Famous UFO abductions and more!

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:06):
Have you ever wondered what was out there in the
night sky, stared up at the stars in the hopes
of seeing something out of the ordinary. Have you heard
unexplainable noises coming from a vacant room or watched the
shadow across the wall in front of you. Have you
asked yourself if there is life after this one, or
if you had life before? What about strange creatures that

(00:28):
are mythical and elusive? Have you experienced dejeuvu or felt
a prompting to leave because you felt you were in danger.
If you have, you were on the Fringe.

Speaker 2 (00:59):
Good evening and welcome to another wonderful episode of On
the Fringe. I'm Mark, I'm Pam, I'm just and we're here.

Speaker 3 (01:09):
Yay, we're here.

Speaker 2 (01:12):
We have a really fun show lined up tonight, unless,
of course, you're the subject of the show, in which
case you probably did not have a good time. So
I don't know, likely, not likely. Not. Before we get started,
I've got, uh, just some housekeeping take care of. And hey,

(01:38):
this is Mark with what If Tomorrow and what If
Tomorrow on the Fringe. Be sure to check out our
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(01:59):
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Now on with the show, all right.

Speaker 4 (02:18):
So.

Speaker 2 (02:21):
Who's interested in a good probing of this subject? Jesus,
I've been waiting for a week to say that I'm sorry.

Speaker 4 (02:31):
He's been rooting around for a good way to put
in Now.

Speaker 3 (02:36):
Why you chose this topic?

Speaker 2 (02:39):
Actually, I mean the joke came up after the topic
came up, but I was just like, I couldn't help myself.
If there's a bad dad joke, I'm probably going to
take it. I'm probably going to do it. And so.

Speaker 3 (02:59):
It's your man. I don't know.

Speaker 2 (03:02):
Yeah, that's her favorite icon of the face palm. I
don't know why. I do know why I apologize. I
do apologize even though I'm not really sorry.

Speaker 3 (03:18):
You're not sorry.

Speaker 5 (03:19):
Look at your face, and that therein lies the problem
our subject tonight is famous UFO abductions.

Speaker 2 (03:31):
And as you know, we'll probably get a little off
topic here and there. I mean, not us, never I
get in the weeds awfully bad.

Speaker 3 (03:43):
There's a path.

Speaker 2 (03:44):
I promise you. I promise you an entertaining show, So
let's get on with it. Uh. Of course I started
out looking up and so oh no, and though you
you had, we're not even five. There are some emojis

(04:16):
that he's posted that I've shared with everybody, so I mean.

Speaker 3 (04:20):
Use your imagination.

Speaker 2 (04:21):
If you just use your imagination, you're probably right on them.
So I started out, of course, looking up Betty and
Barney Hill, because that's the most famous, right. You can't
have this show without talking about Betty and Barney Hill.
They were this is in nineteen sixty one, and they

(04:44):
were driving along back from vacation at night or falls,
I mean, so they were at a fun spot. They
saw a light in the sky like a shooting star
and it was moving erratically, including vertically cheers. Betty urged
Arnie to stop the car. They pulled over a picnic

(05:05):
spot and they watched it with binoculars before they were abducted.
And so they they said they didn't remember it until
several days afterwards. They were stopped by short gray men
wearing blue suits and military military style cadet caps who

(05:28):
took them into the forest and they did all sorts
of stuff. They had psyched hypnotic regression and told their
story and so it everybody needs to get the book.

(05:48):
I'm not going to beat it to death because everybody's
heard about it. But apparently these aliens were from Zeta
reticularized star system.

Speaker 3 (06:07):
So what was the deal with Betty's dress? There was
something on her dress or yes, in the recordings of
their regressions, They're horrifying, they really are.

Speaker 2 (06:19):
They are. I'm not going to go into detail about
it because everybody should have heard this story.

Speaker 4 (06:26):
So and if you haven't, like go look it up.
Like if we were to do Betty and Barney Hill,
it deserves its own entire show.

Speaker 2 (06:38):
Dig into this. The book is that thick. It's not
a book.

Speaker 4 (06:44):
I mean, it's one of the most researched looked at
abduction cases in the history of the world. There is
so much evidence and like the hypnosis that they did
the regression therapies, I think they yeah, and it's not
everything involved with it. Yeah, they had there was men

(07:08):
in black involved with it. Well, the stuff that got
touched had oddities with it, Like the car was like
magnetized that they were in for a week, it was
fully magnetized. Just all sorts of highness went along with
this particular one. So, like I said, if we were
to do it, they deserve probably a part show just

(07:32):
to get across all of the information that comes with.

Speaker 2 (07:36):
Don't know, a lot of these probably probably deserve a
full full show they can. Yeah, we could probably do
a deep dive on a couple of these, uh later
if if everybody uh get on uh the what if

(07:59):
Tomorrow podcast Facebook group and if you want to hear
more about some of these later, drop us a line.
We're glad to do the deep dive. But I think
we're just going to touch on most of these because
there's a bunch of them. Aliens have been busy.

Speaker 3 (08:16):
Yeah. The interesting thing I think about the whole Betty
and Barney Hill situation is, prior to their story, aliens
were always the little you know, we take me to
your leader, you know, really kind of the little green.

Speaker 2 (08:34):
Men, you know, Marvin the Martian.

Speaker 3 (08:38):
Yes, and with the Hills, this was the first actually
horrifying story that you know, maybe they aren't all good.
It's it's very it's fascinating, and it kind of is
a real turning point when it comes to the abduction stories.

Speaker 2 (08:58):
Yep, yeah, it really is. It was not your friendly,
visit friendly neighborhood as now, not at all. So anyway,
I thought we'd start with that one and just touch
on it, because if we're going to touch on this
subject at all, I felt like we had to least
rush past it a little bit. Yeah, but there's so

(09:21):
many interesting ones that most of you probably haven't heard of.
Some of these y'all probably have, and some of them
maybe not. There's just so many of them out there.

Speaker 3 (09:37):
There's a bunch, and there's some that are really fun.
I found one's. It's a gentleman. His name, his pseudonym
is Philip Spencer. He did not give his real name
for all of this because he was concerned about ridicule
and his family and everything. But he actually snapped a

(09:59):
photo and I have the photo to share with you
guys here, so great. Yeah, I'll let me tell the
story a little bit and then I'll share the screen.
So this is the title of this It's the UFO
of Ilkley Hill or ilk Sorry, Ilkley More, and it's
too bad Ian's not here. He could make fun of

(10:20):
my pronunciation of all of the UK terms. I'm fixing
the butcher and massacre and do everything terrible too. One
of the most famous and well known photos of a
supposed extraterrestrial being was said to be taken by this guy.
He was a retired PC, a police officer, and he's

(10:43):
from the UK. He claimed that on December first, it
was nineteen eighty seven, he was walking in an area
of Moreland in Yorkshire, England, and that he not only
witnessed a UFO departing, but he took a picture of
one of the occupants. So where Ilkley More is. It's

(11:04):
situated in Moreland, between the towns of Ilkley and Keighley
in West Yorkshire, and it's considered a place of like
mystery and eeriness. This is the area where they're always
always seeing the lights, the strange lights in the sky,
and there's a lot of in the northern area. There's
carved boulders that date from the Bronze Age, and there's

(11:25):
you know, this small stone circle off to the east
called the twelve apostles. So this place for years and
years has been known for its strange legends and the
strange creatures that are said to you know, roam through
the night and like swirling. It's almost an intelligent lights

(11:46):
that come through fog, which I thought was interesting because
fog is another thing that pops up a lot with
abduction cases. So this Chentle, he was headed to his
father in law's house and he was walking through the moors.
It was supposed to take him, you know, maybe a

(12:07):
half hour to forty five minutes. He hadn't lived in
this area long. He had moved up I think from London,
if I remember correctly, and they moved here because it
was closer to his wife's family. And so he decides
to take this walk through the moors, and because it's
always foggy and gross through that area, he's carrying a
compass with him and he has a camera because you know,

(12:30):
you're in a new area, going to take pictures, So
that's what he's doing. And he comes up this small
hill and he sees this strange little being ahead of
him on the slopes. It was on the trail, and
it was green, and it was about four foot tall,
and it seems like at the time he thought it was,
you know, telling him to go away and so, but

(12:52):
he saw it. So he pulls up his camera and
takes picture of it. And then when he does that,
the creature runs away and goes behind an outcropping and
spencer for summer. You know, he immediately, instead of running
the other direction, he runs after it, and he loses it,
you know, as it goes around this outcropping. But when

(13:14):
he comes around, he sees this dome shaped craft and
it rises up over the moor and it has like
a white square top on top of the dome, and
then it just disappears into the sky and it just
you know, leaves him just flowergast and he's just like
it happens so quickly, he didn't get a picture of
the craft itself. Excuse me. So he's so taken aback

(13:36):
by this, he decides instead of continuing on to his
father in laws, he's going to head to the nearest
village and it's about a half an hour's walk away.
So he does that, and when he gets there, he
realized that the clock tower in the village says it's
two hours later than what his watch says, and he
happens to look at his compass, and now his compass

(13:58):
is pointing south and not north. So he's like, I
have no idea what happened to me, you know, And
so let me pull this picture up to show you guys,
just because it's kind of kind of wild, and this
first one is hard to see, but I have some
others that are a little bit easier to see on it. Okay,

(14:24):
So in that circle, see this little thing right here,
that's the creature. Okay, let me see. Here's a kind
of a zoomed in, well, kind of a doctored a
little bit so you could see it better. Isn't it weird?
Looking long? His arms are very long? He is, for

(14:47):
you know, he's about four to five foot tall and
overly long arms. And so he takes this. Once he
gets the the film, I'm gonna stop sharing that for
a se I'll come back to the rest of it
here in a minute. Tha, Oh no, I lost my

(15:08):
notes where my notes go? There they are? So after
this happens, he gets this picture developed and he's like, okay,
it's here. So he takes it and sends it to
a number of experts around, including Kodak laboratories in Hampstead

(15:30):
and even sends it to the laboratories in the US,
and there was an optical physicist from the Navy and
he looked at this and he was like, you know,
this picture's just too grainy. This was the eighties, you know,
and I have a lot of pictures that are pretty
much this quality right here from photographer, and I'm surprised
to get a picture at all. Honestly, I got.

Speaker 2 (15:52):
A good picture of my thumb almost every roll film.

