June 26, 2025 • 43 mins
In this episode of Louisiana Unfiltered, Kiran Chawla and Megan Kelly delve into Reverend Jimmy Swaggart's life, recent health crisis, and legacy.
Chapters
09:35 Who is Jimmy Swaggart?
11:55 The Swaggart Family Legacy
13:53 The Ministry's Evolution
20:36 The Impact of Camp Meetings
22:40 Addressing the Scandal
26:57 The Aftermath of the Scandal
36:55 Lessons from Jimmy Swaggart
Local Sponsors for this episode include:
Neighbors Federal Credit Union:
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Dudley DeBosier Injury Lawyers
Sound and Editing for this audio podcast by Envision Podcast Production:
Chapters
09:35 Who is Jimmy Swaggart?
11:55 The Swaggart Family Legacy
13:53 The Ministry's Evolution
20:36 The Impact of Camp Meetings
22:40 Addressing the Scandal
26:57 The Aftermath of the Scandal
36:55 Lessons from Jimmy Swaggart
Local Sponsors for this episode include:
Neighbors Federal Credit Union:
Another Chance Bail Bonds:
Dudley DeBosier Injury Lawyers
Sound and Editing for this audio podcast by Envision Podcast Production:
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
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Today's episode is both emotional and deeply significant. We remember
(00:46):
a man whose voice echoed through generations, a preacher, musician, teacher,
soul winner whose life was marked by passion for the Gospel,
Reverend Jimmy Swaggert. From tent revivals in rural Louisiana to
global broadcasts reaching millions. Swaggart's ministry spanned nearly seven decades.
(01:14):
His message was simple and unwavering. Jesus Christ and him crucified.
Jimmy Swaggert is now in the hospital after suffering a
cardiac arrest on Father's Day. Today, we will be joined
by someone who knew him closely, his spokesperson and publicists,
(01:39):
and someone who has watched or who has grown up
in front of Reverend Swaggert.
Speaker 2 (01:47):
Megan Kelly.
Speaker 1 (01:49):
We will talk about his legacy, his humanity, the powerful
impact of his music. We will also discuss the scandal
and the message of the Cross continues through sun Life
Broadcasting Network in the entire next generation of leaders. I'm
(02:10):
Karen Shalla and this is Louisiana Unfiltered.
Speaker 2 (02:27):
Welcome back everyone.
Speaker 1 (02:28):
This week, we are joined by a dear friend, a
fellow co worker, Megan Kelly. Megan, thank you so much
for joining us.
Speaker 3 (02:37):
Thank you for having me.
Speaker 1 (02:40):
So we are talking about a man who I would
go ahead and venture out and say he is known worldwide.
In fact, he put Baton Rouge on a map, probably what.
Speaker 2 (02:55):
Twenty thirty years ago.
Speaker 3 (02:57):
Megan, Oh, it's been a while. It's been a long time.
He's definitely put it, put Baton Rooge on the map.
Brother Swagger is a legend in the Christian world. He
is up there with Billy Graham. You know. He is
an amazing man. He's actually quite funny too. I don't
think a lot of people realize that, but he is funny,
(03:20):
and he's legendary. He's legendary and for so many people,
myself included, he's someone that we look up to and
someone that we aspire to be like and someone that
has been a major influence and had a major impact
in our lives.
Speaker 1 (03:35):
Yep, Jimmy Swaggert is who are we are talking about
this week? And Megan, we almost, in fact, in leading
up to starting this podcast, somebody had just mentioned that, well,
I don't really know much about him outside of the scandal.
There's a big scandal out there, and we're going to
talk about that as well a little bit later on.
(03:57):
But he came out of that, and again, Megan knows
a lot because she's the publicist and she is also
serving as the spokesperson for the family right now, and
I guess we should get to that.
Speaker 2 (04:09):
To begin with, Megan, let's kind of start with what.
Speaker 1 (04:12):
A week, almost two weeks ago is when we kind
of got word that Jimmy Swagger was rushed to a hospital.
Speaker 3 (04:22):
Yeah, so let's let's go back to Father's Day, okay,
because that's that's when things really started heating up, so
to speak. So Sunday morning, Father's Day, they have service
that starts at ten am. Brother Swagger's always there, you know,
it's obviously his favorite place to be besides with this family.
That morning he went into cardiac arrest. Now, you have
(04:46):
to look the way that their houses are. They all
live in the same area, like right in the same property.
So sister Francis was able to get in touch with
her son and with Gabriel, who is this grand grandson,
and they rushed over over immediately. Gabriel got there first,
then followed by he called the EMS, and then followed
by Pastor Donnie and sister Debbie and they got there.
(05:08):
He's in full cardiac arrest now. Gabriel said, he was
there within minutes, and he started doing chess compressions. Now,
just just to back up a little bit, like the
thought of having to do test compressions on someone that
you love so much that in itself is just heart gripping. Yeah,
I mean, that's it's tough. It's tough. He just said
(05:31):
the other day when I was talking to him, he said,
Father's Day just can't ever be the same, you know.
That was that was really hard for them. So they
did test compressions. They took turns, Gabriel and Pastor Donnie
took turns given chess compressions until EMS arrived. They got
there rather quickly and they were able to regain a pulse.
(05:53):
They then transported him to the hospital where he still
remains right now in ICU, and they are surrounding him
with prayers, with thoughts. We are I would say, day nine,
day ten into this right now, and he's still in
the same position. So it hasn't gotten worse. It also
(06:14):
hasn't gotten better. So right now they're in that process
of we wait, we wait, we pray, praying that God
a miraculous thing happens, that God comes through either way.
At this point, I know no one wants to say, Okay,
we're going to give up, and that's not the plan.
The plan is to hold on and hold.
Speaker 1 (06:33):
Fast and Megan. So father's day was June fifteenth. As
of this recording, he remains in the ICU, And I
think you and I have had these conversations that it's
never easy being in that hospital room and figuring out
what's next, and the younger me, you always pray that
(06:56):
something's going to happen. They're going to come back, They're
going to come back, and that's likely where this family
is right now.
Speaker 3 (07:02):
Of course, of course, this is this is somebody that's
larger than life, not only just to people around or
to his church. But to his family, you know, he
is the man. He is their their go to. He
is the rock. Him and sister Francis, they are solid rocks.
They are wonderful grandparents. They are phenomenal great grandparents, and
(07:23):
they're great parents, you know. So this is a very
close knit family and they and he has two other
grandkids that live out of town with their children, and
so it's really hard for them too because they're they
haven't always seen I know, when my grandmother was in
the situation in November and all of last year. Actually
(07:43):
are progressed as they get older, just kind of like
declines and declines and stuff and where you're walking now
you're a little bit slower and things like that. And
so for my cousins who are out of town, it
was incredibly difficult for them because they would hear, oh,
you know, there's a little bit kind but when they
come back, they're like, wow, drastic change, right right, right,
So you can imagine the same thing here as well,
(08:05):
when the out of town grandkids come in. And although
they have they're here often, it's still incredibly tough because
you're not here all the time. And so it's been
a very emotional week. They are processing it as best
as they can. They have been incredibly open and vulnerable
and honest, and which Brother Donnie said when he first
made this announcement, has not always been you know, the
(08:27):
way they've handled things. They're a private family, so they
tend to handle things on their own and not involve
other people, just you know, so we can be here
for you guys and you don't have to worry about us.
But in this situation, they've been incredibly vulnerable. Like this
is hard for us. We're struggling, this is tough. We
are praying. But one thing Brother Donnie has been incredibly
(08:49):
insistent on is like we are not questioning God. We're
not asking, we're not doubting, We're not saying why us,
why did this happen? We trust God every day and
the good and in the bad.
Speaker 2 (09:00):
Those are some powerful words.
Speaker 3 (09:03):
Yeah, very powerful. And that really is I mean, that
really is life, isn't it. You know, Like we are
in news and we see the most horrific things happening
all the time, you know, we see the crime and everything,
and there's this there's this you know, inclination to lean
into the fear and lean into why and why there's
(09:24):
no why. He's either God or he's not. He's either
in control or he's not. I might need you to
remind me of that sometime soon. But it's you know,
it's the truth. And that's the same thing here, Megan.
Speaker 2 (09:36):
I guess let's start with the basics.
Speaker 1 (09:38):
For people who don't know who is Jimmy swagger tell
us about this man.
Speaker 3 (09:44):
So Jimmy Swaggert is a Louisiana man. Louisiana born and Faraday, Louisiana.
So that's not too far from capital city, Baton Rouge,
several hours. And he grew up and at the age
of eight years old, he gave his heart to the life,
to the Lord and it was a special moment. His family.
