Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
This is JPO sits down with where we dive into
the heart of as Well's most important stories. In today's episode,
we have an incredibly powerful and emotional conversation with Tamara
and Atara from GFIDF, an organization that provides vital support
to the partners of fallen IDF Soldiers. It's honestly such
a positive to be sisting with both of you. I've
(00:21):
been excited about this interview and I personally I am
excited for what we're going to talk about here and
what I can learn. But to start off, I just
wanted both of you guys to introduce yourselves. Tell me
a little bit about who you are and how you
got to be involved with the Partners of Fallen Soldiers
of the IDF.
Speaker 2 (00:40):
Okay.
Speaker 3 (00:40):
So, my name is Tamal Tamalheimwitz Richter, and I'm one
of the founders and the chair of a GFIDF and
the organization. I got involved in the organization when my
sister lost her beloved soon to be fiance in Lebanon
in nineteen ninety seven. His name was Avid Buk. Lieutenant
(01:01):
Avi Buk was killed in a mutzadd lat in the
Lat Post in Lebanon, and after he was killed, we saw,
our family saw that there was no help to these girlfriends.
Mihau was completely devastated and shattered, and we spoke to
the bereavement officer during the Shiva and we said, look
(01:24):
at her. She needs someone to help her, and she said,
I know, but we can't do anything because she's not
considered part of the bereaved family according to law. And
we felt, my mother and I felt that this is
such a wrong thing and that Israel and the IDF
and the Ministry of Defense have a moral obligation to
(01:45):
the soldier that fell to take care.
Speaker 2 (01:47):
Of their girlfriend.
Speaker 3 (01:48):
And after pulling many strings and being very stubborn, we
finally got to Roshaka, who's the head of a manpower
in the army, and we explained the need and he said,
I understand and I agree there is a need to
take care of these girlfriends, but the army can't do
(02:09):
it directly. But if you, if you form a nonprofit,
we'll be able to finance you.
Speaker 2 (02:15):
And that's what happens.
Speaker 3 (02:16):
Four days later we formed GFIDF and for twenty seven
years it's been taking care and hugging and supporting and
giving a lifeline to hundreds and hundreds of bereaved partners
of Fullen Idea of Soldiers.
Speaker 4 (02:35):
And that's one of me. My name is at Tracent ten.
I'm the partner girlfriend loved one of Ariel, surgeon Aril
so Snow. He was killed during Iron Swords War before
his third deployment into Elevenon. Ariel was the soldier of
combat Fighter. Yeah, we were together for almost three years
(02:58):
and ari died protecting his country and the people that
he loved. And that's how I got connected to the
organization to around GFIDF And here I'm here.
Speaker 1 (03:09):
Thank you guys so much for being here, and I'm
so sorry for your loss. I want to kind of
talk about the early days of the organization. What were
some of the challenges that you faced, because it sounds
like to me, you know, you heard there was a
need for something, and then you know, a couple of
days later, once you realized, okay, we'll make this nonprofit,
it was up. So what were the challenges you faced
(03:31):
after making something you know so quickly.
Speaker 3 (03:33):
Well, there were very very many challenges actually. Well, first
of all, the challenge of the recognition of the place
of these girlfriends and boyfriends and the life of the soldier,
because before the soldier was killed, they were the center
of his universe and he was the center of their universe.
And once he's killed, then the girlfriends weren't considered for anything.
(03:57):
They were totally and completely overlooked, and it was such
a wrong doing, and it took a long time. The
Ministry of Defense and the Army realized that quite soon,
but it took a long time, and we're still working
on it for the social and for the social recognition
(04:17):
of this special position in the family of the Israeli bereaved,
and because the girlfriend has a special place, and.
Speaker 2 (04:27):
There are still things.
Speaker 3 (04:29):
May tell you during the Shiva, you know, we have
people that come to these girlfriends and say or people
who came to my sister and said, who was literally
four months before getting married, and they said to her, oh,
you're so young and you're so beautiful, you immediately find
someone else. These things are like, you know, let's take
a girlfriend a week before her wedding and a wife
(04:51):
a week after her wedding, feeling wise, just.
Speaker 2 (04:54):
In the same place.
Speaker 3 (04:55):
No one would dare to say something like that to
someone a week after the wedding. But they do there
to say it to a girlfriend, and I.
Speaker 4 (05:02):
Think it's even more than that. I feel like, for
no one comes to a sibling that lost their brother,
or to a parent who lost their son, or to
a wife, They'll come, there'll be someone else. Don't worry,
someone else will take their place. Don't worry, you're still young.
No one ever says that, because people understand that this
person was the whole world to them and they know
what's special place they held in their heart and there's
(05:24):
no replacement. And as a girlfriend, I'm for myself and
many others really hear this all the time that Okay,
you're oh, you're you're young, don't worry. I'm so happy
you didn't get married. I'm so proably didn't have kids,
Like you're lucky to have kids, like you should be.
You should be you should be happy you didn't have kids,
because it would have been so much harder. And I'm like, wait,
(05:46):
I just lost a lot of my life, the love
of my life, like we're supposed to do all these
things together. And people not only don't recognize the pain,
they also take away some of the pain that I
already have, and they started like make it smaller, like
if you compare it to widows or true orphans, or
to people who lost their sons, and the pain is
(06:07):
so there and people continue taking it away and don't
even see it sometimes, so.
Speaker 1 (06:11):
You'd say like you felt overlooked kind of like just
from people around you.
Speaker 4 (06:16):
It's more than overlooked. It's this they don't even see.
It's not long they see other people's pain and like, Okay,
you're not important. It's really you. Look at me, and
I'm broken. I'm wrecked. The most important thing to me
in the world, the person that I chose. Even if
we didn't get married, I knew we were going to
get married. We had a plan. Two months later. He
(06:37):
was supposed to like he was supposed to pull out
a ring. He talked to his friends about it, he
talked to my parents about it. And then you're like, okay,
you weren't married, okay, bye, like and I'm like, wait, wait,
I just I just lost him and he's not here.
