December 26, 2024 • 55 mins
Bull Dredd returns and talks the amazing 2024 he had. His upcoming induction into the Paradise Alley Pro Wrestling Hall of Fame in 2025, winning the Connecticut hardcore championship, winning the Pure Vanguard Wrestling Break The Chains championship and what it means to him, as he approaches his 25th year in the business, what’s coming in 2025, and much more! ProWrestlingWire.net --- Support this podcast: https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/rick252/support
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:11):
How's it going to everybody? This is Rick del Santa.
You're listening to Pro Wrestling Wire Podcasts, part of Pro
Wrestling Wire dot Net, Helix, Rock Radio, AWAIWF Network, Apple, Spotify, YouTube,
and wherever you find your podcast. Got a very special
guest this week, who's got a tremendous year of twenty
(00:33):
twenty four, especially the last few weeks, has become ever
so important. And of course another special announcement coming for
twenty twenty five, we have bull Dread with us again.
Speaker 2 (00:48):
Hey, goomba, It's not like we don't talk every day.
Speaker 1 (00:51):
Pretty much, you know, this is true, This is true.
Speaker 2 (00:55):
I mean, we do these podcasts and it's like, hey,
what do you want to talk about? I'm like, let's
just wing it because you know, next thing, you know,
fifteen minutes just goes by, and you know, I mean.
Speaker 1 (01:04):
Well, I have no notes prepared. I mean I have
mentally notes prepared of things that i'd you know, wanted
to talk about because you did have an extraordinary twenty
twenty four and you know, without any trash talking and
shit talking, a drama talking, I think that we can
have a pretty damn good conversation today.
Speaker 2 (01:22):
Oh yeah, I mean, the best thing about the end
where I am now in my life and my career is,
you know, I think I said it to somebody today,
you know, I mean maybe ten rewind ten to fifteen
years ago, I was that person posting crap on fucking
social media, making believe talking like I would knew more
than what I what I was. But you know, fast forward,
(01:44):
you know, going into my twenty fourth year and twenty
five on the way, it's like, I think I've earned
that right now to say what needs to be said
and say it the way it is, you know. I mean,
and I'm not involved in any drama, you know, or
anything like that, or because I just I don't care
what goes on in other people's lives, careers, whatever. I
(02:04):
just pay attention to what goes on in my life
my career, and I try to do it as best
as I can, because I wouldn't have had the year
i'd have in twenty twenty four if if I cared
about what everybody else was doing.
Speaker 1 (02:16):
Right, And like I said, I don't want to get
to dive too deep into those subjects because it seems
like there's a lot of drama always always, yeah, and
it seems like in our particular area in the last month.
There's kind of a lot in the last few weeks,
and it's just, you know, I try to ignore it
as best as I can. I've had some conversations, but
(02:39):
I don't post about it. I try not to. It's
just I don't want to get wrapped up in that.
I'm here too for the betterment of the wrestling world,
the Pro Wrestling Wire, and of course the guests that
I bring on, such as yourself, and you've been in
a awfully you know. This is I think now that
you are the number one as far as appearances goes.
(03:01):
You've appeared here more than anybody else and whether it
be for twenty minutes or whether it be an hour
and a half or what have you. So you are
the highest appeared guest. And we've always had a great conversation.
Speaker 2 (03:14):
I thought, well, it's good, you should do like an
end of year awards of like.
Speaker 1 (03:18):
I still have a week left, you know.
Speaker 2 (03:20):
Okay, So, but it's like it's not like we go
into a podcast and we have nothing to talk about.
It seems like every podcast, yeah we talk about certain things,
but there's so much. It's so the conversation is so
well rounded you can go anywhere.
Speaker 1 (03:37):
Yeah, I mean a lot of times, you know, we
might have particular subjects, but then we always especially here,
when you and I we trail off into an old
school conversation talking about Rick Flair versus Ricky steamboat or
something random like that.
Speaker 2 (03:53):
You know, you know, it's pretty It's pretty funny because
earlier I was just watching something came up on YouTube
and I was it was a montage or of Luger
and Flair and you know, when they were going through
their rivalry, was promo for Prome. I didn't watch the
whole thing, but yeah, I mean, that's just stuff I
grew we grew up on, and you know, and I've
(04:14):
and I kind of kind of feel, I mean, maybe
not a lot of people are going to agree, Maybe
the new school people aren't going to agree, but I'm like,
when a lot of us twenty year vets that have
been around from the early two thousands are not around anymore,
the feel of the business, especially in the area, it
is just not going to feel the same. And that's
(04:36):
just because I look back and I'm sure you do
the same thing. The guys we grew up watching locally
or on TV once they're gone and just loses the
feel of the entertainment and the business and what we watch.
It's a total different generation now.
Speaker 1 (04:53):
Yeah, yeah, I mean it's there's a lot of guys
we've grown up with watching TV, you know. I mean,
I don't think me. I still love the world of
professional wrestling. I love watching wrestling, but there's nobody out
there that strikes me, like, say, it's like a steamboat
or a Brett Hart or even a Hogan or what
have you. Nobody that really grabs me on television that
(05:13):
I'm really that far. Like, well, for us, that's what
I'm saying.
Speaker 2 (05:19):
Yeah, for us, no, But for a typical eight year old,
they see it, they see it that way, right, I mean,
I guess that's the evolution of the business. But at
the same time, the business and everything is at their fingertips.
When we had to wait till Saturdays, you know that.
Speaker 1 (05:37):
Saturday Monday or Saturday morning, Sunday morning, Saturday night, you know,
I mean I could remember between you know, Friday night
would end would air nw A Power Hour, and then
they would replay it some Saturday morning. Then there was
nw A Pro and then there was WWF Superstars, and
(05:58):
then there was Challenge, Yeah, Wrestling Challenge was on Sundays,
and then there was Saturday Night and you know, and
then every now and again there'd be something random sprinkled
in there, maybe the Herb Abrams UWF for something random
like that.
Speaker 2 (06:12):
You know, AWA on ESPN. Then he had aw A
I think it was Channel eleven in Waterbury for me. Yeah,
or then you know, then you had World Class. I
think it was channel six or it was sixty nine
or maybe that was for NWA. Yeah, just uh, you know,
I know.
Speaker 1 (06:29):
They were on ESPN for a while. They were on
ESPN as well.
Speaker 2 (06:32):
Yeah, yeah, you know, I mean, you know, just just
not the same. And like I just watched you know,
Saturday Night's main event for last week, and I'm like,
to me, it's just looked like either one a regular
pay per view, a regular Monday night without the talking
you know, so.
Speaker 1 (06:48):
You know, it was basically from you know, the simulcast
between Peacock and NBC. And the one thing with that
is it was, uh, it felt like it was just
a normal pay per view or p a lee whatever
you want to call them. These days, there was nothing
very special about it. You know, it's they brought some
(07:10):
of the legends in, Greg Valentine, Coco, Tito, there's some
others I can't remember off the top of my head,
you know, to try. Oh, Jesse obviously came in did
the introduction and commentary for the main event, and it
didn't seem really you know, I think it fell flat personally.
Speaker 2 (07:28):
Yeah, well, there's no it's flat to us.
Speaker 1 (07:33):
Yeah, because we've been watching wrestling for forty years. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2 (07:38):
I mean it's like listening to same Judas Priest album
over and over again.
Speaker 1 (07:43):
I mean, hold on, hold on before you Screaming for
Vengeance still gets me as if it's brand new. All right.
Speaker 2 (07:50):
Well, what I'm saying is you know what's coming, Yeah,
you know what riff is coming next. Sometimes you will
replay a certain song you don't like the next song
too much, so you skip it.
Speaker 1 (08:02):
Yeah. I always thought that, you know, as part of
speaking that, I always thought the Hellion, the introduction to
that album would be a fantastic wrestling entrance. But I
don't think I've ever heard anybody use that.
Speaker 2 (08:13):
Yeah, you know, I mean a lot of things, especially
when I picked a had to pick a song for
pure Vanguard. It has to have to be pure before
nineteen ninety five or pre nineteen ninety five. And I
was like, well, is anybody using sad but true? And
he was like, I don't think so, but out'll work.
Then I then the thoughts started coming out, like oh shit,
I could use this because I always wanted to come
(08:35):
out to a modern day cowboy from Tesla, you know,
like when I was, you know, in high school and
going like, oh, this will be a good entrance song,
you know certain things, and you know, I even had
a thought of using another Rainy Night from Queens Reich
as a as an entrance song. But this is pre
before getting into the business. And I think I told
(08:57):
you about having my first experience in the business where
I went down to the Portuguese Club and there was
the show was run by back then it was Nicholas Richards,
you know, he is the hippie freak. And that's where
I met Roma Atlas credible. That's I met him beforehand.
But you know, and I was supposed to be there.
I was like, oh, I'll get you in a battle royal,
(09:18):
but I wasn't trained. So that's where I met like
Da Vito and body the other guys. But yeah, I'll
see we're getting off track here, but that's what I'm saying.
Speaker 1 (09:27):
You didn't the Battle Royal, did you? No? No?
Speaker 2 (09:30):
But I tell people like, listen, your entrance song has it.
It has a lot to do very it's very important.
It has a lot to do with your build up
and who your character is, you know. I mean I
personally don't like rap, you know, for in wrestling, but
it works for certain people.
Speaker 1 (09:54):
So one of the things there at Pure Vanguard is
that Doc Warren is the promo and he is what
you just told me. He wants to make it a
and he's been a guest on the program before, probably
months ago. He wants to make it an old school
Catches Catch Can influenced style professional wrestling, old school wrestling, AWA,
(10:18):
World Class, NWA, stuff like that. So I didn't know
that he was making trying to make it that old school,
trying to so by using a song prior to nineteen
ninety five. That was his request.
Speaker 2 (10:30):
That's what was said to me when I was talking
to the jeter, and he was like, hey, I don't
know if they told you, but they want you to
use something old school, like you know, pre nineteen ninety five,
and I think they might even want to go even
earlier than that. But and that's the first song that
came to mind, because Sad but True is a good
(10:50):
entrance song. It's just heavy and it fits me. And
you saw my evolution, you know, especially you know at
Pure Vanguard where uh, you know, especially at the last
show last weekend, you saw Heel Dread And when was
the last time you saw Heel Dread.
Speaker 1 (11:09):
It's been a number of years.
Speaker 2 (11:11):
Yeah, yeah, And I was aggressive, I was I was relentless.
I that's where that's where I'm most comfortable. That's what's
more natural to me, you know. But you know, I
work hard to stay in shape to be that. Not
not because it's you know, uh, it's it's because I'm
(11:32):
not worried about, you know, being blown up or anything
like that. And it's just what comes more natural to me.
It was more my element. And in order it to
look real, it has to be real. And you're right
there in front of the fans, so you know you
have to Uh that's what that means, you know, catch
versus catch? Can you know what I mean? What you said,
(11:52):
it's asked to look real and that's old school. It's
time to bring you back old school.
Speaker 1 (11:57):
There's a bunch of interesting matches on the show. This
was my first Vanguard show. Now did they run two
or three shows that you're aware of?
Speaker 2 (12:05):
Which is that was the third? I have wasn't part
of the first one?
Speaker 1 (12:09):
Okay?
Speaker 2 (12:10):
They brought me in for the second one, which was
a good draw. You know, I was in that three
way dance. And this was, you know, my second show.
It was this third show, and I think this one
was even bigger on the second one. It's only gonna
get better, you know.
Speaker 1 (12:24):
Well for everybody that's listening. We haven't spoken about this
part yet, but of course Pure Vanguard Wrestling is out
of Bristol, Connecticut. It's a semi newer promotion. As we
just said, three shows. Ryan Frost fell to my guest here,
bull Dread. What's that two weeks ago?
Speaker 2 (12:44):
Now?
Speaker 1 (12:44):
Was it two weeks ago? Last week?
Speaker 2 (12:46):
Yeah?
Speaker 1 (12:47):
Last Saturday? Okay, and now Bull Dread is the Break
the Change champion. And I know that going into this,
I did not want to know any information whatsoever regarding this.
