31: The Play Professional Ft. Michael Hollice

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
I went to school for education, and what I love
about education is like how you communicate with diverse learners.
And so now that I've practiced so many times telling
all of my black friends about what I do, you know,
it's like I know how to deliver it to black
people now, which is one of the harder audiences to
deliver it to.

Speaker 2 (00:20):
We have an episode with this guy, that friend Luis
I was talking about a boss about his play party.

Speaker 3 (00:24):
He has a good.

Speaker 2 (00:24):
Language around it too. You should listen to discussies pretty
eloquently about.

Speaker 3 (00:28):
Especially black people in this space because.

Speaker 2 (00:30):
It's specific, Like our bodies are a lot more.

Speaker 3 (00:35):
There's like trauma associated.

Speaker 4 (00:36):
Yeah, there's race play that happens.

Speaker 1 (00:38):
You know. There's the people like other leaders in the
community have had to call me about a lot of
black situations. I mean, they'll call me about situations just because,
like I see more than most.

Speaker 3 (00:47):
Like in their own parties.

Speaker 1 (00:48):
Yeah, though, like a bunch of people who as some
private parties, they'll just hit me up and be like, okay, yo,
what would you do in this situation? I was like, okay,
so this is this, this and that boom. So one
of them was like, hey, we just had Race Play
like This.

Speaker 3 (01:04):
Welcome to Love like This.

Speaker 2 (01:06):
I'm your host, Mila, and I'm joined here with my
lovely fiance Orlando. Today we're joined by a very special guest.
We have Michael Hollis from The Play l A a
play party that we went to recently and it was
by far and fucking experience.

Speaker 3 (01:28):
Orlanda and I had a really good time.

Speaker 2 (01:29):
We know, if you listen to the show before, you
know that me and Orlando are always complaining about the
lack of play parties in LA and the the range
of play parties that we've attended so much so that
we made.

Speaker 5 (01:43):
Our parties are lacking.

Speaker 2 (01:47):
So we were really excited to go to Michael's play
party the play and we had a really really, really
really amazing time. So we just wanted to share Michael's
in a non ethically non monogamous relationship. He obviously is
the king of sex party plays parties in LA. And yeah,
I just want to pick your mind about your marriage

(02:08):
with your wife and you guys are in business together,
doing this business and you know all of the good stuff.

Speaker 5 (02:14):
Yeah, welcome friend.

Speaker 1 (02:16):
You know, it's good to be here. Thank you both
for having me.

Speaker 5 (02:18):
Yeah, yeah, it's good to see you. And it's really
good to also have a fellow black men in the
space player, like you know, of and of quality and
who I feel is like at a certain level of
like experience, because usually you'll get people that of like
black men, but they are still a bit immature in

(02:38):
the in the experience or in the mindset or more
before e being in the experience of playing, but in
the mindset. So now that I have somebody here that
is like respective, like has respective politics and respect within
their relationship in this space, it's like, oh good, finally,
like somebody could talk to and hang out with and
have an understanding and have like a range in their mindset.

(02:59):
So yeah, that's thank you.

Speaker 4 (03:00):
Thank you for saying all that.

Speaker 1 (03:02):
I will say, I'm human and I'm figuring it out
too in this space, but you know, my wife will
remind me I'm still I'm still working through it, but
I appreciate that that sentiment and and you know, thank
you guys for coming to the play.

Speaker 4 (03:19):
Yeah, I put this thank you for together.

Speaker 1 (03:22):
And to have you know, uh, more people of color
in the space means a lot to me, and and
that you guys felt welcomed.

Speaker 4 (03:32):
And that you had a good time and you were
able to kind of just.

Speaker 5 (03:35):
Uh oh we had Yeah, we had a time. I
will say. I mean one of my favorite moments there
that stand out was having sex with Mila doggy style
behind the DJ booth and then being able to have
a wide scope that was like it was kind of
like watching important Honestly, it was like kind of like

(03:56):
watching for you know, it's.

Speaker 3 (03:58):
Like it's my turn, yeah.

Speaker 5 (04:04):
Experience, But there was there were a few very sexy
thing other than the fact that I am sexy myself
and I was in the place, there were other things
that were very sexy about the space, and one of
it was the s ci testing. That was a very
sexy experience to have. Like and for me and be

(04:24):
let to go to what is the men's health clinic
in who Yeah, So we went there and it's kind
of funny because you gotta do a rectal swab there
and so I was looking at the guy and now
he was like, yeah, this is for your rectal, and
I was like your rectal. He was like rectal. I

(04:45):
was like, I can.

Speaker 4 (04:49):
So friendly at the.

Speaker 1 (04:52):
Yeah, I've been in that same situation. I remember the
first time I had to do a rectal swab you
there's just these instructions on the wall. Usually I heard
you out a room that didn't have.

Speaker 5 (05:03):
The breathing, Like, how do I do it? What's the anger?
Y'all could have given me an example.

Speaker 4 (05:11):
It turns out there is an angle.

Speaker 1 (05:13):
It's like you're supposed to go in there at an angle,
not like straight in. I literally learned that like a
few months ago, and I was like, all this time.

Speaker 5 (05:21):
The angle that I went in on, I was like,
did I even put in the right side? Because it
feels sharp?

Speaker 1 (05:26):
It feels extremely sharp, And I'm like, is there a
way that we get you know, like.

Speaker 5 (05:33):
It's like you need put my figure at the top,
and I.

Speaker 3 (05:36):
Like, listen to a moment I didn't think.

Speaker 5 (05:41):
I was like, I don't need no car. But the
reason why I say it was such a sexy experience
is because I like to think about things being sexy
that aren't necessary, like intercourse or like kissing or things
are sex. But I think that knowing your status is
a very sexy experience because when you know your status right,
you're on the same page with your person, and then

(06:04):
you go into the experience. Now you can really let
loose and that's when all the things can happen or
whatever you want can happen because you don't have you
have one less thing in your mind.

Speaker 1 (06:15):
Absolutely, and you know when you're going in when you're
going into a space where there's other people outside of
your relationship, like if just knowing just like an underlining,
we all kind of got tested recently, right.

Speaker 4 (06:28):
Yeah, okay, cool?

Speaker 6 (06:29):
Right, that's not to say I'm playing with everybody, but
just like knowing that, like you know, what if you
were to kiss this other person, I know that if
you kiss.

Speaker 1 (06:37):
Me, like there's a less probability of an exchange. Now,
we don't make safe spaces. We make safer spaces, you know, yeah, yeah,
safe space right right?

Speaker 5 (06:49):
And then we've even been in experiences where other people
were involved and like we went in a like the
all natural way.

Speaker 4 (06:58):
Are saying that you've sucked another couple? Wrong, okay, But the.

Speaker 5 (07:03):
Thing about the reason, the reason why it was it
was an even better experience is because the trust of
doing this was there, so it felt even better, higher
intensity and it was wrong.

Speaker 1 (07:20):
But to your point, like you're absolutely when you can
get to that level of trust with just other humans, right,
like forget just the relationship status, like just with other humans,
Like we're going to try this thing and trust each
other and you know, come into this ethically to where

(07:42):
we can and maybe enjoy the experience a little bit
more than you know with someone else that you're using
protection with, you know, or boundaries with that's what I
should call them.

Speaker 3 (07:54):
We're called boundaries latex boundaries.

Speaker 1 (08:00):
But all to say is like it becomes you know,
a deeper connection, not just physical just you know em
Yeah exactly.

Speaker 3 (08:07):
It puts your mind at ease.

Speaker 2 (08:08):
It's one less thing to worry about, and you know,
it's just one less worry. Yeah, and yeah, it makes
it less complicated. And so there's you're putting your partner ease,
you're putting the person you're playing with at ease. And
what I really enjoyed is that you still encourage condoms.
They're still contents exactly.

Speaker 1 (08:22):
And that's what I was just going to say, Like
most people are going to, you know, just get tested
and still use the condoms. And that's like the norm
in this space I think as when you're going to
play parties, especially, but when you're you know, hanging out
with a couple and you've played with them maybe a
couple of times, it's like, you know what, since we
trust each other and this is like we're all being
honest about who we're playing with. Yeah, right, this is

(08:42):
the situation. Then let's uh see if we can try
something new. Right.

Speaker 5 (08:49):
And my whole thing always were.

Speaker 4 (08:51):
A little more vulnerable.

Speaker 5 (08:53):
Yeah, yeah, exactly. And my whole thing always when it
comes to intercourse specifically not necessarily just sex, but intercourse,
is that when you have one less thing to worry about,
it makes the situation way better. And so for you
specifically and your and your party the play when you
put down like hey, everybody has to get s CI tested,

(09:13):
and then you get there and you know, like, oh crap,
everybody here has been tested and it's a vast amount
of people. For whatever amount of the amount of people
that are there, they're all tested. It's like I have
such another level of ease, like coming into this and
you see a lot more smiles, a lot let's worry.
Yeah yeah.

Speaker 1 (09:31):
I was telling a Mela this the other day that
the whole point of this space is, you know, to
decrease anxiety. You know, we decrease the anxiety, we increase
people's willingness to be vulnerable, and with that increase vulnerability,
then an increase opportunity for deeper connections.

Speaker 4 (09:53):
And so.

Speaker 1 (09:55):
That's kind of like you know, when you guys are
talking about this trust between partners, that's like a deeper
connection in a sense.

Speaker 4 (10:02):
You can get to that level. But I think most
people don't.

Speaker 1 (10:05):
You know, I don't. That was really dope that y'all
did that, even at this stage with my wife and
I like, that is a very rare situation.

Speaker 5 (10:13):
It also rare for us. But it still did happen,
which is which is it does happen? Oh sorry, no,
go ahead, baby, No, please go ahead. Another sexy thing
that happened. As you can see, I'm very excited to
talk about. Try to really hold it down because I was,
like I've been telling people like, yo, I had a
really good time despite there's nothing that happened that made
me not have a good time, but just coming into

(10:36):
it with like no expectations, I was like, Yo, this
was a really good party regardless of the Another part
about it was the deep connection part. And I can
see how the setup and the intention for the deep
connection for all the different things that you put together,
the length of the party, the consent speech, like just

(10:57):
having everybody centered around and just all me on the
same page. But the the thirty seconds of ice staring
with multiple people, specifically with somebody you don't know exactly stranger,
you know.

Speaker 2 (11:10):
Actually, we had a party the next day. I was
gonna invite you, but I figured you're asleep, so I
was like, he's sleep.