He grew up with Christian parents. He had a sister
(10:06):
as well. And you know what they did. His parents
would travel around and they would go to places and
they would set up tents and they would have these
tent revivals of sorts and in that area they would
help the people there plant churches and then when they
were done and they're ready, they would move on to
the next place. And that's what they did, you know,
him and his family did. They were all very musical,
(10:27):
which is how he became very musical, and that's how
he actually met his wife, Francis, and she was at
one of these tent revivals areas in the area where
she lived, and I remember as a child him telling
the story about how he saw her and that was it.
He saw her, his eyes locked on her, and that
was it. And shortly thereafter they did get married at
(10:50):
a young age. But he's also a part of a
very musical family. If you'd heard of Jerry Lee Lewis
and Mickey Gilly who like Country Royalty, those are his cousins,
and so it's pretty yeah, it's pretty amazing in American history,
and as it pertains to music, that is a part
of Jimmy swagger.
Speaker 1 (11:10):
I did not know that, Megan. One of the interesting
things that you just brought up. That to me, watching
your parents do that, like that's got to kind of
influence you. That watching his parents go travel and helping
others set up pretty much what he ended up doing,
but on a much larger scale.
Speaker 3 (11:31):
Absolutely absolutely so, you know, and he believes at the
age of eight years old, he fell in love with
the Lord and he knew he was called to be
in ministry, and you know, obviously his parents played a
very big interest, in a very big role in that
is who he is. You know, sometimes you just that's
who you are, it's no separating it. And that is
(11:51):
who he is, and that's who he's been, and the
world will always remember that of him.
Speaker 1 (11:56):
And so megan going back to his wife him they
have been married for roughly seventy years. That is a
very long time. And I think you were saying this.
He was probably about nineteen or so, and she was
only a few years younger than him when they got married, right,
a few.
Speaker 3 (12:16):
She's only a few years younger when they got married,
and they have been married their whole life. So Pastor
Donnie mentioned it the other day when he was talking
about his mom and just what a rock she is,
and he said, you know, the first several years of
her life, a decade and a half or so of
her life, she was with her parents, and then every
day since then it's been her and her husband. So
(12:39):
you can just imagine at this time how unbelievably difficult
this is for her because she's not known a life,
you know.
Speaker 2 (12:48):
With outside of him.
Speaker 1 (12:50):
Yeah, yeah, you know, I never thought of it that way.
If you I think she was roughly sixteen, I mean
think back to when we were that age, were kids.
Speaker 3 (13:00):
I have memories from whenever I was, you know, younger
and stuff. But you know, you really start to it's
a pivotal point when you start hitting seventeen eighteen nineteen.
That's when your brain is fully developed. I believe it
is at twenty one, and then you become your own
person and you live your own life. So those first
formative years, you know, they're just not as much a
(13:22):
part of your life as everyday since, and everyday since
for her has been brother Swagger.
Speaker 1 (13:27):
I have always said, which maybe that's a podcast in itself, Megan.
Speaker 2 (13:31):
That we as women learn.
Speaker 1 (13:34):
Life in our thirties, thirties, almost forties, forties, is how
long it takes for us to finally put ourselves first.
But hey, that's a whole other podcast. Not trying to
change the subject.
Speaker 2 (13:46):
Yep, we'll come back to that later.
Speaker 1 (13:48):
Let's start at his ministry. He was not always on
Blue Bonnet. They started over on Bon Marche, And for
our listeners who are familiar with that area, it's of
near Airline Highway in Florida Boulevard.
Speaker 3 (14:03):
Right, So if you think Goya Avenue, I cannot. I
can't tell you exactly where that is. But just the
other day in the office, I was talking with Nikki,
who is basically the boss woman over there. But Nikki
was pulling out a picture and showing me of the
original location, you know, and it was Goya that was
before my time. But I was just looking at it
(14:26):
like wow, because at that time that was the big
area of Baton Rouge, that is where everything was happening. So,
I mean, he has since moved, but that that was
the start, and it was the camp meeting hour that
they started, as I remember my parents talk about that
they used to go when it was in that direction,
and then when they moved here, our house was situated
(14:49):
and maybe a mile and a half away from Bluebonnet
where it is so where it is now. But I
remember my dad saying he just knew it was a
god thing because we've gotten a high And then the
ministry moved just a mile away.
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zero zero seven seven. So let's talk about the area
on blue Bonnet. So it's blue Bonnet kind of near Perkins.
Speaker 2 (16:37):
And this area is it's huge.
Speaker 1 (16:41):
It is not just a building where people come for
a service on Sundays.
Speaker 3 (16:47):
It's it's not And when you drive by, you'd see
you're gonna go right down middle blue bonnet. So on
that right side, if you're heading north, you're gonna see
the Ministry with the big cross on the top. On
the left side, the Renaissance says, you're going to see
the dormitories, which is now an apartment complex, the SUNLIGHTE
broadcasting studios, as well as the bookstore and also d
(17:11):
EQ is back there as well. That building has always
been owned by Swaggers. It is massive. Behind the church
is the school and the school has a wonderful nursery, daycare,
then elementary school which is kindergarten through high.
Speaker 2 (17:31):
School and Meg.
Speaker 1 (17:33):
What a lot of people may not know is that
what is now the Renaissance Hotel, the Swaggered family was
actually looking to buy that to add on more apartments
for when things used to get so busy. And from
everything I've understood is that when deputies and law enforcement
worked extra duty over there, it was so intense. And
(17:57):
I don't mean just Sundays, I mean holidays. July fourth,
instead of a family going on vacation, they were coming
to bent Rouge. They were coming to bent Rouge for Jimmy.
Speaker 3 (18:07):
Swaggert absolutely, so originally what happened was brother Swagger owned
that building which is the Renaissance because it had been
there for years, and then they sold it off as
well as they've also sold off because I do believe,
correct me if I'm wrong, which I'm pretty sure i'm not,
but like they also owned the area where the mall was,
so all of that, like all of that was Jimmy
(18:29):
Swagger Ministries, right, and so a lot of it has
been sold. But that building where the Renaissance was was
intended to become another dormitory area for JSBC, which is
Jimmy Swagger Bible College. So interesting, Yeah, it's very interesting.
A lot of history and stuff over there.
Speaker 2 (18:46):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (18:46):
Yeah. So when the mall actually opened, we were so
excited because you know, I went to FCA Family Christian Academy.
I am a flame yay. But when the mall opened,
we just thought it was the best thing ever because
you know, now we can have somewhere to go after
school and we could walk over there. We all had
jobs over there, you know, so basically like our life
(19:08):
kind of upgraded a little bit, but we're still don't
move on it.
Speaker 1 (19:12):
Interesting well, and so I was saying, like going back
that any holiday bat Rouge, you couldn't even get a
room at a hotel. Those apartments were full, campgrounds were packed,
and everybody was in town. It was almost like saying
you were at a fair, because that's how many people
were coming in town. And Megan, we're about to date ourselves.
(19:35):
But when we were coming up, fairs were a really
big deal. You you went to a fair. So I
guess that's what I meant when I said fair. Now
I think about him like, I don't know if they're
that big of a deal now as they were when
we were growing up.
Speaker 3 (19:49):
Yeah, I kiss these days will never understand. But no
talk show, Oh yeah, yeah. It was always there's always
things going on. So they have camp meetings throughout the years,
Eastern Camp meeting at Fourth of July Camp meeting, and
also there was a Thanksgiving camp meeting as well, and
so every time these camp meetings happened, it was a
(20:09):
huge deal. People were coming in from all over the world.
They also have International Youth Camp which brought people from
all over the world, and also International Kids Camp as well,
so there's always a lot happening, and to this day,
there is still always a lot happening, and there's always
a lot of people, you know, going through We talked before,
you know, in blue Bonnet and whenever you'd be going
(20:32):
to church. I mean, it was just shut down, you
know what medden by there, you just go the other direction.
And interestingly enough, it is still the same way. You know,
on Sunday mornings. The police are out there directing traffics
in and out Sunday morning at ten and at six.
So there's still a lot happening, yep.
Speaker 1 (20:51):
And I guess the other interesting thing that I found
about this was that, like you said, there was an
international crowd that would come in, but that was just
the people coming in physically.
Speaker 3 (21:04):
Absolutely, Yeah.
Speaker 1 (21:05):
And you have to take into account the amount of
people who were listening to him, watching him on TV,
listening on the radio. And one of the big things
to add here is that he was he was getting
donations from multiple people. And we kind of talked about
this earlier, Megan. Those donations. People weren't giving it to
Jimmy Swagger, yes they were, but they were giving it
(21:29):
for a specific reason. And there were so many people
that were willing to go almost in I don't know
if starvation is the correct word, but poverty level, very
close to poverty level because they were giving majority of
their paycheck to Jimmy Swagger.
