Ep 323: UFC Vancouver Recap. UFC 321 This Weekend, Aspinall vs. Gane. All The Latest News.

Episode 323: UFC Vancouver, Brendam Allen with a big win over RDR. UFC 321 this Saturday headlined by Tom Aspinall defending the heavyweight title against Ciryl Gane. All the latest news. 












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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:04):
Hey, everybody, Welcome back to MMA after Hours. It's Michael
Carlisle alongside Micah Frankle.

Speaker 2 (00:10):
Micah, how you doing.

Speaker 3 (00:11):
Man, Man living the dream, chasing the UFC around the
world where we sit here on our computers.

Speaker 1 (00:18):
Living the dream. A lot of chase said man. UFC
was in Vancouver this past weekend. They're in Abu Dhabi
this weekend. Big heavyweight title fight. We'll talk about that
coming up. Lots to get to man. Another busy weekend.

Speaker 3 (00:33):
It's another busy weekend. This weekend. Last weekend was crazy.
And I'm gonna ask a really tough question right off
the bat to you, okay, is refereeing We normally talk
about judging, and I don't this week so much want
to jump on the judges. But is refereeing hitting like

(00:56):
a low point all of a sudden?

Speaker 2 (01:00):
I don't know if it's hitting a low point, but
all right.

Speaker 1 (01:05):
First of all, refereeing is a completely thankless job, and
when they do well, nobody notices. You only notice when
there's a mistake, there's controversy, or you think they did
something wrong. That being said, there doesn't seem to be
any consequences for a referee when they make a mistake,

(01:27):
and I'm not saying you got to fire them, you
gotta find them, but the whole setup with because keep
in mind, the referees don't work for the promotions. The
judges don't work for the promotions. They work for the commissions.

Speaker 2 (01:39):
What the fuck do the.

Speaker 1 (01:40):
Commissions actually do when there's controversial judging decisions, when there's
controversial referee decisions, and referees do one thing and then
say oh no, no, no, that's not what I was
doing at all, when video shows us exactly what you
were doing. Look, I'm not saying you got to fire anybody,
and obviously I think what we're both talking about here

(02:04):
is Dan migr Outa in Vancouver at the UFC efit
this past weekend, and look, I like him a lot.

Speaker 2 (02:14):
I think he's a good official. Everybody makes mistakes. Is
there ever any hey, let's do some.

Speaker 1 (02:19):
Remedial training even if you don't make a mistake, just
randomly for officials, for judging and things like that. I
don't know, but when it happens, Sorry I got long
winded there, it does stick out like a sore thumb,
and it certainly stuck out in a huge way on
the Undercard on Saturday Night.

Speaker 3 (02:40):
My intention wasn't to plain out Dan Merigliata. I was
trying to start off the show, which is a general
statement because even Mark Goddard, I think, sure, we've been
a little hard on him Jason Herzong. Of course, the
bigger the spot, like the bigger the controversy. But it
just feels like in twenty twenty five there's been an

(03:00):
abundance of these situations where for the other two years
of the podcast, I feel like we were more on
the judges houses than we were on the referees, And
there's gonna be a whole lot of that talk here
as we go through UFC Vancouber. That was more of
my mission statement.

Speaker 1 (03:17):
No, it looks again, I'm not in this situation picking
on any official. Look, it's tough and it's a thankless job.
I think in sports in general, we're all conditioned to
complain about referees, complain about umpires and things like that,
and look, sometimes it's just low hanging fruit, but sometimes

(03:38):
it's also warranted. But it doesn't mean they're necessarily bad people.
They're trying to ruin your day or mess up your
parlay or screw your team over or your favorite fighter over.

Speaker 2 (03:50):
Sometimes crap just happens.

Speaker 1 (03:53):
Then there are other times it seems that crap happens
that doesn't have to happen, and a little extra training
now in, a little accountability from commissions maybe does something
to eliminate some.

Speaker 3 (04:06):
Of that accountability. You don't know what reprimanding is. Like
I heard a story where supposedly an official was told
to stay home from event or two. A week off
or two is that big of a reprimand I don't
know what you are to do in these situations. It

(04:26):
just feels like there needs to be some clarification on
the training and as we go through the rules meetings,
maybe some clarification on is the referees decision final. We'll
get to all that here in a moment. Let's not
stray away from who should be the man of the Allan,
I mean the hour he's all in, Brendan Allen back

(04:50):
in the win column. Damn if that two fight skid
is not forgotten in a big way. Putting a thrashing
on a man who was auditioning for a world title.

Speaker 1 (05:01):
Fight Saturday could not have been a worse day for
a rainier de Ritter h Brendan Allen, as you said,
looked really impressive. De ritter not able, not able to
answer the bell. I want to talk about that in
a second as well. But Brendan Allen, taking this fight
on short notice, went in and yeah, got some bad

(05:27):
taste out of his mouth, maybe some bad taste out
of the fans mouth from his last couple of fights,
and in just a few short rounds, really re established
himself in that division.

Speaker 3 (05:38):
Same on me for not noticing it, for not bringing
you up last week. They had spent time in the
same training room together, not training together because they thought
this could be an inevitability, or at least Alan did,
but they had both been in South Florida, so we're

(05:59):
there was that familiar ality with each other, and I
think that having seen his game up close, I think
that also gave Alan an extra echelon of confidence where
he felt that the fight would play out as it did. Now.
Maybe there were some extenuating circumstances to the snowball that

(06:21):
rolled up on ourdr but it felt that even getting
taken down, being mounted, having to fight off an arm triangle,
that Brendan Allen felt very comfortable in understanding the game
that RDR was going to impose, and he was able
to have composure while working out of those big situations.

(06:44):
I think that Alan kind of anticipated the lack of
ground and pound that would be coming from RDR, so
he was able to focus on the submission defense and
to a degree, I think things did play out as
he thought they would.

Speaker 1 (07:00):
Did they rent or quit on the stool or did
the coaches quit for him?

Speaker 2 (07:05):
And does it even really matter? Is that a little
too nitpicky?

Speaker 3 (07:10):
Well, if you did not see the fight real quick.
Through the first round and a half, RDR is in control.
Went in the grappling, Brendan Allen is aggressive on his feet,
keeps getting caught up in these clinch situations. He's taken down,
he's in a bad position. He's able to reverse the
positions here someway through the second round and that's when
he gets on top. And as soon as Brendon Allen's

(07:30):
on top, he's shoving a forearm into the throat. He
is landing around in pound. He is starting to do
more damage in the last half round than what was
done to him in the previous seven minutes of being
in a vulnerable position. That snowball effect continued into the
third round, into the fourth round, as it's only getting
worse as they're on the ground, to the point where

(07:50):
Alan is now the one taking rd R to the ground,
picking up the giant Dutchman, walking him to his corner,
throwing him on the mat. He wore him down, he
beat him up. Did RDR quick? Was RDR sick? Was
this the effects of a quote unquote weight bully having

(08:12):
cut weight now five times in a twelve month span,
and the body was just not responding anymore because he
was pushing himself to the edge, cutting so much weight
so many times. They're all good speculations, I'm not really sure.
It looked like the corner in him had a pretty

(08:33):
good understanding that he didn't have anything left. And then
the coach said, okay, we'll call the fight.

Speaker 1 (08:40):
Yeah, which, by the way, I don't have a problem
with it, and I don't have a problem either way.
I just you know, we always talk about the corners
there to protect the fighters, and but you very rarely.

Speaker 2 (08:52):
See the corner actually throw in the towel.

Speaker 1 (08:55):
I was under the impression they read or they said, no,
I'm done, can't do it anymore. Reading stuff postfight it
seemed more like it was a coach's decision, but I'm
with you, it was probably more of a group effort
and ultimately it doesn't matter. Again, I don't have a
problem with it. Fighter safety is paramount, whether it was
the fighter that made the decision, whether it was the corner.

(09:18):
Sometimes it's not your night. You live to fight another day.
There's no reason to go out and take unnecessary punishment,
especially if there's sickness, the effects of a.

