain way, to look a certain way.
And it's like, you're always told you're not good enough.
Whatever that may be, you know, you're not the direction we want.
Because you're not the race you want or you're not the height we want or you're not, you
know what I mean?
(08:37):
There's always trying to like figure out to be perfect.
And so when you do that, you almost kind of overcompensate.
And with that, it's like, you know, it can make you kind of mad at times and crazy because
you're trying to like keep up with everything and stay relevant and do your social media
and work out.
And you've seen that meme of that girl like driving crazy.
It's like, I'm trying to do all this and still keep my sanity.
And it's tough.
(08:58):
And then still trying to like, you know, get over one thing.
And it's like, there's only so many hours in the day.
Yeah.
Or just being normal.
You know what I mean?
Like, that's my biggest struggle is like, my best friends don't work in sports.
They don't, they work in regular corporate America jobs.
So my life is insane to them.
And I'm like, this is just normal.
Like I don't know how to do anything else.
(09:20):
And so trying to find that balance of like, what is extra to them is like, that's the
more everyone stays, you thrive on stress.
And I'm like, yeah, I do.
I was thrive on like, I can't sit still.
Like I love, I don't know.
It's there's something you think as you get older, you would grow out of that.
But it's no, but it's like, I love that.
And my friends are like, well, I live through you on social media because I've got four kids.
(09:45):
And you know, my night out of the town is like pizza after soccer practice here.
Whatever, like with their kids.
And that's fine.
But I chose at one point like, you know, for it was like kind of like that forking the
road where I was either going to like have family and have kids and do that.
And I was like, no, I'm going to take the other route.
And I've been literally married to my career.
But as you get older, now my gosh, I wish I had a little more balance because like we were
(10:06):
talking before, we started filming that like I've kind of ruined a lot of relationships
or they're not fit for me because of my career.
Everything goes back to like, either I don't have time for them because of my career or
they don't understand my career.
But it still goes back to my career.
So it's like a struggle like in trying to balance it.
And you know, at some point you're like, oh, do you want to balance it?
(10:26):
Because it's what you're used to doing and what we know.
And you only like run on one, you know, kind of so under the same over and over again.
And it's hard to get out of it.
How did you get into sports?
I want you because I'm looking at your bio.
I mean, I don't even know where I could just like drop a pen and ask this question because
they knew you have done so many amazing things.
(10:49):
And how did you kind of walk us through our muv age?
I'm going to get a job.
This is kind of what led me to where I am because I think probably a lot of it is not by
design.
It's a lot like most women in sports.
It's by opportunity and chance and curiosity.
Right.
So I mean, if they go way back, you know, being a daddy's girl, you know, that was the all
(11:12):
of us to know when you're with your daddy going all the games.
So going to NBA games and NFL and college and you name it, my dad's own race horses before
I was born.
So I was the little girl who was, you know, going to page into my mom and I was a little
bit thin at the, you know, at the end of the day, I was reading the racing form knowing
how to handicap horses and bet on horses and asking my dad, like when I made money, I
(11:33):
wanted like the old bet on horses and gamble and stuff.
And then my dad, like, this is not normal.
Like what, you know, how old are you?
How old are you?
I knew how to read a racing form pros and I was like five years old.
She's like, Yuppie in the library, Megan.
I can just see this now.
She's like, put your money in, you know, and I was able to go and certainly like, you know,
(11:55):
these horses and odds and my dad was like, oh, you know, because I always saw him doing
it.
So I'm like, you know, then I would go to the mutual and try to bet and I'm like, looking
up and I'm like, kind of, you can't bet.
And I'm like, oh, yeah, I can.
And so they, I'd have to have my dad bet for me.
And I was like, you know, I really just do that.
And it was just funny, you know, because I was just me.
I just loved it.
And then reading like, you know, I used to read, you know, the sports industry did and asking
(12:17):
my dad about why these guys ran the 40 and what does that mean?
And just verticals and like, just things that like normal kids, my age would not be doing.
They'd be going to the games and looking to get con-candier or by the foam finger or
do you know what I mean?
Like, just totally different.
I just was kind of out of the womb with different type of little girl.
And so I knew that I wanted to work in sports and kind of combined both of that to figure
(12:40):
out what I was going to do in sports.
And I was a trailer for the Golden State Warriors and NBA and then went on to the San Francisco
49ers, winning a single ring with them.
I was 18 and then went on after that for two years season with them went to the Dallas Cowboys.
And along the way, even at a young age, I knew about networking and knew about like starting
to build these relationships and, you know, I'm older now.
(13:01):
So I was like, riding notes, like handwritten notes.
There was no email.
I was riding handwritten notes, like my parents had taught me and sending things, you know,
just like trying to keep up with everyone and stuff that I translated into my career because
being friends, the Bartlett family, along the 49ers and the Jones family, who are your friends
of mine, being able to have them.
So I don't care anyone's dead yet.
It helps when you have connections with you.
(13:22):
You're not going to be able to keep your job or get the job, but getting you in the
door and meeting new people and being able to, you know, because networking is everything
in our industry.
I believe.
You know, so I think for that, that really helped me to then get my job over at ESPN.
And it was called Cold Peats at the time, which is now first take, but it was the morning
show for ESPN.
(13:43):
I was a course one there and was doing media.
I'd already got my degree at University of Texas in Austin.
And then from there, I just started to develop what I want to do at media and really wanted
to work in a front office.
And that opportunity came by chance, you know, just because me speaking about the Lakers
and talking about the triangle offense and Mitch Cup check and Jerry West realizing I knew
(14:03):
the game.
And it was just not, you know, not conventional because I wasn't the way that everyone else
would be a scout.
You know, so it was different, but it worked out.
I think God has a way of working things out and it did.
And so from there, it's just my career has been, you know, like I said, multifaceted and
being in media, you know, I know how to write, I know how to shoot, I know to produce, you
(14:26):
know, all of those things that are really important.
And that's why I wanted to write this book because there wasn't someone for me to look up to
when I was scouting.
And so when I was like, okay, you know, I want to write a book so females can know there's
a space for them, the younger generation, whether it's an agent, whether it's a scout, whether,
you know, it's not just an athlete.
There's more, you know, areas to be, you know, to have a career in sports.
(14:47):
And so I was like, let me do this and call it in a league of around.
And I had Billie Jean-Gang as my chapter one.
And then went all the way through with Jean-Giebass and so many different women that have
paint the way that have been the pioneers, trailblazers, and it was really important for me to
kind of highlight all these women because some of the women are older, so they didn't have
social media, you know, like, my non-real, who's the first female to play in NHL hockey game.
(15:08):
They're a lot of people that know that she was, where Julie Cron, the first female,
jockey to win a Breeder's Cup.
So I kind of wanted it to resonate with all different women and be able to have it touch
not just women, I mean, anyone, you know, even males to know how hard with, you know, work
ethic and determination, tenacity, you can kind of accomplish anything.