And if he would have been here, he would have
made sure I would be taken care of and everything
he could. And when he's not here, there's no one
(06:59):
to do it for me now. And I think that's
what the organization really comes to do when they do
in a way that no one else does. And I
think definitely saves literally saves many girls' lives and boyfriend's life,
and I think it's something really special.
Speaker 3 (07:13):
It's something very interesting that Avi, my sister's boyfriend, he
realized the importance of girlfriends and taking care of them
before he was killed. Avi was in Pala, which was
a combat combat unit in the Nahal, and he went
to offices course and his friends who were in the
(07:35):
you know, went into the army with him. They continued
on and many of them were killed in Asna Misuk
half a year before he was killed. And he went
with Michal to visit the families of these of these
his friends. And she has a letter that he wrote her.
You know, it was the days of letters that we
know what's up the smartphones, and he wrote her a
(07:58):
letter how important it is to take care of these
girlfriends because of what they lost. And it was afterwards,
you know, after he was killed. It was kind of
his legacy, his will.
Speaker 2 (08:09):
That's amazing.
Speaker 3 (08:11):
Another thing I want to say is that professionally wise,
I mean dealing with grief and trauma and losing such
a close beloved.
Speaker 2 (08:23):
Person.
Speaker 3 (08:24):
These girls don't only lose the soldier, they lose the
future that they already dreamt and plan together. And they
can't start to heal if they're fighting for recognition, if
they're fighting for their place, if they have to prove
that they have a place and they have a right
to grieve. That's a terrible thing that for many many
years they had to prove.
Speaker 2 (08:45):
And GFIDF change.
Speaker 3 (08:47):
Then today there is that when the soldiers come to
inform that a soldier was killed, to inform the family,
they have to ask if there's a girlfriend.
Speaker 2 (08:57):
By law, they have to ask if.
Speaker 3 (08:59):
There is a girlfriend, and if there is a girlfriend,
they have to ask if the family wants this unit
to go and inform her in a form a way.
This is a huge change. And during the Shiva, the
bereavemental officers speak to the girlfriend. They tell her that
the Gamota, that our nonprofit exists. They tell her that
(09:20):
we're the way that the Ministry of Defense takes care
of these girls. It's it helps these girls and boys
heal because it gives them a place.
Speaker 4 (09:31):
Yeah, and when they when they come to tell you,
it's more than just telling you. There is an organization.
They're telling you have a place to cry, and there's
a place for you to be upset and fall up,
fall apart, and there's a place for your grief, and
there's a place for your loss. It's a lot more
than just telling them that about there's an organization. They're
telling you that they recognize you. They look at you
(09:53):
in the eye and they see you. And I think
that's a lot more than what they actually do. And
it's a big part of it. And I think you
said a really pointing important thing that it's hard to
explain missing something that you haven't like haven't to have
help before. Like there's always the song of like, oh
they own to know the light when it's burning low,
like only miss son when it starts to snow, and
(10:13):
then and then but then something. There's the thing that
you start missing snow without seeing snow, just by imagining it.
And it's a pain that it's really hard to explain
to someone that doesn't because you start I'm starting to
I'm crying over that he was supposed to talk to
my father and ask him his permission to marry me,
(10:36):
and he was going to go and we had all
these plants that we were going to go do a
trip together, if visit my family and the like the
United States, and we were going to he was supposed
to I was just talking to my friend of how
he was planning to propose to me and what song
he was going to play in the background, and how's
been doing. You start crying over the kids you're not
gonna have together, and they're not going to fight over
their names, and then you're not going to have a
(10:57):
dog and you have to take them out, and he's
not going to be there to hold your hand when
you're pregnant, and all these things that you don't even
think about, and you start grieving and not only everything
you've lost, you started giving everything you haven't had before.
That's the thing that's so unique also about girlfriends and
partners pains that it's so hard to explain in words
like only that someone that really has experienced it, I
(11:19):
can't really feel it because starvicing everything, even the things
you haven't experienced yet. And I think that's a really
good point that you've printed that out of the grief
is a double grief.
Speaker 1 (11:28):
Almost to me, that makes so much sense because everything
that you do afterwards is you know, the first thing
that you do without that person, right, so no matter
what you're doing, you're going to feel it exactly.
Speaker 4 (11:40):
And I really like that you said.
Speaker 1 (11:41):
You know, if you compare between somebody who's a week
before that wedding and somebody's a week after, what really
is the difference other than you've had the ceremony. The
way that you're planning to live your life together, it's
the same. I wanted to ask you, Watara, how like
once you first heard about the organization, what was your
experience like kind of getting more involved the first time
you want?
Speaker 4 (12:00):
And what does that feel like? So for me, the
first time I heard me and Ariel were three were
together and everyone, everyone in his surroundings knew about me.
So the organization told me that they got probably like
twenty differend maybe to Mark and say they got many
many different people that came in. And then for me,
the first first time I encountered the organization was two
days after the two days after the beginning of the shiva,
(12:22):
and I was sitting at home and I got a
message from a woman called Ravaya that she's now I know,
it's like the girl that guides me and is with
me the whole thing. And she says, send me a
message from a friend to a friend as someone that
I as someone that knows the pain. You're here. I
just want to let you know I'm here for you.
I'll be on the Shiva on Sunday. And that's it.
And I was I saw the message and I started
(12:43):
crying immediately because I was like, wait, I'm not but myself,
I'm not alone. And then she felt seen totally, and
then Ravilla came and shout out to Ravaya, she's amazing.
I really felt like she Ariel really sent her to
guide me and be there. She's exactly the I think
also many things that Ariel compliments me in and he's
the opposite in me and has the way of like
(13:05):
if I'm if I'm like really a people pleaser, he
knows to tell me, hey, like make sure you're taking
care of yourself. And Revias really also reflects all of
that sometimes, and I really feel like Ariel really sent
her to like kind of be like my guardian angel
together with him. If he's from far and she's from
like close. I was saying, that's the really first encounter.
And then slowly but so like I'm beginning. I was
more like with myself and with the revia, and then
(13:27):
slow they started opening up, like a couple months ago
and yams carone that was my first really big meeting.
