ESPN launches ESPN Bet sportsbook + Penn gives Portnoy his sportsbook back to join ESPN's - Segment 2 - 8/10/23

Gambling has become less and less taboo over the years, but we're about to go completely buckwild now that the mothership is getting involved. Has the gambling influence in sports gone too far?

Episode Transcript

(00:02):
High Noon continues now on five ninetythe fans all right, rocking it ruin

(00:53):
here on a Thursday Nation high Noonon five ninety The Fan five ninety the
fan dot Com Grammer in the house. I apologize to you guys. You
never need to apologize, and uh, I'm sure the fans were thankful that
they got forty five minutes stop.Anyway, Yeah, still working on my
knee. We'll figure it out,but I'm back. But most importantly you

(01:17):
you made a nice play third basein your ball game last night. Well
highlight real. No, I justsaying it was fun playing with my bud
Light guys, and you got LasDz and he's a terrific person. I
would never complain. I'm gonna sayright now, you get sheeated out of
your loan. It bad last night. That was a foot outside. You

(01:40):
know what. You don't go tothe grand kids and say, hey,
I walked. No, you neverplayed a walk? Go hack? Right?
And then when I hacked it sucked. No, But it's fund The
bud Light guys are a great,great bunch of great bunch of guys to
play ball with. Really fun.So anyway, so I can move around.

(02:00):
But the knee is not where it'ssupposed to be. Doesn't that just
so we'll figure it crazy, we'llfigure it out. You're going I may
be in the New England Journal ofMedicine by the time they figure this.
Are you the guinea pig? Oh, no doubt they're gonna try. Also,
have you ever done stem cell?I've never done that. I've never

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done that. I've done PRP,but never never stem cell. Well,
it's good to have you in withThank you, Okay, I kind of
cheased as we went to break.I didn't get to it yesterday. But
this is a pretty massive development thatDave Portnoy has bought back Barstool Sports from
Penn Entertainment for a total of adollar. That's correct, a dollar.

(02:46):
So I wish I'd have been inon that. Could I'd have been two
ho ho. Considering what Portnoy initiallysold uh to uh Pen for five one
hundred and fifty one. One milliondollars is what Penn paid to acquire Barstool
initially. According to reports, PennEntertainment says it will record a loss of

(03:10):
up to eight hundred and fifty milliondollars on the deal, which is just
I mean, that's hard to fathom, right, eight hundred and fifty million
dollars on the deal. Pursuant tothe Barstool SPA, Penn sold one hundred
percent of the outstanding shares of Barstoolto David Portnoy in exchange for a nominal
cash consideration one dollar and certain noncompete and other restrictive covenants. The company

(03:36):
wrote and its quarterly report on Wednesday. According to a securities filing, Portnoll
acquired the sports media brand he foundedfor just one dollar. So there are
other pieces to the deal which makesit interesting. But Penn says that it
expects to record a loss between eighthundred and eight hundred and fifty million dollars

(03:57):
in the deal. In addition,says it sold Barstool back to Portnoy in
exchange for certain noncompete and other restrictivecovenants in the right quote to receive fifty
percent of the gross proceeds received byDavid Portnoy in any subsequent sale or other
monetization event of Barstool. Now,Portnoy came out and said he had an

(04:20):
emergency press conference, which he doesfrequently. It's kind of his stick,
so to speak. Emergency press conference. He's got an emergency press conference,
and he proclaimed that he would neverrelinquish the rights to barstool ever again.
So it was he kind of makinga quality control statement that it didn't go

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the way I wanted, and I'mgoing to control it because I know what
the product is. Bingo. Yeah, he felt like with bringing in a
company like Penn, well, Iget why he initially did it. I
mean, if you're gonna make fivehundred and fifty one dollars on essentially it
was a blog that he started andand it took off. If you're going
to get an offer for five hundredand fifty million dollars, I mean that
is generational wealth. You got totake the money. Now he's still,

(05:08):
I believe, kept a minority stakein the company and still had some influence.
But it became very clear that theBarstool brand was going to go through
a different a different filter, soto speak, because Penn had a lot
of oversight and an HR department thatdidn't necessarily align with some of what barstool

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content inherently brings, right, whichhaving worked in companies with HR, if
I never have to sit in anothermeeting with an HR person in my life,
I will be considered myself the luckiestman on earth. I have disdain
for HR people. Well, ifyou get good ones. When I was