Speaker 3 (21:47):
So at that time we can kind of set see
when you're talking about the eighties and nineties and stuff,
there was a major revival happening, you know, and it
was brother Swagger was at that top of it. But
on other side, even with Carlton Pearson, the late Carlton Pearson,
there was mass revival happening and people are wanting to
come and to be a part. I know someone else
(22:09):
who likes to tell a story about how his father
decided to move down here at that time so that
they can be a part of it. You know, there
was something happening. There was just a buzz, The spirit
was moving and Brother Swaggert very much was anointed, and
that is showing. So yes, people wanted to give to
be a part because they wanted to continue to further
(22:30):
the cause of Christ. Their lives have been changed and
they wanted that for other people. And so yes, people
were giving at large amounts of money to help further
that cost.
Speaker 2 (22:40):
And I mean We've said this before.
Speaker 1 (22:42):
You cannot talk about Jimmy Swagger without addressing the scandal
and where we will be discussing it because we call
ourselves Unfiltered, the name of this podcast and our company
is unfiltered.
Speaker 2 (22:54):
So yes, we discussed that.
Speaker 1 (22:55):
And having so much money was a small portion of
what kind of led him down that road as well,
along with probably other things with the power and influence
that came with it.
Speaker 3 (23:07):
So I think, you know it would is that what
let it? I don't know. I don't know if we'll
ever truly really know. I will say that at that
time there he is very very influential, you know, a
very big name, very huge name, and people watched him,
(23:28):
followed him, thought he was just the most amazing man,
and he is. And from my own personal opinions perspective,
I do sometimes think that, you know, people put a
lot of pressure on man, on a person, as opposed
to Jesus. And I will tell you firsthand, and I
know if Brothers Slagger were listening, he would one hundred
(23:49):
percent back me on this. But he would always say listen,
I'm human, you know, don't follow me, follow Jesus. He
is literally just a signpost pointing to Jesus, not follow me,
follow me, because all of us are human, all of
us are flawed, none of us are perfect. So yes,
you know, he was larger than life figure. He always
he always has been, even just going into a restaurant,
(24:12):
he's just a larger than life figure. He just draws
the attention. It's just the spirit about him. So yes,
whenever we go into nineteen eighty eight, it was a
very big deal. The world was shocked, The Christian world
was shocked. They were rocked off their you know, off
their hands goes, Oh my goodness, look what has happened.
(24:33):
And I'll tell you. You know, last Sunday when brother Donnie
got up to speak, he did a phenomenal jobs and
speaking and he said, he said, normally we're not as
open and transparent and stuff because they are a private family.
They like to take care of their own issues and
not worry other people. But he said, we're gonna be
transparent and we're gonna be honest. And he and I
(24:55):
had a conversation just even about news and media and
talking about because obviously this topic is gonna come up.
But the bottom line is we're not running from it.
We're not hiding from it. We're not backing down, and
neither is he. He's got his head high because he
is the legacy of one of the most incredible men ever.
And the truth of the matter is Jimmy Swagger's life,
(25:16):
the good, the bad, the ugly, all of it points
to Christ. And so that's what matters the most.
Speaker 1 (25:22):
How did the scandal kind of get going? And I'll
even say this, yes, when you have that much reach
and that much power, there is there is this influence,
there is this confidence. And then add on to that
the amount of money that is coming in kind of
(25:44):
like you said, for your belief in God, your faith
in God, but that money was coming to Jimmy Swagger.
So let's kind of start there. Those are the ingredients
I guess that helped fuel this scandal.
Speaker 3 (26:00):
Of course, now I will say this as well, and
I'm confident that brother Swaggert, if he were to hear,
would fully agree with me. While he had a lot
of influence and continues to have a lot of influence,
he is the first one to say I'm not perfect.
He's the first one to say, look, don't follow me,
follow him, right, you know. So that's just the case.
(26:24):
And I do think also that as a whole, and
not just Brother Swaggert. When you look at big ministers
of the Gospel, your tdjs, your joel Ostein's and all
these things, they carry influence. And there's nothing wrong with
carrying influence. But I do think as a whole that
things go wrong when people put more emphasis on the
(26:44):
man instead of the man. Right, because at the end
of the day, no one is perfect, none of us
are perfect. Just because we're not perfect doesn't mean that
we can't share the truth. Because I tell you what
I can tell my kids all the time, don't lie,
don't lie. But there's been times in my life when
I've lied, and I'm not gonna now stop telling my
kids don't lie because I lied once before. Right, the
(27:04):
truth is still the truth, and that's what Brother Swagger
has always preached and continues to preach, good or bad. Right,
So I'll preface it with that, Yes, there was a scandal, right,
two scandals. In fact, we lived through it because we
were there. My background as I grew up at Brother
Swagger's church since I was two, all the way up
until I was twenty one years old, went to school there,
(27:27):
So when I was six is when the first situation happened.
And I remember that as a child because again it
was huge. Lots of things were happened, The school was thriving,
had a lot of friends, and then the next day
did not have a lot of friends, you know, and
at that age didn't really understand what it happened. In fact,
(27:49):
I actually didn't understand the whole the you know, the
extent of what happened until like the last three years,
because I honestly never really went back to look it up.
But it was two scandals and it involved prostitutes, and
Brother Swagger was defract from the Assemblies of God, meaning
he was asked to leave. And then he came back
(28:09):
in his own way and started and kept preaching the
word of God because again that's what he's called to
do and that was never going to change. So he
did come back and he started his own ministry or
his own denomination, so to speak, and he continued to
preach the word of God. So yes, it was big, Yes,
it was huge, and it was it was It rocked
(28:32):
everyone's world and rocked a lot of Christian a lot
of the Christian world, because oh my goodness, look what's happened, right,
And because of that people in people's eyes, he was then.
Speaker 2 (28:45):
Here yeah, right, yep.
Speaker 3 (28:47):
But here's here's the truth of the matter, right, because
the Bible says the callings of God are without repentance,
meaning when God called brother Swagger, similar to whenever he
chose David to be king, and the Bible like, he
didn't do that without knowing what's going to happen. God
is omniscient. He knows everything, you know, So when he
called brother Swagger, he did that with full knowledge of
(29:10):
knowing every decision that he would make from here then
to the rest of his life. He knew that. The
same with David. In the Bible, God called David knowing
because he's omniscient, knowing the things that he would do
with Bathsheba, knowing that he would then go on to
have her husband Yuriah killed. Yet he still said, this
(29:30):
is a man after my own heart, this is the
person I'm gonna call. And because of that, you know,
brother Swagger. In other people's eyes might have lost influence,
might have lost notoriety, might have lost that, but he
never lost that in the eyes of God.
Speaker 1 (29:46):
That's a very interesting thought process to it, and the
fact that you lived it. I mean I was not
in Batage at that time, so I did not live it.
But from all that I'm told, it's kind of like
you just said that immediately everything shut down. I mean
that area of blue Bonnet near Perkins if it was
(30:07):
July fourth weekend, a simple Sunday. I was told that
on Sundays you might as well not even go that
direction because it would take forever for the masses to
come out of the church and the traffic to just
try to get everybody out, and then earlier in the
day to get everybody in there.
Speaker 2 (30:26):
All of that stopped.
Speaker 1 (30:28):
The crowds coming in for the holidays, the apartments that
were completely booked up, the campgrounds that were sold out,
all of it stopped overnight.
Speaker 3 (30:39):
It stopped at that point. It stopped. Now. The media
might not cover this now because obviously it's not like
as in your face, but if you drive down Bluebonter
on a Sunday morning, even now, you're still going to
hit that same issue. You know you are. When they
have camp meetings, they're still full. When they have international
youth camps, kids camp it is still packed. It's still
(31:01):
the issue is it's just there's not a spotlight on
it and people don't see it right now. But it
is still thriving and it is still going. But yet
at that point it did. It was a big it
was a big hold, and it was a media swarm.
It was crazy. The media was out there. They were
all over the place. They were saying all kinds of things.
(31:22):
It was tough. And for his grandkids it was tough
because they would then go in stores and see tabloids
of their grandfather, you know, and I mean you imagine
as a child, that's that's really that's really harsh. They also,
like me, but obviously worse, had friends that they just
suddenly lost overnight. You know, it was a hard time
and there is no there's no sugarcoating it. It was tough,
(31:46):
right And brother Donnie the other day, you know, we
had to talk in his office and we talked about media,
talking about things in media, saying and things like that,
and he even said, like there is there's no getting
around it. That is what happened. But guess what, like,
look at where we are right now, and that's where
the big thing is. Right, Yes, these things happen. No,
(32:06):
we're not going to shy away from it. Yeah, it's
okay to talk about but we're not gonna only talk
about that. We're going to talk about the comeback because
you and I we've been in journalism for a long time,
you know, so we've seen a lot of people take
some hits, We've seen a lot of people fall. But
how many people have you seen get back up?
Speaker 2 (32:24):
Absolutely?
