May 25, 2025 • 19 mins
Welcome to the Mythic Mind Games podcast! In this introductory episode, I discuss how video games might play a positive role in the pursuit of wisdom. In particular, I discuss their position as sub-creation with reference to J.R.R. Tolkien's essay, "On Fairy-Stories."
If you are excited about this show and want to see it continue for a long time to come, I welcome your support at patreon.com/mythicmind.
Watch the video and subscribe to my YouTube channel at https://youtu.be/lYzzMFDus9U
If you are excited about this show and want to see it continue for a long time to come, I welcome your support at patreon.com/mythicmind.
Watch the video and subscribe to my YouTube channel at https://youtu.be/lYzzMFDus9U
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:04):
Hellone. Welcome to the Mythic Mind Games podcast, where we
pursue wisdom on the path between primary and secondary worlds.
I'm doctor Andrew Snyder, and I'm glad that you're here. Hello,
and welcome to the brand new Mythic Mind Games podcast,
and I'm really excited to be joining you today on
(00:24):
this new venture. Now. Odds are if you're listening to
this shortly after it comes out that then you're already
familiar with Mythic Mind. That's probably how you had discovered us. However,
if you are discovering us a new as you listen
to this, then know that this series that we're doing
right now, this show is part of a broader humanities
organization known as the Mythic Mind Fellowship. And you can
(00:46):
check out the main Mythic Mind podcast wherever you get
your podcasts. However you're listening to this right now, or
you can also find some of the episodes on YouTube.
I didn't always consistently post there, but you can at
least find the more recent episodes of run YouTube now.
Mythic Mind has gone in a number of different directions.
The podcast started off with philosophy, as I engage with
(01:06):
some of the material related to my dissertation on the
Danish existentialist philosopher Soaring Kirkey Garden. Now, from there, over
time we've expanded into this broad Mythic Mind Fellowship, which
is made out of patrons of Mythic Mind. As a
record list, we have over fifty patrons, a number of
which are involved in these conversations that we're having in
(01:29):
creating courses, in the content creation of their own independently
as well as in conjunction with Mythic Mind. And so
this just it's a great community, it's a great fellowship,
and if you want to be part of that, check
us out over at patreon dot com slash Mythic Mind,
or you can just check out our content right I mean,
listen to this podcast, listen to the Other Mythic Mind podcast.
(01:50):
You can find a number of our group conversations over there.
Things on Beywolf, on the poetic eeda of the Northern
myths and legends. You can find stuff on Tolkien, on Lewis,
on a number of a number of topics related to
literature philosophy, and right now we're down a book club
on Augustine's Confessions, and so there's a lot going on there,
(02:13):
which is part of why I'm splintering this off instead
of having everything come together into the singular Mythic Mind podcast,
I thought it'd be beneficial to kind of break some
of that out in order to to specialize, right, And
so this is just gonna be devoted to h to
video games and philosophy. And you know, I don't know
(02:33):
that I'll always be the one leading this. In fact,
I hope that eventually, you know, maybe be able to
hand this off or at least maybe partner with somebody
else in the Mythic Mind Fellowship. And from the outset,
you're going to be hearing from a number of our
other patrons, other other members of this fellowship. But for
the rest of today, I really just want to to
bring in an episode from the main Mythic Mind podcast
(02:56):
that deals with this idea of video games as subcreation.
And this is going to get into some of the
driving themes, the ideas that will justify doing a show
like this in looking at video games not just for
entertainment value, but for edification and wisdom, right, Like, is
that it is that valid our video games just a
waste of time? I mean, odds are that you know,
(03:16):
if you're listening to this, you probably don't think that's
the case. But this provides just some of the some
of the philosophical justification for what we're doing in this series,
in this show. And so let me just go ahead
and copy that right on over. Now, there's no video
for that one if you're watching this on YouTube, but
moving forward, there will typically be video for these episodes,
(03:37):
and so you're welcome to watch on YouTube, welcome to
listen through your preferred podcast app. But for now, let's
go ahead and get into this. With video games as subcreation,
I wouldn't call myself a gamer, at least not these days.
Between my responsibilities as a husband and a father, as
well as my lesser roles, the time simply has not
(03:58):
been there for quite a while, not necessarily a bad thing. Furthermore,
making up for an over engagement with video games in
my youth, I had long become convinced that they were,
at least for the most part, a waste of time. However,
as I advanced further into my literary renaissance of the
last few years, which has got me thinking about questions
regarding what is art, what is enchantment, what is beauty.
