Why Isaiah Thomas is a Celtics Legend: "You Had To Be There" Vol. 7 ft. Derrick Myers

It's the NBA offseason which means "You Had To Be There" episodes return! Today, Dez invites Derrick Myers, Celtics fan and owner of On the Sidelines Media to the show to give flowers to one of the most unique & special players to ever play for the Celtics---Isaiah Thomas. Derrick declares why he believes Thomas is a Celtics legend, discusses IT's generational impact on the Celtics' culture, explains how he understood both sides of the controversial trade for Kyrie Irving, and much more. 

Enjoy and share your memories of IT! Thank you for all the support! - Dez

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
To me, he is a Celtics legend. It didn't matter
who was on the who was defending him. Oh yeah
he was cooking. Yeah he was cooking. You had to
be there to see that. Right. If there's one thing
that anybody should take away from from his story, his grind.

Speaker 2 (00:19):
Welcome to Hip to the Games, the podcast for you
the basketball junkie and the hip hop hit. I'm your host,
Desmond and I too have had hoop dreams and enjoy
the beautiful genre of hip hop and its history. Together
we will enjoy some of the greatest albums, songs, artists, players, moments, teams,
and so much more, while even mixing the two on occasion.

(00:40):
All in my hope that you remember why you love both.
For either of these to begin with, you'll soon understand
that Hip to the Games is more than just a podcast.
It's a lifestyle. And if you were looking for a
platform that combines both basketball and hip hop, you've come
to the right place. They play my kind of basketball
and a lot of layers.

Speaker 1 (00:58):
To this song.

Speaker 2 (00:59):
If you're really paying attention, it's a huge shout out
to you for being Hip to the Games. Welcome to
a new episode of Hip to the Games. Whether you
are new to the H two DG family or a
Day one supporter, I sincerely thank you for listening or
watching today's show. All praise to the creative director, Jesus

(01:22):
christ As is always a blessing to get in front
of this microphone and share what he's putting my heart
with you. And a special shout out to the home team,
my nineteen Media Group family for the opportunity to represent
a network filled with passionate independent podcasters. If you consider
yourself hip to the games, I would really appreciate it
if you took a few seconds to give the show
an honest rating and review on audio platforms like Apple

(01:44):
Podcasts or Spotify so we can continue to grow the
H two DG family. But for now, though, the NBA
offseason is here, which means that over here on H
two DG, it's time to get back to our exclusive segment.
You had to be there. When the NBA season ends
and there's little to talk about this, this is the
perfect time to throw it back and give flowers to
our NBA favorites of the past. Whether they are widely

(02:05):
considered all time greats or hitting gems, none of that
matters here. There are legends, but there are also legends
in our hearts, and that's what we want to do
with You had to be there. This segment makes room
for both of those. You had to be present to
watch them play on a night in, night out basis
to really appreciate what they brought to the game. And
in today's edition of the episode, I am excited to
be joined by owner of on the Sidelines media and

(02:27):
Celtics fan. Another Celtics fan making his appearance on h
U DG making his hip to the game's debut is
Derek Myers, as he takes us on a time travel
journey to reminisce and or learn about one of his
players that he enjoyed watching. And by the end of
this episode, we hope to get the overall point across
that you just had to be there to witness the

(02:47):
way they impacted the game. Derek, I'm happy and grateful
to have you on an episode if to the games Man, welcome.

Speaker 1 (02:53):
Thank you very much for having me on. Man, I've
been looking forward to this so I love it. Man,
I love it. Thank you, Thank you for sure.

Speaker 2 (03:00):
Man. Like like I've said off camera, Man, I just
we've been able to connect within the last few months
a couple of times, and I admire what you've built
with OTS as a sports platform and respect the way
you offer your critiques and your analysis, but in an
honorable way. I think you and I both know of course, man,
I think we both know the sports world needs more
of that, and I'm happy to allow our listener here

(03:20):
to get a glimpse of that today.

Speaker 1 (03:22):
Oh for sure. I appreciate that, bro, Yeah it is.
It's refreshing when you come across people that actually you
can see take time with their craft and you know,
actually appreciate all angles of the sport, not just on
the court, but reporting and all that stuff and actually

(03:42):
trying to be fair to the people that they're talking about.
So you know, I salute you for everything you've been
doing with your show. Man. This is a great platform.
So I'm glad to be on here.

Speaker 2 (03:53):
Thank you man. Absolutely, But wasting no time, Derek Meers,
You've had a decent amount of time to think about it. Now,
who is that player that you look back on and
just say, man, you had to be.

Speaker 1 (04:04):
There, man, So I had thought I thought about it
actually like three different guys.

Speaker 2 (04:09):
That's how it goes.

Speaker 1 (04:12):
But I'm gonna talk. I'm gonna bring up the guy
that is actually one of my favorite and he's actually,
to me, he's very underrated in certain aspects. I think
for the franchise itself and the fans, I think they
appreciate him, but I think that overall, I kind of

(04:35):
feel like his contribution kind of gets overlooked a little bit.
And I'm gonna I'm gonna talk to you about Isaiah Thomas.

Speaker 2 (04:45):
The little guy isah T I T four okay, okay, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 1 (04:54):
Yeah, I think specifically with his time with the Celtics.
To me, he is a Celtics legend. And I think
I've said that before and people have actually given me
a little bit of flack over it. But when you
think about when he came to Boston, the team was horrible,

(05:20):
like like.

Speaker 2 (05:20):
You're still figuring some things out. It was a transition phase.

Speaker 1 (05:23):
It was. It was a big transition man, that that was.
That was a horrible time. And like when he came there,
it was it was supposed to be a time of
just kind of like a rebuild, right. We weren't even
supposed to be in any conversations of contention and just

(05:45):
to see the immediate impact that he had on that
team coming over from Phoenix. Mm hmm, bro, this man
resurrected and people actually think I'm joking. This mans erected
the the intensity and fire that it takes to be

(06:08):
on this team at Lake. For sure, I feel like
he brought that fire and that tenacity, that that grind,
the hustle. He brought that all back to Boston that
we had not had that specific intensity since KG was there.

Speaker 2 (06:26):
Ooh, I like that. Okay, see you you now I'm
really excited because you say something like that. Right, KG
is a is a beloved member of the NBA fraternity.
Right but when when? I so this is the first
player if I'm if memory serves me correct, I know
I've only done this. This is like the seventh episode
if you had to be there. But yeah, if memory

(06:48):
serves me correct, this is the first one of the
twenty ten's since I did like Andre Goodala to start
the series. So I'm excited because I really have the
memory of this player. Yes, so I'm really excited to
get into this. I know, I know you say you
want to focus on the Celtics part, but just just
as a whole. So of course, Before we get into

(07:09):
kind of his career summary, I need the origin story.
Where were you when you first got wind of.

Speaker 1 (07:14):
I t ooh when he was in Sacramento? Okay, you
know I saw what he was doing that out there
and loved it, right, I didn't really, I ain't gonna lie.
I didn't follow the Kings. I don't think anybody did.

Speaker 2 (07:28):
Nobody. Was no disrespect to the Kings fans, but we
wasn't watching that was that was That was some dog ears.

Speaker 1 (07:36):
I'm pretty sure that Sacramento fans weren't even paying attention,
but like he was. It was just something different about him.
And then when he got the Phoenix, it was it
was more the same. It was just kind of like
you saw something there that was just, in my opinion,
wasn't appreciated as much as it should have been by

(07:58):
those franchises. And he gets to Boston I think it
was twenty fourteen twenty fifteen season, gets to Boston, Yes,
and immediately, I mean, the smallest guy on the court,
the smallest one, but the to me, he was the
most intense on the court. Right, he was horrible on defense.

(08:22):
Let's let go. I can't can't sugarcoat it. He wasn't
you had to hide him on defense, right, but he
was willing to throw his body on the line even
if even if he got blown by. It was like
he was going to be there late and and and
and and contest. Right. There was something about his dynamic

(08:44):
with Marcus Smart and Avery Bradley, who I actually was
going to bring up Avery, Avery Bradley. I decided to Yeah,
I decided to go with him.