Speaker 2 (09:29):
Weight cut like you brought up.

Speaker 1 (09:31):
Whatever the issue is, if you don't have it, you
don't have it, recoup and come back and fight another time.

Speaker 3 (09:41):
It did seem like all three members of the corner,
even had Robbie Lawler was doing the ikes, it looked
like the head coach did, look, we are ending this.
All three guys were in agreement. It's hugely disappointing, though,
because you were built up to say to have this
a event, as was this defining step for ourdr to

(10:06):
jump past Naserdma Mavov and get next to gm IV
and he underperformed. There's gonna be a segment of the
MMA audience that says, and you can't fault them for it.
You can't quit on the stool. You just can't. You
have to be a man. You have to go out
on your shield, and not just saying that because you're
in the UFC, but because you're in a five round

(10:29):
main event in another country going for a title shot,
and you can't just say, oh, I lose another one
like this, I'll be right back in this position. You
quit on the stool. Will they trust you in that position?
You came in horrendously sick and you pushed it as
hard as you could. Will they respect that or will

(10:49):
that cost you? Because you still, to the naked eye,
look like somebody that could have got up in fought
five more minutes and didn't deliver. And it's not something
that we're used to seeing in this sport.

Speaker 2 (11:01):
It's not. But I don't.

Speaker 1 (11:04):
I think you're correct in what you just said that
that's how some people will look at it.

Speaker 2 (11:10):
I don't look at it like that at all. If
you do, not talking about you.

Speaker 1 (11:14):
Micah, But but those listening, look, that's fine, that's your prerogative.
We all look at things the way we do. But
you can't talk out of one side of your mouth
about fighter safety and the corner stepping up and then
turn around when the fighter himself RECOGNI recognizes it and
says I don't have it, we can't do this.

Speaker 2 (11:37):
Will that hurt him long term? I honestly don't think so.

Speaker 1 (11:40):
Now from the standpoint of you're number four in the world,
you're potentially with a win, putting yourself in position for
a title shot. Yeah, you got to go back to
the drawing board now, no doubt about that. But again,
safety to me is paramount. And anybody who says you're

(12:00):
not tough you quit on the stool.

Speaker 2 (12:02):
If I were that fighter, my response would be fuck you.
That being said, you are entitled to that opinion, but.

Speaker 1 (12:11):
Nothing is more important than the safety of the fighters
in my opinion, And like I said earlier, recuperate, live
to fight another day and try to climb back.

Speaker 2 (12:22):
Up the ladder.

Speaker 3 (12:24):
Is it, though fair to agree with the assessment. He
had to know that by giving up in that moment,
you may be giving up your best opportunity to get
a title shot. I understand lift to fight another day,
but we also have to take into the account the
horrendous weight cuts. It's hard for you to make this

(12:45):
weight anyway. Are you really continuing at eighty five and
RDR is thirty five years old. That's not the death sentence.
It is in other divisions. But having to put together
another year or two of work to rebound from a
loss puts you that much behind the apple cart. So
it is an assessment that this was a huge blow

(13:09):
from his ultimate goal, even though it is smarter to
live to fight another day. In my assessment, you're right,
this hurts the ultimate goal in a way that it's
going to take a long time to rebound from.

Speaker 1 (13:22):
You know what, I'm gonna say no, And here's why No.
With the caveat if it were two to two going
into the fifth round, if he were up on the scorecards,
this is a much different conversation.

Speaker 2 (13:36):
He was down three to one on every single scorecard. Now, look,
I get it as well.

Speaker 1 (13:41):
Anything can happen, lucky punch, fighters slips, Brendan Allen gets injured,
de ridder Land, something gets a takedown, Something wonky could happen.
De Ridder no doubt, felt like I'm not making anything
wonky happen in this fourth I'm getting in this fifth round,

(14:01):
I'm getting my ass beat out here.

Speaker 2 (14:05):
No, it ain't happening. So from that standpoint, I would
kind of say no.

Speaker 1 (14:09):
If the circumstances at that point in the fight were different,
I do think this could be a much different conversation
and a lot of the things you just said maybe
come into play a little bit more.

Speaker 2 (14:21):
But the reality was.

Speaker 1 (14:24):
Nothing was going to change in that fifth round. Dave
Rider was going to go out and eat more punches
and take more abuse that he didn't have to.

Speaker 3 (14:31):
Take, and all that credit because Brendan Allen, you freated
him like a rag doll. He beat that ass and
to put a morehatic stamp on it. And this is
the more damning thing for me to d RDR. He
did it in his game. He took him to the
ground and he punched that man in the face. He said,
you are the submission expert, you are the Dutch Knight
of grappling. You are this badass and ninja on the ground. Cool,

(14:54):
let's go there, and he owned his ass there. That
is a statement making performance. That's beating Autosania on the feat,
that's beating Pereira on the feast. You took this man
to the ground and you grinded him into dust.

Speaker 2 (15:07):
And that's what should not be lost in any of this.

Speaker 1 (15:10):
Yes, we can talk about De Ridder in the corner,
quitting on the stool, throwing in the towel, whatever Brendan
Allen put him in that position. Brendon Allen controlled that
fight pretty much from the outset. Yes day, Ritter on
all three scorecards, won the first round. After that it
was all Brendan Allen and De Ritter had no answers

(15:33):
for him whatsoever.

Speaker 3 (15:36):
Composure, the ability to control losing position had been an
issue for Brendan Allen many times throughout his career, using
that ground and pound tool and flick damage a vicious mindset.
There was a Brendan Allen that you and I talked
to one year at International Fight Week and walked away

(15:59):
with the feeling of did he kind of check out?
Was he a little despondent from the company? He seemed
angry by Now that feels fully re engage. This is
a guy that looks like he gets it again. He
feels what he's doing again. He understands his purpose. He
put it all together to have the composure, to have

(16:22):
the mentality to do what he did on four weeks
notice against a two division world champion from one who
was a legitimate argument for a world title shot and
absolute mauling by Brendan Allen cannot go understated that Hardr

(16:45):
beat Whittaker in an incredibly competitive fight and then just
got mauled in his own house.

Speaker 1 (16:54):
All right, So Brendon Allen, coming off the back to
back losses, he gets the victory win, he gets this one.

Speaker 2 (17:01):
If you're the UFC, what are you doing with Brendan Allen.

Speaker 3 (17:07):
Dracus duplusy Ooh, I don't, I don't.

Speaker 2 (17:12):
I don't know about that.

Speaker 1 (17:15):
I was thinking more in lines of it. You're running
it back with Anthony Hernandez. But do you think that
the wind was that impressive you're gonna give him DDP.

Speaker 3 (17:26):
I don't know how far the injury sets back Hernandez.
We're kind of keeping Sean Strickland free in case something
comes about with she Mif even though we feel that
Imalvov is automatically number one. To me, that opens up

(17:46):
DU plus C because I don't think that Alan is
the name that's gonna move Adis Sonia and I don't
mean to say this in a disrespectful manner, but autos
Ania som I retired. He's only doing big fights now,
only big shit maybe big crossovers. I don't think we're
coming back just for a regular contender. I'm sorry, Brendan Allen.

(18:07):
I think it's more likely that we end up with
a strickland a due plus A for Brendan Allen at
this point, and then the latter possibly fight Swuffy Hernandez.

Speaker 2 (18:21):
Okay in interesting as well.

Speaker 3 (18:27):
I don't know, man, if you don't know, if you
book a rematch like that right away, we're like, oh,
we didn't need to decide who the contender out of
contenders contenders is, so we're gonna make Allen fight Fluffy.
You just want to say there's an a visible line
without telling us there's a visible line. Ain't neither one
of you getting a big fight, even though both of

(18:47):
you should get a big name fighter. We're just not
gonna do that.

Speaker 1 (18:51):
I don't know if your duplus A are you interested
in that fight part one? In part two? If your
dupless A right now? Does it matter if you're interested
in that fight right now? If the UFC tells you
that's what's next.

