2023 Ep. 9: Hope Giselle

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:04):
Papa shows gave. And so Ifound out from our show videographer and producer

(00:25):
and sound engineer that in his careerof doing this, his long lengthy career,
girthy career, real thick, thatthe most like that he and views
that he's ever had on a pieceof work has been our show on porn
Hub. So in order for himto share this accolade, you let people

(00:55):
know his whole pornhub handle and allthe followed me on the porn But isn't
that cool? Yes? And Ialso found out that he has not used
the equipment for this situation from thiscooking shit. So we're gonna be doing
a show very soon in which I'mgonna teach people how to make that that

(01:19):
crab oprah stool and a couple otherthings maybe maybe my great grandmother's crab cakes
or something. Okay, don't getit in now. You don't want a
crab cake battle, not a battle. I want a crab cake battle.
Let's scrap for a crap cake.But I put some people from Maryland's shame.
Now come on now, now,came up from Miami to put the

(01:41):
people from Maryland a shame. Tolook here. I was taught one good
time by one of those old soulmothers in Maryland. And since then you
can't tell me nothing about my crabcake. I mean, the recipes still
come from the right place though.Indeed, you know, shout out,
shout out to you know, GGWrestling Peace Eastern Shows of Maryland. That's
where that's where she came from withthe recipe. And I've just tinker with

(02:04):
it just a little bit to getthe lard out of it. Okay,
you know what I'm saying. Butoh, for your health, the oil,
the large the margarine. For therecord, there will be no but
none. All right. So ifyou could cook a meal that you were

(02:25):
not competing with king on in thiskitchen, what does it inspire you to
whip up? Honestly, I'm thinkinglike chicken breasts with some brussels sprouts,
Okay, it's giving healthy, Yeah, like brussel sprouts. Maybe a little
like yellow rice, corn bread muffinmom giving multicultural yeah, I mean,

(02:49):
because I mean I'm after Latina,so I have to like mix in all
of the things and then you know, I always have to have a little
start. So that's with the cornbread, and I think probably for dessert,
Um, smoothie. I don't likeheavy desserts anymore. The older I
get, the less I like supersweet things. So probably like a good
smoothie that I'll like chunky blend,so I have like a good chew on
it. Yeah, texture, y'allwatch too many cookie shop. I'm about

(03:15):
to be chopped on royal fetish.Chopped it is. My little brother used
to do. Um. We usedto watch the Food Network a lot,
so he would be at the table, like critiquing my mom's food, and
it was the fun like it wasnever bad, but like it was always
the funniest thing. And he woulddo it with Capri sons. So he
would like sip a Capri son andbe like, I taste like notes of

(03:35):
ginger. It would be the funniestthing in the world. What kind of
ginger? An elusive? Not asingle one? Okay, he was just
coming up with that. He hadheard that I got my whole hopes up
just now. It's like they gotginger, not even your sons. I

(03:58):
can't but wait, Yeah, that'sa good idea. And a little pouch
just had to be trademarks. Yeah, I was gonna say, I don't
know if there's like a certain liquorcontent. I don't know, it's just
a little it might come to youwhen that type of packaging though, you
know what I'm saying, you mighthave to it's like a hard capri son.
Now we're gonna take this behind thescenes. So speaking of little brother,

(04:23):
family, home, cooking, allthose things, what does it feel
like to be coming home to Florida? Oh, it's bittersweet. I love
being at home. I love thesun, I love the beach, I
love all of those things. Butright now, with all of this stuff
happening in legislation, I am alittle shaky, Like I recognize that I
benefit from certain privileges, so Idon't like I don't have people walking around

(04:44):
like, oh, it doesn't meanyou know, Like so I don't think
that I experienced that stuff, butjust the possibility, and sometimes it's not
even a possibility for me, it'sthe possibility of me, Like what happens
if it happens in front of me, right, what am I going to
do? Whereas like I'm faced withthat every single day, but like here
and especially right now, I'm justkind of like I was a little auntie

