Agents, Athletes & the NCAA: Who Really Runs the Game?

This week on Let’s Talk with Carl Lee, the crew welcomes NFL agent and attorney Paul DeRuzel for an electric, wide-ranging conversation. From contract negotiations to NIL chaos, Paul shares stories from inside the industry—including how he helps players grow as professionals, not just performers. Carl reflects on his own experience navigating the NFL without the luxuries today’s players have, and the two connect over the power of mentorship, memory, and integrity in a system that doesn’t always value it. Then the team pivots to a blistering roundtable on the NCAA’s latest controversies, sparked by Tennessee QB Nico Iamaleava’s $4 million NIL demand and holdout. From “Do Not Contact” transfer tags to the future of revenue sharing, they ask: Is college football already a professional league without the structure? And who’s protecting the legacy—and the smaller schools—before it’s too late? Lively, honest, and filled with insight—this episode pulls no punches on the state of modern sports.

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:01):
Yeah, you gotta work.

Speaker 2 (00:10):
You gotta work. Bry Son is mine, gotta show. Everybody
is my time here. You gotta work. Cry Sin another
mile sag of Dogs Day.

Speaker 3 (00:20):
Welcome to Let's Talk with Carl Lee. Join Carl alongside
frequent co hosts Lisa Odie and Hollis Lewis as they
explore dynamic conversations with guests from all walks of life.
Let's Talk is proudly brought to you by Attorney Frank Walker,
Real Talk, Real Experience, Real results. Visit Frank Walker Law
dot com. The conversation starts now. This is Let's Talk.

Speaker 4 (00:46):
Hello, ladies and gentlemen, This is Carl Lee with Let's Talk.
And I have my both of my co hosts in
the building today, Lisa Odie.

Speaker 5 (00:55):
And Hollis Lewis. And what's going on?

Speaker 4 (00:57):
And I believe Hollis is going to introduce to somebody.
We're gonna start right out with the guest today.

Speaker 6 (01:04):
So we have a sports agent and the Southern University
lost in a grad one of my fellow classmates, Paul
de Rusal, No, I did I pronounce your name right,
my brother?

Speaker 7 (01:15):
I mean you're almost with it.

Speaker 5 (01:19):
I knew we made sure he did it. We didn't
want to message.

Speaker 7 (01:26):
How you've been on this time in Louis And I
can't say my name.

Speaker 6 (01:29):
Right, I said, you know, I was a sub. I
was a subteacher when I was in law school. And
it just got to a point where I just passed
the pipe. Go ahead and just sign. Now try your name.

Speaker 7 (01:41):
You know, it just depends right there. But I say
the rustle if I really want to sound sophisticated, I
got you. I feel like my credit score.

Speaker 5 (01:55):
Now. Now we're just going back a little bit. Like
I said, we went to law school together.

Speaker 6 (01:58):
You were a Division one athlete, tennis player, and ever since,
you know, when I came in you you wanted to
be I know, you always talked about sports and sports agent,
different things of that nature. And now we're here. You
represent a pretty nice client list. So so how is
that transition, going from being an attorney to now being
a certified sports agent.

Speaker 7 (02:21):
I'd say that being an attorney kind of prepared me
for it, you know, doing buildable hours like the movie
Karate Kid, you know, the wack so wax sau Yeah,
doctor view, attending the detailed client relations kind of all
these things. Working at a law firm until a lot
of their skills set translated. And just to be honest,

(02:43):
I feel like, give's your clevel of credibility. When you
walk into a room, you know, people know that the ESQ,
you know that there's some education behind you too, that
you're not, you know, a street agent that they call
a lot of the people. So I think get helped
in a lot of ways from sitting through more mediations,
understanding negotiation tactics, and just honestly just sitting in a

(03:04):
lot of those rooms just prepared to make you realize
it's no stage too big man, never intimidated by anybody.

Speaker 4 (03:11):
Yeah, and and and this is Carl Man. How you doing?

Speaker 5 (03:15):
So what's up? I'm I'm I'm.

Speaker 4 (03:18):
Every agent that I had was actually a you gotta
tell them you you NFL. Well, I'm a former NFL guy.
Played for the Vikings. I played from eighty three to
ninety four. I finished my career with UH with the
New Orleans Saints. And yeah, so fortunately for me, I
ran into I had a couple of buddies who played

(03:39):
and they had an They had a guy that was
an agent and he was an attorney, and I knew
some other guys who had jumped in with some other
guys who were just the streets.

Speaker 5 (03:52):
They were the street agent, you know.

Speaker 4 (03:54):
And and I don't I don't want to necessarily say
that that was a that was a that was a
bad deal. But one of the things that I felt
that when you have an agent that's actually an attorney,
when you get into the room on the negotiating piece
of it and all of the other personal life lessons
and things like that, having that a guy that's an

(04:15):
attorney is a huge benefit. That guy who's just gonna
go in and try to get you a million dollars
on your contract, there's a whole lot more to that.

Speaker 5 (04:24):
Wouldn't you agree with that? Yeah?

Speaker 7 (04:26):
I think, well, first off, I don't. I think that's
just being an attorney just a certain degree. Man. It's
just so you said, you you're versatile. You can do
a lot of things more than just be an agent.
And you know, sometimes you can help advise on business
deals and review certain uh like you know with the
Nike contract key on, and I just got that I

(04:47):
was able to point out certain inconsistencies. You know. I
just think your eye is trained for it. But I
don't want to say that it's a lot of great
agents that aren't attorneys too, so I want to be
clear on it, right, Right, some of that is just
based on who you are. There's like it's terrible agents
that are attorneys, so right for me, being an attorney

(05:08):
help because you trained my eye to certain things. But
I do think, you know, there's people who got MBA's
right and finance backgrounds and other things they kind of
translate and make them serviceable and great agentsies work.

Speaker 8 (05:19):
Hey, Paul, this is Lisa, thanks for coming on the
podcast tonight. Hey, so I'm going to go outside of
what we're talking about right now and just kind of
talk about in general.

Speaker 9 (05:29):
Question about conflict. I'm sure as a sports agent.

Speaker 8 (05:32):
You run into that, you know, probably on a daily basis,
if not weekly. So how do you handle like when
you have a conflict or a disagreement between clients and teams?

Speaker 9 (05:43):
What's your strategies to kind of handle that?

Speaker 7 (05:47):
I Mean, the first thing is, like I understand that
is the nature of the business. I think a lot
of times conflicts escalate because people are a lot of things,
you know, to get personal, right. I think one of
the things I understand is that I'm a big picture thinker. Right,
So there's a conflict between a team and a player.
I understand that these teams are run by billionaires, right,

(06:08):
most of us who have business backgrounds. So I understand
that a lot of times, while you do look at
players as people, sometimes they're viewed as commodities, and you know,
it's business. So I understand going into it any conflict
that I try to look at it through the other
person's lens while also advocating for our client and doing

(06:30):
with in my client's best interest at all times. So
I think I just try to navigate that through clear
conversation by For example, you might have a player with
an injury settlement, for example, that's probably one of the
more common common conflict injury settlement workers comp type stuff,
and they might believe it to be a five week injury,
so they'll pay you this amount of times the length

(06:51):
of the injury they believe it to be. Whereas you
go get a second opinion and do all these type things,
I just think the better you do at having a
paper trail and making an intelligent argument as opposed to
an emotional one, one that's couched in fact and that
can be proven as best as you can. You got
to shout in all all these conflicts, and also you

(07:13):
just want to be a professional throughout it.

