March 19, 2025 • 38 mins
In this heartfelt episode of the Love Like Crazy Podcast, hosts Jay and Stacey Coleman dive into a topic that touches every life—grief and loss. Joined by their close friend and licensed counselor, Lindsy Hornsby, they explore the complexities of processing grief and how to navigate its challenges with faith, community, and practical steps. Lindsey shares her personal journey into counseling, her experience working with grief support programs, and the importance of proactive healing.
Whether you’re walking through loss, supporting a loved one, or simply seeking to understand how to navigate grief, this conversation offers powerful insights, encouragement, and hope. Tune in for a discussion on how grief manifests, the value of community, and how to process loss in a healthy, faith-filled way. Don’t forget to like, subscribe, and leave a review! If there’s a topic you’d love for us to discuss, let us know. Together, let’s continue building stronger marriages, families, and faith-filled lives.
Listen now and be encouraged to approach grief with hope and grace.
Let’s continue building stronger marriages and families—together.
Whether you're a young family seeking encouragement or simply love uplifting stories of faith and family, this episode offers heartfelt wisdom, humor, and inspiration.
Don’t forget to:
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Podcast Produced by Hi Hello Labs
Website: hihellolabs.com
Whether you’re walking through loss, supporting a loved one, or simply seeking to understand how to navigate grief, this conversation offers powerful insights, encouragement, and hope. Tune in for a discussion on how grief manifests, the value of community, and how to process loss in a healthy, faith-filled way. Don’t forget to like, subscribe, and leave a review! If there’s a topic you’d love for us to discuss, let us know. Together, let’s continue building stronger marriages, families, and faith-filled lives.
Listen now and be encouraged to approach grief with hope and grace.
Let’s continue building stronger marriages and families—together.
Whether you're a young family seeking encouragement or simply love uplifting stories of faith and family, this episode offers heartfelt wisdom, humor, and inspiration.
Don’t forget to:
- Like, subscribe, and leave a comment with future topic suggestions
- Share this episode with friends or anyone facing a tough season
------------------------------------
Podcast Produced by Hi Hello Labs
Website: hihellolabs.com
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:22):
Hey, everyone, and welcome to this episode of Love Like Crazy.
We're your hosts Jane Stacy Coleman. Thank you so much
for joining in because we're going to talk about something
today that is very dear to my heart. We're going
to be talking about grief and loss. And joining us
today is going to be our friend Lindsay Hornsby, who
(00:43):
as a professional licensed counselor and she has just found
her way into helping people deal with grief and loss,
and I just.
Speaker 2 (00:52):
Want to take a moment Lindsay before we dive in.
We've got a lot to talk about today, but before
we dive off into this, you guys know every episode
we love to talk about how much we appreciate you
guys helping us to build this podcast.
Speaker 3 (01:03):
And if you're.
Speaker 2 (01:04):
Enjoying this, please like, subscribe, share, give us a comment,
leave us a review, and we love to hear feedback
from you guys, So thank you so much. And I
know that today I'm excited about the episode today because
not only you're talking about she's a licensed professional counselor,
but she's also a really good friend to us. And
we've known you and Roger for many many years now
(01:24):
and whenever it comes to the topic that we're going
to talk about today, I like to say it like
this everybody's least favorite topic grief, but it's actually something
that every single person eventually deals with. I don't care
who you are. They say that two things are you know,
in life are certain death and taxes. We will all
face that moment where we have lost within our life.
(01:46):
And so thank you for joining us today, thank you
for being here with us.
Speaker 3 (01:49):
So let's do this dive.
Speaker 2 (01:50):
Let's dive off into this and why don't you just
take a moment kind of tell us a little bit
about you.
Speaker 3 (01:54):
Tell us about your.
Speaker 4 (01:55):
Family, not my family and me. Okay, so I'm, like
you said, am marriage to Roger Horne. We've been married
almost twenty years, which is hard to believe because I
still think of us as being so young. But we
met on the first day that the new campus of
our church opened. So that's when I met him.
Speaker 3 (02:13):
You saw there, you were like, there's the man for me.
He went to church to beat a guy.
Speaker 4 (02:17):
You know, I had a boyfriend.
Speaker 3 (02:20):
He saw that. I was like, I can break them up.
Speaker 4 (02:23):
Yeah, So met him that day. Been together for almost
twenty years and we have two beautiful children, Knox and Letty,
and they're almost ten and almost six.
Speaker 2 (02:34):
So my goodness, it is awesome. Now you you know,
I know this because we've referred a lot of people
to you for counseling throughout the years, and the time
came where you decided, you know, I want to step
back and take on the most important role to me
and as being a wife, being a stay at home mom.
And I know that you've enjoyed that role very much.
Speaker 4 (02:53):
I really have. I am making the best of it
doing all the you know, baking and cooking and gardening
and all those things.
Speaker 1 (03:00):
And so you live out in the country, so you
get to do a lot of those kind of things.
That's wonderful.
Speaker 2 (03:04):
Now our listeners don't know this, but you live in
the big metropolis of Bluff Creek, Yes, and there's about
four people that live out.
Speaker 4 (03:11):
There, Yes, mostly cows and chickens.
Speaker 2 (03:15):
And I think all the other residents out there had
the last name Hornsby.
Speaker 4 (03:18):
Yeah, you're right, it's absolutely true.
Speaker 2 (03:21):
But it's you know, as we talk about this topic today,
you know, one of the things that I've done it
there's a lot of people who come in and I
don't I like to tell people I'm not a professional counselor.
You know, Stacey, and I with you, Yeah, we can
help give you some guys. Yeah, A lot of times
we refer people to counselors and we refer people to you.
Speaker 3 (03:40):
And I know I'm through the.
Speaker 2 (03:41):
Years, I've jokingly tried to pull you back into it,
like come on back, But I'm curious how you actually
got it.
Speaker 3 (03:47):
Tell tell Stace how you how did it come about
you going into counseling.
Speaker 2 (03:52):
Was that in your heart for being a you know,
from high school forward or like, how did it all
come to you being a counselor?
Speaker 4 (03:58):
Actually, No, I did not out and counseling. I started
out in nursing. So yeah, So at that time I
was at Southeastern and I went there for about six years.
For nursing. I worked as a nursing assistant at Woman's
Hospital for several years. And even though I loved the
work and I loved the people, I just knew in
(04:18):
my heart that it wasn't my calling. It just wasn't.
And I was having a conversation on Wednesday night before
church with our pastoral counselor who's a friend of mine.
Pastor Paul Downing, and he's our counselor, our pastoral counselor
at the church, and we were just talking and he
was like, you know, you really sound a lot like me.
(04:39):
And because what we were talking about is, you know
a lot of people when they go to the grocery store,
to any type of social event and you say, hey,
how are you doing, people say, I'm fine, how are
you well? When I asked that question to people, it's
never I'm fine, it's they open up and we might
be there for fifteen or twenty minutes, or I'm praying
with them. I share a really funny story about how
(05:01):
one time I somehow ended up over here in a
conversation in Cato's dressing room and ended up going into
the dressing room with a lady who was not fully
dressed and prayed with her for her son. So it
just ends up that way. For whatever reason, you know,
God has gifted me with maybe just a personality that
(05:25):
seems open and people just open up to me. So
he said, you know, you really would probably thrive in counseling.
So I switched my major at that point and finished
up with bachelor's in psychology and then went from there
to get my master's at Liberty University, which is an
amazing Christian university, and got my master's of Marriage and
(05:47):
Family Therapy there and then it just went from there.
Speaker 2 (05:51):
Maybe one of our listeners is that lady in that
dressing room for Kato.
Speaker 3 (05:54):
She's like, hey, that we reach out.
Speaker 4 (05:56):
Yeah, her son had cancer and she had been in
he had been and treatment for a long time, and
it was the first date that she and her husband
were going to go on since the treatment started, so
she was looking for an outfit. Yeah, and I just
my heart went out to her and I just I said,
can I pray with you? And she said, come on in.
So it was too funny.
Speaker 2 (06:16):
I know when we talked about counseling, you know, you
and I have had these conversations about grief. Yeah, and
when it comes to dealing with grief, everybody, everybody at
some point is going to deal with that. Everybody deals
with it differently. I know that whenever we first got
married or when we met started dating, she had lost
her mom a few years prior, and I was just
(06:36):
kind of at that point eighteen nineteen, twenty years old,
and I'm just like, you know, you'll be okay, you know,
and not really understanding. I was just kind of ignorant
in that regards because I had never really dealt with
grief in my life. I'd lost a you know, great
grandma and things like that, but had never really personally
lost somebody.
