Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Welcome to the deep Dive. Today, we're looking at a
huge time sensitive shift in the status of one of
the NFL's biggest stars, Cincinnati Bengals quarterback Joe Burrow.
Speaker 2 (00:08):
Yeah, we're digging into that ESPN report from November twentieth,
and we're trying to figure out if his return from
that turf toe injury is a lot closer than anyone.
Speaker 1 (00:18):
Thought that injury he got way back in week two.
And the mission today is really to deconstruct what's going on,
because the official story and what's happening on the field
seemed to be two very different things.
Speaker 2 (00:29):
That's the core of it, right, It's a classic case
of what the organization says versus what it actually does.
For weeks, we've heard Thanksgiving was the target, cautious conservative.
But this new information, the practice reports, it all suggests
they're pushing hard for return. Maybe even this Sunday. It
really feels like the team is screaming, we need you
back now.
Speaker 1 (00:50):
And before we get into the practice details, let's just
quickly frame why this injury turf toe is such a
big deal because it sounds minor, but for a quarterback,
it's not at all.
Speaker 2 (01:00):
It's crucial to understand. Turf toe is a sprain in
the big toe joint. And for a QB throwing isn't
just your arm, it's your whole body. It starts from
the ground up.
Speaker 1 (01:10):
You need to push off that foot exactly.
Speaker 2 (01:13):
That big toe is where you generate all your force,
your drive, especially on deep balls. If you can't push
off properly, you lose velocity, you lose accuracy. It's a disaster.
Speaker 1 (01:23):
Okay, So the report says he's a full participant in
practice for the second day in a row. That one
phrase seems to be the trigger for this whole conversation.
Speaker 2 (01:32):
That is the phrase. It sounds so you know, clinical
and dry, but it is loaded with meaning. It's the
team showing its hand.
Speaker 1 (01:39):
So what does full participant actually mean in this context?
Because he's still on injured reserves?
Speaker 2 (01:44):
Right, So when a player is on IR, you have
to open a twenty one day practice window before you
can activate him for Burrow. That window opened back on
November tenth. Okay, Wednesday was the very first day he
was listed as a full participant. So Thursday, that second
day row, that's the confirmation. It shows it wasn't a
one off. It shows he can handle the load.
Speaker 1 (02:04):
But I guess I have to ask, isn't that just
the box they have to check, you know, a bureaucratic
step to even be eligible. How do we know this
isn't just paperwork.
Speaker 2 (02:14):
That's a fair challenge. But it's the level of participation
that tells the story. We're not talking about him just
jogging on the side. We're talking about Thursday practice, and
in the NFL, Thursday is the big one. It's the
most extensive, most physically demanding practice of the week.
Speaker 1 (02:29):
And the report says he took what of the reps
one hundred.
Speaker 2 (02:33):
Percent all of them. That's not a player being eased
back in. That's the workload of a QB one who
is starting on Sunday period.
Speaker 1 (02:41):
One hundred percent is yeah, wow, I mean at three
seven that feels like a calculated risk. They're saying the
risk of another loss is greater than the risk of
re injury.
Speaker 2 (02:50):
Absolutely, And we have visual evidence of what he was
doing in those reps. During the part of practice opens
to the media, he's taking snaps from his starting center
Ted Carris.
Speaker 1 (02:59):
So they're working on the mechanics, the ball exchange, the footwork.
Speaker 2 (03:04):
And another subtle tell when they went to position drolls.
He was the first quarterback throwing, not the backup, not
anyone else. He was leading the rotation, he was setting
the pace.
Speaker 1 (03:15):
The team is physically putting him back in the QB
one slot before they've even announced it.
Speaker 2 (03:20):
That's it. It's organizational body language.
Speaker 1 (03:22):
Okay. So if the reps and the drills are the
hard data, we need to talk about the emotional side
of this, and that comes from his teammates, specifically wide
receiver t Higgins.
