August 6, 2025 • 41 mins
What if three simple questions could transform how you handle stress, mistakes, and personal growth?
Jon Goehring, Coach Jim Johnson, and Dr. Rehnuma Karim welcome Michael Lopez — leadership coach, author of Change: Six Science-Backed Strategies to Transform Your Brain, Body, and Behavior — for a deep dive into the science of change and actionable leadership insights.
Michael shares how embracing discomfort and cultivating a better relationship with stress unlocks neuroplasticity and resilience. Drawing on his rich background in business, military, and sports, he unpacks:
Resources Mentioned:
Jon Goehring, Coach Jim Johnson, and Dr. Rehnuma Karim welcome Michael Lopez — leadership coach, author of Change: Six Science-Backed Strategies to Transform Your Brain, Body, and Behavior — for a deep dive into the science of change and actionable leadership insights.
Michael shares how embracing discomfort and cultivating a better relationship with stress unlocks neuroplasticity and resilience. Drawing on his rich background in business, military, and sports, he unpacks:
- Why change often fails, and how to reframe mistakes as growth opportunities
- The power of adaptability as the world evolves rapidly
- Leading with authenticity through action-oriented leadership by example
- The critical role of clear goals and process-focused efforts over just outcomes
- Evidence-based strategies for rewiring your brain and behavior for success
- How to build championship team culture starting with identity and ownership
- Tools and mindset shifts for emerging leaders gearing up for growth
Resources Mentioned:
- Michael Lopez’s book Change: amazon.com/Change-science-backed-strategies-transform-behavior-ebook/dp/B0DS47PQWM
- Website: michaeljlopez.coach
- YouTube Channel: youtube.com/@MichaelJLopez9
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
This podcast is a proud member of the Teach Better
podcast network, Better Today, Better Tomorrow, and the podcast to
get you there. You can find out more at teefbetter
dot com slash podcast.
Speaker 2 (00:12):
I truly believe that these three questions, in their simplicity,
can change anything about your life. You will not grow,
you will not change unless you have a better relationship
with stress. The stress response is an essential and enduring
element of the human experience.
Speaker 3 (00:31):
Right stress was designed to make us move.
Speaker 2 (00:35):
Mistakes are probably the single largest contributor to the opportunity
for neuroplasticity that we can have because it signals to
the brain that something needs to change. So rather than
thinking about a mistake is some kind of epic failure
that I'll never recover from, It's an opportunity.
Speaker 4 (00:50):
Do you want to be a leader in a constantly
changing world? Our emerging leaders look different, come from various
backgrounds and from all different age groups.
Speaker 3 (00:59):
Leaders is changing and it's hard.
Speaker 4 (01:02):
To keep up.
Speaker 3 (01:03):
But the good news you can be a leader too.
Speaker 4 (01:06):
You can be an emerging leader. Welcome to the Limitless
Leadership Lounge, a try generational conversation for emerging leaders. Come
spend some time with us to discuss leadership from three angles,
the coach Jim Johnson, the professor doctor Renumah Kareem, the
host John Gering, a monthly guest, and you get in
(01:28):
on the conversation on Facebook and Instagram and be sure
to follow us on Apple Podcasts, Spotify and Speaker. So
come on in and make yourself comfortable.
Speaker 5 (01:38):
Why is it that sometimes traditional approaches to change fail?
And are there some better approaches that we can't pay
And what does science have to say about all this?
So many questions answer here today on the Limitless Leadership Lounge.
This is for you, the young and emerging leader wants
to level up your leadership game. Maybe you've just started
a leadership position and you want to prove your own
(02:01):
personal leadership brand.
Speaker 6 (02:02):
I am John Garing.
Speaker 5 (02:03):
Joint is always here by coach Jim Johnson, and we
brought along another leader who is actually an author, a
coach and has a lot of great things going for him.
So let's dive right in today and dive into some
science backed strategies to transform your brain and more.
Speaker 6 (02:18):
Coach go ahead and introduce our guests.
Speaker 7 (02:20):
Yeah, I'm excited I've got a chance to connect with
Michael Lopez our guest today, I want to share a
little bit about him and then welcome to the show.
So Michael has delivered results for clients across multiple industries
and business models. As a student of the human industry,
Michael uses his experience and passion for the science and
practice of behavior change to design innovative change strategies. He
(02:42):
brings a diverse leadership style fords from a blend of business,
civil service, military and athletic experience which he has he
uses to accelerate performance for leaders and teams of all types.
Prior to forming Michael J. Lewis has consulting, Michael worked
as a profit brand strategy Before this, he spent time
as a managing director of both KPMG and EY after
(03:06):
thirteen years with Booz Allen Hamilton. In addition, Michael spent
two years as a director of Innovation and Strategy at
Smith's inter to Connect, a global diversified industrial products company.
He began his career as an intelligent office officer in
the US intelligence community. Michael earned his MBA from George
Mason University and his BA from Accidental College. And I
(03:29):
know he was also an athlete in college. And Michael
also is the author of a book that I've had
the pleasure to read called Change. Here it is for
our YouTube watchers. It's a great book. I highly recommend it,
and I know we're going to get into it well further.
Aduel Michael Lopez, Welcome to the Limitless Leadership Lounge.
Speaker 3 (03:46):
Thanks for having me, both of you. This is great.
Speaker 2 (03:49):
Really excited to jump in and talk about change and
coaching and leadership and all of it. They really excited
to be here. Thanks for having me.
Speaker 7 (03:57):
Yeah, so I'm going to dive into it saying because
I was a athletic coach and I know you are
as well, and so I'm curious because now I do
a lot of presentations around the country to both educational groups,
but also like my next presentation is to a business
and I've done a building team culture and leadership. So
I'd be curious of your thoughts because you do a
(04:17):
lot of consulting and speaking as well as well as
coaching ball. What are the similarities in leadership that you've
learned that you've been able to transfer in both worlds.
Speaker 2 (04:28):
Yeah, first, just let me say that every good thing
I've learned about being a leader and a teammate came
from playing football, playing college football, and being a coach
in the years since then. Team sports are the place
where those less are taught, they're learned, they're earned in
the struggle of the big and small moments. And so
(04:50):
for me, one of the reasons I started this company
and kind of left Big Consulting was I've always been
using those strategies, the same strategies I used to motivate
a or to build a team, or to win a game.
Speaker 3 (05:03):
The same strategies I use when I.
Speaker 2 (05:04):
Lose a game, right, watching the to know this coach, right,
you know, it's the first thing you do, right, what
could I have done differently? And was using all of
those strategies in my work and telling stories about moments
like you do. And so you know, it all starts
from there. For me, my teammates are my brothers, my
head coach from college. I just talked to him yesterday.
(05:25):
He's given me some of the best advice. He's like
a father to me.
Speaker 3 (05:28):
Right.
Speaker 2 (05:29):
So for me, this fraternity of football that I've been
fortunate to be a part of, and this fraternity of
coaching has just been such a gift, And it just
all starts with that. For me and that will never change.
Speaker 5 (05:42):
Yeah, and so let's talk a little bit about your
style as a leader and as a coach, because we
all have a leadership brand.
Speaker 6 (05:50):
Reading a great book by former.
Speaker 5 (05:51):
Guests, Marty Osborne talks about our leadership brand. And I
know there's multiple leadership brands that make good leaders.
Speaker 6 (05:59):
Not all leaders are the same.
Speaker 5 (06:00):
But what is your leadership brand and how have you
found that to be effective in your coaching.
Speaker 3 (06:07):
That's a great question.
Speaker 2 (06:08):
I on my website, I've put this down and it's
the ethos that I live by. Is this three commitments
position that I take right and my first commitment is
to help people into uncomfortable but necessary experiences, conversations, moments,
because that's where growth happens, right. The second one is
(06:29):
to give them tools to work through that experience.
Speaker 3 (06:32):
And the third is to lead by example.
Speaker 2 (06:34):
And I tell my athletes, I tell executives, I tell
my kids, I will never ask you to do something
that I haven't done or I'm not willing to do myself.
Speaker 3 (06:42):
And that's how I show up as a coach.
Speaker 2 (06:44):
Growth is hard, and I think anyone but being in
the consulting world, a lot of times we talk about
change is easy, and it's not because if it was,
everyone would do it. Right, excellence is not easy. If
it was, everyone would do it. And so for me,
it's about understanding. My leadership brand is all about an
action oriented leadership by example support model, which is I'm
(07:09):
here to help you grow, which means it's going to
be tough, but I'm going to be right next to
you as you go through it. And I've been through
it and I'm still going through it in different ways,
and it's leading by.
Speaker 3 (07:18):
Example For me.
Speaker 2 (07:19):
It's just it's just such an important attribute and I'm
still learning and growing and trying new things and struggling
and failing and starting again. And I've just always wanted
people on my teams, my clients, my kids, my teammates,
my athletes to know that I've been there and I'm
not just been there, but I'm going through it too,
just in different ways.
Speaker 7 (07:38):
Yeah said, it's a powerful things. I really can relate
because I used to always tell my players, if it
was easy to be a champion, everyone would be one. Right, Actually,
you got to go be willing to make the commitment
and go through the challenging processes. So I'm going to
dig in I've got some few questions about the book,
and I'll start with this one. You had three questions
(07:59):
to change people lives? Can you delve into those questions?
And I think they're pretty powerful?
Speaker 2 (08:04):
Yeah, yeah, I not to give away too much of
the book. I've written about this and I shared it
because I truly believe that these three questions, in their simplicity,
can change anything about your life. But you have to
answer them honestly, and I think that's the trick, right.
