Ep 320: Cena's Last Match This Weekend. Continental Classic Heats Up.

Episode 320: John Cena's last match this weekend on Saturday Night's Main Event. In AEW, The Continental Classic heats up.  All the latest news.
















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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:05):
What's up, everybody? Welcome back to Pro Wrestling After Hours.
I'm Michael Carlisle, joined as always by Micah Franco. Micah
was shaken man.

Speaker 2 (00:16):
A death rive through the Callous Family because of a
Continental Classic is the vibing all of us. If you're
in one universe and if you're in the other, it's
like on Saturday Night, a big gust of win ends
because it's something we can't see.

Speaker 3 (00:31):
Were you trying to go, John Cena? You can't see
me there? Yeah?

Speaker 2 (00:36):
I was bringing up the death Rids, the Callous Family
from one brand and John Cena from the other. The
what feels like the three most prevailing storylines of our
two biggest pro wrestling brands.

Speaker 1 (00:47):
Yeah, that's probably fair. The Continental Classic over in ae W,
and not just the tournament itself, but the further dissension
is causing in the Callous Family where it or may
not be directly leading to with the Death Riders as
you mentioned, and yes, over in WWE. Uh, John Cena's

(01:09):
last ride you can't see me The last time is now,
how however you want to phrase it, assuming he's sixx
to it.

Speaker 3 (01:19):
John Cena's last match on Saturday.

Speaker 2 (01:22):
That's what we've been told and at the same and
at the same time I believe. I also saw he
has inked a brand new five year deal as an
ambassador of the show. So he's gone. But John ain't
gonna be gone.

Speaker 1 (01:42):
Well, hold on, John never said he was gonna be gone.
He said last match.

Speaker 3 (01:51):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:51):
Look, I would fully expect.

Speaker 3 (01:52):
John Cena to to stay around.

Speaker 1 (01:54):
I mean, hell, he's being advertised. We talked about this
last week, being advertised to the role after WrestleMania. I
don't think he's gone gone, but as far as wrestling, maybe,
although could we see him again at some point, I mean,
typically speaking, we do when people retire, so I don't

(02:14):
even think people will hold it against him. But as
far as what passes for a full time career for
him at this point, semi full time career. Yeah, until
they prove me otherwise and he comes back for an
extended run, I'll take him at their word that this
will be it for Sina.

Speaker 2 (02:33):
Some form of it for Sina. Yeah, you're right. Coming
back a couple months later, like we said, Hall of
Fame induction, I'm sure he'll have returns, he'll have promos.
The funniest thing that I heard since the heel face
turned about John Cena in one of the many promos
that they've been giving him recently. I'm talking about the
the backstage, the interview ones he said, and none of

(02:55):
this will be remembered. The ww audience has such a
short memory span that none of this will be remembered
really by Royal Rumble, because we'll be off into the
road to Russell Mania. And I find that incredibly short sighted,
because if we really had that shorter memories, we really

(03:16):
wouldn't remember who John Cena is for this retirement tour
that's happening three to four years since he's been sporadically
around the program. So if you were gonna forget that quickly,
you know what I mean, we would forget that quickly.
I don't think that he was going in the right
direction with that comment.

Speaker 3 (03:34):
Oh I think he's one hundred percent right. He is
one hundred percent right.

Speaker 1 (03:41):
Wrestling fans historically short sighted memories. Obviously, you're gonna remember Sena,
You're gonna remember the career, the retirement tour, the Botch
heel turn. Yeah, whether it's we don't want to remember that,
or you know, I want to remember prime Scena versus

(04:03):
into the road for Sena. Yeah, I actually think he's right.

Speaker 2 (04:06):
I'm gonna have a hard time forgetting some of this myself.
I truly wish I would just thick with the memories
of aj Styles beat up John Cena, Randy Wurton trying
to kick him in the head, Kevin Owens and him
having a classic back and forth. I want to think
of those three things most importantly. But some of this
has just been really really impactful on me.

Speaker 3 (04:33):
No I look, yeah, no I look.

Speaker 1 (04:38):
If you ever wanted to do a master class on
how not to do a pro wrestling retirement tour.

Speaker 3 (04:45):
This is it.

Speaker 1 (04:47):
The fact that it's been as close to being successful
as it has is a credit to John Cena and
how much the fans like him. Nothing to do with creative,
with looking with matches or any of that, because honestly,
from the creative side of things, at points in time
you kind of wondered, who in WWE h John Cena

(05:10):
and why are they trying to ruin his retirement tour.
The heel turn, which nobody wanted, went nowhere. Now, you
could have done something with that had it been done correctly.
But with the rock deciding to take his ball and
go home and all that that killed it before it
ever got going. You turn him back seemingly on a whim,

(05:34):
and then you had losses along the way that didn't
make sense because he had.

Speaker 3 (05:39):
No interest in trying to avenge those lots.

Speaker 1 (05:41):
I'm still waiting for him to try to avenge the.

Speaker 3 (05:44):
Rock Lessener loss.

Speaker 1 (05:45):
Obviously that ain't gonna happen, but yeah, it's been.

Speaker 2 (05:50):
Done incredibly poorly. Not to mention he had to do something.
He had to do something as Survivor series. I understand
a rub to dom my stereo, but just me, I
there's something just unsatisfactory about the going downhill of how

(06:13):
we've watched this, and I don't know if it's compounded
by that are number one pick. And normally, when we
go in to a tournament and you select the number
one pick and you say this thing is going chalk,
and it goes chalk, and the Lakers win and you're
celebrating that sixteen championship, you're good about it. But somehow
I didn't feel as good just watching Gunther steamroll through

(06:35):
this tournament in kind of a way we expect. And
now I'll give them credit. The La Night match had
a couple moments that felt a bit more competitive, but
I didn't really think there was a point ever that
it felt like Gunther was gonna lose in lead up.

Speaker 1 (06:51):
No, I think it was almost preordained Gunther was gonna
be the final opponent, for better or for worse. I
guess rather than just announcing it, you felt the need
to have a little drama with it and do the tournament.
But yeah, I don't think there was ever much of

(07:11):
a question who the final opponent was gonna be unless
they tried to swerve us at the last minute, and
sure enough, Gunther gets the win over La Night in
the finals of the Retire John Cena Tournament, whatever the
hell they actually called it, and he's going to be
the opponent. I don't have a problem with him being

(07:32):
the opponent. I think we kind of all knew that
was probably going to be the case.

Speaker 3 (07:37):
How we got there. Could it have been done better?

Speaker 1 (07:41):
Yeah, I'll do you one better than that. You're retiring
John Cena with a Saturday Night's main event card, which
isn't NBC Saturday Night's main event anymore. It's strictly Peacocks
Saturday Night's main event and the rest of this card. Micah,
if we're being completely honest, as the kids say, sucks balls.

Speaker 3 (08:05):
This is a.

Speaker 1 (08:05):
Terrible fucking card. Anybody who watches this is watching this
for John Cena, and look, that might be more than enough.
I'm not saying people won't tune in for it. Hell
that's probably a big enough draw. But hell, I don't
even have a problem necessarily with featuring some NXT talent.

Speaker 3 (08:25):
I get it, you're gonna.

Speaker 1 (08:26):
Get eyeballs, show some some young talent, some new talent.
But there is nothing exciting about this card other than
Sena versus Gunther, and I don't even other than it's
the last time you're gonna see John Cena in the ring.
I don't even know how exciting that match is.

Speaker 2 (08:46):
If we're being honest, I don't know what my reason
and be excited about that match is. I'll go steph further.
I don't know how much more it adds to Gunther too.
Now he's the guy that retired John Cena, because I
don't feel like it did him that much good to
have the title of the man who retired Goldberg. Now

(09:07):
you're gonna retire John Cena also, and your Minie Randy
Horton the Legend Retier Okay match will probably be better
than I expected. I'm expecting it to easily be the
best match on the card. I just don't know what
good it does if you're looking at it from a

(09:30):
impartial standpoint. We're pretty sure that John's losing. You're putting
over gun there, and just because we know that's a
foregun conclusion, as the tournament is a foregun conclusion, it
leaves me with less anticipation because there's a lack of story.
So I'm not sure what the general reason is for
the excitement from that perspective where we know where the

(09:51):
story is already going, but what makes the story it exciting.