Speaker 3 (15:54):
Oh yeah, yeah. It was easy to do what they
did determine it's too grainy for proper analysis. But they
were able to establish that it was not a superimposed image,
and it was not a double exposure, and that whatever
this thing is, it's truly there in the picture. There's been,

(16:16):
you know, skeptics that say it's a cardboard cutout. You know,
there's Ian you've missed me massacre, all of these names
of these UK places already. Sorry, maybe it's a good
thing you're late. So, you know, he's like still curious

(16:39):
about where these two hours went that he lost. So
he gets hypnotically regressed and utter hypnosis. His story kind
of changes a little bit he still sees the creature,
but when he sees it, he finds hisself instantly paralyzed
and levitating off the ground for a few feet. And

(17:00):
this little green man starts to have this pull on
him kind of like now this guy's a b like
he would be a balloon floating behind, you know. And
he takes him to the saucer and pulls him inside,
and they're really nice, they're very calm and they but
they do do some medical experiments on him. They insert
stuff up in his nose, in his mouth, and at

(17:23):
some point he's given a tour of the craft and
he notices when he looks out the portal that he
can see the Earth, you know, so he knows he's
not on the planet anymore, or he thinks he's not
on the planet anymore. And he got a better look
at the creatures. He said that they were enormous or
they had enormous three fingered hands and V shaped feet

(17:44):
with two huge toes on them, and then they had
these ginormous eyes and with a slit for a mouth
and no nose, and you can kind of see that
in the picture too. I'll pull it back up here
in a minute.

Speaker 2 (17:57):
He seems pretty much like a classic gray.

Speaker 3 (18:00):
It does, doesn't It just a little bit differently shaped,
not a lot, but a little. Let me pull that
up back up, mark because if you look like right here,
you can kind of make out like where we'd be
two eyes and see how he said it has a

(18:21):
flat face which just has no nose and the slip
for a mouth.

Speaker 2 (18:26):
Yeah, and the hands do look oversized.

Speaker 3 (18:29):
They are oversized, and they have the three fingers as
opposed to you know, and the feet you can't really
see anything on.

Speaker 2 (18:38):
No, No, it's hard to see, but there's something there
and it doesn't look quite human. Cool. Well, it could
be somebody holding something, I guess, making it look like
their arms are really long. But I mean that doesn't
look right.

Speaker 3 (18:59):
No, it doesn't look right at all. And zo. He
said that the navy expert that reviewed it was Bruce mccabee.
He waiter, he waiter, he waiter worked. He later worked
with uh Nicap and moufonol. Okay, let me knock this
back down here again for a minute, find my notes again. Okay,

(19:27):
So while he was on this ship, he claimed that
they set him down in front of a scream and
essentially showed him apocalyptic imagery, nuclear explosions, famine, floods, tank soldiers,
et cetera. And then he was shown another film and
whatever he was seen this second time, Yeah, he does
kind of look like gun Beat, isn't he. Whatever he

(19:50):
saw on the second film he still has yet to reveal.
He said that, uh, it's too important and these creatures
didn't want the rest of us to know. So he
vowed never to discuss the topic of saying he's not
allowed to divulge anything, which is interesting because he could not.

(20:11):
He was not able to divulge it under hypnosis either.
So at that point, after that second movie, he was
apparently returned to the more and he took a picture
of one of his captors, which you know is the
picture that I just showed you guys. But this is
where his story really changed from what he originally said,

(20:32):
because at first he said that the creature was like,
you know, waiving him to get away, but he said no,
he was actually telling him goodbye. So that was his
change on that. So it's always there's been a lot
of skeptics that have argued this one, but it's still
considered one of the most I think it's one of
the top eleven stories to come out of the UK.

Speaker 2 (20:54):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (20:57):
So but you know, Nick Redford, he said that Spencer
has been hassled by the Ministry of Defense a few
days after the incident on the Moor and that they
opened a file on Aim and that meant in black
have been intimidating him and kinds of things. So but
I thought that was an interesting one.

Speaker 2 (21:15):
They show up in several of the stories.

Speaker 3 (21:17):
Tonight, they do. And before we move on, let me
show you the rest that goes along with this. This
is the only one I have pictures for tonight, so.

Speaker 2 (21:30):
I'd always.

Speaker 3 (21:33):
Oh, I yeah, I'm all about the pictures. Okay, So
hang on, I gotta find my notes back there we go.
So when I was on Reddit and looking around this
this one is on there too, and somebody said, you
know what, there's an uncanny resemblance to the cop Grove Devilstone,

(21:56):
which is a mysterious place and it's not too far
from this area as well. And this is what that
looks like. See there's the small creatures, see the longer
arms and the short legs. Yeah it does, yep. And

(22:17):
here's kind of you can see a little bit better here.
I just thought it was interesting though.

Speaker 2 (22:23):
Yeah, yeah, surely is.

Speaker 3 (22:28):
Yeah, and this particular thing, it used to be on
the outside of one of the buildings. I can't remember
which one it was, off the top of my head,
but they ended up taking it off the outside of
the building and bringing it inside because it was degrading
to the point you can barely can't really photograph it
anymore because you just can't really see it. It doesn't

(22:49):
really show up in photographs anymore. But I thought that
was a cool one. Yeah, cool, Okay, I'm done, it's
done holding something? Or is just have a big frying
pan for a hand? Yeah, you know, I don't know.

Speaker 4 (23:12):
Maybe it's a ping pong paddle.

Speaker 5 (23:16):
Well.

Speaker 3 (23:19):
Im the establishment. Maybe he's what.

Speaker 4 (23:26):
A crossing guard, he's got to stop something.

Speaker 3 (23:28):
Maybe so.

Speaker 2 (23:31):
Crossing guard. Alright, alrighty, then.

Speaker 3 (23:40):
Too funny.

Speaker 4 (23:43):
So I thought that I would talk a little bit
about the Valientege disappearance in the Bastrait of Australia, a
really highly well known one. I think it's kind of sad.
If you look it up the first like eight pages
of internet sources, you're going to find that Valenteers was

(24:05):
basically just an idiot who didn't know how to fly
his plane and got himself into trouble and then got
his plane disappeared.

Speaker 2 (24:14):
Yeah, there's so.

Speaker 4 (24:15):
Much more to it, and I've always thought it was
a very.

Speaker 2 (24:19):
Yeah, we've mentioned this guy before on I think one
of the triangle shows.

Speaker 4 (24:25):
Yeah, it's bast Rate. So the Bass Straight is one
of the thirteen vile triangles that we've discussed on former shows.
In fact, I actually pulled up the notes from that
previous show, so once I'm done kind of talking about
his experience a little bit, I was going to kind
of touch upon everything that's happened in the Bass Straight

(24:46):
along with his incidents, so you can kind of see.
I think there was a little bit something more to
it than what the Australian government and military officials and
the news programs would have you believe on this particular
our topic.

Speaker 2 (25:01):
And there have been several TV shows that's actually covered
this as well.

Speaker 4 (25:05):
Yes, if you if you're a fan of unsolved mysteries
or any the type of shows or even the ones
they show like on the History Channel and travel and
stuff like that, you've most likely heard a little bit
about this one. It's just extraordinarily interesting and there are
reasons for him, like for it not being paranormal or

(25:29):
for natural or UFO based in any ways, so much
more far out than his excuses. It's kind of it
will it'll speak for itself. I'm just gonna tell you,
tell you all about it. So Cretic Valentiche disappeared in
nineteen seventy eight and straight in Australia.

Speaker 3 (25:53):
He was a.

Speaker 4 (25:54):
Pilot who was playing a Cessna one eighty two. He'd
gone off on of his on his own this flight October,
which was it Saturday to twenty first October nineteen seventy eight.
He was about twenty years old at the time, and
he called in to the Melbourne out Air Traffic Control
Center because he said he was suddenly followed by an

(26:20):
aircraft with a greenlightment. It was following him about one
thousand feet above and trailing him. He also reported that
his engine had begun running roughly and right before he
had completely and lost him. He said, this is not
an aircraft and then they lost him and he was gone.

(26:43):
And just so you all know, there were other reports
UFOs this night all around his reporting, just to let
you all know that there was actually in Sandity happening.
And here in a minute, when I read the notes
from our previous Triangle story, you're going to the entire
year was full of just mass reportings and the Triangle

(27:06):
area aircraft did not They never found one piece or
anything left over the plane, which absolutely which is really
so the Department of trans Yeah, it's it's strange. So
the Department of Transport was completely skeptical about his UFO

(27:29):
report being you know, behind his disappearance, and their officials
were speculating that he had become disoriented and saw his
own lights reflected in the water or lights from the
nearby island because he was accidentally flying upside down.

Speaker 2 (27:43):
You know, when you're upside down.

Speaker 4 (27:45):
I am sorry, even if your panel is out, you know,
when you're flying upside down.

Speaker 2 (27:56):
Upside that is ridiculous. And I don't think flies very
good upside down. It's a very reliable and safe aircraft. Uh,
perfect for the kind of training flight he was doing.

(28:16):
I need to talk to a pilot, but I don't
really think you fly them upside down easily.

Speaker 4 (28:26):
So according to his father and I, there was he
was actually quite interested in UFOs, which kind of puts
a little spin on it. His father said that he
was an ardent believer in UFOs. Valentiche was and had
been worried about being attacked by them. Six days before
his disappearance, he had discussed it with his girlfriend, Ronda Rushton,

(28:48):
the possibility of a UFO taking him away. The destination
of Valentiche's final flight was King's Island, but his motivation
for the flight is unknown. He told flight officials that
he was going to King's Island to pick up some friends,
and while he told others that he was going to
pick up crayfish. Later investigations found both stated reasons to
be untrue. Valentiche also failed to inform King's Island Airport

(29:11):
of his intention to land there, going against standard procedure.
So that's just a little bit of oddness inside of it.
So I'm going to throw that in there, you know,
so you can make your own decisions about things. So
I'm just going to get into a little bit more
of the details of the flight itself so you can
kind of see how weird and strange it was. So

(29:31):
Valentiche radioed Melbourne Flight Service at seven oh tho pm
to report that an unidentified aircraft following at him at
forty five hundred feet, he was told there was no
known traffic at that level. Valentiche said he could see
a large, unknown aircraft which appeared to be illuminated by
four bright landing lights. He was unable to confirm its type,

(29:52):
but said it passed about one thousand feet overhead and
was moving high speed. Valentache then reported that the air
was approaching him from the east and said the other
pilot might be purposely toying with him. Valentiche said the
aircraft was orbiting above him and that it had a
shiny metal surface and a green light on it. He
further reported that he was experiencing engine problems. As to

(30:14):
identify the aircraft, Volantese radioed it's not an aircraft. His
transmission was then interrupted by unidentified noise described as metallic
scraping sounds, and then all contact was lost, now also
in Valentiche's favor. Later on, three different eyewitnesses who had

(30:36):
multiple people with them, so there's more than the three
each had sent in claims that they seen a cessna
flying through the air with a gigantic green light chasing
him through the sky, and they all reported them on
their own at times that evening playing him. When they

(30:56):
had come home, a lot of them were on the
road on the way home from work were you know,
were out and about doing chores and things, and they
called in to either the air Force base or the
local sheriffs tell them that they had watched this gigantic
green light chase the Cessna around. So that completely goes

(31:17):
in his favor. It does, unbidded from anyone. Nobody hunted
those people up. They called in on their own volition,
So that's pretty much the end of his story. They
never found anything of his plane, which doesn't make sense
because apparently the route he was at and the way
that the tides flow in that area, something should have
eventually washed up on King's Island.

Speaker 3 (31:39):
But there are too many people with eyes on him
for him ever did fall off the face of the Yeah.

