April 7, 2025 • 29 mins
Deb Krier's powerful story is a testament to the resilience of the human spirit. Diagnosed with stage four triple positive breast cancer in 2015, and later thyroid cancer in 2023, Deb transformed her adversity into action. Despite the initial shock of her diagnosis, which progressed rapidly from stage zero to stage four, Deb refused to let cancer define her.
Instead, she channeled her energy into empowering other "cancer warriors" to find strength, share their voices, and build supportive communities. Deb's journey embodies resilience, humor, and the power of connection, serving as a beacon of hope for those facing similar challenges. Her story underscores the importance of regular cancer screenings, even for younger women, and Deb's commitment to supporting others on their own transformative journeys is truly inspiring.
Deb encourages listeners to recognize their own resilience, to embrace the ups and downs, and to be their own advocate in their healthcare journey. Her motto, "Living is the only cure for cancer," resonates as a powerful message of hope and empowerment. Deb Krier shares heartfelt insights on the power of supportive communities and embracing life with passion.
Don't miss these inspiring conversations that will change your perspective on resilience, community, and the power of the human spirit. Listen now to hear how these remarkable individuals transformed their struggles into strength.
Instead, she channeled her energy into empowering other "cancer warriors" to find strength, share their voices, and build supportive communities. Deb's journey embodies resilience, humor, and the power of connection, serving as a beacon of hope for those facing similar challenges. Her story underscores the importance of regular cancer screenings, even for younger women, and Deb's commitment to supporting others on their own transformative journeys is truly inspiring.
Deb encourages listeners to recognize their own resilience, to embrace the ups and downs, and to be their own advocate in their healthcare journey. Her motto, "Living is the only cure for cancer," resonates as a powerful message of hope and empowerment. Deb Krier shares heartfelt insights on the power of supportive communities and embracing life with passion.
Don't miss these inspiring conversations that will change your perspective on resilience, community, and the power of the human spirit. Listen now to hear how these remarkable individuals transformed their struggles into strength.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
What's to do when life throws you a curveball and
you find yourself facing a stage four cancer diagnosis. Well,
on this episode of Life Jack the Resilience Podcast, I
am honored to welcome Deb Career, the founder of Trying
(00:22):
Not to Die dot Live. Dev's journey is a powerful
testament to the strength of the human spirit. After her
life was forever changed by her diagnosis a stage four
triple positive breast cancer in twenty fifteen and then later
thyroid cancer and twenty twenty three, Deb transforms her adversity
(00:49):
into action with a mission to empower cancer warriors to
find strengths, hear their voices, and build supportive commune. He
embodies resilience, humor, and connection. Join me as we for
her remarkable story of turning personal struggles into a beacon
(01:13):
of hope for others.
Speaker 2 (01:16):
Sometimes life gives us lemons, Sometimes it gives us lemonade.
Other times it gives us something entirely out of left
field that makes us say w t F. But no
matter what obstacles come, there is most often a way
out on the other side, and we are once again victorious.
(01:42):
My name is doctor Rome, and you are listening to
my podcast about resilience. Every guest shares a tragedy to
triumph story to give listeners like you the inspiration to
push through every single day. As my next guest shares
(02:03):
how they were.
Speaker 1 (02:05):
Like Jack, Hi, deb welcome. Thank you so much for
being a guest on my show. How are you?
Speaker 3 (02:11):
Oh? I am fantabulous, Doctor Roade, Thank you so much.
This is an honor to be here.
Speaker 4 (02:18):
Well, I'm most definitely happy for you to be here
as well.
Speaker 1 (02:23):
You know, I'm always excited when I get to meet
cancer warriors, you know, because just because you're diagnosed with
cancer doesn't mean it has to be a death sentence.
And so I love your attitude about everything, and I
can't wait for this interview to inspire the listeners out there.
Speaker 3 (02:42):
Well, if people could see me, I'm just granting the
ear to ear.
Speaker 4 (02:46):
I love it. Okay, Deeb.
Speaker 1 (02:48):
Now can you share what it was like to receive
the initial diagnosis for the breast cancer.
Speaker 3 (02:57):
Well, as you mentioned, it was back in twenty fifteen,
and the initial diagnosis was stage zero, so you know,
this was, hey, something we need to watch but not
be overly concerned about. And I did not have a
lump a bump or anything like that that you normally expect.
I had what they call little little bumps, tiny, tiny
(03:21):
little little things, and found out that they are typically
something that women of a certain age get in our
bodies as the hormones change, but in some cases they
start to coalesce and cause some issues. So yeah, I
really was not that concerned. I you know, spent several
months having a couple more biopsies, still nothing concerning, and
(03:46):
didn't even have an oncologist, I mean, you know, because
they kept saying, hey, you don't really need to worry
about this. And so finally my surgeon said, hey, you know,
let's go ahead and let's pull some lymph notes us
to make sure. And so they pulled the lymph nodes
and much to everyone's surprise, eight of twelve lymph nodes
were positive for cancer. And so that man, I went
(04:09):
from state zero. Yeah, nobody was more surprised than the doctor, right,
I went from stage zero to stage three, just co
plunk and you know. And then several months later I
happened to mention, hey, my my rib hurts, and we
did a really fun bone biopsy and that test came
back inconclusive and so they decided at that point let's
(04:33):
just stay stage four and not have to worry about this.
But you know, more than anything, I was annoyed. I
literally told the doctor, I am so sorry. I don't
have time for this. You know, it was like pushaw, well.
Speaker 4 (04:45):
Yeah, yeah, let me ask you.
Speaker 1 (04:48):
Did you do the normal yearly or you know, annual mammograms?
Didn't do this.
Speaker 4 (04:54):
I did SAMs And.
Speaker 3 (04:57):
You know, I was the good kid that went every
year for my Mammo gramma. And what happened was they
actually called me before I got home and said, hey,
you need to come back. Now, my background, way back,
you know, when I was probably your age. I worked
for an oncologist and for the American Cancer Society, and
so I knew being called back was not a good thing,
(05:20):
but yeah it was. You know, I really did. I
went in every year. I did exactly what I was
supposed to do. And so that was why I was
really a surprise when they started saying, hey there's something
going on. Wow, well good for you, because I'm one
of these forty something year old young women that I
just believe before not now.