The first one is pretty simple, How have I done
something in the past, whatever it is that maybe you
(08:25):
want to change? How have I approached a problem, a relationship,
a challenge, a setback? Ever it may be right? How
have I done something in the past? And the answer
to that question is about understanding your patterns and really
understanding the triggers, the reactions, the responses, right, And there's
(08:46):
a difference, right, A reaction is not a response, and
those two things are different. Really investigating honestly the answer
to that question. The second question is how has that
served me? And notice I didn't say what was the outcome?
And I think the reason I asked that question differently
is because the answer to that question is Where did
(09:09):
I grow? Where did I maybe atrophy? Where did I
struggle in the experience in ways that were ucing growth?
Where are ways that maybe unintended consequences happened that I
didn't realize that I benefited from. And the answer to
that question it really requires that someone outside of you
give you some feedback. You have to it's the tape, right,
(09:32):
and saying, wow, what I didn't realize that happened in
that experience. We're so consumed with our own experience that
we often miss so many things that happen to us and.
Speaker 3 (09:44):
Outside of us.
Speaker 2 (09:46):
The third question is then the kind of fun part, right,
how might I do it differently? And that question also
if you have a good coach, you have a peer,
you have a mentor, and someone that says, okay, what
could change based on what you learned about your investigation
of your own behavior? Right, Because we're so focused on outcomes,
(10:07):
because we're so focused on the result, these questions are
designed to help you understand your patterns and your process.
And the last one is about the possibility, right, what
could be different? And for me, those three questions have
served me in my life in really tough moments, maybe
just to tell a quick story. I actually got I
got fired from a client one time. They actually they
(10:30):
actually deactivated my badge when I showed up to the
client site the next day. I had a personal difference
of opinion with one of my clients who was going
back on his word to a number of other clients,
and we had a disagreement.
Speaker 3 (10:46):
This guy was a tough guy, and.
Speaker 2 (10:47):
I played a little bit of hardball with him, and
he played hardball with me, and no, I forgot that
he had the power to just say, we don't want
you on this team anymore. And the investigation of that experience,
at the moments of wow, how did I show up
in there? I was really militant, right, I was really combative,
and I didn't think about my relationship with him talking
(11:10):
through the things that we needed to talk through.
Speaker 3 (11:12):
I was morally correct.
Speaker 2 (11:14):
I always say that this wasn't a mistake in values,
it was a mistake in execution.
Speaker 3 (11:18):
I learned more from that.
Speaker 2 (11:20):
Experience than at any point in my career, right, And
so I was able to step back and remove the
emotion of the moment.
Speaker 3 (11:27):
And follow the pattern of those three questions.
Speaker 2 (11:30):
They're just They're wonderfully simple to ask difficult to answer questions.
Speaker 5 (11:37):
I know, something else that you talk about in your
book is a lot about adaptability too, And that kind
of plays into this conversation too, that it's not so
much about the results, But if you can simply become
a more adaptable person, what does your book show about
that that might be more of the key than to
changing those results.
Speaker 2 (11:57):
Look, we are the most adaptable that has ever existed
on this planet, and I think it's important for people
to understand what that means.
Speaker 3 (12:07):
Right.
Speaker 2 (12:07):
So, adaptation in the clinical definition means the changes an
organism makes to become better suited to its environment. And
we all lived through probably the largest interruption of our
environment that we've experienced in a generation, which was COVID, Right,
And we all know now the ways in which we've changed,
not just that we use zoom war we're sitting on
(12:29):
a zoom call now, but the way in which we've
adapted the work from home experience. Right, Understanding how that
changes your behavior in terms of all the other side
effects of that experience. And it's important to understand that
adaptation is not just doing something different, it's actually the
resultant effects in my behavior and my beliefs and my
(12:49):
patterns that come from shifting into new ways of being,
thinking and existing. Right, that's I think the first important
principle to understand. You have the ability to change just
outside of your DNA. You have the ability to change
just about anything about yourself. And we often forget that
(13:11):
because it's hard, we don't exit that experience. And so
for me, that concept is so important because the other
side of that coin is in the clinical definition, if
you're not improving and growing, you're going backwards. Stagnation is
not just the act of staying put or you know,
going backwards. It's the act of staying put. It's the
(13:31):
act of not growing. And so for me, but those
concepts are just central this to this idea that you
have the ability to change, and you have the ability
for your entire life. I say this sort of tongue
in cheek. I hope we all learn something new the
day before they close the casket. Right, you have that ability,
you just have to step into the process.
Speaker 7 (13:52):
A great point, Peter or Peter Michael, Yeah, I was
think of that is because I want to delve into
one of your other books behind You for our followers
is Outlive, a book that I've also read and one
of the things I always kid my good friend here John,
is the first person you got to lead is of
course yourself. So talk a little bit about your way
(14:14):
that you've been able because I know one of the
things you said that I thought it was really powerful
is one of my seven leadership keys is lead by example.
So is leading an example? What do you do to
take care of you first so you could be a
more effective leader?
Speaker 2 (14:30):
Yeah, Look, I know there is an enduring principle of
humanity which I think is important. Right, The only person
you can change is yourself. That is in all ways
will be true. You cannot change another person and you'll
never have the ability to change it. You can influence
and guide and suggest and recommend. But much like our kids, right,
(14:51):
our children, you know, they're great observers to the things
that you do, and they mimic those patterns. And so
for me, leading by example and showing up this way
is the best way to demonstrate to others that these
strategies work. And so for me, I never want to
be a hypocrite. Hypocrisy is one of my least favorite
(15:11):
things in the world. And starting with that idea, which
is a mindset of I have a responsibility. If I'm
going to talk about these things, I'm going to write
about these things, I'm going to expect these things and others.
Then I have to do it too. And for me,
that's really incredibly motivating. Well, in terms of other strategies,
I exercise a lot, and I make sure I'm fifty one.
Speaker 3 (15:29):
I have a small.
Speaker 2 (15:30):
Baby and grown kids, and I need to be around
for a long time. So for me, you know, that
experience is all about putting your mask on first and
know that I've got to stay around and take care
of myself. I'm surrounded by amazing people. I have an
incredible wife, I have incredible children that we're a blended family.
(15:50):
And I have an ex and we get along and
she's fantastic. I have incredible teammates that I talk to
every day. And you know this idea that our social network,
our social infrastructure, it's one of the most powerful environments
we can cultivate. And not being alone in that experience
and that journey is really important. And I think the
(16:12):
last thing I would say back to this leading by
example is I enjoyed the challenge. I've self induced a
lot of stress in my life. That helps me in
the harder moments. You know, you train your body, you
do push ups, you run, you do hard workouts. You
can train your mind. And that's doing hard things. And
every hard thing you do that you succeed through. And
(16:32):
even if you fail, if you ask the three questions.
For me, everything's a learning experience, and so I just
really try not to get too high or too low.
I give myself what I call the twelve hour rule.
I have twelve hours to kick rocks and then it's
time to move on. Right, You got to figure out
how to get to the next thing, And so those
are just things I try. I'm not perfect, but yeah,
(16:53):
are It all starts with those three things, right, taking
care of yourself, exercise, a great network of people around you,
in a mindset that so you can get through this.
Speaker 3 (17:03):
What can you learn and how do you grow?
Speaker 5 (17:05):
Yeah?
Speaker 7 (17:06):
I just got to delve in one last thing because
I know most people know this, but you can tell
from our country that most people are doing this. Give
a little bit of vice because you say you exercise,
I do too. I don't miss and I have my
own strategies. But I'm curious, what are your strategies? Because
that's the one thing I don't have time to exercise.
(17:27):
And I said, well, if you don't have time to exercise,
your life is going to live a lot shorter. So
if you have any strategies you do that you could
give wisdom to people that you have the famous I
don't have time.
Speaker 3 (17:37):
I think, Look, it's tough, right.
Speaker 2 (17:39):
We all contend with a lot of obligations in life,
and so I'm not here to minimize the effort that's
required to do that. I think the first principle is
something is better than nothing, right, And I think that's
important for people to understand. Now, our bodies, the human
body was designed to move, and so it's really important
for us to understand that movement is an important pattern
(18:03):
that also feeds the brain, and so there is a
bi directional relationship between our brain and our bodies.
Speaker 3 (18:09):
And this idea of use it or lose it, it's really important.
Speaker 2 (18:12):
In the sense that if you stop moving, your brain
thinks that the signals that it's been sending for all
sorts of athletic or based patterns aren't necessary, and it
shuts those down and they get even harder. So when
you move, you train your brain to say, wow, I
need to move. I need to be ready for this pattern,
And so that's important. You're not just moving your body,
(18:33):
you're actually feeding your brain. The second thing I would
say in terms of an advice is that short bouts
of very focused exercise, even ten minutes, particularly higher intensity exercise,
are incredibly beneficial for your immune system, for your state
(18:53):
of mind. I have some of the best thoughts and
the best people talk about to get the best thoughts
in the shower.
Speaker 3 (19:00):
Even short walking up a fly of.
Speaker 2 (19:02):
Stairs four times quickly has incredible benefits on your ability
to focus all of these things. And so instead of
maybe thinking about it as a burden, think about it
as an input. Right, Hey, I've got a hard problem
I'm working on. Go hike the stairs five times. You'll
be surprised at what happens. Right, And so movement is medicine.
I tell people when you're sad, move when you're happy,
(19:25):
Move when you don't know what to do, move right.
It's a big piece of this equation. The last thing
I'd say is particularly for older folks. Right, I'm on
the other side of fifties, halfway maybe more. Hopefully I
get to one hundred.
Speaker 3 (19:38):
That's my goal.
Speaker 2 (19:39):
Resistance training is so important and putting your body under
that kind of stress, this is even more compelling, particularly
for folks in their seventies eighties.
Speaker 3 (19:48):
It's never too late.
Speaker 2 (19:50):
Pick up a weight, find a way to put your
body and your bones and your muscles under some kind
of stress. Again, even small amounts are we really impactful.
Speaker 5 (20:00):
You hit out right on the thing that I hate
the most, and that is resistance to it.
