July 20, 2025 • 51 mins
#Broncos #DenverBroncos #TrainingCamp
Training Camp is here, and all eyes are on the Denver Broncos' offense. In this episode of Let’s Talk Broncos, we break down every key offensive position and player heading into Broncos Camp. Which player has the most to prove at training camp? What are the offense's biggest lingering concerns? We preview the quarterbacks, running backs, wide receivers, tight ends, offensive line, and the biggest battles to watch this summer at Broncos camp. 👇 Comment below with who YOU think will shine in camp!
Training Camp is here, and all eyes are on the Denver Broncos' offense. In this episode of Let’s Talk Broncos, we break down every key offensive position and player heading into Broncos Camp. Which player has the most to prove at training camp? What are the offense's biggest lingering concerns? We preview the quarterbacks, running backs, wide receivers, tight ends, offensive line, and the biggest battles to watch this summer at Broncos camp. 👇 Comment below with who YOU think will shine in camp!
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:18):
Welcome. Let's Talk Broncos preemasons Zach Seegers, Joey Richards is off.
I don't know what he's doing today, but that's all right.
You got the two of us here on an episode
of Let's Talk to Broncos. Excited to be back to
talk about last week. You may remember we talked about
the defense and with a training camp preview, what to
expect as we approach Man the Faded Days Tomorrow, training
(00:42):
camp week officially starts. I know Zach and I will
be out there intermittently when we are able to do so.
Hopefully we'll see some of you out there today. We're
going to be covering the offense, you know, gonna level
it out, make sure that we have balanced coverage there.
But first and foremost, I want to open it up
to Zach. Zach, how are you.
Speaker 2 (01:01):
I'm doing well, doing well. I have my dad in
town right now, so it's been nice visiting with him.
I might be the Rockies good luck charm. We went
to the game yesterday and they had one of their
best offensive games of the season. Scored ten runs, got
fifteen hits one to zero, which I mean compared to
what they are when I'm not there is remarkable, So
(01:22):
maybe I can be what turns the Rockies around. I
think giving me pre season tickets it would frankly be
a better use of resources than that Chris Bryant contract.
Speaker 3 (01:33):
So you know, sign me up.
Speaker 1 (01:35):
I think that's what they're going to have to do
in order to keep that streak alive. Although I think
even if they won every game to close out this season,
they'd still be out of any sort of playoff picture.
Is that right, Zach? Are you following?
Speaker 3 (01:49):
They're not mathematically eliminated yet. They could take a break.
Speaker 2 (01:55):
They're zero to two right now, or on a two
game Sorry, they're on a two game win streak right now. Now,
maybe they're getting hot at the right time and they're
going to climb back into it from thirty games out.
Speaker 1 (02:07):
I'm not trying to put you on the spot here, Zach,
but you are part of the problem by continuing to
show up to this franchise and cheer on their baseball team.
Speaker 3 (02:17):
Okay, here's my thing. Yes, but I just I think
they're screwed. I don't know what.
Speaker 2 (02:27):
Well, I'm not gonna me alone. I'm not going to
change it. I'm actually here's my counter, Bree, I do
I do have a counter. I was grasping at straws
there for a second. I found my footing to shout
out to my employer, KOA official home of the Rockies.
Got my tickets through work free, so I'm not supporting
(02:48):
them financially at all. I just, you know, already had
the hookup. So how about that, Brie.
Speaker 1 (02:54):
It was a work event. Shout out to the Home
of the Rockies KOA, also zach employer. So we'll keep
it a little bit straight in here, Sniper sag get
Intian guys. Zach got some facial hair growing, Zach. I
want to know, is there a holdout in which you
are waiting to trim it down, shave it down, or
are you trying to find the length in which you
(03:16):
really like where it's at.
Speaker 2 (03:19):
Yeah, to be honest, they're the holdout right now. Is
so I've got all the equipment, like the clippers and everything.
I just I don't know what I'm doing, and I'm like, man,
this could go horribly wrong whenever I do do it,
and I'm just kind of I've been procrastinating it for
that reason, but eventually I I today was the plan
(03:42):
today it's not happening. It might happen tomorrow. I think
we're going to get to it here pretty soon.
Speaker 1 (03:47):
Now I think we're going to do it live. We're
doing it live on the podcast.
Speaker 3 (03:51):
So it's definitely going wrong. I try and do it live.
I try and farm it for content.
Speaker 1 (03:58):
Yeah, I think we should. If you're watching over on Twitter,
now's your time. Jump on over to the YouTube chat
search Let's Talk Broncos, or you can find the link
in the description below. I want you to egg zach
on so that we can live stream this facial hair
trimming because I think it would be the benefit of
all of Broncos Country and specifically myself, So that's why
(04:19):
I'm actually pushing for it right now. But also, while
you're there and you want to comment on the show,
let us know what you're excited for as training camp approaches,
whether it's on the offense or the defense. Like I
said to start the show, we're going to talk about
the offense today. We already did the defense. If you
missed it, go on back on the channel and find
that episode because it was a lot of fun and
(04:41):
the trio was back together, so that's always a good time.
All right, Zach. First, before we jump into it, I
want to talk a little bit about rookie contracts because
not only is doad A Baron's done, RJ. Harvey inked
his deal as well. I know there was a little
bit of a holdout just specifically with contra negotiations, as
there is, but I think there was just a little
(05:03):
bit of trepidation with all of Bronco's country because you
don't like it when all of you guys aren't signed
prior to the off season workouts happening. So anything you
want to clear up on that end as it comes
to rookie deals, feel in a certain way about them
getting done.
Speaker 2 (05:17):
I'm glad they got done. I credit Broncos ownership. They
were one of the first, you know, seven or eight
teams to get it done. And really the resolution here
was they didn't get fully guaranteed deals, but it was
just a matter of stepping up the guarantees. This is
such a minor financial risk. Really, we're talking about very
(05:38):
very small contracts and the nature of a.
Speaker 3 (05:41):
Second round pick.
Speaker 2 (05:42):
A second round pick has to be pretty bad to
not live out that rookie deal on the team you know,
or has like terrible off field issues, and even then
they're probably getting two three years on the team. You're
it's such a minor risk, and if you felt good
enough to draft this guy in the top sixty four picks,
(06:03):
you should feel comfortable guaranteeing a large portion of that
rookie deal. Bronco's ownership and the front office ponied up there.
I think it was very good they did so, and
as a result, R. J. Harvey didn't miss any practice time,
which I think is sneaky, sneakily very important. There's so
often these rookie weapons, whether it be running back, wide receiver, whatever,
(06:26):
are injured to start training camp or have some hold
up of some sort, miss the first week or the
first handful of practices, and they missed that basic insult
and they struggle to catch up the rest of the season.
I think Roman Wilson is a great example of this.
He was a third round pick by the Steelers last year.
Everyone anticipated he'd be starting one of their starting receivers,
(06:47):
be a big part of the offense. He barely got
any run at all, and he said it kind of
it was largely because he was injured early on in
training camp. He felt like the offense kind of left
the station without him, and I think Arthur Smith has
said as much as well. So I getting this resolved
ahead of camp, making sure Argie Harvey can just hit
(07:09):
the ground running, especially at this really important position of
need for the Broncos I think is huge.
Speaker 1 (07:15):
Yeah, exactly is you said a position of need the
Broncos need to run the ball. I'm like Jason's comment
here because as we were speaking of contract talks, we're
also hearing you know, looks like talks are happening with
Benito and the Broncos too. Benito was saying that the
edge market is really playing in his favor here, and
(07:37):
I don't think that he's wrong. He's got a lot
of negotiating factors as it comes into this season. I
know there's been kind of a back and forth with
all of the Broncos country as to whether or not
he deserves to get paid for the production that he
had last season and what could be his production in
twenty twenty five. Zach, where are you at with the
Benito contract negotiations? I guess where do you see that falling?
(08:01):
Do you think the edge market is helping his negotiating
tactics here? As we head into the season, I.
Speaker 2 (08:06):
Think it definitely is because I think we might see
another meaningful leap up Miles Scartt's amazing, but TJ. Watt
was kind of tapering off last year, and for him
to get that forty point one number, I feel like
Micah Parson's agent can come to the Cowboys now and ask.
Speaker 3 (08:22):
For forty two, asks for forty three. We also know.
Speaker 2 (08:24):
He's not gonna leave the Cowboys, and Jerry Jones has
just handled these situations really poorly consistently. If I was Micap,
I would be chilling. I would not be worried about
rushing to a deal, you know, maybe even playing this
year out come back next year and instead of forty
one or forty two, getting forty five or more. But
the Garrett and the TJ. Watt giant leap at the
(08:47):
top of the market is definitely helping THENDO out. And
if you're going to keep a guy around, which Benito's
good enough, I bet he's a Bronco long term, it's
almost always better to get the deal done early. If
he has another ten SAX season, like just you know,
production kind of comes back to the pack sun. But
he has a ten sax season, which with how good
(09:09):
this secondary is, with how good vance Joseph is at
getting him an advantageous one on one situations, I think
he should be productive again. If that happens, you're looking
at thirty to thirty five million dollars because he produced
at that level last year. Right now, the discount is, well,
we haven't seen it on early downs or rundowns. We've
only seen it for one year. That's deflating his market
(09:31):
to that twenty twenty five number that's been talked about
right now. I think if you sign him there, it
winds up looking like a great deal. If you wait
and he has another great season, you're going to be
on the hook for a thirty to thirty five million
dollar contract. And I think people only see the risk
the one way, where it's well, what if we sign
(09:51):
Nick Benito and he's bad and then, oh my god,
you've wasted fifteen million dollars. Well what if you don't
sign Nick Benito he's good again, which does seem like
the more likely outcome based on his current career trajectory,
And then you're wasting fifteen million dollars that way, because
it's contracts shot up like crazy.
Speaker 3 (10:08):
So yeah, I hope they get it done.
Speaker 2 (10:12):
The fact, it sounds like they're negotiating right now, Benito
said as much as a summer football camp. Hopefully they
get it done. I think it would benefit all parties.
Benito would get his money up front and the Broncos
would kind of get him on what I think ultimately
will be a cheap deal.
Speaker 1 (10:29):
Yeah, and I could see where they're also in the
prime position, not only with where Benito is in his
age and career, just playing wise right, you're going to
get the most run for your buck in that moment.
And then also you're looking at a window for the
Denver Broncos where they're everything that they've shored up on
the offensive line, on the defense, everything that they're building
(10:50):
around b NICKX and Bonick's heading into some very key
seasons for development. I think it's really important that they
do lock up those pieces. There's obviously some others that
are the wings. But when you talk about solidifying your defense,
that tells me that they're on the competitive streak. So
they are primed and ready to really make a run
(11:12):
for it. And what a run for it means is
playoff contention. You know, I'm not going to throw the
word super Bowl out there, but if they want to
continue to win games and take advantage of what they
found in bo Nix and the rest of their offense
as it continues to find it spark, I think it's
really important that they make the move now and not
wait until later. Like I don't like the idea that
(11:32):
it's not going to be an appreciable decrease in production
if you were to try to go find somebody else
or focus on that position and the draft. The Broncos
are always teetering on the edge of whether or not
they have competition or competitiveness at that edge position because
we were just talking about a year ago of it
being a need for them. So I don't think this
(11:52):
is really a conversation of letting Nick Benito walk necessarily.
I don't like it when the negotiations stretch out so
far because the Broncos are not needing to pinch pennies
at this moment, but they, you know, they're still reeling
a little bit with some contract deals that they've made
in the past. I don't want to jump into it.
I don't want to name any names, but Sniper says
I like Nick Benito, but I'd rather wait to potentially
(12:14):
pay him either later on this upcoming season or after
twenty twenty five. Jason Neale doesn't think that Sniper's wrong
there would like to see another consistent season. I hear you, guys,
I understand the plight and why you would want to
do that. Zach.