(05:04):
on the way here anytime somebody askedme, you know, when I'm traveling
and all of that, and they'relike, where are you from? You
know, I'm on I'm from Jersey, but I live in Florida. And
then I always get the response fromhow do you this that any other same
exact thing you said. I'm like, yo, that sun, the beach
weather, it's beautiful, but thesituation looking for sun. No, Well,

(05:30):
we want to thank you for forcoming here, like you know,
braving getting on a plane when youdo not have to to come and talk
to us and to our fans andfriends and royal fetish family. To No,
it's really because I don't know thatif I was invited to anti black

(05:56):
woman state, which is we livein one, I know that, but
I'm just like that, that's soblatant, you know, so blatant,
and it's a hotbed that I wouldhave been as as apt as you are.
But I know that this is alsoa part of your work to be
brave. Going into the spaces wherepeople expect you to go into uncomfortable and

(06:18):
stepping in with your headhel high isthe best way to change things. I
think that a lot of bigotry andtransmissia and all of that stuff is based
off of the idea that you're goingto be ashamed, right, And so
if I allow you to feel likeyou've won that battle by not doing,
by not going, by not saying, by not having the conversations, then

(06:40):
essentially you have right. Whether ornot I take that with me, you
have because you've blocked me from spacesthat make me happy in order for you
to feel justified in your bigotry andwhatever it is that you have going on.
So I'm gonna go where I wantto go, And the thing about
it is, I'm going there knowingthat there might be repercussions and consequences,
but I'm also going there to makea statement that says fuck you, And

(07:02):
that's what you was talking about,because I still want my crab legs and
they have the best ones on thebeach, like you know. And I
think that that's just how I enteredthe spaces, and I think ultimately a
lot of people respect that. Ithink a lot of people respect the fact
that I'm not a punk ass activistwho sits online and goes I want to
talk d d D dada, Butthen when I'm invited, it's just like
I come up with all these excusesin these minor like oh but it's Florida,

(07:25):
and oh but it's this, youknow, But it's that Invisibility is
still important. So if I don'tshow up there, who else does?
You know? I think that's importantalso because there are people who live here
who are looking for somebody to lookup to or an example to let them
know like I can live, Ican be out, I can do the
same ship that everybody else should beable to do facts, you know,

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So it's important to be able todo so. So we jumped in.
We did, jump in, Wedid, we jumped all the way in.
We did. But there's a bioreis there is? And I'll be
so mad exactly And this, thisbio deserves it's a moment. So let

(08:11):
me let me introduce you to thepeople's all right. Hope Giselle is a
highly respected national organizer, author,artist, and activists. She co founded
Alabama State University's first LGBT organization whileearning a master's in Fine art and certifications
from Harvard and s HRM. Hopeis the founder of the nonprofit organization Allow

(08:33):
Me, and serves as a trainingdirector of get fluid. She has worked
with numerous organizations, including NASA andthe Human Rights Campaign to amplify the voices
of marginalized communities. As a twotime bestselling author, columnists, and nationally
recognized panelists, Hope's passion for inclusionand social justice has inspired many to join

(08:54):
the fight. Welcome Hope, Gazelle. Oh oh, and also, we
are sitting with the upcoming New YorkCity Grand Marshal for the Pride Parade.
Yes, that is this is thefirst platform that I'm actually allowing people to

(09:15):
say it on because I haven't beenable. But it's gonna by the time
this episode drops, it'll be fine. But I'm really excited. I'm so
excited. What does that? Whatdoes that mean for you personally? Like
forget all like the professional accolades,When when you got that news that you
were going to be the Grand Marshalwhat I honestly felt saying, I felt
really seeing And I think that forme, especially because of the type of

(09:37):
content that I created, how realI am When the white gays are still
like, hey, we like you. Um, And it's not to say
that that's the white stamp of approval. This is not that right, but
this is one of those things whereit's like when the people that you are
calling in right still respect you callingthem in on a regular basis and do
that so much so that they inviteyou to the space to honor you.