Speaker 1 (05:41):
So I'm saying all this because you know, this podcast
is about resilience, and we also want to hear that
we're educating women out there, right.
Speaker 4 (05:50):
You know, I was a woman.
Speaker 1 (05:52):
I passed forty and I was told by my doctor, okay,
she would give me the order, and then I would go, okay, yeah,
I'll take care of it, okay.
Speaker 4 (06:00):
And I did forty one.
Speaker 1 (06:01):
Ten next year she'd say, hey, she said, you haven't
gone to do your mammogram.
Speaker 4 (06:06):
I said, yeah, yeah, I'll do.
Speaker 1 (06:08):
It, okay, didn't do it. Forty two came and she
was like, Renika, are you going to do this or not?
I was like, yeah, yeah, yeah, I'll get it done.
And I did not. Now I'm still okay. Forty three
last year, I did my first mammogram, I finally said.
Speaker 3 (06:24):
And it was such fun.
Speaker 4 (06:25):
It was as well. I mean, it wasn't as bad
as I thought it was going to be. But I
thought to myself, I've got.
Speaker 1 (06:32):
Three boys, and I would never forgive myself if I
had been wasting time in lying to the doctor and
to myself, and I'm going to go do this mammogram
and then find out later that I did, in fact
have some type of you know, cancer or humor lump
like you said.
Speaker 4 (06:51):
You had tiny teen tiny yell the computer song.
Speaker 3 (06:55):
The human eye could not see them.
Speaker 4 (06:57):
Mmm wow wow.
Speaker 1 (07:00):
So now I have done two mammograms. Now yay, so
I am I am a lifer. Now I am a lifer.
I planted to them every year, now, you.
Speaker 3 (07:10):
Know, and for the what five minutes of this is
really uncomfortable, It's worth it, you know. I actually had
mammograms starting fairly young because I had a non malignant
tumor removed when I was nineteen, and so starting at
about thirty was probably when I started having annual mammograms.
(07:32):
And but yeah, I mean there was there was nobody
more surprise than all of us, you know, and especially
me when they said, hey, there's a problem man.
Speaker 1 (07:41):
And so all right, you go through your breast cancer diagnosis.
She goes through the treatment and you come out. You know,
you've made it to stage four and you are still here,
and then you get the news that do you have
cancer again? At this time is in a different area
of your body? Eight?
Speaker 3 (08:01):
So I actually did not go through treatment. I have
this now. I had chosen to. I was going to
do the very traditional approach, and I tell people you
need to do what works best for you. But I
was going to do traditional I was going to do chemo.
I was going to do surgery. Then I was going
to do radiation. And so when I had my first chemo,
it was a large dose. It was eight different drugs,
(08:25):
and I got a reaction that happens less than one
percent of the time, and at that point in time,
I was the only person that ever survived it, and
I still might be. You know, it is it is.
It happens less than one percent at a time. And
my doctor had actually had another patient die from it,
so she knew exactly what to do. And so I
(08:47):
spent seven weeks in the hospital, in and out of ICU,
in and out of surgeries, and you know, it was
it was just kind of one of those things that
you know, we weren't expecting, obviously to be the about it.
And they had told me. What happened was I went
into septic shock, and I remember hearing the doctors argue
(09:08):
about how fast I was going to die that day.
I mean, you talk about life, Jack holy cow, Yeah,
you know, and I remember thinking, excuse me, I get
a vote here, and you know, and obviously I voted
and said not going to happen. But you know, and
then I did have I decided to have a double
mask stectomy, got a complication from that that my surgeon
(09:31):
had never seen. You know, if you're kind of getting
this trend now that I'm special, that's what's going on.
And so and then then I did but we you know,
it was we did tri chemo again. I had the
exact same reaction, fortunately not nearly as severe, but I
did spend another week in the hospital, and then I
sailed through radiation, which considering I am a little freckly,
(09:52):
redheaded kid, everybody was really surprised at. But then, you know,
things were going along pretty good. I did have another
round of cancer and there had basal cell carcinoma, which
sounds horrible and awful, and it's it's a very simple,
easy to treat skin cancer. And that is pretty much
because I'm this little, freckly, redheaded kid. But you know,
(10:13):
when in twenty twenty three, I had told them, excuse me,
that I was having some pain on the bad side,
you know, so the side that they had initially diagnosed cancer,
and so we ordered a cat scan and that came
back that the pain was you know, I had a
pinch nerve and no big deal. Physical therapy was going
(10:33):
to fix it. But oh, by the way, there were
two lesions on my thyroid and so I did, you know,
did some more fun tests with lots of big needles,
and that came back as positive. And so I had
what was known as papillari thyroid cancer. And it was
so funny because my doctor called and you know, when
your caller ID lights up and it's the doctor's number,
(10:55):
you're thinking that's not good. And so when she told
me I had pappellari thigt cancer, I said, oh, bad word,
bad word, bad word. And she laughed and she said,
that's why you're going to be perfectly fine. So in
twenty twenty three, they remove my thyroid gland, They remove
the entire thing, and it had not spread. We caught
it when it was very very early. But I still
(11:17):
remember thinking, really seriously, three I have three cancers.
Speaker 1 (11:22):
Wow, I mean talk about yeah, you're right, talk about
life jacks. I mean some of them get through, you know,
maybe we get one cancer, yeah.
Speaker 3 (11:31):
But yeah, I hopefully you get none.
Speaker 4 (11:34):
SPE's little girl, you had three of them.
Speaker 3 (11:37):
I know, I know, you know. I'm like, okay, I
can go back to being normal now really, man.
Speaker 1 (11:43):
So you know a lot of people when they receive
a cancer diagnosis at some point it kind of does
a transformation.
Speaker 4 (11:53):
On their lives. It does on their life, right.
Speaker 1 (11:57):
And so for you, what you see happened as you
went through, Like, what do you think happened to you?
Speaker 4 (12:05):
What was your transformation?
Speaker 3 (12:07):
You know a big part of it was that there
was a shift in how I decided to live my life,
you know, get rid of the toxic people, maybe not
read so many of the Facebook posts and right especially
last year. Oh and I enjoy life more, you know.
(12:28):
I think that was one of the things, because I
kept thinking, Okay, I've beat this. I'm actually still in
active treatment. I went in last week and had treatment.
