July 21, 2025 • 11 mins
dive into the life of "Murray the Hump," the brilliant yet understated mastermind who helped shape the American underworld. From his rise alongside Al Capone to his pivotal role in the national crime syndicate, discover how Humphreys wielded immense power not with bullets, but with strategy, diplomacy, and political influence. This is the story of the mob's best-kept secret.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
So when you think of legendary figures in the American underworld,
names like al Capone, Lucky Luciano, Meyer, Lansky probably jump
right to mind.
Speaker 2 (00:11):
Absolutely the big names.
Speaker 1 (00:12):
Yeah, figures known for their flash, you know, their brute force,
their undeniable presence. But what happens when maybe the most
powerful figures operate entirely out of the spotlight, never really
seeking it. Okay, let's unpack this. What kind of influence
can someone like that actually wield?
Speaker 2 (00:33):
Well, that's what's truly compelling, isn't it. Because today we're
taking a deep dive into the life of Llewellyn Morris Humphries,
widely known as Murray the Hump.
Speaker 1 (00:40):
Murray the Hump.
Speaker 2 (00:41):
He's a figure not nearly as notorious as Capone, sure,
but a profoundly influential an American organized crime. Our sources,
particularly this book Murray the Hump, Architect of the American Underworld,
they paint this picture of a quiet calculator, a savvy strategist,
the consummate fixer, the diplomat enforcer, and just the master
(01:02):
of political connections.
Speaker 1 (01:03):
So not the typical image at all, not at all.
Speaker 2 (01:05):
And our mission today really is to understand how Humphrey's
influence reached far, far deeper than most people realized, often
without anyone hearing a sound. He fundamentally shaped the mob
as we kind of know it.
Speaker 1 (01:18):
Okay, So to really get a grip on this elusive
power of Murray the Hump, we have to go back,
right back to his gritty beginnings. Yeah, he was born
April twenty, eighteen ninety nine, Chicago, Illinois, Welsh immigrants right
there on the South Side mm hmm.
Speaker 2 (01:34):
Tough neighborhood, you can imagine.
Speaker 1 (01:36):
Growing up there, he probably learned pretty quick that playing
by society's formal rules that well, didn't always pay off.
Speaker 2 (01:43):
That environment was certainly formative, no question, he was undeniably bright,
a quick learner, but he soon found out that petty
crime offered let's say, far more immediate rewards than schoolwork.
By his teenage years, he was already deep into local
gang stuff, everything from bootlegging to hijacking, strong arming rivals.
Speaker 1 (02:02):
So he got started young, very.
Speaker 2 (02:04):
Young, And that nickname the Hump it actually started as
kind of a play on his last name, Humphreys. Oh,
but Murray the Hump stuck because of his reputation that cold,
calculated efficiency. It just it perfectly fit the man he
was becoming, and.
Speaker 1 (02:18):
His real sort of assent, like for so many others
back then, came during Prohibition.
Speaker 2 (02:25):
Oh, absolutely the golden era for organized crime.
Speaker 1 (02:28):
Murray. He quickly aligned himself with the biggest player in Chicago,
al Capone.
Speaker 2 (02:32):
He did.
Speaker 1 (02:33):
But it wasn't just about like joining the biggest gang
on the block, was it. How did Humphries actually manage
to become Capone's most trusted aid, especially when, as you said,
his whole approach was so different from the typical mobster.
Speaker 2 (02:47):
It's a really striking contrast, and that's what set Humphrey's apart.
He became indispensable not through muscle, but through sheer intellect
or brains. He handled the outfits complex finances, manage their
intricate communications. He was the crucial go between with politicians,
with union leaders.
Speaker 1 (03:06):
Wow.
Speaker 2 (03:06):
And this wasn't just like a personal preference for avoiding violence.
It really marked a key evolution in organized crime, recognizing
that the real levers of power weren't always in overt threats,
but in systemic infiltration, economic control. Humphreys basically weaponized discretion.
Speaker 1 (03:23):
Weaponized discretion. I like that.
Speaker 2 (03:25):
Yeah, he rarely carried a gun, didn't need to. His
power came from knowing exactly who to call, what to say,
and crucially, how to make a problem disappear without bloodshed.
Capone himself supposedly said, you need a man who can
talk you out of a jam faster than a Tommy
gun can shoot you out.