Speaker 9 (07:16):
Thank you.

Speaker 5 (07:17):
That's perfect.

Speaker 6 (07:17):
So let me ask you this, Like a lot of
times when we you know, a lame, a laming person
who doesn't really you know, know the business slash sports world,
when they think of agents, they think of like agents
being involved in every aspect of a player's life and
kind of, you know, ride with that person through whatever,
you know, personal and or business. So what is kind

(07:39):
of like a day to day or is it mostly
just that excuse me, negotiating contracts or are you kind
of involved in sort of like an advisor role to
you know, life in general whatever.

Speaker 7 (07:51):
I first wanted to say that, it's kind of like
any of y'all got.

Speaker 10 (07:53):
Kids, Yeah, yeah, and I'm going through where with this,
I think that there's no like you might have one kid,
Like my sister calls my mama every day, where I
suldn't only call my mama if I need something.

Speaker 7 (08:07):
So it's kind of like with with athletes, it just
depends on where they are in their career as to
what your role will be. I got four guys in
the draft right now, so I'm talking to them a
lot more right, helping navigate through visits, evaluating rosters should
they fall out of Day three of that draft. Whereas
with Key On our conversations are a little different because

(08:29):
you know, he's just training right now, getting ready to
go to OTA's and stuff. So no day is the same.
If you're in contract negotiation season where you got a
guy that's getting ready to go into free agency, those
conversations look different. If you got a you know, a
rookie or veteran like a Jeffrey Simmons, he ain't got
nothing to do for the next three years for real,
So you're just showing up his events, supporting them, just

(08:52):
being being there, pulling up the game, maybe just just
flying out the nasvilla, grabbing dinner. All of your players
are going to have a different personality, and I think
some agents go wrong because you can't be the same
person for everybody. For example, Key Coleman called me ten
times a day. You know receiver as Marcus Banks in Tampa.

(09:14):
He's my frat brother. He's twenty four years old. A
little bit further along, he gonna call me and he
might talk about the territs that are going on, you know.
So I think part of being a great agent is
just understanding what role you have to play in that
player's life and asking them what are the expectations of

(09:34):
you and what did they need from you? You know
what I mean. Some players want you to come to
as many games as you can. Other guys like now,
man just pull up with me on my off day,
which is Tuesday.

Speaker 6 (09:45):
And I'm looking at this number for Jeffrey Simmons that
he did for a little while.

Speaker 5 (09:49):
So I looked at that number, I said, okay, right.

Speaker 4 (09:55):
And you know, and what's interesting to me about listening
listening to you, you know, and I'm sitting here as
you as you're talking about the relationship, and I'm thinking
to myself about the relationship that I have with the
guy who who I worked with like like to like
at any part in time, anything that happens in my
life today, like I'm likely to call him and have

(10:19):
a conversation with him and say, hey, I'm trying to
do this.

Speaker 5 (10:22):
Like it.

Speaker 4 (10:23):
It really does become almost I want to say, like
a father figure, almost, even though it's not.

Speaker 5 (10:31):
You know, the age is not much different.

Speaker 4 (10:33):
But the things that I'm needing, I know that he's
going to have the answers or he's gonna go find him.
You know, he's going to come back and call me
and say, hey, look yeah, I think what we need
to do is we need to do it this.

Speaker 5 (10:44):
Way, that way, da da da da.

Speaker 4 (10:46):
And I think that the average person doesn't have that
that luxury. I don't think and and and I think
you know, when you when you think about it, like
people like you, man, I don't know if you really
understand like how relative and how important that that is
to guys like me, you know, because.

Speaker 5 (11:07):
We need that.

Speaker 7 (11:09):
Yeah, And I think a lot of you know, I
don't want to turn off any of your viewers here,
but I think a lot of that is just for me.
You get into this business if you're a Christian before
you're an agent, which I am, it's about it's about.

Speaker 5 (11:23):
Service, right right.

Speaker 7 (11:26):
So if the main thing and your main purpose in
life is for God, you get this opportunity and he
gives you this platform. You want to help people. You know,
people get caught up in this agent stuff and they
think about, oh, I saw you on the sideline. You
did a hundred million dollars deal, key hun Kole and
Jeffrey Simmons. At its core, I'm helping a young man navigate,
no different than a school teacher, right then, So it's

(11:49):
so many of those things are already in you. Is
as I have the title of an agent. You know,
you're an advisor, you're a friend, you're a confident. You
know a lot of the bodies are buried, you know.
I think you have to want that. I think to
who much is given, much is required. So, like you
said about your agent, I enjoyed being counted on. I

(12:13):
enjoyed being depended on. I enjoy you know that, kid,
love giving the answers to the test of other people.
You know, my home was a lot of them passed
because of me. I enjoyed it right right, So for you,
for you to revere your agent so much, that means
they're doing something right. And I think that's all you want.
You want to want to be that. But now on

(12:33):
the other side of that, I think I do a
really good job of trying to empower those guys. For example,
my my rookies. I don't call back the team and
set up their zooms or I said, no, man, you're
a grown man. You I can tell you what to say,
but I want these teams to understand that you can
hold you can handle some of your own business because

(12:55):
what you're in the meetings. You know, there's a fine
line between guidance and hindering and handicap and I think
you got to find that right because you're still your
own business. You your players. You want them to keep
you around because obviously you add value, but you don't
want to become too much of a crutch to where
they don't grow. And that's the hard point, right you know,

(13:17):
I don't know you're for louis Ina we Boil croff
is here, right, Yeah, you know to get some of that,
I had to learn to feel my own crafts at
some point.

Speaker 4 (13:27):
Well, okay, so let me ask this question because as
as you were talking, I'm sitting there and I'm thinking
about like different situations.

Speaker 5 (13:34):
And we had a really difficult general manager. His name
was Mike. Lenny's passed away and you know call him
coach him.

Speaker 4 (13:43):
I mean, I mean, he was for sure, without any question,
he was a racial type and one of the one of.

Speaker 7 (13:52):
The expected dudes.

Speaker 5 (13:54):
I don't I don't.

Speaker 4 (13:55):
Really have a good filter, so so you know, one
of the things he would he would tell you like
like if you didn't, if you if you didn't take
his offer, Like so he throws an offer right out there,
and nobody takes the first offer. You know that nobody
takes the first offer. So he would tell you, if
you don't like my offer, go drive a bus, now,

(14:19):
you know, and and and again I'm coming through you know,
eighty three, eighty four, eighty five. But you can't say that.
You can't say that to me. Why do I got
to go drive a bus? If I don't, if I
don't play ball, what what's going? And I and I
try to look at this now if I don't have
if I don't have an agent in that room at

(14:39):
some point in time, like like, I don't know if
that that works out for me, right, you know what
I'm saying. And you so, I'm wondering if you've been
in that kind of a situation where there's that guy.
And I'm not saying I'm that guy, but you you
have that guy that you have to kind of sit
in to have that conversation because that general manager might
say something off the and or maybe they don't.