I go in every twenty one days, get those nasty
drugs put into me, and go, well that was annoying,
and then I go merrily along. I have had because
of the septic shock, and you know, several other things
(12:50):
I am now up to I think surgery number thirty
five in nine years, you know. And so yeah, you know,
but it really was I'm just going to live my
life and I'm not going to let it stop me.
I'm not going to let anybody else stop me. I'm
not going to do things I don't want to do.
You know, It's like, nah, life, life really is too short,
(13:13):
and we need to enjoy it and do what we
can to make sure that we do enjoy it.
Speaker 4 (13:19):
I love that. I love that.
Speaker 1 (13:20):
So what inspired you to create Trying Not to Die
dot Live?
Speaker 3 (13:28):
So business coach, and what happened was I was talking
with her about business things. She knows my whole story.
She is also a very dear friend of mine, and
about three years ago she said, you know, you didn't
go through all of this without using it to help others.
And I thought, I don't wanna. I don't want to
(13:51):
be cancer girl, you know. But then I realized she
was right. I get called in to speak with students,
I get called in to speak with people who have
been just diagnosed, all sorts of things like that, and
I thought, you know, what can I do to help others?
So the try not to die part came from actually
my mother. You know, I'm an only child, and when
(14:13):
I was in extremely critical condition, of course she came
out from Kansas to be there. And one in the
times when one of my lovely medical people who are
true superheroes right came and went from my hospital room.
I got the disapproving mother face and I went and
she said, you did not say thank you? And I said, oh,
(14:34):
for God's sake, mom, I'm trying to not die. And
then you know, and it was like oh, and then
we decided, you know, dot com try not to die.
Dot com was actually taken how rude, and so we thought, okay,
dot live and make it an acronym. But it really
is about living life and you know, so it has
(14:55):
been about three years since we officially launched, and it
is about help anyone on their cancer journey, whether they
are the person with cancer or they are someone who
knows someone who has cancer. You know, because probably one
of the biggest questions I get is my friend, my wife,
my spouse, my coworker has cancer and I don't know
(15:16):
what to do and you and we also work with
medical people because they tell them, you know, I am
not my diagnosis and I am not a patient. I
am a person, and so it really is about how
to do that. But it's you know, how are we
going to as especially if you are the person who
has been diagnosed with cancer, how are you going to
advocate for yourself because you're in charge nobody else.
Speaker 4 (15:42):
And you mentioned your mother was there during your you know.
Speaker 1 (15:46):
Statements and your process, so a great experience. What was
it like for you to have a support system during
your cancer journey?
Speaker 3 (15:57):
You know, it's it is huge and it is something
that is absolutely critical for people. You know, we kind
of laugh and joke that we are a warrior. And
I tell people, I'm not a survivor. I'm I'm certainly
not a victim. I don't cancer warrior because I am
in the fight for my life. But no warrior stands alone.
We always have to have our tribe around us, you know,
(16:19):
And so I had my husband, could not have made
it through any of this without him. And then my mother,
her sister is a retired nurse practitioner, so she also
came out because she spoke that language and so she
could help. But then all my friends, you know, and
people that just I didn't even expect some of them
(16:41):
to pay me any attention, and they were fabulous. You know.
They were the people who came and drove me around.
They were the people who came and took me for
walks after I got out of the hospital. You know
all these various things, people who just would click like
on a Facebook post so that I knew they were
there supporting me. It's absolutely critical to have a great
(17:01):
support system, and sometimes some of your support system needs
to be wished to do. Right. I fired several doctors
through this process because they just weren't serving my needs.
And so I said, you know what, you're a good doctor,
but we're not a good fit.
Speaker 1 (17:18):
I've heard that often that you need to make sure
that you find a doctor.
Speaker 4 (17:22):
That you deal with right, that you're right.
Speaker 1 (17:25):
Oh yeah, that you really can, because it is truly
life or death, right, it is exact, and you do
want to have people around you that makes you feel good,
not just your pact system, but then within your doctors
as well. I think that's now you and you emphasize
the importance of humor and connection in the face of adversity.
And I mean, even throughout this interview you've s frikled
(17:47):
in a little humor and I love it. So how
are you able to laugh?
Speaker 4 (17:52):
Right? Because this is tragic? So how are you able
to laugh?
Speaker 3 (17:56):
Well? Yeah, One of the things that we know is
that humor and laughter especially actually does have physiological effects
on your body a raise, It raises endorphins, it helps
your blood pressure, it obviously helps your mental health, all
sorts of things like that, and so yeah, I try
and bring as much humor as possible. I also try
(18:18):
to make my caregivers laugh. Right, They've got a really
hard job, and can I make them laugh?
Speaker 4 (18:25):
You know.
Speaker 3 (18:25):
I had to have a little bit of surgery several
weeks ago, and they chose not to knock me out,
and I told them, you're you're probably gonna regret that,
you know, and and so but they, you know, one
of the things they told me was now they got
me in this position and they said, now you do
not move. Now, that for me is hard. I'm, you know,
as a hyperactive little kid as can be, but I'm
(18:47):
you know, frozen in this position. And before Christmas so
that you know, they've got Christmas music playing in the
surgical suite and the Charlie Brown song came on, you
know that, And so what I do. I yell everybody dance,
so you know, my little toes are moving because that's
(19:07):
about all I could move, and I couldn't see they
had draped my face and I'm like, are y'all dancing?
Y'all dancing, and I heard a couple of grunts, so
I don't know if they really danced or not. But
when we were done, I told them, I said, I'm sorry,
you know, I'm sorry. I gibber jabbered, and they all
told me, we really appreciated it. You made our day.
Speaker 4 (19:27):
I love that.
Speaker 1 (19:28):
Now. I know everybody's experience is different, and no one
goes through the same experience. If they are going through
their fight with cancer, right, it's for them to be
the warrior up next. Right, But what advice would you
give to those who may feel overwhelmed or isolated in
(19:50):
their own battle against cancer.
Speaker 3 (19:53):
The first thing is, it is very natural to feel
those feelings. You're gonna be angry, You're going to be scared,
you're going to you know, it's much like grief. Right,
we start bargaining all eat well for the rest of
my life, you know, all of those various things. But
reach out to people. People really do want to help,
(20:14):
but they don't read our minds, so we have to say, hey,
I need this, could you do that?
