March 24, 2025 • 9 mins
OHSAA Executive Director Doug Ute was on the show Monday. Todd Walker discussed many topics with Doug, including the new seven-division format for HS basketball, whether that new setup is a windfall for the organization, what they do with their "profits", the possibility of modifying the State Tournament format to eliminate the week off between the semifinals and the finals and the potential of moving the football championship games to the proposed Browns domed stadium.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
Boys stayed basketball tournament here at u D Arena, and
HSA Commissioner Doug Ute is with us. We've seen really
good games here thus far tonight, Doug, some good matchups
and I know the first year of the seven divisions
you wondered how it would all shake out to the
championship games. So far the draw has been kind. As
far as great games here are U.
Speaker 2 (00:20):
D oh absolutely and you know it just you know
with with going to the reason we went to seven
is to reduce that disparity in student enrollment where and
I supposed your child for us was Lewisville, who's a
small D one and went to D three this year,
played similar size schools and here they come down here
and so and they bring their community with them, and
(00:42):
you know that school is a focus of that community.
And we've seen that with a support and we've seen
when schools teams getting down here.
Speaker 1 (00:49):
Clearly, there was some consternation about going to seven divisions
and some tumult with the first of all, the break
between the semifinals and the finals. I think you guys
would like to eliminate that as well. What have we
learned from the first go around with seven divisions. That
are things you'd hope to correct next year.
Speaker 2 (01:08):
Yeah. Well, as I mentioned, it did what we wanted
it to do, but logistics are something todd we have
to continue to look at. And we're just now talking
to our member schools. I just talked to the coach
of Rushie because he's been here old style and he
and he's here new style, and you know, talk to
him about the venue. He loved the venue and atmosphere
(01:29):
at Bowling Green, but not a fan of having that
one game one weekend and not another game to the
next and this time of year, and and so those
are the things we're trying to figure out. You know,
we put our young ladies in some great environments at
their high schools, and you know, I personally was at
a light of high school and watched two Division six
(01:49):
and seven semis and I'm not sure you can be
in a better environment. And then you know, last weekend
I was not there because I was at Right State,
but the camp and field House.
Speaker 3 (02:01):
You know, everybody I talked.
Speaker 2 (02:02):
To about the environments that they played in that But
but you know, we we're just continue looking at what's
what are some other options can we use? Right State
and date in the same weekend. And you know one thing,
if we go old style, in other words, you do
the semis in the finals the same weekend. We don't
want to calls our schools and our communities a lot
(02:23):
of expense. So it's in one day and out the
next in terms of games, so you play back to back.
We can work that out. And so we're looking at
all those different things right now.
Speaker 1 (02:32):
You know the other thing that you know, whether you
wanted to go to seven divisions or not, from a
general perspective, there's this narrative out there that you guys
meaning the UHSA, did it to create more streams of
revenue and all this cash flow or something, this big
windfall of cash. That's the thing that I object to
(02:54):
people that say, that's why you did it. But from
the financial standpoint, what does this wash out to for
the organization as a whole, to have seven divisions and
all these sports.
Speaker 3 (03:05):
Is this a big windfall profit for you? No?
Speaker 2 (03:08):
You know, we do have the records from the fall
with soccer and volleyball, and no, there was no more
or no less money because the same amount of games.
And so we have proof of that. From that standpoint,
and it's still too early to nail down this winner,
but early indications are we might have lost a little
(03:29):
bit of money doing this. And you know, we're school people.
Just like our schools. Everything we do is for our
student athletes, and I get it, but you want to
see the You know, we are very transparent about our
finances to our membership, and so we have the proof
now that hey, it did what we thought it would
do financially, wouldn't gain a lot of money, wouldn't lose
a lot of money, and the winner looks the same.
Speaker 1 (03:50):
Speaking of the money situation, when you first came in,
you were candid about the dire straits at that point
for the HSAA, and.
Speaker 3 (03:58):
COVID certainly made it worse right as you had started.
Speaker 1 (04:01):
And now you feel like you're on solid footing. Is
there some kind of recompense to the schools on a
yearly basis or those that.
Speaker 3 (04:09):
Make it the state tournament? Talk about that?
Speaker 2 (04:11):
Yeah, we created so so five years ago, you know,
going into COVID, we were we were a little bit
more in a month's cash on hand, and to be
honest with you, the trends were saying in about a year,
year and a half, we were we were gonna go bankrupt.