Speaker 6 (20:05):
I just had to bring that up.
Speaker 5 (20:06):
I love to run, Michael, I love to bike, and
I just hate resistance training.
Speaker 2 (20:12):
So we say, oh, look, I want to make a point.
I talk about this in the book and one of
the strategies is about this idea of embracing stress. And
to put it simply, you will not grow, you will
not change unless you have a better relationship with stress.
The stress response is an essential and enduring element of
(20:33):
the human experience.
Speaker 5 (20:34):
Right.
Speaker 2 (20:34):
Stress was designed to make us move full stop. And
stress doesn't know if you're moving because you're motivated, or
you're moving because you're scared, or it's a bear or
it's a hard presentation. Right, Nobody, the stress response doesn't
know that. But the truth is, look, bones grow under stress.
They get harder, they get stronger, muscles grow under stress.
(20:55):
Your brain also learns under stress, and so it's required, right,
that experience of being uncomfortable. The adrenaline response is what
helps us focus. It's what draws our attention to the moment.
And so I know it's uncomfortable, but it's necessary. And John,
you're being funny about I don't like resistance training, but
(21:18):
resistance is a central component of all change, whether it's
your body or your brain. Right, it's going to feel difficult,
and so I just try to help people lean into that.
And for me, exercise is so important because it is
a it's an at bat, right, it's a rep for
this idea of what it feels like to be intensely
(21:39):
uncomfortable and then come out the other side and go, wow,
I did that.
Speaker 3 (21:42):
That's a confidence builder.
Speaker 6 (21:44):
Yeah, oh for sure.
Speaker 5 (21:45):
And stress is it's an interesting thing that you brought
up stress, having a good relationship with stress, because a
lot of times we want to run from stress because
of how it makes us feel. And sure, it's uncomfortable,
but stress is actually a good biological response, right, It's
what keeps us safe.
Speaker 6 (22:03):
Without stress, I don't know if.
Speaker 5 (22:05):
We would live, we would die because we would do
something stupid and not be worried about it. I know
you have six science based strategies in your book, Change,
talk about why science is so important to you and
having that background to back up your strategies rather than
just talking about these because we all know this may
be true from science or just from culture, but why
(22:26):
is that scientific angle so important for you?
Speaker 2 (22:29):
I think it helps to depersonalize maybe some of the
thoughts we have internally about why should I do this.
I can't do it, I don't have the willpower, I
don't understand why this works or why it's important, and
I feel like giving people information it's a great empowerment
tool to help both demystify understanding, but then taking away
(22:52):
some of the negative self talk that comes up when
we have a setback.
Speaker 3 (22:57):
Right while I'm a failure. I can't do this, I
can't do that. Look. One of the things I talk
about in the book is this idea of mistakes.
Speaker 4 (23:03):
Right.
Speaker 2 (23:04):
Mistakes are probably the single largest contributor to the opportunity
for neuroplasticity that we can have because it signals to
the brain that something needs to change. So rather than
thinking about a mistake is some kind of epic failure
that I'll never recover from. It's an opportunity, right. So
I think the science gives people a way to move
away from this internal struggle of dialogue and negative self
(23:27):
talk and gives them an understanding of the mechanism, right.
And I think when you understand the mechanism, how I
can start to direct it? Right, I can start to
point it like stress, right, rather than thinking about stress
as some sort of thing to be avoided and this
idea that stress, Look, it's an autonomic response, right. You
don't control it, you can self induce it. And that's
(23:50):
a big strategy that I talk about, right. So the
more I induce stress, the more agency I feel like
I have over it. But if I know the mechanism
and I understand the science well, then I can point it.
Can start to get in front of things and use
them to help accomplish my goals rather than to be
in the passenger seat right and feel like these things
are happening to me. The last thing I would say
(24:11):
about why the science is important is, Look, we know
more about the brain than at any point in our history,
and a lot of people are leaning into concepts that
they intuitively understand. But I think there's some sort of proof.
There's this idea that this is not some pop culture
moment of just thinking positively, and that's just all it's about.
(24:36):
Not to say that thinking positively is not important you
should do that, but now it sort of gives us
some evidence that even in the moment while we might
not feel like we're hitting our goals. And that's a
big part of this experience, right, sort of talking about exercise, Right,
you don't lose thirty pounds from one workout, right, you
got to do it over and over again. Is that
in the absence of maybe understanding where the outcomes are
(24:59):
going to happen, I've got some evidence now that when
I take these actions, they are working, and I think
that's important to help people keep going.
Speaker 7 (25:07):
That's a great point you mentioned. It is ironically I
was going to delve into this my next question. So
take us through working with it could be so your
football team or client in the business world of because
he has some really interesting ideas on goal setting and
it's something that's been studied in a lot of different angles.
(25:27):
But tell us a story of you working with somebody
to help them with their goals.
Speaker 2 (25:33):
Well, goals are wonderful. Let me say that we all
have goals. We should have goals. There's nothing wrong with
having goals. The challenge is the way that we design
goals and we define goals.
Speaker 3 (25:43):
Right.
Speaker 2 (25:44):
We tend to define goals in terms of outcomes, right,
we know, losing thirty pounds, making a million dollars, getting
a new job, winning the championship. All of those things
are our vision of ourself into the future, where we
have this idea that on the other side of this
accomplishment is the best version of us, or some moment
where I'll feel great.
Speaker 3 (26:05):
And we all do that in all sorts of ways.
Speaker 2 (26:08):
The challenge with that we just talked about is that
you don't accomplish those things in one action, right. They
take time, and so because they take time, we get
demotivated in the process of trying to chase that outcome
because it takes too long, it takes too many repetitions.
Speaker 3 (26:25):
I'm not seeing the results.
Speaker 7 (26:27):
Right.
Speaker 2 (26:27):
We talked about this in the book. January nineteenth is
Quitter's Day. That's the day most people give up on
their New Year's resolution, not even three weeks. And so
the first thing is to understand that shifting away from outcome.
I'd say this finnally to my clients, right, and they
use KPIs key performance indicators or some ROI number. We
(26:48):
want to save ten million dollars and I get it right,
But I tell them quite often ly stop measuring that,
stop measuring and putting your temperature gage up up of
how much did we save today?
Speaker 3 (27:01):
Instead?
Speaker 2 (27:03):
And this is the second point is understand what are
the inputs to the performance I need that enable the
outcome to be possible. If I wanted to go from
eleven seconds in the one hundred meter to ten five,
I wouldn't just tell you to run faster. Sure, that's
the goal, Right, We'd measure your start time, we'd talk
about your foot tone over, we'd work on your flexibility,
(27:24):
we'd work on your strength.
Speaker 1 (27:25):
Right.
Speaker 2 (27:25):
We would understand all of the variables that go into
faster performance, and we'd execute actions to get those inputs
to be better. And that's what I help companies do. Right, Hey,
we make slow decision? Okay, how are you delegating?
Speaker 3 (27:40):
Right?
Speaker 2 (27:40):
Do you have an understanding of how people make decisions?
And are they empowered to do that? Do they have
that skill? Set and what does that look like? Then
you'll make faster decisions.
Speaker 3 (27:49):
Right.
Speaker 2 (27:49):
And so this first part is understanding outcomes are important,
but you've got to really understand the inputs to the process.
That's just such a huge compon of understanding how to
change performance. You don't change performance by putting people in
a headlock and telling them to run faster. You help
them understand the inputs to what makes them move faster.
(28:11):
The last thing I'll say, and then I would love
to get your feedback, is we also define goals a
lot of times in terms of things we want to avoid,
and what we need to do is think about things
we want to approach.
Speaker 3 (28:23):
Right.
Speaker 2 (28:23):
This happens all the time in our personal life. Right,
don't eat the donut? Right, I want to stop eating
junk fall All now I'm thinking about is junk food.
Speaker 4 (28:30):
Right?
Speaker 3 (28:30):
I see jump food everywhere.
Speaker 2 (28:32):
As opposed to someone that says I want to live
a healthy lifestyle. Now I'm orienting towards the thing I'm approaching,
which is an opportunity to make choices that are in
keeping with my values instead of denying myself the thing
that I want to do all the time. And that's
much more motivating. But we know that in the science
of motivation that when we're striving, when we're chasing things,
(28:54):
we are far more motivated than we're running from things.
And so that's another big piece of the goal redefinition experience.
Speaker 7 (29:02):
That's a great point because the one thing that we
really emphasize with our teams is yes, we did set goals,
we had team goals. I met with our players. One
of the things I always mentioned to the leaders is
that I think it's really important that you meet with
your people one on one and understand what their individual
goals and how do they synchron it with the team goals, right,
because if you don't have that in a team situation,
(29:24):
things are going to go awry. But is our goal
for almost all teams if you're trying to win some
type of championship. But then I always talk to the
famous Wizard of Oz. Are we staying the process on
the yellow brick road or it will be rearing off
in the woods. And when that's something I think as
(29:44):
a leader, I always call the leaders got to be
the cro the chief reminding officer that you got to
be getting them back on the yellow book road.
Speaker 2 (29:52):
So, yeah, patients and repetition and my leve what you
said their coach and this idea that the goal is
the effort I deliver in pursuit of the goal. That's
really the goal, right, That's what I tell my athletes.
There's only two things you can control in life, your
attitude and your effort, and everything else comes from outside
of you. And so I tell executives the same thing.
(30:12):
I had a mid level manager one of my clients
about a year and a half ago. Of all places,
working at a nuclear power station, eight hundred people at
a power station, they were one of the most underperforming
stations in the US. Right, there's about one hundred stations.
They were like ninety two or something. There's like actual
ranking system, and one of the things that we're trying
to do.
Speaker 3 (30:31):
Is turn it around.