Speaker 3 (12:31):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (12:31):
And I hear them on the Zach Allen point too.
You know, I think Zach Allen should be the priority.
Speaker 3 (12:36):
I think he's the.
Speaker 2 (12:37):
More proven, like elite player up front for this team.
I think they should get both done. But one thing
I would say to ease the concerns about a Benito
contract is look at what happened with a Patrick Cirtan
contract extension or a Quinn Minors contract extension. Those are deals,
both of them. Like Patrick's Artan, people thought he was
going to reset the market. He only took like a
(12:58):
slight step up. Quinn Miners was like signed at the
middle of a quickly exploding guard market rather than at
the top, which all those contemporaries were. The Russell Wilson
thing was terrible, and you know, we haven't expunged that entirely.
But this front office has been on a crazy hot
(13:19):
streak with their contracts and even like the moment they're signed,
it's like, WHOA, this is at a low annual number
and the Broncos are well protected. They're even well protected
in the Patrick's or Tan deal, like they could get
out of that in two seasons, which is nuts, Like
I don't think we anticipate them needing or even wanting
to get out of it.
Speaker 3 (13:39):
But same thing with Quinn Miners. And if they could.
Speaker 2 (13:41):
Build in those like emergency escape patches on the Certan
deal and the Quinn Miners deal, you can bet they
can negotiate those into the Benito deal in my opinion,
So I just I'm not too worried about like some
deal going bust because I think they've demonstrated and they
have a enough culture with the players, kind of like
(14:02):
the Eagles. The Eagles consistently get their guys on favorable
numbers because there's a mutual understanding that hey, if you
perform on this, we're going to reup you up again
at a higher number, and like everyone takes care of everyone.
Speaker 1 (14:16):
Yeah, I hear you. Great conversation, guys. I want to
move on just a little bit too. An interesting idea
of whether or not there could be a reunion. Sounds
like Noah Fant was released by Seattle. I have to
throw it out there. I have to ask, right, Broncos
have been hurting for that position, but it didn't necessarily
work out here, whether or not it was categorically personality wise,
(14:40):
I liked Noah Fans. I think that it was unfortunate
that it didn't work out. You always want to see
draft picks kind of flourish there. But do you think
that there would be any interest in a reunion on
either side, Zach?
Speaker 2 (14:53):
I feel like, ultimately no, there probably won't be much
interest on either side, but I feel like there should be,
you know, I you know, no a fan's familiar with
the area, it might be a little easier for him
to find his footing. And then for the Broncos, I
just you have this big void after Evan Ingram at
tight end. I think all the options are pretty subpar,
(15:15):
and Evan Ingram's not even like a true inline tight end.
No offense are receiving first guy too, but he can
be an inline guy in a way that Evan Ingram
can't really so and he'll line up there, but it
just doesn't work He's a much smaller body. No a
fan can hold up there, I think better than Ingram can,
(15:38):
so it would give you a little more versatility. He's
not the most exciting option, but I think the Broncos
could get him for pretty cheap and he'd immediately upgrade
the veteran presence in that room.
Speaker 1 (15:48):
Sure, and it looks like Seattle had to move off
of him simply for financial constraints anyways, but I think
that you're hitting on the very important point that the
Broncos depth at tight end starts to become fairly steep.
I do think that it is a little bit of
a concern. We'll wave a little well yellow flag here
(16:10):
if we think that the Broncos are content with where
the tide end group is moving into twenty twenty five.
I think time will tell whether or not. There seems
to be a lot of chemistry there, but I think
it should. It should be interesting to see what they do.
I wish there was just a little bit more patting,
but I think you always feel that way, especially when
a position has been at such high need. I think
(16:31):
that's even the same when you look at linebacker and
bringing in a Drake Green Law. You worry about injuries
and what could strike there, but you also worry if
that move is enough to really heighten that room. And
I think that's where I'm concerned with the Evan Ingram move.
Isn't enough to raise all of the ships with that tide, hopefully,
but time will tell. And I think it's a combination too,
(16:51):
because you're looking at your targets, and you're looking at
what BO is going to favor as they move through,
and what Sean Payton's idea is for extending drives, and
I think all that's going to come together, whether or
not it's enough, kind of leads me thinking that if
they can get a cheap bargain there, it would be interesting.
But I definitely think that there's some other options out
there as well. Injuries happen. I know Sniper mentioned earlier
(17:16):
that's kind of this thing that he's watching out for
training camp. Happens in football is a collision sports, so
injuries can happen at any time. Fingers crossed that everybody's
good to go at the start of the season, but
hoping that it all works itself out there, and maybe
there's a fan ringing. I don't think so. I think
that there's kind of outside of the nostalgia factor of
it all, I don't see that there's a big spot
(17:38):
for him in general. It didn't go too well for
him in his career here, didn't catch on as quickly
as you had wanted to. And I think that now
that he's entering the prime of his career, he'll he'd
be better suited moving on to a different team, all right, Zach,
So got fan out of the way. We had a
little bit of a conversation there as it came to
(17:58):
rookie contract. Do you everybody in the chat if you
want to let me know what you're excited for as
training camp approaches. We're going to work on the offense
today and I'm going to start off with maybe a
positional battle that you're most excited for. Zach, who do
you think on the offense we're going to be keeping
feelers out on as we approach this upcoming week.
Speaker 3 (18:20):
Man, I I'll the biggest one. I think the one we.
Speaker 2 (18:24):
Have to talk about first is running back. I think
that that is the mediest one. It's great we're not
having to talk quarterback. I think that's fantastic, But running back,
the other backfield position feels unsettled to me, I mean
goes without saying JK.
Speaker 3 (18:42):
Dobbins, R. J. Harvey.
Speaker 2 (18:43):
I'm curious how that works out. But really the whole
room is a battle. I think you've got the clear
top two guys with JK. Dobbins and RJ.
Speaker 3 (18:52):
Harvey.
Speaker 2 (18:52):
They're going to be battling for you know, and both
are going to see work this year. But what is
that split?
Speaker 3 (18:57):
Like is RJ.
Speaker 2 (18:58):
Harvey seeing seventy percent of the world or you know,
like forty percent of the work. Alvin Kamara, as great
as he was, didn't get the most touches in that
Saints backfield. Now, his complimentary option was mark Ingram, Who's
a better player than either.
Speaker 3 (19:13):
Of these guys.
Speaker 2 (19:13):
But you know, I'm just curious to see how that
ends up breaking down. I think it's huge for the
offense in general. That was the missing component from this
offense being like above average to maybe being a great
unit last year was Boonix needed a little more seasoning.
He's got that now. And then I think you've got
a running back group that was so low wattage last year,
(19:36):
and if they can just get to like average, the
offensive line is opening up amazing looks for the running
backs to take advantage of. And if these backs can
take advantage of it, it'll be game changing. So how
they jockey for position at the top of the room's interesting.
But even beyond that, is this team going to keep
four running backs and a fullback with Michael Burton and
(19:58):
like a weird hybrid piece with Nate Adkins. I kind
of don't think so. I think it might only be three.
So McLoughlin and Estimate are probably battling for a roster spot,
and then Blake Watson and Tyler Bidet are on the
periphery of that picture. They're also battling for a practice
squad spot, because if Estimate doesn't make the roster, he
might be on the practice squad. I just think from
(20:19):
top to bottom, this room is in flux, a total battleground. Estimate,
by the way, he could end up being the starter. Like,
that's not the most surprising outcome. So it's just it's
a battle royale and I can't wait to watch it.
Speaker 1 (20:34):
Wow, that's crazy. Victory lap is coming in and say an
estimate is gone. There is a confidence factor of zero
coming out of victory lap. There in the let stock
Broncos Chat. If you want to get in on this conversation,
jump on over Let's talk Broncos description. If you're watching
it on Twitter, you can click on the link over
there and come hang out with us while we talk
about the offense. And Zamak has said that the running
(20:55):
back group is what he's going to be looking at
as far as training camp battles go. It's an interest
concept because I'm going to put on Joey's hat right now.
I don't have a baseball cap in my realm. But
let's talk a little bit about the speedster factor that
you're going to be seeing out of training camp, and
the running backs get to show that full throttle, but
they're not wearing pads, and a lot can be left
to the imagination when that happens. So I think technically
(21:18):
you're going to see some of the guys who are
a little bit speedier, like a Julia McLoughlin, really show
out early in camp, and we just see that traditionally,
So I want to throw that out into the ring
and say how much of that is going to play
into the idea that he is competing for a larger
spot here. What I like about the Broncos running back
room is because it was such a position of need
(21:38):
last season. As we go into twenty twenty five, now
it's kind of open core. It's open session. Anybody can
come in with a rookie like RJ. Harvey with oudro
guest and may still needed needing to prove himself. And
you already talked about who may be on the bubble there, Zach.
But the idea is, is Burton going to have a
bigger role here? If you know are out to adjustment.
(22:00):
Friends over there, Mario U Tansey and Patrick Keyote, they
tell you, yes, Michael Burton is going to have a better,
bigger picture here in Sean Payton's offense. But the biggest
contributing factor to me feels like it's going to be JK. Dobbins.
Not only does he have a ton to prove for
the rest of his career as he gets this kind
of prove it chance with the Denver Broncos, but he
(22:23):
still has to carve a name for himself. And what
this running back picture is going to be personally, how
I think it's going to work is a lot like
a committee approach, which I know everyone who loves a
good Belkow is going to be disappointed. That's not what
we're going to be anticipating here, at least not yet. Now,
a hot hand can change everything, But you lose the
Javonte Williams, you bring in an RJ. Harvey, who is
(22:46):
a really intriguing addition because it blends all of these styles.
But you've got this explosive, bursty running back from UCF
and I think he's going to be a natural fit
in Sean Payton's offense. So I think that he's got
a lot to prove, so is JK. Dobbins, and I
could see them going neck to neck to really prove positive.
And who's going to have the largest amount of carries
(23:07):
this season? I don't think it's going to be a
carry heavy season for any of the running backs. I
think you're still trying to find out who has that
ability to do that. And I just don't have a
whole lot of faith in the Broncos figuring the run
game out overnight by flushing out their group and reintegrating
new members into that system.
Speaker 3 (23:24):
What do you say to that, Zach, I think you're right.
Speaker 2 (23:27):
I think this is still a transitional year and a
work in progress. I think the rushing production will be
fairly even at least between Harvey and Dobbins, And then
you know McLaughlin could get into the picture, their estimate
could get into the picture. There you know Watson the
day maybe as sleepers to be that third guy as well.
So I fully agree on that front. That said, I
(23:49):
think from like a raw production like overall production perspective.
Speaker 3 (23:54):
I think RJ.
Speaker 2 (23:55):
Harvey is going to be a game changer on those
screens that we know Sean Payton loves to run, like
he's so good in the phone booth where like he's
such a creative runner, good vision to find those those
little scenes, enough contact balance to pay it off, and
he's really explosive and I you know, like McLoughlin's fast,
but he does not offer what r J. Harvey does
(24:16):
really outside of that, and I think r J. Harvey
is even different juice to your initial point, which is
a good one, like, yes, this is maybe the biggest battle,
but how much can we really pick up on it
from the training camp reps that are limiting contact And
it's totally true. I think there are some necessary points
we can pick up on this Broncos run game, though,
(24:36):
like Dobbins coming back from injury. Also down the stretch
last year, you know, it looked like he had a
lot less juice. Is that burst back after, you know,
a summer of rest. I think that'll be interesting to
see r J. Harvey, how does that burst and like
overall speed compared to a guy like Julia McLoughlin, who
we already know is a jitter bug and then estimate.
