April 7, 2025 • 42 mins
In this thought-provoking episode we explored the deep and interconnected themes of death, life and the transitions that shape our existence
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
Welcome to another episode of Just Us on Justice and
other Things. I am Scott Jones here with my baby brother,
Dan Jones. I almost actually said it the opposite, I
am Dan Jones here. That would be weird because we
have two. We had a technical issue with one of
our podcasts, so now we're going to have to figure
out how to deal with that, which is fucking annoying
because we always have annoying things with our technology. But
(00:23):
this one will work, and we're double recording it on
my phone.
Speaker 2 (00:26):
Just in case. Yes, because we are technically idiotic.
Speaker 3 (00:30):
I think we're Also there's something about us that ruins technology,
Like things happen like that shouldn't happen, like I've had.
Like I was just saying I had a wiretap. I
was writing a wire tap, and halfway through the wire tap,
the like the autocorrect stuff turned French, so it looked
like I didn't know how to spell any single English
word because it was redline.
Speaker 4 (00:48):
Like what is happening?
Speaker 1 (00:49):
Every single credit card I've ever owned loses its ability
to tap within about.
Speaker 4 (00:53):
Three weeks and watches die on me very quick.
Speaker 1 (00:55):
Me too, yeah, watches weirdly. My garment doesn't. But every
other watch that I've ever had. They constantly get fried
and Terry's even commented on the weird electrical field, which
I think Dad has as well.
Speaker 4 (01:06):
Yeah, so it might be some get Maybe we're superhero.
Speaker 1 (01:09):
Maybe we are just the fucking most useless more superhero
just so fucking used as terrible.
Speaker 4 (01:15):
Don't even know our own powers.
Speaker 3 (01:16):
No, I have none, So we are unexpectedly kind of guestless.
We had a guest booked for today and they ended
up having to cancel due to personal circumstances. So we
thought we would keep this and just do adjust us
with just us.
Speaker 1 (01:32):
Yes, so we have whatever three or four things to
talk about. First off, let's start. We're gonna start off
sad and then we'll recover it with some joy. Unfortunately,
we have a funeral to attend tomorrow of individual named
John Fiorelli. Guido was his nickname that pretty much everybody
knew who I probably most people wouldn't even know what
was the name of John. Of those kind of nicknames
(01:53):
that was more used in his real name. So he
was a police officer with Edmonton. He retired and twenty
eleven he suddenly passed away. Here my understanding his heart attack,
but I'm not sure. And the reason we're bringing up
is he was a remarkable individual. I was honored and
lucky enough to work for him. I was a patrol
(02:15):
sergeant in two thousand and seven two thousand and nine and.
Speaker 2 (02:19):
Guido was my supervisor.
Speaker 1 (02:21):
He was my staff sargeant or watch matter back then,
and he was just one of those remarkable guys who
you he somehow translated whatever you thought the organizational message was.
If you thought it was bullshit, he would turned it
in such a way that made you want to do
it because you didn't want to disappoint him.
Speaker 3 (02:37):
He was and I never had the opportunity to work
for him, but I worked in and around him and
knew him. Interestingly enough, he started his policing career in Barhead,
Barhead when Barhead had its own police service and any
transitions to EPs.
Speaker 4 (02:52):
But he was really one of the most genuine human beings.
Speaker 3 (02:58):
And you know, you see a lot of things and policing,
and you see people go down different paths and different routes,
and I think of myself, I was probably five different
people in policing that I some of which I didn't like.
Guido was that same guy all the time, always gave
a shit about his people, always gave a shit about
the organization, and just a person you wanted to be
(03:19):
around and didn't want to disappoint.
Speaker 1 (03:21):
Like you said, Yeah, and he was one of the
few people who as a boss I didn't challenge because
I had so much respect for him.
Speaker 4 (03:27):
That is absolutely say that again.
Speaker 1 (03:29):
Yeah, I did not challenge him as a supervisor, and
he want more than once but one I can think
of where he yelled at me, and deservedly.
Speaker 2 (03:37):
So.
Speaker 1 (03:38):
I had altered the shift schedule for my squad. I
started them whatever fifteen minutes earlier, half hour earlier, or
something like that.
Speaker 2 (03:45):
And I didn't let him know.
Speaker 1 (03:47):
And it was very stringent back then with what we're
with our the new deployment model the time. So he
used to go out, he smoked, and we went out
to the smoking doors, and he kicked the door open
and it flew back, and he was just tearing me
to pieces, and he was totally right, And because I
had such respect for him, I took it like a
chap and it never happened again.
Speaker 3 (04:06):
I kind of have a feeling if any of your
other supervisors were listening to this, they just shut it off.
Speaker 1 (04:11):
They probably fucked that guy and why he was such
an asshole when just an example of what a great
guy Guda was. So before he retired from EPs, he
went from being our watchmander patrol. He then I think
went to be the staff start and advice if I
remember correctly, So prior to him transitioning from that role
(04:31):
to that like from a uniform to a non uniform position,
but still a police officer, we surprised him with a
stand up parade.
Speaker 2 (04:39):
So all four squads got.
Speaker 1 (04:42):
Together and we were in the gymnasium and I can't
remember somebody convinced him because I was in the gym,
so somebody kind of bullshit at him and got him
up the gym and to show him something, and he
was like fucking like at off time, it's fucking bullshit.
Speaker 2 (04:53):
And whoever did a really good job of getting out there.
Speaker 1 (04:56):
And we had four squads, so probably forty to fifty
people there, and as soon as he came in the gym,
we came to attention. And sorry, I just remember his
look as he walked in, and he was an emotional
guy as far as he was fiery, very Italian fiery,
but he was overcome with emotion at fifty of his
(05:19):
cops standing to attention for him.
Speaker 2 (05:21):
But he was that kind of dude.
Speaker 3 (05:22):
Yeah, and he yeah, And I believe did he not
eventually go on to Eye Track, Yes, but did he
start that as a as a member? Did he go
retire and going think he retired and went there, yeah,
because that's where because he was working there after. Yeah,
I can, I can. Actually the last time I saw
him was I think it was last summer. I went
to I can't remember. Who cares what restaurant I went to.
Speaker 2 (05:44):
Nobody does at all. Nobody does, and you make it up.
Speaker 4 (05:46):
You went to Earls and it wasn't Earls, it was
that Halifax one whatever that one's called. It doesn't matter.
Speaker 3 (05:52):
Him and Trudy a triplet and there was respective spells
as were sitting on the on the patty and I
went and chatted with him for for a while.
Speaker 4 (06:02):
And he was one of those guys too.
Speaker 3 (06:04):
Always he will always, he would always make time for
anyone who came and talked to him, like, yeah, it's
it's a huge loss. And he was really young, like
to me, sixty six years old. Yeah, and it's a
it's a it's a It's a tragic loss, and it's
sad because you know, he.
Speaker 4 (06:20):
Was in his retirement. I think he was fully retired
now I think he was.
Speaker 2 (06:23):
Oh yeah, he was. Yeah, because I was lucky enough.
I saw him at the.
Speaker 1 (06:26):
Airport in October November before we were going on a
trip with me and Terry and the boys to go
watch football game and him and his wife are on
their way to a cruise. So I saw him in
line waiting to go through customs. And it's one of
those the universe puts you where you're supposed to be.
Because I got to tell on what a great boss
he was. I got to remind him when he yelled
at me. He's like, I don't remember doing that, but
I'm sure I did it. I did or he did.
(06:49):
And then he we were sitting there in the restaurant
eating breakfast, and he came over and chatted with me
and Terry and the boys, and we got to have
actually a really good little conversation. So I'm really happy
that that happened. That's awesome. It's funny someone tells you
something and you don't remember it. This is totally a
diversion from this. I have a thing this is gonna
be too much information for anyone listening. But I really
don't like not showering after I go to the washroom.
Speaker 4 (07:12):
It's disgusting to me.
Speaker 2 (07:14):
And it's better than I thought. You're going to say
you're an aggressive wiper.
Speaker 4 (07:17):
Oh no, I have said that before.
Speaker 3 (07:19):
But and I was reminded by a friend of ours,
Chris Fadoun, who said, your description of why it's better
to shower is better than he knows. The best thing ever,
because I said, if you get shit on your hand,
do you just wipe it off the napkin and then
go eat your sandwich?
Speaker 4 (07:33):
Or do you wash your hand?
Speaker 3 (07:35):
And I didn't remember actually saying that, but it stuck
with Chris like that was a very good thing to
stick with.
Speaker 1 (07:41):
I've heard Trevor Nola talk about that because he and
his analogy is that if you had ship on your shoe, yeah,
you wouldn't just wipe it with a napkin, you would
wash it properly.
Speaker 2 (07:48):
Yeah, on the side of your Jordan's Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 4 (07:51):
I just you know, you.
Speaker 3 (07:52):
Think of when someone tells you something that you did
and you didn't remember doing it, just like I remember
you having a similar with a with a with a
constable in your command at one point in time who
came and talked to you about you didn't do something
or you said something to him, and you're like, I
have no recollection of doing that, but he.
Speaker 2 (08:08):
Kind of happened a lot.
Speaker 4 (08:09):
You forget those kind of things, John.
Speaker 1 (08:12):
Along the line of funerals, but a little less. I
don't know, Sad, I guess for us, and I don't
like give any props because it's gross. But we were
at a restaurant the other day and there happened to
be a crowd of about forty people, and they looked
like they just come from a funeral, just based on
their attire. They were all kind of sixties seventies, eighties,
(08:34):
so they couldn't hear shit, so they were very loud,
and we kind of quickly realized that they probably went
to a funeral. And one of the guys stood up said, Hey,
we have a beer here on the table. This is
beers for our fallen friend ron and cheers the row
and everybody did. And then you actually grabbed some cash
and went over and dropped money on their table to
(08:55):
pay for a round for them, And then they proceeded
to come over and tell us all about tragically their
friend who had was a bus driver. They were all
Greyhound bus drivers, and they uh talked about how he
died suddenly because he slipped and fell and hit his head,
which is awful.
Speaker 2 (09:11):
And he was relatively young as well, in his late sixties.
Speaker 1 (09:15):
But it was a cool like almost like we'd got
a ringside seat into a subculture that honestly, I had
no idea existed. And then we had a steady stream
of people coming over to thank you for what you
uh the cash you had thrown on the table and
they thanked us thank god, saying I didn't do and
do it but.
Speaker 3 (09:34):
No, that was that was and it was amazing And
it wasn't a lot of money.
Speaker 4 (09:37):
I like that, but it's.
Speaker 3 (09:38):
Amazing to see when those things happened, and how appreciative
people are of a gesture like that, Like it was
like I gave them a house each or something like
the it was it was, yeah, it was, it was yeah,
it was nice and it was you could tell it
mattered to them. And someone actually thought some of them
thought we were actually at the funeral. We're like, no, no,
we weren't there.
Speaker 2 (09:57):
That was quite a funeral. Hey, I'm like, I have
no idea.
Speaker 3 (09:59):
No idea, didn't know run But yeah, now that was
Funerals are an interesting thing, right, and it's actually funny.
And this is probably something that I don't know if
a lot of people feel this way, but I would
actually rather go to funerals than most weddings.