Yeah, how did you make that transition from being, you know, NFL MBA cheerleader and then
(15:32):
moving into the media space?
And what kind of skills we talk about this lot for our younger listeners, how, like, what
skills did you develop maybe through college or throughout your life that you then kind
of transitioned into your career?
Yeah, definitely.
So obviously going to college and getting my degree, broadcast journalism degree, that
really helped.
You know, it was going through and being and working for these teams, lawyers and the
(15:56):
Niners and the Cowboys and building those relationships and then taking the first job
when I got was the ESPN job and it was nice because it was a small job.
It was just like, okay, we're going to throw to you for some updates.
And then all of a sudden you kind of start to show, no, I can do more than this and you
kind of push your producer and you push, you know, certain people to say, hey, I will do
(16:16):
this as a myth.
I will go get your coffee, but let me also do this as well.
You know, give me a chance.
And so I was writing all my scripts and then finally they started letting me do be a course
one and going out on location and it was more just starting to just push, you know, you
have to kind of, when you want something bad, you got to be aggressive about it and you
have to push, you know, without being obnoxious, but just kind of the same that you deserve
(16:37):
to be there.
But it was a lot of just constant like, you know, hey, hi, I'm here, you know, like, I
don't want to work just one day a week doing this.
I want to work five days a week doing this.
So, but it was a lot of the work ethic.
Like, I was there just like a, you know, a gym rat would be I was there at the studio before
anyone else was there and then I was the last person to leave and I was a named patron
all that time and the days that I wasn't working, I was there.
(17:00):
So I think that's important because work ethic, I believe is lost in this younger generation.
They want everything candid to them and they want the flashy, you know, job right away,
the flashy desk and, you know, making millions of dollars or even six, you know, six figures
a year.
It's like, you haven't done anything.
So, I think it's really important to show, you know, what work ethic does and also just
being like a very kind person like I, that goes a long way.
(17:23):
Like my parents taught me like you treat the janitor the same way you treat the executive,
the CEO, the owner of the team and that along the way is healthy because I've had interns
who are like, no one was nice to me except you.
And now that interns the VP.
And so he got rid of all the girls who were bitches to rude and everything else and he
was not, and I didn't know how would, how would I know that the little intern guy is
going to end up being the VP of the company and not to say that's why you do it, but it's
(17:46):
just you treat people kind and compassionate and have empathy for people.
And I think that really goes a long way as well.
I think that's why you have to do it though.
I say that all the time, like just be a good person and be kind, right?
He does that work.
He never, it's not, it's really not.
Sometimes I don't get it right.
Sometimes I fail, but I try really hard.
But like you never know the people you come across where you're going to re-encounter
(18:09):
them.
I say this all the time.
And so, if you are having an opportunity to just be kind to someone or just remind them that
we were talking about earlier, they have a job to do.
You might not agree with me.
You might not like it, but they have a job to do.
And sometimes you do have to stand up and say this isn't okay, but other times it's about
(18:33):
respecting the role others have to play within the organization or within the ecosphere.
And sometimes we'll get lost.
And not like that job is not as important as my job.
And it's like, well, that's true.
But if he didn't clean the locker rooms, your guys wouldn't have anywhere to go.
And if he wasn't here to do it, who would be doing it?
And then your guys are complaining to you, the locker room smells or there's some kind of
(18:55):
bump on this going around because it's not, you know what I mean?
The small things add up to the big things.
That's the only organization you're right.
And it's in a team.
It's so awesome.
Because everyone's like, I'm going to be this hard-nosed person.
And I think you said something earlier that really impacted me.
You have to raise your hand and ask.
And you have to put yourself in that position.
(19:16):
Because I think sometimes as women and I have done this myself and my career, I have been
too afraid to be aggressive.
I actually had this conversation with one of the guys who works for me is if you were trying
to get guys jobs or workouts, we're doing this right now, you have to call and you have
to keep going.
You have to keep the phone.
And keep calling.
And keep calling email.
And people are going to be like, but aren't you afraid?
(19:37):
You've already sent them like three emails and three texts.
And I'm like, do you not think it 400 texts today?
And are you saying that because for me as a woman, I come across as aggressive, bossy,
you know, very assertive?
As opposed to there's a guy doing the exact same thing that is not thinking twice about
doing it.
But I've been trained to think like, don't be too forward.
(20:00):
Always like, no, you're wrong.
And it's like, what?
That's not fair.
He's not having to be taught to be nicer just because I'm nice.
I feel like I'm just going to do my job, but you do have to like lean in and really advocate
for yourself, which is why I think you, especially on this show and what you've accomplished is
so important because if you're not advocating for yourself, some other young girl doesn't
(20:21):
know that it's okay to advocate for herself.
Yeah.
Absolutely.
If you're not demonstrating that in a leadership position, no one knows.
No, I didn't have that.
No one told me you could do this.
You can be that.
But now there's so much classes in going to conferences, you get internships.
All of that did not exist when I was getting this opportunity now for women.
(20:46):
There was none.
I had to create a position that you have to.
And it's funny you say that, okay, because it's good that you constantly email and call
and reach out to your clients because like me when I was doubting, like we would get tons
of emails, you get so many emails that you get flooding.
So if someone's not the top of your email sometimes and you're looking at so much, and we're
looking at so much tape.
You know, so it's like not constantly having to remind you, right?
(21:10):
Especially if you don't have something lottery paper, someone that's a standout, it's like,
hey, bring that person to your attention.
So I always respect an agent who would or even pullers who actually come up to you and be like,
hey, can you watch this?
Do you need to do this all?
Yeah, I like that because they're taking their career into their own hands and saying,
hey, even if they have an agent, you know what I mean?
(21:32):
You've got to create things.
You know, no one's going to, people are going to work hard for you.
I'm not going to get me wrong, but no one's going to work as hard as you do for yourself.
Okay.
How does your navigate those challenges and biases that you entered this career path?
I mean, I think, you know, look, they're getting better.
We have so much work to do, but it's interesting to me to hear a first person perspective of
(21:53):
how you really navigated and managed your own self because I'm sure there days you're
like, can I do this?
And other days you're like, I got this.
How did you manage and navigate, you know, the challenges and biases within the sports
industry?
I really get therapist.
No, I do have a therapist now.
At the time, I probably shouldn't have a therapist, but I think that it was just, you know,
(22:18):
that you're going to go through those ups and downs and it was kind of just starting over
each day, you know, like trying to kind of brush it off, right?
Because I would have everything from like the Boston Globe, like writing this "Get Peace
on Me" during the NBA Finals, talking about my career and me thinking that it was, oh,
you know, they're going to write this really nice piece about me, you know, not realizing,
(22:39):
we're in the NBA Finals with the Celtics.
I'm with the Lakers.
I should have put two and two together.
Okay, well, we get to the feature and it's horrible.
It's blasting me and I get on the plane and Cobb had the newspaper and he's like, don't
look at it.
And I'm like, no, I got to look at it.
So I read it and I'm like starting to like cry, but not like I'm trying to just like, I'm
like, mad.
