911 to The Plandemic & Everywhere In Between

Episode Transcript
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(00:01):
One world currency. I imagine thatright now you're feeling a bit like Alice
tumbling down the rabbit hole. Letme tell you why you're blue. You're
here because you know something. Whatyou know you can't explain, but you

(00:24):
feel it. You felt it yourentire life, that there's something wrong in
the world. You don't know whatit is, but it's there, like
a splinter in your mind, drivingme mad. It is this feeling that
has brought you to me. Thisis your last chance. After this,
there is no turning about. Youtake the blue pill. The story ends.

(00:44):
You wake up in your bed andbelieve whatever you want. You take
the red pill. You stay inWonderland, and I show you how deep
the rabbit hole is. All I'moffering is the truth. Nothing. When
we are opposed around the world bya monolithic and rumless conspiracy and relies primarily

(01:07):
on covert means for expanding its sphereof influence, on infiltration instead of invasion,
on subversion instead of elections, onintimidation, instead of free choice,
on guerrillas by night instead of armiesby day. It is a system which
has been scripted vast human and materialresources into the building of a titan,

(01:29):
myth highly efficient machine that combine military, diplomatic, intelligence, economics, scientific
and political operations. Its preparations areconcealed, not published. Its mistakes are
buried, not headlined. Its descentivesare silenced, not praised. No expenditure
is questioned, no rumor is printed, no secret is revealed. But I

(01:53):
am asking your help and the tremendoustask of informing and alerting the American people.
And now welcome to another episode ofDown the rabbit Hole. Here's your
host. It's Popeye. Ladies andgentlemen, Welcome to another live edition of

(02:15):
rabbit Hole Radio. It is Junetwenty second, two thousand and twenty four,
tonight's live edition. I am joinedby two very special guests, and
I'm going to get right to thembecause we have a lot to talk about.
So first I'm going to introduce DonJefferies, somebody who obviously needs no

(02:36):
introduction on this radio broadcast. Heis a frequent guest and friend of the
broadcast, and I like to thinkthat Don is also a personal friend of
mine. He's a great guy,great author, great researcher, and all
around great human being. Don,welcome back. Well, thanks so much
for the kind introduction, Popeye,it's been too long. It's always great
to be with you. Yes,well, introduction is deserved you, brother,

(03:00):
you are a great human being.And I'm also joined tonight by a
first time he's on the broadcast,but definitely won't be the last by an
old school Down the rabbit Hole listener, not even just rabbit Hole Radio,
but down the rabbit Hole with Popeyegoing back in the day, and he

(03:23):
is now a researcher and a podcasterin his own right, and he's got
kind of a special story to tellabout his like his journey being a researcher,
and he works with Don So Iwant to introduce mister Chris Graves.
Chris, welcome to the broadcast,brother Popye. It's an honor and a

(03:50):
pleasure, and I really appreciate this. This is it's kind of a full
circle moment for myself. Like youhad mentioned, Yeah, we'll go ahead
explain explained to the listener really quickwhat you would tell because I only learned
this recently. You had just toldme about a month or so ago about
this, and I didn't know this, So go ahead and explain what you
mean by this is a full circlemoment, you know, being on here

(04:13):
with me and Don Well, I'vebeen researching conspiracy theories or I don't even
like using that term just because itwas you know, as a lot of
people probably already know that the termconspiracy theory was created by the CIA in
nineteen sixty seven to kind of discreditthe Warren Commission critics. But I like

(04:39):
to think of myself and other peoplethat I really respect, like Wester Jeffries
and in yourself, as conspiracy analysts, and especially the late great Day McGowan,
who recently I've been able to havequite a few conversations with his brother
Craig. And what makes us afull circle moment for me is that I

(05:03):
originally I actually first came across misterDonald Jeffries talking about his book Hidden History
on your broadcast. And forgive meif it's not the correct year, but
I think it was either twenty thirteenor twenty fourteen, and he had mentioned
certain certain weird oddities about a Idon't know if you're going to get you

(05:28):
know, I don't want to getyou in trouble on any platforms. But
there was a certain tragedy that happenedin Connecticut in twenty twelve, in December,
you can say the name We're onRumble and I don't care. I
mean, I'm not on YouTube,so you could say it was the Sandy
Hook massacre. It was the SandyHook massacre, which a lot of people,
including myself and others have questions about. And I've never claimed that it

(05:53):
was a hoax or anything like that. I actually think that a lot of
these weird oddities that were broadcasts tothe world, like people, you know,
for instance, just weird human behavioron certain you know, certain individuals
was broadcast and kind of uh,kind of put out there like this weird

(06:16):
Twilight Zone aspect to that whole casethat kind of entrapped researchers and legitimate truth
seekers, and it kind of,in my opinion, they kind of culminated
with the Alex Jones trials, whichI fully, I fully think that mister
Jones, I can't prove it,but I have I have a sneaking suspicion

(06:39):
that he probably he played a part, I feel like. But anyway,
mister Jefferies on your show had mentionedthings like don uh like the principal Don
Hawk Sprung doing an interview with theNew Town b and then we find out
that she was the first one officiallymurdered, so that that was an impossibility,

(07:01):
and other things like, uh,that nurse mentioning that Adam Lanez's mother
had been a kindergarten teacher and thenan excellent kindergarten teacher actually said nothing but
kind words. But then we findwe find out that part of the official
story that Nancy Lanza had nothing todo with the Sandy Oak School. And

(07:23):
the last thing besides the helicopter footage, which kind of made it seem like
nothing really was going on. Youknow a lot of us thought that I
watched it in real time where theyhad other they had other perpetrators supposedly in
the woods, and another reports aboutother assailants that got away that were dressed

(07:44):
up like nuns and just weird odditiesand things like that. And the last
thing that mister Jefferies brought up itreally got me on his radar like with
this, was that there was alot Montenior that was doing an interview with
MSNBC news the phone, and hestarted giggling, and that intrigued me like

(08:05):
nothing else, because I'm actually someonewhen it comes to conspiracy theories. I'm
someone that is really basically, what'sthe I'm trying to think of the correct
term, But I'm intrigued because alot of these are like most of these

(08:26):
are tragedy. So I'm not gettingany kind of enjoyment out of it.
But there's an era of mystery aboutthese individual events, and especially when when
it comes to footage or you know, articles and things that were first reported
about incidents that disappeared down the memoryhole, never to be seen again.

(08:48):
We were not supposed to actually knowabout them from the beginning. And I'll
say this TWA eight hundred is abig issue for me because it was reported
that there were multiple airings on differentcable networks of missiles taking down that flight,
and we were never privy to thatfootage ever again. And there were

(09:09):
way too many witnesses that reported onit after the fact that all that stuff
went down the memory hall, whichis it's actually very relevant to mister Jeffries's
new book, especially with the title. And there was also a thing about
Columbine because I'm actually friends with aColumbine survivor that saw things and people that

(09:31):
were involved that were not a partof the official story. Including other shooters
and things like that. And Iremember distinctly in the mid two thousands there
being reports and pictures and actually videofootage from a helicopter of a NATO truck
in front of Columbine High School andthen began and I've never been able to

(09:52):
find that stuff ever since. SoI was introduced to mister Jeffries on your
program, POPU and also people likeWolfgang Halbig had an infamous interview with you
when he was visited by state troopersthat were telling him to shut his mouth,
so, you know, looking intoSandy Hook in the incident. So

(10:16):
this very much is a full circlemoment for me. And if I may,
there's an actual even better researcher formister Don Jeffries's name, Peter Seacosh,
who he really should be here rightnow when I just want to make
sure that he is known as well. Even as much as I can find

(10:37):
things that have been disappeared on theInternet, mister Seacosh goes even further and
by decades and decades as mister Jeffries. Pride of you. So thank you
for having me, of course,Chris, I'm I'm honored that you know
I was able to touch your lifein such a way by just doing a

(10:58):
show with Don and it led youon the path that you're on. So
I think it's completely awesome. That'swhy I do what I do. Dude,
I just try to. I jokearound and I call myself the Johnny
Apple Seed of truth because I justrun around dropping seeds and I know that
you know, there will be youknow, the trees will grow and the

(11:20):
fruit will be you know, bornfrom those trees and your proof of that.
So I'm one of those trees.Brother, Thank you for having I
appreciate it. Well, I mean, you're you're a great researcher, Chris,
you're and you're a smart guy.And just so you guys know,
anytime, if you guys are everlooking for video of something and you're not
sure, hit me up. BecauseI've been archiving the Internet since two thousand

(11:45):
and five. Because when I firststarted doing this, I was doing this
before YouTube was owned by Google,when Google Video was out, and I
was ripping videos because I would Iwas uploading stuff and I would see all
this stuff that was free on Google, and I'm like, how like after
I understood all the way back thenwhat was going on. I was like,
they're not gonna let this stay up. No way, I'm gonna popay

(12:09):
if you don't mind me. Idon't mean to interrupt, but if if
you have certain archives, there's anepisode that down and I I know I
can speak for Dawn when it comesto this. With Shepherd Smith from one
his Fox News program on July seventeenth, nineteen ninety nine, he mentions the
other explosion in the sky witness thatwas that saw JFK Junior's plane explode.

(12:33):
So if you have that, thatwould be huge because he names names in
that segment, and Shepherd Smith won'tget back to me. He won't get
back to Dawn, but there weremultiple explosion. I'll go through my stuff
and see what I've got, becauseI've got hard drives of just videos,

(12:54):
dude, stuff that I've forgotten about, so I can look through it and
if it if I find anything evenremotely close to it, Like I found
a video of Prince in nineteen ninetynine at a concert. What was audio
that somebody had made a video of, you know, it was like a
still shot the early days of YouTube. Uh, and it's Prince in nineteen

(13:16):
ninety nine at a concert saying Osamabin Laden like in the middle of concert,
you hear him like like the beatand he goes Osama bin Laden and
getting ready to bomb, you know, New York City watch Out in nineteen
ninety nine and what. I've playedthis before and people the first time I
played it on air years ago,other like it was we were doing a

(13:37):
live stream and the other hosts thathave known me for years, I played
this and they were like, dude, did you make that up? And
I'm like, no, I swearto God, that's real, Like this
has been a rend. There's soI have a ton of stuff like that.
So give shoot me a little listof whatever. I took a note
of what you asked for. I'lllook for that, and if there's anything
else you guys need, just hitme up because if I have it,

(14:01):
if I have a you know,if I have an ebook copy of it,
you know, of whatever you needor a video or whatever, I
will gladly give it to you guys. So I'm going to take you up
on that, sir, seriously.Thank you. So let's get right to
the nitty gritty don before we getinto anything. I know the last time
I had you on we discussed maskingthe truth. And by the way,

(14:22):
we can say vaccines. We cansay the V word here. You won't
get punished or yelled at on mybroadcast. We can also say COVID was
bullshit that you're allowed to say aswell. Okay, we're allowed to say
it was a scam, demic ora plandemic or whatever you guys want to
call it. So and I wantto get into your book, masking the
Truth being like completely suppressed on sincethe last time I had you on.