Speaker 3 (06:54):
That I was really close with. And walking with.
Speaker 2 (06:57):
Her through the loss that she's incurred with in her life,
it's taught me a lot throughout the years, and of course,
you know, being the age I am, we've lost people
who are close to us as well. Sow Stacy said
that this is a topic that that's dear to her
heart because she likes to help people walk through this.
Speaker 1 (07:15):
Yeah. I think since recently, in the last few years,
I have been more open with the loss that I've
experienced in my life. I lost my mom when I
was eighteen. My dad has also passed away, We've lost
some very close friends over the years, and then my
grandmother I affectionately call her Granny. She passed away two years ago.
(07:36):
And whenever I lost my Granny, I immediately was like, Okay,
I need to talk to someone. Because when I was younger,
it really wasn't a thing to go and seek help,
and so I immediately had her service on the Sunday,
and by Wednesday morning, I was in a grief Share class.
(07:56):
I jumped in the middle of like week seven, and
I found it to be extremely helpful. And since I've
been able to process more of my grief and realize
that I was carrying things along the way over the years,
it has been so helpful for me. So I admire
you using that as as your ministry to help those
that are grieving. And so, you know, I want us
(08:19):
to talk about how how can we help others who
are processing laws because it's not something that's really talked about.
But since I've been more open with our church and
with others about my loss and how that I am
processing it with the Lord's help, then more people are
coming to me, you know, because they want prayer or
(08:42):
you know, how how did this affect you and how
can it solve them? Some support? Actually, that's what the
grief Share was to me, and what we even have
offered at our church in the past.
Speaker 2 (08:53):
Well, I'm curious because you know, we've had conversations in
the past about you know, you going in to counseling,
but you know, grief's not necessarily the direction that a
lot of counselors are going to go to school and
be like, Oh, I'm going to school to be a
grief counselor, no help people walk through this. How did
you wind up going in that direction?
Speaker 4 (09:12):
Well, all counselors obviously, like you said, because everyone is
going to deal with losing someone at some point in
their life, So all of us deal with grief and
walk with people through that season of their lives. But
for me, it was something different. I was sought out
as a counselor that was hired for a funeral home
(09:34):
and they were looking to provide a service for the
people that the families that would utilize their services, and
they developed a grief support group and it was a
whole program. It was a bereavement program, and it was
a monthly grief support group, and then it was individual
counseling for people who were having a tougher time, you know,
(09:54):
maybe they had a tragic loss, one that wasn't so expected,
or just even if it was, I mean, everyone goes
through that process differently, and so for people who are
having a harder time, I would see them individually as
clients of mine at a funeral home.
Speaker 2 (10:09):
Is that common that a funeral home would have a
grief counselor or have a grief you know, like it's.
Speaker 4 (10:17):
Really not that common that they would have a counselor
on site or one on staff, but it is very
common that they do support groups and you know, at
least offer resources for people to you know, have those
types of services.
Speaker 2 (10:31):
So I will say this much that to me, that
is like a genius. I get it's very compassionate for
them to be able to have somebody onsite who can
help the family because needed a lot of towns when families,
you know, they go to the funeral, they're in such
shock they don't know how to process. I've had people
call me, you know, pastor Jay, we need you to
help us walk us through this process just because they don't.
Speaker 3 (10:55):
They're, like I said, they're in shock. They don't know
what to do right.
Speaker 4 (10:58):
And well, one thing that I'll point out is that,
you know, like Stacey said, whenever she lost her granny
and after all of the other accumulated loss over your life,
you know, you decided, you know what, I'm going to
be more active about this. And I find that people
who are more active about that process of grieving they
(11:19):
really do have a better outcome and they're able to
process through it a little bit better, even if they
don't go to a professional counselor for it. It's just
good to just know what to expect, if nothing.
Speaker 1 (11:31):
Else, and to be around other people who have also
experienced laws. And I found that it really doesn't matter
the exact loss. You can have a room full of
people who have lost a parent, lost a child, lost
a friend, whatever the situation, and it's just the coming
together of the commonality of we have experienced something and
(11:53):
that and we have each other to support, like, hey,
you know how I'm how I'm feeling, but you know
what I'm walking what you know, you know what I'm
walking through. Though there are the specific difficulties when it
is the loss of a child versus the loss of
a parent, you know, but overall that having that in
common in that community helps you to process your grief.
Speaker 4 (12:18):
And yeah, well that's one thing that I learned when
I did the monthly support group is that I was
a little bit surprised how a lot of the people
would come together and say, you know, it's such a
blessing to come here and to not know you people,
because you know, you everyone grieves in a different way,
you know, they express their their emotions in a different way.
(12:41):
And sometimes whenever a family experiences a great loss together,
they process it in their own individual ways, and sometimes
it can get exhausting for you know, let's say it's
a child coming to their parent for the loss, or
or if a husband or our father is lost. You know,
(13:01):
it's really difficult and you can exhaust those relationships sometimes,
and so it's really neat to see how you get
around people who don't really know your specific story, but
they can say, oh, yeah, me too, I'm going through
that as well. I can relate to that.
Speaker 2 (13:17):
You know, maybe you feel like, oh, what I'm feeling
is normal? Yeah, yes, because a lot of times I
think that everybody who maybe there's a lot of people
who give you a lot of you know, opinions. Yeah,
whenever you're walking through something and you're like, well, is
this normal or is this not normal? But to be
around people who you realize, oh, I'm dealing with this.
I'm not able to snap out of it and move
(13:37):
forward after two weeks after the funeral, So this is
normal that I'm walking through this.
Speaker 1 (13:42):
Yeah, I think it's important though, having that support group
to be able. It's to be able to just talk
about your loved one because a lot of times in
certain family dynamics, and I'm kind of speaking from my
own family dynamics when we lost my mom my dad,
I mean, my mom was like forty one, so my
(14:05):
dad was really young, still having his calves in college,
but still having his kids at home and losing his wife.
But his way of dealing with it was not to
deal with it, and it was almost as if we
were not allowed to talk about her, and so that
was such a hindrance, you know, to us being able
(14:25):
to process any kind of grief if you can't talk
about her. So it ended up where if I could
find someone that I could talk about her with, it
was helpful, you know, to me. But yes, definitely the
different family dynamics and almost kind of feeling like you
have to carry the grief for someone else in your
(14:47):
family as well, like you have to be strong for them,
which keeps you from processing your own grief, you know.
Speaker 2 (14:54):
And I think for me, you know, I meet her
two years after her mom passed away. She's twenty years
old at this time, and in my mind as immature
as I was. I'm not thinking like, you're still grieving
and walking through this. I'm thinking like, oh, well, that's
in the.
Speaker 3 (15:08):
Past, You've gone past it.
Speaker 1 (15:10):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (15:10):
And I've shared in a past episode about how on
our honeymoon she sat on the end of the bed
and start we get to the hotel and I'm dealing
with the luggage and I hear something turnound. She's sitting
on the end of the bed crying and I didn't.
I'm just like, oh my gosh, what did I do?
And she not knowing all the happiness of the day,
but now she's grieving. It's settled in that I had
(15:32):
to do this without my mom, and you know, I
was just just being immature, did not really know how
to deal with that.
Speaker 3 (15:37):
So let's do this.
Speaker 2 (15:38):
Let's talk about some of the ways that maybe grief is,
it manifests, it shows itself in people's lifecause a lot
of times, I, like, you talk about your dad, just
we're not talking about it. We're going to cover it up,
we're not going to deal with it. But what are
ways it grief like shows itself?
Speaker 4 (15:52):
Okay, so many different ways, And like you said, sometimes
people will suppress that grief. But the problem with that
is it's always kind of come to the surface in
one or another, and so it can come out in
your physical health obviously, because during the grieving process it's
very normal for your immune system to be low anyway,
(16:15):
because all of your energy is spent emotionally, and so
your your immune system is just low. And so people,
you know, it's really wise to make sure that you're
eating healthy, you're exercising, you're getting sunlight, and all those
other things that we should be doing anyway, but you
don't want to do those things at this time. So
(16:37):
you have to just put one foot in front of
the other sometimes and make sure that you are or
oftentimes you will find yourself sick, and then obviously emotionally
it can come out and it can look like lots
of tears, and it can look like anger, you know,
because a lot of people have a really rough time,
especially depending on the situation of the death.
Speaker 3 (16:58):
And so seeing a lot of people get angry.
Speaker 4 (17:00):
God absolutely absolutely in a time where you know you
need to be drawn closer to him so that he
can bind up that broken heart.