(23:00):
I don't even mad cry because you're just so pissed off that someone you trusted as a journalist
would completely tear you down, especially a woman.
So Cobb was like, this is good.
This is, you know, this is why you want this.
You want the haters.
You want the naysayers.
He's like, because now you've got that fire to prove people wrong.
You want that chip under shoulder.
That's how I play.
And it was funny to this day.
I listened to what everything that Cobb said to me because Cobb had that way of mentality
(23:23):
of like always kind of seen angry when he plays and this, you know, I don't give a attitude
in.
It was so like parallel to what I was dealing with, obviously off the court, but he instilled
that in me to have that really like good.
You want it?
You want to see like, I'll prove you wrong.
Doubt me.
Doubt me.
And I'll prove you wrong.
And so I think I still am like that today.
(23:44):
Maybe that's why my relationships are always a mess.
And personally, you know, but it is good that you know that you feel like.
I don't know if the challenge she said they less.
She said, Oh, really?
Okay.
And don't know.
No, no, no.
No challenge, because she is just too.
To that.
Who do you go?
You know, I think we get it's like that.
You're a lot.
Okay, awesome.
(24:04):
Fine.
You'll be bored.
I have a charge that says if I'm too much, please go find less.
Well, I left.
And our less is boring.
And yeah, we'll be back.
There's like a great saying to that.
It was something about like if you don't like, I got to I'm going to butcher it.
(24:24):
I'm going to look at that later.
But it's something along the lines of like if you don't like me, then acquire some taste.
And I'm like, I love that.
It's a good.
Oh, that's a good.
It's true.
That's really good.
I know.
That's really good.
I know.
That's really good.
I'm going to use that.
I'll find out.
But we talked about, I mean, that's just a small little, you know, blip in your career
(24:47):
where you're having this obstacle and it's this news article.
But what obstacles have you encountered overcome in your career?
I know you've done so much and especially being a woman.
And Kate and I talked about this all the time.
You know, just being in the male dominated industry, kind of talk about obstacles you've
had to overcome throughout your career.
(25:08):
Constantly, like we spoke about before we got on, you know, start filming that it because
if you are in a track with female, and I'm just going to say it, because I don't think
enough people talk about it, that you are not going to be smart.
You're not going to be knowledgeable.
You're not going to be credible.
You're obviously thinking of all the players.
You're obviously there because you just want to find an athlete today.
You want the spotlight.
There's so many things that kind of people automatically think or, you know, like for me,
(25:33):
for the longest time, I was dressing in these baggy sweats with Jordans, you know, in my
hair up.
I didn't want people to see that I was a female, which was B. Shaw, Brian Shaw, who was
at one of our assistant coach at the time.
He said, "BJ, stop.
Why are you walking like that?"
And I'm like, I don't know.
And I was talking.
I was trying to talk like I could do.
It was a mess, okay?
But he was like, you know, money to all her except tape.
(25:56):
We need to, I need to buy the money to see my little swaggy walk.
And everyone's like, what are you doing?
We're all like, she's never walked like that.
And I just want to mesh in and blend in because any term I go to get my credential, they
be like, oh, are you one of the cheerleaders?
Oh, are you here?
Scouting cheerleaders?
There's no such thing as scouting for truth.
No, I'm not prepared for neither.
I'm scouting, you're with the lakers.
But it's because they didn't ever, you know, I mean, to there, I guess I could say they
(26:20):
didn't, they're not used to female scouting.
So, but it was having to overcome that.
So I wanted to be one of the boys.
And so I wasn't really comfortable on skin.
And then I started to realize, you can be attractive.
You can be sexy.
You can have all of that.
Obviously you want, you have to have a flat.
That's why you're doing it.
But you can do all of that and still be good at your job.
And I think there's something to be said that people think it's both the already.
(26:41):
You guys are gorgeous.
It's like one of those things where people take away, they stereotype you, right?
When they see you, especially me, being a cheerleader, being a model, being an out of
there, like, oh, yeah, like this girl's going to be like, you know, scouting players in
her bikini.
It's like, I am.
Yeah, how did you know?
Like, you know, just certain things.
And these are the things that people would say to me.
And it's like, it was so ignorant.
(27:02):
And you almost have to laugh it off.
And because I'm very sarcastic, I would just throw it back in their face.
And like, let's talk boobs.
You know, you think I don't know who boobs it's off.
And then on the set, it's like gaining that credibility.
And then they forget about that you put, you know, the long hair and that you're female,
because it's not about that.
Like, I always say that like, I don't want females to get positions because they're filling
(27:22):
up quota.
You want them to have a position because they're the best for that job.
And they deserve to be there.
Stop getting someone job is because, oh, we got to have a girl there.
No, I'm not a girl, either.
You know, I'll be honest with that.
Like, I don't want just like a box that you check.
I want it because that person is talented enough and deserves to be there.
And it's worked your ass off to be there.
Yeah.
(27:42):
Well, it's definitely interesting, especially, you know, as you come through sports, right?
And you, you almost grow up in it too, right?
Where you come in at a younger age.
And then you kind of grow and evolve.
And what was acceptable to you, you know, 10 years ago is not acceptable today.
And I think, you know, you talked about, you know, bagging clothes.
And I always say all the time, like, sometimes you're just muted.
(28:03):
Like, I literally, I look at some pictures of myself when I started in sports.
And it looks nothing like me now because I felt like I couldn't authentically be me.
And so it's so, so important for me now to not only be authentic, but consistently authentic.
Because sometimes it's like, oh, you're only dressing because it's this big moment.
It's like, no, this is what I wear all the time.
(28:24):
If that makes you uncomfortable.
I want to know that's on you.
Not to you problem, right?
Not a me problem.
But, you know, what is about being aware?
And I do say, especially the young girls, you know, they have to be aware of what
is going to be used against them or the box they're going to put it be put in or the conversations
that are going to be had.
And I always use it just like anybody.
(28:46):
Take away their ability to tear you down.
Because if you're aware of how they're going to use it against you, don't give them the
opportunity.
And it's not so much about changing yourself.
It's just understanding the dynamic, the role, the situation.
It's like, it's like that.
Read the room scenario.
You know what I mean?
Where it's like, read it.
Because you might get it wrong.
(29:06):
You might get it right, but don't get lost in trying to be too much yourself or not yourself,
just be yourself.
Be yourself.
Because there's no one else like you.
People try to be someone else.
And I was like, no, they already have that person already out there.
And you can be your own.
But you can take from people.
Like we've all taken from people.
Things that we like.
And, you know, but you become your own person.
(29:27):
You know, but it is so important to be able to be comfortable like, you know, in your
own skin and be able to shine and be able to be happy with that person.
And not to be looked at at the stereotype, oh, she's, you know, I never will say, oh, I'll
talk about it.
Yeah, I was a cheerleader in the NFL and the NBA.
Yeah, I was a hooters girl.
Slinging wings and beer.