Speaker 4 (11:17):
But we had a little at this party. Didn't invite
me to.

Speaker 3 (11:19):
It was just like a little you know, we have
a lot of shin digs.

Speaker 2 (11:23):
Orlando's the King of Jerk Chicken, so barbecues and people
come over for Sunday there we got a DJ.

Speaker 3 (11:28):
It's just like something light at our house.

Speaker 4 (11:30):
But do you know make Jamaica patties?

Speaker 5 (11:32):
Do you make jama and petty? Do I know how
to make? I know how to make it? Do I
make it?

Speaker 3 (11:36):
Oakes?

Speaker 5 (11:37):
I know where to go get some really fire.

Speaker 3 (11:39):
Patties, super important guys.

Speaker 2 (11:43):
And you know, we do that at our retreat, at
Good Vibe Retreat, a lot of ice staring. That's like
one of the exercises that we practice in connection. But
at my party the next day, I was like, everybody
stare at somebody you.

Speaker 3 (11:54):
Didn't come with. I was like, and actually chaos was there.

Speaker 1 (12:00):
That?

Speaker 3 (12:00):
Yeah?

Speaker 5 (12:02):
On the podcast?

Speaker 4 (12:02):
Was that that was at the birthday party? Was that
the was there like a birthday party?

Speaker 5 (12:07):
No, it was just a little get together the very
next day.

Speaker 2 (12:10):
And I use that I use that because it's it's
it's I use it in tanto. It's like a big connection,
like I staring, and so I was like, I liked,
I'd love to go to a party that.

Speaker 3 (12:18):
The next day.

Speaker 2 (12:18):
I'm literally utilizing these tools that I received at the
party to you know, incorporate in my own intimate spaces
because I love to make people feel connected. I love
to make people feel comfortable, like with they're in a
safe space in our home. My dad was there, my
brother who is down downstairs beautiful, he was.

Speaker 3 (12:35):
Staring, you know.

Speaker 2 (12:36):
So it's like it does it's something past language. It's
something like energetically when you can connect with somebody that
you've never met, whereas you realize how often you're meeting
people like hey, how are you doing? But no one's
actually looking at each other's eyes. You're literally even like
rarely looking at yourself.

Speaker 3 (12:49):
In your eyes.

Speaker 2 (12:50):
Yeah, so it's like it reminds you to tap back in.

Speaker 1 (12:55):
Thank you for saying that that's that's why we do it.

Speaker 5 (12:59):
Yeah, that's not so, my brother. You threw a great party,
like the player aspect of out. You threw a great party,
had great aspects to it that can be used in
everyday life and other other type of like events.

Speaker 1 (13:09):
Yeah, we're just you know, when it comes to connecting
and self expression, what what are some of the questions
in this funerabal space should you be asking yourself? You know,
And that's that's why we have the DIBs. And I
think the other you know, the other part about why
we do the eye gazing is just creating opportunity for
verbal and non verbal connection.

Speaker 4 (13:29):
You know. Not everybody's a type A.

Speaker 1 (13:31):
And like with me and my partner, she is, you know,
in America, she's an introvert. In in Paris, she's like,
she speaks French, like I don't know this person and
I'm the quiet one, you know. So it's it's it's interesting.
But here, you know, it made me think, like, well,

(13:52):
how can I create more opportunities for her to connect
if if you know, you may not have the same game,
you know, And it's it really puts everybody on the
same playing field. To just have some breaths and staring
into someone's eyes and it's super grounding. And then you know,

(14:13):
asking those questions about you know, your desires and tensions, boundaries,
sexuality in this space, they're good questions to ask. If
I was just going to do a normal party, you know,
without the sex part of it, I wonder what questions
i'd ask. I'm interesting to see what questions like next
time you do it at a party that's not you know.

Speaker 2 (14:30):
I mean, I think it's nice sometimes to start with
very general questions like tell the person like your celebrity crush,
you know, what's your sign, and then you graduate to
something else, like, you know, like what's the most pain
you've been in that was not physical? And so suddenly
you're put in a vulnerable space to say something that
you may not have naturally.

Speaker 1 (14:48):
Or creating emotional release workshops.

Speaker 4 (14:51):
Why don't you come on down time to play. We
are creating.

Speaker 2 (14:57):
Things, honestly, I mean, you know, because I'm because I'm
a tantric practitioner.

Speaker 3 (15:02):
I do really much. I value just you.

Speaker 2 (15:11):
Just tantalizing all of the senses throughout the party. There's
a lot of different things that were for you know
each of the senses, which I always feel like weaves
in like a full body experience.

Speaker 1 (15:20):
You so much were saying that because I think, you know,
when this is the fun part about designing the party, right,
It's not just like the lights, the DJ, the location,
like how are we gonna weave our way through this crowd?

Speaker 4 (15:33):
What do we want?

Speaker 3 (15:33):
All those things are important. The lights, the DJ, they're.

Speaker 1 (15:36):
They're important, But there's like other things like what's the smell?
You know, there's there's when when it comes to like
all these surfaces, like well, there was a time where
we were spraying it with like lavender rose water, you know,
so you're like.

Speaker 3 (15:47):
Woh, what's that that's important?

Speaker 4 (15:49):
Okay, we got to.

Speaker 1 (15:50):
Smell going like taste you guys were It was because
it was the play rodeo. We had like the corn bread,
and I was like, yo, make the corn bad at
eight o'clock.

Speaker 5 (15:57):
They'll never see it coming. My gee. I had a
corn bread with.

Speaker 4 (16:00):
The honey Yes, I had with the honey mouth.

Speaker 5 (16:04):
I took a bite and I think Mila was outside
checking her bag or something, and I held in my
hand and I was trying to weave through the party.
I was like I gotta get to I was like,
I was like, babe. She was like, she was like,
where'd you get this? I was like, hurry up.

Speaker 4 (16:16):
My friend was still there. Shout out to Shana.

Speaker 1 (16:19):
Yeah she can just Usually we have freshly baked cookies
and that's that's usually our claim to frame a cookie
o clock. I love it at you know, the parties
are usually from like eight pm to four a m.
So like a two am freshly baked cookie.

Speaker 3 (16:37):
Yeah.

Speaker 4 (16:38):
Sometimes I'll just go around the party with the cookie tray.

Speaker 3 (16:40):
Scushy you would have for your little cookie yere.

Speaker 2 (16:45):
That's what I appreciated that there were surprising little small
nuggets throughout the night.

Speaker 3 (16:49):
The fire play.

Speaker 2 (16:50):
I was getting hit from the back by Orlando with
the DJ in front of me, and then I there
was some fire action going through periodically through the windows, and.

Speaker 3 (16:58):
I was like ray, yeah, I also was.

Speaker 2 (17:02):
I was also having sex with Orlando on top of
a cage where our friends were below us having sex.

Speaker 5 (17:07):
So we would look down and see that, and they
wud look up and see us.

Speaker 2 (17:10):
And I was listening to classical piano music and I
was like, oh. I was like, I was like a
shout out to Jonathan, I'm supposed to say that, but
he's my friend. Find my instagram Michael yours. I know
we had a connection. We had energetic musical threesome and
Michaels hayining on us.

Speaker 1 (17:27):
When they told me the story, they were like, did
you hear about the guy who was playing the piano
in the dungeon and getting his dick sucked?

Speaker 4 (17:34):
I was like, I didn't hear about it, but this
might be Imagine that I.

Speaker 3 (17:39):
Had a full performance.

Speaker 1 (17:41):
You told me like I had a performance. I was like,
I didn't know that that aspect of it as well.

Speaker 3 (17:45):
Talk about activation surprise.

Speaker 2 (17:47):
You didn't know it was happening, but I activated myself.

Speaker 5 (17:50):
This might this might need to be a thing that
needs to be put together because if if the coyote uglies,
we can do this. Meel and naked dancing to classical
music was chef's kiss.

Speaker 4 (18:01):
The performance right now. Because I've got a violinist.

Speaker 5 (18:03):
I knew this would be a good way to set
up this for you, baby, and I was like, I'm
gonna get Michael on the pocket commit on camera heard.

Speaker 3 (18:09):
Her first time of classical.

Speaker 1 (18:10):
Before convinced me. I'm just I'm gonna say the whole thing.
I have a little I got a cellist, violinist. My
thing is are you are you going to be ready
for I.

Speaker 3 (18:23):
Have some ideas for the camp.

Speaker 2 (18:25):
We should be like a little camp connection Connection camp Workshop.

Speaker 5 (18:28):
No, she's good, she's got I can vouch for her.

Speaker 4 (18:31):
Okay, I got I can.

Speaker 3 (18:32):
Vouch for that man who's like my mom mager.

Speaker 5 (18:36):
What was playing the instrument? The key part is the
word is playing the instrument has to be getting head
at the same time.

Speaker 2 (18:40):
Man, I told him after we had energetic THREESA yeah,
I was like moaning it was great.

Speaker 5 (18:47):
And I was just wearing like I was energy to cook.

Speaker 1 (18:54):
I just found out, like I don't know, it was
like maybe two years ago, but like in every hotel
room there's a cock chair.

Speaker 5 (19:00):
That's the chair in the corner.

Speaker 1 (19:01):
I thought like, well, I mean in my experience, I
was like, Oh, that's just the chair that you like
look up in, you know, like that's you you get
ahead in that chair, like you know, you look up
in that chair.

Speaker 3 (19:09):
It's a work chair exactly.

Speaker 5 (19:11):
I'm gonna tell you why. It's a cutchair on. It's
not comfortable enough to be a work chair. It's not
a sex chair because usually the handles at the size
are too high. It's mostly it's like a king's chair,
just like sit down and voyor and watch. That's how
sometimes I've seen in sturn of hotels and I'm.

Speaker 4 (19:24):
Like, that's the cuntry.

Speaker 5 (19:25):
Yeah, all designers, most hotels have it.

Speaker 3 (19:27):
I mean, but I didn't think of it as a
cup chair.

Speaker 1 (19:30):
I never thought of as a cut chair. And also
in like my experience, like that was just an extra
little surface, you know, if we were playing in there
or something, or that's where I put my bag, you know,
that's the chair.

Speaker 4 (19:41):
But when they said cut chair, I was like, oh,
leave it, that's not the bag chair.

Speaker 2 (19:45):
Would be a cook with your wife or is that
not something that arouses or gets too excited?