Speaker 5 (15:01):
Say it like that.

Speaker 7 (15:02):
Now I don't think they say it but but to
your point that there's definitely still some of those those
overtoes or whatever you want, because you know, like I said,
sometimes they view the athletes as commodities that they can
just replace, they just go out. So there is a

(15:22):
little bit of that, right, not wanting people to get
their worse. I mean, they're trying to save the owner
as much money as possible. That's really what they're trying
to do. If we think about it's trying to get
the cheapest labor, get the most out of you, and
pay you the minimum amount until they absolutely have to
pay you. You know. So I think the role of
the agent, as I said earlier, it's to stay calm

(15:43):
and make the player understand that it's not personal. But
it's so hard not to feel personal. You know, I'm
not the one getting hit, right, I get out of
the bed just perfect. I can still duck the basketball.
You know. It's being able to empathize and also trying
to make them understand like, yo, this is a seventy
eight year old owner from West Texas. Bro he don't

(16:06):
you know. That's a lot of it is how you
were raised, you know.

Speaker 6 (16:09):
So I'm looking at you, I'm looking at you your
client list, and you mentioned some of the names Jeffrey
Simmons from Tennessee, uh Keyon Coleman Buffalo, Terrell Shaver's Buffalo,
Marcus Banks, you know, Tampa Bay and what I'm impressed by, Like,
I remember when you know, watching you online, he was
trying to break and get in the game. And now
we're here and you mentioned you got four other rookies.
So what's the process now for acquiring clients. Is it

(16:34):
you soliciting or you getting solicited from from from players
and their families.

Speaker 7 (16:39):
It's a combination, right, I think you know I could
speak to like, for example, my last year's draft players.
You know, you got Calling Vigors from Eunus, Louisiana, and
he's from where I'm from.

Speaker 5 (16:52):
Yeah.

Speaker 7 (16:52):
Aiden Huntington was a teammate of called it so a
lot of the stuff, man, Yeah, some people. I didn't
realize how connected I was to people. And sometimes when
you do a really good job and you have a
social media presence and people see that the acumen is there,
they get a little intrigued. Feel like anybody, if I
get a fair chance in any room, you know, I
feel like I'm as good as anybody. So a lot

(17:15):
of a lot of my clients come from referral, A
lot of it becomes geographically being from southwest Louisiana. Kind
of these kids grow up knowing who I am now
because I've been blessed. You know, when you got a
superstar like ke Coleman.

Speaker 5 (17:27):
Let's just call it it is.

Speaker 7 (17:31):
Let's just be honest. You know, all your clients matter,
but you know, the kids from where we're from, from
the same place, so they you know that that's built
in it. And one thing about he gonna say my
name in rooms that I'm not in.

Speaker 5 (17:42):
He's nice, He's a humble kid, So I like him
a lot.

Speaker 7 (17:45):
He's gonna say my name anywhere. So you want to
you know, you want to do that level. You want
to solicit, But the best solicitation is doing good work.

Speaker 8 (17:53):
Yes, yes, hey Lisa again, I know Hollis just he
kind of named all some of you or more prominent
clients that you are representing here in the present. But
how many contracts do you think you've negotiated over the
years total, Like what.

Speaker 7 (18:09):
Do you see as a legal career? And yes, yes,
well we one hundreds. Wow, you know, because you know
I did a lot of mediations when I was an
up and coming attorney at a big firm. Okay, so
I've done a lot of negotiations, you know, like on paper,
maybe I negotiated nine, maybe ten, fifteen NFL contact Sure,
you know, like I said, my first time at the

(18:30):
big boyd table for really we got one hundred for.

Speaker 8 (18:32):
M Did you get to say did you get to
say show me the money?

Speaker 7 (18:37):
You know what about that news came out of it
on Good Friday in Louisiana. Yeah, it was one of
the one of the best days of my life. Wow,
to see the look on your client's face.

Speaker 5 (18:51):
Come on, I remember that. I'm watching that so so.

Speaker 6 (18:54):
So like now you know, kind of where can people
find you at? Where can they you know, what's your
social media? Where can people keep up with you?

Speaker 7 (19:03):
Well, you know the cool thing, man, they can always
find me at the agent Paul on Instagram. I'm still
independent right now, you know, as you know how all
these big agencies calling me. Yeah, yeah, I'm cool right now.
You know, I'm in a good space. You know, I
know that day will come, but I'm gonna just keep
stacking up and having quality players and if we move

(19:24):
we move as a unit, one band, one sound.

Speaker 6 (19:27):
Now is there any thoughts of maybe like going like expanding,
going to different sports?

Speaker 5 (19:31):
Are you just kind of locked in with the NFL
right now?

Speaker 7 (19:33):
Oh no, no, No, I'd love to do basketball. I'd love
to represent coaches down the road. I want to keep growing,
but I want to grow at the correct pace. I
think the biggest mistake you can make is to allow
other people to dictate how you move. Like about it
in basketball, what they said, a great point, gud. You
can't speed them up, play at their own speed. Like
nothing you can do to make them rush, make them

(19:54):
take a bet. And That's where I'm at right now.
I kind of just take my time, just just be
because you should. Just because you could doesn't mean you should.

Speaker 5 (20:02):
Yes, exact, I love that.

Speaker 7 (20:04):
I'm gonna just keep building man, day by day and
doing right by the players that I do have, and
keep you know, keep stacking man. That's really all I
can do.

Speaker 4 (20:14):
Hey, man, just just again, just from somebody who's been
in that situation and have watched different people, good bad
and in different just hearing you and and and hearing
the passion in what you have. But I can appreciate
who you are what you're doing, and I'm sure that
the guys that you are representing will all do well

(20:35):
because of who you are. And Bro, I'm telling you now,
don't change be that dude, because that'll that'll that'll work
for you because players like that kind of that that
kind of person, that true person that you can really
deal with.

Speaker 7 (20:46):
I mean, you you blessed right the way I look
at it, Man, it's a blessing. I know what it's
like to have no clients, right, and I remember them nights,
you know, just crying knowing I as good as everybody,
but I realized, you know, you got to go through
a process to make you appreciate it. So I'm just
as appreciative of a sixth round pick as I am
a first round pick. Third round. You gotta love them

(21:08):
all the same, and you might have to love them
differently because every player got a different love language, you know,
but you love them all the same. You treat your
top of the roster guys saying, well, you treat the
god fighting for a fifty three right, Well.

Speaker 5 (21:21):
You know, I'm looking for an agent for my forty
five U team.

Speaker 7 (21:25):
So mannar, I'm not a aar.

Speaker 5 (21:36):
Hey man, I really appreciate you, man, It's been excellent. Yeah,
I appreciate it, man, Thank you so much.

Speaker 7 (21:41):
I got a question to know for my man who
played for the Vikings though.

Speaker 5 (21:45):
Yes, sir Carl Lee, what years you played, bro? I
came in in eighty three.

Speaker 4 (21:50):
I was a seventh round pick, and.

Speaker 5 (21:55):
And my career went from eighty three to ninety four.

Speaker 4 (21:58):
I ended up with Yeah, well he played one year. Yeah,
one year with the Saints. I played one year with
the Saints.