Speaker 2 (30:32):
And I'm happy to report that in the year that
we were spending time, they literally went from like worse
to first and really proud of the work that team did.
One of the managers was talking to me and we
were working on delegation. That's why I brought up that example,
and he said, my meeting with my team, he goes,
but we're just not being effective enough. I'm helping my
supervisors understand what they need to do. And I said,
(30:54):
what are you doing why. I meet with them every
day before the day and after the day and we
plan what's happening.
Speaker 3 (31:00):
We talk about what we could have done better.
Speaker 2 (31:02):
And he goes, I've got a couple, man, some of
my folks are getting it. There's two folks that are
really just still struggling. So we're still working on it.
And I said, you're doing it. That's the way you
are achieving the goal, which is teaching people through example
and conversation and feedback how to grow. And I'm like,
don't worry about the fact that two.
Speaker 3 (31:22):
Of them aren't getting it yet. They will.
Speaker 2 (31:24):
It might be a little slower, but they'll get it.
And that was helpful for him because he felt like
a failure. Right, He's like got five people, three or good,
two aren't And what was he doing? He was staring
at the two people that weren't getting it number one
and as opposed to the three that were Yeah, and
he was focusing on the outcome, right, they're not there yet,
(31:44):
But I said, no, focus on the art. Are you
still meeting with them? Are you still coaching them? And go, yeah, Okay,
then you're doing it. You're achieving the goal right, and
that those are important shifts that a lot of people
and companies don't make because they're so focused on the result.
Speaker 5 (31:59):
Ye processor related goals versus those results or related goals
so important. And one of our previous guests said it
well too. He said something about pulling back the how layers.
So you want to result how and then usually you
need about three how layers, three how questions. So that's
the word I heard you used too, Michael, is three
questions to get back to.
Speaker 6 (32:19):
Oh, I just need to make more calls or whatever
the case may.
Speaker 5 (32:23):
Yeah.
Speaker 6 (32:24):
I know who's like the main client that you work
with in your coaching.
Speaker 2 (32:30):
I think it's I've worked, as you said in the introduction, Coulde,
I've worked with companies of all kinds and all sizes
and all industries. I always tell people that as long
as you have human beings in your company, I can
help you change. Now, my relationships are with the c
suite a lot of time, the CEOs and folks that
are trying to really change their company trajectory. We have
(32:52):
a client project I'm getting ready to start. Also happens
to be in the energy space and one of the states.
He's the CEO of the operating company for a state,
and he has got a leadership team of ten twelve people.
They've been they've been together for a long time, and
he said to me, they understand the job that exists today,
and they're very good at running the business as it
(33:14):
exists right now. But we're at the front end of
probably the most explosive growth that we'll ever see, and
they don't understand how to do that job. I need
your help moving this team, not just in terms of
their perspective, but in their ability to shift and help
enable those around them the next layer of the business
(33:35):
to be in a position to go capture that right.
Speaker 3 (33:38):
So those are things that I spend my time with.
Speaker 2 (33:41):
I've got a client that's in the healthcare space and
they purchase a number of companies over the years, and
they never had a set of corporate value. They never
decided who are we right, They just had a bunch
of businesses all clumped together, which we're doing very well,
a billion dollar company.
Speaker 3 (33:56):
But they were like, wow, we're starting.
Speaker 2 (33:58):
To see the effects of maybe a lack of affiliation
because everybody's just doing their own thing right. We want
to get bigger, we want to be more connected, we
want to feel that these eighty thousand people have a
sense of identity to what we're building and.
Speaker 3 (34:12):
Help me do that. How do I do that?
Speaker 6 (34:14):
Right?
Speaker 3 (34:14):
How do I bring that to life? Yeah? I love
what I do. I am a practitioner.
Speaker 2 (34:19):
One of the reasons I started my independent company was
as a big consultant. Nothing against those companies, they're great.
I do the work right. I'm in the meetings, I'm
in the moments, I design the workshops right, I'm on
the field coach, right, I'm on the hardwood right, I'm
there in those sessions because I think it's really about
high leverage moments, right, And you can't do that from
(34:42):
a distance, and you can't outsource that. And oh yeah,
I just every day as a competition. Every day is
an opportunity. It's a practice.
Speaker 3 (34:50):
And I really do love what I do.
Speaker 7 (34:52):
That's great, Michael. I have one final question. I know
John probably as I think a couple of things to
wrap up, but we really appreciate your insights today. Again
reminder of the book. I've got it here too change.
But my question is, let's go back. You're working with
a leader that's starting with a new team and something
you've talked a little bit about, but let's delve in
(35:13):
what would be a couple ideas you would give them
and helping them start to build. My next presentation is
how to build a championship culture. And I've keys I'm
going to share with this group of business people is so,
what woich advice would you give if you narrow down?
Because there's a lot to culture, right, but if you're
narrow down and give a couple bits of advice to
(35:35):
get them off to the right start, what would you
share with them?
Speaker 2 (35:39):
Look, Peter Drucker famously said years ago right culture eats
strategy for breakfast, and I am a co signer of
that concept, and for me, it's all about the culture
of an organization. And as a result, and I would
say that this is the first principle is that team
has to be the one that defines who they are.
(36:02):
And I think a lot of CEOs come in, a
lot of big leaders come in, and the first thing
they think about, see our previous conversation about goals, is
what do we need to accomplish? How big is the target?
And then they jump into how are we going to
do that. And what I tell leaders is your job
is not to decide that. Your job is to help
the team define who we are and then let them
(36:26):
decide what we need to accomplish. And then, if you're
really savvy about it, the next layer down in the
business should be about how do we get that done?
Because we know and again this is the science of motivation,
is that we own what we create, right, and so
I need as a leader to not hand people their
identity and the goals. I need to give them the
(36:49):
environment where they create them and feel a sense of
attachment to those principles.
Speaker 3 (36:55):
Right.
Speaker 2 (36:55):
The more I create attachment to those ideas, the more
willing and more motivated I am to go chase them.
And maybe using the example of the nuclear power station,
but they had a million metrics that they get measured by.
We helped them identify five shifts, five behaviors that they
needed to adjust, and they were a part of that experience.
(37:18):
Maybe to tell the story of what happened there and
come back to your question when we started with them,
they're like sixteen metrics that these stations use gauge performance.
Fifteen of them were yellow. One of them was green,
many of them trending downward. By the time we got done,
fifteen of them were green, only one was yellow, and
ten of them were green for the first time in
(37:39):
the history of the station. And never once did I
tell them to go do that. They decided, this is
who we are, this is who we want to become,
and they did it right. And so I think, as
a new coach, new leader coming into an organization, resist
the urge to set the goals for them and instead
create an environment where we can decide who we are
(38:00):
who we want to be. And then the second thing
is give people a voice in that experience and then
help them design the goals. Once you do that, I
think the third piece then is help those leaders understand
how to work down in the organization. To allow the
people that are really the execution arm of whatever company
(38:20):
you're a part of, the people that have to do
the work. Also give them a voice in designing how
do we get there, what's the path right? And to
maybe use the military example, right, generals and admirals and colonels,
they're there to set the strategy right, it's the captains
and the lieutenants that are the ones that decide how
to go take that action. And again, that's incredibly motivating
(38:41):
for people to have agency on designing the path. And
so for me, it all starts with that who are we,
what do we need to accomplish, and how do we
get there? If you're a great leader, follow that structure
and give your teams the ability to answer those questions
and really own their own destiny.
Speaker 4 (39:00):
Well, thank you.
Speaker 5 (39:01):
I'm shocked at how fast these conversations go, Michael, because
it's a good conversation. When you look at the time,
you go, wow, we've been talking for how long? We've
learned a lot from you, and I think there's a
lot more to learn too. That's the sad part that
we can't just appreciate you here all day. Your book
Change six Signs Back Strategies to transform your brain, body,
and behavior. It's available up on Amazon. I know where
(39:24):
else can we find that? Where else can we find
out more about you and learn more about these strategies.
Speaker 2 (39:30):
Yeah, the book's available on Amazon, Ingram, Barnes, and Noble,
all the normal retailers that you can get books from,
and so would really appreciate folks checking that out.
Speaker 3 (39:39):
It's getting good reviews and I'm just super.
Speaker 2 (39:41):
Proud of the opportunity to put that out there, and
I hope it makes a difference in people's lives.
Speaker 3 (39:46):
I wrote this book about the individual.
Speaker 2 (39:48):
I started to write it about companies and I realized
they need to take a step back, So it's really
for everyone. I'm working on another book that will be
about organizations and coming soon.
Speaker 3 (39:57):
You know, my website's a great place to start. Michael J.
Speaker 2 (39:59):
Lope dot coach. You can find the book there. I
also you can find all my other socials. I do
also a weekly LinkedIn Live series. I'm a top Voice
on LinkedIn, which I'm incredibly proud of, and I do
a Top Voice Tuesday discussion that now is part of
my YouTube channel, which you can find there.
Speaker 3 (40:16):
Michael J.
Speaker 2 (40:16):
Lopez nine. That was my coach. It's all about sports
and identity. That was my football number. You can see
there's a picture behind me that's my son. Fortunately he's
six' to, one so that's. Great he's number. Eleven my
best friend super imposed an image of me from college
next to that same, picture and SO i was number.
Speaker 3 (40:34):
Nine you, know it's just special.
Speaker 2 (40:36):
Moments but and Then i've got a newsletter on my
website that comes out Every friday that's tied to those,
conversations insights from my book and.
Speaker 3 (40:43):
Other resources around.
Speaker 2 (40:44):
Chain but, YEAH i appreciate everyone's, support And i'm really
having a great time having these conversations and giving a
platform to other people and being on platforms like yours
and on the famous words Of Captain, AMERICA i can
do this all.
Speaker 3 (40:57):
DAY i can talk about this as much as people want.