Speaker 2 (08:52):
Yeah, hey, they don't they don't pick up full court
like that. And he did a good job. But yeah,
you're not picking up at all.

Speaker 1 (09:01):
Man. I think he's he's one of the most underrated
players as well, because I actually learned a lot in
terms of defensive assignment watching him. And this is during
the dog years, right, like this is.

Speaker 2 (09:15):
You got, you got, you got plenty of time to
pay attention to.

Speaker 1 (09:21):
Yeah. Yeah, And it was something about I t getting
to that team though, that just kind of like lit
a fire. Like they had Jay Crowder, Marcus Smart, Avery Bradley,
John Dogs bron guys that really like when you look
at their names on paper, the only one that should

(09:41):
make a difference is Marcus Smart on paper. He's the
only one that you look at late. Okay, yeah, I
gotta I gotta game plan for him everybody else I
can just kind of like make it up as I go.
I t had us contending bro like and and this
is if I can if I'm not wrong, I might

(10:04):
be wrong by this, but he was one of the
first guys that to me, it was like they named
the fourth quarter after him. I can't remember, I couldn't.

Speaker 2 (10:14):
I think you're right, right, he did. He did take
the I remember it was big because he took the
Dame time thing. There was some debate of who did
that first because and I team made it his own.
That was that was a big deal back then. But
I think you're right.

Speaker 1 (10:29):
The fourth and and it was something about that fourth quarter, right,
like he just that fire was going man like and
he was so intense, especially in the playoffs. I mean,
to me, he likely will not likely that'd be a
Hall of Famer, But he's one of those guys that

(10:52):
in my eyes, and I I you might people might
think I'm stupid for saying this. There are specific players
that when the team gets a championship ring, I believe
they should get an honorary ring. Okay, Isaiah Thomas is one.

(11:14):
DeMar DeRozan is another.

Speaker 2 (11:16):
Yeah, that's a good example.

Speaker 1 (11:18):
I see, Yeah, like there is because there are specific
trades that kind of like lead to other things that
allow you to get the player that ultimately leads you
to that championship, right, And I feel like he is
one of them that deserves it. Marcus Smart, I would
say the exact same thing, just for what he did

(11:40):
in Boston during that time and how he got traded. Yeah,
because if he did not get traded, we weren't getting
Drew Holliday, which led us to get in a championship. Right. Like,
it's little things like that where I'm looking at him
like if I were the owner of a franchise, I'm
giving players like that an honorary championship because when you

(12:04):
look at how they impacted the team, whether it was
the specific team that won the title or maybe the
iteration before or two iterations before, their impact allowed the
pathway to the championship, correct, Right, And that fire that

(12:26):
he brought to Boston stayed there, that has been there
since he has left, it has been is it like
if you look at.

Speaker 2 (12:35):
It, Yeah, what makes you say that? What makes you
say that with such conviction?

Speaker 1 (12:39):
Because now, even in bad years, we're supporting the team. Right.
We love the team, we love the players, all that stuff.
But there's a level of intensity that comes when you
know you have something. When when before he got there,
we were not contending, like we're not the Dallas Cowboys.

(13:01):
We're not gonna sit here and say, oh, we're winning it.
That ain't us. We're not gonna be an average team
and be like, yeah, you know, you know it's our time.

Speaker 2 (13:13):
No, just because you were, you got me some cowboy fans.

Speaker 1 (13:21):
We're gonna be real. We're gonna be real about it,
and and we're gonna tell you what it is, but
we will support that team no matter what. When Isaiah
Thomas came to Boston, there was this level of intensity,
Like I said, that hadn't been there since cag left,
But there was this The intensity was on the court,

(13:46):
but it was also from the with the fans, Like
it was like you had an expectation that's a better word.
There was an expectation that we had with this team
when everyone else was doubting it. Hm hmm, right, And
and and that allowed us to get all the way,
you know, into the Eastern Conference finals, and and and

(14:07):
it's just to me that standard being set at that point,
it's like, okay, yeah, n for the new guys that
are coming in, this is where we are.

Speaker 2 (14:18):
So I think I'm sorry. I'm sorry, Derek. I just
think that I feel what you're saying, because now it
makes sense, right, Like that year was like, oh, we
have a twenty point per game score and a bunch
of gritty role players. Yeah, that's actually a doable formula.
So then even when he gets traded the way he
gets traded, it's it turns into Kyrie, Jason Tatum, Jaylen Brown,

(14:40):
role players, Al Horford's in the mix, y'all still making
the Eastern Conference finals, Terry Rogier blows up as a
role player, and it just continues U for for the
next few years. I understand what you're saying.

Speaker 1 (14:50):
Yeah, yeah, and and and that's been for the last
eleven years, bro. Like it's just you cannot you can't
replace that, you can't rep like just that, you can't
just automatically like manufacture that. That has to be something
that's within you, right, And he brought that attention to

(15:11):
detail to the Celtics that is like, Okay, nah, this
is where we are. You know when when when they
shipped off Paul Pearson and Garnet, you knew the team
was wasn't going to be anything. And then Rondo was gone. Yeah,

(15:31):
Rondo was that was that dog too. But when he
was gone, I think it was traded. Uh, Doc Rivers
was traded as well. Like it's like when when the
only coach to be traded right, like that was that
was amazing. But when when all that kind of when
that happens, it you build up to a point where

(15:55):
you're just like, Okay, our only expectation is that we
are rebuilding and we're trying to get specific players to
help us. And that led into you know, actually Avery
Bradley led the charge after that iteration was gone. So
it was like Avery Bradley was the first building block.
But then they went and drafted Marcus Smart and then

(16:16):
they drafted James Young, who nobody remembers, but we had
expectations from him.

Speaker 2 (16:23):
Yeah, yeah, he was supposed to be, dude.

Speaker 1 (16:26):
He was supposed to be I don't know what happened.
I really don't know what happened. But it's like it's
those little things that come up where you're you're looking
at it and you're figuring out the specific type of
player that you want to lead the charge that rebuilt,
Like Bradley wasn't the guy to lead the charge because
he got hurt a lot. But yeah, you go out

(16:47):
and get Isaiah Thomas is like okay, like we we
see what we got with these three guards right here,
what like what else can we add? Then the add
j Crowder to the mix, who nobody really knew he
was Alas Maveris, but nobody was paying attention to him,
right and he came in and it was just like
this little this elevated intensity of attention to detail on defense,

(17:12):
like it's just for me. Isaiah Thomas is a Celtics legend, Bro,
I don't care what anybody says, stand on it.

Speaker 2 (17:21):
Stand on it.

Speaker 1 (17:25):
When you average twenty four points, I think what seven
assists two rebounds in your time with that team, Bro,
especially back then.

Speaker 2 (17:37):
Like I was saying in a weird in a weird
stage in the Celtics Laura, but also like to your point,
if the league was different back then, yeah, different back then?

Speaker 1 (17:45):
Yeah?

Speaker 2 (17:46):
And you mentioned so you mentioned Derek a lot. The
word I'm hearing a lot is impact Now? Is that
because I have I have plenty, I have plenty of
thoughts of what you just said. But is that is
that the thing that you would say is what stood
out about Isaiah Thomas because I think it's interesting that
you're mentioning a lot of his who he is as
a person, and I think that's why a lot of

(18:07):
the fans gravitated towards towards it because he knew, Like
I was just having this conversation the other day, like
Isaiah Thomas knew he was five nine, Like yeah, yeah, yeah,
and to go out there and do what he did, Yeah,
Like you know, he knows this, so to play with
that chip on his shoulder. So like, do you think
that's what stood out or would you say there's a
specific part of his game that stood out to you

(18:28):
as well?