Speaker 2 (10:12):
Oh me too.
Speaker 1 (10:12):
We've talked about that before here. Yeah, Like weddings are
the wedding singer every wedding. Yeah, exactly the same. The funerals,
if they're done well, you get a real insight into
who the person is.
Speaker 3 (10:24):
One of the most impactful funerals now we're stung with
funerals that I've ever gone to was Mark Goodkey's funeral.
Speaker 2 (10:31):
Oh yeah, yeah, just because the way that they did.
Speaker 3 (10:34):
Mark was a brother of EPs member that Scotty was
in class with. And I actually Mark worked at the
Young Young Defender Center when I was there, and he
actually died and a young offender and a Young Offender
hockey game that was being played by the Alberta Justice Department,
And yeah it was. They did this entire funeral in
(10:57):
like Star Wars theme, like the even the minister read
off red quotes from Star Wars movies and then when
they they played the Emperor's March at when they when
the casket left, and it was really a funeral all
about him, and I always thought that one's that one
kind of stuck with me, and partly because he was
(11:19):
close to my age, I.
Speaker 1 (11:19):
Guess, Yeah, and such a tragical, oh, a horrible accident. Yeah, Okay,
let's get off funerals. Okay, let's uh gonna go uh
into I don't know, transitions. I guess we can kind
of title it specifically retiring and empty nesting.
Speaker 2 (11:38):
So I don't know what you want you want to
start with.
Speaker 3 (11:41):
I think let's let's go empty nesting because I think
we'll talk about retirement and we'll talk about that after
and we'll talk about it, but let's go empty nesting
because I think that one, that one has the potential
to be more sad than the other one. I think
the retirement can be a little bit more funny, and
I think empty nest. And you're new to it, and
(12:02):
it's it's a heart it's hard.
Speaker 1 (12:04):
It's way harder than I expected it to be, and
there's a giant grief process, like it's exactly what's supposed
to happen. So background here. My boys are twenty five
and twenty seven. They're both awesome, they're both doing wallet life.
They both completed university like they're doing what they're supposed
to do. But the little fuckers, within a week of
each other moved out at the same time to separate places.
(12:27):
My oldest bought a condo and for Sascatchia and my
youngest bought a condo with his girlfriend in Shirt Park.
Speaker 2 (12:32):
And they're doing what they're supposed to do.
Speaker 1 (12:35):
But it was really really rough again, far rougher than
I thought. And I've probably said I don't know seventy
five times. Thank God I love my wife, because if
you didn't, this would make it really really tough off.
All of a sudden, you're looking at that person going,
I don't know who you are. Oh, I don't really
like you.
Speaker 3 (12:51):
Yeah, And I think that you see, well, I think
we've both seen that late in life divorces, when people
have late in life divorces because they they they all
of a sudden find themselves alone with the person that
they don't know anymore. Because and I think that that's
one of the things.
Speaker 4 (13:08):
That you have to do.
Speaker 3 (13:09):
And I'm not you have no one has to do
in anything. But when you are married and have kids,
it is very easy to make everything about the kids.
Speaker 2 (13:19):
Yep.
Speaker 3 (13:19):
And you have to make sure that you're cognizant and
cautious to make sure you keep that relationship going because
eventually it's just the two of you. And if it's
just the two of you and you don't really know
each other or like each other, either you're gonna have
a miserable existence or you're gonna get divorced late in life.
And neither one of those are I don't think are attractive.
But you it's it's it was like a for you,
(13:41):
it's like a bomb went off because like both at
the same time. That's see, at least for us, we
had Vanessa left the house relatively early. Vanessa, my oldest daughter,
she was like she had enough of us by the
time she was about eighteen nineteen. She was like gonna
go on around. She's always been a super independent uh.
And then she came back for a while like they
(14:01):
often do, and then she went and she's now she
lives in Ontario, and she's again, They're amazing. I'm very lucky.
My children are so amazing. And then Emma. We got
to kind of wean ourselves off of Emma like a
because she was a scholarship athlete and went away for
school every school semester and then we get her back
(14:22):
for the summer, so we kind of got kind of
got a slow transition, and I think I'm very grateful
for that transition because it it was it kind of
eased everything. What happened to you is just well, it's
wonderful and awful at the same time.
Speaker 1 (14:34):
It is and I almost like it's akin to when
and I didn't we didn't have this, but people having
twins at the start, if it's your first babies, you
wouldn't know the difference having two versus if you had
one and then twins.
Speaker 2 (14:46):
That would be torture. I thinkyeah, sorry to those who've
thought that happened to but.
Speaker 1 (14:50):
It was just all done so like the amount of
times I've been bawling my face off, and especially when
we moved Sam out because that was kind of the
final move.
Speaker 2 (15:01):
I we got him.
Speaker 1 (15:02):
Set and then this is one of the few times
Terry and I had to go through this for a
day or two by ourselves where we didn't have the
capacity to even help each other.
Speaker 2 (15:10):
Out of it.
Speaker 1 (15:11):
And as I walked out to the truck after moving Sam,
I like ugly cried, like was making I'm sitting there
bawling my face.
Speaker 2 (15:19):
Off, and I'm like, what the fuck is that sound?
And I realized it's me.
Speaker 1 (15:23):
I was making these sobbing sounds so loud that I
didn't even know it was me. And then after and
there's a lady in the parking lot bondo me. Thank god,
she was sitting there on her phone, not paying attention
at all. So I get myself get composed, and I
have to go to uh grab food. So I'm gonna
go in this restaurant. I look at my face and go,
what the fuck? How am I gonna explain this? As
she starts like what the matter? What's the matter, and
(15:44):
my I was just gonna tell her that I went
on a coke pinch.
Speaker 2 (15:46):
I've never done coke my life. I have no idea, but.
Speaker 1 (15:49):
My eyes were fucked and I was all flushed, and
I'm like, I'm just gonna tell her.
Speaker 4 (15:52):
That's because it's easier than to tell her the truth.
Speaker 2 (15:54):
Yes, and then started crying again in front of the
poor lady.
Speaker 4 (15:56):
At the she calls you and as an overdose.
Speaker 3 (15:59):
Yeah, yes, you know, and it's all those things and
it's what it's what we built them to do, right
like we built them to move out. We hopefully taught
them as much as they can and that it's a
big it's also a big learnings curve for them, for sure,
because now all of a sudden, when your water tank breaks,
you got to deal with it. When any of these
(16:20):
things occur, it's on you. Now you're the homeowner. You're
the you know, you're the one who has to make
sure you They're both in condos so they don't have
to mow the lawn and shovel the sidewalks, so that's
kind of nice for them, but you also but they
do have to pay the mortgage.
Speaker 1 (16:33):
But for sure, budgeting and food prep and laundry and
all the things grocery shopping, grocery shopping and all the
things that you take for granted when it's always happening
for you that they are just magically taken care of.
And now it's on you to take out the garbage
and the food and think of what the cook.
Speaker 3 (16:48):
And all that shit and clean and clean, yeah, right,
because if you're not used to cleaning, and all of
a sudden, you're living in a place and you don't
clean it, it becomes gross pretty fast.
Speaker 1 (16:58):
And I can tell you the bathroom downs theirs with
the boys shirt was fucking atrocious, like it would have
been in the old days, would have been at the
Cecil Hotel.
Speaker 2 (17:05):
That's how gross. Yeah, there's disgusting.
Speaker 3 (17:07):
So you guys didn't mean that they were responsible, and
they didn't really.
Speaker 2 (17:10):
You know what I mean, like historically, Yeah, that's how
it's been.
Speaker 1 (17:13):
Okay, yeah, it's like we had a die bar in
our house, but just on the bathroom.
Speaker 4 (17:17):
Gross.
Speaker 3 (17:18):
Yeah, gross, find out that's good. And you're talking about
let's and retirement, and there's a lot. There's been a
lot over the last three years for for you, retirement being.
Speaker 4 (17:30):
One of them.
Speaker 3 (17:31):
Eighteen months eighteen months now, So in eighteen months, you've
had two kids move out, you retired, started a new job,
realized that you are pretty ugly, just kidding.
Speaker 2 (17:47):
Fucking did you You don't have the mirrors pointed you, obviously.
Speaker 3 (17:51):
No, but you you you had you in eighteen months
have had a ship ton of change, yeah, and transitions
like mine's three years ago and then my kids got married,
but they were already living outside of the house. So like,
when kids get married and they're not living in your house,
is really not a transition?
Speaker 2 (18:05):
Yeah for them, it is.
Speaker 4 (18:07):
For me, it's not.
Speaker 3 (18:08):
But yeah, you you have had a lot happen and
even vehicles, right, yeah, you you're selling a car right, No,
if anyone's interested in buying it, and just.
Speaker 1 (18:17):
Hate Nissan Frontier SV four by four for the leader.
Speaker 4 (18:22):
Anyone's interested in bridging it, please get.
Speaker 2 (18:24):
Us on us on justice Instagram.
Speaker 3 (18:27):
But yeah, like yeah, like it. And so how are
you doing with all of the transitioning now?
Speaker 2 (18:36):
Good?
Speaker 1 (18:37):
But it's been interesting because I'm more introspective than I
would have been way back when. Yeah, so I've kind
of talked about the kids moving on and that's going
to be an ongoing And again, Terry and I reather
like each other.
Speaker 2 (18:47):
I love each other.
Speaker 1 (18:48):
So that part's been kind of cool because we've almost
reconnected and we're really really close anyway. So we just
have new patterns where we make sure we work out
together and we hang out a lot, and we have
our shows that we watch and thank god we have
our dog because he's awesome. But the retirement thing, I
was ready to leave, and I was. I don't regret leaving.
It was the right time. Thirty in change was absolutely enough,
(19:09):
and the first six months there was almost an elation,
so I thought the opposite, and actually comes from talking
to Guido way back when, where when he retired he
was miserable over the first six months and didn't know
why until his wife pointed out, like, well, because you've
lost part of your identity, like you just like I'm sure,
not like I've been in a high level athlete, but
I'm sure when somebody retires after being an NHL hockey
player and now they're not or a football player, it's
(19:31):
similar as it would be with police fire, any first
responder population, where you whether you've identified with it or
not intentionally, it's still become woven in as part of
your identity. Absolutely, but I was ready to walk away.
So the first six months I was like, oh, this
is great, and I feel like I shed a weight.
And then there's times where I don't necessarily I don't
(19:51):
miss it. I'm not roadse colored glasses like oh I
want to go back into a car and take calls.
I don't want to, but it was all I ever
wanted to do and then and there's a part of
me is like, I can't fucking believe that's over. I
can't believe that I will never go to a call again,
or I will never be a homicide, or I'll never
look for that next thing in my career, what area
I'm going to go to? That that part is done,
(20:13):
and it's good and it's supposed to be. But it's
been more than I thought it would be.
Speaker 3 (20:19):
That's interesting because you're right, like, and you probably more
than me wanted to be a police officer.
Speaker 1 (20:26):
Oh that's all I like, that's my backup plan was teacher,
but that was only if there was some medical reason
I couldn't do.