(25:01):
I think he was lacking and burst last season generally,
So I'd be curious to see, you know, does that
maybe look a little better this year now he's had
an NFL strength program for a whole season, So.
Speaker 3 (25:14):
I I don't. I'm excited for the r. J.
Speaker 2 (25:17):
Harvey element for sure, but I think you're right it's
going to be a very very much a committee situation.
Speaker 1 (25:23):
Well, I think that's the first time we've agreed on
something and I don't know three years. Perhaps I don't.
It's interesting, it's an interesting concept. I don't want to
make Zack out to be argumented. If I think I
am the ar he went ahead and threw himself under
the bus, that's fine, all right, Well, Zach, I hear you.
(25:46):
We already talked about the tight end position not really
being a battle there, and then you bringing on the
I think, just an on point conversation about the running backs,
but I think particularly the wide receiver as we see
I want to say, like a chart, like a pack hierarchy,
as we continue to see. I think too many of
(26:08):
us are assuming that Courtland Sutton is just that shoe
in number one, the guy that bo Nicks needs to
rely on in order to see success in the offense. Now,
do I think that it's ill fitted and ill fated
and assuming that, No, not necessarily, but I think that
there are some front runners that are getting glossed over
(26:30):
just by the fact that we haven't seen enough out
of them.
Speaker 2 (26:32):
Right.
Speaker 1 (26:33):
We know what Courtland Sutton is, we know what he
brings to the table, and that's why there's ongoing conversations
when it comes to what that next contract is going
to look like, or if there's going to be a
next contract, because honestly, at this point, anything can happen
as we're heading into the season. But I want to say,
it's a competitive and unpredictable group on this roster, and
I think that's a good thing. I think that if
you have too many sure things you're not quite sure
(26:56):
how draft picks and how you know second your guys
are going to play into these pictures. We still need
to figure out what Troy Franklin is going to be.
We need to see if Marvin Min's is going to
take an additional step this year. But you've got a
Devon Veley who I think turns a ton of heads
with his size and physicality and just having that overall
(27:18):
impact for the team. And then you've got the adverse
almost in a Troy Franklin where you've seen through his
scouting reports and then last season it just sort of
wasn't clicking. Yet that can change overnight in the NFL
now can hands not necessarily, But I think Troy Franklin
just needs a little more time under his belt to
really truly succeed. You already had the built in chemistry
(27:39):
with a Bonnix, So it'll be interesting to see to
me if there's a camp standout in that group who
was already presently on the roster. Because I'm not quite
sure that I have a whole lot of idea of
what Pat Bryant is going to bring to this team.
It's not about who's starting, so I don't want to
throw out the wide receiver one who's going to be
(27:59):
opposite them. I think it's who's going to earn the
trust in different packages, who's going to be on the
field in a crunch time position, Who's going to be
there when Sean Payton needs a guy in the red zone.
It can't be an Adam Troutman, Like those are the
days of the past, and I'm hoping that this current
wide receiver group is going to be the ones that
are going to take it to the next level, because
if they're not there, the offense lacks an extreme spark.
(28:20):
You can hide your deficiencies all you want, but if
your run game and your wide receivers are struggling, you're
not really functioning in an offense with an Adam Troutman
Evan Ingram and then throw out any other arbitrary tight
end names that you can't. So I think those two positions,
Zach or why they're the most competitive battles that we
need to watch because they play such a large emphasis
(28:41):
on what the offense is going to do and how
efficiently they're going to get it done.
Speaker 2 (28:46):
Yeah, I fully agree with the wide receiver pick. This
is another one where I think there's like battles all throughout.
You know, who is the guy opposite Courtland Sutton? We
know Sutton's the starting next, but who's the guy opposite
him on the other boundary?
Speaker 3 (29:00):
Is it Mims?
Speaker 2 (29:01):
Like I think that's the ideal plan. I think that's
kind of a huge skeleton key for the entire offense,
but he hasn't proven to be able to take that
role over. If that changes this year and we'll get
some glimpses of that at training camp, I think it
changes everything for the offense. I think it's one of
the biggest X factors for the Bronco season. But if
(29:22):
not him, is it Valay? Same thing in the slot,
like which one of those two is getting a lot
of slot? Looks how big of like presence is Evan
Ingram in that picture? Like what are they doing with
Troy Franklin, What are they doing with Pat Bryan? Because
you maybe think Pat Bryan, if he's that Michael Thomas guy,
you'd think he's the heir apparent maybe as that big slot.
(29:44):
What does that do to Vala or Marvin Mims who
are jostling for those same positions. And then even on
the back end both of Sean Payton's seasons here in Denver,
He's carried five receivers on at least the initial fifty
three roster. There's a pretty clear cut six that you'd
think would be rosterable, right with Sutton, Mims, Valet, those
(30:07):
guys are all probably pretty locked in his safe. Pat
Bryant probably not going to cut the third round rookie.
But then Troy Franklin and Trent Sherfield. They just signed Sherfield.
It's not the biggest deal. They could move on from it,
but you know that you don't typically sign free agents
or cut free agents, rather that you immediately just signed
(30:28):
it to a deal like the one Trent Sherfield did.
Maybe they finally carry six this year, but I think
that's even an interesting thing to like who winds up
being the odd man out or drawing the shortest straw. Yeah,
I'm very excited for this one, and like you said,
it's gonna have huge implications for how the Bronco season goes,
because Yeah, I just can't get over the Marvin Mims
(30:50):
of it all. If you can emerge, is that like
solid field stretching Z. It's like such a missing component
in this offense right now, Like if you can be
Sewan Peyton's next Brandon Cooks, it opens up, It clears
up the log jam in the slot. It just it
solves the lack of verticality or speed or juice that
(31:11):
can sometimes be in this offense with some of the bigger,
slower bodies are out there. It makes it so Marvin
Mims doesn't just have to be this, you know, a
backfield weapon where you're having to scheme up how he's
getting the ball. He can impact the game in a
more varied way. And I just that's the one I'm
(31:31):
really hung up. I hope Marvin Mims wins that battle
because it would be game changing for the Broncos offense.
Speaker 1 (31:37):
It's like you read my mind. I don't think we've
ever been this in sink Zach. So as you're talking
about Marvin Mims, it was between him and Vley with
the who I was the most excited to watch, simply
for that reason. You've got a large amount of questions
that still need answers, and I think it should be
that this year's the year that Marvin Mims makes the leap.
He showed flashes last season. He was used in a
(32:00):
way that really allowed him to show his speed and
his burst and his ability to stretch the field. But
now he needs to take that up a notch. Right,
So now you're bringing in tandem with a quarterback who
needs to do much of the same. And I think
with having that experience under his belt and in Sean
Payton's system, with a second year quarterback that is bo
Nix who has got a lot to prove here and
not only in Broncos Country, but in the league as
(32:22):
a whole. He's building real chemistry and I think they're
going to move around him. I hope that this is
the year that Sean Payton decides to take the pigs
that he has given and place them in the holes
that we have instead of trying to just hammer away
that square into a circle. Because I'm worried that if
you don't utilize what these individuals are good for, you're
(32:43):
going to end up kind of running them by the wayside.
And that's where I'm really excited about Marvin Mims looking
forward to how he looks in training camp. But I
also wanted to throw out Vley in there, and I
think that it's important to kind of show that both
of maybe aren't the flashiest names or guys in the room,
but they're the most intriguing to me, And I'd like
(33:06):
to see with Vley's physical presence, how he works consistently
outside of Sutton, showing strong hands continuously, and then if
he's able to fight for contested balls deep into the
end zone. I think you're just going to see someone
who is that powerhouse back or a wide receiver that
you've been looking for. So to me, MEM's and Vley
(33:26):
really intriguing options on who I'm excited to watch heading
into training camp. Zach, I want to keep rolling off
of that. As I talked about we talked about wide receivers.
Those guys stand out to me. Is there anybody else
on the offense that you're excited to watch as we
approach training camp?
Speaker 2 (33:40):
Mom in lockstep with you, I'm curious, can Filet make
a step or take a leap older players, especially at
those skill positions, you know the development curve. We don't
see guys take big leaps at twenty seven, twenty eight
or so on. But it being his second year in
the league, him being able to hit the ground running
(34:01):
hopefully this year instead of being hampered by injuries at
the front end. I wonder if he can take more
of a leap and sees more of a role in
this offseason.
Speaker 3 (34:08):
And I already explained my.
Speaker 2 (34:10):
Hype for Mims, but my choice for this question in
particular is going to be Evan Ingram. I just I
don't think it ends up. It's not going to be
as good as Jimmy Graham where it's like borderline all
pro level. I'm not expecting that. But hearing him talk,
it sounds like a big part of him coming to
Denver was Sean Payton kind of selling him on this
(34:30):
vision and knowing how like, hey, I know how to
get tight ends these numbers, and that is a large
part of his menu of concepts that he hasn't really
been able to tap into here in Denver yet with
Adam Trautman.
Speaker 3 (34:46):
And the like.
Speaker 2 (34:47):
And I'm just I'm really excited to see what that
looks like this season. Like Caleb Loaner to a lesser extent,
because I just think he's raw, It's going to take
a while before he can really contribute in a major way.
But like if Evan Ingram is top five in touchdowns
among tight ends this season, I wouldn't be surprised at all.
I think he could have one of the most productive
(35:09):
seasons of his career. I just I think it lines
up really nicely for him, not only because he can
be this great red zone threat like a Jimmy Graham
that I think Sean Payton knows how to utilize perfectly,
but also because he's got really great movement skills for
the tight end position. Sean Payton, you know, we loves
(35:31):
these screens, love getting loves getting these guys on the
move close to the line of scrimmage. I think that's
one of Bose's strengths too, is kind of those quick
hitter RPO deals where you can just deal the ball
out quick, let the guy get on the run and go.
And I think Evan Ingram aligns well with that skill
set too. He's also just a freak athlete, like not
the freakiest of all time or anything, but these kind
(35:53):
of tight end wide receiver hybrid guys are just kind
of crazy. But naturally, you know, there's six five guys
who can run a four. It's just stuff you don't
see often. I'm excited to see what that looks like
in that environment. And because it's it's kind of contactless.
Him being a smaller tight end, that's not going to
show up so much. So I think he's gonna just
(36:14):
ball out in training camp and I'm excited to watch that.
Speaker 1 (36:17):
Okay, yeah, you got me there. Although wouldn't you be
shocked if Caleb Loher was the standout, you know, he
like he was just the dominating tight end from day one,
because that would be kind of the futility of the
prospecting game to go ahead and grab a player like
that where you got him with without a whole lot
of expectation for the individual, but knowing that he can ball,
(36:40):
Like simply put, you grabbed him because he is an athlete,
and I think that the end of day that could
be the hidden gem that you have towards your team.
So I just wanted to highlight that that, like, watch
us all be crazy and that be the standout there,
not only from training camp, but those preseason reps are
going to tell us a lot. So I'm excited about that.
But you're right on the nose there with Evan Ingram, like,
(37:03):
I'm excited about it too. I think it's one of
those ones where you're bringing something to the offense that's
been missing for a while, and that's just a mismatch.
And Sean Payton loves versatility. This is a guy that's
really going to get him done in the wide receiver speed.
You've got the build for a tight end, even though
it's not traditionally as big as you would want, but
(37:24):
having the ability to create the constant matchup problems for
opposing defenses, and bo Nix is going to have a
reliable and athletic outlet where you're just going to keep
the chains moving. And I think it's really important just
to highlight how like we wanted the weaponry, but I
think too often we associate that with deep balls, you know,
(37:44):
like a pretty moon ball is going to outweigh the
idea that, no, if we're not getting kicked off the
field on third down, I think there's a bigger emphasis
of success in the offense when you're able to stretch
the field, rule time of possession, and ultimately score more points.
