July 13, 2023 • 35 mins
Joe Curotte is known as one of the toughest defensemen to come out of Kahnawake. His playing career stretched from 1965 through 1980 for both the Junior and Senior Caughnawaga Indians teams.
He played against the best including Gaylord Powless, Johnny Davis, Bruce Roundpoint, Frank Benedict and Mike Benedict. As a Junior he received the Best Defenceman Award in 1966 and 1968 and a similar award as a Senior player in 1976.
He was a Junior All Star in 1967 and 1969. Joe was a member of the Junior team that won the Provincial Championship in 1966. He also won Silver with the Seniors in 1969.
A crowning achievement was capturing the Thorpe Longboat Trophy at the North American Lacrosse Championship in Vancouver in 1969.
This accomplishment and his career in general led to his induction into the Ontario Lacrosse Hall of Fame in 2018.
He played against the best including Gaylord Powless, Johnny Davis, Bruce Roundpoint, Frank Benedict and Mike Benedict. As a Junior he received the Best Defenceman Award in 1966 and 1968 and a similar award as a Senior player in 1976.
He was a Junior All Star in 1967 and 1969. Joe was a member of the Junior team that won the Provincial Championship in 1966. He also won Silver with the Seniors in 1969.
A crowning achievement was capturing the Thorpe Longboat Trophy at the North American Lacrosse Championship in Vancouver in 1969.
This accomplishment and his career in general led to his induction into the Ontario Lacrosse Hall of Fame in 2018.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:06):
And here Gonawage territory, here withJoe Carrot. What was your birth date?
October fifth, nineteen forty seven,Hey, and were you born here
in Ghanawagi, in Gonawaga. Soyou've been here your entire life, entire
life other than work. Wow,at some point somebody introduced you to this
(00:29):
great game of lacrosse. Do youremember how that happened or who gave you
your first stick? My father boughtme to my first stick, actually,
and he wasn't a lacrosse player,but he was a lacrosse fan. And
I just happened to live maybe astone show on the local rink, you
(00:49):
know, in my younger days.So I got to watch a lot of
a lot of old older guys play, and that's how I got the bug.
So I played. I started playinglacrosse, and my father bought me
my first stick. What I wasabout, i'd say about eighty years old.
Do you remember the stick maker whomade your first day? Yes?
Yes, yes, it was Chisholmlacrosse stick. And uh and I was
(01:10):
Austin chasing round point. Oh thereyou go, all right? And so
you played at the outdoor box righton the seaway there. Now the box.
It was originally where the Cagary schoolis it right now? They had
a box there, you know,so I live fring hear buy it,
you know, So the boxes there, and eventually the box was moved up
to where do you know how schoolis? You know, I'm telling you,
(01:34):
but it's it's uh further up yeah, in the village, and that
was eventually dismantled and brought to theuh to near the church and it was
built rebuilt there. So played alot of my lacrosse there next to the
church box right and there. Andwhen you were given the stack your your
(01:56):
dad got you the stick and uhdid you feel like this was a game
for you? Oh? Yeah,because I told you. But I was
right next to a La Cross rinkson the road. I wanted to be
like them, y yeah, SoI learned or drew the ball up in
the air, and you know,eventually I learned how to play the game,
you know. But we didn't haveany organization at that time until the
(02:19):
baby I was about twelve years old, okay, So more or less,
I go to the rink what theyshoot around, break in my stick and
you know, you know the oldroute. They got a glass bottle and
break it and scrape the handle andmake it feel the till the fields right
and then you play right, keepshooting around. Okay, And how did
(02:42):
you form your pocket a new stick? What was your I said? I
There was a lot of older guysthere who saw me as a kid,
and they told me how to fixmy stick. And of course then and
got a ball and that and eventuallyso it was all leather in those days,
right, Yes, everything leather.So you have to break it in,
make sure he didn't get it wet. Yeah, but are you go?
(03:04):
It's an ordin or game. Youhave to get it away. When
was the first team that you playedon? What what was that first team?
I would say when I was abouttwelve years old. That's when we've
started getting together. And Walter wasstill younger, but the same with Lewis.
Uh, but a lot of ourguys were getting we're getting together.
But it was run by day atchurch churchhood. It was a prest there
(03:28):
named Father Brunell and Father Arsenal.They were, Uh, they're the one
that's got us organized and we startedplaying playing Barbeth College. I was also
in that cornwall. That's we wereonly about twelve years old at that time.
That was really or that was thefirst time we played organized lacrosse.
Okay, that was what they calledpeewee. You know. I guess,
yeah, I guess, so yeah, and then yeah, and then you
(03:50):
played bantam level, and then Iplayed junior and junior and senior and you
brought you got brought up the seniorvery early. Uh isn't that the case?
Yeah? Yeah, I was,I was. I wasn't I was
seventeen eighteen because my birthdays in October, right, So I broke in with
the team in nineteen sixty five atthe senior team, I played out in
(04:13):
Montreal for him. That was ourhome break at the time. So I
got to play with these my heroes. Who were some of those heroes,
Oh, Georgie Hemblock, I rememberthat, Percy Goodley's big Al Jacobs and
uh, Frankie Benedict. Uh therewas a buster Mitchell from ugazast So it
was Frankie Benedict and uh a numberof other guys you know that that were
(04:39):
my heroes of the day, youknow. And that league that that team
played in that was all like Quebec. Yeah, I was all Quebec league.
At that time. At the time, there was there was gonnawalge uh.
There was a Montreal team which eventuallymoved to Georgian Valley Field. There
was a Ville Saint Pierre team.They had a team they was Sorel Drummondville.
(05:02):
Uh. Then uh we had Ottawain one year and then uh uh
short book came in later on,but it was a U at the time.
It was considered a pro league,so we were ineligeable to play any
Canadian Ross championships at the time becausethey considers an out with all league.
(05:25):
But we have players from everybody everywhere. We have players from BC, we
have players from Peterborough, Ottawa,Cornwall. Uh. There were everywhere from
everywhere. And we mentioned we hadthe great Johnny Allen playing in that league,
Bob Allen, Bobby Allen, youknow, playing in that league.
You know the Fellows were paid alittle bit well as a semi fro.
Yeah, like what what kind ofmoney, what kind of money? Where
(05:47):
we thought, Hey, I wasI was here, I was, I
was I was playing, I wassun. Our manager came to me and
say, here's your money. That'sjust money. You mean, you're you're
paying me to play you're paying meto play? I said, yeah,
(06:08):
I would have if you would askme to play, I would have paid
to play. But they pay big, big time money in those days.
Was ten dollars a game, okay, ten bucks a game? Yeah,
all right, yeah, and thatwas enough to make you guys an Outwall
week. Yeah. Well, alot of guys were being being paid more,
okays, you know, and wewanted to The coaches was John Ferguson,
(06:31):
he coached Sorel at the time.Played against him a lot, so
I got to know him quite abit over the years. And uh so,
like I said, there was alot of good guys. Uh,
Cornwall had, uh had Ron Ward. I know if you remember Ron Ward,
he was a great cross hockey anda little cross player in those days.