Speaker 1 (09:58):
Well, there's no lack of s that's just not accurate.
If you want to tell me the story is not good,
I'll hear that argument, because that's a problem with any
type of retirement thing unless there's a belt on the line,
or you're doing it career versus title or career versus something.

(10:19):
When it's a long tour, you know how it ends.
It ends with Sena's last match, whether he's victorious, whether
he's not. But there's no titles at stake, So from
that standpoint, it is anti climactic. I don't disagree with
you on that, but I think the story's been there.
I think they've done a good job over the last

(10:40):
week or so of building to this. You know, Gunther
hasn't been there weekend and week out during the scene
of retirement tour, so until he was officially the last opponent,
you couldn't really build the match itself. Yes, in some
ways it is anti climactic, but that's not even so

(11:02):
much from the storytelling standpoint as it is that's how
this was always going to end, because it with no
titles on the line or anything like that, there was
no other way for it to end other than being
anti climactic. The big story is Cansino win in his
last match or does he lose in his last match?

Speaker 3 (11:20):
Yeah, that is anti climactic. I agree with you on that.

Speaker 2 (11:24):
And also a part of the anti climatic maybe that
you pointed out Johnsena doesn't even care if he loses anymore,
and I'm not talking about every win and pro wrestling
shouldn't care if they win or lose because we're in
a written, produced, theatrical drama. No no, no, no, no,
you said it. He ain't mentioned brock Lesner. He didn't
care about it. He lost to Dominic Mysterio, got cheated,

(11:47):
swindled thirty ways from Sunday, and he's not even going
to show up to a venue to cut another promo.
Really about it. He already knows he's preordained to this tournament.
So there feels like there's a lot of emotional connection
for does John Cena carefe winsor loses because it doesn't
seem like he's he's carried if he's lost recently, does

(12:10):
does that make sense? Also?

Speaker 1 (12:12):
Yeah, that's assuming John Cena is to be believed, and
I've got no reason to doubt him. That's all on WWE.
Sina was on Joe Rogan last week. He said his plan,
the original plan was to do two hundred dates. Now
in this day and age, I don't know that there
are two hundred dates, but the point being he wanted

(12:32):
to be there every week. It was WWE who wanted
way less dates and spread it out the way they have.
So from that standpoint, it assuming Sena is being honest,
and again.

Speaker 3 (12:46):
I don't doubt him.

Speaker 1 (12:47):
That's more on how WWE decided to tell this story
rather than the way Sina wanted to tell the story
because he wanted to be there every week, and if
he's there every week, at that point, you do have
the opportunity. Fuck you, Brockley, you came back blindsided me.
I want my revenge. There could have been a lot
more meat on the bone then, But if you were

(13:07):
limiting the number of dates and appearances, yeah, it had
to play out the way it did. I think there
was a lot better ways to do this. In the end.
This was about taking John Cena around to these cities
one last time and things like that. From that standpoint,
I have to assume it was incredibly successful from a yeah,

(13:31):
but from a TV storytelling standpoint, to me, it left
it left a lot to be desired.

Speaker 2 (13:40):
It was like you went to a buffet and then
they very quickly restricted you on how big the plates
can be. Is what it felt like. There was a
lot to be desired. I'm sure it's gonna be the
best match on the card. I'm sure we're gonna see
John Cena back in some capacity quite frequently or have

(14:00):
a presence still around the brand, obviously, and then you
also see him on Wipeout, where there are re one,
So it's not like the media star of John Cena's
going anywhere without active. He's gonna be in Hollywood, he
will be around in WWE, and I'll also be pretty
sure it may not be a match, but this won't
be the last time we see him in anyone with

(14:21):
an AA or a five knuckle shovele.

Speaker 3 (14:23):
Yeah, as far as gumph goes.

Speaker 1 (14:28):
With what you're doing with the two world title pictures
or the heavyweight title in the world title pictures, respectively,
he needed to take a step back. As far as
plan b's go. Retiring Goldberg, retiring Sena in and of
itself ain't a bad way to go. The amount of
time between those things, the amount of time he's been gone,

(14:53):
probably hurts that a little bit. But assuming assuming Gunter
beats on Saturday, and assuming he does it in a
violent way, does it the way he says he's going
to do it, you can build Gunther off of this
and put him right back in title contention. Now does

(15:16):
it play out that way? It's WWE We're gonna have
to see, But I think you're in a good position
where you're gonna have to try to f this up
for Gunphther in order to f it up. Having said that,
we also just talked about how it seemed like at
times they were trying to f up the John Cena
retirement tours. So I guess anything's possible as far as

(15:37):
it relates to Gunther coming out of this match and
going forward.

Speaker 2 (15:41):
And it wasn't like man the gout the title reign
was a little underwell main the Goldberg lead up was
a little underwell maing. They haven't done a lot of
good for Gunther in quite a while, so they could
do good off of this. They also could have done
a lot of good in those other scenarios where they
drop the ball, So we'll see if they hold on

(16:01):
to it to cross the goal line this time.

Speaker 1 (16:03):
Yeah, we'll look more at this match in a second.
The rest of the card Again, I I guess you're
just selling Sena and you feel like that's gonna be enough.
I get not wanting to overshadow him, but it doesn't

(16:23):
seem like there's much of a reason to tune in
other than Sena versus Gunther. Aj Styles and Dragon Le
defend their tag titles against Javon Evans and Leon Slater.
Do we really see I guess if NXT talent is
going to win a match, I could see it being
this one. But I kind of don't feel like the

(16:45):
other aj Lee, aj Styles and Dragon Lee. I don't
see them losing here.

Speaker 2 (16:51):
If I am to understand this correctly, Javon Evans is
an NXT talent and Leon Slater is a a TNA talent.
So this is actually a makeshift tag team from the
two developmental promotions that the ww WE likes to work
with to take on one of their slap together random

(17:14):
tag teams who I was halfway interested in the concept
of what is our name gonna be? Dragon Styles, aj
Lee was a fan favorite, and we just get the
tag team champions. Okay cool? Yeah, Okay, So that was
a great follow up from the WWE to keep us
all interested on what they would be named. And I'm

(17:36):
sure they're not losing the titles here. That'll be nice
to at least have talent be put in a nice position.
But yeah, it feels a little rundom when you figure out, oh,
they're not even an NXT tag team, They're a TNA
NXT slap together tag team. But both dudes have springs

(17:58):
in their legs. Hop for days ultra athletic. From the
highlights that I've seen on social media.

Speaker 1 (18:06):
I'm sure it'll be a fine match. How can it
not be with AJ Styles involved in it. I just
I don't know that it's something that excites the family.

Speaker 3 (18:18):
Well, maybe it does.

Speaker 1 (18:20):
We can certainly talk more about that aspect of it
next week when we're looking back on this.

Speaker 2 (18:26):
Well, I think the biggest issue for most of us
is it's WWE, and we're used to some side of
story attached to this, and when it's John Cena, story
is we're promoting new young talents. So we're promoting new
young talents, but he's taking on Guther, it's an established talent.

(18:46):
We're just looking for more connective tissue on why these
NXT teams are taking on these WWE teams. But booking
the tag team division with AJ and Dragon Lee doesn't
seem like it's been a strong clone of RAW so
far at all.

Speaker 1 (19:01):
Remember when WWE was going to run WCW completely separate
and they quickly abandoned that, and within three or four
months you were doing WWE versus WCW pay per view.
That was basically the end of the storyline. You were
killing it before it got started, and you just kind
of looked at the.

Speaker 3 (19:20):
Card and you're like, nope, nope, nope, nope, nope. That's
kind of what this feels like.

