January 19, 2025 • 16 mins
Netflix's The Breakthrough is a dramatized miniseries based on the true story of a 2004 double murder in Sweden. The series follows the sixteen-year investigation, highlighting the crucial role of forensic genealogy in finally identifying the killer, Daniel Nyqvist. While inspired by real events, the show fictionalizes some aspects of the case, including character names and certain plot details, for dramatic effect. The real-life investigation utilized newly passed legislation allowing access to commercial genealogy databases, a pivotal development in solving the cold case. The show ultimately recounts both the tragic crime and the innovative investigative techniques that brought it to a resolution.
Become a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/murder-files-unsealed--6017387/support.
Become a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/murder-files-unsealed--6017387/support.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Welcome back everyone for another deep dive. This time we're
going to be looking at forensic genealogy.
Speaker 2 (00:06):
Ooh exciting.
Speaker 1 (00:07):
Yeah, and we'll be using the Netflix show The Breakthrough
and some related source material kind of as our guide.
So you know, think CSI meets ancestry dot com basically,
I like it. We're talking about DNA testing combined with
traditional genealogy to solve crimes. Yeah, and you know, the
case we're going to be unpacking is not just some
(00:28):
fictional story from TV. It's a real life cold case. Wow,
one of the biggest in Swedish history. It was cracked
wide open thanks to this cutting edge technique, you know.
Speaker 2 (00:39):
And that's what I think makes this case so interesting
is that it really shows the power of this emerging field. Yeah.
Forensic genealogy is not just about technology. It's about you know,
the connection between science, data analysis and just good old
fashioned detective work.
Speaker 1 (00:53):
Yeah, definitely. So just set the scene. We're going to
go back to two thousand and four in link Kepving, Sweden. Okay,
an eight year old old boy, Mohammad A Moury is
walking to school when he's attacked and killed and a
fifty six year old woman Annelina s Fenson witnesses the
attack and she tries to intervene oh no, but tragically
she also becomes a victim. So you can imagine the
(01:14):
terror that must have gripped that community.
Speaker 2 (01:16):
Absolutely, And you know, this case, with its brutality and
just seeming randomness, it really left investigators baffled. Right, they
found DNA evidence at the crime scene, but there was
no match in any existing criminal database.
Speaker 1 (01:29):
Wow.
Speaker 2 (01:30):
So for sixteen years the case went cold, leaving the
families of the victims with you know, so many unanswered questions.
Speaker 1 (01:38):
Talk about a frustrating situation. Right, Yeah, you have the evidence,
but you can't connect it to a suspect exactly. But
then in twenty nineteen, new law in Sweden changed everything.
Law enforcement was finally allowed to use commercial genealogy websites
for investigative purposes. Interesting, and that's where forensic genealogy really
enters the picture.
Speaker 2 (01:57):
And it was a game changer. You know, this legal shift,
Swedish investigators were able to team up with genealogist Peter Schuland,
and together they started combing through these ancestry databases looking
for any DNA matches that could point them toward the killer.
Speaker 1 (02:13):
Wow.
Speaker 2 (02:14):
But you know it wasn't just a simple search. This
involved painstakingly constructing a massive family tree.
Speaker 1 (02:21):
Okay, So how do you even start to build a
family tree from a DNA sample? Right? It sounds like
searching for a needle in a haystack.
Speaker 2 (02:28):
It is incredibly complex, and that's why Sholin's expertise was
so vital.
Speaker 1 (02:32):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (02:32):
They started with the crime scene DNA and used it
to find potential relatives in these databases. Okay. They were
looking specifically for matches on the autosomal DNA, which is
inherited from both parents, right, and then through a process
called genetic triangulation, they could estimate the degree of relatedness.
Speaker 1 (02:51):
So if they found someone who shared let's say twenty
five percent of their DNA with the unknown suspect, yeah,
that would indicate like a grandparent or grandchild relationship exactly.
Speaker 2 (03:03):
And by piecing together these DNA relationships and comparing them
to historical records, you know, birth certificates, marriage licenses, death certificates,
Shuland was able to build a family tree that stretched
back over two centuries. It was like putting together a
giant puzzle, one DNA match at a time.
Speaker 1 (03:21):
That's incredible. So all that work paid off, right, They
found their suspects, they.
Speaker 2 (03:25):
Did, This intricate genealogical web led them straight to Daniel Niquist,
who ultimately confessed to the murders. Wow, and he was
sentenced to indefinite psychiatric care.