(05:56):
up the street at one on one, our HR person was off the charts,
fantastic, really, really a coollady who would do whatever you needed,
whether you're talking about your medical insuranceor just just whatever you need to
do. She was great. ButI've been other places where, uh,

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maybe the way you comport yourself inan office situation with other people and the
way you interact could could perhaps comeinto question. It can get pretty ugly.
What do you have against HR?David Solomon? Well, it was
the deal. I think that selfexplanatory. I would say, we have

(06:41):
a decent HR manager, and DavidSolomon I think so too. Yeah,
well, because you guys know,you can bribe him with junk food absolute
whatever it takes. In fact,not even my own junk food. I
I literally just told him when Iwalked out of the production studio during the
break, I said, David,have a donut that Bonnie brought in interning
with Frank on the press box andhe goes, I already had one,

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thank you, I said, Well, at least know that I offered.
You don't. We're not mine tooffer to begin with. That's right.
But also in a big office situation, I think it's better to keep your
head down and keep your mouth shut. Otherwise the politically correct HR goons will

(07:27):
find you. Keep your head down, do your job, keep your mouth
shut. Does it make work fun? Nope? But if you want the
job or you need it until youget a better one, that's my advice.
Yeah. Literally, by saying nothingis actually you say a lot by
saying nothing. But saying nothing oftentimeskeeps you from being implicated in something that

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will be addressed by Karen the HRgal who looks like she hasn't skipped a
meal in five hundred years. Doesseem to be a theme, in my
opinion that our managers like to eat. Have you done a study or is
this just person anecdotal? Anecdotal?Absolutely? Which in in my life that
is that warrant's authenticity. Absolutely,I stamp it as approved. Okay,

(08:11):
I'm with you by it on thatpot. No, But I mean really
like and when you're dealing, here'sthe tricky part, you know, Penn.
Really it was about the gambling aspectof this that they truly wanted to
monetize, and the fact that they'venow all of a sudden divested from Barstool
and they they reached an exclusive partnershipdeal with ESPN to trademark and create ESPN

(08:35):
BET for a ten year agreement.I think that with all of the different
regulations surrounding gaining, they had tobe extra cautious of personnel and certain things
that were going on inside their company, because when the government gets involved,
then they can clearly sort of bereally difficult to deal with with all the

(09:00):
red tape and regulations, and they'renot gonna make your life easy if you're
not going to have the most pcgo along and kumbayaway type of behavior from
your organization. And there were verypublic feuds when Penn took over Barstool.
They fired multiple people inside the organizationthat, you know, God in the

(09:26):
crosshairs of saying something that maybe wasn'tpolitically correct, or having something arise in
the office, of staring at somebodythe wrong way, which God forbid you
do that. And you know,we're gonna need to have a little chat.
Why don't you bring your resume,you know? Or what are they
say in Hard Knocks, Hey,the coach needs to meet with you.
Why don't you bring your playbook?That means you better get ready to start

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looking elsewhere, see if you canget out of your lease. And I
think it drove, you know,the brand into something that a lot of
people who attached themselves with Barstool foundthemselves going, wow, Portnoy is such
a sellout. He took the bigtime, million dollar payday, but in
trade, he gave up what madeBarstool the platform, which seemed to be

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the outspoken, the antagonist, thecrewed, the fraternity type atmosphere that everyone
sort of attached with. But we'renot blaming him for taking the money.
No no, no, no no. That's his right. And he created
it and sold it. That's justthe way it goes. But once you
sell something someone else and you're notin charge, it's not your baby anymore.