Speaker 3 (19:04):
I don't think duplus A has the pull to have
to say yeah, And your only concern is, hey, RDR
was going to get a title shot if you beat
that bloke, right, do I get the same agreement? That's
all you care about if your duplus A. If this
gets me back to my belt, I'll take the down
fight that. That's got to be his number one concern.

Speaker 1 (19:26):
Comaine event Mike uh Welterweights, Kevin Holland came in ranked
fifteenth taking on Mike Mallot. Kevin Holland will not be
ranked fifteenth this week. Mike Mallot the unanimous decision.

Speaker 3 (19:41):
Kevin Holland got hit low twice. A point should have
been taken after the second. Now I understand one was
a kick, one was a need. There's an argument different weapons,
different ranges, different situations, but each testicular blow happened within

(20:07):
a minute of each other. This was the worst not
first round that we've seen in a while, and it
is absurd that a point was not immediately taken, Like
maybe not immediately, let's give it like ninety seconds. But
there's a point where Dan is talking Tom Lot and
Holland's in the background, and Holland is coughing so bad.

(20:29):
I'm like, oh, this fight's about to be over, because
I don't know if he is not about to lose
whatever waters in his stomach on the canvas, and that's
an automatic end of a fight. You can't throw up
in a ring, in a cage. It's it's you know,
bile coming out of your body. Fight has to be over.
So I thought it was gonna be over then, but
we continue. But then everything just goes to shit because

(20:49):
somehow the five minutes turns into a lot longer than
five minutes. So at the five minutes, at that extra
twenty thirty seconds, when you're not really restarting the fight,
that's when Big Dan's just supposed to be waving his arms,
you had your five minutes. The fight should have been stocked.
Holland turned his back in the final seconds of the
first round on the lot and doubled over and pain

(21:10):
again for a split second to grab his junk. The
fight should have been stopped. Holland was not prepared for
the second round to stop. To start, the faul had
already been adjudicated, We had already been through that procedure.
The five minutes had already went on, and as soon
as the second round did not start, the fight should
have been stopped.

Speaker 2 (21:26):
So the moral of this is.

Speaker 3 (21:30):
Kevin Holland should have just taken the damn no contest
the first five minutes, and the referee should have been
mad enough to make that call to understand, Well, obviously,
Kevin Holland doesn't want to say I don't want to
fight and I don't want to stop the fight, so
we're just gonna do this dance and make it look
awkward for twenty minutes until we actually start the fight.
How fuck was that?

Speaker 1 (21:51):
Interestingly enough, the only round Kevin Holland won on all
three scorecards was the round he got hitting the nuts twice. Now,
look that being said, all you guys out there listening,
you know, sometimes it's not necessarily the moment of impact
that's the worst.

Speaker 2 (22:10):
It's the moments leading afterwards.

Speaker 1 (22:14):
But yeah, so all right, we started the show talking
about it.

Speaker 2 (22:19):
Let's talk about it again here real quick. The officiating.
Are we seeing some of these issues? And I think
this probably applies here because you don't want to make
the tough decision, and even if it's.

Speaker 1 (22:35):
The right decision, because you don't want to take away
a fighter's opportunity, so you do screwy shit like this,
and then it just like magnifies the problem. It stands out, well, look,
he's had his five minutes. Wait, it's time for the
second round. What are we doing here? Fucking make the call?

Speaker 2 (22:54):
I look, I get it.

Speaker 1 (22:55):
You don't want to rob a fighter or have the
fans boo because you stop the fight.

Speaker 2 (23:00):
But you do have a job to do in there. Right.

Speaker 3 (23:03):
The fight should have been stopped in the first round
when he took longer than the five minutes. It's the
easy way. It's a no contest. The fighter cannot continue.
The fight has been deemed a no contest. The fact
that you absolutely have to have verbal confirmation to stop
the fight is absolutely absurd. Well, he never said he
didn't want to fight, so we gotta keep checking until

(23:24):
he says something to just go mute, and you can
take as much time as you want. Hey, we're gonna
have to make a decision here. Hey, we're having the doctor.
If you could actually hear walks over to Kevin Holland
asks him. Holland says nothing. He doubles over in pain.
He's in a defenseless position. The doctor says, I'm gonna
have to tell him you can't fight. He turns to

(23:44):
the ref and says he can't fight. You need to
stop the fight. The ref walks back over and says, hey,
he's telling me that I have to stop the fight
because you I'm like, no, we all understand this. Why
are we repeating the same sentence so many times? Because
they all felt like it was gonna be wrong to
desquaal the fight Kevin Holland for getting hid in the
nuts because they did not have the nuts to objectively

(24:06):
no contests the fight in the first round.

Speaker 2 (24:08):
Well, you're not disqualifying Kevin Holland, you are ruling it
in no contest.

Speaker 3 (24:12):
But to your point, no, that's actually what they said
is it would be a DQ because he was unable
to fight. They had already assessed the foul at that point.
It's a TKO win from a lot.

Speaker 1 (24:22):
Okay, what's the point of having it? Okay, what's the
point of having the doctor check on a fighter If
you're not going to listen to the doctor.

Speaker 3 (24:32):
What's the point of fouls warnings any of this if
you're not going to follow through.

Speaker 2 (24:38):
Yeah, the doctor says, stop the fight. You got to
stop the.

Speaker 1 (24:42):
Fight otherwise, don't bother bringing the damn doctor in there.
And look, if you say, all right, fine, we won't
bring the doctor in. I think that's dumb, but that's fine.
If you're going to bring the doctor in and then
not listen to the doctor, why the fuck are we
wasting the doctor's time, time, the fighter's time.

Speaker 2 (25:02):
Just don't bring the damn doctor in.

Speaker 3 (25:04):
And what did the doctor do? What does the doctor
assessment do? You're not like reaching in there right and
to more time. Kevin Holland doesn't respond throughout any of
this time. Once they bring the doctor in, he's like, yeah,
bring the doctor in. And then once the doctor's in there,
they have to bring a second doctor in because he's
still not talking to them. So they're like wondering, what's happening.

(25:26):
I would have stopped the fight right there, worrying about
his neurological condition. He is not responding to English anymore.
And this is a talker, like, yeah, obviously he's during
the fight. He's not talking to the doctor for ninety seconds.

Speaker 2 (25:39):
Obviously this is speculation.

Speaker 1 (25:42):
You think Holland wanted to fight stop but didn't want
to say we got to stop the fight.

Speaker 2 (25:48):
I can't keep.

Speaker 1 (25:48):
Going, even though he knew he couldn't keep going, so
he just assumed the doctors would stop it. Somebody would
stop it, and they didn't stop it exactly.

Speaker 3 (25:58):
So he's a man and he's not taking away out,
but he was trying to look for every way out
without taking away out one and two. He's also probably thinking,
if they're going to keep letting me get away with this, Mike,
nuts are hurting. I'm going to try to get away
with this as long as I can to see if
it calms down, if I do get some relief. He
gained the system, The system is broken. It was all

(26:20):
laughing stock of a moment. I don't know if he's
going to be ranked right now, but this doesn't give
me a lot of hope for Mike Malot against another
top fifteen because his nose did get bloodied up. He
did get dropped in the first round, and that was
a obviously very depleted Kevin Holland, who he overcame for
the decision.

Speaker 2 (26:41):
Yeah, I look, I'm with you on that.

Speaker 1 (26:43):
I was going to say, not taking any anything away
from Mike Malot, but I guess we are.

Speaker 2 (26:49):
Yeah. I don't know that that was because of the circumstances.
The most impressive win.

Speaker 1 (26:54):
Ever and hell, for that matter, I said at the
outset Kevin Hollin ain't going to be ranked this week.

Speaker 2 (27:00):
Shit, he might be.

Speaker 1 (27:03):
Maybe you don't hold it against him that much. I
don't know, but yeah, I don't think it was good
for either fire.

Speaker 3 (27:12):
We also had a split decision win. Aiman's a hobby.
Marlon Vera's pissed as fuck about it. He got a
knockdown in the second round. Those first round was really close.
That's your swing. Round third round, I thought it's a hobby.
Won that round. That was his best round of the fight.
You can't be mad. It was a split decision that

(27:33):
was really down close.