Speaker 1 (03:35):
So this case really became a landmark victory for forensic genealogy.
It proved how powerful it could be to solve even
the most baffling cold cases.
Speaker 2 (03:45):
Totally.
Speaker 1 (03:46):
Now, the Netflix show The Breakthrough dramatizes this story, brings
it to life on screen, but like any adaptation, it
takes some creative liberties.
Speaker 2 (03:54):
Right Like, for example, some names and backstories in the
show were altered, probably for privacy reasons or to streamline
the narrative a bit. And then there's a subplot about
investigators breaking data privacy laws to access information, which didn't
actually happen in the real life case. Right.
Speaker 1 (04:10):
So it's important to remember that the show is entertainment first,
but it does get the core elements of the investigation
right Yeah, and it definitely raises some interesting questions about
how much creative license is acceptable when you're portraying a
true story, especially one with such sensitive subject matter. But
we'll dive into all those nuances a little bit later. Okay,
(04:31):
for now, let's get back to the real life's investigation.
Speaker 2 (04:34):
Sounds good.
Speaker 1 (04:35):
You know, this breakthrough in the link up in case
wasn't just about identifying the killer. It was about bringing
closure to the families who had been searching for answers
for almost two decades. And that, to me, is one
of the most powerful aspects of forensic genealogy.
Speaker 2 (04:50):
It's a testament to its potential for sure to bring
justice and healing to families who have suffered the pain
of unsolved crimes. But you know, the link up in
case is the tip of the iceberg. Yeah, forensic genealogy
is now being used to solve a wide range of crimes,
from homicides and sexual assaults to identifying unknown remains, even
cracking historical mysteries.
Speaker 1 (05:12):
Right, It's not limited to just murders, and we'll be
exploring these other applications in more detail later in our
deep dives.
Speaker 2 (05:18):
Looking forward to it, But first, let's.
Speaker 1 (05:20):
Take a closer look at the process itself. You know,
how do they go from a DNA sample to a
family tree spanning centuries? What were the specific techniques and
challenges involved.
Speaker 2 (05:32):
Well, let's start by talking about the different types of
DNA analysis used in forensic genealogy. So we left off
talking about DNA analysis, and there are actually a few
different types used in forensic genealogy. The most common one
is autosomal DNA, which we inherit from both parents, and
this type of DNA is really good for finding relatives
within about five generations.
Speaker 1 (05:52):
So you're essentially casting a wide net looking for anyone
who shares enough DNA to suggest a family connection exactly.
Speaker 2 (05:59):
And once you find those matches, you use a process
called genetic triangulation to sort of narrow down the possibilities.
Let's say you and I both match the unknown suspects DNA.
By comparing our DNA segments and how much we each
share with the suspect, we can figure out if we're
related through a common ancestor on our you know, maternal
or paternal sides. Oh, interesting, that helps zero in on
(06:20):
a specific branch of the family tree.
Speaker 1 (06:23):
So it's like using those overlapping circles on a map
to pinpoint a location.
Speaker 2 (06:27):
Yeah, exactly, that's pretty cool.
Speaker 1 (06:28):
But wouldn't this process get like way more difficult the
further back in time you go.
Speaker 2 (06:32):
Oh. Absolutely. The further you go, the more the DNA
gets diluted through the generations, and those connections get much
harder to find, right, And that's where traditional genealogy comes in.
You need to back up those DNA matches with historical records,
you know, birth, marriage and death certificate, census data, military records,
even old newspaper clippings. It's like detective work on steroids.
Speaker 1 (06:55):
I can imagine the amount of patience and meticulousness it
must take to sift through all that information. Oh yeah,
but isn't that part of what makes forensic genealogy so interesting.
It's like you're solving this historical puzzle using DNA as your.
Speaker 2 (07:09):
Guide, and it's so rewarding to piece together those ancestral stories,
especially when you know it's leading to justice for victims
in their families.
Speaker 1 (07:18):
Yeah, for sure.
Speaker 2 (07:19):
And that brings us to another key aspect of forensic genealogy.
It's potential for solving these cold cases that have just
been sitting there for years, even decades. Right, think about
all the families out there still waiting for answers, still
hoping for closure.