Speaker 1 (19:51):
That's not like I wouldn't where I'm at right now
in my sexuality, in my journey, I'm not by wanting
to set the cuck situation up. It's going to be
it's not gonna be like, oh, hey, let's have a
hotel night and you know that guy at you like,
let's go and then I'll just watch.

Speaker 2 (20:09):
Would you prefer like an equal rights like you're playing
over here, she's playing over here, same room.

Speaker 3 (20:13):
Type of situation.

Speaker 1 (20:14):
Yeah, I mean it all depends like that we're at
the stage. It just like depends on the people, depends
on the situation, like whose energy do we do we
all of us want to mix with this energy or
is it just you who really wants to just like
want me there to max, you know, like what's the
actual But there's been times where we found situations like oh,
we want to you know, play with them. But let's
just like backing up the cut question, right. There are

(20:36):
times where we're at the party and she could be
hooking up with someone and I'm not hooking up on someone,
and I'm like, oh.

Speaker 4 (20:42):
Look at you, okay, God, like you're good, like okay.

Speaker 1 (20:50):
Or you know, like okay, like you got this bad
you know, like you're doing you're doing great, like you're
just you're having a good time. And then you know,
it's rarely a time. I'm not rare, but there's just
sometimes goal will be like, oh, well, like.

Speaker 4 (21:04):
Are you good? She's like, you know, she'll answer and
then she's.

Speaker 1 (21:07):
Like, why are you talking to me right now? But god, Michael,
I may I may have to like check in with
her real quick to be like, hey, like is it
you know?

Speaker 4 (21:17):
Is it cool I hook up of so and so
like yes you know? Or no you know, like okay, cool,
go back.

Speaker 5 (21:23):
No, no you can't.

Speaker 6 (21:24):
If it's something deserves a conversation, like do we have
to talk about it right now? I was like that's
probably Like that sounds like I'm.

Speaker 2 (21:30):
Going to make do you guys have a conversation before
there's an act outside of one another?

Speaker 4 (21:36):
That's the agreement nowadays.

Speaker 1 (21:38):
I mean like, let's let's just how we started, because
I feel like that advice may be better.

Speaker 3 (21:43):
For where you're at now.

Speaker 4 (21:44):
Yeah, yeah, exactly.

Speaker 1 (21:46):
So I think with all couples who want to experiment
in the lifestyle or and you know, a good framework
is for both of you to write out your boundaries
in separate rooms because there's always somebody in the relationship
that's going to influence the other person. That's my boundary too,

(22:07):
Then like come on, you write yours, You rite yours, right,
and when you guys come together to talk about them,
then it becomes a conversation. Right, It's not just reading
them off. We are communicating them to each other. Right,
This starts the conversation. And then if the conversation evolves
into Okay, well why is that boundary for you? Like
what's coming up? Like what makes if I hook up

(22:30):
with someone in the why is it not okay for
me to kiss someone? But you know I can get ahead,
you know, like you there's just so many different why yeah,
why is it that right now? And and the other
part is as these parties happen, things evolve.

Speaker 4 (22:47):
You know, there's been.

Speaker 1 (22:47):
People where we go to a party and she's like,
you know, that person's off limits. You know, because I
think right now where we're at, you know, and for
my people who are out there experience in the lifestyle,
it's good to start a party with who were your nose?
Not your Yeah, it's like who are just the nose?
So it's like more so like yo, enjoy your freedom

(23:08):
just but like that persons person, I don't got to
explain it, right, I said, no, that's just the nose
right now, you got all these other options.

Speaker 5 (23:17):
And to even make a point to what you're saying,
I trust when my partner tells me no to that person,
that that person because if women tend to have a
better sense for women, and I think men tend to
have a better sense for men. So it's like, if
she has to explain to me why she said no
to this girl, then it's like I might not get
it in a sense where she might pick up on

(23:39):
something that I don't, And that's also happened in the
past where it's like she's picked up on something. Then
that's just my reason for why I would trust that.

Speaker 1 (23:46):
I will say, like, there's definitely like feminine intuition and
male intuition. There, there is that, but I think they're
more a more tangible way to look at it than
just intuition, is that you're just seeing things that they're
not seeing, right, Like you saw how she looked at
this other person who was like I don't like how
you looked at your friend, you know, like boom, or

(24:08):
like you saw a girl do something. It's like, oh,
like that girl wants to look up with my girl.

Speaker 4 (24:12):
Like no, I don't like how you did that thing
over there. It's like, yeah, you guys are seeing and if.

Speaker 1 (24:16):
You're on the scene as well, you're like learning about
people as you go. So it's like, oh, that person
wants a yes, But then I heard they did XYZ
and they didn't tell her partner about what so, like
you know, off the table, so you know, I would
definitely there's some intuition stuff, but also don't prejudge people
that you just don't know. You know, they can be
a no, but like maybe you still have a conversation

(24:37):
with them, because a lot of times, as we grow
in the space, the no becomes the yes, and the
yes becomes a no.

Speaker 5 (24:44):
Yeah. And I've also realized that a yes might kill
you and to know what might save your life.

Speaker 1 (24:50):
Hey, let me tell you there's piece of advice for
you both. If one person wants to go home, were
going on.

Speaker 3 (25:01):
I learned that the hard way I got, especially.

Speaker 1 (25:07):
Like in the early stages of it, you know, your
first few years, you know, easily easis, Like one person
wants to go, it's just time for us to go.
Just be happy that we go to These things start
there right, Like I didn't even touch anything, and like
I still saw some ship right Like that's still we're

(25:29):
making progress here. So I think there's there's another side
of this where there are people out there in relationships
or one person's chomping at the bit to go to something. Yeah,
and it's like, hey, we're gonna go out of space.
A pace that both of us can go at. And
so if your pace may be too fast and the
other praise is slower, like we need to operate on
the slow person's pace because when there's motion, you know,

(25:53):
like the pace should be like you have some type
of motion and somebody needs to pause, That is totally fine.
If you're in this really relationship, then you may need
to pause as well and talk it through. But I've
seen that so many times where one person just tries
to go a little bit faster than what that relationship is.

Speaker 2 (26:10):
Right, the rhythm should be in sync because that could
potentially fuck up your relationship, being too high, being too eager,
going too fast. You should always drop back and like
be in sync with your partner.

Speaker 3 (26:20):
Yeah, because I feel like.

Speaker 2 (26:22):
There's times I initiated shit that could have so many things.
If we're not in the same pace, it's it can
fuck me. It's so delicate, it could fuck up.

Speaker 5 (26:30):
And I was having a conversation with a friend of
mine and he was talking about things in his relationship
and just asking about, well, you know what if like
Mila wants to do something or you want to do
something and the other person does. I was like and
we just don't do it, because it's not if we
don't do fifty fifty, it's one hundred or zero. Like
and if I'm enjoying something and Mela isn't, then I'm
not enjoying myself. And my whole thing is, like I

(26:52):
I've had a lot of experience in like the play
party space and stuff like that where I'm not necessarily
pressed for things, and anything that I'm pressed for now
is to enjoy it with my woman. And that's the
most enjoyable experience for the absolutely.

Speaker 1 (27:08):
And I've also been there, you know, and that too
will evolve, Yeah, you know, to get to the space
where you can potentially play with someone by yourself or
and you know, you guys feeling comfortable with with that,
being ready for those conversations when they come up. You know,
I think like having no conversation should be off the table,

(27:29):
but what we should do is be open to having
the conversation and communicating through it.

Speaker 4 (27:35):
Yeah, exactly.

Speaker 1 (27:36):
And and if it's okay, if a person is stuck
at a stage and that that's fine, we.

Speaker 4 (27:41):
Can talk it through.

Speaker 1 (27:42):
There's there's some really interesting you know, this concept that
I learned called hot monogamy, hot hot monogamy. So we
this NYU professor came to the play to give a
presentation and she does all these different types of like
it's like this non monogamy chart, right, because monogamy is

(28:03):
this thing right here.

Speaker 4 (28:03):
We know it's one on one.

Speaker 1 (28:05):
Guy, right, no cheating, okay, got it? Yeah, yeah, okay,
But non monogamy is like it's just has so many
different aspects too, right, And so there's you know, whether
it's polyamory or ethical non monogamy or hierarchical polyamory or
I mean, there's just so many different aspects of it.

(28:26):
And because it's so fluid, you know, and where everybody
is how they identify sexually, may I may be how
you then identify the relationship.

Speaker 4 (28:34):
It's just like a whole web.

Speaker 1 (28:37):
But one of the concepts she brought up was hot monogamy.
And it's like you two are out right and there
is a woman that you both are like, damn, that
woman is fine, right, Like we can just agree she
didn't get those tits done for church, right, So so

(28:58):
you both like okay, like she she's and then you
guys go home and Mela dresses up like that woman
you know, and like she dresses up while I get
in like just role plays like okay, like I'm doing
I'm gonna act like how she was acting, and then
we're gonna we're gonna look up. So that way, you
guys just did some role playing push the boundaries of
your relationship, but stayed within the boundaries of your monogamy, right.

Speaker 2 (29:21):
Hot monogamy basically fantasy monogamy, you fantasy simulation.

Speaker 5 (29:27):
We've actually kind of like do did something like that,
or we actually still do because role playing is like acting,
and role playing for us is like really fun in
what we do. And it started we did a month
long vacation to solify the foundation of our relationship. And
while we were there, she was wearing braids actually like this,
and I was like, you know what, these braids, you

(29:48):
just feel like a whole different wom because she usually
has short hair, so you feel like a whole different
woman these braids. And I was like, you know, it'd
be kind of fun if you were like, you're a
whore at a brothel and I was cheating on you
with short hair, but I'm cheating on you with you
with braids, and your name is Jade. That it is.
I was like, your name is Jade, and she was
looking at me and she'd be talking him like, you know,

(30:10):
is your what's your wife's name? And I was like
her name is Mila, And I was like, she was like,
I bet Mela doesn't do it like this.

Speaker 2 (30:21):
She doesn't call it the fantasy.

Speaker 5 (30:26):
We call it the fantasy fields. That's yeah, yeah, I mean.

Speaker 2 (30:30):
I think that's like literally like step point five before
opening up, you know, like I think there's steps. I
think people are, like, things are not going good in
my relationship. Let's not be non monogamous, let's be polly,
let's have.

Speaker 4 (30:41):
Yeah, don't don't do that.

Speaker 1 (30:44):
There's stuff you try this do stuff when your relationships
at a good point, I just save the relationship and.

Speaker 3 (30:49):
You don't even have to bring in a third person
per se.