Speaker 1 (27:35):
I thought Vera won the first round, but I agree
with you it was close. I didn't have a problem
that two of the judges scored it the other way.

Speaker 2 (27:43):
But yeah, that was the swing.

Speaker 1 (27:45):
And look, I get Vera being upset because he felt
like he did enough, but sadly that's the way it
goes sometimes. And again, it was close. I agree with you.
I didn't think it was when they read the scorecards
and then you look at him later and two of
the judges gave the first round to Zababby.

Speaker 2 (28:08):
Well, I didn't agree with it.

Speaker 1 (28:10):
Like I said, I didn't think it was bad. I
just thought Vera did enough to win the first round.

Speaker 3 (28:16):
I thought it was a close round. I already was like, oh,
how do you score that one? When it happened, I'm
not surprised. Good on Zahaby, I'd say the more disappointing
for aspect from me to the fight from Cheetoh a
year away. I'm gonna come back and look new, and
he looked like the same fighter overall. It was the
same performance manor of fjort right back in the win column,

(28:39):
bringing France back, pulled JJ in to the left hand,
executed it beautifully, granted pound stoppage. The Canadians were not
happy about that one. I was okay with the stoppage.
And we're getting this line of where there are the
flyweights and there aren't the flyweight contenders.

Speaker 2 (29:02):
And then that gets this Kyle Nelson and mad Frivola.

Speaker 3 (29:08):
Well don't don't skip over.

Speaker 2 (29:10):
Oh but that's right. Yeah, I wasn't over Jordayne. Yeah,
my bad air, Jordayne.

Speaker 3 (29:16):
Because of those two beautiful flyinings. I don't know how
Davy Grant took that first one. The guillotine is lethal
at five foot nine, the man is huge at one
thirty five two and zero in the division and then
intriguing as long as he can make the way and
perform in a healthy man or big big questions after
we saw RDR. But Jordaane looking great about and wait

(29:36):
right now, now back to the controversy.

Speaker 2 (29:38):
Right now, now back to the contrary. My bad, sorry,
Charles Jordaane. Yeah, now back to the controversy.

Speaker 1 (29:45):
I don't know, man, I sure thought the referee was
stop the fight with three seconds left.

Speaker 2 (29:54):
I think everybody else thought that too, until he said no, no, no, no.

Speaker 3 (30:01):
We said I heard a horn and it was the
end of the round. The intriguing part of that explanation
is I don't hear I hear crowd roar, but I
didn't hear anything that sounded like a horn the many
times they replayed it. Kyle Nelson won by first round
TKO that unconscious body Matt free Vola, to the shock

(30:22):
of all of us, actually came back and fought pretty
damn well in the second round, took it on two
judges of scorecards, and then Kyle Nelson manages to salvage
what was a spectacular performance turned what the fuck turned horrendous?
Gets the decision when if we're doing anything about fighters safety.
I understand that he stopped the fight. He thought, how

(30:42):
do you not just stop the fight? Yeah, Kyle mattre
Vola went limps several times during that ground and pound. Yep,
the fight was over.

Speaker 2 (30:49):
Yes, and look, you are right.

Speaker 1 (30:51):
I don't care how loud An Arena is a stadium is.
You can hear the fucking horn in the cage and
round octagon side.

Speaker 2 (31:03):
Mistakes happened. Look, and I'm not shoting on well, I
guess I am. We are. You can make a mistake.

Speaker 1 (31:13):
Maybe he thought he heard something, but again, it's just
a bad situation. I don't I don't know how you
can make that mistake, But mistakes do happen.

Speaker 2 (31:26):
It came at a really bad time.

Speaker 3 (31:28):
It came at the perfect time where it looked like
a TKO stoppage that none of us would have complained about.

Speaker 1 (31:33):
Yeah, exactly, exactly. It was just Yeah, it was a
bad look. It was a really bad look.

Speaker 3 (31:40):
A hot damn mess of refereeing throughout the night. Thankfully,
thankfully the right man got their hand raised. That could
have well horrendous for Nelson exactly worked out for him.

Speaker 2 (31:51):
Yeah, exactly, the right guy wound up winning.

Speaker 3 (31:55):
Hey, if you want more controversy, how'd you feel about
Drew doverra down two rounds on the scorecard? Lands a nutshot,
got a quick breather and then went super saying, as
he blasts through Kyle Prolect. I didn't have as much
problem with it at the time, but then I went
to X and I was like, wow, oh, you guys

(32:15):
aren't wrong. I kind of just thought Prolect gassed a
little bit, but maybe he was damaged still from that
shot and trying to hold on to the final bell.

Speaker 2 (32:26):
He said he could continue.

Speaker 3 (32:27):
Right, you're right.

Speaker 1 (32:32):
So the question you started that with, how do I
feel about it? I'm okay with it. If it was
that damaging a blow, fucking speak up or don't say
anything and hope the referee stop it now. As we
learned later, they won't even when the doctor tells him to,
but we didn't know that at the time.

Speaker 3 (32:54):
Arishi long twenty one second knockout. Bad job of Cody
Gibson setting up his low kicks, got devastated with the
right hands and finished good stoppage there Bruno Silva blasting
through hung Sung part even with what I thought was
a much more adjusted test. We saw the one dimension
that Park offers. If you can make it dirty, he's

(33:15):
gonna crack Djor and Santos makes it dirty against Danny Marlow,
another guy that was making it look great when he
was able to keep it clean. When it got dirty,
he got beat up. A couple more stoppages from the
women were Stephanie Lucindo and Melissa Cordon pull him out
in the third round. And speaking of the third round,

(33:35):
you also had Useri Belgari. I was also excited to
see crushing devastated kickboxing, showed a little bit of that
takedown defense and got the finish. Now for some other
things around the MMA world, a shout out to fill
the freeze. He was able to get his thirteenth heavyweight
title defense in KSW No matter where you are in

(33:58):
the world, thirteen titled defenses. I feel like it's quite
an impressive feat.

Speaker 2 (34:03):
I would agree with you.

Speaker 3 (34:05):
So we had that win. We had poly Malalinaji apparently
retiring again. He gets a split decision win over Tyler
good John that was BKB forty seven in Leeds, absolutely
bloody breaking of a victory. Malonaji gets his hand raised
in the cage but I think from the litany of

(34:28):
injuries that were listed in the doctor's office, he may
not have actually walked away the winner bare knuckle. Not
for the faint of heart.

Speaker 2 (34:37):
It is not.

Speaker 1 (34:38):
And yeah, he was the most beat up winner I've
seen it sometime.

Speaker 3 (34:44):
Danny Garcia also going out on top. They call him swift.
He did it in the Barclays in his own promotion,
a fourth round knockout. It was a goodbye to Brooklyn.
There's already speculation about the return tour being contemplated, but
at least for one week of congratulations to a former
world champion in Danny Garcia. We also had BKFC fight

(35:07):
night in Hammond, Bryce Henry six and oh second round knockout,
budding contender, keep your eye on him for big things coming.
And speaking of BKFC, we've seen some more interesting claims
high pot the newses I guess hypotheses put out about

(35:29):
what happened with Frankie Edgar and his recent unsuccessful foray
trying to compete with BKFC. I'm not sure how much
our audience has capped up with this, but Frankie was
going to be on the card. He was going to
take on Jimmy Rivera at a point we were told

(35:50):
the co main event. Then in lead up to the fight,
it's announced that the fight was being moved to the
feature fight because the BKFC faithful demanded the Queen of
Violence fight be elevated. That already kind of stuck out
as an interesting situation because you felt that Frankiegar's presence

(36:10):
on the card was one to sell tickets, to bring
the local New Jersey audience in and in that process,
you and I were there back in the day where
Bellator would come to New Mexico and you would leave
your big local headliner until after the card, making sure
that your televised portion of the event had as many
fans as possible. What I'm saying people, is the earlier

(36:31):
Frankie Edgar fought, the more likely it was people would
leave after Frankie fought, So there was a reason to
have a title fight before he fought. Well. Then during
the week it comes out that there's issues with his medicals.
The BKFC is proactively looking for a replacement who Jimmy
Rivera did end up facing, and for the betterment safety

(36:56):
of frank Jeger, he was not allowed to fight well
then frank Keegger on his own podcast comes back and
shares his side of the story. Is that where you
wanted to pick it up.