Speaker 1 (07:34):
Yeah, it's heartbreaking to think about those unresolved cases. But
with this technology, there's a new sense of hope. We're
essentially giving law enforcement a brand new tool to revisit
old evidence and re examine leads that maybe they overlooked
or just couldn't pursue before.
Speaker 2 (07:51):
Exactly. Cases that seemed hopeless can suddenly become active again.
And while forensic genealogy doesn't always lead to an immediate arrest,
can offer and provide crucial breakthroughs, you know, narrowing down
the suspect pool or uncovering new evidence that can help
investigators move forward.
Speaker 1 (08:07):
So it's like breathing new life into cold cases, giving
them a fighting chance of being solved.
Speaker 2 (08:11):
That's a great way to put it.
Speaker 1 (08:12):
But let's shift gears a little bit and talk about
another application of forensic genealogy that's really fascinating. Identifying unknown remains. Okay,
this feels like a whole other ballgame, doesn't it.
Speaker 2 (08:23):
It definitely has its own unique challenges. You might be
dealing with skeletal remains, degraded DNA samples, even just a
few bone fragments. Wow, And a lot of times there's
very little information to go on, right. But even in
these cases, forensic genealogy can be incredibly powerful.
Speaker 1 (08:39):
So how does that even work. You can't just plug
a bone fragment into a genealogy website.
Speaker 2 (08:44):
Oh not yet anyway. What you can do is extract
DNA from the remains and analyze it to create a
DNA profile.
Speaker 1 (08:50):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (08:50):
Then, just like in criminal investigations, you compare that profile
to databases like ged match or family Tree DNA, looking
for any relatives who might have submitted their DNA for
genealogical purposes.
Speaker 1 (09:02):
So you're essentially building a family tree from the ground up. Yeah,
starting with that unknown individual and working your way back
through generations, hoping to connect with someone in the present
day who can identify them precisely.
Speaker 2 (09:13):
And these identifications can have a huge impact, not just
for law enforcement, but for families who have lost loved
ones without knowing what happened to them. Imagine being able
to finally give closure to a family whose relative went
missing in war decades ago, or identify a victim of
a natural disaster or a crime that happened years in
the past.
Speaker 1 (09:33):
It's like you're giving a voice to the voiceless, allowing
those who were lost to finally be recognized and remembered.
Speaker 2 (09:40):
Yeah, I like that.
Speaker 1 (09:41):
But it's not just about solving crimes and identifying remains.
Forensic genealogy is also being used to unravel historical mysteries,
and that, to me is where things get really exciting.
Speaker 2 (09:51):
Yeah, it's like opening a time capsule using DNA to
shed light on events from the past. Historians and genealogists
are working together now to solve historical puzzle that have
baffled researchers for generations.
Speaker 1 (10:02):
Wow.
Speaker 2 (10:02):
For example, forensic genealogy was used recently to identify the
remains of victims of the nineteen twenty one Tulsa Race massacre,
a horrific event that was basically erased from historical records.
Speaker 1 (10:12):
That's a chilling example of how this technology can not
only solve crimes but rewrite history bring to light events
that have been suppressed or forgotten. For sure, But as
with any powerful tool, there are some potential downsides to consider.
Of course, Next we'll dig into the ethical considerations surrounding
forensic genealogy. What are the potential risks? What safeguards do
(10:36):
we need to put in place? Yeah, and who gets
to decide how this technology is used?
Speaker 2 (10:40):
These are crucial questions, and they're not easy to answer.
Let's start by looking at the privacy concerns that come
up when you use genetic information this way.
Speaker 1 (10:49):
We've seen how powerful forensic genealogy can be, you know,
solving those cold cases, identifying remains, even shedding light on
historical mysteries. But it does come with some serious ethical questions,
doesn't it.
Speaker 2 (11:02):
Definitely. I mean, we're talking about using people's DNA, often
without their consent, to potentially incriminate them or their relatives.
Speaker 1 (11:09):
Yeah, that's a big deal.
Speaker 2 (11:10):
Is It's a Pandora's box we need to open very
carefully for sure.
Speaker 1 (11:13):
And privacy has got to be one of the biggest concerns.
When you send your DNA to a genealogy website, are
you basically saying it's okay to use it for a
criminal investigation?
Speaker 2 (11:24):
Yeah?
Speaker 1 (11:25):
What don't your family members right, they never agreed to that,
but their genetic information is now part of the equation exactly.
That brings up some really tough legal and ethical questions.