(14:45):
But what's the new book about?Really quick promo your new book? Okay,
well, the new book's American memoryhole. How the court historians promote
this information. We just got SamTripoli signed on to write the foreward.
And if you know Sam, Sam'sa comedian, but as he's in our
world, he host Tinfoil Hat,which is a conspiracy related show. I've

(15:05):
been on it, Chris has beenon it. It's I'm excited about it
because it kind of opens up bywhat I hope is a new audience for
me, because I mean, he'sfriends with Joe Rogan, he's friends with
Jimmy Door. People like that.That. I am trying. I would
love to be able to make themaware of my work. But it's basically
combination of hidden history and crimes andcover ups in the American politics seventeen seventy

(15:30):
six nineteen sixty three, which wasbasically hidden history too. This is basically
hidden hisstory three. But for somereason, Skyhorse, my primary publisher,
doesn't like to put the numbers in. I don't know why. I think
it makes more sense, but youknow, that's what they don't want to.
So this is basically the third lineof the Hidden History, and it's
a combination of the first two becausewe start at the beginning of the Republic
and we have lots of things thatwere going on. I talk a lot

(15:52):
about judicial review and Thomas Jefferson,and I think I'm the first person since
Thomas Jefferson and you talk about howhorrible judicial review has been and still is
and has ruined the checks and balancesand ruins the legal system. More about
Lincoln, the awful you know,tired Abraham Lincoln. US grant all your
favorite president, my favorite president,you know, all the war crimes and

(16:18):
the terrible presidents. He said,we'll talk a little more about the war
with Mexico and James Polk and againhow that was really the first step.
You know, we kind of andand how you know, we did steal
a lot of land from Mexico.So as much as I don't like a
group like Loraza, they have apoint. We did steal and we'd committed
a lot of atrocities there. Andwe talked a lot about when this is

(16:40):
where you know, Peter Seacosh comesin. Peter Seacusch did so much work
on Woodrow Wilson and his intervention,his foreign policy. We'll talk about all
the times he went into Mexico andHaiti and Dominican Republic, Philippines, things
like that that don't get reported andthe atrocities committed there. And also way
more about FDR. Again, PeterSeacutch did that. We Peterson FDR invented

(17:03):
cancel culture. Will show that inthe book. I mean, he ruined
so many careers, He got peoplefired from the radio stations and newspapers back
then, that was the media backthen. He was running cancel culture.
Then second favorite president obviously, andalso lots on Joe McCarthy, who I'm
continuing to try to restore his image. I think he was a genuine American

(17:25):
hero, and we'll talk like moreabout that, and then we go into
areas that Chris really helped a lot, and research a lot more about JFK,
a lot more about the JFK Junior. As Chris kind of alluded to.
I talked to a couple of people, communicated with a couple of people
that are important in that people willbe I think interested in what they had
to say. And Chris did alot of work on Oklahoma City and nine
to eleven. We go much deeperin there as well. So it's kind

(17:47):
of a combination of everything. It'sa big book, you know, it's
four and fifty pages or whatever itis. So I certainly people that like
the other two lines will want toget this one nice and where can they
buy it to best help you?Well? Masking the Truth is the only
book that I have where if youbuy it through that Lulu Midnight Writer News
thing, I get a much biggercommission cut. And actually at this point

(18:10):
that's really the only place you canbuy it because Amazon and Barnes and Noble
have basically disappeared the book. SoI do you don't have much choice,
But most of my books I don'tcare they pay us so little Popeye.
I mean, the authors get solow. You have to sell so many
books to make money on this stuff. It's just they really really ripped the
people on just like I mean,it's not as bad, but it's the

(18:33):
same kind of principle. They're usingmusic as I wrote my book on bar
and Fame about the entertainment industry.As you know, when they were given
even the Beatles and the Rolling Stonesone one to two cents per record,
and they had to split that upwith the band members, so they pay
you penis and the same thing withall you know, you get ten percent
or whatever, maybe fifteen percent ifyou're lucky, and so you're not getting

(18:53):
anything. You have to sell awhole lot of books. So I'm certainly
not doing this for money, althoughI feel if I get enough books out
there, maybe eventually, you know, enough of them altogether will add up
to something. So I just peoplecan buy it where everything want. I
usually, as much as I don'tlike Amazon, Amazon is important for authors
because it's the only place that hassales rankings, and it's it's the place

(19:15):
people go to first now and ifthey see a lot of rate you know,
ratings like, you know, pleasegive it a five star rating.
Anybody doing it, in my books, is very appreciated. People are followers,
and so they're going to look andsay, oh, that's got a
lot of ratings. Maybe I'll checkit out. If it doesn't have a
lot of ratings, just go bybecause they're followers. And if you as

(19:37):
far as sales ranking, if theyscroll down to see it and you have
a high sales ranking, that againthey'll be more like, well, wow,
what's this book's like. It lookslike a lot of people reading it,
and maybe I do want to readit. So Amazon's as good as
any place. And right it's outthere now, it's out for pre sale,
and so people can always that theywant to pre order it. That's

(20:00):
they would be wonderful, awesome.Everybody go out there, any of my
listeners that are interested in Don's work, please support him. Go to Amazon,
by his books, by all ofthem. That you will not be
bored. I promise you, Ipromise you. You. Look. As
as long as I've been doing this, Don has blown my mind with a

(20:22):
few things. The whole thing aboutI'm I'm stuck right now on Merriweather Lewis
and his murder. I am sointrigued by that. I keep bringing that
up in random conversation. I swearto God, anytime I can interject the
murderer, I don I I'll dropthat. I'll be it'd be a random

(20:45):
conversation and something will come up aboutlike, oh, you know, well
back, you know, remember twohundred years ago, blah blah blah blah
blah, And all of a sudden, my brand's like, oh, the
murder of Merriweather Lewis. I haveto somehow like work that in. I'm
so intrigued by that. So thankyou for opening my eyes to that whole
thing. And you know, thethe untold truths of their journey, you

(21:07):
know. So again, ladies andgentlemen, Don's work is amazing. Really
he you know, he will intrigueyour brain. Even if you think you
know everything, you don't. Soget his books. You'll be entertained.
And you're supporting a great guy.So I want to get in to what
you said about five minutes ago,and then I want to pick Chris's brain

(21:30):
about something. But you were talkingabout your book Masking the Truth being completely
suppressed by Amazon and Barnes and Nobleand everywhere else. It's like the one.
You can talk about the assassination ofa president. You can say the
government you know did nine to eleven. That's fine, But damn you if
you say anything negative about the Kofkoofor the arm dart right, if you

(21:56):
say anything bad about either one ofthose two, then suddenly you're a social
pariah, Don because you can't goagainst the World Health Organization. You know,
God forbid. Okay, you know, how dare you, you ugly
human being that you want people tobe sick? Don You know you don't
you love Fauci. I'm kidding.So yeah, you know when you say

(22:18):
suppressed, I know when you cameon and we talked about it the last
time. I know you had talkedabout you were having problems. How bad
did it get since the last timeyou were on. Well, it's just
basically, I mean I still checkcheck it, but I mean it's it's
stuck. It's not I don't thinkit's going to get any more reviews on
Amazon. Many many people have toldme they reviewed the book and that you
ever went up, So they justthey just decided, Okay, you know,

(22:40):
it's stuck at thirty two reviews we'renot going to get anymore Amazon interesting
number. Yeah, well yeah,I'm president. Maybe they let it go
to thirty three and really get people. Well no, because then you then
you'd be ascending into the illuminati degreesdon and that's a no note. Oh
okay, so I'm study they're keepingyou right there, isn't that kind of
Yeah, I stuck at the whateverlevel that is in thirty second. So

(23:03):
the paperback is still there, youcan so buy it. The kindle version
is just gone. There's no explanation. It's just not there anymore. So
you can't get it in a kindle. You can still get the e version
again through Lulu and the have beenthat Writer News and you have to look
again. The easiest way, Idon't have the link in front of you,
is just to type in Masking theTruth Donald jeffries H Midnight Writer News

(23:26):
or Lulu and it'll come up anduse you can let it from there.
Barnes and Noble took the entire bookoff before Amazon. I mean it's just
gone. I mean there's no there'sthere's no trace of it view and for
a long time Amazon wasn't. Youcould get to it if you've found it
individually. But if you looked formy books, and you know I have
ten now with American Memory Hole,it'll books by Donald Jeffries. It just

(23:49):
wouldn't be listed there. Even thoughit was there. They would do Google
books for a long time. Youcouldn't. You might be able to do
it now, but you for along time you would search for it and
you couldn't find it. It wasthere, but they were hiding it from
searches. You had to go tothe back door, uh say, and
World cat the Library, the WorldCatalog, the Boy the libraries. Really,

(24:10):
you know, my books are inhundreds of libraries around the world,
all of them and this one justyou know, and I have a big
audience now. It's substack. It'sthe only place I'm being allowed to grow.
It's the only place I'm not shadowman, so and people want to
support me. It's Dollal Jefferys atsubstack dot com. It's I Protest,
it's the name of some like mypodcast. So when I promoted it there,

(24:33):
you know, I had lots ofpeople that went out and tried to
get it in their libraries and theywould tell me the stories, you know,
they would they would say you know, sometimes they would just tell them,
no, we're not going to addit, which nobody ever did that.
Typically what happens is the library justsays, we'll send this for consideration
or something. They you know,they they was gonna tell you, no,
we're not going to order it.In this case, they did.

(24:55):
And it's you know, very strangebecause the library systems that were I know,
having published so many books, Ijust kind of know which library systems
across the country tend to be moreyou know, you know, friendly to
my books, that they're more open, and then you know, will usually

(25:15):
add into the collection. But theydidn't work for this one. So it's
in a handful of libraries. Andthat's it. And in fact, the
addition that was sent to the Libraryof Congresses maybe it's shown up by now,
but it didn't show up for along time. It literally wasn't even
show up in the Library of Congress. So Apple Books that I don't know
how many people buy from Apple Books, but if you wanted to buy Asking

(25:37):
the Truth from Apple Books, itwas listed for nine hundred and ninety nine
dollars there and again nobody I obviouslydidn't. It wouldn't set up a price
like that. I'd like to seesomebody that would pay nine or nine nobody
nice commission. But so that that'sthere, they're playing those kind of games.
And again, the most incredible thingis that Popeye is that considering how
controversial the subject matter is, becauseagain, my book is the only one

(26:02):
that starts from point A. Imean, I'm saying that, you know,
COVID nineteen has not been proven toexist. I'm not saying it came
out of the you know, awoohun lab in China. You know,
I'm not saying I'm saying, no, the bioweapon is the vaccine. But
I'm saying, hey, let's let'sgo back to point A, and what
is this thing? What is it? Why did you lie so much about
the statistics? Why did you youknow, why did both China and Italy

(26:25):
both No, well, actually youknow we lumped it in together with pneumonia.
And why some of the empty hospitals, the dancing nurses, all this
stuff. I talk about that theother authors like my friend named Naomi Woo
for Alex Berenson or Peter McCullough,RFK Junior with the book on Fauci,
they all are fine from the timethe vaccine is introduced, but they're not

(26:47):
talking about the things I'm talking aboutabout the aspect to it that not the
whole sea. Yeah, the lie. Yeah, I mean I call it
the greatest si op in the historyof the world. I don't think there's
any other name you can apply toit. So I think that's why it's
And even in the alt media,I mean, I've tried to get people

(27:07):
interested in it that have really bigplatforms and the biggest platforms because they're talking
about it and there, you know, this should be the book they were
waiting for. And I got onInfo War as American journal Harrison Smith once
and that caused a brief you know, I got a brief uptick in sales,
but haven't been asked back. Alexdidn't ask me on and you know
other things Jimmydore, places like that, Stup Peters, these shows that should

(27:32):
be interested, I can't get intouch with them. So that's the problem
is that the really bigger platforms toyou know, to make that people aware
of this book. So people say, hey, well this is the book
to find out everything about it frompoint a on that tells you the history
of it. It talks about thethings that the other people that go down
the rabbit hole, if you will, all the way to the bottom.