I went to the organized with organization. They had a
whole ceremony. That was my first really big encounter with
other people. And then slowly joined the support group and
my personal therapist. I get from them so slowly. Yeah,
it's a manaything the whole You can talk hours about
the support that they give it. It's so many different
(13:47):
ways and every girl and everybody can really find the
one thing. Maybe not everything is good for everyone, but
everyone can really find the things that really helps them.
And some girls the mentor and some girls it's the
therapy or the prior therapy or the group. There we're
the therapy that offer from my parents. So slowly, I'm
also getting to learn like my place and where how
much do I want to be involved and how much
(14:08):
I want to where is it? Where is trying to
find my balance between everything?
Speaker 3 (14:12):
Yeah, I'm not sure it was clear that is a
bereaved girlfriend was some Yeah.
Speaker 2 (14:18):
We developed in GFIDF. We developed a.
Speaker 3 (14:21):
Very unique way of of of hugging and supporting these girls.
What happens is when there's a message that's from the
army saying, well, CALIPI assumed that a soldier was killed.
We immediately have a special unit that checks out and
finds out if there's a girlfriend or a boyfriend, and
(14:44):
which by the way, we also have the same sexes.
Speaker 2 (14:47):
It's not only.
Speaker 3 (14:51):
So there's a unit which which is comprised from bereaved,
from old older bereaved girlfriends that they they find out
within our we know if there's a girlfriend, and if
there is a girlfriend, there's a special a first response
team that's set up for her. And the response team
is there are two people on the response team. There's
(15:11):
an older bereaved girlfriend and a volunteer therapist, and the
girlfriend contacts the new girlfriend, and the therapists contacts the
parents of the girlfriend, because we saw that the parents
of the girlfriend are also experiencing laws. They're experiencing a
double loss because first of all, they lost a soldier
(15:34):
who in ninety nine percent of the time was like
their child, and they think they lost their own daughter
and their own child and they need support to and
you know, parents, what do you want as a parent,
you just want your children to be happy. And sometimes
you can say wrong things and hurtful things. And when
(15:55):
someone's hurting, So who do you lash out at? You
lash out at who the people who are close to
you that you know will never leave you because they
love you. So the parents deal with a lot and
they need guidance, so we'd give that too. And this
whole the system of gf IDF is set up to
give each person what they need. We have girlfriends that
(16:16):
want everything that it's good for them to talk, They
want people to come visit them during the shiva, they
come to the events. There are others that just want
to be to take back a little and just know
that we're there. Come every now, and then there are
people who don't come for years and then come later.
Speaker 2 (16:34):
So it's it's a very unique system.
Speaker 4 (16:37):
And I think it's so any good also recognize it's
not only the girlfriend's pain, but she lost more than
just her wofriendship, her whole future, her whole world. And
that world involves people like her parents and her friends
and her siblings. And I think for me, Aril was
such a big part of my family, like he had
(16:57):
a whole unit that my parents gave to him when
he went drafted with like we made him a keychain
with the picture of our family and says your home
was where your heart is. And he lived by us.
He came to us for shawbucees all the time, he
was invited family trips. He was a part of our family.
And I think when the first time I saw my
father cry was when I when he came to me
(17:22):
before we knew that. I knew he was injured. We
knew something was happening. Can we pick me up? I
right saw him crying, and from that moment he didn't
stop crying for seven days straight. He cried. My mom
told me that he's She's with my father for twenty
five years and she's never seen him like this. And
every time we talk about Ril, we both start crying.
Because my father lost my mother and my siblings. They
(17:44):
lost a family member, and my parents lost a son
or son in law to be and they were they
knew exactly what was going to happen, and it's more
than the futures. But they have met now they have
a connection. My Aril used to give used to give
my parents gifts. You know, my mom, he knows. My
mom is very spiritual, and she was like, so he
a couple of days, he got a couple of days
(18:05):
after suc coat. And then there's them like the et roug.
So Ariel had all these soldiers in Levanon shake Foraminim.
And then when he came back from Levanon, he came
to my mom and told me. He told her he
has a present for her, and he gave her these
et rugs the soldiers like went and then and he
just he just knew exactly what everyone in his life
(18:28):
needed at the point in time. And I think it
just shows. And my siblings, like the amount of times
that I was with Ril, and and then Ril is like,
you know, make your sister's calling me now, And I'm like, wait,
when my sister or my sister got a boyfriend and
Ariel took her to go, he took both of them
and he did a conversation. He sat there down and
he was like, yeah, had had he had the talk,
(18:51):
and like he was He's like or the first time
that when my brother had bar Mitzva and Ariel took
him and told him you're a man now you have
to smell good and gave him a perfume, and he
was just such a big brother to them and a
son to my parents. It's not even like they felt
like it was his son, their son. He really was
a part of us. And I think also recognizing that
(19:13):
pain is so important because there's a lot of a
lot of loss ats clear like a see through sometimes
and because you don't have the title, and I think
just being able to recognize that and recognize how hard
it is because you're crying and you're dealing with yourself
and then your daughter also lost someone, You lost someone,
(19:36):
And I think that's also a big part of it.
It's really having the whole support system and not only
just for you. I think it's a big I.
Speaker 3 (19:45):
Think another another unique thing about GFI the F is
that the entire staff of GFI the F is the
bereaved partners that were helped by the organization and then
they decided they want before the word of volunteer, and
then after the war, because of the immense number of
new Belief partners, they started working full time for the
(20:07):
for GF.