Speaker 1 (18:30):
So of course you're gonna look at his shooting, like
his range was for a player that's five nine to
have that type of range, that's extremely impressive. And also
not just the range, but being able to this is
the part of his game that I feel is the
most underrated part is playing in the post m he

(18:53):
was crazy is what led to his his injury though
which I always I always like got nervous about him
going into the post because the way he fell, he
would fall down and he would land on his hip,
and that's what ultimately led to the deterioration of that
whole thing, which sucks, That really sucks. But his ability

(19:19):
to get into the post at five nine still score
and have his way with anybody, it didn't matter who
was on the who who was defending him. Oh yeah
he was cooking. Yeah, he was cooking. You had to
be there to see that. That was something that was

(19:40):
just beautiful to watch. Now, the person, the type of
person that he is, and and and his character, Yeah,
that to me was that that that leads to charge
for sure. But when you when you see someone at
that stature go in and and play amongst giants and

(20:06):
have his way and action.

Speaker 2 (20:09):
Every trip down.

Speaker 1 (20:11):
Yeah, I'm sorry. There's no way you can sit here
and tell me that he's not a Celtics legend.

Speaker 2 (20:19):
I So what stands out to me, Derek, is that,
like when I go back and watch Celtics it in particular,
especially the year he averaged twenty nine. Yeah, incredibly sharp.
There there's usually a point when scores reach the pinnacle
of their career where they are sharp like like it's
it's a lot of people hear what I'm saying and

(20:40):
they're gonna say, oh, yeah, as you're talking about their peak. Yes,
their peak. But when you really watch the game, how
sharp every movement is, every shot, especially to your point
it mind you, a lot of that was off the
dribble as well. A lot of his threes weren't always catching.
Shoot he's coming off the pick and he's rising, he's
elevating because of his size, he has to elevate higher.

(21:02):
He had a high release point. He's shooting over the defender,
coming over top like. He was incredibly sharp, incredibly sharp,
every every dribble, penetration, move in and outs, change of pace,
change of direction, the ability to slither in get a layup.
I love seeing all of that. And to your point,
I think it was on a greater scale with with
those Celtics teams. And I think, well, I'll get into

(21:26):
it eventually in the in the conversation, but you know,
you mentioned that you feel like he's a legend. Some
may disagree, but you also introed it saying how you
felt like he was underrated and how how uh he's
he's beloved among Celtics fans, So like just kind of
with all that in mind, like, do you do you
feel like he's underrated and just the grand scheme of

(21:47):
the of NBA basketball as well, or is it just
Celtics area, How do you see.

Speaker 1 (21:52):
That grand scheme of basketball? Because if you see like
what he's even able to do right now, To be
honest with you, the only reason why he's not on
a team right now is because of his height. That's
literally the only reason why it's it's his height. But
then also defense. Right now, we're in the era where
you prefer your players to be able to switch one

(22:13):
through four. One through three, matt like at the minimum,
but one through four is kind of like what you want.
One through five is like beautiful dream case. Yeah, yeah,
that's that's your dream and and and he can't do that,
you know, he he he can't, So you have to
have him on a team. That's why having Marcus Smart

(22:35):
and Avery Bradley and j Crowder having those guys surround
him was was absolutely perfect. And then bringing in how
Al Horford, all four of those guys amazing defenders, right
so I can hide behind that where it's like okay, yeah,
you might have a hole on defense and you know

(22:57):
right here, but it's not a big hole because you
got these guys are gonna slide over like it was
just to me, it was poetry in motion. And I
think that's one of the things that when you watch,
just as a basketball fan, if you can't appreciate what
he did to me, it's one of those things where

(23:19):
you you just like the name, You just like the
guy that the specific guy that you're talking about. You
don't like the game, You don't you're not a fan
of the game. You're a fan of a person. And
you know that those are two different things. To me.
You can't sit here and talk to me about specific
players and and and then you say, oh, I'm not

(23:42):
now when I talk about bringing someone up, it's like
I don't really know, but I don't think, but I
don't think that's the case. Like, for example, we're in
this era now where people like to uh downplay Kobe's
impact or or his ranking, and it's just like, as
a basketball fan, like how do you do that? Like

(24:05):
if you're an actual student of the game, how do
you do that?

Speaker 2 (24:08):
Even if you hated the man, Like you have to
acknowledge that I hated.

Speaker 1 (24:14):
Kobe Bryant bro and I love him at the same time.
It was like, you can't sit here and talk to
me about basketball, and then it's like, eh, nah nah,
these certain guys you can say, you know, maybe they
weren't that great, that's fine. But to downplay greatness, to

(24:35):
me is one of the hallmarks of how should I
put this someone who is basketball illiterate When you're when
you're down playing it like that, it's like someone that's
just not that can't fully grasp what they're watching or

(24:56):
they don't care to. And that's fine. If you don't
care to, you just you just want to sit in
on specific players and specific teams. Cool, that's fine. I
can sit here and watch some league, you know what
I'm saying, Like, I love the game, so you know,
I have my favorites, of course, but I love the game.

(25:17):
Isaiah Thomas, to me, especially if you watch what he's
done in the G League.

Speaker 2 (25:23):
He tears it up the minute he gets called up.

Speaker 1 (25:26):
It's a fourth single time.

Speaker 2 (25:27):
And to your point, there are the people out there
who see that and they're like, well he's five eight,
he's thirty five years old, and he did it on
thirty three shots. I'm like that was his first that's
straight off playing with his kids in the backyard when.

Speaker 1 (25:42):
He gets the rest, like.

Speaker 2 (25:45):
He's dropping forty fresh off of his first call up, Like, yeah, yeah,
I can't stand it. I can't stand it.

Speaker 1 (25:52):
Yeah. Yeah, But I think I think he's definitely unappreciated
amongst basketball fans in general, because Isaiah Thomas, to me,
is one of those guys that, to me, if I
had anything to do with it, I'd put him in
the Hall of Fame just based off of impact. Just
based off impact, you know, like he had a short
stint of time where he was the guy where he

(26:14):
was like you were looking at him, you're looking at
him actually being in MVP conversations. Do you know how
difficult that this.

Speaker 2 (26:24):
At five not? Yeah? Hard in general, it's hard to
it's situational and everything. Yes, to do it at five nine.

Speaker 1 (26:31):
Yeah, that's that's crazy, especially when you're not a good defender.

Speaker 2 (26:36):
Yeah, and the vegue was changing about that too. That
was right, he that year was right. I always say
twenty sixteen seventeen was the start of a lot of
what we're seeing today. Yes, and yeah, so that doesn't
surprise me.

Speaker 1 (26:49):
Yes, yes, So.

Speaker 2 (26:52):
What we what we typically do when you had to
be there, is I like to go down their career
and on like a year by year kind of thing
and kind of summarize where they were, the stops they
had in the situations. Because you you made you made
a good point earlier. So his first three years are
with Sacramento, and again we we didn't even mention yet
just the simple fact that he's the last pick in

(27:13):
the draft, in the twenty eleven draft, and this is
the draft with Kyrie. Yes, Kawhi's in this draft class,
Like there's some there's some hoopers here, but sixtieth is
this this this five to nine dude who I think
at that time. Now now me personally, I'm I'm similar
to you. I picked up on it in Sacramento. But
you look back and you see what he was doing

(27:34):
at Washington. He is the game winner in one of
the tournament games, Like yes, so he's like, okay, this
this dude can hoop. And so he averages eleven and
four out the gate in his in his rookie season,
and he pretty much I think he starts over half
the games. So he's showing promise. A year two, he's
at fourteen and four, so he's he's showing what he

(27:55):
can do. He's starting more, but again the Sacramento Kings
aren't in the greatest spot. Now, what really sticks out
is that third year. So again it's always dope when
players really show something that within those first three years,
and at five to nine in his third year, he's
averaging twenty points and six assists, and I believe yes.