Speaker 3 (20:32):
Yeah, And I kind of went through phases of wanting
to do different things, but I really wanted to. And
when you apply for the police back then, it was significantly,
I think, more competitive than it is now, just just
by volume of applications and the size of classes. Right,
the classes we were I think it was twenty eight
(20:52):
was the max class that we had. And but you're right,
you do everything you can to get that job, and
then it doesn't feel like twenty five years went by.
Speaker 1 (21:01):
No, Like that's where you're like are we sure we're
not in a simulation here? Yes, that thirty years seems
awfully compressed and seems like it's about eleven.
Speaker 4 (21:08):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (21:09):
Yeah, And I didn't do I do twenty five. In policing,
I did three incorrections. I think the toughest three years
were corrections. I for any correction of the office bilt through.
My hats off to you. That is that is a
tough job. That is in a trauma soaked environment all day,
every day.
Speaker 4 (21:25):
Like in policing.
Speaker 3 (21:26):
Yeah, you see things and you get involved in things,
but you also get to talk to people, and you
get to go outside, and you get to go outside,
you get to talk to people like business owners and
stuff like that. Like when I walk into Beat one
hundred and eighteenth Avenue, the vast majority of your contact
with people is actually with neighborhood people.
Speaker 4 (21:40):
You're walking saying hi to Grandma carrying our groceries. Right.
Speaker 2 (21:44):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (21:45):
But in jail and I made some strong relationships with
people that were incarcerated, And that's you can do that.
Speaker 2 (21:53):
But not a chance you want to do that for
twenty five years.
Speaker 4 (21:55):
Not a chance I could have done that for twenty
five years.
Speaker 2 (21:57):
I had no desire whatsoever.
Speaker 1 (21:59):
Although back when you were deferred, I contemplated going because
I was fucking mad. Yeah, and I'm like, fuck it,
then I'll quit and I'll go there too if you
don't get hired.
Speaker 2 (22:09):
That was actually pounced from I. Thank god that didn't help. Yeah, sucked.
Speaker 3 (22:11):
We'd have been sitting at the Man and it's not
a twenty five and out, it's eighty five factors, so
we'd still be there, have an art freaking lunch in
the in the room being made by the guys at
the Max.
Speaker 4 (22:24):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (22:25):
No, I'm good over time. So it's been a lot.
It's again, I'll pay more attention to it. And then
so if I'm dysregular today, I'm like, not necessarily the why,
but there's been a lot of reasons why that is.
Speaker 2 (22:37):
And then I'm like, Okay, what do I need to do?
Speaker 1 (22:39):
And honestly, the answer for me right now has been
movement and like working out with weights, running, learning how
to swim. That's been a cool process. Teaching yoga a
couple of times a week, all of that has made
a huge difference.
Speaker 3 (22:52):
And you also, the cool thing for you too is
you're still doing dinners with your boys.
Speaker 2 (22:58):
Yes, we're very we have a set.
Speaker 1 (23:01):
This is from our uncle Randy's wife or Auntie Lynn,
and she told Terry a long time ago when and
I don't know why she had this kind of wisdom
back then because the kids were her kids were even smaller.
So like, you need to make sure you set a routine,
like make that Saturday dinner, Sunday dinner, whatever it happens
to be. So we've been very intentional with right now,
we're not going like so Friday dinner whoever's available, and
(23:22):
Sunday dinner, whoever's available. So right now we're double topping it.
And then we'll probably just knock that down to one.
And then we're lucky because we have the cabin and
then when we open that up, the boys have every
intention of spending lots of time there because it's a
free fucking resort for them.
Speaker 4 (23:35):
Basically.
Speaker 3 (23:36):
Yeah, and that's one thing that you're lucky where I'm
not as lucky. We obviously have Amma close and we
actually were just there on Saturday witham and Brady, but
Vanessa and Matt live in Ontario, and that is that
would suck.
Speaker 4 (23:52):
That sucks? It does it really does?
Speaker 3 (23:54):
I know? We do our best to go out there,
and they're going to get themselves out here later this year,
and we've already got plans to head out there as well.
And it's nice because the girls are so close that
they're on their way to they're going to go to
Florida in the next couple of weeks with each other
and they're going to meet each other there and and
it's really cool because my son in laws get along
really well as well, which is kind of neat to
(24:16):
see that that those relationships kind of in adulthood be
what they are and that they're there for each other.
And and you kind of know that, and that's a
that not to be morose or like that, but knowing
that they're there for each other and they'll take care
of each other is kind of in the future when
eventually I die, you know that that that that that
(24:36):
they're they're there for each other.
Speaker 1 (24:39):
Speaking of we're going to keep along the transition line
here and you recently speaking of vehicles sold your Mercedes,
which talk about that and the identity that was wrapped
up in that, because I actually noticed that we talked
about this the other day, that you had shifted and
shed like some weight after getting rid of a car,
(25:00):
which was a nice car, but there was something attached
to it.
Speaker 3 (25:03):
Yeah, so the couple of things. So the reason I
bought that car was the song Fuck the Police actually
by NWA. There's a line in that song that says
me and Lorenzo rolling in a Benzo.
Speaker 4 (25:15):
So I've always liked that song.
Speaker 3 (25:17):
And then damn it feels good to be a gangster,
and he says, driving around town, my drop top bends.
Speaker 4 (25:22):
Hit and switches my black six foot.
Speaker 3 (25:24):
So that's why I want a six morm Palette some
point in time in my life, because I want to
hit switches in my black six form. Probably I have
an inkling to buy an older car one day.
Speaker 4 (25:34):
I don't know why.
Speaker 3 (25:35):
I probably won't put it. Why it's a money pit.
I don't know why I would do that.
Speaker 2 (25:38):
It's a Rose Colors.
Speaker 4 (25:39):
It's one of those.
Speaker 3 (25:40):
Things, right like anyway, But I purchased the Mercedes while
I was in a homicide and it like, at one
point in time I looked at getting a This is
what a douchebag I was. I looked at getting a
license plate like A. I had two options read rom
and they wouldn't let me get that. I went by
it and they said I wasn't allowed, and then I
(26:03):
was going to get C eleven, which is the form
you filled out for overtime, because we worked so much
overtime in homicide, which was a douchey thing to do right,
and part of my identity got caught up in that.
I started like I would and only I would only
buy Hugo Boss suits or Armani suits, and I would
only Tag watches, and I have Hugo Boss watches.
Speaker 4 (26:24):
Three of them. I've got.
Speaker 3 (26:27):
A dk and Y watch, I've got a couple Kenneth
Cole watches. And I can't tell time like we talked
about last time. So I have all these like I
had this I don't know desire to be, I don't
know a douchebag, And getting rid of the Mercedes actually
felt like the last of the douchebag left because I
didn't I wasn't a good person when I was in homicide.
Speaker 4 (26:50):
I don't think many of us weren't good people.
Speaker 3 (26:52):
I loved the work, it was amazing and it was
impactful work, but there was an arrogance that went with
that work. I kind of I was happy to get
rid of that and I'm happy just to drive a
twenty fifteen rogue.
Speaker 4 (27:04):
I'm pretty, it's and if.
Speaker 3 (27:07):
You look at the way I dress now, I literally
I wear jeans and T shirts and dress jackets and
sometimes a hoodie under a dress jacket.
Speaker 4 (27:14):
And people think I'm weird. I don't care.
Speaker 3 (27:16):
I just I've become to me I want to be.
I guess is the best way to put it. And
it was nice to kind of get rid of that
last piece of the old mea. I kind of likened
it to when I stopped doing uc where a groundercover work.
I got rid of all my undercover clothes right away,
like I literally all the Donnie Smith clothes.
Speaker 2 (27:36):
Interesting, I didn't.
Speaker 4 (27:36):
I got rid of them like that.
Speaker 3 (27:37):
As soon as they stopped, those clothes went right into
a bag and right to Goodwill.
Speaker 4 (27:40):
I got rid of that.
Speaker 2 (27:41):
I took.
Speaker 1 (27:41):
You know what's funny, though, I did the same thing
after retiring. I purged all my shit, Like I've kept
a few things that may or may not make it
onto a wall, some up making it into the grade
that are eventually you're gonna go on in plaques and
twelve pictures because you get so much much shit. But
I did the same thing. I had a necklace more
for thirty years and had a little badge on it.
St Michael Yep. I stopped wearing the day I retired.
(28:02):
I don't need it anymore. That's not part of what
this is anymore. And I did the same thing, and
I'm and now with the kids moving out, that's an
even more of purging any and all that.
Speaker 3 (28:11):
Yes, And I think that's that's a good way to
do it because and you see people get they get
caught up in it, and they stay in the in
the mindset that that and and like even like you
talked about, Guido, for the first six months had a
felt like a loss, that he lost part of his identity.
And I actually didn't feel I lost any of my identity.
I felt like my identity shifted. And I say that
(28:33):
because I kinda while I was still in policing, I
started getting into academia and teaching, and not saying that
my identity as being an academic, it's not. It's just
that I was able to kind of turn my hobby
into a career and it was through that became really
enjoyable my in between academic work working at a healing
(28:58):
center that started to feel almost exactly the same as
being in policing, like it was the same kind of
too adjacent, too adjacent, and I didn't want that.
Speaker 4 (29:06):
And you see a lot of guys leave and they.
Speaker 3 (29:08):
Go to investigative roles, right or they go and they
take a job, as you know, setting up the special
investigations unit for an insurance company. Like I ran into
somebody that's doing that the other day, and and good,
and that's good that those options are there. But I
do think it's I think it's important to have a
second arc and do something a bit different.
Speaker 2 (29:27):
Yeah, and it was.
Speaker 1 (29:28):
I didn't file find it as an identity loss either
because I again I think, and we've talked about here before,
when you transition from what EPs, we have black shirts
and white shirts, and the white shirts are.
Speaker 2 (29:38):
The senior officers.
Speaker 1 (29:39):
When you become a white shirt, you kind of bleach
out your soul anyway, and you become a little bit
of the other. And I had no intentions, nor did you,
of ever being that. So when I was wearing one,
it felt a little like antithetical to my soul that
I was in that role. And I don't regret it.
It's not me whining. I asked for it, and I
applied more and all that kind of stuff. But I
(30:00):
think that made the identity shift a little bit easier
because honestly, if you're identifying as an inspector of superintendent,
you probably need some like a team of psychological well being.
Speaker 3 (30:10):
Yeah, and you're right, and you kind of go from
being active and on the team to being the general manager. Right,
that's kind of right. Like you're you're you know, you're
you're not sitting on the you're not even sitting on
the bench anymore. With the guys you're you're not you're
up top, like you're not Paul Coffee, you're Kevin Lowe. Right,
(30:32):
if you want to go to sports analogies again, and
for those of you who don't know, those are Edmonton
Euler hockey players.
Speaker 4 (30:40):
Yeah, I think we were taught. We had one other
thing we're talking about.
Speaker 3 (30:43):
What was we were going to say? And you said,
can you remember all these things? And now I don't
remember the one?
Speaker 2 (30:47):
Uh, total aside, it's a weird thing. So uh.
Speaker 1 (30:51):
Next to police headquarters in downtown Edmonton, there's a remount center.