(04:23):
I'm starting to reconsider this prejudice that I've had toward
video games based off an over indulgence of my youth.
So our games, are they indeed an unhealthy escape from
responsibility and real world achievements, And obviously that argument can
be made, or might video games serve some kind of
real world benefit? And I'm still working through this question
(04:46):
and even exactly how to articulate that question properly, but
I'm definitely moving toward the latter possibility that there is
some potential value here. Now. As a kid, video games
were ubiquitous in my life. I can't remember a time
before the es and the snees were set up, or
or before the game Boy was a hallmark of long drives.
And yes I'm talking about the original clunky gray game Boy.
(05:09):
I mean equipped with the handy boy of course, to
add to the sound, add to the light dynamic, and
so I really had that maxed out. And then I
remember being taken in by the quote realistic graphics of
the Nintendo sixty four and the PlayStation two. And then
eventually I moved into primarily PC gaming, and I would
regularly ask for a new graphics card for Christmas, and
(05:31):
so that's really my thing for a while. And the
reality is that I just played video games far too
much in my youth, and I now regret that I
didn't spend more of that time reading books. I regret
that I only really discovered the value of reading relatively recently,
all things considered, within the last several years, while waxing
and waning with other responsibilities. This practice, this regular engagement
(05:52):
with video games continued largely through my young adulthood until
I was married, at which point I started to play
considerably less. Then, once the twins were born, the gaming
time became nearly non existent. A significant cause for this
was mere necessity, as I saw to fulfill the greater
desire of providing for and spending time with my family.
(06:12):
And you know, part of that meant that I had
to work a lot. It's important to me that my
wife is able to fulfill her desire to be home
full time with the kids. It's important to me that
you know my kids that yeah, we're not extravagantly wealthy,
but I want them to be comfortable. That's important to me,
and so I work a lot, and I also spend
a lot of time with them. Which means I'm working
(06:35):
odd hours sometimes to make that happen, which means there's
not a whole lot of time for things like video games. However,
as I continue to consider questions about the nature of
enchantment and the power of wonder, I'm starting to conclude that,
you know, properly ordered within life's demands, there can be
some good in playing games. Now, it's not an overstatement
(06:58):
to say that my life is changed by reading Tolkien,
not being an active reader in my youth. As I mentioned,
I discovered Tolkien later in life, just a few years
before writing this article. I was, of course familiar with
Tolkien inspired media such as the Jackson films and various games,
but I'm still fairly new to actually reading Tolkien's own
(07:19):
words new as in, you know, I just picked up
The Fellowship really a few years ago, and from the
moment that I opened The Fellowship, I knew that I
was engaging with something real, although I didn't get have
the categories for articulating what that meant. But it didn't
take me long for me to finish Lower the Rings.
I went through that pretty quickly, and then I moved
on to Tolkien's other works, including on fairy Stories, in
(07:43):
which he describes fantasy as subcreation, rather than merely being
made up. We make in the image of and with
the materials made by the one in whose image we
are made. Good fiction, therefore, is dealing with things that
are dealing in the domain of truth. That's what good
fiction does. And this was a very important corrective to
(08:05):
a misunderstanding that I had growing up, and that honestly
most people today have. Se I once thought that if
I wanted to learn something, if I wanted to know
something true, then I would have to turn to nonfiction,
because nonfiction deals with truth and fiction is made up right,
and this is typically how these two categories of literature
are divided. One's true, one's made up. Well, this is
(08:27):
certainly what I thought for a number of years, although
even before picking up Tolkien, I was already starting to
spend some time with fairy tales and with folklore, and
I was starting to recognize that there is some hidden
wisdom there, there is truth to be found there, and
so my appreciation for good, so called made up stories
was beginning to grow. But Tolkien helped me to understand
that good fiction is not made up at all, but
(08:49):
it's rather a secondary creation. That is true, and as
much as it relates to the way that things are
on a metaphysical level. Of course, we don't believe that
there are such things as orcs and elves and dwarfs
in the same way, at least that they are portrayed
in Tolkien's text. However, there is something fundamentally true about
the character of the story, the fibers of his world,
(09:10):
and the interaction to the peoples that are involved, which
is why one can read the Lord of the Rings
as an act of Christian discipleship as much as anything else.