Speaker 1 (03:43):
And that was Murray.
Speaker 2 (03:44):
That was Murray.
Speaker 1 (03:45):
That really highlights his unique knack for diplomacy right and
understanding alliances both inside the underworld and outside it. How
did he cultivate such diverse relationships? I mean, politicians, judges,
what did they mean for the outfits ability to operate well?
Speaker 2 (04:02):
His genius really lay in building this vast network politicians, judges,
law enforcement, powerful union bosses. This whole web of influence
allowed the outfit to operate with well near impunity through
the twenties and thirty youre impunity.
Speaker 1 (04:15):
Wow.
Speaker 2 (04:16):
And if we step back connect this to the bigger picture,
you see his instrumental role in building the National Crime Syndicate.
Speaker 1 (04:22):
Ah okay, the national level.
Speaker 2 (04:24):
Yeah, working closely with guys like Lucky Luciano Meyer, Lanski,
Frank Costello to formalize a structure. The idea was to
prevent needless turf fors, boost overall profits makes sense like
a business exactly. This syndicate often called the Commission. It
functioned pretty much like a corporate boardroom, and Humphreys he
often played the role of the unassuming coo, the coo
(04:49):
of the mob, sort of balancing egos, resolving disputes, making
sure the money flowed smoothly. He was the quiet architect
right there behind the scenes, and you can see.
Speaker 1 (04:58):
How he'd also be the perfect go between in really
volatile situations. Absolutely, when powerful gangsters needed someone to negotiate
peace or maybe deliver a quiet, veiled threat, they called Murray. Mmm,
he's calm demeanor, that polished speech. Yeah, it masked a
truly ruthless streak, didn't it. It ensured people didn't just listen,
(05:19):
they complied.
Speaker 2 (05:20):
And perhaps the most significant part of his whole career
was his deep, deep involvement in political manipulation and labor racketeering. Okays,
get into that Humphreys had this profound understanding. He got
that controlling unions was basically like controlling entire cities. So well,
think about it. If you can dictate who works, what
gets built, how goods move you hold immense power, real
(05:44):
tangible power, and he proved it.
Speaker 1 (05:46):
With I mean astounding effectiveness.
Speaker 2 (05:48):
He did through strategic alliances with labor leaders. He helped
the outfit gain control over construction, transportation, the longshoreman's unions
in major American cities. It's huge, brought in just enormous
revenue naturally, but also incredible political clout.
Speaker 1 (06:04):
It's almost unbelievable the depth of that infiltration, it really is.
Speaker 2 (06:08):
Humphreys basically became the de facto ambassador between the mob
and well legitimate society.
Speaker 1 (06:15):
Wow.
Speaker 2 (06:16):
He had judges in his pocket, cops on his payroll,
politicians who owed him big favors. Right, there's that famous anecdote. Right,
It was said that if you wanted a political favor
in Chicago during the nineteen thirties and nineteen forties, you
didn't go to city Hall, you went to Murray.
Speaker 1 (06:29):
You went to Murray. That says it all.
Speaker 2 (06:31):
Because he was the financial architect behind so many of
these mob operations. Federal law enforcement, specifically the Treasury Department,
they recognized his central role. They started targeting him. They
figured out he was the money guy exactly. They understood
that if you wanted to cripple the outfit. You had
to dismantle the financial network. And he was key.
Speaker 1 (06:51):
And it wasn't just about like hiding cash, was it.
It was more systemic, creating this untraceable empire.
Speaker 2 (06:58):
Oh. Absolutely, he was a master of financial crime, tax evasion,
money laundering, creating these intricate shell companies, washing cash through
legitimate businesses. His genius was keeping those paper trails as
fuzzy as humanly possible, just making the money disappear into
the ether.
Speaker 1 (07:14):
So how did they finally get him? I mean, he
sounds incredibly slippery.
Speaker 2 (07:17):
Oh, he was incredibly slippery. He managed to dodge major
charges for years thanks to that huge web of loyal
allies and just his uncanny knack for knowing precisely when
to keep quiet. Hmmm, it's almost ironic, isn't it. The
ultimate fixer. He ultimately faced the classic mobster downfall income
tax evasion in nineteen fifty five.
Speaker 1 (07:39):
Ah, the taxman gets him.