Speaker 1 (19:26):
Hey, we're going to showcase some young talent, some NXT
talent and whatnot. But you know how these matches are
all playing out.

Speaker 2 (19:35):
Am I wrong to think Cody is annoying?

Speaker 3 (19:40):
No, kind of annoying.

Speaker 2 (19:42):
To me Where he was going that was WW is
playing out exactly what my problem was with wargames. Wargames
is a war, it's a coleman nation, and for them
it was more of an igniter because Cody loses and
Cody cry baby is now all over Drew because he
didn't get his revenge. Will you already beg for Drew

(20:04):
to not be suspended? You were happy to have him
in war games too, and now you're attacking him because
that's prevalent to you. But it's so not prevalent that
it could take a back seat because you want to
go in against an NXT star Obi Femi. It just
feels like too much on the plate from Cody Rhodes
for where there is a prominent storyline to sidetrack to

(20:27):
take on a monster from NXT and I lose interest
in the match, where for months I've asked you about
NXT pay per views that you've put your eyes on,
and not the d ring has ever been the topic
of impression with Obi Femi. I'm sure that Cody's gonna
sell the shit out of this match until he gets

(20:48):
the victory to try to make Fami will look good.
But I don't know if I'm intrigued by it.

Speaker 1 (20:56):
I'm intrigued by what could happen. I'm not intrigued by
the match itself. Although look, Femmy's a big guy, he's
imposing looking. I think it'll probably be a fun match.
I kind of bet we don't get a decision in
this one that we get outside interference, whether it's McIntyre,

(21:18):
whether it's someone else. McIntyre would make a lot of sense.
We'll see, but you probably have a pretty good match here,
and then there's the outside interference schmas that sets up
something for whether it's McIntyre, Rhodes or Cody and someone else.

Speaker 3 (21:35):
So my guess would be that's what we get out
of this one.

Speaker 2 (21:39):
I wouldn't be surprised. There's the possibility of Ricky Saints
getting evolved. I believe he was in action with Obi
Femi the other night if he beat him, and that's
how he won this opportunity to go against Cody. So
there's an opportunity there. You already said it Drew McIntyre
as a possibility.

Speaker 1 (22:00):
You never know.

Speaker 2 (22:00):
With WWE, I would put money though, because you have
to have some battance somewhere. It's salt Ruka defeating Bailey.
The women's match will go the prospects way. That is,
Bailey's a lot in life at this point.

Speaker 1 (22:17):
Very possibly, and in the WWE world, it doesn't even matter.

Speaker 2 (22:25):
Good doesn't matter.

Speaker 1 (22:26):
You could have Bailey lose on Saturday and come back
on Rawl or SmackDown and win a women's world title.
I mean, that's just how WWE works. I'm not saying
they'll do that, but stranger things have happened. Yeah, I
did say earlier I could see Evans and Slater being
the the non WWE talent that wins. But soul Rucca

(22:50):
beating Bailey would not be the most shocking thing.

Speaker 2 (22:55):
And That's where I'm gonna hone in on. I wouldn't
be surprised if we're going gun the Cody, aj Lee
and soul Ruka.

Speaker 3 (23:05):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (23:05):
Look, I also don't think it's out of the realm
of possibility that Sina gets his hand raised one last time.
I think you're destroying Gumph at that point, unless Sina
somehow gets to win, and think Gunph just beats the
ever loving shit out of him and the show goes
off with Sina laying in a heap in the middle

(23:27):
of the ring, convulsing or something. But even then, I
think Gumph has to have his hand raised. It doesn't
seem like Sena has a problem doing that, so I
would expect that's.

Speaker 3 (23:40):
The road we go down.

Speaker 1 (23:44):
Certainly, you see the Losses scene is taken at the
end of this tour. To have him suddenly say, no,
I gotta be gun th, I gotta get my hand
raised in the last one would seem totally out of character.
So I'm assuming Gumhther wins here. Micah, I think if
we were talking betting favorites, Guntherer would have to be

(24:05):
the overwhelming betting favorite here. But this is wwe that
they could always do something Wonky.

Speaker 2 (24:13):
Gunther wins. This has all been so predictable for a while.
We called the dominic mysterio victory. We called the Guntherro
Tournament victory. I'm calling the gun Through victory here. John
Cena does the job. I would actually be quite happy
if it goes the other way because the reality of

(24:33):
WWE booking. Just look at the women's tag team division
right now. Anyone who attacks anyone from behind is automatically
considered in the tag team title picture. The USO's just
reunited out of the blue, and they're considered number one contenders.
All Gunther has to do is try to offend Cody's

(24:54):
wife on Twitter, and he's the number one contender for Cody.
We can just shove Drew mckinton out of there. So well,
I want to say, it's incredibly detrimental if Gunphther loses.
I just don't feel like that is the booking pattern
in WWE. He could get back in the mix easily.

Speaker 1 (25:13):
Oh, I can get him back in the mix even
easier than that. What if Sena versus Gunther isn't the
main event of Saturday night's main event. What if it
is Cody Rhodes versus Obafemi, and after Gunther is victorious,
he somehow interferes in this match or comes out after
the match and beats Cody down. Hey, I've retired Goldberg,

(25:36):
I've retired Sena. I just beat the hell out of you.
I want my title back. Give it up, or I'll
retire your ass as well. Boom, there you go. Not
saying that's what they'll do, but I mean, if the
goal here is to solidify Gunther as a player, have
him beat Sena and then make another statement, I could

(25:59):
see it going down that way.

Speaker 3 (26:00):
Now.

Speaker 1 (26:00):
Having said all that, I'd be really surprised if Sina
versus Gunther is at the last match. But I don't
know that it necessarily has to be the last match.

Speaker 2 (26:12):
You have to try really hard to fuck up Gunther.
I think he could lose still be in the mix.
I think he could win and be right there. I
feel like it probably does need to be the last match.
Even if he loses, you still feel like they'll be.

Speaker 1 (26:32):
The heroes.

Speaker 2 (26:34):
Clap after he's able to bring himself to his feet.
The refs are trying to help and he's pushing them away.
He's getting up on his zone because he's booked to
be there again so soon. I'd almost be surprised if
they had him the microphone at that point. But maybe
there's even a little hand of a microphone and a

(26:54):
thank you to the DC audience, a wink at the president,
who knows or whatever members of the political establishment will
be there, because maybe it's not Trump, but it is DC,
so you can't tell me none of them will be there.

Speaker 1 (27:13):
I could see a scenario where they're not, but yeah,
it is d C. Donald Trump, and I think this
is easy if it does have a long history with wrestling,
hosted back to back. WrestleMania's at Atlantic City was a
big part of the hair versus Hair match WrestleMania with

(27:36):
Lashly and Oomaga. He's in the damn WWE Hall of Fame.
I could absolutely envision a scenario where Donald Trump is
there and he brings some friends along. The other question
that seems to come up a lot is will one
of those friends be Vince McMahon. Anything's possible, And if

(27:57):
Vince McMahon walks in with the Trump on entourage, nobody's
going to stop the President and say, all you guys
are good, but that one over there has got to stay.

Speaker 3 (28:06):
You know you're not doing that.

Speaker 1 (28:09):
But otherwise I can't imagine a scenario where Vince McMahon
is there because you're not showing him on TV. I
can't imagining him walking in the front doors of the
arena with a ticket. I think it would be really
awkward for a lot of talent there if he's backstage.

(28:30):
So if you wanted me to put odds on it,
I think there are much better odds that Donald Trump
is there than Vince McMahon is there, despite their friendship,
no legit friendship with he and Seena and now seene
Ha just put his foot down. I ain't going out
there unless you let me bring Vince. Maybe you work
out something, you sneak him in the building and put
him in a suite somewhere. But I would actually be

(28:51):
surprised if Vince McMahon is there for this.