I mean, we're out done. So it's very important my
school superintendent days twenty years of that and well beyond administratively,
(04:34):
is to get nine months cash on hand. That is
something that we felt like if COVID hit or something hit,
we didn't take in any revenues, we could survive a
year without touching our member schools. Because that's the thing
I saw COVID is that our members schools weren't getting
any money either. And so for us to have tournaments
and you know, Todd, you were there, we had we
were one of the very few states that had those
(04:55):
kind of tournaments that still gave our kids a good experience.
So so two years ago we had that nine months
cash on hand. In the last two years, we've established
a fund at the end of the year, we're going
to turn the corner at nine months. Anything above that
we get back to our members school. So we did
two hundred and one thousand dollars scholarships last year, so
(05:18):
you know, it was two hundred thousand dollars and went
back to the membership. Every member school, whether you won
a tournament game or not, got a check for two
thousand dollars last year, which was about one point eight
million dollars. Out of that excess funds, we increased the
if you make it to a regional game you get
seven hundred and fifty dollars a game, and if you
(05:40):
make the state game you get fifteen hundred. And we
went back. We did that last year. We went back
at the end of the year and gave those schools
more money in that fund that way, and so we
find creative ways to give back. You know, we always
say we're a nonprofit. We're not allowed to share legally
in our profits. However, we can assist our school with
(06:01):
their mission, and our mission is to provide interscholastic opportunities
for athletes. So that two thousand dollars check tod they
can pay for officials, they can buy football helmets, that
user transportation. It's up to them to use them on
what they want to.
Speaker 1 (06:14):
Has anybody ever returned those checks without cashing them.
Speaker 3 (06:18):
No, not yet.
Speaker 2 (06:19):
We don't have that that. We get positive feedback from
our member schools. Hey, thank you. Some of them say
what's this for, but we tell them all the time.
You know, we've got our nine months cash on hand, Todd,
and we're not interested in getting fifteen months. So anything
above nine months is going to write back to our membership.
Speaker 1 (06:35):
Clearly, the squeaky wheel gets the grease. Usually if you're
on social media, you would think the seven divisions was
the worst thing since the apocalypse.
Speaker 3 (06:45):
There's no intention to go back, is there?
Speaker 2 (06:48):
Oh No, not one bit there because it did exactly
what was intended to do. And it just underlying thing
Todd is we put schools in a tournament that those
schools would play in that league against similar site schools.
And before we did the seven division, there was a
reason Marion Harding and Marion County wasn't in wasn't in
the occ because Gehannah's Newark's they're double and triple the
(07:12):
size of them. But there's what we turn around. Put
them in a tournament that way, Western Brown down down
in southwest Ohio. Same thing with Moeller and Lakota West
and those guys they didn't play in the league there
because of size. And then you know, so you know,
and I've said this a thousand times, Uh you know,
I'm not on social media, and I'm not I don't
(07:33):
disapprove of that, but I didn't run a school district
on what they're saying on social media. I'm not going
to run this organization that way either, because most of
those who I'm going to listen to is our membership,
our member schools. And that's why I talked about talking
to schools who are in this format now and how
they like it, those things, because most people on social media,
they've never taught a day of school. Uh, they've never
(07:55):
coached a sport, and what makes them an.
Speaker 3 (07:57):
Expert on on what we do and what's best for kids?
You know, a question out of left field we came
up with today.
Speaker 1 (08:03):
We were all joking around about the Browns and their
new stadium. You know a lot of states where they
have the Colts, the Lions, they play their state tournaments
in those domes. This is all theoretical now, but that
could present you guys and the Browns and the Hall
of Fame with the you know, a choice to make
or whatever.
Speaker 3 (08:22):
Any idle chat about that.
Speaker 2 (08:24):
Well, there's sometimes you know, we're talking flag football with
the Browns and Bengals, and that comes up. But the
states that you mentioned, they don't have the Hall of
Fame either, and so the Hall of Fame's good to
us and supporting high school football. And I love the
fact that you get a Masslin against Hoban and there
and there's fourteen thousand people in a seventeen thousand seats.
(08:46):
There's no better football environment out there. And you know,
coach Day has talked about Ohio State, but again it's
one hundred and five thousand seats and you put fourteen
thousand in there, it's still gonna seem dead. And so
but I will say this, Missus Haslm is very generous
to the OHSAA and that with the soccer and the
(09:07):
old Crew Stadium, those things. Even when they had hockey
at the Brown Stadium, she made sure our high schools
had a chance to play there for very little money.
And so we do appreciate that. But if they put
a dome in there, you know, we'll see what mister Haslm,
mister and Missus Haslm might do for us.
Speaker 1 (09:26):
Doug, I'm here to create more things for you to
do and more problems to solve.
Speaker 3 (09:29):
So hey, great to visit with you. Appreciate you taking
time for us, Todd. I always tell you this.