Speaker 2 (03:33):
Right, this is where it gets really interesting because Higgins
isn't reading from a coach's script. He's just ah, he's talking,
and his assessment was, you know, glowing.
Speaker 1 (03:42):
What did he say exactly?
Speaker 2 (03:43):
He said, Burrow has been and this is a quote,
looking outstanding man. Then he added, he's slinging at deep
short routes. Everything's been pretty good.
Speaker 1 (03:51):
Slinging. It is a strong choice of words. It implies confidence, velocity,
it does.
Speaker 2 (03:56):
And he didn't stop there. He went on to say
that Burrow looks just as good as he did at
the start of the season, and get this, that he
personally believes Burrow is now at one hundred percent.
Speaker 1 (04:06):
From a guy catching his passes. That one hundred percent
claim is that's almost more valuable than a doctor's report.
It's a field report. It means a ball is coming
out right.
Speaker 2 (04:16):
It's the ultimate vote of confidence. But the best part,
the detail that really brings this to life is this
little nonverbal thing. Higgins mentioned the smirk, the smirk. He
said Burrow gave him this side eyed stare with a
slight smirk, and Higgins read that as a good sign.
Speaker 1 (04:34):
That's amazing. It's like a secret message between them. You know,
it's Burrow saying yeah, I'm back, completely bypassing the official
team channels.
Speaker 2 (04:41):
It totally is. It's the player communicating his status directly
to his offense. And it brings us right back to
that core conflict what the team is doing versus what
the coach is saying.
Speaker 1 (04:51):
Let's talk about the coach, Zach Taylor, because his comments
are the complete opposite of what Heiggins is saying.
Speaker 2 (04:57):
Night and day. When reporters asked Taylor if Burrow would
be activated for the game against New England, he was
extremely careful.
Speaker 1 (05:03):
He said he's not there.
Speaker 2 (05:04):
Yet exactly, and he added this key line one day
at practice, isn't going to lead to that decision. Yet, well,
we know it's been two full days.
Speaker 1 (05:13):
He's giving himself an out. He's creating plausible deniability, putting
it on the process, even though he's the one who
approved a one hundred percent workload.
Speaker 2 (05:23):
He's buying time. He's not scheduled to speak again until
Friday afternoon. The official move from IR hasn't happened yet.
Maybe he wants the Patriots to have to prepare for
two different quarterbacks.
Speaker 1 (05:33):
So while the coach is being cautious, look at how
they're handling their other quarterbacks. That really tells the story.
They have Joe Flacco, the backup.
Speaker 2 (05:40):
Yep, the veteran they traded for, and Flacco is dealing
with his own injury, a sprained ac joint in his throwing.
Speaker 1 (05:47):
Shoulder, which is a real injury for a QB for sure.
Speaker 2 (05:51):
So Flacco took Wednesday off. Thursday, by all accounts, should
have been his day to get the bulk of the
reps to be ready just in case, but he didn't.
He did not. Instead, Burrow got what the report called
the more favorable quarterback treatment. They gave every important rep
to the guy on IR over the active backup.
Speaker 1 (06:07):
So what was the point of even trading for Flacco
just for a few weeks of insurance that they're now
deciding not to even use.
Speaker 2 (06:13):
It seems that way. It shows how quickly the plan
can change when a season is on the line. The
team is basically signaling, Okay, the insurance policy did its job,
but now it's time to bring back the primary asset.
The priority is no longer just getting through the week.
It's salvaging the entire season.
Speaker 1 (06:30):
And that leads us right to the stakes, because the
stakes couldn't be higher. They're three to.
Speaker 2 (06:35):
Seven, looking at a potential fourth straight loss, which would
pretty much end any faint playoff hopes they might have.
Speaker 1 (06:42):
And it's not just any opponent. It's the New England.
Speaker 2 (06:45):
Patriots, a nine to two Patriots team, no less. And
you have to add the historical context here. The Bengals
are on an eight game using streak against the Patriots.