Speaker 1 (17:09):
You know, I have found because this has been so
recent with my granny and we just in the last
few months settled all of her affairs, sold her house,
all that. And it's like until I got to that
place of closure, and even when I had to go
and sign and do a lot of different things, I
found myself extremely irritable and irritable with him and nothing
(17:34):
that he did, poor thing he took. And so we
do that, we we do take it out on the
ones around us.
Speaker 3 (17:41):
I think it's because you feel safe with that person.
Speaker 1 (17:43):
Right And and then I didn't even realize how irritable
I was, you know, but it was just the stress
of it, that the anticipation of having to deal with it,
the letting go of things, you know, because you're having
to release, you know, these things that have you know,
been so dear to you all of your life, whenever
(18:04):
you lose someone. And one of the things that I
found helpful when I took the grief share classes and
then I also facilitated them recently, was how they talked
about you know, people want to come to someone who's
grieving and say, Okay, well you need to move on now,
you know, like that like you were thinking, well that
(18:25):
was years ago, you know, you should be doing better
by now, and it's not that we want our need
to move on, because you moving on implies that you're
leaving that person behind. But what's important is that we
begin to process our feelings, our emotions, and therefore we're
moving forward. And so I think that that was like
(18:47):
a light bulb that came on for me that Okay,
I don't need to like move on, and we're not
going to forget this person that was so dear to us.
There's just there's just no way that's not going to happen.
But we can move forward with our lives, you know,
and process everything.
Speaker 2 (19:04):
Well, how so how do people process? You know when
it comes to grief? What is is there is there
a process to processing?
Speaker 3 (19:11):
Well?
Speaker 4 (19:11):
There is, Yeah, it doesn't look the same for every person.
But obviously, like we're talking about sharing with other people,
you know, I mean we can we can talk to
God about these things, obviously, and he will. He is
near to the brokenhearted. But where we're created to be relational,
and so when we share things with one another, the
(19:32):
grief is divided. You know, you have your marriage podcast,
and so whenever we love one another, it's multiplied. But
when we share grief, it's divided and so that's how
it's meant to be, so that that helps us process.
You know, there are many different things that people do
in our culture. Obviously, we have a funeral that helps
(19:52):
to sort of finalize because you see the person there
and it's a it's a final thing. It's a ceremony
to memorialize them. You hear all the stories. But really
that's part of it too, is hearing people talk about
your loved ones, So talking about them and keeping them alive,
so to speak, in spirit and just in your memories
(20:13):
and that type of thing. So it really does. Some
people like to go to the grave sites, other people
do not. Whenever I was counseling with people who were
having a hard time, I'd say, what feels best to you,
what feels best to you, talking to them out loud,
just as though you're talking to them, going to the graveyard,
(20:36):
whatever it is. Do those things. And I always like
to be sure that people just felt like whatever they
were doing to remember that person was normal. It's normal
and it's not depression. Okay, when you're grieving a lot
of people say, oh, well they're depressed. Well, yeah, yes
they are. They have a depressed mood because something tragic
(20:59):
has happened in their life, and they have lost a
great part of their life. And so it's very normal
to experience depressed emotions and have behaviors that look like depression.
But this is not the same thing as your major
depressive disorder as a disorder.
Speaker 2 (21:16):
So you're saying grief is not clinical depression exactly. You
are depressed because you've lost somebody, but it's not clinical depression.
Speaker 3 (21:23):
That's right, okay.
Speaker 2 (21:25):
And I think it's accepting that and just and moving
forward in that. And let me ask you this, and
you can tell me if I'm safe in saying this
or not. There's a lot of times people whenever it
comes to maybe a friend or somebody has lost a
child or something of that nature, it's like people feel
like they were walking on eggshells around that person because
they don't want to exasperate the situation or make the
(21:48):
person hurt anymore, you know, worse than they are. And
so maybe they don't talk about that person, or they
don't mention that person's name.
Speaker 1 (21:55):
They're afraid to say their name.
Speaker 2 (21:56):
They're afraid to say their name. But is it common
that that person wants to talk about that person because
they don't want the like that person to be.
Speaker 3 (22:04):
Forgotten, right.
Speaker 4 (22:05):
It is usually quite the opposite of wanting to tiptoe
around it and not mention them because it's too painful.
It is painful, but it's also very healing to have
that person remembered, to talk about.
Speaker 1 (22:18):
The fun times and the laughter and the different things. Yeah,
we had lost a very close friend. It's probably been
almost fifteen years now that he was like. We called
him uncle uncle Carl to our boys, and he passed
away suddenly. And one of the things that I specifically
was intentional about was we would talk about him all
(22:40):
the time to the boys, like, oh, my gosh, did
you know that was his favorite movie? You know, if
Uncle Carl was here, he would tell you, but you
know this, that or the other. And because I experienced
that with my dad not wanting to talk about my mom,
I was like, no, we're going to. And you know,
because my mom passed away when I was younger, Jay
(23:01):
did not get to meet her. So therefore my kids
did not know her. But do you know that they
feel as if they knew her because I talked about
her and incorporate her within our lives, the memory of
her and so I think that's so very important, and
people they want you to talk about their loved one.
Speaker 2 (23:20):
Okay, well, let's bproach since you brought that topic up,
let's broach that subject of how do you have help
your kids deal with with greet whether it's a grandparent
or a friend or whoever. It might be a lot
of times unfortunately what you experienced in your sister experience,
she was much younger than you. We don't talk about
that person, and that's not healthy. How can we help
(23:40):
our kiddos deal with grief?
Speaker 4 (23:41):
Yeah? There, So, you know, one of the things that
I have learned in this journey of mine on you know,
grief counseling and helping people, is that in our American culture,
we are so disassociated with death and dying just because
we're so progressed in our technologies and all of those
different types of things. So we we don't as adults,
(24:04):
have to deal with it very much in terms of
the entire process. So we if someone's sick, they go
to the hospital. Oh, they get fixed, and they get
fixed usually okay, and then if not, they immediately are
taken to the morgue or the funeral home. And then
someone else takes care of the remains of the person's
body and then we go and you know, have the
(24:26):
visitation and then someone else buries them. Well, I mean
think about one hundred two hundred you know, years ago,
it wasn't that way. I mean, families were very closely
associated with death and dying and even did some of
those you know processes.
Speaker 2 (24:42):
So what you're saying is this really removed from our lives.
Speaker 4 (24:45):
It has been, and so people will actually shudder at
you know, physically draw away, you know, whenever someone wants
to talk about you know, death or dying and that
type of thing. And so we have a tendency as
not as adults, and then passing that along to our
kids is just kind of just shoving it out of
the way until it's absolutely necessary and then we don't
(25:08):
know what to do. So I think it's very important.
Like Stacy said, that is such a great way to
do it. It's just to continue to talk to them
about it, make that a safe space, you know, crying
with them and in front of them. You know, that's
really an important thing. Our kids need to see us
grieve and how it's done. Well, Okay, I mean some people,
(25:31):
you know, don't do it the most healthy ways. They
may self medicate or you know, some of those more
negative ways, but to see it done in a healthy
way and to talk about it and to cry some
and you know, to say, well today I'm just having
a hard day. I'm just missing you know, so that
type of thing, and then other thing, Yeah, just being honest,
because if they're asking questions, especially, they're usually ready for
(25:54):
an age appropriate answer. You know, their little minds are
wondering what do I do with this? And so you know,
that's that's what I would say, is to approach the
topic to them in an age appropriate way, whatever age
they are. For little ones, you can do little memorial boxes,
or you know, some people do the balloon releases and
(26:16):
just all all different sorts of things like that. But
just normalizing the fact that grief is sad and there
has been a loss, that's the most important.
Speaker 2 (26:26):
I thought it was kind of cool what our friend
did with her husband's shirts. She had pillows made for
the grandkids cases made out of the shirts, and I
thought that that was kind of a neat thing.
Speaker 4 (26:36):
There's a lot of neat things like that.
Speaker 2 (26:38):
And you're seeing more and more of this versus you know,
years ago people really didn't talk about it or deal
with it. But now I kind of feel like maybe
now people are a little bit more open to this. Counseling,
in fact, was one of the things that years ago,
you don't go see a counselor that means you're weak,
And now people are talking about you know, there is
an openness to going and getting counseling and getting grief counseling.
Speaker 1 (27:00):
Yeah. I once told my granny because my mom was
her daughter and she grieved so deeply for her, and
I told her one time, I said, you know, if
we would have all gone to counseling, or if we
would have all had somebody to talk to when we
first experienced the loss, how much farther along, you know,
or how much better it would have been for us.
(27:22):
And I definitely love the idea and tell this to
people often about doing something special in memory of that person,
especially when there's children involved, you know that you need
to do that to represent that, you know, celebrate their memory.