Speaker 1 (37:06):
Sure, here's the quote from Frankie Edgar. I passed every
single one of my medicals. I did a whole shit
ton of medicals. I thought BKFC had something. I was like, Wow,
this is pretty entertaining. They've got something, But not if
they treat the fighters like this, because I'll tell you
what fighters out there beware. Frankie alleges the medicals were

(37:28):
done and done in plenty of time. BKFC, for reasons
we can speculate on in a second, just didn't bother
to turn those medicals over to the commission.

Speaker 3 (37:39):
And apparently the doctor that said that Frankie was not
allowed to compete did not review those medicals. It's alleged,
and it was Dave Feldman's doctor. I'm not sure if
it's the BKFC residing physician who they travel with or
Dave Feldman's actual doctor. Right.

Speaker 2 (38:04):
Frankie says that.

Speaker 1 (38:07):
When he found out the Commission didn't have his medicals,
he took it upon himself to contact his doctors and
get the medical sent over.

Speaker 2 (38:15):
He says the.

Speaker 1 (38:16):
Doctors told him he was in perfect health and to
let his family know if they're concerned about him fighting,
that he is fine.

Speaker 2 (38:23):
There's nothing to worry about.

Speaker 1 (38:25):
His head looks good, the brain looks good, the eyes
look good.

Speaker 2 (38:28):
Everything was good.

Speaker 3 (38:29):
Now.

Speaker 1 (38:30):
It is entirely possible the truth here lies somewhere in
the middle. But these are some pretty serious allegations from
Frankie Edgar, and the more you get into it, the
more plausible. At the very least, it is that BKFC
was unhappy with the ticket sales. Combine that with what
they were paying Frankie Edgar for the fight, and they're like,

(38:52):
let's just cut our losses, let's get Edgar off this card,
give him what we got to give him, and let's
just move on about our day.

Speaker 2 (39:00):
Where do you come down on this, Micah.

Speaker 3 (39:03):
That, like you said, it's plausible to get to those
steps that BKFC either did not feel comfortable after thinking
about their idea more with putting Frankie Igger in there,
because we have seen the way his MMA career turned out.

(39:24):
A guy that had legendary toughness didn't seem to have
that chin anymore. It was a little eyebrow raising that
they were going in this direction considering how the end
of the UFC run was. But it's likely to say
did they think better of it? Was the money not
coming through? Did the ticket sales not work out. There's

(39:47):
been theories put out there. Did a sponsor drop out
and they no longer had the ability to pay Frankie.
There's quite a few speculations out there. Like you said,
there's his side, her side. The truth lies somewhere in
the middle of an argument. I don't think we'll ever know,
but this is a pretty damning allegation from BKFC. And

(40:13):
in the podcast that Frankie did, he said, they are
cutting me a check. I'm not gonna sue them because
they're cutting me a check, and I'm pretty sure they're
cutting me a check, so I don't sue them.

Speaker 1 (40:25):
If you're BKFC and you book a man who's forty
four years old and lost six of his last eight fights,
I believe five of those were either knockouts or tkos,
you have to know there's been a lot of damage
incurred and you should be out in front of any
medicals and making sure everything's done. Sent to the Commission examined.

(40:47):
So if there is an issue, it's not fight week
when you're pulling this fight from the card. Again, we
don't know, and BKFC may have had very valid reasons
for pulling this fire and taking frankiegar off the card,
but it sure seems like they used him to sell
tickets and then.

Speaker 3 (41:08):
Pulled the plug.

Speaker 1 (41:10):
And maybe that's not the case, but it ain't real
hard to buy into that theory.

Speaker 3 (41:17):
It's not hard to and I love you BKFC. Let's
kick them one more time now. They're also I don't
know if it's a bait and switch, if it's bad salesmanship,
but there's another accusation being flung their way. I had
already brought it to our audience's attention. BKFC had announced

(41:38):
Dave Mundell Middleway Champion, moving up to light heavyweight, gonna
take on Josh Dyer. I had told you that there
was a interview cofined on YouTube out there where Mondell
denied having signed the contract without a press release, without
a lot of attention. If you go to the BKFC website,

(42:00):
you can now see that November fifteenth main event in
California is Josh Dyer rematching the former champion who never
lost his belt, Lorenzo the Juggernaut Hunt no longer is
it Dave Mandal. This is on their website. You can
look at their news section. You can look at their

(42:22):
press release section. There's actually no formal announcement to be
found of this change. This is a massive announcement Lorenzo Hunt.
We knew he'd be coming back after his foray at heavyweight.
I think most people believe that two hundred and five pounds,
as he was the one to eighty five and two

(42:42):
hundred and five pounds champion, that two hundred and five
pounds would be his design. Here he goes at one
eighty five. Interesting to see how things play out with
this fight seemingly coming together within the last week from
when we're recording and thinking that we're three weeks out
from a fight world titled fight four weeks notice dire

(43:03):
Hunt too. I think BKFC should promote this a little more.

Speaker 1 (43:12):
I'm trying to choose my words carefully here, Micah, I
do cover.

Speaker 3 (43:17):
Them and go see them live. Don't don't don't get
me hurt. I'm already doing enough to myself here.

Speaker 2 (43:21):
Well, no, dude, it's just calling it like you see it.
This is.

Speaker 1 (43:28):
This is a little wonky, And look, BKFC could eliminate
a lot of this speculation by just coming out giving
the reasons why Frankie Eegar was pulled, giving the reasons
for this fight being changed. Maybe, look, hey, we learned
from our mistakes. We had ounced fight before it was

(43:49):
completely signed in. That's our bad. We'll do better whatever
it's another bad look.

Speaker 3 (43:56):
Dave Felman did do an interview I believe it was
with Damon Martin and and he does say we thought
it was the best interest from fake Key from what
we saw of his medicals, to pull him, and we
have cut him a check to make good on his
efforts to help promote the show and everything he did
to promote the BKFC brand. He has even said they

(44:16):
cut him a check, So I don't know if that's
answering the situation or not answering it.

Speaker 2 (44:20):
But did he say it was Feld medicals. Did he say.

Speaker 1 (44:24):
We were about to lose our ass on this show,
we had to cut losses, ticketsit and.

Speaker 2 (44:29):
Move the way we thought we wouldn't any of that.

Speaker 3 (44:32):
No, there was not that kind of candor. There was
a very publicly orchestrated speech, a declaration if you will. Okay,
so it kind of seemed like you were listening to
like Dana White's side guy.

Speaker 2 (44:46):
You know what I mean, gotcha, gotcha, got you, got you,
got you. So then they really didn't answer any of
those questions.

Speaker 3 (44:52):
I don't think many promotions would really answer those questions.
And no, no, we didn't get it.

Speaker 1 (44:57):
Well, hold on, when a fighter comes out in allegens,
you do and send the medicals. Yeah, I would think
you need to respond to that, especially if you did
send them. Now, if he's got you dead to rights,
maybe you don't say anything.

Speaker 2 (45:11):
I just hope it goes away. But that's a pretty
serious accusation.

Speaker 3 (45:18):
And it was not responded to.

Speaker 1 (45:23):
If UFC for a main event fight didn't bother to
send the medicals in, they're gonna have to address that.

Speaker 2 (45:32):
Hey we fucked up, or hey we didn't want this
guy on the car. We knew he wasn't gonna make
it so, or we knew we were gonna change it
or whatever. Whatever. You got to address it somehow.

Speaker 3 (45:42):
Well, short of a fighter perishing in competition between Frankieger
and Polly Malinaji, this last two weeks. Could there have
been a more requisite black eye on the sport of
Bare Knuckle?