There's many phases of this game, so I am right
in step with you, honestly, Zach. I don't think we've
(38:05):
ever been in the same sentence, let alone the same
page before, and I think we're just singing the tune
of our people today. So this is exciting, This is
a good show. I think we should fight about something.
I feel like I have to manufacture an argument at
this point.
Speaker 3 (38:21):
A good reflection on your character.
Speaker 2 (38:22):
I'll actually agree with you one more time here really
quick with Caleb Loher. I'm really excited for that one.
And I feel like there will be limitations on him
just because he is so new to football, but I
think he could be a really relatively speaking productive red
zone weapon even as a rookie, because like they drafted
(38:44):
an athlete and they took that gamble on this really
experienced football player. Because I mean there are times, and
I know we've hyped this up on the show before,
but like his touchdown against Colorado, He's going up against
a cornerback prospect that's going to go on the first
two days of the draft next year and dunked on it.
Like was uncoverable on the play because his size, strength, speed,
(39:08):
It's just it's you don't see it often. And Sean Payton,
I think one thing he does very well is like
understanding the limitations of his players and just not asking
them to do what they're not good at, like Marvin
Mimms last year kind of struggled to get him on
the field early, but once he figured out that role
of like, Okay, this is how we can make you useful,
(39:28):
Marvin Mims was like one of the most productive, the
most useful players on the offense. Bo Nicks struggled out
of the gate last year, but once Sean Payton figured out, like, oh, okay,
this is what maybe you need some more time to
figure out as a rookie quarterback needs, and this is
maybe where you're more comfortable the stuff we can lean
into more. Take some of this stuff off your plate,
make it a little simpler for you. We saw bo
(39:50):
catch fire down the stretch and then he was able
to put a little bit more back on the plate
where I think he's going to be able to find
some sort of you know, sim plistic red zone role,
even if it's just like, dude, learn how to run
a fade route, Like that's all we need to learn
how to run a fade route. Get on the jugs machine,
and we're going to do that, like, you know, ten
(40:10):
times this season and you'll catch like two or three touchdowns.
I really can envision that role because he is just
again like Evan Ingram's kind of freaky, Caleb Blowner's freaky freaky.
Speaker 1 (40:23):
I think that's a good way to put it. I
was looking for the mute button, so I didn't pull
a Sears last episode, if you want to go ahead
and rewatch that. Although it was a defense heavy episode,
we did talk about concerns and I had to bring
up the center position. So I don't want to cross
contaminate the conversations here. But Zach, while I have you
and we're talking about the offense, is there anything lingering
for you as we approach training camp and the idea
(40:46):
that maybe there's some positions or conversations, narrative, storylines, contracts
that you are concerned about. Because I feel like we've
been ultimately too positive tonight.
Speaker 2 (40:57):
There are some things I'm concerned about, and I've kind
of alluded to. The big one for me is the
what's happened? Like how did these pieces fit together? I think,
like in a vacuum, they're all very exciting, but outside
of Courtland Sutton, I have a lot of questions about
how it all comes together. Like Evan Ingram we mentioned earlier,
(41:20):
far and away the best tight end in the room
but do you want him like playing that many inline snaps.
I don't really know. I think kind of you don't
want that. I think to my Jimmy Graham point. Jimmy Graham,
when he got franchise attacked, tried to argue he was
a wide receiver because he was lining up more as
a wide receiver than as a tight end.
Speaker 3 (41:40):
I think it could be the same with Evan Ingram.
Speaker 2 (41:42):
So if he's lining up outwide, some lining up in
the slots, some like that's taken away snaps from Marvin
N's who we talked about how exciting it would be
if he can prove he can be the outside guy,
and it would be. But last year when he started
catching fire, it was because John Payton moved him into
the slot. So that kind of creates that or furthers
(42:05):
that slot log jam. Pat Bryant I brought up the
Michael Thomas thing before, and maybe him being the future
of big slot, that's probably where you want to put
him this year, especially when you have Courtland Sutton at
the X and that's Pat Bryant's other logical position. Okay,
so that's for another player in that log jam. Devon
Valet he got a lot of his work out of
(42:26):
the slot last year and was really really good as
that big slot. How does that work out? I really
don't know. I think it's going to be fascinating, which,
again curtling back to the Mims thing, him taking that
leap or not is so huge because if he locks
down that Z spot, it just I feel like unconstipates
(42:47):
that whole situation because it is it is a real
logjam right now. And you know, I think it'll still
be Okay, You've got some nice pieces and you can turn.
You can create a decent to maybe good and to
maybe even very good offense out of this. But I
am concerned if they can figure out how it all
(43:10):
comes together, because I do think there are not redundant
skill sets.
Speaker 3 (43:14):
So much is like.
Speaker 2 (43:17):
You've got a bunch of different like specialty tools for
the slot right now, and like can any of them
expand beyond that, or like how do you how do
you get them to sing in symphony working concert?
Speaker 3 (43:30):
And I'm I'm we'll see.
Speaker 2 (43:32):
That's that's one area of concern I have right now
that I could see kind of hamstringing this offense.
Speaker 1 (43:38):
Okay, that's fair. I think there's a broader level concern
of consistency and identity. This team was operating under a
notion that they were young and hungry. Well as your
team ages and as your team you know, achieve success
or has to continuously achieve success. I think that there
(43:59):
needs to be some level of not I guess rolling
down the hill with the snowball, like if you have
a slow start and you have mental lapses and you
have turnovers, which have haunted the Broncos on many occasions
in the past. I don't know, let's say ten seasons.
That's where leadership and coaching and team identity and veteran leadership,
(44:24):
all of that has to come together. So I'm in
total agreement with the pieces being there, but how do
they come together and how do they really are they cohesive?
Do they tell a story? But I also want to
highlight that I have a little bit of a concern
when it comes to depth along the line. Right, Sean
Payton and George Payton have spent a ton of money
and resources to bolster that offensive line, and it's an
(44:47):
expensive starting line. But you lose a couple of pieces
there in the realm of depth, and you're going to
be hurting for what inevitably happens at some point in
the season, which is injuries. The bug comes around for everybody.
And although the line has been you know, pretty healthy,
(45:09):
I think there's still a concern, especially if you know
there's a question at center if that position were to
go down. But ultimately, who is your reliable backups there?
Whether it's at tackler guard that you have met Pert
Frank Crumb, there's a couple of additions there will Sherman
nt Garjulo. You have to start asking the question of who, though,
(45:31):
is the reliable one that you're going to be able
to plug and play when the Broncos are on a
four game win streak and you don't want to go
down to a t who's going to have playoff implications
later on? So to me, there's just kind of that
anxiety mindset of that's not really sure. To me, I
think that there's plenty of journeymen that the Broncos have
(45:52):
picked up a year after a year have been able
to play that piece. Quinn Bailey was that for them
for you know, a few seasons there, and I don't
think that's going to be an availability heading into this season.
So who's going to be the guy who steps up.
But I think that's where the question goes. Sniper is
on pace with me here and says, as far as
the O line goes, I do think that if the
(46:12):
Broncos let Luke Wattenberg walk after the season, the Broncos
will address that position in the twenty twenty sixth draft.
Zach Center next year, question.
Speaker 2 (46:21):
Mark, I think it's possible, you know, definitely somewhere early.
I think Sean Payton has cared about the trenches. It
valued the trenches everywhere he's gone. He even drafted a
center in the first round with Caesar Ruiz, who hasn't
panned out great, but just rare in general to draft
those guys in the first round, so it stands out
that he's done it in the past. I don't know
(46:42):
the center prospects looking ahead, admittedly, so I don't know
if there's anybody who'd get serious first round conversation, but
I bet they will invest in it. I don't think
Forsyth has turned out, but I love your call out here.
Bria was on my short list of options because I'm
kind of concerned about it too. This offensive line, and
it has been amazing for the Broncos these past couple
(47:03):
of seasons. They've also been very, very healthy, like each
of these past two years.
Speaker 3 (47:08):
Among the healthiest lines in the league.
Speaker 2 (47:10):
And yes, Sean Payton's done a good job with managering
the managing the injuries since she's since he's come in.
But injuries are also like largely a luck thing, and
that luck could flip at any point. It doesn't mean
that they're likely to have bad luck because they had
good luck the last two seasons, But you know, will
they have good luck again, I don't know.
Speaker 3 (47:30):
We just don't know.
Speaker 2 (47:32):
They haven't had to lean very hard on Matt Parrott
or Powchwski or Alex Forsyth or Nick Garjulo in the past,
you know, in the little flashes here there, I think
those guys have looked promising when they they've had to
be called up, if you know, they've had to be
called up. But we haven't seen it in long since.
(47:52):
We haven't seen the Broncos suffer like a wave of
injuries on the line, And I think, you know, that's
very if they do get worse luck this year, because
bo Nix, I think the biggest hole in his game
last season was struggling under pressure. You know, his sack
rate was low. We're all aware of that. I'm not
(48:14):
talking about picking sacks. I'm talking about even though he
was avoiding sacks. He was near the bottom of the
league in EPA per dropback when pressured. And the fact
that he was so good at avoiding sacks and still
was that poor in terms of production says all you
need to know about what he was doing as a
passer or even as a scrambler in those moments. Overall,
(48:35):
what happens if he starts getting pressured a lot more
because there's a bunch of offensive line injuries. You know,
that's kind of scary to me. The run game. I
talked earlier about how you just need these running backs
to be averaged because the holes getting paved by the
offensive line. I don't know if that's true. If all
of a sudden you suffer a rash of injuries to
(48:57):
the offensive line, Now, all of a sudden, maybe you're
asking RJ. Harvey to be a true difference maker, like
a top ten back as a rookie to support that
run game, and that probably doesn't go so well. So
the depth up front is something I'm very curious to
monitor throughout training camp as well.
Speaker 1 (49:18):
Great, I give him myself a case to the Sunday
Scaries unintentionally. On that note, I think i'll a little
touch on something a little bit more fun. The mail
bag video that you've been highly anticipating. Bronco's Country is
coming out on Wednesday. I think there's still time to
leave your comments below, zach Am.
Speaker 2 (49:34):
I right, sorry, I was very slow getting over to
my mic feature. Yes, yes, it's not too late. I
want to apologize. I hyped this future up last week
and when I went to upload it the Bronco it
was largely focused on the Ja Da Bear and RJ
(49:54):
Harvey contract negotiations, and then those got solved right before
I was going to upload it, and I was like, well,
that's like sixty percent of the episode. So I canned it,
but I'm going to get back to it.
Speaker 3 (50:08):
This week.
Speaker 2 (50:08):
We will drop an episode that I won't show this time.
Speaker 3 (50:13):
Please, though, update the questions. Leave me some questions.
Speaker 2 (50:15):
Below and I will get to them on the show
one of these weeks.
Speaker 3 (50:20):
I definitely will.
Speaker 2 (50:21):
We're doing random questions every week and I think it
will be pretty fun. So circle back here on Wednesday,
or actually, we've got outitude adjustment pack now, so I'll
be uploading it the Thursday.
Speaker 3 (50:31):
Come back here Thursday.
Speaker 1 (50:33):
Oh yes, that's right. If you're new here, then you
don't know about altitude adjustment. Check them out on Tuesdays
at eight pm. I think I'm on the show tomorrow,
so you're welcome. Surprise surprise from Zach and I thank
you for tuning in lovely show. If you have questions
for us, you know how to get a hold of us.
(50:53):
You can leave comments down below, or you can go
on over to Twitter. Breemases threeho three Zach underscore seekers.
Is that still your handle?
Speaker 3 (51:05):
It is?
Speaker 2 (51:05):
I haven't changed. I'm an og You and Joey have
both been changing years. But I'm just I'm loyal to
the soil. Bre What can I say? You know?