Speaker 5 (40:59):
To Fantastic Michael lopez up online and all of those
links that we have down there on the show, Notes
so just scroll down and check out his, book check
out his website linked in a great place That michael is.
Too thank you so much for your, Time. Michael today
we learned so much about change and excited to implement these.
Speaker 3 (41:15):
Strategies, thanks, GUYS i appreciate.
Speaker 4 (41:17):
It thank you for joining us this week at The
Limitless Leadership. Lounge to listen to this episode again and
to find previous, episodes check us out On Apple, Podcasts,
spotify And. Spreaker you can also get in on the
conversation find us On facebook And. Instagram then tell three
of your friends to.
Speaker 6 (41:34):
Join in as.
Speaker 4 (41:34):
Well Coach numa And. John we'll be back again next
week for another try generational leadership. Discussion we'll talk to
you then on The Limitless Leadership lounge
This podcast is a proud member of the Teach Better
podcast network, Better Today, Better Tomorrow, and the podcast to
get you there. You can find out more at teefbetter
dot com slash podcast.
Speaker 2 (00:12):
I truly believe that these three questions, in their simplicity,
can change anything about your life. You will not grow,
you will not change unless you have a better relationship
with stress. The stress response is an essential and enduring
element of the human experience.
Speaker 3 (00:31):
Right stress was designed to make us move.
Speaker 2 (00:35):
Mistakes are probably the single largest contributor to the opportunity
for neuroplasticity that we can have because it signals to
the brain that something needs to change. So rather than
thinking about a mistake is some kind of epic failure
that I'll never recover from, It's an opportunity.
Speaker 4 (00:50):
Do you want to be a leader in a constantly
changing world? Our emerging leaders look different, come from various
backgrounds and from all different age groups.
Speaker 3 (00:59):
Leaders is changing and it's hard.
Speaker 4 (01:02):
To keep up.
Speaker 3 (01:03):
But the good news you can be a leader too.
Speaker 4 (01:06):
You can be an emerging leader. Welcome to the Limitless
Leadership Lounge, a try generational conversation for emerging leaders. Come
spend some time with us to discuss leadership from three angles,
the coach Jim Johnson, the professor doctor Renumah Kareem, the
host John Gering, a monthly guest, and you get in
(01:28):
on the conversation on Facebook and Instagram and be sure
to follow us on Apple Podcasts, Spotify and Speaker. So
come on in and make yourself comfortable.
Speaker 5 (01:38):
Why is it that sometimes traditional approaches to change fail?
And are there some better approaches that we can't pay
And what does science have to say about all this?
So many questions answer here today on the Limitless Leadership Lounge.
This is for you, the young and emerging leader wants
to level up your leadership game. Maybe you've just started
a leadership position and you want to prove your own
(02:01):
personal leadership brand.
Speaker 6 (02:02):
I am John Garing.
Speaker 5 (02:03):
Joint is always here by coach Jim Johnson, and we
brought along another leader who is actually an author, a
coach and has a lot of great things going for him.
So let's dive right in today and dive into some
science backed strategies to transform your brain and more.
Speaker 6 (02:18):
Coach go ahead and introduce our guests.
Speaker 7 (02:20):
Yeah, I'm excited I've got a chance to connect with
Michael Lopez our guest today, I want to share a
little bit about him and then welcome to the show.
So Michael has delivered results for clients across multiple industries
and business models. As a student of the human industry,
Michael uses his experience and passion for the science and
practice of behavior change to design innovative change strategies. He
(02:42):
brings a diverse leadership style fords from a blend of business,
civil service, military and athletic experience which he has he
uses to accelerate performance for leaders and teams of all types.
Prior to forming Michael J. Lewis has consulting, Michael worked
as a profit brand strategy Before this, he spent time
as a managing director of both KPMG and EY after
(03:06):
thirteen years with Booz Allen Hamilton. In addition, Michael spent
two years as a director of Innovation and Strategy at
Smith's inter to Connect, a global diversified industrial products company.
He began his career as an intelligent office officer in
the US intelligence community. Michael earned his MBA from George
Mason University and his BA from Accidental College. And I
(03:29):
know he was also an athlete in college. And Michael
also is the author of a book that I've had
the pleasure to read called Change. Here it is for
our YouTube watchers. It's a great book. I highly recommend it,
and I know we're going to get into it well further.
Aduel Michael Lopez, Welcome to the Limitless Leadership Lounge.
Speaker 3 (03:46):
Thanks for having me, both of you. This is great.
Speaker 2 (03:49):
Really excited to jump in and talk about change and
coaching and leadership and all of it. They really excited
to be here. Thanks for having me.
Speaker 7 (03:57):
Yeah, so I'm going to dive into it saying because
I was a athletic coach and I know you are
as well, and so I'm curious because now I do
a lot of presentations around the country to both educational groups,
but also like my next presentation is to a business
and I've done a building team culture and leadership. So
I'd be curious of your thoughts because you do a
(04:17):
lot of consulting and speaking as well as well as
coaching ball. What are the similarities in leadership that you've
learned that you've been able to transfer in both worlds.
Speaker 2 (04:28):
Yeah, first, just let me say that every good thing
I've learned about being a leader and a teammate came
from playing football, playing college football, and being a coach
in the years since then. Team sports are the place
where those less are taught, they're learned, they're earned in
the struggle of the big and small moments. And so
(04:50):
for me, one of the reasons I started this company
and kind of left Big Consulting was I've always been
using those strategies, the same strategies I used to motivate
a or to build a team, or to win a game.
Speaker 3 (05:03):
The same strategies I use when I.
Speaker 2 (05:04):
Lose a game, right, watching the to know this coach, right,
you know, it's the first thing you do, right, what
could I have done differently? And was using all of
those strategies in my work and telling stories about moments
like you do. And so you know, it all starts
from there. For me, my teammates are my brothers, my
head coach from college. I just talked to him yesterday.
(05:25):
He's given me some of the best advice. He's like
a father to me.
Speaker 3 (05:28):
Right.
Speaker 2 (05:29):
So for me, this fraternity of football that I've been
fortunate to be a part of, and this fraternity of
coaching has just been such a gift, And it just
all starts with that. For me and that will never change.
Speaker 5 (05:42):
Yeah, and so let's talk a little bit about your
style as a leader and as a coach, because we
all have a leadership brand.
Speaker 6 (05:50):
Reading a great book by former.
Speaker 5 (05:51):
Guests, Marty Osborne talks about our leadership brand. And I
know there's multiple leadership brands that make good leaders.
Speaker 6 (05:59):
Not all leaders are the same.
Speaker 5 (06:00):
But what is your leadership brand and how have you
found that to be effective in your coaching.
Speaker 3 (06:07):
That's a great question.
Speaker 2 (06:08):
I on my website, I've put this down and it's
the ethos that I live by. Is this three commitments
position that I take right and my first commitment is
to help people into uncomfortable but necessary experiences, conversations, moments,
because that's where growth happens, right. The second one is
(06:29):
to give them tools to work through that experience.
Speaker 3 (06:32):
And the third is to lead by example.
Speaker 2 (06:34):
And I tell my athletes, I tell executives, I tell
my kids, I will never ask you to do something
that I haven't done or I'm not willing to do myself.
Speaker 3 (06:42):
And that's how I show up as a coach.
Speaker 2 (06:44):
Growth is hard, and I think anyone but being in
the consulting world, a lot of times we talk about
change is easy, and it's not because if it was,
everyone would do it. Right, excellence is not easy. If
it was, everyone would do it. And so for me,
it's about understanding. My leadership brand is all about an
action oriented leadership by example support model, which is I'm
(07:09):
here to help you grow, which means it's going to
be tough, but I'm going to be right next to
you as you go through it. And I've been through
it and I'm still going through it in different ways,
and it's leading by.
Speaker 3 (07:18):
Example For me.
Speaker 2 (07:19):
It's just it's just such an important attribute and I'm
still learning and growing and trying new things and struggling
and failing and starting again. And I've just always wanted
people on my teams, my clients, my kids, my teammates,
my athletes to know that I've been there and I'm
not just been there, but I'm going through it too,
just in different ways.
Speaker 7 (07:38):
Yeah said, it's a powerful things. I really can relate
because I used to always tell my players, if it
was easy to be a champion, everyone would be one. Right, Actually,
you got to go be willing to make the commitment
and go through the challenging processes. So I'm going to
dig in I've got some few questions about the book,
and I'll start with this one. You had three questions
(07:59):
to change people lives? Can you delve into those questions?
And I think they're pretty powerful?
Speaker 2 (08:04):
Yeah, yeah, I not to give away too much of
the book. I've written about this and I shared it
because I truly believe that these three questions, in their simplicity,
can change anything about your life. But you have to
answer them honestly, and I think that's the trick, right.
The first one is pretty simple, How have I done
something in the past, whatever it is that maybe you
(08:25):
want to change? How have I approached a problem, a relationship,
a challenge, a setback? Ever it may be right? How
have I done something in the past? And the answer
to that question is about understanding your patterns and really
understanding the triggers, the reactions, the responses, right, And there's
(08:46):
a difference, right, A reaction is not a response, and
those two things are different. Really investigating honestly the answer
to that question. The second question is how has that
served me? And notice I didn't say what was the outcome?
And I think the reason I asked that question differently
is because the answer to that question is Where did
(09:09):
I grow? Where did I maybe atrophy? Where did I
struggle in the experience in ways that were ucing growth?
Where are ways that maybe unintended consequences happened that I
didn't realize that I benefited from. And the answer to
that question it really requires that someone outside of you
give you some feedback. You have to it's the tape, right,
(09:32):
and saying, wow, what I didn't realize that happened in
that experience. We're so consumed with our own experience that
we often miss so many things that happen to us and.
Speaker 3 (09:44):
Outside of us.