Like, there's nothing that I will not talk about in my career because it made me shoe I
(29:50):
was.
That didn't take away from the fact that I know my sports.
And it's funny how sports has changed because when I was working for Fox, they were like,
putting me like a turtle mag and throw glasses on her, I'll take the glasses off.
Now she looks too sexy.
Oh, she's, you know, I'm more ethnic because my mom's Spanish is like, oh, we wanted to make
her look more white.
Or like, there's so many things that I had to deal with when I was a media and now you look
(30:12):
and it's so much more diverse and girls are super sexy when they're on air now, right?
And I'm like, that's awesome because I was like, you know, couldn't show like any skin.
Like, I'm like, do I need to work gloves too?
Even though it's 100 degrees, that's not show any skin, right?
It was just so funny how they were so because you don't even mean like women, it was different
back then.
(30:32):
They really wanted a certain look and they didn't want to go outside the box because they were
scared of what certain people would perceive them as.
And I'm like, listen, which I said to my producer, the same guy who's reading Max and magazine
is watching sports.
Okay.
I don't say that you'd be in laundry and bikini, but don't be afraid for a woman to wear
(30:53):
a dress that happens to be for fitting.
Like, it's fun.
And now you see it.
I was kind of like laughing a good way because I could have never worn with these girls
wear now.
I mean, you know, because it was too sexy.
Right.
Because it would have evolved there.
Yeah.
Yeah.
I still have time too.
Yeah, like even like I watched Fox, I mean, I used to work there for a bit, but watching Fox
(31:15):
and seeing the woman.
I love it and I'd champion it when I see like Joy Taylor on the screen.
I'm like, yes.
I love Joy.
I love Joy.
She's a good friend of mine.
I love it.
She can wear it and she can post anything like, you know what I mean?
But you know, before like, like social media was just like getting started when I was like
in the middle of my Lakers.
And it was like very much so like be careful with what you post and be careful of this and
(31:37):
this, and this, and this.
And it's like, we're encouraging you.
We want you to post, but we were like, we don't even know what this is.
What you just, you know, talk about your life and everyone knows.
And, you know, and you're trying to figure it out.
And then then sometimes it would get people in trouble, right?
Because you didn't know what you're supposed to say or not say.
And now it's great.
The girls who were working at sports, they can do whatever.
They can post whatever.
They can be in any outfit.
(31:58):
They can, and it's all fine, which is totally different from what I was.
We loved having Bonnie Jill on the show.
We're actually going to break the episode into two parts.
So make sure you guys are on the lookout to see part two of Bonnie Jill's episode on her
table.
[Bell]
Hey y'all, Bonnie Dill, Laughlin here.
(00:03):
First and only she knows scout in the NBA,
and current sports reporter, and host,
and this is her cable.
Now you see her.
(upbeat music)
You are magnificent!
(upbeat music)
Welcome to her tape,
the podcast that shines a spotlight
on the badass women who are redefining the game.
Join hosts, Kate Foley, and Megan Martinez
(00:25):
as Payon Locke, the Secrets of Success
of the brightest female pioneers in the industry.
Welcome back to her table.
We are so excited to welcome Bonnie Dill,
Laughlin to the show today.
Bonnie was one of the first and only female NBA scouts
where she held a front office executive position
with the Los Angeles Lakers.
She holds so many firsts,
like which is the first first, Megan?
(00:46):
I don't know, which is the first first,
but she was the first female
to be awarded six championship rings
in two professional sports,
earning a Super Bowl ring during her time
with the 49ers.
And five, that's right ladies and gentlemen,
five NBA championship rings
as an executive for the Los Angeles Lakers.
Beyond her accomplishments in sports,
(01:07):
Bonnie Dill also ventured into the world of broadcasting.
She has worked as a reporter and host
for various high profile networks,
including ESPN and Fox Sports.
What hasn't she done?
I came in to learn more about Bonnie Dill,
so let's get started.
Welcome to her table.
(upbeat music)
Bonnie Dill, I'm so excited to have you on her table today.
(01:27):
Thanks for joining us.
- Thank you, it's excited when you all reached out.
I love what Jotter Dillin and Powering Women in Sports
right at my alley, so thanks for having me all.
- Yes.
- It's just you all, Megan.
It's another girl.
I love me.
I say you all all the time, so I feel yes.
- We're good.
Yeah, I say you all the time, fix them.
I just, sometimes I can't help it.
Not on hair, like, second show, like producers,
(01:49):
when I've said you all up by accident,
like what, you're not in the cell right now.
We're in the cell, we're in the cell.
And I'm like, sorry.
(laughing)
That's amazing.
Bonnie Dill, you have done so much in your career.
You're still doing so much.
We talked briefly about you writing a book
and we'll get into that.
But I want to talk about how you were the first
and only MBA scout for the Lakers.
(02:10):
Let's do a deep dive into that
'cause I'm so excited to hear about it.
- Yeah, so being the first female scout
with the Lakers, it was crazy because when I first started,
I was actually doing a pre-imposed game for the Lakers.
So it was K-Cal K-PBS, which is a flagship for the Lakers.
And they love how I can break down the triangle offense
and Phil Jackson liked how they saw that I for talent.
(02:32):
And they're like, if you're about about scouting
and I'm like, no, I mean, I love talk about players,
but I haven't really thought about that
because there's no other female.
So you don't even, you don't even need at that point.
You didn't really think about that, which is, you know,
it's kind of inherent, but at the same time,
you're just not thinking, you know, the big scope of things.
So they said, well, why don't you scout for us
for, you know, this season and see how it goes.
And it was pack 10 at the time, which is actually,
(02:54):
you know, nope, there's no pack 10, there's no back 12,
there's nothing.
But, and big 12 conferences, and they tried me out for a year.
I wasn't getting paid.
It was kind of like the intern, the shift sort of speak.
And I proved myself, which was fine.
I like always prove myself.
And they liked my scat of reports and saw that I did have
that I for talent.
And they sent me to a five year deal, five year deal.
(03:14):
And it been with the Lakers at 13 years.
I got five championship rings with them.
And it was some of the best memories.
They also end up deciding me to be in the assistant
GM for our Julie team, Los Angeles defenders.
And so I was able to go through CBA contracts.
Kate, what you know, you know, so many things,
cutting players running practices.
I mean, you name it, they had me doing it, which was great,
(03:37):
because I feel like in sports, it's very important
to be multifaceted if you want to have longevity.
You know, otherwise, sometimes if you can only do one thing,
that's it, right?
So it's like for me, like even in media, like I've always
just felt like it's great to be multifaceted
and have different layers of your career.
And so I was lucky to be a assistant
GM for Julie team and also a scout.
(03:58):
And like I said, it was a tough path.
A lot of hoops and hurdles and definitely not as glamorous
as you people think are like, oh, you were a scout for the Lakers.
I'm like, what do you think we're doing?
I'm like, I'm getting like on red eyed flights driving
this rental car in the middle of like nowhere.