And he had eventually played for Drummondville. Okay, it was a great
(06:54):
rival where you play in the NHL. Do you remember Ron Ward? Yeah
you never played the NHL. Heplayed in the whah he played for New
York oh the time. Yeah,but he was an athlete, he was
Oh yeah, he was from Cornwallat the time. Yeah. Okay,
yeah, Now you had big crowds, didn't you. Oh yeah, I
(07:14):
mean the Montreal Forum was capacity crowdat that time, you know it was
the old Forum was over twelve thousanda time, but we get crowds round
anywhere for eight to ten thousand.Lacrosse was big in Montreal in those days,
sixty to sixties, great following,you know, wow, a lot
of Yeah, what do you thinkhappened to it if it was up at
that level in the sixties, Likewhen did it start to change? And
(07:36):
why do you think it started?Well, um, I would say,
uh, the reason why it probablychanges because now TV money and hockey was
the big thing, you know,and we we couldn't afford to play in
the Montreal Forum anymore, okay,how you could play there? And then
(07:58):
of course u x Well came alongand things changed, and I'd say things
evolved different after that, you know, we lacrosse was still a big draw,
yeah those days, and what aboutthe seventies, But like where did
you play when you left the Forum? I guess like we played. We
ended up playing in suburb It justwe're done, We're done. Auditorium just
(08:20):
just down the road, maybe aboutfive minutes ten minutes away from the Montreal
Forum. We played there, andwhat did that seat like four or five
thousand. Oh yeah, had aboutu yeah about that five or six thousand
people, six thousand we drewed allour old grouse used to come down to
Verde. That must be quite theatmosphere with Yeah, it was quite a
(08:41):
place. Yes, it was therelike a day of the week when you're
sat was featured. Saturday was lacrossenight. Is that right? Lacrosse wall
Again, everybody was looking forward toeverybody just everybody would come to the lacrosse
game Saturday. Saturday was the bigmust have been something. Oh yeah,
yeah, uh yes. Where Assome memories you have playing and very dune,
(09:05):
we'll say, you know at thatuh well, this was one game
we were playing, uh we wereplaying I think we were playing Sorel and
there were a rough crowd and therewas a big fighter broke out, big
fight. Anyways, the referees anyways, once they started it all out,
okay, he says, okay,you know we're everybody was thrown out the
(09:28):
best out. So that so forno us to finish the game. They
only allowed us to, uh havebesides the goalie six runners finish off the
third period. Really yeah, soI was thrown Yeah, so I got
to be one of the six players, so I was You're lucky. Yeah,
okay, but uh we managed toplay that uh final period and I
(09:54):
got to play, you know,as a defender. As a defender,
I even scored a goal, sothat's okay. Yeah, you were very
defensive oriented. I heard you werea really hard checker. Yeah, well
that's left to ask the guys Ichecked against, well as Joe Cabrio.
None of them can hold the stickeranymore. Yeah, you can ask Joe
(10:16):
Cabrio if I was or not.He was just here, So you did
you know you wanted to be defensiveminded from the beginning or had it that
all? I always wanted to bebecause my big hero was Big Al Jacob's
big number two, and I uh, he was the roughest, toughest guy
ever. It was built like hisnickname was big Al Buffalo. He was
(10:39):
so big. Yeah, and hewas my hero. And of course,
uh uh when I broke in inuh sixty five, who was my partner?
Really? Yeah, you must havebeen in heaven, he would say
to me. Joel, he says, he said, he didn't call me
(11:00):
Joyce called my son. He says. All I want because I was a
good checker. And that really ishow much older was he than you?
First of all, he at thetime I was he was probably I'd say
I was only seventeen. I wouldsay he wasn't the thirties already. Get
out of here. This is aman. Yeah, you're playing work,
Yeah, he says, says tome. He says, Joey, he
(11:22):
says, just chased them my ways. I'll take care of the rest.
I was your job, correl himand send him into them. I remember
this one game we're playing in uhDrummondville. There was this one guy who
was just aggressive, coming down,coming down all the time, you know.
(11:43):
So of course he couldn't get byme. So I says, find
that I Big alicis Jason moving onmy way out? Take it? So
I did you went down this way? And I'm chatting outside of here.
Whoa And I look the guys layingon the floor, and he says,
and here's big al walk into thepenalty box. He says, yeah,
coming back. Sure enough, wedidn't have to worry about him anymore.
(12:07):
We're big al was He sounds likea character. Oh he was. He
was a good character. He washe was one of those guys you'd love
to have in your room. Youwant to You would never want to play
against them, but you would wanthim in your room with you. He
was one of those guys. Didhe hang around for the seventy four seventy
five Pro League? He was tooold for that. He was just uh
(12:28):
in this in the UH because whenwe played the Presidents Cup in the nineteen
sixty nine he was that was he'dbeen in his last year. Oh okay,
okay. Did he play in thatshort lived pro league in sixty eight?
I had Detroit and oh no,no, no, no, no,
he didn't play that. No,no, he was. He was,
(12:48):
like I said to to eight,he tried out, but I mean
he was at the end of hiscareer at that point. Yeah, huh
did you play in that that?I was on the team, but I
was I got injured in the finalUH exhibition game against Toronto and and they
(13:09):
cut me. Who is it.Who's the coach going to be for you?
John Ferguson. Oh really Ferguson wasyour coach And Jim Bishop was involved
with the organization at the time too, So I know Jim Bishop. Well,
yeah, well, at the timeand you know me. Yeah,
now, I remember you tell mea story about when you moved on to
coaching. You had to go toa clinic with Jim Bishop and Morley Celts
(13:35):
and you said that was like lifechanging clinic. Yeah, man, when
I started coaching in nineteen seventy eight, because uh, you know, I
was. I was still playing andbut we needed they needed uh we didn't
have all these players. They needa team. So I formed the team
and got to play in the leaguewith Montreal Ottawa Area team Cornwall and that
(14:00):
was us. And you know weplayed and uh we were five hundred.
You know, you'd always like tothink you're all good. You know you
can translate from being a player toa coach. Doesn't work that way.
It's a different game altogether. It'sI always worked that way as much as
you think you could. Yeah,But like I said, I was.
(14:22):
I had at the end of thatyear where I ended up in coaches clinic
with Jim Bishop and Morley calls thegreatest coaching clinic I ever had in my
life. And I said, andI knew them both, you know,
I knew, I knew it abouttheir career. And like I said,
I played against him Bishop's teams overthe years, but I didn't know how.
(14:43):
And they told me how would coachingshould be. And I said,
I want to be like them.And I was at one and I did
the following year. Uh, inseventy nine, I turned my team around.
I lost one game all year,and Jay just right from that clinic.
Yea, I applied all the thingsthat he showed me. I still
(15:05):
have my book at home and Ihave all the notes and everything and all
the things that uh he he putout that day, you know, and
it was I was. I feltbad when he passed away, you know,
in a car accident. You know, he was one of my uh
mone of my heroes you know life. You know, really before leaving your
(15:28):
playing career completely, what were someof your biggest moments playing the game?