(28:16):
So for the again, he started not all the games,
but a majority of the games. And now you're like, okay,
like this dude, like twenty points is at his size
is pretty noticeable. But then he gets traded to Phoenix.
And the funniest thing about that Phoenix team, Derek, I
don't know if you remember, but that was the year
where we were all looking at them crazy because it's

(28:37):
like you're bringing in dragic, you're bringing in it you have.
I can't remember if either if it was either of them,
are both Eric Bledsoe, Brandon Knight, I don't think. I
don't think Brandon Knight just yet, but I think even
Tyler Ulis, you have like four point guards on that team.
So his numbers, his numbers did back down to sixteen

(28:59):
and four and he was a full time six man
on that team. So yeah, it was strange. It was strange,
and I think he knew that. I think Boston kind
of knew that. Like, hey, like, okay, anytime you see
a team with that many point guards handling the ball
at the same time, somebody's getting shipped. Yeah, And the
Celtics did the best thing that they could have done

(29:19):
at that time, and they traded for that dude. And
to your point, instantly there's a connection. His points jump
up to nineteen and he's averaging five assists with the Celtics,
So he comes from fifteen and three with the Sons
to nineteen and five with the Celtics. Now again, you
mentioned this team earlier, and that's what I love. Some

(29:39):
of my most favorite teams of those those eras are
the teams with grit, Like you said, not a lot
of household names, and that in turn makes you band
together as brothers and say like, hey, like, let's build something.
And I think each of those guys were in that
stage in their careers. You know, Marcus Smart, like the
Celtics hadn't been in the lottery in quite some time,
so he's new to the fold. It is new to

(30:02):
the fold. Every Bradley's trying to get in this transition
where he's learning from the Big four. But now they're
all gone, right. Emir Johnson has bounced around the league.
He's a tough interior presence. Like you said, they eventually
get Jay Crowder, a name we didn't mention, Evan Turner.
Evan Turner's his way as a point forward. So yeah, man, yeah,

(30:23):
I liked him in Boston, man, I really did. I
thought it was a great bounce back from from Philly
for him. But yeah, so suddenly you have all these
pieces again, like you said, Kelly olynnok you know, being
the college star that he was, and it's like you
look around the locker room and it's like, okay, like
we we nice, but like we just got to get
the people to see it, and boy did they do that.

Speaker 1 (30:45):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (30:46):
What do you remember about about some of these Are
there any specific memories of those teams that you have there?

Speaker 1 (30:51):
Yeah? Man, the battles with Washington. God, I forgot what
year that was. We battled with Washington in the playoffs.

Speaker 2 (31:02):
I think that was twenty seventeen, twenty seventeen.

Speaker 1 (31:05):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, that one.

Speaker 2 (31:10):
I believe.

Speaker 1 (31:12):
Cleveland was that same year, if I'm not mistaken, but they.

Speaker 2 (31:18):
Think because I think that was the same one where
John Wall was like, have we beat Boston like we
were to face. I think we could beat Cleveland.

Speaker 1 (31:24):
Yeah, yes, yes, yes, but that specific time against Washington.
Believe I forgot what the score was and what the
where they were in the series, but I think it
was a closeout game and it was like, man, he

(31:48):
basically I ain't gonna ain't gonna say specifically what he
said because you know he's profanity, but he was like,
we got them against the ropes, don't let up, Like
basically like, let's go, let's kill him. Let's kill him.

Speaker 2 (32:02):
He did that against he did that against my bulls.
I remember that.

Speaker 1 (32:05):
Yes, Oh my god. When I heard the audio from that,
I was sitting that that that's gave me shivers, but
I was. I was. I got so excited. I knew
we were winning championship that year. You couldn't tell me
anything like it was just the fight. Oh man, look

(32:26):
that I think that was the same year. I think
that was the same week as we went against Cleveland.
The only reason why we didn't win that series we
didn't have the experience.

Speaker 2 (32:37):
And it'd be like that sometimes that's all was.

Speaker 1 (32:42):
That's all it was, because if we had the experience,
to me, it doesn't even matter who was on that
Cleveland team, we were going to beat them like we
had the ability to do it.

Speaker 2 (32:52):
Let's unpack that. Let's unpack that because again, people people going,
people are gonna try to think back and rebuttal So
my thing is, okay, so do you remember anything about
those regular season matchups? What gave you the confidence that
those that Celtics team could be the team with lebron
K Love Kyrie.

Speaker 1 (33:09):
So it to me it was defense, right, Everything that
I say is predicated upon.

Speaker 2 (33:17):
Defense, right, I respect defense guy.

Speaker 1 (33:20):
Yeah. So we had Al Horford there at that point,
and and it was it was like the way he
was able to switch positions, and then Bradley comes in
and and and and and does his thing and Crowder like.
To me, it was the only difference was the experience

(33:41):
and Bradley's health. It was pretty much the only reason
why we didn't. I don't remember the regular season matchups,
but I can tell you the the the expectation that
was there during that time was like this team like,

(34:01):
it's not like finals or bust. It's not. That's not
what you think about with that team. But it was like,
this team can get there. To me, it was like
the the the least I thought the lowest round they
were gonna get bounced out was the Eastern Conference Finals.

(34:24):
I'll put it to you like that, That to me
was the the floor for that team. They were just
different and and Brad Stevens, the way he was able
to draw ex's and o's, it was, it was.

Speaker 2 (34:39):
He did a great job with that team.

Speaker 1 (34:41):
He did a phenomenal job, especially coming in like being
so young. He I think it came from Indiana and
being that young Butler Butler, yes, yes, but no one
knowing who he is really like on a on a
on a national level outside of the college game when
he came into When he came to the Celtics, everybody

(35:02):
was like me included, I was like, who is this guy?

Speaker 2 (35:06):
I'm I'm I remember being hyped for y'all.

Speaker 1 (35:10):
So that's the thing. I don't follow college the college
game like that, like to be able to tell you
who's coaching and all that. Like, I don't follow it
that much, or at least back then, I didn't. Now
I can tell I have a loose understanding of certain
coaches and players, but back then I was. I was

(35:32):
in the position of, okay, let's see what happens. Like, wow,
that had nothing to lose. We honestly had nothing to lose.
We already lost the Big three, a Big four, Like
you trade away you coach, Like, what, what's the worst
that can happen at this point.

Speaker 2 (35:51):
That's a good point because we talk about the players,
and now you have this new head coach as well,
who yes, it's got to prove himself as well.

Speaker 1 (35:58):
So a culture culture, Yeah, it's to me, it's one
of those things where you just look at it and like,
all right, we don't have that big of an expectation
going in. But as a season was going, it was like,
hold on, these guys could actually do something you didn't
want to. You didn't want to press into it too heavy.

(36:20):
But and then I had everything like when we drafted
Jalen Brown, you know, it was a bit of the
same thing, what can we do? What can we do?
And then everybody's like trade Jalen Brown. I'm like, no
trading for Kawhi No. I like I saw it back
then he was even at that time, Yes, that time,

(36:41):
he was bro I swear on everything I had, I
was the only I was the only person that I
knew of saying don't trade Jalen Brown m hm. Because
they wanted us to trade him for Butler. They wanted
us to trade him for Kawhi. And to me, I'm
not trading a young guy for an old guy, a
older guy, but he's doing the exact same thing those

(37:02):
guys do on a significantly lesser contract. Why to me,
it just it never it never made sense. It has
never made sense to me. So I saw the potential
back then. I can't explain what that looked like in
the moment, but you saw it. He was there. Like
this team now is Isaiah Thomas's thumb print, like he

(37:28):
has his dumb print is on this team. And and
and people people might might you know, say differently. I'm
okay with that. I'm okay with being in the minority
with this one. You will not shake me on this.
Isaiah Thomas, to me, is a Celtics legend. If I
had it my way, that may would be in the
Hall of Fame for just what he did in Boston,

(37:49):
for those three years. That man is phenomenal, phenomenal and
and and I like, I wish he was still in
the league because I believe he still has what it takes.
But I want to see him get into coaching because
his attention to detail.

Speaker 2 (38:11):
Is you want to see him coach on the NBA level.

Speaker 1 (38:16):
Yeah, I would love to see that. I mean eventually,
not right now, eventually, Like I want to see I
want to see what he can do, like you know,
with with the kids and if he builds up and
stuff like that, you know, maybe going to the college
game or whatnot, maybe getting onto uh, to a coaching
staff in the NBA, something like that. But I want
to see him. I want to see him being to
developed players.

Speaker 2 (38:35):
Because he's got he's got plenty of wisdom to dish out.