Speaker 7 (22:05):
But you know, it's crazy. You went seven round back
in the day when they used to have like twelve rounds,
so technically you were kind of like a like a
third round.

Speaker 6 (22:12):
Yeah, man, don't tell this man, Man, you don't tell him, man.

Speaker 4 (22:17):
Brother, it really it really, it really to me when
I when I you know, at that pick, you know, I.

Speaker 5 (22:26):
Didn't know where it was, what it was, but there
was a whole lot it was.

Speaker 4 (22:31):
It was still a challenge because again I'm trying to
play a corner position that I really hadn't played.

Speaker 5 (22:37):
I was a safety, but it.

Speaker 4 (22:39):
Was it was it was the challenge of seeing all
the different people, you know, and and I had a
buddy from LSU, Willie till who's who's down in baton rouge.

Speaker 5 (22:51):
He kind of really took.

Speaker 4 (22:52):
Me under the wing and kind of got me going
and helped me a whole bunch.

Speaker 7 (22:57):
Man.

Speaker 4 (22:57):
And I can give him a little props too, just
because of having somebody that that that played that position
who was a buddy of mine. We always lived in
the same apartment complex. So I got to get my
hats off to him as well.

Speaker 7 (23:10):
Hey, so you you couldn't so you played, say you
couldn't turn them hell slaying? Well, why they had you
a safety in that corner?

Speaker 5 (23:15):
Well, I play safety.

Speaker 4 (23:17):
I play safety in college at Marshall and uh and
and and I have to I'm gonna pat myself on
the back because I was a him.

Speaker 5 (23:24):
I was. I was I was.

Speaker 4 (23:27):
I was physical, you know, I was physical and and
so I was more of a safety type. But then
I get to I get my opportunity to play corner
with Pete Carroll. He comes in and and puts us
through the whole bump and run thing.

Speaker 5 (23:40):
Man, And then my my career just jumped off.

Speaker 7 (23:42):
Man.

Speaker 5 (23:43):
I just you know, yeah, so I played with Pete Carroll, Yes.

Speaker 7 (23:46):
Son, he was then too.

Speaker 4 (23:51):
Man, you I'm telling you but he turned our he
turned our defense or I'll.

Speaker 5 (23:57):
Say that for sure, the secondary.

Speaker 4 (23:58):
But we had a we had a defensive ordinative brother
that was just blitz blitz blitz. So, Bro, we're playing
man the man every almost every down, and Bro, that's
Jerry Rice Era.

Speaker 7 (24:09):
That's all them does look I know, I look see
she's trying to rust us off the foor. I love Boston,
of though. My last question in the hold on.

Speaker 5 (24:18):
Okay, you didn't. We ain't got nothing. We're gonna talking
about something.

Speaker 9 (24:24):
He's interviewing Carl. Tables have turned.

Speaker 7 (24:29):
I'm doing I'm doing media. When I get done with there,
you got I retire. But so did you? Were you
with the Vikings for what? Through what? Years?

Speaker 5 (24:39):
Eighty three to ninety three?

Speaker 7 (24:43):
All right, so pitts of this? You know how like
you have certain core memories as a child that you
cannot forget? Yes, all right, So Christmas nineteen eighty nine, Okay,
I'm gonna take you somewhere, Okay, okay, young bro. I
was like, maybe it's three. I'm telling my age. I was,
and we were Monday night football was on the and

(25:04):
the Vikings were playing on Christmas night on a Monday night,
and I don't know why I remember it is, but
I cannot forget it. Do you remember that?

Speaker 5 (25:13):
I No, I don't.

Speaker 4 (25:15):
I'm sure that we played on on on on.

Speaker 5 (25:18):
One of those days.

Speaker 7 (25:20):
I know you played on Christmas, on Christmas, I.

Speaker 5 (25:23):
Get it, Christmas, Thanksgiving all that.

Speaker 4 (25:25):
I don't like, we played a bunch of games on
on on different times.

Speaker 5 (25:28):
I don't really like.

Speaker 4 (25:29):
I can't pull out a game or a situation where
I could say that I actually played.

Speaker 5 (25:35):
Unfortunately, I don't have that memory. And you can. You
can blame that on the contact.

Speaker 4 (25:43):
Trust you all good.

Speaker 7 (25:46):
You played on that on that hard, concrete.

Speaker 3 (25:54):
Term.

Speaker 7 (25:56):
And I know, like everybody I ever talked to from
your era, like the Ogs, they think they're like, man,
these receivers just get to run across the middle and
gallivant that boy.

Speaker 4 (26:07):
And I say that here like all the time, like
there's just simply no way that a receiver in the
league now is gonna catch a slam And bro, I'm
not gonna go across his head. Say that a lot,
you know, Yeah, you said, I'm just there's just no way.
And I get it, Like now that's gonna be fifteen.
But back then, that was gonna be fear for the receiver,

(26:29):
you know, you know we was, you know back in
those days. Brother like you, you know you talking like
putting fear in somebody's mind so that they don't do
this again.

Speaker 5 (26:41):
That was the whole thought process of defense. You know.

Speaker 4 (26:44):
You start talking about something, you talk about like somebody
like lt Bro, like he ain't trying to just hit
you and bring you down, trying to intimidate you to
when you don't ever come back that way.

Speaker 5 (26:57):
And I think that's the difference in where the game
is gone.

Speaker 4 (27:00):
No for sure, and I can't and I and I
don't mean that in a bad way because you know,
safety is safety is important and all that kind of stuff,
you know. But if someone asked me if I would
go back and do it again, knowing that my memory
is horrible, I would say absolutely, I would do it
without a question. I would I stand with my hand

(27:22):
up to say, I want to be first in line.

Speaker 7 (27:25):
Hey man, I respected, but love of the love, love
of the game. Man, sir, man, I'm young, I'm younger
than you, but like I got an old soul.

Speaker 4 (27:35):
Man, I'm with you, and and I appreciate I appreciate
the money you know, and I had loved to have
made that money.

Speaker 5 (27:43):
But but if you love the.

Speaker 4 (27:45):
Money and you can't love the game with the with
the intensity of wanting to be something, want somebody to
call your name out by, you're missing it.

Speaker 5 (27:58):
That's what we're gonna talk about. We sure are.

Speaker 7 (28:04):
I'm knowing you gotta hell, you gotta love this stuff.
You almost made me curtains.

Speaker 5 (28:10):
And that's one thing I can say about Paul.

Speaker 6 (28:12):
Ever since I know that he was in law school,
he always had a really love for sports. He thinks
sports related, always talking about it, doing it, but playing
flag football, just talking about it in the last centers,
always a football.

Speaker 7 (28:24):
Hey, I'm gonna tell you something. I hope Marcus the
Lord is listening to this. I was unguardable, bro. I was,
you know, like six two and a half, not a
real burner. But they described me like a white guy,
you know, first the first guy in the room type guy.

Speaker 8 (28:50):
Okay, Paul needs to be a stand up comedian. Get
the immedia style, just get straight on the stage.

Speaker 4 (28:58):
That's so somebody you six two.

Speaker 5 (29:03):
Division one in this division one? Okay, in a quarter
I am pointed the quarters off. Okay, So now if
you were to played football? What what?

Speaker 7 (29:15):
What?

Speaker 4 (29:15):
What?

Speaker 5 (29:15):
What?