Uh, you know when you werea player. Well, I say,
in nineteen sixty nine, we hadplay the President's Cup in here in Shadowgy
and uh in those days, itwas the East against the West, you
know, Eastern Eastern representative in theWest, so we are represented the Eastern
(15:52):
that day. You know, wewe played and we ended up winning the
Eastern division. And in the Westwe played was against Nanaimo and iimo luckies.
So we played we had we playeda seven game best out of seven
in those days, you know,and we played seven games game seven games,
(16:14):
seven nights. I lost the firstthree, we won the second three,
and we lost the final and andmy two goals. But I I'm
not uh, I wasn't we callan offensive minded player or like that.
I was a more defender. ButI scored five goals in that series.
(16:37):
What of them was a shorthanded goal. And I had like seven assists,
so I had two at twelve pointsat night, and it was like it
was how do you you know?Yeah, that was a great series,
you know for me? You knowthat. I mean I played in seventy
six, uh two, Uh wewent to the President's Cup in uh Winnipeg
(16:59):
the win it there? What team? What team were you playing for that
went to Winnipeg. I got hima while day. Yeah, and we
had uh we had good players.But you know that's when the things have
changed. Now you're playing uh roundrobin and so it's a different thing.
And you know, you uh wewe didn't. We we got close.
(17:22):
That's it that way. And thenin seventy seven I was awesome. I
picked me up and I went tothe President Scup in Edmonton that year for
them. Okay, yeah, allright, so you got to travel,
you got yeah, and you gotto play in some big games. Oh
and I've been to British Columbia.I played in uh. We used to
have North American Indiana Lacrosse Championship.We should play that every year and uh
(17:47):
in nineteen sixty nine we played thatin uh North Van. We played that,
so we won that tournament there andUH following years, you know,
we played it in UH here andgone all we played out over done.
Like I said, you know,there was teams from nort Van Nanaimo usually
six nations. Usually I was Austina team and our team, know,
(18:10):
we played a North American Lacrosse thechampionship for Jim Torp Jim uh not long
Boat Trophy we used to call it, okay, which it's just Native group.
Yeah, but what's great, Isay, So I got to travel
across the country playing the playing thosegames. So they in nineteen eighty that
they had the first World Indoor orWorld Box Championship and they did have a
(18:33):
team. Did you get to tryout for that team? At all or
uh no, no, I wasinvolved in that I was involved with.
By nineteen eighty, I had thatwas my last year i'd played lacrosse,
and uh, I shouldn't say seventynine the last year played lacrosse. And
nineteen eight I started coaching the seniorteam. So, oh boy, so
you really got into the coaching atthat stage. Yeah, how did you
(18:55):
feel about coaching compared to playing?Like terms, I mean as a player,
any player can relate to this.You know, you have this a
greeneraline rush and playing the game.You can't wait to play and just enjoy
the game, you know, Ijust feel good about it. Well,
when I started coaching, I wasn'tsure, but then I started and I
(19:21):
had the same feeling, you know, the same general under rush and the
water. Said I, I reallyenjoyed coaching, you know, very good.
Yeah. I just I couldn't wait, you know. And I told
my players before I started the season, I says, uh, you're not
just coming to play lacrosse and goto lacrosse game. The most important part
(19:44):
as me as a coach, it'sme coaching, okay, And you're gonna
come to practices, you know,be on time. You're gonna be there
and you're gonna learn, and thegame is gonna get whatever I teach you,
You're gonna play it in the game. And that's how they did it,
and that's that's how that's how Ibecame success doing it. Yeah,
I had success. So between playingcoaching, who were some of the great
(20:06):
players either played with or coached coached? Who were some that you can think
of as a coach, I hadmy team. I had UH Barry Alford,
who was in the Hall of Fame. Okay, yeah, um,
I had Brian Jacob Sagoli. Itwas I thought he was a senior.
(20:29):
Um. Uh, there's but there'sa lot of other players that were played
there that were very good, youknow, and I think I've helped their
career. You know. But asa player I can name, I don't
have enough fingers or toes to counton many players. Uh. I the
(20:49):
great players I played against, youknow, and played with so uh.
Like I said, I played againstUH Gaylor Paulis he'd with him too in
UH in a couple of games,you know, in the exhibition games and
(21:10):
UH we played UH. I playedagainst UH. One of the greats in
is Oliver Hill you know he's playedagainst it Bouche Rome Point. Hey,
him and I were. He happenedto always come down my side of the
floor. I can't so he andI were really yeah, yeah, yeah
(21:33):
for years and years and years.Oh yeah, that would be something that
Mike Bennedict, you know, Iwas awesome, you know, Mike Benedict
was he was m at IBC.But he had avoid me. But he
was such a great player, youknow. I mean he could shoot left
right over his head. He waskind of was amazing, amazing player.
(21:55):
You you had a number of differentprofessions right outside of lacrosse, Like tell
people a little bit about the differentthings you worked on. Well, um,
just like anybody else, you knowhere in Gonna Wage. You know,
I did little iron work in thenineties, in the seventies, in
early seventies, so you know.But in nineteen seventy I was working in
(22:19):
New York City, you know,working there doing ironwork. But also I
got a call from the owner fromRochester in the new league they just started.
So I went there and I playeda few games for Rochester. So
I'd come home on the weekend,jump in a car, drive to Rochester
or whatever. Playing lacrosse. Wasthat seventy four? It's nineteen seventy seventy
(22:45):
I was doing playing lacrosse and playingdoor an artwork as they've done. They
like it. It killed me,Yeah, I couldn't, so you left.
I play a Saturday night game,in a Sunday afternoon game and drive
back to gotta waga jump on,I ride and head back to New York
midnight. But you guys loved it, loved the crosse, you know.
(23:07):
I mean that's the only reason whyI did. And do it for money
they paid me, but uh,it was uh that wasn't important. Wow.
Wow, And what did you doafter iron work? Well, I
was living on work, and thenI got a couple of different jobs here
and there. You know, Istarted, uh got into the printing business,
so up in and now uh inMontreal. It was with a native
(23:32):
organization, so they hired me andI started learning how to be a printer,
you know, and not just verybut putting things together. And then
uh, eventually that revolved into Iwent to uh Ryerson okay in Toronto,
and I uh into graphic arts management. So I graduated there in seventy eight.
Okay, of course, Ryerson's inRyerson anymore. But I graduated there.
(23:57):
But I take pride in that becausewhen I first started off in that
programmed or was hidd forty of usin that program, and I remember the
deed and it is this he saidto us. He says, you know,
when we got her opening, hesays, he looked at the left
and right of you. He says, half of you ain't gonna be here
(24:18):
in Christmas. After Christmas, that'sencouraging. Yeah. Anyways, out of
one hundred and forty guys, Iwas one of seventeen to have graduated in
that program. Wow, writers,So I take a much pride in that.
So you kind of learned management management. There was mostly management and graphic
arts in printing business. I didthat for once I got out and graduated,
(24:41):
and like I said, seventy eight, I gradually I came home.