It is a bit unsettling, isn't it. It is you
think you're just tracing your family tree and suddenly you're
caught up in a murder investigation. Yeah, so where do
we draw the line. Should there be stricter regulations on
(11:47):
how law enforcement can access these databases?
Speaker 2 (11:50):
Well, that's the debate that's happening right now. Some people
argue that using ancestry DNA for criminal investigations, even with
good intentions, is a slippery slope. It could lead to
a future where these DNA databases are used for things
we never intended, like employment screening, insurance assessments, even social profiling.
Speaker 1 (12:08):
That's a scary thought, is It's like they say, the
road to hell is paved with good intentions. We start
with a good goal solving violent crimes, but where does
it end and who gets to decide that? Should we
be having a bigger conversation about this as a society.
Should people have the right to say, hey, don't use
my DNA for law enforcement purposes?
Speaker 2 (12:29):
These are really tough questions that policymakers, ethicists, and everyday
people are grappling with. There are no easy answers. On
one hand, you have the chance to bring justice to
victors and their families, but on the other you have
the potential for misuse and the erosion of privacy. Exact
finding that balance is so important.
Speaker 1 (12:47):
It really feels like we're at a crossroads here. We
have this incredible technology that can do so much good,
but we need to be really careful about how we
use it. What are some steps we can take to
reduce those risks while still using the good parts of
forensic genealogy.
Speaker 2 (13:02):
Well, transparency is really key here. People need to know
how their genetic information can be used, and they should
be able to choose to consent or not. We also
need clear legal guidelines and oversight to make sure that
law enforcement agencies aren't abusing their power. And maybe most importantly,
we need to have open and honest conversations about the
(13:23):
ethical side of this technology. And those conversations shouldn't just
involve experts, they should involve the public too.
Speaker 1 (13:29):
That's a great point. This isn't just a science issue.
It's a society issue, and we need to come together
to decide what kind of future we want with this technology.
But let's ship gears for a minute and have some
fun speculating. We've seen how fast DNA technology is moving.
Where do you see forensic genealogy going in the next five, ten,
twenty years.
Speaker 2 (13:46):
Well, we're already seeing advancements in DNA analysis that can
predict physical traits from a DNA sample, things like hair color,
eye color, even facial features. Wow, imagine what that could
mean for identifying suspects or even reconstructing the faces of
historical figures.
Speaker 1 (14:01):
That's mind blowing. We're basically talking about painting a picture
of a person from just a tiny drop of blood
or a strand of hair. But doesn't that open up
a whole new set of ethical questions too? What if
we get to the point where we can predict things
like personality traits or even someone's risk for certain diseases.
Speaker 2 (14:19):
That's the science fiction scenario that's starting to feel more
and more real. It makes us think about some fundamental
questions about free will. You know, are we really in
control of our destiny? And what about the possibility of
discrimination based on someone's genes. If we can predict someone's
likelihood of committing a crime based on their DNA what
does that do to our legal system, our ideas about
(14:40):
guilt and innocence. These are big philosophical questions that we're
going to have to face as a society.
Speaker 1 (14:45):
Wow, it's a lot to take in, isn't it. We
started by talking about solving cold cases, and now we're
discussing the very nature of what it means to be human.
But that's the beauty of these deep dyes. They take
us beyond the headlines and force us to confront the
complicated reality of a world that's constantly changing.
Speaker 2 (15:03):
Absolutely, and for our listeners today, I think that's the
most important takeaway. Forensic genealogy is this powerful tool that
can bring justice and closure and help us understand the past,
but it also raises profound ethical and societal questions that
we need to pay attention to as we move forward.
We have to engage in thoughtful debate. We have to
weigh the risks and the benefits, and we have to
(15:25):
make sure this technology is used responsibly and ethically. The
choices we make today are going to have consequences for
a long time to come.
Speaker 1 (15:32):
You said it perfectly, so to our listeners, we leave
you with this. Now that you've gone on this deep
dive into forensic genealogy, how do you feel about it?
What are you hoping for, what are your concerns and
what role do you think you can play in shaping
how this powerful technology is used in the future. This
isn't just a story about science. It's a story about
all of us, about our responsibility to use knowledge wisely
(15:54):
and to protect the rights and freedoms of every single person.
Thanks for coming along on this journey with us until time,
keep those minds open and keep exploring
Welcome back everyone for another deep dive. This time we're
going to be looking at forensic genealogy.