Speaker 4 (20:08):
If I really remember, like realizing it was in the
Yomzikarn ceremonial and they call the project manager blah blah
blah blah, the partner of blah blah, bah blah blah,
and they start and they called the accountant and then
I need to see and blah blah blah blah the
partner blah blah blah. And just you go there and
you're standing there and like and it gives you also
(20:28):
give you some hope in a way. I feel like
because I say, when you were talking about beginning in
the future, and like, so we only we're losing. I
lost my partner. I didn't only lose a reel. I
lost myself. I lost my plans, I lost my I
lost my future. I lost my life. Like it's it's
that simple. I lost my life. I lost the life
I was, I deserved to have and that I had
(20:49):
and it's gone. And I think being able to see
so many women and men that have grown from and
our continue and remembering there and there and hurting but
but but living. I think for me that was such
a meaningful moment that just remember like I remember looking
(21:11):
at like seeing all these girls, I feel crazy woman
power like just seeing them everyone standing there. It's just
really was was very meaningful to me. I think to
realize that because you're going to really because you go
from a place where you see you had, Like I
always like to say that, I feel like I was
on the one lane and then my lane was blocked
and I had to move. They had to force me
(21:31):
to move a lane. But suddenly that I can't see
where I'm going, like I don't know, Like everything just
seems black, and like my future, which I was very
clear to me where I'm going, just turned black in
a minute, in a second, And I think that's really
seeing that was a really important thing for at least
from my experience.
Speaker 1 (21:50):
It really, it's honestly, it's really beautiful to hear. I
think it also what you just said before goes back
to what we were saying about kind of losing the
future for you and also for your parents and for
your siblings and for friends. Everybody has the plans with
that person.
Speaker 2 (22:07):
A whole person is.
Speaker 1 (22:07):
You know, an entire universe, and I think they to
have something that makes people feel seen, I think is
one of the most amazing things you can give. Because
there aren't a lot of things you can do with
the situation is so difficult, but the fact that you're
doing that, I think is just incredible.
Speaker 3 (22:25):
I think it's more than just them being seen, it's
also giving support and exact support when they need it.
Speaker 1 (22:33):
I mean, THEO therapy sounds incredible. Actually, yeah, can you
tell me a bit more about what day to day
looks like.
Speaker 3 (22:40):
But what we do in GFIDF is we support these
partners throughout their entire lives from the moment that the
soldier falls.
Speaker 2 (22:48):
And i'd know, if a sleep, you don't until as
long as they need.
Speaker 4 (22:53):
And that's not even something that the country does. Even
if you're a fiance you have like a five year
like they okay after five years, yet I say you're
going to I think that's something that's even more unique that.
Speaker 2 (23:04):
Because there are many challenges.
Speaker 3 (23:06):
You're influenced. They're so young when they lose their partners,
and this influences every aspect of life, and for instance,
to be in a new relationship, there's so much guilt,
there's so many hard feelings, there's so much you have
to know what to do and to understand that it's
okay to feel these feelings. Or right before the war,
(23:28):
right before October seventh, we opened the support Group for
bereaved Partners for bereaved girlfriends who are now sending children
into the army. You can understand the complexity of that.
So we're there for these girls throughout their entire lives
whenever they need. And I'll tell you something very interesting.
This war brought to us over forty women that lost
(23:49):
their partners years before the Amota le years before GFIDF
was established, from the young people, or even before, and
they were never treated. And when the war came and
they heard about g FIDF, they contacted us and we
opened the support room for them. Their grandmothers there that
never spoke about their boyfriend, but it influenced their lives
(24:10):
until today. So it's really a very unique system. It's
it's actually I think in the Amata we call it
the family because it's it really is a family. It's
it's a community. And I think when somebody, when a
soldier falls, so the partner gets support from many many circles,
her family, his family, his friends. But there's also a
(24:35):
very unique place to the support that she gets from
other girlfriends that went through the same thing. Because a
strange thing won't understand exactly because things things that seem
insane in other places, you know that you that you
just wear his clothing and and that's it. You go
to the cemetery every night and you sit there for
(24:55):
four hours. These things seem a little not normal, but
with the girlfriends, it's really just four hours.
Speaker 4 (25:02):
Five yeah, reaction, Like you're sitting with friends and like
I have our l's ring and I have our I
have two rings and his embracelet he gave me, and
like you sitting with a girlfriend and like, oh, I
like it's his right, and like you have a moment
of connection even though over the small things and just
like the things thoughts you think to yourself and you're like,
I'm insane, I'm going crazy, and then you hear other
(25:22):
girls and you're like maybe maybe I'm okay, Like maybe
definitely okay. Even it's like okay, I'm I'm okay. And
I think that's also some big thing.
Speaker 3 (25:33):
I think also because of this community and that each
person grieves differently. So the saying is your.
Speaker 2 (25:41):
Way is the good way? Anyway it is okay.
Speaker 3 (25:44):
You want to grieve this way, that's fine, you want
to grieve that way, that's fine too.
Speaker 2 (25:47):
It's all acceptable.
Speaker 3 (25:49):
And I think to connect with what you said before
about them, the older, I believe the girlfriends. The goal
of gf I DF is to enable these partners to
pick up the slivers of their lives and then in
time live a happy and fulfilling life alongside their grief
and not within its shadow. That's the statement that we say,
(26:10):
because this is not something that you that goes away.
It's not, you know, a wound that heals, it's not
it influences their entire lives. But with the right support
and the right help, they can really go on to
live a very happy and fulfilling life. And which which
that's I'm sure is what the soldier also wanted.
Speaker 1 (26:33):
Yeah, first of all, I feel emotional because that's such
a beautiful saying. You know, learning how to not live
in the shadow of something just really difficult. It's not
just like, you know, you decide that and then all
of a sudden, okay, fine, I kind of want to
move a little bit into the fact that, you know,
we're in a war right now. October seventh happened, and
(26:54):
I'm sure influenced the work that you do quite strongly,
and I kind of wanted to touch a little bit
on what that change looked like. And you said you
started it in ninety seven, so there were obviously, you know,
things before that. How does this look different to kind
of what you've seen before, Wow, it's very different.
Speaker 3 (27:14):
Nobody could be prepared for this, for October seventh and
this war, but we were prepared for something to happen.