Speaker 1 (51:12):
Breemaistice eight thousand and four, bunch of numbers. It just
didn't It didn't work, and so I figured it was
best to shorten that to three oh three. The other
breemaistis who's out there somewhere. I will find you, and
I will steal your Twitter account and I will deactivate
it so I can have my name back. All right,
I guess it's been a fun night. I'm gonna get
(51:35):
out of here and we will be back with you,
uh next week, So go Broncos and I'm trying to
find the button to get out of here. So'll break
fun if you all will
Welcome. Let's Talk Broncos preemasons Zach Seegers, Joey Richards is off.
I don't know what he's doing today, but that's all right.
You got the two of us here on an episode
of Let's Talk to Broncos. Excited to be back to
talk about last week. You may remember we talked about
the defense and with a training camp preview, what to
expect as we approach Man the Faded Days Tomorrow, training
(00:42):
camp week officially starts. I know Zach and I will
be out there intermittently when we are able to do so.
Hopefully we'll see some of you out there today. We're
going to be covering the offense, you know, gonna level
it out, make sure that we have balanced coverage there.
But first and foremost, I want to open it up
to Zach. Zach, how are you.
Speaker 2 (01:01):
I'm doing well, doing well. I have my dad in
town right now, so it's been nice visiting with him.
I might be the Rockies good luck charm. We went
to the game yesterday and they had one of their
best offensive games of the season. Scored ten runs, got
fifteen hits one to zero, which I mean compared to
what they are when I'm not there is remarkable, So
(01:22):
maybe I can be what turns the Rockies around. I
think giving me pre season tickets it would frankly be
a better use of resources than that Chris Bryant contract.
Speaker 3 (01:33):
So you know, sign me up.
Speaker 1 (01:35):
I think that's what they're going to have to do
in order to keep that streak alive. Although I think
even if they won every game to close out this season,
they'd still be out of any sort of playoff picture.
Is that right, Zach? Are you following?
Speaker 3 (01:49):
They're not mathematically eliminated yet. They could take a break.
Speaker 2 (01:55):
They're zero to two right now, or on a two
game Sorry, they're on a two game win streak right now. Now,
maybe they're getting hot at the right time and they're
going to climb back into it from thirty games out.
Speaker 1 (02:07):
I'm not trying to put you on the spot here, Zach,
but you are part of the problem by continuing to
show up to this franchise and cheer on their baseball team.
Speaker 3 (02:17):
Okay, here's my thing. Yes, but I just I think
they're screwed. I don't know what.
Speaker 2 (02:27):
Well, I'm not gonna me alone. I'm not going to
change it. I'm actually here's my counter, Bree, I do
I do have a counter. I was grasping at straws
there for a second. I found my footing to shout
out to my employer, KOA official home of the Rockies.
Got my tickets through work free, so I'm not supporting
(02:48):
them financially at all. I just, you know, already had
the hookup. So how about that, Brie.
Speaker 1 (02:54):
It was a work event. Shout out to the Home
of the Rockies KOA, also zach employer. So we'll keep
it a little bit straight in here, Sniper sag get
Intian guys. Zach got some facial hair growing, Zach. I
want to know, is there a holdout in which you
are waiting to trim it down, shave it down, or
are you trying to find the length in which you
(03:16):
really like where it's at.
Speaker 2 (03:19):
Yeah, to be honest, they're the holdout right now. Is
so I've got all the equipment, like the clippers and everything.
I just I don't know what I'm doing, and I'm like, man,
this could go horribly wrong whenever I do do it,
and I'm just kind of I've been procrastinating it for
that reason, but eventually I I today was the plan
(03:42):
today it's not happening. It might happen tomorrow. I think
we're going to get to it here pretty soon.
Speaker 1 (03:47):
Now I think we're going to do it live. We're
doing it live on the podcast.
Speaker 3 (03:51):
So it's definitely going wrong. I try and do it live.
I try and farm it for content.
Speaker 1 (03:58):
Yeah, I think we should. If you're watching over on Twitter,
now's your time. Jump on over to the YouTube chat
search Let's Talk Broncos, or you can find the link
in the description below. I want you to egg zach
on so that we can live stream this facial hair
trimming because I think it would be the benefit of
all of Broncos Country and specifically myself, So that's why
(04:19):
I'm actually pushing for it right now. But also, while
you're there and you want to comment on the show,
let us know what you're excited for as training camp approaches,
whether it's on the offense or the defense. Like I
said to start the show, we're going to talk about
the offense today. We already did the defense. If you
missed it, go on back on the channel and find
that episode because it was a lot of fun and
(04:41):
the trio was back together, so that's always a good time.
All right, Zach. First, before we jump into it, I
want to talk a little bit about rookie contracts because
not only is doad A Baron's done, RJ. Harvey inked
his deal as well. I know there was a little
bit of a holdout just specifically with contra negotiations, as
there is, but I think there was just a little
(05:03):
bit of trepidation with all of Bronco's country because you
don't like it when all of you guys aren't signed
prior to the off season workouts happening. So anything you
want to clear up on that end as it comes
to rookie deals, feel in a certain way about them
getting done.
Speaker 2 (05:17):
I'm glad they got done. I credit Broncos ownership. They
were one of the first, you know, seven or eight
teams to get it done. And really the resolution here
was they didn't get fully guaranteed deals, but it was
just a matter of stepping up the guarantees. This is
such a minor financial risk. Really, we're talking about very
(05:38):
very small contracts and the nature of a.
Speaker 3 (05:41):
Second round pick.
Speaker 2 (05:42):
A second round pick has to be pretty bad to
not live out that rookie deal on the team you know,
or has like terrible off field issues, and even then
they're probably getting two three years on the team. You're
it's such a minor risk, and if you felt good
enough to draft this guy in the top sixty four picks,
(06:03):
you should feel comfortable guaranteeing a large portion of that
rookie deal. Bronco's ownership and the front office ponied up there.
I think it was very good they did so, and
as a result, R. J. Harvey didn't miss any practice time,
which I think is sneaky, sneakily very important. There's so
often these rookie weapons, whether it be running back, wide receiver, whatever,
(06:26):
are injured to start training camp or have some hold
up of some sort, miss the first week or the
first handful of practices, and they missed that basic insult
and they struggle to catch up the rest of the season.
I think Roman Wilson is a great example of this.
He was a third round pick by the Steelers last year.
Everyone anticipated he'd be starting one of their starting receivers,
(06:47):
be a big part of the offense. He barely got
any run at all, and he said it kind of
it was largely because he was injured early on in
training camp. He felt like the offense kind of left
the station without him, and I think Arthur Smith has
said as much as well. So I getting this resolved
ahead of camp, making sure Argie Harvey can just hit
(07:09):
the ground running, especially at this really important position of
need for the Broncos I think is huge.
Speaker 1 (07:15):
Yeah, exactly is you said a position of need the
Broncos need to run the ball. I'm like Jason's comment
here because as we were speaking of contract talks, we're
also hearing you know, looks like talks are happening with
Benito and the Broncos too. Benito was saying that the
edge market is really playing in his favor here, and
(07:37):
I don't think that he's wrong. He's got a lot
of negotiating factors as it comes into this season. I
know there's been kind of a back and forth with
all of the Broncos country as to whether or not
he deserves to get paid for the production that he
had last season and what could be his production in
twenty twenty five. Zach, where are you at with the
Benito contract negotiations? I guess where do you see that falling?
(08:01):
Do you think the edge market is helping his negotiating
tactics here? As we head into the season, I.
Speaker 2 (08:06):
Think it definitely is because I think we might see
another meaningful leap up Miles Scartt's amazing, but TJ. Watt
was kind of tapering off last year, and for him
to get that forty point one number, I feel like
Micah Parson's agent can come to the Cowboys now and ask.
Speaker 3 (08:22):
For forty two, asks for forty three. We also know.
Speaker 2 (08:24):
He's not gonna leave the Cowboys, and Jerry Jones has
just handled these situations really poorly consistently. If I was Micap,
I would be chilling. I would not be worried about
rushing to a deal, you know, maybe even playing this
year out come back next year and instead of forty
one or forty two, getting forty five or more. But
the Garrett and the TJ. Watt giant leap at the
(08:47):
top of the market is definitely helping THENDO out. And
if you're going to keep a guy around, which Benito's
good enough, I bet he's a Bronco long term, it's
almost always better to get the deal done early. If
he has another ten SAX season, like just you know,
production kind of comes back to the pack sun. But
he has a ten sax season, which with how good
(09:09):
this secondary is, with how good vance Joseph is at
getting him an advantageous one on one situations, I think
he should be productive again. If that happens, you're looking
at thirty to thirty five million dollars because he produced
at that level last year. Right now, the discount is, well,
we haven't seen it on early downs or rundowns. We've
only seen it for one year. That's deflating his market
(09:31):
to that twenty twenty five number that's been talked about
right now. I think if you sign him there, it
winds up looking like a great deal. If you wait
and he has another great season, you're going to be
on the hook for a thirty to thirty five million
dollar contract. And I think people only see the risk
the one way, where it's well, what if we sign
(09:51):
Nick Benito and he's bad and then, oh my god,
you've wasted fifteen million dollars. Well what if you don't
sign Nick Benito he's good again, which does seem like
the more likely outcome based on his current career trajectory,
And then you're wasting fifteen million dollars that way, because
it's contracts shot up like crazy.
Speaker 3 (10:08):
So yeah, I hope they get it done.
Speaker 2 (10:12):
The fact, it sounds like they're negotiating right now, Benito
said as much as a summer football camp. Hopefully they
get it done. I think it would benefit all parties.
Benito would get his money up front and the Broncos
would kind of get him on what I think ultimately
will be a cheap deal.
Speaker 1 (10:29):
Yeah, and I could see where they're also in the
prime position, not only with where Benito is in his
age and career, just playing wise right, you're going to
get the most run for your buck in that moment.
And then also you're looking at a window for the
Denver Broncos where they're everything that they've shored up on
the offensive line, on the defense, everything that they're building
(10:50):
around b NICKX and Bonick's heading into some very key
seasons for development. I think it's really important that they
do lock up those pieces. There's obviously some others that
are the wings. But when you talk about solidifying your defense,
that tells me that they're on the competitive streak. So
they are primed and ready to really make a run
(11:12):
for it. And what a run for it means is
playoff contention. You know, I'm not going to throw the
word super Bowl out there, but if they want to
continue to win games and take advantage of what they
found in bo Nix and the rest of their offense
as it continues to find it spark, I think it's
really important that they make the move now and not
wait until later. Like I don't like the idea that
(11:32):
it's not going to be an appreciable decrease in production
if you were to try to go find somebody else
or focus on that position and the draft. The Broncos
are always teetering on the edge of whether or not
they have competition or competitiveness at that edge position because
we were just talking about a year ago of it
being a need for them. So I don't think this
(11:52):
is really a conversation of letting Nick Benito walk necessarily.
I don't like it when the negotiations stretch out so
far because the Broncos are not needing to pinch pennies
at this moment, but they, you know, they're still reeling
a little bit with some contract deals that they've made
in the past. I don't want to jump into it.
I don't want to name any names, but Sniper says
I like Nick Benito, but I'd rather wait to potentially
(12:14):
pay him either later on this upcoming season or after
twenty twenty five. Jason Neale doesn't think that Sniper's wrong
there would like to see another consistent season. I hear you, guys,
I understand the plight and why you would want to
do that. Zach.
Speaker 3 (12:31):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (12:31):
And I hear them on the Zach Allen point too.
You know, I think Zach Allen should be the priority.
Speaker 3 (12:36):
I think he's the.
Speaker 2 (12:37):
More proven, like elite player up front for this team.