Speaker 4 (31:46):
Too many people with eyes on him. The only they
ever found apparently, at one point another they found a
small piece of a plastic that they thought might have
been off of a panel for the airplane, and they
claimed that it was his. But when I looked into
it further, it came from the time period that his
Cesna was made from, but it spanned twelve years, Like

(32:11):
it could have been any plane from a Cessna something
something to a something something within a twelve year period
had been made piece of a plastic channel. It could
have come from anywhere, and it was washed up in
the wrong spot too. So AnyWho, So if we dive
into the Best Strait really quick, just to kind of

(32:32):
give you guys an idea of the insanity that happens,
the Bass Strait is one of the most active triangles
when it comes to high strangeness, and just so nineteen
seventy eight is when Valentie went missing. Also in nineteen
seventy eight they picked the captured five pictures of UFOs.

(32:54):
There were mass UFO sidings on the coastlines of Tasmania
and Victoria. And in nineteen seventy eight is when that
crazy story happened about that woman reporting that that portal
had opened up on her front lawn and like sucked
her furniture through it and had eye witnesses for it.
So that's just tea. Yeah, that's just nineteen seventy eight alone.

(33:17):
So within the Bass Straight they have tons of missing
ships and UFOs and missing planes and the portals, and
I have a list. I'm not just them all, of course,
because we'll be here.

Speaker 2 (33:31):
This is look at all this that's a show.

Speaker 4 (33:34):
Yeah, it's an entire show on its own, and it
continues on the next page. I think Valentee might have
been a victim of something other than I really wanted
some crayfish and I accidentally flew upside down and saw
my own reflection in the ocean, just saying, yeah.

Speaker 2 (33:57):
I don't care how miss up you are. I feel
to see how somebody could accidentally be flying upside down.

Speaker 4 (34:08):
Yeah, I can understand if you were coming in at
an angle and didn't realize it, because maybe you were disoriented.
It's not you've lost your painel you can't see the
horizon line, and maybe you're feeling the gees because you're
coming down quickly. You may not realize that you're tilted
or you're coming in at the wrong angle. But being

(34:28):
completely upside down, I am sure there is.

Speaker 3 (34:31):
Some gravity, surely, yeah, exactly.

Speaker 4 (34:39):
In your cabin. Yeah, and it falls. You could held
the pressure on your helmet or your.

Speaker 3 (34:46):
Well, your face even just you know, just the pull
of your.

Speaker 2 (34:49):
Face, your feet. So if you were upside down, you
would have trouble touching the pedal. You would have trouble
the pedals, touching the pedals and actually steering the aircraft.
You would know something was rereadfully wrong.

Speaker 3 (35:06):
You'd pull against the seat belts differently, and.

Speaker 2 (35:09):
I mean you could be strapped down so tight that
you weren't pulled off of the the pedals, but I
mean you're gonna feel you're gonna be dragging in there. Yeah,
And I don't know, so I just have trouble imagining

(35:31):
that you could do that and accidentally.

Speaker 3 (35:36):
Yeah, hean's playing Devil's advocate. He said. Nineteen seventy eight
was the year after Close Encounters came out. I wonder
if people's imaginations were running over time, like with recent
drone activity. Maybe could be, Maybe could be.

Speaker 4 (35:51):
It also might have encouraged people reporting what they were seeing.

Speaker 2 (35:55):
Yeah, that's true, that's true, and there were several of
these incidents. Sorry I went blank for words there for
a second. I'm sorry. Words are hard people, they really are.

Speaker 3 (36:12):
They are preaching to the choir.

Speaker 2 (36:15):
A lot of these are mid seventies, some of them
are before Close Encounters, some of them are after. So
I don't know if we can blame that on the
movie or not. But I mean, it is a good
point because it does bring it to the forefront of
people's minds, people who might have just saw lights in
the sky a year or two earlier, but now saying, oh,

(36:37):
that must be a UFO and I get that. And
it also could very well be like Jess said, after
the movie and stuff, people say, well, you know, it's
not so far fetched. I'm gonna say something. I'm going
to report this.

Speaker 3 (36:56):
So yeah, maybe so.

Speaker 2 (37:00):
All right, so we got anything else on that one?

Speaker 4 (37:06):
No, I think we should move on. If we go
too deep, then we're going to be here sitting going
through uh. Because if you are interested, you can get
up online and look. The full written transcript is available
for free to go read his entire conversation he had
back and forth with the with the airbase and everything.
You can hear the conversation that went on, and you

(37:27):
can hear the scraping and metallic sounds of them before
he cuts out. It's super interesting. We don't have time
to sit here and go back and forth because he
was on the line with him for quite a while,
so there's a whole lot of back and forth and
a lot of dialogue that I don't understand because it's
in you know, air speak, So yeah, super interesting. But yeah,

(37:47):
that's all I have on that one.

Speaker 2 (37:49):
And there's several TV shows that have at least parts
of their episode is about this. So yeah, there's even
a couple of dramatic reenactments. So all right, what's next?

Speaker 3 (38:08):
Pam trying to yawn without anybody noticing? It didn't work
very well. Excuse me?

Speaker 2 (38:15):
Everybody noticed?

Speaker 3 (38:17):
Do me go next to? You want to go next?

Speaker 2 (38:19):
Mark? I don't have a whole lot that you guys
don't don't have, but I do have, and I'm I'm sorry, Uh, Sylvaine,
I am going to very badly, but you're This guy's
name Antonio Villas Boas October October sixteenth, nineteen fifty seven,

(38:42):
while working at nine on his family's farm in Brazil,
sounds French, so I don't know. I think extraterrest rules.
He said he saw a large egg shake craft with
a coppola cupola a little dome on top containing a

(39:05):
rotating red light. Well, that sounds sounds like it might
be earth based with a rotating red light. I mean
that was on all the airplanes at the time. Craft
landed by extending three legs, after which a five foot
several five foot tall beings disembarked. Antonio tried to escape
on his tractor, but the tractor died and he continued

(39:28):
on foot. He was eventually captured by these beings, who
wore gray overalls and helmets. He was taken aboard their ship,
whereupon they took their helmets off. They had small blue
eyes and communicated via a series of animal like grunts.
Once on board the ship, Antonio was stripped, naked and
covered in gel. He was led to a large semicircular

(39:51):
room that had all kinds of symbols on it, and
he was able to remember these symbols with perfect clarity.
He says, Uh, the gas was pumped into the room
and a naked female alien came to talk to him.
So now we're starting to get into I don't know anyway.

(40:20):
They got frisky, They got frisky, and.

Speaker 4 (40:23):
Uh this one, now.

Speaker 2 (40:27):
Yeah, it is a famous one. It's famous, okay, sounds
like it. And a medical examination afterwards, uh uh, after
he made these claims, show that he was suffering from
a mild dose of radiation sickness. So that's the reason
I included it. Besides the fact that it's reasonably famous.

(40:52):
You don't just get radiation sickness. Something has to give
you radiation sickness.

Speaker 3 (41:00):
Yeah, Inzo, he's feisty tonight, he is, he is.

Speaker 2 (41:12):
So and there I guess there's a cartoon book. Yeah,
I'm not not even going to go there. But it
was fairly well known at the time, and I thought
it was I'm sure, I'm sure illuminati. Ah h, that's

(41:37):
bad anyway, I'm now thoroughly embarrassed for having read that
out loud.

Speaker 3 (41:45):
You did leave out some of the other portions of it.

Speaker 2 (41:48):
He did leave some of the naughty stuff out. I'm sorry.
This is a sort of family show, so.

Speaker 3 (41:55):
You did, and we appreciate that.

Speaker 4 (42:01):
Maybe maybe you should start like an only page for
your for the ear.

Speaker 2 (42:10):
Well, you know, the only only fans I could do
would be paid me not to put pictures up. Oh wait,
that's called ransom. We can't do that. Probably nineteen ninety five.
We'll remove this picture from your computer.

Speaker 4 (42:33):
Oh lord, Pam, you better get moving on.

Speaker 3 (42:36):
I've read never better comments match. Even your wife is
getting you.

Speaker 2 (42:43):
Yeah, I am read. Sorry you have.

Speaker 3 (42:47):
Oh okay, moving on. Okay, so we're back to you know,
we just I think everybody likes to watch us, just
so they could see us completely slaughter these these words,

(43:07):
these names, especially this one's this one's Russian. So here
we go.

Speaker 2 (43:16):
When you're talking about I can't pronounce it either.

Speaker 3 (43:19):
Okay. So this guy's name is Chrissan el yum Zenoff. Yeah,
that's close enough. We'll call him Kissan. How's that. And
he was the governor of Kolmikia, which was a Buddhist
region in Siberia, and he was the president of five
and he claimed to have been adducted in nineteen ninety seven.

(43:42):
And he's a bit of an unorthodox kind of guy,
completely obsessed with chess. And he's a self made millionaire.
And he is the keeper of Buddha's remains that were
sent to Komikia from Sri Lanka. I can't even say that.

Speaker 2 (43:59):
Sounds like chmyte.

Speaker 3 (44:00):
I'm yeah, we'll leave with that alone. Oh my goodness.
So this guy I already forgot his name, Chissan. He
believes his main belief is that the game of chess
was actually invented by extraterrestrials, and he claims to have
been abducted by aliens in Yellow spacesuits on the night

(44:22):
of September seventeenth, nineteen ninety seven. So in an interview
that was done with him, No, he's not covered in
blue jail. Who said that I can't see their names
and so.

Speaker 4 (44:37):
This has gone off the rails.

Speaker 3 (44:39):
It has.

Speaker 2 (44:39):
I'm sorry, I'm sorry I even brought that one up.
I apologize, Oh it.

Speaker 4 (44:45):
Was It's not your fault. I have members in the
chat room who need to grow up. Shame too.

Speaker 3 (44:56):
Funny yellow space suits? Was it Darth Vader from the
planet Vulcan? Maybe?

Speaker 2 (45:01):
So I just hadn't thought about about that.

Speaker 3 (45:05):
Yeah, that's funny. I didn't even think of that. That's cool. Okay,
So what I'm going to read through here he actually
did an interview and it's been translated into English. So
what his story was that he was in his apartment
and these aliens in the yellow spacesuits flew in and

(45:25):
took him. He remembers a particular moment where they entered
the spaceship and there wasn't enough air or oxygen, and
so they gave him a spacesuit and he puts it
on and he still couldn't breathe. So the aliens like
pointing at his chest with a twisting motion. So he
understands that there's I guess something on his chest to

(45:46):
regulate the flow of air. So he does that. Now
he can breathe. And he said, what's most interesting is
once he was able to breathe, they just kind of
ignored him. Nobody really showed him around the spaceship or anything.
And he said, this ship is enormous. It was like
one of just one cabin alone was like the size
of a large football field, and there were portals so

(46:09):
he could see out. And they actually flew to a
different planet and they got out. They were taking some
equipment out, and once he went out with them, they
paid attention to him and they were telling him in detail,
you know, what they were doing and who the captain
of the ship was and things like that, and he
just remembers kind of freaking out and being like, you know, hey,

(46:32):
I need you to take me back and they were
like why, and he's like, because I have somewhere to be.
You know, I'm the governor, basically, I have somewhere to be.
And he kept telling them that over and over and
finally they were like, okay, we'll take you back.