Speaker 2 (07:41):
Every time, often does He was convicted, yeah, but only
served a few years, And even from behind bars, he
apparently maintained his role as considlier, that trusted advisor.
Speaker 1 (07:50):
Still pulling strings from prison, seems like it, and later
on when you had names like Tonyakrdo, Sam g and
Kanna becoming the sort of public faces of the outfit. Yeah,
iners knew, Murray the hump was still there, wielding immense
influence as the outfits shadow boss behind the scenes.
Speaker 2 (08:07):
That's the picture we get. He never craved the spotlight.
In fact, he actively avoided it.
Speaker 1 (08:12):
Do you think that that aversion to fame was actually
part of what made him so effective, allowing him to
be involved in everything from I don't know, Vegas casino
skimming to international narcotics trafficking, all while keeping a relatively
clean public image.
Speaker 2 (08:27):
Absolutely, I think you hit it right there. His disinterest
in the limelight was a massive strategic advantage. It let
him operate with far greater freedom, much less scrutiny. And
then Llwell and Moore As Humphreys died November twenty three,
nineteen sixty five. He was sixty six at home Lincolnwood, Illinois.
Speaker 1 (08:42):
And not violence, Nope, heart attack, which in itself is
kind of ironic, marking the end of an era and
the broader significance here. I think he truly was this
transitional figure in organized crime, moving from that brute force
of the prohibition gangsters right to Tommy Guns to the
more corporate style criminal empires that followed. He was, in
(09:06):
a way a precursor to the modern white collar mob boss.
He showed that real lasting power was about systemic control,
not just public notoriety.
Speaker 2 (09:16):
It's such a complicated legacy, though, isn't it. Definitely on
one hand, I mean undeniably a criminal responsible for corruption, racketeering,
and perpetuating this whole system of systemic vice.
Speaker 1 (09:27):
Sure.
Speaker 2 (09:27):
But on the other hand, a master strategist, a political operator,
a guy who's intelligent that you have to admit, rivaled
any boardroom executive in America. How do we reconcile those
two sides.
Speaker 1 (09:39):
It's that tension I think that makes his story so fascinating.
And despite his incredible influence, he's largely underrepresented in pop culture.
Speaker 2 (09:47):
Yeah, you don't see movies about Murray the Hump.
Speaker 1 (09:48):
Really.
Speaker 2 (09:49):
It's not like Capone or Luciano. Unlike those flashy gangsters
immortalized in film, Murray's story is often told sort of
in the margins, which, honestly, he probably wouldn't have it
any other way.
Speaker 1 (10:00):
H probably not.
Speaker 2 (10:01):
There's something almost I don't know, poetic about his obscurity.
He understood that power didn't come from attention, It came
from control, secrecy, leverage, historians, mob enthusiasts. They certainly recognize
his place as a pivotal figure.
Speaker 1 (10:18):
Okay, So, wrapping this up, what does this all mean
for us? For you listening today, Murray the Hump's story,
it seems to offer these broader insights right about human nature, ambition, influences.
Speaker 2 (10:29):
I think. So.
Speaker 1 (10:30):
He proved that power doesn't always roar, sometimes it whispers.
He built empires not with bullets, but with blackmail and ballots.
He was a master of timing, knowing exactly when to talk,
when to listen, and maybe most importantly, when to just vanish.
In many ways, Murray the Hump was kind of the
ultimate concilier, wasn't he? He really was the man who
(10:50):
stood beside the throne, not on it, yet maybe held
more sway than the king that captures it. So Llewellyn
Moore as Humphreys. Yeah, maybe not as famous as al Capone,
not as mythologized as Lucky Luciano, But for anyone who
really wants to understand how organized crime worked, how it evolved,
he was one of the true architects of the American underworld.
(11:11):
Whyat calculated, yeah and brilliant.
Speaker 2 (11:16):
Absolutely, he didn't need the spotlight. He just needed the
phone lines and that political rolodex. He was the guy
making sure the right palms were greased, the right laws ignored,
the right enemies disappeared, all with that calm demeanor and
a tip of the hat.
Speaker 1 (11:30):
So in the end, Murray the hum story. It really
offers this compelling lesson, doesn't it, about how true power
so often operates far.
Speaker 2 (11:37):
From the headlines, in the shadows, and.