Speaker 2 (28:56):
I don't know if we're at the point yet in
the distancing from the product to bring Vince back. I
don't know if it's that important to really be live
to see John Cenen's last match. You're not getting to
be hands on. I don't know what that would do
emotionally for Vince, you know, to be there, to not

(29:16):
be a part of it. It's a lot of fun
to speculate. I think that it's more likely, like we said,
a Trump some other kind of member of his cabinets,
someone of his party.

Speaker 1 (29:30):
Is there, some of those folks that show up with
him at UFC events, like Cash Betel and Pete Headseth
and things like that.

Speaker 3 (29:38):
Thanks you.

Speaker 2 (29:38):
I don't know if these people's names, so thanks for
throwing them out right, But yeah, exactly, something like that, the.

Speaker 1 (29:42):
Trump kids, Eric and Don Junior and hell, but Baron's
probably a wrestling fan. He would seem to be in
that sweet spot age wise. Yeah, I could see something
like that. I just I don't envision I don't envision
Vince there though, And you're right, other than just because

(30:02):
of the friendship with Sena and Sena wants him there,
why would Vince want to be there to see his
baby being run by someone else, especially if he ain't
gonna be on TV, if he's not gonna be involved,
if there's no storyline reason for him to be there,
he'd probably just as soon sit at home and catch
some highlights or something.

Speaker 2 (30:22):
I'd be more likely to believe that at DC's probably closed.

Speaker 3 (30:27):
If he's still.

Speaker 2 (30:28):
Residing, I don't even know where Vince lives anywhere, But
if he still resides in Connecticut. He could easily get
a jet, John jumps on it and they have dinner
that night.

Speaker 1 (30:35):
Anyway, Yeah, oh absolutely I could see something like that.
But uh, yeah, I don't I don't know. Is Trump
gonna show up and sit there and watch all those
shitty matches waiting for the Scena match.

Speaker 2 (30:50):
No, he shows up right before the scene of match,
and you probably even air the walkout, just like the
WWE does, I mean the UFC does you air that?
On Peacock You literally have a camera in the back
following him to his suite, because there's no way he's
sitting in the front row for this.

Speaker 1 (31:05):
I could see him sitting in the front row, but yeah,
not for the whole show. I think there'd be a
lot of awkward shots of Donald Trump asleep, you know,
kind of like in his cabinet meetings, But with this
time it would almost be understood because you'd be like, yeah,
I'd like to kind of be asleep right now, catching
a little nap too during this Soul Ruca Bailey match.
But I would expect the WWE Hall of Famer slash

(31:32):
Leader of the Free World is probably there. Vents probably
not so.

Speaker 2 (31:36):
Much before we get away from the WWE talk, there
are other things going on besides Saturday Night. Did the
establishing of Rock Sane and Live as a tag team
on Monday Night? Surprise you? That colored me intrigued as

(31:56):
they move Raquel into challenging Stephanie Van, which I don't
think works out for her, but it's an interesting way
to go different than what was expected.

Speaker 1 (32:05):
I think it's a short term thing, but yeah, it was.
I don't know if there's not drama in the judgment
day is other than mysterio.

Speaker 3 (32:15):
Is there any reason to have any of them on?

Speaker 1 (32:17):
I don't think so, because it seems like there's always
some drama, some infighting and whatnot.

Speaker 3 (32:23):
So you know, this kind of fed that a little bit.
I didn't know. We had to run it by you.

Speaker 2 (32:30):
Well, yeah, do you think there's a possibility. I'm not
even sure when the pay per view is, but that
elimination chamber could be for the WWE women's tag titles?

Speaker 3 (32:44):
Is it an elimination chamber after the rumble?

Speaker 2 (32:48):
It could be way far down the line and too
far from me to say it might be, And I
know they're building it up now, but what do you
do with the eighty seven tag teams that they've thrown together.
I mean it feels like on Raw and SmackDown they
each have two or three tag teams going for tag titles.
I'm not sure how we settle this with all the

(33:10):
different teams they've established, and anybody who attacks anybody is
now a contender.

Speaker 1 (33:18):
Rumble will be the next pay per view in an
elimination chamber in February. Uh, maybe I'm just jaded. I
don't care about the WWE Women's Tag Team division because
it seems like the only reason they're pretending to care
about it right now is because Tony Kahan is winding

(33:40):
down his tournament to crown the first ae W Women's
Tag Team Champions. So they're like, whoa, we had women's
tag team champions first. We gotta do something to make
it seem like we care about that. But that's how
I feel watching it. And again, maybe I'm jaded. Maybe
I'm as wrong as can be, but that's how it
all comes off to me, so it's hard for me
to get all that interested in it.

Speaker 2 (34:01):
Maybe That's where I'm going with Rhea Ripley kind of
I don't know why she's everybody's tag team partner. Now, yes,
Damian Priest and eat A Sky, but you got that team,
you got the Goo BOOKI Warriors, then you got Charlotte
and Alexa you jump over and you got and you
got built up to five to six tag teams. So

(34:21):
we went from a fatal four way to a dynamic
half dozen or something. And I just wonder, maybe you're right,
they're just doing it to do it, because I wonder
where any of this goes. Where I guess the story
is just everyone wants the title, but it seems it's
prevalent because it's taking up so much time. But I

(34:42):
don't know where we're going with it.

Speaker 1 (34:43):
Yeah, No, if they're going to be serious about their
women's tag team title division, all right, I can get
on board with that. I just I've thought they were
going to be serious before and they really weren't, So
I don't know that I'm buying it.

Speaker 3 (34:59):
Now, but yeah, I I hear you.

Speaker 2 (35:01):
And as the women's division I feel like has been
so prevalent on Raw and SmackDown. Also, I am more
confused than ever about Maxine Dupree, having trained under Chad
Gable for years, being inept at wrestling, going away coming
back still as in nept getting a miracle victory over Becky,

(35:24):
and now we're seeing footage a couple weeks later of
Natty turning her into a badass when she's been around
Natty quite often. I just wish the story would have
played out where we're still waiting for the Icy title
match and she comes back as a badass and wins
that rather than a champion. Turning into a badass after
winning the title feels very uninspiring to me.

Speaker 1 (35:49):
Well, you're being trained to be a badass by someone
who on WWE isn't really a badass.

Speaker 2 (35:56):
Now that's maybe the missing link.

Speaker 1 (35:57):
Yeah, now her independent dates and things, but when she's
on WWTV, Natty not really a badass.

Speaker 2 (36:06):
Well reportedly, now after a year of begging, and just
like a clip in the promo, it looked like in
the background, tough Natty is going to get her opportunity
to run this character on WWE. I'm like, really, it
took all those dates, all those Blood Sport, GCWMLW dates
to finally get this character on TV. It almost feels

(36:30):
a little tiring, right, And look.

Speaker 1 (36:32):
All that's fine and great, but you've got to establish
that character on WWETV first before you have her as
a badass, not established trying to train someone else to
be a badass.

Speaker 2 (36:44):
Oh, but they've already just done it. They've just done it,
and the ratings are great and everybody loves WWE. So
I tell you this holes in the story and it's
a problem. But I don't know how to quantify what
they do as a problem when we're just the ones
pointing out the we sound like sober pustles a little bit.

Speaker 3 (37:02):
Yeh, yeh, I'm with you on that.

Speaker 1 (37:05):
We saw the the hooded figure again on raw.

Speaker 2 (37:10):
Well you know why it's not South rawlins that who
would be bedazzled? Come on, motherfuckers, you know he cannot
just wear plane black and not be seen. But yeah, yeah,
another member of the Vision keeps implementing himself and attacking people,
and Austin Theory is out there doing it. I'm still

(37:32):
not gonna care when the un mask amnutes Austin Theory
in thus some way this turns out to be Buddy Matthews.
That still doesn't matter. MJF. Maybe Buddy Matthews, Eddie Murphy,
Buddy Murphy.

Speaker 1 (37:50):
Who's still under contract and will probably have a year
added to his contract. When his contract is up, you
think that's who's going to be.