Speaker 4 (29:16):
So are you saying that you would would you be
a receiver? Is that what you're saying?

Speaker 7 (29:20):
I mean, wait a minute, now, you should.

Speaker 5 (29:23):
You should be quick with that.

Speaker 7 (29:24):
Answer that no no, no no, I gotta get I gotta provide,
contay provide.

Speaker 5 (29:30):
Okay, I'm waiting it.

Speaker 7 (29:32):
I would really want to be like the you Donna's
Haslam of the NFL, like, don't play, just get to
walk around and be in it. I guess you to tapling.

Speaker 9 (29:45):
I think playing that part loud.

Speaker 4 (29:48):
Oh gosh, So you want to be on the side.

Speaker 7 (29:52):
I just want to put on a uniform, run out,
kiss my family before the game, you know, like you
know in the family, if you on.

Speaker 11 (30:00):
The sideline, to be whiter than the okay, okay, wow,
because one other position, I can't play dB, I won't

(30:20):
get cooked back as a receiver.

Speaker 7 (30:21):
I can at least go out there and block or
do something like for Tim to be busy on outside.

Speaker 5 (30:27):
Why you gotta say the DV gotta get beat d
what we all did.

Speaker 7 (30:33):
Being a d V bro is the hardest position in football,
one hundred percent.

Speaker 5 (30:38):
I said all the time.

Speaker 6 (30:39):
It's the most athletic position, being a cornerback, you have
to be the best athlete maybe in sports. Now let
me just let me just give you some context to
that that statement that he made. If you wasn't on
the phone, we wasn't having this conversation, he would have
never always say that.

Speaker 5 (30:56):
I always I always say what was what was your like?

Speaker 7 (31:01):
What you ran in the forty and all that.

Speaker 4 (31:03):
See now, now, now this is gonna be this is
gonna be a little bit of an issue here, all right.
So I was no, no, no, no, no, bro before that. Okay,
here's the thing. I ran four four. I ran four
four at the Combine my second year in the league.
I ran I run I ran a four two eight
and four to three five back to back. Hold on,

(31:25):
hold on, I'm just telling you. I'm just said four
three eight No no, no, no for two eight, four, three five.
Come on, That's what I'm saying too. Come on, listen.
Let's Decko took over the team. Let's Decko took over
the scene, took over the team, and he made us
do this crazy running program. So Brad, like you know,
he tried. He called me and said, look, you need

(31:47):
to come up to Minnesota. And work out because camp's
gonna be hard, blah blah blah blah. I said, no,
if that's all it's gonna be, I'll take care of
that here at home. And so he had this this
deal where we had to run the forties, do the shuttles,
kind of almost like the combat rock. So I was
the fastest dude on our.

Speaker 5 (32:07):
Team that particular year.

Speaker 4 (32:10):
I was Darren Nelson from Stanford was you know, he
was everybody thought he would be the fastest.

Speaker 5 (32:18):
My time was the fastest time.

Speaker 4 (32:19):
This is the first time I heard about that for
too well, when am I supposed to brag about it?

Speaker 5 (32:23):
I don't.

Speaker 9 (32:28):
Don't take his come on now, come on this moment.

Speaker 7 (32:36):
I feel like that Chamberlain point games.

Speaker 5 (32:40):
I heard.

Speaker 7 (32:48):
And is he just mentioned all this about the lawyers, Like, okay,
did you run it outside.

Speaker 5 (32:55):
Grass turfed? We were we were we.

Speaker 4 (32:58):
Were Oh my god, we were outside. We were on
the turf. We was on the turf, and it was
and and and the coaches were the timers. They timed
the twenty into forty. I don't remember what the twenty
was because it didn't really matter because because the forty
was good.

Speaker 5 (33:14):
Yeah, So I didn't work.

Speaker 6 (33:15):
But I'll say this, if you go back and watch
some of the highlights of Coach Carl Lee, Yeah you
you had some wheels, so I mean I could believe it.

Speaker 5 (33:23):
I'm messing with you, but yeah, you was doing your
thing out there. That's the first.

Speaker 4 (33:28):
But we might need to keep you on the show
every week. That's the only problem he's ever given me.

Speaker 7 (33:36):
Line.

Speaker 5 (33:36):
Now, don't be.

Speaker 9 (33:38):
Loud now, now, boys, you know how.

Speaker 5 (33:44):
How are we? What are we? What?

Speaker 7 (33:46):
Like?

Speaker 5 (33:49):
That's a fact? Now that's a fact. Yeah, I gave
you that.

Speaker 7 (33:54):
I like, I'll give you that also for y'all kind
of delusion on two like you can overthrow it. It'd
be a bad throwing the dB doing something.

Speaker 4 (34:07):
See see that's new school. That ain't old school. If
we old school, we only take credit for what we do.

Speaker 7 (34:14):
I'm gonna ask you this, you a dB, what was
your what was your pregame? Swag? Like? Every like your
wrist band had to be a certain way, y'all.

Speaker 4 (34:21):
Ury I want to hear this. Okay, So I was
a spatter, so I would spat my shoes.

Speaker 5 (34:27):
You know, my cleats. I spat him up, boy, and
I take.

Speaker 4 (34:30):
My wrists and I had had you know, you had
the towel. You had to put the towel right the
town had to be right on the side on the hip.
You know, you had the glove. You did the gloves too,
you know, see you did the elbow elbow band. But
see I had two years with with with Bud Grant
and Bud Grant, you know, he was strict on what

(34:51):
how you look like, you know you we need to
look like a team.

Speaker 5 (34:55):
So he kind of tapered some of that.

Speaker 4 (34:58):
Then in my third in my second year when we
had less stuckle, he kind of try to step in
and do that same kind of thing. But after that
it was kind of it was kind of like wide open.
We could do kind of really whatever you want it.
You know, you could spat it up and then you know,
smatch your cleats up and draw something on it if
you wanted whatever, you know, put your number on it, whatever,
you know.

Speaker 7 (35:17):
So whats used todss.

Speaker 4 (35:22):
I?

Speaker 5 (35:22):
See I don't I didn't play. I didn't play with him.

Speaker 7 (35:25):
OK.

Speaker 5 (35:26):
Yeah, I was gone before he got there.

Speaker 4 (35:27):
Yeah yeah, But Bret, I'm telling you, the dress code
is important for you. You don't come out on the
field until you ready. Now and here's the here's what
people don't know. So like the warm up, when you
come out like prior to the game, you know, before
before the whole team comes out, you got your own look.

Speaker 5 (35:47):
You got your look to come out there. You know,
you got got.

Speaker 4 (35:49):
That look first, and then when it's the whole team
or special teams are coming out, you got that look.
Then when you're coming out final for the game, you
got you got the whole complete look.

Speaker 5 (36:03):
You know. That's just that's that's just how it was.

Speaker 4 (36:06):
Let me ask you a question, Pap, while we got you,
what far as the draft, just so we can talk
about that. What what's what's your what's your feelings on
the top maybe two or three picks or can you
say that?

Speaker 5 (36:17):
I don't know if you can go there?