We knew in Israel on average, I think every seven
years there's some kind of big thing, and you know
Tzu Keetan and then the Second Lebanon War. After those
we had forty bereefing partners and we felt that that
(27:35):
was wow so much and because it was you know,
forty at one time, and we prepared for another situation
like that. We had the emergency units set up into place,
we had volunteers, had we had everything set up, and
then October seventh came and because we were set up,
(27:55):
we could deal. We started literally on October seventh to
deal with everything that was going on, but nobody understood
and could prepare for the immense amount. As of today,
since October seventh, there are over three hundred and sixty
new bereaved partners. It's insane. In the twenty five years
until the war we took we took care of five hundred.
(28:16):
Now in a year and two years and a year
and a half. There are so many and unfortunately they
keep fooling the soldiers that fell. Yesterday, five soldiers fell.
We know already about two girlfriends.
Speaker 2 (28:29):
It's it's insane.
Speaker 3 (28:32):
So what happened was that immediately when the war started,
our bereaved girlfriends that were helped by the AMOTA by
GFIDF said we're here.
Speaker 4 (28:42):
And.
Speaker 3 (28:44):
We literally within days opened a phone line for to
get the calls. We opened the hundreds of emergency and
first response teams. I think a week and a half
after the war started, we already had a support group
for the parents. So we really worked a lot time
(29:07):
and around it, and people put just put their lives
aside in order to help these girls because we knew
what they were going through. Also, another thing that's very
different about this war is the the immense numbers, and
I think some of the bereaved families and the girlfriends
(29:28):
they may feel a.
Speaker 2 (29:29):
Little lost in all of this.
Speaker 3 (29:30):
You know, when six soldiers are killed, so he's one
out of six or one out of hundreds. And because
of this, we gave really a special place to each
one because they need the space because their loss is
their entire life.
Speaker 4 (29:48):
I definitely agree with that. I think that we're just
talking about it before we came in that it's like
you can't even start even grieving properly because of everything,
because like you go from hey, Aril died, and then
another friend of my owner died, and then he and
there's seven friends of ral and it just doesn't stop.
(30:10):
And I think that it's just like I feel like
like we're kind of like dog paddling in water, and
I feel like every time I like start coming up,
like take a breath and like come, come, that push
him me back down. And it's because you're so you're
surrounded and death and pain and something that it's it's insane.
It's not okay, Like we just go around. It's everyone
(30:31):
just opened the flom this morning and we saw that
there was five people, five soul. There's five kids, five
kids that haven't done haven't done anything yet, and they
just got killed. And everyone just continues going. We're looking
outside the window and there's traffic and people are going
and the sun is shining and and it's not and
we just live in a place that's it's so not okay.
(30:53):
Because they were the whole world. To some people, it's awful,
Like there's no other word to say. It's it's awful
that we live in a world that we open the
news every morning and we see that there's a twenty
year old, if not one, then five, and if not five,
then seven or even more, and we're just we just
live it. And I think that it's you like for us.
(31:15):
For me, I just really always say that for me,
the war kind of ended. It was ario in a
way because because I lost what I got to lose,
like the worst, my worst nightmare happened. I lost it
all then then and for a second you're like, Okay,
there's nothing more for me to lose. Then then you
wake up the next day and there's another person that
(31:37):
you lost, and you wake up, especially because of my age,
people then in the army like it's just and then
you realize maybe there's more for me to lose. And
that's also a big some people. A couple of weeks,
a couple of weeks ago, two weeks ago, a week
last week, last week, a girlfriend lost her brother, one
of our friends, and it's just understanding that we live
(31:58):
in a world that there's no way to run away
from and it's it could be harder times to understand
that that and it's awful because that's my life now.
Speaker 1 (32:09):
I feel like we can't. I think people say this
just in a general way as well. The war's still
going on, so a lot of times you can't heal
from things, or you can't even start the process of
healing when you're still in the middle. And it's not
like you get this moment to kind of say, Okay,
now everything's done and I can take a deep breath
and reflect, because every day there's more things that are
(32:30):
added on to it. And I know that that's like
kind of like a national feeling right now. But again,
when everybody's feeling it, you can get lost inside that
movement because not that it takes away from how you're feeling,
but when everybody is saying and I feel this and
I feel this, we're all kind of I mean, it
is insane. We're going through this insane time, and it's
(32:52):
I agree, Like it's just it's really mad.
Speaker 4 (32:54):
Like when you've said that, and like you're one out
of three and you're not the only one. I remember
I told her different girlfriends, and I thought beginning I
was crazy because I was like, I was happy that
Ariel died alone, not only because I'm happy no one
else lost their life and that and because there was
some relief that Ariel got his place, that people were
talked about him, that people remembered him. It's not only
(33:16):
just me. I'm not the only one remembering him, at
least for a day until another one got killed. But
I think it's and something that no one really talks about.
How it's like there's so many people, so many people,
and there's so much chilled to lose also and so
much for me, someone so much, And I think that's
a really thing that Okay, so at least I have
my place. At least that's I'm here and Ariel is
(33:37):
here with me.
Speaker 3 (33:38):
Another thing that we do in gfidf IS is to
allow the place for the girlfriend to tell her story.
And we have a project and that we're doing of
testimonial movies that the girlfriend tells about her love and
I'm about the soldier and it's we see it as
you know, something to remember the soldier by.
Speaker 1 (34:00):
Every person has their own story and the universe that there.
Speaker 4 (34:04):
I always say that I feel like also Ariel, but
also every other soldier, but mainly Ariel. Everyone keeps saying
how their heroes when they die, but there's so much
more than that. Their heroes every day they lived. I
think everyone that died being a soldier, they're automatically a hero.
And I think, but they like their life before that incident,
(34:27):
before they are not here anymore. They're true heroes because
they live their life and they live their values. And
everyone has their own story and their own challenges they've
been through, and their old loved ones, and their own
dreams and goals and values that they truly lived out.
And I think sometimes it's it's easy to remember only
the death. Then you forget that there was there's a
whole life.
Speaker 2 (34:48):
Before the war.
Speaker 3 (34:49):
As I told you, since the organization was found in
the Ministry of Defense, gave us a yearly allotment to
do our activity, to give the support groups, to pay
the private therapists, and up until the war, ninety percent
of our budget was given by the Ministry of Defense,
and we actually didn't want to raise donations because there
(35:11):
was a saying in it. There was a saying to
come to these girlfriends and say, look, the Ministry of
Defense is financing the entire care of you. So that
was really important to us. And then the war came.