(27:53):
And so it's it's been very frustrating. As you know, I still have
my YouTube channelman, I mean Ihang on by Conferidos, and it's you
know, again they hold they've beenholding on my subscribers on YouTube again.
They just just don't let it grow. I mean I'll look and say I
haven't any new subscribers I had thatmonth, but then the total number almost
ever changes. It's just like theyplay that game with me on Twitter as

(28:15):
well, and I have people tellme all the time our x rather that
hey, you know, I wasfollowing you and then somebody unfollowed me and
one guys I followed you like eighttimes. So they play these games when
you'd be in shadow bam. Sothank god for substack because substack is the
only place, at least for now, I'm not being shadow ban but on
YouTube when I'm hanging on like that, when we do our live streaming podcast

(28:37):
every Friday at five pm Eastern Eyeprotest that's called I Protests as well,
I live streaming on YouTube. That'swhere I get the biggest audience, but
I also do on a rock finbut more people, you know, interact
on YouTube. And if i'm ifI have a show about COVID, if
I don't, we have to takeit down right away because otherwise they'll suspend

(28:57):
the channel or we'll give a strikeagainst So they've banned my channel a couple
of times. But I peeled thatsomebody. They let me come back.
But as you said, you cantalk about anything. I think I'm pretty
sure I could have a show aboutHolocaust that or something I don't know,
and I think I don't think,Oh, that would be perfectly fine.
You can completely that. You coulddo a three hour broadcast about it,

(29:18):
and you could have people doing Nazisalutes, and that would be perfectly fine.
You mentioned COVID, you mentioned anyof the bullshit or anything poof it
gets removed. Dude, I havevideos now. And when they started,
if you remember when they started takingstuff down under the guise of the WHO,
and they were saying, we're onlygoing to do it for COVID related

(29:40):
subjects, and it was like,yeah, sure, sure, that's the
camel's nose under the tent. Sureyou're only going to do it for that.
I'm sure you're gonna have this powerto do that and censor, but
you're only going to use it forone thing. Sure you are, because
that's always how it's gone in history, right. Sure. And now I
get videos being taken down that areeleven years old, twelve years old about

(30:04):
you know the effect of cannabis,you know that the health effects for it.
I interviewed a whole bunch of momsdown here about how they were,
you know, using it to andat the time it was illegal down here
to help their kids with seizures anddifferent disorders and stuff. Those moms helped
change the laws here in Florida.So we actually got medical cannabis because of

(30:25):
these people and because of their activism. And it literally that YouTube sends me
emails. Oh we deleted those becausethe WHO doesn't believe that cannabis can help
with cancer or seizures. And it'slike, well, but all these other
countries, where is the WHO,like unplugged from reality? I mean,
but of course we know they are, and we know that the Who's bullshit

(30:45):
and we know what their real gameis, right, But my point is
they literally have now expanded this soit does not surprise me that your book
and any discussion of your book,which do you directly with the heart of
the matter, don the key thingthat caused all of this censorship and out
of control bs, it does notsurprise me that it's been censored. So

(31:11):
before we get into any other discussion, take thirty seconds and plug where people
can buy it. Because what Iwant people to do is this. I'm
going to challenge people to do this. This is some old school activism.
I got this idea where you weretalking. So back in the day,
we used to burn DVDs. Weused to buy documentaries and then I would
burn. I had a DVD duplicatorand we would burn thousands of copies of

(31:33):
different movies. And then we wouldrun around to like Best Buy and Walmart
and stuff, and we would youknow, they used to have DVD players
that controlled all the televisions, andwe would find all the DVD players that
control the TVs and we would plunktruth documentaries in them and we would press
play and then if they had arepeat function, just repeat and take off.

(31:56):
So you'd have like Alex Jones documentariesor other people documentaries. Just pring
on Luke and Entertainment Section right,and we used to do. We used
to buy, like if there wasan author that made a good book,
you'd go out and buy ten twentythirty copies in support. Maybe get a
bunch of people together to pull theirmoney together and buy thirty copies, and

(32:22):
everybody takes a couple of copies.Maybe you each keep a copy for yourself,
but then take the rest and goto public places where like there's books
and magazines and stuff and drop oneoff, like in the waiting room of
a doctor's office, or you know, like I used to do it at
the VA Hospital. I used togo the Gary Franchiat, the guy who

(32:43):
does the next news network. Gary'san old friend. Gary used to He
got the reins from Aaron Russo beforeAaron Russo died for Restore the Republic,
and he had created a magazine calledRestore the Republic Magazine or it was Restore
their Public or Republic Magazine, whateverit was. Anyway, it was under

(33:05):
that that banner, and it waslike I want to say, like two
thousand and eight, two thousand andI was right around the time that Aaron
passed away, and you could ordercopies of this magazine in bulk and they
would print them up and ship themout and then you could go and leave
them all over the place. Andit was same idea. So this is
what I challenge people to do.If you want to make change, you

(33:28):
want to get the truth out,you want to beat censorship, Okay,
we're going to do what the Russiansare doing. The Russians went back to
using typewriters because of all this spyingand all this high tech bullshit and interception.
It's really hard to intercept an oldschool typewriter though, isn't it.
You know, if you can't interceptthat piece of paper, you're not going
to get that information right. Andeverybody's relying on all this new technological garbage.

(33:53):
So let's go old schools. Let'sbe inspired by the Russians and their
ingenuity. Okay, I challenge everybodycould go and buy Don's book and go
out and take the book and getlike, I don't know, get like
if you can twenty thirty copies whatever, If you can go get a couple
of copies everybody. If everybody onlybought like three copies, camped a copy

(34:15):
and then either gave a copy tosomeone that might read it or put it
in a public place. Go toyour local library. They won't put it
there, you know, figure outthe Dewey decimal system, figure out how
they have it. Jam that thingin there. They put it on in
the health section. Stick it ina library. If they won't purchase Don's
book, do it for them.I mean, you want to put your

(34:37):
money to good use, You wantto do some stuff, do some old
school activism. Seriously, go buyDon's book, Buy multiple copies and give
them out, Pass them out,leave them wherever because somebody's going to pick
it up. Book. A lotof people think it's bullshit. Now a
lot of people are seeing people dropdead, you know, at fifty or

(34:57):
at thirty five, Oh died suddenly. That's the that's odd. And when
you're keep seeing it, even thepeople that bought into it, even that,
like Bill Cooper coined the term sheeple, right, well, even the
sheeple are starting to see because youknow, you can only see so many
thirty five year olds drop dead ofa heart attack, and they just go,
oh, I don't know, theydied suddenly. It's kind of weird,

(35:19):
isn't it. Why is there asudden uptacking cancer? Gee, that's
kind of Weird Don Yeah, andI really appreciate that. That's you know,
but the the best win and it'sthere on Amazon. The paperback is
I'm fine with you buying it there. I mean, I do get way
more of a commission if you buyit from this the publisher. And that's
the only place you read to getthe e book now, the electronic book,

(35:43):
so the easiest way to do it. I don't have the link in
front of me, but it's justsearch Donald Jefferies Masking the Truth, Comma,
either Midnight Writer News or Lulu.It'll probably come up just under a
search for the book. But that'sthe easiest way you can get both formats
there. And yeah, any orPop I say it's great. I mean,
I really appreciate that pop by peopledoing that. And because I don't

(36:05):
have the way, I mean,I I suspect I'm not going to name
any names. Chris knows what I'mtalking about, but they're there are people,
they're alternative writers that come from avery wealthy background and they they I'm
convinced that the way they sell itbecause I know how hard it is to
sell books now because there's not thatmany readers, you know, there just
isn't as there used to be,and that read books anyhow, I'm convinced

(36:27):
that, and I would do itif I had the money. If I
had the money, I would Iwould buy five thousand copies of my book
right away, and because they allhit it one time, but would probably
go into the New York Times bestsellerlist. And once it does that,
people are followers, people will startbuying it. You'll get real sales from
it. But you know, ofcourse I don't have the wherewithal to do
that, So you know, wehave to do things like that, So

(36:49):
I appreciate you saying that kind ofit was kind of gorilla tactics, I
guess, but obviously they can workif people do it. We did it
back in the day, homie.That's how we made effective change, way
before YouTube and everything else. Iused to be out on street corners,
given at DVD's. Oh yeah,sure, yeah. I had water bottles

(37:09):
chucked out the window at me.I remember, I've had soft drinks thrown
on me. It's cool old schoolguerrilla warfare. If we want to look,
if we want to witness, yougot to you gotta fight how they
fight, because they do the samething, except they have a you know,
they have control over all the technow. So you know, we
used to use social media like guerrillawarfare. We have to go back to
old school ways. We did thingstwenty thirty years ago. So by Don's

(37:31):
book, support Don get Masking theTruth, you won't be disappointed. I
have a copy of it. Okay, even if you read. If you
read the book and you don't agreewith everything Don writes, the whole point
of getting the book out there isDon's just asking questions and pointing shit out.
Like I mean again, you know, I don't want to get sidetracked.

(37:52):
But like the dancing nurses, thatwas always a bone of contention for
me, Like, wow, allthese people are dropping dead and dying of
the you know, oh my god, we have to lock everything down,
it's so bad. But all thesenurses are making TikTok videos. I mean,
and it looked pretty coordinated and likethey have practiced, so like wow.

(38:13):
And I don't think people were like, well, it's all fake.
No, I think those were reallythey had nothing better to do. They
were being encouraged. That's all partof the whole mind game. You know.
It's like when people say, oh, well, I don't think anybody
died in any given situation. It'slike no, no, no, that's
see, that kind of narrative isput out there to muddy the water of
any real research and any real questionswith anything. You know, they need

(38:37):
real death and they need real destructionbecause they need the real emotional response.
And the deeper they can get thepublic sucked into the bullshit, the better
it is for them because the morefear is sewed inside of people's minds,
and the more fear that is sowedgives them more control. I mean,
that's really the long and short ofit. So Chris, I have a

(39:00):
question because you brought something up earlierand before we get two sidetracks, since
we're talking about things where people diedor didn't die, and you know,
you brought up Sandy Hook, andSandy Hook is definitely an interesting subject.
And you know, same thing.I never said that people didn't die or
anything. All I wanted to knowwas, you know, what was the

(39:23):
My big thing is what standard operatingprocedures were violated? And that's one of
the first things I look at withany situation. Nine to eleven. Okay,
See, anything does not matter.Anything you look at what kind of
standard operating procedures were violated. Andin that interview with Wolfgang, that's why

(39:43):
I reached out to him. Iwas talking to him, and when you
said that, that actually made thehair on my arms stand up because I
remembered being live because it was apre recorded show that wasn't even live.
Just so people know, there wasno live streaming back of the day when
we did this. There wasn't whatwe do now. So I was pre
recording an audio only broadcast to airat a later date, and I was

(40:05):
on Skype using a Skype call recorder, and I called Wolfgang Hailbig on a
landline, and the cops, thesheriffs showed up to his house not once
but twice during the interview and toldhim to stop talking. And they were
referring to our phone conversation. That'swhat was creepy. And this that was

(40:30):
a long time ago. That was, like you said, Chris twenty twelve.
So when you heard that the firsttime you heard that, did like
obviously you said that that set alarmbells off. What did you think when
you heard that interview? Can youhear me right now? Yeah, I
can hear you great, Okay.During that interview, I wasn't. I

(40:55):
can't remember it because it's been Ithink it was. It wasn't twenty two
well, because I think the Masacrehappened on December fourteenth, twenty twelve,
So I think your interview with himwas in twenty thirteen, maybe twenty fourteen
issue, you know, I wastwenty thirteen. It was like mid twenty
thirteen, I want to say,somewhere around there, like or maybe like

(41:17):
around August or something of twenty thirteen. I had the impression that it was
actually Connecticut State troopers that visited himin his Florida home. I could be
wrong, and if what I thoughtwas, if what I was thinking was

(41:38):
correct, if it was Connecticut statetroopers visiting him in his home in Florida,
which I think that's what it was. I think it was that put
out a lot of alarm bells becausebasically he got back on the air and
he was very distraught, and heended up telling you that they were telling

(41:59):
him to shut his mouth basically aboutemployer requests in terms of like Wolfgang was
looking for records when it came tolike the food delivery service to the school.
He was looking for the biohazard companythat was in charge of, you
know, picking up the like theby like the blood and I don't want

(42:24):
to get too graphic, but likethe the remains that were still in the
classrooms, things like that. Andhe was basically forbidden from by the state
troopers I think it was Connecticut,and they they came down with the with
the local sheriff's department. It waslike two detectives. Yes, they it

(42:45):
was like two Connecticut state trooper detectivesand they came down and they were like
high ranking and they came down andthe local sheriff's department went out with them,
and he was very spooked by it. I remember talking to him like
off because remember it was off airthat wasn't live I aired, and I
didn't edit anything like I mean,I edited are what he didn't want me