When we escape in the right way and into the
right substance, we are not merely running away from the
primary world, but we are rather escaping to a place
of value that we might recover something of that value
(09:31):
and bring it back into the primary world, although of
course we can get lost along the way, because for
better or worse, no one leaves the perilous realm unchanged,
because it is there that we come to terms with
ourselves and decide what that relationship looks like. Again, in
un Fairy Stories, Tolkien clarifies that it is not the
denizens of fairy that are supernatural as they're actually hypernatural,
(09:54):
but that it is we, with our transcendent souls, that
are supernatural, the perilous realm. It brings us not to
heaven or to hell, Tolkien tells us, but to the
road that we must walk. It's where our destination is determined.
It's where our direction is set. It may be the
path to salvation or damnation. Hence the differing impacts of
(10:15):
Galadriel on Borimir and the other members of the party,
that everyone becomes really more solidified in the direction that
they are going. So this is where our relationship with truth,
for better or worse, becomes solidified. It's where we can
be gained or where we can be lost. And so
Tolkien provides us with a framework for relating to truth
even in worlds that are not found in history. And
(10:37):
this is immediately relevant for our primary topic in dealing
with how we might engage with video games, and in
pointing out that this is a place where we can
gain something or it's a place where we can lose something,
even ourselves. Now Again, in the same essay, Tolkien also
discusses why literature is a superior medium for fantasy compared
to cinema and I think that this is going to
give us some useful principles as well. In a movie,
(11:00):
he tells us, the audience is given the full story,
including plot, visuals, music, etc. There's no room for the
viewer to get involved in the process of subcreation. A book, however,
does provide this room. When you read a book, assuming
you've not first seen a cinematic adaptation of the book,
you fashion so much of the story in your own
head based on your background other books you've read, the
(11:23):
thoughts floating around in your conscious and unconscious mental spaces,
and everything else that you bring with you to the text.
You cast the characters and decide exactly what the text
looks like, what it sounds like, what it feels like.
So we could all read the same story but have
different mental adaptations as we contribute to the story through
our own process of subcreation alongside the primary author with
(11:46):
what they give us. Now, it seems to me that
much the same could be said regarding video games, whether
we're talking about a story driven role playing game or
something more in the sandbox arena, there is space for
the player to decide who they are are, what their
background and motivations entail, and what kind of impact they
will have on the world, and whatever else may be
(12:07):
relevant to that particular game. All of this brings us
into the act of subcreation, which can be a great
aid in helping us to become more enchanted in our
primary world experience. Of course, it should be noted that
the potential of the reader's subcreation is directly related to
the materials that they are provided in the text, and
the same could be said of video games. Sometimes the
(12:27):
material is so corrupted that one who engages with it
is far more likely to be destructive first and foremost
to their own selves than creative in a positive direction.
Some books are just bad. Some games are just bad.
They're very unlikely to move us in the direction of
being more integrated selves, situated to bear primary world responsibilities
(12:50):
and to accomplish worthwhile things. Maybe the philosophy at hand
is particularly heinous, or maybe the nature of the material
is so tedious and addictive it is simply amusing, which
is literally to not be amusing that we're likely to
throw away time with very little hope of gaining something
back in return. Now, sometimes, and probably most of the time,
(13:11):
the fault is not so much with the material, even
if that might be there, but the primary fault is
actually with the person who's engaging with it. As with
every vice, it's easy to prioritize whatever lesser good that
may come from games over the greater goods that are
before us. However, that many and that you and I
can go wrong with games does not mean that games
(13:32):
themselves are an evil. It has been said, do not
suppose that abuses are eliminated by destroying the object which
is abused. Men can go wrong with wine and women,
shall we then prohibit and abolish women? Now, as far
as I can tell, this is an apocryphal quotation attributed
to Martin Luther, but the principle certainly holds up even
if the citation does not. That we can go wrong
(13:53):
with video games does not mean that video games are
of necessity wrong. There is a way I believe to
go right with games, instead of letting them pull you
into the abyss of empty amusement. They can be tethered
to virtue, to truth, and too beauty, and in turn
they can become points of connection between you and goodness. Furthermore,
games can become touch points with our culture and with
(14:15):
ourselves for dealing with significant topics that apply to primary life.
As with most mediums, you're likely to find what you
are seeking. If your desire is rightly ordered, you will
find another step on the upward journey. If your desire
is wrongly ordered, you will slip further toward the abyss.
Discernment rarely involves in all or nothing mentality. It instead
(14:35):
involves having honest conversations with yourself and with others. If
you are honest with yourself, then in your heart you
generally know when something is upbuilding and when it's not.