Speaker 1 (38:38):
You can see, yes, you can see yes, Yes. I
feel like his impact from a coaching perspective would be
that of what Sam can sells is ooh ooh.

Speaker 2 (38:50):
I like that. I like that though, he would definitely
have that respect. I can see, yes, I can see
yes now, Derek. You you mentioned earlier too of the
of his impact on that team. So for our listener
here mind you twenty thirteen, to fourteen. In case anybody forgot,
the Boston Celtics went twenty five and fifty seven the
year they got it, that went to forty and forty two,

(39:13):
and again mid season.

Speaker 1 (39:15):
That was a mid season too, yeah.

Speaker 2 (39:17):
Yes, and they still managed to make the playoffs. That
was the year they got swept by Cleveland in the
first round, but again noticeable improvement. And then the following
year twenty fifteen to sixteen, forty eight and thirty four,
first All Star appearance for it Celtics, they once again
lose in the first round to the Atlanta Hawks in
six games. And then of course the when the year

(39:41):
he finished fifth in MVP fifty three and twenty nine
and like you said, lost in five in the Eastern
Conference finals. So again, he always and Alan Iverson was
one of his favorite players. I know that, but yeah,
he had a similar effect. I understand what you're saying,
like and I agree wholeheartedly. He had that effect. He
fell in love with being a Celtic, the fans embraced him.

(40:02):
He put that on his back with the chip that
he already had on his shoulder, and carried this team
to a fifty win season. At five to nine, we
have not seen that. We had not seen that before.
We've seen have we seen small guards? Do they thing? Absolutely?
But at five to nine that it is. And I
know we keep saying it. It sounds like a broken record,

(40:23):
but it's just impressive. It's incredibly impressive, and I think
so so Derek. We have to of course we could,
we have to go over the glory days, but we
also have to kind of go into win. It all
went downhill. Now you kind of alluded to it earlier.
Unfortunately it's tenure as a Celtics did not last that long.

(40:45):
What do you kind of remember about that transition? Because
you mentioned some of the different phases the Celtics went through.
How was that? And I actually I want you to
focus on this. How was it knowing that you got
somebody like Kyrie Irving? But the way they did it,
especially after the way he played in the playoffs, dealing
with the passing of his sister, all of those things.

(41:06):
He put his hip on the line to do great
things and then they ship him the very next season.
Can you can you get into all that? Yeah?

Speaker 1 (41:13):
Yeah, So I'll be honest with you. I when when
the trade happened, I think if I'm not mistaken. I
think I was watching ESPN when it broke, and my
reaction was like I was confused, because not confused, like

(41:36):
why they move on from him? I was confused from
about everything, like moving on from him when we just
got Gordon Hayward. Mind you, Gordon Hayward was coming to
Boston to basically be that number two option. He was yep,

(42:00):
and that was with Al Horford there right, So it
was like when when he when we got Gordon Hayward,
there was a video. I don't know if you I
don't know if you remember this. There was a video of it.
When he got the news that we got Hayward. He
started dancing and everything like that because he was like this,
remember that we got to get a championship. He was
at home. He was hype.

Speaker 2 (42:21):
You got to get and real quick, real quick. They
don't they don't know how how cold Gordon Hayward was
at that time, and he had also just been an All Star.
Gordon Hayward was a dog.

Speaker 1 (42:33):
At his prime. That man. He there was nothing that
could prevent him from being a great number two option.
Like on that team in Utah he was a number
one option. He was killing it, right, Yeah, But it

(42:54):
was one of those things where you can see you're
not going to win with him at the core, at
least not in Utah Utah was was wasn't as developed
as as it is right now, but you could see
that that potential in his game right there. So it
was like, okay, you pair him with it and you've

(43:14):
got Jay Crowder, you got you still kept the core
with James Brown. It's like, what the hell, Like, what
is going on here? Mind you if I'm not gonna
saying that was the same season, the same summer they
drafted Tatum. It was so so now it's like at

(43:35):
that point they were looking they were saying they were
looking at Markel Folts, so you're kind of like looking
at folks as like you know, oh, maybe you come
off the bench something like that. Right, cool, But then
they they made the trade and one hand, I'm I'm

(43:56):
honestly hurt and betrayed because that full disclosure. I even
said I was going to name my son Isaiah Thomas
this is how much respect, which.

Speaker 2 (44:08):
Is interesting, which is interesting because that's how he was named, right.

Speaker 1 (44:13):
Yes, yeah, yeah, so that was that was the thing
I was looking at. I'm like, oh man, this is
my guy right here. So they trade for for Kyrie,
and it is you feel pain, but then you also
feel excitement at the same time, like because he just

(44:35):
won a championship with Cleveland. Oh, Kyrie, Gordon Hayward, Jaylen Brown,
Al Horfruit.

Speaker 2 (44:44):
Jason Tatum.

Speaker 1 (44:46):
They didn't even get Tatum at that point yet. Yeah,
it was like when they when they drafted Tatum, I'm
that I'm thinking, oh my god, all the possibilities endless. Right.
It hurt, but I understood, I understood the reason why.
Mind you, The part that a lot of people don't
think about either is it was a part of the

(45:10):
reason as to why Durant was almost about to come
to Boston. It was he wanted to play with Horford
and he also saw it there. So you're looking at
at a to me, a magnet, right like you said
All Star. You're seeing what they're doing in the in

(45:30):
the in the conference finals, and it's just there were
so many elements to it that you got hurt, like
I was emotionally. Let me tell you you know how
how much this hurt me. This hurt me just as
much as seeing Paul Pearson KG get traded away like

(45:51):
it was that level for me. For me, however, the
only reason why I would say it was a little
bit more than Hall, Peerce and KG in terms of
the pain is because those guys at the end you
could already see they weren't they were not going to

(46:12):
be that high end level anymore at that point.

Speaker 2 (46:16):
And they got y'all one. Unfortunately it was only one,
but they got y'all one.

Speaker 1 (46:20):
Should have been two, should have been too. If Perkins
doesn't got down, it is too. But that was the
pain that was felt when he got traded away. Now
you're looking the reason why it got a little bit
eased is because you're looking at it like he got
traded to Cleveland. Remember this is a team that had

(46:43):
Lebron uh d Wade.

Speaker 2 (46:49):
They end up getting d Wade, d Rose, they had ball.
They was supposed to be the team to be bad team.

Speaker 1 (46:57):
Yeah, So that's where to me it was like, I
don't look at the trade as a betrayal to I
t in the sense that they sent him to a
championship contender. They sent him to you know, you know
what I'm saying. They sent him to the team that
was going to go all the way. Should have gone

(47:18):
all the way. But that's what helped it a little bit.
At the same time, I didn't want to see Isaiah
Thomas and the jersey. I only wanted to see him
in the Celtics jersey. That was it.

Speaker 2 (47:31):
So so was there any was there any moment where
because because I feel like a lot of most of
the con consensus back then was like, oh, no, they
did it dirty, like it's a dirty business. How dare you,
Danny Ainge, like was there some of that as well?

Speaker 1 (47:44):
Or or you were just the no. Mainly because I
understood the health aspect of it, and I was like,
I was amazed that we were able to get Kyrie
because if you think about it, let's let's look at
it like this way. Okay, in today's game, if you're

(48:05):
trading for who's off the injured player, Yeah, that's okay,
that's enough. That's let's let's use that example. If you're
Philly you trade Embiid for for Jahn Morant, do you
not look at Memphis as a team that got got

(48:26):
in that trade because Embiid is at least for the
last two years, he's been out a ton of games.
You know what I'm saying?

Speaker 2 (48:38):
Fair share too.

Speaker 1 (48:39):
He's missed his fair share, but it's not always because
of injury, you know, Like.

Speaker 2 (48:44):
Yeah, you're right, you're right. He had and stuff. Yeah, yeah, he.

Speaker 1 (48:46):
Had his stuff. Yeah. You know, you can say the
same thing for Zion Williamson, right, Like it's like if
you trade someone that's always injured, because if you if
you think about it, Isaiah Thomas was gone that last year.
He was gone a lot. And the the idea that
they were able to to get him to Cleveland and

(49:09):
get Kyrie Irving in return is ridiculous. That that's what you.