(09:58):
That the really good because I getthe white gays together all the time,
and so the fact that they werejust like, you know what, we
hear the message, we see it, and we want to add you to
that message this year made it amazing. I've hosted New York Pride, I've
done like different panels, and thisyear to be the Grandma Show just felt

(10:18):
really good. That's so beautiful,so beautiful. Speaking of gathering the white
gays, this is something that Ispeaking speaking of gathering the white folk.
Um, this is a little bitoff topic, but it's you brought my
attention to win bud Light. That'sthe beer that's under fire or whatever.
Okay, that's not literally under fireright now. It is really it is,

(10:41):
and they have changed their position alittle bit. Did you notice that.
Okay, I just read a littlebit about that last night, but
I found out about the whole debaclefrom your page because um, the spokesmodel
Demovy Delamol Vaney has their complexities asa person as just their compati person okay,

(11:05):
and has their their place and opinionin the LGBTQ community. And they
were chosen for this spokesmanship. Andthen you know everybody got mad. They
started blowing up their bud Light andship. And now bud Light has sort
of done like a well, itwas actually like a third party marketing company
that hired this person. You know, we didn't like as if they don't

(11:28):
sign off on every dollar that yeah, because they saw another dipping sales.
I didn't realize how many people wasout here drinking bud Light. I mean
it's it's one of the beers ofchoice, and like because my grandma I
still remember the order. It's theMiller light in the can, not the
short one at all. One likelike I knew, and like those were

(11:48):
subsidiaries of each other, and soI knew like that people was doing it.
And it's like the number one likeJuly cookout beer or two, which
is interesting. But I mean there'sa knee. It's a backtrack. I
think, not even just because ofthe backlash, because I think, honestly,
if the backlash was coming from aperson who wasn't so controversial on both

(12:09):
sides, it might have been different, but I think what they realized was
that they didn't and they chose thewrong person. Right. It's a difference
when you do this and the communityis like, yeah, I said behind
this pert, right, and thenthe people that you expected to go fuck
that shit, go fuck that shit, right. But it was for them.
I think the kicker was the communitywas like, really, bitch,

(12:33):
and then they was like, oh, we got the wrong person all the
way around, and now there doesn'tneeds a backtrack. I don't think that
it's backtracking because they don't support becausebut like, this isn't their first pride,
initiation or whatever the case may be. But I think that what it
really is is that they're trying todistance themselves from her and say, like,
we would have done a better jobthis company, right, they picked

(12:56):
this, you know, this thing, and so it's like they're trying to
put it off on like those likeyou said, they sign off on every
dollar. Y'all thought it was agood idea until it wasn't. That's really
what it was. They forgot tohave someone from the community indorse or like.
But that's the thing too, becausethey do have people from community,
but they have white gay men wholook at things like that and go,
oh my god, it's great,it's awesome. That's inclusivity, because they

(13:18):
don't like the idea of having tohave conversations with women like me where it's
like, yeah, it's great,it's awesome. That's inclusivity. But also,
so let's talk about the racism inthe community as well. And if
you don't mind, I realized thatI was getting paid ten thousand dollars less
than she was, So let's talkabout the paid wage gap and why because
I got more followers and more influencedin her right. And so those are

(13:39):
the things that they run away from. And people like Dylan one because she's
so very young in her transition,but too because she's willing to smile and
grin and bear it and maybe havethose conversations on the background, but she's
never going to check you in themoment, and that's what they like,
and unfortunately for them this time,it costs them money. I think also
a lot of times in these situations, like I did see whatever m Dylan's

(14:03):
most recent post was, and wassaying, I come from a conservative family,
you know, so it's like they'regonna reach out like when you think
of like, I don't know whoowns bud Light, like if that's the
full parent. So like you thinkof them, you think, of course
the course family Um in Colorado sponsoredall kinds of tea party and all kinds