(43:07):
to know, the off air conversationthat he didn't want, but he was
he was spook. He was legitimatelylike your show. It was your show
that occurred during regardless of or pretaped or whatever. And he know it
was crazy. He is still sufferingto this day, you know what I

(43:30):
mean. Yeah, No, theythey really went after him man. They
and so people know who Wolfgang wasbecause there's a lot of like miss info
and like bs, Look, Wolfgangwas a former state trooper, right,
and he retired and then went intopublic safety consulting for schools, teaching schools

(43:51):
how to harden themselves against being asoft target and like, you know it
like a mass shoot shooting situation,which is what a hed at Sandy Hook.
Like he's the combine situation too.Yes, so he knew what he
was talking about. He had likea I mean, he had a very
long career. He was he beforehe was a state trooper, he was
a cop somewhere else, and Idon't remember if he was a sheriff steppuy

(44:14):
or a regular police officer. Andthen he like he moved to Florida and
he he ended up like he hadthis like I think Wolfgang was in law
enforcement like twenty or twenty five yearsif I remember Craig, it's been a
while. But he had like avery storied career. He was not like
it wasn't like he was just asecurity guard for two months at you know,
target and then decided to do ananalysis of the whole situation. He

(44:36):
really had a background, and hewas paid for a long time. Jevod
Well like who was like him gettingthat full safety position? Yes, he
yes, when when we'll get becauseBush used to be the former governor of
Florida back in the day, solike and Wolfgang was very well known like

(44:58):
he was, That's what I mean. He was high ranking in the law
enforcement community. He wasn't like aPutts where he wasn't known as like a
crazy guy or anything like that.I mean, schools hired him all over
the place to help harden themselves againstsuch a situation. So he looked at
it from his standpoint of this publicsafety official, and he was blown away

(45:21):
by the complete breakdown of standard operatingprocedures that should have happened that day and
they did not. So he startedto ask questions and that's when he sent
all these Foyer requests and they Iremember the Connecticut State Police saying something to
the effect that they felt like hewas harassing them or something like that,

(45:42):
and that was like the message thatthey were trying to convene. He actually
he got some assistance from Info Warsand Alex Jones in the beginning, and
he had a camera crew that wentwith him to Connecticut to for the Foyer
request US hearings, and the peopleat the hearings treated him like garbage.

(46:06):
You can't. Oh, yes,he actually I went to Sandy Look,
and I'll tell you, I don'tknow, like I don't want to get
too esoteric on you, but there'slike a real weird feeling about that place.
But that aside when Wolfgang there's actuallyI think it still might be on
YouTube or bit shoot or whatever,there's videos of him going to the firehouse

(46:31):
that was literally down the driveway fromthe school and there's firefighters still punch out
Wolfgang. Yeah, everything, andit's the oddest, it's the honest thing.
And he I went to the samebuilding that Wolfgang ended up going to
the charity there and Dohn can probablyyeah it's been a while, but I

(46:54):
went to that had parked a lotand he all he wanted was to get
the records of like where all themoney from the charities were going. And
he was he was met with likestate troopers there too, that wanted to
like throw them in the fact,you know, the paddy wagon and everything.
It was the weirdest situation. Anduh, they they were monitoring his

(47:15):
phone calls because when when they cameto the door, because they came twice,
they they interrupted the interview twice,and the second time is when I
ended the interview with him because theycame back and he was really wigged out.
He was really and that had abig effect on me. Pop Eye
by the way, Yeah, wellyou know, I'm really won't see,

(47:42):
well they made the mistake. Seewhat they did was even if it even
if not thousands of people had thatthat experience, Chris, you just said
something. You just said that thathad an effect on you. You remember
that you and it had an effecton you because you heard you could probably
tell by his voice he was legitimatelylike freaked out and what you know.

(48:05):
And I don't remember if we broughtthis up on air, but I know
he taught we might have. Therewas some stuff that I cut, you
know, like I said, becausehe was trying not to inflame things.
But they knew that he was onthe like they knew he was talking.
They were listening to the phone call, and like that's why I brought up
that he was on a landline.So that when you said that, when
you had mentioned that, I didnot know that they had like your your

(48:28):
radio interview on their radar already,and that they were listening. Well,
they were, they were listening tohis phone call. They told him when
they came up, they said,you know, we know, you know,
we're listening right now to the conversationbasically, And it was like the
only I ever kind of came acrossthem people listening in was survivors of the

(48:49):
Columbine massacre that saw other shooters thatwere not a part of the official story,
and firefighters that wouldn't shut their mouthsabout other explosions is going off in
the tower. And when I canagree with my arms went up. Well,
you know, when I used tointerview Susan Lindauer too, she would

(49:10):
come on the show and she'd beon a landline with me and all you'd
hear is click click click, click, click click, and Susan would go
there they are again, popeye.One day she was on the phone with
me, and while we're on thephone, there was a guy running around
her front yard dressed in black.I remember, I actually do remember that.

(49:30):
And Jack Blood said the same thingabout certain guests. He would have
too and did legit to tell youthe truth. Even recently I've been talking
to Craig McGowan, right gave thelate Gave McGowan, the author, you
know, weird changes inside the canyon. I've been talking to Craig quite a

(49:51):
bit and his phone has been doingthe same thing, and it reminds me
of when I had my conversations withDawn, like almost weekly there's a click,
click click thing. So it's thesame crap. Yeah, and you
know, they could they look,the technology exists with the line doesn't have
to click, you know, likein new cars the blinker noise it used

(50:15):
to be a solenoid. Now it'sactually just an a lot and a lot
of times it's an MP three that'srecorded and it's just like a little circuit
board and it plays it because theythey realize that if you take away the
click click click of the blinker,that's like a comforting noise in a car
that people expect to hear. Well, it's it's the same thing. Okay.

(50:36):
I think the click, click click, I don't think they need that
on the line. I think theydo that to let you know, like
we're listening, like they're they're totallyeffing with them facing sure that that new
that newly formed click click click thatyou're talking about. I don't mean to
like get goofy on it, butlike that was definitely a car thing too,

(50:57):
you know what I mean. Well, no, it was like the
old school that the reason what theclick was was a solenoid. It was
just a little metal solenoid and itwould you know, go on off,
on off, on off right,and that's what would make that clicking noise.
Well, people got used to it, and new car this you could
look it up. It's a realthing. A lot of new cars don't
have a solenoid that does it.It's an audio file that is, you

(51:21):
know, triggered. And the reasonthey did that was because they did away
with the click click click, youknow, solenoid style the Blinker system a
long time ago. But they realizedwhen they took it out of cars,
people didn't like the car. Itwas uncomfortable because that noise that became very
comforting. They got used to it. Their brain associated it with a properly

(51:44):
functioning vehicle. When they took thatlittle base noise away, it made the
car unappealing. It's a real thing. You can google it, you can
look it up. That I'm surethey haven't deleted before, but I'm learning
more about it right now. Well, it's it's all, it's it's look,
it's you know, there's a lotof psychology and manipulation that goes into
marketing. Uh you know. Butanyway, so when you hear the click

(52:07):
click click thing, you know onthe line, like I'm I always you
know, even even back in theday when Susan Lindauer used to get it,
you know, and I'd be callingher on Skype and stuff. They
you know, back then, youdidn't need to hear the click click click.
I mean, come on, likethey're just letting you know, hey,
we're here. And that's part oftheir psychological operations. They they slowly

(52:28):
taunt and f with people they don'tthat they don't want, you know.
Now it's easier just to censor theright. Yes, she was, she
used to be. She was aformer CIA asset. Yes, yep.
So I'm glad that that episode withWolfgang, even though they tried shutting him

(52:49):
down. You see, when theymake it's like the streisand effect, even
on a small scale, because now, look, look they triggered you.
I don't know how many other peopleyou know, Uh, that interview.
I'm sorry that that episode I sharedwith so many different people and don already
knew about it obviously, but thatkind of put me down my path when

(53:10):
it came to searching out like thingsthat were memory hold and things that are
on the way back machine. AndI don't even want to say all the
little churchs I have, but I'vebeen able to find all kinds of things
that the powers that be or whoeverwe want to call them, have been
trying to hide for years and years. But you have been a huge part

(53:34):
of that, and you I haveyou to thank for introducing me to mister
Donald Jefferies. And the only otherthing I wanted to ask you was I
think you I don't know if thisis correct or not because I can't find
it, but were you able tointerview Dave McGowan before you passed away?
No? I was not, ButI have a lot of his old archives.

(53:58):
Okay, I've aired that over theyears, like they were up on
YouTube. I used to have likea huge one of my YouTube channels,
has it, I don't know,I can't remember which one. They might
still be up there, but theymight have also been on a channel that
got red octobered. So you're rightbecause for the the longest time, and

(54:19):
Donn and I would would actually chatabout it. We thought that they got
to you a long time ago,and that's why we hadn't heard from you
in a long time, and wewere actually kind of worried, like we
didn't know what happened. There's alot of good researchers that just kind of
disappear, like like I A.McGowan ended up getting a fast acting cancer.
You know, you know, uh, you know, Jack Ruby or

(54:42):
whatever you know may or may nothave been a part of his demise after
he did his presentation about the Bostonbombing with John B. Wells in like
the lady Bill Cooper, who I'vebeen trying like I have a couple of
people that were, you know,involved with Bill Cooper that I've been trying
to get a hold of and mightcome forward about his murder. And I

(55:06):
do say murder because they they shotthey killed him like on his property and
there was no reason for it,so they shot him at point blank range.
The kill shot was like I wouldhave conversations with people, would like
gone about what happened to this personor that person or well Chris will tell
you that when we we were researchinghid in history, well American memborhood,

(55:31):
especially that uh, you know,people that were that were very vocal at
the time, like April Gallop innine to eleven, witnesses like that that
were very vocal talking early on anddisputing the story. You can't get to
hold these people now. Their numbersare disconnected. I mean, Chris will

(55:51):
find this information for me and sendthem to me, and almost every time
the number has been disconnected. AndI I just don't think that that many
people have their numbers to connected,you know that often and they were,
yeah, but don We were ableto find not only Timothy mcveigh's father,
but also the the the great OliverNorth, Holly North or whatever and the

(56:15):
Yeah, certain people will answer thephone, others won't. So that's where
I seemore hersh answered that I hada brief conversation with him, and Timothy
mcvay's dad answered the phone. Italked to him, but most of the
time they don't. And you know, it's it's uh, but it gets
frustrating because you say, you knowwhat happened to these people researchers too,
I mean some of the people thatdid research on uh, you know,

(56:36):
nine to eleven Oklahoma City and everything. Most of them are well, some
of them have died, but othersare you know not. Also also,
Don will tell you that in termsof the Sandy Hook stuff we've been talking
about. And I apologize for cuttingdown off, but I don't blame Don.

(56:57):
Like when I find certain people likethe corner of Adam Lanza that let
her husband take a look at whatwas in the body bag I found this
person, I don't blame Don fornot wanting to reach out to this person
because of all these b S lawsuitsthat are going on. Yeah, I'm
not talking to anybody associated with sendingthat's not going to you know, I'll

(57:22):
write about it, and I'll andI'll make it very clear when i'm writing
too that I'm not saying I knowanything that happened or didn't happen. I'm
just asking questions. And I'm notmaking any kind of you know, casting
as persons on himity, But I'mjust asking questions. Why does a helicopter
start to show nothing going on?Why why are there no AMT people let

(57:44):
the building? Just basic questions likethat, and uh, and I can't
ask them. I don't know,but that can get you sued though.
Now, so I don't blame likewhen I send on these things when he
doesn't, if he's not a ordoesn't want to contact these people, I
don't blame him because there's a precedentnow with the Alex Jones trial, yes,

(58:09):
or trials, Yeah, because nowthat, in my opinion, Popeye,
like January sixth, they the SandyHook Alex Jones trials were meant to
dissuade any researchers from asking any questionsabout any past, present, or future

(58:31):
questionable events, just like January sixthmade it so that people are scared of
death to be a out to protest, go out and protest, peacefully protest,
And I think it was effective onboth counts. Well, yeah,
January sixth, definitely it serves apurpose to make people afraid to go to

(58:52):
protest. But it also they neededa physical meme of for you know,
the Trump support quote unquote the MAGAmovement, because they're trying to put all
you know, because there's so manydifferent groups that were like, oh,
well you know I support Trump,you know, I support all these different
groups, So there was no oneway to lump them all under an umbrella

(59:16):
and throw a label on them.So they needed a physical meme. They
literally needed something that they could control, but something that they could scream and
yell about. I mean, theythey compare January sixth to nine to eleven,
and that makes me want to punchpeople in the face. Nine to
eleven is a source subject for me. It's the thing that woke me up.