Speaker 2 (46:01):
No, but this when you when you're pinning your hopes
and we are talking two different promotions here, But I'm
forty four year old guys, What the fuck do you expect?
And I'm not knocking it.

Speaker 1 (46:20):
Look, if Mala and Age wants to get in there
and get his ass beat, that's fine. If Frankieger wants
to come back and take a fight, hey, more power
to I'm assuming you pass.

Speaker 2 (46:28):
All the medicals and all that.

Speaker 1 (46:30):
But if you're a promotion and these are the guys
you're banking on, you got to realize this is going
to kind of come.

Speaker 2 (46:38):
With the territory, don't you.

Speaker 3 (46:41):
Touche?

Speaker 1 (46:45):
I mean, I yeah, I don't know, man. Not a
good couple of weeks for the Bare Knuckle world. Shall
we say?

Speaker 3 (46:57):
Ready for some fighting announcements?

Speaker 2 (46:59):
Let's do it.

Speaker 3 (47:00):
Nick Klein is out, Dante Johnson will now fight Sadrikas
through Moss November one, Marco Tulo versus Chris Lee, Roy
Duncan MAT's now versus Joseph Morales, Muslim Solikov versus euros Metic,
Robert Valentine versus Jackson McVeigh. All additions to the UFC

(47:21):
Vegas one to eleven card November eighth, sirih Sidney out
Malcolm Wellmaker that fight like got canceled right after it
was announced. He's now facing Cody had in UFC three
twenty two on November fifteenth, and Nicholas Dalby versus seygid
It's makamov is added to the UFC Guitar card November

(47:46):
twenty second. Not a requisite main event yet announced. Not
the big announcements this week.

Speaker 2 (47:55):
No also Mike.

Speaker 1 (47:57):
Before we move on to this week's action, we would
remiss if we didn't send our condolences and acknowledged the
passing of famed coach Duke Rufus, who passed away this
past week at the age of fifty five, Among others,
Anthony Pettis, Tyron Woodley, Ben Askron, their coaches, their coach

(48:20):
for long periods.

Speaker 2 (48:21):
Of time, leading them the world titles at them and
many more.

Speaker 1 (48:25):
An absolute legend in this sport and a pretty damn
good kickboxer in his own right too.

Speaker 3 (48:31):
World champion yep I heard one of the best above
waist kickboxers were no leg kicks or incorporated that there
ever was a world champion. Hit me where I'm thinking about.
You mentioned the world champions, But there's the guys like
Emmanuel Sanchez, Nate Jennerman, Brennan Allen. There's a ton of

(48:52):
guys from the LFA, from the regional scene, from that
RUFUS sport Jim that I had talked through throughout the years,
hearing about Duke griff Is, hearing about his leadership. So
a true law has gone way too soon at fifty
five years old and two weeks ago where it looked
like again Team Pettis was on top of the world

(49:14):
after the knockout that Sergio put on Maga Man Maga
metalf yep So.

Speaker 1 (49:21):
Certainly thoughts and condolences to his family and friends before
we get to UFC three twenty one this Saturday.

Speaker 2 (49:30):
On Yas Island. What else have we got this week? Minka, Well, I'll.

Speaker 3 (49:35):
Bring them up one more time, BKFC. This is a
mega event for them, like this card is ridiculously stacked.
They return to Italy for the second time. It's BKFC
eighty three. Probably the wrong time to do it, as
it's gonna go head to head right with the UFC.
I believe it is a two pm Eastern start time

(49:57):
for the car Your main event, Chris Camosi looks to
defend the BKFC Cruiserweight title for a second time, imposing
figure at two hundred and five pounds, taking on Italy's
most famous mixed martial artist, Alessio Legionnaire. Sakara recently made
a BKFC debut that has earned him a title shot

(50:21):
in his backyard. Just so happened that they were going there.
Lightweight title tournament semifinal matchup in your co main event,
Ben Bonner Interim Champion battles former champion Franco Tenaglia. Tanaglia
had been stripped when he was unable to make his
defense that Bonner jumped into. Bonner won that fight. Thew

(50:44):
now battle for the interim title December fifth is still
the follow up where we get Trout Polomino two. Your
other semifinal UK middleweight title as former world champion Francisco
Ricci looks to grab another belt. Nico Goffe, who had
a stunning upset over Brendan Allen or Brandon Allen not

(51:05):
Brandon Brandon Allan in his debut. He's coming for a
UK Featherweight title thirty four fight Bare Knuckle Vet Jimmy
Sweeney is gonna take on former title challenger Big Power
puncher Carlos Trinidad, Dan Campman James Brown. That might steal
the show. Two of the most technical featherweights I've seen

(51:26):
in Bare Knuckle for a card that I don't know
how many people are gonna see. This shit is actually
absolutely stacked.

Speaker 1 (51:36):
You probably can't answer this, Micah, but stack card, loaded card?

Speaker 2 (51:41):
Why and I get there in Italy?

Speaker 1 (51:43):
Why on earth would you go head to head the
exact same start time as the UFC three twenty one
main card.

Speaker 2 (51:51):
You're shooting yourself in the foot here.

Speaker 3 (51:56):
I actually there's a some kind of structural planning issue
with BKFC. I loved BKFC. They were my Friday Night
to Light. They were taking over Friday nights for us.
They were bringing Friday nights back to the fight game.
And now they've seen the double down on going on Saturdays.

(52:17):
We have this event, we had last weekend's event. Last
week when we had the fight and night we had
the BKB, we had the UFC. Heck, you'll hear about
Proto Wrestling After Hours where aaw had a huge pay
per view. Everything was on at the same time. I
have no clue who's scheduling all this shit. And from BKFC,
it's not just this pay per view, it's the fallowing
the weekend, it's the weekend after that, it's the Trout

(52:39):
versus Paulameto fight. Is the first time they returned to
a Friday to not have to battle anyone else. It's
like three events in a row where they're just going
head to head with the UFC and this one unfortunately.
Maybe you were hoping originally the UFC was doing an
event in because isn't this the pay per view that

(53:02):
was brought onto the calendar because we lost the pay
per view from UFC notch that earlier.

Speaker 1 (53:09):
I think that was the earlier in the month, but regardless,
it's been on the books for quite a while.

Speaker 3 (53:14):
You figure you could adjust. I'm wondering if the financial backer,
because there has to be someone that is bringing BKFC
to Italy. I wonder if it was more to their
desire the venues availability, and that you were more banking
on your ticket sales and the investor who's bringing you

(53:34):
there your site fee, like the UFC would call it
rather than your pay per view by rates that you're
going to get on his own. But still it's a
stack card, so it feels like you did do this
for a broader market pool. It would be great if
this was Friday Night.

Speaker 2 (53:52):
Good Luck to be KFC this weekend.

Speaker 1 (53:54):
UFC three twenty one Saturday, Yas Island your main event,
first heavyweight title defense for Tom Aspinall as he takes
on the number one contender.

Speaker 2 (54:07):
Surreal, gone, Wow, here we go.

Speaker 3 (54:13):
It is the official maiden voyage for the Aspinall error.
We've been talking about it. It's felt like it's a
second coming. We've speculated about the fear that John Jones
has had, wanting to put his unpurbeable record to have
a blemish against a Tom Aspinall. The biggest question now

(54:35):
I think going into this FI and you have to
tell me what yours is is can Tom Aspinall handle
the pressure of the baddest man on the planet, the
weight of the world, all the expectation are on your shoulders. Now, Hell,
he's been an underdog until this moment. We didn't actually
think he was gonna do what he did against Favlac,
And now it's all on Tom Aspital, I think the

(54:56):
pressure is the biggest question for me. What's your biggest
question about this incredible matchup.

Speaker 2 (55:02):
I don't think there's pressure at all. Aspinall has look,
say what you want.