Speaker 3 (32:25):
How many comebacks have you seen on this level?
Speaker 1 (32:28):
And Megan, I'll always say this that at the end
of the day, we are all human, We're all gonna
make errors.
Speaker 2 (32:35):
We're not God.
Speaker 1 (32:36):
But I feel and I mean I just went through
a conference for journalism and the biggest takeaway for me
as a journalist from that conference was the public demands transparency,
and that's what they demand of media.
Speaker 2 (32:51):
But truth be told. I think the.
Speaker 1 (32:53):
Public demands transparency period from anybody and everybody.
Speaker 2 (32:58):
And I have seen it. Oh, were an over and over.
Speaker 1 (33:01):
It doesn't matter if you're a news anchor, if you're
a police officer, if you're the mayor, or, if you're
the President of the United States, or a preacher or brother.
If you messed up, if you can own up to
it and you accept your responsibility, the public's going to
forgive you.
Speaker 3 (33:22):
It's true, It's so very true. And he did do that,
and he did, you know, I remember the famous I
have send message when he was on the stage. I
was there for that. My best friend Stephanie and I
were sitting in the back of the sanctuary. We were
on the floor, you know, for us, we were just
there for another Sunday. We had no idea the historic
(33:44):
moment that we were about to be a part of.
But it was there for that. And people might reuse
that meme all the time and you know, maybe making
fun or whatever, but that was genuine from his soul.
There is this man loves Jesus more than anything else
in this world. He is one hundred percent obsessed with
(34:06):
his wife Francis. In fact, every if you go into
his bathroom in the office, every magazine they have a
magazine called the Evangelists, and every issue with her face
on it. He took off and put in his on
his mirror in his bathroom, which is further you know,
because he loves his wife, but more than that, he
loves Jesus so much. He just I don't know, it's
(34:30):
just not even strong enough words to express that. So
as much as he felt that he had let down people,
his family, his wife, he felt that even greater to
the glory, He felt that he had truly been the
one that messed up the most, you know, and he
wore that and that humility and those tears that you
(34:51):
see that people might make fun of, they are genuine.
Those came from his heart. He genuinely felt remorse for
what he did. And he was genuinely a apologetic and
sorry because you know, people again may or may not
be with you or what because never going to leave you.
And he knew that, and he never wanted to let
the Lord down. I know he carried what he did
(35:12):
and this calling and this honor just preach the word
of God. He carried that so well and so yes,
he felt it and he did apologize. Now it was
up for people to say if that was enough or not,
you know, and their own opinion and continue follow it up.
I know we have had many conversations with our parents
(35:33):
across the years, like why did y'all stay?
Speaker 2 (35:38):
Why did they.
Speaker 3 (35:40):
Yeah, we've asked the same thing. But I'll tell you
my dad was said because the Lord never said to move.
My dad is very much like he's going to hear
from God and he's going to do what God said.
And he's been always been clear. The Lord never said
to move. And again I know and believe, but that
my parents also saw and experienced the calling of God
(36:00):
on Brother Swagger's life, and the experience is that we
had there and they knew too. Yes he messed up,
Yes he's a man, but the callings of God are
without repentance. There was anointing on his life. There's anointing
on that ministry. And that's why they stayed. And that's
why I am the person I am today because they
made that choice. Brother Swagger made the choice to get up.
(36:21):
My parents made the choice to stay, and for that
I'm personally will always be grateful.
Speaker 1 (36:27):
And you know, I guess I didn't think of it
that way that even the people his followers, it probably
was life changing for them as well. And I don't
know if life changing is the correct words that maybe
help me out here. I guess a life lesson to
take away that we're all human beings and we can
(36:47):
all mess up, but it's up to us to choose
to get back up and start over or make things right.
Speaker 3 (36:56):
Yes, and that would be the legacy of Jimmie Swagger,
someone who loved Jesus fanatically, who was so in love
with him, who chose to get up and keep going.
There was one hundred thousand reasons he could have laid
down and called her today. You know, he could have
called a quits, he could have been done, but he
got back up and his ministry from then over the
(37:18):
last thirty years has been greater than it was before.
The souls that he's reached, the millions that he has
reached again, like I said, some Life Broadcast Network, three
hundred million homes that's going into that farsar passes all
the people he was reaching in Crusades, and those were
thousands as well. So you know, again it doesn't matter
(37:39):
to the drug addict, to the pastor who's lost their way,
to anybody out there who's just struggling. There's never a
point where you can't go, where you can't do one
hundred and eighty degree turn around and go in the
other direction. There's never a point where you can't call
out to Jesus and say help me, and he won't
meet you there. And Brother Swagger's life is testament to that.
Speaker 1 (37:59):
Yep, Well, do we know any more As far as
his health condition. He remains in ICU. And that's, like
you said, roughly nearly ten days since he originally went
into the hospital.
Speaker 3 (38:14):
Yeah, so he remains in ICU right now. His family
has been living at the hospital day in and day out.
They are waiting for God to move, waiting for The
prayer is that the Lord will provide a miracle in
this situation. And that miracle looks like if it's here
(38:35):
on this side of heaven, on the other side of heaven.
The prayer is just that God will move.
Speaker 1 (38:40):
And how old is he now?
Speaker 3 (38:41):
Megan ninety years old. He just had a ninetieth birthday
the weekend that you got married.
Speaker 2 (38:47):
Marge told me that.
Speaker 1 (38:49):
Yeah, wow, same exact day, and I was trying to
book the exact same venue.
Speaker 3 (38:53):
Yeah, yeah, yeah. And they tried to book that venue.
I mean, they tried to book that venue. They're told
that there was an Indian wedding that was going to
be there.
Speaker 2 (39:00):
Imagine that Indian wedding.
Speaker 3 (39:03):
Goodness, I mean, seriously, you know, Indian weddings got all
the beautiful, colorful clothes and stuff.
Speaker 1 (39:11):
Golly well, I'm actually really glad we did talk about this.
To me, there's a bigger takeaway here that life is
going to happen and you individually have to make the
choices that you made to figure out where you want
to go next in life. And Megan, it even goes
(39:36):
to kind of like you said, there were a lot
of people who stopped following him. You went from these
massive crowds for everything just went quiet. And yeah, maybe
in that immediate moment it is it's this. Maybe they
felt betrayed. Maybe we don't know. I can't get in
people's minds of what was going on back then, but
(39:59):
there were it's everybody's choice as to where they would
like to go. But then there were all the people
who chose to stay. Prime example, you're dead and the
reason he gave to staying and the impact it had
on you, your brother, your sister. Now that impact that
you guys have because of your upbringing on your kids.
(40:23):
It's a generational thing.
Speaker 3 (40:25):
It's a generational thing. And my kids have never been
back over to Swaggert's and heard him preach, which I
now regret. I wish that I would have brought them
over there a few times. But my kids don't realize
that his legacy affects them too, you know what I've
(40:46):
learned affects them to. And there's so many people, so
many ministries that have started with the people being at
Jimmy Swagger's ministries and now they've started their own church.
That is also a part of his legacy. His legacy
will always be Jesus Christ and him crucified. His legacy
will also be there is never anything that you can
(41:08):
do to outrun the hand of God and to outrun
the fervent love of God, and that is his legacy
and he is a testament of that.
Speaker 2 (41:17):
Yep, yep.
Speaker 1 (41:18):
Well, our prayers continue for his well being and for
his family. I can't imagine what that family is going through.
And kind of like you said that at this point,
they're just waiting to see what happens and they accept
whatever it may be.
Speaker 3 (41:37):
Yeah, they aren't. And brother Swagger, brother Donnie Swagger, has
been incredibly transparent and honest with that and just you know,
we are hurting. This is hard, but we will never
question God. We will always stand on his truth. He
is always going to be sovereign. His decisions, his ways
are much higher than ours, and they always will be.
(41:58):
You might not understand, and just talking to Gabriel the
other night in the hospital, he said the same thing.
He's trying to come up with answers and questions and
why why did this happen? Or maybe why did this
or maybe this And the truth of the matter is
we won't ever know, he said. You know, he said,
we won't know until we get on the other side
of heaven. Yep. But we have hope. We don't grieve
(42:18):
or hurt like people who don't have hope. We have hope,
and we know that we're going to see Brother Swaggert.
We know that we are going to see Jesus one day.
Very true, very true.
Speaker 2 (42:29):
Well, Megan, we appreciate you joining us.
Speaker 1 (42:31):
Thank you so so very much for the insight, absolutely
and absolutely and to our viewers, to our listeners, we
will of course continue to keep you updated on his status.
If you're not already doing so, go follow us Unfiltered
with Kieran, go download our app. But we're going to
(42:51):
keep you updated. We're on all social media platforms.
Speaker 2 (42:54):
Just go follow us there.