It's this psychological hurdle for the franchise.
Speaker 1 (06:57):
So you have the current desperation of the three to
seven record, and you stack this historical baggage on top
of it. The pressure to get Burrow back in there
must be immense.
Speaker 2 (07:05):
It's enormous and there's one more fascinating historical parallel here.
Speaker 1 (07:08):
All Right, this has happened before.
Speaker 2 (07:10):
It's the second straight year. If he plays Sunday, it'll
be the second year in a row. He returns from
a major injury to face the Patriots at home. Remember
he came back from that wrist injury against them in
the twenty twenty four season opener.
Speaker 1 (07:24):
It's likely to become his personal litmus test. If he
can play well against them, then he's officially back.
Speaker 2 (07:29):
Exactly, it's not just about winning the game. It's about
validating the risk, validating the entire recovery process.
Speaker 1 (07:36):
So, to wrap this up for you, the listener, what
we're seeing is this incredible tension. On one side, you
have Coach Taylor's very guarded, very cautious public.
Speaker 2 (07:47):
Statements, and on the other you have the mountain of
physical evidence one hundred percent of the reps leading the drills,
and then you have that enthusiastic, unfiltered confidence from t Higgins.
Speaker 1 (07:58):
The big takeaway here is that when you analyzing these
high stake situations in pro sports, you have to learn
to read between the lines. What our organization does with
its players is often way more revealing than what the
coach says at a press conference.
Speaker 2 (08:11):
Pay attention to the actions, not the words, and that
leaves us with a final thought free to chew on.
Not too long ago, burrows teammates were all saying, let's
be patient, let's make sure our franchise guy is totally healthy.
But now Higgins is saying he's ready, He's one hundred percent.
So when you consider the three seven record, that eight
game losing straight to the Patriots, and what does this
sudden urgency really tell you about the pressure, both internal
(08:34):
and external that's shaping this decision. Is this really about
him being one hundred percent ready or is it about
him being ready enough to save a season that's falling apart.
Welcome to the deep Dive. Today, we're looking at a
huge time sensitive shift in the status of one of
the NFL's biggest stars, Cincinnati Bengals quarterback Joe Burrow.
Speaker 2 (00:08):
Yeah, we're digging into that ESPN report from November twentieth,
and we're trying to figure out if his return from
that turf toe injury is a lot closer than anyone.
Speaker 1 (00:18):
Thought that injury he got way back in week two.
And the mission today is really to deconstruct what's going on,
because the official story and what's happening on the field
seemed to be two very different things.
Speaker 2 (00:29):
That's the core of it, right, It's a classic case
of what the organization says versus what it actually does.
For weeks, we've heard Thanksgiving was the target, cautious conservative.
But this new information, the practice reports, it all suggests
they're pushing hard for return. Maybe even this Sunday. It
really feels like the team is screaming, we need you
back now.
Speaker 1 (00:50):
And before we get into the practice details, let's just
quickly frame why this injury turf toe is such a
big deal because it sounds minor, but for a quarterback,
it's not at all.
Speaker 2 (01:00):
It's crucial to understand. Turf toe is a sprain in
the big toe joint. And for a QB throwing isn't
just your arm, it's your whole body. It starts from
the ground up.
Speaker 1 (01:10):
You need to push off that foot exactly.
Speaker 2 (01:13):
That big toe is where you generate all your force,
your drive, especially on deep balls. If you can't push
off properly, you lose velocity, you lose accuracy. It's a disaster.
Speaker 1 (01:23):
Okay, So the report says he's a full participant in
practice for the second day in a row. That one
phrase seems to be the trigger for this whole conversation.
Speaker 2 (01:32):
That is the phrase. It sounds so you know, clinical
and dry, but it is loaded with meaning. It's the
team showing its hand.
Speaker 1 (01:39):
So what does full participant actually mean in this context?
Because he's still on injured reserves?