Speaker 2 (38:00):
I don't have anybody better besides the person actually doing
the actions right now in that hood is Austin theory.
Now who they unmasked could be interesting. I think it
can still be Chad Gable.

Speaker 1 (38:15):
I think it's gonna be awesome, for better or for worse.
It's gonna be Austin theory. And if you want to
tell me that's gonna be for worse until we see it,
I won't argue with you, because, yeah, again, isn't he
the dude that had his money in the bank title
shot and used it for the US title and.

Speaker 3 (38:36):
Wasn't even successful.

Speaker 1 (38:37):
I think that's how hell look again, Short Memoriespan, maybe
the fans forget about that too. Micah Over in ae W,
You've got the continuation of the Continental Classic this week
on Dynamite. Among the Continental Classic matches, we saw death
Writer on Death Writer action with Claudio Castignoli and John

(39:03):
Moxley going at.

Speaker 2 (39:04):
It the whole tournament. The story that it builds together
is crazy because I think I know where they're going,
and then you get to collision and they change it.
At least as we're on Dynamite, you feel like you're
getting the succeeding of power. They went at it tooth
and nail in that main event. In a violent, ferocious

(39:26):
forearm finish, Claudio knocks Moxley out cold in a moment
where it felt like we were assuredly going to a draw,
as they have the point per person built into the draw.
This felt like one of those matches and it ends
in the last seconds. You felt like the change of

(39:48):
power that we were looking for in the Death Writers
was being precipitated right there. And then we get to
collision and that's not what we were reading. But what
were you getting after Dynamoe.

Speaker 1 (40:01):
After You know, we've talked a lot about the end
of the Death Riders, or at least the changing of
the guard with the Death Riders, and how it had
to be someone from the outside. You had even brought
you up, brought up kut Claudio. You know, could they
beat Moxley down? Could Claudio take over? Like, no, it's
got to be somebody else coming out of Dynamite. I

(40:22):
felt like it's going to be Claudio. They have just
set this up. He defeats Moxley. YadA, YadA, YadA. Then
we get to Collision and you have Claudio losing to Dorada.
So all of a sudden, I feel reinforced in, Well,

(40:43):
it can't be Claudio. It has to be someone from
the outside. I don't know, but I do think we
are headed to a break between Moxley and the rest
of the crew. Who takes over? Do they become just
another faction? Is they're an outsider and it could be
someone within the company. It didn't have to be someone

(41:04):
outside the company. When I say outsider, but outside the
death Rider circle, I think the group becomes lesser than
if they beat Moxley down, take him out, and then
one of them steps up. I think it has to
be somebody else. And by the so to answer your
question long way around, my apologies. After Wednesday I thought

(41:25):
it could be Claudio. After Saturday, I do not.

Speaker 2 (41:28):
That's the exact confusion, especially when it was a trio
of death Rider losses. Even Pack loses to Okada, he
was dominant, but he still takes the l in the match.

Speaker 3 (41:41):
In the end.

Speaker 2 (41:43):
You don't know what is going on now with that
reconfiguration where because for a moment I thought shortly Claudio
is gonna blast through Derata, and this is gonna put
him into a position where he probably doesn't make the
finals because we're still doing takeshmi Okada, which we'll get to,
but at least got him in that semi final bracket,
if you know what I mean. I thought we're gonna

(42:03):
be on that trajectory and possibly a point where Moxley
is looking like last year's commander going oh four and
we're just supplanting his demise. That may still be true
for Moxley, but it feels a lot more level. Let's
Pack and Claudio take losses too. Hey, you guys are
not available in this tournament either. That kind of perplexes

(42:25):
the story. I feel a bit.

Speaker 1 (42:30):
Now as far as as Moxley and Claudio go.

Speaker 3 (42:33):
I enjoyed the hell out of the match.

Speaker 2 (42:35):
I thought that was a banger.

Speaker 1 (42:36):
Yeah, I thought they told a really good story. I
just think the follow up on collision with and look,
I get it. Here's the problem with doing tournaments like this,
especially around Robin. To keep them interesting, people have to lose.
You're not running through the tournament undefeated, so you have,
in the case of Claudio, a huge win against Moxley,

(42:57):
a teammate and all that, and then you come back
back in it's the proverbial fart in Church against Derata.

Speaker 3 (43:06):
Look, same thing.

Speaker 1 (43:07):
Kevin Knight losing to uh, you know, was hot after
week one, runs into Kyle Fletcher this week. Oh yeah,
all of a sudden, this is what we thought.

Speaker 3 (43:16):
We were gonna get from Kevin Knight in this tournament
in l.

Speaker 2 (43:21):
So.

Speaker 1 (43:23):
As much as I enjoyed the Continental Classic, and I'm
glad they brought it back, there are issues with the
booking because everybody's most everybody has to get some wins
somewhere along the way. You brought up you know, commander
going oh for last year, and maybe that happens. I
could wind up being Jack Perry, who's for those who

(43:44):
ever heard subbing for Darby Allen who's unable to compete
due to injury. But yeah, as far as your upper eschel,
I mean, hell Okata is still looking for a win.

Speaker 3 (43:56):
Am I correct?

Speaker 2 (43:58):
No? Okata beat Pack, That's right, that's he beat Pack, but.

Speaker 3 (44:01):
You know he loses week one. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (44:05):
So yeah, it's with with the tournament format, the round
robin tournament format format. You gotta have guys win, you
gotta have guys lose.

Speaker 2 (44:15):
Do we read anything into the entrances Claudio backed by pack,
Garcia and Wheeler will only Max being accompanied by Marina,
And that does slightly stick out because Max has been
the one accompanying Garcia in many scenarios. But I'm not

(44:36):
sure if if we read deeper into the storylines, is
there enter politicking and the Death Riders? Is there predetermined allegiances?

Speaker 1 (44:45):
I think you do have to read something into that,
and I think that's something is there's Mox and Marina
on one side and there's everybody else on the other.

Speaker 2 (44:56):
Well, then our prediction is Marina is the one that
sticks the knife in his back. Maybe I don't think
she takes over, but I think she's the one that
has to cut the head off the snake that they're
going to be like. She's the last one on the
plane you need to jump over on our side, and
I think his loss will finally lead to her being
the one that cometh over. Now, I also wonder if

(45:16):
this opens up the Death rid associate from New Japan.
Do you think we get more Gabe Kid here, making
the group at least one more guy, and he can
almost move in to the Claudio position. Should Claudio become
the leader, even though that might be disappointing. Do you
think that makes sense to them bring in a new general.

Speaker 1 (45:42):
I think that scenario is very possible. I think it
also makes the Death Rids less than I just assume
Gabe kid. When he's around, he's around. When he's not,
he's not, And I'm fine with that. But if you're

(46:02):
eliminating Moxley and Claudio's taking over, even if kids around
for three months straight before he goes back or whatever,
you've weakened the Death Writers. Even if you feel like
Moxley's a week link, it has to be dealt with.
All Right, that's cool, but you're not stronger for this.

(46:24):
It's not an addition by subtraction. You've got to add
a new member, and one who probably has to be
the leader.

Speaker 2 (46:32):
Okay, what if we don't excommunicate John Moxley. What if
we do some really sadistic shit where the Death Writers
are beating him down because he's losing. Claudio supplants him.
But this is a way to build John Moxley back up,
and he eventually does go back to being his ruthless self.

(46:56):
He just had to reawaken that vision and he becomes
the leader all along. It was just they kind of
demote him within the house because he's not that guy
right now. But it's a lot more sickening psychological than
that where they're beating him down where he's almost off
TV and locked away.

Speaker 1 (47:17):
Then I think that's a stupid storyline, my point being,
and I don't mean your idea, I just mean what
was the purpose of it all. You could have taken
a tough loss at blood and guts and done that.
You don't have to further humiliate Moxley, have him take
ls things like that. You could have the rest of

(47:40):
the group, could have drug him out into the desert,
beat him down, tied him up, and left him defend
for himself, and then he could have come.

Speaker 3 (47:48):
Back a better man for it.