Speaker 1 (20:19):
You know?
Speaker 3 (20:20):
And and there are times where obviously it might actually
take professional help. Maybe it's a minister, maybe it is
a counselor you know, but don't go through this alone.
Make sure that you have people, you know, support group,
whatever it is that you need to share this journey with.
You know, everybody. It is very true, very different for
(20:41):
every single person, but we all kind of have the
same feelings as we're going through it. So it's very
important to acknowledge those and honor them. I had somebody
that told me, you know, give yourself a little grace
when you're not feeling good, when you're feeling cranky and pitiful,
and then go on, you know, And so yeah, it's
(21:01):
it's perfectly natural to feel all those things. It'd be
kind of weird if we didn't, you know. And and
but reach out to folks and let them help you
and know that you might actually be helping them.
Speaker 1 (21:13):
One of the things that I've noticed about people who
have gone through something very painful is that the strength
comes in and they're able to take their pain and
try it into purpose. Like I've done with this podcast,
is it was being like left and right, like things
are just happening. I was going through this crisis after
(21:37):
crisis just I mean it was just insane all and
I mean they weren't the same crisis. I mean they
were all different crisis crisy right, all at one time,
and I was like.
Speaker 3 (21:47):
Lord, like not really.
Speaker 4 (21:50):
Anymore, you know, right?
Speaker 1 (21:53):
But you know I have birth this podcast right to
help others who are also going through these moments or
if they just need a little bit of hope, just
a beacon.
Speaker 3 (22:05):
Right.
Speaker 1 (22:05):
So you doing, you know, creating, trying not to die,
dot live, and you have turned your pain into purpose.
So what do you feel you have gotten in this process?
Speaker 3 (22:21):
You know, hopefully I've made a difference with people, you know,
and helped them through it. I actually, you know, have
somebody that just today went and had their first appointment
with all their doctors, and so right before and right
after they were texting me, and you know before I
was telling them, make sure you have all your questions
written down, don't leave if your questions have not been answered,
(22:45):
all these various things. I've gained some really wonderful friends
in this entire process. You know, my oncologist is a
very special friend of mine. And you know, just along
the way, I think you do. You know, there are
some people that disappeared, people that I thought would be
my biggest supporters, no dropped off the face of the earth,
(23:09):
and I thought, I guess that friendship was done. But
in other cases, it's like, wow, you know, it really
has been gratifying, and I really do hope that you know,
I can help people, even if it's just as simple
as hey, don't leave that room until you've got your
questions answered.
Speaker 4 (23:26):
I love that.
Speaker 1 (23:28):
So you have a motto, would you mind sharing that
model with the listeners.
Speaker 3 (23:35):
One of the things I say is living is the
only cure for cancer. And of course I'm not talking
about your curing the cancer. What we're talking about is
that your cancer is just a very small part of
who you are, and so you need to live your
life and just kind of put it in perspective. You know,
(23:57):
there are times where it's going to be a little overwhelming,
times where so much, but living your life is the
most important thing. And you know, even if it's a
very short period of time, how are you going to
live those those last hours, in those last days.
Speaker 4 (24:13):
I love that.
Speaker 1 (24:14):
At first, when I saw that you have that motto,
I was thinking, well, of first, living is secure. You
don't want to die, right, But I never thought of
it that.
Speaker 4 (24:23):
Way, that you don't let it become you in your
whole entire exit, right, but you.
Speaker 1 (24:29):
Still live within it, you like, you still on your life.
And I mean it's just as you know, you kind
of treat it. I guess that's the same as when
your roof falls in of your house after a heard Okay.
Speaker 3 (24:41):
Yeah, you're like ah, and you deal with it and
you go on. You know, it's it's different and you
have to acknowledge that. But yeah, I mean, you know
you you just keep going.
Speaker 1 (24:52):
Oh, yes, absolutely so. I know everybody has their own
opinion about how to build resilience, right, and some times
people say that no time fits.
Speaker 4 (25:02):
All, and you know, people have to do whatever they
have to do. But of course this podcast is about resilience,
and we could.
Speaker 1 (25:09):
Right in this interview without you sharing your opinion on
the best way to build resilience.
Speaker 3 (25:19):
I think it is to recognize that we are human,
that we can have the pain, we can have the
pity parties, you know, and then we we just need
to go on. And you know it's but we have
to be as as I mentioned before, we are the
people in charge, you know, not my doctors, not my husband,
(25:40):
not anybody. I am the person in charge of how
I'm going to live the rest of my life, you know,
however long it is, and just keep going. I mean,
you know there are times like when like like we said,
you know, when the doctor called to tell me I
had a third cancer and I was like, well, bad word,
bad word, bad word, right, you know, and you know
that was that was the thing. It was like, Okay,
(26:03):
what do we need to do? You know, you pause
and you do think bad word, bad word, bad word,
You might cry, you know, whatever it is that you
need to do, but then you go on, you know,
and are you going to go backwards? Sometimes yes, but
the key is you need to just get up and
go forward again.
Speaker 4 (26:23):
I love that. I love that. Well, I can't believe
our time is up.
Speaker 3 (26:28):
I know, I've been watching the clock.
Speaker 4 (26:30):
I'm like, no, no, Well yeah.
Speaker 1 (26:34):
For sharing your inspiring journey and insights with us today
as a guest on Life Stacks the Resilience Podcast, your
ability to transform personal challenges into a powerful mission of
empowerment and connection is truly remarkable.
Speaker 4 (26:54):
Now as we conclude.
Speaker 1 (26:55):
Remember that we I mean, we have to remember that
resilience is not just about enduring, but about thriving and
listing others along the way, and I love that we
have to remember that because you said it your motto,
living is the only cure for cancers. Living but not living,
not dying, but actually living right doing, just living your
(27:19):
life in.
Speaker 4 (27:19):
The midst of it. So how can listeners find and
connect with you?
Speaker 3 (27:26):
Well, again, thank you so much. This has been such
an honor to be chatting with you and such a
delight easy way is to go to my website trying
not to Die dot live and actually dot com works
now too, but trying not to Die dot live. And
the big thing there is you will see a link
to our private Facebook page. So I encourage anyone to
(27:46):
connect with us on Facebook. We have a lot of
fun there, we have a lot of inspiration, a lot
of support, so you know, feel free to do that.