Like I don't even know if you like some behind me's following
and they kill me.
Then checking into a hotel that I super diced
(04:20):
sometime because they don't sometimes have
a four seasons or a red.
So yeah, and then I'm dressing like a guy to be accepted.
So no, it's not glamorous at all.
Like it's not what you think.
And they see that I got five rings and you know,
that I'm good friends with, you know, certain people
in the league.
So they think it's glamorous, but it's not, you know.
So it's a, it's funny how there's that whole scene
(04:42):
of quote before that people don't realize
which you win through to get where you're at now.
And so they see, they don't see all of the blood
soine tears, I should say, sort of speak before you get
to the point where you're happy.
And maybe not even that because with me,
I never liked the videocracy or never being complacent.
So it's always, you know, going to the next level
and striving to be better.
But that wasn't the long answer, but kind of a lot of the
(05:05):
idea.
You missed that.
You missed the hot dogs.
I went through this this weekend with the final four here
in Phoenix.
I was like, if I have to eat one more hot dog, French fry,
you know, they're taking the water top off my waters.
And I'm just like, I'm just annoyed at this point.
I just want like to be regular.
So it's after you sit in these gyms, and it's funny
(05:26):
because we were doing a player appearance with one of our clients.
And we're in the back of the house going through all the boxes
are, like it's not glamorous.
Then you come out behind a curtain and it's a beautiful fan
fest.
But for us to get there was like, you know, the trashes on the side,
the boxes are on the side.
And it's I feel like TV shows, Bonnie Jill, have made like the
glamorous side of sports.
(05:47):
And there is.
I'm not saying there is no.
Because I've been on the big old lady's world.
Yeah, they see a stressed out for heels and fun.
But like they just see like anything else.
And you made such a great point, Kate, because I am so into like my
workouts and my trying to eat healthy.
I mean, I'm sure.
I mean, I love Sarah Patch Kids.
That's like my little thing.
I go to him in the mornings, I don't drink coffee like Megan
(06:09):
knows.
But it's like you're trying to be like on a routine.
It is everything but a routine because you can't with our schedules
everything's different.
It's like people say, what's your day to day life?
Like there's no such thing, right?
Because it's different all the time.
So when you're on the road, like trying to work out in one of the
gyms, we're like, you know what I mean?
It's like you're on a, like, it's just hard.
It's just, you know, there's no time to like be able to set your
(06:31):
schedule.
So it makes you kind of crazy at time.
Well, even if you set it, it's always the intangibles.
Your flight's delayed.
There's a game.
I mean, it's, it's you have to be very like flexible and in a
war.
It's funny.
It's a sportsman with self structured, but you yourself have to be
flexible.
Oh, so close.
Of course my room's not ready.
(06:51):
Sure.
I'll take this room and so on.
You know, I mean, like you just have to be ready.
We'll take your back.
I think that's awesome.
But I have no makeup on it.
I look like a cheesy monster right now.
I'm on a red.
I would like to like take a shower and get ready.
Like, well, you could get ready in our, oh, oh, when the hotel
lobby about things.
Sure.
I would like a homeless person, but okay, I'll do that for now.
(07:11):
So it's like, you know, it's like, and then you have to be all like, I
don't know, on your game.
And as a woman, you know, there's always so much scrutiny, you know, already.
So it's like trying to make sure that you're just perfect.
If that makes sense, like, so it's tough.
It's a part of me, perfect all the time.
But yet, we try to achieve that.
Why do you think that is?
It's funny.
(07:32):
I asked myself this question of like, why do I put this pressure on
myself?
I went to the gym last night and a full sweat outfit and they
thought something goes wrong with me.
Because it's so funny.
And they're like, oh, are you okay?
And I'm like, what?
I'm just in a full black sweat outfit and tennis shoes.
It's 10 o'clock at night.
It's like, I'm over this right now.
And they're like, yeah, you know, I think that the pressure being, you know, in
the public eye, being on camera, being like, I was dual-girled.
(07:55):
My mom had me in Patience, like I was three years old with like, you
know, extensions and fake eyelashes winking at like six-year-old men.
You know what I mean?
So it's like, yeah, that's weird, right?
Now, really weird.
You know, but I've been talking to his normal.
And so it's like doing that and then going to with my horses and play stop-baw and
basketball.
I was doing so many things and I felt like you wanted to perfect everything you
(08:17):
did.
And then as you grow into, especially me being in the entertainment industry as
well, it's like, you've got this pressure to have a certain way, to look a certain way.
And it's like, you're always told you're not good enough.
Whatever that may be, you know, you're not the direction we want.
Because you're not the race you want or you're not the height we want or you're not, you
know what I mean?
(08:37):
There's always trying to like figure out to be perfect.
And so when you do that, you almost kind of overcompensate.
And with that, it's like, you know, it can make you kind of mad at times and crazy because
you're trying to like keep up with everything and stay relevant and do your social media
and work out.
And you've seen that meme of that girl like driving crazy.
It's like, I'm trying to do all this and still keep my sanity.
And it's tough.
(08:58):
And then still trying to like, you know, get over one thing.
And it's like, there's only so many hours in the day.
Yeah.
Or just being normal.
You know what I mean?
Like, that's my biggest struggle is like, my best friends don't work in sports.
They don't, they work in regular corporate America jobs.
So my life is insane to them.
And I'm like, this is just normal.
Like I don't know how to do anything else.
(09:20):
And so trying to find that balance of like, what is extra to them is like, that's the
more everyone stays, you thrive on stress.
And I'm like, yeah, I do.
I was thrive on like, I can't sit still.
Like I love, I don't know.
It's there's something you think as you get older, you would grow out of that.
But it's no, but it's like, I love that.
And my friends are like, well, I live through you on social media because I've got four kids.
(09:45):
And you know, my night out of the town is like pizza after soccer practice here.
Whatever, like with their kids.
And that's fine.
But I chose at one point like, you know, for it was like kind of like that forking the
road where I was either going to like have family and have kids and do that.
And I was like, no, I'm going to take the other route.
And I've been literally married to my career.
But as you get older, now my gosh, I wish I had a little more balance because like we were
(10:06):
talking before, we started filming that like I've kind of ruined a lot of relationships
or they're not fit for me because of my career.
Everything goes back to like, either I don't have time for them because of my career or
they don't understand my career.
But it still goes back to my career.
So it's like a struggle like in trying to balance it.
And you know, at some point you're like, oh, do you want to balance it?
(10:26):
Because it's what you're used to doing and what we know.
And you only like run on one, you know, kind of so under the same over and over again.
And it's hard to get out of it.
How did you get into sports?
I want you because I'm looking at your bio.
I mean, I don't even know where I could just like drop a pen and ask this question because
they knew you have done so many amazing things.
(10:49):
And how did you kind of walk us through our muv age?
I'm going to get a job.
This is kind of what led me to where I am because I think probably a lot of it is not by
design.
It's a lot like most women in sports.
It's by opportunity and chance and curiosity.
Right.