It's an old one and it's currently under destruction. So
it's being kind of knocked down, and they can't just
blow it up because it's sitting over top of LARTs
and blah blah blah, and it's yeah all that, so
they're kind of slowly tearing it apart. But even looking
at it, you can just sense how much trauma and
(31:13):
sadness is attached to that space. And my wife shook
her head at me the other day because she doesn't
have thoughts like these, and I'm like, I wonder if
there were ghosts there now that the walls have been
ripped apart, do the ghost get to leave there? And
I don't know the answer to that, And you may
everybody way be going, holy fuck, these guys are totally
off their rocker now, which maybe a little bit, but
I just thought it was just that's what popped in
(31:34):
my head, and then I was thinking about it, and
then it of course takes me back to some of
the files that we had, some horrible files, unfortunately, And
you wonder the people who lost their lives there now
finally get some peace when the walls are gone.
Speaker 2 (31:46):
Yeah, that's I hope.
Speaker 4 (31:48):
So for anyone who's ever been in that building, it's
fucking awful.
Speaker 3 (31:53):
I worked in that building as a wage correctional officer
for a few shifts.
Speaker 4 (31:57):
Can you do like three shifts and you're like five, yeah, shifts?
And I didn't.
Speaker 3 (32:00):
I stopped taking ships at the Remount. I would went
to the fort in euy uh.
Speaker 2 (32:05):
It was.
Speaker 4 (32:05):
It was a horrendous place.
Speaker 3 (32:07):
Like it was dark, it was dank, it was dingy,
it smelled bad. It was when we were there. It
was packed to the rafters, it was violent. There was
trauma everywhere.
Speaker 4 (32:22):
It was.
Speaker 3 (32:24):
So, you know, and having worked a homicide from there,
I sure hope that those folks that that were, if
they were ghosts there, they do get released out of
that place, because that's a pretty shitty place to be
stuck in purgatory. Yep, yeah, no, it's and you think
(32:46):
about that too, you know. I don't know what they're
gonna do with that area. I've heard that they're putting
a potentially like a a built like a building a condo.
Speaker 1 (32:54):
Conc because there was talk about them turning that into
a like making it basically for unhoused folks. But then
I think it came to be that it would cost
too much to renovate, and because of the nature of it,
there'd be so much trauma associated too, that people.
Speaker 2 (33:11):
Would be like, I don't want to stay here.
Speaker 3 (33:13):
And then there was a plan to make it student
housing for Mchuen and I actually saw the blueprints and
they were gonna actually just kind of retrofit the cells
to be bedrooms, and I thought, I don't know if
I'd want to live there, Like there's just a lot
of energy in that space that I yeah, And.
Speaker 4 (33:29):
Riemann's a funny thing.
Speaker 3 (33:32):
I would have water forgot to bring waters in Remand's
a funny thing because you think about that. You know,
they're housed people that have yet to be convicted of anything,
so they're presumed innocent, right and interestingly enough, and every
single day we have twelve thousand people in Remand and
ten thousand people sentenced in provincial facilities, so we have
(33:52):
more people in Remand than we actually have sentenced in
the province and province across them. And you think, and
at that time for those folks, and it's dead time,
like you know, you might get double credit for it,
but you have no idea what's going to go on.
And there's there's a lot of you know, unsettledness to
being in.
Speaker 2 (34:11):
The room, isn't it also a mix?
Speaker 1 (34:12):
So if you've done something relatively minor in comparison, and
you could be sitting in the room next to a
guy who's committed a murder or allegedly committed a murder
absolute all that.
Speaker 3 (34:23):
Yeah, yeah, it is very much like you could be
in there for identity theft.
Speaker 4 (34:27):
Yeah, and sitting in this.
Speaker 1 (34:29):
Although I'd be shocked if anybody is sitting in a
remainder for identity theft.
Speaker 4 (34:33):
Well, you know what, one of the things that on
a hot you're right on identity theft.
Speaker 3 (34:37):
But when people do like four hundred five hundred thousand
dollars plus frauds, those people end up in remo.
Speaker 4 (34:46):
You think about it. We had an eph I'm going
to on the other side of it.
Speaker 1 (34:49):
If my grandma lost her house because some guy did
fraud on her, he should be in remamber and then
he should go to jail.
Speaker 3 (34:54):
So I'm actually okay, yeah, no, fair Well, and we
even and it was in the news we had an
EPs mam end up in jail for a fraud and
who ended up losing his job eventually.
Speaker 4 (35:01):
But so it's funny.
Speaker 3 (35:04):
It's like if you fuck with bridge people's money, do
you go to jail or if you beat people up
and kill people, you go to jail. In between like
stealing cars and not unless you do it all the time,
you're not. You don't see a lot of reman time
for auto theft.
Speaker 1 (35:18):
No, And then a lot of those folks are on
multiple recognisants. They get caught, release, caught, release, cut, release,
where that's not this solution either.
Speaker 3 (35:26):
One of the I was co teaching a class with
at Northquest at work, and one of the assignments we
gave to the students was to re imagine a prison,
like if reimagine a prison and make it a better
place to heal and some very interesting concepts. My thought was,
(35:48):
find a river and build a prison so the river
runs through it, so people can be near water, and
because you kind of can heal on the land a
little bit more kind of land based, kind of like
Camp Hope in Montreal Lake and try to do some
of that kind of stuff. Because the way prisons are
now that you don't want it and you can go there,
(36:09):
they deserve it or whatever. But at the same time,
everyone leaves a prison eventually it would be better that
they left there better than when they went in there,
and it would be nice to see us do some
different things with our incarcerated population rather than just put
them in these horrific environments warehouses.
Speaker 4 (36:25):
Yeah, exactly.
Speaker 1 (36:27):
I'm gonna finish with one more thing, talk about the
impact that changed to immigration rules had on Northquest.
Speaker 2 (36:35):
I e. That you had to fire me. So the
I r c C changed some rules.
Speaker 3 (36:42):
And it's interesting because they only changed them for colleges
and polytechnics, not for universities. So what they did was
for any college. I don't know, Okay, I don't know
what it stands where ayone keeps telling me I r
c C something Canada immigration something. Yeah, And what they
(37:02):
did was they took away postgraduate work pyramits for people
from specific not everything at colleges and polytechnics. But unless
there was a job that says yes, you're going to
get a job after they took that away. So it
actually it resulted in unfortunately people, you know, some reimagining
people losing their jobs, people having to go and you know,
(37:24):
get laid off. And that's unfortunate because we are a
country of immigration, and there's unfortunate things out there like
miss miss information, wrong information about immigration and immigration actually
makes your country safer than it makes it that it's
not dangerous.
Speaker 4 (37:43):
And I know there's been.
Speaker 3 (37:44):
Police leaders on podcasts saying things like with every immigrant
immigrant comes a new threat, which is actually untrue.
Speaker 4 (37:51):
But that's the unfortunate kind.
Speaker 1 (37:53):
Of I guess you could say that, like every person
who's born is a threat. I guess yea, which is
kind of gets its potential. Yeah, immigration, refugees and citizenship
Canada is what, no problem, That's what I do here.
Speaker 4 (38:07):
So yes, I had to it was, and I know
you didn't give a shit, well.
Speaker 1 (38:11):
Not give a shit, that's not the right word, because
I really really liked it, like it, and I really
like this. I'm teaching criminal investigations and it's been super
fun because it's my favorite course that I've taught. But you,
I know how badly you felt, so I wasn't gonna
start like weeping. But it's another, honestly, added to the
transition of retirement, getting a job, kids, moving out, losing
(38:32):
a job, gets another either until this.
Speaker 4 (38:35):
Another takes another. Yeah.
Speaker 3 (38:37):
Yeah, And you know the thing about the economy right now,
if you start to look at it, what you're seeing
is possible. I'm not neither of us economists or political scientists, but.
Speaker 2 (38:49):
Both of us can barely spell economists and political science.
Speaker 4 (38:51):
It's true, but we have an impending.
Speaker 3 (38:55):
Recession coming based on what's going on in political which
I'm not going to get into. But the one thing
about recessions, recessions are really good for post secondary institutions.
So I would suggest if this happens, you're going to
see an uptake anyway and in enrollment.
Speaker 1 (39:13):
So yeah, not to besmirch universities, et cetera, but a
place like Northwest, those kids are their kids, like some
of them are thirty five years old, but they're there
and they literally will get a piece of paper that
will lead them to a job, like of all the things.
Speaker 4 (39:28):
Yeah's weird.
Speaker 2 (39:29):
It's so stupid and short sighted.
Speaker 4 (39:31):
It is.
Speaker 3 (39:31):
It's it's And then again, I'm not trying to be political,
but I feel like it was a I feel like
it was a performative move by the liberal government to
show that they're, you know, going to deal with immigration
issue issues that are always brought up with oftentimes are
falsely brought up and talked about falsely without any academic
(39:53):
background by political leaders and leaders of police agencies and
stuff like that that that don't really know what they're
talking about when they say things like that. So yeah,
okaything else nothing, nothing, nothing, nothing else. I made lobster
again this weekend.
Speaker 1 (40:11):
I used my airfire over the first time. I've never
used an air fire. I did Brussels sprouts in it
with honey and uh kind of a spicy spice that
I get from I can't remember the name of it.
Speaker 2 (40:21):
It's audust Salt Spring Island had olive oil. They were
really good.
Speaker 3 (40:25):
But uh, Brussels sprouts in the airfire. That's the best
way to do bussels.
Speaker 1 (40:28):
It is actually yeah, a little bit too long though
they were. Because it's said for twenty three minutes, I
would knock that down.
Speaker 2 (40:34):
To what eighteen mays.
Speaker 3 (40:35):
Yeah, I would say, yeah, eighteen is what I do. Yeah,
I guess we're gonna shut it down. We are sitting
in a beautiful location a park. This guy's yelling his
dog named Billy and Billy Milly, oh Millie Milly was
not listening, didn't even shit what he said. And now
he's got control of his dog. My dog can't be
off least because I would never see my dog again.
(40:56):
Because I have zero control of my.
Speaker 4 (40:57):
Dog because you were a terrible dog trainer. I'm a
terible lodge.
Speaker 1 (41:00):
Yeah like that, don't put that on your resume. You
would be sunking. The dogs would be everywhere everywhere. Yeah,
hump and shit, biting things, barking and everybody.
Speaker 4 (41:06):
Yeah, yeah, they're usually good.
Speaker 3 (41:08):
That was a little bit. It was a little bit
off putting the other day when they bark like that.
Speaker 4 (41:16):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (41:16):
So anyway, with that, we.
Speaker 3 (41:20):
Are in this beautiful park and we are in the
middle of the threety six Territory, the home of the Kree,
the Dane, the Soto, the mayti on a Shnabe, the Lakota,
sioux Uh and Inuit people who have people who have
walked these lands and time memoriam and it is a
beautiful time of the year as things start to green
(41:43):
up and you start to see spring, and it's nice
to sit in this amazing river valley that Edmonton offers.
Speaker 1 (41:48):
And at time it's timely because Guido was a huge
proponent of indigenous spirituality, which if you didn't know him,
maybe you wouldn't known that, but he before his time
aim was focused on that and when you got to
know him, he would kind of impart that wisdom.
Speaker 3 (42:06):
Behalf and he was, Yeah, and he was very connected
to the community, and yeah, awesome love
Speaker 4 (42:13):
MHM.