I think they should get both done. But one thing
I would say to ease the concerns about a Benito
contract is look at what happened with a Patrick Cirtan
contract extension or a Quinn Minors contract extension. Those are deals,
both of them. Like Patrick's Artan, people thought he was
going to reset the market. He only took like a
(12:58):
slight step up. Quinn Miners was like signed at the
middle of a quickly exploding guard market rather than at
the top, which all those contemporaries were. The Russell Wilson
thing was terrible, and you know, we haven't expunged that entirely.
But this front office has been on a crazy hot
(13:19):
streak with their contracts and even like the moment they're signed,
it's like, WHOA, this is at a low annual number
and the Broncos are well protected. They're even well protected
in the Patrick's or Tan deal, like they could get
out of that in two seasons, which is nuts, Like
I don't think we anticipate them needing or even wanting
to get out of it.
Speaker 3 (13:39):
But same thing with Quinn Miners. And if they could.
Speaker 2 (13:41):
Build in those like emergency escape patches on the Certan
deal and the Quinn Miners deal, you can bet they
can negotiate those into the Benito deal in my opinion,
So I just I'm not too worried about like some
deal going bust because I think they've demonstrated and they
have a enough culture with the players, kind of like
(14:02):
the Eagles. The Eagles consistently get their guys on favorable
numbers because there's a mutual understanding that hey, if you
perform on this, we're going to reup you up again
at a higher number, and like everyone takes care of everyone.
Speaker 1 (14:16):
Yeah, I hear you. Great conversation, guys. I want to
move on just a little bit too. An interesting idea
of whether or not there could be a reunion. Sounds
like Noah Fant was released by Seattle. I have to
throw it out there. I have to ask, right, Broncos
have been hurting for that position, but it didn't necessarily
work out here, whether or not it was categorically personality wise,
(14:40):
I liked Noah Fans. I think that it was unfortunate
that it didn't work out. You always want to see
draft picks kind of flourish there. But do you think
that there would be any interest in a reunion on
either side, Zach?
Speaker 2 (14:53):
I feel like, ultimately no, there probably won't be much
interest on either side, but I feel like there should be,
you know, I you know, no a fan's familiar with
the area, it might be a little easier for him
to find his footing. And then for the Broncos, I
just you have this big void after Evan Ingram at
tight end. I think all the options are pretty subpar,
(15:15):
and Evan Ingram's not even like a true inline tight end.
No offense are receiving first guy too, but he can
be an inline guy in a way that Evan Ingram
can't really so and he'll line up there, but it
just doesn't work He's a much smaller body. No a
fan can hold up there, I think better than Ingram can,
(15:38):
so it would give you a little more versatility. He's
not the most exciting option, but I think the Broncos
could get him for pretty cheap and he'd immediately upgrade
the veteran presence in that room.
Speaker 1 (15:48):
Sure, and it looks like Seattle had to move off
of him simply for financial constraints anyways, but I think
that you're hitting on the very important point that the
Broncos depth at tight end starts to become fairly steep.
I do think that it is a little bit of
a concern. We'll wave a little well yellow flag here
(16:10):
if we think that the Broncos are content with where
the tide end group is moving into twenty twenty five.
I think time will tell whether or not. There seems
to be a lot of chemistry there, but I think
it should. It should be interesting to see what they do.
I wish there was just a little bit more patting,
but I think you always feel that way, especially when
a position has been at such high need. I think
(16:31):
that's even the same when you look at linebacker and
bringing in a Drake Green Law. You worry about injuries
and what could strike there, but you also worry if
that move is enough to really heighten that room. And
I think that's where I'm concerned with the Evan Ingram move.
Isn't enough to raise all of the ships with that tide, hopefully,
but time will tell. And I think it's a combination too,
(16:51):
because you're looking at your targets, and you're looking at
what BO is going to favor as they move through,
and what Sean Payton's idea is for extending drives, and
I think all that's going to come together, whether or
not it's enough, kind of leads me thinking that if
they can get a cheap bargain there, it would be interesting.
But I definitely think that there's some other options out
there as well. Injuries happen. I know Sniper mentioned earlier
(17:16):
that's kind of this thing that he's watching out for
training camp. Happens in football is a collision sports, so
injuries can happen at any time. Fingers crossed that everybody's
good to go at the start of the season, but
hoping that it all works itself out there, and maybe
there's a fan ringing. I don't think so. I think
that there's kind of outside of the nostalgia factor of
it all, I don't see that there's a big spot
(17:38):
for him in general. It didn't go too well for
him in his career here, didn't catch on as quickly
as you had wanted to. And I think that now
that he's entering the prime of his career, he'll he'd
be better suited moving on to a different team, all right, Zach,
So got fan out of the way. We had a
little bit of a conversation there as it came to
(17:58):
rookie contract. Do you everybody in the chat if you
want to let me know what you're excited for as
training camp approaches. We're going to work on the offense
today and I'm going to start off with maybe a
positional battle that you're most excited for. Zach, who do
you think on the offense we're going to be keeping
feelers out on as we approach this upcoming week.
Speaker 3 (18:20):
Man, I I'll the biggest one. I think the one we.
Speaker 2 (18:24):
Have to talk about first is running back. I think
that that is the mediest one. It's great we're not
having to talk quarterback. I think that's fantastic, But running back,
the other backfield position feels unsettled to me, I mean
goes without saying JK.
Speaker 3 (18:42):
Dobbins, R. J. Harvey.
Speaker 2 (18:43):
I'm curious how that works out. But really the whole
room is a battle. I think you've got the clear
top two guys with JK. Dobbins and RJ.
Speaker 3 (18:52):
Harvey.
Speaker 2 (18:52):
They're going to be battling for you know, and both
are going to see work this year. But what is
that split?
Speaker 3 (18:57):
Like is RJ.
Speaker 2 (18:58):
Harvey seeing seventy percent of the world or you know,
like forty percent of the work. Alvin Kamara, as great
as he was, didn't get the most touches in that
Saints backfield. Now, his complimentary option was mark Ingram, Who's
a better player than either.
Speaker 3 (19:13):
Of these guys.
Speaker 2 (19:13):
But you know, I'm just curious to see how that
ends up breaking down. I think it's huge for the
offense in general. That was the missing component from this
offense being like above average to maybe being a great
unit last year was Boonix needed a little more seasoning.
He's got that now. And then I think you've got
a running back group that was so low wattage last year,
(19:36):
and if they can just get to like average, the
offensive line is opening up amazing looks for the running
backs to take advantage of. And if these backs can
take advantage of it, it'll be game changing. So how
they jockey for position at the top of the room's interesting.
But even beyond that, is this team going to keep
four running backs and a fullback with Michael Burton and
(19:58):
like a weird hybrid piece with Nate Adkins. I kind
of don't think so. I think it might only be three.
So McLoughlin and Estimate are probably battling for a roster spot,
and then Blake Watson and Tyler Bidet are on the
periphery of that picture. They're also battling for a practice
squad spot, because if Estimate doesn't make the roster, he
might be on the practice squad. I just think from
(20:19):
top to bottom, this room is in flux, a total battleground. Estimate,
by the way, he could end up being the starter. Like,
that's not the most surprising outcome. So it's just it's
a battle royale and I can't wait to watch it.
Speaker 1 (20:34):
Wow, that's crazy. Victory lap is coming in and say an
estimate is gone. There is a confidence factor of zero
coming out of victory lap. There in the let stock
Broncos Chat. If you want to get in on this conversation,
jump on over Let's talk Broncos description. If you're watching
it on Twitter, you can click on the link over
there and come hang out with us while we talk
about the offense. And Zamak has said that the running
(20:55):
back group is what he's going to be looking at
as far as training camp battles go. It's an interest
concept because I'm going to put on Joey's hat right now.
I don't have a baseball cap in my realm. But
let's talk a little bit about the speedster factor that
you're going to be seeing out of training camp, and
the running backs get to show that full throttle, but
they're not wearing pads, and a lot can be left
to the imagination when that happens. So I think technically
(21:18):
you're going to see some of the guys who are
a little bit speedier, like a Julia McLoughlin, really show
out early in camp, and we just see that traditionally,
So I want to throw that out into the ring
and say how much of that is going to play
into the idea that he is competing for a larger
spot here. What I like about the Broncos running back
room is because it was such a position of need
(21:38):
last season. As we go into twenty twenty five, now
it's kind of open core. It's open session. Anybody can
come in with a rookie like RJ. Harvey with oudro
guest and may still needed needing to prove himself. And
you already talked about who may be on the bubble there, Zach.
But the idea is, is Burton going to have a
bigger role here? If you know are out to adjustment.
(22:00):
Friends over there, Mario U Tansey and Patrick Keyote, they
tell you, yes, Michael Burton is going to have a better,
bigger picture here in Sean Payton's offense. But the biggest
contributing factor to me feels like it's going to be JK. Dobbins.
Not only does he have a ton to prove for
the rest of his career as he gets this kind
of prove it chance with the Denver Broncos, but he
(22:23):
still has to carve a name for himself. And what
this running back picture is going to be personally, how
I think it's going to work is a lot like
a committee approach, which I know everyone who loves a
good Belkow is going to be disappointed. That's not what
we're going to be anticipating here, at least not yet. Now,
a hot hand can change everything, But you lose the
Javonte Williams, you bring in an RJ. Harvey, who is
(22:46):
a really intriguing addition because it blends all of these styles.
But you've got this explosive, bursty running back from UCF
and I think he's going to be a natural fit
in Sean Payton's offense. So I think that he's got
a lot to prove, so is JK. Dobbins, and I
could see them going neck to neck to really prove positive.
And who's going to have the largest amount of carries
(23:07):
this season? I don't think it's going to be a
carry heavy season for any of the running backs. I
think you're still trying to find out who has that
ability to do that. And I just don't have a
whole lot of faith in the Broncos figuring the run
game out overnight by flushing out their group and reintegrating
new members into that system.
Speaker 3 (23:24):
What do you say to that, Zach, I think you're right.
Speaker 2 (23:27):
I think this is still a transitional year and a
work in progress. I think the rushing production will be
fairly even at least between Harvey and Dobbins, And then
you know McLaughlin could get into the picture, their estimate
could get into the picture. There you know Watson the
day maybe as sleepers to be that third guy as well.
So I fully agree on that front. That said, I
(23:49):
think from like a raw production like overall production perspective.
Speaker 3 (23:54):
I think RJ.
Speaker 2 (23:55):
Harvey is going to be a game changer on those
screens that we know Sean Payton loves to run, like
he's so good in the phone booth where like he's
such a creative runner, good vision to find those those
little scenes, enough contact balance to pay it off, and
he's really explosive and I you know, like McLoughlin's fast,
but he does not offer what r J. Harvey does
(24:16):
really outside of that, and I think r J. Harvey
is even different juice to your initial point, which is
a good one, like, yes, this is maybe the biggest battle,
but how much can we really pick up on it
from the training camp reps that are limiting contact And
it's totally true. I think there are some necessary points
we can pick up on this Broncos run game, though,
(24:36):
like Dobbins coming back from injury. Also down the stretch
last year, you know, it looked like he had a
lot less juice. Is that burst back after, you know,
a summer of rest. I think that'll be interesting to
see r J. Harvey, how does that burst and like
overall speed compared to a guy like Julia McLoughlin, who
we already know is a jitter bug and then estimate.
(25:01):
I think he was lacking and burst last season generally,
So I'd be curious to see, you know, does that
maybe look a little better this year now he's had
an NFL strength program for a whole season, So.
Speaker 3 (25:14):
I I don't. I'm excited for the r. J.
Speaker 2 (25:17):
Harvey element for sure, but I think you're right it's
going to be a very very much a committee situation.
Speaker 1 (25:23):
Well, I think that's the first time we've agreed on
something and I don't know three years. Perhaps I don't.