So I mean, if they go way back, you know, being a daddy's girl, you know, that was the all
(11:12):
of us to know when you're with your daddy going all the games.
So going to NBA games and NFL and college and you name it, my dad's own race horses before
I was born.
So I was the little girl who was, you know, going to page into my mom and I was a little
bit thin at the, you know, at the end of the day, I was reading the racing form knowing
how to handicap horses and bet on horses and asking my dad, like when I made money, I
(11:33):
wanted like the old bet on horses and gamble and stuff.
And then my dad, like, this is not normal.
Like what, you know, how old are you?
How old are you?
I knew how to read a racing form pros and I was like five years old.
She's like, Yuppie in the library, Megan.
I can just see this now.
She's like, put your money in, you know, and I was able to go and certainly like, you know,
(11:55):
these horses and odds and my dad was like, oh, you know, because I always saw him doing
it.
So I'm like, you know, then I would go to the mutual and try to bet and I'm like, looking
up and I'm like, kind of, you can't bet.
And I'm like, oh, yeah, I can.
And so they, I'd have to have my dad bet for me.
And I was like, you know, I really just do that.
And it was just funny, you know, because I was just me.
I just loved it.
And then reading like, you know, I used to read, you know, the sports industry did and asking
(12:17):
my dad about why these guys ran the 40 and what does that mean?
And just verticals and like, just things that like normal kids, my age would not be doing.
They'd be going to the games and looking to get con-candier or by the foam finger or
do you know what I mean?
Like, just totally different.
I just was kind of out of the womb with different type of little girl.
And so I knew that I wanted to work in sports and kind of combined both of that to figure
(12:40):
out what I was going to do in sports.
And I was a trailer for the Golden State Warriors and NBA and then went on to the San Francisco
49ers, winning a single ring with them.
I was 18 and then went on after that for two years season with them went to the Dallas Cowboys.
And along the way, even at a young age, I knew about networking and knew about like starting
to build these relationships and, you know, I'm older now.
(13:01):
So I was like, riding notes, like handwritten notes.
There was no email.
I was riding handwritten notes, like my parents had taught me and sending things, you know,
just like trying to keep up with everyone and stuff that I translated into my career because
being friends, the Bartlett family, along the 49ers and the Jones family, who are your friends
of mine, being able to have them.
So I don't care anyone's dead yet.
It helps when you have connections with you.
(13:22):
You're not going to be able to keep your job or get the job, but getting you in the
door and meeting new people and being able to, you know, because networking is everything
in our industry.
I believe.
You know, so I think for that, that really helped me to then get my job over at ESPN.
And it was called Cold Peats at the time, which is now first take, but it was the morning
show for ESPN.
(13:43):
I was a course one there and was doing media.
I'd already got my degree at University of Texas in Austin.
And then from there, I just started to develop what I want to do at media and really wanted
to work in a front office.
And that opportunity came by chance, you know, just because me speaking about the Lakers
and talking about the triangle offense and Mitch Cup check and Jerry West realizing I knew
(14:03):
the game.
And it was just not, you know, not conventional because I wasn't the way that everyone else
would be a scout.
You know, so it was different, but it worked out.
I think God has a way of working things out and it did.
And so from there, it's just my career has been, you know, like I said, multifaceted and
being in media, you know, I know how to write, I know how to shoot, I know to produce, you
(14:26):
know, all of those things that are really important.
And that's why I wanted to write this book because there wasn't someone for me to look up to
when I was scouting.
And so when I was like, okay, you know, I want to write a book so females can know there's
a space for them, the younger generation, whether it's an agent, whether it's a scout, whether,
you know, it's not just an athlete.
There's more, you know, areas to be, you know, to have a career in sports.
(14:47):
And so I was like, let me do this and call it in a league of around.
And I had Billie Jean-Gang as my chapter one.
And then went all the way through with Jean-Giebass and so many different women that have
paint the way that have been the pioneers, trailblazers, and it was really important for me to
kind of highlight all these women because some of the women are older, so they didn't have
social media, you know, like, my non-real, who's the first female to play in NHL hockey game.
(15:08):
They're a lot of people that know that she was, where Julie Cron, the first female,
jockey to win a Breeder's Cup.
So I kind of wanted it to resonate with all different women and be able to have it touch
not just women, I mean, anyone, you know, even males to know how hard with, you know, work
ethic and determination, tenacity, you can kind of accomplish anything.
Yeah, how did you make that transition from being, you know, NFL MBA cheerleader and then
(15:32):
moving into the media space?
And what kind of skills we talk about this lot for our younger listeners, how, like, what
skills did you develop maybe through college or throughout your life that you then kind
of transitioned into your career?
Yeah, definitely.
So obviously going to college and getting my degree, broadcast journalism degree, that
really helped.
You know, it was going through and being and working for these teams, lawyers and the
(15:56):
Niners and the Cowboys and building those relationships and then taking the first job
when I got was the ESPN job and it was nice because it was a small job.
It was just like, okay, we're going to throw to you for some updates.
And then all of a sudden you kind of start to show, no, I can do more than this and you
kind of push your producer and you push, you know, certain people to say, hey, I will do
(16:16):
this as a myth.
I will go get your coffee, but let me also do this as well.
You know, give me a chance.
And so I was writing all my scripts and then finally they started letting me do be a course
one and going out on location and it was more just starting to just push, you know, you
have to kind of, when you want something bad, you got to be aggressive about it and you
have to push, you know, without being obnoxious, but just kind of the same that you deserve
(16:37):
to be there.
But it was a lot of just constant like, you know, hey, hi, I'm here, you know, like, I
don't want to work just one day a week doing this.
I want to work five days a week doing this.
So, but it was a lot of the work ethic.
Like, I was there just like a, you know, a gym rat would be I was there at the studio before
anyone else was there and then I was the last person to leave and I was a named patron
all that time and the days that I wasn't working, I was there.
(17:00):
So I think that's important because work ethic, I believe is lost in this younger generation.
They want everything candid to them and they want the flashy, you know, job right away,
the flashy desk and, you know, making millions of dollars or even six, you know, six figures
a year.
It's like, you haven't done anything.
So, I think it's really important to show, you know, what work ethic does and also just
being like a very kind person like I, that goes a long way.
(17:23):
Like my parents taught me like you treat the janitor the same way you treat the executive,
the CEO, the owner of the team and that along the way is healthy because I've had interns
who are like, no one was nice to me except you.
And now that interns the VP.
And so he got rid of all the girls who were bitches to rude and everything else and he
was not, and I didn't know how would, how would I know that the little intern guy is
going to end up being the VP of the company and not to say that's why you do it, but it's
(17:46):
just you treat people kind and compassionate and have empathy for people.
And I think that really goes a long way as well.
I think that's why you have to do it though.
I say that all the time, like just be a good person and be kind, right?
He does that work.
He never, it's not, it's really not.
Sometimes I don't get it right.
Sometimes I fail, but I try really hard.