Speaker 1 (55:06):
He's been nothing but dominant inside the octagon, and he
comes in as a huge favorite here against Surreal Gone.
I think the question more is what the hell are
you doing with Aspinall after this fight? I look, I
don't want to overlook anybody. And maybe Cereal Gon makes

(55:28):
me eat all these words next week right here on
the show, but I think it's already a foegone conclusion.
Aspinall is winning here and again maybe that comes back
to bite me, but yeah, I don't think that there's
any of that John Jones pressure, any of that. I
think for now that ship has sailed. If it comes

(55:49):
back around later, hey that's great. But Aspinall's focused on
Gone here and then what's whatever's next after that? And
I honestly, I think he makes it look easy.

Speaker 3 (56:01):
I think the shit the bad potential is massive. Who
was Surreal Gone?

Speaker 4 (56:05):
You just said it, Tom Aspital should walk through him
and make it look easy, and not to discourage Michael Carlyle,
but buddy, you're You're not the only one saying it.

Speaker 3 (56:16):
I wanted to say it, and I'm scared to death
to say it because there's so many people saying it,
because it's such a foregone conclusion, because this is the
next man, this is the next great ruler of the
heavyweight division. Syrel Gond did not get waxed by Francis Enganu.

(56:38):
He was able to be in that fight the whole time.
He got out wrestled John Jones, took Surreal gone down,
put him on his back and put him in danger
very quickly. Do we see that same avenue from Tom Aspinall.
Is that gonna be the same game plan from Tom
Aspital or does he say I want to feel it

(56:59):
out on the feet. There needs to be more of
a club and sub I'm not going to tackle him.
I'm not going to take this to Alex Perira trajectory
that I've described to people I would approach that fight us.
Does this fight become a lot more fifty to fifty?
Do we feel it out on the feet? Where Surreal
gone with his athleticism that matches the potential movement and
speed that Aspinall brings. The only person that I think

(57:22):
really can in the heavyweight division. Does it make a
difference if we start playing it out on the feet,
then it's a little more of a crapshoot. That's where
I feel does the pressure mount on Tom Aspital for
how he approaches surreal game.

Speaker 1 (57:38):
The only way the pressure starts getting to Aspinall is
if this fight makes it to the third round at
that point in time, because you're in an uncharted territory
at that point. If you're asked about Aspinall has never
had a fight go past the second round. He's only
had one UFC fight that didn't end in the first round.

(58:00):
If Gon can stretch this out for a while, maybe
it does get interesting.

Speaker 2 (58:06):
I think you asked.

Speaker 1 (58:09):
I think it's going to start out on the feet,
and if Aspinall sees an opportunity, he sezes it. If not,
he's going to try to make it a short fight,
standing there and trading punches, and I think he's probably
good with that. Now that being sad, If somehow Gone

(58:29):
can get this late second round into the third, then
you get into those championship rounds.

Speaker 3 (58:36):
All right.

Speaker 1 (58:36):
Maybe on the fly we got to start reevaluating some shit.
But assuming this goes the way Aspinall wants it to.
I think he makes it look pretty quick and easy.

Speaker 3 (58:47):
There should be an advantage in the wrestling that has
been an Achilles heel of Cereal Gon. I'm not sure
what to say about on the feet, because Surreal Gon
has manage to be adequate, if not excel, pass all
of his competition when they're striking. But Tom Aspinall has
touch guys and they've went limp. You want to look

(59:08):
at the record, bawl. Aspinall has three losses. Well, the
last one his knee kind of blew out in fifteen
fricking seconds. That's that point where you say anything can happen,
and anything can happen because there's been an illegal move
landed by Tom Aspinall and his only real loss he

(59:28):
got heel hooked, So shit can happen in there. That's
why I wonder if there is the pressure where if
Surreal Gone goes in there knowing he can fight freely
because he really didn't beat Alexander Volkov. We all disputed
that decision, and now this is the guy that got

(59:49):
exposed by Gone dominated by John Jones. What's the worst
that can happen? Man, you've already been beaten in the
two worst ways possible, and you've lucked into a third
world title shot. I mean, you know there's a chance
for your groppolin to get exposed. I think you might
need to go Drew Dober in the first round and
just go for it with Aspinall before the tide turns.

(01:00:12):
That's why I see this as being a tricky fight
because surreal, Gone, he's already lost this opportunity so many times.
Does he care or does that? Does that make him
a little more skittish in this fight, because how many
more times do you get this opportunity?

Speaker 2 (01:00:27):
See?

Speaker 1 (01:00:27):
I think that plays right into Aspinall's favor. Though, Go
in and go for broke early, because that's gonna give
Aspinall the opportunity to finish early himself.

Speaker 2 (01:00:40):
I think if you're gone, you're.

Speaker 1 (01:00:42):
Patient and you try to gradually wear down Aspinall. Now
that's also a whole hell of a lot easier said
than done. But getting Aspinall into the later rounds I
think is Gone's best bet. I'm not saying you're wrong
and what you just said. If you're gone, hey, I've
already had this shot A couple of times.

Speaker 2 (01:01:01):
This is probably it. I'm gonna go in and go
for broke.

Speaker 1 (01:01:04):
That seems pretty solid, but it also seems like it
plays into Aspinall's favorite.

Speaker 3 (01:01:11):
Can you really play the Matador for twenty five minutes
with a Tom Aspinall ball that in fifteen victories? Also
there in the first round. Man, he touches guys and
it's not the Francis and Gano Dema touch, but he
has a natural finishing ability club and sub hitting you
with combinations. Tom Aspinall, I'm not sure if you're seeing different.

(01:01:33):
I'm seeing four twenty five minus four twenty five favorite.
It's pretty steep price, but I don't know if it's
unwarranted with the performances that we've seen.

Speaker 2 (01:01:45):
Uh no, I'm seeing plus four hundred.

Speaker 1 (01:01:47):
But yes, somewhere right in that area gone roughly our
minus four and excuse me, gone a plus three hundred underdog.

Speaker 2 (01:01:55):
But no, look you look at Aspinall.

Speaker 1 (01:01:59):
Three fights that have made it to the second round,
one was a loss, one was a DQ loss, and
the other was the ARLASKI win. The longer this fight goes,
the better that is for gone. But again, easier said
than done. I think I just think Aspinall, but put
it like this, Micah, and you've laid out a very

(01:02:19):
convincing scenario of how this might be a better fight
than we think, and maybe Gone does have a chance.
You're walking up to the pay window and you're getting
plus three hundred for Surreal Gone? Are you really putt
your hard earned money down on that? Did you believe
that much in Surreal?

Speaker 3 (01:02:36):
Oh? After our dr Algermain Sterling and TJ. Dillashaw, I'm
contemplating even you know, any betting anymore because I don't
know if Tom Aspinall was walking in there with neurovirus.
You don't know. And that's the serious part about that
is later there could be a dislocated show there. Malcolm

(01:02:56):
Mugga met and Calive didn't have a rib or something.
Everything that happens after the fight, we don't know. I
can't tell you. I'm putting on herd earn money on
Gone with the faith you're I understand where you're trying
to get at. But there is a thought process, Like
you said, if he's able to jab keep that movement going,
maybe he's able to hit a couple angles, stay away
from the cage for a round. Do you make it

(01:03:18):
harder on aspinal? Does that cardio come into play? One
guy has managed a five round fight before. Where is aspinall?
If it gets long enough? But twenty five minutes of
avoiding that power feels a long time. But I am
the one thinking that that power can carry for twenty
five minutes. I just got this real feeling that I
don't think we get past ten.

Speaker 1 (01:03:40):
I'm with you on that, regardless of what happens is
the main event, Micah, we know in the co main
event we.

Speaker 2 (01:03:46):
Will crown a new women strawweight champion. Will it be Janjeroba?
Will it be Dern?

Speaker 3 (01:03:54):
Two incredible Brazilian jiu jitsu practitioners. The more consistent performer
has been Virna Jenjioba. With that said, she is the
more limited performer where she has been very grappling, heavy
attacker jiu jitsu. I think we did see the striking
has come along. But I think that Mackenzie Dern is

(01:04:14):
a more fearless operator, a more tenacious striker, and probably
a better wrestler, a more feared submission artist. There are
levels to this, and she was a world champion in
the Brazilian jiu jitsu. I think she's better than where
jenjer Oba is, and even though it's a close fight
the first time out, I just think this is the

(01:04:35):
beginning of the Durned era. They finally positioned her to
be a face of the company, where they've wanted her
to be for a while.