I was married still, I sawI was married, and I started lacrosse
team. So I was working inI was coaching and managing a team and
h and I was still and Iwas still playing. So busy, busy,
(25:03):
yeah, but lacrosse is lacrosse,you know. Yeah, And then
you were involved a very important thinghere Gottawagi the Survival School. Yeah.
Well and you got somehow got intomanagement of project like that. Yeah,
like I said, and uh,in nineteen seventy eight, it just so
happened. That was the beginning ofthe Gatawaga Suraval School. Okay. And
for people don't know what that is. What is the Gonawai Survival is a
(25:29):
local high school. And the reasonwhy the name survival is a survival of
the language and also of our heritageand all of that. So that's why
they called it survival school. None, it was there wasn't our survival school.
It's but that's the reason why theycalled it Gonawaga Survival. Save the
traditions, save the language. Savethat's right, that still exists today.
(25:51):
Anyways, seventy eight it started,uh that and what I was still working
in the graphic arts business, andlike I said, involved in lacrosse,
and I needed someone who In seventynine, they were looking for her something
to being involved in the construction ofa new school because mount money was available
to build a school. So Ihad applied, not for that job,
(26:15):
I just volunteer. Volunteer. Sothey looked over my biography and they said,
so they they'd like to be toapply for that job, so I
did so I ended up being thedirector of construction for that So I worked
for five years. So we builta survival school, and that was my
beginning of my uh, construction career. I've never I never stepped out after
(26:41):
that. So I've been U inconstruction until about six seven years ago.
And then I know, like Lewisde Lil was the principle at one point
and my brother, my younger brother, he was, he was the principal
ad there went on. So Ihappened to coach too in his junior years.
And now they have a nice lacrosseprogram out of that school and uh,
(27:02):
you know with kids going on scholarshipto places and yeah, yeah,
pretty impressive. Yes, I'm impressedwith a lot of the lacrosse programs going
right now in Donawaga, you know. Yeah, yeah, it seems to
me that right now is a goodtime for lacrosse in Gottawage, whereas maybe
five eight years ago it wasn't asas bright a future for it. Yeah,
(27:27):
and uh, and that call comesdown to having to write people,
okay, if almost people and uh, if you don't have that, you
don't have, you don't have theseorganizations, you know. So, like
I said, uh, in theseventies, uh, late seventies, Uh,
(27:47):
Louis Lille was involved in lacrosse andgorson a whole lot of people involved.
So I got involved in you know, that was and that's how I
ended up becoming a juniors. Thenthen lacrosse expanded even more after that,
you know, because lacrosse at thatpoint was someone a little old because there
wasn't enough people involved in the organization. Yeah. Yeah, it's always people
(28:10):
that are willing to put out timeand do it, and that's that's the
most important. Yes, yeah,you gotta have the people, and you
gotta have people who want things towork. Well. Yes, yes,
so they put the time into it. Out of your entire lacrosse career,
what can you say about that?Yeah, well, lacrosse was always a
big part of my life. Andthank god, my wife let me play.
(28:37):
She let me be what I wantedto be. And I enjoyed every
game. I couldn't wait to play. I couldn't wait for the season to
begin, you know, and youknow I'm practice, I was there,
uh game. There wasn't any placethat I if somebody said to you,
Joey, you want to go playuh in Nadalga tomorrow. I'm there about
(29:04):
it. I have to think aboutit twice. I mean I'm not the
only one. There was a lotof guys like that, but I mean
I was that type of person who, well, lacrosse was very important to
me and I loved it so much, you know, and culturally also,
you know, as of being atraditionalist. It's uh, it's a very
important part of our of our ofour life, you know, across game
(29:26):
you know, and the medicine game. Yeah, medicine game. Uh we
play it. Uh uh we playthat for the creator, you know,
and that's that's a game. Yes, yeah, that's the root of it
all, is the medicine game playingfor the entertainment of the creator. And
you were fortunate enough to be ableto coach your sons, you know.
(29:48):
So you you have grandchildren coming,right, Yeah. I have one grandson.
He's just turned six and uh he'sstarting playing lacrosse and uh he loves
it. He's enjoying it. Sofor me, that's like uh being born
again. So you're being drawn inagain. Oh yeah, yeah, I
just never let you go. Yeah, you don't want it to. Oh
(30:11):
that's right, you know you don'twant it to. Well what would you
like to close with talking about eitherghnawagi or lacrosse or the whole experience.
You know, Well, I gotinducted it into a Tara Lacrosse Hall of
Fame in uh uh in nineteen uhuh ninety six or something. Yeah,
(30:34):
and uh and that was quite anhonor to be involved in that. And
uh so, I mean I thoughtthat I played to be not that I
played lacrosse to be in the Hallof fame, but it was an honor
to be in there. And Ilook at all the names in Saint Catsine's
you look at the list of guyson there, and he's like, hey,
(30:56):
I played with all those guys.I played against all those guys,
you know, so I mean goodcompany. Yeah, and just think you
the way you started out as asenior was in the Montreal Forum. Yeah,
unbelievable. Oh yeah, many peoplewooden floor, wooden floor, Yes,
they had a wooden floor. Wow. Yeah, you know that that's
(31:18):
a treat. Just the plan,would you know, like out salmon bellies
out west and you know, anduh, I told you we had played
uh a series of field A crossgames in UH at Exmo nineteen sixty seven
and how have you here? InMontreal and uh it was an all star
(31:40):
game between UH guys from the Canadianside and team UH Natives from the American
side. So I got to playwith a lot of guys from I was
Austin and six Nations, you know, Paulis, and our coach was Ross
(32:02):
Pallis. He was her coach,you know. And so when I got
on the team too ready to go, and or Ross Pallis came to me,
he says, Joe, and heremembers me. He remember Joe,
he says, Joe. I says, surprised me, says Joe. He
says, uh, one job foryou, he says. This is what
(32:22):
he says. Their best player areon that team. His name is uh
Um Oliver Hill, Oliver Hill,I says. And your job is to
watch him, I says, Andyou watch him wherever he goes. You're
gonna be playing in this. Ifhe starts to go to the bathroom and
take a ship, he says,you go take it with him. But
(32:46):
but the thing was that no shadowy, Yeah, it was Ross Pallis,
and that he remembered me. SoI was honored that he would remember me.
But that's I think there is becauseI played A Yancy's Sons several years
and he was he was so hesaw because my job was always to watch
(33:07):
uh, gaylord, gaylord, youknow. So I guess he liked the
job I did. So, sothat was an honor to be to be
pointed out and saying, I wantyou to do this. Very nice,
very nice. You know, whatdo you think of? You know,
the opportunities for the game, aswe there is some good quality across played
(33:30):
not only in Canada and the US, but also in Europe, you know,
England and Australia, you know,and surprising now big it is.
And in those areas you know,you know, there's seventy two countries playing
now. Yeah. Unbelievable, unbelievable, you know. Yeah, it's great
to have you here and now yourstory. Hopefully people will be reading these
(33:53):
like fifty years from now, youknow, closing too, you know,
like when I my speech to theat the Tara Lacrosse Hall of Fame,
I spoke about the past, thepresident and now you know, and one
of the things I ended off withwas the I got into the Hall of
(34:15):
Fame, not because I was alwaysthe best player or anything like that,
is because I had the privilege andhonor to play with some great players.