I know that you said that you were bringing it,
and you know what your plan of attack was I
did not know how to know any kind of a
result because I wanted to be able to pop if
(13:09):
anything special happened. So and it happened. And I remember
you in one of our telephone conversations. I believe that
you said that this was if you won this belt,
this would probably be the most important belt you've won.
Speaker 2 (13:25):
Yeah, it's so far. I mean, every title is important,
no matter what at this point. You know, I've always
looked at a title as a as a prop. I mean,
it's not what the title can do for me. It's
what you bring to the title to make it prestigious,
bringing up another level. And this means a lot to
me because what it signifies and what I've learned about
(13:48):
what it signifies on it, and it signifies you know, life.
It's like what I said in my post, I don't
have a life or a past of mental illness or
drug addiction or alcoholism or any of that in my family.
But what I overcame and what we talk about is life.
You know, over the circumstances of life of depression, transformation,
(14:11):
weight loss, financial debt being rock bottom, and you know,
kind of confidence, insecurities and and it's been a you
know what feels like an overnight success, It's been It's
been a lifelong journey. But you know, when I ventured
off of my own, you know, being you know, divorced,
(14:31):
separated to single, you know, divorced, it's going on thirteen years.
So it's a thirteen year battle that I have had
to overcome. And it's I came into my own maybe
a few years ago, but it's an everyday struggle regardless.
It's always going to be there. You learn how to
deal with something differently than we're ten years ago, where
(14:52):
you know, not like as yourself, you could probably be
stuck in your head over over things. And I've helped
you come over that. And for me, you know, every
day if it's a stressful time and I try to
remind myself it's going to be okay the end of
the day, give yourself something to look forward to, and
the reality doesn't stop. It's how you deal with it
(15:12):
and uh and it's you know, it's all mental, you know,
and like I'm sure at the end of the day
you look back and I'm like, what the hell was
I worried about? That? For you got through it, right,
And that's that's what it's a daily struggle. It's a
daily it's a daily evolution. We evolve more every day,
and that's what the title means to me. You know,
I forty nine. We're going to be starting twenty four
(15:34):
years in a couple of weeks, and obviously next month
we're heading back to the Cadillac branch where it all
started for me, you know, almost twenty four years to
this date and uh, you know, to be in that
building again and it feels like it was yesterday. But yeah,
at this point, it is probably the most important title
because you know, I've worked hard. I've worked hard to
(15:58):
get to where I am. You know, I I rest
sold more this year than I did last year. And
I said the same thing last year about the year before,
and I think it's about you know, it's like what
I said to you today. I think it's I'm gonna
try one more time the you know, for the p
WI five hundred, because I think maybe I've qualified for
that now or that made some headway, especially in New
(16:19):
England in Connecticut. To be where I am, it seems
like you have to be a champion or or you know,
it's who you know. But I think i'd like enough
people would give me that support, you know, just to
make the list. I mean, not that it really means anything.
It just I guess just to be uh, what's the
honored day, you know what I mean? Or recognize best the.
Speaker 1 (16:40):
One forever immortalized, you know, and being in that list,
and you know that's a list that comes out once
a year. It's a very prestigious list. I feel it's
very important. Did I ever tell you that the guy
that created the PWA five hundred has been on the show?
Speaker 2 (16:58):
No?
Speaker 1 (16:59):
Yeah, it was Bob Smith. He was one of the
editors for Pro Wrestling Illustrated in the late eighties into
the nineties. I've now appeared on his show three times.
He's peered over here. He is too slated to return
for people that are listening. But that was all Bob
Smith's idea. He is actually the very first commentator for
ECW TV when they were on public access in Pennsylvania.
Speaker 2 (17:21):
So well, see, these are things I don't know, you
know what I mean.
Speaker 1 (17:24):
Now, I just think that's a nice little random, unknown
fact really. So yeah, and being the history nerd that
I that I kind of am when it comes to
professional wrestling, it's just kind of you know, it's kind
of cool to.
Speaker 2 (17:37):
Me, but he called the prof and I bought you.
Speaker 1 (17:41):
Yeah, well yeah you did. By the way, Uh, you
know you should have been wearing that. Mike has one
of the shirts. Excuse me, Dread has one of the shirts.
Speaker 2 (17:48):
That shirt. You know, it's kind of cold.
Speaker 1 (17:50):
So yeah, you could go and buy the new prof
shirts on my store. There's a link in the link tree,
so go for it. And you mentioned the Cadillac Ranch.
It's where you got your start, but you're going to
be returning there January nineteenth for Paradise Alley Pro Wrestling
to be inducted into the Paradise Alley Pro Wrestling Hall
(18:11):
of Fame.
Speaker 2 (18:12):
Yeah, it's an honor. I mean it was unexpected but expected,
you know what I mean if you can understand, I mean,
because I think I'm at that time of my career
where it's like, okay, you know I've seen people get
inducted into the New England Hall of Fame, you know
that were not even in twenty years or just about
(18:35):
twenty years or you know, and next thing you know,
like I'm in my going to be my twenty fourth
and I'm like, you know, why are some people not
getting recognized here, but I'm not. I don't want to
bring up the negative, but you know, and I think Mario,
because I remember having a conversation with him, said he
wanted to do something for me. So I didn't know
what it was. But it's it's an honor, you know.
(18:56):
And I can't wait to kind of see how what
the setup is and how it's gonna happen. But I
will be in the house that night. I mean, I'm
not wrestling that night is you know, for a night
for me, but not used to not wrestling, you know
what I.
Speaker 1 (19:10):
Mean tonight to be it's a night to be honored
and just sit back, relax, watch the action, you know
what I mean. And I think that it's a blessing
because you've been involved in the wrestling twenty four years,
going into your twenty, going into your twenty fourth.
Speaker 2 (19:25):
Yeah, yeah, the road to twenty five starts.
Speaker 1 (19:29):
Yeah. You claim that you're gonna hit the that you're
gonna or you've been hinting for the last at least
as many times as you've been on this program, you're
gonna retire at twenty five years. And I think that
you've been kind of hinting at not following through with that.
How's that feeling?
Speaker 2 (19:48):
I think, as long as I could stay healthy. But
ask me next year at this time, when we're doing
the podcast again.
Speaker 1 (19:58):
We're gonna be talking about your next appearing when you're
here at this time of year.
Speaker 2 (20:02):
Yeah, let's hit the date, you know what I mean?
Look at that.
Speaker 1 (20:05):
It's going to be a Monday night next year, December
twenty second to twenty twenty five. So you know, just
folks look forward to that podcast next year.
Speaker 2 (20:14):
Yeah, it's going to be hard. It's like I had
just had this conversation with Kurt Kurt Adonis. You know,
he was there from the beginning of my career, and
he was like, dude, you're always going to be involved somehow.
But he started questioning me, testing me of what what
else could I bring once I hit twenty five? You know.
I mean, he's been a real, you know, advocator for me.
(20:34):
And he was like, dude, you don't need to wrestle
twenty five years to reach your goal, you know. But
once you have a goal, it's like you can't. You
don't want to be stared away from it. I want
to reach twenty five as an active wrestler. After that,
I guess we will see you, you know, I mean,
maybe limited dates. But it all depends on how I
feel and how healthy I can keep myself.
Speaker 1 (20:57):
Look at someone like Kurt, like you just mentioned him.
Kurt has done an amazing He's done a lot of
things in the world of professional wrestling, and he is
still involved somehow, somewhere behind the scenes. He's a man
of a million hats, you know what I mean. So
it's would you find yourself? Like he does a lot
of production, he's still referees, he does ring announcing. I
(21:19):
don't think he'll be and I think he does commentary
for some places. Like I said, I know he's an
event planner for some organizations. Would you find yourself I don't.
I don't think that you would do ring announcing, a refereeing,
and maybe as a special guest referee. But would you
find yourself behind the scenes doing stuff or and I
know that you just made your commentary debut recently, so
(21:41):
would you find that maybe?
Speaker 2 (21:43):
Well, if I were to referee, I'm gonna be on
the outside the whole time because I can't get up
and down, so I'll just count from the outside all right, we.
Speaker 1 (21:52):
Had just one two. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (21:53):
Yeah. One of the things I said to him is like,
you know, he asked her, what worth can I see
myself doing. I'm like, I could be a match agent
putting a match together, because I think psychology is something
that i've I'm not gonna say I've mastered. I studied it,
you know what I mean, And I think I got
the proof of that. You know, you know the why
(22:16):
and the what not to do, and how to build
a talent, how to build up the next star, build
a match, et cetera. You've seen this first hand, especially
when you were commentating me versus mister Z you know,
and other matches. But commentary, I debuted, you know, I offered,
and you know I sat down with Joey g at CWF.
(22:37):
You know, the night that I won the I was
surprised with the you know, well, all the time was
c XW, but now the CWF Fark Court Champion, you know,
another title, you know, an achievement by the end of
the year, being at the top of the fucking world. Uh.
I had fun and that's what it's about, and it's
(23:01):
about I think it's easier for me because I'm a character,
so I was able to kind of be me. I
could be the smart ass, you know, even though it
was a face, you know. But it was fun and
I think I think you you know, you listen to
it and me and Joey g he was like he
was like the saying because I fucking love you man,
you know, uh, you know, I watch my language, but
(23:22):
I think you know it's on YouTube or whatever. I
just don't think it really matters. But let's just say
if I were to do it for PAPW, I mean, yeah,
I could handle, you know, the words and stuff like that.
And yeah, it was definitely fun. And I think when
you should do something one day and just have fun
with it. But I got a funny feel I'm gonna
(23:42):
make you laugh and make you lose character.
Speaker 1 (23:45):
That's happened to me a couple of times. You can
ask Tommy saman about the about that. Well, I could
say it here because we were commentating at a coliseum
event and Bryan Ross want to go jump over the
ropes into the ring and his knee got caught, and
(24:05):
I think I lost it and I only made it
worse for Tommy so and we had to mute ourselves
and you could definitely tell watching that match back, there's
a lot of silence in there because we were both
trying to compose ourselves and get ourselves back into the match.
But uh, yeah, it's uh, there's stuff like that, you
(24:26):
know what I mean. But it's there's plenty of times
I had to look away from the camera or pull
away from the microphone because something that somebody said, whether
it be Joey g or what made me laugh.
Speaker 2 (24:36):
Yeah, I guess we do a lot of that, you know,
even when we rewatch matches or means behind the guy
in the curtain where I can't believe you just saw that,
and a lot of the trash that you could probably
see out there, people that call themselves workers and are
not and you know, only wrestling where people claim to
dev done this and come from this and have no
(24:58):
proof of it and know it seems like it never
goes it's never going to end. I mean it was
like that when I first started. You know, people, I
guess like wrestling, maybe even the music industry, where people
can put in the less amount of work then call
themselves either a musician or in a wrestler.
Speaker 1 (25:15):
Yeah, it seems to be going around a lot lately. Uh,
you know, from what you just said, you know, a
couple of people been pretty much called out for not
doing the work and calling themselves professional wrestler and claiming
certain guys that they're as their trainers, and certain someone
claimed multiple guys. And I saw on social media today
(25:37):
that each one debunked that story.
Speaker 2 (25:40):
Yeah. See, I don't. It's hard because one, I don't
know enough of the person. And you know, you know,
I met the guy a couple of years ago, and
I know he knew me, but I had I get
a lot of that where people know who I am,
but I don't know who they are, and especially if
they haven't been around or this area. And I'm like,
(26:01):
I was like, all right, who are you? But regardless,
I still treat people with respect. And as long as
they treat me with respect, that's you know, it's fine.
Speaker 1 (26:10):
I don't it's Italian.
Speaker 2 (26:12):
Yeah, And and but people will eventually. There's a lesson
that I learned is don't throw dirt on anybody because
they will eventually bury themselves, right, And that's what happened. Uh,
you know, and next thing, you know, you got called out.
I was like, all right, now, he said it. So
I'm like whatever, And you know, Jason Knight, you know
(26:35):
my trainer, you know who's come back around and you
know it.
Speaker 1 (26:42):
He's not the only one that denied it. There's a
couple other guys that tonight it too, Jason Rumble.
Speaker 2 (26:47):
See I I don't know. And and and somehow people
like to insert themselves in and believe me, we know
a lot of people and I met a lot of people.