Speaker 1 (42:55):
And we appreciate you listening to our podcast, Louisiana and
Filtered and as always, we will see you on the
next episode of Louisiana Unfiltered
Speaker 3 (43:07):
M
This episode is brought to you by Dudley Devosure injury lawyers,
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(00:21):
four four four four four or visit Dudleydebosure dot com.
Today's episode is both emotional and deeply significant. We remember
(00:46):
a man whose voice echoed through generations, a preacher, musician, teacher,
soul winner whose life was marked by passion for the Gospel,
Reverend Jimmy Swaggert. From tent revivals in rural Louisiana to
global broadcasts reaching millions. Swaggart's ministry spanned nearly seven decades.
(01:14):
His message was simple and unwavering. Jesus Christ and him crucified.
Jimmy Swaggert is now in the hospital after suffering a
cardiac arrest on Father's Day. Today, we will be joined
by someone who knew him closely, his spokesperson and publicists,
(01:39):
and someone who has watched or who has grown up
in front of Reverend Swaggert.
Speaker 2 (01:47):
Megan Kelly.
Speaker 1 (01:49):
We will talk about his legacy, his humanity, the powerful
impact of his music. We will also discuss the scandal
and the message of the Cross continues through sun Life
Broadcasting Network in the entire next generation of leaders. I'm
(02:10):
Karen Shalla and this is Louisiana Unfiltered.
Speaker 2 (02:27):
Welcome back everyone.
Speaker 1 (02:28):
This week, we are joined by a dear friend, a
fellow co worker, Megan Kelly. Megan, thank you so much
for joining us.
Speaker 3 (02:37):
Thank you for having me.
Speaker 1 (02:40):
So we are talking about a man who I would
go ahead and venture out and say he is known worldwide.
In fact, he put Baton Rouge on a map, probably what.
Speaker 2 (02:55):
Twenty thirty years ago.
Speaker 3 (02:57):
Megan, Oh, it's been a while. It's been a long time.
He's definitely put it, put Baton Rooge on the map.
Brother Swagger is a legend in the Christian world. He
is up there with Billy Graham. You know. He is
an amazing man. He's actually quite funny too. I don't
think a lot of people realize that, but he is funny,
(03:20):
and he's legendary. He's legendary and for so many people,
myself included, he's someone that we look up to and
someone that we aspire to be like and someone that
has been a major influence and had a major impact
in our lives.
Speaker 1 (03:35):
Yep, Jimmy Swaggert is who are we are talking about
this week? And Megan, we almost, in fact, in leading
up to starting this podcast, somebody had just mentioned that, well,
I don't really know much about him outside of the scandal.
There's a big scandal out there, and we're going to
talk about that as well a little bit later on.
(03:57):
But he came out of that, and again, Megan knows
a lot because she's the publicist and she is also
serving as the spokesperson for the family right now, and
I guess we should get to that.
Speaker 2 (04:09):
To begin with, Megan, let's kind of start with what.
Speaker 1 (04:12):
A week, almost two weeks ago is when we kind
of got word that Jimmy Swagger was rushed to a hospital.
Speaker 3 (04:22):
Yeah, so let's let's go back to Father's Day, okay,
because that's that's when things really started heating up, so
to speak. So Sunday morning, Father's Day, they have service
that starts at ten am. Brother Swagger's always there, you know,
it's obviously his favorite place to be besides with this family.
That morning he went into cardiac arrest. Now, you have
(04:46):
to look the way that their houses are. They all
live in the same area, like right in the same property.
So sister Francis was able to get in touch with
her son and with Gabriel, who is this grand grandson,
and they rushed over over immediately. Gabriel got there first,
then followed by he called the EMS, and then followed
by Pastor Donnie and sister Debbie and they got there.
(05:08):
He's in full cardiac arrest now. Gabriel said, he was
there within minutes, and he started doing chess compressions. Now,
just just to back up a little bit, like the
thought of having to do test compressions on someone that
you love so much that in itself is just heart gripping. Yeah,
I mean, that's it's tough. It's tough. He just said
(05:31):
the other day when I was talking to him, he said,
Father's Day just can't ever be the same, you know.
That was that was really hard for them. So they
did test compressions. They took turns, Gabriel and Pastor Donnie
took turns given chess compressions until EMS arrived. They got
there rather quickly and they were able to regain a pulse.
(05:53):
They then transported him to the hospital where he still
remains right now in ICU, and they are surrounding him
with prayers, with thoughts. We are I would say, day nine,
day ten into this right now, and he's still in
the same position. So it hasn't gotten worse. It also
(06:14):
hasn't gotten better. So right now they're in that process
of we wait, we wait, we pray, praying that God
a miraculous thing happens, that God comes through either way.
At this point, I know no one wants to say, Okay,
we're going to give up, and that's not the plan.
The plan is to hold on and hold.
Speaker 1 (06:33):
Fast and Megan. So father's day was June fifteenth. As
of this recording, he remains in the ICU, And I
think you and I have had these conversations that it's
never easy being in that hospital room and figuring out
what's next, and the younger me, you always pray that
(06:56):
something's going to happen. They're going to come back, They're
going to come back, and that's likely where this family
is right now.
Speaker 3 (07:02):
Of course, of course, this is this is somebody that's
larger than life, not only just to people around or
to his church. But to his family, you know, he
is the man. He is their their go to. He
is the rock. Him and sister Francis, they are solid rocks.
They are wonderful grandparents. They are phenomenal great grandparents, and
(07:23):
they're great parents, you know. So this is a very
close knit family and they and he has two other
grandkids that live out of town with their children, and
so it's really hard for them too because they're they
haven't always seen I know, when my grandmother was in
the situation in November and all of last year. Actually
(07:43):
are progressed as they get older, just kind of like
declines and declines and stuff and where you're walking now
you're a little bit slower and things like that. And
so for my cousins who are out of town, it
was incredibly difficult for them because they would hear, oh,
you know, there's a little bit kind but when they
come back, they're like, wow, drastic change, right right, right,
So you can imagine the same thing here as well,
(08:05):
when the out of town grandkids come in. And although
they have they're here often, it's still incredibly tough because
you're not here all the time. And so it's been
a very emotional week. They are processing it as best
as they can. They have been incredibly open and vulnerable
and honest, and which Brother Donnie said when he first
made this announcement, has not always been you know, the
(08:27):
way they've handled things. They're a private family, so they
tend to handle things on their own and not involve
other people, just you know, so we can be here
for you guys and you don't have to worry about us.
But in this situation, they've been incredibly vulnerable. Like this
is hard for us. We're struggling, this is tough. We
are praying. But one thing Brother Donnie has been incredibly
(08:49):
insistent on is like we are not questioning God. We're
not asking, we're not doubting, We're not saying why us,
why did this happen? We trust God every day and
the good and in the bad.
Speaker 2 (09:00):
Those are some powerful words.
Speaker 3 (09:03):
Yeah, very powerful. And that really is I mean, that
really is life, isn't it. You know, Like we are
in news and we see the most horrific things happening
all the time, you know, we see the crime and everything,
and there's this there's this you know, inclination to lean
into the fear and lean into why and why there's
(09:24):
no why. He's either God or he's not. He's either
in control or he's not. I might need you to
remind me of that sometime soon. But it's you know,
it's the truth. And that's the same thing here, Megan.
Speaker 2 (09:36):
I guess let's start with the basics.
Speaker 1 (09:38):
For people who don't know who is Jimmy swagger tell
us about this man.
Speaker 3 (09:44):
So Jimmy Swaggert is a Louisiana man. Louisiana born and Faraday, Louisiana.
So that's not too far from capital city, Baton Rouge,
several hours. And he grew up and at the age
of eight years old, he gave his heart to the life,
to the Lord and it was a special moment. His family.
He grew up with Christian parents. He had a sister
(10:06):
as well. And you know what they did. His parents
would travel around and they would go to places and
they would set up tents and they would have these
tent revivals of sorts and in that area they would
help the people there plant churches and then when they
were done and they're ready, they would move on to
the next place. And that's what they did, you know,
him and his family did. They were all very musical,
(10:27):
which is how he became very musical, and that's how
he actually met his wife, Francis, and she was at
one of these tent revivals areas in the area where
she lived, and I remember as a child him telling
the story about how he saw her and that was it.
He saw her, his eyes locked on her, and that
was it. And shortly thereafter they did get married at
(10:50):
a young age. But he's also a part of a
very musical family. If you'd heard of Jerry Lee Lewis
and Mickey Gilly who like Country Royalty, those are his cousins,
and so it's pretty yeah, it's pretty amazing in American history,
and as it pertains to music, that is a part
of Jimmy swagger.
Speaker 1 (11:10):
I did not know that, Megan. One of the interesting
things that you just brought up. That to me, watching
your parents do that, like that's got to kind of
influence you. That watching his parents go travel and helping
others set up pretty much what he ended up doing,
but on a much larger scale.