And you don't become you don't comeinto this Hall of Fame simply because you're
of anything. It's because there's somegreat people who play this game and there's
(34:39):
a great future in it and U. And one of the things was I
in closing, I said, Ithanked all the people that because I am
a traditionalist, I says, oneof the things that seemed important that when
we played a game is that wehonored a creator. Okay, And I
(34:59):
said tonight that night, that says, tonight, you've given me the honor
to have honored a creator for thisand you've also helped me being part of
it. So that's how I closedit. So thank you, you know me
And here Gonawage territory, here withJoe Carrot. What was your birth date?
October fifth, nineteen forty seven,Hey, and were you born here
in Ghanawagi, in Gonawaga. Soyou've been here your entire life, entire
life other than work. Wow,at some point somebody introduced you to this
(00:29):
great game of lacrosse. Do youremember how that happened or who gave you
your first stick? My father boughtme to my first stick, actually,
and he wasn't a lacrosse player,but he was a lacrosse fan. And
I just happened to live maybe astone show on the local rink, you
(00:49):
know, in my younger days.So I got to watch a lot of
a lot of old older guys play, and that's how I got the bug.
So I played. I started playinglacrosse, and my father bought me
my first stick. What I wasabout, i'd say about eighty years old.
Do you remember the stick maker whomade your first day? Yes?
Yes, yes, it was Chisholmlacrosse stick. And uh and I was
(01:10):
Austin chasing round point. Oh thereyou go, all right? And so
you played at the outdoor box righton the seaway there. Now the box.
It was originally where the Cagary schoolis it right now? They had
a box there, you know,so I live fring hear buy it,
you know, So the boxes there, and eventually the box was moved up
to where do you know how schoolis? You know, I'm telling you,
(01:34):
but it's it's uh further up yeah, in the village, and that
was eventually dismantled and brought to theuh to near the church and it was
built rebuilt there. So played alot of my lacrosse there next to the
church box right and there. Andwhen you were given the stack your your
(01:56):
dad got you the stick and uhdid you feel like this was a game
for you? Oh? Yeah,because I told you. But I was
right next to a La Cross rinkson the road. I wanted to be
like them, y yeah, SoI learned or drew the ball up in
the air, and you know,eventually I learned how to play the game,
you know. But we didn't haveany organization at that time until the
(02:19):
baby I was about twelve years old, okay, So more or less,
I go to the rink what theyshoot around, break in my stick and
you know, you know the oldroute. They got a glass bottle and
break it and scrape the handle andmake it feel the till the fields right
and then you play right, keepshooting around. Okay, And how did
(02:42):
you form your pocket a new stick? What was your I said? I
There was a lot of older guysthere who saw me as a kid,
and they told me how to fixmy stick. And of course then and
got a ball and that and eventuallyso it was all leather in those days,
right, Yes, everything leather.So you have to break it in,
make sure he didn't get it wet. Yeah, but are you go?
(03:04):
It's an ordin or game. Youhave to get it away. When
was the first team that you playedon? What what was that first team?
I would say when I was abouttwelve years old. That's when we've
started getting together. And Walter wasstill younger, but the same with Lewis.
Uh, but a lot of ourguys were getting we're getting together.
But it was run by day atchurch churchhood. It was a prest there
(03:28):
named Father Brunell and Father Arsenal.They were, Uh, they're the one
that's got us organized and we startedplaying playing Barbeth College. I was also
in that cornwall. That's we wereonly about twelve years old at that time.
That was really or that was thefirst time we played organized lacrosse.
Okay, that was what they calledpeewee. You know. I guess,
yeah, I guess, so yeah, and then yeah, and then you
(03:50):
played bantam level, and then Iplayed junior and junior and senior and you
brought you got brought up the seniorvery early. Uh isn't that the case?
Yeah? Yeah, I was,I was. I wasn't I was
seventeen eighteen because my birthdays in October, right, So I broke in with
the team in nineteen sixty five atthe senior team, I played out in
(04:13):
Montreal for him. That was ourhome break at the time. So I
got to play with these my heroes. Who were some of those heroes,
Oh, Georgie Hemblock, I rememberthat, Percy Goodley's big Al Jacobs and
uh, Frankie Benedict. Uh therewas a buster Mitchell from ugazast So it
was Frankie Benedict and uh a numberof other guys you know that that were
(04:39):
my heroes of the day, youknow. And that league that that team
played in that was all like Quebec. Yeah, I was all Quebec league.
At that time. At the time, there was there was gonnawalge uh.
There was a Montreal team which eventuallymoved to Georgian Valley Field. There
was a Ville Saint Pierre team.They had a team they was Sorel Drummondville.
(05:02):
Uh. Then uh we had Ottawain one year and then uh uh
short book came in later on,but it was a U at the time.
It was considered a pro league,so we were ineligeable to play any
Canadian Ross championships at the time becausethey considers an out with all league.
(05:25):
But we have players from everybody everywhere. We have players from BC, we
have players from Peterborough, Ottawa,Cornwall. Uh. There were everywhere from
everywhere. And we mentioned we hadthe great Johnny Allen playing in that league,
Bob Allen, Bobby Allen, youknow, playing in that league.
You know the Fellows were paid alittle bit well as a semi fro.
Yeah, like what what kind ofmoney, what kind of money? Where
(05:47):
we thought, Hey, I wasI was here, I was, I
was I was playing, I wassun. Our manager came to me and
say, here's your money. That'sjust money. You mean, you're you're
paying me to play you're paying meto play? I said, yeah,
(06:08):
I would have if you would askme to play, I would have paid
to play. But they pay big, big time money in those days.
Was ten dollars a game, okay, ten bucks a game? Yeah,
all right, yeah, and thatwas enough to make you guys an Outwall
week. Yeah. Well, alot of guys were being being paid more,
okays, you know, and wewanted to The coaches was John Ferguson,
(06:31):
he coached Sorel at the time.Played against him a lot, so
I got to know him quite abit over the years. And uh so,
like I said, there was alot of good guys. Uh,
Cornwall had, uh had Ron Ward. I know if you remember Ron Ward,
he was a great cross hockey anda little cross player in those days.