Speaker 2 (30:51):
But you can actually simulate being someone else, being different
people doing things that you wouldn't maybe naturally or regularly do,
and then you like maybe go to the ship club
and get a lap dance together and see what happens.
Or before that, maybe you watch porn together if you've
never watched porn together. But at least you can play
with the idea of a different energy being there before
you jump right in, because I always like strugg like

(31:13):
I always battle with what if jealousy is human nature?
Or is it what we've been socialized to believe? And
I have to think it's socialization because in friendships, we
don't get like you have a new friend, fuck you.

Speaker 4 (31:24):
I mean, yes, you know what I mean.

Speaker 3 (31:26):
It's just so ridiculous it is.

Speaker 1 (31:28):
While just thinking that, I think it's just such a
limited way of.

Speaker 4 (31:34):
I don't want to you.

Speaker 1 (31:34):
Know, experiencing life, experience exactly existing, you know, Like why
are we limiting our how much we can love one
one another? Like I'm just going to save this type
of vulnerable, soft, precious love for this one person. Although
I can do that with my three children. I can
show them all this you know type of love and
it's and it's infinite, but with this person, yeah, and unconditional,

(31:58):
but this person just has to be with them.

Speaker 4 (32:00):
I think when you, oh, when you.

Speaker 1 (32:01):
Allow yourself to have those different connections with people, and
I think some of it derives from, like, you know,
the not one person is going to be able to
fill up your cup, you know, so like you know,
my wife, she fills up eighty percent that's a strong
eighty percent, you know, but there's this twenty percent where, like, m,
I go on a date with this other person, Like

(32:22):
that person fills up like fifty percent of my cup,
but it does cover the twenty percent that my partner
doesn't fill up. You know.

Speaker 2 (32:29):
It's a shiny thing. It's new and shiny. Oh it's
that it's new and shiny. I never seen it before.

Speaker 4 (32:34):
It's also like brings appreciation for what you have. You know.

Speaker 1 (32:37):
There's times where I've been on dates with with other
women or connected with them and I'm like, man, I
cannot wait to get home.

Speaker 4 (32:43):
You know, Like right, I'm so like that was fine
for that, but like this is.

Speaker 1 (32:48):
The one of the most beautiful things about nominogamy is
how much closer it brings you to your partner. And
I've heard that from so many different people of like
it brought us so close together because it inspired us
to have these harder conversations with each other. And this
is what I really like about you. And I went

(33:09):
deep with this other person and also realized, like you
know what, like I like what I got, you know,
or hey, I experienced this with someone else, Like would
you mind trying it.

Speaker 2 (33:20):
Yeah, and it's a trust Like while you really respect
and trust me enough to give me the opportunity to
have this experience, you're not limiting my pleasure. You're not
limiting how I can like you have but mostly like
that's what most people do, but in this you love
and respect me so much that you are supporting me
in my exploration of community of like how I can

(33:42):
connect with the next person, and I think.

Speaker 1 (33:45):
Connect with humans in general, Like I'm open to you
having deeper connections with your environment.

Speaker 5 (33:53):
And that's always been like a true curious form with me.
I don't like being limited. I like being airy and
being free and just say to just move as I like,
but also within the respect of my relationship and even
one of the And also I like feeling like my
person has that freedom to move and enjoy just like that,

(34:13):
and that's where like my compulsion comes in. I'd like
to be happy and see the people that I like
be happy as well, and even things even knowing like
some of her fantasies and back to back to what
we were saying about, like the simulations when she would
she let me know like, oh, she would like to
experience an MMF like one day and I was like,
all right, well I'm not just gonna throw another man

(34:33):
into like the bedroom, but like, let we simulated it first,
so like I would we she would have like her
toys or whatever, and we would simulate like an MMF
as I it was another person, so we would be
fucking I'll just take her toys, just slapping on her face,
you like a dick slap on your face. This is
what you want during your MMF is how you want it.
But I.

Speaker 4 (34:57):
Understand what you're saying. I have been. They're trying to
figure it out.

Speaker 5 (35:01):
Yeah, and that's what it was. It was just figuring
it out, like let's let's make it ridiculous, make it
let's make it serious, let's make it fun, let's make
it structure, Let's do all the things, and then see where.

Speaker 3 (35:10):
We like when it actually happens on their actual dick.

Speaker 4 (35:17):
I think it's it's.

Speaker 1 (35:19):
I love that you brought up the m m F,
right because in this patriarchy, right when we people say threesome,
they automatically think, you know, guy, girl girl, right, male
female female and anybody that wants to it's just yin
and yang. It's just actual equality, right, So if you

(35:40):
want to have a threesome with your girl, right with
another girl, great, just make sure you're just as open
and also participatory in making it happen like your partner was,
so that it can happen, you know. So when like
I knew exhibit as soon as we had our uh

(36:01):
uh m f F, I was like, as soon as
it happens, like when she's ready to do that, when
that question gets asked, when that situation happens.

Speaker 4 (36:09):
Be cool, bro.

Speaker 6 (36:12):
Yeah, so it's just like okay, right, And and she
was also patient, like yo, here's the person, like you
know this person, like this is here, We're gonna try it.

Speaker 1 (36:22):
And it was you know, it was great, it was
it was fun.

Speaker 5 (36:25):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (36:26):
You know what, I like one of my favorite sayings
that I've kind of discovered through this experience is it's
it's not the sex, it's the pillow talk, you know.
And we were able to like chill, like we are
right and you're everybody's like half naked, just just got
super intimate with each other and just the conversations that
you have, the vulnerability that you experienced sometimes just having

(36:48):
a little cuddle puddle with everybody after it's it's so, uh,
it's tender, it's healing.

Speaker 4 (36:56):
Yeah, it can be really cool.

Speaker 2 (36:58):
This is how sexist supposed to be utilized. I think
we use like we're so used to utilizing on the
set to surface level and just dictating and controlling what
it means, what it looks like, what it's called that
I think that people just get like the tip of
the iceberg of the benefits and the medicine that sex
could be. You know, but when you can say, like, wow,
I really connected with this person because we just had

(37:20):
this experience, and I'm not so quick to jump to
the sex a I'm like playing in the journey of
it and the connection of it, in the conversation of it,
in the chemistry of it. There's a dance that happens
that like allows the pleasure, the orgasm to like elongate
and you can just like ride the wave. Because a
lot of times you get you fuck somebody, you see

(37:40):
someone cute, you fuck them, then you're like huh. But
if you like really dig into that person and you
really feel free. And I think I always say this
about to the men because this is a big thing
for women, this safety and for me, like I'm a
pretty wild, free woman, and I always doubted that there
was a man that could accept and hold me for
all of that, because I know historically men want to

(38:01):
be free and and and flexible and want to have
three sums, but very rarely give the opportunity to the
women that they call partners.

Speaker 3 (38:10):
But it's like, oh, I'm a man, so I'm different, Like, no, man,
if you like pussy and I like dick, let's.

Speaker 2 (38:16):
Just put let's just I did the numbers and I'd
like to tool.

Speaker 3 (38:25):
You know what I'm saying.

Speaker 2 (38:26):
It's just like, but so many men are so willing
to jump past that part and just be like, you're.

Speaker 4 (38:29):
A heart, you know.

Speaker 1 (38:30):
And there's dudes you know that want to talk about
the divine masculine.

Speaker 5 (38:36):
You know.

Speaker 1 (38:36):
Then those situations that's when it really comes in, right, Like,
now we've got both of our energies, these male energies
in here.

Speaker 4 (38:42):
How are we going to support this queen?

Speaker 5 (38:44):
Yeah?

Speaker 4 (38:44):
How are we? How are we?

Speaker 1 (38:45):
How are we going to support the divine feminine? I'll
also respect in our masculine right, We're not here for
each other, you know, but we are here to work together,
to work together. So now you've got to be my
teammate and we have we we are on a mission.
And it's been it's you know, shout out to my
boys I teamed up with. You know, it's been some

(39:11):
Kobe Shack moments, your divine.

Speaker 3 (39:13):
Your divine brothers in play.

Speaker 5 (39:15):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (39:15):
But but but it becomes it becomes like that divine
masculine of like, you know, how we speak to women
in this experience, how we treat and what's the aftercare?
How do you give after care to someone that's not
your partner, right, because they still deserve aftercare? How do
you make your partner? How do you give your partner

(39:37):
after care? After you've played with someone, right, they still
need after care when you come home. And the advice
I tell everybody is ah, this thing called reclamation sex.
It's it's me and my wife's favorite favorite term.

Speaker 4 (39:53):
Especially when we start off reclamation sex.

Speaker 1 (39:56):
You hook up with someone else, one of you guys
hooks up with someone else, or both you guys took
up with someone else. The jealousy comes over you.

Speaker 4 (40:05):
Because I don't.

Speaker 1 (40:06):
Think like jealousy, doesn't it You know people who say, oh,
they don't get jealous, it's to me is a big
red flag, right, Like I I get jealous I experience it.
I identify it. What a blessing in this existence to
experience the emotion of jealousy first off, right, how lucky

(40:28):
we are and the full range of emotion. So the
jealousy comes over me, I breathe through it. What is
making me jealous?

Speaker 4 (40:35):
You know?

Speaker 1 (40:39):
Yeah? So so basically working through the jealousy part. And
so I'm sorry, I was on a thought it was reclamation.
So with the reclamation, you feel the jealousy and it's like, yeah,
I'm gonna go prove myself again. Clearly I need to
remind her you had a good time.

Speaker 3 (40:58):
And that's that's an element that people.

Speaker 2 (41:02):
Why yeah, yeah, yeah, okay, I know your boss, all right,
I know.

Speaker 5 (41:12):
That's a that's a beautiful primal part of like the
male psyche is like the the safe competition part. Like
I when we're competing for your pleasure, like everybody wins
because you are now being You've been pleased over there
and now you're you're back home. You're gonna get this
pleasure again. But now you're getting pleasure in a competition state.
And it's like sports, like a healthy basketball game, soccer

(41:35):
and football game where men are coming together to show
and their proof and they're worth We're doing this dance,
like oh you like this dance.

Speaker 4 (41:43):
And it's a dance partner.

Speaker 1 (41:44):
And and then also, you know, what I've learned is
like sometimes there's people who may dance better with your partner.
You know, that's something to swallow as well, But that
doesn't mean that you are lacking anything in that relationship, right,
Like they could do something that maybe you couldn't, right,
or maybe they have you know, a different situation than

(42:05):
you got, but still being able to to like with
the reclamation like you're with me because of the experience
that I give you, I don't have to like show
out to do the the most, you know, ta compeace
with that person. Yeah, but like also like part of
me just wants to like.