I mean this a thousand times. It's never going to end.
People will hang around with people that are in the business.
The next thing, you know, they claim to be in
the business, or they start running shows, they start doing this,
(27:09):
and next thing you know, they think they have an
opinion and this that whatever. I mean, And it's never
gonna end no matter what. I'm not like pinpointing people
or anything like that. It's happened and it's going to
continue to happen.
Speaker 1 (27:24):
Uh.
Speaker 2 (27:24):
But again, I mean the magic happens training, you know,
and putting in that work, paying your dues, and you know,
don't talk like a fucking veteran if you don't have
anything to prove of what you've done, especially if a
veteran of the area don't know who the fuck you are.
Speaker 1 (27:42):
I mean, there's no you know, I tried researching this
and there's literally no YouTube footage of this person, this
said person. So I tried youtubing it and nothing comes
up other than some other guy that's not him.
Speaker 2 (28:00):
I don't know, Like I said, I don't know enough
of the person. I just know how he's treated me
and about the fit a few times that I've been
with him. Ah, you know the O I see potential,
Like I think he has a voice where it could
be a going a voice and arrogant, you know, manager
(28:20):
or something behind the scenes on the mic, commentating, et cetera.
Uh you know, I mean, I don't know. I mean
it's not gonna be the first. I mean, you're not
gonna grab a kid playing streetball and put him on
the team, you know, in a major league bas and
the same thing with a promoter. You're not gonna grab
(28:41):
someone from the or a football or a fan from
the stands and put them in charge of a company
or a fan got a football game. You're gonna make
them in charge of a coach of a team. You
gotta have humble beginning somewhere and a track record of that.
Speaker 1 (29:00):
Yeah, Yeah, talk about we touched upon it in CWF
or at the time c XW in April there returning
and they changed the name to the Connecticut Wrestling Federation.
You are the current actually the first hardcore champion there.
Speaker 2 (29:22):
Yeah, it's an honor to hold it and bring whatever
prestige I can to it and bring it to another level,
the same as to break the chains title, same as
I've done with the PAPW Intercontinental title, which is now
well they've dropped in now it's become the ai WF.
Speaker 1 (29:41):
Right, the ai WF International Belt was that and then
now the Paradise ally has the ai WF. What the
belt is that? The Atlantic Championship currently held by Blood saw.
Speaker 2 (29:57):
Right, Yeah, I don't know. I think think I'm I
think it's me and Nate Nasty one more time, you know,
third times as a charm. This is going to beat
his ass again.
Speaker 1 (30:08):
I mean he might deserve it, really, right, what the
ass beating? Yeah? Yeah, he's a young kid.
Speaker 2 (30:14):
He's a young kid. He could take it.
Speaker 1 (30:15):
Yeah. Yeah, So what else you got going on there?
We at home or not at home, in wrestling or
in life.
Speaker 2 (30:23):
Coming is other than the Hall of Fame. January nineteenth.
We're back at Vanguard, which is what February.
Speaker 1 (30:30):
February eighth, if I don't if you don't mind me
inserting just a little bit something here, I am making
my Pure Vanguard debut as the play by play announcer.
I just got the information yesterday.
Speaker 2 (30:40):
That's awesome that I think you would fill in great
and yeah, I mean all it.
Speaker 1 (30:47):
You know, one of the things I'm looking forward to
the most, and I love commentating your matches, is working
with working with you again. And of course you know
Alan Compass, I like working with he really he loves
having me do commentary over his matches. So he's pretty
damn excited from the conversation we had yesterday as well.
Speaker 2 (31:07):
Yeah, I mean commentation. Like I said I and I've
said this, you know, from the depths of my heart,
how honored and privileged I am. I mean because especially
not that I'm not, and they didn't enjoy everybody else
throughout my career that's been commentating on you know, from
you know, Jerry Strauss and which is Rob Echoes's brother,
(31:30):
you know, from any w and you know, everybody throughout
my career that's commentated. You guys are the voice of
my career, and and it means a lot more to
me now because I don't know what next year will bring.
You know what I mean? You know you and you
know even Alex Rojas, you got Andrew, you know Big Daddy,
(31:54):
Tommy Tonime is Joey g Who else I'm as d
m forcer you know what I mean? Is there anybody
else I missed? You know, maybe you know, like Sean Jacobs,
if there's you know, there's somebody else I mean out
there that I you know, then you got Matt to
court and you know g K Durant. You guys are
the voice of my career right now, you know, and
(32:17):
and I and I appreciate that you guys make me
want the deep going because I look forward to that,
you know. And it's like you make us look like
like larger than life. And I'm just a short, fat
Italian kid that wanted to be a wrestler. You know,
I'm tattooed and bearded. Kids look at me as I'm
a superstar, and I'm quick to remind people I'm just
(32:40):
an Italian kid that wanted to be a wrestler.
Speaker 1 (32:43):
You've gotten quite a bit of young fans recently and
you know, we got to meet them at Vanguard, and
you know after your match against Ryan Frost, you know
you were signing pieces of the door that you put
him through or he put you through.
Speaker 2 (32:59):
Yeah, me through. But you know it's not the first
store I've been through or table, you know what I mean.
I've signed chairs, I've signed you know a lot of things,
and you know what I mean. My might signature worth anything,
but it's the memory that's worth more. I've made a
lot more memories friends and fans in this business that
(33:19):
I have money.
Speaker 1 (33:21):
I have right here behind me. You're not gonna be
able to see it in this view because my background
is blurred out, but hanging out behind me, I have
a turnbuckle with the Paradise Sally Pro Wrestling roster from
Jesus five years ago, and you're the first person that
got that signed it. It's an old it's a turnbuckle.
(33:41):
I bought a Lang term buckle and I said, I'm
bringing this. I want you to sign it. So you
were the first one. You are the person that I
had in mind when I got this to sign it,
and then I ended up getting probably like thirty other
guys to sign it.
Speaker 2 (33:53):
On Toody never told me that. What you never told me.
Speaker 1 (33:56):
That you don't remember signing this?
Speaker 2 (33:59):
No, no, no you don't. They didn't tell me. You know,
you had me in mine first.
Speaker 1 (34:05):
I had it, you know, and I was like, I
want to get you to sign it.
Speaker 2 (34:08):
Now, this is like does it go does it go
back to when you fucking saw me come out when
I dated for APW.
Speaker 1 (34:14):
No, No, it was probably a year or so after that.
I think they were still running shows in the Annex
and the at the school maybe.
Speaker 2 (34:24):
Yeah, oh look where we are now.
Speaker 1 (34:26):
Yeah, I mean it was a weird time because it
was like it was pre pandemic and post pandemic, and
I think during the pandemic that's when you and I,
you know, got closer and became better friends over time.
So like the last five over the last five years.
Speaker 2 (34:40):
Yeah, it was it the last show at the Annex
where No, no, it wasn't that show. The last show
at the Annex was, uh.
Speaker 1 (34:48):
The Bob Lachlan was there.
Speaker 2 (34:49):
I think, yeah, I was gonna say, what did it start?
The night that when Jamie came up to the railing
and I, you know, and I kissed him on his head.
Speaker 1 (35:00):
That was probably the show before that or the show
before that. It was probably it was in that group
of shows, probably like within three or four shows.
Speaker 2 (35:06):
Yeah, yeah, that one was before the that six man. Okay,
I think I.
Speaker 1 (35:12):
Remember, and that's the video. You know, we both share
it yearly, and it kind of that moment, you know,
I remember talking to you outside and that moment really
kind of meant a lot to me, and that you
went right up to him and you know, and it
just meant a lot to me that you took that time,
that brief second right there, kissed him on the forehead,
right and he was up there and you know, my
(35:32):
kid nine years old now still knows knows who you are,
and like see a whole lot.
Speaker 2 (35:37):
Yeah. Well I try to you know, special winter together
and he's acting not acting right, you know, and I'll
kind of you know, my the father and me is like,
listen to your father.
Speaker 1 (35:46):
You look at that old Italian ass whooping, you know. Yeah,
you know that's a joke everybody just you know, I share.
Speaker 2 (35:54):
I was just recently talking to somebody about this. I
got to spoon from my mom and the belt for
my dad.
Speaker 1 (36:00):
Yeah, the wooden spoon, right. I remember at one point
that was just kind of oblivious to them. They my
mom hit me with one and it just like broken half.
So it just like it didn't work anymore.
Speaker 2 (36:10):
Well, I used to get the slipper too. They call
it lots off if you look it up. I mean
it means which, but it's the heel, the the shoe
with the with the hard bottom of the freaking open Tony.
My mom's hardcore. That's where it came from.
Speaker 1 (36:29):
That got you into the hardcore, Righteah? Yeah? Uh so
what else man would have been up to otherwise? Have
you been watching any wrestling going on?
Speaker 2 (36:38):
You know, I was just watching about a half hour
ago before we went on uh Adam Cole and MJF
confrontation promo. That's what I enjoy more than actual wrestling.
Sometimes I'll watch, like, you know, videos and whatever comes
up on YouTube, or you know, if if like a
highlight from a match comes up, they don't show the
(36:58):
whole match and it's a w or I highlight from
Raw or SmackDown, I'll watch that. I can't sit there
and watch a lot of today's product, you know. That's
why it's weird for me to go to a show
and sit there and watch wrestling because I'm like, you know,
because I'm still active, and I'm like, you know, and
I'm fatiguing and this and that. But I don't know.
(37:21):
I like promos. I like storytelling and the build up,
and I like to kind of do that myself, you know,
either if it's a promo, if I do it myself,
or in the ring. And you know, that's what's missing.
Speaker 1 (37:35):
Yeah, I mean a lot of the storytelling, especially in AW,
I think that it's missing. There's not a lot going
on over there. But then again, I mean I attempt
to watch the product every so often, and even when
I'm home on Wednesdays, it's Wednesday evenings. I don't It's
not something that I'm like, hey, i gotta be done
in time to sit and watch AW, you know what
I mean. It's just Friday nights and SmackDown that's another thing,
(37:58):
you know, But views that's another thing. But regular weekly TV.
It's a completely different thing than it was than when
we were a kid, Like I had to be there
on Saturday mornings ten am to watch Superstars.
Speaker 2 (38:10):
Well, how do you feel about Raw coming on the
Netflix now? Because I'll behold for that.
Speaker 1 (38:16):
I'll be able to watch that it's game changing, I
think honestly, because not only is you know, RAW or
WWE has a history of changing the game as far
as professional wrestling and television as a whole, live sports,
live wrestling. Netflix kind of changed the game when they
went to streaming and no more DVDs, you know what
(38:39):
I mean, when they started the streaming thing. So it's
two of the game changers coming together to put this
show together. And the show is being built up like
it's a super show, like a big main event, like
kind of like a plee or something to that effect.
It's a lot of big matches and I'm looking forward
to it and I'm looking forward to checking it out.
Speaker 2 (39:00):
Uh.
Speaker 1 (39:01):
I think that I'm interested in the Punk and Rollins match.
I think that's gonna be those are to me, Rollins
is like one of the top performers today.
Speaker 2 (39:10):
Uh.
Speaker 1 (39:11):
You know, Punk is kind of legendary and granted he
is a little bit older, a little bit slower, but
he still has I feel a lot of quality left
in him.
Speaker 2 (39:20):
Kind of feels like me right now, right where people
feel I feel like people are trying to get the
rub for me, now, you know what I mean? You
know what I mean like not to bring this to
make this about me. But punk has that nostalgia and
still has that power draw, you know what I mean,
it's more. But that's what WW is the entertainment. It's
(39:43):
they're trying to what's gonna draw and that's what they're doing.
And I feel I hope it's more. If they're trying
to do edge your stuff, maybe wind it back to
the attitude era we will see. I mean, I think
that you've seen the changes where people are actually becoming
an off I think of who they are. You know,
I just said it to you, and I said it
(40:04):
to one or the other commentators. Is if you're trying
to be something that you're not, you're not going to
be authentic, you know, I mean, not gonna be able
to be creative.
Speaker 1 (40:15):
What do you think of the WW product today as
a whole? Do you think it's improved under Hunter?