The numbers were insane, the numbers of girlfriends and boyfriends
(35:31):
and the needs, and we had older boyfriends and girlfriends
who were very influenced by the war and they needed
extra support. So we got we went to the Ministry
of Defense and they said they upped our budget. Was
unheard of. They upped it immensely in money. But now
it only covers sixty five percent of our yearly activities
(35:56):
and the rest is raised by donations from federations, from
companies in Israel and companies in the States donors, so
we're very we.
Speaker 2 (36:08):
Work on that too.
Speaker 1 (36:09):
Sogenations is something that's really important to kind of keep
the organization going.
Speaker 3 (36:13):
It is because it enables us to fulfill extra dreams
and things that we want the girlfriends and boyfriends to
have besides the things that are given by the Ministry
of Defense.
Speaker 4 (36:26):
We're talking about like people that suddenly their need start
again because of the war, and we're talking about about
it before of how the trauma opens up every time
from the beginning, like the wound like starts not even healing,
but starts covering itself. And it reopens. And every time
we see a hotel apiel soon, every time I hear
of a girlfriend, every time I see on Instagram sped eulogy, eulogy,
(36:52):
eulogy of a girlfriend, something popular on my Instagram, every
time I hear of another person, and every time the siren,
every time we hear booms, every time something else happens,
the trauma comes back, and it's not just just Okay,
it happened, and then okay from up from here, it's
an uphill and we're able to come and heal. And
(37:13):
I think because of the continuous war, it's every time
you have one step forward and three steps back, it's
totally like because the trauma is there and it's and
I think that's also all these people that women that
maybe they were dealt without the organization for fifty years
and then the war came back and the trauma is
there and it's a big part of it.
Speaker 2 (37:35):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (37:36):
I won't put this part in, but like I relate
to that so much. I feel like from October seventh
until now, I feel like every month there's something where
I'm like, Okay, I think you've said it's like you
think it can't get any worse, and then there's like
another name, there's another person, you know, there's another power
story too. It's almost like I mean, honestly, it's just
(37:58):
it's unbearable. And I think it's important to be able
to say, like it's unbearable. We shouldn't have to say no,
you know what, but that's just how it is, because
it's yeah, we should accept it.
Speaker 4 (38:09):
That's just we also have to put this in that
I don't have to put this in. But like so
for me, like when I asked, let's say, where is
the maybe maybe maybe you can put it. Okay, I'll
think about it. I okay, So when I came in here,
the first thing question is where's a safe room? Or
when I heard the ambulance and I start started all up.
(38:31):
Is because that, let's say, when ari y'all died and
when I was on the phone call with him and
I was a siren in the background, and then he
mumbled something and he said the whole call me right back,
and I'm still waiting for him to call me back.
And I think that as part of the traumas every
time I hear a siren, ari y'all died again, and
(38:53):
every time that I hear something happened and so I
myself fell somewhere and there's another siren. Then I keep
losing url every time again, and I think that's a
big part of the trauma that we are in. It's
maybe my personal story, but it's sorry of so many
other people that every single time that something happens and
you really you relive it every single time, and there's
(39:15):
no way for you to heal when you live in here.
There's there's no way.
Speaker 1 (39:19):
Because yeah, I think that's why it's so important that
you're coming and sharing your story. And I don't think
it's like, how do you say, it's not move on
my love to come and kind of it's not given
that you would come and do that, because I think
if somebody's watching this and they see that you say
something like that and they resonate with it can help
somebody so much because you're brave enough to say, you
(39:39):
know what, like every time I hear this, that's the
trigger for me, I feel the trauma over and over again.
And I think that's just why it's so special, Like
first of all, that there's a forum like that you
can go and say that to people who will really
understand and listen, and also that you guys decided to
come here and share it with the world. I think
that's just it's it's really special. Thank you, yeah, and
(40:00):
says is so authentic, like it's genuinely felt, like it's
a real experience and you can just see the impact
of the organization. And I think it is amazing, Like
I'm really like honored to be part comp thank you
for having us. He knows it's amazing. I wanted to
kind of move on a little bit to the Presidential Award.
I know that you are a award, very exciting. I'd
(40:23):
love to hear a little bit more about it and
how you had about it.
Speaker 3 (40:26):
First of all, I have to say that we've been
in contact with Mikhal Heltzeng, the first lady who's before
the war.
Speaker 2 (40:35):
She's an amazing human being.
Speaker 3 (40:37):
She connected the gfi DF immediately and when the war
started she called Adi, who's the CEO, who's the bereaved,
the girlfriend and the CEO of the of the organization
and said to her, Adi, how can I help, which
is amazing.
Speaker 2 (40:52):
Really, she's the first lady.
Speaker 3 (40:54):
She has so much to do, and she thought about
the girlfriends and we were in a meaning in her
house and in there in the present house, and the
girls that was sitting there introduced themselves and she knew.
She said, I remember I was in the shiva, you
sat here and there, And to another girl she said,
I have a picture of your boyfriend in my room.
I want you to come see it. Really amazing. And
(41:17):
so the truth is that GFID have got a few
awards during the years, and my mother who founded the
Amota the organization together with me and got an award
from net Fisher beneff Fesh for Olim who made a
huge change for his early society, and we.
Speaker 2 (41:35):
Got other awards because.
Speaker 3 (41:38):
I think it's very very clear that what we do
in gfi D is we do from the deepest place
of our heart in order to give some relief to
people who are really My mother calls it that there's
a place under hell. It's a place that good people
who are in hell, they're under hell. They're not really
(41:59):
in hell underhill. And and that's the way it is.
Speaker 2 (42:03):
These girls.
Speaker 3 (42:04):
When you look look at that fella, she's so beautiful,
she's so m fluent. So seriously, if you would see
her walking down the street, you wouldn't think she has
one worry in life, and inside these girls are shattered
and it's I think it's very very comforting to us
(42:25):
in the organization that that we can help, that we
can hug, that we can can say, look, there's gonna
be a future. You're suffering, you're in the worst place now,
but you're gonna be okay. It's it's a privilege.