Speaker 4 (42:23):
Give you a really good experience.

Speaker 1 (42:25):
You know, it's not gonna be like the morning sex
when you get home, you know what I mean. Like, so,
so it's it's really cool and especially and you know,
if both of you guys play with somebody else, then
it's like you both are like looking at each other
like Okay, let's go, and that becomes like me and
my wife were like obsessed with that for a second,
Like it was just like we both went, Yeah, we
played with with the other people. We like saw that
we were playing with other people, and then we would

(42:46):
get home be like we would we would give ourselves
forty eight hours for reclamation forty eight hours and like okay,
now our turn.

Speaker 4 (42:54):
Let's create some space, you.

Speaker 5 (42:56):
Know, like let's let's environment.

Speaker 1 (42:57):
Yeah, like make let's make sure like we went to
that party that had the space and everything, like let's
do the same thing for us instead of just like
this sometimes, especially being married for so long, like you know,
we still have it, but it's like the rollover morning sex.

Speaker 4 (43:10):
You know, it's it's it's it's great, gets everybody.

Speaker 1 (43:13):
Up going, but you know, still being able to make
time for what we call the hotel nights. Yeah, we're
gonna go to hotel crashing.

Speaker 4 (43:23):
Yeah, I do all the things and I have to
worry about cleaning that.

Speaker 5 (43:26):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (43:27):
And and also like making sure that we're connecting like that,
because sometimes at home we can get a little mundane.

Speaker 5 (43:33):
It's not the life happens. Work happens, like and you're like, oh,
I gotta find time. It's like now I want to
have a moment where like we're on a staycation where
we don't got to think about the outside world and
I can really focus on you. And then sometimes I
can get in my head by thinking about like outside factors.
It's like, all right, I want to fuck you silly
and crazy, but I gotta get up and edit some shit.
I gotta have I'm gonna time crunch these things done. Yeah,

(43:57):
And and one thing I wanted to ask is what
is something that you can't an advice that you give
to couples in like finding like their boundaries or like
finding like something they may not like. Because for me specifically,
I'm cool and chill, and I'm not saying like I
don't get Yeah, I'm cool and chill, but I'll be

(44:23):
cooling chilled to the point where I might not know
where like my boundaries like stand and lie. And I
do get. I do experience jealousy, but it's just not what.

Speaker 6 (44:34):
You say.

Speaker 5 (44:35):
It's not hot, it's not I don't experience jealousy, just
about the same things that like usually men would like experience, Right,
So I have to sometimes like really think and figure out,
like what about this situation would make me feel like
I need to let you know what boundary I would
have so that it doesn't just pop up in my
face and I'm just like tight. So it's like, what's

(44:55):
something if you were to tell a couple to like,
how do you find out your boundary?

Speaker 4 (45:00):
Uh that boundaries exercise?

Speaker 1 (45:02):
Right? Doing it your putting your boundaries, separate and then
coming together talking about it and then go test the boundaries.

Speaker 4 (45:09):
M you know, like I think it's.

Speaker 2 (45:11):
Easier to separate and say what do I want. I
think people have an easier time being like this is
what I would want, this is what I do, what
my fantasies are versus like even when you ask me
like about the boundaries, because that's one of the questions
for vetting, and I was just like, I just don't
want to be touched. If I don't, no one asked
me to be touched because a lot of times I
think sometimes people don't even know their boundaries their boundary
until they see it and they're.

Speaker 3 (45:30):
Like they're going to pull you about the threesome like
by their ear, like.

Speaker 4 (45:33):
Yeah yeah, yeah yeah yeah.

Speaker 1 (45:36):
And you know, as you like, you'll understand your first
play party, it may feel like a different language, but
as you get more experience, you'll know, like what the
actual boundary is, you know, like what is the the thing.
There's a lot of times you're gonna have conversations whilst
things are happening. We always have a debrief session after

(45:56):
any time you play. Also, it's so fun to debrief
with your partner after any situation, you know, like they
go on a date, you go on to day, you
guys go to a party together, and just be like,
oh my god, are you ready to talk because like
this is what I experienced, Like what did you what
did you see?

Speaker 4 (46:11):
You know, and it.

Speaker 1 (46:12):
Makes it it's like really feels like a friendship. It's
like talking to because you only talk to your friends
about like hooking up, right, You never really like talk
to the person that you hooked up with or you know,
it's like it's a different conversation, right, So talking to
your partner about someone you hooked up with is super's
super cool kind of like brings you back to just
like regular friendship where you're just telling your person, like, man,

(46:33):
this person like did x y Z Like.

Speaker 4 (46:35):
Then they tried to do this.

Speaker 6 (46:36):
I was like, baby, take that thing away.

Speaker 4 (46:40):
I was like, I know, I don't know why she
came out the bathroom.

Speaker 1 (46:44):
Just I was like, whoa, you know, but it's kind
of fun to have those conversations. But to your point,
when it comes to boundaries, you know, figuring them out,
trying to figure out a few of them. When you before,
you guys like you guys said, hey, we're only going
to play with each other, and like if something we're
gonna start with each other and if something else happens, great,

(47:04):
you know, you guys played with each other, right, Awesome,
Maybe the next time it switches up, because eventually there's
gonna be a time where you go and it's like,
you know what, I'm attracted to that person. You know
that other person is attracted to me. So then you're
gonna have a little encouragement to be like.

Speaker 4 (47:21):
We kind of need to have a conversation exactly.

Speaker 1 (47:26):
And then also it's up to the other partner to
notice like, okay, they are attracted and I'm not gonna
cog block, you know, because that's the it's a natural
thing that we do. We like, we can't, that's just
what the society that we're trained in, right, Like, somebody
else is attracted to our partner, like, then I turn
my back to them, you know, or like we're our
conversation is shorter and we're moving.

Speaker 4 (47:46):
This way, you know.

Speaker 1 (47:46):
And what I've had to do is realize, especially with
my partner being the shy win in the relationship, I
gotta be the activator, you know, I gotta I gotta
be to because there's been times where we were going
to play. Partner's like I'm getting you know, I'm having
a great time, and she's like maybe you're.

Speaker 4 (48:01):
Not really having too much fun, you know, like are
you are you good?

Speaker 6 (48:09):
And like there's not a time she's like, oh no,
I'm not good and like clearly you forgot it. Like
she's not gonna nobody's gonna make a big deal there,
but like yeah, after the.

Speaker 1 (48:17):
Yeah, after yeah exactly, but after the sexpart was like
I just find it.

Speaker 4 (48:20):
Weird that.

Speaker 5 (48:24):
Three party.

Speaker 4 (48:28):
And like, oh my god, what's what's going on?

Speaker 1 (48:31):
And here's the best part is that when she has
something to do, like then the conversation is different, like.

Speaker 4 (48:38):
So what did you do? You had a great talk
me too, you know.

Speaker 1 (48:43):
So I find myself when when we're in parties and
stuff like okay, like who are you attracted to? Like
I know, we know, we know that we know your boundaries,
we know your desires, Like, so who are you trying
to you know, And she'll be like, oh, maybe like
this person, like don't look you know, like this person,
this person, this person.

Speaker 4 (48:58):
You know, Michael, Yeah, exactly.

Speaker 1 (49:00):
Just I'm like, I'm gonna be cool like they like
they're both way.

Speaker 4 (49:06):
Okay that one.

Speaker 1 (49:07):
Okay, I'm gonna go up to them and I'm gonna
introduce myself, you know.

Speaker 4 (49:11):
So yeah, it's for couples who are in this space.

Speaker 5 (49:14):
You know.

Speaker 1 (49:14):
I always feel like there's one that is a little
bit more, a little bolder than the other one. Mm hm.
And so setting your partner up with a win, the
goals should be setting each other up with wins.

Speaker 4 (49:26):
Yeah, and so.

Speaker 5 (49:28):
That that that actually makes me feel good because when
Miela came to me telling me, like her what she
wanted for MMF and we actually were in a situation
where she was like, oh, I think I found somebody.
Tonight might be the perfect night for it to happen
for me. You have to be confident in what you want.
I can't do like the half passing or like maybe
I kind of want because then I feel like that

(49:48):
sets up a situation for mistakes to happen, Like if
you don't fully aren't sure what you want, yes, it's
no yeah, So for her, for me, you have to
be like, this is what I want to do, and.

Speaker 1 (50:00):
If yeah, it's like if you're like, well, I guess
I kind of want to do it. And I think
like we were raised in a culture where like women
are being like, oh, yeah, I guess.

Speaker 3 (50:10):
I have to be.

Speaker 5 (50:18):
Over there too.

Speaker 3 (50:22):
It's true. Women have to work through the shame and
the guilt.

Speaker 2 (50:25):
Even when I first told him I wanted to have
a three way with another guy or whatever, I was
just like, maybe it won't be with you because I
don't want to. I don't really have time to be
in my own head about if you're going to judge
me after this and if you're gonna want to keep
me as your wife and shit, like I want to just.

Speaker 3 (50:38):
Be free and like WHOA.

Speaker 2 (50:39):
But I think women have a hard time feeling that
they feeling like they can be free and actually be
honest because oftentimes men can't handle the truth and for
us to say, you know, has often meant I'm a whore,
I'm a hoe. And I think I think men have
to really understand the extra layer of what like being
a woman really comes with because when we're talking on

(51:00):
the other episode, what of Good Moms is about, like
how we feel is the kink to to to cheat
because there's something sneaky about it and it kind of
feels a like dark and mastic cup or is that
like I actually feel like triggered that if I tell
you this, you're gonna not love me anymore.

Speaker 1 (51:16):
I mean it's it's all of those feelings right, you know,
like and it's it's really releasing the shame of it
with your partner.

Speaker 2 (51:25):
Feeling safe with a partner that I can I can
be honest and you're not gonna You're gonna love me still?

Speaker 1 (51:29):
And I mean it's one of like, yes, you want
them to love you still. But I think it's like
taking the more vulnerable and honest you get in the relationship.
I think that's kind of the more honesty you get
out of it. But I say that and I still
hesitate to be like, man, so I took something too

(51:50):
far with this other person.

Speaker 2 (51:53):
Okay, I was gonna ask you what and what kind
of like marriage did you grow up around? What kind
of like were you in an open household and sexually
or romantically? What did you experience and see.