Speaker 2 (46:49):
And so the.

Speaker 3 (46:52):
Interviewer says, well, who are these aliens? What do they
look like? And he said, well, they look like humans
and they were about six and a half foot tall,
he said two meters, which roughly six and a half
foot tall, And Chrsann says, don't take me as crazy.
I'm just saying how I saw them. It was the

(47:12):
way I talked to them was normal, just like I'm
sitting here talking to you, and I saw them the
same way, you know, like it was a normal thing.
It wasn't like completely weird. But what struck him because
he's like, you know, I would think I was crazy.
But two of my assistants noticed my absence in the
time that I was gone, because they were like, where

(47:35):
did you go to? You know, it's evening time, where
have you been all day? You know you were here,
then you weren't here. And the way he says it is,
my body left and then it came back. But he
described everything, and then two of his assistants noticed his
absence and he said that he still doesn't understand it,
and he walked around for several days being like why

(47:57):
did they take me? And you know, he still doesn't
know no clue why they did. He said, the only
thing he can think of is that maybe it's not
time for these extraterrestrial civilizations to meet us, or for
us to meet them, or for us to be able
to acknowledge them maybe, I don't know, or for them

(48:18):
to acknowledge us, I should say, but ethically, we have
not yet reached the level where we can meet them
and be I don't know if it'd be on level ground,
but be able to accept or understand, you know, whatever
they are. So, but his whole theory is he's very

(48:38):
big into chess. So his theory is chess comes from space.
And the reason he thinks that is because it's the
same rules. They're sixty four squares, it's black and white.
It's the same rules in Japan, China, Qatar, Mongolia, and Africa,
and the rules are all same, all the same. And
he just thinks that it was brought to us by

(48:59):
somebody else for it to be that way everywhere. So, yeah,
that's the weird.

Speaker 2 (49:06):
Little Yea one was a bit strange there, It was.

Speaker 3 (49:10):
It was really strange. But the the only reason I
threw it in here is because he was an actual
governor slash president basically where he was at that time,
and then once his term expired, Putin uh took away
the presidency there. So now Putin's I.

Speaker 2 (49:33):
Thought he was going to blab state secrets probably Yeah,
so yeah, that that one was.

Speaker 3 (49:41):
It's interesting, it's interesting. But that's the whole reason I
brought it up, because this dude had a lot to lose.
You know, he was in a pretty high powered position
and he didn't have to talk about this, but he did.
So I don't know, in situations like that where they
have a little bit more to lose, it kind of
makes me double take, you.

Speaker 2 (50:02):
Know, yeah, pay attention to it, yeah, no matter what,
no matter how it sounds, because they should be a
credible person or they wouldn't be in that position, right.

Speaker 3 (50:15):
And so yeah, and so I said, that's odd. Why
take him? Yeah, that's a good question. Why take him?
I don't know?

Speaker 4 (50:24):
Mm hm, who knows.

Speaker 3 (50:27):
Maybe it was an any meaning and who knows, I
don't know. Maybe maybe they wanted to learn how to
pronounce his name, because I sure didn't do it very well.

Speaker 2 (50:40):
Yeah, I ain't even gonna try. It's not happening. I
speak I barely speak English. I struggle.

Speaker 3 (50:51):
I struggled with English, y'all hear me bi weekly struggle
with English.

Speaker 4 (50:57):
So yeah, okay, so I'm going to take us to
Scotland for just a little bit. This one happened, Yeah,
this one happened in nineteen seventy nine, and I thought
this one was super interesting. So we're not going to
hear anything about experiences going up because he literally, this

(51:17):
gentleman literally blacks out and then comes to hours later.
It's it's the initial encounter that I thought was just
so weird and strange, and some evidence left behind you
and it's not long, so it's kind of interesting. So
this one happened in mont Woods in Scotland in nineteen

(51:40):
seventy nine. It happened to a gentleman named Rob Taylor
or Bob. He went by Bob. He was actually a
forestry worker for the Livingstone Development Corporation in the area,
and he had just parked his pickup truck at the
end of the road or that made motorway with his

(52:02):
dog and was walking along the forest path checking the
fence lines and the gates when he reported seeing what
he described as a gent flying dome or a large
circular sphere approximately seven yards in diameter. Hovering above the
forest floor and a clearing about one hundred and thirty

(52:25):
yards away from his truck. He described the object as
dark metall material with rough texture like sandpaper, featured the
outer rim set with small propellers. He claimed he experienced
a foul odor like burning brakes, and that small spear
similar to the similar to sea mines, seized him and

(52:51):
were dragging him in a direction of the larger objects.
So it wasn't even creatures. It was spears that came
out and grabbed him by his legs and was dragging
him towards the spaceship. Yeah, so not even like little creatures.
It's really really strange.

Speaker 2 (53:08):
And I watched footage from the time from the police department.
They had his pants and they were torn where they
said it, I was consistent with somebody being picked up
by their pants.

Speaker 4 (53:23):
Yeah, and they weren't torn down or out, they were
torn up as if he'd been lifted right. Yeah, while
he was being drug is dragged towards the ship is
when he lost all consciousness. Later on, when he woke up,
he said the objects were gone, but he couldn't get

(53:43):
his truck to start, so he ended up having to
walk back to his home in Livingstone. His wife reported
that when he arrived back on foot, he appeared disheveled
and muddy, with torn clothing and the rip trousers that
we were talking about. His wife called the piece and
the doctor who treated him for grazes his chin and thighs.

(54:04):
So apparently he, like I, tipped forward at some point
and was drawn that way. Police accompanied Taylor to the
site where he claimed he received his injuries. They found
a ladder shape marks in the ground where Taylor said
he saw the large sphiritual spherical object, and other marks
that Taylor said were made by all our mind like objects.

(54:27):
Accorded the matter as criminal assault, though I don't know
how that works.

Speaker 2 (54:34):
A doctor when he examined it, he had been assaulted.

Speaker 3 (54:39):
Wow, yeah, yeah, and so said the dollars yep, pretty much.

Speaker 2 (54:49):
Uh.

Speaker 4 (54:51):
A crime scene investigator actually went out also to look
at the area and kind of review what had happened,
and he said he saw the strange marks on the ground,
strange marks on the ground that were about thirty two holes.
So he found thirty holes all around which were about

(55:12):
three point five inches in diameter, as well as marks
similar to those made by the type of caterpillar tracks,
often bulldozers. The officer went to mister Taylor's emploiler to
see if the machinery they had could solve the mystery.
But after examining every piece of machinery they had up there,
they couldn't find anything that matched those treadmarks.

Speaker 2 (55:33):
On the ground.

Speaker 4 (55:35):
Well, whatever it was was made by whatever that weird
ship thing was there. These marks just arrived, the officer said.
They did not come from any go anywhere. They just
arrived as though a helicopter or something had landed from
the sky. So what he was saying is there was
no lead up to the mark and there was no

(55:58):
lead out. Is it was if something came in, landed
smush made the marks and then flew off. There wasn't
any before it or after it, no coming or going.
But yeah, and then just a little a little bit
of evidence on the pan. But it's just as Mark said,
they could tell by the way that they were ripped

(56:19):
that he had been pulled forward, not down. It wasn't
as if he tripped into some barbed wire or caught
it on something and it ripped. It was if both
legs were pulled from the same exact position and ripped forward,
so he got drug.

Speaker 2 (56:35):
That's wild. Yeah. I saw news footage from the time
and the officials seemed convinced that something had definitely happened
to him, and they thought he was credible.

Speaker 4 (56:48):
So yeah, well, I don't know how you like do
that to yourself, do you know create that situation?

Speaker 2 (57:00):
Yeah, Ian says, I blame most Scottish ufocuses on raf
I'm gonna butcher this mac Hurnish and the odds going on.
There lots of conspiracies about that place, even in recent years.
So yeah, it was a very fascinating case. I actually

(57:25):
was amazed on how much footage was available of this guy.

Speaker 4 (57:29):
So yeah, he was quite open about it. A very
interesting case. And like I said, I that's just so
interesting because you're not having little beings or little grays
get out and you know, come over and snag you.
It was like they sent out two How did like,
I want to know how they grasped him, How did
they grab a hold?

Speaker 2 (57:50):
I don't know. And I saw pictures of the little
hole they made they I mean they were got that
bearer am yeah right deep, Yeah, I would say they
went down about that far. So I would say they
were something that weighed, you know, more than a definitely
more than one hundred pounds, even if they were rolling

(58:13):
around on their spikes, which seems an odd way of locomotion.
But alien logic may not be human logic, and we lost.

Speaker 4 (58:27):
Pam, Pam, you're remuted.

Speaker 2 (58:30):
I saw that after I looked up You've been had.

Speaker 4 (58:35):
No.

Speaker 3 (58:36):
I was reading what Enzo said. He googled the bass
in the first picture he saw was a famous Casey
one thirty five refueling. The triangle and the sphere seemed
to have sticks around them. I'm not sure how that
grabs anyone. It's pretty wild.

Speaker 2 (58:51):
I don't know. I don't know.

Speaker 4 (58:54):
I wish we had more of the medical side of it,
like his injuries. We could kind of like get an
idea of maybe how he was dragged or what happened
to him as he was being dragged. I think we
probably understand it a little bit better.

Speaker 2 (59:07):
But his eyes right under his pockets.

Speaker 4 (59:12):
Yeah, I was saying, like, I know that he had
abrasions on his nose and his chin, part of his chest,
in the tops of his thighs, So it's obvious to
me that after he was grabbed at some point he
probably fell forward and was so he got almost like
a yeah type of a situation. But like, how how

(59:34):
did they have a hold of him?

Speaker 2 (59:35):
That's what I want.

Speaker 4 (59:35):
It was there like actions where the jeans were attracted
being did he get like he had a little claws
on the end of him, little claws little.

Speaker 2 (59:49):
Maybe static. So it's interesting though, And remember and I
really feel like something happen up into him. He may
have been so traumatized he really couldn't articulate exactly how

(01:00:09):
this would have looked or operated.

Speaker 3 (01:00:13):
Doll like section cups yep, yeah, So I don't know.

Speaker 2 (01:00:20):
He's an interesting case though.

Speaker 3 (01:00:22):
M Ian said that was pretty much the UK's Area
fifty one back in the day, or at least a contender.
Nice interesting, all right, But.

Speaker 2 (01:00:36):
You got Mark, I've got a lot of the same
things you guys got. Well, I think we've taken care
of my unique ones.

Speaker 4 (01:00:46):
Okay, uniques.

Speaker 2 (01:00:48):
I'm going to another one.

Speaker 4 (01:00:53):
Well, why don't you throw one into him? Okay, So
I think Mark has.

Speaker 2 (01:00:58):
What we have now. Okay, I might have another one
in here, but I don't think so.