Speaker 2 (42:39):
So how did you hear about about the world.
Speaker 3 (42:41):
I remember, honestly, when they do, they like award you
with it.
Speaker 2 (42:46):
When is it? When is the ceremony gonna be?
Speaker 3 (42:49):
Yeah, it's gonna Well, it was postponed because it was
supposed to be when when we attacked her in it
was postponed to the beginning of September, and Michael Helts
and herself called me to tell me.
Speaker 2 (43:01):
It was a big surprise.
Speaker 3 (43:03):
Actually, and I think more than it's an award for me,
it's an a word for their girlfriends because it's saying again,
the Israeli States sees you, and it sees that you
have a special place and you're part of the bereaved family.
It's a very very big statement.
Speaker 1 (43:21):
For us, and that is that's like you're doing like
it's incredible you and all the people that work for you,
and all the people who have gone through this experience
as well and have decided, you know what, I'm going
to take that and I'm going to help other people.
I mean, it's just it's phenomenal. I'm not surprised that
you guys are getting the award and it's really amazing.
I kind of want to go into a little bit
(43:42):
about you know, what's next, what's next for organization, what's
next for you ATARA?
Speaker 2 (43:46):
A happy future.
Speaker 3 (43:47):
For you and I hope, Well, we did a lot
of things after the war and this war. I don't
know why, but every time you felt reached the bottom
of of of of the worst thing that can happen
is more bottom that you can go down. So we
did a lot of things than things that we dreamt
(44:09):
about in the past. For instance, we formed a special
and special fund. We formed a special fund that supports
that can give financial support to girlfriends in need, because
we have stories of girlfriends that have no family background.
They were totally dependent on the soldier who who financed
(44:32):
them from his military salary, and then he was killed
and she's left with nothing. We had girls who had
literally nothing to eat, so this was a dreamy way
able to do. We're now forming a scholarship fund and
just like the Ministry of Defense gives bereaved brothers or widows,
So this year we're starting coming October, we're going to
(44:54):
start giving out scholarships, and we're dreaming about forming the
How of the Girlfriends, and we want to form a
house that will be a place of meeting and healing
and that our activities will be and some of our
activities will be there because at the moment we're all
over Israel and we have support groups and private therapy
(45:17):
basically everywhere. So we have a lot of plans and dreams.
Speaker 1 (45:21):
I'm excited to see where it goes. I think it's
only gonna you know, they're gonna grow.
Speaker 4 (45:26):
I always saying that they're saying like one day at
a time, so for me, it's really every minute at
a time, Like I really take a step back, and
I think for me, first of all, my really goal
is really to be happy again, because with Ariel was happy,
and I think that's a big dream that hopefully one
day I'll be able to sit here and be I
(45:46):
did it. And I think that one of the things
I'm looking for, like the future. Is I actually just
funded now a nonprofit organization and memory of Ril. Oh wow,
And I think it's I always saying is that if
I was in a situation with Ariel, I would have
done done for him CPR and try to make him
live as long as I can. So as long as
(46:08):
it's up to me, along I had the powers in me,
I would have continued being there and making sure he
would live. And I wasn't there and I wasn't able
to make sure that. So this is my way to
making sure Ariel lives as long as I can, and
as long as I have the powers in me, then
he's here with me. It's an organization that also did
a couple of projects that actually got in tribute for
(46:29):
the Juicelomp post for it. The flower Man project will
come too, so the flower Man. So it's something Ariel
used to do, which used to give me flowers every Friday,
even when he was in Gazar eleven on. He would
make sure that the flowers get to me, and I
hope when he died, so I promised him, I'll continue
buying flowers for myself every Friday. They go to our
rehearsal every Friday and put for him some flowers as well.
(46:51):
And the thing is that we give out for like
soldiers flowers when they come home, and we give out
almost five thousand bouquets of flowers soldiers that are coming
home to them for them to make their girlfriends or
their mothers or their friends happy, and continue to bring
a little bit of Ril's life because you usually get
at touching people's hearts. And I think that's of Riel's
(47:11):
biggest values that he was able to talk to personally
touch him. And that's one of the ways and Ariel,
and part of the big thing is doing all of
Ril's dreams because we talked about the future and Ril's
dreams that he wasn't able to fulfill. And as long
as I promised him that by myself, fower was every Friday.
I promised him that everything that he said he'll do,
I'll do for him. Because Ariel did everything that he
(47:33):
said he did, and things that he wasn't able to
do because his life was too short, I'll do for him.
And a part of it is Ariel had a dream
to open a youth group for kids that kids in
danger and there are somewhere in a spectrum that can't
their life wasn't fair to them and they didn't get
(47:55):
what they were supposed to get. And then have open
organization youth they are going toation or leaming out and all.
This a dorm for kids, for kids in danger and
to help them get their lives back. And that's something
that we're working on now. And just a couple of
months ago I got the the approval and hopefully one
(48:16):
day I'll also be able to sit here and tell
you a little more about that and for invitation, and
so it's it's really it's my way of also continuing
our l's the way, you know, sort of helping myself.
I think it's giving me something also to do, something
to look forward to, because when a reel died, then
suddenly we wake up in the morning and then realize
(48:38):
the reason I woke up every morning is not there anymore,
and it's really easy to go back into your bed.
And I'm just going to stay here now, and I
think this organization is a reason to wake up in
the morning and continue and fulfill all my promises. I'm
to a reel, so that's my future right now, and.
Speaker 2 (48:57):
I wait to see you.
Speaker 4 (49:00):
So amazing.
Speaker 1 (49:00):
Also, he lives on through you, which I think is
really special.
Speaker 3 (49:04):
I think it's also very we see with so many
girlfriends that we have, that the soldier really keeps living
on in the girl with the girlfriend. Yeah, my sister
married a friend of Avi's who she didn't know before
he was killed, and they have a very happy marriage.