(59:39):
I was a firefighter in New Jerseyon that day, Like I can't
explain to you, yes, andI can't explain to you. I helped
out with the Red Cross. Idid a bunch of stuff, but I
don't talk about that anyway. Thepoint is it's a personal thing for me.
That's what woke me up. That'sno no christ you, no no
policies. I don't. I don'tlike to talk about it because I'm not

(01:00:00):
trying to like bring attention on me. The point is nine to eleven woke
me up years a couple of yearslater. It was the first thing I
looked back into and when I lookedback into it with my brain, like
because I was a firefighter and Iwas I had a year and a half
of arson investigation and explosive investigation trainingfrom New Jersey State Fire College as well

(01:00:22):
as one of the county fire academiesin North Jersey. So I had,
like all this experience and understanding andknowledge, but it was completely blinded.
And this is why I say theirmind control techniques are powerful. As smart

(01:00:42):
as I am and knowledgeable about thesubject, I did not even bother accessing
any of that when it came tonine to eleven because it was such an
emotional thing for me that I actedand reacted emotionally. I did. I
did, just like everybody else did. I bought being so close, being

(01:01:04):
able to smell the death in theair, being able to I have memories
from those first couple of weeks thatwill never go away. Okay, And
I can tell you that you hadto go through that series. No,
no, there's there's no it's no. I don't That's not why I bring
it up. Oh No, No, As an outsider looking in, that
was my That was the That wasthe incident. I think JFK is Dawn.

(01:01:30):
I don't want to speak for him, but I think JFK was his
incident nine to eleven. I wasin high school watching it live on TV
in the classrooms. So I'm stilllike traumatized by that. So it's like,
when you're telling me this, Ididn't even know, Like I listened
to your program back in the day, like back in like twenty ten,

(01:01:52):
twenty eleven, whatever, I didn'tknow this backstory. And I'm sorry you
had to through that, because Ihave talked to quite a few firefighters that
have gotten They felt like they weren'table to come forward with what they experienced

(01:02:16):
and that event has never been justlike, there's never been any real true
justice for that. So I'm notpandering to you, but I didn't know
that that part of your story.And well, yeah, and what I
didn't do anything special or heroic.I didn't run up any stairs or anything

(01:02:37):
like that. I just did whatthousands of other people did those Yeah,
well no, yeah, but itwasn't I didn't do anything like heroic.
And I don't think anybody nobody,you know, the guys that were there
when the buildings came down, thoseare the heroes, right, Everybody else
that did anything that day or didany work connected to it afterwards, even
in the month, weeks or monthsafterwards, everybody that helped out, Uh,

(01:03:00):
it was just it was you know, the guys that died that they
they were the heroes. We werejust kind of like a clean up crew,
and we actually felt really bad thatwe couldn't have done more to you
know, when something like that happens, you kind of have survivor's guilt,
and that all of that emotion iswhat blocked me from looking into that event

(01:03:22):
with any type of logic until oneday I was like, I have to
deal with this. And it wasabout three and a half four years later,
and I looked it was by likeabout the end of like the middle
of two thousand and five. It'sabout four years later, and I,
uh, I went back and Italked to a few friends of mine about
it, you know, told themhow I felt. And I couldn't even

(01:03:43):
look at videos from that day.And I had recorded I you know,
one of my famous videos that's gonelike epically viral, is I have the
I recorded the live NWS footage thatmorning. I threw a VHS tape in
like immediately and hit record on myVCR and so I have like raw beads
from the all the local networks forlike six hours of this, and uh,

(01:04:08):
you know, I've made digitized versionsof it over the years and uploaded
it to different platforms and stuff.But I didn't even look at that stuff
I had. I had that stufffor like four years before I ever went
back and looked at it. Andonce I said, I, you know,
once I talked to a few friendsof mine about things that had been
through, some stuff, some combatvets that I knew, I felt comfortable

(01:04:30):
enough to go back and I lookedat it. And when I did,
my fing mind was blown. Iwas like, oh my god, how
did I miss this? And Iwas angry at myself because I expected more
of myself. So I was like, holy crap, how did I miss
this? And as I've gotten deeperdown the rabbit hole that you can't know,

(01:04:50):
you can't be expected to remember allthe well, right, but see
that's the level of control Chris Airportso many times. And I found out
that flight eleven supposedly took off fromgates twenty six and I think thirty two.

(01:05:12):
And when I found that out andthat they actually have two separate memorials
for flight eleven at on the groundswhich I went and visited, that blew
my mind too, where I'm like, how can you say, it came
one flight took off from two differentgates at the same time, and then

(01:05:33):
it harkens back. I hate tosay, the tinfoil hat in me goes
back to Operation Northwoods, where theyhad a plan. And I'm not saying
that it's an updated plan, butit just reminded me of that. No,
it totally was. It's like theytook Northwoods the north Woods like plan

(01:05:55):
and it revamped it. Because youknow, people say, well, you
know if they compare it, andthey said, well, Northwoods also said
that they were going to have terroristsrun around Miami and do shootings, and
they didn't do that. Oh contremon frere. They arrested, but they
arrested three vanloads of Israelis. Okay, they there was one van load.

(01:06:18):
There was one van Yeah, therewere reports they Okay, I can tell
you this because I, like Isaid, I've this is one thing that
I remembered, Okay, and thenwe can move on from nine to eleven.
But this is one thing I didremember. Like, as I said,
I woke up right, I sawthese reports that oh there was a
vanload of Israelis arrested on the GeorgeWashington Bridge. And when I would see

(01:06:41):
this brought up. I found theoriginal I have the original CBS news footage
from my talk about it that nightthe officer that was in New Jersey that
arrested quite a few of these guys. Yes, and there and and there
was a yes, a couple ofI think there were there's two. There
were two of the officers that werethere have done like separate interviews. And

(01:07:03):
you probably talked to the one thatI think has been interviewed by AFP too,
And it's funny because that those wouldn'tdo any more interviews. But I
didn't do an interview with him properlike on the record, but I talked
to him. Is his first namewas Scott Yep. That's the guy.

(01:07:24):
That's the same dude that AFP interviewedyears ago. Yeah, and his story
has never changed. But when whenthey talked about that, when I saw
these interviews, I saw people sayingthat's bullshit. That didn't happen. And
I was like, actually, no, that did happen, and yeah,
how do you And they would say, well, how do you know that
it happened? And I'm like,well, okay, A I went and

(01:07:44):
found like the CBS news footage butI can tell you a personal anecdotal story
about that. I was standing inthe radio tent at the command center at
what used to be Giants Stadium inNew Jersey. Yeah, that's where that
where the staging center was for allthe firefighters that day. So like everybody
that from out of town was Wehad people coming in from like Connecticut,

(01:08:10):
people coming in from Maryland, allover Virginia, ambulances, fire departments,
like the outcouring of around, Likeyou actually were there that all? Right?
Yes, So I was at thecommand center and I was in the
radio tent when they arrested the vanloadof Israelis. I was standing there and

(01:08:30):
they were right next to the police. There were multiple vans that were arrested
with like and and then dogs wentin for you know, explosive residue and
things like this. They like reportsare all all over the place, but
they were multiple, Like that's anaspect that doesn't get covered because the potential
for you know, the Masade connectionand then you get thrown with the anti

(01:08:55):
you know, so they yes,they they say you're an anti semi if
you bring it up. That correct, But it was allied moving systems.
People can look this up. Itwas Allied Moving Systems, which is almost
urban moving. Yeah, urban movingsystems. And it's a it's a it's
a U. Yeah, it's aknown front from Masade. It's so like

(01:09:15):
they know this and they moved.They moved Urban Moving Systems out of the
United States like everybody. They movedthem shortly after nine to eleven. Everybody
boop. But one of their vansis one of the van there's famous audio
foot audio blew up yes of theNYPD saying that a van with a mural

(01:09:39):
street mural van where there was forpeople that out there don't know, Yes,
it's a van, a white vanthat had a mural of uh plane
hitting the twin towers. Yes,it was remote control, but remote control
airliners diving into the twin towers thatwere only a few blocks away from the

(01:09:59):
action that was actually happening. Thatwas depicted in these murals. And there's
King Street footage and it's still onYouTube. I believe our bit shoot where
they're asking for backup and then thething they say it exploded and people were
guys that looked like Arabs were runningaway from it. Is that what you're
talking I don't mean to keep thisknow that is the exactly, that's the

(01:10:24):
exact I have that video. Ihave I archived that video, the one
from YouTube from years ago. Butyes, that is that's the audio from
the NYPD. Yes, I thinkthat down Please don back me up here.
I think I sent you. Therewas also news footage from New York
one I think where they were talkingabout guys on the ground that were planning

(01:10:47):
explosives. Yeah, well in Americanmemory hall, I have several reports early
on that we're alluding to that fromthe mainstream source of that. I think
there was something about a truck orsomething that was seen, but they were
talking about it like an explosives beingplanted in front at the base of the
building, talking about the NYPD thathad their guns drawn. Because yes,

(01:11:13):
yes, the ground, Yes,yes, yeah, there were reports several
reports on that early on. Again, it's one of those things that go
down the memory hole. That's thethe name of the book because these reports
and the nine to eleven section ofthe book is incredible. I think they
were over over one hundred and fiftyfirefighters. I believe that talked about explosions.
The firefighters alone, just firefighters areonly over one hundred and fifty firefighters

(01:11:35):
that heard and talked specifically about explosions. Louis Caccioli, who became a chief
because he was he was a captainand he ended up becoming a chief because
something higher ups with Bill. Itried to get him in. He won't
talk either. Now, well yeah, yeah, and I and I could
tell you what I there's the theFDN Y did stuff to these guys behind

(01:11:59):
the scenes after. But like LouisCaccioli, he's famous. He's skinny Italian
guy, like salt and pepper hair, and he's talking about there's footage,
video footage because these two French brothers, the Naudae brothers, we're doing this.
That's they're the ones that caught theinfamous footage of the second plane hitting
and they happen to be Wazo.Yeah. They happen to be stationed or

(01:12:24):
riding around with this engine company andthey it's Louis Caccioli's company. So they
come back at the end to atthe end of the day because you know,
they had to go back to thefirehouse and kind of like rest,
eat, shower, debrief like causethey've been through hell and they're talking.
There's video of Louis Caccili talking withthe other guys, and they're like comparing,

(01:12:45):
you know, when when you've gonethrough this, like I understand this,
like being in the military, beinga firefighter. You you compartmentalize the
shit you have to deal with whenyou're in it, but when you get
back, you can't talk to yourfamily about it. So you sit and
you kind of like debrief with theguys. You have like maybe an hour
or two hours, three hours whereyou guys are, you know, talking
about what you just went through.And he's talking very candidly about seeing the

(01:13:11):
molten metal from the towers, theyou know, the core columns, the
solid steel core columns of the twintowers. It wasn't an aluminum cam.
And he's talking about seeing the metalrunning down the subway rails because there were
you know, underground tunnels and stuffunder the towers. Yes, like lava