Speaker 7 (36:19):
No go there. I ain't got no dog in the
fight this. I feel like cam Ward is and that's
gonna go to the Titans. Sure, I think too. The
Browns need to to do something right. I think they're
gonna I think they're gonna go get Travis Hunter, energize

(36:41):
their fan base, exciting player. They're gonna find a way
to creative ways to use them on both sides. At
three I can see that's the Giants.

Speaker 5 (36:51):
Yeah, I believe the door.

Speaker 7 (36:53):
Thing is a smoke screen. I believe they go dual
Carter okay for the Patriots. I can see the Patriots
go and get alignment, probably Will Campbell or maybe the
kid from Missouri, whoever they have higher. But I mean,
I think all of those guys can really play. Man.
So it's just like this year's first round is gonna
be more defense. Every thing was mostly offense, so sometimes

(37:16):
it alternates. This year defense is gonna be at the forefront.
You might see twenty twenty three guys on defensive draft.

Speaker 5 (37:25):
Yeah.

Speaker 6 (37:25):
Now, just as far as the Browns pick is concerned,
you know, I'm a big Travis Hunter fan.

Speaker 5 (37:30):
I thought he was phenomenal.

Speaker 6 (37:31):
So but to that pick into a franchise like that,
that is rebuilding. Do you take the player like Travis
Hunter or do you take like more of a foundational
player like that good offensive or defensive lineman, or do
you think or is he just the best player player
available in that slot.

Speaker 7 (37:48):
I think he's the best available player in that slide.
I think when you're picking at the top of two,
which you are, you're gonna get a defecto first round,
so you can get creative there. Maybe trade into the
first if you want to go get a quarterback because
you got a top two, right you say, I tell
you like a GM. Sometimes you got to top of
two pick, which is really a first round pick. You're

(38:08):
gonna have somebody with a first round grade go there,
so you can go get it. Go get a d
lineman there top you know, old lineman. That's gonna be
a starter. I just don't. I'm not in the in
the business of passing on once in a generation tight players. Yeah,
and I think you can overthink it. I don't think
they said, oh, I think you run that card up.

(38:29):
You draft Travis Hunter and you ball. You look, you
go ball. If you put them on deep or you
put them on defense, you already got ward on the
other side of righting your Your receiver room is kind
of Jerry Judy pretty much. And you know, no notable
guys other than that. You give them twenty twenty five
players in a package, find manufacturer touches for them, screens,

(38:50):
getting them the ball in space, and sometimes it's the
thread of him out there, you know, send them out
on a vertical, get tight ends open. So I think
you go do that, man, and you you know you're
gonna be picking right there next year anyway. Quarterback class
next year, you know, so are are? You know, if
you're feeling it, feeling it, feeling it like you really are?

(39:11):
You make a trade at seven with somebody and come
get the door. What do you get? You reunite Sedor
and uh travers if you like, right, who's at seven
to je You just got to get up to eight
ahead of New Orleans. So you make a trade with
Carolina mm hmm. They got to give up a two.

(39:35):
You probably got to give up some stuff. But I mean,
if you believe in Shador that much, that means you're
you're banking on the He's better than next year's quarterback
class anyway.

Speaker 5 (39:44):
So yeah, I like sha Door. It's a quarterback.

Speaker 6 (39:46):
I mean, I've never seen, you know, a young quarterback
delivered the ball with such accuracy that's particularly underpressure. The
only thing I worry about when you look at the
modern quarterbacks that Jalen hurts, the Lamar Jackson's they got
them wheels, and I I'm not sure if he's going
to be able to to to do what needs to
be done in a modern sense of football as far

(40:06):
as that is concerned.

Speaker 7 (40:08):
Here's my thing, though, Matt Stafford isn't a crazy at
least if you're an elite processor. Okay, you know, I
think if you're an elite processor and you get the
ball out quick, you go through your progressives and your reads,
which I think he does. He has a you know,
he took a lot of sex to Colorado. A lot
of that was whole line related. But I'm a believer, man,

(40:29):
I'm a I'm a believer and shoulder, and I don't
you know, the whole him being super fast thing you got.
You know, they've got a lot of quarterbacks that ain't burners, Yeah,
but he got you just got to be fast enough
to be evasis as long.

Speaker 8 (40:44):
As they're not mister irrelevant right exactly to throw it
in there, Yes.

Speaker 7 (40:54):
Rock Purdy brock Perky irrelevant.

Speaker 5 (40:57):
Yeah, yeah, my brother, I tell you what.

Speaker 4 (41:00):
We appreciate the time we thought we was gonna be
here like maybe ten fifteen, but we Yeah, we got
to have you.

Speaker 9 (41:06):
Back for sure.

Speaker 7 (41:08):
I enjoyed talking to you, all.

Speaker 5 (41:10):
Right, man, We'll get back to you. Thanks, Paul, appreciate,
thank you.

Speaker 4 (41:13):
Yeah.

Speaker 5 (41:14):
Yeah, So I don't know if I want to get
any credit for that. I don't know if I would
have given any credit. He's awesome, but that's a conversation there.

Speaker 4 (41:27):
You know what I'm saying, like, you know, and and
the fact that even came out with his ques in
the car actually happens to you.

Speaker 12 (41:39):
Sound presentation that's time zero four zero zero one.

Speaker 4 (41:50):
Yeah, in your phone, talk a little bit about your story.

Speaker 5 (41:55):
Okay, visit dot com.

Speaker 3 (42:00):
Let's Talk with Carl Lee is probably presented by Attorney
Frank Walker. Visit Frank Walker Law dot com. Share your thoughts,
ask questions, or suggests topics on our Facebook page. Just
search for Let's Talk with Carl Lee and don't forget
to like the page to join the conversation. Catch past
episodes anytime at w c hsnetwork dot com, slash Let's

(42:22):
Talk and tune in Thursday nights at seven or Sunday
evenings at eight for Let's Talk with Carl Lee. Now
back to the conversation.

Speaker 4 (42:31):
I don't know if I want to get any credit
to that all. I don't know if I want to
give it viny credit.

Speaker 5 (42:38):
He's awesome, but that's a conversation there.

Speaker 4 (42:41):
You know what I'm saying, Like you know, and and
the fact that he actually himself even came out with
his own questions.

Speaker 5 (42:47):
You know, I think I thought.

Speaker 9 (42:48):
That the future media. Absolutely, yeah, he's got a future.

Speaker 6 (42:53):
So so I know we wanted to talk. We ain't
got that much time left, so.

Speaker 9 (43:00):
Lies we could talk about Nico. I think that's pretty.

Speaker 5 (43:03):
Important to you. Yeah, okay, let's let's do that. So
tell us talk to us a little bit about the story.

Speaker 9 (43:09):
Okay.

Speaker 8 (43:10):
So, so we all know Nico, and I hope I
say his last name right, I'm a Lava.

Speaker 9 (43:15):
Did I say it right?

Speaker 5 (43:17):
Okay?

Speaker 7 (43:21):
So he is.

Speaker 8 (43:23):
He was the quarterback at a Tennessee, a starter, and
he was being paid by the school and the alumni
in ale funds, and he was making basically about at
one point he was making about two million total, I guess,
with endorsements and everything.

Speaker 9 (43:41):
And then he.