Speaker 2 (49:17):
Mean the season, the season he was like on the calves.

Speaker 1 (49:21):
Yeah he was. He was injured a lot that season. Yea,
into that into that offseason he was hurt.

Speaker 2 (49:26):
He played through played through the hip.

Speaker 1 (49:28):
Yeah, he played through the hip and the playoffs and
and and you were like you can see it. It
wasn't like something that that was just you could hide.
You can see that in the playoffs that like, oh
when when when it's time to shut the season down,
he's gonna be out for a little bit. The idea
that you were able to to trade him away and
get and get Kyrie Irving is is like is mind blowing,

(49:52):
and that trade in of itself, to me, catapulted the
next iteration of this of the Celtics because now you're
looking at it where yeah, it's Kyrie and Gordon Hayward
as the leaders of the team. Going in Game one,
Hayward gets season injury, season ending injury, which then catapults

(50:16):
JB and j T into a position of oh, we
gotta do we got, we gotta become those guys we
got you got you look at it and like, okay,
now got time to build up.

Speaker 2 (50:26):
It's show why we drafted, to show why.

Speaker 1 (50:29):
We drafted you. Yeah, and and for j T to
do what he did in the playoffs and that year
was like you could see it. So yeah, to me,
that's why I say that that it's thumb print is
on this team as well, because the grit, the attention
to detail on on defense and also trading him away

(50:52):
to go get Kyrie led to what we have right
now for sure. So like I would give him a
champion and shit ring like you know that he deserves it.
He deserves it. I didn't feel bad in the sense
that he got done wrong with that. I just I
do feel in a sense that he got done wrong

(51:14):
in a way that I do, like he just yeah,
he just put his body on the line, lost his sister,
you know what I'm saying, Like lost his tooth, had
to go get them through reconstruction. Like it's a lot
that he went through for that franchise that I think

(51:35):
that's the reason why people say he got done dirty.
And in that sense, yes, I get it. At the
same time, I can't argue against it because it's a business.

Speaker 2 (51:48):
It's another day.

Speaker 1 (51:50):
That's what Danny Ainge does. And if you I'm not
did you watch Celtic City on HBO. Okay, they didn't
talk about Isaiah Thomas like that. I'm not even sure
if they think. Yeah, I don't think they actually even
include his name in this in this in the series,
which was wild to me. But in that series, Danny

(52:14):
Ainge speaks about how Red Hour Back kept Larry Bird,
Kevin McHale and Robert Parrish past the time that he
should have because he was loyal to those guys, right,
and he loved them. They were lifelong Celtics at that point. Sure,

(52:35):
get it. But when you have the opportunity to strike
and trade for someone that can put you in a
position where you can reset the timeline, so to speak,
to compete for much more championships. He was looking at
it like, why the hell do we not make this move?
Why do we not trade Larry Bird for a potential championship?

(52:58):
Why why we Why would you hold onto the loyalty
aspect of things and not pay attention to the fact
that we're in here and now we can compete. We
have players here that we can build with if we
go get someone that's younger that can lead h And
because that was his his mindset back then, that was

(53:23):
his mindset going in as a GM period that he
was not going to keep someone longer than he should
based on loyalty. And yes, it sucks, but that's exactly
why you saw Paul Pearson KG get traded. Now, he
did talk to them and ask them where they want
to go, but it's like you're going You're not staying here,

(53:54):
You got to get out of here.

Speaker 2 (53:56):
He sent them. He sent them to teams that were
either their preference or that was another contending team. So
I see what you're saying in the sense that he
did he did the best that he could with the
cars that he that he was dealt like, yeah, I
would hate to trade you, but it is a business.
But I'm not gonna do you dirty and send you
to you know, can Kon. You'm gonna you can go
to Cleveland. So I get that, I get I just

(54:18):
you know, I just wanted to clear that up a
little bit, just because I knew, you know, people people
might watch this and then they're gonna be it'll it'll
take the conversation in a whole different direction, uh than
than the intention. But so so when we think about again,
it's like the unfortunate rise and fall of It's career
that he again, he was one of those stars that

(54:38):
had a short prime. You know, you hate that he
was never really the same after the injury. And again
to what we were saying earlier, he showed plenty of flashes,
plenty of flashes, but didn't always get his just due.
And I again, I was just having this conversation and
I was like, I missed the NBA when if you
could play, you were out there. I hate this whole

(54:59):
Oh he's gonna get picked on on defense, blah blah blah.
And it's like like to what I said earlier, you
don't think these guys know that, like even Yuki with
with the Bulls Summer League right now, Like you think
he doesn't know he's five eight. Yeah, I'm like, that's
why he's again what I said about it, he's he's
sharp as heck. You have if anybody that can play

(55:19):
the game of basketball, no matter the size, should have
a spot on an NBA roster, if they can, if
they're if they're able to that. I missed that part
of the NBA, So it was unfortunate that you saw
that with how the league was going that I t
it was just getting clear and clear. It's like he
can hoop, but these teams aren't. Just they not messing
with him because the game is changing. But with that said,

(55:41):
and even then, I know that this might be a
tough one to answer, Derek, But with that in mind,
is there a player in the game today that reminds
you of anything close to it? And whether and and
size aside, right, is there anybody in the game today
that reminds you of Isaiah Thomas?

Speaker 1 (55:59):
Oh, just from scoring perspective, let me see, I would
that's a good question.

Speaker 2 (56:08):
Yeah, because I'm trying to think too. It's it's you
could you there are still some small guards out there.
But again, it's not like what it.

Speaker 1 (56:15):
Used to be, not at all small. Small today is
like maybe six six foot even six foot two. Yeah, yeah,
So man, who plays like it now?

Speaker 2 (56:31):
Like I'm trying to think of somebody who's sharp, somebody
who's on an up and coming team.

Speaker 1 (56:36):
We got Peyton Pritchard.

Speaker 2 (56:40):
I like it. I like it. I could see that.

Speaker 1 (56:42):
I could see Pritchard because again he is small, he's
on a smaller end mm hm, and he still has
that ability to get to his spot no matter who's
guarding him, and and and and it's almost like it's
it's almost like it's unguardable at times, especially when you're

(57:03):
talking about like half court shots. He's able to he's
shooting on a high clip. Coming into the NBA, when
he was first drafted, he was not that really he
wasn't that great from long distance. But I think it
was also because of time. He didn't have a lot
of playtime. And I think, yeah, I think that's the

(57:25):
thing that people don't factor into consideration when they're talking about, uh,
someone's averages. They just look at the box score, but
they don't look at the playtime, especially when they're younger.
If you don't have a lot of playtime, when you
get out there on a court, you're not.

Speaker 2 (57:42):
Going to be it's hard to get a rhythm.

Speaker 1 (57:44):
Oh you're not gonna be a rhythm at all.

Speaker 2 (57:46):
He because he didn't really get his opportunity till Kemba
got hurt. Yeah, that's when people were like, oh, this
dude's nice.

Speaker 1 (57:52):
Yeah yeah, yeah, yeah. And I look, I mean he's
a man. He's the only one could think of off time.

Speaker 2 (57:58):
I'll say this it is. I was going to especially,
I think it might show more this year because of
the defense that they have around him. I was gonna say,
Trey Young, Trey Young has a little bit.

Speaker 1 (58:08):
Of yeah, yes, yes, yes, yes, and you're right, you're right, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 2 (58:15):
I was trying to think of guys, other guys around
the league too, But yeah, I would venture to say, uh,
Trey Young, Trey Young.

Speaker 1 (58:24):
Yeah, I think I'm with you on that one. Yeah.

Speaker 2 (58:28):
Now, now, Derek, we'll do a fun thing here. You
have the opportunity to put Isaiah Thomas in the modern
NBA with four current players that would realistically fit his
style of play. Who would those four teammates be? So
you could pick from any any team.

Speaker 1 (58:43):
Okay, I'm going Marcus Smart he's with the Lakers right now, which, well,
he's about to sign with the Lakers. That that hurts.
I hate that.