One of the things that I started doing since my
(27:44):
granny's been gone a couple of years now is I
used to always send her she didn't live here, she
lived a couple of hours away, and I would always
send her a point setter for Christmas. And so I
got really sad, like I can't send her a point setus.
So I went down to Sam's Club, bought two large
point set us and put them by my front door.
(28:05):
And so that is now my new tradition. I'm going
to continue to buy a point set up in her memory,
you know, because that's something that I miss being able
to do. And so, and I think it's okay to
talk about like, hey, I'm doing this to honor the
memory of this person, you know, and it be an
open communication thing.
Speaker 2 (28:25):
Well, I love that being able to keep that memory
alive of that person. I also want to kind of
broach this topic as well. You know, as a minister,
a lot of times I have to conduct funeral services,
and it is a blessing to be able to speak,
you know, for people speak.
Speaker 3 (28:39):
On their behalf of their life.
Speaker 2 (28:41):
I've encountered people who are grieving with the hope of
Christ and people who are grieving without the hope of Christ.
You know, in other words, somebody is they don't you know,
believe in Christ, or or somebody who is a Christian
and Paul actually wrote about you know, those who grieve
with hope versus those who don't in Thessalonians and have you,
(29:01):
you know, working in the funeral home at you know,
dealing with people through that process of grief, do you
see a difference there within people?
Speaker 4 (29:08):
There is a difference.
Speaker 1 (29:11):
You know.
Speaker 4 (29:11):
Obviously the people who have hope, they tend to do better. Yeah,
you know that that's just kind of a given to
me as a Christian. But what you will see though,
is that when someone loses someone very close to them,
that is the realist and rawest that they'll ever be.
And so it's an opportunity for us as Christians to
(29:35):
share Christ with them. And it's not anything that you
you know, you want to fill in the gaps in
terms of you know, pushing it down their throat or
any any of that type of thing. But it's an
opportunity I think that God gives us in that process
for them. And if God puts somebody in your life
who has lost someone, you know, we should be taken
(29:57):
that opportunity because eternity is is just as real right.
Speaker 2 (30:01):
Well, and to help them understand that Christ is the
one who can bring peace to your heart. Through this
time of morning, and he's near to the broken hearted.
It is a powerful thing, and it's when you are
a believer and you're walking through that time of grief,
you draw strength from knowing that there's people praying for you. You
draw strength from the presence of Christ within your life.
(30:22):
So that's why I agree with you. It's the time
that you can really not shoving it down people's throats,
but being able to pray with them, to minister to
them and share the hope of Christ with him. It's
also great I've seen this side of it as well,
that people value the community that they have within.
Speaker 3 (30:37):
Their church family. You know, people don't know what to do.
Speaker 2 (30:41):
A lot of towns whenever somebody passes away, so what
do they do. They cook, you know, and they show
up with a cake or casse role something of that nature,
or they're calling, texting letting people know we're praying for you.
Speaker 3 (30:53):
So that community is very, very valuable.
Speaker 4 (30:56):
It really is, and more than like I said, filling
in the gaps, because one of the things, like I
think you mentioned it earlier, people try to say all
kinds of things to people who are grieving, and well,
he or she is in a better place or you know,
well we'll see them again in heaven or at least
they're not suffering or whatever. You know. We mean, women
(31:17):
really do. And that's the thing is I learned that,
and I had to train people, you know, to understand that,
please don't get angry with your friends and family when
they try to fill that space. They want to see
you be okay. And so it makes us, you know,
as people, very uncomfortable when the people that we love
are not okay, and so they just want to say
(31:38):
something that's meaningful. But really the most important thing that
you can do is just show up all them, Go
do their dishes, go do their laundry, go drop off
some groceries on their porch, cut their grass, whatever it is.
Just be a presence and a support. In that way,
you don't have to say much.
Speaker 1 (31:58):
Right, And community is so important because as when you're
going through the grief, that that shock, that there's just
this feeling of like almost kind of like things are
standing still and it's almost hard to put one foot
in front of the other to do anything to get
out of bed, you know, And so it's so helpful
(32:21):
that when you do have that community and friends that
will just step up and do for you. It's not
necessarily that you have to say anything, but your actions
speak a lot of love. Definitely.
Speaker 2 (32:32):
Well, so I think it's valuable to say that community
is important, whether it's community with your church, family or
joining a sport group. I know for you y'all kind
of talked.
Speaker 3 (32:42):
About this about grief Share. Grief Share was very valuable.
Speaker 2 (32:45):
I know, whenever she lost her grandmother, she comes to
me and she says, I'm not gonna, you know, this time,
kind of sit on the sidelines.
Speaker 3 (32:52):
And do nothing.
Speaker 2 (32:52):
This time, I'm gonna I'm going to grief share.
Speaker 3 (32:54):
I want to see a counselor.
Speaker 2 (32:55):
And I'm like, I fully support you in whatever it
is that you need to do. And it was kind
of funny because the grief share group that she joined,
she was like the young in there. Everybody had lost
their spouse. They were in their seventies, eighties.
Speaker 1 (33:08):
It's true. Well, I went on the grief share website
and I put in the zip code to see what places,
what churches offered grief share, and then so I picked
the time that was most convenient for me, which was
Wednesday mornings. So I decided to drive into downtown Baton
Rouge on Wednesday mornings and meet with this precious group
(33:30):
and they were so welcoming to me and I just
I sat there one time and I thought Grannie would
have loved this, you know, this was just because she
was such an extra art And they asked me, when
you stay and eat lunch with us, when you visit
with us, And that in itself was healing to me
to be put in the middle of the older generation,
(33:51):
the age of what my granny was.
Speaker 3 (33:54):
And you had a whole room full of grandpa.
Speaker 1 (33:56):
I did. I did, And they were just so very
encouraging to me, and I could ask them, you know,
certain questions like how did you, you know, work through
this and different things, and they were just so very
honoring to you know, what is the what is the
website for that grief Share dot work, Yes and grief Share.
Speaker 4 (34:16):
If some of you don't know what that is, she
Stacey has explained it pretty well. It's a it's a
community organization that in your local area. You can type
in your zip code and it will show you any
church or any place that is offering this and it's
a thirteen week program. Yeah, you know, it's a curriculum.
There's a book that you work through and it's like
(34:38):
a thirty minute video and then it's a support group
and distort questions and discussion after and it's just very helpful.
It's for anybody. It doesn't have to be loss of
a specific person. It's spouse's children, parents, whomever, and so
it's really really helpful to so many people. But then otherwise,
(35:00):
there are grief support groups that a lot of churches
and even funeral homes hospice services sometimes provide those types
of things monthly or weekly grief support groups. And then
individual counseling. You know, if you're having a harder time
or maybe you don't feel comfortable around other people just yet,
getting in touch with a professional counselor or some a
(35:22):
pastor at your church that is very very helpful. Like
we said earlier, just being proactive about it.
Speaker 1 (35:28):
Yes, And I think that's that's what you have to be.
You have to say, Okay, I'm going to step out
and I'm going to do this like I did with
grief Share. I jumped in in the middle. And I
think a lot of times it's like, oh, well, I'll
wait till the next grief Share class starts are. You know,
there's just all kinds of excuses that we put out
to like push it, push it aside. And I just
(35:50):
encourage all of our listeners to you know, be proactive,
jump in and get build that community and get the
support that you need.
Speaker 2 (36:00):
Well you you even when as far as after going
through the grief Share.
Speaker 1 (36:04):
Program, yes, yes, and I was going to say and
I sought out a specific grief counselor as well, but
yes I did. I offered it at our church and
had a huge, you know turnout and our large class.
I feel that we went through all of the you know,
(36:26):
the curriculum, and it was it was extremely helpful. There
was such a need. I really saw what a need
there was for that.
Speaker 3 (36:35):
Well.
Speaker 2 (36:35):
So I think a couple of takeaways today as we
wrap up this episode is don't don't be reactive, be proactive,
step out and get the help you need. Find it,
find a great supporter, whether it's through your church, whether
it's through seeing a grief counselor whether it's going through
grief Share, whatever it might be.
Speaker 1 (36:53):
Well, also also tell us the website of where they
can go to search for a counselor.
Speaker 4 (37:00):
Okay, So there is one that it's called psychology today,
and you can search for any type of counselor you
can search for male or female and your area. That's
a very helpful one that you can find some resources for.
Speaker 1 (37:13):
That's good.
Speaker 2 (37:14):
That's good. Well, I know this kind of sounds ironic
to say it's been fun today.