(01:13:32):
in a foundry. And if youbring that up to this day, they'll
say that never happened, No firefightersever witnessed it, And it's like,
dude, what are you talking about. There's video footage of him talking about
September twelfth, The People magazine onlineedition printed Louis Caccioli's testimony verbatim, and

(01:13:53):
he talks about how there was anotherbomb that went off. We went up
to like twenty third floor, twentysecond floor or whatever, and he's describing
he said, we thought there werebombs planted in the building. That was
from People magazine, the online editionfrom September twelfth. So that was that
like less than twenty four hours.Will we got you another thing if you

(01:14:15):
guys ever need anything like early couplefirst, like three four weeks nine to
eleven related, I still have newspapersfrom all the local newspapers from the area,
and I have like real magazine,People Magazine. I saved all that
stuff. I was like, youknow, I'm gonna need this one day
for some reason, like this ishistorical and like I have a feeling is

(01:14:35):
I just remember I knew already aboutJFK, right, Like I always thought
the government killed him. But thenyou get you know, you get caught
up in the real world and stuff, and when when you're that close.
And this is that's why I broughtup like how blinded I was because and
I shared that little personal piece.The reason I bring that up is because,

(01:14:58):
as you know, everybody thinks,well, you're so smart, you're
conspiracy orient did you do this radioshow or you do light you live stream
and all, yeah, Well,you know what, I was susceptible to
the same emotional mind control that everybodyelse is. I'm not special. So
that's my point when I tell everybody, Look, I'm not a superhero.
I just pulled my head out ofmy ass and could started to see the

(01:15:20):
truth. And that's the whole reason, you know, like I said,
I try to be the Johnny Appleseedof truth because I realized, like,
oh my god, like what elsedid they lie to us about? And
then I started like looking into it. And when I looked into it,
like one of the you know,I I respect. Okay, fire Engineering
magazine. There was two magazines forfirefighters. There's Firehouse, which is what

(01:15:44):
I would I would I would referto as like the people magazine for firefighters,
Okay, And it was like theyshowed cool fire trucks and big fires
that fire departments had responded to andhow they you know, did it and
stuff. But it was it wasn'tlike the science, the fire science or
the engineering side of it. Thenthere was Fire Engineering Magazine, and that
was the scientific and the engineering aspectof the firefighting world. And I subscribed

(01:16:11):
to both magazines. And when Ifound out that the former editor of Fire
Engineering Magazine referred to the cleanup atGround zero as a quote half baked farce,
I was blown away because I respectedthese guys on such a logical level
and I was like, oh myGod. And I started to dig further

(01:16:34):
and further, and I knew someof the contractors that were down there.
I knew an iron worker that happenedto be down there, and they passed
me photos that they had taken,and I had passed these photos on to
Steven Jones, and Stephen Jones saidthat he felt that there was some very

(01:16:56):
interesting photos and you could see insome of the pictures that were the literally
the girders had been cut at anangle. Okay, so have you been
privy to the THEEMA photos of KurtSonnseld? Yeah? Yeah, I have
his video footage. I have likehis raw video footage. YouTube. Man,

(01:17:17):
that's one video that YouTube does notlike. Can I just tell you
that he's got footage? It's allabout that hidden history. Three. Yeah,
you can see in his in hisFEMA video footage that he took.
You can see that where there wereexplosions, like in the basement levels,

(01:17:39):
you can clearly see evidence of explosions. And when I went back again with
a clear mind, and now Istarted uncovering this kind of stuff, Chris,
this is the kind of stuff Istarted archiving. Because immediately as soon
as I found this, guys,I was like, yeah, this is
not like I realized, Like Istarted going further and I was like,
oh my god, yeah Illuminati,Yeah you know what. Oh yeah,

(01:18:00):
they idiots that killed Kennedy and I. He was taking pictures of the vault
underneath the building. Talk about Buildingseven. Well, there's another thing people
don't know about. That's another thingpeople don't know about, Chris. The
trucks, all the dump trucks.They found tunnels that were loaded with gold

(01:18:21):
and they were abandoned, like somebodytold them run Now who I thought the
buildings fell down? Yeah? Howdid they know that? And and but
and and and the bigger question iswhy does that sound roughly familiar to the
plot of die Hard two where JeremyIrons is the bad guy, right,

(01:18:45):
and they're they faced for die Hardthree? Yeah? They wait? Wait,
Oh no, it wasn't. I'msorry. I'm sorry. It wasn't
die Hard two. It was Diehardthree. Die Hard two was the one
where he's still there. They takeover the airport. Die Irons is the
bad guy, and they fake likea school, a bomb at a school,

(01:19:06):
and it's gonna kill all these kids, and all the cops are there,
the firefighters, and all the focusis on this big explosion. Meanwhile,
yes, and they're stealing all thegold out of Wall Street because there
were there were vaults with all thesecountries, foreign countries gold deposits underneath the

(01:19:29):
World Trade Center. And then inreality, in the real world, they
found trucks loaded with stolen gold fromthese vaults in tunnels and they were abandoned
with the doors open. Were dead. Ye didn't. Later there were some
people that they did find bodies too, And you don't. You don't.

(01:19:51):
It's funny you don't hear about that. It's kind of weird. It's kind
of weird. As they had therolls of film from Daley Plaza that disappeared
that were in those vaults too.I think I sent that to missus Jeffries
as well. Building seven was theJFK but I'm just saying there's articles out

(01:20:13):
there where they Building seven, someof the last remaining roles of film footage
from Daley Plaza on November twenty second, nineteen sixty three, or in some
of these vaults underneath the World TradeCenter that were missing when everything was starting
to get recovered. Well, Buildingseven really, I don't know, the

(01:20:34):
second largest CIA field office outside ofLangley, Virginia. Right, So then
and they had all the SEC filesconveniently for Enron happened to be on building
your World. Come, I couldn'tmake this ship up like and they said
it was fortified for all kinds ofearthquakes and and the wolf scenarios. Yeah,

(01:21:00):
dropped in forty seven seconds. Andpeople say, oh, it's the
fuel tanks. But NIS already blewtheir They blew their cover by saying that
that had nothing to do with whythe build that tower, that particular tower
came down. Well, so I'llbring bring something up Building seven related in
a minute, but before before Iforget this point, another the say with

(01:21:24):
nine to eleven, but that's mynine to eleven is a very important subject
because it's in my eyes, it'sthe lynchpin that allowed them to change everything
and turn the United States into whatKennedy called and was trying to stop,
a pack with Romana lockdowns. Itleads up to our present day scenario.

(01:21:45):
In my opinion, well he itcreated. It created Kennedy's biggest fear.
Packed Romana was what he was tryingto stop. That's what the Project for
a New American Century, their packdocument, the Rebuilding America's Defenses, where
they talk like a year and ahalf before, where they said, look,
we want to do we want tochange our foreign policy on our domestic
policy, but we can't do itwithout some catalyzing and catastrophic event like a

(01:22:10):
new Pearl harbor. And whoops,happened a year and a half later.
I'm sure that's a coincidence. ThoughI'm sure that that's nothing one of them.
I'm a big believer in one ofthe other one of the other things.
One of the other things. Aboutnine to eleven, Chris, that's
important. And you know, youguys, uh, you know, I'm

(01:22:31):
sure you guys realized this too,you know. It just so like the
convenience of Building seven falling, well, you know the spot in the Pentagon
where the and I'm doing air quotes. You guys can't see this. Where
is the plane hit trillion audited?Yeah, right, yes, it happened
to hit in the only spot thatwas reinforced, right, and in that

(01:22:55):
spot is just where this meeting thatDonald Rumsfeld had set up. And he
was on the news of the nightbefore going, yeah, we lost a
couple of trillion dollars, but we'regonna we're gonna have this, you know,
we're looking into it. And hewas looking into it, all the
investigators, with all the evidence asto where all that money went. We're
sitting in the wing of the Pentagonwhere Hani Honyir managed to pull this epic

(01:23:19):
corkscrew turn in a passenger jet likea test. Yes, yes, yes
he Daniel Hopsinger went down and interviewedRip Daniel. He he went down and
he interviewed great researcher folks. Danielpassed away about a year ago, Rip

(01:23:40):
buddy, he was just a greatguy. Daniel went down and to Florida
and interviewed the flight school instructor thatthat trained these guys and he said,
honey, Honyir could fly Ana orwhatever his wife to be. Yeah,
he will. Well, he hedid a lot of stuff. He went,

(01:24:01):
he found Shuckham's Bar where they werepartying. And you know Muhammadada,
who's supposedly a devout too, andhe scared shitless crapless too. Well,
no, you can swear it's fine. No, of course he's scared shitless,
do you know? So my pointis going back to building seven.
You know why April Gallup and thebartender from Shuckham's Bar all the way down

(01:24:25):
in you know, Florida, oranybody else even remotely related, doesn't want
to talk because what happened to BarryJennings murdered? Well, what happened to
Barry Jennings there was another witness,right, I don't know if you ever
do you remember when there was uhthe the the guy that checked in Muhammadada

(01:24:45):
and the other his his cohort inPortland, Maine. Like right before boarding
in Portland, Maine to go toLogan that morning, would he fall off
a cliff? You know? Hewent on Oprah and did a whole thing
about how he felt so guilty andeverything. And granted, he probably did

(01:25:05):
feel guilty even though he really didn'thave anything to feel guilty about because he
didn't know that there were terrorists orwhatever. But I found he mentioned on
Oprah that there was a twenty twoyear old woman at Logan Airport that committed

(01:25:25):
suicide that supposedly dealt with the Flighteleven hijackers at Logan, and I was
able to find this eighty. Ithink she was a seventy something year old
retiree that worked with this twenty somethingyear old woman and down could talk more

(01:25:47):
about this because when I found hercontact until I sent it Dawn for just
research or whatever, and this elderlywoman didn't want anything to do with it.
Like, I don't think she deniedit, right, don But I
don't know. I talked to her. I talked her on the phone,
and she people can read in thebook about it, but yeah, she

(01:26:09):
she remembered and everything. It wasan interesting conversation, but she she believes
the official story. But yeah,she she she didn't deny it, right,
like she worked with No, shecouldn't remember her name for some reason.
She didn't remember her name. Iremember her name. Yeah, well,
so yeah, my point is BarryJennings right Building seven, he testified,

(01:26:30):
Yeah, I mean, well hedidn't testify. He I When I
say testified, it was like videotestimony. He was interviewed by Jason Burmis
and Dylan Avery and they interviewed himfor their last edition of the Loose Change
series UH Loose Change and American Coup. And when they interviewed Barry, he

(01:26:54):
they what he said was so likethe evidence that he had presented his story.
It was just his story. Itwasn't like Barry was a researcher.
He worked for the city and hisjob in an emergency was to be in
that building, and he was therewhen there were explosions. The person that

(01:27:15):
he was trapped with Michael Hess.And Michael Hess I guess Giuliani or whatever,
but yes, yes, Michael Hess. No, well he's not going
to talk either because Barry discussed thathim and Michael Hess, and he's in
the interview. Barry refers to himas mister Hess, and he basically says

(01:27:38):
that there were explosions in the building, multiple explosions. And he says when
they got to the command center,like you know, they there was an
they got alerted that there was anemergency. He arrived at the building where
he's supposed to go and he walksin and he said the command center was
empty. There was coffee with steamsstill coming off of it. There were
half eaten bagels as if people werein the midst of doing their command center

(01:28:00):
stuff. And somebody came in theroom and said, everybody get out now.
Now, how did they know thatthere were going to be explosions?
How did they know? I thoughtthe building came down because of a diesel
tank explosion. See, it's abullshit story. So Barry's own just story.
Just he wasn't a researcher, folks. He was just somebody that worked

(01:28:23):
in the government. And when hewas interviewed, he gave his honest recount
of what happened. And he wasrescued because the explosions. Him and Michael
Hess had to be rescued by theFDN Y and twice they tried to rescue
them and they ran away, andthat was because the first tower fell.
Then they came back. Then theyhad to run away again because the second
tower fell. Then they came backthe third time, and they got them

(01:28:44):
out of there, now you know, And they were interviewed. Barry was
interviewed on the street on day notjust Dylan's documentary, but the footage of
Barry Jennings being interviewed by a reporteron this street and start right after,
right after he was rescued by thefire department. Yes, within like within

(01:29:04):
like five or ten minutes. Yes, he was a castle by actually yelling
down from the from the window tothe FDNY as well. There's that,
yes, yes, there's a lotof footage. Yes. And after Barry
Jennings died mysteriously, his family disappeared, and Dylan Avery hired a private investigator

(01:29:25):
to go find him, and sheended up telling it. She ended up
coming back to him and resigning andsaying, never call me again. I
tried to ask him, I'm goingto I refer to this to the authorities.
Never contact me again. And alsoBarry said in those interviews with Dylan
Avery that he felt like he wasstepping over bodies as well. And officially

(01:29:46):
no one died in building seven,right, And and yes he said the
fire department told him not to lookdown because he was stepping over dead bodies.
Yes. And you know it doesn'tsurprise me that you off. I
apologize. You're not cutting me off. This is this, it's called the

(01:30:08):
conversation with you know, another intellectualresearcher. You're not cutting it. Do
you have to apologize? Dude?Ever? Thank you. I appreciate you.
You're very well researched, Chris,and you're you're very knowledgeable on the
subject. It's hard for me tohave a conversation with many people. You
two are very well, you know, well researched and knowledgeable on my subject.