Speaker 3 (01:01:04):
I've got one on the four men that were camping
in aligash Maine that realized later on that they were
most likely abducted. So the details of this case. These
guys were in August of nineteen seventy six. There was

(01:01:25):
four of them, Jack and Jim Winer there, twins, and
then their friends Chuck and Charlie, friends from school. They're
older now, but you know when they went to school together.
They said that they had this terrifying encounter with aliens
while they were in the main wilderness. Took them years
to go public, and each one of them has been

(01:01:46):
polygraphed and hypnotized and their stories are holding up. So
after they were on this trip, Jack, when he got home,
one of the twins, he was having these recurring nightmares
and he didn't tell anybody about him except for his
wife Mary, but he said that he started having nightmares

(01:02:06):
that were really terrible. He couldn't explain them. He would
find himself in a very brightly lit room and he
had no idea where he was or how he got there,
but it was always to his left. He could see
his brother, Jim, and Chuck and Charlie sitting on some
type of bench and they were all naked, and he
kept wondering why they weren't trying to help him because

(01:02:27):
he felt like he was in danger. And while he's
trying to figure this out, he notices that there's like
this figure, it's like a dark, shadowy type figure emerging
from this light. This bright light just pops right in
front of him, and then this thing out and he
would wake up at this point and he would be
sweating and just in total state of terror. And so,

(01:02:50):
you know, this happened to them in nineteen seventy six. Well,
in nineteen eighty eight, Jack finally gets around to telling
his twin about this, and Jim, his twin, He's like,
you know what, I've been having the same exact nightmares.
You know, all this time, there were certain elements of
the dream that were the same, especially the same type

(01:03:11):
of creature. The feeling of helplessness and the feeling of
like being violated was something that he would wake up
with a lot.

Speaker 2 (01:03:24):
And then so.

Speaker 3 (01:03:28):
In every single dream, both of the twins, they were
always with Charlie and Chuck every time, and so they
started to wonder, you know, the last time we really
spent any huge amounts of time with Charlie and Chuck
were this camping trip twelve years earlier, so what happened
there was a specific thing that happened during that trip

(01:03:49):
that made him think that. So again, it was August
to seventy six. They spent two weeks in Maine's Alligash Wilderness,
and the Aligash it covers like thousands of acres and
it's like in the northernmost part of the state. And
on the second night that they were out, Jim noticed
this bright object in the sky and he said, it

(01:04:10):
was just floating above the tree tops and it didn't
really seem to be moving in any direction. It was
just kind of there. So he's looking at it through
binoculars and it was tops thirty seconds, it wasn't very long,
and all of a sudden it just winked out, and
he said it came from the outside edges in so
it just kind of did a cool you know, and
it was gone, and there was something about it that just,

(01:04:33):
you know, he thought that was really strange, wasn't quite right.
So and the other saw it too. He wasn't alone,
but he's just the one that saw it through binoculars.
So they continue on and on the fourth day they
decided that they're going to go night fishing, and so
they built a great big bonfire so they could keep

(01:04:53):
an eye on their campsite where it was. And once
they were out on the water, Chuck was like, you know,
started getting this feeling that he's being watched. So he
looks over his right shoulder and there's this large, round
globe of light that looks exactly like what they'd seen
just two nights previously, and it had this royalting effect

(01:05:13):
to it, kind of like a miniature sun, and it
was very, very bright, and it was lighting up the
treetops again like daylight, and it was completely quiet. So
after they they all were looking at it, and for
what seemed like in several minutes, they decided, well, I'm
just going to signal this thing. So Charlie picks up
a flashlight and he squeezed off the message SOS, and

(01:05:34):
this thing instantly responds. So it starts coming towards them,
and so they're all like, oh shit, you know, So
they their paddles and they start paddling back to shore
and they are thinking the whole time. They're looking over
their shoulder and they're like, it's getting this thing's almost
on top of us. You know, this is crazy, and

(01:05:55):
Jack said he remembers thinking, there's no way we can
outrun this thing. Then all of a sudden, their next
memory is they're all back on the shore and they're
just staring up at this bright object. And Jim said
he remembered, I could pick up a stone. This thing's
so close. I could take a stone and just bounce
it right off that thing. That's how close it was.

(01:06:15):
And then all of a sudden it just streaks away,
very very fast, and within a few minutes. It's just
you can't tell it from another star in the sky.
It's that far away, that fast. But Chuck did say
that he remembers this whole time that they're watching it,
nobody was panicking. Everybody seemed to be really relaxed, which

(01:06:35):
is complete opposite of how they felt when they were trying. Yeah,
just a few minutes before. So all the men agree,
all four of them agreed that they were on the
lake for less than twenty minutes. But when they turn
around at their camp, their bonfire it was huge and
it should have burned for hours, and all that was
left of it was coals, so they had definitely been

(01:06:58):
gone more than twenty minutes, and Jim said, Uh, the
really strange thing was, you know, these are four young
guys that are out here camping together. And the really
unusual thing was that they didn't stay up and discuss this.
They were all just like super tired and they all
just wanted to go to bed. So that's what they did.

(01:07:19):
They just went straight to bed, and then they got
up the next morning and paddled to their next campsite.
So they spent another eight days out in Allagash Wilderness.
But they never did see this really bizarre light again.
And so as the years go by, they tell friends
and family that they had this UFO siding, But you know,

(01:07:40):
everybody kind of was like whatever, you guys are crazy,
and the guys, you know, they were kind of like not.
You know, you get to that point where you're far
enough out from a situation sometimes it's really hard to
believe yourself. But Jim and Jack were having these nightmares,
and so finally, once they talk to each other about it,
they decided that they were going to get a hold
of a UFA researcher and ask them what their thoughts were.

(01:08:04):
So they get a hold of a guy named Ray Fowler,
and Fowler suggests that they find a trained hypnotherapist and
undergo hypnosis to see what they can uncover, you know,
what kind of details they can recover, So under hypnosis,
and they're all hypnotized separately, completely separately by the same guy,

(01:08:26):
but under hypnosis, each of the men experienced terrifying memories
of being abducted, and they were almost the exact same memory,
so independent of each of them. They all drew illustrations,
and all four of them said they were taken aboard
this craft and the aliens forced them to strip naked
and seem to be conducting medical examinations, and that they

(01:08:48):
took samples of the men's skin and body fluids, so
that kind of plays into their nightmare, you know, where
they were seeing. They were able to see each other
in this in this situation, and it wasn't until after
the hypnotic or the hypnosis sessions were done that the
four discovered that they recalled the same events. And so

(01:09:10):
at that point they're like, okay, we want to know.
We're going to take polygraph tests, you know, and see
and they all four past them just fine. And after
all this time, none of them have backed down from
their stories. What Charlie said, he had a quote that said,
this happened. If you believe it, that's all right. If
you don't believe it, I don't care. I don't care

(01:09:31):
because it did happen. And so doctor John Mack, he's
a psychiatrist and he's an author, and he brought up
a very valid point. He said, usually there's the people.
These are people that they don't have an interest in deductions,
and they don't really read about it. They're unfamiliar with
any types of beings, and so when they hear somebody

(01:09:52):
else have a similar situation, they're really shocked in the
standard that someone else had this experience. So yeah, that
on that one I thought was interesting just because of
the fact that they were all even under hypnosis, telling
the same story. And when they were all did a

(01:10:12):
polygraph test it all, you know, they all passed.

Speaker 2 (01:10:17):
Right, Several of the people involved in Tonight's stories did
take polygraphs and also passed.

Speaker 3 (01:10:25):
So yeah, and it's also interesting how many of them
don't recall specific details unless they go under hypnosis. Yes,
like there's been a block pit.

Speaker 2 (01:10:41):
And that could be everything from the human mind trying
to protect itself to more nefarious things.

Speaker 3 (01:10:49):
Yeah, you could be right. Yeah, so I thought that
was an interesting one.

Speaker 2 (01:10:54):
I've blocked things out or I know it's possible.

Speaker 4 (01:11:01):
All of these are rather interesting. I mean, every single
one of them has some kind of an aspect. You're
just like, wow, yeah, Mark, did you do any research
on the Pasca Gula abduction?

Speaker 2 (01:11:12):
I did. The Pasca Gula abduction was. Let's just say,
I don't want to go fishing and what is it Tennessee? Now, yeah, yeah,
I am.

Speaker 4 (01:11:25):
You want to you want to do that one, I'll
let you have that one if you want.

Speaker 2 (01:11:31):
Sure, I'll do that. Okay. So these two guys, uh,
let's see, what's their names. I can't remember their names.

Speaker 4 (01:11:42):
Sorry, Charles Hickman and Parker.

Speaker 2 (01:11:46):
Okay, Calvin Parker and Charles. Uh. One of them was
much older than the other, can't remember which one. I
think Calvin Parker was the younger one.

Speaker 4 (01:11:55):
He was he was nineteen and Charles was forty two.

Speaker 2 (01:11:59):
They go about fishing, and they're fishing and they see this, uh,
this object. This they said, an oval, a lighted oval
shaped object thirty to forty feet across and eight to
ten feet tall. They said they were conscious and paralyzed. Well,

(01:12:23):
three creatures with robotic split mouths and crab like pincers
took them aboard the object and subjected them to and
a physical examination. It's like Mark has just been after
read school. I mean, and I'm terrible at speech. Okay,

(01:12:46):
all right, I did it in school. So anyway, guys, sorry.
They described the inside of this as being very very futuristic. Uh,
object comes out of the wall and does tests on them.

Speaker 4 (01:13:08):
And yeah, they said it was like a giant robot
eye came out and started doing experiments on them, right, And.

Speaker 2 (01:13:17):
And they've got a book, The Closest to Counter My Story,
which you guys should check out. Uh, And there's a
historical marker out there, so you can go to the site.

Speaker 3 (01:13:30):
That's pretty cool.

Speaker 4 (01:13:31):
You actually can.

Speaker 2 (01:13:31):
There's yeah, oh close, the one with all the pictures.
Damn it.

Speaker 4 (01:13:39):
So well you go go hunt the pictures back up
because they're pretty interesting. So yeah, I'll chit chat about
it for a little bit while you're while you're looking
at those so interesting. So like this this thing, this
disc was clashing this blue white and it was making
a really weird worrying wings sound. They said it kind

(01:14:04):
of hovered there and came off of it came these
little creatures that just kind of floated. They didn't walk
on the land, they were like floating just above. It
kind of paralyzed them and they felt was being pulled
on board, and just like Mark said, they were kind
of they got experimented on this huge They said, it

(01:14:26):
looked like a huge robotic eye that came out of
the wall and just started to kind of poke it
and prodded at them, and before they knew it, they
were being dropped back off on the side of the
lake that they were fishing at, or excuse me, the
river that they were fishing at. They left right away
and reported it to buy Healer Air Force Base or

(01:14:47):
Keysler excuse me, and the Jackson County Sheriff's Department, and
they actually secretly sorted both of them giving their separate views,
which no one found out about until much later. But
if you go back, you can actually listen to parts
of it. They, in my opinion, were being completely honest

(01:15:09):
about the entire situation. They were traumatized. They said, they
were completely worried about their families and what was going
to happen to them. And basically, we're not deceiving anyone.
They were telling the exact same story, and both of
them do a polygraph and passed it both past also
and even Alan Heinick. Jalen Heinick wrote about it and

(01:15:35):
said it was one of the most credible experiences that
he'd ever seen. In fact, you can read about it
in uh jalen Heinick's The UFO Experiment if you want
to read up a little bit more on it. Really
good book for anyone who's interested in UFO studies, by
the way. But yeah, it was also they described the

(01:15:59):
creatures really strange to Mark touched on.