Speaker 1 (37:19):
Yeah, well, this has been a great conversation and I
needed one. And I do hope that our listeners, you know,
find this helpful and you know that we begin to
process these feelings that we have. When you experience loss,
it's so so very important not to isolate yourself and
to to get the help that's needed. And it's okay
(37:42):
to do that.
Speaker 2 (37:44):
Well, I think it's let me say it this way,
it's not. It's been informative today. It's been fun.
Speaker 3 (37:49):
We get to hang out with our friends and talk
about this.
Speaker 2 (37:51):
But Lindsey, thank you so much for joining.
Speaker 3 (37:53):
Us today on the podcast. It's great to have you
with us. So and listen.
Speaker 2 (37:57):
If you guys have enjoyed this podcast, make sure that
you like, you subscribe, you share, leave a comment. If
there's a particular topic that you would like for us
to talk about, leave a comment. We would love to
talk about the different ideas that maybe you have and
give us a review as well. Help us continue to
grow this podcast as we're all about building a stronger
family and a stronger marriage. And as always, I'm Jay
(38:19):
Andy and this is Love Like Crazy.
Hey, everyone, and welcome to this episode of Love Like Crazy.
We're your hosts Jane Stacy Coleman. Thank you so much
for joining in because we're going to talk about something
today that is very dear to my heart. We're going
to be talking about grief and loss. And joining us
today is going to be our friend Lindsay Hornsby, who
(00:43):
as a professional licensed counselor and she has just found
her way into helping people deal with grief and loss,
and I just.
Speaker 2 (00:52):
Want to take a moment Lindsay before we dive in.
We've got a lot to talk about today, but before
we dive off into this, you guys know every episode
we love to talk about how much we appreciate you
guys helping us to build this podcast.
Speaker 3 (01:03):
And if you're.
Speaker 2 (01:04):
Enjoying this, please like, subscribe, share, give us a comment,
leave us a review, and we love to hear feedback
from you guys, So thank you so much. And I
know that today I'm excited about the episode today because
not only you're talking about she's a licensed professional counselor,
but she's also a really good friend to us. And
we've known you and Roger for many many years now
(01:24):
and whenever it comes to the topic that we're going
to talk about today, I like to say it like
this everybody's least favorite topic grief, but it's actually something
that every single person eventually deals with. I don't care
who you are. They say that two things are you know,
in life are certain death and taxes. We will all
face that moment where we have lost within our life.
(01:46):
And so thank you for joining us today, thank you
for being here with us.
Speaker 3 (01:49):
So let's do this dive.
Speaker 2 (01:50):
Let's dive off into this and why don't you just
take a moment kind of tell us a little bit
about you.
Speaker 3 (01:54):
Tell us about your.
Speaker 4 (01:55):
Family, not my family and me. Okay, so I'm, like
you said, am marriage to Roger Horne. We've been married
almost twenty years, which is hard to believe because I
still think of us as being so young. But we
met on the first day that the new campus of
our church opened. So that's when I met him.
Speaker 3 (02:13):
You saw there, you were like, there's the man for me.
He went to church to beat a guy.
Speaker 4 (02:17):
You know, I had a boyfriend.
Speaker 3 (02:20):
He saw that. I was like, I can break them up.
Speaker 4 (02:23):
Yeah, So met him that day. Been together for almost
twenty years and we have two beautiful children, Knox and Letty,
and they're almost ten and almost six.
Speaker 2 (02:34):
So my goodness, it is awesome. Now you you know,
I know this because we've referred a lot of people
to you for counseling throughout the years, and the time
came where you decided, you know, I want to step
back and take on the most important role to me
and as being a wife, being a stay at home mom.
And I know that you've enjoyed that role very much.
Speaker 4 (02:53):
I really have. I am making the best of it
doing all the you know, baking and cooking and gardening
and all those things.
Speaker 1 (03:00):
And so you live out in the country, so you
get to do a lot of those kind of things.
That's wonderful.
Speaker 2 (03:04):
Now our listeners don't know this, but you live in
the big metropolis of Bluff Creek, Yes, and there's about
four people that live out.
Speaker 4 (03:11):
There, Yes, mostly cows and chickens.
Speaker 2 (03:15):
And I think all the other residents out there had
the last name Hornsby.
Speaker 4 (03:18):
Yeah, you're right, it's absolutely true.
Speaker 2 (03:21):
But it's you know, as we talk about this topic today,
you know, one of the things that I've done it
there's a lot of people who come in and I
don't I like to tell people I'm not a professional counselor.
You know, Stacey, and I with you, Yeah, we can
help give you some guys. Yeah, A lot of times
we refer people to counselors and we refer people to you.
Speaker 3 (03:40):
And I know I'm through the.
Speaker 2 (03:41):
Years, I've jokingly tried to pull you back into it,
like come on back, But I'm curious how you actually
got it.
Speaker 3 (03:47):
Tell tell Stace how you how did it come about
you going into counseling.
Speaker 2 (03:52):
Was that in your heart for being a you know,
from high school forward or like, how did it all
come to you being a counselor?
Speaker 4 (03:58):
Actually, No, I did not out and counseling. I started
out in nursing. So yeah, So at that time I
was at Southeastern and I went there for about six years.
For nursing. I worked as a nursing assistant at Woman's
Hospital for several years. And even though I loved the
work and I loved the people, I just knew in
(04:18):
my heart that it wasn't my calling. It just wasn't.
And I was having a conversation on Wednesday night before
church with our pastoral counselor who's a friend of mine.
Pastor Paul Downing, and he's our counselor, our pastoral counselor
at the church, and we were just talking and he
was like, you know, you really sound a lot like me.
(04:39):
And because what we were talking about is, you know
a lot of people when they go to the grocery store,
to any type of social event and you say, hey,
how are you doing, people say, I'm fine, how are
you well? When I asked that question to people, it's
never I'm fine, it's they open up and we might
be there for fifteen or twenty minutes, or I'm praying
with them. I share a really funny story about how
(05:01):
one time I somehow ended up over here in a
conversation in Cato's dressing room and ended up going into
the dressing room with a lady who was not fully
dressed and prayed with her for her son. So it
just ends up that way. For whatever reason, you know,
God has gifted me with maybe just a personality that
(05:25):
seems open and people just open up to me. So
he said, you know, you really would probably thrive in counseling.
So I switched my major at that point and finished
up with bachelor's in psychology and then went from there
to get my master's at Liberty University, which is an
amazing Christian university, and got my master's of Marriage and
(05:47):
Family Therapy there and then it just went from there.
Speaker 2 (05:51):
Maybe one of our listeners is that lady in that
dressing room for Kato.
Speaker 3 (05:54):
She's like, hey, that we reach out.
Speaker 4 (05:56):
Yeah, her son had cancer and she had been in
he had been and treatment for a long time, and
it was the first date that she and her husband
were going to go on since the treatment started, so
she was looking for an outfit. Yeah, and I just
my heart went out to her and I just I said,
can I pray with you? And she said, come on in.
So it was too funny.
Speaker 2 (06:16):
I know when we talked about counseling, you know, you
and I have had these conversations about grief. Yeah, and
when it comes to dealing with grief, everybody, everybody at
some point is going to deal with that. Everybody deals
with it differently. I know that whenever we first got
married or when we met started dating, she had lost
her mom a few years prior, and I was just
(06:36):
kind of at that point eighteen nineteen, twenty years old,
and I'm just like, you know, you'll be okay, you know,
and not really understanding. I was just kind of ignorant
in that regards because I had never really dealt with
grief in my life. I'd lost a you know, great
grandma and things like that, but had never really personally
lost somebody.
Speaker 3 (06:54):
That I was really close with. And walking with.
Speaker 2 (06:57):
Her through the loss that she's incurred with in her life,
it's taught me a lot throughout the years, and of course,
you know, being the age I am, we've lost people
who are close to us as well. Sow Stacy said
that this is a topic that that's dear to her
heart because she likes to help people walk through this.
Speaker 1 (07:15):
Yeah. I think since recently, in the last few years,
I have been more open with the loss that I've
experienced in my life. I lost my mom when I
was eighteen. My dad has also passed away, We've lost
some very close friends over the years, and then my
grandmother I affectionately call her Granny. She passed away two years ago.
(07:36):
And whenever I lost my Granny, I immediately was like, Okay,
I need to talk to someone. Because when I was younger,
it really wasn't a thing to go and seek help,
and so I immediately had her service on the Sunday,
and by Wednesday morning, I was in a grief Share class.