If you authentically seek the good, you will surely find it,
as seeking the good is evidence that you have already
found it in some measure. For more on this topic,
you can go back and listen to episode seventy eight
(14:57):
of Mythic Mind when I talk with Master Samwise and
Josh Trailer about this topic in a more extended fashion.
All right, thank you for listening. Next time, we'll be
getting into the second nights of the Old Republic game.
We just covered the first game over on the main
Mythic Mind podcast, and that's really our launching point over here,
(15:18):
and so next time we'll be talking about Coetar two
and hopefully if all goes according to plan, that's already available,
and so you can go ahead and check that out. Now.
If you did enjoy this and you want me to
keep doing this series, right, if this seems like something
that you're excited about, then I strongly welcome you to
I mean very at least just let me know, right
they send me a message, contact me on X send
(15:41):
me an email over at Mythic Mind podcast at gmail
dot com, talk to me on Discord or Patreon if
you're there, you know, just let me know that this
is something you're interested in. But also it really would
help me is if you're not already a patron of
Mythic Mind, then go over to patreon dot com slash
mythic Mind and let me know if I mean a
few dollars or more than a few dollars, you know,
(16:01):
whatever it is that you can afford. Every little bit helps,
and also every little bit counts as a vote that
this is something that you're interested in and that's going
to go a long way in like showing me this
is somewhere that I should invest my time and energy
in making it a long lasting venture that's profitable for
the both of us and so again, Patroon dot com
slash Mythic Mind, become part of our fellowship, whether you
(16:21):
are actively involved in these conversations and content creation, or
you just want to be a silent supporter of what
we are doing. But that's a for now. I really
look forward to where we're going with this show. I
look forward to the next episode, as we discussed the
second Nights of the Old Republic. But that's a for
now until next time, God Speeding. I have always, at
(16:58):
least ever since I can remember, had a kind of
longing for death. It was when I was happiest that
I longed most. It was on happy days when we
were up in the hills, the three of us, with
the wind and the sunshine, where you couldn't see Gloam
or the palace. Do you remember the color and the
smell in looking across at the gray mountain in the distance,
And because it was so beautiful, it set me longing,
(17:21):
always longing somewhere else, there must be more of it.
Everything seemed to be saying, Psyche, come, but I couldn't come,
and I didn't know where I was to come to.
It almost hurt me. I felt like a bird in
a cage when the other birds of its kind are
flying home. And now I will make answer to you, o,
my judges, and show that he who has lived as
(17:44):
a true philosopher has reason to be of good cheer
when he was about to die, and that after death
he may hope to receive the greatest good in the
other world. For I deem that the true disciple of
philosophy is likely to be misunderstood by other men. They
do not perceive that he is ever pursuing death and dying.
And if this is true, why, having had the desire
of death all his life long, should he regret the
(18:05):
arrival of that which he has always been pursuing and desiring.
The longing of Plato and the control of the Stoics
pervades Lewis's retelling of the Cupid and psyche Myth until
we have faces with this incredible novel, which he believed
to be his best. Lewis demonstrates the tensions and ancient thought,
and even more significantly, the limits of rational philosophy, which
(18:28):
can only go as deep as the foxes can dig.
Beyond that, Under that and providing the life of that thought,
we find the dark and holy places that blind our
faculties of reason, What then shall we do? This is
a topic that we will explore after first surveying some
important philosophical contributions in the ancient world that have had
(18:48):
some significant bearing on Lewis's great novel. To this end,
we will begin with Plato's Fato, which discusses the immortality
of the soul and what those who love wisdom might
expect in the life to come. And then we'll spend
four weeks with some of the great stoics, including Epictetus, Emperor, Marcus, Aurelius,
and Seneca. Finally, we will turn our attention to till
(19:09):
we have faces for the final two weeks with original content,
and so this will not be the same as what
you may have seen in the fiction and philosophy of CS.
Lewis course. Each week of this eight week study will
include readings from primary sources that will be provided as PDFs,
although these are all texts that belong in your personal library.
You'll be provided with recommendations for secondary readings. You'll have
(19:29):
recorded presentations for you to watch at your leisure, ongoing
discord chats, and weekly live meetings to discuss the readings
enrolled today. By going to patreon dot com slash Mythic
Mind and checking out the job. Or you can gain
access to all courses, past, present, and future this year
by purchasing a Tier three annual subscription. I hope to
see you there,
Hellone. Welcome to the Mythic Mind Games podcast, where we
pursue wisdom on the path between primary and secondary worlds.