Speaker 2 (01:16:01):
A little bit.

Speaker 4 (01:16:02):
They had like gray skin, but this time instead of
being shiny and smooth like they usually say it is,
they said it was more like elephant skin. That it
was really wrinkly and hard. No facial mouth, yeah, the
slit mouth. They had bullet shaped heads instead of like

(01:16:23):
the oval type of egg shaped heads like you usually
hear about. And they had crab like pincers they said hands,
but they were more pincher like. And of course they
levitated like I was talking about, just above the ground,
so instead of walking on the surface, they floated. Really strange.

Speaker 3 (01:16:44):
Yeah, when I lived down there. I only lived like
half an hour from where that is, And I.

Speaker 2 (01:16:50):
Saw interviews with these guys. They they were generally still
freaked out. M m. Yeah, years and years later, totally
freaked out. They weren't online and look for interviews with
these guys because that's they they're still freaked out.

Speaker 4 (01:17:14):
I mean yeah, like Enzo said, they covered this abduction
on the Netflix documentary called Files That They Unexplained. There's
also been a couple of indie movies made about it
and other small documentaries. And these have also been featured
on all the you know, Unsolved mysteries and the mysteries

(01:17:38):
on Travel Channel and stuff like that. It's kind of
all over the place. Very interesting though, And I do
think I think it was Alvin. The younger one wrote
a book about the experiment experience not too long ago,
I think.

Speaker 3 (01:17:53):
Yeah, I want to say, I mean the older guy
he's passed now, Kevin.

Speaker 2 (01:18:00):
Yeah, yeah, he was in his forties back in seventy nine.
So yeah, well the younger one would be seventy now.

Speaker 3 (01:18:13):
Yeah, that's what I's gonna says.

Speaker 2 (01:18:16):
He's not a young man. Like I said. The interviews
I saw years later, they were still you know, I
don't really want to talk about it, but I feel
like I got to you.

Speaker 3 (01:18:28):
Yeah type, Yeah, they weren't. They definitely weren't looking for
notoriety at all. They preferred not to have it. There's
a lot of weird stuff there. I felt there's weird
stuff anywhere though.

Speaker 2 (01:18:42):
Looking I mean looking at their faces while they talked
about this, I really felt the ring of truth and
what they were saying. So I like it when I
says to the Live universe or interviews, am a lot.

Speaker 3 (01:19:03):
Oh no, hang on.

Speaker 4 (01:19:04):
Oh, he called you by your full name, like you're
in trouble, I know, get that shot through your system.

Speaker 2 (01:19:11):
What do I do? Well? I get mark Land every day,
so it's it's fun.

Speaker 3 (01:19:17):
Hey, you didn't bring out the middle name.

Speaker 2 (01:19:18):
So we're okay. Yeah, yeah, okay.

Speaker 3 (01:19:21):
So oh I'm in the wrong one.

Speaker 2 (01:19:23):
Hang on.

Speaker 4 (01:19:26):
Zo, says Ufo. Contact at Pascagoula is available on Amazon,
published nineteen eighty three.

Speaker 3 (01:19:33):
Nice, yeah sweet Oh it was published in nineteen eighty three. Wow.

Speaker 4 (01:19:37):
Yeah, I was wrong on the I thought there was
one published sooner than that, but it might have been
like a documentary I was looking at or something. After
a while, all of this information starts kind of.

Speaker 2 (01:19:49):
I watched so many interviews in Red scrap.

Speaker 3 (01:19:55):
Yeah, okay, so this one that I have, I this
one's on the fence for me. And I say that
because I'm looking at it through a different lens. I
think it was written more from the aspect or the
just from the the side of UFOs. You know people,

(01:20:19):
but you know how we used to be more separated
into camps. There used to be the Bigfoot, the UFO,
and the ghost people. So this one kind of crosses
lines for me, But I was going to see what
you guys think of it. This one is about a
lady named Tracy Jones and her family and so for
several years she's from the UK, and she believed that

(01:20:43):
her house was haunted due to the just the amount
of paranormal activity that her and her family would experience,
and then when they would move residents, they thought it
would continue. So she was like, well, maybe it's just me.
But when it's really started to ramp up up in severity,
she started to think, Okay, maybe it's something else. So

(01:21:07):
what she was doing, and when we get into this,
a lot of her experiences they show up in a
lot of other UFO and alien abduction cases. There's one,
it's the Kelly k Hill incident. She would speak a
lot of dark beings, which you do do hear that
in some UFO cases, but those are also remarkably similar

(01:21:28):
to descriptions of the like shadow people, So there's a
lot of crossover on this one and other researchers they've
also drawn conclusions between alien beings and ghosts, you know,
especially crossing between like the gray aliens, or you know,
thinking that what might be a demon might actually be

(01:21:51):
you know, something more alien, or you know, back and
forth or entities from another dimension. So what going on
with these people? She she was having all these experiences
and then by the summer of nineteen ninety seven, that's
when she ended up contacting a guy named Tony Dodd,

(01:22:14):
and he's known as Britain's leading UFO detective. So what
when things started for her? She was actually decades earlier,
when she was a child. And what intrigued Odd about
this whole thing was the fact that not only was
she having these experiences, but she was also seemed to
be gifted psychically, okay, and so whether that was a

(01:22:38):
result of her experiences or not, he didn't know, but
that does seem to play into not all cases of
abductions or contact, but it does show up in a
few of them. So when she would first started speaking
to Dodd, she was able to describe the layout of
his office in his home even though she'd never been there.

(01:23:00):
And she also had like a certain sense when it
came to people or situations, but she always said it
was something she couldn't control, it was just there. So
when all this really started coming to a head, like
early in nineteen ninety three, Tracy's husband was named Darren,
and they had their first child, and they were living
in this cottage that they rented from her parents. It

(01:23:22):
was a three hundred year old cottage and like one
particular incident would be, shortly after nine pm, they heard
this really strange and almost an urgent humming sound coming
from outside. So they look out of their windows and
they don't see anything unusual. But then when they stopped
looking outside, all of a sudden, there's this intensely bright

(01:23:45):
light that just hits the cottage, just lights it up,
and it's so bright that they couldn't see anything of
their surroundings. And it only lasted for a few seconds,
but by the time it vanished and the humming had ceased.
When they looked at their clocks, fifteen minutes had gone by, so,
you know, they weren't quite sure what was happening. Scared
out of their minds, so they didn't go outside until

(01:24:07):
the next day when Darren would go out and see,
you know, if he could see what had happened. And
when he looked, they had like this really heavy wrought
iron fence that went completely around their yard and it
was all twisted and just wrenched apart. And he also
discovered that three large doors on outbuildings they had these

(01:24:28):
heavy duty padlocks. They'd been ripped completely off and the
doors were open. And over the time that they lived
in this cottage, this would happen over and over again.
And one of the strangest things that happened was Tracy
had been in and out of the hospital because she

(01:24:49):
had an infected wound on her chest and it was
affected to the point to where she had to go
daily to have everything changed and have you know, medication
and put on it everything. So she was doing these
daily visits. They went on for almost a month, and
then all of a sudden, she wakes up one morning,

(01:25:10):
expecting to continue treatments, and she's pain free, there's and
so she reaches for her chest and there's no bandage
there anymore, and the wound's not infected anymore. In fact,
it completely healed overnight, and the bandage itself, they couldn't
They had no idea where it went. It was completely gone,

(01:25:31):
which I thought was really incredible, and I would this
is when I haven't had a chance to look more
into but this part I would really like to see
if we could find more info on it, just because
that sounds so crazy. But she also had similar instances
occur where like undergarments she had on when she went
to bed, she would wake up the following morning she

(01:25:53):
would still have her pjs on, but her underwear would
be gone, you know, it would be just really weird,
and they would be completely gone, like not in the house,
not anywhere anymore. So that was a little concerning for sure.
But these they moved to their next home and these
events followed them there. But they continued to amp up,

(01:26:14):
you know, in intensity, like doors were opening and shutting
with bangs, Electrical devices and appliances were breaking. Even the
toilet would flush and taps would turn on under their
own power. Sounds very poltergeisty to me at that point.
And on several occasions Tracy would hear footsteps approaching and

(01:26:34):
to the point to where she could hear somebody pass her,
like in the hallway, like they walked right beside her,
but she couldn't see them at all. And there was
like one room in their house it completely smelled the
lavender all the time, and it was always permanently cold,
and there was a TV in that room that would
turn itself on all the time. So they go to

(01:26:55):
move houses again, and this time they move out to
the Yorkshire which is really close to where that first
story that I was talking about came from. And she
said that the activity followed them again and they were
regularly seeing these strange lights over the moors. They would
swoop down and back up and out of sight in
an instant. But this isn't so crazy, because there is

(01:27:17):
a long history of those lights being seen over the moors.
They weren't the only ones that were experiencing that. But
in this particular house, there was one morning when her
husband he goes to take a shower and she went
into the bathroom just seconds later to get some water,
and he's not in there, and she's like, I just
saw him come in here to take a shower. Where
is he? So she starts calling his name and starts

(01:27:40):
searching all over the house because she cannot find him anywhere,
and so she's freaking out, and so she's gone down
through she goes to run back upstairs, and all of
a sudden, he's walking out of the bathroom and she's like,
where did you go? And he's like, I just hit
his hair's wet. He just took a shower. And she
was like, did he step out of time or did I?

(01:28:04):
And it sounds more like she did than anything, but
he did start to from that point on experience increasing
instances of missing time. They also their two years old son.
He was also now experiencing night terrors, and on one
occasion he ended up with a strange four fingered handprint

(01:28:26):
clearly visible on his torso, so you know, things were
getting worse and they didn't have a lot of questions
or a lot of answers for their questions. And about
this time, Darren Is offered a contract to work in Dubai,
which they are like, absolutely, we need to get out
of here. Let's do that. So in July of nineteen

(01:28:49):
ninety seven, Tracy and Darren and they now have four
young children, and they move out to Dubai and they've
been there several there's like a several weeks delay before
Tracy and the children joined Darren. And what was interesting
during that time, Darren experienced zero activity, nothing out of
the ordinary at all. But when his family arrives, the

(01:29:10):
bizarre experiences begin almost instantly again. And their son, Marcus,
he starts telling their parents that there's a man that
lives in the light in his room, and then he
would go into the light with his sister to talk
and play to the man. And then he also seemed
to have knowledge of the roof of the house that
they were renting. He claimed that the man and the

(01:29:32):
light told them that there was a water tank on
the roof and there was a water tank on the roof,
and that, you know, that really worried the parents because
there's no way he could have known this.

Speaker 2 (01:29:42):
And then.