But like you never know the people you come across where you're going to re-encounter
(18:09):
them.
I say this all the time.
And so, if you are having an opportunity to just be kind to someone or just remind them that
we were talking about earlier, they have a job to do.
You might not agree with me.
You might not like it, but they have a job to do.
And sometimes you do have to stand up and say this isn't okay, but other times it's about
(18:33):
respecting the role others have to play within the organization or within the ecosphere.
And sometimes we'll get lost.
And not like that job is not as important as my job.
And it's like, well, that's true.
But if he didn't clean the locker rooms, your guys wouldn't have anywhere to go.
And if he wasn't here to do it, who would be doing it?
And then your guys are complaining to you, the locker room smells or there's some kind of
(18:55):
bump on this going around because it's not, you know what I mean?
The small things add up to the big things.
That's the only organization you're right.
And it's in a team.
It's so awesome.
Because everyone's like, I'm going to be this hard-nosed person.
And I think you said something earlier that really impacted me.
You have to raise your hand and ask.
And you have to put yourself in that position.
(19:16):
Because I think sometimes as women and I have done this myself and my career, I have been
too afraid to be aggressive.
I actually had this conversation with one of the guys who works for me is if you were trying
to get guys jobs or workouts, we're doing this right now, you have to call and you have
to keep going.
You have to keep the phone.
And keep calling.
And keep calling email.
And people are going to be like, but aren't you afraid?
(19:37):
You've already sent them like three emails and three texts.
And I'm like, do you not think it 400 texts today?
And are you saying that because for me as a woman, I come across as aggressive, bossy,
you know, very assertive?
As opposed to there's a guy doing the exact same thing that is not thinking twice about
doing it.
But I've been trained to think like, don't be too forward.
(20:00):
Always like, no, you're wrong.
And it's like, what?
That's not fair.
He's not having to be taught to be nicer just because I'm nice.
I feel like I'm just going to do my job, but you do have to like lean in and really advocate
for yourself, which is why I think you, especially on this show and what you've accomplished is
so important because if you're not advocating for yourself, some other young girl doesn't
(20:21):
know that it's okay to advocate for herself.
Yeah.
Absolutely.
If you're not demonstrating that in a leadership position, no one knows.
No, I didn't have that.
No one told me you could do this.
You can be that.
But now there's so much classes in going to conferences, you get internships.
All of that did not exist when I was getting this opportunity now for women.
(20:46):
There was none.
I had to create a position that you have to.
And it's funny you say that, okay, because it's good that you constantly email and call
and reach out to your clients because like me when I was doubting, like we would get tons
of emails, you get so many emails that you get flooding.
So if someone's not the top of your email sometimes and you're looking at so much, and we're
looking at so much tape.
You know, so it's like not constantly having to remind you, right?
(21:10):
Especially if you don't have something lottery paper, someone that's a standout, it's like,
hey, bring that person to your attention.
So I always respect an agent who would or even pullers who actually come up to you and be like,
hey, can you watch this?
Do you need to do this all?
Yeah, I like that because they're taking their career into their own hands and saying,
hey, even if they have an agent, you know what I mean?
(21:32):
You've got to create things.
You know, no one's going to, people are going to work hard for you.
I'm not going to get me wrong, but no one's going to work as hard as you do for yourself.
Okay.
How does your navigate those challenges and biases that you entered this career path?
I mean, I think, you know, look, they're getting better.
We have so much work to do, but it's interesting to me to hear a first person perspective of
(21:53):
how you really navigated and managed your own self because I'm sure there days you're
like, can I do this?
And other days you're like, I got this.
How did you manage and navigate, you know, the challenges and biases within the sports
industry?
I really get therapist.
No, I do have a therapist now.
At the time, I probably shouldn't have a therapist, but I think that it was just, you know,
(22:18):
that you're going to go through those ups and downs and it was kind of just starting over
each day, you know, like trying to kind of brush it off, right?
Because I would have everything from like the Boston Globe, like writing this "Get Peace
on Me" during the NBA Finals, talking about my career and me thinking that it was, oh,
you know, they're going to write this really nice piece about me, you know, not realizing,
(22:39):
we're in the NBA Finals with the Celtics.
I'm with the Lakers.
I should have put two and two together.
Okay, well, we get to the feature and it's horrible.
It's blasting me and I get on the plane and Cobb had the newspaper and he's like, don't
look at it.
And I'm like, no, I got to look at it.
So I read it and I'm like starting to like cry, but not like I'm trying to just like, I'm
like, mad.
(23:00):
I don't even mad cry because you're just so pissed off that someone you trusted as a journalist
would completely tear you down, especially a woman.
So Cobb was like, this is good.
This is, you know, this is why you want this.
You want the haters.
You want the naysayers.
He's like, because now you've got that fire to prove people wrong.
You want that chip under shoulder.
That's how I play.
And it was funny to this day.
I listened to what everything that Cobb said to me because Cobb had that way of mentality
(23:23):
of like always kind of seen angry when he plays and this, you know, I don't give a attitude
in.
It was so like parallel to what I was dealing with, obviously off the court, but he instilled
that in me to have that really like good.
You want it?
You want to see like, I'll prove you wrong.
Doubt me.
Doubt me.
And I'll prove you wrong.
And so I think I still am like that today.
(23:44):
Maybe that's why my relationships are always a mess.
And personally, you know, but it is good that you know that you feel like.
I don't know if the challenge she said they less.
She said, Oh, really?
Okay.
And don't know.
No, no, no.
No challenge, because she is just too.
To that.
Who do you go?
You know, I think we get it's like that.
You're a lot.
Okay, awesome.
(24:04):
Fine.
You'll be bored.
I have a charge that says if I'm too much, please go find less.
Well, I left.
And our less is boring.
And yeah, we'll be back.
There's like a great saying to that.
It was something about like if you don't like, I got to I'm going to butcher it.
(24:24):
I'm going to look at that later.
But it's something along the lines of like if you don't like me, then acquire some taste.
And I'm like, I love that.
It's a good.
Oh, that's a good.
It's true.
That's really good.
I know.
That's really good.
I know.
That's really good.
I'm going to use that.
I'll find out.
But we talked about, I mean, that's just a small little, you know, blip in your career
(24:47):
where you're having this obstacle and it's this news article.
But what obstacles have you encountered overcome in your career?
I know you've done so much and especially being a woman.
And Kate and I talked about this all the time.
You know, just being in the male dominated industry, kind of talk about obstacles you've
had to overcome throughout your career.
(25:08):
Constantly, like we spoke about before we got on, you know, start filming that it because
if you are in a track with female, and I'm just going to say it, because I don't think
enough people talk about it, that you are not going to be smart.
You're not going to be knowledgeable.
You're not going to be credible.
You're obviously thinking of all the players.
You're obviously there because you just want to find an athlete today.
You want the spotlight.
There's so many things that kind of people automatically think or, you know, like for me,
(25:33):
for the longest time, I was dressing in these baggy sweats with Jordans, you know, in my
hair up.