Speaker 1 (47:52):
At that point, I think everything else is a waste
of time that we're doing now, So that would be
by you.

Speaker 2 (48:00):
With that, I just don't know where we're going to,
where we're getting there, And as you've said, a lot
of this, losing Mocks just makes them feel less than
But I'm still pretty secure in my assessment that one
day we're gonna have like Darby Mocks as the Darby
stin combination. I still feel like we're inevitable towards that direction.

Speaker 1 (48:25):
Uh, maybe not quite to that degree, but certainly aligned
and taking on the death Riders. Yeah, I could see
that also depending on how legit Darby's injuries are. And
I still question some of that, But maybe that's the test.
Let me try that again. Maybe that's necessitated drawing out

(48:46):
the death Rider's stuff a little longer until Darby can
come back for that very reason.

Speaker 3 (48:51):
So I mean, look, maybe.

Speaker 1 (48:53):
There's some things that play other than what they were
originally trying to do.

Speaker 3 (48:57):
And when they were trying to do it, do you.

Speaker 2 (49:01):
Think them draw chick had hard enough to concuss or
do you think the dropkick was portrayed hard enough to
make Darby look concussed? And Darby is, as you've called
Gunther before, more of a spectacle. We don't need him
wrestling every week. Do you need him in a Continental Classic?
Is that what you're referring to? Could this be like
the seth rawlins of concussions.

Speaker 1 (49:23):
Well, you didn't need him in the Continental Classic, but
you put him in there. I don't think you put
him in there to take him out necessarily, And I'm
not also not necessarily saying he's not really hurt. But
I think they might be overplaying it.

Speaker 3 (49:42):
But I don't know.

Speaker 1 (49:43):
That's just me speculating, and I might be very wrong
on that, Micah, I acknowledge that, but yeah, I don't.
But if he is hurt and your plan is when
the Death Writers beat Maxley down, Darby's there for the
save Darby's day to be the teammate. If he's not
physically in a position to do that, maybe you put

(50:05):
the brakes on what you were planning to do with
the Death Riders until he is.

Speaker 2 (50:09):
That's all okay, Yeah, that's a very good possibility. You
could see that coming together. And as we have the
complexity of the Darby the Death Riders, the continent of
the Classic doesn't end there because there's big trouble in
Callous Land, is there, though?

Speaker 1 (50:28):
Or is it? When half the Damn roster's a member
of the Callus family, you're going to have Callous on
Callous family fights, matches, and not everybody's going to be happy.

Speaker 3 (50:40):
They're all trying to win.

Speaker 1 (50:43):
It certainly seems like there's turmoil in the House of Callous,
But I wonder how much turmoil there really is other
than I can't help but feel like Takeshka Okada, one
of them is going to be out of the family.
Other than that, is there that much much or is

(51:03):
it just because everybody wants to win in the Continental
Classic and they're all fucking in it.

Speaker 2 (51:08):
It could be also did you read anything, because I
think there's a possibility. Does Takeshna somehow go Okada into
putting that international title? Does the whole unified belt end
up a part of this Continental Classic or at least
the finals by the time we're all said and done,

(51:29):
And with that being said and their egos move being
out there, I still think there's an underlying chance, not
saying they end up on a unifying front, but that
Fletcher gets them out of his family and just start
plants them as the leader and takes some control of this.
Because you said, there's just too many factors that are
uncontrollable and we need a more sustained one guy at

(51:50):
the head of this spear.

Speaker 1 (51:53):
I think Fletcher is probably the guy to step up when.

Speaker 3 (51:56):
Whichever one of them is gone is gone. I'm so.

Speaker 1 (52:02):
That the one that's not gone just becomes second secondmand
if he will, Yeah, yeah, Yeah.

Speaker 2 (52:13):
I could see that being a position for Okada. It
feels like, as I said, is the van stage, he
works a little lighter of the schedule. I could see
him kinda. And also because he's just had the little moments,
the middle finger, the cheesy smile, there's just the pops,
the pop moments. I think that's good for a number
two where I still think we're eventually ending up with

(52:34):
Takashna a face turn and trying to make a real
run as a solo guy, a hangman page field if
you will. But no, he's not wearing Butterfly Cowboys hit.

Speaker 1 (52:46):
Yeah. Look, if Okada was going to be the one
to leave, he probably doesn't turn on his former friends,
the young Bucks, you know which, which come on, it's
not like you.

Speaker 2 (53:00):
They weren't Bullet Club and he wasn't Chaos before. They're like,
oh my god, I'll kinda just hit a buck.

Speaker 1 (53:04):
I'm like, I know, but but but that didn't happen
in AEW Micah, we're talking about the AEW alliance between
Okada and the Bucks, and so point being, if he
was gonna be the guy to leave the family, he
either walks away. He's conveniently not there when the beatdown
happens or whatever. If one of Takeshka or Okada is

(53:28):
leaving the don Kallas family, it's a good bet it
is Takeshka and he's going to be a face in.
Okata has made his bed with the Kallous family and
he's gonna lie in it.

Speaker 2 (53:40):
That bet is very itchy bond.

Speaker 1 (53:42):
I think Callous would say I don't think so, because
that's a lip bomb.

Speaker 2 (53:47):
So Callous might say it.

Speaker 1 (53:52):
Well, I mean, I think he speaks Japanese better than
he speaks Spanish, so I'm still.

Speaker 2 (53:58):
Gonna say no the sanor it would probably be a
a colliente grande pindejo from him.

Speaker 1 (54:09):
Yes that that that seems about right? Yes, yes, yes, yes,
yes yes.

Speaker 2 (54:16):
Oh so. I am liking the continent of class keeping,
though it still feels like we are leading down a
pretty obvious road in the finals. I still wonder do
we get some kind of surprise in the semifinals Fletcher
taking out Okada and instead of Okada, Okada Takeshna. As

(54:38):
we've been awaiting it's Fletcher Takeshna. That's still my second choice.

Speaker 3 (54:47):
I think it's more likely.

Speaker 1 (54:52):
Takeashka gets taken out before the finals.

Speaker 2 (54:56):
Could Roderick Strong become a member of the Kallus family
now that he is shunning away his conglomeration responsibilities. Obviously,
Kyle O'Reilly not being there is a huge influence on
how much shananigan ism Roderick can handle in his day.

Speaker 1 (55:21):
Callous Family. Maybe I think we at one point threw
him out for the Death Riders. His wife's there, but
it looked like you were gonna do more with Roddy.
Roddy at this point seems to be a fifty to
fifty guy when one week lose one week. And I'm
not just talking about in the Continental Classic there again,

(55:44):
by the nature of the tournament, a lot of people
have to be that way in the tournament, but I'm
just talking about overall. So I don't know that there's
a lot of momentum in a Roddy Strong he'll turn,
But if there is, it would make a lot more
sense for something like the Callous Family than that and
say joining up with his wife and the Death Riders.

Speaker 2 (56:03):
Yeah it's past that point. Yeah, yeah, it would be irritation.
Now it would be just to be evil, er, more violent,
more about the business. But I don't know if it happens,
just interesting how he is annoyed.

Speaker 1 (56:15):
I think he's better off being the annoyed guy who
sticks around with the with the conglomeration because of O'Reilly,
because he feels like he needs a group and he
doesn't have a group. And I'm still gonna be annoyed.
I don't like all the shenanigans. I don't like fucking
piano playing. Is shee who moves like a turtle but

(56:39):
its damn fingers tickle those ivories.

Speaker 3 (56:43):
But yeah, but he tolerates them.

Speaker 1 (56:45):
I think that's probably his lot in life in aew
right now, just to get so eachy man, it gets
so easy ae W.