Speaker 2 (00:06):
Ooh exciting.
Speaker 1 (00:07):
Yeah, and we'll be using the Netflix show The Breakthrough
and some related source material kind of as our guide.
So you know, think CSI meets ancestry dot com basically,
I like it. We're talking about DNA testing combined with
traditional genealogy to solve crimes. Yeah, and you know, the
case we're going to be unpacking is not just some
(00:28):
fictional story from TV. It's a real life cold case. Wow,
one of the biggest in Swedish history. It was cracked
wide open thanks to this cutting edge technique, you know.
Speaker 2 (00:39):
And that's what I think makes this case so interesting
is that it really shows the power of this emerging field. Yeah.
Forensic genealogy is not just about technology. It's about you know,
the connection between science, data analysis and just good old
fashioned detective work.
Speaker 1 (00:53):
Yeah, definitely. So just set the scene. We're going to
go back to two thousand and four in link Kepving, Sweden. Okay,
an eight year old old boy, Mohammad A Moury is
walking to school when he's attacked and killed and a
fifty six year old woman Annelina s Fenson witnesses the
attack and she tries to intervene oh no, but tragically
she also becomes a victim. So you can imagine the
(01:14):
terror that must have gripped that community.
Speaker 2 (01:16):
Absolutely, And you know, this case, with its brutality and
just seeming randomness, it really left investigators baffled. Right, they
found DNA evidence at the crime scene, but there was
no match in any existing criminal database.
Speaker 1 (01:29):
Wow.
Speaker 2 (01:30):
So for sixteen years the case went cold, leaving the
families of the victims with you know, so many unanswered questions.
Speaker 1 (01:38):
Talk about a frustrating situation. Right, Yeah, you have the evidence,
but you can't connect it to a suspect exactly. But
then in twenty nineteen, new law in Sweden changed everything.
Law enforcement was finally allowed to use commercial genealogy websites
for investigative purposes. Interesting, and that's where forensic genealogy really
enters the picture.
Speaker 2 (01:57):
And it was a game changer. You know, this legal shift,
Swedish investigators were able to team up with genealogist Peter Schuland,
and together they started combing through these ancestry databases looking
for any DNA matches that could point them toward the killer.
Speaker 1 (02:13):
Wow.
Speaker 2 (02:14):
But you know it wasn't just a simple search. This
involved painstakingly constructing a massive family tree.
Speaker 1 (02:21):
Okay, So how do you even start to build a
family tree from a DNA sample? Right? It sounds like
searching for a needle in a haystack.
Speaker 2 (02:28):
It is incredibly complex, and that's why Sholin's expertise was
so vital.
Speaker 1 (02:32):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (02:32):
They started with the crime scene DNA and used it
to find potential relatives in these databases. Okay. They were
looking specifically for matches on the autosomal DNA, which is
inherited from both parents, right, and then through a process
called genetic triangulation, they could estimate the degree of relatedness.
Speaker 1 (02:51):
So if they found someone who shared let's say twenty
five percent of their DNA with the unknown suspect, yeah,
that would indicate like a grandparent or grandchild relationship exactly.
Speaker 2 (03:03):
And by piecing together these DNA relationships and comparing them
to historical records, you know, birth certificates, marriage licenses, death certificates,
Shuland was able to build a family tree that stretched
back over two centuries. It was like putting together a
giant puzzle, one DNA match at a time.
Speaker 1 (03:21):
That's incredible. So all that work paid off, right, They
found their suspects, they.
Speaker 2 (03:25):
Did, This intricate genealogical web led them straight to Daniel Niquist,
who ultimately confessed to the murders. Wow, and he was
sentenced to indefinite psychiatric care.
Speaker 1 (03:35):
So this case really became a landmark victory for forensic genealogy.
It proved how powerful it could be to solve even
the most baffling cold cases.
Speaker 2 (03:45):
Totally.
Speaker 1 (03:46):
Now, the Netflix show The Breakthrough dramatizes this story, brings
it to life on screen, but like any adaptation, it
takes some creative liberties.
Speaker 2 (03:54):
Right Like, for example, some names and backstories in the
show were altered, probably for privacy reasons or to streamline
the narrative a bit. And then there's a subplot about
investigators breaking data privacy laws to access information, which didn't
actually happen in the real life case. Right.