Speaker 1 (52:05):
So, my parents got divorced at five years old, when
I was five years old, and when they got divorced,
I ended up. I was living in Houston at the time,
and my mom's from Los Angeles, like I come from
like a long line of Los Angelinos, real Angelina's. But

(52:27):
the point is, after they broke up and she was
in text, she was like, well, I'm gonna just move
back to California.

Speaker 3 (52:32):
Okay, you had moved there because he's from Texas.

Speaker 4 (52:34):
No, his job took in the Yeah.

Speaker 1 (52:36):
St.

Speaker 3 (52:36):
Louis And how old were you know they got divorced
five years old?

Speaker 5 (52:39):
Ok?

Speaker 1 (52:39):
So I stayed in Texas for like three more years,
and then when I was eight years old, I moved
to Ladera Heights. I lived with my grandparents out there.
It was a whole, the whole thing. But when I
was living with my mom, you know, we were single
mother raising three kids, you know, me and my two sisters.
And she's from Los Angeles, so she she like is

(53:02):
on the scene, you know, just like she's like always
knows the places to be, the people social exactly exactly.
So uh, you know, but she still had three jobs,
you know, just did did her thing, you know, shout
out to my mom. And but I would see her
dating life right like she was a player. I was like, Yo,
I'm peeping. I'm clocking it like this dude, this dudeent

(53:26):
like maybe that dude right. Because also like when these
dudes are trying to date my mom, they're like, oh,
let me just take her son to the movies.

Speaker 4 (53:34):
Christmas good.

Speaker 1 (53:37):
It's just like you know, they always like wanted I'm
gonna say like Christmas gifts. But it was more of like, oh,
I'm gonna do something with your song. That's like man,
you know, so I'm like, all right, bro, what's your deal? Right?

Speaker 4 (53:45):
You know, yeah, I want to.

Speaker 5 (53:46):
Listen with my mama.

Speaker 1 (53:48):
You know.

Speaker 4 (53:48):
It's just like, bro, I know what you're doing.

Speaker 1 (53:49):
Like let's just go watch the Matrix, you know, like
whatever new movies is out, Like let's go see that, Okay.
But I could see kind of how she was always
you know, how she moved around, and and I could
see that like each person that she was with like
filled up her cup differently.

Speaker 4 (54:03):
And not only that each of these individuals that she
was with.

Speaker 6 (54:06):
Filled up my cup differently, like oh, this is the
movie guy. Like I love watching movies with this guy.
Like he would talk to me about him after and
like take me deeper places. I was like, damn, that's dope.
And like this guy like he likes to hoop, you
know what, Like he has a son that hoops, you know,
you know, like I like.

Speaker 4 (54:19):
Hooping with his son.

Speaker 1 (54:21):
So it's like you you kind of see just the
uh I saw how she was moving and yeah, exactly.
And so I think, you know, growing up, like it
was something to where I became a player myself, you know,
like having girlfriends for like, you know, in high school
like two weeks at a time, and you know, college
was a whole other situation. But yeah, I think because

(54:45):
my parents were divorced and my dad got remarried, he
kind of went down the path of just you know,
having right after you be married, like that's still my
step mom, you know. And I told him I told
my parents recently about I mean last year, I told
him that this is this is my life's work.

Speaker 4 (55:02):
They didn't know, they mean, I just know.

Speaker 3 (55:06):
Is ever doing events and regular parties.

Speaker 1 (55:09):
You know, there was a time where I was doing
the play and I was like producing for like an
ad agency, and like there's a time I was working
at Universal.

Speaker 5 (55:17):
It's like a whole.

Speaker 1 (55:18):
Thing, and you know I was, I was making super
Bowl commercials and doing the play, like producing super Bowl commercials,
and so I'd be able to still send them my work, right,
like this one for Taylor made, like here's another one
for Tragger. So they saw like the evidence of like, oh,
he is out there doing something, you know, So then
I wouldn't then I just like when I decided to

(55:40):
do the play full time, I just like didn't talk
about it. And I have some you know, I'm very
lucky to be in a family where there's there's some
some big superstars in my family.

Speaker 4 (55:51):
So we keep the attention on them, like, oh my god,
they did it again.

Speaker 5 (55:55):
Thanks, you're talking about yo, yo, you're.

Speaker 3 (55:58):
Crushing it where you're upset or they were? They were
they okay with it?

Speaker 5 (56:03):
Am.

Speaker 2 (56:03):
I'm assuming that in that conversation you also included that
you and your wife were non monogamous.

Speaker 4 (56:07):
Yes, So I told him that.

Speaker 1 (56:10):
I was like, well, we got to start with like first,
you know we're non monogous, let's start there. We don't
let's get to the business of the second we're not monogamous, right,
and also you know they weren't.

Speaker 2 (56:24):
It was like, oh, okay, was there infidelity in their
relationship at all? Did you did you ever see any?
Like did they is that? Was that a reason they
broke up? Or you had no idea because you were five?

Speaker 1 (56:35):
No, they just like they just didn't like each other.
Like I just saw the communication over the years. I
was like, I don't know how this happened.

Speaker 4 (56:41):
Like clearly this.

Speaker 6 (56:42):
Sex was fire, like I know, fire and ice getting together. Okay,
so uh basically where was I selling about them?

Speaker 3 (56:53):
How they received the information?

Speaker 4 (56:54):
Yeah?

Speaker 1 (56:54):
So so one it was like, okay, well that's that's
your sex life. You know. One of one of my sisters,
you know, she's in the LGBTQ community, you know, and uh,
she came to them and and you know, basically said
said her her piece. And so I feel like my
parents were open, you know, to to hearing their other

(57:17):
titles that exist, you know. And so when I told
them that I was, you know, non monogamous with my wife,
you know, I also put it with a caveat that, like,
if you want to talk about that, you know it's
going to be a conversation yeah, so do y'all want
to talk about your love life? Yeah, well, are we

(57:38):
gonna have this conversation. It's not gonna be like, oh,
I do this and then I do that, Like are
you guys, what's going on with you?

Speaker 4 (57:43):
You know?

Speaker 1 (57:44):
So, I mean they just respected, Like, yo, that's your
choice if that's what you guys want. Like, you guys
have been married for seven years now. It's clearly nothing
that is you know, you guys are longer than their
first marriages.

Speaker 4 (57:56):
You know what I mean?

Speaker 1 (57:56):
So all to say they just respect to my decision,
it's not like, you know, it's like to each their own.

Speaker 4 (58:04):
I really was.

Speaker 1 (58:05):
You know, I was actually pretty surprised because they're black.
Not really, you know. I think my mom was the
type to like force us to go to Sunday school.
My dad was like, you know, uh, Catholic and went
to all boys Catholic school growing up. So they definitely
came from those institutions. And yeah, there there was, There was,

(58:31):
and there was a time where I got pretty That
was I was in college. My freshman year, I did
I went to a Bible.

Speaker 3 (58:39):
Study and wow, voluntary.

Speaker 1 (58:42):
Yeah, I started a Bible study like group. I was
one like, and then I became in college. I became
vice president of the longest largest on campus ministry. Yeah,
and it was the most diverse as well.

Speaker 4 (58:55):
No, no, I was just the vice president titles now.

Speaker 1 (58:59):
But but you know, during that experience and my freshman
year is when I officially was like, Okay, Jesus, this
is enough.

Speaker 5 (59:11):
You know.

Speaker 4 (59:11):
It's yeah, it's like Jesus.

Speaker 1 (59:13):
Like, first off, when it comes to just religion in general,
my my thing is like, you're willing to die over
this text, right, but you won't read the other text
of the things that other people would die for, you know,
so once you start reading the other text out there,
it's like, Okay, we're all kind of saying the same thing.
But also like I can see how this worked two

(59:35):
thousand years ago. This is just not going to work
with my u the current situation, Like science has evolved,
like how we eat, like except the human Yeah, and
so that, you know, when it came to religion and stuff,
it's it's never been something that's like being like, oh
my God, I'm going to hell. Like you know, my
my plumber came in a public came into the house

(59:56):
one day and he was like he was like, man,
the devil's been chasing me me. My wife was like, whoa,
But we haven't even said the word devil in our home.

Speaker 3 (01:00:06):
We're not talking to come up in here with that.

Speaker 1 (01:00:08):
Yeah, we don't talk about heaven or hell or all
these biblical concepts, like they don't exist for us. So
there is no devil out there that's trying to get us,
or there isn't like a hell that we could but
like it's just not in my imagination, so we'll just
keep it there.

Speaker 2 (01:00:24):
I ask about the religious part, and always also the
background you come from, because I think a lot of
times we're unaware of like how.

Speaker 3 (01:00:30):
Those formative years stick with us.

Speaker 2 (01:00:32):
And like I do think and I noticed this too,
like men who have women who moms who were free
in some capacity, men or boys who saw their women
be adults, be human and respected them that way. I
think a lot of boys grow up with this understanding.
My mom never seck dick. My mom never dated nobody.
She hadn't bring nobody at home, Like, actually that's how
you got here, my nigga, you know. And I think

(01:00:54):
there's like a humanity that we take away from the women.
And also I always ask about the religious part because
I recognize, you know, especially with people who just with
like countra clients who suffer from religious I mean religious religious.

Speaker 3 (01:01:08):
Shame and no trauma.

Speaker 2 (01:01:10):
But I also realized some of the like the spaces
that I've been in sexual spaces, play parties have been
the most divine and church like places congregations I've ever experienced.
And I feel like when you're at your true authenticity,
when you're at your most vulnerable, and you're at your
most free, and you can be literally naked and not
just in the sexual sense, but just free to be
yourself truly and unapologetically and embraced in that whether it

(01:01:34):
be romantic love or friend love, there is such a
true divinity and like medicine that comes through and a
lot of times that's why I visit these places and
not because I'm like fucking everybody and I must suck
munch a lots of dicks, but I'm well, I'm nosy too,
but also like there's a divine congregation church that you
experience just energetically from being in places where people are.

Speaker 3 (01:01:56):
In agreeance to be free. We're here to be vulnerable.

Speaker 2 (01:01:59):
Hey, we're here, That's what we're putting, we're taking it down,
and it's a form of prayer. It's a form of
like exalting the humanity and the divine in.

Speaker 3 (01:02:08):
All of us.