I'm doctor Andrew Snyder, and I'm glad that you're here. Hello,
and welcome to the brand new Mythic Mind Games podcast,
and I'm really excited to be joining you today on
(00:24):
this new venture. Now. Odds are if you're listening to
this shortly after it comes out that then you're already
familiar with Mythic Mind. That's probably how you had discovered us. However,
if you are discovering us a new as you listen
to this, then know that this series that we're doing
right now, this show is part of a broader humanities
organization known as the Mythic Mind Fellowship. And you can
(00:46):
check out the main Mythic Mind podcast wherever you get
your podcasts. However you're listening to this right now, or
you can also find some of the episodes on YouTube.
I didn't always consistently post there, but you can at
least find the more recent episodes of run YouTube now.
Mythic Mind has gone in a number of different directions.
The podcast started off with philosophy, as I engage with
(01:06):
some of the material related to my dissertation on the
Danish existentialist philosopher Soaring Kirkey Garden. Now, from there, over
time we've expanded into this broad Mythic Mind Fellowship, which
is made out of patrons of Mythic Mind. As a
record list, we have over fifty patrons, a number of
which are involved in these conversations that we're having in
(01:29):
creating courses, in the content creation of their own independently
as well as in conjunction with Mythic Mind. And so
this just it's a great community, it's a great fellowship,
and if you want to be part of that, check
us out over at patreon dot com slash Mythic Mind,
or you can just check out our content right I mean,
listen to this podcast, listen to the Other Mythic Mind podcast.
(01:50):
You can find a number of our group conversations over there.
Things on Beywolf, on the poetic eeda of the Northern
myths and legends. You can find stuff on Tolkien, on Lewis,
on a number of a number of topics related to
literature philosophy, and right now we're down a book club
on Augustine's Confessions, and so there's a lot going on there,
(02:13):
which is part of why I'm splintering this off instead
of having everything come together into the singular Mythic Mind podcast,
I thought it'd be beneficial to kind of break some
of that out in order to to specialize, right, And
so this is just gonna be devoted to h to
video games and philosophy. And you know, I don't know
(02:33):
that I'll always be the one leading this. In fact,
I hope that eventually, you know, maybe be able to
hand this off or at least maybe partner with somebody
else in the Mythic Mind Fellowship. And from the outset,
you're going to be hearing from a number of our
other patrons, other other members of this fellowship. But for
the rest of today, I really just want to to
bring in an episode from the main Mythic Mind podcast
(02:56):
that deals with this idea of video games as subcreation.
And this is going to get into some of the
driving themes, the ideas that will justify doing a show
like this in looking at video games not just for
entertainment value, but for edification and wisdom, right, Like, is
that it is that valid our video games just a
waste of time? I mean, odds are that you know,
(03:16):
if you're listening to this, you probably don't think that's
the case. But this provides just some of the some
of the philosophical justification for what we're doing in this series,
in this show. And so let me just go ahead
and copy that right on over. Now, there's no video
for that one if you're watching this on YouTube, but
moving forward, there will typically be video for these episodes,
(03:37):
and so you're welcome to watch on YouTube, welcome to
listen through your preferred podcast app. But for now, let's
go ahead and get into this. With video games as subcreation,
I wouldn't call myself a gamer, at least not these days.
Between my responsibilities as a husband and a father, as
well as my lesser roles, the time simply has not
(03:58):
been there for quite a while, not necessarily a bad thing. Furthermore,
making up for an over engagement with video games in
my youth, I had long become convinced that they were,
at least for the most part, a waste of time. However,
as I advanced further into my literary renaissance of the
last few years, which has got me thinking about questions
regarding what is art, what is enchantment, what is beauty.
(04:23):
I'm starting to reconsider this prejudice that I've had toward
video games based off an over indulgence of my youth.
So our games, are they indeed an unhealthy escape from
responsibility and real world achievements, And obviously that argument can
be made, or might video games serve some kind of
real world benefit? And I'm still working through this question
(04:46):
and even exactly how to articulate that question properly, but
I'm definitely moving toward the latter possibility that there is
some potential value here. Now. As a kid, video games
were ubiquitous in my life. I can't remember a time
before the es and the snees were set up, or
or before the game Boy was a hallmark of long drives.
And yes I'm talking about the original clunky gray game Boy.