Speaker 2 (09:34):
I mean, I appreciate all you do and your station
does so you're a sports station and promoting high school athletics,
and you're always positive about the kids, so we appreciate
you
Boys stayed basketball tournament here at u D Arena, and
HSA Commissioner Doug Ute is with us. We've seen really
good games here thus far tonight, Doug, some good matchups
and I know the first year of the seven divisions
you wondered how it would all shake out to the
championship games. So far the draw has been kind. As
far as great games here are U.
Speaker 2 (00:20):
D oh absolutely and you know it just you know
with with going to the reason we went to seven
is to reduce that disparity in student enrollment where and
I supposed your child for us was Lewisville, who's a
small D one and went to D three this year,
played similar size schools and here they come down here
and so and they bring their community with them, and
(00:42):
you know that school is a focus of that community.
And we've seen that with a support and we've seen
when schools teams getting down here.
Speaker 1 (00:49):
Clearly, there was some consternation about going to seven divisions
and some tumult with the first of all, the break
between the semifinals and the finals. I think you guys
would like to eliminate that as well. What have we
learned from the first go around with seven divisions. That
are things you'd hope to correct next year.
Speaker 2 (01:08):
Yeah. Well, as I mentioned, it did what we wanted
it to do, but logistics are something todd we have
to continue to look at. And we're just now talking
to our member schools. I just talked to the coach
of Rushie because he's been here old style and he
and he's here new style, and you know, talk to
him about the venue. He loved the venue and atmosphere
(01:29):
at Bowling Green, but not a fan of having that
one game one weekend and not another game to the
next and this time of year, and and so those
are the things we're trying to figure out. You know,
we put our young ladies in some great environments at
their high schools, and you know, I personally was at
a light of high school and watched two Division six
(01:49):
and seven semis and I'm not sure you can be
in a better environment. And then you know, last weekend
I was not there because I was at Right State,
but the camp and field House.
Speaker 3 (02:01):
You know, everybody I talked.
Speaker 2 (02:02):
To about the environments that they played in that But
but you know, we we're just continue looking at what's
what are some other options can we use? Right State
and date in the same weekend. And you know one thing,
if we go old style, in other words, you do
the semis in the finals the same weekend. We don't
want to calls our schools and our communities a lot
(02:23):
of expense. So it's in one day and out the
next in terms of games, so you play back to back.
We can work that out. And so we're looking at
all those different things right now.
Speaker 1 (02:32):
You know the other thing that you know, whether you
wanted to go to seven divisions or not, from a
general perspective, there's this narrative out there that you guys
meaning the UHSA, did it to create more streams of
revenue and all this cash flow or something, this big
windfall of cash. That's the thing that I object to
(02:54):
people that say, that's why you did it. But from
the financial standpoint, what does this wash out to for
the organization as a whole, to have seven divisions and
all these sports.
Speaker 3 (03:05):
Is this a big windfall profit for you? No?
Speaker 2 (03:08):
You know, we do have the records from the fall
with soccer and volleyball, and no, there was no more
or no less money because the same amount of games.
And so we have proof of that. From that standpoint,
and it's still too early to nail down this winner,
but early indications are we might have lost a little
(03:29):
bit of money doing this. And you know, we're school people.
Just like our schools. Everything we do is for our
student athletes, and I get it, but you want to
see the You know, we are very transparent about our
finances to our membership, and so we have the proof
now that hey, it did what we thought it would
do financially, wouldn't gain a lot of money, wouldn't lose
a lot of money, and the winner looks the same.
Speaker 1 (03:50):
Speaking of the money situation, when you first came in,
you were candid about the dire straits at that point
for the HSAA, and.
Speaker 3 (03:58):
COVID certainly made it worse right as you had started.
Speaker 1 (04:01):
And now you feel like you're on solid footing. Is
there some kind of recompense to the schools on a
yearly basis or those that.
Speaker 3 (04:09):
Make it the state tournament? Talk about that?
Speaker 2 (04:11):
Yeah, we created so so five years ago, you know,
going into COVID, we were we were a little bit
more in a month's cash on hand, and to be
honest with you, the trends were saying in about a year,
year and a half, we were we were gonna go bankrupt.
I mean, we're out done. So it's very important my
school superintendent days twenty years of that and well beyond administratively,
(04:34):
is to get nine months cash on hand. That is
something that we felt like if COVID hit or something hit,
we didn't take in any revenues, we could survive a
year without touching our member schools. Because that's the thing
I saw COVID is that our members schools weren't getting
any money either. And so for us to have tournaments
and you know, Todd, you were there, we had we
were one of the very few states that had those
(04:55):
kind of tournaments that still gave our kids a good experience.