(10:35):
That's why he's glad he's got itback. And that's why when you
lose editorial rights, that is agame changer. And that's why it's kind
of crazy to me. Remember thewhole Brian Williams fiasco on when he did
Nightly News. Yeah, well,Brian Williams had he had an executive producer
title, he was in charge ofall He had final say on all editorial

(10:58):
content, which is very If youwere to dissect prominent media figures contracts,
there are only probably a handful inthe entire nation that possess entire editorial control
over what they put on their show. Historically, though, the nightly news
guy, regardless of the network,usually has at least the title and often

(11:22):
control. And you know, we'retalking three that's three jobs in the whole
industry, but those are the topof the heap jobs. You know,
Dan rather Forever, cron Kite beforehim, and Brian Williams, as you
point out, didn't go so wellfor him well, and it didn't go
so well for him because if hewasn't in charge of final say on editorial

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the pushback from the executive producer mayhave been, well, Brian, you
really weren't in the airplane that youclaimed you were in being shot at making
your way overseas, so maybe weshould leave that out of the broadcast,
and maybe he'd still be doing thenightly news for NBC. That's not the
case. He I did to lieon television and he ended up you know,
being kind of the butt of thejoke until MSNBC. We're on an

(12:07):
island somewhere with Kennedy and Elvis.No, they brought they loved him so
much they figured he was perfect fitfor MSNBC. Brian Williams literally got back.
Is he on? There? Hashe been? All on? He
recently retired, I believe, butthey gave him a show. He did
a show called The Eleventh Hour.I think for three or four years his

(12:28):
journalistic standards fit that network perfectly.Huh, Yeah, that's interesting, isn't
it that a convicted liar wouldn't fittheir cable nets. I guess we shouldn't
be shocked, shouldn't I'm not shocked, Okay, But when it comes to
Portnoy, I think there are alot of people who maybe ventured away from

(12:48):
the Barstool brand because of what someof the than the new leadership brought in.
And you can already tell, evenin just video over the last twenty
four thirty six hours that Portnoy hasreleased, that it appears like Barstool is
returning to the brand that was afirestorm that caught all sorts of attention when

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it was really on fire. I'vealways been a casual observer the bar Stool.
You're a hardcore guy. I don'tknow if i'd say hardcore, Okay,
certainly more involved as a consumer thanI have been over the years.
Did you see a difference, Oh, yeah, clear, it was a
clear difference. Yeah, not necessarilybad, but not as good, not

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as in your face, not asblatantly honest, and just you could tell
everything they did. While it wasstill maybe raunchy or it had an edge
to it, it was filtered andthere's a clear cut you could just tell.
And many of us, you andI in particular, and I believe

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Cole too, we prefer it unfiltered. Yeah, and it's very obvious when
it is being filtered. Like ifyou can do it in a way in
which it's filtered and no one reallyrecognizes, which is hard to do,
there's probably not going to be awhole bunch of pushback. But if you
get into a situation where your brandis now changed and it's obvious to the

(14:20):
consumer, I think that's not agreat look, in particular for a brand
that was as out there as Barstool. Yeah. So when you compare this
now to how ESPN has acquired Iguess Penn has acquired in a partnership deal
with ESPN to trademark and create ESPNBET. I think the challenge for ESPN

(14:43):
is going to be several things.First of all, they're a little late
to the ballgame. I mean,the market share is heavily, heavily,
heavily dominated by Fan Duel Draft Kings, and they have created you know,
Draft Kings has already gotten into thegaming industry. For example, if you
go down to the Casino Queen,that is all DraftKings branded, and they,

(15:07):
you know, have a partnership withthe Casino Queen to have the sports
book in the actual casino. FanDuel has created a massive network Fan Duel
TV. Uh. They have theyhave put a massive investment in on horse
racing. You know, you goto most bars right now, sports bars,
and there there's literally horse racing thatyou can bet on twenty four seven
because it's in every country pretty muchgoing so even when you know you're there

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at eleven o'clock, we'll shoot,they'll have races on in Australia and you
just log onto the Fan Duel appand boom, you can watch it and
bet on it right there. Whileyou're sipping down a domestic sphere. That's
amazing to me. It might bebad for society, but the ease at
which you're able to do it ispretty remarkable. So you understand the gaming

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world, Hetty, ESPN come toyou and said, what do you think.
Would you say, now, stayout of it, do what you
do, or would you have said, well, you got to do something
to save the brand. What wouldyour advice have been to ESPN? I
suppose I would say go in becauseI think your current model is a disaster

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working. It's not working. That'sevident by all of the massive layoffs,
the huge names with making boatloads millionsof dollars of cash that have been laid
off in multiple rounds this year alone. And I think the ESPN model is
broken and it's a radical shift inwhat they're trying to do. I mean,
look no further than them bringing inPat McAfee. You know, Pat