And he had eventually played for Drummondville. Okay, it was a great
(06:54):
rival where you play in the NHL. Do you remember Ron Ward? Yeah
you never played the NHL. Heplayed in the whah he played for New
York oh the time. Yeah,but he was an athlete, he was
Oh yeah, he was from Cornwallat the time. Yeah. Okay,
yeah, Now you had big crowds, didn't you. Oh yeah, I
(07:14):
mean the Montreal Forum was capacity crowdat that time, you know it was
the old Forum was over twelve thousanda time, but we get crowds round
anywhere for eight to ten thousand.Lacrosse was big in Montreal in those days,
sixty to sixties, great following,you know, wow, a lot
of Yeah, what do you thinkhappened to it if it was up at
that level in the sixties, Likewhen did it start to change? And
(07:36):
why do you think it started?Well, um, I would say,
uh, the reason why it probablychanges because now TV money and hockey was
the big thing, you know,and we we couldn't afford to play in
the Montreal Forum anymore, okay,how you could play there? And then
(07:58):
of course u x Well came alongand things changed, and I'd say things
evolved different after that, you know, we lacrosse was still a big draw,
yeah those days, and what aboutthe seventies, But like where did
you play when you left the Forum? I guess like we played. We
ended up playing in suburb It justwe're done, We're done. Auditorium just
(08:20):
just down the road, maybe aboutfive minutes ten minutes away from the Montreal
Forum. We played there, andwhat did that seat like four or five
thousand. Oh yeah, had aboutu yeah about that five or six thousand
people, six thousand we drewed allour old grouse used to come down to
Verde. That must be quite theatmosphere with Yeah, it was quite a
(08:41):
place. Yes, it was therelike a day of the week when you're
sat was featured. Saturday was lacrossenight. Is that right? Lacrosse wall
Again, everybody was looking forward toeverybody just everybody would come to the lacrosse
game Saturday. Saturday was the bigmust have been something. Oh yeah,
yeah, uh yes. Where Assome memories you have playing and very dune,
(09:05):
we'll say, you know at thatuh well, this was one game
we were playing, uh we wereplaying I think we were playing Sorel and
there were a rough crowd and therewas a big fighter broke out, big
fight. Anyways, the referees anyways, once they started it all out,
okay, he says, okay,you know we're everybody was thrown out the
(09:28):
best out. So that so forno us to finish the game. They
only allowed us to, uh havebesides the goalie six runners finish off the
third period. Really yeah, soI was thrown Yeah, so I got
to be one of the six players, so I was You're lucky. Yeah,
okay, but uh we managed toplay that uh final period and I
(09:54):
got to play, you know,as a defender. As a defender,
I even scored a goal, sothat's okay. Yeah, you were very
defensive oriented. I heard you werea really hard checker. Yeah, well
that's left to ask the guys Ichecked against, well as Joe Cabrio.
None of them can hold the stickeranymore. Yeah, you can ask Joe
(10:16):
Cabrio if I was or not.He was just here, So you did
you know you wanted to be defensiveminded from the beginning or had it that
all? I always wanted to bebecause my big hero was Big Al Jacob's
big number two, and I uh, he was the roughest, toughest guy
ever. It was built like hisnickname was big Al Buffalo. He was
(10:39):
so big. Yeah, and hewas my hero. And of course,
uh uh when I broke in inuh sixty five, who was my partner?
Really? Yeah, you must havebeen in heaven, he would say
to me. Joel, he says, he said, he didn't call me
(11:00):
Joyce called my son. He says. All I want because I was a
good checker. And that really ishow much older was he than you?
First of all, he at thetime I was he was probably I'd say
I was only seventeen. I wouldsay he wasn't the thirties already. Get
out of here. This is aman. Yeah, you're playing work,
Yeah, he says, says tome. He says, Joey, he
(11:22):
says, just chased them my ways. I'll take care of the rest.
I was your job, correl himand send him into them. I remember
this one game we're playing in uhDrummondville. There was this one guy who
was just aggressive, coming down,coming down all the time, you know.
(11:43):
So of course he couldn't get byme. So I says, find
that I Big alicis Jason moving onmy way out? Take it? So
I did you went down this way? And I'm chatting outside of here.
Whoa And I look the guys layingon the floor, and he says,
and here's big al walk into thepenalty box. He says, yeah,
coming back. Sure enough, wedidn't have to worry about him anymore.
(12:07):
We're big al was He sounds likea character. Oh he was. He
was a good character. He washe was one of those guys you'd love
to have in your room. Youwant to You would never want to play
against them, but you would wanthim in your room with you. He
was one of those guys. Didhe hang around for the seventy four seventy
five Pro League? He was tooold for that. He was just uh
(12:28):
in this in the UH because whenwe played the Presidents Cup in the nineteen
sixty nine he was that was he'dbeen in his last year. Oh okay,
okay. Did he play in thatshort lived pro league in sixty eight?
I had Detroit and oh no,no, no, no, no,
he didn't play that. No,no, he was. He was,
(12:48):
like I said to to eight,he tried out, but I mean
he was at the end of hiscareer at that point. Yeah, huh
did you play in that that?I was on the team, but I
was I got injured in the finalUH exhibition game against Toronto and and they
(13:09):
cut me. Who is it.Who's the coach going to be for you?
John Ferguson. Oh really Ferguson wasyour coach And Jim Bishop was involved
with the organization at the time too, So I know Jim Bishop. Well,
yeah, well, at the timeand you know me. Yeah,
now, I remember you tell mea story about when you moved on to
coaching. You had to go toa clinic with Jim Bishop and Morley Celts
(13:35):
and you said that was like lifechanging clinic. Yeah, man, when
I started coaching in nineteen seventy eight, because uh, you know, I
was. I was still playing andbut we needed they needed uh we didn't
have all these players. They needa team. So I formed the team
and got to play in the leaguewith Montreal Ottawa Area team Cornwall and that
(14:00):
was us. And you know weplayed and uh we were five hundred.
You know, you'd always like tothink you're all good. You know you
can translate from being a player toa coach. Doesn't work that way.
It's a different game altogether. It'sI always worked that way as much as
you think you could. Yeah,But like I said, I was.
(14:22):
I had at the end of thatyear where I ended up in coaches clinic
with Jim Bishop and Morley calls thegreatest coaching clinic I ever had in my
life. And I said, andI knew them both, you know,
I knew, I knew it abouttheir career. And like I said,
I played against him Bishop's teams overthe years, but I didn't know how.
(14:43):
And they told me how would coachingshould be. And I said,
I want to be like them.And I was at one and I did
the following year. Uh, inseventy nine, I turned my team around.
I lost one game all year,and Jay just right from that clinic.
Yea, I applied all the thingsthat he showed me. I still
(15:05):
have my book at home and Ihave all the notes and everything and all
the things that uh he he putout that day, you know, and
it was I was. I feltbad when he passed away, you know,
in a car accident. You know, he was one of my uh
mone of my heroes you know life. You know, really before leaving your
(15:28):
playing career completely, what were someof your biggest moments playing the game?
Uh, you know when you werea player. Well, I say,
in nineteen sixty nine, we hadplay the President's Cup in here in Shadowgy
and uh in those days, itwas the East against the West, you
know, Eastern Eastern representative in theWest, so we are represented the Eastern
(15:52):
that day. You know, wewe played and we ended up winning the
Eastern division. And in the Westwe played was against Nanaimo and iimo luckies.
So we played we had we playeda seven game best out of seven
in those days, you know,and we played seven games game seven games,
(16:14):
seven nights. I lost the firstthree, we won the second three,
and we lost the final and andmy two goals. But I I'm
not uh, I wasn't we callan offensive minded player or like that.
I was a more defender. ButI scored five goals in that series.