Speaker 2 (56:56):
Also, with a lot going on in the tag team division,
I wasn't sure how I was gonna like it and
where the two hundred thousand dollars victory was gonna matter.
But we transitioned to the Bang Bang Gang versus FTR,
the random win that they had over them a month
ago or so coming back into play, and now they've

(57:18):
had a battle back and forth on the microphone that
at least it's felt fun enough that they can kind
of hang with the cats phrases. There is obviously no
way that FTR is losing this quickly. But more of
the question is have you felt that the Bang Bang
Gang has done themselves good by being able to so

(57:38):
far hang on the mic with FTR and Big Stoke. No.

Speaker 1 (57:43):
No, Instead of bringing dark Order back against the Ops,
they could have just brought to the dark Order back.

Speaker 3 (57:50):
That the challenge FTR is the same thing.

Speaker 1 (57:53):
I guess you can milk Bang Bang Gang a little more,
but the end results ultimately the same.

Speaker 2 (58:00):
You don't know where this is going, who the next
one is going to be, where the infusion of excitement
in the story from the Tag Team division is gonna come.
We probably are waiting to know when a certain filming
is done. Oh I don't know.

Speaker 1 (58:14):
Yeah, I think you absolutely know, and it is Copeland
and Christian and it's probably at World's end or if not,
the seed gets planted at World's End on December twenty seventh. Yeah,
I think that's happening much sooner rather than later.

Speaker 3 (58:30):
And this is just a temporary placeholder.

Speaker 2 (58:32):
Well, that's where I was surprised that we didn't get
an announcement of Bang Bang Gang FTR for winners coming
and then that would be the place. I think to
put the seed in that that Cope and Christian are
back and that we're having them at World's end. If
we don't, I'm guessing we're actually probably waiting, like you said,
till World's end too. I guess have this match and

(58:55):
possibly have that return.

Speaker 1 (59:00):
World's end would be my guess. I think the problem
with Winter is coming FTRS, the Collision Crew winner is coming.
Collision is in Wales. I'm not one hundred percent sure
one half of FTR can leave the country at least

(59:21):
to go there, so that that could have complicated thing.
But maybe not and help maybe we get that announcement
on Dynamite. Hey, Saturday, Collision it's on. I mean maybe,
And you mentioned it earlier. As WWT is turning up
the heat on the women's tag team division, it's because
a certain tournament is coming to a conclusion, and especially

(59:43):
considering the way that Blood and Guts turned out, I
am shocked that we are getting the losing side matching
each other in these finals.

Speaker 2 (59:52):
Will there be wrath, there will be babes, will there
be booze? I kind of feel like us return has
to be mentioned. I think he lost a little bit
of the Santa Gut, even though he portrayed the jolly
Man to at glad to see that he's healthy again.

(01:00:12):
Does Tony Khan swerve us eventually?

Speaker 3 (01:00:15):
Do?

Speaker 2 (01:00:15):
Do we just see Harley Cameron and Willow Nightingale as
the champions?

Speaker 3 (01:00:22):
It would be.

Speaker 1 (01:00:22):
Better for the women's division to strap a belt on
Willow Nightingale and Harley Cameron. I guess I can't imagine
your inaugural tag team women's tag team champions would be
someone other than Tony Storm, and since she's teaming with
Mina Shira Kala Shira Kala. But you asked, could we

(01:00:48):
could there be a swerve of coming? Yes, there absolutely
could be, and it probably wouldn't be nearly as shocking
if we really broke it down as it might seem.
Money still on Storm and Shira Kawa. But Storm especially
and probably to a little lesser degree, Mina already established

(01:01:12):
you could really solidify Willow and Harley with the tag titles.

Speaker 3 (01:01:16):
I think so.

Speaker 1 (01:01:17):
Yeah, I think it's definitely a possibility.

Speaker 2 (01:01:20):
It's that question to me, the solidifying versus the champions
that make the belt, You know what I mean. It's
not just someone to have a title, but it's the
champion feeling, and Tony Storm gives you that champion feeling
of legitimacy, But you could also legitimize everything that Willow's

(01:01:40):
done by a win over Tony Storm, the biggest win
of her career. So it's an intrigue to me of
how this tournament plays out, which direction they want to go,
and because neither one is bad, it's just how do
you feel about it? Because one felt obvious the whole time.

Speaker 1 (01:01:59):
Yeah, hey, speaking of the women's division and speaking of
women and belts and winning and losing. Ring of Honor
had a final battle this past Friday, and Mercedes mone
comes out of that down a belt as she loses.
Was she the she wasn't the interim TV champion anymore

(01:02:19):
because they did or.

Speaker 2 (01:02:21):
Maybe she was a fine or in disputed a TV
champion because they had unified on Dynamite to believe a
couple of weeks prior.

Speaker 1 (01:02:28):
Right, But she loses to a red velvet and red velvet.
Now you're a world television champion trying.

Speaker 2 (01:02:35):
To draw some eyes towards Ring of Honor. I guess
you really thought we're not gonna have Mercedes Weekly on
Ring of Honor. We're not going to be booking her
on this platform consistently, so I guess it made sense
to have that reign be short and try to elevate
the status of a Red Velvet. The fourth loss since

(01:02:55):
Mercedes Monette has went on her belt tour, so not many,
but they've been meaningful and hopefully this one helps boost
the Red Velvet profile a bit.

Speaker 1 (01:03:10):
I don't know if it does. I mean, we'll see
what they do with it. You would certainly hope that Athena,
by the way, held onto the Ring of Honor World
Women's Championship, so I mean you've got that consistency.

Speaker 3 (01:03:27):
I guess with the Ring of Honor women.

Speaker 2 (01:03:29):
You kind of almost wish for her to lose the bell,
right everybody, so that we could just see the full
elevation to watching her weekly on TNT, TBS Max. However,
you consume your dynamite and collision. I hope.

Speaker 1 (01:03:46):
I think she's much better off as the Ring of
Honor Women's Champion rather than being a middle of the
pack a w women's wrestler.

Speaker 3 (01:03:57):
Yeah okay, yeah, I don't.

Speaker 1 (01:04:00):
Think shoot, she'd be in the upper eche line of
the aw women.

Speaker 2 (01:04:05):
I feel like she hangs right there with possibly not Storm,
but right there with stat Lander, right around Monett. I
think she's just as good. I just think that Tony
Storms a level above, but I think she could definitely
be in there. As we have the Sisters of San,
we have Thatakla developing. I think she's above the middle
of the pack. But you may be right that she

(01:04:26):
could just get lost in the fray.

Speaker 1 (01:04:32):
I think she would get lost in Yeah. Look, none
of that speaks to her talent or anything like that.
I didn't mean it like that, but I think she
gets lost in the fray. I mentioned earlier we had
a Dark Order sighting on Dynamite. I guess somebody had
to get the shit beat out of them by the
ops and set up Hangman coming out.

Speaker 3 (01:04:51):
So Dark Order made sense.

Speaker 2 (01:04:54):
Made sense. At least it was somebody that could look
at Hangman and say, hey, wait till the match is over,
you owe us hat.

Speaker 1 (01:05:03):
But see, that was illogical because if I'm a Hangman,
I'm like, you guys aren't fucking winning when the opportunity strikes,
I'm striking, I'm not. If it's at the end of
the match, great, but no, Look, I love you guys.
You're my goofy little buddies or you used to be anyway,
But you have no chance of winning if I interfere.
It ain't costing you a chance to win the trios

(01:05:24):
titles because you ain't winning those fucking things anyway, So
screw you.

Speaker 2 (01:05:29):
Hang Men doesn't talk that honestly to the to the
Dark Order.

Speaker 1 (01:05:32):
He talks that honestly to everybody else.

Speaker 2 (01:05:35):
But not to the Dark Order obviously, why because he
you know, let them go anyway. So he did the
one solid they were left behind trash, He did the
one little solid. Uh. It's fun to see the aw
title picture developing where we have Hangmen, Hangmen and Swerve

(01:05:56):
on their now obsession towards Joe Josh Alexander remind Serve
about who actually injured him and put him on the sideline,
and oh yeah, Joe has a detour where he is
having to deal with Eddie Kingston, and Eddie Kingston is
very pissed about hook and if nothing else, his words
feel like he believes them. When he cuts a passionate

(01:06:18):
promo about wanting to do it so the next generation
could learn the right way of wrestling, of wrestling people,
he makes a lot of life mistakes, but the right
way of wrestling.