Welcome to another episode of Just Us on Justice and
other Things. I am Scott Jones here with my baby brother,
Dan Jones. I almost actually said it the opposite, I
am Dan Jones here. That would be weird because we
have two. We had a technical issue with one of
our podcasts, so now we're going to have to figure
out how to deal with that, which is fucking annoying
because we always have annoying things with our technology. But
(00:23):
this one will work, and we're double recording it on
my phone.
Speaker 2 (00:26):
Just in case. Yes, because we are technically idiotic.
Speaker 3 (00:30):
I think we're Also there's something about us that ruins technology,
Like things happen like that shouldn't happen, like I've had.
Like I was just saying I had a wiretap. I
was writing a wire tap, and halfway through the wire tap,
the like the autocorrect stuff turned French, so it looked
like I didn't know how to spell any single English
word because it was redline.
Speaker 4 (00:48):
Like what is happening?
Speaker 1 (00:49):
Every single credit card I've ever owned loses its ability
to tap within about.
Speaker 4 (00:53):
Three weeks and watches die on me very quick.
Speaker 1 (00:55):
Me too, yeah, watches weirdly. My garment doesn't. But every
other watch that I've ever had. They constantly get fried
and Terry's even commented on the weird electrical field, which
I think Dad has as well.
Speaker 4 (01:06):
Yeah, so it might be some get Maybe we're superhero.
Speaker 1 (01:09):
Maybe we are just the fucking most useless more superhero
just so fucking used as terrible.
Speaker 4 (01:15):
Don't even know our own powers.
Speaker 3 (01:16):
No, I have none, So we are unexpectedly kind of guestless.
We had a guest booked for today and they ended
up having to cancel due to personal circumstances. So we
thought we would keep this and just do adjust us
with just us.
Speaker 1 (01:32):
Yes, so we have whatever three or four things to
talk about. First off, let's start. We're gonna start off
sad and then we'll recover it with some joy. Unfortunately,
we have a funeral to attend tomorrow of individual named
John Fiorelli. Guido was his nickname that pretty much everybody
knew who I probably most people wouldn't even know what
was the name of John. Of those kind of nicknames
(01:53):
that was more used in his real name. So he
was a police officer with Edmonton. He retired and twenty
eleven he suddenly passed away. Here my understanding his heart attack,
but I'm not sure. And the reason we're bringing up
is he was a remarkable individual. I was honored and
lucky enough to work for him. I was a patrol
(02:15):
sergeant in two thousand and seven two thousand and nine and.
Speaker 2 (02:19):
Guido was my supervisor.
Speaker 1 (02:21):
He was my staff sargeant or watch matter back then,
and he was just one of those remarkable guys who
you he somehow translated whatever you thought the organizational message was.
If you thought it was bullshit, he would turned it
in such a way that made you want to do
it because you didn't want to disappoint him.
Speaker 3 (02:37):
He was and I never had the opportunity to work
for him, but I worked in and around him and
knew him. Interestingly enough, he started his policing career in Barhead,
Barhead when Barhead had its own police service and any
transitions to EPs.
Speaker 4 (02:52):
But he was really one of the most genuine human beings.
Speaker 3 (02:58):
And you know, you see a lot of things and policing,
and you see people go down different paths and different routes,
and I think of myself, I was probably five different
people in policing that I some of which I didn't like.
Guido was that same guy all the time, always gave
a shit about his people, always gave a shit about
the organization, and just a person you wanted to be
(03:19):
around and didn't want to disappoint.
Speaker 1 (03:21):
Like you said, Yeah, and he was one of the
few people who as a boss I didn't challenge because
I had so much respect for him.
Speaker 4 (03:27):
That is absolutely say that again.
Speaker 1 (03:29):
Yeah, I did not challenge him as a supervisor, and
he want more than once but one I can think
of where he yelled at me, and deservedly.
Speaker 2 (03:37):
So.
Speaker 1 (03:38):
I had altered the shift schedule for my squad. I
started them whatever fifteen minutes earlier, half hour earlier, or
something like that.
Speaker 2 (03:45):
And I didn't let him know.
Speaker 1 (03:47):
And it was very stringent back then with what we're
with our the new deployment model the time. So he
used to go out, he smoked, and we went out
to the smoking doors, and he kicked the door open
and it flew back, and he was just tearing me
to pieces, and he was totally right, And because I
had such respect for him, I took it like a
chap and it never happened again.
Speaker 3 (04:06):
I kind of have a feeling if any of your
other supervisors were listening to this, they just shut it off.
Speaker 1 (04:11):
They probably fucked that guy and why he was such
an asshole when just an example of what a great
guy Guda was. So before he retired from EPs, he
went from being our watchmander patrol. He then I think
went to be the staff start and advice if I
remember correctly, So prior to him transitioning from that role
(04:31):
to that like from a uniform to a non uniform position,
but still a police officer, we surprised him with a
stand up parade.
Speaker 2 (04:39):
So all four squads got.
Speaker 1 (04:42):
Together and we were in the gymnasium and I can't
remember somebody convinced him because I was in the gym,
so somebody kind of bullshit at him and got him
up the gym and to show him something, and he
was like fucking like at off time, it's fucking bullshit.
Speaker 2 (04:53):
And whoever did a really good job of getting out there.
Speaker 1 (04:56):
And we had four squads, so probably forty to fifty
people there, and as soon as he came in the gym,
we came to attention. And sorry, I just remember his
look as he walked in, and he was an emotional
guy as far as he was fiery, very Italian fiery,
but he was overcome with emotion at fifty of his
(05:19):
cops standing to attention for him.
Speaker 2 (05:21):
But he was that kind of dude.
Speaker 3 (05:22):
Yeah, and he yeah, And I believe did he not
eventually go on to Eye Track, Yes, but did he
start that as a as a member? Did he go
retire and going think he retired and went there, yeah,
because that's where because he was working there after. Yeah,
I can, I can. Actually the last time I saw
him was I think it was last summer. I went
to I can't remember. Who cares what restaurant I went to.
Speaker 2 (05:44):
Nobody does at all. Nobody does, and you make it up.
Speaker 4 (05:46):
You went to Earls and it wasn't Earls, it was
that Halifax one whatever that one's called. It doesn't matter.
Speaker 3 (05:52):
Him and Trudy a triplet and there was respective spells
as were sitting on the on the patty and I
went and chatted with him for for a while.
Speaker 4 (06:02):
And he was one of those guys too.
Speaker 3 (06:04):
Always he will always, he would always make time for
anyone who came and talked to him, like, yeah, it's
it's a huge loss. And he was really young, like
to me, sixty six years old. Yeah, and it's a
it's a it's a It's a tragic loss, and it's
sad because you know, he.
Speaker 4 (06:20):
Was in his retirement. I think he was fully retired
now I think he was.
Speaker 2 (06:23):
Oh yeah, he was. Yeah, because I was lucky enough.
I saw him at the.
Speaker 1 (06:26):
Airport in October November before we were going on a
trip with me and Terry and the boys to go
watch football game and him and his wife are on
their way to a cruise. So I saw him in
line waiting to go through customs. And it's one of
those the universe puts you where you're supposed to be.
Because I got to tell on what a great boss
he was. I got to remind him when he yelled
at me. He's like, I don't remember doing that, but
I'm sure I did it. I did or he did.
(06:49):
And then he we were sitting there in the restaurant
eating breakfast, and he came over and chatted with me
and Terry and the boys, and we got to have
actually a really good little conversation. So I'm really happy
that that happened. That's awesome. It's funny someone tells you
something and you don't remember it. This is totally a
diversion from this. I have a thing this is gonna
be too much information for anyone listening. But I really
don't like not showering after I go to the washroom.
Speaker 4 (07:12):
It's disgusting to me.
Speaker 2 (07:14):
And it's better than I thought. You're going to say
you're an aggressive wiper.
Speaker 4 (07:17):
Oh no, I have said that before.
Speaker 3 (07:19):
But and I was reminded by a friend of ours,
Chris Fadoun, who said, your description of why it's better
to shower is better than he knows. The best thing ever,
because I said, if you get shit on your hand,
do you just wipe it off the napkin and then
go eat your sandwich?
Speaker 4 (07:33):
Or do you wash your hand?
Speaker 3 (07:35):
And I didn't remember actually saying that, but it stuck
with Chris like that was a very good thing to
stick with.
Speaker 1 (07:41):
I've heard Trevor Nola talk about that because he and
his analogy is that if you had ship on your shoe, yeah,
you wouldn't just wipe it with a napkin, you would
wash it properly.
Speaker 2 (07:48):
Yeah, on the side of your Jordan's Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 4 (07:51):
I just you know, you.
Speaker 3 (07:52):
Think of when someone tells you something that you did
and you didn't remember doing it, just like I remember
you having a similar with a with a with a
constable in your command at one point in time who
came and talked to you about you didn't do something
or you said something to him, and you're like, I
have no recollection of doing that, but he.
Speaker 2 (08:08):
Kind of happened a lot.
Speaker 4 (08:09):
You forget those kind of things, John.
Speaker 1 (08:12):
Along the line of funerals, but a little less. I
don't know, Sad, I guess for us, and I don't
like give any props because it's gross. But we were
at a restaurant the other day and there happened to
be a crowd of about forty people, and they looked
like they just come from a funeral, just based on
their attire. They were all kind of sixties seventies, eighties,
(08:34):
so they couldn't hear shit, so they were very loud,
and we kind of quickly realized that they probably went
to a funeral. And one of the guys stood up said, Hey,
we have a beer here on the table. This is
beers for our fallen friend ron and cheers the row
and everybody did. And then you actually grabbed some cash
and went over and dropped money on their table to
(08:55):
pay for a round for them, And then they proceeded
to come over and tell us all about tragically their
friend who had was a bus driver. They were all
Greyhound bus drivers, and they uh talked about how he
died suddenly because he slipped and fell and hit his head,
which is awful.
Speaker 2 (09:11):
And he was relatively young as well, in his late sixties.
Speaker 1 (09:15):
But it was a cool like almost like we'd got
a ringside seat into a subculture that honestly, I had
no idea existed. And then we had a steady stream
of people coming over to thank you for what you
uh the cash you had thrown on the table and
they thanked us thank god, saying I didn't do and
do it but.
Speaker 3 (09:34):
No, that was that was and it was amazing And
it wasn't a lot of money.
Speaker 4 (09:37):
I like that, but it's.
Speaker 3 (09:38):
Amazing to see when those things happened, and how appreciative
people are of a gesture like that, Like it was
like I gave them a house each or something like
the it was it was, yeah, it was, it was yeah,
it was nice and it was you could tell it
mattered to them. And someone actually thought some of them
thought we were actually at the funeral. We're like, no, no,
we weren't there.
Speaker 2 (09:57):
That was quite a funeral. Hey, I'm like, I have
no idea.
Speaker 3 (09:59):
No idea, didn't know run But yeah, now that was
Funerals are an interesting thing, right, and it's actually funny.
And this is probably something that I don't know if
a lot of people feel this way, but I would
actually rather go to funerals than most weddings.
Speaker 2 (10:12):
Oh me too.