Speaker 2 (40:21):
It's improved. It's not a lot. It's the talking is
still there, but there's a lot more build up, there's
a lot more fighting. It reminds me of the old
world class and the old school type way of booking words.
Speaker 1 (40:34):
There's my studio, the nw A studio shows. Maybe when
they brawl like crazy.
Speaker 2 (40:39):
What aw does words? There's like thirty factions.
Speaker 1 (40:43):
I don't get that.
Speaker 2 (40:44):
Yeah, yeah, I mean, and then we're talking about Ring
of Honor. To me, it's just Ring Ring of Honors,
a w LTE that's all.
Speaker 1 (40:51):
And it sucks that I was not talking about Harry
de Villa from Blood, Sweat and Tears yesterday or the
day before on the phone. And it was one of
those things where we discussed like here, you know, I stayed,
I watched h what's the show Final Battle the other night,
the Ring of Honor show, and it's like, I can't
watch the Ring of Honor television show. And he stated
(41:12):
it's like it has no heart to it, and I'm like,
it's that's it's yeah, that's true. Like the old Ring
of Honor television or the events they were like, you know,
they had something. It was like watching Japanese footage from
like the eighties, like a bunch of junior heavyweights from
the eighties or something like that, like dynamite can't Tiger Mask,
but like a full show of it, you know, something
to that effect. There was no like that super heavyweight
(41:33):
that would come in and annihilate everybody like a Stan
Hanson or anything like that. But it's just AW Light.
It's become Ring of Honor has gotten watered down and
dwindled down ever since Tony Kahan purchased it. It's basically
become the developed It's the NXT to AW Dynamite and collision,
(41:58):
you get, you know what I mean. It's like it's
become the developmental brand. It's not it's lost all its
importance that it once had. The Ring of Honor name.
Speaker 2 (42:10):
Yeah, I mean it's it's the same and equivalent of
how ECW was and then WWE try bringing it back.
You know, they're doing their version of it, but in
the garbage. Yeah, not the same. I mean we've been
to you know, an AW event. You know, they have
a few Ring of Honor matches for TV. Here comes
the AW show. Then they have three or four more
(42:32):
matches for Ring of Honor TV after and the crowd
leaves after that. But nobody fucking cares.
Speaker 1 (42:38):
The crowds are dead as well, like nobody's cheering. That's
the other thing that drives me, drives me nuts, like
watching wrestling and it's like a bunch of people sitting
on their hands.
Speaker 2 (42:49):
I'll never be able to talk or understand or defend
of what goes on at that level. You know, I
could certainly say that I wouldn't be able to do
this for a living. Maybe now maybecause if things have changed,
But I don't know. I mean, you know, my circumstances
(43:10):
were different, you know, in my career and what I've
wanted a shop of course, but priorities are first.
Speaker 1 (43:17):
Yeah, I mean, you're older, your kids are older now,
and you know, but you're older and working. So would
your body be able to handle traveling and stuff like that?
Speaker 2 (43:26):
Yeah? I mean, I mean I can't even handle a
two hour drive in a car because my knees fucking hurt.
But I came to sit in a chair for twenty
minutes and I need somebody to help me up. I mean,
you just witnessed Mikes Yep, you know what I mean.
Speaker 1 (43:40):
Yeah, and you recently had a knee issue trying to
get having a hard time getting up in the ring
and stuff like that because your knee was bothering you,
like immensely.
Speaker 2 (43:52):
It almost felt like my knee got locked because I
was sitting in a certain position for four hours, you know,
two hours worth and another hour back for the next
day and ever since then kind of felt like I
lost mobility, so I had to kind of stretch it back.
But I did feel it last week a little bit
at the last show. But you know, being over the
(44:15):
last three, you know, maybe five years now be in
a face, you know, being a baby face, and you know,
it hard to be a deal, you know, anywhere I
go unless depending on how I'm booked or what story
I'm telling, you know, and it's harder for me to
you know, move around as a as a baby face
(44:36):
because I'm always selling them down. I'm always getting up
and ship and it's become harder. And if you noticed,
you know, like I always kind of have to push up.
I have to pull the rope something to help me up,
and depending on how I move, I could swing my
leg over and I could get up. It's gotten better,
but that's constant, like work, you know, stretching cardio and
(44:59):
like today I did an We're on the treadmill just walking,
you know, speed walking, and I definitely feel it, but
I'll feel better in the morning, you know, especially being
on my feet you know during you know, eleven hours
a day at work, you know, and I still go
to the gym and do my cardio and et cetera,
get through the pain. I rather deal with the pain
later and get the work in. But being in a
(45:20):
heel like last week, even though it's a little easier,
more my element, I can save myself, save my body,
save my movements. And like you said, you saw it firsthand.
I was beating frost ass and that's heel. Dread, it's
(45:40):
me amped up, and there wasn't a me Can you
say other than the match was a little slow paced.
There was not a dull moment when.
Speaker 1 (45:50):
When I'm there, I don't think that it was a
dull like a dull moment. It was a little slow paced.
Speaker 2 (45:57):
Like there's never a dull moment right with me?
Speaker 1 (46:00):
No, I mean, like I said, over time, you've become
one of my you know, I've obviously I've known your
career probably almost since the beginning, and I've gotten every
time I get the opportunity to work with you. I
take it as an honor to do that. And you know,
I think that you've only gotten better over the years.
(46:21):
It's something that I look forward to. I wouldn't say
there's a dull moment, no, because I think that some
of these young cats that you're working with are keeping
you young?
Speaker 2 (46:31):
What about frank Z? Like you? You told our story
about how that was the last minute thing, and I
would I didn't even know you were there, but I
love the fact that you were there because I know
how one you have When you're calling you a match
for me and you think of that match compared to
last week.
Speaker 1 (46:47):
I mean, let me tell the backstory about how I
got involved on that show. It's uh, you know, it's
the show is slated to start at seven pm. At
six fifteen, I got a text from both Kevin and
Big Daddy, Hey are you on your We need you
in the booth, and I'm like, oh, I had no clue.
Nobody said anything. I immediately grabbed that shirt off off
(47:09):
my hangar and just jumped in the car. I made
it there with ten minutes to spare, went to the
bathroom and ended up in the booth. I had no
time to go over notes or anything. Your match was
a hardcore match with mister Z the Nightmare, and this
was his first hardcore match, I believe, and I got
(47:30):
to tell you that both of you guys killed it.
You went all over ringside. There was I don't know.
It was very interesting matchup. There's lots of weapons involved
and kind of stick the garbage pail. What else was
there better? A barbed wire, the table, right, yeah, the chairs,
and it was very enjoyable. It's up on YouTube for
(47:52):
folks that you can go check out Paradise ally Pro
Wrestling's YouTube Mania and Paradise. And the fact that I
got to call that match between a guy that's up
and coming in Frank mister Z and the a friend
and legend that is Bull Dread. I was completely honored
because I think that Frank is a guy that has
all the potential in the world to be a great
(48:14):
character and to go very far and be maybe the
next Bull Dread in a way.
Speaker 2 (48:21):
Yeah, uh, you know, he could very well be the
next you know, hardcore nightmare, you know what I mean. Uh,
you know, looking back, I watched the match completely because
I love the commentary, and like I said, I thank
to you guys because it made us. It made the
match even more enjoyable to watch, even though it was
(48:42):
me watching myself. And you know, there's certain certain things
where I have to pull the inside of the certain
things I want to critique him on. But my I
think that was his fifth match, and that was his
biggest crowd, you know what I mean.
Speaker 1 (48:56):
And there's almost three hundred people in that building.
Speaker 2 (49:00):
Problemly, I put that match together and I kind of pinpointed,
these are the points you know of I'm building you up.
I mean, it's not about the win or loss. For me,
it doesn't bring meat, doesn't do anything to me. You know,
I'm already established. I move on to the next you know,
to you, it brings you up, get you ready for
(49:20):
whoever storyline you're going to go into next. And like
I said, it was about building him up his character.
You know, he's only going to get better. But I
did my part. The rest is up to him. Like
and I said that to somebody else in the past.
You know, the fans are there for you. The rest
is up to you. Right, You have to keep them invested.
(49:40):
You got to be passionate, You got to bring that intensity.
You know what's more important to sell or the spot?
What gets you over?
Speaker 1 (49:51):
Yeah? I get you. It's it's the Yeah, I get you.
Speaker 2 (49:55):
You know it's not the spot that's gonna get you
over it. It's to selling. Who's ever selling for you? You
know that intensity, and that's what's missing, you know. I
think that's what people have gotten off track or what
ring of honor has kind of you.
Speaker 1 (50:09):
Know again, and I'll say it again. I say it
on the show all the time.
Speaker 2 (50:13):
Less is more, Yeah, you know, I mean I maybe
I've been through that stage. We're you to try to
do so many things, but as you mature, and I
said this to Frank mister, as you mature as a performer,
you will learn there's certain things you don't need to do.
You have to give him less, you know, and build
your character, save your breath for when it's important, you know.
(50:35):
I mean like when you saw me last week? Did
you see me screaming and yelling at the fans?
Speaker 1 (50:40):
No, I save that.
Speaker 2 (50:42):
I showed my emotions with my my movements, and you know,
and even some lady front row. I don't know if
you heard it. I'm at a comfortable stage in my
life and career where how hard I work to be
where I am, where I can take my shirt off
and you know see where I was where I am
and it's a confidence, especially when you you're I'm out
(51:06):
there performing because I'm not thinking about that. I'm not
thinking about how I look, I'm thinking about getting the
performance down in my character. A front lady in the
front row looked at me and she goes, no, no, no,
put your shirt back on it. I just stared at her,
and the thoughts that were going through my head where
I could have said stuff, I just brushed and I
just looked at her and I just continued with what
(51:28):
I was doing. It's amazing how people can judge a
book without reading the story. Because if I was a
good guy, you know, if it wasn't something she liked,
if it was something she liked, she would have been applotting.
But because it was somebody you didn't like, you gotta
(51:50):
draw them down, you know, I mean, but not to
get off the subject. It's I mean, you saw that
in the match with me and mister Z and uh,
it's about saving your breath, you know, words you start
yelling and this and that. It's cheap heat. You know
I've done that. But you can show a lot more.
You can get a lot more at heat with not
(52:12):
giving the fans what they want. But you can show
with your intensity and you know certain movements or whatever.
You know, doesn't always have to yell to get heat.
Speaker 1 (52:26):
Correct correct, Yes, and uh, well, you know, I wish
the best to mister Z and I think that, like
I said, I think he's got a bright career and
and of course Mike Buldred has had a tremendous career. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (52:42):
I mean, uh, everybody, everybody that's up and coming from
p APW are coming into the business the right way,
you know, even people with t O s.
Speaker 1 (52:50):
Yeah, we look at the look at the instructors that
that are there. You have t os. You have Alec
excuse me, Slick and what Bobby Ocean right over there, yeah, yeah,
and then and then Pierre Diyally, it's Mario and Roma
and I believe Chris Battle is a coach there, and
I think on occasion Holiday is over there.
Speaker 2 (53:11):
Yeah, you know, and then you got Ja Busta you.
Speaker 1 (53:13):
Know Team three D. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (53:15):
Yeah, there's a lot, you know, a lot of great
places to go. I mean, I I'll tell people like
these are the three I'll tell them like if you know,
I would, you know, you you'll learn one aspect here,
you learn one aspect there. You know, maybe learn You're
to learn three different ways you know of the same
It's like having directions three different type of directions, but
(53:38):
it's always going to have the same destination. Yeah, p
APW has become my home and uh and I'm honored
to be kind, you know, to be where I am.
You know, five years is going by that fast.
Speaker 1 (53:51):
Yeah, here last.
Speaker 2 (53:53):
Year staying to you, you know, I mean, wow, you
know next year it was gonna be twenty four years.
Le's get through this year.
Speaker 1 (54:01):
Yeah. I hope to do more work there in the
coming year in twenty twenty five, you know, I know
they have the I don't know if there's any word
whether the show is going to be broadcast or not,
and if it is, I'd really like to be a
part of it. That's on them. That's up to them though,
so but the answer is yes, if that's what they decide.