(07:56):
I jumped in the middle of like week seven, and
I found it to be extremely helpful. And since I've
been able to process more of my grief and realize
that I was carrying things along the way over the years,
it has been so helpful for me. So I admire
you using that as as your ministry to help those
that are grieving. And so, you know, I want us
(08:19):
to talk about how how can we help others who
are processing laws because it's not something that's really talked about.
But since I've been more open with our church and
with others about my loss and how that I am
processing it with the Lord's help, then more people are
coming to me, you know, because they want prayer or
(08:42):
you know, how how did this affect you and how
can it solve them? Some support? Actually, that's what the
grief Share was to me, and what we even have
offered at our church in the past.
Speaker 2 (08:53):
Well, I'm curious because you know, we've had conversations in
the past about you know, you going in to counseling,
but you know, grief's not necessarily the direction that a
lot of counselors are going to go to school and
be like, Oh, I'm going to school to be a
grief counselor, no help people walk through this. How did
you wind up going in that direction?
Speaker 4 (09:12):
Well, all counselors obviously, like you said, because everyone is
going to deal with losing someone at some point in
their life, So all of us deal with grief and
walk with people through that season of their lives. But
for me, it was something different. I was sought out
as a counselor that was hired for a funeral home
(09:34):
and they were looking to provide a service for the
people that the families that would utilize their services, and
they developed a grief support group and it was a
whole program. It was a bereavement program, and it was
a monthly grief support group, and then it was individual
counseling for people who were having a tougher time, you know,
(09:54):
maybe they had a tragic loss, one that wasn't so expected,
or just even if it was, I mean, everyone goes
through that process differently, and so for people who are
having a harder time, I would see them individually as
clients of mine at a funeral home.
Speaker 2 (10:09):
Is that common that a funeral home would have a
grief counselor or have a grief you know, like it's.
Speaker 4 (10:17):
Really not that common that they would have a counselor
on site or one on staff, but it is very
common that they do support groups and you know, at
least offer resources for people to you know, have those
types of services.
Speaker 2 (10:31):
So I will say this much that to me, that
is like a genius. I get it's very compassionate for
them to be able to have somebody onsite who can
help the family because needed a lot of towns when families,
you know, they go to the funeral, they're in such
shock they don't know how to process. I've had people
call me, you know, pastor Jay, we need you to
help us walk us through this process just because they don't.
Speaker 3 (10:55):
They're, like I said, they're in shock. They don't know
what to do right.
Speaker 4 (10:58):
And well, one thing that I'll point out is that,
you know, like Stacey said, whenever she lost her granny
and after all of the other accumulated loss over your life,
you know, you decided, you know what, I'm going to
be more active about this. And I find that people
who are more active about that process of grieving they
(11:19):
really do have a better outcome and they're able to
process through it a little bit better, even if they
don't go to a professional counselor for it. It's just
good to just know what to expect, if nothing.
Speaker 1 (11:31):
Else, and to be around other people who have also
experienced laws. And I found that it really doesn't matter
the exact loss. You can have a room full of
people who have lost a parent, lost a child, lost
a friend, whatever the situation, and it's just the coming
together of the commonality of we have experienced something and
(11:53):
that and we have each other to support, like, hey,
you know how I'm how I'm feeling, but you know
what I'm walking what you know, you know what I'm
walking through. Though there are the specific difficulties when it
is the loss of a child versus the loss of
a parent, you know, but overall that having that in
common in that community helps you to process your grief.
Speaker 4 (12:18):
And yeah, well that's one thing that I learned when
I did the monthly support group is that I was
a little bit surprised how a lot of the people
would come together and say, you know, it's such a
blessing to come here and to not know you people,
because you know, you everyone grieves in a different way,
you know, they express their their emotions in a different way.
(12:41):
And sometimes whenever a family experiences a great loss together,
they process it in their own individual ways, and sometimes
it can get exhausting for you know, let's say it's
a child coming to their parent for the loss, or
or if a husband or our father is lost. You know,
(13:01):
it's really difficult and you can exhaust those relationships sometimes,
and so it's really neat to see how you get
around people who don't really know your specific story, but
they can say, oh, yeah, me too, I'm going through
that as well. I can relate to that.
Speaker 2 (13:17):
You know, maybe you feel like, oh, what I'm feeling
is normal? Yeah, yes, because a lot of times I
think that everybody who maybe there's a lot of people
who give you a lot of you know, opinions. Yeah,
whenever you're walking through something and you're like, well, is
this normal or is this not normal? But to be
around people who you realize, oh, I'm dealing with this.
I'm not able to snap out of it and move
(13:37):
forward after two weeks after the funeral, So this is
normal that I'm walking through this.
Speaker 1 (13:42):
Yeah, I think it's important though, having that support group
to be able. It's to be able to just talk
about your loved one because a lot of times in
certain family dynamics, and I'm kind of speaking from my
own family dynamics when we lost my mom my dad,
I mean, my mom was like forty one, so my
(14:05):
dad was really young, still having his calves in college,
but still having his kids at home and losing his wife.
But his way of dealing with it was not to
deal with it, and it was almost as if we
were not allowed to talk about her, and so that
was such a hindrance, you know, to us being able
(14:25):
to process any kind of grief if you can't talk
about her. So it ended up where if I could
find someone that I could talk about her with, it
was helpful, you know, to me. But yes, definitely the
different family dynamics and almost kind of feeling like you
have to carry the grief for someone else in your
(14:47):
family as well, like you have to be strong for them,
which keeps you from processing your own grief, you know.
Speaker 2 (14:54):
And I think for me, you know, I meet her
two years after her mom passed away. She's twenty years
old at this time, and in my mind as immature
as I was. I'm not thinking like, you're still grieving
and walking through this. I'm thinking like, oh, well, that's
in the.
Speaker 3 (15:08):
Past, You've gone past it.
Speaker 1 (15:10):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (15:10):
And I've shared in a past episode about how on
our honeymoon she sat on the end of the bed
and start we get to the hotel and I'm dealing
with the luggage and I hear something turnound. She's sitting
on the end of the bed crying and I didn't.
I'm just like, oh my gosh, what did I do?
And she not knowing all the happiness of the day,
but now she's grieving. It's settled in that I had
(15:32):
to do this without my mom, and you know, I
was just just being immature, did not really know how
to deal with that.
Speaker 3 (15:37):
So let's do this.
Speaker 2 (15:38):
Let's talk about some of the ways that maybe grief is,
it manifests, it shows itself in people's lifecause a lot
of times, I, like, you talk about your dad, just
we're not talking about it. We're going to cover it up,
we're not going to deal with it. But what are
ways it grief like shows itself?
Speaker 4 (15:52):
Okay, so many different ways, And like you said, sometimes
people will suppress that grief. But the problem with that
is it's always kind of come to the surface in
one or another, and so it can come out in
your physical health obviously, because during the grieving process it's
very normal for your immune system to be low anyway,
(16:15):
because all of your energy is spent emotionally, and so
your your immune system is just low. And so people,
you know, it's really wise to make sure that you're
eating healthy, you're exercising, you're getting sunlight, and all those
other things that we should be doing anyway, but you
don't want to do those things at this time. So
(16:37):
you have to just put one foot in front of
the other sometimes and make sure that you are or
oftentimes you will find yourself sick, and then obviously emotionally
it can come out and it can look like lots
of tears, and it can look like anger, you know,
because a lot of people have a really rough time,
especially depending on the situation of the death.
Speaker 3 (16:58):
And so seeing a lot of people get angry.
Speaker 4 (17:00):
God absolutely absolutely in a time where you know you
need to be drawn closer to him so that he
can bind up that broken heart.
Speaker 1 (17:09):
You know, I have found because this has been so
recent with my granny and we just in the last
few months settled all of her affairs, sold her house,
all that. And it's like until I got to that
place of closure, and even when I had to go
and sign and do a lot of different things, I
found myself extremely irritable and irritable with him and nothing
(17:34):
that he did, poor thing he took. And so we
do that, we we do take it out on the
ones around us.
Speaker 3 (17:41):
I think it's because you feel safe with that person.
Speaker 1 (17:43):
Right And and then I didn't even realize how irritable
I was, you know, but it was just the stress
of it, that the anticipation of having to deal with it,
the letting go of things, you know, because you're having
to release, you know, these things that have you know,
been so dear to you all of your life, whenever
(18:04):
you lose someone. And one of the things that I
found helpful when I took the grief share classes and
then I also facilitated them recently, was how they talked
about you know, people want to come to someone who's
grieving and say, Okay, well you need to move on now,
you know, like that like you were thinking, well that
(18:25):
was years ago, you know, you should be doing better
by now, and it's not that we want our need
to move on, because you moving on implies that you're
leaving that person behind. But what's important is that we
begin to process our feelings, our emotions, and therefore we're
moving forward. And so I think that that was like
(18:47):
a light bulb that came on for me that Okay,
I don't need to like move on, and we're not
going to forget this person that was so dear to us.