(14:28):
of you know what I'm saying.So those companies themselves are like deep rooted
in that mind state anyway. Soof course when they reach out to someone
that's lgbt QIA and their perspective,they're gonna reach out to also someone who's
fucking conservatively right, you know whatI'm saying. Same as if they were
gonna have a black women, theygonna get Candice Owens on that ship,
you know what I'm saying. Sothey're gonna still kind of keep it within
their zone. So I think,like a lot of a lot of times,

(14:52):
when these companies wind up doing thatshit, they're like, well they
still they still with us, though, right, you know what I'm saying.
And then they missed them double tongue. Yeah, didn't miss that mark
real bad, real bad, realbad. You gathered them real good too,
I really had. Because there's mything is, there are so many
like, amazing trans women that couldhave been used and actually trans women that

(15:15):
actually drink beer, like that's thething that that ad and being somebody who
has done stuff, and I knowthat I've nowhere near the amount of money
that she got offered for that.I've had people that were only offered me
ten thousand dollars and I had tosend them six different edits something, you
know what I'm saying, And thatto me felt like that was her first
take. It was the only take. She was like, I'm only sipping

(15:37):
this beer one time and I'm done, and they were like great, right,
Like nobody vetted that to even seethat she does not enjoy and it's
very clear that she didn't enjoy thebeer that she was drinking, and maybe
go back and say, just talkabout the beer as a matter of fact,
just hold up your can. Don'teven all the rest of this is
unnecessary. But then it's like youmake a mockery out of women who do
enjoy sports, because it's like youyou're making it see as if women are

(16:00):
not interested in it. So you'rejust like march madness whatever that is like,
and it's like, what, like, do you know how many women
actually like live it is harder thantheir husband, and it was just it
was a mockery. This year,the women's the Women's March Madness was actually
way better than the men's and Ithink they actually got a higher market share

(16:21):
for like a majority of the gameson television viewership. You know what I'm
saying. So you don't, youdon't, I don't know. I think
this kind of would lead to someof the other questions that we have.
So I don't want to get it. No, no, no, it's
good because I mean, think aboutit for the folks that that listen to
us talk about you know, let'sjust say people in kink and b DSM
that take jobs or representation that theyshouldn't like you haven't learned the ropes yet

(16:48):
or you can only take that conversation, but to a point. And I
think that all of us who representwhether it's marginalized communities, subcultures, what
have you, we have a responsibilityto turn jobs away too and opportunities away
and maybe give it to the peoplewho you're still you're still listening to or
I don't know, I see thata lot. You know, it's hard

(17:10):
to turn dollars away especialized, especiallywhen you are in a marginalized community,
whatever that community may be. Butit's like, your time is coming,
and if you're really about furthering,furthering opportunities for people, like get out
the way it's coming. Your timeis coming. I love it. We
say past the mic like yeah,you're not ready for it, you ain't

(17:32):
ready. But the reason I waseven thinking about that is I think you
touched on it just now. Whereit's like to say women are all into
or not into one particular thing islike the definition of like just laning a

(17:52):
whole group of people. Yeah,And I think right now with laws in
Florida, Tennessee, Mississippi, Montana, just rattle off these states that are
making all these laws, I thinkthey are also instead of reaching out a
hand to understand or lending an earto understand, they are making these laws

(18:17):
because they are leaning an entire groupof people and within that trying to formulate
this to just kind of like whatwe talk about a lot. Like,
for example, whenever somebody tells awhite person they're acting black, it's always
like you're acting like you're not outhere acting like Marcus Garvey. You know

(18:37):
what, I'm saying, may beout here acting a one particular way that
they've seen in a rap video,So like, no, you're acting like
that one fucking person. So withthat being said, in regards to the
perception of transpolt right now, howdo you let people know that you are
trans but also your individual human beingand let them know that these particular laws