Because it's a Sunday afternoon, two o'clock is the Hall
(54:22):
of Fame, three o'clock is the show, I urge everybody
to get out there because it's going to be a
big one. There's a lot of great matches already announced.
You can go to the Paradise Sally Pro Wrestling Facebook
page to see those announcements. On their Instagram
How's it going to everybody? This is Rick del Santa.
You're listening to Pro Wrestling Wire Podcasts, part of Pro
Wrestling Wire dot Net, Helix, Rock Radio, AWAIWF Network, Apple, Spotify, YouTube,
and wherever you find your podcast. Got a very special
guest this week, who's got a tremendous year of twenty
(00:33):
twenty four, especially the last few weeks, has become ever
so important. And of course another special announcement coming for
twenty twenty five, we have bull Dread with us again.
Speaker 2 (00:48):
Hey, goomba, It's not like we don't talk every day.
Speaker 1 (00:51):
Pretty much, you know, this is true, This is true.
Speaker 2 (00:55):
I mean, we do these podcasts and it's like, hey,
what do you want to talk about? I'm like, let's
just wing it because you know, next thing, you know,
fifteen minutes just goes by, and you know, I mean.
Speaker 1 (01:04):
Well, I have no notes prepared. I mean I have
mentally notes prepared of things that i'd you know, wanted
to talk about because you did have an extraordinary twenty
twenty four and you know, without any trash talking and
shit talking, a drama talking, I think that we can
have a pretty damn good conversation today.
Speaker 2 (01:22):
Oh yeah, I mean, the best thing about the end
where I am now in my life and my career is,
you know, I think I said it to somebody today,
you know, I mean maybe ten rewind ten to fifteen
years ago, I was that person posting crap on fucking
social media, making believe talking like I would knew more
than what I what I was. But you know, fast forward,
(01:44):
you know, going into my twenty fourth year and twenty
five on the way, it's like, I think I've earned
that right now to say what needs to be said
and say it the way it is, you know. I mean,
and I'm not involved in any drama, you know, or
anything like that, or because I just I don't care
what goes on in other people's lives, careers, whatever. I
(02:04):
just pay attention to what goes on in my life
my career, and I try to do it as best
as I can, because I wouldn't have had the year
i'd have in twenty twenty four if if I cared
about what everybody else was doing.
Speaker 1 (02:16):
Right, And like I said, I don't want to get
to dive too deep into those subjects because it seems
like there's a lot of drama always always, yeah, and
it seems like in our particular area in the last month.
There's kind of a lot in the last few weeks,
and it's just, you know, I try to ignore it
as best as I can. I've had some conversations, but
(02:39):
I don't post about it. I try not to. It's
just I don't want to get wrapped up in that.
I'm here too for the betterment of the wrestling world,
the Pro Wrestling Wire, and of course the guests that
I bring on, such as yourself, and you've been in
a awfully you know. This is I think now that
you are the number one as far as appearances goes.
(03:01):
You've appeared here more than anybody else and whether it
be for twenty minutes or whether it be an hour
and a half or what have you. So you are
the highest appeared guest. And we've always had a great conversation.
Speaker 2 (03:14):
I thought, well, it's good, you should do like an
end of year awards of like.
Speaker 1 (03:18):
I still have a week left, you know.
Speaker 2 (03:20):
Okay, So, but it's like it's not like we go
into a podcast and we have nothing to talk about.
It seems like every podcast, yeah we talk about certain things,
but there's so much. It's so the conversation is so
well rounded you can go anywhere.
Speaker 1 (03:37):
Yeah, I mean a lot of times, you know, we
might have particular subjects, but then we always especially here,
when you and I we trail off into an old
school conversation talking about Rick Flair versus Ricky steamboat or
something random like that.
Speaker 2 (03:53):
You know, you know, it's pretty It's pretty funny because
earlier I was just watching something came up on YouTube
and I was it was a montage or of Luger
and Flair and you know, when they were going through
their rivalry, was promo for Prome. I didn't watch the
whole thing, but yeah, I mean, that's just stuff I
grew we grew up on, and you know, and I've
(04:14):
and I kind of kind of feel, I mean, maybe
not a lot of people are going to agree, Maybe
the new school people aren't going to agree, but I'm like,
when a lot of us twenty year vets that have
been around from the early two thousands are not around anymore,
the feel of the business, especially in the area, it
is just not going to feel the same. And that's
(04:36):
just because I look back and I'm sure you do
the same thing. The guys we grew up watching locally
or on TV once they're gone and just loses the
feel of the entertainment and the business and what we watch.
It's a total different generation now.
Speaker 1 (04:53):
Yeah, yeah, I mean it's there's a lot of guys
we've grown up with watching TV, you know. I mean,
I don't think me. I still love the world of
professional wrestling. I love watching wrestling, but there's nobody out
there that strikes me, like, say, it's like a steamboat
or a Brett Hart or even a Hogan or what
have you. Nobody that really grabs me on television that
(05:13):
I'm really that far. Like, well, for us, that's what
I'm saying.
Speaker 2 (05:19):
Yeah, for us, no, But for a typical eight year old,
they see it, they see it that way, right, I mean,
I guess that's the evolution of the business. But at
the same time, the business and everything is at their fingertips.
When we had to wait till Saturdays, you know that.
Speaker 1 (05:37):
Saturday Monday or Saturday morning, Sunday morning, Saturday night, you know,
I mean I could remember between you know, Friday night
would end would air nw A Power Hour, and then
they would replay it some Saturday morning. Then there was
nw A Pro and then there was WWF Superstars, and
(05:58):
then there was Challenge, Yeah, Wrestling Challenge was on Sundays,
and then there was Saturday Night and you know, and
then every now and again there'd be something random sprinkled
in there, maybe the Herb Abrams UWF for something random
like that.
Speaker 2 (06:12):
You know, AWA on ESPN. Then he had aw A
I think it was Channel eleven in Waterbury for me. Yeah,
or then you know, then you had World Class. I
think it was channel six or it was sixty nine
or maybe that was for NWA. Yeah, just uh, you know,
I know.
Speaker 1 (06:29):
They were on ESPN for a while. They were on
ESPN as well.
Speaker 2 (06:32):
Yeah, yeah, you know, I mean, you know, just just
not the same. And like I just watched you know,
Saturday Night's main event for last week, and I'm like,
to me, it's just looked like either one a regular
pay per view, a regular Monday night without the talking
you know, so.
Speaker 1 (06:48):
You know, it was basically from you know, the simulcast
between Peacock and NBC. And the one thing with that
is it was, uh, it felt like it was just
a normal pay per view or p a lee whatever
you want to call them. These days, there was nothing
very special about it. You know, it's they brought some
(07:10):
of the legends in, Greg Valentine, Coco, Tito, there's some
others I can't remember off the top of my head,
you know, to try. Oh, Jesse obviously came in did
the introduction and commentary for the main event, and it
didn't seem really you know, I think it fell flat personally.
Speaker 2 (07:28):
Yeah, well, there's no it's flat to us.
Speaker 1 (07:33):
Yeah, because we've been watching wrestling for forty years. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2 (07:38):
I mean it's like listening to same Judas Priest album
over and over again.
Speaker 1 (07:43):
I mean, hold on, hold on before you Screaming for
Vengeance still gets me as if it's brand new. All right.
Speaker 2 (07:50):
Well, what I'm saying is you know what's coming, Yeah,
you know what riff is coming next. Sometimes you will
replay a certain song you don't like the next song
too much, so you skip it.
Speaker 1 (08:02):
Yeah. I always thought that, you know, as part of
speaking that, I always thought the Hellion, the introduction to
that album would be a fantastic wrestling entrance. But I
don't think I've ever heard anybody use that.
Speaker 2 (08:13):
Yeah, you know, I mean a lot of things, especially
when I picked a had to pick a song for
pure Vanguard. It has to have to be pure before
nineteen ninety five or pre nineteen ninety five. And I
was like, well, is anybody using sad but true? And
he was like, I don't think so, but out'll work.
Then I then the thoughts started coming out, like oh shit,
I could use this because I always wanted to come
(08:35):
out to a modern day cowboy from Tesla, you know,
like when I was, you know, in high school and
going like, oh, this will be a good entrance song,
you know certain things, and you know, I even had
a thought of using another Rainy Night from Queens Reich
as a as an entrance song. But this is pre
before getting into the business. And I think I told
(08:57):
you about having my first experience in the business where
I went down to the Portuguese Club and there was
the show was run by back then it was Nicholas Richards,
you know, he is the hippie freak. And that's where
I met Roma Atlas credible. That's I met him beforehand.
But you know, and I was supposed to be there.
I was like, oh, I'll get you in a battle royal,
(09:18):
but I wasn't trained. So that's where I met like
Da Vito and body the other guys. But yeah, I'll
see we're getting off track here, but that's what I'm saying.
Speaker 1 (09:27):
You didn't the Battle Royal, did you? No? No?
Speaker 2 (09:30):
But I tell people like, listen, your entrance song has it.
It has a lot to do very it's very important.
It has a lot to do with your build up
and who your character is, you know. I mean I
personally don't like rap, you know, for in wrestling, but
it works for certain people.
Speaker 1 (09:54):
So one of the things there at Pure Vanguard is
that Doc Warren is the promo and he is what
you just told me. He wants to make it a
and he's been a guest on the program before, probably
months ago. He wants to make it an old school
Catches Catch Can influenced style professional wrestling, old school wrestling, AWA,
(10:18):
World Class, NWA, stuff like that. So I didn't know
that he was making trying to make it that old school,
trying to so by using a song prior to nineteen
ninety five. That was his request.
Speaker 2 (10:30):
That's what was said to me when I was talking
to the jeter, and he was like, hey, I don't
know if they told you, but they want you to
use something old school, like you know, pre nineteen ninety five,
and I think they might even want to go even
earlier than that. But and that's the first song that
came to mind, because Sad but True is a good
(10:50):
entrance song. It's just heavy and it fits me. And
you saw my evolution, you know, especially you know at
Pure Vanguard where uh, you know, especially at the last
show last weekend, you saw Heel Dread And when was
the last time you saw Heel Dread.
Speaker 1 (11:09):
It's been a number of years.
Speaker 2 (11:11):
Yeah, yeah, And I was aggressive, I was I was relentless.
I that's where that's where I'm most comfortable. That's what's
more natural to me, you know. But you know, I
work hard to stay in shape to be that. Not
not because it's you know, uh, it's it's because I'm
(11:32):
not worried about, you know, being blown up or anything
like that. And it's just what comes more natural to me.
It was more my element. And in order it to
look real, it has to be real. And you're right
there in front of the fans, so you know you
have to Uh that's what that means, you know, catch
versus catch? Can you know what I mean? What you said,
(11:52):
it's asked to look real and that's old school. It's
time to bring you back old school.
Speaker 1 (11:57):
There's a bunch of interesting matches on the show. This
was my first Vanguard show. Now did they run two
or three shows that you're aware of?
Speaker 2 (12:05):
Which is that was the third? I have wasn't part
of the first one?
Speaker 1 (12:09):
Okay?
Speaker 2 (12:10):
They brought me in for the second one, which was
a good draw. You know, I was in that three
way dance. And this was, you know, my second show.
It was this third show, and I think this one
was even bigger on the second one. It's only gonna
get better, you know.
Speaker 1 (12:24):
Well for everybody that's listening. We haven't spoken about this
part yet, but of course Pure Vanguard Wrestling is out
of Bristol, Connecticut. It's a semi newer promotion. As we
just said, three shows. Ryan Frost fell to my guest here,
bull Dread. What's that two weeks ago?
Speaker 2 (12:44):
Now?
Speaker 1 (12:44):
Was it two weeks ago? Last week?
Speaker 2 (12:46):
Yeah?
Speaker 1 (12:47):
Last Saturday? Okay, and now Bull Dread is the Break
the Change champion. And I know that going into this,
I did not want to know any information whatsoever regarding this.
I know that you said that you were bringing it,
and you know what your plan of attack was I
did not know how to know any kind of a
result because I wanted to be able to pop if
(13:09):
anything special happened. So and it happened. And I remember
you in one of our telephone conversations. I believe that
you said that this was if you won this belt,
this would probably be the most important belt you've won.