And my my information on how to connect with me
is there also wonderful.
Speaker 4 (28:02):
Any last words of encouragement for the listeners, I.
Speaker 3 (28:06):
Would say, remember that you are the one in charge.
You are your own advocate. You need to make sure
that people know what your wishes are and you need
to make sure that they happen no matter what they are.
You are the person that is in charge. You are the.
Speaker 1 (28:20):
Warrior that I appreciate the insights you've shared, and I
hope the listeners take away the importance of building supportive
communities and embracing life whole heartedly. I wish you and
your family nothing but blessings and abundance.
Speaker 4 (28:35):
Please take care you also their career.
Speaker 1 (28:39):
Everyone be sure to join me next time for more
uplifting stories and insights on resilience. Until then, keep pushing forward,
embrace the journey, and remember that every fitback can lead
to a greater comeback. Doctor Rowe signing off.
What's to do when life throws you a curveball and
you find yourself facing a stage four cancer diagnosis. Well,
on this episode of Life Jack the Resilience Podcast, I
am honored to welcome Deb Career, the founder of Trying
(00:22):
Not to Die dot Live. Dev's journey is a powerful
testament to the strength of the human spirit. After her
life was forever changed by her diagnosis a stage four
triple positive breast cancer in twenty fifteen and then later
thyroid cancer and twenty twenty three, Deb transforms her adversity
(00:49):
into action with a mission to empower cancer warriors to
find strengths, hear their voices, and build supportive commune. He
embodies resilience, humor, and connection. Join me as we for
her remarkable story of turning personal struggles into a beacon
(01:13):
of hope for others.
Speaker 2 (01:16):
Sometimes life gives us lemons, Sometimes it gives us lemonade.
Other times it gives us something entirely out of left
field that makes us say w t F. But no
matter what obstacles come, there is most often a way
out on the other side, and we are once again victorious.
(01:42):
My name is doctor Rome, and you are listening to
my podcast about resilience. Every guest shares a tragedy to
triumph story to give listeners like you the inspiration to
push through every single day. As my next guest shares
(02:03):
how they were.
Speaker 1 (02:05):
Like Jack, Hi, deb welcome. Thank you so much for
being a guest on my show. How are you?
Speaker 3 (02:11):
Oh? I am fantabulous, Doctor Roade, Thank you so much.
This is an honor to be here.
Speaker 4 (02:18):
Well, I'm most definitely happy for you to be here
as well.
Speaker 1 (02:23):
You know, I'm always excited when I get to meet
cancer warriors, you know, because just because you're diagnosed with
cancer doesn't mean it has to be a death sentence.
And so I love your attitude about everything, and I
can't wait for this interview to inspire the listeners out there.
Speaker 3 (02:42):
Well, if people could see me, I'm just granting the
ear to ear.
Speaker 4 (02:46):
I love it. Okay, Deeb.
Speaker 1 (02:48):
Now can you share what it was like to receive
the initial diagnosis for the breast cancer.
Speaker 3 (02:57):
Well, as you mentioned, it was back in twenty fifteen,
and the initial diagnosis was stage zero, so you know,
this was, hey, something we need to watch but not
be overly concerned about. And I did not have a
lump a bump or anything like that that you normally expect.
I had what they call little little bumps, tiny, tiny
(03:21):
little little things, and found out that they are typically
something that women of a certain age get in our
bodies as the hormones change, but in some cases they
start to coalesce and cause some issues. So yeah, I
really was not that concerned. I you know, spent several
months having a couple more biopsies, still nothing concerning, and
(03:46):
didn't even have an oncologist, I mean, you know, because
they kept saying, hey, you don't really need to worry
about this. And so finally my surgeon said, hey, you know,
let's go ahead and let's pull some lymph notes us
to make sure. And so they pulled the lymph nodes
and much to everyone's surprise, eight of twelve lymph nodes
were positive for cancer. And so that man, I went
(04:09):
from state zero. Yeah, nobody was more surprised than the doctor, right,
I went from stage zero to stage three, just co
plunk and you know. And then several months later I
happened to mention, hey, my my rib hurts, and we
did a really fun bone biopsy and that test came
back inconclusive and so they decided at that point let's
(04:33):
just stay stage four and not have to worry about this.
But you know, more than anything, I was annoyed. I
literally told the doctor, I am so sorry. I don't
have time for this. You know, it was like pushaw, well.
Speaker 4 (04:45):
Yeah, yeah, let me ask you.
Speaker 1 (04:48):
Did you do the normal yearly or you know, annual mammograms?
Didn't do this.
Speaker 4 (04:54):
I did SAMs And.
Speaker 3 (04:57):
You know, I was the good kid that went every
year for my Mammo gramma. And what happened was they
actually called me before I got home and said, hey,
you need to come back. Now, my background, way back,
you know, when I was probably your age. I worked
for an oncologist and for the American Cancer Society, and
so I knew being called back was not a good thing,
(05:20):
but yeah it was. You know, I really did. I
went in every year. I did exactly what I was
supposed to do. And so that was why I was
really a surprise when they started saying, hey there's something
going on. Wow, well good for you, because I'm one
of these forty something year old young women that I
just believe before not now.
Speaker 1 (05:41):
So I'm saying all this because you know, this podcast
is about resilience, and we also want to hear that
we're educating women out there, right.
Speaker 4 (05:50):
You know, I was a woman.
Speaker 1 (05:52):
I passed forty and I was told by my doctor, okay,
she would give me the order, and then I would go, okay, yeah,
I'll take care of it, okay.
Speaker 4 (06:00):
And I did forty one.
Speaker 1 (06:01):
Ten next year she'd say, hey, she said, you haven't
gone to do your mammogram.
Speaker 4 (06:06):
I said, yeah, yeah, I'll do.
Speaker 1 (06:08):
It, okay, didn't do it. Forty two came and she
was like, Renika, are you going to do this or not?
I was like, yeah, yeah, yeah, I'll get it done.
And I did not. Now I'm still okay. Forty three
last year, I did my first mammogram, I finally said.
Speaker 3 (06:24):
And it was such fun.