Speaker 2 (09:46):
The third question is then the kind of fun part, right,
how might I do it differently? And that question also
if you have a good coach, you have a peer,
you have a mentor, and someone that says, okay, what
could change based on what you learned about your investigation
of your own behavior? Right, Because we're so focused on outcomes,
(10:07):
because we're so focused on the result, these questions are
designed to help you understand your patterns and your process.
And the last one is about the possibility, right, what
could be different? And for me, those three questions have
served me in my life in really tough moments, maybe
just to tell a quick story. I actually got I
got fired from a client one time. They actually they
(10:30):
actually deactivated my badge when I showed up to the
client site the next day. I had a personal difference
of opinion with one of my clients who was going
back on his word to a number of other clients,
and we had a disagreement.
Speaker 3 (10:46):
This guy was a tough guy, and.
Speaker 2 (10:47):
I played a little bit of hardball with him, and
he played hardball with me, and no, I forgot that
he had the power to just say, we don't want
you on this team anymore. And the investigation of that experience,
at the moments of wow, how did I show up
in there? I was really militant, right, I was really combative,
and I didn't think about my relationship with him talking
(11:10):
through the things that we needed to talk through.
Speaker 3 (11:12):
I was morally correct.
Speaker 2 (11:14):
I always say that this wasn't a mistake in values,
it was a mistake in execution.
Speaker 3 (11:18):
I learned more from that.
Speaker 2 (11:20):
Experience than at any point in my career, right, And
so I was able to step back and remove the
emotion of the moment.
Speaker 3 (11:27):
And follow the pattern of those three questions.
Speaker 2 (11:30):
They're just They're wonderfully simple to ask difficult to answer questions.
Speaker 5 (11:37):
I know, something else that you talk about in your
book is a lot about adaptability too, And that kind
of plays into this conversation too, that it's not so
much about the results, But if you can simply become
a more adaptable person, what does your book show about
that that might be more of the key than to
changing those results.
Speaker 2 (11:57):
Look, we are the most adaptable that has ever existed
on this planet, and I think it's important for people
to understand what that means.
Speaker 3 (12:07):
Right.
Speaker 2 (12:07):
So, adaptation in the clinical definition means the changes an
organism makes to become better suited to its environment. And
we all lived through probably the largest interruption of our
environment that we've experienced in a generation, which was COVID, Right,
And we all know now the ways in which we've changed,
not just that we use zoom war we're sitting on
(12:29):
a zoom call now, but the way in which we've
adapted the work from home experience. Right, Understanding how that
changes your behavior in terms of all the other side
effects of that experience. And it's important to understand that
adaptation is not just doing something different, it's actually the
resultant effects in my behavior and my beliefs and my
(12:49):
patterns that come from shifting into new ways of being,
thinking and existing. Right, that's I think the first important
principle to understand. You have the ability to change just
outside of your DNA. You have the ability to change
just about anything about yourself. And we often forget that
(13:11):
because it's hard, we don't exit that experience. And so
for me, that concept is so important because the other
side of that coin is in the clinical definition, if
you're not improving and growing, you're going backwards. Stagnation is
not just the act of staying put or you know,
going backwards. It's the act of staying put. It's the
(13:31):
act of not growing. And so for me, but those
concepts are just central this to this idea that you
have the ability to change, and you have the ability
for your entire life. I say this sort of tongue
in cheek. I hope we all learn something new the
day before they close the casket. Right, you have that ability,
you just have to step into the process.
Speaker 7 (13:52):
A great point, Peter or Peter Michael, Yeah, I was
think of that is because I want to delve into
one of your other books behind You for our followers
is Outlive, a book that I've also read and one
of the things I always kid my good friend here John,
is the first person you got to lead is of
course yourself. So talk a little bit about your way
(14:14):
that you've been able because I know one of the
things you said that I thought it was really powerful
is one of my seven leadership keys is lead by example.
So is leading an example? What do you do to
take care of you first so you could be a
more effective leader?
Speaker 2 (14:30):
Yeah, Look, I know there is an enduring principle of
humanity which I think is important. Right, The only person
you can change is yourself. That is in all ways
will be true. You cannot change another person and you'll
never have the ability to change it. You can influence
and guide and suggest and recommend. But much like our kids, right,
(14:51):
our children, you know, they're great observers to the things
that you do, and they mimic those patterns. And so
for me, leading by example and showing up this way
is the best way to demonstrate to others that these
strategies work. And so for me, I never want to
be a hypocrite. Hypocrisy is one of my least favorite
(15:11):
things in the world. And starting with that idea, which
is a mindset of I have a responsibility. If I'm
going to talk about these things, I'm going to write
about these things, I'm going to expect these things and others.
Then I have to do it too. And for me,
that's really incredibly motivating. Well, in terms of other strategies,
I exercise a lot, and I make sure I'm fifty one.
Speaker 3 (15:29):
I have a small.
Speaker 2 (15:30):
Baby and grown kids, and I need to be around
for a long time. So for me, you know, that
experience is all about putting your mask on first and
know that I've got to stay around and take care
of myself. I'm surrounded by amazing people. I have an
incredible wife, I have incredible children that we're a blended family.
(15:50):
And I have an ex and we get along and
she's fantastic. I have incredible teammates that I talk to
every day. And you know this idea that our social network,
our social infrastructure, it's one of the most powerful environments
we can cultivate. And not being alone in that experience
and that journey is really important. And I think the
(16:12):
last thing I would say back to this leading by
example is I enjoyed the challenge. I've self induced a
lot of stress in my life. That helps me in
the harder moments. You know, you train your body, you
do push ups, you run, you do hard workouts. You
can train your mind. And that's doing hard things. And
every hard thing you do that you succeed through. And
(16:32):
even if you fail, if you ask the three questions.
For me, everything's a learning experience, and so I just
really try not to get too high or too low.
I give myself what I call the twelve hour rule.
I have twelve hours to kick rocks and then it's
time to move on. Right, You got to figure out
how to get to the next thing, And so those
are just things I try. I'm not perfect, but yeah,
(16:53):
are It all starts with those three things, right, taking
care of yourself, exercise, a great network of people around you,
in a mindset that so you can get through this.
Speaker 3 (17:03):
What can you learn and how do you grow?
Speaker 5 (17:05):
Yeah?
Speaker 7 (17:06):
I just got to delve in one last thing because
I know most people know this, but you can tell
from our country that most people are doing this. Give
a little bit of vice because you say you exercise,
I do too. I don't miss and I have my
own strategies. But I'm curious, what are your strategies? Because
that's the one thing I don't have time to exercise.
(17:27):
And I said, well, if you don't have time to exercise,
your life is going to live a lot shorter. So
if you have any strategies you do that you could
give wisdom to people that you have the famous I
don't have time.
Speaker 3 (17:37):
I think, Look, it's tough, right.
Speaker 2 (17:39):
We all contend with a lot of obligations in life,
and so I'm not here to minimize the effort that's
required to do that. I think the first principle is
something is better than nothing, right, And I think that's
important for people to understand. Now, our bodies, the human
body was designed to move, and so it's really important
for us to understand that movement is an important pattern
(18:03):
that also feeds the brain, and so there is a
bi directional relationship between our brain and our bodies.
Speaker 3 (18:09):
And this idea of use it or lose it, it's really important.
Speaker 2 (18:12):
In the sense that if you stop moving, your brain
thinks that the signals that it's been sending for all
sorts of athletic or based patterns aren't necessary, and it
shuts those down and they get even harder. So when
you move, you train your brain to say, wow, I
need to move. I need to be ready for this pattern,
And so that's important. You're not just moving your body,
(18:33):
you're actually feeding your brain. The second thing I would
say in terms of an advice is that short bouts
of very focused exercise, even ten minutes, particularly higher intensity exercise,
are incredibly beneficial for your immune system, for your state
(18:53):
of mind. I have some of the best thoughts and
the best people talk about to get the best thoughts
in the shower.
Speaker 3 (19:00):
Even short walking up a fly of.
Speaker 2 (19:02):
Stairs four times quickly has incredible benefits on your ability
to focus all of these things. And so instead of
maybe thinking about it as a burden, think about it
as an input. Right, Hey, I've got a hard problem
I'm working on. Go hike the stairs five times. You'll
be surprised at what happens. Right, And so movement is medicine.
I tell people when you're sad, move when you're happy,
(19:25):
Move when you don't know what to do, move right.
It's a big piece of this equation. The last thing
I'd say is particularly for older folks. Right, I'm on
the other side of fifties, halfway maybe more. Hopefully I
get to one hundred.
Speaker 3 (19:38):
That's my goal.
Speaker 2 (19:39):
Resistance training is so important and putting your body under
that kind of stress, this is even more compelling, particularly
for folks in their seventies eighties.
Speaker 3 (19:48):
It's never too late.
Speaker 2 (19:50):
Pick up a weight, find a way to put your
body and your bones and your muscles under some kind
of stress. Again, even small amounts are we really impactful.
Speaker 5 (20:00):
You hit out right on the thing that I hate
the most, and that is resistance to it.
Speaker 6 (20:05):
I just had to bring that up.
Speaker 5 (20:06):
I love to run, Michael, I love to bike, and
I just hate resistance training.
Speaker 2 (20:12):
So we say, oh, look, I want to make a point.
I talk about this in the book and one of
the strategies is about this idea of embracing stress. And
to put it simply, you will not grow, you will
not change unless you have a better relationship with stress.
The stress response is an essential and enduring element of
(20:33):
the human experience.
Speaker 5 (20:34):
Right.
Speaker 2 (20:34):
Stress was designed to make us move full stop. And
stress doesn't know if you're moving because you're motivated, or
you're moving because you're scared, or it's a bear or
it's a hard presentation. Right, Nobody, the stress response doesn't
know that. But the truth is, look, bones grow under stress.