Speaker 2 (13:25):
Yeah, it's so far. I mean, every title is important,
no matter what at this point. You know, I've always
looked at a title as a as a prop. I mean,
it's not what the title can do for me. It's
what you bring to the title to make it prestigious,
bringing up another level. And this means a lot to
me because what it signifies and what I've learned about
(13:48):
what it signifies on it, and it signifies you know, life.
It's like what I said in my post, I don't
have a life or a past of mental illness or
drug addiction or alcoholism or any of that in my family.
But what I overcame and what we talk about is life.
You know, over the circumstances of life of depression, transformation,
(14:11):
weight loss, financial debt being rock bottom, and you know,
kind of confidence, insecurities and and it's been a you
know what feels like an overnight success, It's been It's
been a lifelong journey. But you know, when I ventured
off of my own, you know, being you know, divorced,
(14:31):
separated to single, you know, divorced, it's going on thirteen years.
So it's a thirteen year battle that I have had
to overcome. And it's I came into my own maybe
a few years ago, but it's an everyday struggle regardless.
It's always going to be there. You learn how to
deal with something differently than we're ten years ago, where
(14:52):
you know, not like as yourself, you could probably be
stuck in your head over over things. And I've helped
you come over that. And for me, you know, every
day if it's a stressful time and I try to
remind myself it's going to be okay the end of
the day, give yourself something to look forward to, and
the reality doesn't stop. It's how you deal with it
(15:12):
and uh and it's you know, it's all mental, you know,
and like I'm sure at the end of the day
you look back and I'm like, what the hell was
I worried about? That? For you got through it, right,
And that's that's what it's a daily struggle. It's a
daily it's a daily evolution. We evolve more every day,
and that's what the title means to me. You know,
I forty nine. We're going to be starting twenty four
(15:34):
years in a couple of weeks, and obviously next month
we're heading back to the Cadillac branch where it all
started for me, you know, almost twenty four years to
this date and uh, you know, to be in that
building again and it feels like it was yesterday. But yeah,
at this point, it is probably the most important title
because you know, I've worked hard. I've worked hard to
(15:58):
get to where I am. You know, I I rest
sold more this year than I did last year. And
I said the same thing last year about the year before,
and I think it's about you know, it's like what
I said to you today. I think it's I'm gonna
try one more time the you know, for the p
WI five hundred, because I think maybe I've qualified for
that now or that made some headway, especially in New
(16:19):
England in Connecticut. To be where I am, it seems
like you have to be a champion or or you know,
it's who you know. But I think i'd like enough
people would give me that support, you know, just to
make the list. I mean, not that it really means anything.
It just I guess just to be uh, what's the
honored day, you know what I mean? Or recognize best the.
Speaker 1 (16:40):
One forever immortalized, you know, and being in that list,
and you know that's a list that comes out once
a year. It's a very prestigious list. I feel it's
very important. Did I ever tell you that the guy
that created the PWA five hundred has been on the show?
Speaker 2 (16:58):
No?
Speaker 1 (16:59):
Yeah, it was Bob Smith. He was one of the
editors for Pro Wrestling Illustrated in the late eighties into
the nineties. I've now appeared on his show three times.
He's peered over here. He is too slated to return
for people that are listening. But that was all Bob
Smith's idea. He is actually the very first commentator for
ECW TV when they were on public access in Pennsylvania.
Speaker 2 (17:21):
So well, see, these are things I don't know, you
know what I mean.
Speaker 1 (17:24):
Now, I just think that's a nice little random, unknown
fact really. So yeah, and being the history nerd that
I that I kind of am when it comes to
professional wrestling, it's just kind of you know, it's kind
of cool to.
Speaker 2 (17:37):
Me, but he called the prof and I bought you.
Speaker 1 (17:41):
Yeah, well yeah you did. By the way, Uh, you
know you should have been wearing that. Mike has one
of the shirts. Excuse me, Dread has one of the shirts.
Speaker 2 (17:48):
That shirt. You know, it's kind of cold.
Speaker 1 (17:50):
So yeah, you could go and buy the new prof
shirts on my store. There's a link in the link tree,
so go for it. And you mentioned the Cadillac Ranch.
It's where you got your start, but you're going to
be returning there January nineteenth for Paradise Alley Pro Wrestling
to be inducted into the Paradise Alley Pro Wrestling Hall
(18:11):
of Fame.
Speaker 2 (18:12):
Yeah, it's an honor. I mean it was unexpected but expected,
you know what I mean if you can understand, I mean,
because I think I'm at that time of my career
where it's like, okay, you know I've seen people get
inducted into the New England Hall of Fame, you know
that were not even in twenty years or just about
(18:35):
twenty years or you know, and next thing you know,
like I'm in my going to be my twenty fourth
and I'm like, you know, why are some people not
getting recognized here, but I'm not. I don't want to
bring up the negative, but you know, and I think Mario,
because I remember having a conversation with him, said he
wanted to do something for me. So I didn't know
what it was. But it's it's an honor, you know.
(18:56):
And I can't wait to kind of see how what
the setup is and how it's gonna happen. But I
will be in the house that night. I mean, I'm
not wrestling that night is you know, for a night
for me, but not used to not wrestling, you know
what I.
Speaker 1 (19:10):
Mean tonight to be it's a night to be honored
and just sit back, relax, watch the action, you know
what I mean. And I think that it's a blessing
because you've been involved in the wrestling twenty four years,
going into your twenty, going into your twenty fourth.
Speaker 2 (19:25):
Yeah, yeah, the road to twenty five starts.
Speaker 1 (19:29):
Yeah. You claim that you're gonna hit the that you're
gonna or you've been hinting for the last at least
as many times as you've been on this program, you're
gonna retire at twenty five years. And I think that
you've been kind of hinting at not following through with that.
How's that feeling?
Speaker 2 (19:48):
I think, as long as I could stay healthy. But
ask me next year at this time, when we're doing
the podcast again.
Speaker 1 (19:58):
We're gonna be talking about your next appearing when you're
here at this time of year.
Speaker 2 (20:02):
Yeah, let's hit the date, you know what I mean?
Look at that.
Speaker 1 (20:05):
It's going to be a Monday night next year, December
twenty second to twenty twenty five. So you know, just
folks look forward to that podcast next year.
Speaker 2 (20:14):
Yeah, it's going to be hard. It's like I had
just had this conversation with Kurt Kurt Adonis. You know,
he was there from the beginning of my career, and
he was like, dude, you're always going to be involved somehow.
But he started questioning me, testing me of what what
else could I bring once I hit twenty five? You know.
I mean, he's been a real, you know, advocator for me.
(20:34):
And he was like, dude, you don't need to wrestle
twenty five years to reach your goal, you know. But
once you have a goal, it's like you can't. You
don't want to be stared away from it. I want
to reach twenty five as an active wrestler. After that,
I guess we will see you, you know, I mean,
maybe limited dates. But it all depends on how I
feel and how healthy I can keep myself.
Speaker 1 (20:57):
Look at someone like Kurt, like you just mentioned him.
Kurt has done an amazing He's done a lot of
things in the world of professional wrestling, and he is
still involved somehow, somewhere behind the scenes. He's a man
of a million hats, you know what I mean. So
it's would you find yourself? Like he does a lot
of production, he's still referees, he does ring announcing. I
(21:19):
don't think he'll be and I think he does commentary
for some places. Like I said, I know he's an
event planner for some organizations. Would you find yourself I don't.
I don't think that you would do ring announcing, a refereeing,
and maybe as a special guest referee. But would you
find yourself behind the scenes doing stuff or and I
know that you just made your commentary debut recently, so
(21:41):
would you find that maybe?
Speaker 2 (21:43):
Well, if I were to referee, I'm gonna be on
the outside the whole time because I can't get up
and down, so I'll just count from the outside all right, we.
Speaker 1 (21:52):
Had just one two. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (21:53):
Yeah. One of the things I said to him is like,
you know, he asked her, what worth can I see
myself doing. I'm like, I could be a match agent
putting a match together, because I think psychology is something
that i've I'm not gonna say I've mastered. I studied it,
you know what I mean, And I think I got
the proof of that. You know, you know the why
(22:16):
and the what not to do, and how to build
a talent, how to build up the next star, build
a match, et cetera. You've seen this first hand, especially
when you were commentating me versus mister Z you know,
and other matches. But commentary, I debuted, you know, I offered,
and you know I sat down with Joey g at CWF.
(22:37):
You know, the night that I won the I was
surprised with the you know, well, all the time was
c XW, but now the CWF Fark Court Champion, you know,
another title, you know, an achievement by the end of
the year, being at the top of the fucking world. Uh.
I had fun and that's what it's about, and it's
(23:01):
about I think it's easier for me because I'm a character,
so I was able to kind of be me. I
could be the smart ass, you know, even though it
was a face, you know. But it was fun and
I think I think you you know, you listen to
it and me and Joey g he was like he
was like the saying because I fucking love you man,
you know, uh, you know, I watch my language, but
(23:22):
I think you know it's on YouTube or whatever. I
just don't think it really matters. But let's just say
if I were to do it for PAPW, I mean, yeah,
I could handle, you know, the words and stuff like that.
And yeah, it was definitely fun. And I think when
you should do something one day and just have fun
with it. But I got a funny feel I'm gonna
(23:42):
make you laugh and make you lose character.
Speaker 1 (23:45):
That's happened to me a couple of times. You can
ask Tommy saman about the about that. Well, I could
say it here because we were commentating at a coliseum
event and Bryan Ross want to go jump over the
ropes into the ring and his knee got caught, and
(24:05):
I think I lost it and I only made it
worse for Tommy so and we had to mute ourselves
and you could definitely tell watching that match back, there's
a lot of silence in there because we were both
trying to compose ourselves and get ourselves back into the match.
But uh, yeah, it's uh, there's stuff like that, you
(24:26):
know what I mean. But it's there's plenty of times
I had to look away from the camera or pull
away from the microphone because something that somebody said, whether
it be Joey g or what made me laugh.
Speaker 2 (24:36):
Yeah, I guess we do a lot of that, you know,
even when we rewatch matches or means behind the guy
in the curtain where I can't believe you just saw that,
and a lot of the trash that you could probably
see out there, people that call themselves workers and are
not and you know, only wrestling where people claim to
dev done this and come from this and have no
(24:58):
proof of it and know it seems like it never
goes it's never going to end. I mean it was
like that when I first started. You know, people, I
guess like wrestling, maybe even the music industry, where people
can put in the less amount of work then call
themselves either a musician or in a wrestler.
Speaker 1 (25:15):
Yeah, it seems to be going around a lot lately. Uh,
you know, from what you just said, you know, a
couple of people been pretty much called out for not
doing the work and calling themselves professional wrestler and claiming
certain guys that they're as their trainers, and certain someone
claimed multiple guys. And I saw on social media today
(25:37):
that each one debunked that story.
Speaker 2 (25:40):
Yeah. See, I don't. It's hard because one, I don't
know enough of the person. And you know, you know,
I met the guy a couple of years ago, and
I know he knew me, but I had I get
a lot of that where people know who I am,
but I don't know who they are, and especially if
they haven't been around or this area. And I'm like,
(26:01):
I was like, all right, who are you? But regardless,
I still treat people with respect. And as long as
they treat me with respect, that's you know, it's fine.
Speaker 1 (26:10):
I don't it's Italian.
Speaker 2 (26:12):
Yeah, And and but people will eventually. There's a lesson
that I learned is don't throw dirt on anybody because
they will eventually bury themselves, right, And that's what happened. Uh,
you know, and next thing, you know, you got called out.
I was like, all right, now, he said it. So
I'm like whatever, And you know, Jason Knight, you know
(26:35):
my trainer, you know who's come back around and you
know it.
Speaker 1 (26:42):
He's not the only one that denied it. There's a
couple other guys that tonight it too, Jason Rumble.
Speaker 2 (26:47):
See I I don't know. And and and somehow people
like to insert themselves in and believe me, we know
a lot of people and I met a lot of people.
I mean this a thousand times. It's never going to end.
People will hang around with people that are in the business.