(16:41):
McAfee is more of the barstool typecommentary than anything that you'll watch on ESPN.
And ESPN decided to go full inon social justice and sort of the
quote unquote woke branded media that Ithink led to a lot of people looking

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for different outlets to consume their sportsmaterial and I firmly believe, and I've
brought up the numbers to back thisup, but just look at the growth
of a company like OutKick, whichis owned by Clay Travis, and where
that's gone now owned by the FoxCorporation, and is similar to what Penn
did with Portnoy. I mean,OutKick was just a blog that Clay Travis

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started and all they did was pushedback on some of the ESPN brand and
their ridiculous takes. An OutKick hasgrown exponentially to the point where it got
bought out for who knows how manyhundreds of millions of dollars by Fox.
Do a quick I don't want toget too deep in the weeds. A
bar Stool versus OutKick compare and contrast. Are they too big, too different

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of animals? Well, okay,so I would both. I would say
they've both gone under the umbrella ofsports, entertainment, gambling and just kind
of like culture lifestyle type of sportsand culture. I would say that that
Barstool has a little more raunchy edgeto it. It's more college. Okay.

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The people, the big personalities onbarstool are like adults, but it's
more like college humor, college typeof bro dude attitude type stuff. So
guys like me that just refuse togrow up a little bit. Yeah,
but I they talk a lot aboutsex, and well that's cology too.

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Yeah, like I'll kick, he'smore political, more networking. I get
like they kind of talk about networkfeuds and media. They almost like cover
the media they do in a waythat Barstool doesn't really do. No,
Barstool is not going to put upa clip of an ESPN host having a

(18:55):
meltdown over George Floyd, Like,that's not going to be what they do.
Out Kick will go immediately after thatand then dig up history on said
host or anchor and they will showcasethe hypocrisy. And so it's a little
bit different branding. The only timethat El Kick really kind of gets into
that bro dude sort of attitude iswhen they're talking about college football. But

(19:17):
that's just like that, but that'sparticularly because it pertains to college football.
They do get a little bit TMZis like, oh did you see look
at Aaron Murray's new girlfriend or somethinglike that. They'll do a little bit
of TMZ style stuff, but soand a little bit I've dipped my toe
into that social media information entertainment stuff. I understand why I gravitate more to

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OutKick than bar Stool. Yeah,it makes more sense now that I know
that's kind of their demographic and theyare, I mean, they're definitely going
after probably a little bit more matureaudience that has a bit more of a
worldview outside of kind of grabass stuffthat bar Stool plays on constantly. Well

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so, Travis, So Travis iswho do you talk to? You talk
to your peers, and that's kindof what he's doing. Yeah, he's
talking to his peers in a lingothat his peers would use if it really
were a given take. Yeah,they definitely do have a renegade sort of
energy. I guess both of themdo. It's just different styles of the
renegade energy. So I'll be intriguedto see if ESPN bet is able to

(20:30):
acquire, you know, massive amountsof subscriptions for people. This is what
I think is difficult. One.You know, if you're comfortable using the
current app that you choose, ifyou're in a state that has legalized betting.
Someday Missouri will get on board.But who knows when that will be.
But let's say you're in Illinois.You know, are you really going

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to change from using fan Duel orDraftKings or whatever you're preferred. You're a
gambler. What would they have todo to win you over? How could
they get you better lines? Andwell better? How is it better?
Well, it's more you don't payas much juice. Okay, So you
know typically in Vegas, like you'renot, you'll see lines that are predominantly

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let's say it's just an even game, the money line's gonna be minus one
ten. Well, there are someplaces you know you'll be able to find
it for maybe you know, plusone hundred even money or minus one oh
four, or you're saving six centson the dollars. So it's just shopping
for the best deal. That's whatthey'll need to do to come over.
That would it would take a prettysignificant change in the line, I think

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to see that number grow to thepoint where it would actually be a drastic
impact on how many people would thenuse ESPN BET. I think a lot
of people would get it just becauseI think they want to have as many
sports books as possible. So whenthey do see a game. Oh,
I really think the Lions are gonnawin this weekend or something. Let me
go, let me go check everysingle sports book and see which one has

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the best odds, Like maybe maybeESPN is giving you a plus four and
a half and everybody else is givingyou plus four or something like that.
Yeah, so I got another questionfor you too, and this so I'm
gonna I'm gonna go all bar stooland OutKick on you. I'm gonna try