(19:03):
they might affect one person in oneway, someone else someone else. And
I know this is like the longestfucking question, but how would you how
do you even get to approach thatwhen people aren't trying to have this conversation,
that's the thing. But that's areally great question because people aren't right,
Like people don't but also people don'tcare. And the saddest part about
it is that, like, mypeople don't care because when you try to
talk about that as a black person, like it is not even like you're

(19:26):
a white trans person or a whitequeer person trying to like make the equivalency,
which will still be valid like dependingon who you are in your past,
but like as black queer people,when we try to draw that,
it's like, don't do that,Like those are two false equivalencs, and
it's like, but it's not.You're literally using the same talking points that
white supremacists use against us on mebecause I'm queer, and then you overlook

(19:48):
the fact that I'm black the entireconversation as if you're talking to the oppressor.
You're talking to me like I don'tget it, Like I get it.
I'm still black regard. You mighthave forgot that once you heard the
wor or trans come out of mymouth, but I'm still black. And
it's one of those things where I'malways saddened when I'm in space with other
women and all we care about iscackling as women, and then the second

(20:15):
that my transness comes up, We'reno longer cackling anymore. Now it's judgment.
Now I got a thousand and onequestions for your existence. Now I
have all of these things as ifwe weren't all just sharing the experience.
None of those things matter until youknew. But it's one of those things
where it's like, as a blacktrans woman, I can't have that conversation
because as soon as you find outof them trans, nothing else that I

(20:37):
say matters. Like just to takeyou back, I have the incident on
Fox Soul where I did not discloseduring a conversation that had nothing to do
with my gender identity. It hadeverything to do with how I felt about
black men and whether or not theywere under attack. That was all.
That was what the conversation was about. And because I didn't disclosed, and

(21:00):
doctor Umar called me a beautiful blackqueen, I'm wrong, and the entire
internet, mind you, I hada day of peace. And this is
how I know and why I callbullshit on certain things. I was not
clocked during the interview by anybody.After the interview, I still wasn't clocked.
I had a day. Then.I guess one of them hoped t

(21:22):
ups was trying to find a thingbecause I made points, and you know
that's what they do. You getthe making points. Now they want to
go look up stuff and see whatthey can use to discredit you. And
so one of them went and foundout, like, oh, you a
whole man out here. And mindyou, I'm reading the comments. I'm
going through the things as unhealthy asit is for us. Don't read the

(21:44):
comments. Stop reading them comments,you know, but I'm reading the comments.
And while people might not have necessarilyagreed with me, nobody was being
transphobic. Nobody was saying anything likedisrespectful. People were just like, I
don't like what the ladies said.Cool the second that they found out,
even the people that agree with me, even the women that agreed with me,
were just like, oh, butyou shouldn't have been the one to

(22:04):
say those things. You don't havea right to talk about black men because
you're a black man who didn't evenwant to be a black man. You
like, I don't care how goodthe points were, And it's like,
okay, wait, wait, wait, pause, So now everything that I
said is invalid, not because you'vedone research and found out that I was
giving misinformation, but just because I'mtrans. And that's why it's hard to

(22:25):
have those conversations, because it's justlike, it doesn't matter what you say,
how intelligent you are, whether Italk at the octave of a two
so that I'm not, you know, giving the wrong tone or making it
seem like I'm trying to be whatever, or if I get on here and
I'm just spitting my ship, there'salways going to be something because I'm trans,
and it does not matter that I'mblack. And I think that that's
one of the conversations that I wishthat we could have, But I don't

(22:48):
think that anybody wants you, becausethen they would have to recognize that what
they're doing is dead ass wrong.And it don't make no sense for us
to be going like not us,like, let's have the conversation about like
queerness and understanding and all of thosethings, but let's not like argue and
beat each other down in the process, because we have bigger fish to fry.