Speaker 1 (01:04:43):
I think UFC would definitely like to see Mackenzie Dern
win here.

Speaker 2 (01:04:48):
I actually like jener Roba.

Speaker 3 (01:04:51):
Now.

Speaker 2 (01:04:51):
Will I be shocked if Durna wins. No, not not
at all. But I like Genderoba. She's just a little
bit more here, so.

Speaker 3 (01:04:59):
I'll be surprised with gen can maintain position and have
the top control without Dern threatening her enough to sway
the rounds. That's what I think. I think the submissions
are gonna come from durn You don't want to play
in that realm uh real.

Speaker 2 (01:05:14):
Quick, Mike god darn.

Speaker 1 (01:05:15):
For those curious, minus one sixty favorite, Jenji Roba a
plus one thirty five hundred dog, it's close.

Speaker 3 (01:05:20):
It's just I think the general concessus is Durn's a
little bit more dangerous on the ground and just a
little bit crazier on the feet. Yep, Gota wait number
one contender on the line quite possibly. Umer nurmagum Matov. Yeah,
remember that guy, it's been a long time. He's been
about nine months. He's ready to let that baby burst
and we'll see if he's a new fighter when he

(01:05:42):
takes on Mario Bautista. Bautista incredible wind streak, not well
liked by the fan base coming off of the win
over Patch. He mix holding on to Jose all theough.
The guy has a variation of ways to win. And
the biggest question here to me is can he close
the distance? Can you apply the pressure that marab did
to Umar? Can Umar improve his cardio? And can he

(01:06:06):
lie on a decisive strike to back off Mario Batista?
Because if you're not respecting him, he doesn't do anything flashy,
but Mario Batista is a motherfucker, will not get out
of your face.

Speaker 1 (01:06:18):
Umar Numbergameta far and away the biggest favorite on this
card at minus eight hundred, no surprise, Mario Bautista the
biggest underdog at plus five hundred.

Speaker 3 (01:06:28):
Do you feel it's that way? Do you feel maybe
home field advantage plays somewhere in that the Nerma Gametovs
fear very well on the judge's score cards in that region.

Speaker 2 (01:06:37):
I don't think he goes to the score cards.

Speaker 3 (01:06:40):
Oh you're thinking that Norma Gametov derails, maybe exposes the
Batista win streak. Yes, oh that's a big look then
from Michael Carlile quite possibly a heavyweight. I don't I
was out of Volkov. We were all told that they
were gonna make things right for the surreal Gon scorecard debacle,

(01:07:02):
and it's that surreal gone against the title fight and Volkov,
who does have a seventy two percent takedown defense, but
that takedown defense has faltered against the guys that you'd
actually think are gonna take him down, takes on the big,
hulking jiu jitsu expert wrestler Jai Yelton Almeida.

Speaker 1 (01:07:21):
Not only do you not make things right for Volkov,
you give him a fight against Almeida on the same
card that serel Gon's getting the title shot that should
be Volkov's, and.

Speaker 2 (01:07:30):
You're putting him in there with a fucking guy who's
favored to.

Speaker 3 (01:07:33):
Beat him because styles may fight. This is a bad
stylistic match for Volkov. Volkov is a big dude. Though
all of his six foot seven he is all of
two hundred and eighty pounds now cutting down to make heavyweight.
Maybe the number holds true and his takedown defense is
better than we think. But surreal Gon had success taking

(01:07:54):
down Alexander Volkov. Youn't do much shit with it, but
he had success with it. It might be a long
night for the Russian. I have no clue how this
was made well feature prelim you get nasarat har request
a five fight win streak, flying under the radar. Did
they change the now you made a weird look on
your face.

Speaker 2 (01:08:14):
Oh it's the Rackatge fight. Oh oh yeah, I'm sorry. Yeah,
that that's opening your pay for you.

Speaker 3 (01:08:21):
Yeah, okay, yeah, sorry, I jumped by that one. Ranked
light heavyweights racketed Versonna Khanov Versonic Khanov, unbeaten, really untested.
He's an explosive striker. He's kind of tricky, rackete, a
little bit injury prone, a little bit sagnet. He should
be the favorite. He should win the fight, but don't

(01:08:42):
be surprised if he gets caught, because Ozmo is the
kind of guy that can put together a trick. So
does the explosiveness bring out a performance from rackets where
he's able to maintain the fighter? Does he get caught
with one, he should win. But this isn't a slam duncan.
This is a guy that looks like a hulking figure
that you want to be a contender, but he's just

(01:09:03):
never hit that next level in his skill.

Speaker 2 (01:09:06):
Yeah, he's not the favorite either, by the way.

Speaker 1 (01:09:08):
Now it's pretty much a pick him as Matt's minus
one fifteen Rackets is minus one oh.

Speaker 3 (01:09:13):
Five, a little bit closer than I'd expect. I thought
the size of ventage, possibly the higher level experience would
give Rackets the experience nasau rat ha request featured pre
Limb getting to that one five fight win streak flying
under the radar. UFC gonna push that one to the
test because he's getting Quillin soligd Saligad two under the

(01:09:35):
radar win so far in the UFC. One was a
first round knockout, but an interesting matchup for the nine
to one fighter to get somebody with twice as much
experience who you thought would be knocking on the door
of the rankings. Same kind of situation. Jun Young Park
has kind of floated on knocking on the door of
the rankings. He's taking on an ikram a lascarav who

(01:09:56):
came to the promotion with all so much hype. Tremendous striker.
He's hit that ceiling going against Robert Whittaker too early.
He had a nice violence back. We'll see how that
one plays out. Matthews, Rebeccy, lud m Kleine low Key
might be fire of the night. Both guys are reckless,
both guys are aggressive. Both guys have big right hands.
I think that Ludocline is a little more well thought

(01:10:18):
out and a little more tactful. Well, Rebeccy is more
of a tanky, So we'll see if that one plays
out in that nature. Walter Walker Louis Sutherland. This one
comes together as both heavyweights that had their recent fights
play out. Does Walker get another heel hook? I'm not
as confident now in this one as the last time

(01:10:38):
he was booked. Sutherland has to be aware of it.
Chris Barnett returns. Does his knee hold up Michael Carlo
when he takes on the wrestler hamdy aduwad.

Speaker 1 (01:10:49):
I sure hope it does. My guess is the knee
holds up. I don't think it matters.

Speaker 2 (01:10:53):
I don't like Barnett here unfortunately.

Speaker 3 (01:10:56):
And I believe it's kicking off the card, it's Jacqueline
Amore versus Mazake in a way, two phenomenal female strawweight grapplers.
You might get a tweet if you're really into the
jiu jitsu where this one starts out. Amore a I'm
believing should be the favorite, a lot more potential in
where she has where we've seen in a way kind

(01:11:17):
of struggle regained her game. I think that this is
a nice test for Morey to see if she's ready
to go that next level.

Speaker 1 (01:11:24):
Early start on Saturday prelims ten am Eastern on ESPN,
plus your main card at two pm Eastern for UFC
three twenty one.

Speaker 2 (01:11:34):
Anything else, Micah.

Speaker 3 (01:11:37):
Go over to cageminds dot com. We got a whole
ton of interviews going on. I believe this week I'm
gonna get a cast of characters this weekend into the office,
So check out the YouTube. Hoping to go live and
have a watch along in the afternoon for the UFC
three twenty one, so come hang out with us for
lunch there.

Speaker 1 (01:11:56):
You go get the show on ex at MMA after hours.
You can find me at Realmike Carlisle. We will talk
to you next week for another episode of m M
A After Hours here on the After Hours podcast Network.

Speaker 3 (01:12:13):
Love combat Sports. I have a website for you, cageminds
dot com. That's c A g E D m I
n d s dot com. Fight news from around the world,
in depth interviews, live event coverage covering combat sports for
over a decade. Established in April twenty eleven, That's cageminds

(01:12:36):
dot com.