Speaker 1 (11:39):
Whisper deals in quiet rooms, In those shadows, where decisions
get made before anyone even knows a meeting happened. It
kind of makes you wonder, doesn't it, what other historical
figures might fit that description, operating unseen but shaping huge outcomes.
So when you think of legendary figures in the American underworld,
names like al Capone, Lucky Luciano, Meyer, Lansky probably jump
right to mind.
Speaker 2 (00:11):
Absolutely the big names.
Speaker 1 (00:12):
Yeah, figures known for their flash, you know, their brute force,
their undeniable presence. But what happens when maybe the most
powerful figures operate entirely out of the spotlight, never really
seeking it. Okay, let's unpack this. What kind of influence
can someone like that actually wield?
Speaker 2 (00:33):
Well, that's what's truly compelling, isn't it. Because today we're
taking a deep dive into the life of Llewellyn Morris Humphries,
widely known as Murray the Hump.
Speaker 1 (00:40):
Murray the Hump.
Speaker 2 (00:41):
He's a figure not nearly as notorious as Capone, sure,
but a profoundly influential an American organized crime. Our sources,
particularly this book Murray the Hump, Architect of the American Underworld,
they paint this picture of a quiet calculator, a savvy strategist,
the consummate fixer, the diplomat enforcer, and just the master
(01:02):
of political connections.
Speaker 1 (01:03):
So not the typical image at all, not at all.
Speaker 2 (01:05):
And our mission today really is to understand how Humphrey's
influence reached far, far deeper than most people realized, often
without anyone hearing a sound. He fundamentally shaped the mob
as we kind of know it.
Speaker 1 (01:18):
Okay, So to really get a grip on this elusive
power of Murray the Hump, we have to go back,
right back to his gritty beginnings. Yeah, he was born
April twenty, eighteen ninety nine, Chicago, Illinois, Welsh immigrants right
there on the South Side mm hmm.
Speaker 2 (01:34):
Tough neighborhood, you can imagine.
Speaker 1 (01:36):
Growing up there, he probably learned pretty quick that playing
by society's formal rules that well, didn't always pay off.
Speaker 2 (01:43):
That environment was certainly formative, no question, he was undeniably bright,
a quick learner, but he soon found out that petty
crime offered let's say, far more immediate rewards than schoolwork.
By his teenage years, he was already deep into local
gang stuff, everything from bootlegging to hijacking, strong arming rivals.
Speaker 1 (02:02):
So he got started young, very.
Speaker 2 (02:04):
Young, And that nickname the Hump it actually started as
kind of a play on his last name, Humphreys. Oh,
but Murray the Hump stuck because of his reputation that cold,
calculated efficiency. It just it perfectly fit the man he
was becoming, and.
Speaker 1 (02:18):
His real sort of assent, like for so many others
back then, came during Prohibition.
Speaker 2 (02:25):
Oh, absolutely the golden era for organized crime.
Speaker 1 (02:28):
Murray. He quickly aligned himself with the biggest player in Chicago,
al Capone.
Speaker 2 (02:32):
He did.
Speaker 1 (02:33):
But it wasn't just about like joining the biggest gang
on the block, was it. How did Humphries actually manage
to become Capone's most trusted aid, especially when, as you said,
his whole approach was so different from the typical mobster.
Speaker 2 (02:47):
It's a really striking contrast, and that's what set Humphrey's apart.
He became indispensable not through muscle, but through sheer intellect
or brains. He handled the outfits complex finances, manage their
intricate communications. He was the crucial go between with politicians,
with union leaders.
Speaker 1 (03:06):
Wow.
Speaker 2 (03:06):
And this wasn't just like a personal preference for avoiding violence.
It really marked a key evolution in organized crime, recognizing
that the real levers of power weren't always in overt threats,
but in systemic infiltration, economic control. Humphreys basically weaponized discretion.
Speaker 1 (03:23):
Weaponized discretion. I like that.
Speaker 2 (03:25):
Yeah, he rarely carried a gun, didn't need to. His
power came from knowing exactly who to call, what to say,
and crucially, how to make a problem disappear without bloodshed.
Capone himself supposedly said, you need a man who can
talk you out of a jam faster than a Tommy
gun can shoot you out.
Speaker 1 (03:43):
And that was Murray.
Speaker 2 (03:44):
That was Murray.