(23:10):
What is what is that? Imean, we know it's transphobia,
homophobia, racism, we know it'sall the isms, but it's almost like
when you get folks that are oppressed, we have to compete for who's the
most suppressed, or to look forthe enemy that we could That's I think

(23:30):
it feels like fear, right Likeit's the fear of not being able to
feel the power that somebody else hasover you. And even within the trans
community right now, we have alike a little debacle going on because there's
a very popular trans woman who decidedthat she was gonna make non binary people
the enemy this week, and I'mjust like, first of all, we're
already a marginalized group within a marginalizedgroup within a marginalized group, and now

(23:53):
you, as a marginalized person,are going to turn around and do the
same thing within the group. Likethat don't make sense, Yeah, it
doesn't make sense. It's everywhere youlook at it. It always happens though.
I mean, it's one of thereasons why America and Britain before it
were able to rule the world byputting a minority in charge of another minority,

(24:14):
but the smaller minority. I'm saying, but I think within black folks,
and there was that whole I forgetwho had originally said it, but
there was that tweet where it waslike black men or the white people black
community, and it's like that totempole situation, like I know these people
above me, you know, thesethese white folks above me is gonna treat

(24:37):
me this, that and the other. And I can't respond to them the
way that either I want to orI should, Right, you know what
I'm saying, because there are certainconsequences that I'm not willing to deal with.
So I'm gonna take all of thatshit out on somebody who's in a
lower position than me. Well,I also ask people, because when when
you do approach people about their theirthought process, you get pushed back like

(25:00):
you know, I don't have awhatever bone in my body and all that,
and I do I think that alot of this is learned behavior.
Right. So we have watched thepeople, We have watched our families,
our communities be oppressed repressed in allthe ways, and like, what is
a different model that we can lookat to to be able to see how

(25:23):
we can actually like how how canhow can we have community amongst each other
without doing exactly what's being done tous? Like where do you feel safe?
Hope? Where do you feel likeyou can have nuanced conversations and where
you are seen and recognized and treatedas the individual that you are. Um,

(25:47):
you don't have to have an siftingI was gonna say, Um,
I mean I think obviously like myinner circle, right, like my my
people, like my five people thatlike are like my folks. But honestly,
in general, like I don't reallyfeel say that because there's always somebody
in the room that's gonna take somethingthat I said and make it about like

(26:07):
I literally I literally tweeted a pictureand it was literally like a little infographic
that just said, sis is nota slur It's a descriptor, that's all
it says. My caption to thatreiterated that and just said, have you
ever been called sis and felt away about it? Let's open up dialogue.
Nothing about it was antagonistic. Nothingabout it called out any particular race

(26:27):
or gender or anybody. I havepeople underneath that post. There are some
white folks that are like, it'sthe same thing as the N word.
Then I have some black women underthat post that are like, oh,
but don't call me sis. I'ma regular woman. I'm biological. People
are under their debating the idea ofthis being just as bad as when black

(26:49):
folks were trying like there are somany things happening underneath this post that was
not in any way, And honestly, I was hoping that people would be
like, I've been called sis andI like that shit, Like I was
expecting that, right, But thenI was also being I was willing to
put myself in this space to belike, Okay, so why didn't you
like it so that I can understandX, Y, and Z. And

(27:11):
then there are people combating it andsaying like, oh, well, don't
call me that, and I'm like, I won't like I respect that.
I respect the fact that you don'twant to be called sis, and if
I'm talking directly to you or referringto you, I won't say it,
right, But there's not that samerespect for trans people when we say like,
hey, I've been respectful to you, and so the fact that you
still feel the need to come outof the woolwork and be like, oh

(27:33):
you a man, Like what wasthat about? And why is that for?
Well, I mean, you are, It's just the truth. Why
is there a defense around that orwhy do you get to have defense around
that? But then when a transperson says, I'm calling you sis because
that's literally what you are and it'sjust another term for it. But no,
no, no, I'm normal.I don't need another term. It's
the same shit. It's they're synonymous. They're literally synonymous, and it's just

(27:55):
like, oh no, but wellno, every time I've heard it used,
it's been used to make me feelbad. You it in a sentence
I've tried, like, in mymind, even if I wanted to insult
a system the person with the words, it sounds dumb, which is another
reason why the upper hand against homomssiaand transmissia don't make sense because it's easy
to make gay feel bad. Eventhough it's not necessarily inherently a bad word.