Speaker 3 (11:31):
Absolutely absolutely so, you know, and he believes at the
age of eight years old, he fell in love with
the Lord and he knew he was called to be
in ministry, and you know, obviously his parents played a
very big interest, in a very big role in that
is who he is. You know, sometimes you just that's
who you are, it's no separating it. And that is
(11:51):
who he is, and that's who he's been, and the
world will always remember that of him.
Speaker 1 (11:56):
And so megan going back to his wife him they
have been married for roughly seventy years. That is a
very long time. And I think you were saying this.
He was probably about nineteen or so, and she was
only a few years younger than him when they got married, right,
a few.
Speaker 3 (12:16):
She's only a few years younger when they got married,
and they have been married their whole life. So Pastor
Donnie mentioned it the other day when he was talking
about his mom and just what a rock she is,
and he said, you know, the first several years of
her life, a decade and a half or so of
her life, she was with her parents, and then every
day since then it's been her and her husband. So
(12:39):
you can just imagine at this time how unbelievably difficult
this is for her because she's not known a life,
you know.
Speaker 2 (12:48):
With outside of him.
Speaker 1 (12:50):
Yeah, yeah, you know, I never thought of it that way.
If you I think she was roughly sixteen, I mean
think back to when we were that age, were kids.
Speaker 3 (13:00):
I have memories from whenever I was, you know, younger
and stuff. But you know, you really start to it's
a pivotal point when you start hitting seventeen eighteen nineteen.
That's when your brain is fully developed. I believe it
is at twenty one, and then you become your own
person and you live your own life. So those first
formative years, you know, they're just not as much a
(13:22):
part of your life as everyday since, and everyday since
for her has been brother Swagger.
Speaker 1 (13:27):
I have always said, which maybe that's a podcast in itself, Megan.
Speaker 2 (13:31):
That we as women learn.
Speaker 1 (13:34):
Life in our thirties, thirties, almost forties, forties, is how
long it takes for us to finally put ourselves first.
But hey, that's a whole other podcast. Not trying to
change the subject.
Speaker 2 (13:46):
Yep, we'll come back to that later.
Speaker 1 (13:48):
Let's start at his ministry. He was not always on
Blue Bonnet. They started over on Bon Marche, And for
our listeners who are familiar with that area, it's of
near Airline Highway in Florida Boulevard.
Speaker 3 (14:03):
Right, So if you think Goya Avenue, I cannot. I
can't tell you exactly where that is. But just the
other day in the office, I was talking with Nikki,
who is basically the boss woman over there. But Nikki
was pulling out a picture and showing me of the
original location, you know, and it was Goya that was
before my time. But I was just looking at it
(14:26):
like wow, because at that time that was the big
area of Baton Rouge, that is where everything was happening. So,
I mean, he has since moved, but that that was
the start, and it was the camp meeting hour that
they started, as I remember my parents talk about that
they used to go when it was in that direction,
and then when they moved here, our house was situated
(14:49):
and maybe a mile and a half away from Bluebonnet
where it is so where it is now. But I
remember my dad saying he just knew it was a
god thing because we've gotten a high And then the
ministry moved just a mile away.
Speaker 1 (15:04):
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zero zero seven seven. So let's talk about the area
on blue Bonnet. So it's blue Bonnet kind of near Perkins.
Speaker 2 (16:37):
And this area is it's huge.
Speaker 1 (16:41):
It is not just a building where people come for
a service on Sundays.
Speaker 3 (16:47):
It's it's not And when you drive by, you'd see
you're gonna go right down middle blue bonnet. So on
that right side, if you're heading north, you're gonna see
the Ministry with the big cross on the top. On
the left side, the Renaissance says, you're going to see
the dormitories, which is now an apartment complex, the SUNLIGHTE
broadcasting studios, as well as the bookstore and also d
(17:11):
EQ is back there as well. That building has always
been owned by Swaggers. It is massive. Behind the church
is the school and the school has a wonderful nursery, daycare,
then elementary school which is kindergarten through high.
Speaker 2 (17:31):
School and Meg.
Speaker 1 (17:33):
What a lot of people may not know is that
what is now the Renaissance Hotel, the Swaggered family was
actually looking to buy that to add on more apartments
for when things used to get so busy. And from
everything I've understood is that when deputies and law enforcement
worked extra duty over there, it was so intense. And
(17:57):
I don't mean just Sundays, I mean holidays. July fourth,
instead of a family going on vacation, they were coming
to bent Rouge. They were coming to bent Rouge for Jimmy.
Speaker 3 (18:07):
Swaggert absolutely, so originally what happened was brother Swagger owned
that building which is the Renaissance because it had been
there for years, and then they sold it off as
well as they've also sold off because I do believe,
correct me if I'm wrong, which I'm pretty sure i'm not,
but like they also owned the area where the mall was,
so all of that, like all of that was Jimmy
(18:29):
Swagger Ministries, right, and so a lot of it has
been sold. But that building where the Renaissance was was
intended to become another dormitory area for JSBC, which is
Jimmy Swagger Bible College. So interesting, Yeah, it's very interesting.
A lot of history and stuff over there.
Speaker 2 (18:46):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (18:46):
Yeah. So when the mall actually opened, we were so
excited because you know, I went to FCA Family Christian Academy.
I am a flame yay. But when the mall opened,
we just thought it was the best thing ever because
you know, now we can have somewhere to go after
school and we could walk over there. We all had
jobs over there, you know, so basically like our life
(19:08):
kind of upgraded a little bit, but we're still don't
move on it.
Speaker 1 (19:12):
Interesting well, and so I was saying, like going back
that any holiday bat Rouge, you couldn't even get a
room at a hotel. Those apartments were full, campgrounds were packed,
and everybody was in town. It was almost like saying
you were at a fair, because that's how many people
were coming in town. And Megan, we're about to date ourselves.
(19:35):
But when we were coming up, fairs were a really
big deal. You you went to a fair. So I
guess that's what I meant when I said fair. Now
I think about him like, I don't know if they're
that big of a deal now as they were when
we were growing up.
Speaker 3 (19:49):
Yeah, I kiss these days will never understand. But no
talk show, Oh yeah, yeah. It was always there's always
things going on. So they have camp meetings throughout the years,
Eastern Camp meeting at Fourth of July Camp meeting, and
also there was a Thanksgiving camp meeting as well, and
so every time these camp meetings happened, it was a
(20:09):
huge deal. People were coming in from all over the world.
They also have International Youth Camp which brought people from
all over the world, and also International Kids Camp as well,
so there's always a lot happening, and to this day,
there is still always a lot happening, and there's always
a lot of people, you know, going through We talked before,
you know, in blue Bonnet and whenever you'd be going
(20:32):
to church. I mean, it was just shut down, you
know what medden by there, you just go the other direction.
And interestingly enough, it is still the same way. You know,
on Sunday mornings. The police are out there directing traffics
in and out Sunday morning at ten and at six.
So there's still a lot happening, yep.
Speaker 1 (20:51):
And I guess the other interesting thing that I found
about this was that, like you said, there was an
international crowd that would come in, but that was just
the people coming in physically.
Speaker 3 (21:04):
Absolutely, Yeah.
Speaker 1 (21:05):
And you have to take into account the amount of
people who were listening to him, watching him on TV,
listening on the radio. And one of the big things
to add here is that he was he was getting
donations from multiple people. And we kind of talked about
this earlier, Megan. Those donations. People weren't giving it to
Jimmy Swagger, yes they were, but they were giving it
(21:29):
for a specific reason. And there were so many people
that were willing to go almost in I don't know
if starvation is the correct word, but poverty level, very
close to poverty level because they were giving majority of
their paycheck to Jimmy Swagger.
Speaker 3 (21:47):
So at that time we can kind of set see
when you're talking about the eighties and nineties and stuff,
there was a major revival happening, you know, and it
was brother Swagger was at that top of it. But
on other side, even with Carlton Pearson, the late Carlton Pearson,
there was mass revival happening and people are wanting to
come and to be a part. I know someone else
(22:09):
who likes to tell a story about how his father
decided to move down here at that time so that
they can be a part of it. You know, there
was something happening. There was just a buzz, The spirit
was moving and Brother Swaggert very much was anointed, and
that is showing. So yes, people wanted to give to
be a part because they wanted to continue to further
(22:30):
the cause of Christ. Their lives have been changed and
they wanted that for other people. And so yes, people
were giving at large amounts of money to help further
that cost.
Speaker 2 (22:40):
And I mean We've said this before.
Speaker 1 (22:42):
You cannot talk about Jimmy Swagger without addressing the scandal
and where we will be discussing it because we call
ourselves Unfiltered, the name of this podcast and our company
is unfiltered.
Speaker 2 (22:54):
So yes, we discussed that.