It's interesting, it's an interesting concept. I don't want to
make Zack out to be argumented. If I think I
am the ar he went ahead and threw himself under
the bus, that's fine, all right, Well, Zach, I hear you.
(25:46):
We already talked about the tight end position not really
being a battle there, and then you bringing on the
I think, just an on point conversation about the running backs,
but I think particularly the wide receiver as we see
I want to say, like a chart, like a pack hierarchy,
as we continue to see. I think too many of
(26:08):
us are assuming that Courtland Sutton is just that shoe
in number one, the guy that bo Nicks needs to
rely on in order to see success in the offense. Now,
do I think that it's ill fitted and ill fated
and assuming that, No, not necessarily, but I think that
there are some front runners that are getting glossed over
(26:30):
just by the fact that we haven't seen enough out
of them.
Speaker 2 (26:32):
Right.
Speaker 1 (26:33):
We know what Courtland Sutton is, we know what he
brings to the table, and that's why there's ongoing conversations
when it comes to what that next contract is going
to look like, or if there's going to be a
next contract, because honestly, at this point, anything can happen
as we're heading into the season. But I want to say,
it's a competitive and unpredictable group on this roster, and
I think that's a good thing. I think that if
you have too many sure things you're not quite sure
(26:56):
how draft picks and how you know second your guys
are going to play into these pictures. We still need
to figure out what Troy Franklin is going to be.
We need to see if Marvin Min's is going to
take an additional step this year. But you've got a
Devon Veley who I think turns a ton of heads
with his size and physicality and just having that overall
(27:18):
impact for the team. And then you've got the adverse
almost in a Troy Franklin where you've seen through his
scouting reports and then last season it just sort of
wasn't clicking. Yet that can change overnight in the NFL
now can hands not necessarily, But I think Troy Franklin
just needs a little more time under his belt to
really truly succeed. You already had the built in chemistry
(27:39):
with a Bonnix, So it'll be interesting to see to
me if there's a camp standout in that group who
was already presently on the roster. Because I'm not quite
sure that I have a whole lot of idea of
what Pat Bryant is going to bring to this team.
It's not about who's starting, so I don't want to
throw out the wide receiver one who's going to be
(27:59):
opposite them. I think it's who's going to earn the
trust in different packages, who's going to be on the
field in a crunch time position, Who's going to be
there when Sean Payton needs a guy in the red zone.
It can't be an Adam Troutman, Like those are the
days of the past, and I'm hoping that this current
wide receiver group is going to be the ones that
are going to take it to the next level, because
if they're not there, the offense lacks an extreme spark.
(28:20):
You can hide your deficiencies all you want, but if
your run game and your wide receivers are struggling, you're
not really functioning in an offense with an Adam Troutman
Evan Ingram and then throw out any other arbitrary tight
end names that you can't. So I think those two positions,
Zach or why they're the most competitive battles that we
need to watch because they play such a large emphasis
(28:41):
on what the offense is going to do and how
efficiently they're going to get it done.
Speaker 2 (28:46):
Yeah, I fully agree with the wide receiver pick. This
is another one where I think there's like battles all throughout.
You know, who is the guy opposite Courtland Sutton? We
know Sutton's the starting next, but who's the guy opposite
him on the other boundary?
Speaker 3 (29:00):
Is it Mims?
Speaker 2 (29:01):
Like I think that's the ideal plan. I think that's
kind of a huge skeleton key for the entire offense,
but he hasn't proven to be able to take that
role over. If that changes this year and we'll get
some glimpses of that at training camp, I think it
changes everything for the offense. I think it's one of
the biggest X factors for the Bronco season. But if
(29:22):
not him, is it Valay? Same thing in the slot,
like which one of those two is getting a lot
of slot? Looks how big of like presence is Evan
Ingram in that picture? Like what are they doing with
Troy Franklin, What are they doing with Pat Bryan? Because
you maybe think Pat Bryan, if he's that Michael Thomas guy,
you'd think he's the heir apparent maybe as that big slot.
(29:44):
What does that do to Vala or Marvin Mims who
are jostling for those same positions. And then even on
the back end both of Sean Payton's seasons here in Denver,
He's carried five receivers on at least the initial fifty
three roster. There's a pretty clear cut six that you'd
think would be rosterable, right with Sutton, Mims, Valet, those
(30:07):
guys are all probably pretty locked in his safe. Pat
Bryant probably not going to cut the third round rookie.
But then Troy Franklin and Trent Sherfield. They just signed Sherfield.
It's not the biggest deal. They could move on from it,
but you know that you don't typically sign free agents
or cut free agents, rather that you immediately just signed
(30:28):
it to a deal like the one Trent Sherfield did.
Maybe they finally carry six this year, but I think
that's even an interesting thing to like who winds up
being the odd man out or drawing the shortest straw. Yeah,
I'm very excited for this one, and like you said,
it's gonna have huge implications for how the Bronco season goes,
because Yeah, I just can't get over the Marvin Mims
(30:50):
of it all. If you can emerge, is that like
solid field stretching Z. It's like such a missing component
in this offense right now, Like if you can be
Sewan Peyton's next Brandon Cooks, it opens up, It clears
up the log jam in the slot. It just it
solves the lack of verticality or speed or juice that
(31:11):
can sometimes be in this offense with some of the bigger,
slower bodies are out there. It makes it so Marvin
Mims doesn't just have to be this, you know, a
backfield weapon where you're having to scheme up how he's
getting the ball. He can impact the game in a
more varied way. And I just that's the one I'm
(31:31):
really hung up. I hope Marvin Mims wins that battle
because it would be game changing for the Broncos offense.
Speaker 1 (31:37):
It's like you read my mind. I don't think we've
ever been this in sink Zach. So as you're talking
about Marvin Mims, it was between him and Vley with
the who I was the most excited to watch, simply
for that reason. You've got a large amount of questions
that still need answers, and I think it should be
that this year's the year that Marvin Mims makes the leap.
He showed flashes last season. He was used in a
(32:00):
way that really allowed him to show his speed and
his burst and his ability to stretch the field. But
now he needs to take that up a notch. Right,
So now you're bringing in tandem with a quarterback who
needs to do much of the same. And I think
with having that experience under his belt and in Sean
Payton's system, with a second year quarterback that is bo
Nix who has got a lot to prove here and
not only in Broncos Country, but in the league as
(32:22):
a whole. He's building real chemistry and I think they're
going to move around him. I hope that this is
the year that Sean Payton decides to take the pigs
that he has given and place them in the holes
that we have instead of trying to just hammer away
that square into a circle. Because I'm worried that if
you don't utilize what these individuals are good for, you're
(32:43):
going to end up kind of running them by the wayside.
And that's where I'm really excited about Marvin Mims looking
forward to how he looks in training camp. But I
also wanted to throw out Vley in there, and I
think that it's important to kind of show that both
of maybe aren't the flashiest names or guys in the room,
but they're the most intriguing to me, And I'd like
(33:06):
to see with Vley's physical presence, how he works consistently
outside of Sutton, showing strong hands continuously, and then if
he's able to fight for contested balls deep into the
end zone. I think you're just going to see someone
who is that powerhouse back or a wide receiver that
you've been looking for. So to me, MEM's and Vley
(33:26):
really intriguing options on who I'm excited to watch heading
into training camp. Zach, I want to keep rolling off
of that. As I talked about we talked about wide receivers.
Those guys stand out to me. Is there anybody else
on the offense that you're excited to watch as we
approach training camp?
Speaker 2 (33:40):
Mom in lockstep with you, I'm curious, can Filet make
a step or take a leap older players, especially at
those skill positions, you know the development curve. We don't
see guys take big leaps at twenty seven, twenty eight
or so on. But it being his second year in
the league, him being able to hit the ground running
(34:01):
hopefully this year instead of being hampered by injuries at
the front end. I wonder if he can take more
of a leap and sees more of a role in
this offseason.
Speaker 3 (34:08):
And I already explained my.
Speaker 2 (34:10):
Hype for Mims, but my choice for this question in
particular is going to be Evan Ingram. I just I
don't think it ends up. It's not going to be
as good as Jimmy Graham where it's like borderline all
pro level. I'm not expecting that. But hearing him talk,
it sounds like a big part of him coming to
Denver was Sean Payton kind of selling him on this
(34:30):
vision and knowing how like, hey, I know how to
get tight ends these numbers, and that is a large
part of his menu of concepts that he hasn't really
been able to tap into here in Denver yet with
Adam Trautman.
Speaker 3 (34:46):
And the like.
Speaker 2 (34:47):
And I'm just I'm really excited to see what that
looks like this season. Like Caleb Loaner to a lesser extent,
because I just think he's raw, It's going to take
a while before he can really contribute in a major way.
But like if Evan Ingram is top five in touchdowns
among tight ends this season, I wouldn't be surprised at all.
I think he could have one of the most productive
(35:09):
seasons of his career. I just I think it lines
up really nicely for him, not only because he can
be this great red zone threat like a Jimmy Graham
that I think Sean Payton knows how to utilize perfectly,
but also because he's got really great movement skills for
the tight end position. Sean Payton, you know, we loves
(35:31):
these screens, love getting loves getting these guys on the
move close to the line of scrimmage. I think that's
one of Bose's strengths too, is kind of those quick
hitter RPO deals where you can just deal the ball
out quick, let the guy get on the run and go.
And I think Evan Ingram aligns well with that skill
set too. He's also just a freak athlete, like not
the freakiest of all time or anything, but these kind
(35:53):
of tight end wide receiver hybrid guys are just kind
of crazy. But naturally, you know, there's six five guys
who can run a four. It's just stuff you don't
see often. I'm excited to see what that looks like
in that environment. And because it's it's kind of contactless.
Him being a smaller tight end, that's not going to
show up so much. So I think he's gonna just
(36:14):
ball out in training camp and I'm excited to watch that.
Speaker 1 (36:17):
Okay, yeah, you got me there. Although wouldn't you be
shocked if Caleb Loher was the standout, you know, he
like he was just the dominating tight end from day one,
because that would be kind of the futility of the
prospecting game to go ahead and grab a player like
that where you got him with without a whole lot
of expectation for the individual, but knowing that he can ball,
(36:40):
Like simply put, you grabbed him because he is an athlete,
and I think that the end of day that could
be the hidden gem that you have towards your team.
So I just wanted to highlight that that, like, watch
us all be crazy and that be the standout there,
not only from training camp, but those preseason reps are
going to tell us a lot. So I'm excited about that.
But you're right on the nose there with Evan Ingram, like,
(37:03):
I'm excited about it too. I think it's one of
those ones where you're bringing something to the offense that's
been missing for a while, and that's just a mismatch.
And Sean Payton loves versatility. This is a guy that's
really going to get him done in the wide receiver speed.
You've got the build for a tight end, even though
it's not traditionally as big as you would want, but
(37:24):
having the ability to create the constant matchup problems for
opposing defenses, and bo Nix is going to have a
reliable and athletic outlet where you're just going to keep
the chains moving. And I think it's really important just
to highlight how like we wanted the weaponry, but I
think too often we associate that with deep balls, you know,
(37:44):
like a pretty moon ball is going to outweigh the
idea that, no, if we're not getting kicked off the
field on third down, I think there's a bigger emphasis
of success in the offense when you're able to stretch
the field, rule time of possession, and ultimately score more points.
There's many phases of this game, so I am right
in step with you, honestly, Zach. I don't think we've
(38:05):
ever been in the same sentence, let alone the same
page before, and I think we're just singing the tune
of our people today. So this is exciting, This is
a good show. I think we should fight about something.
I feel like I have to manufacture an argument at
this point.
Speaker 3 (38:21):
A good reflection on your character.
Speaker 2 (38:22):
I'll actually agree with you one more time here really
quick with Caleb Loher. I'm really excited for that one.