Speaker 1 (03:45):
That really highlights his unique knack for diplomacy right and
understanding alliances both inside the underworld and outside it. How
did he cultivate such diverse relationships? I mean, politicians, judges,
what did they mean for the outfits ability to operate well?
Speaker 2 (04:02):
His genius really lay in building this vast network politicians, judges,
law enforcement, powerful union bosses. This whole web of influence
allowed the outfit to operate with well near impunity through
the twenties and thirty youre impunity.
Speaker 1 (04:15):
Wow.
Speaker 2 (04:16):
And if we step back connect this to the bigger picture,
you see his instrumental role in building the National Crime Syndicate.
Speaker 1 (04:22):
Ah okay, the national level.
Speaker 2 (04:24):
Yeah, working closely with guys like Lucky Luciano Meyer, Lanski,
Frank Costello to formalize a structure. The idea was to
prevent needless turf fors, boost overall profits makes sense like
a business exactly. This syndicate often called the Commission. It
functioned pretty much like a corporate boardroom, and Humphreys he
often played the role of the unassuming coo, the coo
(04:49):
of the mob, sort of balancing egos, resolving disputes, making
sure the money flowed smoothly. He was the quiet architect
right there behind the scenes, and you can see.
Speaker 1 (04:58):
How he'd also be the perfect go between in really
volatile situations. Absolutely, when powerful gangsters needed someone to negotiate
peace or maybe deliver a quiet, veiled threat, they called Murray. Mmm,
he's calm demeanor, that polished speech. Yeah, it masked a
truly ruthless streak, didn't it. It ensured people didn't just listen,
(05:19):
they complied.
Speaker 2 (05:20):
And perhaps the most significant part of his whole career
was his deep, deep involvement in political manipulation and labor racketeering. Okays,
get into that Humphreys had this profound understanding. He got
that controlling unions was basically like controlling entire cities. So well,
think about it. If you can dictate who works, what
gets built, how goods move you hold immense power, real
(05:44):
tangible power, and he proved it.
Speaker 1 (05:46):
With I mean astounding effectiveness.
Speaker 2 (05:48):
He did through strategic alliances with labor leaders. He helped
the outfit gain control over construction, transportation, the longshoreman's unions
in major American cities. It's huge, brought in just enormous
revenue naturally, but also incredible political clout.
Speaker 1 (06:04):
It's almost unbelievable the depth of that infiltration, it really is.
Speaker 2 (06:08):
Humphreys basically became the de facto ambassador between the mob
and well legitimate society.
Speaker 1 (06:15):
Wow.
Speaker 2 (06:16):
He had judges in his pocket, cops on his payroll,
politicians who owed him big favors. Right, there's that famous anecdote. Right,
It was said that if you wanted a political favor
in Chicago during the nineteen thirties and nineteen forties, you
didn't go to city Hall, you went to Murray.
Speaker 1 (06:29):
You went to Murray. That says it all.
Speaker 2 (06:31):
Because he was the financial architect behind so many of
these mob operations. Federal law enforcement, specifically the Treasury Department,
they recognized his central role. They started targeting him. They
figured out he was the money guy exactly. They understood
that if you wanted to cripple the outfit. You had
to dismantle the financial network. And he was key.
Speaker 1 (06:51):
And it wasn't just about like hiding cash, was it.
It was more systemic, creating this untraceable empire.
Speaker 2 (06:58):
Oh. Absolutely, he was a master of financial crime, tax evasion,
money laundering, creating these intricate shell companies, washing cash through
legitimate businesses. His genius was keeping those paper trails as
fuzzy as humanly possible, just making the money disappear into
the ether.
Speaker 1 (07:14):
So how did they finally get him? I mean, he
sounds incredibly slippery.
Speaker 2 (07:17):
Oh, he was incredibly slippery. He managed to dodge major
charges for years thanks to that huge web of loyal
allies and just his uncanny knack for knowing precisely when
to keep quiet. Hmmm, it's almost ironic, isn't it. The
ultimate fixer. He ultimately faced the classic mobster downfall income
tax evasion in nineteen fifty five.
Speaker 1 (07:39):
Ah, the taxman gets him.
Speaker 2 (07:41):
Every time, often does He was convicted, yeah, but only
served a few years, And even from behind bars, he
apparently maintained his role as considlier, that trusted advisor.