(05:09):
I mean equipped with the handy boy of course, to
add to the sound, add to the light dynamic, and
so I really had that maxed out. And then I
remember being taken in by the quote realistic graphics of
the Nintendo sixty four and the PlayStation two. And then
eventually I moved into primarily PC gaming, and I would
regularly ask for a new graphics card for Christmas, and
(05:31):
so that's really my thing for a while. And the
reality is that I just played video games far too
much in my youth, and I now regret that I
didn't spend more of that time reading books. I regret
that I only really discovered the value of reading relatively recently,
all things considered, within the last several years, while waxing
and waning with other responsibilities. This practice, this regular engagement
(05:52):
with video games continued largely through my young adulthood until
I was married, at which point I started to play
considerably less. Then, once the twins were born, the gaming
time became nearly non existent. A significant cause for this
was mere necessity, as I saw to fulfill the greater
desire of providing for and spending time with my family.
(06:12):
And you know, part of that meant that I had
to work a lot. It's important to me that my
wife is able to fulfill her desire to be home
full time with the kids. It's important to me that
you know my kids that yeah, we're not extravagantly wealthy,
but I want them to be comfortable. That's important to me,
and so I work a lot, and I also spend
a lot of time with them. Which means I'm working
(06:35):
odd hours sometimes to make that happen, which means there's
not a whole lot of time for things like video games. However,
as I continue to consider questions about the nature of
enchantment and the power of wonder, I'm starting to conclude that,
you know, properly ordered within life's demands, there can be
some good in playing games. Now, it's not an overstatement
(06:58):
to say that my life is changed by reading Tolkien,
not being an active reader in my youth. As I mentioned,
I discovered Tolkien later in life, just a few years
before writing this article. I was, of course familiar with
Tolkien inspired media such as the Jackson films and various games,
but I'm still fairly new to actually reading Tolkien's own
(07:19):
words new as in, you know, I just picked up
The Fellowship really a few years ago, and from the
moment that I opened The Fellowship, I knew that I
was engaging with something real, although I didn't get have
the categories for articulating what that meant. But it didn't
take me long for me to finish Lower the Rings.
I went through that pretty quickly, and then I moved
on to Tolkien's other works, including on fairy Stories, in
(07:43):
which he describes fantasy as subcreation, rather than merely being
made up. We make in the image of and with
the materials made by the one in whose image we
are made. Good fiction, therefore, is dealing with things that
are dealing in the domain of truth. That's what good
fiction does. And this was a very important corrective to
(08:05):
a misunderstanding that I had growing up, and that honestly
most people today have. Se I once thought that if
I wanted to learn something, if I wanted to know
something true, then I would have to turn to nonfiction,
because nonfiction deals with truth and fiction is made up right,
and this is typically how these two categories of literature
are divided. One's true, one's made up. Well, this is
(08:27):
certainly what I thought for a number of years, although
even before picking up Tolkien, I was already starting to
spend some time with fairy tales and with folklore, and
I was starting to recognize that there is some hidden
wisdom there, there is truth to be found there, and
so my appreciation for good, so called made up stories
was beginning to grow. But Tolkien helped me to understand
that good fiction is not made up at all, but
(08:49):
it's rather a secondary creation. That is true, and as
much as it relates to the way that things are
on a metaphysical level. Of course, we don't believe that
there are such things as orcs and elves and dwarfs
in the same way, at least that they are portrayed
in Tolkien's text. However, there is something fundamentally true about
the character of the story, the fibers of his world,
(09:10):
and the interaction to the peoples that are involved, which
is why one can read the Lord of the Rings
as an act of Christian discipleship as much as anything else.
When we escape in the right way and into the
right substance, we are not merely running away from the
primary world, but we are rather escaping to a place
of value that we might recover something of that value
(09:31):
and bring it back into the primary world, although of
course we can get lost along the way, because for
better or worse, no one leaves the perilous realm unchanged,
because it is there that we come to terms with
ourselves and decide what that relationship looks like. Again, in
un Fairy Stories, Tolkien clarifies that it is not the
denizens of fairy that are supernatural as they're actually hypernatural,
(09:54):
but that it is we, with our transcendent souls, that
are supernatural, the perilous realm. It brings us not to
heaven or to hell, Tolkien tells us, but to the
road that we must walk. It's where our destination is determined.