Speaker 4 (06:25):
It was as well. I mean, it wasn't as bad
as I thought it was going to be. But I
thought to myself, I've got.
Speaker 1 (06:32):
Three boys, and I would never forgive myself if I
had been wasting time in lying to the doctor and
to myself, and I'm going to go do this mammogram
and then find out later that I did, in fact
have some type of you know, cancer or humor lump
like you said.
Speaker 4 (06:51):
You had tiny teen tiny yell the computer song.
Speaker 3 (06:55):
The human eye could not see them.
Speaker 4 (06:57):
Mmm wow wow.
Speaker 1 (07:00):
So now I have done two mammograms. Now yay, so
I am I am a lifer. Now I am a lifer.
I planted to them every year, now, you.
Speaker 3 (07:10):
Know, and for the what five minutes of this is
really uncomfortable, It's worth it, you know. I actually had
mammograms starting fairly young because I had a non malignant
tumor removed when I was nineteen, and so starting at
about thirty was probably when I started having annual mammograms.
(07:32):
And but yeah, I mean there was there was nobody
more surprise than all of us, you know, and especially
me when they said, hey, there's a problem man.
Speaker 1 (07:41):
And so all right, you go through your breast cancer diagnosis.
She goes through the treatment and you come out. You know,
you've made it to stage four and you are still here,
and then you get the news that do you have
cancer again? At this time is in a different area
of your body? Eight?
Speaker 3 (08:01):
So I actually did not go through treatment. I have
this now. I had chosen to. I was going to
do the very traditional approach, and I tell people you
need to do what works best for you. But I
was going to do traditional I was going to do chemo.
I was going to do surgery. Then I was going
to do radiation. And so when I had my first chemo,
it was a large dose. It was eight different drugs,
(08:25):
and I got a reaction that happens less than one
percent of the time, and at that point in time,
I was the only person that ever survived it, and
I still might be. You know, it is it is.
It happens less than one percent at a time. And
my doctor had actually had another patient die from it,
so she knew exactly what to do. And so I
(08:47):
spent seven weeks in the hospital, in and out of ICU,
in and out of surgeries, and you know, it was
it was just kind of one of those things that
you know, we weren't expecting, obviously to be the about it.
And they had told me. What happened was I went
into septic shock, and I remember hearing the doctors argue
(09:08):
about how fast I was going to die that day.
I mean, you talk about life, Jack holy cow, Yeah,
you know, and I remember thinking, excuse me, I get
a vote here, and you know, and obviously I voted
and said not going to happen. But you know, and
then I did have I decided to have a double
mask stectomy, got a complication from that that my surgeon
(09:31):
had never seen. You know, if you're kind of getting
this trend now that I'm special, that's what's going on.
And so and then then I did but we you know,
it was we did tri chemo again. I had the
exact same reaction, fortunately not nearly as severe, but I
did spend another week in the hospital, and then I
sailed through radiation, which considering I am a little freckly,
(09:52):
redheaded kid, everybody was really surprised at. But then, you know,
things were going along pretty good. I did have another
round of cancer and there had basal cell carcinoma, which
sounds horrible and awful, and it's it's a very simple,
easy to treat skin cancer. And that is pretty much
because I'm this little, freckly, redheaded kid. But you know,
(10:13):
when in twenty twenty three, I had told them, excuse me,
that I was having some pain on the bad side,
you know, so the side that they had initially diagnosed cancer,
and so we ordered a cat scan and that came
back that the pain was you know, I had a
pinch nerve and no big deal. Physical therapy was going
(10:33):
to fix it. But oh, by the way, there were
two lesions on my thyroid and so I did, you know,
did some more fun tests with lots of big needles,
and that came back as positive. And so I had
what was known as papillari thyroid cancer. And it was
so funny because my doctor called and you know, when
your caller ID lights up and it's the doctor's number,
(10:55):
you're thinking that's not good. And so when she told
me I had pappellari thigt cancer, I said, oh, bad word,
bad word, bad word. And she laughed and she said,
that's why you're going to be perfectly fine. So in
twenty twenty three, they remove my thyroid gland, They remove
the entire thing, and it had not spread. We caught
it when it was very very early. But I still
(11:17):
remember thinking, really seriously, three I have three cancers.
Speaker 1 (11:22):
Wow, I mean talk about yeah, you're right, talk about
life jacks. I mean some of them get through, you know,
maybe we get one cancer, yeah.
Speaker 3 (11:31):
But yeah, I hopefully you get none.
Speaker 4 (11:34):
SPE's little girl, you had three of them.
Speaker 3 (11:37):
I know, I know, you know. I'm like, okay, I
can go back to being normal now really, man.
Speaker 1 (11:43):
So you know a lot of people when they receive
a cancer diagnosis at some point it kind of does
a transformation.
Speaker 4 (11:53):
On their lives. It does on their life, right.
Speaker 1 (11:57):
And so for you, what you see happened as you
went through, Like, what do you think happened to you?
Speaker 4 (12:05):
What was your transformation?
Speaker 3 (12:07):
You know a big part of it was that there
was a shift in how I decided to live my life,
you know, get rid of the toxic people, maybe not
read so many of the Facebook posts and right especially
last year. Oh and I enjoy life more, you know.
(12:28):
I think that was one of the things, because I
kept thinking, Okay, I've beat this. I'm actually still in
active treatment. I went in last week and had treatment.
I go in every twenty one days, get those nasty
drugs put into me, and go, well that was annoying,
and then I go merrily along. I have had because
of the septic shock, and you know, several other things
(12:50):
I am now up to I think surgery number thirty
five in nine years, you know. And so yeah, you know,
but it really was I'm just going to live my
life and I'm not going to let it stop me.
I'm not going to let anybody else stop me. I'm
not going to do things I don't want to do.
You know, It's like, nah, life, life really is too short,
(13:13):
and we need to enjoy it and do what we
can to make sure that we do enjoy it.
Speaker 4 (13:19):
I love that. I love that.
Speaker 1 (13:20):
So what inspired you to create Trying Not to Die
dot Live?
Speaker 3 (13:28):
So business coach, and what happened was I was talking
with her about business things. She knows my whole story.
She is also a very dear friend of mine, and
about three years ago she said, you know, you didn't
go through all of this without using it to help others.