So so two years ago we had that nine months
cash on hand. In the last two years, we've established
a fund at the end of the year, we're going
to turn the corner at nine months. Anything above that
we get back to our members school. So we did
two hundred and one thousand dollars scholarships last year, so
(05:18):
you know, it was two hundred thousand dollars and went
back to the membership. Every member school, whether you won
a tournament game or not, got a check for two
thousand dollars last year, which was about one point eight
million dollars. Out of that excess funds, we increased the
if you make it to a regional game you get
seven hundred and fifty dollars a game, and if you
(05:40):
make the state game you get fifteen hundred. And we
went back. We did that last year. We went back
at the end of the year and gave those schools
more money in that fund that way, and so we
find creative ways to give back. You know, we always
say we're a nonprofit. We're not allowed to share legally
in our profits. However, we can assist our school with
(06:01):
their mission, and our mission is to provide interscholastic opportunities
for athletes. So that two thousand dollars check tod they
can pay for officials, they can buy football helmets, that
user transportation. It's up to them to use them on
what they want to.
Speaker 1 (06:14):
Has anybody ever returned those checks without cashing them.
Speaker 3 (06:18):
No, not yet.
Speaker 2 (06:19):
We don't have that that. We get positive feedback from
our member schools. Hey, thank you. Some of them say
what's this for, but we tell them all the time.
You know, we've got our nine months cash on hand, Todd,
and we're not interested in getting fifteen months. So anything
above nine months is going to write back to our membership.
Speaker 1 (06:35):
Clearly, the squeaky wheel gets the grease. Usually if you're
on social media, you would think the seven divisions was
the worst thing since the apocalypse.
Speaker 3 (06:45):
There's no intention to go back, is there?
Speaker 2 (06:48):
Oh No, not one bit there because it did exactly
what was intended to do. And it just underlying thing
Todd is we put schools in a tournament that those
schools would play in that league against similar site schools.
And before we did the seven division, there was a
reason Marion Harding and Marion County wasn't in wasn't in
the occ because Gehannah's Newark's they're double and triple the
(07:12):
size of them. But there's what we turn around. Put
them in a tournament that way, Western Brown down down
in southwest Ohio. Same thing with Moeller and Lakota West
and those guys they didn't play in the league there
because of size. And then you know, so you know,
and I've said this a thousand times, Uh you know,
I'm not on social media, and I'm not I don't
(07:33):
disapprove of that, but I didn't run a school district
on what they're saying on social media. I'm not going
to run this organization that way either, because most of
those who I'm going to listen to is our membership,
our member schools. And that's why I talked about talking
to schools who are in this format now and how
they like it, those things, because most people on social media,
they've never taught a day of school. Uh, they've never
(07:55):
coached a sport, and what makes them an.
Speaker 3 (07:57):
Expert on on what we do and what's best for kids?
You know, a question out of left field we came
up with today.
Speaker 1 (08:03):
We were all joking around about the Browns and their
new stadium. You know a lot of states where they
have the Colts, the Lions, they play their state tournaments
in those domes. This is all theoretical now, but that
could present you guys and the Browns and the Hall
of Fame with the you know, a choice to make
or whatever.
Speaker 3 (08:22):
Any idle chat about that.
Speaker 2 (08:24):
Well, there's sometimes you know, we're talking flag football with
the Browns and Bengals, and that comes up. But the
states that you mentioned, they don't have the Hall of
Fame either, and so the Hall of Fame's good to
us and supporting high school football. And I love the
fact that you get a Masslin against Hoban and there
and there's fourteen thousand people in a seventeen thousand seats.
(08:46):
There's no better football environment out there. And you know,
coach Day has talked about Ohio State, but again it's
one hundred and five thousand seats and you put fourteen
thousand in there, it's still gonna seem dead. And so
but I will say this, Missus Haslm is very generous
to the OHSAA and that with the soccer and the
(09:07):
old Crew Stadium, those things. Even when they had hockey
at the Brown Stadium, she made sure our high schools
had a chance to play there for very little money.
And so we do appreciate that. But if they put
a dome in there, you know, we'll see what mister Haslm,
mister and Missus Haslm might do for us.
Speaker 1 (09:26):
Doug, I'm here to create more things for you to
do and more problems to solve.
Speaker 3 (09:29):
So hey, great to visit with you. Appreciate you taking
time for us, Todd. I always tell you this.
Speaker 2 (09:34):
I mean, I appreciate all you do and your station
does so you're a sports station and promoting high school athletics,
and you're always positive about the kids, so we appreciate
you
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