And they have five children and two of them are
named after Avi, and there's a picture of him in
(49:25):
the living room. And we have families that the children
of the girlfriend call the parents of the boyfriend who
was killed.
Speaker 2 (49:33):
They call them Saba and Sofa.
Speaker 3 (49:34):
They're their grandparents. And I think this is what happens
in many many cases because the girlfriend present represents a
part of the soldier's life that the parents want to
know about. We had like a month and a half
after the war started with Mikhael Heltzo. She when she
called Addie and said, how can I help? So Adis said,
(49:55):
let's have a meeting with the new girlfriends, and we
had a meeting in Adie's house. Michail came and there
were many new girlfriends there and one of them said,
each one of them told their story, and one of
them said, I didn't meet his parents before he was killed,
and I didn't know how they would accept me. And
then when she came into the house, they were so happy.
(50:16):
They were so happy that he loved They were so
happy to hear about something that they didn't know about him.
And that's the way it is. The we and the
government see, taking care of the girlfriends was taking care
of the Reed family also.
Speaker 4 (50:33):
I think also it's I wanted to live all the
rest of my life with Ril. I knew that's how
I was going to live my life. And because the
Aril is not here anymore, it doesn't mean that I
don't want to continue living with him. So maybe it's
not the way I imagined it or what I thought
we were going to have, But you have to find
a girl way, my way and binding my way of
having Ariel with me wherever I go. And because that
(50:57):
he died doesn't mean our future with him stopped just changed, Alene,
And that's really my way of living with Ariel. That's
all I ever wanted. So that's just because he's not
here doesn't mean I stopped wanting it, or I stopped
loving him, or because I didn't choose, I didn't choose.
Ariel didn't choose. We didn't choose, And I think that's
(51:20):
part of a bit understanding of Ariel's just because he died,
this is me. He's not here with me.
Speaker 1 (51:24):
Even just from hearing the small bits that you've kind
of sheard, now you can kind of just tell when
like people bring sort of like a light into the world,
or like they just want to do good and bring good.
You know, he wanted to give you flowers, he wanted
to help, like no obviously cool and all these things.
Like I feel like I'm just getting a little bit
of a glimpse and it's it's crazy to think that there's,
(51:45):
you know, so many people in an organization and every
person has the story. I'm so glad that you guys
are doing the testimonials as well, because that will really show,
you know, real perspectives of real people and real lives.
As we start to wrap up, I want to ask
if there's anything else that you guys want to share
with our listeners, anything that we haven't covered, any kind
of thoughts that you have that you know, you think
(52:08):
people may want to hear.
Speaker 3 (52:09):
I think the main thing for me is that when
people come across a story or a girlfriend. They should
understand the depth of the grief and they should understand
their role in it. Their role is not to say
things like you'll be find you're young. Is to acknowledge
(52:30):
the special place that this girlfriend has in the life
of the soldier and in the death of the soldier,
and to give space to heal and to respect this place.
I think that's the main thing where because the recognition
of this unique grief is really part of the healing.
(52:51):
It's a big part of healing. You can only start
healing after you're recognized, and that's why it's so important,
and I think people in society can and help with that.
Speaker 4 (53:02):
I think before you, Amzi Corone, everyone is uploading to
their Instagram of try to honk lass, be nicer to people.
It's a hard day for people and the people like me,
girls like me, girlfriends, partners, families. Every day is Amazi karn.
You know every day you should be nicer to people.
Every day you should try to be a little better
(53:23):
to people around you, to try to be a little
more patient and open hearted. And because some people are
walking with us with broken hearts and they're walking in
the world and pretending like trying to make a put
their poker face on and smiling when they try it,
but you can see in their eyes that their smile
is not full. And I think that if we can
(53:44):
say to people that are listening to this, just try
to be a little nicer and a little more open
to the people around you, because you really never know
who the person in front of you is going through,
and you never know. Yeah, we never know, and we
just need some more good and love in this world.
I think we just need more good people here. A
big part of it is that are always said that
he'll love me for forever, and that was his forever.
(54:07):
He got his forever, and there's people like me, that's
what about my forever? I don't deserve it forever? And
and I don't know, it's a question I know how
to answer answer, but I'm here, and I think just
opening your hearts really to other people, I think that's
that's the one thing I want people to come out
(54:29):
to hear recognize this such important subject, and even you here,
thank you for having us in you. That's you're a
big part of it of recognizing part of our part
of our fight.
Speaker 3 (54:43):
I think also it's important for English speakers who don't
live in Israel to understand what a terrible price we
pay for the Jewish people to survive here, and it's
a price unfortunate, it has to be paid. But I
think that our job as people is to is to
help the ones who paid the price.
Speaker 4 (55:04):
Yeah, and I think that I think everyone that's listening
to this should make sure that they didn't fall for nothing.
If it's not, everyone can go I can't go out
and fight in the battle field, that I can be
a better person. And that's also our yells will that
he told me he wrote do good and do good
for other people. That's the most important thing there is.
(55:25):
And we can not all of us can fight the
way that we can fight for our country and for
people and for people we love. But we can try
to make it it wasn't for nothing, because they fought
for future, They far for our lives, They fought for
us to be able to live here and the minimum
that we can do and at least be better people
and to make sure that they didn't die for nothing.
Speaker 1 (55:46):
So I honestly I can't thank you guys enough for
a coming to talk about the organization being so authentic
and real with something that's so painful, and it can
be easy to kind of you be so vulnerable and share,
but it's so power and I hope that you know,
people who watch this episode will feel as like kind
of inspired as I do. And you know, I'll put
(56:07):
all in all the information about the organization in the
video and hopefully, you know, you'll just continue to grow
and hopefully we won't have a need, but unfortunately we do.
And it's just been really special to sit and speak
with both of you, and I just wish you all
the best.
Speaker 4 (56:21):
Thank you for this opportunity. Really it's meaningful.
Speaker 1 (56:27):
This episode was hosted by Shipper Jacobs. Editing and production
was done by Shipper Jacobs and Uvel Barnaia. For more
information on jpo's podcast, check the description of this episode,