I didn't want people to see that I was a female, which was B. Shaw, Brian Shaw, who was
at one of our assistant coach at the time.
He said, "BJ, stop.
Why are you walking like that?"
And I'm like, I don't know.
And I was talking.
I was trying to talk like I could do.
It was a mess, okay?
But he was like, you know, money to all her except tape.
(25:56):
We need to, I need to buy the money to see my little swaggy walk.
And everyone's like, what are you doing?
We're all like, she's never walked like that.
And I just want to mesh in and blend in because any term I go to get my credential, they
be like, oh, are you one of the cheerleaders?
Oh, are you here?
Scouting cheerleaders?
There's no such thing as scouting for truth.
No, I'm not prepared for neither.
I'm scouting, you're with the lakers.
But it's because they didn't ever, you know, I mean, to there, I guess I could say they
(26:20):
didn't, they're not used to female scouting.
So, but it was having to overcome that.
So I wanted to be one of the boys.
And so I wasn't really comfortable on skin.
And then I started to realize, you can be attractive.
You can be sexy.
You can have all of that.
Obviously you want, you have to have a flat.
That's why you're doing it.
But you can do all of that and still be good at your job.
And I think there's something to be said that people think it's both the already.
(26:41):
You guys are gorgeous.
It's like one of those things where people take away, they stereotype you, right?
When they see you, especially me, being a cheerleader, being a model, being an out of
there, like, oh, yeah, like this girl's going to be like, you know, scouting players in
her bikini.
It's like, I am.
Yeah, how did you know?
Like, you know, just certain things.
And these are the things that people would say to me.
And it's like, it was so ignorant.
(27:02):
And you almost have to laugh it off.
And because I'm very sarcastic, I would just throw it back in their face.
And like, let's talk boobs.
You know, you think I don't know who boobs it's off.
And then on the set, it's like gaining that credibility.
And then they forget about that you put, you know, the long hair and that you're female,
because it's not about that.
Like, I always say that like, I don't want females to get positions because they're filling
(27:22):
up quota.
You want them to have a position because they're the best for that job.
And they deserve to be there.
Stop getting someone job is because, oh, we got to have a girl there.
No, I'm not a girl, either.
You know, I'll be honest with that.
Like, I don't want just like a box that you check.
I want it because that person is talented enough and deserves to be there.
And it's worked your ass off to be there.
Yeah.
(27:42):
Well, it's definitely interesting, especially, you know, as you come through sports, right?
And you, you almost grow up in it too, right?
Where you come in at a younger age.
And then you kind of grow and evolve.
And what was acceptable to you, you know, 10 years ago is not acceptable today.
And I think, you know, you talked about, you know, bagging clothes.
And I always say all the time, like, sometimes you're just muted.
(28:03):
Like, I literally, I look at some pictures of myself when I started in sports.
And it looks nothing like me now because I felt like I couldn't authentically be me.
And so it's so, so important for me now to not only be authentic, but consistently authentic.
Because sometimes it's like, oh, you're only dressing because it's this big moment.
It's like, no, this is what I wear all the time.
(28:24):
If that makes you uncomfortable.
I want to know that's on you.
Not to you problem, right?
Not a me problem.
But, you know, what is about being aware?
And I do say, especially the young girls, you know, they have to be aware of what
is going to be used against them or the box they're going to put it be put in or the conversations
that are going to be had.
And I always use it just like anybody.
(28:46):
Take away their ability to tear you down.
Because if you're aware of how they're going to use it against you, don't give them the
opportunity.
And it's not so much about changing yourself.
It's just understanding the dynamic, the role, the situation.
It's like, it's like that.
Read the room scenario.
You know what I mean?
Where it's like, read it.
Because you might get it wrong.
(29:06):
You might get it right, but don't get lost in trying to be too much yourself or not yourself,
just be yourself.
Be yourself.
Because there's no one else like you.
People try to be someone else.
And I was like, no, they already have that person already out there.
And you can be your own.
But you can take from people.
Like we've all taken from people.
Things that we like.
And, you know, but you become your own person.
(29:27):
You know, but it is so important to be able to be comfortable like, you know, in your
own skin and be able to shine and be able to be happy with that person.
And not to be looked at at the stereotype, oh, she's, you know, I never will say, oh, I'll
talk about it.
Yeah, I was a cheerleader in the NFL and the NBA.
Yeah, I was a hooters girl.
Slinging wings and beer.
Like, there's nothing that I will not talk about in my career because it made me shoe I
(29:50):
was.
That didn't take away from the fact that I know my sports.
And it's funny how sports has changed because when I was working for Fox, they were like,
putting me like a turtle mag and throw glasses on her, I'll take the glasses off.
Now she looks too sexy.
Oh, she's, you know, I'm more ethnic because my mom's Spanish is like, oh, we wanted to make
her look more white.
Or like, there's so many things that I had to deal with when I was a media and now you look
(30:12):
and it's so much more diverse and girls are super sexy when they're on air now, right?
And I'm like, that's awesome because I was like, you know, couldn't show like any skin.
Like, I'm like, do I need to work gloves too?
Even though it's 100 degrees, that's not show any skin, right?
It was just so funny how they were so because you don't even mean like women, it was different
back then.
(30:32):
They really wanted a certain look and they didn't want to go outside the box because they were
scared of what certain people would perceive them as.
And I'm like, listen, which I said to my producer, the same guy who's reading Max and magazine
is watching sports.
Okay.
I don't say that you'd be in laundry and bikini, but don't be afraid for a woman to wear
(30:53):
a dress that happens to be for fitting.
Like, it's fun.
And now you see it.
I was kind of like laughing a good way because I could have never worn with these girls
wear now.
I mean, you know, because it was too sexy.
Right.
Because it would have evolved there.
Yeah.
Yeah.
I still have time too.
Yeah, like even like I watched Fox, I mean, I used to work there for a bit, but watching Fox
(31:15):
and seeing the woman.
I love it and I'd champion it when I see like Joy Taylor on the screen.
I'm like, yes.
I love Joy.
I love Joy.
She's a good friend of mine.
I love it.
She can wear it and she can post anything like, you know what I mean?
But you know, before like, like social media was just like getting started when I was like
in the middle of my Lakers.
And it was like very much so like be careful with what you post and be careful of this and
(31:37):
this, and this, and this.
And it's like, we're encouraging you.
We want you to post, but we were like, we don't even know what this is.
What you just, you know, talk about your life and everyone knows.
And, you know, and you're trying to figure it out.
And then then sometimes it would get people in trouble, right?
Because you didn't know what you're supposed to say or not say.
And now it's great.
The girls who were working at sports, they can do whatever.
They can post whatever.
They can be in any outfit.
(31:58):
They can, and it's all fine, which is totally different from what I was.
We loved having Bonnie Jill on the show.
We're actually going to break the episode into two parts.
So make sure you guys are on the lookout to see part two of Bonnie Jill's episode on her
table.
[Bell]
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