Speaker 8 (43:42):
Decided this past off season, this offseason right now, that
he wanted that increase to four million. And so the
volunteer fan base, the coaches, the administration did not take
well to that. Actually, the head coach, coach Hype even said,
which is something that kind of stuck with me. And

(44:03):
I'm hoping that a lot of the coaches at at
you know, big schools around the nation also kind of
take it to heart that no one is bigger than
the program and that's a fact.

Speaker 9 (44:12):
Basically, they let him go and.

Speaker 6 (44:14):
He attempted to hold out by saying he missed practice.
He yes, So basically it was a it was a
holdout for it.

Speaker 4 (44:20):
Was a holdout for the definitely, yes, it was definitely
a holdout and saying if I'm not gonna do anything
until y'all payment paid more, yes, which.

Speaker 9 (44:30):
I think that the whole setup of his NIL deal.

Speaker 8 (44:34):
He would have at one point if he would have
stayed with the program went through the complete four years
that he had signed up for, with the incentives that
were in there, with wins and his successes, it would
have increased to more than that. But he wasn't willing
to stick it out.

Speaker 5 (44:48):
And again, this is one of those things.

Speaker 6 (44:50):
While I'm a little conflicted on this because we've seen
coaches do this, right, We've seen coaches lead programs that
they were vested in if they had success, then for
more money, U essentially hold out to try to stick
the team up for more money. I just think, again,
when I look at this, this is an n double
A in the n C double A problem. This is
an n C double A issue and they should have

(45:11):
fixed it when they had the opportunity. But now it's
the wild wild West, you know what I mean? I
agree with the whole wild wild West issue. And and
and what what what bothers me.

Speaker 4 (45:26):
Is because again and in this past conversation we had,
we talked about teamwork, you know, and it is about
team and.

Speaker 5 (45:36):
It's gotten to a point.

Speaker 4 (45:37):
What we what nil has created is individualized situations in
the sport. Because Hollis gets X, and I think I'm
better than Hollis. I got to go in and I
gotta get X plus plus. And I think that was
the case.

Speaker 5 (45:53):
Yes, we were.

Speaker 6 (45:55):
He was a quarterback and I think his name is
Becker in Miami. He's getting for me, So I think
that's where the Nico the kid got that number.

Speaker 4 (46:03):
And then and the fact that you can walk aw now,
let's be honest, let's just be honest. We're talking collegiate sports. Yeah, right,
top level collegiate sports. You are walking away from let's
just say three million dollars, right, because because you want
four over over.

Speaker 5 (46:24):
Your time for this year, for that year, da da
da da, da, Are.

Speaker 4 (46:28):
You kidding me to to to play collegiate football. You
have the you have the audacity to walk away from
four million dollars.

Speaker 6 (46:38):
But it's hard. But I think it's hard to argue.
I seen a report yesterday where the SEC is a
conference made like eight hundred million or some like close
to some several billion dollars as a conference. It's hard
to argue. It's hard for me to say, well, he's
he's wrong for doing that when you're seeing all this
money on.

Speaker 5 (46:59):
The table across the board.

Speaker 4 (47:00):
No, I believe that collegiate sports are making tons of money.
I also believe like this, the NFL makes tons of money. Okay,
but does that mean that a collegiate player should make

(47:21):
that kind of money? Again, I don't. But again, they
weren't asking for this. The players were not asking asked
for a piece of a pie.

Speaker 6 (47:31):
And because the n Cuba failed to act, this is
the result. And again I'm not saying it's got to
get tightened up. I don't think we can stay here.

Speaker 5 (47:41):
We can't.

Speaker 8 (47:42):
No, we cannot live here. And this is something interesting.
And we've all talked about the transfer portal a lot
on this podcast, but this is a different angle that
I'm going to present to you guys that I wasn't
aware of.

Speaker 9 (47:54):
Maybe you guys were.

Speaker 5 (47:56):
But in this.

Speaker 8 (47:57):
Specific instance, when when Nico entered the the transfer portal,
he entered with a tag of do not contact. Okay, okay, okay,
I know there's a dude, whenever you enter the portal,
there's a possibility if you want to you can. You
can enter with a tag that says do not contact,
which means one of two things.

Speaker 9 (48:16):
One of two things.

Speaker 8 (48:17):
One of them is that he already knows where he's going,
he's already got to do in place, or his representatives
will contact your school to let you know you're interested.

Speaker 9 (48:29):
So it's one of two things.

Speaker 8 (48:30):
Either he already knew he was going and we found
out the seating he's going to U c l A.

Speaker 4 (48:34):
Correct, is that what I don't think those deals are
officially done?

Speaker 8 (48:39):
Well, the possibility he's going there. So here's the one
of two things. When he went into that portal, he
either knew that l U c l A wanted him
and maybe that's why he did the things he did
with Tennessee to get out of that, or he's going
he's in his mind he Is that all that that
he's able to pick where he wants to go and
have his peeple contact their people.

Speaker 5 (49:02):
Yeah, that's it. That's like a franchise tag or something
like that.

Speaker 9 (49:05):
But my question to my question, I didn't know that though,
did you?

Speaker 5 (49:07):
Guys? No idea that.

Speaker 4 (49:12):
I'm trying to figure out, Like, Okay, I'm a colleague
athlete and I'm getting ready to say how much money
I want for n I l that sounds like so
my question the question that that comes to me in that, Okay,

(49:33):
so I got to look at Hollis and see what
he's making.

Speaker 5 (49:35):
I gotta look at least and see what she's making.
You know what I'm saying, Like I am?

Speaker 1 (49:38):
I am?

Speaker 4 (49:38):
I researching players to see where I fit.

Speaker 5 (49:43):
Definitely doing that. Somebody's doing it for some I have
to assume somebody is doing it. Yeah.

Speaker 4 (49:48):
Now the question becomes to me, which is again a
pro issue. Like so I said, so you're making four million,
So I'm thinking, now, oh, shoot, if Hollis is making
in four million, then I need to make four and
a half or five?

Speaker 5 (50:04):
Yeah? How am I? How am I processing my skill
set versus you? Is it? Stats?

Speaker 4 (50:11):
Are we going by stats, or we just thinking that
we got the skill.

Speaker 5 (50:15):
Set, I think, or it's the same thing you will
processing in a pro sense.

Speaker 6 (50:18):
You're looking at your success versus that guy's success, that
guy's versus your status. You're looking at all those things.
I mean, he did take Tennessee to the playoffs. He
was a good quarterback.

Speaker 7 (50:27):
Now you.

Speaker 4 (50:29):
Said he took him to the playoffs, but.

Speaker 9 (50:32):
Yeah, I think they were there. They were part of
the conversation.

Speaker 5 (50:35):
But if you're quarterback, that's coming back and I'm saying,
maybe you.

Speaker 4 (50:39):
Want to be the top you want to be the
top pay quarterback, and and and you got into the
play but.

Speaker 9 (50:44):
Else it depends on what the school needs.

Speaker 8 (50:46):
I mean, maybe the school has players in place that
you know would be able to push him to the
next level. You know, if you're going to Ohio State
from Tennessee, that's that's a that's a huge difference in
talent levels really, and.

Speaker 6 (50:59):
Again, I just think is one of those things where
it really it just from from a fans perspective, it's
ruined college sports. And because I think the legacy angle
of what college sports were is gone. Because I think
when you're looking at like, you know, those tim Tebow's
and those other guys that we grew up watching, they

(51:20):
were distinctly associated with that university.