(16:37):
What of them was a shorthanded goal. And I had like seven assists,
so I had two at twelve pointsat night, and it was like it
was how do you you know?Yeah, that was a great series,
you know for me? You knowthat. I mean I played in seventy
six, uh two, Uh wewent to the President's Cup in uh Winnipeg
(16:59):
the win it there? What team? What team were you playing for that
went to Winnipeg. I got hima while day. Yeah, and we
had uh we had good players.But you know that's when the things have
changed. Now you're playing uh roundrobin and so it's a different thing.
And you know, you uh wewe didn't. We we got close.
(17:22):
That's it that way. And thenin seventy seven I was awesome. I
picked me up and I went tothe President Scup in Edmonton that year for
them. Okay, yeah, allright, so you got to travel,
you got yeah, and you gotto play in some big games. Oh
and I've been to British Columbia.I played in uh. We used to
have North American Indiana Lacrosse Championship.We should play that every year and uh
(17:47):
in nineteen sixty nine we played thatin uh North Van. We played that,
so we won that tournament there andUH following years, you know,
we played it in UH here andgone all we played out over done.
Like I said, you know,there was teams from nort Van Nanaimo usually
six nations. Usually I was Austina team and our team, know,
(18:10):
we played a North American Lacrosse thechampionship for Jim Torp Jim uh not long
Boat Trophy we used to call it, okay, which it's just Native group.
Yeah, but what's great, Isay, So I got to travel
across the country playing the playing thosegames. So they in nineteen eighty that
they had the first World Indoor orWorld Box Championship and they did have a
(18:33):
team. Did you get to tryout for that team? At all or
uh no, no, I wasinvolved in that I was involved with.
By nineteen eighty, I had thatwas my last year i'd played lacrosse,
and uh, I shouldn't say seventynine the last year played lacrosse. And
nineteen eight I started coaching the seniorteam. So, oh boy, so
you really got into the coaching atthat stage. Yeah, how did you
(18:55):
feel about coaching compared to playing?Like terms, I mean as a player,
any player can relate to this.You know, you have this a
greeneraline rush and playing the game.You can't wait to play and just enjoy
the game, you know, Ijust feel good about it. Well,
when I started coaching, I wasn'tsure, but then I started and I
(19:21):
had the same feeling, you know, the same general under rush and the
water. Said I, I reallyenjoyed coaching, you know, very good.
Yeah. I just I couldn't wait, you know. And I told
my players before I started the season, I says, uh, you're not
just coming to play lacrosse and goto lacrosse game. The most important part
(19:44):
as me as a coach, it'sme coaching, okay, And you're gonna
come to practices, you know,be on time. You're gonna be there
and you're gonna learn, and thegame is gonna get whatever I teach you,
You're gonna play it in the game. And that's how they did it,
and that's that's how that's how Ibecame success doing it. Yeah,
I had success. So between playingcoaching, who were some of the great
(20:06):
players either played with or coached coached? Who were some that you can think
of as a coach, I hadmy team. I had UH Barry Alford,
who was in the Hall of Fame. Okay, yeah, um,
I had Brian Jacob Sagoli. Itwas I thought he was a senior.
(20:29):
Um. Uh, there's but there'sa lot of other players that were played
there that were very good, youknow, and I think I've helped their
career. You know. But asa player I can name, I don't
have enough fingers or toes to counton many players. Uh. I the
(20:49):
great players I played against, youknow, and played with so uh.
Like I said, I played againstUH Gaylor Paulis he'd with him too in
UH in a couple of games,you know, in the exhibition games and
(21:10):
UH we played UH. I playedagainst UH. One of the greats in
is Oliver Hill you know he's playedagainst it Bouche Rome Point. Hey,
him and I were. He happenedto always come down my side of the
floor. I can't so he andI were really yeah, yeah, yeah
(21:33):
for years and years and years.Oh yeah, that would be something that
Mike Bennedict, you know, Iwas awesome, you know, Mike Benedict
was he was m at IBC.But he had avoid me. But he
was such a great player, youknow. I mean he could shoot left
right over his head. He waskind of was amazing, amazing player.
(21:55):
You you had a number of differentprofessions right outside of lacrosse, Like tell
people a little bit about the differentthings you worked on. Well, um,
just like anybody else, you knowhere in Gonna Wage. You know,
I did little iron work in thenineties, in the seventies, in
early seventies, so you know.But in nineteen seventy I was working in
(22:19):
New York City, you know,working there doing ironwork. But also I
got a call from the owner fromRochester in the new league they just started.
So I went there and I playeda few games for Rochester. So
I'd come home on the weekend,jump in a car, drive to Rochester
or whatever. Playing lacrosse. Wasthat seventy four? It's nineteen seventy seventy
(22:45):
I was doing playing lacrosse and playingdoor an artwork as they've done. They
like it. It killed me,Yeah, I couldn't, so you left.
I play a Saturday night game,in a Sunday afternoon game and drive
back to gotta waga jump on,I ride and head back to New York
midnight. But you guys loved it, loved the crosse, you know.
(23:07):
I mean that's the only reason whyI did. And do it for money
they paid me, but uh,it was uh that wasn't important. Wow.
Wow, And what did you doafter iron work? Well, I
was living on work, and thenI got a couple of different jobs here
and there. You know, Istarted, uh got into the printing business,
so up in and now uh inMontreal. It was with a native
(23:32):
organization, so they hired me andI started learning how to be a printer,
you know, and not just verybut putting things together. And then
uh, eventually that revolved into Iwent to uh Ryerson okay in Toronto,
and I uh into graphic arts management. So I graduated there in seventy eight.
Okay, of course, Ryerson's inRyerson anymore. But I graduated there.
(23:57):
But I take pride in that becausewhen I first started off in that
programmed or was hidd forty of usin that program, and I remember the
deed and it is this he saidto us. He says, you know,
when we got her opening, hesays, he looked at the left
and right of you. He says, half of you ain't gonna be here
(24:18):
in Christmas. After Christmas, that'sencouraging. Yeah. Anyways, out of
one hundred and forty guys, Iwas one of seventeen to have graduated in
that program. Wow, writers,So I take a much pride in that.
So you kind of learned management management. There was mostly management and graphic
arts in printing business. I didthat for once I got out and graduated,
(24:41):
and like I said, seventy eight, I gradually I came home.
I was married still, I sawI was married, and I started lacrosse
team. So I was working inI was coaching and managing a team and
h and I was still and Iwas still playing. So busy, busy,
(25:03):
yeah, but lacrosse is lacrosse,you know. Yeah, And then
you were involved a very important thinghere Gottawagi the Survival School. Yeah.
Well and you got somehow got intomanagement of project like that. Yeah,
like I said, and uh,in nineteen seventy eight, it just so
happened. That was the beginning ofthe Gatawaga Suraval School. Okay. And
for people don't know what that is. What is the Gonawai Survival is a
(25:29):
local high school. And the reasonwhy the name survival is a survival of
the language and also of our heritageand all of that. So that's why
they called it survival school. None, it was there wasn't our survival school.