It's where our direction is set. It may be the
path to salvation or damnation. Hence the differing impacts of
(10:15):
Galadriel on Borimir and the other members of the party,
that everyone becomes really more solidified in the direction that
they are going. So this is where our relationship with truth,
for better or worse, becomes solidified. It's where we can
be gained or where we can be lost. And so
Tolkien provides us with a framework for relating to truth
even in worlds that are not found in history. And
(10:37):
this is immediately relevant for our primary topic in dealing
with how we might engage with video games, and in
pointing out that this is a place where we can
gain something or it's a place where we can lose something,
even ourselves. Now Again, in the same essay, Tolkien also
discusses why literature is a superior medium for fantasy compared
to cinema and I think that this is going to
give us some useful principles as well. In a movie,
(11:00):
he tells us, the audience is given the full story,
including plot, visuals, music, etc. There's no room for the
viewer to get involved in the process of subcreation. A book, however,
does provide this room. When you read a book, assuming
you've not first seen a cinematic adaptation of the book,
you fashion so much of the story in your own
head based on your background other books you've read, the
(11:23):
thoughts floating around in your conscious and unconscious mental spaces,
and everything else that you bring with you to the text.
You cast the characters and decide exactly what the text
looks like, what it sounds like, what it feels like.
So we could all read the same story but have
different mental adaptations as we contribute to the story through
our own process of subcreation alongside the primary author with
(11:46):
what they give us. Now, it seems to me that
much the same could be said regarding video games, whether
we're talking about a story driven role playing game or
something more in the sandbox arena, there is space for
the player to decide who they are are, what their
background and motivations entail, and what kind of impact they
will have on the world, and whatever else may be
(12:07):
relevant to that particular game. All of this brings us
into the act of subcreation, which can be a great
aid in helping us to become more enchanted in our
primary world experience. Of course, it should be noted that
the potential of the reader's subcreation is directly related to
the materials that they are provided in the text, and
the same could be said of video games. Sometimes the
(12:27):
material is so corrupted that one who engages with it
is far more likely to be destructive first and foremost
to their own selves than creative in a positive direction.
Some books are just bad. Some games are just bad.
They're very unlikely to move us in the direction of
being more integrated selves, situated to bear primary world responsibilities
(12:50):
and to accomplish worthwhile things. Maybe the philosophy at hand
is particularly heinous, or maybe the nature of the material
is so tedious and addictive it is simply amusing, which
is literally to not be amusing that we're likely to
throw away time with very little hope of gaining something
back in return. Now, sometimes, and probably most of the time,
(13:11):
the fault is not so much with the material, even
if that might be there, but the primary fault is
actually with the person who's engaging with it. As with
every vice, it's easy to prioritize whatever lesser good that
may come from games over the greater goods that are
before us. However, that many and that you and I
can go wrong with games does not mean that games
(13:32):
themselves are an evil. It has been said, do not
suppose that abuses are eliminated by destroying the object which
is abused. Men can go wrong with wine and women,
shall we then prohibit and abolish women? Now, as far
as I can tell, this is an apocryphal quotation attributed
to Martin Luther, but the principle certainly holds up even
if the citation does not. That we can go wrong
(13:53):
with video games does not mean that video games are
of necessity wrong. There is a way I believe to
go right with games, instead of letting them pull you
into the abyss of empty amusement. They can be tethered
to virtue, to truth, and too beauty, and in turn
they can become points of connection between you and goodness. Furthermore,
games can become touch points with our culture and with
(14:15):
ourselves for dealing with significant topics that apply to primary life.
As with most mediums, you're likely to find what you
are seeking. If your desire is rightly ordered, you will
find another step on the upward journey. If your desire
is wrongly ordered, you will slip further toward the abyss.
Discernment rarely involves in all or nothing mentality. It instead
(14:35):
involves having honest conversations with yourself and with others. If
you are honest with yourself, then in your heart you
generally know when something is upbuilding and when it's not.
If you authentically seek the good, you will surely find it,
as seeking the good is evidence that you have already
found it in some measure. For more on this topic,
you can go back and listen to episode seventy eight
(14:57):
of Mythic Mind when I talk with Master Samwise and
Josh Trailer about this topic in a more extended fashion.
All right, thank you for listening. Next time, we'll be
getting into the second nights of the Old Republic game.
We just covered the first game over on the main
Mythic Mind podcast, and that's really our launching point over here,
(15:18):
and so next time we'll be talking about Coetar two
and hopefully if all goes according to plan, that's already available,
and so you can go ahead and check that out. Now.