Speaker 5 (51:23):
I seen one guy who been in like six different schools.

Speaker 6 (51:26):
I seen the there was they were talking about men
Majors in basketball and they look at the three players
and now they're all gone going to Division I school.
So it's like the legacy that you could have established
being at a school and being known for that school
is just gone.

Speaker 5 (51:43):
And I think that.

Speaker 6 (51:44):
That's the part that we're going to have to wrestle
to figure if we can sort of pull that back,
because that's the heart of collegiate sports.

Speaker 4 (51:51):
I don't think I don't think that kids see or
care quote about their legacy from somewhere.

Speaker 5 (52:02):
You got a kid, want money.

Speaker 6 (52:03):
You got two kids, these like top basketball players going
to be Y, you going there.

Speaker 5 (52:10):
They're like the top basketball ones.

Speaker 4 (52:12):
Ones coming out of high school going to be YU,
and the other one was like a transfer. These are
like top basketball I forget their name, top basketball players.
And because b YU has a structure where they're going
to really pay you. So now these kids now they're
not thinking about like Kentucky, they're not thinking about the dukes,
the tar Hills, Kansas. It's like I'm going to who
can pay the most well, regardless of anything, and to

(52:33):
that if I can get that money in in.

Speaker 5 (52:37):
College, I don't need it.

Speaker 4 (52:40):
I'm not worried about pro at least not right now,
not right now, not right now.

Speaker 8 (52:44):
And I'm going to throw this out here, guys, because
I think what's what's happened with the transfer portal was
not not what the n C double A intended when
they when they kind of created it. It's become it's
become a leverage tool. I mean, these you know what
I'm saying. I mean they're going to the school and
they're saying, hey, I know I can get in this portal,

(53:05):
make more money.

Speaker 5 (53:05):
What can you what can you give me?

Speaker 9 (53:07):
I need more? I need more.

Speaker 8 (53:08):
And so it's become something completely different than what I
think the NC double A intended it to be.

Speaker 5 (53:14):
I don't know if they intended on anything.

Speaker 6 (53:16):
Like I'm never for calling for somebody's job, but I
think we need a whole new administration.

Speaker 5 (53:21):
I mean, I seriously think that.

Speaker 6 (53:22):
I think far as n C double A is concerned,
we need all new everything from top to bottom of it.

Speaker 4 (53:28):
Okay, here here's here's the problem with that. I can
totally agree with it, but here's the problem with it. Okay,
So me and Lisa are coming in, like what are
we doing? Like, like what what changes can we Because
the moment we touch any kind of money, the changes
that you If I was depulated, if I wouldn't even
I was, I wouldn't, that wouldn't be my first thing.

(53:49):
My first thing would be to the money's gonna come
from us, forget all the NIL stuff. So we're going
to do a revenue shame model at this level. Yes,
so it's n CUBA because that's how you regulate it,
because now hows it stands if it's a third party
in IL, just like West Virginia just passed the law,
it hasn't yet to be signed by the governor where
nonprofits can now come in and be part of the

(54:12):
school essentially and help regulate to help deal with the
NIL stuff. So if I'm the n c DOUBLEA, the
very first thing I'm doing is I'm I'm gonna have
to do like a President Trump those things start cutting
some some some fat around so I can free up
some money, and I'm going to do a revenue shame model.
So that way I can control it, because outside of that,

(54:33):
you're not going to control it.

Speaker 5 (54:33):
You can't just need limit rules.

Speaker 4 (54:35):
They don't care because they don't they don't need that body,
that government body anymore.

Speaker 8 (54:38):
It's sprald out of control now. I mean it's it's
completely out of control. It's about who has the most money,
is who's going to win. Look a look at March Madness.
What happened there?

Speaker 9 (54:47):
It was the top four number one seeds.

Speaker 8 (54:50):
The Cinderella has disappeared, It has completely decimated the Cinderella story.

Speaker 4 (54:54):
Yeah, that that's almost virtually impossible to happen.

Speaker 6 (54:57):
And it just like to the Gramblin coach when he
was saying, like, if you pick one of my players off,
you should have to do a buyout. Sure, and I
do like and I think that's competitive balance, right, I think?
So I think something something to that degree has to happen,
right because you because basically the smaller schools are just
farm teams for the bigger.

Speaker 5 (55:15):
Schools, right, And I really do.

Speaker 4 (55:18):
And if you think about it, if you sit back
and you look at it, and you say, okay, so
Gramblin loses a player to Alabama, So now Alabama now
has to pay gramblin X number of dollars or percentage
of what you're paying that player, however they want to
work that. I think that I think that is the

(55:39):
perfect I think that is perfect because I think that
allows the schools who are, like you said, are creating
these young athletes that end up jumping ship and going
somewhere bigger. You can't afford to lose those guys unless
you get unless, unless it's money in, you're getting money back.

Speaker 6 (56:00):
And and I think the n C double A they
they the money has to come from them, so that
money has to come from them in the conferences.

Speaker 5 (56:07):
So that way you can fully control because.

Speaker 6 (56:10):
Having a third party, if you have a you know,
a Jeff Bezo who is your benefactor, it's just endless,
endless money.

Speaker 8 (56:19):
And you know what else, we also have to look
at the transfer portal rules now, I mean if they've
got things like you know, the the do not contact tag.

Speaker 9 (56:26):
I mean that that's.

Speaker 8 (56:27):
A whole new level to that that I didn't even know,
I mean insisted, so, I mean, I know, it's just
there's so many things that are wrong right now with
all of it, and and and the n C Double
A is going to have to intervene.

Speaker 9 (56:41):
They have to do something.

Speaker 5 (56:42):
If they can, if they can, if they can, that's
a question.

Speaker 4 (56:46):
Well again, we in the show on on college sports
and money.

Speaker 5 (56:54):
That seems to be n I L seems to be
the way. We always got to come five, always not
coming back here.

Speaker 4 (57:00):
Ladies and gentlemen, We hope you enjoyed the show and
we'll be back again next week.

Speaker 5 (57:03):
We're out of here.

Speaker 3 (57:04):
Let's Talk with Carl Lee is probably presented by Attorney
Frank Walker. Visit Frank Walker Law dot com. Share your thoughts,
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search for Let's Talk with Carl Lee and don't forget
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(57:27):
tune in Thursday nights at seven or Sunday evenings at
eight for Let's Talk with Carl Lee.

Speaker 2 (57:32):
If you follow does it do for get back up
for your feet. Anything will be a win, yup, even defeat.
They say, shits a bath for you wise vineary sweet
couldn't play with big kids.

Speaker 5 (57:42):
I had to sit in the street and watch from
a distance. But over time I grew. If I put
in the work in.

Speaker 2 (57:47):
No time, I'm doing everything that I worked and prayed
on Moka.

Speaker 5 (57:51):
If you ask me, how did I do? What I'm
gonna say.

Speaker 2 (57:54):
You gotta work right shin just mine, gotta show everybody
is my time. You gotta work, grind shine. Never mind
who talking died this day line, don't talk.

Speaker 1 (58:05):
You gotta work. You gotta work. You gotta work. You
gotta work. You gotta work, You gotta work.