Speaker 1 (10:12):
We've talked about that before here. Yeah, Like weddings are
the wedding singer every wedding. Yeah, exactly the same. The funerals,
if they're done well, you get a real insight into
who the person is.
Speaker 3 (10:24):
One of the most impactful funerals now we're stung with
funerals that I've ever gone to was Mark Goodkey's funeral.
Speaker 2 (10:31):
Oh yeah, yeah, just because the way that they did.
Speaker 3 (10:34):
Mark was a brother of EPs member that Scotty was
in class with. And I actually Mark worked at the
Young Young Defender Center when I was there, and he
actually died and a young offender and a Young Offender
hockey game that was being played by the Alberta Justice Department,
And yeah it was. They did this entire funeral in
(10:57):
like Star Wars theme, like the even the minister read
off red quotes from Star Wars movies and then when
they they played the Emperor's March at when they when
the casket left, and it was really a funeral all
about him, and I always thought that one's that one
kind of stuck with me, and partly because he was
(11:19):
close to my age, I.
Speaker 1 (11:19):
Guess, Yeah, and such a tragical, oh, a horrible accident. Yeah, Okay,
let's get off funerals. Okay, let's uh gonna go uh
into I don't know, transitions. I guess we can kind
of title it specifically retiring and empty nesting.
Speaker 2 (11:38):
So I don't know what you want you want to
start with.
Speaker 3 (11:41):
I think let's let's go empty nesting because I think
we'll talk about retirement and we'll talk about that after
and we'll talk about it, but let's go empty nesting
because I think that one, that one has the potential
to be more sad than the other one. I think
the retirement can be a little bit more funny, and
I think empty nest. And you're new to it, and
(12:02):
it's it's a heart it's hard.
Speaker 1 (12:04):
It's way harder than I expected it to be, and
there's a giant grief process, like it's exactly what's supposed
to happen. So background here. My boys are twenty five
and twenty seven. They're both awesome, they're both doing wallet life.
They both completed university like they're doing what they're supposed
to do. But the little fuckers, within a week of
each other moved out at the same time to separate places.
(12:27):
My oldest bought a condo and for Sascatchia and my
youngest bought a condo with his girlfriend in Shirt Park.
Speaker 2 (12:32):
And they're doing what they're supposed to do.
Speaker 1 (12:35):
But it was really really rough again, far rougher than
I thought. And I've probably said I don't know seventy
five times. Thank God I love my wife, because if
you didn't, this would make it really really tough off.
All of a sudden, you're looking at that person going,
I don't know who you are. Oh, I don't really
like you.
Speaker 3 (12:51):
Yeah, And I think that you see, well, I think
we've both seen that late in life divorces, when people
have late in life divorces because they they they all
of a sudden find themselves alone with the person that
they don't know anymore. Because and I think that that's
one of the things.
Speaker 4 (13:08):
That you have to do.
Speaker 3 (13:09):
And I'm not you have no one has to do
in anything. But when you are married and have kids,
it is very easy to make everything about the kids.
Speaker 2 (13:19):
Yep.
Speaker 3 (13:19):
And you have to make sure that you're cognizant and
cautious to make sure you keep that relationship going because
eventually it's just the two of you. And if it's
just the two of you and you don't really know
each other or like each other, either you're gonna have
a miserable existence or you're gonna get divorced late in life.
And neither one of those are I don't think are attractive.
But you it's it's it was like a for you,
(13:41):
it's like a bomb went off because like both at
the same time. That's see, at least for us, we
had Vanessa left the house relatively early. Vanessa, my oldest daughter,
she was like she had enough of us by the
time she was about eighteen nineteen. She was like gonna
go on around. She's always been a super independent uh.
And then she came back for a while like they
(14:01):
often do, and then she went and she's now she
lives in Ontario, and she's again, They're amazing. I'm very lucky.
My children are so amazing. And then Emma. We got
to kind of wean ourselves off of Emma like a
because she was a scholarship athlete and went away for
school every school semester and then we get her back
(14:22):
for the summer, so we kind of got kind of
got a slow transition, and I think I'm very grateful
for that transition because it it was it kind of
eased everything. What happened to you is just well, it's
wonderful and awful at the same time.
Speaker 1 (14:34):
It is and I almost like it's akin to when
and I didn't we didn't have this, but people having
twins at the start, if it's your first babies, you
wouldn't know the difference having two versus if you had
one and then twins.
Speaker 2 (14:46):
That would be torture. I thinkyeah, sorry to those who've
thought that happened to but.
Speaker 1 (14:50):
It was just all done so like the amount of
times I've been bawling my face off, and especially when
we moved Sam out because that was kind of the
final move.
Speaker 2 (15:01):
I we got him.
Speaker 1 (15:02):
Set and then this is one of the few times
Terry and I had to go through this for a
day or two by ourselves where we didn't have the
capacity to even help each other.
Speaker 2 (15:10):
Out of it.
Speaker 1 (15:11):
And as I walked out to the truck after moving Sam,
I like ugly cried, like was making I'm sitting there
bawling my face.
Speaker 2 (15:19):
Off, and I'm like, what the fuck is that sound?
And I realized it's me.
Speaker 1 (15:23):
I was making these sobbing sounds so loud that I
didn't even know it was me. And then after and
there's a lady in the parking lot bondo me. Thank god,
she was sitting there on her phone, not paying attention
at all. So I get myself get composed, and I
have to go to uh grab food. So I'm gonna
go in this restaurant. I look at my face and go,
what the fuck? How am I gonna explain this? As
she starts like what the matter? What's the matter, and
(15:44):
my I was just gonna tell her that I went
on a coke pinch.
Speaker 2 (15:46):
I've never done coke my life. I have no idea, but.
Speaker 1 (15:49):
My eyes were fucked and I was all flushed, and
I'm like, I'm just gonna tell her.
Speaker 4 (15:52):
That's because it's easier than to tell her the truth.
Speaker 2 (15:54):
Yes, and then started crying again in front of the
poor lady.
Speaker 4 (15:56):
At the she calls you and as an overdose.
Speaker 3 (15:59):
Yeah, yes, you know, and it's all those things and
it's what it's what we built them to do, right
like we built them to move out. We hopefully taught
them as much as they can and that it's a
big it's also a big learnings curve for them, for sure,
because now all of a sudden, when your water tank breaks,
you got to deal with it. When any of these
(16:20):
things occur, it's on you. Now you're the homeowner. You're
the you know, you're the one who has to make
sure you They're both in condos so they don't have
to mow the lawn and shovel the sidewalks, so that's
kind of nice for them, but you also but they
do have to pay the mortgage.
Speaker 1 (16:33):
But for sure, budgeting and food prep and laundry and
all the things grocery shopping, grocery shopping and all the
things that you take for granted when it's always happening
for you that they are just magically taken care of.
And now it's on you to take out the garbage
and the food and think of what the cook.
Speaker 3 (16:48):
And all that shit and clean and clean, yeah, right,
because if you're not used to cleaning, and all of
a sudden, you're living in a place and you don't
clean it, it becomes gross pretty fast.
Speaker 1 (16:58):
And I can tell you the bathroom downs theirs with
the boys shirt was fucking atrocious, like it would have
been in the old days, would have been at the
Cecil Hotel.
Speaker 2 (17:05):
That's how gross. Yeah, there's disgusting.
Speaker 3 (17:07):
So you guys didn't mean that they were responsible, and
they didn't really.
Speaker 2 (17:10):
You know what I mean, like historically, Yeah, that's how
it's been.
Speaker 1 (17:13):
Okay, yeah, it's like we had a die bar in
our house, but just on the bathroom.
Speaker 4 (17:17):
Gross.
Speaker 3 (17:18):
Yeah, gross, find out that's good. And you're talking about
let's and retirement, and there's a lot. There's been a
lot over the last three years for for you, retirement being.
Speaker 4 (17:30):
One of them.
Speaker 3 (17:31):
Eighteen months eighteen months now, So in eighteen months, you've
had two kids move out, you retired, started a new job,
realized that you are pretty ugly, just kidding.
Speaker 2 (17:47):
Fucking did you You don't have the mirrors pointed you, obviously.
Speaker 3 (17:51):
No, but you you you had you in eighteen months
have had a ship ton of change, yeah, and transitions
like mine's three years ago and then my kids got married,
but they were already living outside of the house. So like,
when kids get married and they're not living in your house,
is really not a transition?
Speaker 2 (18:05):
Yeah for them, it is.
Speaker 4 (18:07):
For me, it's not.
Speaker 3 (18:08):
But yeah, you you have had a lot happen and
even vehicles, right, yeah, you you're selling a car right, No,
if anyone's interested in buying it, and just.
Speaker 1 (18:17):
Hate Nissan Frontier SV four by four for the leader.
Speaker 4 (18:22):
Anyone's interested in bridging it, please get.
Speaker 2 (18:24):
Us on us on justice Instagram.
Speaker 3 (18:27):
But yeah, like yeah, like it. And so how are
you doing with all of the transitioning now?
Speaker 2 (18:36):
Good?
Speaker 1 (18:37):
But it's been interesting because I'm more introspective than I
would have been way back when. Yeah, so I've kind
of talked about the kids moving on and that's going
to be an ongoing And again, Terry and I reather
like each other.
Speaker 2 (18:47):
I love each other.
Speaker 1 (18:48):
So that part's been kind of cool because we've almost
reconnected and we're really really close anyway. So we just
have new patterns where we make sure we work out
together and we hang out a lot, and we have
our shows that we watch and thank god we have
our dog because he's awesome. But the retirement thing, I
was ready to leave, and I was. I don't regret leaving.
It was the right time. Thirty in change was absolutely enough,
(19:09):
and the first six months there was almost an elation,
so I thought the opposite, and actually comes from talking
to Guido way back when, where when he retired he
was miserable over the first six months and didn't know
why until his wife pointed out, like, well, because you've
lost part of your identity, like you just like I'm sure,
not like I've been in a high level athlete, but
I'm sure when somebody retires after being an NHL hockey
player and now they're not or a football player, it's
(19:31):
similar as it would be with police fire, any first
responder population, where you whether you've identified with it or
not intentionally, it's still become woven in as part of
your identity. Absolutely, but I was ready to walk away.
So the first six months I was like, oh, this
is great, and I feel like I shed a weight.
And then there's times where I don't necessarily I don't
(19:51):
miss it. I'm not roadse colored glasses like oh I
want to go back into a car and take calls.
I don't want to, but it was all I ever
wanted to do and then and there's a part of
me is like, I can't fucking believe that's over. I
can't believe that I will never go to a call again,
or I will never be a homicide, or I'll never
look for that next thing in my career, what area
I'm going to go to? That that part is done,
(20:13):
and it's good and it's supposed to be. But it's
been more than I thought it would be.
Speaker 3 (20:19):
That's interesting because you're right, like, and you probably more
than me wanted to be a police officer.
Speaker 1 (20:26):
Oh that's all I like, that's my backup plan was teacher,
but that was only if there was some medical reason
I couldn't do.