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and pull all this together with astory that I heard talked about today and
sort of where are we attitudinally withgambling? You and I had a debate
yesterday about NFL players and what theycan and can't do, and the rules
are too confused, all those kindof things. So first question, is

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gambling good? Good for society?Just good? You interpret it anyway you
want? No, No, okay, So then it's okay. People are
I don't I don't think outrage isthe right word. But oh my goodness,
did you see how much Phil Mickelsonhas bet you know, and on

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and on and just horrified. Yetthey're gonna go bet on some random baseball
game that day. R. SoI'm trying to figure out. Is it
hypocrisy or are are the ones whoare offended and outraged by Phil Mickelson's behavior?
Are they gonna, you know,are we gonna start saying we must

(23:30):
cancel legalized betting? Where where arewe here? Seems like if betting is
okay, and obviously these big companiesare paying hundreds of millions of dollars to
be involved, so at least amajor segment of our society, by our,
I mean the three of us,the sports world, we have to

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think it's okay at some level becausewe participate. But here's the difference,
finish figure if you participate, sothen how can we be getting the vapors?
Because Phil Mickelson bet a billion dollars. If it's okay for us to
bet on a horse race at SantaAnita, why can't he bet on whatever

(24:15):
he wants? And oh, okay, that's cool. But you see what
I mean. It's like, oh, did you see Phil Mickelson? Can
you believe it? And I'm justtrying to to me that's a disconnect.
Well, I will say the numberat which Phil Mickelson lost money, it's
his money. I know. It'sjust hard. I think when you hear
that a guy has lost upwards whatwas like fifty million dollars or something like

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that gambling. I think it wasforty. But at the same point,
it's just I think that's a hardnumber for most people to grasp. First
of all, they can never evenimagine making a million dollars, you know,
in one year, you know,maybe in their lifetime. I don't
know. I mean people, that'sa huge number. So when they hear
forty plus million dollars being lost,I think it's just so shocking. But

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where I would say that the keydifference for me is is that while I
can sit here and acknowledge that gamblingprobably isn't great for society, that doesn't
necessarily mean that I believe it shouldbe illegal. So I don't know,
you're not outraged or offended, oryou don't get the vapors when you hear
about the Michelson number. I don'tknow how many people get offended other than

(25:23):
the people who are reading the teleprompterwho are trying to foist it on you
to be offended. Yes, lookat this number, Yes, this should
you should be outraged by this?Why should I be outraged by that?
It's phil Michelson's money. He's gothundreds of millions of dollars and he bets
a bunch of it. So yeah, I mean, is it okay?
Is it sad to hear that aguy loses that much money? I doan

(25:45):
care. I don't care. Wedon't know how much he lost. Well,
the forty million, but I mean, you bet a billion dollars,
you could win four hundred something millionlose five hundred something million, and so
oh, he's betting a bill milliondollars. Well, maybe he only lost
a couple million out of that building. If he only lost forty he must
have done pretty well. Yeah,if you're betting a billion, that's not

(26:07):
that means that you probably you wonfour hundred and eighty million dollars with the
bets, but you lost five hundredand twenty million dollars with the bets.
When a poor schemo ends up onskid row because he gambled his money away,
I'm empathetic, But do I reallyfeel bad? Choices we make that

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have an element of blowback, andyou choose to do it anyway, and
we all do it too. Youknow, you cross the street, you've
chosen to do something a little bitmore dangerous than not crossing the street.
And whether it's gambling or smoking,or riding a motorcycle without a helmet,

(26:51):
riding a motorcycle period, riding abicycle on public streets, all of us
have a line that will go toof I'll accept the risk and then if
you get if it blows up onyou, Yeah, I don't want to
see anybody hurt or damaged or whatever. But that's that's that was part of

(27:15):
the that was part of the gambleyou made, right, Yeah, And
I don't think everybody else should haveto suffer your consequences. So people who
are able to gamble responsibly, Idon't think should be outlawed because one person
couldn't, right and so and sowe all get upset. Oh my goodness,
Phil Mickelson, that's crazy. Well, other people are just sitting on