Speaker 1 (07:50):
Still pulling strings from prison, seems like it, and later
on when you had names like Tonyakrdo, Sam g and
Kanna becoming the sort of public faces of the outfit. Yeah,
iners knew, Murray the hump was still there, wielding immense
influence as the outfits shadow boss behind the scenes.
Speaker 2 (08:07):
That's the picture we get. He never craved the spotlight.
In fact, he actively avoided it.
Speaker 1 (08:12):
Do you think that that aversion to fame was actually
part of what made him so effective, allowing him to
be involved in everything from I don't know, Vegas casino
skimming to international narcotics trafficking, all while keeping a relatively
clean public image.
Speaker 2 (08:27):
Absolutely, I think you hit it right there. His disinterest
in the limelight was a massive strategic advantage. It let
him operate with far greater freedom, much less scrutiny. And
then Llwell and Moore As Humphreys died November twenty three,
nineteen sixty five. He was sixty six at home Lincolnwood, Illinois.
Speaker 1 (08:42):
And not violence, Nope, heart attack, which in itself is
kind of ironic, marking the end of an era and
the broader significance here. I think he truly was this
transitional figure in organized crime, moving from that brute force
of the prohibition gangsters right to Tommy Guns to the
more corporate style criminal empires that followed. He was, in
(09:06):
a way a precursor to the modern white collar mob boss.
He showed that real lasting power was about systemic control,
not just public notoriety.
Speaker 2 (09:16):
It's such a complicated legacy, though, isn't it. Definitely on
one hand, I mean undeniably a criminal responsible for corruption, racketeering,
and perpetuating this whole system of systemic vice.
Speaker 1 (09:27):
Sure.
Speaker 2 (09:27):
But on the other hand, a master strategist, a political operator,
a guy who's intelligent that you have to admit, rivaled
any boardroom executive in America. How do we reconcile those
two sides.
Speaker 1 (09:39):
It's that tension I think that makes his story so fascinating.
And despite his incredible influence, he's largely underrepresented in pop culture.
Speaker 2 (09:47):
Yeah, you don't see movies about Murray the Hump.
Speaker 1 (09:48):
Really.
Speaker 2 (09:49):
It's not like Capone or Luciano. Unlike those flashy gangsters
immortalized in film, Murray's story is often told sort of
in the margins, which, honestly, he probably wouldn't have it
any other way.
Speaker 1 (10:00):
H probably not.
Speaker 2 (10:01):
There's something almost I don't know, poetic about his obscurity.
He understood that power didn't come from attention, It came
from control, secrecy, leverage, historians, mob enthusiasts. They certainly recognize
his place as a pivotal figure.
Speaker 1 (10:18):
Okay, So, wrapping this up, what does this all mean
for us? For you listening today, Murray the Hump's story,
it seems to offer these broader insights right about human nature, ambition, influences.
Speaker 2 (10:29):
I think. So.
Speaker 1 (10:30):
He proved that power doesn't always roar, sometimes it whispers.
He built empires not with bullets, but with blackmail and ballots.
He was a master of timing, knowing exactly when to talk,
when to listen, and maybe most importantly, when to just vanish.
In many ways, Murray the Hump was kind of the
ultimate concilier, wasn't he? He really was the man who
(10:50):
stood beside the throne, not on it, yet maybe held
more sway than the king that captures it. So Llewellyn
Moore as Humphreys. Yeah, maybe not as famous as al Capone,
not as mythologized as Lucky Luciano, But for anyone who
really wants to understand how organized crime worked, how it evolved,
he was one of the true architects of the American underworld.
(11:11):
Whyat calculated, yeah and brilliant.
Speaker 2 (11:16):
Absolutely, he didn't need the spotlight. He just needed the
phone lines and that political rolodex. He was the guy
making sure the right palms were greased, the right laws ignored,
the right enemies disappeared, all with that calm demeanor and
a tip of the hat.
Speaker 1 (11:30):
So in the end, Murray the hum story. It really
offers this compelling lesson, doesn't it, about how true power
so often operates far.
Speaker 2 (11:37):
From the headlines, in the shadows, and.
Speaker 1 (11:39):
Whisper deals in quiet rooms, In those shadows, where decisions
get made before anyone even knows a meeting happened. It
kind of makes you wonder, doesn't it, what other historical
figures might fit that description, operating unseen but shaping huge outcomes.
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