Speaker 3 (20:32):
Yeah, And I kind of went through phases of wanting
to do different things, but I really wanted to. And
when you apply for the police back then, it was significantly,
I think, more competitive than it is now, just just
by volume of applications and the size of classes. Right,
the classes we were I think it was twenty eight
(20:52):
was the max class that we had. And but you're right,
you do everything you can to get that job, and
then it doesn't feel like twenty five years went by.
Speaker 1 (21:01):
No, Like that's where you're like are we sure we're
not in a simulation here? Yes, that thirty years seems
awfully compressed and seems like it's about eleven.
Speaker 4 (21:08):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (21:09):
Yeah, And I didn't do I do twenty five. In policing,
I did three incorrections. I think the toughest three years
were corrections. I for any correction of the office bilt through.
My hats off to you. That is that is a
tough job. That is in a trauma soaked environment all day,
every day.
Speaker 4 (21:25):
Like in policing.
Speaker 3 (21:26):
Yeah, you see things and you get involved in things,
but you also get to talk to people, and you
get to go outside, and you get to go outside,
you get to talk to people like business owners and
stuff like that. Like when I walk into Beat one
hundred and eighteenth Avenue, the vast majority of your contact
with people is actually with neighborhood people.
Speaker 4 (21:40):
You're walking saying hi to Grandma carrying our groceries. Right.
Speaker 2 (21:44):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (21:45):
But in jail and I made some strong relationships with
people that were incarcerated, And that's you can do that.
Speaker 2 (21:53):
But not a chance you want to do that for
twenty five years.
Speaker 4 (21:55):
Not a chance I could have done that for twenty
five years.
Speaker 2 (21:57):
I had no desire whatsoever.
Speaker 1 (21:59):
Although back when you were deferred, I contemplated going because
I was fucking mad. Yeah, and I'm like, fuck it,
then I'll quit and I'll go there too if you
don't get hired.
Speaker 2 (22:09):
That was actually pounced from I. Thank god that didn't help. Yeah, sucked.
Speaker 3 (22:11):
We'd have been sitting at the Man and it's not
a twenty five and out, it's eighty five factors, so
we'd still be there, have an art freaking lunch in
the in the room being made by the guys at
the Max.
Speaker 4 (22:24):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (22:25):
No, I'm good over time. So it's been a lot.
It's again, I'll pay more attention to it. And then
so if I'm dysregular today, I'm like, not necessarily the why,
but there's been a lot of reasons why that is.
Speaker 2 (22:37):
And then I'm like, Okay, what do I need to do?
Speaker 1 (22:39):
And honestly, the answer for me right now has been
movement and like working out with weights, running, learning how
to swim. That's been a cool process. Teaching yoga a
couple of times a week, all of that has made
a huge difference.
Speaker 3 (22:52):
And you also, the cool thing for you too is
you're still doing dinners with your boys.
Speaker 2 (22:58):
Yes, we're very we have a set.
Speaker 1 (23:01):
This is from our uncle Randy's wife or Auntie Lynn,
and she told Terry a long time ago when and
I don't know why she had this kind of wisdom
back then because the kids were her kids were even smaller.
So like, you need to make sure you set a routine,
like make that Saturday dinner, Sunday dinner, whatever it happens
to be. So we've been very intentional with right now,
we're not going like so Friday dinner whoever's available, and
(23:22):
Sunday dinner, whoever's available. So right now we're double topping it.
And then we'll probably just knock that down to one.
And then we're lucky because we have the cabin and
then when we open that up, the boys have every
intention of spending lots of time there because it's a
free fucking resort for them.
Speaker 4 (23:35):
Basically.
Speaker 3 (23:36):
Yeah, and that's one thing that you're lucky where I'm
not as lucky. We obviously have Amma close and we
actually were just there on Saturday witham and Brady, but
Vanessa and Matt live in Ontario, and that is that
would suck.
Speaker 4 (23:52):
That sucks? It does it really does?
Speaker 3 (23:54):
I know? We do our best to go out there,
and they're going to get themselves out here later this year,
and we've already got plans to head out there as well.
And it's nice because the girls are so close that
they're on their way to they're going to go to
Florida in the next couple of weeks with each other
and they're going to meet each other there and and
it's really cool because my son in laws get along
really well as well, which is kind of neat to
(24:16):
see that that those relationships kind of in adulthood be
what they are and that they're there for each other.
And and you kind of know that, and that's a
that not to be morose or like that, but knowing
that they're there for each other and they'll take care
of each other is kind of in the future when
eventually I die, you know that that that that that
(24:36):
they're they're there for each other.
Speaker 1 (24:39):
Speaking of we're going to keep along the transition line
here and you recently speaking of vehicles sold your Mercedes,
which talk about that and the identity that was wrapped
up in that, because I actually noticed that we talked
about this the other day, that you had shifted and
shed like some weight after getting rid of a car,
(25:00):
which was a nice car, but there was something attached
to it.
Speaker 3 (25:03):
Yeah, so the couple of things. So the reason I
bought that car was the song Fuck the Police actually
by NWA. There's a line in that song that says
me and Lorenzo rolling in a Benzo.
Speaker 4 (25:15):
So I've always liked that song.
Speaker 3 (25:17):
And then damn it feels good to be a gangster,
and he says, driving around town, my drop top bends.
Speaker 4 (25:22):
Hit and switches my black six foot.
Speaker 3 (25:24):
So that's why I want a six morm Palette some
point in time in my life, because I want to
hit switches in my black six form. Probably I have
an inkling to buy an older car one day.
Speaker 4 (25:34):
I don't know why.
Speaker 3 (25:35):
I probably won't put it. Why it's a money pit.
I don't know why I would do that.
Speaker 2 (25:38):
It's a Rose Colors.
Speaker 4 (25:39):
It's one of those.
Speaker 3 (25:40):
Things, right like anyway, But I purchased the Mercedes while
I was in a homicide and it like, at one
point in time I looked at getting a This is
what a douchebag I was. I looked at getting a
license plate like A. I had two options read rom
and they wouldn't let me get that. I went by
it and they said I wasn't allowed, and then I
(26:03):
was going to get C eleven, which is the form
you filled out for overtime, because we worked so much
overtime in homicide, which was a douchey thing to do right,
and part of my identity got caught up in that.
I started like I would and only I would only
buy Hugo Boss suits or Armani suits, and I would
only Tag watches, and I have Hugo Boss watches.
Speaker 4 (26:24):
Three of them. I've got.
Speaker 3 (26:27):
A dk and Y watch, I've got a couple Kenneth
Cole watches. And I can't tell time like we talked
about last time. So I have all these like I
had this I don't know desire to be, I don't
know a douchebag, And getting rid of the Mercedes actually
felt like the last of the douchebag left because I
didn't I wasn't a good person when I was in homicide.
Speaker 4 (26:50):
I don't think many of us weren't good people.
Speaker 3 (26:52):
I loved the work, it was amazing and it was
impactful work, but there was an arrogance that went with
that work. I kind of I was happy to get
rid of that and I'm happy just to drive a
twenty fifteen rogue.
Speaker 4 (27:04):
I'm pretty, it's and if.
Speaker 3 (27:07):
You look at the way I dress now, I literally
I wear jeans and T shirts and dress jackets and
sometimes a hoodie under a dress jacket.
Speaker 4 (27:14):
And people think I'm weird. I don't care.
Speaker 3 (27:16):
I just I've become to me I want to be.
I guess is the best way to put it. And
it was nice to kind of get rid of that
last piece of the old mea. I kind of likened
it to when I stopped doing uc where a groundercover work.
I got rid of all my undercover clothes right away,
like I literally all the Donnie Smith clothes.
Speaker 2 (27:36):
Interesting, I didn't.
Speaker 4 (27:36):
I got rid of them like that.
Speaker 3 (27:37):
As soon as they stopped, those clothes went right into
a bag and right to Goodwill.
Speaker 4 (27:40):
I got rid of that.
Speaker 2 (27:41):
I took.
Speaker 1 (27:41):
You know what's funny, though, I did the same thing
after retiring. I purged all my shit, Like I've kept
a few things that may or may not make it
onto a wall, some up making it into the grade
that are eventually you're gonna go on in plaques and
twelve pictures because you get so much much shit. But
I did the same thing. I had a necklace more
for thirty years and had a little badge on it.
St Michael Yep. I stopped wearing the day I retired.
(28:02):
I don't need it anymore. That's not part of what
this is anymore. And I did the same thing, and
I'm and now with the kids moving out, that's an
even more of purging any and all that.
Speaker 3 (28:11):
Yes, And I think that's that's a good way to
do it because and you see people get they get
caught up in it, and they stay in the in
the mindset that that and and like even like you
talked about, Guido, for the first six months had a
felt like a loss, that he lost part of his identity.
And I actually didn't feel I lost any of my identity.
I felt like my identity shifted. And I say that
(28:33):
because I kinda while I was still in policing, I
started getting into academia and teaching, and not saying that
my identity as being an academic, it's not. It's just
that I was able to kind of turn my hobby
into a career and it was through that became really
enjoyable my in between academic work working at a healing
(28:58):
center that started to feel almost exactly the same as
being in policing, like it was the same kind of
too adjacent, too adjacent, and I didn't want that.
Speaker 4 (29:06):
And you see a lot of guys leave and they.
Speaker 3 (29:08):
Go to investigative roles, right or they go and they
take a job, as you know, setting up the special
investigations unit for an insurance company. Like I ran into
somebody that's doing that the other day, and and good,
and that's good that those options are there. But I
do think it's I think it's important to have a
second arc and do something a bit different.
Speaker 2 (29:27):
Yeah, and it was.
Speaker 1 (29:28):
I didn't file find it as an identity loss either
because I again I think, and we've talked about here before,
when you transition from what EPs, we have black shirts
and white shirts, and the white shirts are.
Speaker 2 (29:38):
The senior officers.
Speaker 1 (29:39):
When you become a white shirt, you kind of bleach
out your soul anyway, and you become a little bit
of the other. And I had no intentions, nor did you,
of ever being that. So when I was wearing one,
it felt a little like antithetical to my soul that
I was in that role. And I don't regret it.
It's not me whining. I asked for it, and I
applied more and all that kind of stuff. But I
(30:00):
think that made the identity shift a little bit easier
because honestly, if you're identifying as an inspector of superintendent,
you probably need some like a team of psychological well being.
Speaker 3 (30:10):
Yeah, and you're right, and you kind of go from
being active and on the team to being the general manager. Right,
that's kind of right. Like you're you're you know, you're
you're not sitting on the you're not even sitting on
the bench anymore. With the guys you're you're not you're
up top, like you're not Paul Coffee, you're Kevin Lowe. Right,
(30:32):
if you want to go to sports analogies again, and
for those of you who don't know, those are Edmonton
Euler hockey players.
Speaker 4 (30:40):
Yeah, I think we were taught. We had one other
thing we're talking about.
Speaker 3 (30:43):
What was we were going to say? And you said,
can you remember all these things? And now I don't
remember the one?
Speaker 2 (30:47):
Uh, total aside, it's a weird thing. So uh.
Speaker 1 (30:51):
Next to police headquarters in downtown Edmonton, there's a remount center.