Speaker 1 (22:55):
And having so much money was a small portion of
what kind of led him down that road as well,
along with probably other things with the power and influence
that came with it.
Speaker 3 (23:07):
So I think, you know it would is that what
let it? I don't know. I don't know if we'll
ever truly really know. I will say that at that
time there he is very very influential, you know, a
very big name, very huge name, and people watched him,
(23:28):
followed him, thought he was just the most amazing man,
and he is. And from my own personal opinions perspective,
I do sometimes think that, you know, people put a
lot of pressure on man, on a person, as opposed
to Jesus. And I will tell you firsthand, and I
know if Brothers Slagger were listening, he would one hundred
(23:49):
percent back me on this. But he would always say listen,
I'm human, you know, don't follow me, follow Jesus. He
is literally just a signpost pointing to Jesus, not follow me,
follow me, because all of us are human, all of
us are flawed, none of us are perfect. So yes,
you know, he was larger than life figure. He always
he always has been, even just going into a restaurant,
(24:12):
he's just a larger than life figure. He just draws
the attention. It's just the spirit about him. So yes,
whenever we go into nineteen eighty eight, it was a
very big deal. The world was shocked, The Christian world
was shocked. They were rocked off their you know, off
their hands goes, Oh my goodness, look what has happened.
(24:33):
And I'll tell you. You know, last Sunday when brother Donnie
got up to speak, he did a phenomenal jobs and
speaking and he said, he said, normally we're not as
open and transparent and stuff because they are a private family.
They like to take care of their own issues and
not worry other people. But he said, we're gonna be
transparent and we're gonna be honest. And he and I
(24:55):
had a conversation just even about news and media and
talking about because obviously this topic is gonna come up.
But the bottom line is we're not running from it.
We're not hiding from it. We're not backing down, and
neither is he. He's got his head high because he
is the legacy of one of the most incredible men ever.
And the truth of the matter is Jimmy Swagger's life,
(25:16):
the good, the bad, the ugly, all of it points
to Christ. And so that's what matters the most.
Speaker 1 (25:22):
How did the scandal kind of get going? And I'll
even say this, yes, when you have that much reach
and that much power, there is there is this influence,
there is this confidence. And then add on to that
the amount of money that is coming in kind of
(25:44):
like you said, for your belief in God, your faith
in God, but that money was coming to Jimmy Swagger.
So let's kind of start there. Those are the ingredients
I guess that helped fuel this scandal.
Speaker 3 (26:00):
Of course, now I will say this as well, and
I'm confident that brother Swaggert, if he were to hear,
would fully agree with me. While he had a lot
of influence and continues to have a lot of influence,
he is the first one to say I'm not perfect.
He's the first one to say, look, don't follow me,
follow him, right, you know. So that's just the case.
(26:24):
And I do think also that as a whole, and
not just Brother Swaggert. When you look at big ministers
of the Gospel, your tdjs, your joel Ostein's and all
these things, they carry influence. And there's nothing wrong with
carrying influence. But I do think as a whole that
things go wrong when people put more emphasis on the
(26:44):
man instead of the man. Right, because at the end
of the day, no one is perfect, none of us
are perfect. Just because we're not perfect doesn't mean that
we can't share the truth. Because I tell you what
I can tell my kids all the time, don't lie,
don't lie. But there's been times in my life when
I've lied, and I'm not gonna now stop telling my
kids don't lie because I lied once before. Right, the
(27:04):
truth is still the truth, and that's what Brother Swagger
has always preached and continues to preach, good or bad. Right,
So I'll preface it with that, Yes, there was a scandal, right,
two scandals. In fact, we lived through it because we
were there. My background as I grew up at Brother
Swagger's church since I was two, all the way up
until I was twenty one years old, went to school there,
(27:27):
So when I was six is when the first situation happened.
And I remember that as a child because again it
was huge. Lots of things were happened, The school was thriving,
had a lot of friends, and then the next day
did not have a lot of friends, you know, and
at that age didn't really understand what it happened. In fact,
(27:49):
I actually didn't understand the whole the you know, the
extent of what happened until like the last three years,
because I honestly never really went back to look it up.
But it was two scandals and it involved prostitutes, and
Brother Swagger was defract from the Assemblies of God, meaning
he was asked to leave. And then he came back
(28:09):
in his own way and started and kept preaching the
word of God because again that's what he's called to
do and that was never going to change. So he
did come back and he started his own ministry or
his own denomination, so to speak, and he continued to
preach the word of God. So yes, it was big, Yes,
it was huge, and it was it was It rocked
(28:32):
everyone's world and rocked a lot of Christian a lot
of the Christian world, because oh my goodness, look what's happened, right,
And because of that people in people's eyes, he was then.
Speaker 2 (28:45):
Here yeah, right, yep.
Speaker 3 (28:47):
But here's here's the truth of the matter, right, because
the Bible says the callings of God are without repentance,
meaning when God called brother Swagger, similar to whenever he
chose David to be king, and the Bible like, he
didn't do that without knowing what's going to happen. God
is omniscient. He knows everything, you know, So when he
called brother Swagger, he did that with full knowledge of
(29:10):
knowing every decision that he would make from here then
to the rest of his life. He knew that. The
same with David. In the Bible, God called David knowing
because he's omniscient, knowing the things that he would do
with Bathsheba, knowing that he would then go on to
have her husband Yuriah killed. Yet he still said, this
(29:30):
is a man after my own heart, this is the
person I'm gonna call. And because of that, you know,
brother Swagger. In other people's eyes might have lost influence,
might have lost notoriety, might have lost that, but he
never lost that in the eyes of God.
Speaker 1 (29:46):
That's a very interesting thought process to it, and the
fact that you lived it. I mean I was not
in Batage at that time, so I did not live it.
But from all that I'm told, it's kind of like
you just said that immediately everything shut down. I mean
that area of blue Bonnet near Perkins if it was
(30:07):
July fourth weekend, a simple Sunday. I was told that
on Sundays you might as well not even go that
direction because it would take forever for the masses to
come out of the church and the traffic to just
try to get everybody out, and then earlier in the
day to get everybody in there.
Speaker 2 (30:26):
All of that stopped.
Speaker 1 (30:28):
The crowds coming in for the holidays, the apartments that
were completely booked up, the campgrounds that were sold out,
all of it stopped overnight.
Speaker 3 (30:39):
It stopped at that point. It stopped. Now. The media
might not cover this now because obviously it's not like
as in your face, but if you drive down Bluebonter
on a Sunday morning, even now, you're still going to
hit that same issue. You know you are. When they
have camp meetings, they're still full. When they have international
youth camps, kids camp it is still packed. It's still
(31:01):
the issue is it's just there's not a spotlight on
it and people don't see it right now. But it
is still thriving and it is still going. But yet
at that point it did. It was a big it
was a big hold, and it was a media swarm.
It was crazy. The media was out there. They were
all over the place. They were saying all kinds of things.
(31:22):
It was tough. And for his grandkids it was tough
because they would then go in stores and see tabloids
of their grandfather, you know, and I mean you imagine
as a child, that's that's really that's really harsh. They also,
like me, but obviously worse, had friends that they just
suddenly lost overnight. You know, it was a hard time
and there is no there's no sugarcoating it. It was tough,
(31:46):
right And brother Donnie the other day, you know, we
had to talk in his office and we talked about media,
talking about things in media, saying and things like that,
and he even said, like there is there's no getting
around it. That is what happened. But guess what, like,
look at where we are right now, and that's where
the big thing is. Right, Yes, these things happen. No,
(32:06):
we're not going to shy away from it. Yeah, it's
okay to talk about but we're not gonna only talk
about that. We're going to talk about the comeback because
you and I we've been in journalism for a long time,
you know, so we've seen a lot of people take
some hits, We've seen a lot of people fall. But
how many people have you seen get back up?
Speaker 2 (32:24):
Absolutely?
Speaker 3 (32:25):
How many comebacks have you seen on this level?
Speaker 1 (32:28):
And Megan, I'll always say this that at the end
of the day, we are all human, We're all gonna
make errors.
Speaker 2 (32:35):
We're not God.
Speaker 1 (32:36):
But I feel and I mean I just went through
a conference for journalism and the biggest takeaway for me
as a journalist from that conference was the public demands transparency,
and that's what they demand of media.
Speaker 2 (32:51):
But truth be told. I think the.
Speaker 1 (32:53):
Public demands transparency period from anybody and everybody.
Speaker 2 (32:58):
And I have seen it. Oh, were an over and over.
Speaker 1 (33:01):
It doesn't matter if you're a news anchor, if you're
a police officer, if you're the mayor, or, if you're
the President of the United States, or a preacher or brother.
If you messed up, if you can own up to
it and you accept your responsibility, the public's going to
forgive you.