Speaker 3 (01:29:46):
Let's see Marcus's sister, another one of their kids, her
name's Georgina. She started to experience strange visitors and she
was telling her mom that there was a bright light
in her room from which a strange man would come out,
and so she drew a picture of this for Tracy.
Tracy added it to her collection of pictures that she

(01:30:07):
had been drawing, and when she showed these to Marcus,
the other child, he immediately singled out the one that
his sister had drawn and was like, that's the man
in the light.

Speaker 2 (01:30:17):
So I don't know, weird, it is weird.

Speaker 3 (01:30:23):
And so as this activity increases, and the malfunctioning of
the electrical equipment, it starts up again, and now Crockery's
moving across the kitchen table and smashing on the floor.
And Tracy said at one point her and Georgina were
sitting at the kitchen table one morning and then Tracy
just kind of jerked back to herself and realized she

(01:30:44):
couldn't account for the last thirty minutes. So at that
point she's been remaining in touch with Dodd through email.
And so in December nineteen ninety seven, Tracy and the
kids they returned to England and they ran a house there,
waiting on Darren to come back because his contract was ending.
But the activities followed them right back, and in particular

(01:31:07):
now it seems like it's focusing on Marcus. And an
interesting point is by this time, everybody in the family
was hearing someone's voice clearly speaking to them, even though
there was nobody in the house, so they didn't know.
She was starting to wonder, you know, is there like
an entity that's trying to trick that person into communicating

(01:31:29):
with them? And so she did finally agree to go
under hypnotic regression, and so they took her back to
the night that her chest wound had originally vanished, and
she told of waking up in her bed in the
middle of the night, and at the foot of her
bed was two dark figures. Each one wore a long
headed robe, which interest interestingly or not, is a detail

(01:31:53):
that often surfaces in such reports of under hypnotic regression
where there might be some type of induction. And she
would also state that each of the figures had piercing
bright blue eyes and white beards, which you don't always
hear that, but still, and suddenly in this regression, she
finds herself on a table. She can't move, but there's

(01:32:13):
nothing visible holding her down, but she notices there's like
a large needle descending towards her exposed wound on her
chest and these red lights appear to be coming from
the needle, and as the open wind on her chest
and the needle connect, there's an intense burning sensation and
she sees the strange hooded figures in the room, but

(01:32:33):
her head's always locked in an upward position, and that
at that point, they brought Tracy out of the session.
But according to this the incidents with the family continue
through today. But I just thought that was interesting. It
seems like a huge crossover between is it more poltergeistie,

(01:32:55):
is it more an abduction or a contact? Or is
it I mean, is it gim You.

Speaker 4 (01:33:02):
Know, I was gonna say it sounds like she's a
gig the window area because first house, it's I was
like that she's sitting in a window area, but if
it moved with her, it did just like she's her
own window area.

Speaker 2 (01:33:20):
Yeah. I'm spitballing here, but it almost sounds to me
like something discovered she had some sort of gift and
was experimenting on her and her family about her gift.
And even if they have stopped, she may be the

(01:33:41):
focus for this because it may be her subconscious mind
causing some of that turned on kind of thing, turned
on the turned on the juice to whatever it does.
It does this. I don't know whether it's UFOs, whether
it's paranormal and dimensional or whatever, or just plain old psychic.

Speaker 3 (01:34:05):
Yeah, it could be a little, it could be anything
that one just really you know, have me scratch in
my head. That's why I wanted to bring it because, yeah,
I have strangeness.

Speaker 2 (01:34:18):
Very strange. I don't have any any idea on that.

Speaker 3 (01:34:23):
And Zo said, so what are you supposed to do
about this if you're in that situation. I have no idea.
I'm not sure anybody would know. I don't know what
to do.

Speaker 2 (01:34:33):
Just hang on and try to stay sane.

Speaker 4 (01:34:36):
So yeah, yeah, it's all you could do is try
to safeguard as much as you can, keep your sanity
intact as much as you can.

Speaker 3 (01:34:47):
And how scary you know your kids are involved, especially
if there's a man coming through a light and you know,
talking to that and they're going into the light to hang.

Speaker 4 (01:34:58):
Out with him.

Speaker 3 (01:35:00):
Yeah, that's freaky. And you know what's interesting, maybe she
is too, and she just is blocked because you know,
kids are more, Yeah, they're more flexible, they're more it's
the word I can't think of the word. That'll come
to me here a little bit.

Speaker 2 (01:35:22):
Words are hard, They are hard.

Speaker 3 (01:35:26):
That needs to be our new motto. Words are hard,
are hard.

Speaker 2 (01:35:31):
Well, I can make that happen.

Speaker 4 (01:35:36):
Yeah, I can't imagine that would be. I can't imagine insanity.

Speaker 3 (01:35:40):
Do you see why?

Speaker 4 (01:35:41):
Because it's like, yeah, it very much reminds me of
John kill Mothman prophecies, like the mass amount of the
High Strangers that didn't seem to have anything to do
with the other, you know, uh, oh, nice scrolling words,

(01:36:02):
just a multitude of different like things that you never
thought had anything to do with each other. You've got cryptids,
and you've got paranormal and you've got poulter Geist and
UFOs and men in Black and all of it just
verging in on one spot.

Speaker 2 (01:36:17):
Yeah, it's all like, it's all the weirdness and a blender.

Speaker 3 (01:36:21):
Yeah, exactly, it's all swirling together.

Speaker 2 (01:36:25):
All we need is all we need is a giant
hearing man.

Speaker 3 (01:36:28):
Yeah, just a Crypti encryptid in there and we're mm hmm.
But yeah for it to actually mangle a wrought iron
fence day.

Speaker 2 (01:36:37):
Oh yeah. And that made me think some sort of
magnetic drive system but I mean, I don't know.

Speaker 3 (01:36:44):
Especially with the Yeah, maybe especially with the light that's
so bright that they couldn't even see in the house.

Speaker 4 (01:36:54):
Yeah, that's crazy.

Speaker 2 (01:36:57):
So yeah, all right, So.

Speaker 4 (01:37:04):
I'm gonna do my big one. It's one of my
favorite topics, and I haven't got to talk about it
on a lot on any of our shows, so this
was my opportunity. I'm a really big fan of Terry Lovelace.
If any of you all know UFO Terry Lovelace is.
He is most famous for the Devil's Den incident from

(01:37:27):
nineteen seventy seven. It's an amazing story. He's written books
on it and has done numerous podcasts and interviews and
TV shows and stuff on it. It's highly detailed, and
he had someone with him the whole time. So you've

(01:37:48):
got two exact versions of the story. And I'm just
going to go because it's just amazing. So and it's
it's in our stomping grounds, which excites me. It's within
our little area were so little, but.

Speaker 2 (01:38:01):
Within someone around, within a reasonable drive.

Speaker 4 (01:38:05):
Yes, within a reasonable drive. So Terry Lovelace and his
friend to Bias Uh at the time back in nineteen
seventy seven, Uh, they were actually stationed. They were sergeants
and amts at Whiteman Air Force Base. And Whiteman Air
Force Base is in Missouri. It's actually it sets kind

(01:38:25):
of between Oleifa, Kansas and Sedalia, Missouri, in that little
swap inside there is where the air Force base sits at.
And him and his friend Bias had some time off
and decided that they wanted to go do something, but
they didn't have much cash between them, and his friend
Tobias just all of a sudden one day said let's

(01:38:47):
go camping. Out of the blue. It's not something that
even one of them did. They weren't hunters, they weren't fishermen,
they weren't outdoorsmen. Neither one of them had really gone
camping before. So early on, Terry Lovelace says that he
felt that this entire trip was predestined in a way

(01:39:11):
against their will, and you're gonna get that idea as
I go through it. So he's suddenly like, yeah, let's
go camping. Where do you want to go? And his
friend Tobias said, well, let's go to Devil's Den. It's
down in Arkansas. And he was like, why would we
go clear down to Arkansas. There's tons of you know,
places to camp around us. And he was like, oh no,

(01:39:32):
it's going to be great. It's a beautiful land out there.
And Terry Lovelace was kind of a wanna be photographer.
He wanted to he had aspirations to be this fantastic
photographer and he had a really nice camera. And Tobias
told him, he was like, you can get all this great,
all these great pictures. And he was kind of an
anger astronomer, and he was like, there's you know, you

(01:39:55):
can see forever out there. He was like, we'll both
get something great out of this. Could have a breath
for on the cheap. So Terry Lovelace was like, let's
do it. So they actually spent weeks planning this down
to every last little detail, including what all they were
going to take, and it came up to them leaving
out and the mass amount of stuff they forgot ridiculous

(01:40:22):
and I actually listed it here. These guys were EMTs
in charge of loading ambulances and stuff. They knew how
to follow a list and to pat correctly, but they
forgot almost everything on this trip. So they left out
and soon realized that he had forgotten his camera and
all the brand new film he had just bought, so

(01:40:44):
that wasn't coming on the trip. They also forgot a
good flash light. They had one crap flash light with them,
but they forgot their good flashlight. They forgot their cooking pot,
They forgot their coffee, They forgot their two six packs
beer that they were going to bring with them, and
they forgot all the beans that they packed and various

(01:41:07):
other yeah, and they'd also forgotten like various food provisions
and stuff they had. They forgot their hatchet, they had
no way to chop up wood for far wood, and
they were going to be out there for four days,
and some various other little small tidbits pises about. All

(01:41:28):
they had was their tent, a cooler with a little
bit of water, and a little bit of cananda, and
some other little useless things like a little crap flashlight
and stuff. But they continue on right so, uh, they
get there, and they completely disregard the office license where

(01:41:50):
you go and get your license to camp. They skirt
past it, They skirt past the sheriffs. They get way
back into the woods. They're actually they at one point
took an huhing down to get off onto this little
teeny tiny dirt road. And note they're in a little
tiny car. They're not even in a truck or a jeep.
They're basically off roading in this thing. They wind their

(01:42:13):
way back through Devil's Den and they end up at
the most beautiful huge meadow Terry Lovelaly said he's ever
seen in his life. It was just full of wild flowers.
He was like, he just knew that it was the
perfect spot. And they stopped there and rather than making
their camp, because it was like six evening, they up

(01:42:36):
and decide, let's go for a six mile hike.

Speaker 3 (01:42:42):
Those words have never crossed my lips ever.