If you did enjoy this and you want me to
keep doing this series, right, if this seems like something
that you're excited about, then I strongly welcome you to
I mean very at least just let me know, right
they send me a message, contact me on X send
(15:41):
me an email over at Mythic Mind podcast at gmail
dot com, talk to me on Discord or Patreon if
you're there, you know, just let me know that this
is something you're interested in. But also it really would
help me is if you're not already a patron of
Mythic Mind, then go over to patreon dot com slash
mythic Mind and let me know if I mean a
few dollars or more than a few dollars, you know,
(16:01):
whatever it is that you can afford. Every little bit helps,
and also every little bit counts as a vote that
this is something that you're interested in and that's going
to go a long way in like showing me this
is somewhere that I should invest my time and energy
in making it a long lasting venture that's profitable for
the both of us and so again, Patroon dot com
slash Mythic Mind, become part of our fellowship, whether you
(16:21):
are actively involved in these conversations and content creation, or
you just want to be a silent supporter of what
we are doing. But that's a for now. I really
look forward to where we're going with this show. I
look forward to the next episode, as we discussed the
second Nights of the Old Republic. But that's a for
now until next time, God Speeding. I have always, at
(16:58):
least ever since I can remember, had a kind of
longing for death. It was when I was happiest that
I longed most. It was on happy days when we
were up in the hills, the three of us, with
the wind and the sunshine, where you couldn't see Gloam
or the palace. Do you remember the color and the
smell in looking across at the gray mountain in the distance,
And because it was so beautiful, it set me longing,
(17:21):
always longing somewhere else, there must be more of it.
Everything seemed to be saying, Psyche, come, but I couldn't come,
and I didn't know where I was to come to.
It almost hurt me. I felt like a bird in
a cage when the other birds of its kind are
flying home. And now I will make answer to you, o,
my judges, and show that he who has lived as
(17:44):
a true philosopher has reason to be of good cheer
when he was about to die, and that after death
he may hope to receive the greatest good in the
other world. For I deem that the true disciple of
philosophy is likely to be misunderstood by other men. They
do not perceive that he is ever pursuing death and dying.
And if this is true, why, having had the desire
of death all his life long, should he regret the
(18:05):
arrival of that which he has always been pursuing and desiring.
The longing of Plato and the control of the Stoics
pervades Lewis's retelling of the Cupid and psyche Myth until
we have faces with this incredible novel, which he believed
to be his best. Lewis demonstrates the tensions and ancient thought,
and even more significantly, the limits of rational philosophy, which
(18:28):
can only go as deep as the foxes can dig.
Beyond that, Under that and providing the life of that thought,
we find the dark and holy places that blind our
faculties of reason, What then shall we do? This is
a topic that we will explore after first surveying some
important philosophical contributions in the ancient world that have had
(18:48):
some significant bearing on Lewis's great novel. To this end,
we will begin with Plato's Fato, which discusses the immortality
of the soul and what those who love wisdom might
expect in the life to come. And then we'll spend
four weeks with some of the great stoics, including Epictetus, Emperor, Marcus, Aurelius,
and Seneca. Finally, we will turn our attention to till
(19:09):
we have faces for the final two weeks with original content,
and so this will not be the same as what
you may have seen in the fiction and philosophy of CS.
Lewis course. Each week of this eight week study will
include readings from primary sources that will be provided as PDFs,
although these are all texts that belong in your personal library.
You'll be provided with recommendations for secondary readings. You'll have
(19:29):
recorded presentations for you to watch at your leisure, ongoing
discord chats, and weekly live meetings to discuss the readings
enrolled today. By going to patreon dot com slash Mythic
Mind and checking out the job. Or you can gain
access to all courses, past, present, and future this year
by purchasing a Tier three annual subscription. I hope to
see you there,
Popular Podcasts
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com
New Heights with Jason & Travis Kelce
Football’s funniest family duo — Jason Kelce of the Philadelphia Eagles and Travis Kelce of the Kansas City Chiefs — team up to provide next-level access to life in the league as it unfolds. The two brothers and Super Bowl champions drop weekly insights about the weekly slate of games and share their INSIDE perspectives on trending NFL news and sports headlines. They also endlessly rag on each other as brothers do, chat the latest in pop culture and welcome some very popular and well-known friends to chat with them. Check out new episodes every Wednesday. Follow New Heights on the Wondery App, YouTube or wherever you get your podcasts. You can listen to new episodes early and ad-free, and get exclusive content on Wondery+. Join Wondery+ in the Wondery App, Apple Podcasts or Spotify. And join our new membership for a unique fan experience by going to the New Heights YouTube channel now!