There's just there's just no way that's not going to happen.
But we can move forward with our lives, you know,
and process everything.
Speaker 2 (19:04):
Well, how so how do people process? You know when
it comes to grief? What is is there is there
a process to processing?
Speaker 3 (19:11):
Well?
Speaker 4 (19:11):
There is, Yeah, it doesn't look the same for every person.
But obviously, like we're talking about sharing with other people,
you know, I mean we can we can talk to
God about these things, obviously, and he will. He is
near to the brokenhearted. But where we're created to be relational,
and so when we share things with one another, the
(19:32):
grief is divided. You know, you have your marriage podcast,
and so whenever we love one another, it's multiplied. But
when we share grief, it's divided and so that's how
it's meant to be, so that that helps us process.
You know, there are many different things that people do
in our culture. Obviously, we have a funeral that helps
(19:52):
to sort of finalize because you see the person there
and it's a it's a final thing. It's a ceremony
to memorialize them. You hear all the stories. But really
that's part of it too, is hearing people talk about
your loved ones, So talking about them and keeping them alive,
so to speak, in spirit and just in your memories
(20:13):
and that type of thing. So it really does. Some
people like to go to the grave sites, other people
do not. Whenever I was counseling with people who were
having a hard time, I'd say, what feels best to you,
what feels best to you, talking to them out loud,
just as though you're talking to them, going to the graveyard,
(20:36):
whatever it is. Do those things. And I always like
to be sure that people just felt like whatever they
were doing to remember that person was normal. It's normal
and it's not depression. Okay, when you're grieving a lot
of people say, oh, well they're depressed. Well, yeah, yes
they are. They have a depressed mood because something tragic
(20:59):
has happened in their life, and they have lost a
great part of their life. And so it's very normal
to experience depressed emotions and have behaviors that look like depression.
But this is not the same thing as your major
depressive disorder as a disorder.
Speaker 2 (21:16):
So you're saying grief is not clinical depression exactly. You
are depressed because you've lost somebody, but it's not clinical depression.
Speaker 3 (21:23):
That's right, okay.
Speaker 2 (21:25):
And I think it's accepting that and just and moving
forward in that. And let me ask you this, and
you can tell me if I'm safe in saying this
or not. There's a lot of times people whenever it
comes to maybe a friend or somebody has lost a
child or something of that nature, it's like people feel
like they were walking on eggshells around that person because
they don't want to exasperate the situation or make the
(21:48):
person hurt anymore, you know, worse than they are. And
so maybe they don't talk about that person, or they
don't mention that person's name.
Speaker 1 (21:55):
They're afraid to say their name.
Speaker 2 (21:56):
They're afraid to say their name. But is it common
that that person wants to talk about that person because
they don't want the like that person to be.
Speaker 3 (22:04):
Forgotten, right.
Speaker 4 (22:05):
It is usually quite the opposite of wanting to tiptoe
around it and not mention them because it's too painful.
It is painful, but it's also very healing to have
that person remembered, to talk about.
Speaker 1 (22:18):
The fun times and the laughter and the different things. Yeah,
we had lost a very close friend. It's probably been
almost fifteen years now that he was like. We called
him uncle uncle Carl to our boys, and he passed
away suddenly. And one of the things that I specifically
was intentional about was we would talk about him all
(22:40):
the time to the boys, like, oh, my gosh, did
you know that was his favorite movie? You know, if
Uncle Carl was here, he would tell you, but you
know this, that or the other. And because I experienced
that with my dad not wanting to talk about my mom,
I was like, no, we're going to. And you know,
because my mom passed away when I was younger, Jay
(23:01):
did not get to meet her. So therefore my kids
did not know her. But do you know that they
feel as if they knew her because I talked about
her and incorporate her within our lives, the memory of
her and so I think that's so very important, and
people they want you to talk about their loved one.
Speaker 2 (23:20):
Okay, well, let's bproach since you brought that topic up,
let's broach that subject of how do you have help
your kids deal with with greet whether it's a grandparent
or a friend or whoever. It might be a lot
of times unfortunately what you experienced in your sister experience,
she was much younger than you. We don't talk about
that person, and that's not healthy. How can we help
(23:40):
our kiddos deal with grief?
Speaker 4 (23:41):
Yeah? There, So, you know, one of the things that
I have learned in this journey of mine on you know,
grief counseling and helping people, is that in our American culture,
we are so disassociated with death and dying just because
we're so progressed in our technologies and all of those
different types of things. So we we don't as adults,
(24:04):
have to deal with it very much in terms of
the entire process. So we if someone's sick, they go
to the hospital. Oh, they get fixed, and they get
fixed usually okay, and then if not, they immediately are
taken to the morgue or the funeral home. And then
someone else takes care of the remains of the person's
body and then we go and you know, have the
(24:26):
visitation and then someone else buries them. Well, I mean
think about one hundred two hundred you know, years ago,
it wasn't that way. I mean, families were very closely
associated with death and dying and even did some of
those you know processes.
Speaker 2 (24:42):
So what you're saying is this really removed from our lives.
Speaker 4 (24:45):
It has been, and so people will actually shudder at
you know, physically draw away, you know, whenever someone wants
to talk about you know, death or dying and that
type of thing. And so we have a tendency as
not as adults, and then passing that along to our
kids is just kind of just shoving it out of
the way until it's absolutely necessary and then we don't
(25:08):
know what to do. So I think it's very important.
Like Stacy said, that is such a great way to
do it. It's just to continue to talk to them
about it, make that a safe space, you know, crying
with them and in front of them. You know, that's
really an important thing. Our kids need to see us
grieve and how it's done. Well, Okay, I mean some people,
(25:31):
you know, don't do it the most healthy ways. They
may self medicate or you know, some of those more
negative ways, but to see it done in a healthy
way and to talk about it and to cry some
and you know, to say, well today I'm just having
a hard day. I'm just missing you know, so that
type of thing, and then other thing, Yeah, just being honest,
because if they're asking questions, especially, they're usually ready for
(25:54):
an age appropriate answer. You know, their little minds are
wondering what do I do with this? And so you know,
that's that's what I would say, is to approach the
topic to them in an age appropriate way, whatever age
they are. For little ones, you can do little memorial boxes,
or you know, some people do the balloon releases and
(26:16):
just all all different sorts of things like that. But
just normalizing the fact that grief is sad and there
has been a loss, that's the most important.
Speaker 2 (26:26):
I thought it was kind of cool what our friend
did with her husband's shirts. She had pillows made for
the grandkids cases made out of the shirts, and I
thought that that was kind of a neat thing.
Speaker 4 (26:36):
There's a lot of neat things like that.
Speaker 2 (26:38):
And you're seeing more and more of this versus you know,
years ago people really didn't talk about it or deal
with it. But now I kind of feel like maybe
now people are a little bit more open to this. Counseling,
in fact, was one of the things that years ago,
you don't go see a counselor that means you're weak,
And now people are talking about you know, there is
an openness to going and getting counseling and getting grief counseling.
Speaker 1 (27:00):
Yeah. I once told my granny because my mom was
her daughter and she grieved so deeply for her, and
I told her one time, I said, you know, if
we would have all gone to counseling, or if we
would have all had somebody to talk to when we
first experienced the loss, how much farther along, you know,
or how much better it would have been for us.
(27:22):
And I definitely love the idea and tell this to
people often about doing something special in memory of that person,
especially when there's children involved, you know that you need
to do that to represent that, you know, celebrate their memory.
One of the things that I started doing since my
(27:44):
granny's been gone a couple of years now is I
used to always send her she didn't live here, she
lived a couple of hours away, and I would always
send her a point setter for Christmas. And so I
got really sad, like I can't send her a point setus.
So I went down to Sam's Club, bought two large
point set us and put them by my front door.
(28:05):
And so that is now my new tradition. I'm going
to continue to buy a point set up in her memory,
you know, because that's something that I miss being able
to do. And so, and I think it's okay to
talk about like, hey, I'm doing this to honor the
memory of this person, you know, and it be an
open communication thing.
Speaker 2 (28:25):
Well, I love that being able to keep that memory
alive of that person. I also want to kind of
broach this topic as well. You know, as a minister,
a lot of times I have to conduct funeral services,
and it is a blessing to be able to speak,
you know, for people speak.
Speaker 3 (28:39):
On their behalf of their life.
Speaker 2 (28:41):
I've encountered people who are grieving with the hope of
Christ and people who are grieving without the hope of Christ.