Speaker 4 (01:42:46):
No, well, I mean it wasn't originally like they were like,
go for six miles. They say, let's go for a hike.
So they go for a hike six miles. And in
this time period, if you look back at it, you
realize that there's starting to come underneath this really weird exhaustion.
They kept calling it, like a really weird exhaustion. They

(01:43:06):
just felt tired. And they actually both sat down to
take a break on this hike, and both promptly fell
asleep and woke up a few hours later, just as
the sun's getting ready to go down scary. His friend
wakes him up by kicking him and it is like,
we've got to go, So they're trying to figure out
their way back on this path that they've taken. They

(01:43:30):
finally get back to the meadow just as it's getting dark,
and they actually turn the light on the car to
shine at the meadow so they can get their tents
set up, which they can't do well because they can't
drive the steaks down into the ground because they were
going to use the back end of the hatchet for that,
so they use a rock and they can't get much
wood gathered up, so it's mostly just kindling kind of

(01:43:52):
stuff that they is only going to last him for
a few hours. They did manage to have a few
hot dogs in the cooler, so they heated those up.
They finally eat and they kind of get settled down
and they're kind of looking around leto in front of
this little fire they've got going, and that's where the

(01:44:12):
crap hits the fan as so they say, suddenly we
get a nice oz effect happening, and by oz effect,
I mean everything in the meadow goes dead quiet, not good.
And then the friend Tobias starts seeing these three lights
in the sky, which he at first thought were stars
and then soon realized those aren't stars, and they're getting

(01:44:34):
steadily closer and closer, and they're completely out of place,
and starts realizing that the triangle that they're making is
much darker than the sky behind it. Bump bom bomb
bad times a conn.

Speaker 3 (01:44:52):
Yeah.

Speaker 4 (01:44:52):
So suddenly, without much notice, this thing is right over
the meadow and those three lights on it are it
lights the entire meadow, And suddenly a search beam comes down,
this white light one and his friend Toby, in his
infinite wisdom, decided to flash back with that little crappy

(01:45:13):
flashlight they had, and when he did, the light changed
to a blue laser, which basically they described it just
kind of going all over the place and shining on them,
going in all sorts of different directions. I'm pretty sure
that it was mapping the meadow. What was doing, Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:45:35):
Don't ever.

Speaker 4 (01:45:41):
Yeah. So, while this blue light is flashing everywhere, they
both start feeling extraordinarily relaxed and sedated feeling, and both
looked at each other and just kind of decided to
climb into the tent and go to sleep.

Speaker 2 (01:46:00):
Not good.

Speaker 4 (01:46:02):
When when Terry woke up, he said, it must have
been a lot lot later. He didn't know exactly how
time had passed, but he woke up because the tent
was completely set up, almost like from the inside, and
he was extraordinarily thirsty. And he looked over and his

(01:46:23):
friend Toby was actually up on his knees and had
cracked the tin open. He'd opened the zipper a little
bit and was seeking out. He realized he'd been crying
and was horribly upset, and he said, what's happening, And
Toby said, there's yellow and green lights outside and there's
kids running around, and I don't know why. So he

(01:46:47):
took a peek too, and realized that those were not
kids running around. They were little small beings together in
groups of two or three, and they were literally just
running around underneath, like looking all around the little meadow area.
And while he was watching, they started grouping up even
more and started going towards the central light, and the
light was kind of like pulling them in and dissolving them,

(01:47:09):
and he soon realized it was almost like a tractor beam,
like pulling them back up into the spaceship. The spaceship
started making a sound and it started lifting off and rotating,
and it's the exact same path out as it had
come in. So this has happened, and he's sitting there
contemplating everything that's going on and knows that he's very,

(01:47:31):
very scared. And at this time, as Toby said that
they he said they us and had started crying again.
It's terrible stuff. So yeah, so at this point, while
he's thinking, he had a few memories popped up, which

(01:47:52):
he says he remembers quite well, and I put the
little list here kind of scary. So he remembers the
motion and pulled of being sucked inside like in that
white like that he saw the little kid being being
sucked up. He said, the large, the interior was very large.
Everything was white or stainless steel. The celian walls emitted light.

(01:48:16):
There were three flying saucers parked inside, so it's almost
as if it was like a mother's the type of situation. Yeah,
there were walkways and males and strange symbols etched into
the walls, and there was about fifty to sixty other
people on their and he remembers thinking he didn't think

(01:48:38):
that they were allowed to get off that they were
lucky ones, that they were probably still on there.

Speaker 3 (01:48:44):
Holy yeah.

Speaker 4 (01:48:47):
So after the craft was gone number one, he noticed
that the boots he asleep in were completely unlaid halfway down,
which did makes sense, like they were completely pulled out
of the islets halfway down. His socks were on crooked too.
He was thirsty, sick, and nauseous. His baked all over us.

(01:49:10):
He was feverish, itchy. It felt like he had bugs
crawling all over him. They grabbed the flashlight yeah, and
a little kitchen knife that they had with them, and
ran for the car and left. They left behind everything
they brought with them. The tent then got left behind

(01:49:30):
except for that one knife and the little crap flashlight.
They got the heck out of there in the middle
of the night, got back out onto the highway, and
drove home. On the way home, the thirstiness got worse.
They got completely flushed and their fevers spiked out, super
sensitive swollen eyes. Their skin was puffy and red. They

(01:49:52):
had itchy sores all over. They were severely sunburned with
no tan lines, which he realized later meant that at
some point they were stripped completely.

Speaker 3 (01:50:03):
Yeah.

Speaker 4 (01:50:03):
When he got when they got home, their wives were
so concerned about them they took them to the hospital
on base where they were treated for hundred and four
fever and radiation poisoning.

Speaker 3 (01:50:17):
And then that's when the minimum the sunburn. Yeah, yeah,
that was not a sunburn.

Speaker 2 (01:50:23):
Yes.

Speaker 4 (01:50:25):
Yes, a SI who were strangely dressed like men in
black and we're kind of acting as such, demanded the
photos that he was taking, even though he never even
you know, took his camera with him, and he was
never allowed to speak to Toby again. Now he does
end up speaking to him again much later. I'm not
going to go into all that because this is a

(01:50:46):
very long story that continues on much further. Another interesting
thing just for everybody to kind of chew on a
little bit. He was given a but ton of pills
to take for all of this, and uh, he was
interested because he didn't and there's a lot of these. Well,

(01:51:06):
he's an EMT, so he's seen a lot of you
know ones out of the pharmacies. And he asked his
pharmacist where these pills were from and she said, well,
they're not from me. I did I've never even seen these.
And he did some research and found out that they
were actually coming from right parent Patterson, not FA Pharmacy.

(01:51:31):
He actually stopped taking them just a couple of weeks
after he started them because while on them, he noticed
that he was starting to lose memory, even his like
day to day memory, Like he couldn't remember what he'd
done in the It was a racing everything that he
had remembered. So it keeps going. If you're interested in

(01:51:51):
the story in Oh my gosh, it keeps going. It's
so interesting, and you learn it's not his first UFO experience. Yeah,
you can get his book. It's called Incident at Devil's
Den by Terry Lovelace. It's a really really good read.
And then if you're interested in UFO abduction whatsoever, he

(01:52:14):
actually did a second book to it, called Devil's Din
The Reckoning, And this is I don't remember how many
UFO abduction stories from people read his first book and
were so intrigued and wanted to share their own stories
with him, So he collected those up and those are
in this book. Super super interesting.

Speaker 3 (01:52:35):
That's cool.

Speaker 2 (01:52:36):
And there's hours and hours of interviews and stuff with
this man all over the internet.

Speaker 4 (01:52:43):
Yeah, and he is extraordinary, credible. I don't even have
like he's done everything. He is in a very important figure,
not just in paranormal and UFO, but outside of that.
He hit some very high ranks in some different fields.
And he is extraordinarily well spoken. He gives the best interviews.

(01:53:07):
I've probably listened to a dozen or so interviews with him,
and his story has never changed.

Speaker 3 (01:53:13):
So same and I do well enough on my own.

Speaker 4 (01:53:18):
Yeah, and says I'm over fifty, I don't need pills
to help me forget stuff.

Speaker 2 (01:53:24):
Same. Yeah. On bookcounts, I am absolutely right there. I've
never really need an excuse. Now, I just use the
fact that I'm pushing sixty to say that that's the excuse.

Speaker 3 (01:53:46):
Crazy.

Speaker 2 (01:53:47):
Yeah, and that that's a really good story. The doctor's
report said that they had some kind of flashburns, and
there's there's documentation, so it's just not something that they'd
dreamt up.

Speaker 4 (01:54:04):
The doctor before they released them from the hospital told
him number one, they were never allowed to see each
other again. They put them on different ends of the
base until they could get Tobias moved completely. They completely
moved him off and put him somewhere else. They even
told their wives they were not allowed to ever speak
to each other again, that's good. And then they gave

(01:54:26):
him a full story. Tell if anybody asked about his
weird issues, it's like the burns and stuff that the
doctor told him. If someone asked, all that happened was
that you fell asleep out in the middle of nowhere,
out on some rocks without any kind of sunblocks. So

(01:54:46):
you got sunburn marks because you fell asleep in the
grass and got covered in chiggers. And you have uranium
poisoning because you fell asleep on an out outcropping that
had uranium in it. So you've got poisoning. And that's
what happened. You got really very.

Speaker 3 (01:55:08):
That's crazy.

Speaker 4 (01:55:09):
Yeah, yeah, I know, but that was just the kind
of and it's it's so coolluted, and there's so much
more to the story, like it continues on. He actually
did some question work and things started popping back up
for him after he got off that medication. He eventually
gets back in touch with Tobias years and years and
years later, and they start conferring again about what all

(01:55:32):
went on. It's just and and you get to hear
about his childhood and he actually started remembering some things
that had happened to him when he was young, he'd
had some experiences, so super interesting if you're interested.

Speaker 3 (01:55:47):
That's funny.

Speaker 4 (01:55:55):
Is it one of those cool ones though? Does it
have like the chili side.

Speaker 2 (01:55:59):
Chili side in the handside idea? Yeah, well, ladies, I
think we covered a lot of these. A lot of
these really deserve a deep dive someday. We ought to do.
A lot of them have been deep dived so many
times that we probably won't be breaking any new ground.

(01:56:21):
But it is a fascinating subject, and this is just
there are hundreds of these out there. These are just
some of the more well known ones, and get on there.
I invite everybody out here to get on here and
start researching this stuff because it is absolutely fascinating. Many

(01:56:42):
of them are very very different, many of them are
scarily similar, and I challenge everybody to go out there,
look into it and make up your own minds. I
quite frankly, am a little freaked out after some of
the stuff I've watched heard, So it's concerning. It is,

(01:57:05):
and this is a subject that I don't study enough,
but I find absolutely fascinating.

Speaker 4 (01:57:11):
So it is.

Speaker 2 (01:57:13):
Yeah, all right. With that said, I think I think
we're done for the evening. I hope that everybody has
had fun listening to our nonsense, or at least my nonsense.
I don't know.

Speaker 4 (01:57:28):
I think some of them were having a little too
much fun.

Speaker 2 (01:57:35):
I am famous for nonsense, so we'll just go with
that anyway. Next week, be sure to tune in for
a brand new episode of What If Tomorrow on Monday night,
and on Wednesday night, a brand new episode of border
Town Strange. I'm sure ladies have something really fun cooking

(01:58:01):
up for you right now. Sure, yeah, I have the
utmost most.

Speaker 3 (01:58:14):
I have an idea, you guys, we'll discuss it.

Speaker 2 (01:58:18):
I have an idea. All right, Well, good night everybody,
and keep looking good night everybody. M h m h

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.css-r6mb8g{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:1;overflow:hidden;}My Favorite Murder with Karen Kilgariff and Georgia Hardstark

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