(27:36):
their couch betting ten dollars on theMarlins and the Reds and can't afford it.
Yeah, well, it's all relative. For the people who can't afford
it, should should they be punishedby the people who can't. I mean,
look, if I don't see howit's any different than spending your money
on any other stupid stuff like youcould go to Walgreens right now and just

(27:59):
be an over spender on twenty thousanddollars and soda. Yeah, worth of
anything, And so what's the differencein spending twenty thousand dollars on that?
And what is Balgreen's gonna say?No, you're not allowed to do that,
No you can, you know.I don't gamble, but it's not
because of some moral position. Idon't like the action. I've tried before.
It ruins it. For most people, it enhances the involvement, whether

(28:22):
they're watching on TV or just whatever. But for me, I get sick
to my stuff. I don't likeit. I don't like the action,
so it's just not for me.But you want to do it, go
ahead, Well, I would saythat everyone enjoys it while there's still a
chance of you being able to win, and then as soon as the zero's
hit the clock and you've lost,you get the same sixth sense in your

(28:44):
stomach that anyone else gets from anysort of loss, and that is a
feeling that never grows old. Idon't care if it's a dollar bet or
two grand I mean, losing isnot fun. But for the guys who
really gamble. Yeah, they feelbad, but the way that the adrenaline
rush they had during the event isworth it to them. And then they
keep going back to the going backto the bookie. Yeah, I used

(29:07):
to bet a ton in college.And I'll tell you this, I would
have been the greatest radio host everbecause I could name you every single player,
every single everything. I could nameyou the Mariners lineup one through nine.
Back when I was gambling. Iknew everything that was going on.
You have to and so to theas far as this job goes, there
were some benefits to it, sure, but you start rooting against your own

(29:33):
teams and that that isn't fun,but it doesn't kind of take away from
the wholesome aspect of sports and havinga favorite team in the camaraderie, because
now you're just chasing money and you'rejust rooting for yourself, which you know
that's in the moment you're like,hell yeah, I mean I want to
win the money. But you startrooting against your own teams and you start
to you start to care less aboutyour own teams, and then that that

(29:56):
does take away from the passion ofsports a little bit. And then it
all becomes a transaction. Then itbecomes what college sports is turning into,
and then it's like, well,the deeper meaning that this once had it
kind of got sucked out of itand now it's all about money. I
understand why, but that does kindof hurt. I just think that sports
programming in general is seeing where sportsinterest is going. And the trend has

(30:22):
been on a lot of people pickingup sports gambling, and I think sports
gambling, even before it's been legalizedin States, has been a huge thing
that people get into. And nowthey're recognizing that there is money to be
made in trying to deliver information.There's money to be made in subscription packages

(30:45):
where people want that information. Andthen if you look at it, where
like PENN and ESPN BET hurt nowlooking at it as well, our brand
is literally dying. We are losingmoney hand over fist, and unless we
try to get on board with wherethe sports culture has shifted their interests,

(31:10):
we're gonna still be here sitting talkingabout Ken Aaron Rodgers win a Super Bowl
and people I think are just becomingsort of dull on that type of material
just doesn't add. There's there's toomuch of it. To begin with,
And then also, who wants tosit there and rehash an argument that is
all built on hypotheticals to begin with? No one? Does anyone truly care

(31:32):
what the guys sitting on the ESPNanchor desk thinks about. Well, the
Packers win a game, that's daydesk five days. Sure, that's less
of an indictment on the sports worldas much as it is on ESPN and
FS one for just repeated programming overand over and over again and uninteresting topics.
So what about this theory? It'sonly a theory and probably half baked.

(31:56):
But do the these organizations that aregetting more and more involved, can
it actually be growing their sport?Where hardcore fans are already there and probably
betting, Maybe they weren't. I'ma hardcore fan, but I wouldn't bet,
you know what I'm saying. Butit feels like more and more casual

(32:17):
fans get more into whatever they're bettingon and that sport. So is it
Can we call that an example ofgrowing the sport? Potentially? I mean,
you said that you wouldn't watch theNFL if you couldn't bet on it,
true, so it grew to youat least, and I'm always shocked

(32:37):
at the number of you know,even college kids that have no money,
having been there myself, and they'rewilling to risk, you know, two
hundred dollars every Sunday on games thatthey know they're likely to lose that money
on. But the lure of theopportunity to win money and the lure of