You know, in other words, somebody is they don't you know,
believe in Christ, or or somebody who is a Christian
and Paul actually wrote about you know, those who grieve
with hope versus those who don't in Thessalonians and have you,
(29:01):
you know, working in the funeral home at you know,
dealing with people through that process of grief, do you
see a difference there within people?
Speaker 4 (29:08):
There is a difference.
Speaker 1 (29:11):
You know.
Speaker 4 (29:11):
Obviously the people who have hope, they tend to do better. Yeah,
you know that that's just kind of a given to
me as a Christian. But what you will see though,
is that when someone loses someone very close to them,
that is the realist and rawest that they'll ever be.
And so it's an opportunity for us as Christians to
(29:35):
share Christ with them. And it's not anything that you
you know, you want to fill in the gaps in
terms of you know, pushing it down their throat or
any any of that type of thing. But it's an
opportunity I think that God gives us in that process
for them. And if God puts somebody in your life
who has lost someone, you know, we should be taken
(29:57):
that opportunity because eternity is is just as real right.
Speaker 2 (30:01):
Well, and to help them understand that Christ is the
one who can bring peace to your heart. Through this
time of morning, and he's near to the broken hearted.
It is a powerful thing, and it's when you are
a believer and you're walking through that time of grief,
you draw strength from knowing that there's people praying for you. You
draw strength from the presence of Christ within your life.
(30:22):
So that's why I agree with you. It's the time
that you can really not shoving it down people's throats,
but being able to pray with them, to minister to
them and share the hope of Christ with him. It's
also great I've seen this side of it as well,
that people value the community that they have within.
Speaker 3 (30:37):
Their church family. You know, people don't know what to do.
Speaker 2 (30:41):
A lot of towns whenever somebody passes away, so what
do they do. They cook, you know, and they show
up with a cake or casse role something of that nature,
or they're calling, texting letting people know we're praying for you.
Speaker 3 (30:53):
So that community is very, very valuable.
Speaker 4 (30:56):
It really is, and more than like I said, filling
in the gaps, because one of the things, like I
think you mentioned it earlier, people try to say all
kinds of things to people who are grieving, and well,
he or she is in a better place or you know,
well we'll see them again in heaven or at least
they're not suffering or whatever. You know. We mean, women
(31:17):
really do. And that's the thing is I learned that,
and I had to train people, you know, to understand that,
please don't get angry with your friends and family when
they try to fill that space. They want to see
you be okay. And so it makes us, you know,
as people, very uncomfortable when the people that we love
are not okay, and so they just want to say
(31:38):
something that's meaningful. But really the most important thing that
you can do is just show up all them, Go
do their dishes, go do their laundry, go drop off
some groceries on their porch, cut their grass, whatever it is.
Just be a presence and a support. In that way,
you don't have to say much.
Speaker 1 (31:58):
Right, And community is so important because as when you're
going through the grief, that that shock, that there's just
this feeling of like almost kind of like things are
standing still and it's almost hard to put one foot
in front of the other to do anything to get
out of bed, you know, And so it's so helpful
(32:21):
that when you do have that community and friends that
will just step up and do for you. It's not
necessarily that you have to say anything, but your actions
speak a lot of love. Definitely.
Speaker 2 (32:32):
Well, so I think it's valuable to say that community
is important, whether it's community with your church, family or
joining a sport group. I know for you y'all kind
of talked.
Speaker 3 (32:42):
About this about grief Share. Grief Share was very valuable.
Speaker 2 (32:45):
I know, whenever she lost her grandmother, she comes to
me and she says, I'm not gonna, you know, this time,
kind of sit on the sidelines.
Speaker 3 (32:52):
And do nothing.
Speaker 2 (32:52):
This time, I'm gonna I'm going to grief share.
Speaker 3 (32:54):
I want to see a counselor.
Speaker 2 (32:55):
And I'm like, I fully support you in whatever it
is that you need to do. And it was kind
of funny because the grief share group that she joined,
she was like the young in there. Everybody had lost
their spouse. They were in their seventies, eighties.
Speaker 1 (33:08):
It's true. Well, I went on the grief share website
and I put in the zip code to see what places,
what churches offered grief share, and then so I picked
the time that was most convenient for me, which was
Wednesday mornings. So I decided to drive into downtown Baton
Rouge on Wednesday mornings and meet with this precious group
(33:30):
and they were so welcoming to me and I just
I sat there one time and I thought Grannie would
have loved this, you know, this was just because she
was such an extra art And they asked me, when
you stay and eat lunch with us, when you visit
with us, And that in itself was healing to me
to be put in the middle of the older generation,
(33:51):
the age of what my granny was.
Speaker 3 (33:54):
And you had a whole room full of grandpa.
Speaker 1 (33:56):
I did. I did, And they were just so very
encouraging to me, and I could ask them, you know,
certain questions like how did you, you know, work through
this and different things, and they were just so very
honoring to you know, what is the what is the
website for that grief Share dot work, Yes and grief Share.
Speaker 4 (34:16):
If some of you don't know what that is, she
Stacey has explained it pretty well. It's a it's a
community organization that in your local area. You can type
in your zip code and it will show you any
church or any place that is offering this and it's
a thirteen week program. Yeah, you know, it's a curriculum.
There's a book that you work through and it's like
(34:38):
a thirty minute video and then it's a support group
and distort questions and discussion after and it's just very helpful.
It's for anybody. It doesn't have to be loss of
a specific person. It's spouse's children, parents, whomever, and so
it's really really helpful to so many people. But then otherwise,
(35:00):
there are grief support groups that a lot of churches
and even funeral homes hospice services sometimes provide those types
of things monthly or weekly grief support groups. And then
individual counseling. You know, if you're having a harder time
or maybe you don't feel comfortable around other people just yet,
getting in touch with a professional counselor or some a
(35:22):
pastor at your church that is very very helpful. Like
we said earlier, just being proactive about it.
Speaker 1 (35:28):
Yes, And I think that's that's what you have to be.
You have to say, Okay, I'm going to step out
and I'm going to do this like I did with
grief Share. I jumped in in the middle. And I
think a lot of times it's like, oh, well, I'll
wait till the next grief Share class starts are. You know,
there's just all kinds of excuses that we put out
to like push it, push it aside. And I just
(35:50):
encourage all of our listeners to you know, be proactive,
jump in and get build that community and get the
support that you need.
Speaker 2 (36:00):
Well you you even when as far as after going
through the grief Share.
Speaker 1 (36:04):
Program, yes, yes, and I was going to say and
I sought out a specific grief counselor as well, but
yes I did. I offered it at our church and
had a huge, you know turnout and our large class.
I feel that we went through all of the you know,
(36:26):
the curriculum, and it was it was extremely helpful. There
was such a need. I really saw what a need
there was for that.
Speaker 3 (36:35):
Well.
Speaker 2 (36:35):
So I think a couple of takeaways today as we
wrap up this episode is don't don't be reactive, be proactive,
step out and get the help you need. Find it,
find a great supporter, whether it's through your church, whether
it's through seeing a grief counselor whether it's going through
grief Share, whatever it might be.
Speaker 1 (36:53):
Well, also also tell us the website of where they
can go to search for a counselor.
Speaker 4 (37:00):
Okay, So there is one that it's called psychology today,
and you can search for any type of counselor you
can search for male or female and your area. That's
a very helpful one that you can find some resources for.
Speaker 1 (37:13):
That's good.
Speaker 2 (37:14):
That's good. Well, I know this kind of sounds ironic
to say it's been fun today.
Speaker 1 (37:19):
Yeah, well, this has been a great conversation and I
needed one. And I do hope that our listeners, you know,
find this helpful and you know that we begin to
process these feelings that we have. When you experience loss,
it's so so very important not to isolate yourself and
to to get the help that's needed. And it's okay
(37:42):
to do that.
Speaker 2 (37:44):
Well, I think it's let me say it this way,
it's not. It's been informative today. It's been fun.
Speaker 3 (37:49):
We get to hang out with our friends and talk
about this.
Speaker 2 (37:51):
But Lindsey, thank you so much for joining.
Speaker 3 (37:53):
Us today on the podcast. It's great to have you
with us. So and listen.
Speaker 2 (37:57):
If you guys have enjoyed this podcast, make sure that
you like, you subscribe, you share, leave a comment. If
there's a particular topic that you would like for us
to talk about, leave a comment. We would love to
talk about the different ideas that maybe you have and
give us a review as well. Help us continue to
grow this podcast as we're all about building a stronger
family and a stronger marriage. And as always, I'm Jay
(38:19):
Andy and this is Love Like Crazy.
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