And I thought, I don't wanna. I don't want to
(13:51):
be cancer girl, you know. But then I realized she
was right. I get called in to speak with students,
I get called in to speak with people who have
been just diagnosed, all sorts of things like that, and
I thought, you know, what can I do to help others?
So the try not to die part came from actually
my mother. You know, I'm an only child, and when
(14:13):
I was in extremely critical condition, of course she came
out from Kansas to be there. And one in the
times when one of my lovely medical people who are
true superheroes right came and went from my hospital room.
I got the disapproving mother face and I went and
she said, you did not say thank you? And I said, oh,
(14:34):
for God's sake, mom, I'm trying to not die. And
then you know, and it was like oh, and then
we decided, you know, dot com try not to die.
Dot com was actually taken how rude, and so we thought, okay,
dot live and make it an acronym. But it really
is about living life and you know, so it has
(14:55):
been about three years since we officially launched, and it
is about help anyone on their cancer journey, whether they
are the person with cancer or they are someone who
knows someone who has cancer. You know, because probably one
of the biggest questions I get is my friend, my wife,
my spouse, my coworker has cancer and I don't know
(15:16):
what to do and you and we also work with
medical people because they tell them, you know, I am
not my diagnosis and I am not a patient. I
am a person, and so it really is about how
to do that. But it's you know, how are we
going to as especially if you are the person who
has been diagnosed with cancer, how are you going to
advocate for yourself because you're in charge nobody else.
Speaker 4 (15:42):
And you mentioned your mother was there during your you know.
Speaker 1 (15:46):
Statements and your process, so a great experience. What was
it like for you to have a support system during
your cancer journey?
Speaker 3 (15:57):
You know, it's it is huge and it is something
that is absolutely critical for people. You know, we kind
of laugh and joke that we are a warrior. And
I tell people, I'm not a survivor. I'm I'm certainly
not a victim. I don't cancer warrior because I am
in the fight for my life. But no warrior stands alone.
We always have to have our tribe around us, you know,
(16:19):
And so I had my husband, could not have made
it through any of this without him. And then my mother,
her sister is a retired nurse practitioner, so she also
came out because she spoke that language and so she
could help. But then all my friends, you know, and
people that just I didn't even expect some of them
(16:41):
to pay me any attention, and they were fabulous. You know.
They were the people who came and drove me around.
They were the people who came and took me for
walks after I got out of the hospital. You know
all these various things, people who just would click like
on a Facebook post so that I knew they were
there supporting me. It's absolutely critical to have a great
(17:01):
support system, and sometimes some of your support system needs
to be wished to do. Right. I fired several doctors
through this process because they just weren't serving my needs.
And so I said, you know what, you're a good doctor,
but we're not a good fit.
Speaker 1 (17:18):
I've heard that often that you need to make sure
that you find a doctor.
Speaker 4 (17:22):
That you deal with right, that you're right.
Speaker 1 (17:25):
Oh yeah, that you really can, because it is truly
life or death, right, it is exact, and you do
want to have people around you that makes you feel good,
not just your pact system, but then within your doctors
as well. I think that's now you and you emphasize
the importance of humor and connection in the face of adversity.
And I mean, even throughout this interview you've s frikled
(17:47):
in a little humor and I love it. So how
are you able to laugh?
Speaker 4 (17:52):
Right? Because this is tragic? So how are you able
to laugh?
Speaker 3 (17:56):
Well? Yeah, One of the things that we know is
that humor and laughter especially actually does have physiological effects
on your body a raise, It raises endorphins, it helps
your blood pressure, it obviously helps your mental health, all
sorts of things like that, and so yeah, I try
and bring as much humor as possible. I also try
(18:18):
to make my caregivers laugh. Right, They've got a really
hard job, and can I make them laugh?
Speaker 4 (18:25):
You know.
Speaker 3 (18:25):
I had to have a little bit of surgery several
weeks ago, and they chose not to knock me out,
and I told them, you're you're probably gonna regret that,
you know, and and so but they, you know, one
of the things they told me was now they got
me in this position and they said, now you do
not move. Now, that for me is hard. I'm, you know,
as a hyperactive little kid as can be, but I'm
(18:47):
you know, frozen in this position. And before Christmas so
that you know, they've got Christmas music playing in the
surgical suite and the Charlie Brown song came on, you
know that, And so what I do. I yell everybody dance,
so you know, my little toes are moving because that's
(19:07):
about all I could move, and I couldn't see they
had draped my face and I'm like, are y'all dancing?
Y'all dancing, and I heard a couple of grunts, so
I don't know if they really danced or not. But
when we were done, I told them, I said, I'm sorry,
you know, I'm sorry. I gibber jabbered, and they all
told me, we really appreciated it. You made our day.
Speaker 4 (19:27):
I love that.
Speaker 1 (19:28):
Now. I know everybody's experience is different, and no one
goes through the same experience. If they are going through
their fight with cancer, right, it's for them to be
the warrior up next. Right, But what advice would you
give to those who may feel overwhelmed or isolated in
(19:50):
their own battle against cancer.
Speaker 3 (19:53):
The first thing is, it is very natural to feel
those feelings. You're gonna be angry, You're going to be scared,
you're going to you know, it's much like grief. Right,
we start bargaining all eat well for the rest of
my life, you know, all of those various things. But
reach out to people. People really do want to help,
(20:14):
but they don't read our minds, so we have to say, hey,
I need this, could you do that?
Speaker 1 (20:19):
You know?
Speaker 3 (20:20):
And and there are times where obviously it might actually
take professional help. Maybe it's a minister, maybe it is
a counselor you know, but don't go through this alone.
Make sure that you have people, you know, support group,
whatever it is that you need to share this journey with.
You know, everybody. It is very true, very different for
(20:41):
every single person, but we all kind of have the
same feelings as we're going through it. So it's very
important to acknowledge those and honor them. I had somebody
that told me, you know, give yourself a little grace
when you're not feeling good, when you're feeling cranky and pitiful,
and then go on, you know, And so yeah, it's
(21:01):
it's perfectly natural to feel all those things. It'd be
kind of weird if we didn't, you know. And and
but reach out to folks and let them help you
and know that you might actually be helping them.