And I feel like there will be limitations on him
just because he is so new to football, but I
think he could be a really relatively speaking productive red
zone weapon even as a rookie, because like they drafted
(38:44):
an athlete and they took that gamble on this really
experienced football player. Because I mean there are times, and
I know we've hyped this up on the show before,
but like his touchdown against Colorado, He's going up against
a cornerback prospect that's going to go on the first
two days of the draft next year and dunked on it.
Like was uncoverable on the play because his size, strength, speed,
(39:08):
It's just it's you don't see it often. And Sean Payton,
I think one thing he does very well is like
understanding the limitations of his players and just not asking
them to do what they're not good at, like Marvin
Mimms last year kind of struggled to get him on
the field early, but once he figured out that role
of like, Okay, this is how we can make you useful,
(39:28):
Marvin Mims was like one of the most productive, the
most useful players on the offense. Bo Nicks struggled out
of the gate last year, but once Sean Payton figured out, like, oh, okay,
this is what maybe you need some more time to
figure out as a rookie quarterback needs, and this is
maybe where you're more comfortable the stuff we can lean
into more. Take some of this stuff off your plate,
make it a little simpler for you. We saw bo
(39:50):
catch fire down the stretch and then he was able
to put a little bit more back on the plate
where I think he's going to be able to find
some sort of you know, sim plistic red zone role,
even if it's just like, dude, learn how to run
a fade route, Like that's all we need to learn
how to run a fade route. Get on the jugs machine,
and we're going to do that, like, you know, ten
(40:10):
times this season and you'll catch like two or three touchdowns.
I really can envision that role because he is just
again like Evan Ingram's kind of freaky, Caleb Blowner's freaky freaky.
Speaker 1 (40:23):
I think that's a good way to put it. I
was looking for the mute button, so I didn't pull
a Sears last episode, if you want to go ahead
and rewatch that. Although it was a defense heavy episode,
we did talk about concerns and I had to bring
up the center position. So I don't want to cross
contaminate the conversations here. But Zach, while I have you
and we're talking about the offense, is there anything lingering
for you as we approach training camp and the idea
(40:46):
that maybe there's some positions or conversations, narrative, storylines, contracts
that you are concerned about. Because I feel like we've
been ultimately too positive tonight.
Speaker 2 (40:57):
There are some things I'm concerned about, and I've kind
of alluded to. The big one for me is the
what's happened? Like how did these pieces fit together? I think,
like in a vacuum, they're all very exciting, but outside
of Courtland Sutton, I have a lot of questions about
how it all comes together. Like Evan Ingram we mentioned earlier,
(41:20):
far and away the best tight end in the room
but do you want him like playing that many inline snaps.
I don't really know. I think kind of you don't
want that. I think to my Jimmy Graham point. Jimmy Graham,
when he got franchise attacked, tried to argue he was
a wide receiver because he was lining up more as
a wide receiver than as a tight end.
Speaker 3 (41:40):
I think it could be the same with Evan Ingram.
Speaker 2 (41:42):
So if he's lining up outwide, some lining up in
the slots, some like that's taken away snaps from Marvin
N's who we talked about how exciting it would be
if he can prove he can be the outside guy,
and it would be. But last year when he started
catching fire, it was because John Payton moved him into
the slot. So that kind of creates that or furthers
(42:05):
that slot log jam. Pat Bryant I brought up the
Michael Thomas thing before, and maybe him being the future
of big slot, that's probably where you want to put
him this year, especially when you have Courtland Sutton at
the X and that's Pat Bryant's other logical position. Okay,
so that's for another player in that log jam. Devon
Valet he got a lot of his work out of
(42:26):
the slot last year and was really really good as
that big slot. How does that work out? I really
don't know. I think it's going to be fascinating, which,
again curtling back to the Mims thing, him taking that
leap or not is so huge because if he locks
down that Z spot, it just I feel like unconstipates
(42:47):
that whole situation because it is it is a real
logjam right now. And you know, I think it'll still
be Okay, You've got some nice pieces and you can turn.
You can create a decent to maybe good and to
maybe even very good offense out of this. But I
am concerned if they can figure out how it all
(43:10):
comes together, because I do think there are not redundant
skill sets.
Speaker 3 (43:14):
So much is like.
Speaker 2 (43:17):
You've got a bunch of different like specialty tools for
the slot right now, and like can any of them
expand beyond that, or like how do you how do
you get them to sing in symphony working concert?
Speaker 3 (43:30):
And I'm I'm we'll see.
Speaker 2 (43:32):
That's that's one area of concern I have right now
that I could see kind of hamstringing this offense.
Speaker 1 (43:38):
Okay, that's fair. I think there's a broader level concern
of consistency and identity. This team was operating under a
notion that they were young and hungry. Well as your
team ages and as your team you know, achieve success
or has to continuously achieve success. I think that there
(43:59):
needs to be some level of not I guess rolling
down the hill with the snowball, like if you have
a slow start and you have mental lapses and you
have turnovers, which have haunted the Broncos on many occasions
in the past. I don't know, let's say ten seasons.
That's where leadership and coaching and team identity and veteran leadership,
(44:24):
all of that has to come together. So I'm in
total agreement with the pieces being there, but how do
they come together and how do they really are they cohesive?
Do they tell a story? But I also want to
highlight that I have a little bit of a concern
when it comes to depth along the line. Right, Sean
Payton and George Payton have spent a ton of money
and resources to bolster that offensive line, and it's an
(44:47):
expensive starting line. But you lose a couple of pieces
there in the realm of depth, and you're going to
be hurting for what inevitably happens at some point in
the season, which is injuries. The bug comes around for everybody.
And although the line has been you know, pretty healthy,
(45:09):
I think there's still a concern, especially if you know
there's a question at center if that position were to
go down. But ultimately, who is your reliable backups there?
Whether it's at tackler guard that you have met Pert
Frank Crumb, there's a couple of additions there will Sherman
nt Garjulo. You have to start asking the question of who, though,
(45:31):
is the reliable one that you're going to be able
to plug and play when the Broncos are on a
four game win streak and you don't want to go
down to a t who's going to have playoff implications
later on? So to me, there's just kind of that
anxiety mindset of that's not really sure. To me, I
think that there's plenty of journeymen that the Broncos have
(45:52):
picked up a year after a year have been able
to play that piece. Quinn Bailey was that for them
for you know, a few seasons there, and I don't
think that's going to be an availability heading into this season.
So who's going to be the guy who steps up.
But I think that's where the question goes. Sniper is
on pace with me here and says, as far as
the O line goes, I do think that if the
(46:12):
Broncos let Luke Wattenberg walk after the season, the Broncos
will address that position in the twenty twenty sixth draft.
Zach Center next year, question.
Speaker 2 (46:21):
Mark, I think it's possible, you know, definitely somewhere early.
I think Sean Payton has cared about the trenches. It
valued the trenches everywhere he's gone. He even drafted a
center in the first round with Caesar Ruiz, who hasn't
panned out great, but just rare in general to draft
those guys in the first round, so it stands out
that he's done it in the past. I don't know
(46:42):
the center prospects looking ahead, admittedly, so I don't know
if there's anybody who'd get serious first round conversation, but
I bet they will invest in it. I don't think
Forsyth has turned out, but I love your call out here.
Bria was on my short list of options because I'm
kind of concerned about it too. This offensive line, and
it has been amazing for the Broncos these past couple
(47:03):
of seasons. They've also been very, very healthy, like each
of these past two years.
Speaker 3 (47:08):
Among the healthiest lines in the league.
Speaker 2 (47:10):
And yes, Sean Payton's done a good job with managering
the managing the injuries since she's since he's come in.
But injuries are also like largely a luck thing, and
that luck could flip at any point. It doesn't mean
that they're likely to have bad luck because they had
good luck the last two seasons, But you know, will
they have good luck again, I don't know.
Speaker 3 (47:30):
We just don't know.
Speaker 2 (47:32):
They haven't had to lean very hard on Matt Parrott
or Powchwski or Alex Forsyth or Nick Garjulo in the past,
you know, in the little flashes here there, I think
those guys have looked promising when they they've had to
be called up, if you know, they've had to be
called up. But we haven't seen it in long since.
(47:52):
We haven't seen the Broncos suffer like a wave of
injuries on the line, And I think, you know, that's
very if they do get worse luck this year, because
bo Nix, I think the biggest hole in his game
last season was struggling under pressure. You know, his sack
rate was low. We're all aware of that. I'm not
(48:14):
talking about picking sacks. I'm talking about even though he
was avoiding sacks. He was near the bottom of the
league in EPA per dropback when pressured. And the fact
that he was so good at avoiding sacks and still
was that poor in terms of production says all you
need to know about what he was doing as a
passer or even as a scrambler in those moments. Overall,
(48:35):
what happens if he starts getting pressured a lot more
because there's a bunch of offensive line injuries. You know,
that's kind of scary to me. The run game. I
talked earlier about how you just need these running backs
to be averaged because the holes getting paved by the
offensive line. I don't know if that's true. If all
of a sudden you suffer a rash of injuries to
(48:57):
the offensive line, Now, all of a sudden, maybe you're
asking RJ. Harvey to be a true difference maker, like
a top ten back as a rookie to support that
run game, and that probably doesn't go so well. So
the depth up front is something I'm very curious to
monitor throughout training camp as well.
Speaker 1 (49:18):
Great, I give him myself a case to the Sunday
Scaries unintentionally. On that note, I think i'll a little
touch on something a little bit more fun. The mail
bag video that you've been highly anticipating. Bronco's Country is
coming out on Wednesday. I think there's still time to
leave your comments below, zach Am.
Speaker 2 (49:34):
I right, sorry, I was very slow getting over to
my mic feature. Yes, yes, it's not too late. I
want to apologize. I hyped this future up last week
and when I went to upload it the Bronco it
was largely focused on the Ja Da Bear and RJ
(49:54):
Harvey contract negotiations, and then those got solved right before
I was going to upload it, and I was like, well,
that's like sixty percent of the episode. So I canned it,
but I'm going to get back to it.
Speaker 3 (50:08):
This week.
Speaker 2 (50:08):
We will drop an episode that I won't show this time.
Speaker 3 (50:13):
Please, though, update the questions. Leave me some questions.
Speaker 2 (50:15):
Below and I will get to them on the show
one of these weeks.
Speaker 3 (50:20):
I definitely will.
Speaker 2 (50:21):
We're doing random questions every week and I think it
will be pretty fun. So circle back here on Wednesday,
or actually, we've got outitude adjustment pack now, so I'll
be uploading it the Thursday.
Speaker 3 (50:31):
Come back here Thursday.
Speaker 1 (50:33):
Oh yes, that's right. If you're new here, then you
don't know about altitude adjustment. Check them out on Tuesdays
at eight pm. I think I'm on the show tomorrow,
so you're welcome. Surprise surprise from Zach and I thank
you for tuning in lovely show. If you have questions
for us, you know how to get a hold of us.
(50:53):
You can leave comments down below, or you can go
on over to Twitter. Breemases threeho three Zach underscore seekers.
Is that still your handle?
Speaker 3 (51:05):
It is?
Speaker 2 (51:05):
I haven't changed. I'm an og You and Joey have
both been changing years. But I'm just I'm loyal to
the soil. Bre What can I say? You know?
Speaker 1 (51:12):
Breemaistice eight thousand and four, bunch of numbers. It just
didn't It didn't work, and so I figured it was
best to shorten that to three oh three. The other
breemaistis who's out there somewhere. I will find you, and
I will steal your Twitter account and I will deactivate
it so I can have my name back. All right,
I guess it's been a fun night. I'm gonna get
(51:35):
out of here and we will be back with you,
uh next week, So go Broncos and I'm trying to
find the button to get out of here. So'll break
fun if you all will
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