Speaker 2 (01:02:08):
It's a way of exalting like the pleasure that God
has given us to experience and to commune in that space,
in that community. And like I always feel that when
the times when I give myself the most permission, whether
it be sexually, just just just to relate to others
and to like to connect, those are the times where
I feel God most present in my life. And I

(01:02:28):
think it does like so many religious people from traditional
religions remove the sex from the divinity, and it literally
ruins how spiritual and beautiful sex can be.

Speaker 3 (01:02:41):
Sexual energy is the most divine. It's the closest thing
to God.

Speaker 2 (01:02:46):
And so when you remove that from the religion or
from the church, or from the practice of spirituality, we're
often removing like a huge piece of how you connect
to the divine.

Speaker 3 (01:02:57):
Like think about when you orgasm, how.

Speaker 2 (01:02:58):
Connected you are, how like mind, like how you just
leave your body literally for pleasure. It is that's the
Holy Ghost.

Speaker 1 (01:03:12):
Like I can't tell you how deeply I do feel
that right I made my transition from a regular you know,
my nine to five to the play. I had one
foot in, one foot out of both right, and then
I took ayahuasca and I was like, oh, regardless of

(01:03:32):
the money, the status, whatever, like, I'm gonna try to
connect people. I'm going to try to make these smiles bigger.
You know. How do I in this existence make other
people's light shine brighter?

Speaker 6 (01:03:45):
You know?

Speaker 1 (01:03:45):
And I'm careful to talk about the very spiritual experience
that you happen, that happens in this space because I don't.

Speaker 4 (01:03:55):
The last thing I want is like cult leader vibes.

Speaker 1 (01:03:58):
Right, I mean for good No, no, no, no, no exactly. Look,
we've we've been, I've had these conversations. You got to
you just have like let them feel it. And it's
the same thing with religion. Let them feel it.

Speaker 4 (01:04:15):
We can.

Speaker 1 (01:04:15):
We got so many people want to talk about it
and tell you what it is. How about you just
come to the space and feel it. And you know what,
we don't need to define it. You know, not every
feeling needs to be expressed. Some can just be felt.
And I think that's the beauty of this space. It's
it's about the infinite connections that you can have with somebody.
It's it's about, you know, the evolution of how we

(01:04:41):
as as humans connect with each other, especially with the
you know, like I was saying before, like with the
increase of AI and just technology, it feels lonely.

Speaker 2 (01:04:49):
We have to work to have human connections. We have
to work to remind each other, Hey, yo, look at
me in my face. This is why, this is why
we're experiencing anxiety, because we're forgetting to be like.

Speaker 3 (01:04:59):
Hey, what's up. Pay Oh like I've been here all day.
You know what I'm saying. Yeah, Like this is what
God intended for us to do.

Speaker 2 (01:05:09):
Yeah, even between man and man and like, hey, there's
people who are out here for real touch starved.

Speaker 3 (01:05:14):
I made we had a sex party.

Speaker 2 (01:05:16):
I made eye contact with this man and I just
was like, hey, look at me, are you cool? Literally
for just like three, like just a minute, and I
can see tears like just come.

Speaker 3 (01:05:23):
Up, well up in those eyes. I'm like, Yo, give
me a hug.

Speaker 2 (01:05:26):
And I held this stranger and it was so deeply
powerful and there was no sex involved, There's nothing. It
was intimate, but it wasn't I.

Speaker 5 (01:05:33):
Made a play party.

Speaker 3 (01:05:34):
Actually it wasn't.

Speaker 5 (01:05:35):
It reason like, Yo, this made my night, But it's.

Speaker 2 (01:05:38):
This is what we're this is what our communities are
lacking on such a deep level, and this is why
you know you may it may feel extreme to someone
who's who's not putting themselves in these positions, but it's
like religion is always going to tell you to seek
something outside of yourself. As healers, I would say, we
all are in different capacities, doing different things. But like
when you're when you're asking someone to go back to themselves,

(01:06:00):
I'm not asking you to believe in anything outside of yourself.
I'm asking you to go back to the very depth
of your own pleasure, your very depth of your own essence,
and say, what the fuck is that? Let me dig
deeper into that, Let me believe in that shit like
your intuition, that is God innately inside of you.

Speaker 3 (01:06:15):
Stop seeking outside.

Speaker 2 (01:06:16):
And following other people's rules for fucking you.

Speaker 3 (01:06:19):
It's not about what we do.

Speaker 2 (01:06:20):
It's not about what Betsy next door does, or John
and Jacob Jingle Hiersmith of Genesis, John Second or whatever
the fun. It's just solely about the book of you,
and so often we're studying outside of ourselves how to
fit into spaces that are on our own. How to
fit into this religion and this religion in this space
or this job. And essentially you're only going to win

(01:06:42):
in life if you are constantly seeking.

Speaker 3 (01:06:45):
Back to your motherfucking self.

Speaker 1 (01:06:47):
Facts, every every every scripture, you know. Like so when
I was in that religious time, I was like, let
me just read all the other ones, right, and and
a lot of them are just saying that, like God
is withinside all of us, exactly right, So like why
not just go inside yourself? If it's there, there's I
don't have to go to the church, the temple, the

(01:07:07):
wherever you know to to get God if it's just
within me. Are we digging inside of ourselves looking for
God and getting back to the space. This is why
I ask everyone. I need y'all to show up as
your best self tonight because everybody is being vulnerable tonight,
and all it takes is one person front. You know,

(01:07:29):
it takes one person who thinks they're better than you
are going to stick out. But that's that's the thing.
It's like, if we can hold space for each other
being vulnerable, how do you want to be approached?

Speaker 4 (01:07:40):
You know, Like if somebody says no to you. Hey man,
thank you for taking care of yourself.

Speaker 6 (01:07:44):
That's what I needed to hear when I said no
to you, Like, I felt so bad. So coming to
these spaces, it's safer than the bars and the clubs, right,
because of how people are interacting. And I think it's
you know, I say, I tell everyone that the currency
is kindness.

Speaker 4 (01:08:03):
Yeah, that's what's going to make this whole.

Speaker 5 (01:08:05):
And it's free, and it's so fucking free. And all
I could to sit here and think about is we
just need less directors and more examples. This is where
it really goes.

Speaker 2 (01:08:15):
It's well, Thank you both, gentlemen, for being wonderful examples
of the divine mask.

Speaker 5 (01:08:20):
Thank you for.

Speaker 2 (01:08:21):
Holding space for your women, for all women, for not
only your women, but all women, and for you know,
just being self aware and constantly checking yourself and being
able to have conversations like this so that other women
that are listening, and other men specifically can hear and
be like, oh, there are men that have care and
love and respect and want to treat me as a
partner and as equal. So this is you know, I

(01:08:42):
think it's so important that women hear these conversations because
a lot of women are on that men ain't shit,
niggas ain't shit, and you know, we all know that
there are men out there that are. You just have
to be seeking and also.

Speaker 1 (01:08:52):
Creating vulnerable spaces for those men to show that vulnerability.

Speaker 5 (01:08:56):
Which is why I love and miess throwing play parties
when when I was throwing play parties in New York,
because I would get more so like an entry level
of people, but being able to like be the host
and let people and give people a different experience than
we're experienced as far as like play parties, as far
as just like oh, just come show up, pay your fee,

(01:09:18):
and then like there'll be sex here and if you
get some sex and cool. If you don't, then I
don't tell you. It's like no, I really one of
my favorite things about hosting a play party was like
being a fantasy facilitator where people can come and I
really know that there's like a nervousness and being like
the rookie into the space. So I was like, listen,
don't worry about feeling nervous. If you feel like you

(01:09:40):
want to try something, come to me and I will
help try and facilitate like whatever you need to be
that was actually, yeah, I would Okay, that's what happened. Yeah,
one of my one of my favorite things was this
girl had told me that she wanted to just get
eaten out by multiple guys, like in one night.

Speaker 1 (01:09:59):
Now.

Speaker 5 (01:09:59):
I was like, all right, this is what you do.
You stay right over there, lay back, just lay back,
be comfortable, just chilling, and I'm gonna I'm gonna come
to you and point out some options and if you
want me to go ask, then I'll have the conversation
for you. Like I was. I was, everybody's like fantasy fairy.
That's awesome, but it would be different situations where like,
you know that nervousness is really in there, but if

(01:10:19):
you have somebody to like facilitate for you, and and
I see that and you and like your party where
you said that you were the concierge the other part,
and I was like, that is perfect. That's great because
everybody just needs like a little bit of help somewhere,
a little bit of an example of someone the MC you.

Speaker 1 (01:10:37):
Know, And that's really what it comes down to. It's
like I want to help guide people through the experience.
You know, you guys know I'm kind of like telling
jokes the whole time. Yeah, but it's really just like
things that are coming up for me, like.

Speaker 4 (01:10:49):
This is this feeling awkward right now?

Speaker 1 (01:10:51):
You like, or like let's all you know, like just
walking people through a breath.

Speaker 5 (01:10:56):
With each.

Speaker 1 (01:10:59):
Comfortable doing that you know, wasn't I wasn't taking what
I learned from doing guided meditations to like a group
setting and also being like authentic in that, you know,
time and time again has been it's been great.

Speaker 5 (01:11:14):
And then even me and Mila when we've hosted parties together,
it was like, and we did a great job because
we're goddamn perfect and everything we do everything to do together,
which is fucking amazing. But like just people also seeing
us and the like the love that we have and
like the trust that we have for each other and
going like oh yeah, I like what they got. It

(01:11:35):
brings me a sense of ease and a sense of comfort.

Speaker 1 (01:11:38):
That's that's one thing I you know, I do after
every party when it's like, you know, there's a time
where I was like, okay, guys, like the shows, the
main performances are over, you know, I think the team,
and then I always think my wife. You know, it's
just like a nice little shout out.

Speaker 3 (01:11:52):
Because you guys founded it together.

Speaker 4 (01:11:54):
We founded it together.

Speaker 1 (01:11:55):
But also like it's a reminder to everybody there right
where you're there with a partner or something like, don't
get lost in the.

Speaker 3 (01:12:04):
Remember where you came for.

Speaker 4 (01:12:06):
Allowing me to party like this?

Speaker 6 (01:12:09):
Do?

Speaker 4 (01:12:09):
I love you? Thank you?

Speaker 2 (01:12:11):
That's what's up, you know, the foundation, this is how
we got here at each other.

Speaker 5 (01:12:15):
Let's not forget that I wouldn't be having as much
fun as I'm having anyway if my partner wasn't like
satisfied in some aspect or in some way of doing this.
Like the reason why I'm enjoying myself is because the
person at home is good at home and happy.