(33:00):
trusting someone enough with their gambling adviceto feel like, Wow, this guy's
a winner, and signing up fortheir subscription package where their material. I
think that that idea is so youbecome so addicted to it that it's there
whether it's good or not. I'mnot here to play to be the moral

(33:23):
police. What I'm saying is thatthese operations are seeing a trend and they
are doing everything they can to jumpin the pool. Because the pool that
once existed for a brand that youknow that was the go to place where
you got all the information and scoresand highlights and all that you can now

(33:43):
get that everywhere. So that fieldhas become so watered down that they are
no longer a go to spot tosee who won a game last night and
who pitched the best or who hadthe farthest touchdown, run catching, it's
no longer interesting to people. Sofor a while it got into the back
and forth. You know, That'swhy you saw almost every single ESPN show

(34:06):
where you had two people pitted againstone another and a host there to sit
there and debate the whole thing.And I even think that that model is
becoming outdated, and it's now we'reseeing a shift. Fox really gravitated towards
it first with Fox Bet, andnow ESPN is moving in that lane with
ESPN Bet. But I think bothof those networks are still grossly behind what

(34:30):
FanDuel and DraftKings have already brought tothe table, which is a an app
which is extremely user friendly and it'svery easy to sit there on your couch.
And one of the elements that alot of young people enjoy betting more
than just the winner of the gameare prop bets. You know, will

(34:53):
Aaron Rodgers throw two touchdowns in theseason opener against the Browns on our against
who are they playing in the roundthe I forget to whoever on Monday Night
Football when they open the season,will Aaron Rodgers throwed two and a half
touchdown passes? And those are thetypes of insights that I think people really

(35:15):
think that they can get an advantageon. And if you look at pricing
in the betting markets on those propbets, they know that they are liable
on those because you pay significant juiceon some of those, more so than
just a straight up winner of thegame. I mean, the algorithms in
some of these leagues have gotten sogood where it's basically even money on the

(35:38):
point spread or the run line orwhatever the different line is in terms of
the model being able to project theoutcome of the game where they are definitely
liable, and I think people havebeen able to take advantage in some cases
are on these prop bets. Youknow, will you find a guy,

(35:58):
maybe there's a player to night inthe lineup that's had tremendous success against mister
Littell who's pitching for the race,and you go and look, well,
Goldschmidt's hitting five hundred in his careeragainst Littell. I'm gonna go put a
prop bet on Goldschmidt over two anda half hits. And oh, by
the way, I'm gonna parlay thatprop bet with like two other prop bets.

(36:19):
And so then you get into whata lot of these kids are doing
now. A lot of people willsay parlays are for the house bets and
they're losing money on it. Butthink about it. If you're risking ten
dollars on a six player parlay that'sgonna pay out maybe upwards of a thousand
dollars. Shoot, you can loseall month long and you hit one and
boom, not only have you madeyour original investment back, but you're up

(36:42):
six hundred dollars. And I seemore and more people investing in that type
of market, and that is that'ssomething that has made it tough. I
think for bookies, which were andstill are illegal, but it's been hard
for them to sort of replicate theaccess that people can get on these apps
would be a fan Duel and DraftKings, and I haven't necessarily checked out

(37:02):
the pen app. I do thinkthat the Barstool sports betting app was similar
to that, but I don't thinkthat they had the wide array of prop
bets that are readily available on DraftKings and fanduels. So again, that's
all about development and app creation andyou know, understanding algorithms and all that.
I mean, that's those are techsoftware people that are building these models,

(37:25):
which is crazy because it has nothingto do with sports. The one
thing in my perfect world that Iwish were the case would be that there
would be no VIG and that itwould be a true fifty fifty between you
and the casino. But obviously that'snot going to be the case because and
look, it's not totally unfair.They're offering you a certain price and if
you take it, you don't reallyhave much of a leg to stand on

(37:46):
it. If you say, oh, that's not fair, that's not fair
that you're guaranteeing that you win everysingle game because of the VIG, it's
like, well, then why areyou betting on it if you have such
a problem with it. But thatis the thing where you can go up
above fifty percent, because the linesare set basically to be fifty fifty,
and you can go fifty one percentand still being fifty six percent is what