They get harder, they get stronger, muscles grow under stress.
(20:55):
Your brain also learns under stress, and so it's required, right,
that experience of being uncomfortable. The adrenaline response is what
helps us focus. It's what draws our attention to the moment.
And so I know it's uncomfortable, but it's necessary. And John,
you're being funny about I don't like resistance training, but
(21:18):
resistance is a central component of all change, whether it's
your body or your brain. Right, it's going to feel difficult,
and so I just try to help people lean into that.
And for me, exercise is so important because it is
a it's an at bat, right, it's a rep for
this idea of what it feels like to be intensely
(21:39):
uncomfortable and then come out the other side and go, wow,
I did that.
Speaker 3 (21:42):
That's a confidence builder.
Speaker 6 (21:44):
Yeah, oh for sure.
Speaker 5 (21:45):
And stress is it's an interesting thing that you brought
up stress, having a good relationship with stress, because a
lot of times we want to run from stress because
of how it makes us feel. And sure, it's uncomfortable,
but stress is actually a good biological response, right, It's
what keeps us safe.
Speaker 6 (22:03):
Without stress, I don't know if.
Speaker 5 (22:05):
We would live, we would die because we would do
something stupid and not be worried about it. I know
you have six science based strategies in your book, Change,
talk about why science is so important to you and
having that background to back up your strategies rather than
just talking about these because we all know this may
be true from science or just from culture, but why
(22:26):
is that scientific angle so important for you?
Speaker 2 (22:29):
I think it helps to depersonalize maybe some of the
thoughts we have internally about why should I do this.
I can't do it, I don't have the willpower, I
don't understand why this works or why it's important, and
I feel like giving people information it's a great empowerment
tool to help both demystify understanding, but then taking away
(22:52):
some of the negative self talk that comes up when
we have a setback.
Speaker 3 (22:57):
Right while I'm a failure. I can't do this, I
can't do that. Look. One of the things I talk
about in the book is this idea of mistakes.
Speaker 4 (23:03):
Right.
Speaker 2 (23:04):
Mistakes are probably the single largest contributor to the opportunity
for neuroplasticity that we can have because it signals to
the brain that something needs to change. So rather than
thinking about a mistake is some kind of epic failure
that I'll never recover from. It's an opportunity, right. So
I think the science gives people a way to move
away from this internal struggle of dialogue and negative self
(23:27):
talk and gives them an understanding of the mechanism, right.
And I think when you understand the mechanism, how I
can start to direct it? Right, I can start to
point it like stress, right, rather than thinking about stress
as some sort of thing to be avoided and this
idea that stress, Look, it's an autonomic response, right. You
don't control it, you can self induce it. And that's
(23:50):
a big strategy that I talk about, right. So the
more I induce stress, the more agency I feel like
I have over it. But if I know the mechanism
and I understand the science well, then I can point it.
Can start to get in front of things and use
them to help accomplish my goals rather than to be
in the passenger seat right and feel like these things
are happening to me. The last thing I would say
(24:11):
about why the science is important is, Look, we know
more about the brain than at any point in our history,
and a lot of people are leaning into concepts that
they intuitively understand. But I think there's some sort of proof.
There's this idea that this is not some pop culture
moment of just thinking positively, and that's just all it's about.
(24:36):
Not to say that thinking positively is not important you
should do that, but now it sort of gives us
some evidence that even in the moment while we might
not feel like we're hitting our goals. And that's a
big part of this experience, right, sort of talking about exercise, Right,
you don't lose thirty pounds from one workout, right, you
got to do it over and over again. Is that
in the absence of maybe understanding where the outcomes are
(24:59):
going to happen, I've got some evidence now that when
I take these actions, they are working, and I think
that's important to help people keep going.
Speaker 7 (25:07):
That's a great point you mentioned. It is ironically I
was going to delve into this my next question. So
take us through working with it could be so your
football team or client in the business world of because
he has some really interesting ideas on goal setting and
it's something that's been studied in a lot of different angles.
(25:27):
But tell us a story of you working with somebody
to help them with their goals.
Speaker 2 (25:33):
Well, goals are wonderful. Let me say that we all
have goals. We should have goals. There's nothing wrong with
having goals. The challenge is the way that we design
goals and we define goals.
Speaker 3 (25:43):
Right.
Speaker 2 (25:44):
We tend to define goals in terms of outcomes, right,
we know, losing thirty pounds, making a million dollars, getting
a new job, winning the championship. All of those things
are our vision of ourself into the future, where we
have this idea that on the other side of this
accomplishment is the best version of us, or some moment
where I'll feel great.
Speaker 3 (26:05):
And we all do that in all sorts of ways.
Speaker 2 (26:08):
The challenge with that we just talked about is that
you don't accomplish those things in one action, right. They
take time, and so because they take time, we get
demotivated in the process of trying to chase that outcome
because it takes too long, it takes too many repetitions.
Speaker 3 (26:25):
I'm not seeing the results.
Speaker 7 (26:27):
Right.
Speaker 2 (26:27):
We talked about this in the book. January nineteenth is
Quitter's Day. That's the day most people give up on
their New Year's resolution, not even three weeks. And so
the first thing is to understand that shifting away from outcome.
I'd say this finnally to my clients, right, and they
use KPIs key performance indicators or some ROI number. We
(26:48):
want to save ten million dollars and I get it right,
But I tell them quite often ly stop measuring that,
stop measuring and putting your temperature gage up up of
how much did we save today?
Speaker 3 (27:01):
Instead?
Speaker 2 (27:03):
And this is the second point is understand what are
the inputs to the performance I need that enable the
outcome to be possible. If I wanted to go from
eleven seconds in the one hundred meter to ten five,
I wouldn't just tell you to run faster. Sure, that's
the goal, Right, We'd measure your start time, we'd talk
about your foot tone over, we'd work on your flexibility,
(27:24):
we'd work on your strength.
Speaker 1 (27:25):
Right.
Speaker 2 (27:25):
We would understand all of the variables that go into
faster performance, and we'd execute actions to get those inputs
to be better. And that's what I help companies do. Right, Hey,
we make slow decision? Okay, how are you delegating?
Speaker 3 (27:40):
Right?
Speaker 2 (27:40):
Do you have an understanding of how people make decisions?
And are they empowered to do that? Do they have
that skill? Set and what does that look like? Then
you'll make faster decisions.
Speaker 3 (27:49):
Right.
Speaker 2 (27:49):
And so this first part is understanding outcomes are important,
but you've got to really understand the inputs to the process.
That's just such a huge compon of understanding how to
change performance. You don't change performance by putting people in
a headlock and telling them to run faster. You help
them understand the inputs to what makes them move faster.
(28:11):
The last thing I'll say, and then I would love
to get your feedback, is we also define goals a
lot of times in terms of things we want to avoid,
and what we need to do is think about things
we want to approach.
Speaker 3 (28:23):
Right.
Speaker 2 (28:23):
This happens all the time in our personal life. Right,
don't eat the donut? Right, I want to stop eating
junk fall All now I'm thinking about is junk food.
Speaker 4 (28:30):
Right?
Speaker 3 (28:30):
I see jump food everywhere.
Speaker 2 (28:32):
As opposed to someone that says I want to live
a healthy lifestyle. Now I'm orienting towards the thing I'm approaching,
which is an opportunity to make choices that are in
keeping with my values instead of denying myself the thing
that I want to do all the time. And that's
much more motivating. But we know that in the science
of motivation that when we're striving, when we're chasing things,
(28:54):
we are far more motivated than we're running from things.
And so that's another big piece of the goal redefinition experience.
Speaker 7 (29:02):
That's a great point because the one thing that we
really emphasize with our teams is yes, we did set goals,
we had team goals. I met with our players. One
of the things I always mentioned to the leaders is
that I think it's really important that you meet with
your people one on one and understand what their individual
goals and how do they synchron it with the team goals, right,
because if you don't have that in a team situation,
(29:24):
things are going to go awry. But is our goal
for almost all teams if you're trying to win some
type of championship. But then I always talk to the
famous Wizard of Oz. Are we staying the process on
the yellow brick road or it will be rearing off
in the woods. And when that's something I think as
(29:44):
a leader, I always call the leaders got to be
the cro the chief reminding officer that you got to
be getting them back on the yellow book road.
Speaker 2 (29:52):
So, yeah, patients and repetition and my leve what you
said their coach and this idea that the goal is
the effort I deliver in pursuit of the goal. That's
really the goal, right, That's what I tell my athletes.
There's only two things you can control in life, your
attitude and your effort, and everything else comes from outside
of you. And so I tell executives the same thing.
(30:12):
I had a mid level manager one of my clients
about a year and a half ago. Of all places,
working at a nuclear power station, eight hundred people at
a power station, they were one of the most underperforming
stations in the US. Right, there's about one hundred stations.
They were like ninety two or something. There's like actual
ranking system, and one of the things that we're trying
to do.
Speaker 3 (30:31):
Is turn it around.
Speaker 2 (30:32):
And I'm happy to report that in the year that
we were spending time, they literally went from like worse
to first and really proud of the work that team did.
One of the managers was talking to me and we
were working on delegation. That's why I brought up that example,
and he said, my meeting with my team, he goes,
but we're just not being effective enough. I'm helping my
supervisors understand what they need to do. And I said,
(30:54):
what are you doing why. I meet with them every
day before the day and after the day and we
plan what's happening.
Speaker 3 (31:00):
We talk about what we could have done better.
Speaker 2 (31:02):
And he goes, I've got a couple, man, some of
my folks are getting it. There's two folks that are
really just still struggling. So we're still working on it.
And I said, you're doing it. That's the way you
are achieving the goal, which is teaching people through example
and conversation and feedback how to grow. And I'm like,
don't worry about the fact that two.
Speaker 3 (31:22):
Of them aren't getting it yet. They will.