Speaker 1 (01:12:30):
And then I don't want to scare people away to
think only try this with a partner right now. You know,
there's going out there as a single Let me tell
you going to going to play party as a single
man as a whole, like I've been going for years
and still to this day. Like going as a single
man is difficult, you know, like the you're already like

(01:12:54):
how you approach situations, like you gotta be like how
you're approaching people, you know, for I think for with
women in the patriarchal society. You know, it's a little
bit easier to like, hey, do you.

Speaker 4 (01:13:04):
Mind if I join?

Speaker 1 (01:13:04):
You know, it's like most people are like yes, you know,
but the guys like hey do you mind if I join?

Speaker 5 (01:13:09):
Is like, you know, I mean n get away from
strange man exactly.

Speaker 2 (01:13:14):
You know what Speaking of strange man, one one rule
that I really did appreciate your party party was don't
have your dicks swinging out. Oh please not have a
dick dangling?

Speaker 3 (01:13:25):
Can it just be like enclosed quarters?

Speaker 4 (01:13:27):
Talk about that.

Speaker 1 (01:13:28):
There's there's two two rules, right, so it's our voyeurism rule.
We call it our consent rule, I mean our COVID rule.
If you're within six feet you need to ask can
I watch right? I'm gonna tell you on that. Y'all
gonna go to play parties. You know people out there.
You're gonna go to play parties and you're like, oh
my god, that's so hot. Like let's like we're not
touching them, but we're watching them, you know. And you
got to get people like six feet because it starts

(01:13:49):
to feel like a three sim especially when you're in
this place of like, you know, your emotions are open,
you're vulnerable, like you're you're you know, we all become
a little bit empathetic, you know, you become impass and
feeling our energy. So just asking somebody is okay if
I watch, that's another way to be like to see
if you could potentially.

Speaker 4 (01:14:06):
Join the scene.

Speaker 1 (01:14:06):
You know, it's like, hey, is it cool if I watch?
And then they're giving you signs like is it cool
if I touch?

Speaker 4 (01:14:12):
You know, like keep asking.

Speaker 1 (01:14:13):
Questions, Please keep asking questions, you know, Like that's a
big part of this is continue to ask questions. Even
when you're doing it, it's like is this feeling great?

Speaker 4 (01:14:22):
Exactly?

Speaker 1 (01:14:22):
Just ask the questions. And then the other rule was
you were saying, oh no, dick dangling. So there's times where, like,
you know, a guy will come into a situation and
a woman is in like a subspace, you know, so
she's like, look, I'm a dirty little slut right now,
you know, and if anything's in my vicinity, yeah, yes,

(01:14:43):
you've seen the tight you know, and like men can
sometimes try to take advantage of that. People can sometimes
try to take advantage of that. Let me not just
say men, because women out there as well, where it's like, oh,
she's in a subspace.

Speaker 4 (01:14:56):
Well, now I'm gonna go get after.

Speaker 1 (01:14:58):
So you always, you know, when people noticing when somebody's
in that space and understanding like hey, when a scene
is paused, you know, and that's like, you know, like hey,
were they were just going at it for a minute,
they just kind of like rolled over.

Speaker 4 (01:15:10):
Maybe they're like.

Speaker 1 (01:15:10):
Switching positions, but they're taking more time. It's like there's
like a little lull, you know, like maybe that's when
you're like, hey, is it cool if I watch you guys?

Speaker 4 (01:15:17):
It cool if I you know.

Speaker 1 (01:15:19):
So it's it's the EQ. It's a big EQ space,
you know, feeling, feeling it out, testing it out.

Speaker 5 (01:15:26):
And then even and even times like that, you tend
to be understand how to read the room for regular
real life situations and know like how to ask questions
and know how to navigate because I mean, if I can,
if I can have the the comfort to ask questions

(01:15:46):
in a play party, then in a regular yeah, exactly,
I can maneuver so much better.

Speaker 1 (01:15:52):
So one of the things that I take away from
the place, you know, we have this saying if it's
if it's not a yes, if it's not a fuck yes.

Speaker 4 (01:15:59):
It's a no. So I just use that in regular life.
You know. I'm like, hey, do you guys want to
like take the uber to this next round?

Speaker 5 (01:16:05):
They're like, well, I.

Speaker 1 (01:16:05):
Don't that all right, I'll get my own over you guys.

Speaker 4 (01:16:09):
You know what I mean.

Speaker 1 (01:16:09):
So it's just you start feeling it out. And that's
one of the big lessons, Like I'm just looking for more.
I want to fuck yes for.

Speaker 3 (01:16:15):
Everything cancer in you. If we feel so, I can just.

Speaker 4 (01:16:22):
Go somewhere else. Yeah, exactly exactly.

Speaker 2 (01:16:25):
My cancer brother and our sensitivity, our spidy senses are high.

Speaker 5 (01:16:30):
Get each other.

Speaker 3 (01:16:32):
Yeah, I was gonna say before we get out of here.

Speaker 2 (01:16:36):
We always ask our guests if they have any love
they want to send to anyone.

Speaker 5 (01:16:41):
Want to love you want to dedicate to anybody in
the world.

Speaker 1 (01:16:43):
Oh man, I've got I've got three three uh three things.
One the play team, I gotta send them love it.
It's a team sport there.

Speaker 4 (01:16:55):
You know.

Speaker 1 (01:16:56):
What I'm asking them to do is wild. What We're
tasked with hosting a festival at different locations around Los
Angeles eight hours. That last one was ten hours with
a four hour after part. You know, like we it's
a lot to ask. And then also the back to
back of being at parties. You know, they see everything
every time. You know, they're seeing a lot, so that

(01:17:16):
changes you as well. So just the endurance and their
dedication to making this amazing experience to people.

Speaker 4 (01:17:22):
Yeah, and then my last shot is to my wife.

Speaker 1 (01:17:27):
Yeah, I'm save with the two to my wife.

Speaker 5 (01:17:29):
I met her well coming in checking.

Speaker 1 (01:17:32):
You know, she's gonna see these She's gonna see these
podcasts and she's like, I can't believe you said this.

Speaker 4 (01:17:36):
I can't believe you said that.

Speaker 1 (01:17:38):
You know, but I wouldn't have been able to do
any of this without her, not even close. You know,
her feminine energy in this community has been huge, like
where you know, men and women can come to her
to maybe a softer touch.

Speaker 4 (01:17:53):
You know, I have, I have an intense energy.

Speaker 5 (01:17:55):
I see it.

Speaker 1 (01:17:55):
You know, I can be a polarizing figures. But but
all to say, it's like, you know, she she's just man.
You know, she's believed in me, and I think that's
that's She's believed in me. When I'm I'm coming up
with these wilds, this wild dream I'm out here chasing.

(01:18:18):
It takes a lot out of myself it takes a
lot out of her. It affects our relationship, it affects
how we interact with our families. There's there's just so
much and she's made so many sacrifices. Uh, and just
the unconditional love this woman continues to pour into me
is taught me how to unconditionally love others and myself.

(01:18:42):
I learned that from my wife, Labor.

Speaker 5 (01:18:45):
Thank you, and I do want to dedicate some love
to you and putting you and your wife and putting
this space together because it's so important for us to
experience this. And I realized the freedom and openness that
black and brown and people of color like feel when
they can finally get into a space where they could
be nude and free in themselves, and how it just

(01:19:07):
changes the chemistry like within you on the inside. And
and it's really been beautiful. And if you, if it
ever alignes, you ever need to beautiful black hosts for
your for your parties and fantasy fairies like fantasy.

Speaker 4 (01:19:20):
We could use some performers.

Speaker 1 (01:19:21):
From what I heard, there is a girl right there,
there's a there's a performance happened.

Speaker 4 (01:19:25):
I hed up Jonathan and I'm slade you.

Speaker 5 (01:19:27):
I'm slade you my business. Tell Jonathan's people to talk
to your people, to talk to my people.

Speaker 2 (01:19:35):
Tell the people they can find you and where they
can find the play.

Speaker 1 (01:19:38):
You can find the play on Instagram at the play
dot l a, on our website the play dot l A,
and uh my Instagram, Michael Hollis at Michael Hollis h
O L L I C. I think we have a
TikTok as well at the play dot l A.

Speaker 4 (01:19:56):
You know, I'm not.

Speaker 1 (01:19:56):
I'm not on TikTok with our social media manager. She's
crushing it. But yeah, come come check us out. You know,
not all the applications get accepted. That's just what it is.

Speaker 2 (01:20:07):
You can put us if you find out put the
play from love like this, go ahead and put that
on the play application.

Speaker 3 (01:20:13):
Don't don't roll up on Michael. And in the case
that you get in that so why did I get picked?
You know he is a regular civilian. Do not corner Michael.

Speaker 5 (01:20:28):
And if you if you need any more information or
like any more like I don't know, to feel more
comfortable with, send the application. You know, hit us up.
I'd love to help concierge myself, conscierge people into feeling
comfortable into the space because I really truly believe being
nude and interacting with other people is one of the
best experiences you can have into finding out who you

(01:20:50):
really are and finding out who somebody else really is.
And that's a great way to connect and know people.
When we're wearing clothes and wearing makeup and wearing all
the things that we can cover up anything and cover
up our mistakes. But when you're fully nude and you're
fully exposed and fully vulnerable, that's when you really get
to learn about yourself and everybody else. So hit us up,

(01:21:11):
hit up the play, please go ahead, and the experience
that yeah, all links in the bio.

Speaker 4 (01:21:15):
Thank you guys for having me.

Speaker 5 (01:21:17):
Oh no, thank you for being here.

Speaker 1 (01:21:19):
I think this is the first A second, but we're
talking with couples is super dope. I think what it
inspires right to show that, like you, guys can have
this open conversation about your sexuality and your relationship with
a third person in the room and not feel like,
oh no, I got to defend myself.

Speaker 4 (01:21:39):
How would you say that about us? What do you mean.

Speaker 3 (01:21:44):
From a distance? Friends?

Speaker 1 (01:21:47):
Now we were there, so but but all to say
It's like these type of conversations are are are super hard,
I think to have to start to know where to start.
And you know, you guys modeling this for for people's
I can't even imagine the type of healing and communication
that's it's inspiring.

Speaker 4 (01:22:06):
So thank thank you.

Speaker 5 (01:22:07):
Guys for having Thank you. We're not dictators, we're examples
by love y'allah like this,

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}31: The Play Professional Ft. Michael Hollice

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