Speaker 2 (58:54):
I call it damon effect.

Speaker 1 (58:56):
Yeah yeah, I put Marcus Smart at the two.

Speaker 2 (59:02):
Okay.

Speaker 1 (59:03):
I put Jaylen Brown at the three. Okay, at the four,
surprise you, but surprise you Tatum at the four. Okay
you kitch at the five. Oh now you're telling me
that starting five wouldn't win the championship.

Speaker 2 (59:23):
That's a sixty win team for sure.

Speaker 1 (59:27):
Yes, yeah, because you have your you have your ability
to defend with all four, right, but then you also
have your shooting with.

Speaker 2 (59:39):
Yeah, you can you can five out.

Speaker 1 (59:41):
You can five out with shooting the spacing on that
would be crazy, like that would give any coach a headache.

Speaker 2 (59:48):
How do you see that? How do you see that?
With with the with Joko, with with with the off
ball movement. You know, I T I T is cold.
He needs that rock. J T. I think need that rock.

Speaker 1 (01:00:00):
Yeah, Well, j T plays. JT over the last two
years has played significantly better without the ball, okay. And
and his ability to which this is the reason why
I hate why people got on him for not playing
specifically well in at least in the finals. Let's you know,

(01:00:23):
that's fine, but I mean he actually averaged what what
SGA did and that that's where where I'm like, how
does that not? Well? If this man got a finals
MVP for doing the exact same thing, that's a whole
other topic. But when he plays without the ball, you
see how he is on the defensive side. You see

(01:00:44):
how he is with his ability to to to playmake
you see how he is when he's in the post,
like he's able to stretch the floor out his his presence.
Even if he's not scoring at a high clip in
a specific game, his presence alone is going to demand attention.

Speaker 2 (01:01:07):
Yeah, that's true. That's true. That's true. And I'm thinking
of it right now. I would I would venture to say,
and I don't know why I'm I'm prefacing this like
it sounds crazy, but I would. I would venture to
say that Jokic and I t at his peak. You
think you think Jamal Murray and Jokic is cold with
the d h os, You imagine I T having Jokic.

Speaker 1 (01:01:31):
Like it.

Speaker 2 (01:01:34):
I like it. I like it. I'm trying to think
and and and you made me. What we just talked
about made me think of this, so I would probably
go I T. I would go Dison Daniels, for sure,
give me. And I'm trying to think of I need
to go back and look at everybody who I've used
already to this point. I do this every time. I
want to say Anthony Edwards. But I'm trying to think

(01:01:54):
of somebody just in case I used him in the past.
Somebody another another score on the wing, somebody that could.

Speaker 1 (01:02:08):
Shoot the three, Bank Carrol.

Speaker 2 (01:02:11):
I would. I would put Bank Carroll at my four.
I could put Polo at my four. I'm I'm more.
I want somebody at my three. And see, Okay, okay,
he hasn't played, he didn't play a lot last year.
But I'll go Herb Jones.

Speaker 1 (01:02:26):
Man, I think people sleep on Herb Jones.

Speaker 2 (01:02:28):
Yeah, yeah, I hate that he got hurt. I hate
that he got hurt. Yeah, because he was he was
doing his thing. He was doing his thing. But also
I go, I T Dyson, Daniels, Herb Jones, Polo, and
then my five. Uh, and I go more traditional too.
I can't even lie. I tend to go more traditional.

(01:02:56):
Let me see, dang I wonder if I, uh, he
don't stretch the floor. But if I haven't used them already,
I'll Gouba is one of my favorite bigs and.

Speaker 1 (01:03:07):
He's another underrated player. Yeah yeah, but if you put
him out there with players that will force you to stretch.

Speaker 2 (01:03:16):
Oh yeah, yeah, he'll be just fine. He'll be just fine.

Speaker 1 (01:03:19):
You'll be fine.

Speaker 2 (01:03:20):
I like those teams though. I like how you think
you had me with the Celtics in the beginning. But
you know, it makes sense. It makes sense interesting putting
out there, and that's what that's the dynamic that it
t didn't have. So that's dope.

Speaker 1 (01:03:31):
That dope. Well he had de Marcus Cousins.

Speaker 2 (01:03:35):
Oh true, he wasn't shooting threes back then.

Speaker 1 (01:03:39):
Yeah that yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:03:41):
You're right, you're right though, you right, Yeah, presence.

Speaker 1 (01:03:44):
In the post, yeah for sure. Yeah. Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:03:48):
Now, Derek, you have to pick because it's hip to
the games, you have to pick one hip hop song
as the soundtrack to I ts whether you want to
do his style of play or his career, the theme
of his career. What song would that be? And why?

Speaker 1 (01:04:06):
Hold on? Hold on? I want to I want to
make sure I get this song.

Speaker 2 (01:04:08):
Right, Okay, I got I got one that came to
mind instantly. I want to hear yours first though.

Speaker 1 (01:04:16):
Hustle and motivate.

Speaker 2 (01:04:17):
Oh, you gotta go nip with I. T you gotta
go nip with I. T see, And I didn't even
think of that. That's what I know. Nip nipps is god. Man. Dang,
that's a great one. That's a great one. Why why?

Speaker 1 (01:04:31):
Because it personifies it describes his his play style in
terms of his attention to detail, hustle and motivate. He
was also always hustle on the court and he was
always motivating his teammates. That was that was his that
was his theme, that was his that was that was

(01:04:51):
his identity of what he wanted to do. And absolutely phenomenal.

Speaker 2 (01:04:58):
Man, Yeah, I like that. That's a great pick. That's
a great pick. Now. I immediately thought of Jadakiss off
of the Love and still yeah, I was like, dang.
I was like, that's actually that fits. Like I see it.
And again I made the comparison earlier. But the same
way you kind of that can kind of be synonymous

(01:05:19):
with Alan Iverson. I see that same exact thing with Isaiah.
He put his everything on the floor on a night
and night out basis, Like you said, say what you
want about the defense. But he again, he was one
of those guys. He embodied everything the Boston Celtics were about.
He could have easily went into that situation upset that
he was on another team and in his first few
years in the league with his third team, and in

(01:05:40):
the first few years, he could have easily been like, man,
I can't find my place. But he took every situation
and he balled out, and the Celtics was the one
that really got him over the top. So I think
again and again, the love for the game you gotta have,
and just to go through what he's went through and
still have his joy for the game, still this passion
for the game, even for this to this day, trying

(01:06:02):
to get back. I think it's it's no question. Uh
A song is passionate as that. And and you know Jada,
I love I love Jada Kiss. So yeah, I had to,
I had to. I had to go with that one
from my two good songs for the IT mix. Yeah yeah, yeah,
I like that all right. Now. Lastly, last few questions, Derek,
I want to let you have the Florida to share

(01:06:23):
any final statements on Isaiah. But as a lead, I
will ask you, what is one thing that you wish
the newer generation newer understood about this player?

Speaker 1 (01:06:34):
Oh oh, I like that his willingness to grind. I
feel like there are a lot of players that want
the success, that want the fame and notoriety, but don't

(01:06:56):
care about the grind mm hmm. And there's something there's
something about when you see someone who's been counted out
multiple times and and and and by by metrics, should
not be there by standards of of other people, believe

(01:07:25):
he's never gonna make it. When you have that against you,
And like you said earlier, the last pick in the draft, uh,
playing on a team where it was a crowded uh.
There was a ton of point guards on the team,
and you still find a way to to shine in

(01:07:50):
a crowded room.

Speaker 2 (01:07:52):
Mm hmm.

Speaker 1 (01:07:52):
Think about that, you're in a crowd like it's like,
that's like going to a concert sitting in the nosebleeds
where you're tapping Jesus and and and the performer is like, hey,
it does man, how you doing?

Speaker 2 (01:08:06):
Yeah?