The next thing, you know, they claim to be in
the business, or they start running shows, they start doing this,
(27:09):
and next thing you know, they think they have an
opinion and this that whatever. I mean, And it's never
gonna end no matter what. I'm not like pinpointing people
or anything like that. It's happened and it's going to
continue to happen.
Speaker 1 (27:24):
Uh.
Speaker 2 (27:24):
But again, I mean the magic happens training, you know,
and putting in that work, paying your dues, and you know,
don't talk like a fucking veteran if you don't have
anything to prove of what you've done, especially if a
veteran of the area don't know who the fuck you are.
Speaker 1 (27:42):
I mean, there's no you know, I tried researching this
and there's literally no YouTube footage of this person, this
said person. So I tried youtubing it and nothing comes
up other than some other guy that's not him.
Speaker 2 (28:00):
I don't know, Like I said, I don't know enough
of the person. I just know how he's treated me
and about the fit a few times that I've been
with him. Ah, you know the O I see potential,
Like I think he has a voice where it could
be a going a voice and arrogant, you know, manager
(28:20):
or something behind the scenes on the mic, commentating, et cetera.
Uh you know, I mean, I don't know. I mean
it's not gonna be the first. I mean, you're not
gonna grab a kid playing streetball and put him on
the team, you know, in a major league bas and
the same thing with a promoter. You're not gonna grab
(28:41):
someone from the or a football or a fan from
the stands and put them in charge of a company
or a fan got a football game. You're gonna make
them in charge of a coach of a team. You
gotta have humble beginning somewhere and a track record of that.
Speaker 1 (29:00):
Yeah, Yeah, talk about we touched upon it in CWF
or at the time c XW in April there returning
and they changed the name to the Connecticut Wrestling Federation.
You are the current actually the first hardcore champion there.
Speaker 2 (29:22):
Yeah, it's an honor to hold it and bring whatever
prestige I can to it and bring it to another level,
the same as to break the chains title, same as
I've done with the PAPW Intercontinental title, which is now
well they've dropped in now it's become the ai WF.
Speaker 1 (29:41):
Right, the ai WF International Belt was that and then
now the Paradise ally has the ai WF. What the
belt is that? The Atlantic Championship currently held by Blood saw.
Speaker 2 (29:57):
Right, Yeah, I don't know. I think think I'm I
think it's me and Nate Nasty one more time, you know,
third times as a charm. This is going to beat
his ass again.
Speaker 1 (30:08):
I mean he might deserve it, really, right, what the
ass beating? Yeah? Yeah, he's a young kid.
Speaker 2 (30:14):
He's a young kid. He could take it.
Speaker 1 (30:15):
Yeah. Yeah, So what else you got going on there?
We at home or not at home, in wrestling or
in life.
Speaker 2 (30:23):
Coming is other than the Hall of Fame. January nineteenth.
We're back at Vanguard, which is what February.
Speaker 1 (30:30):
February eighth, if I don't if you don't mind me
inserting just a little bit something here, I am making
my Pure Vanguard debut as the play by play announcer.
I just got the information yesterday.
Speaker 2 (30:40):
That's awesome that I think you would fill in great
and yeah, I mean all it.
Speaker 1 (30:47):
You know, one of the things I'm looking forward to
the most, and I love commentating your matches, is working
with working with you again. And of course you know
Alan Compass, I like working with he really he loves
having me do commentary over his matches. So he's pretty
damn excited from the conversation we had yesterday as well.
Speaker 2 (31:07):
Yeah, I mean commentation. Like I said I and I've
said this, you know, from the depths of my heart,
how honored and privileged I am. I mean because especially
not that I'm not, and they didn't enjoy everybody else
throughout my career that's been commentating on you know, from
you know, Jerry Strauss and which is Rob Echoes's brother,
(31:30):
you know, from any w and you know, everybody throughout
my career that's commentated. You guys are the voice of
my career, and and it means a lot more to
me now because I don't know what next year will bring.
You know what I mean? You know you and you
know even Alex Rojas, you got Andrew, you know Big Daddy,
(31:54):
Tommy Tonime is Joey g Who else I'm as d
m forcer you know what I mean? Is there anybody
else I missed? You know, maybe you know, like Sean Jacobs,
if there's you know, there's somebody else I mean out
there that I you know, then you got Matt to
court and you know g K Durant. You guys are
the voice of my career right now, you know, and
(32:17):
and I and I appreciate that you guys make me
want the deep going because I look forward to that,
you know. And it's like you make us look like
like larger than life. And I'm just a short, fat
Italian kid that wanted to be a wrestler. You know,
I'm tattooed and bearded. Kids look at me as I'm
a superstar, and I'm quick to remind people I'm just
(32:40):
an Italian kid that wanted to be a wrestler.
Speaker 1 (32:43):
You've gotten quite a bit of young fans recently and
you know, we got to meet them at Vanguard, and
you know after your match against Ryan Frost, you know
you were signing pieces of the door that you put
him through or he put you through.
Speaker 2 (32:59):
Yeah, me through. But you know it's not the first
store I've been through or table, you know what I mean.
I've signed chairs, I've signed you know a lot of things,
and you know what I mean. My might signature worth anything,
but it's the memory that's worth more. I've made a
lot more memories friends and fans in this business that
(33:19):
I have money.
Speaker 1 (33:21):
I have right here behind me. You're not gonna be
able to see it in this view because my background
is blurred out, but hanging out behind me, I have
a turnbuckle with the Paradise Sally Pro Wrestling roster from
Jesus five years ago, and you're the first person that
got that signed it. It's an old it's a turnbuckle.
(33:41):
I bought a Lang term buckle and I said, I'm
bringing this. I want you to sign it. So you
were the first one. You are the person that I
had in mind when I got this to sign it,
and then I ended up getting probably like thirty other
guys to sign it.
Speaker 2 (33:53):
On Toody never told me that. What you never told me.
Speaker 1 (33:56):
That you don't remember signing this?
Speaker 2 (33:59):
No, no, no you don't. They didn't tell me. You know,
you had me in mine first.
Speaker 1 (34:05):
I had it, you know, and I was like, I
want to get you to sign it.
Speaker 2 (34:08):
Now, this is like does it go does it go
back to when you fucking saw me come out when
I dated for APW.
Speaker 1 (34:14):
No, No, it was probably a year or so after that.
I think they were still running shows in the Annex
and the at the school maybe.
Speaker 2 (34:24):
Yeah, oh look where we are now.
Speaker 1 (34:26):
Yeah, I mean it was a weird time because it
was like it was pre pandemic and post pandemic, and
I think during the pandemic that's when you and I,
you know, got closer and became better friends over time.
So like the last five over the last five years.
Speaker 2 (34:40):
Yeah, it was it the last show at the Annex
where No, no, it wasn't that show. The last show
at the Annex was, uh.
Speaker 1 (34:48):
The Bob Lachlan was there.
Speaker 2 (34:49):
I think, yeah, I was gonna say, what did it start?
The night that when Jamie came up to the railing
and I, you know, and I kissed him on his head.
Speaker 1 (35:00):
That was probably the show before that or the show
before that. It was probably it was in that group
of shows, probably like within three or four shows.
Speaker 2 (35:06):
Yeah, yeah, that one was before the that six man. Okay,
I think I.
Speaker 1 (35:12):
Remember, and that's the video. You know, we both share
it yearly, and it kind of that moment, you know,
I remember talking to you outside and that moment really
kind of meant a lot to me, and that you
went right up to him and you know, and it
just meant a lot to me that you took that time,
that brief second right there, kissed him on the forehead,
right and he was up there and you know, my
(35:32):
kid nine years old now still knows knows who you are,
and like see a whole lot.
Speaker 2 (35:37):
Yeah. Well I try to you know, special winter together
and he's acting not acting right, you know, and I'll
kind of you know, my the father and me is like,
listen to your father.
Speaker 1 (35:46):
You look at that old Italian ass whooping, you know. Yeah,
you know that's a joke everybody just you know, I share.
Speaker 2 (35:54):
I was just recently talking to somebody about this. I
got to spoon from my mom and the belt for
my dad.
Speaker 1 (36:00):
Yeah, the wooden spoon, right. I remember at one point
that was just kind of oblivious to them. They my
mom hit me with one and it just like broken half.
So it just like it didn't work anymore.
Speaker 2 (36:10):
Well, I used to get the slipper too. They call
it lots off if you look it up. I mean
it means which, but it's the heel, the the shoe
with the with the hard bottom of the freaking open Tony.
My mom's hardcore. That's where it came from.
Speaker 1 (36:29):
That got you into the hardcore, Righteah? Yeah? Uh so
what else man would have been up to otherwise? Have
you been watching any wrestling going on?
Speaker 2 (36:38):
You know, I was just watching about a half hour
ago before we went on uh Adam Cole and MJF
confrontation promo. That's what I enjoy more than actual wrestling.
Sometimes I'll watch, like, you know, videos and whatever comes
up on YouTube, or you know, if if like a
highlight from a match comes up, they don't show the
(36:58):
whole match and it's a w or I highlight from
Raw or SmackDown, I'll watch that. I can't sit there
and watch a lot of today's product, you know. That's
why it's weird for me to go to a show
and sit there and watch wrestling because I'm like, you know,
because I'm still active, and I'm like, you know, and
I'm fatiguing and this and that. But I don't know.
(37:21):
I like promos. I like storytelling and the build up,
and I like to kind of do that myself, you know,
either if it's a promo, if I do it myself,
or in the ring. And you know, that's what's missing.
Speaker 1 (37:35):
Yeah, I mean a lot of the storytelling, especially in AW,
I think that it's missing. There's not a lot going
on over there. But then again, I mean I attempt
to watch the product every so often, and even when
I'm home on Wednesdays, it's Wednesday evenings. I don't It's
not something that I'm like, hey, i gotta be done
in time to sit and watch AW, you know what
I mean. It's just Friday nights and SmackDown that's another thing,
(37:58):
you know, But views that's another thing. But regular weekly TV.
It's a completely different thing than it was than when
we were a kid, Like I had to be there
on Saturday mornings ten am to watch Superstars.
Speaker 2 (38:10):
Well, how do you feel about Raw coming on the
Netflix now? Because I'll behold for that.
Speaker 1 (38:16):
I'll be able to watch that it's game changing, I
think honestly, because not only is you know, RAW or
WWE has a history of changing the game as far
as professional wrestling and television as a whole, live sports,
live wrestling. Netflix kind of changed the game when they
went to streaming and no more DVDs, you know what
(38:39):
I mean, when they started the streaming thing. So it's
two of the game changers coming together to put this
show together. And the show is being built up like
it's a super show, like a big main event, like
kind of like a plee or something to that effect.
It's a lot of big matches and I'm looking forward
to it and I'm looking forward to checking it out.
Speaker 2 (39:00):
Uh.
Speaker 1 (39:01):
I think that I'm interested in the Punk and Rollins match.
I think that's gonna be those are to me, Rollins
is like one of the top performers today.
Speaker 2 (39:10):
Uh.
Speaker 1 (39:11):
You know, Punk is kind of legendary and granted he
is a little bit older, a little bit slower, but
he still has I feel a lot of quality left
in him.
Speaker 2 (39:20):
Kind of feels like me right now, right where people
feel I feel like people are trying to get the
rub for me, now, you know what I mean? You
know what I mean like not to bring this to
make this about me. But punk has that nostalgia and
still has that power draw, you know what I mean,
it's more. But that's what WW is the entertainment. It's
(39:43):
they're trying to what's gonna draw and that's what they're doing.
And I feel I hope it's more. If they're trying
to do edge your stuff, maybe wind it back to
the attitude era we will see. I mean, I think
that you've seen the changes where people are actually becoming
an off I think of who they are. You know,
I just said it to you, and I said it
(40:04):
to one or the other commentators. Is if you're trying
to be something that you're not, you're not going to
be authentic, you know, I mean, not gonna be able
to be creative.
Speaker 1 (40:15):
What do you think of the WW product today as
a whole? Do you think it's improved under Hunter?
Speaker 2 (40:21):
It's improved. It's not a lot. It's the talking is
still there, but there's a lot more build up, there's
a lot more fighting. It reminds me of the old
world class and the old school type way of booking words.
Speaker 1 (40:34):
There's my studio, the nw A studio shows. Maybe when
they brawl like crazy.