Speaker 1 (04:10):
So it's important to remember that the show is entertainment first,
but it does get the core elements of the investigation
right Yeah, and it definitely raises some interesting questions about
how much creative license is acceptable when you're portraying a
true story, especially one with such sensitive subject matter. But
we'll dive into all those nuances a little bit later. Okay,
(04:31):
for now, let's get back to the real life's investigation.
Speaker 2 (04:34):
Sounds good.
Speaker 1 (04:35):
You know, this breakthrough in the link up in case
wasn't just about identifying the killer. It was about bringing
closure to the families who had been searching for answers
for almost two decades. And that, to me, is one
of the most powerful aspects of forensic genealogy.
Speaker 2 (04:50):
It's a testament to its potential for sure to bring
justice and healing to families who have suffered the pain
of unsolved crimes. But you know, the link up in
case is the tip of the iceberg. Yeah, forensic genealogy
is now being used to solve a wide range of crimes,
from homicides and sexual assaults to identifying unknown remains, even
cracking historical mysteries.
Speaker 1 (05:12):
Right, It's not limited to just murders, and we'll be
exploring these other applications in more detail later in our
deep dives.
Speaker 2 (05:18):
Looking forward to it, But first, let's.
Speaker 1 (05:20):
Take a closer look at the process itself. You know,
how do they go from a DNA sample to a
family tree spanning centuries? What were the specific techniques and
challenges involved.
Speaker 2 (05:32):
Well, let's start by talking about the different types of
DNA analysis used in forensic genealogy. So we left off
talking about DNA analysis, and there are actually a few
different types used in forensic genealogy. The most common one
is autosomal DNA, which we inherit from both parents, and
this type of DNA is really good for finding relatives
within about five generations.
Speaker 1 (05:52):
So you're essentially casting a wide net looking for anyone
who shares enough DNA to suggest a family connection exactly.
Speaker 2 (05:59):
And once you find those matches, you use a process
called genetic triangulation to sort of narrow down the possibilities.
Let's say you and I both match the unknown suspects DNA.
By comparing our DNA segments and how much we each
share with the suspect, we can figure out if we're
related through a common ancestor on our you know, maternal
or paternal sides. Oh, interesting, that helps zero in on
(06:20):
a specific branch of the family tree.
Speaker 1 (06:23):
So it's like using those overlapping circles on a map
to pinpoint a location.
Speaker 2 (06:27):
Yeah, exactly, that's pretty cool.
Speaker 1 (06:28):
But wouldn't this process get like way more difficult the
further back in time you go.
Speaker 2 (06:32):
Oh. Absolutely. The further you go, the more the DNA
gets diluted through the generations, and those connections get much
harder to find, right, And that's where traditional genealogy comes in.
You need to back up those DNA matches with historical records,
you know, birth, marriage and death certificate, census data, military records,
even old newspaper clippings. It's like detective work on steroids.
Speaker 1 (06:55):
I can imagine the amount of patience and meticulousness it
must take to sift through all that information. Oh yeah,
but isn't that part of what makes forensic genealogy so interesting.
It's like you're solving this historical puzzle using DNA as your.
Speaker 2 (07:09):
Guide, and it's so rewarding to piece together those ancestral stories,
especially when you know it's leading to justice for victims
in their families.
Speaker 1 (07:18):
Yeah, for sure.
Speaker 2 (07:19):
And that brings us to another key aspect of forensic genealogy.
It's potential for solving these cold cases that have just
been sitting there for years, even decades. Right, think about
all the families out there still waiting for answers, still
hoping for closure.
Speaker 1 (07:34):
Yeah, it's heartbreaking to think about those unresolved cases. But
with this technology, there's a new sense of hope. We're
essentially giving law enforcement a brand new tool to revisit
old evidence and re examine leads that maybe they overlooked
or just couldn't pursue before.
Speaker 2 (07:51):
Exactly. Cases that seemed hopeless can suddenly become active again.
And while forensic genealogy doesn't always lead to an immediate arrest,
can offer and provide crucial breakthroughs, you know, narrowing down
the suspect pool or uncovering new evidence that can help
investigators move forward.
Speaker 1 (08:07):
So it's like breathing new life into cold cases, giving
them a fighting chance of being solved.
Speaker 2 (08:11):
That's a great way to put it.
Speaker 1 (08:12):
But let's shift gears a little bit and talk about
another application of forensic genealogy that's really fascinating. Identifying unknown remains. Okay,
this feels like a whole other ballgame, doesn't it.