Speaker 1 (01:06:30):
I think Kingston and Joe is going to be an
absolute banger this Wednesday on Dynamite.

Speaker 3 (01:06:36):
I don't think there's a chance in hell Kingston's winning, but.

Speaker 1 (01:06:39):
That's okay as well. I haven't been that impressed with
Kingston upon his return as of yet, but I think
we see the shackles come off against Joe and they
have a barn burner.

Speaker 2 (01:06:55):
I feel like his entering has been like a six,
but his mic has been close to a nine. Yeah
he talks, I'm like, yeah, yeah, and then when he wrestles,
I'm like, not as yeah about it. Just the feeling
I've been getting upon his return. But I do like
how they've culminated and made this a little short, compelling
story of their interaction to lead us to this match

(01:07:18):
that obviously feels like it's just something to keep Joe busy. Well,
we're really getting to a possible triple to that at
World's End.

Speaker 1 (01:07:26):
Which then gets us back to the Hangman swerve.

Speaker 3 (01:07:30):
Are they aren't they?

Speaker 1 (01:07:32):
At some point in time, Ospray comes back. Is he
still the peace maker? Does he say the hell with
both of you?

Speaker 2 (01:07:41):
Yeah? A lot of intrigue, And also I think we
have the dynamite diamond ring coming back into circulation. So
if we could have just held up a bright Chinese
sign and said, MJF.

Speaker 1 (01:07:53):
We'll be back, I can't help but feel like that's
the case. You can't have the damn dynamite ring without MJF.
So I'm assuming this means he'll be back soon.

Speaker 2 (01:08:09):
Can we could we transition it? Could it maybe end
up on the finger of I don't know. Kyle Fletcher
feels like a fun name out there. I throw him
out for a lot of stuff, but I'm just thinking
of another heel that could use that tool as an
implement of destruction and feels quite seed. I know it's
been mjf's trademark, but do you think there's any possibility

(01:08:32):
they can transition it to someone else?

Speaker 1 (01:08:34):
Look, there's always that possibility.

Speaker 3 (01:08:37):
But to answer your question, no.

Speaker 2 (01:08:41):
Shut down. Before I even got up to bad everybody
that I.

Speaker 1 (01:08:45):
No MJF could come back and not win it. But I,
like you said, just like throwing up the hook signal,
you just threw up the MJF signal with that announcement,
so that part definitely have it. Do you go a
different way with him back. Yeah, I think that's more possible.

(01:09:06):
But I don't think we're crowning a new ring wearer
without MJF.

Speaker 2 (01:09:14):
Okay, yeah, I say you're right about the MJF. We
didn't mention with Ring of Honor. Also, congratulations on the
women's side with one champion we didn't mention. Deanna Parrazzo
does come out victorious your first ring Ring of Honor
Women's pure champion Lee Moriarty out grappling Nigel McGinnis out

(01:09:37):
last i'be five to four in an iron Man match.
A Ring of Honor kind of classic staple, if you will, everybody,
Sammy Gavara Beast Mortos officially now the tag team champions,
with Roush having been injured, so best Mortos wearing a belt.

(01:09:58):
So the Mercedes Monet Beast Morta's family lost a Ring
of Honor belt and gained a Ring of Honor belt
on the same show.

Speaker 3 (01:10:07):
Do you really think that made Mercedes feel any better?

Speaker 2 (01:10:13):
I have no clue what would make her feel better.
She could call it three more independent promotions and become
Mercedes sixteen.

Speaker 1 (01:10:19):
At a point, well, she'd have to call four because
she's down to twelve. But yeah, I'm guessing that did
not make her feel better.

Speaker 2 (01:10:28):
It made me feel better. Good for Mortos?

Speaker 1 (01:10:30):
Oh, actually, yeah, it made me feel better. I don't
care if Mercedes dropped six or seven belts. She's got
enough to go around.

Speaker 3 (01:10:38):
What more Toast needed a belt? He's got one?

Speaker 2 (01:10:41):
Is Mendido go ahead? Is Bendido in the same spot
as Athena better off having the Ring of Honor title
or should he have dropped it to start looking as
a more prominent singles participant in AW?

Speaker 1 (01:10:57):
He is not in the same situation Athena is. I
had no problems with him keeping the belt, Uh, keep
it for now, but they're they're much bigger things in
his future than there are athenis future.

Speaker 2 (01:11:13):
Okay, I can see that. I I just didn't know
if we're getting to that point where he becomes, you know,
AE W centric focused and stops making that that trip
back down to to Ring of Honor. But at that point,
also being said, I don't know if there is anybody
in that match that I was directly gonna stop the
title on.

Speaker 1 (01:11:31):
Haven't we been at that point for about six months
now where he's basically a W centric.

Speaker 2 (01:11:40):
He's still the Ring of Honor World Champ.

Speaker 1 (01:11:42):
I understand.

Speaker 2 (01:11:42):
I just wonder when you when you when you pass
that mantle.

Speaker 1 (01:11:45):
Right, But he's on a w TV literally every week,
like literally every week, and even.

Speaker 2 (01:11:53):
Last week, well they didn't do anything. He just was
talking about Ring of Honor. But yeah, he's there.

Speaker 1 (01:11:59):
And by the way, I'll go ahead and say it now,
twenty twenty six, Beast Mortas will be twenty twenty five
banddo maybe not to those heights, but I think twenty
twenty six will be a big year for mor TOAs
we know.

Speaker 2 (01:12:17):
He has the talent. We'll see what they do with it.
Looking at Kyle Fletcher still as a breakout superstar, and
I wonder what happens with the Bang Bang Gang because
from Bullet Club Gold to the Bang Bang Gang, it's
not a good situation anymore. It's almost hopeful that when
Jay White comes back, he's the switch Blade and destroys

(01:12:40):
all of them on his own, because this is never
what it was meant to be.

Speaker 1 (01:12:44):
But you can't do that because three weeks later, when
Jay White's hurt again and it's gone for six months,
then what.

Speaker 2 (01:12:51):
I wonder what it's been that for six years? Eight
years he was able to keep up with the wear
and tear of the ring of the excuse me, the
New Japan schedule, the strong style there, and now the
AW run has just been so injury plagued.

Speaker 1 (01:13:09):
Well, the AW schedule is, while not heavy per se,
it's more consistent, where with New Japan you have long breaks.
I think that's part of it. Bad luck time catching up.
I think there's several reasons.

Speaker 2 (01:13:26):
I hope they can do something. It's like you said,
right now, I don't know if half an ass and
this storm has really been that enticing, right.

Speaker 1 (01:13:36):
And by the way, not the only one in that
group that can't stay healthy. When's the last time you've
had a prolonged period of two ass boys, you know?

Speaker 2 (01:13:47):
And Ace Austin has just thrown into the mix now, right.

Speaker 1 (01:13:52):
And look, I'm not crapping on any of those people.
You can't help injuries. But at some point in time,
when you're booking all this, you realize I can't depend
on these people because they can't stay healthy. I'm happy
to use them when I got them, but I gotta
be careful how I use them, because all of a
sudden I'm gonna wind up with a whole in my
fucking stories because they're hurt again.

Speaker 2 (01:14:15):
And talking about it. As Austin Ricochet looks nice as
a national champion.

Speaker 3 (01:14:20):
He does.

Speaker 1 (01:14:21):
He looks well, yeah, he looks very nice as the
national champion. Anything else before we get out of here, Micah.

Speaker 2 (01:14:30):
I think that's it for me. If you guys have anything,
hit me up over on X It's at frankl Micah.

Speaker 1 (01:14:36):
You can get me on X at Real Mike Carlisle
get the show at PW After Hours. We will talk
to you next week for another episode of Pro Wrestling
After Hours here on the After Hours Podcast Network