Speaker 2 (01:44):
Right, So when a player is on IR, you have
to open a twenty one day practice window before you
can activate him for Burrow. That window opened back on
November tenth. Okay, Wednesday was the very first day he
was listed as a full participant. So Thursday, that second
day row, that's the confirmation. It shows it wasn't a
one off. It shows he can handle the load.
Speaker 1 (02:04):
But I guess I have to ask, isn't that just
the box they have to check, you know, a bureaucratic
step to even be eligible. How do we know this
isn't just paperwork.
Speaker 2 (02:14):
That's a fair challenge. But it's the level of participation
that tells the story. We're not talking about him just
jogging on the side. We're talking about Thursday practice, and
in the NFL, Thursday is the big one. It's the
most extensive, most physically demanding practice of the week.
Speaker 1 (02:29):
And the report says he took what of the reps
one hundred.
Speaker 2 (02:33):
Percent all of them. That's not a player being eased
back in. That's the workload of a QB one who
is starting on Sunday period.
Speaker 1 (02:41):
One hundred percent is yeah, wow, I mean at three
seven that feels like a calculated risk. They're saying the
risk of another loss is greater than the risk of
re injury.
Speaker 2 (02:50):
Absolutely, And we have visual evidence of what he was
doing in those reps. During the part of practice opens
to the media, he's taking snaps from his starting center
Ted Carris.
Speaker 1 (02:59):
So they're working on the mechanics, the ball exchange, the footwork.
Speaker 2 (03:04):
And another subtle tell when they went to position drolls.
He was the first quarterback throwing, not the backup, not
anyone else. He was leading the rotation, he was setting
the pace.
Speaker 1 (03:15):
The team is physically putting him back in the QB
one slot before they've even announced it.
Speaker 2 (03:20):
That's it. It's organizational body language.
Speaker 1 (03:22):
Okay. So if the reps and the drills are the
hard data, we need to talk about the emotional side
of this, and that comes from his teammates, specifically wide
receiver t Higgins.
Speaker 2 (03:33):
Right, this is where it gets really interesting because Higgins
isn't reading from a coach's script. He's just ah, he's talking,
and his assessment was, you know, glowing.
Speaker 1 (03:42):
What did he say exactly?
Speaker 2 (03:43):
He said, Burrow has been and this is a quote,
looking outstanding man. Then he added, he's slinging at deep
short routes. Everything's been pretty good.
Speaker 1 (03:51):
Slinging. It is a strong choice of words. It implies confidence, velocity,
it does.
Speaker 2 (03:56):
And he didn't stop there. He went on to say
that Burrow looks just as good as he did at
the start of the season, and get this, that he
personally believes Burrow is now at one hundred percent.
Speaker 1 (04:06):
From a guy catching his passes. That one hundred percent
claim is that's almost more valuable than a doctor's report.
It's a field report. It means a ball is coming
out right.
Speaker 2 (04:16):
It's the ultimate vote of confidence. But the best part,
the detail that really brings this to life is this
little nonverbal thing. Higgins mentioned the smirk, the smirk. He
said Burrow gave him this side eyed stare with a
slight smirk, and Higgins read that as a good sign.
Speaker 1 (04:34):
That's amazing. It's like a secret message between them. You know,
it's Burrow saying yeah, I'm back, completely bypassing the official
team channels.
Speaker 2 (04:41):
It totally is. It's the player communicating his status directly
to his offense. And it brings us right back to
that core conflict what the team is doing versus what
the coach is saying.
Speaker 1 (04:51):
Let's talk about the coach, Zach Taylor, because his comments
are the complete opposite of what Heiggins is saying.
Speaker 2 (04:57):
Night and day. When reporters asked Taylor if Burrow would
be activated for the game against New England, he was
extremely careful.
Speaker 1 (05:03):
He said he's not there.
Speaker 2 (05:04):
Yet exactly, and he added this key line one day
at practice, isn't going to lead to that decision. Yet, well,
we know it's been two full days.