It's but that's the reason why theycalled it Gonawaga Survival. Save the
traditions, save the language. Savethat's right, that still exists today.
(25:51):
Anyways, seventy eight it started,uh that and what I was still working
in the graphic arts business, andlike I said, involved in lacrosse,
and I needed someone who In seventynine, they were looking for her something
to being involved in the construction ofa new school because mount money was available
to build a school. So Ihad applied, not for that job,
(26:15):
I just volunteer. Volunteer. Sothey looked over my biography and they said,
so they they'd like to be toapply for that job, so I
did so I ended up being thedirector of construction for that So I worked
for five years. So we builta survival school, and that was my
beginning of my uh, construction career. I've never I never stepped out after
(26:41):
that. So I've been U inconstruction until about six seven years ago.
And then I know, like Lewisde Lil was the principle at one point
and my brother, my younger brother, he was, he was the principal
ad there went on. So Ihappened to coach too in his junior years.
And now they have a nice lacrosseprogram out of that school and uh,
(27:02):
you know with kids going on scholarshipto places and yeah, yeah,
pretty impressive. Yes, I'm impressedwith a lot of the lacrosse programs going
right now in Donawaga, you know. Yeah, yeah, it seems to
me that right now is a goodtime for lacrosse in Gottawage, whereas maybe
five eight years ago it wasn't asas bright a future for it. Yeah,
(27:27):
and uh, and that call comesdown to having to write people,
okay, if almost people and uh, if you don't have that, you
don't have, you don't have theseorganizations, you know. So, like
I said, uh, in theseventies, uh, late seventies, Uh,
(27:47):
Louis Lille was involved in lacrosse andgorson a whole lot of people involved.
So I got involved in you know, that was and that's how I
ended up becoming a juniors. Thenthen lacrosse expanded even more after that,
you know, because lacrosse at thatpoint was someone a little old because there
wasn't enough people involved in the organization. Yeah. Yeah, it's always people
(28:10):
that are willing to put out timeand do it, and that's that's the
most important. Yes, yeah,you gotta have the people, and you
gotta have people who want things towork. Well. Yes, yes,
so they put the time into it. Out of your entire lacrosse career,
what can you say about that?Yeah, well, lacrosse was always a
big part of my life. Andthank god, my wife let me play.
(28:37):
She let me be what I wantedto be. And I enjoyed every
game. I couldn't wait to play. I couldn't wait for the season to
begin, you know, and youknow I'm practice, I was there,
uh game. There wasn't any placethat I if somebody said to you,
Joey, you want to go playuh in Nadalga tomorrow. I'm there about
(29:04):
it. I have to think aboutit twice. I mean I'm not the
only one. There was a lotof guys like that, but I mean
I was that type of person who, well, lacrosse was very important to
me and I loved it so much, you know, and culturally also,
you know, as of being atraditionalist. It's uh, it's a very
important part of our of our ofour life, you know, across game
(29:26):
you know, and the medicine game. Yeah, medicine game. Uh we
play it. Uh uh we playthat for the creator, you know,
and that's that's a game. Yes, yeah, that's the root of it
all, is the medicine game playingfor the entertainment of the creator. And
you were fortunate enough to be ableto coach your sons, you know.
(29:48):
So you you have grandchildren coming,right, Yeah. I have one grandson.
He's just turned six and uh he'sstarting playing lacrosse and uh he loves
it. He's enjoying it. Sofor me, that's like uh being born
again. So you're being drawn inagain. Oh yeah, yeah, I
just never let you go. Yeah, you don't want it to. Oh
(30:11):
that's right, you know you don'twant it to. Well what would you
like to close with talking about eitherghnawagi or lacrosse or the whole experience.
You know, Well, I gotinducted it into a Tara Lacrosse Hall of
Fame in uh uh in nineteen uhuh ninety six or something. Yeah,
(30:34):
and uh and that was quite anhonor to be involved in that. And
uh so, I mean I thoughtthat I played to be not that I
played lacrosse to be in the Hallof fame, but it was an honor
to be in there. And Ilook at all the names in Saint Catsine's
you look at the list of guyson there, and he's like, hey,
(30:56):
I played with all those guys.I played against all those guys,
you know, so I mean goodcompany. Yeah, and just think you
the way you started out as asenior was in the Montreal Forum. Yeah,
unbelievable. Oh yeah, many peoplewooden floor, wooden floor, Yes,
they had a wooden floor. Wow. Yeah, you know that that's
(31:18):
a treat. Just the plan,would you know, like out salmon bellies
out west and you know, anduh, I told you we had played
uh a series of field A crossgames in UH at Exmo nineteen sixty seven
and how have you here? InMontreal and uh it was an all star
(31:40):
game between UH guys from the Canadianside and team UH Natives from the American
side. So I got to playwith a lot of guys from I was
Austin and six Nations, you know, Paulis, and our coach was Ross
(32:02):
Pallis. He was her coach,you know. And so when I got
on the team too ready to go, and or Ross Pallis came to me,
he says, Joe, and heremembers me. He remember Joe,
he says, Joe. I says, surprised me, says Joe. He
says, uh, one job foryou, he says. This is what
(32:22):
he says. Their best player areon that team. His name is uh
Um Oliver Hill, Oliver Hill,I says. And your job is to
watch him, I says, Andyou watch him wherever he goes. You're
gonna be playing in this. Ifhe starts to go to the bathroom and
take a ship, he says,you go take it with him. But
(32:46):
but the thing was that no shadowy, Yeah, it was Ross Pallis,
and that he remembered me. SoI was honored that he would remember me.
But that's I think there is becauseI played A Yancy's Sons several years
and he was he was so hesaw because my job was always to watch
(33:07):
uh, gaylord, gaylord, youknow. So I guess he liked the
job I did. So, sothat was an honor to be to be
pointed out and saying, I wantyou to do this. Very nice,
very nice. You know, whatdo you think of? You know,
the opportunities for the game, aswe there is some good quality across played
(33:30):
not only in Canada and the US, but also in Europe, you know,
England and Australia, you know,and surprising now big it is.
And in those areas you know,you know, there's seventy two countries playing
now. Yeah. Unbelievable, unbelievable, you know. Yeah, it's great
to have you here and now yourstory. Hopefully people will be reading these
(33:53):
like fifty years from now, youknow, closing too, you know,
like when I my speech to theat the Tara Lacrosse Hall of Fame,
I spoke about the past, thepresident and now you know, and one
of the things I ended off withwas the I got into the Hall of
(34:15):
Fame, not because I was alwaysthe best player or anything like that,
is because I had the privilege andhonor to play with some great players.
And you don't become you don't comeinto this Hall of Fame simply because you're
of anything. It's because there's somegreat people who play this game and there's
(34:39):
a great future in it and U. And one of the things was I
in closing, I said, Ithanked all the people that because I am
a traditionalist, I says, oneof the things that seemed important that when
we played a game is that wehonored a creator. Okay, And I
(34:59):
said tonight that night, that says, tonight, you've given me the honor
to have honored a creator for thisand you've also helped me being part of
it. So that's how I closedit. So thank you, you know me
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