Speaker 2 (40:39):
What aw does words? There's like thirty factions.
Speaker 1 (40:43):
I don't get that.
Speaker 2 (40:44):
Yeah, yeah, I mean, and then we're talking about Ring
of Honor. To me, it's just Ring Ring of Honors,
a w LTE that's all.
Speaker 1 (40:51):
And it sucks that I was not talking about Harry
de Villa from Blood, Sweat and Tears yesterday or the
day before on the phone. And it was one of
those things where we discussed like here, you know, I stayed,
I watched h what's the show Final Battle the other night,
the Ring of Honor show, and it's like, I can't
watch the Ring of Honor television show. And he stated
(41:12):
it's like it has no heart to it, and I'm like,
it's that's it's yeah, that's true. Like the old Ring
of Honor television or the events they were like, you know,
they had something. It was like watching Japanese footage from
like the eighties, like a bunch of junior heavyweights from
the eighties or something like that, like dynamite can't Tiger Mask,
but like a full show of it, you know, something
to that effect. There was no like that super heavyweight
(41:33):
that would come in and annihilate everybody like a Stan
Hanson or anything like that. But it's just AW Light.
It's become Ring of Honor has gotten watered down and
dwindled down ever since Tony Kahan purchased it. It's basically
become the developed It's the NXT to AW Dynamite and collision,
(41:58):
you get, you know what I mean. It's like it's
become the developmental brand. It's not it's lost all its
importance that it once had. The Ring of Honor name.
Speaker 2 (42:10):
Yeah, I mean it's it's the same and equivalent of
how ECW was and then WWE try bringing it back.
You know, they're doing their version of it, but in
the garbage. Yeah, not the same. I mean we've been
to you know, an AW event. You know, they have
a few Ring of Honor matches for TV. Here comes
the AW show. Then they have three or four more
(42:32):
matches for Ring of Honor TV after and the crowd
leaves after that. But nobody fucking cares.
Speaker 1 (42:38):
The crowds are dead as well, like nobody's cheering. That's
the other thing that drives me, drives me nuts, like
watching wrestling and it's like a bunch of people sitting
on their hands.
Speaker 2 (42:49):
I'll never be able to talk or understand or defend
of what goes on at that level. You know, I
could certainly say that I wouldn't be able to do
this for a living. Maybe now maybecause if things have changed,
But I don't know. I mean, you know, my circumstances
(43:10):
were different, you know, in my career and what I've
wanted a shop of course, but priorities are first.
Speaker 1 (43:17):
Yeah, I mean, you're older, your kids are older now,
and you know, but you're older and working. So would
your body be able to handle traveling and stuff like that?
Speaker 2 (43:26):
Yeah? I mean, I mean I can't even handle a
two hour drive in a car because my knees fucking hurt.
But I came to sit in a chair for twenty
minutes and I need somebody to help me up. I mean,
you just witnessed Mikes Yep, you know what I mean.
Speaker 1 (43:40):
Yeah, and you recently had a knee issue trying to
get having a hard time getting up in the ring
and stuff like that because your knee was bothering you,
like immensely.
Speaker 2 (43:52):
It almost felt like my knee got locked because I
was sitting in a certain position for four hours, you know,
two hours worth and another hour back for the next
day and ever since then kind of felt like I
lost mobility, so I had to kind of stretch it back.
But I did feel it last week a little bit
at the last show. But you know, being over the
(44:15):
last three, you know, maybe five years now be in
a face, you know, being a baby face, and you know,
it hard to be a deal, you know, anywhere I
go unless depending on how I'm booked or what story
I'm telling, you know, and it's harder for me to
you know, move around as a as a baby face
(44:36):
because I'm always selling them down. I'm always getting up
and ship and it's become harder. And if you noticed,
you know, like I always kind of have to push up.
I have to pull the rope something to help me up,
and depending on how I move, I could swing my
leg over and I could get up. It's gotten better,
but that's constant, like work, you know, stretching cardio and
(44:59):
like today I did an We're on the treadmill just walking,
you know, speed walking, and I definitely feel it, but
I'll feel better in the morning, you know, especially being
on my feet you know during you know, eleven hours
a day at work, you know, and I still go
to the gym and do my cardio and et cetera,
get through the pain. I rather deal with the pain
later and get the work in. But being in a
(45:20):
heel like last week, even though it's a little easier,
more my element, I can save myself, save my body,
save my movements. And like you said, you saw it firsthand.
I was beating frost ass and that's heel. Dread, it's
(45:40):
me amped up, and there wasn't a me Can you
say other than the match was a little slow paced.
There was not a dull moment when.
Speaker 1 (45:50):
When I'm there, I don't think that it was a
dull like a dull moment. It was a little slow paced.
Speaker 2 (45:57):
Like there's never a dull moment right with me?
Speaker 1 (46:00):
No, I mean, like I said, over time, you've become
one of my you know, I've obviously I've known your
career probably almost since the beginning, and I've gotten every
time I get the opportunity to work with you. I
take it as an honor to do that. And you know,
I think that you've only gotten better over the years.
(46:21):
It's something that I look forward to. I wouldn't say
there's a dull moment, no, because I think that some
of these young cats that you're working with are keeping
you young?
Speaker 2 (46:31):
What about frank Z? Like you? You told our story
about how that was the last minute thing, and I
would I didn't even know you were there, but I
love the fact that you were there because I know
how one you have When you're calling you a match
for me and you think of that match compared to
last week.
Speaker 1 (46:47):
I mean, let me tell the backstory about how I
got involved on that show. It's uh, you know, it's
the show is slated to start at seven pm. At
six fifteen, I got a text from both Kevin and
Big Daddy, Hey are you on your We need you
in the booth, and I'm like, oh, I had no clue.
Nobody said anything. I immediately grabbed that shirt off off
(47:09):
my hangar and just jumped in the car. I made
it there with ten minutes to spare, went to the
bathroom and ended up in the booth. I had no
time to go over notes or anything. Your match was
a hardcore match with mister Z the Nightmare, and this
was his first hardcore match, I believe, and I got
(47:30):
to tell you that both of you guys killed it.
You went all over ringside. There was I don't know.
It was very interesting matchup. There's lots of weapons involved
and kind of stick the garbage pail. What else was
there better? A barbed wire, the table, right, yeah, the chairs,
and it was very enjoyable. It's up on YouTube for
(47:52):
folks that you can go check out Paradise ally Pro
Wrestling's YouTube Mania and Paradise. And the fact that I
got to call that match between a guy that's up
and coming in Frank mister Z and the a friend
and legend that is Bull Dread. I was completely honored
because I think that Frank is a guy that has
all the potential in the world to be a great
(48:14):
character and to go very far and be maybe the
next Bull Dread in a way.
Speaker 2 (48:21):
Yeah, uh, you know, he could very well be the
next you know, hardcore nightmare, you know what I mean. Uh,
you know, looking back, I watched the match completely because
I love the commentary, and like I said, I thank
to you guys because it made us. It made the
match even more enjoyable to watch, even though it was
(48:42):
me watching myself. And you know, there's certain certain things
where I have to pull the inside of the certain
things I want to critique him on. But my I
think that was his fifth match, and that was his
biggest crowd, you know what I mean.
Speaker 1 (48:56):
And there's almost three hundred people in that building.
Speaker 2 (49:00):
Problemly, I put that match together and I kind of pinpointed,
these are the points you know of I'm building you up.
I mean, it's not about the win or loss. For me,
it doesn't bring meat, doesn't do anything to me. You know,
I'm already established. I move on to the next you know,
to you, it brings you up, get you ready for
(49:20):
whoever storyline you're going to go into next. And like
I said, it was about building him up his character.
You know, he's only going to get better. But I
did my part. The rest is up to him. Like
and I said that to somebody else in the past.
You know, the fans are there for you. The rest
is up to you. Right, You have to keep them invested.
(49:40):
You got to be passionate, You got to bring that intensity.
You know what's more important to sell or the spot?
What gets you over?
Speaker 1 (49:51):
Yeah? I get you. It's it's the Yeah, I get you.
Speaker 2 (49:55):
You know it's not the spot that's gonna get you
over it. It's to selling. Who's ever selling for you? You
know that intensity, and that's what's missing, you know. I
think that's what people have gotten off track or what
ring of honor has kind of you.
Speaker 1 (50:09):
Know again, and I'll say it again. I say it
on the show all the time.
Speaker 2 (50:13):
Less is more, Yeah, you know, I mean I maybe
I've been through that stage. We're you to try to
do so many things, but as you mature, and I
said this to Frank mister, as you mature as a performer,
you will learn there's certain things you don't need to do.
You have to give him less, you know, and build
your character, save your breath for when it's important, you know.
(50:35):
I mean like when you saw me last week? Did
you see me screaming and yelling at the fans?
Speaker 1 (50:40):
No, I save that.
Speaker 2 (50:42):
I showed my emotions with my my movements, and you know,
and even some lady front row. I don't know if
you heard it. I'm at a comfortable stage in my
life and career where how hard I work to be
where I am, where I can take my shirt off
and you know see where I was where I am
and it's a confidence, especially when you you're I'm out
(51:06):
there performing because I'm not thinking about that. I'm not
thinking about how I look, I'm thinking about getting the
performance down in my character. A front lady in the
front row looked at me and she goes, no, no, no,
put your shirt back on it. I just stared at her,
and the thoughts that were going through my head where
I could have said stuff, I just brushed and I
just looked at her and I just continued with what
(51:28):
I was doing. It's amazing how people can judge a
book without reading the story. Because if I was a
good guy, you know, if it wasn't something she liked,
if it was something she liked, she would have been applotting.
But because it was somebody you didn't like, you gotta
(51:50):
draw them down, you know, I mean, but not to
get off the subject. It's I mean, you saw that
in the match with me and mister Z and uh,
it's about saving your breath, you know, words you start
yelling and this and that. It's cheap heat. You know
I've done that. But you can show a lot more.
You can get a lot more at heat with not
(52:12):
giving the fans what they want. But you can show
with your intensity and you know certain movements or whatever.
You know, doesn't always have to yell to get heat.
Speaker 1 (52:26):
Correct correct, Yes, and uh, well, you know, I wish
the best to mister Z and I think that, like
I said, I think he's got a bright career and
and of course Mike Buldred has had a tremendous career. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (52:42):
I mean, uh, everybody, everybody that's up and coming from
p APW are coming into the business the right way,
you know, even people with t O s.
Speaker 1 (52:50):
Yeah, we look at the look at the instructors that
that are there. You have t os. You have Alec
excuse me, Slick and what Bobby Ocean right over there, yeah, yeah,
and then and then Pierre Diyally, it's Mario and Roma
and I believe Chris Battle is a coach there, and
I think on occasion Holiday is over there.
Speaker 2 (53:11):
Yeah, you know, and then you got Ja Busta you.
Speaker 1 (53:13):
Know Team three D. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (53:15):
Yeah, there's a lot, you know, a lot of great
places to go. I mean, I I'll tell people like
these are the three I'll tell them like if you know,
I would, you know, you you'll learn one aspect here,
you learn one aspect there. You know, maybe learn You're
to learn three different ways you know of the same
It's like having directions three different type of directions, but
(53:38):
it's always going to have the same destination. Yeah, p
APW has become my home and uh and I'm honored
to be kind, you know, to be where I am.
You know, five years is going by that fast.
Speaker 1 (53:51):
Yeah, here last.
Speaker 2 (53:53):
Year staying to you, you know, I mean, wow, you
know next year it was gonna be twenty four years.
Le's get through this year.
Speaker 1 (54:01):
Yeah. I hope to do more work there in the
coming year in twenty twenty five, you know, I know
they have the I don't know if there's any word
whether the show is going to be broadcast or not,
and if it is, I'd really like to be a
part of it. That's on them. That's up to them though,
so but the answer is yes, if that's what they decide.
Because it's a Sunday afternoon, two o'clock is the Hall
(54:22):
of Fame, three o'clock is the show, I urge everybody
to get out there because it's going to be a
big one. There's a lot of great matches already announced.
You can go to the Paradise Sally Pro Wrestling Facebook
page to see those announcements. On their Instagram
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