Speaker 2 (31:24):
It might be a little slower, but they'll get it.
And that was helpful for him because he felt like
a failure. Right, He's like got five people, three or good,
two aren't And what was he doing? He was staring
at the two people that weren't getting it number one
and as opposed to the three that were Yeah, and
he was focusing on the outcome, right, they're not there yet,
(31:44):
But I said, no, focus on the art. Are you
still meeting with them? Are you still coaching them? And go, yeah, Okay,
then you're doing it. You're achieving the goal right, and
that those are important shifts that a lot of people
and companies don't make because they're so focused on the result.
Speaker 5 (31:59):
Ye processor related goals versus those results or related goals
so important. And one of our previous guests said it
well too. He said something about pulling back the how layers.
So you want to result how and then usually you
need about three how layers, three how questions. So that's
the word I heard you used too, Michael, is three
questions to get back to.
Speaker 6 (32:19):
Oh, I just need to make more calls or whatever
the case may.
Speaker 5 (32:23):
Yeah.
Speaker 6 (32:24):
I know who's like the main client that you work
with in your coaching.
Speaker 2 (32:30):
I think it's I've worked, as you said in the introduction, Coulde,
I've worked with companies of all kinds and all sizes
and all industries. I always tell people that as long
as you have human beings in your company, I can
help you change. Now, my relationships are with the c
suite a lot of time, the CEOs and folks that
are trying to really change their company trajectory. We have
(32:52):
a client project I'm getting ready to start. Also happens
to be in the energy space and one of the states.
He's the CEO of the operating company for a state,
and he has got a leadership team of ten twelve people.
They've been they've been together for a long time, and
he said to me, they understand the job that exists today,
and they're very good at running the business as it
(33:14):
exists right now. But we're at the front end of
probably the most explosive growth that we'll ever see, and
they don't understand how to do that job. I need
your help moving this team, not just in terms of
their perspective, but in their ability to shift and help
enable those around them the next layer of the business
(33:35):
to be in a position to go capture that right.
Speaker 3 (33:38):
So those are things that I spend my time with.
Speaker 2 (33:41):
I've got a client that's in the healthcare space and
they purchase a number of companies over the years, and
they never had a set of corporate value. They never
decided who are we right, They just had a bunch
of businesses all clumped together, which we're doing very well,
a billion dollar company.
Speaker 3 (33:56):
But they were like, wow, we're starting.
Speaker 2 (33:58):
To see the effects of maybe a lack of affiliation
because everybody's just doing their own thing right. We want
to get bigger, we want to be more connected, we
want to feel that these eighty thousand people have a
sense of identity to what we're building and.
Speaker 3 (34:12):
Help me do that. How do I do that?
Speaker 6 (34:14):
Right?
Speaker 3 (34:14):
How do I bring that to life? Yeah? I love
what I do. I am a practitioner.
Speaker 2 (34:19):
One of the reasons I started my independent company was
as a big consultant. Nothing against those companies, they're great.
I do the work right. I'm in the meetings, I'm
in the moments, I design the workshops right, I'm on
the field coach, right, I'm on the hardwood right, I'm
there in those sessions because I think it's really about
high leverage moments, right, And you can't do that from
(34:42):
a distance, and you can't outsource that. And oh yeah,
I just every day as a competition. Every day is
an opportunity. It's a practice.
Speaker 3 (34:50):
And I really do love what I do.
Speaker 7 (34:52):
That's great, Michael. I have one final question. I know
John probably as I think a couple of things to
wrap up, but we really appreciate your insights today. Again
reminder of the book. I've got it here too change.
But my question is, let's go back. You're working with
a leader that's starting with a new team and something
you've talked a little bit about, but let's delve in
(35:13):
what would be a couple ideas you would give them
and helping them start to build. My next presentation is
how to build a championship culture. And I've keys I'm
going to share with this group of business people is so,
what woich advice would you give if you narrow down?
Because there's a lot to culture, right, but if you're
narrow down and give a couple bits of advice to
(35:35):
get them off to the right start, what would you
share with them?
Speaker 2 (35:39):
Look, Peter Drucker famously said years ago right culture eats
strategy for breakfast, and I am a co signer of
that concept, and for me, it's all about the culture
of an organization. And as a result, and I would
say that this is the first principle is that team
has to be the one that defines who they are.
(36:02):
And I think a lot of CEOs come in, a
lot of big leaders come in, and the first thing
they think about, see our previous conversation about goals, is
what do we need to accomplish? How big is the target?
And then they jump into how are we going to
do that. And what I tell leaders is your job
is not to decide that. Your job is to help
the team define who we are and then let them
(36:26):
decide what we need to accomplish. And then, if you're
really savvy about it, the next layer down in the
business should be about how do we get that done?
Because we know and again this is the science of motivation,
is that we own what we create, right, and so
I need as a leader to not hand people their
identity and the goals. I need to give them the
(36:49):
environment where they create them and feel a sense of
attachment to those principles.
Speaker 3 (36:55):
Right.
Speaker 2 (36:55):
The more I create attachment to those ideas, the more
willing and more motivated I am to go chase them.
And maybe using the example of the nuclear power station,
but they had a million metrics that they get measured by.
We helped them identify five shifts, five behaviors that they
needed to adjust, and they were a part of that experience.
(37:18):
Maybe to tell the story of what happened there and
come back to your question when we started with them,
they're like sixteen metrics that these stations use gauge performance.
Fifteen of them were yellow. One of them was green,
many of them trending downward. By the time we got done,
fifteen of them were green, only one was yellow, and
ten of them were green for the first time in
(37:39):
the history of the station. And never once did I
tell them to go do that. They decided, this is
who we are, this is who we want to become,
and they did it right. And so I think, as
a new coach, new leader coming into an organization, resist
the urge to set the goals for them and instead
create an environment where we can decide who we are
(38:00):
who we want to be. And then the second thing
is give people a voice in that experience and then
help them design the goals. Once you do that, I
think the third piece then is help those leaders understand
how to work down in the organization. To allow the
people that are really the execution arm of whatever company
(38:20):
you're a part of, the people that have to do
the work. Also give them a voice in designing how
do we get there, what's the path right? And to
maybe use the military example, right, generals and admirals and colonels,
they're there to set the strategy right, it's the captains
and the lieutenants that are the ones that decide how
to go take that action. And again, that's incredibly motivating
(38:41):
for people to have agency on designing the path. And
so for me, it all starts with that who are we,
what do we need to accomplish, and how do we
get there? If you're a great leader, follow that structure
and give your teams the ability to answer those questions
and really own their own destiny.
Speaker 4 (39:00):
Well, thank you.
Speaker 5 (39:01):
I'm shocked at how fast these conversations go, Michael, because
it's a good conversation. When you look at the time,
you go, wow, we've been talking for how long? We've
learned a lot from you, and I think there's a
lot more to learn too. That's the sad part that
we can't just appreciate you here all day. Your book
Change six Signs Back Strategies to transform your brain, body,
and behavior. It's available up on Amazon. I know where
(39:24):
else can we find that? Where else can we find
out more about you and learn more about these strategies.
Speaker 2 (39:30):
Yeah, the book's available on Amazon, Ingram, Barnes, and Noble,
all the normal retailers that you can get books from,
and so would really appreciate folks checking that out.
Speaker 3 (39:39):
It's getting good reviews and I'm just super.
Speaker 2 (39:41):
Proud of the opportunity to put that out there, and
I hope it makes a difference in people's lives.
Speaker 3 (39:46):
I wrote this book about the individual.
Speaker 2 (39:48):
I started to write it about companies and I realized
they need to take a step back, So it's really
for everyone. I'm working on another book that will be
about organizations and coming soon.
Speaker 3 (39:57):
You know, my website's a great place to start. Michael J.
Speaker 2 (39:59):
Lope dot coach. You can find the book there. I
also you can find all my other socials. I do
also a weekly LinkedIn Live series. I'm a top Voice
on LinkedIn, which I'm incredibly proud of, and I do
a Top Voice Tuesday discussion that now is part of
my YouTube channel, which you can find there.
Speaker 3 (40:16):
Michael J.
Speaker 2 (40:16):
Lopez nine. That was my coach. It's all about sports
and identity. That was my football number. You can see
there's a picture behind me that's my son. Fortunately he's
six' to, one so that's. Great he's number. Eleven my
best friend super imposed an image of me from college
next to that same, picture and SO i was number.
Speaker 3 (40:34):
Nine you, know it's just special.
Speaker 2 (40:36):
Moments but and Then i've got a newsletter on my
website that comes out Every friday that's tied to those,
conversations insights from my book and.
Speaker 3 (40:43):
Other resources around.
Speaker 2 (40:44):
Chain but, YEAH i appreciate everyone's, support And i'm really
having a great time having these conversations and giving a
platform to other people and being on platforms like yours
and on the famous words Of Captain, AMERICA i can
do this all.
Speaker 3 (40:57):
DAY i can talk about this as much as people want.
Speaker 5 (40:59):
To Fantastic Michael lopez up online and all of those
links that we have down there on the show, Notes
so just scroll down and check out his, book check
out his website linked in a great place That michael is.
Too thank you so much for your, Time. Michael today
we learned so much about change and excited to implement these.
Speaker 3 (41:15):
Strategies, thanks, GUYS i appreciate.
Speaker 4 (41:17):
It thank you for joining us this week at The
Limitless Leadership. Lounge to listen to this episode again and
to find previous, episodes check us out On Apple, Podcasts,
spotify And. Spreaker you can also get in on the
conversation find us On facebook And. Instagram then tell three
of your friends to.
Speaker 6 (41:34):
Join in as.
Speaker 4 (41:34):
Well Coach numa And. John we'll be back again next
week for another try generational leadership. Discussion we'll talk to
you then on The Limitless Leadership lounge
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