(01:30:29):
So there's another aspect I found outabout Building seven that people like loss
over right. They they always citethe same the infamous Jane Stanley BBC video,
uh where she basably says that it'sa Solomon Brothers building, which is
a ka is the Building seven likebehind her over her shoulder? Right?

(01:30:50):
They like every all the research wasreferred to that video. And also Aaron
I can't remember his last name,but Aaron from CNN. Also there's a
video of him saying that Building sevenhad already collapsed like way before, like
a half an hour before it officiallydid. But I found also there's footage

(01:31:13):
out there from I think it's abouteleven am Eastern Standard time of a CNN
correspondent saying that a third building hascollapsed as well, and he doesn't refer
to it as the Solomon Brothers building. But he's basically describing Building seven,
which makes me think that they wantedto take down Building seven kind of more

(01:31:39):
closer to the Twin Towers destruction thanlater on in the afternoon. And yeah,
it was supposed to go down fromflight ninety three, but flight ninety
three didn't make it. See,so I know that the official version of
events is that the passengers overpowered itand flew the plane upside down and the

(01:32:00):
ground at such an angle that itdisintegrated beyond physics and any sensible logic.
But that's the soil sample said.There was no no jet fuel because they
blew it up. They they didwhat the Air Force they did, Chris,
what the Air Force refers to asholding a plane where they they shot

(01:32:21):
it down. So another personal anecdotefrom that day, we were listening to
local reports and they said there's athird plane coming in. My mother had
woken me up that morning. Shesaid, she woke me up. She
came in and she was crying,and she shook me because she knew as
a fireman, and she shook me. I worked the night shift at the

(01:32:44):
time, and I'd literally just gottenhome and maybe had like two or three
hours of sleep. And she shookme awake and she was like, Sean,
get up, there's a problem.And I was like, what's the
matter, mom? And she shesaid, a plane hit the twin towers
like a little Cessna. Because wehad believe it or not. Where we
lived, we had an airport biasthat had you know, ever, at

(01:33:05):
least once a year we had assessmentthe crash into a house or something,
or land in the street or crash. So like, plane crashes were common
for me to deal with. Andyou know, having been on the fire
department and growing up around the firedepartment, so I was like, like
a Cessna. She goes, Noah, big plane, like a passenger jet,
And I said, oh gee,that's wow, Like what the guy?
How did they do that? Theyshould have guidance systems that would avoid

(01:33:28):
that. What the original reports wasthat it was as the crash into uh
well, by this point, bythis point they had already known that it
wasn't a Cessna. And she wokeme up when the second plane hit because
she came running up the stairs andfreaked out. And that's when they were
repeatedly playing that that clip, andwithin twenty minutes they said there was a

(01:33:53):
third plane inbound and within a shortperiod of time. Maybe maybe it don't
seemed like twenty minutes. It mighthave been longer, but I could expand
it out and say maybe within fortyfive minutes they said there was a third
plane inbound, but it wasn't thatActually, I don't even think it was
that long. And shortly thereafter theysaid the National Guard is trailing it.

(01:34:17):
And then shortly thereafter they said,oh, the plane has crashed, And
my mom and I looked at eachother and we were like, oh,
they shot it down, right.I had filmed family that was in the
military, and being on the firedepartment, you know, you just know
that things. There are certain thingsthey're not going to say to the general
public. And within a few minutes, two F sixteen's came flying in an

(01:34:40):
easterly direction towards New York City,right over my house, coming from a
westerly direction, which is where ninetyflight ninety three. If you trace the
line, it goes towards that direction. So I don't know if you guys
know this, but there's video footage. Actually, I got his documents,
the transcripts that he put on anHour of the Time website where he Actually,

(01:35:03):
they have an air traffic controller forout in New Hampshire that confirms that
there was he saw two F sixteen'strailing that that airliner. They were I
could they were making local radio reportsand I wish, you know, you
can't go back and record the oldam you know, recordings of that day.

(01:35:23):
I wish I could go back intime, but but no, they
they totally did. But I don'tknow if you guys know this there and
I got to find the video.I have it archived. Somebody went out
to Shanksville back in the day andI don't remember who, what researcher it
was, but they went out andthey talked to somebody and they said that
right before flight ninety three supposedly,you know, crashed within a couple of

(01:35:44):
minutes of it. The crash rightor the shooting down of flight ninety three
they talked about. They said that, well, right, it was totally
shot down. But you know,when I say crash, I'm doing air
quotes. So they said that thelights blinked in there, and I think
the guy was ane. Yeah,as this a missile was deployed. Because

(01:36:05):
there were a couple of residents fromShanksville that were in Vietnam. Yeah,
their house, like the lights flickered, and they said it reminded them of
their tours in Vietnam when missiles werebeing deployed. Yes, and the reason
being one of them, one ofthe guys, was like a fighter pilot,
like a retired fighter pilot, andhe said to him, he told

(01:36:29):
him what he experienced. And theguy said, oh, they shot the
plane down then, And he said, what do you mean And the retired
fighter pilot said, well, rightbefore we fire a missile, they do
a not like it. It's almostlike an electromagnetic pulse, but it's it's
a pulse to block any radar ofany enemy jet or vehicle whatever they're shooting

(01:36:53):
at. That way, the missilecan fire and lock onto its target and
then engaged target and destroy its target. And he said that they fire this
pulse and that when the guy describedthe lights going out and coming back on,
he said, that's exactly what thatpulse would do, especially if they

(01:37:14):
were at such a low altitude wherethe plane is reported to have been at.
So you know, I mean,I know that's anecdotal evidence, but
it's still you're talking about. Yeah, So have you seen the video?
Do you know what? You know? The interview I'm talking about. Yeah,
they tried scrubbing, And I thinkI said it that I feel bad

(01:37:35):
for Don Jefferies because I've sent somany things, like in the last four
or five years to him, includingthe mayor of Shangshille saying that there was
no plane that crashed there at all, you know, apparently, like in
the print articles around that time,and I have all those two they're the

(01:37:57):
witnesses that we're talking about, diddescribe that there was some kind of weird
like flickering of the lights on theirproperty. And they also in the same
articles said that the FBI came backand told them not to talk about this
to the press, you know,not to get too conspiratorial on you.
But they were pretty much gagged,including air traffic controller that talked to the

(01:38:21):
guy that was in the bathroom,Edward Felt. They said he saw smoke
coming from the aircraft, that hefelt like something hit it and he was
basically scared shitless. I think,don I think I sent that to du
Don. Do you remember the accountof Edward Felt in the air traffic controller
that got jagged by the FBI afterwardsfrom talking about what he talked about,

(01:38:44):
and even the coroner, Wallace Smith, I think he got jagged too.
Yeah, I'm on again. Okay. Yes, there's a lot about Shanksville
in there, and we have alot about DV. Kidd was the researcher.
I think that they did a lotof research on their head her on
my show before she talked to themayor, who gave several different opinions,
a lot of stuff about flight ninetythree in American memory. Holess. I

(01:39:06):
don't know what happened there, butit certainly wasn't what they told you happened.
What do you think from your research? Don do you because I'm sure
you're familiar with the whole you knowthe idea that perhaps you know there's different
theories about what happened to flight ninetythree. I think they just shot it

(01:39:29):
down. But what do you thinkoverall? Do you think the passengers really?
Do you think the story is completebullshit? You think they like just
took something that may have happened andtwisted it. What do you think?
Yeah, well, there's so manyelements this a whole story of the mayor
of Cleveland talking about that it landedin Cleveland. You have that whole element
that there's a very detailed story thatdoesn't seem like a commit out of kind

(01:39:54):
of any kind of confusion. Andthen you have and I have all the
just just the the the mayor aloneout there and then the coroner and all
all it made all these ridiculous andwitnesses as well that talked about it didn't
look like The one consensus statement wasthat it didn't look like there had been
a plane crash. I mean,there was almost no debris. Later they

(01:40:14):
talked about debris and the trees maybea little bit, but it was it
was kind of like outside the Pentagon, you know, there was there was
nothing there. And then eventually theyclaimed that it plowed so deep into the
ground that everything was I mean,it made no sense that everything was underground
so far down. But just readingthe various statements these people and dB kid,

(01:40:35):
you know, the mayor was pissedoff at her, and she had
everybody pissed off at her. Rathershe she's a feisty investigator. But I
you know, it's hard to saybecause then you throw in the course the
ridiculous Todd Beemer and the let's rollnonsense and the the other guy that introduced
himself to high Mom, this isyour son, and you know this entire

(01:40:57):
he gave his entire name, andMark Bingham, yeah, Mark Beingham.
And and the fact that that youknow Beamer. His last conversation, he
ends up talking to the operator andshe says, well, you want to
put you through to your wife,and he says, no, no,
go out talk. He's going todie, but he'd rather talk to an
unknown operator rather than his wife.I mean that none of it makes any

(01:41:18):
sense, and so I have noidea they I know, they wouldn't have
hesitated to shoot it down and lieabout it, but all the eyewitness testimony
seems to suggest that it doesn't looklike there was an evidence of a plane
being there. So I have noidea what happened. Maybe it did land
in Cleveland, probably know because therewas that report, but uh, all

(01:41:40):
we can do is put the informationout of there and then we can do
we can, you know, speculateabout it. But they certainly lied about
what happened. But you know,there's there's a long section of it in
an American memory hole where you canjust read for yourself and just see,
you know, with the people thatwere there, what are they describing?
You know, And like they didwith the nine eleven you know what they

(01:42:01):
parted the the crime scene a way, it's the same kind of thing here
where they eventually claimed that whatever theywhatever they found, eventually they put it
in a secret location. I thinkit's just you know, the kind of
stuff that they do that invites peopleto you know, conspiratorial speculation because and
that's the way they operate about everything. They're not open and transparent about anything,

(01:42:25):
and so of course people are gonnaif you have a brain at all,
you're going to question those phone callsas like you're going to question the
all phone calls on nine eleven,because we know I went into that and
Hidden History the first book about howthey didn't have the wherewithal to even make
those phone calls. And yet they'rethey're telling you that, you know,
people that Barbara Olsen, people likethat that were you know, famous,

(01:42:47):
that had these you know, heartbreakingconversations at the end, and here you
and for flight ninety three, youhave the whole let's roll thing that George
Bush and everybody got a big dealIt's rolled. They finally, you know,
we let all these airplanes be takendown by box cutters and plastic knyves,
and we let just let him doit. We didn't fight back or

(01:43:08):
anything, but finally we're going tofight back. Let's roll. So the
whole thing is just just like therest of nine to eleven, but it
does it doesn't get investigated as muchas everything else. So that's why I,
you know, and Chris certainly helpedwith that. I devoted a pretty
long section of it in the book. Well glad that you're talking about it.
Can I give like a kind ofa salacious peace for Don's book Hidden

(01:43:31):
History three? If anyone is familiarwith one of the richest men on the
planet when it comes to Oracle,you know, the CIA Front Company Oracle,
Larry Ellison, he plays him,Todd Beamer and Todd Beamer's widow.