Speaker 1 (05:13):
He's giving himself an out. He's creating plausible deniability, putting
it on the process, even though he's the one who
approved a one hundred percent workload.
Speaker 2 (05:23):
He's buying time. He's not scheduled to speak again until
Friday afternoon. The official move from IR hasn't happened yet.
Maybe he wants the Patriots to have to prepare for
two different quarterbacks.
Speaker 1 (05:33):
So while the coach is being cautious, look at how
they're handling their other quarterbacks. That really tells the story.
They have Joe Flacco, the backup.
Speaker 2 (05:40):
Yep, the veteran they traded for, and Flacco is dealing
with his own injury, a sprained ac joint in his throwing.
Speaker 1 (05:47):
Shoulder, which is a real injury for a QB for sure.
Speaker 2 (05:51):
So Flacco took Wednesday off. Thursday, by all accounts, should
have been his day to get the bulk of the
reps to be ready just in case, but he didn't.
He did not. Instead, Burrow got what the report called
the more favorable quarterback treatment. They gave every important rep
to the guy on IR over the active backup.
Speaker 1 (06:07):
So what was the point of even trading for Flacco
just for a few weeks of insurance that they're now
deciding not to even use.
Speaker 2 (06:13):
It seems that way. It shows how quickly the plan
can change when a season is on the line. The
team is basically signaling, Okay, the insurance policy did its job,
but now it's time to bring back the primary asset.
The priority is no longer just getting through the week.
It's salvaging the entire season.
Speaker 1 (06:30):
And that leads us right to the stakes, because the
stakes couldn't be higher. They're three to.
Speaker 2 (06:35):
Seven, looking at a potential fourth straight loss, which would
pretty much end any faint playoff hopes they might have.
Speaker 1 (06:42):
And it's not just any opponent. It's the New England.
Speaker 2 (06:45):
Patriots, a nine to two Patriots team, no less. And
you have to add the historical context here. The Bengals
are on an eight game using streak against the Patriots.
It's this psychological hurdle for the franchise.
Speaker 1 (06:57):
So you have the current desperation of the three to
seven record, and you stack this historical baggage on top
of it. The pressure to get Burrow back in there
must be immense.
Speaker 2 (07:05):
It's enormous and there's one more fascinating historical parallel here.
Speaker 1 (07:08):
All Right, this has happened before.
Speaker 2 (07:10):
It's the second straight year. If he plays Sunday, it'll
be the second year in a row. He returns from
a major injury to face the Patriots at home. Remember
he came back from that wrist injury against them in
the twenty twenty four season opener.
Speaker 1 (07:24):
It's likely to become his personal litmus test. If he
can play well against them, then he's officially back.
Speaker 2 (07:29):
Exactly, it's not just about winning the game. It's about
validating the risk, validating the entire recovery process.
Speaker 1 (07:36):
So, to wrap this up for you, the listener, what
we're seeing is this incredible tension. On one side, you
have Coach Taylor's very guarded, very cautious public.
Speaker 2 (07:47):
Statements, and on the other you have the mountain of
physical evidence one hundred percent of the reps leading the drills,
and then you have that enthusiastic, unfiltered confidence from t Higgins.
Speaker 1 (07:58):
The big takeaway here is that when you analyzing these
high stake situations in pro sports, you have to learn
to read between the lines. What our organization does with
its players is often way more revealing than what the
coach says at a press conference.
Speaker 2 (08:11):
Pay attention to the actions, not the words, and that
leaves us with a final thought free to chew on.
Not too long ago, burrows teammates were all saying, let's
be patient, let's make sure our franchise guy is totally healthy.
But now Higgins is saying he's ready, He's one hundred percent.
So when you consider the three seven record, that eight
game losing straight to the Patriots, and what does this
sudden urgency really tell you about the pressure, both internal
(08:34):
and external that's shaping this decision. Is this really about
him being one hundred percent ready or is it about
him being ready enough to save a season that's falling apart.
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