Speaker 1 (21:13):
One of the things that I've noticed about people who
have gone through something very painful is that the strength
comes in and they're able to take their pain and
try it into purpose. Like I've done with this podcast,
is it was being like left and right, like things
are just happening. I was going through this crisis after
(21:37):
crisis just I mean it was just insane all and
I mean they weren't the same crisis. I mean they
were all different crisis crisy right, all at one time,
and I was like.
Speaker 3 (21:47):
Lord, like not really.
Speaker 4 (21:50):
Anymore, you know, right?
Speaker 1 (21:53):
But you know I have birth this podcast right to
help others who are also going through these moments or
if they just need a little bit of hope, just
a beacon.
Speaker 3 (22:05):
Right.
Speaker 1 (22:05):
So you doing, you know, creating, trying not to die,
dot live, and you have turned your pain into purpose.
So what do you feel you have gotten in this process?
Speaker 3 (22:21):
You know, hopefully I've made a difference with people, you know,
and helped them through it. I actually, you know, have
somebody that just today went and had their first appointment
with all their doctors, and so right before and right
after they were texting me, and you know before I
was telling them, make sure you have all your questions
written down, don't leave if your questions have not been answered,
(22:45):
all these various things. I've gained some really wonderful friends
in this entire process. You know, my oncologist is a
very special friend of mine. And you know, just along
the way, I think you do. You know, there are
some people that disappeared, people that I thought would be
my biggest supporters, no dropped off the face of the earth,
(23:09):
and I thought, I guess that friendship was done. But
in other cases, it's like, wow, you know, it really
has been gratifying, and I really do hope that you know,
I can help people, even if it's just as simple
as hey, don't leave that room until you've got your
questions answered.
Speaker 4 (23:26):
I love that.
Speaker 1 (23:28):
So you have a motto, would you mind sharing that
model with the listeners.
Speaker 3 (23:35):
One of the things I say is living is the
only cure for cancer. And of course I'm not talking
about your curing the cancer. What we're talking about is
that your cancer is just a very small part of
who you are, and so you need to live your
life and just kind of put it in perspective. You know,
(23:57):
there are times where it's going to be a little overwhelming,
times where so much, but living your life is the
most important thing. And you know, even if it's a
very short period of time, how are you going to
live those those last hours, in those last days.
Speaker 4 (24:13):
I love that.
Speaker 1 (24:14):
At first, when I saw that you have that motto,
I was thinking, well, of first, living is secure. You
don't want to die, right, But I never thought of
it that.
Speaker 4 (24:23):
Way, that you don't let it become you in your
whole entire exit, right, but you.
Speaker 1 (24:29):
Still live within it, you like, you still on your life.
And I mean it's just as you know, you kind
of treat it. I guess that's the same as when
your roof falls in of your house after a heard Okay.
Speaker 3 (24:41):
Yeah, you're like ah, and you deal with it and
you go on. You know, it's it's different and you
have to acknowledge that. But yeah, I mean, you know
you you just keep going.
Speaker 1 (24:52):
Oh, yes, absolutely so. I know everybody has their own
opinion about how to build resilience, right, and some times
people say that no time fits.
Speaker 4 (25:02):
All, and you know, people have to do whatever they
have to do. But of course this podcast is about resilience,
and we could.
Speaker 1 (25:09):
Right in this interview without you sharing your opinion on
the best way to build resilience.
Speaker 3 (25:19):
I think it is to recognize that we are human,
that we can have the pain, we can have the
pity parties, you know, and then we we just need
to go on. And you know it's but we have
to be as as I mentioned before, we are the
people in charge, you know, not my doctors, not my husband,
(25:40):
not anybody. I am the person in charge of how
I'm going to live the rest of my life, you know,
however long it is, and just keep going. I mean,
you know there are times like when like like we said,
you know, when the doctor called to tell me I
had a third cancer and I was like, well, bad word,
bad word, bad word, right, you know, and you know
that was that was the thing. It was like, Okay,
(26:03):
what do we need to do? You know, you pause
and you do think bad word, bad word, bad word,
You might cry, you know, whatever it is that you
need to do, but then you go on, you know,
and are you going to go backwards? Sometimes yes, but
the key is you need to just get up and
go forward again.
Speaker 4 (26:23):
I love that. I love that. Well, I can't believe
our time is up.
Speaker 3 (26:28):
I know, I've been watching the clock.
Speaker 4 (26:30):
I'm like, no, no, Well yeah.
Speaker 1 (26:34):
For sharing your inspiring journey and insights with us today
as a guest on Life Stacks the Resilience Podcast, your
ability to transform personal challenges into a powerful mission of
empowerment and connection is truly remarkable.
Speaker 4 (26:54):
Now as we conclude.
Speaker 1 (26:55):
Remember that we I mean, we have to remember that
resilience is not just about enduring, but about thriving and
listing others along the way, and I love that we
have to remember that because you said it your motto,
living is the only cure for cancers. Living but not living,
not dying, but actually living right doing, just living your
(27:19):
life in.
Speaker 4 (27:19):
The midst of it. So how can listeners find and
connect with you?
Speaker 3 (27:26):
Well, again, thank you so much. This has been such
an honor to be chatting with you and such a
delight easy way is to go to my website trying
not to Die dot live and actually dot com works
now too, but trying not to Die dot live. And
the big thing there is you will see a link
to our private Facebook page. So I encourage anyone to
(27:46):
connect with us on Facebook. We have a lot of
fun there, we have a lot of inspiration, a lot
of support, so you know, feel free to do that.
And my my information on how to connect with me
is there also wonderful.
Speaker 4 (28:02):
Any last words of encouragement for the listeners, I.
Speaker 3 (28:06):
Would say, remember that you are the one in charge.
You are your own advocate. You need to make sure
that people know what your wishes are and you need
to make sure that they happen no matter what they are.
You are the person that is in charge. You are the.
Speaker 1 (28:20):
Warrior that I appreciate the insights you've shared, and I
hope the listeners take away the importance of building supportive
communities and embracing life whole heartedly. I wish you and
your family nothing but blessings and abundance.
Speaker 4 (28:35):
Please take care you also their career.
Speaker 1 (28:39):
Everyone be sure to join me next time for more
uplifting stories and insights on resilience. Until then, keep pushing forward,
embrace the journey, and remember that every fitback can lead
to a greater comeback. Doctor Rowe signing off.
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