(38:09):
you have to pay if you're payingthe house juice in order to win money,
so that at the over fifty percent, it's fifty two point three eight
or three nine to break. Yes, the best, the best. If
you want to see an unbelievable sixtyminutes This was before sixty minutes went right
in the hell hole, but sixtyminutes had Billy Walters on. Lara Logan

(38:29):
did a piece with Billy Walters,who's now I think in jail for insider
trading. But Billy Walters was ableto manipulate the line so much where he'd
bet on something and he'd get ahalf a point somewhere and he'd go back
and buy his original investment and thendouble down on that. Want to see
the line move. It's unbelievable segment. It's like ten or fifteen minutes,

(38:50):
but it is well worth your time. And when you see his operation and
how he looked at sports gambling,this guy probably couldn't even name you every
player on the roster. He wasn'teven I wouldn't say it was a sportsman.
He was a math magician. Hewas just in numbers guru. And
when you see that he was onlyhitting like fifty seven percent of his bets
with all of the tools he hadavailable, you should recognize that you are

(39:15):
at a disadvantage going into this thing. So, like anything, if you
can sort of have fun doing itwhile not like losing your ass off and
having them come take the keys toyour house and all your different assets.
By all means you go do whateveryou want. But I do get a

(39:36):
little worried when I see this huge, huge movement towards the gambling gambling side
of things and the addiction that it'screating. I can't say that it's good.
But I also don't believe then inthe government banning it. So I
don't know. It's crazy stuff.What I do know is I'd like to
be Dave Portnoy who not only initiallysold his business for five hundred and fifty
million dollars, but then to comeback and re acquire that same business for

(40:00):
a dollar. I'm smart. You'veplayed your cards quite well, my friend.
To anyone being interested in sports betting, I would say, bet on
football because it's in basically a fouror five month window and it's a couple
of times a week. Okay,So it's not going to be your everyday
baseball. It's not going to beyour everyday basketball, and so you can

(40:21):
kind of regulate it a little bitand not just over indulge and just kind
of focus on a couple the endof the week, you also get into
a tailspin where you're chasing money andyou'll still think well, of well,
not the bet period. But doyou know how many people try to win
all their money back on Sunday nightfootball. They lost on college, they
lost on the early games in theNFL. I'm going to double down on

(40:44):
Sunday night football, and then comeMonday morning they are broken. They're getting
a text saying you're down two grandI mean that those are rough days,
folks. Those are rough days.And I can speak from experience. That's
not fun. So you have tobe careful. But Dave Portnoy, and
here's the other I'll just close onthis. This is why I think it

(41:05):
is so cool to see independent mediafolks completely rewrite the script on these executives
and people who have been in networktelevision for a long time, and the
bob Igers of the world who areback at Disney and they're trying to throw,
you know, a parachute to allthese companies that are looking around going

(41:27):
up. Oh, we continue tolose subscribers, we continue to lose all
of our We're losing, losing,losing. We wore we all wore masks.
How are we losing? What dowe do? Why can't we get
where we are. We're in athis is group think echo chamber. Why
isn't it working? Why don't peoplelike our brand keep doing it? And
then a guy like Dave Portnoy,who simply started a blog, made five

(41:51):
hundred and fifty mill and he boughtback brand that I think has more loyalty
built into it than ESPN does fora dollar That is unbelievable to me.
And maybe if these suits ever gottheir head out of their ass and started
putting people who could actually think forthemselves and not what ESG or these other
bogus entities labeled them as, thenmaybe they might be actually capable of growing

(42:17):
their business. But in the meantime, I mean, look at the blood
Light. I mean, for god'ssakes, Annheuser Bush just had to sell
off like seven or eight different assetsunder their beer umbrella, breckon Ridge Alaskan
Beer. They just sold off likeseven or eight major brands because they're making
up for the losses that they hadgoing with Dylan mulvaney and that the trans
bud Light can and it's just like, you know, stop stop doing this

(42:39):
to yourself, right, it iscapable. You are capable of just going
back to like, you know,running a sports operation or running a beer
company, and you've always solved it. They still cannot figure out why they
lose money hand over fist, andit's because of the content that they put
out there that nobody gives a flyinghoot about. It's crazy easy to me,

(43:00):
but leave it to Disney to continueto go about their ways as they
fall into bankruptcy at ESPN. Allright, it's one thirty two. We'll
take a break and we will beback with more. It is high noon
on five ninety The Fan