It's an old one and it's currently under destruction. So
it's being kind of knocked down, and they can't just
blow it up because it's sitting over top of LARTs
and blah blah blah, and it's yeah all that, so
they're kind of slowly tearing it apart. But even looking
at it, you can just sense how much trauma and
(31:13):
sadness is attached to that space. And my wife shook
her head at me the other day because she doesn't
have thoughts like these, and I'm like, I wonder if
there were ghosts there now that the walls have been
ripped apart, do the ghost get to leave there? And
I don't know the answer to that, And you may
everybody way be going, holy fuck, these guys are totally
off their rocker now, which maybe a little bit, but
I just thought it was just that's what popped in
(31:34):
my head, and then I was thinking about it, and
then it of course takes me back to some of
the files that we had, some horrible files, unfortunately, And
you wonder the people who lost their lives there now
finally get some peace when the walls are gone.
Speaker 2 (31:46):
Yeah, that's I hope.
Speaker 4 (31:48):
So for anyone who's ever been in that building, it's
fucking awful.
Speaker 3 (31:53):
I worked in that building as a wage correctional officer
for a few shifts.
Speaker 4 (31:57):
Can you do like three shifts and you're like five, yeah, shifts?
And I didn't.
Speaker 3 (32:00):
I stopped taking ships at the Remount. I would went
to the fort in euy uh.
Speaker 2 (32:05):
It was.
Speaker 4 (32:05):
It was a horrendous place.
Speaker 3 (32:07):
Like it was dark, it was dank, it was dingy,
it smelled bad. It was when we were there. It
was packed to the rafters, it was violent. There was
trauma everywhere.
Speaker 4 (32:22):
It was.
Speaker 3 (32:24):
So, you know, and having worked a homicide from there,
I sure hope that those folks that that were, if
they were ghosts there, they do get released out of
that place, because that's a pretty shitty place to be
stuck in purgatory. Yep, yeah, no, it's and you think
(32:46):
about that too, you know. I don't know what they're
gonna do with that area. I've heard that they're putting
a potentially like a a built like a building a condo.
Speaker 1 (32:54):
Conc because there was talk about them turning that into
a like making it basically for unhoused folks. But then
I think it came to be that it would cost
too much to renovate, and because of the nature of it,
there'd be so much trauma associated too, that people.
Speaker 2 (33:11):
Would be like, I don't want to stay here.
Speaker 3 (33:13):
And then there was a plan to make it student
housing for Mchuen and I actually saw the blueprints and
they were gonna actually just kind of retrofit the cells
to be bedrooms, and I thought, I don't know if
I'd want to live there, Like there's just a lot
of energy in that space that I yeah, And.
Speaker 4 (33:29):
Riemann's a funny thing.
Speaker 3 (33:32):
I would have water forgot to bring waters in Remand's
a funny thing because you think about that. You know,
they're housed people that have yet to be convicted of anything,
so they're presumed innocent, right and interestingly enough, and every
single day we have twelve thousand people in Remand and
ten thousand people sentenced in provincial facilities, so we have
(33:52):
more people in Remand than we actually have sentenced in
the province and province across them. And you think, and
at that time for those folks, and it's dead time,
like you know, you might get double credit for it,
but you have no idea what's going to go on.
And there's there's a lot of you know, unsettledness to
being in.
Speaker 2 (34:11):
The room, isn't it also a mix?
Speaker 1 (34:12):
So if you've done something relatively minor in comparison, and
you could be sitting in the room next to a
guy who's committed a murder or allegedly committed a murder
absolute all that.
Speaker 3 (34:23):
Yeah, yeah, it is very much like you could be
in there for identity theft.
Speaker 4 (34:27):
Yeah, and sitting in this.
Speaker 1 (34:29):
Although I'd be shocked if anybody is sitting in a
remainder for identity theft.
Speaker 4 (34:33):
Well, you know what, one of the things that on
a hot you're right on identity theft.
Speaker 3 (34:37):
But when people do like four hundred five hundred thousand
dollars plus frauds, those people end up in remo.
Speaker 4 (34:46):
You think about it. We had an eph I'm going
to on the other side of it.
Speaker 1 (34:49):
If my grandma lost her house because some guy did
fraud on her, he should be in remamber and then
he should go to jail.
Speaker 3 (34:54):
So I'm actually okay, yeah, no, fair Well, and we
even and it was in the news we had an
EPs mam end up in jail for a fraud and
who ended up losing his job eventually.
Speaker 4 (35:01):
But so it's funny.
Speaker 3 (35:04):
It's like if you fuck with bridge people's money, do
you go to jail or if you beat people up
and kill people, you go to jail. In between like
stealing cars and not unless you do it all the time,
you're not. You don't see a lot of reman time
for auto theft.
Speaker 1 (35:18):
No, And then a lot of those folks are on
multiple recognisants. They get caught, release, caught, release, cut, release,
where that's not this solution either.
Speaker 3 (35:26):
One of the I was co teaching a class with
at Northquest at work, and one of the assignments we
gave to the students was to re imagine a prison,
like if reimagine a prison and make it a better
place to heal and some very interesting concepts. My thought was,
(35:48):
find a river and build a prison so the river
runs through it, so people can be near water, and
because you kind of can heal on the land a
little bit more kind of land based, kind of like
Camp Hope in Montreal Lake and try to do some
of that kind of stuff. Because the way prisons are
now that you don't want it and you can go there,
(36:09):
they deserve it or whatever. But at the same time,
everyone leaves a prison eventually it would be better that
they left there better than when they went in there,
and it would be nice to see us do some
different things with our incarcerated population rather than just put
them in these horrific environments warehouses.
Speaker 4 (36:25):
Yeah, exactly.
Speaker 1 (36:27):
I'm gonna finish with one more thing, talk about the
impact that changed to immigration rules had on Northquest.
Speaker 2 (36:35):
I e. That you had to fire me. So the
I r c C changed some rules.
Speaker 3 (36:42):
And it's interesting because they only changed them for colleges
and polytechnics, not for universities. So what they did was
for any college. I don't know, Okay, I don't know
what it stands where ayone keeps telling me I r
c C something Canada immigration something. Yeah, And what they
(37:02):
did was they took away postgraduate work pyramits for people
from specific not everything at colleges and polytechnics. But unless
there was a job that says yes, you're going to
get a job after they took that away. So it
actually it resulted in unfortunately people, you know, some reimagining
people losing their jobs, people having to go and you know,
(37:24):
get laid off. And that's unfortunate because we are a
country of immigration, and there's unfortunate things out there like
miss miss information, wrong information about immigration and immigration actually
makes your country safer than it makes it that it's
not dangerous.
Speaker 4 (37:43):
And I know there's been.
Speaker 3 (37:44):
Police leaders on podcasts saying things like with every immigrant
immigrant comes a new threat, which is actually untrue.
Speaker 4 (37:51):
But that's the unfortunate kind.
Speaker 1 (37:53):
Of I guess you could say that, like every person
who's born is a threat. I guess yea, which is
kind of gets its potential. Yeah, immigration, refugees and citizenship
Canada is what, no problem, That's what I do here.
Speaker 4 (38:07):
So yes, I had to it was, and I know
you didn't give a shit, well.
Speaker 1 (38:11):
Not give a shit, that's not the right word, because
I really really liked it, like it, and I really
like this. I'm teaching criminal investigations and it's been super
fun because it's my favorite course that I've taught. But you,
I know how badly you felt, so I wasn't gonna
start like weeping. But it's another, honestly, added to the
transition of retirement, getting a job, kids, moving out, losing
(38:32):
a job, gets another either until this.
Speaker 4 (38:35):
Another takes another. Yeah.
Speaker 3 (38:37):
Yeah, And you know the thing about the economy right now,
if you start to look at it, what you're seeing
is possible. I'm not neither of us economists or political scientists, but.
Speaker 2 (38:49):
Both of us can barely spell economists and political science.
Speaker 4 (38:51):
It's true, but we have an impending.
Speaker 3 (38:55):
Recession coming based on what's going on in political which
I'm not going to get into. But the one thing
about recessions, recessions are really good for post secondary institutions.
So I would suggest if this happens, you're going to
see an uptake anyway and in enrollment.
Speaker 1 (39:13):
So yeah, not to besmirch universities, et cetera, but a
place like Northwest, those kids are their kids, like some
of them are thirty five years old, but they're there
and they literally will get a piece of paper that
will lead them to a job, like of all the things.
Speaker 4 (39:28):
Yeah's weird.
Speaker 2 (39:29):
It's so stupid and short sighted.
Speaker 4 (39:31):
It is.
Speaker 3 (39:31):
It's it's And then again, I'm not trying to be political,
but I feel like it was a I feel like
it was a performative move by the liberal government to
show that they're, you know, going to deal with immigration
issue issues that are always brought up with oftentimes are
falsely brought up and talked about falsely without any academic
(39:53):
background by political leaders and leaders of police agencies and
stuff like that that that don't really know what they're
talking about when they say things like that. So yeah,
okaything else nothing, nothing, nothing, nothing else. I made lobster
again this weekend.
Speaker 1 (40:11):
I used my airfire over the first time. I've never
used an air fire. I did Brussels sprouts in it
with honey and uh kind of a spicy spice that
I get from I can't remember the name of it.
Speaker 2 (40:21):
It's audust Salt Spring Island had olive oil. They were
really good.
Speaker 3 (40:25):
But uh, Brussels sprouts in the airfire. That's the best
way to do bussels.
Speaker 1 (40:28):
It is actually yeah, a little bit too long though
they were. Because it's said for twenty three minutes, I
would knock that down.
Speaker 2 (40:34):
To what eighteen mays.
Speaker 3 (40:35):
Yeah, I would say, yeah, eighteen is what I do. Yeah,
I guess we're gonna shut it down. We are sitting
in a beautiful location a park. This guy's yelling his
dog named Billy and Billy Milly, oh Millie Milly was
not listening, didn't even shit what he said. And now
he's got control of his dog. My dog can't be
off least because I would never see my dog again.
(40:56):
Because I have zero control of my.
Speaker 4 (40:57):
Dog because you were a terrible dog trainer. I'm a
terible lodge.
Speaker 1 (41:00):
Yeah like that, don't put that on your resume. You
would be sunking. The dogs would be everywhere everywhere. Yeah,
hump and shit, biting things, barking and everybody.
Speaker 4 (41:06):
Yeah, yeah, they're usually good.
Speaker 3 (41:08):
That was a little bit. It was a little bit
off putting the other day when they bark like that.
Speaker 4 (41:16):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (41:16):
So anyway, with that, we.
Speaker 3 (41:20):
Are in this beautiful park and we are in the
middle of the threety six Territory, the home of the Kree,
the Dane, the Soto, the mayti on a Shnabe, the Lakota,
sioux Uh and Inuit people who have people who have
walked these lands and time memoriam and it is a
beautiful time of the year as things start to green
(41:43):
up and you start to see spring, and it's nice
to sit in this amazing river valley that Edmonton offers.
Speaker 1 (41:48):
And at time it's timely because Guido was a huge
proponent of indigenous spirituality, which if you didn't know him,
maybe you wouldn't known that, but he before his time
aim was focused on that and when you got to
know him, he would kind of impart that wisdom.
Speaker 3 (42:06):
Behalf and he was, Yeah, and he was very connected
to the community, and yeah, awesome love
Speaker 4 (42:13):
MHM.
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