Speaker 3 (33:22):
It's true, It's so very true. And he did do that,
and he did, you know, I remember the famous I
have send message when he was on the stage. I
was there for that. My best friend Stephanie and I
were sitting in the back of the sanctuary. We were
on the floor, you know, for us, we were just
there for another Sunday. We had no idea the historic
(33:44):
moment that we were about to be a part of.
But it was there for that. And people might reuse
that meme all the time and you know, maybe making
fun or whatever, but that was genuine from his soul.
There is this man loves Jesus more than anything else
in this world. He is one hundred percent obsessed with
(34:06):
his wife Francis. In fact, every if you go into
his bathroom in the office, every magazine they have a
magazine called the Evangelists, and every issue with her face
on it. He took off and put in his on
his mirror in his bathroom, which is further you know,
because he loves his wife, but more than that, he
loves Jesus so much. He just I don't know, it's
(34:30):
just not even strong enough words to express that. So
as much as he felt that he had let down people,
his family, his wife, he felt that even greater to
the glory, He felt that he had truly been the
one that messed up the most, you know, and he
wore that and that humility and those tears that you
(34:51):
see that people might make fun of, they are genuine.
Those came from his heart. He genuinely felt remorse for
what he did. And he was genuinely a apologetic and
sorry because you know, people again may or may not
be with you or what because never going to leave you.
And he knew that, and he never wanted to let
the Lord down. I know he carried what he did
(35:12):
and this calling and this honor just preach the word
of God. He carried that so well and so yes,
he felt it and he did apologize. Now it was
up for people to say if that was enough or not,
you know, and their own opinion and continue follow it up.
I know we have had many conversations with our parents
(35:33):
across the years, like why did y'all stay?
Speaker 2 (35:38):
Why did they.
Speaker 3 (35:40):
Yeah, we've asked the same thing. But I'll tell you
my dad was said because the Lord never said to move.
My dad is very much like he's going to hear
from God and he's going to do what God said.
And he's been always been clear. The Lord never said
to move. And again I know and believe, but that
my parents also saw and experienced the calling of God
(36:00):
on Brother Swagger's life, and the experience is that we
had there and they knew too. Yes he messed up,
Yes he's a man, but the callings of God are
without repentance. There was anointing on his life. There's anointing
on that ministry. And that's why they stayed. And that's
why I am the person I am today because they
made that choice. Brother Swagger made the choice to get up.
(36:21):
My parents made the choice to stay, and for that
I'm personally will always be grateful.
Speaker 1 (36:27):
And you know, I guess I didn't think of it
that way that even the people his followers, it probably
was life changing for them as well. And I don't
know if life changing is the correct words that maybe
help me out here. I guess a life lesson to
take away that we're all human beings and we can
(36:47):
all mess up, but it's up to us to choose
to get back up and start over or make things right.
Speaker 3 (36:56):
Yes, and that would be the legacy of Jimmie Swagger,
someone who loved Jesus fanatically, who was so in love
with him, who chose to get up and keep going.
There was one hundred thousand reasons he could have laid
down and called her today. You know, he could have
called a quits, he could have been done, but he
got back up and his ministry from then over the
(37:18):
last thirty years has been greater than it was before.
The souls that he's reached, the millions that he has
reached again, like I said, some Life Broadcast Network, three
hundred million homes that's going into that farsar passes all
the people he was reaching in Crusades, and those were
thousands as well. So you know, again it doesn't matter
(37:39):
to the drug addict, to the pastor who's lost their way,
to anybody out there who's just struggling. There's never a
point where you can't go, where you can't do one
hundred and eighty degree turn around and go in the
other direction. There's never a point where you can't call
out to Jesus and say help me, and he won't
meet you there. And Brother Swagger's life is testament to that.
Speaker 1 (37:59):
Yep, Well, do we know any more As far as
his health condition. He remains in ICU. And that's, like
you said, roughly nearly ten days since he originally went
into the hospital.
Speaker 3 (38:14):
Yeah, so he remains in ICU right now. His family
has been living at the hospital day in and day out.
They are waiting for God to move, waiting for The
prayer is that the Lord will provide a miracle in
this situation. And that miracle looks like if it's here
(38:35):
on this side of heaven, on the other side of heaven.
The prayer is just that God will move.
Speaker 1 (38:40):
And how old is he now?
Speaker 3 (38:41):
Megan ninety years old. He just had a ninetieth birthday
the weekend that you got married.
Speaker 2 (38:47):
Marge told me that.
Speaker 1 (38:49):
Yeah, wow, same exact day, and I was trying to
book the exact same venue.
Speaker 3 (38:53):
Yeah, yeah, yeah. And they tried to book that venue.
I mean, they tried to book that venue. They're told
that there was an Indian wedding that was going to
be there.
Speaker 2 (39:00):
Imagine that Indian wedding.
Speaker 3 (39:03):
Goodness, I mean, seriously, you know, Indian weddings got all
the beautiful, colorful clothes and stuff.
Speaker 1 (39:11):
Golly well, I'm actually really glad we did talk about this.
To me, there's a bigger takeaway here that life is
going to happen and you individually have to make the
choices that you made to figure out where you want
to go next in life. And Megan, it even goes
(39:36):
to kind of like you said, there were a lot
of people who stopped following him. You went from these
massive crowds for everything just went quiet. And yeah, maybe
in that immediate moment it is it's this. Maybe they
felt betrayed. Maybe we don't know. I can't get in
people's minds of what was going on back then, but
(39:59):
there were it's everybody's choice as to where they would
like to go. But then there were all the people
who chose to stay. Prime example, you're dead and the
reason he gave to staying and the impact it had
on you, your brother, your sister. Now that impact that
you guys have because of your upbringing on your kids.
(40:23):
It's a generational thing.
Speaker 3 (40:25):
It's a generational thing. And my kids have never been
back over to Swaggert's and heard him preach, which I
now regret. I wish that I would have brought them
over there a few times. But my kids don't realize
that his legacy affects them too, you know what I've
(40:46):
learned affects them to. And there's so many people, so
many ministries that have started with the people being at
Jimmy Swagger's ministries and now they've started their own church.
That is also a part of his legacy. His legacy
will always be Jesus Christ and him crucified. His legacy
will also be there is never anything that you can
(41:08):
do to outrun the hand of God and to outrun
the fervent love of God, and that is his legacy
and he is a testament of that.
Speaker 2 (41:17):
Yep, yep.
Speaker 1 (41:18):
Well, our prayers continue for his well being and for
his family. I can't imagine what that family is going through.
And kind of like you said that at this point,
they're just waiting to see what happens and they accept
whatever it may be.
Speaker 3 (41:37):
Yeah, they aren't. And brother Swagger, brother Donnie Swagger, has
been incredibly transparent and honest with that and just you know,
we are hurting. This is hard, but we will never
question God. We will always stand on his truth. He
is always going to be sovereign. His decisions, his ways
are much higher than ours, and they always will be.
(41:58):
You might not understand, and just talking to Gabriel the
other night in the hospital, he said the same thing.
He's trying to come up with answers and questions and
why why did this happen? Or maybe why did this
or maybe this And the truth of the matter is
we won't ever know, he said. You know, he said,
we won't know until we get on the other side
of heaven. Yep. But we have hope. We don't grieve
(42:18):
or hurt like people who don't have hope. We have hope,
and we know that we're going to see Brother Swaggert.
We know that we are going to see Jesus one day.
Very true, very true.
Speaker 2 (42:29):
Well, Megan, we appreciate you joining us.
Speaker 1 (42:31):
Thank you so so very much for the insight, absolutely
and absolutely and to our viewers, to our listeners, we
will of course continue to keep you updated on his status.
If you're not already doing so, go follow us Unfiltered
with Kieran, go download our app. But we're going to
(42:51):
keep you updated. We're on all social media platforms.
Speaker 2 (42:54):
Just go follow us there.
Speaker 1 (42:55):
And we appreciate you listening to our podcast, Louisiana and
Filtered and as always, we will see you on the
next episode of Louisiana Unfiltered
Speaker 3 (43:07):
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I’m Jay Shetty host of On Purpose the worlds #1 Mental Health podcast and I’m so grateful you found us. I started this podcast 5 years ago to invite you into conversations and workshops that are designed to help make you happier, healthier and more healed. I believe that when you (yes you) feel seen, heard and understood you’re able to deal with relationship struggles, work challenges and life’s ups and downs with more ease and grace. I interview experts, celebrities, thought leaders and athletes so that we can grow our mindset, build better habits and uncover a side of them we’ve never seen before. New episodes every Monday and Friday. Your support means the world to me and I don’t take it for granted — click the follow button and leave a review to help us spread the love with On Purpose. I can’t wait for you to listen to your first or 500th episode!
The Joe Rogan Experience
The official podcast of comedian Joe Rogan.
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.