Speaker 2 (08:23):
It definitely has its own unique challenges. You might be
dealing with skeletal remains, degraded DNA samples, even just a
few bone fragments. Wow, And a lot of times there's
very little information to go on, right. But even in
these cases, forensic genealogy can be incredibly powerful.
Speaker 1 (08:39):
So how does that even work. You can't just plug
a bone fragment into a genealogy website.
Speaker 2 (08:44):
Oh not yet anyway. What you can do is extract
DNA from the remains and analyze it to create a
DNA profile.
Speaker 1 (08:50):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (08:50):
Then, just like in criminal investigations, you compare that profile
to databases like ged match or family Tree DNA, looking
for any relatives who might have submitted their DNA for
genealogical purposes.
Speaker 1 (09:02):
So you're essentially building a family tree from the ground up. Yeah,
starting with that unknown individual and working your way back
through generations, hoping to connect with someone in the present
day who can identify them precisely.
Speaker 2 (09:13):
And these identifications can have a huge impact, not just
for law enforcement, but for families who have lost loved
ones without knowing what happened to them. Imagine being able
to finally give closure to a family whose relative went
missing in war decades ago, or identify a victim of
a natural disaster or a crime that happened years in
the past.
Speaker 1 (09:33):
It's like you're giving a voice to the voiceless, allowing
those who were lost to finally be recognized and remembered.
Speaker 2 (09:40):
Yeah, I like that.
Speaker 1 (09:41):
But it's not just about solving crimes and identifying remains.
Forensic genealogy is also being used to unravel historical mysteries,
and that, to me is where things get really exciting.
Speaker 2 (09:51):
Yeah, it's like opening a time capsule using DNA to
shed light on events from the past. Historians and genealogists
are working together now to solve historical puzzle that have
baffled researchers for generations.
Speaker 1 (10:02):
Wow.
Speaker 2 (10:02):
For example, forensic genealogy was used recently to identify the
remains of victims of the nineteen twenty one Tulsa Race massacre,
a horrific event that was basically erased from historical records.
Speaker 1 (10:12):
That's a chilling example of how this technology can not
only solve crimes but rewrite history bring to light events
that have been suppressed or forgotten. For sure, But as
with any powerful tool, there are some potential downsides to consider.
Of course, Next we'll dig into the ethical considerations surrounding
forensic genealogy. What are the potential risks? What safeguards do
(10:36):
we need to put in place? Yeah, and who gets
to decide how this technology is used?
Speaker 2 (10:40):
These are crucial questions, and they're not easy to answer.
Let's start by looking at the privacy concerns that come
up when you use genetic information this way.
Speaker 1 (10:49):
We've seen how powerful forensic genealogy can be, you know,
solving those cold cases, identifying remains, even shedding light on
historical mysteries. But it does come with some serious ethical questions,
doesn't it.
Speaker 2 (11:02):
Definitely. I mean, we're talking about using people's DNA, often
without their consent, to potentially incriminate them or their relatives.
Speaker 1 (11:09):
Yeah, that's a big deal.
Speaker 2 (11:10):
Is It's a Pandora's box we need to open very
carefully for sure.
Speaker 1 (11:13):
And privacy has got to be one of the biggest concerns.
When you send your DNA to a genealogy website, are
you basically saying it's okay to use it for a
criminal investigation?
Speaker 2 (11:24):
Yeah?
Speaker 1 (11:25):
What don't your family members right, they never agreed to that,
but their genetic information is now part of the equation exactly.
That brings up some really tough legal and ethical questions.
It is a bit unsettling, isn't it. It is you
think you're just tracing your family tree and suddenly you're
caught up in a murder investigation. Yeah, so where do
we draw the line. Should there be stricter regulations on
(11:47):
how law enforcement can access these databases?
Speaker 2 (11:50):
Well, that's the debate that's happening right now. Some people
argue that using ancestry DNA for criminal investigations, even with
good intentions, is a slippery slope. It could lead to
a future where these DNA databases are used for things
we never intended, like employment screening, insurance assessments, even social profiling.
Speaker 1 (12:08):
That's a scary thought, is It's like they say, the
road to hell is paved with good intentions. We start
with a good goal solving violent crimes, but where does
it end and who gets to decide that? Should we
be having a bigger conversation about this as a society.
Should people have the right to say, hey, don't use
my DNA for law enforcement purposes?