(01:43:55):
They play a huge role in theLet's Roll phenomenon. And also Don kind
of alluded to where the wreckage endedup at a certain point at a secret
military underground base that's huge and thatnever really gets talked about anywhere. And

(01:44:15):
yeah, the Let's Roll thing,and I found that out pretty much a
lot of it from the late GreatDave McGowan as well, and Dave McGowan
thought that Flight ninety three his summation, if you go to a Center for
an Informed America, his website thatis still maintained by his daughter, he

(01:44:39):
goes into he was pretty much thefirst nine to eleven truther. On nine
to twelve, he had pretty muchthe official story broken down. But when
he goes into flight ninety three afew months a few years later, his
idea was that there were people onthe plane that actually were pilots, like
you know, in their you personallives, like private you know, pilots,

(01:45:02):
and that it was possible that flightninety three was shot down because they
had perfectly capable pilots that overtook thewhoever the operatives were, whether it was
Masad or Saudi Arabians or whoever FBI, you know, being a drill or
whatever, after they overtook them verywell, took control of the plane.

(01:45:27):
But then because of what they sawon board going on as some kind of
a drill, possibly the plane hadto be taken down because there couldn't be
any survivors for that particular event ofnine to eleven. But you know,
make that whatever, you know,make that way. You know, that's
up to you know, people toresearch and for themselves. But I thought

(01:45:51):
that was an interesting angle, thatthe idea that some of the passengers were
very capable of landing the plane,but we're not allowed to land the plane
if if, if you will,you know what I mean. Well it
was it was definitely shot down.And it's one of two, the only,
the only. And you guys cantell me what you think about this.

(01:46:13):
You know, you're both logical men, but uh, you know,
there's in my eyes, there's justtwo scenarios that make sense. Either A,
there were some passengers like Jeremy Glickand some of these other people that
did I mean, he was supposedlya black belt, so I called on
board too, by the way,right, And so I mean I I

(01:46:35):
can't see, I can't see thathe couldn't have, like, you know,
taken these guys on, Okay,especially when you've researched the background of
some of these quote unquote terrorists.I mean they they they don't look they're
not that physically intimidating, and theydon't seem to be that highly trained that

(01:46:55):
somebody who's a black belt couldn't maybetake them on with the help of US.
So the idea that the passengers didfight back, overtook them and regained
control of the plane, and thenradioed in and said we have control of
the plane, and the two planesthat were trailing it were ordered to shoot
it down because the people in thebunker, like Dick Cheney, didn't want

(01:47:18):
that plane. That plane was supposedto hit Building seven. So there's that
idea that they they did overtake itand they wanted it shot down. Or
the other idea, which is alsojust as probable, is that you had
two fighter pilots that were doing theirduty to protect the United States and there

(01:47:39):
were so many different drills going onthat day that they had our air defenses
screwed up. But these two guys, they were Air National Guard and they
interviewed. I have the interview thatthey did with the two pilots that were
up in the air, and theysay, oh, we were defending the
skies. And they asked them,would you have shot down a plane if
you were told to? And theywere like yes. And it's like,
you gotta wonder if those the twopilots that were trailing Flight ninety three,

(01:48:01):
they don't say they were but theyhappen to be that. If you go
back into Alex Jones, and I'mnot a big fan of Alex Shoones at
all. I'm a big Bill Cooperthing. But if you go back into
the Info Wars archive, if it'sstill available, Alex interview is one of
the guys that possibly shut down flightninety three and got got awarded for it.

(01:48:24):
Two. Yes, I remember,I remember the interview I but I
don't remember if it was one ofthe same guys that was interviewed by It
was like CBS and it was doneright after nine to eleven, the CBS
interview. But yes, I remember, I remember the Jones interview. I
remember him talking to a fighter pilot. But it could have been the probable

(01:48:45):
out of the two. They're both. I would say it's a fifty to
fifty shot, But I would youknow, knowing that, knowing Cheney,
knowing a lot of the background,knowing what you know. Norman Minetta said
he heard him say when they werein the bunker and he was told,
you know, the planes coming intowards the Pentagon, Sir, the planes
thirty miles out serve the planes twentymiles out serve the planes ten miles out?
Do the orders still stand? Andto quote Norman Minetta, Dick Cheney

(01:49:10):
whipped his neck around and said,of course the order is still stand.
Have you heard anything to the contrary? What orders? You mean? The
stand down order? Because the standardoperating procedure from three different rings of protection
around DC that are all independent ofeach other, would have been to shoot
the plane down. And it madeit through three independent rings of protection.

(01:49:31):
Geez, that's odd. Anyway,Don I'll go to you first, because
we have a few minutes left.What do you think out of the two,
what do you think is the mostprobable, like, out of the
two? Uh? Again, totry to guess what really happened that day,
I don't know. I just hadto look at the I was impressed
by all the eyewitness testimony that saidthere was that there was no you couldn't

(01:49:55):
tell a plane and crash there andIan I'm no expert on planes crash,
but I think there's you're supposed tosee some evidence that a crash happened,
and it looked like people that werethere were just mystified by it. And
you get several people said the samething before the you know, for the
story emerged, and you have thattestimony in the mayor from Cleveland claiming the
plane landed there. So who knows. I mean, it's it's it's you

(01:50:19):
get the same kind of thing withFlight seventy seven with the Pentagon. You
know, whether the whole was obviouslytoo small for the jet liner that they
claimed hit it, where do thewings go? I mean, they weren't
shared off and there's no impact points, So it's I think it's possible that
both of those airliners it didn't crash. And the pace, you know,

(01:50:40):
it's very problematic as well. Thepassenger lists are full of you know,
crazy names, and there's one ofthem that translates into no More War.
I talked about that, uh inthe Hidden History. It's kind of an
Arabic name that basically it's right inthe middle of it. It's no more
war, you know, or somethingmore war or something like that. But
it comes right at at you.But so I think that, uh,

(01:51:00):
you're looking at again deep down therabbit hole. That's But I don't know.
All I know is that if itcrashed, all the witnesses there said
it didn't look like a plane crashsite. And there's No, to my
knowledge, there has never been aphotograph from above or anything showing all the
debris. I mean, I guesswhatever you see it again, it doesn't
look like there's that much debris,So that would be my guess. My

(01:51:21):
guess is that. But I butI don't know. I all I can
do is spect. I just knowthey lied about it, and whatever they
said happened didn't happen. Yeah,they're a bunch of liars. Either way,
it really doesn't. I mean,I would like to know, Like
I said, out of all thepossibilities, I think those are the only

(01:51:42):
two that make any sense of likewhat might have happened to it. They
either way, they shot it down. That's why there's no there was no
debris in Shanksville. And I haveanother piece of I think with CBS News
there's two reports of there was asecond debris field like five miles away.
Well, I mean, planes don'thit the ground to any eject debris five
miles away. That only happens ifit's shot Indian like and supposedly that had

(01:52:08):
human remains at it too, andthey didn't talk about that. That's just
memory hold. And that's another one. I every time I've ever uploaded that
video clip. I think it's maybethirty seconds long. I get immediately a
strike boom. I've had video I'vehad some of my YouTube channels taken down.
That clip is like the poison pill. You're just not allowed to talk

(01:52:30):
about it. So anyway, wehave a few minutes left, guys,
don really quick. I want youto promote your the book the place I
know you said it's Lulu or thebest way for people to buy Masking the
Truth, and then you said theycan pre order the new book on Amazon,
right, yeah, or anywhere.Yeah, you've pre ordered Amazon,

(01:52:54):
Yeah, the best place to again, because they've there doesn't seem to be
any other ebook available. There's noKen and there is no nok anymore because
Barges and Noble's disappeared it down thememory hole. The easiest ways just to
do a search, use your favoritesearch engine. Donald jeffries Masking the Truth
and Midnight Writer News is the actualpublisher. Or you can put Lulu either

(01:53:14):
one l U l U either oneof those that will bring up the site
and you click on that and youcan order. You can also order the
electronic version there. So that's theonly place you can get an e book
if you prefer that, and that'sthe easiest way I can tell you to
do that. And the new bookthat's coming out, it's now going to
be released August twenty seventh, andthat is an American memory hole. How
the court historians promote disinformation. It'sit's out there now for pre order.

(01:53:39):
So and basically they're the publishing industryhas changed, you know, in the
last few years, especially with theridiculous COVID stuff, where they they're really
getting you know, they're they're pinchingpennies. Is you know, we got
we get very little money as itis as authors. But I mean they're
like, they're not sending out advancedcopies anymore, hard copies, they don't
do that. They're just sending uppds. They used to do that,

(01:54:00):
so I would get extra copies,paperback advance copies that I could send to
people. And they don't do thatanymore. They've cut back on their advances.
You know, they're not giving atleast for people like me. You
know, maybe you know, thebig names still get it. But and
audiobook, you know, people alwaysask about audiobook and several of my books

(01:54:21):
have audiobooks. I hope this does, but apparently they're basing that now on
how many pre orders they get.So if people want an audio book,
they have an extra incentive to preorder because apparently that's what they're going to
based on how well did this thingsell and pre order It's so we'll set
up an audio version. But certainlyappreciate everyone's support. But the book is

(01:54:41):
the book I think is worth it. It's got a lot of great stuff
in it, and most of whatwe talked about tonight the book covers it.
Awesome, everybody, I go outand pre order the new book and
again order and Masking the Truth.I challenge you to go out and order
it and split around to some oldschool activism. Don give out your socials
and your YouTube and stuff really quickly. Okay. At Don Jefferies is ex

(01:55:04):
Twitter and again there you can followme there. I get followers. I
think they're they're messingting there. Butthe big one is substack. I protest
Donald Jeffries at substack dot com.I'm getting more subscribers and that's the only
place I'm that shadow man, andthat's the best way to keep up with
me too. I write there regularlybecause I have paid subscribers now too.
Everything else free. You get everythingfor free, but you do you want

(01:55:26):
to become a paid subscriber. That'san extra way to support me. So
that's that's the best place to keepup with my work. Awesome, thank
you Don for coming on again,Chris thirty seconds, plug your Twitter,
plug your podcast, and it wasawesome hanging out with you. And I'll
get you back on go if youwant to try to donate, I have

(01:55:46):
a link tree at c Graves Mascion Twitter. But to be honest with
you, I've got some news inthe you know, the last couple of
days. This probably will be mylast interview like anywhere, So just support
Don and his efforts and check outthe JFK Junior section and Oklahoma City and

(01:56:13):
the nine to eleven stuff and everything, and yeah, I know this has
definitely been a full circle moment forme and I appreciate Popeye for having me
on and for making this possible.And like I said, just check out
all of Don Jeffrey's work, allDave mcgow and Bill Cooper and everything.

(01:56:36):
Thank you for having me, sirwell, Chris, it was an honor
having you on and in the future, if you're free and you change your
mind, you're always welcome to comeback on with me. Brother, and
ladies and gentlemen. With that,we are out of time. I just
want to thank everybody for tuning intonight giving us two hours of your time.

(01:56:57):
You know, I love all allof you that are out there,
each and every single one of you, and I encourage you to go out
and be the heroes that you allneed. Be the candle in the darkness.
Don't wait for somebody to bring youa candle or be the light,
or bring you a light. Yoube the light yourself. So I'm gonna
end it with my favorite quote fromMartin Luther King Junior. Darkness cannot drive
out darkness. Only light can dothat. Hate cannot drive out hate.

(01:57:19):
Only love can do that. Ladiesand gentlemen, I love you all and
I'll catch you all live again nextweek. I'm out of here.

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