Speaker 1 (01:08:09):
Isn't that That's that's absolutely crazy to think about. That
doesn't make sense. For him, the smallest guy on the
team to have the brightest star is crazy. It's crazy.
And I think that's the thing that even outside of
just basketball, it's like, you should be able to do

(01:08:35):
what it takes to get to the destination you're trying
to go to. Right, It doesn't matter what it calls for.
The journey is the journey, Right. It's like, if I
have to sacrifice sleep, and and and if I had
to sacrifice money or if I had to sacrifice notoriety

(01:08:57):
or whatever to be able to get to where I'm
trying to go, to be the ultimate success, I'm going
to do that right now. That that takes a lot
and that's a lot of lip service because people will
say they are willing to do that, but live it
to do it. When it's time to do it, you

(01:09:17):
actually see not only what you're made of, but you're
able to see the type of people that you're surrounding
yourself with, right, And that's that's the type of person
in of itself that anybody should be willing to follow.
That's a leader. There are a lot of players that

(01:09:38):
look at it and just want the notoriety or whatever,
but they're not willing to grind, to get to the
point where it's like others are looking at you to lead,
Like you can say you're a leader, but our people
are willing to follow you. How are you a leader
if no one's following? He was walking by his.

Speaker 2 (01:10:01):
Show, Yeah I see, yeah, Yeah, it showed up with
that Celtics team.

Speaker 1 (01:10:06):
It showed that man was willing to not only walk
the walk, but he was willing to put his his
body on the line. He literally put his body on
the line.

Speaker 2 (01:10:17):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:10:18):
Yeah, playing with the Celtics the way he did cost
him his career, bro. Yeah, and he was willing to
do that and did it. His sister died in a
car accident and he still went out there and played
lights out.

Speaker 2 (01:10:37):
Where was it the fifty seven point game? We didn't
even talk about that, Yeah, but it's yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:10:45):
If you saw him pre game, that man was a.

Speaker 2 (01:10:48):
Wreck, understandably so a wreck.

Speaker 1 (01:10:52):
Still.

Speaker 2 (01:10:52):
I still see that image of Avery Bradley with him
on the bench. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:10:56):
I got chills now thinking of that, Like, how are
you able to perform under that type of bro that
I ain't gonna lie and y'all say what y'all want
to say. That's that's Kobe Bryant level of dedication. That's
that's Michael Jordan esque. You know what I'm saying to me,

(01:11:19):
That's that's something that people don't have. That's what a
lot of players don't have, because a lot of players
don't even want to play as many games as possible.
They want to sit as much as possible. They want
like play as many games to get the recognition for
the awards, but then sit as much as possible. You

(01:11:42):
can't build up endurance. And and that that you that
tough exterior. You can't build that sitting down, Bro, you
can't do that. You can't do that. And and and
Isaiah Thomas was the guy that was out there doing it.
So is there's one thing that anybody should take away
from from his story?

Speaker 2 (01:12:04):
His grind Well said, Man, well, so that's a way
to stamp it, for sure. That's a way to stamp
it for sure. But lastly, Derek, because again this is
a hip hop and basketball platform, and it's been a
minute since I asked this question, the real ones already
know what's next. I need your five by five because
it's his hip to the games. You need to give
us your five favorite basketball players all time and your

(01:12:26):
five favorite mcs.

Speaker 1 (01:12:28):
Oh Jesus man, Oh my god, okay, my favorite five
favorite basketball players. Uh, it goes out saying Isaiah Thomas,
Isaiah Paul Pierce, Paul Pierce, Kobe Bryant, Kobe, Michael Jordan.

Speaker 2 (01:12:51):
Uh huh, Tim Duncan, Tim Duncan, Okay, I like that.
I like that.

Speaker 1 (01:12:58):
Yeah, I like those silent quiet Yeah, there is a
theme there, There is a Yeah, silent Assassin is just
I can show you bet and I can tell you
yeah yeah yeah. And and Tatum is on that he's
he's there now for me too. But you said five,
so I'm trying to think of, you know, the Alzheimer's.

(01:13:18):
But yeah, and and respect.

Speaker 2 (01:13:24):
How fast you came up with that respect?

Speaker 1 (01:13:26):
Thank you?

Speaker 2 (01:13:28):
You know, I know I put people on the spot
when when I ask him that, So.

Speaker 1 (01:13:31):
You were ready for it.

Speaker 2 (01:13:32):
Yeah, what about though, that's a different ball.

Speaker 1 (01:13:35):
Game, Okay. J Cole is my absolute favorite. I was
just listening to Fidy Night Lights before happing over here.
But yeah, as you see backdrop born center. But yeah,
J Cole, Kendrick Biggie mm hmm, Tupac, I have to

(01:14:01):
I'm gonna put jay Z there okay you.

Speaker 2 (01:14:08):
I don't know when you said, Jay, you look like
there was somebody next to him and we can't see
who that is. Yeah, I'm just instigating. I'm just.

Speaker 1 (01:14:21):
Come on, man, this So he's one of those guys
that's significant underrated too. But these are the guys that
got me through like a lot of stuff college and
and and and a lot of life in general. Those
are the top five that I continuously listened to for

(01:14:43):
whatever reason. So actually say six. I'm sorry I said,
so I'm going with all them. I'm going with all these.
You know, you know you want to put other people
in that in there as well, But those are the guys.

Speaker 2 (01:14:58):
Yeah, I feel you. You you he really got about
like a top fifty. But you know, it's it's down
to five and I.

Speaker 1 (01:15:04):
Don't even know how to order them that Like I
got J Cole and everybody else falls wherever they fall,
Like it's just like it's it is what it is
for me, you know.

Speaker 2 (01:15:15):
But Derek, dare I say, and again, if memory serves
me correct, you were probably the fastest person to ever
give me their five by five. If I think about
all of that, like I'm like, I'm sitting here like
he really was ready for that. He was really ready
for that. Like, I'm like, that's and I like it.
I love it.

Speaker 1 (01:15:33):
I love it.

Speaker 2 (01:15:34):
And you you included my dog while a like again,
you know, even he's on my five by five and
I haven't had anybody say him since. So you know,
here we go, like, yeah, I love it. Man.

Speaker 1 (01:15:45):
Oh that man of that generation. I'm being honest with you.
He's three. Is j Cole talk about Kendrick.

Speaker 2 (01:15:54):
Talk about because because he low key got his foot
in the door before those guys did, he he had
to take he had to take the l so those
guys could learn. That's a different conversation. I don't want
to get too long winded. Yeah, but if you know,
you know, if you know, you know. But Derek Man,
thank you so much for your time and bringing your

(01:16:16):
fandom to H two d G and reminding us why
we all had to be there to see Isaiah Thomas
the Remix, New gen Isaiah Thomas. It's exactly what Hip
to the Games is all about.

Speaker 1 (01:16:26):
Man.

Speaker 2 (01:16:26):
But before you go, please let our listeners here know
how they can follow you, how they can stay up
to date with you and your endeavors and things of
that nature and anything else else you want to plug
and promote.

Speaker 1 (01:16:37):
It's serious, Sarah, Well, you can follow me at Derek
Underscore OTS. That's d E R R I c K.
The Black way to spell it. Uh OHTS actually stands
for on the sidelines. That is my media company. I'm
one hiatus right now, but that OTS Media co all
social media platforms OTS media on YouTube. Check out all

(01:17:01):
the shows we have going on. Desmond was kind enough
to come on to the show man like what two
months ago now, like right before the right before the
playoffs playoffs. Yeah, yeah, yeah, so yeah, love having them on.
Love having you on that show, bro like that. That was.
That was when I tell you, like, I was nervous
because I had to take lead. I don't like taking
lead as the host of that mess bro. But that

(01:17:24):
was fun as hell. So I appreciate you for coming
on and you're welcome anytime like that. That was. That
was fun for sure.

Speaker 2 (01:17:30):
I appreciate that for sure for sure. But there it is, man,
Thank you Derek, and thank you for listening to another
episode of Hip to the Games all for the love
of the best combo there is. And of course, here's
a huge shout out to you for being Hip to
the Games, peace out and God bless I hope you
enjoyed this episode of Hip to the Games and if
you enjoyed this episode, be sure to hit up the

(01:17:51):
socials at Desmond Power, Underscore and at Hip to the
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