Speaker 2 (12:29):
These are really tough questions that policymakers, ethicists, and everyday
people are grappling with. There are no easy answers. On
one hand, you have the chance to bring justice to
victors and their families, but on the other you have
the potential for misuse and the erosion of privacy. Exact
finding that balance is so important.
Speaker 1 (12:47):
It really feels like we're at a crossroads here. We
have this incredible technology that can do so much good,
but we need to be really careful about how we
use it. What are some steps we can take to
reduce those risks while still using the good parts of
forensic genealogy.
Speaker 2 (13:02):
Well, transparency is really key here. People need to know
how their genetic information can be used, and they should
be able to choose to consent or not. We also
need clear legal guidelines and oversight to make sure that
law enforcement agencies aren't abusing their power. And maybe most importantly,
we need to have open and honest conversations about the
(13:23):
ethical side of this technology. And those conversations shouldn't just
involve experts, they should involve the public too.
Speaker 1 (13:29):
That's a great point. This isn't just a science issue.
It's a society issue, and we need to come together
to decide what kind of future we want with this technology.
But let's ship gears for a minute and have some
fun speculating. We've seen how fast DNA technology is moving.
Where do you see forensic genealogy going in the next five, ten,
twenty years.
Speaker 2 (13:46):
Well, we're already seeing advancements in DNA analysis that can
predict physical traits from a DNA sample, things like hair color,
eye color, even facial features. Wow, imagine what that could
mean for identifying suspects or even reconstructing the faces of
historical figures.
Speaker 1 (14:01):
That's mind blowing. We're basically talking about painting a picture
of a person from just a tiny drop of blood
or a strand of hair. But doesn't that open up
a whole new set of ethical questions too? What if
we get to the point where we can predict things
like personality traits or even someone's risk for certain diseases.
Speaker 2 (14:19):
That's the science fiction scenario that's starting to feel more
and more real. It makes us think about some fundamental
questions about free will. You know, are we really in
control of our destiny? And what about the possibility of
discrimination based on someone's genes. If we can predict someone's
likelihood of committing a crime based on their DNA what
does that do to our legal system, our ideas about
(14:40):
guilt and innocence. These are big philosophical questions that we're
going to have to face as a society.
Speaker 1 (14:45):
Wow, it's a lot to take in, isn't it. We
started by talking about solving cold cases, and now we're
discussing the very nature of what it means to be human.
But that's the beauty of these deep dyes. They take
us beyond the headlines and force us to confront the
complicated reality of a world that's constantly changing.
Speaker 2 (15:03):
Absolutely, and for our listeners today, I think that's the
most important takeaway. Forensic genealogy is this powerful tool that
can bring justice and closure and help us understand the past,
but it also raises profound ethical and societal questions that
we need to pay attention to as we move forward.
We have to engage in thoughtful debate. We have to
weigh the risks and the benefits, and we have to
(15:25):
make sure this technology is used responsibly and ethically. The
choices we make today are going to have consequences for
a long time to come.
Speaker 1 (15:32):
You said it perfectly, so to our listeners, we leave
you with this. Now that you've gone on this deep
dive into forensic genealogy, how do you feel about it?
What are you hoping for, what are your concerns and
what role do you think you can play in shaping
how this powerful technology is used in the future. This
isn't just a story about science. It's a story about
all of us, about our responsibility to use knowledge wisely
(15:54):
and to protect the rights and freedoms of every single person.
Thanks for coming along on this journey with us until time,
keep those minds open and keep exploring
Popular Podcasts
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com
Betrayal: Weekly
Betrayal Weekly is back for a brand new season. Every Thursday, Betrayal Weekly shares first-hand accounts of broken trust, shocking deceptions, and the trail of destruction they leave behind. Hosted by Andrea Gunning, this weekly ongoing series digs into real-life stories of betrayal and the aftermath. From stories of double lives to dark discoveries, these are cautionary tales and accounts of resilience against all odds. From the producers of the critically acclaimed Betrayal series, Betrayal Weekly drops new episodes every Thursday. Please join our Substack for additional exclusive content, curated book recommendations and community discussions. Sign up FREE by clicking this link Beyond Betrayal Substack. Join our community dedicated to truth, resilience and healing. Your voice matters! Be a part of our Betrayal journey on Substack. And make sure to check out Seasons 1-4 of Betrayal, along with Betrayal Weekly Season 1.