(28:18):
It's easy for it because socially we'veput that in our mind, like,
oh, that's gay gay right,Like it's easy to turn tranny or
any of those things into a slurthinking about like, oh, you're so
sixs like that just sounds dumb.That sounds really stupid to me. And
it's because the word innately was notmeant for that purpose, and societally we

(28:40):
haven't had a conversation and come togetherand saying we all agree that this is
kind of agregious, Like nobody's donethat. Stop trying to be oppressed.
If the oppression Olympics, we're notoppressed enough, so I'm gonna use this
so I'm gonna have something over you, the oppressed Olympics. It happens,
some people are going for gold.Yeah, And I do. I do

(29:02):
think there is also um when wetalk about, like on our previous show,
when we talk about the decolonization ofsex and what was done to us
here, that there is always inorder to make it, I have to
emulate my oppressor. And it's interestingbecause you look at other either. You

(29:27):
look at other European societies right now, they are way more open and understanding
of things than America. But Americaalways has to create a boogeyman or boogie
lady, you know what I'm sayingwith all, and I feel like right
now trans folk are the booge peoplebecause they got what they wanted with abortion.

(29:51):
Abortion the big thing for mad years, and especially if you if you
look at the history of the movementof the pro life movement, right before
that, it was keeping black folkout of schools and they lost that one.
So they were like, we needsome new ship to row people up.
And now this is the new thing. Because you go to a lot

(30:11):
of communities, all this trans folkin every community, every color, every
social bracket you could possibly imagine,and has been that way for years.
But now all of a sudden,the shit is the biggest fucking talking point
in the world. It's also it'salso like a hey, look over there
while we do this thing over there. And I keep telling people that too,

(30:32):
like y'all wondering why every time welook up like there's because my thing
is they distract us with the ogpassed this trans bill, this trans bill
didn't get passed because that keeps thesocial conversation going. See, they getting
all of these things, and blackpeople still they ain't got X Y and
Z or ha ha. Y'all didn'tget what y'all wanted this time x Y
and Z. But whole time sixmonths from now, mark my words,

(30:52):
we're gonna find out that some majorthing for black people or something like that
guy passed and we're gonna be likewhen it did. When did they?
Even when y'all was arguing about thewords says on Twitter, Well, I
mean you see that here in Florida, all the books that they're pulling out
there, they're saying like, oh, we don't want this gender conversation in
schools, but also we're taking outmy angel but they had to put them

(31:15):
right to and they put they Andalso I think for black folks, we
need to stop that shit because whenyou take the black people who are lgbt
QI out of our conversation, we'relosing our family. You can't take our
family out the conversation. So Ithink that shit is detrimental as to the
community. Well, we're losing ourdamnselves because that too. But I mean

(31:40):
the people that be the loudest,they be struggling. Yeah, may be
struggling, but but I think likeand then also not even just the people
who are allowed est, but thepeople who listen to the loudest people.
Those those are sometimes the ones whoget to be the dangerous people because they
can't use their words. Yeah,you know what I'm saying. So I
think that this conversation and you ifyou look at the history of black volte

(32:04):
from America to the continent, soall over, this is a part of
our story. And you look atnative native folks here in this land,
part of our story. But thenin order to oppress us, in order
to make us specifically made sexually,to reproduce, to make them money,

(32:28):
there's they are going to cut outany version of love that we had,
right, you know what I'm saying. So emulating them is only going to
kill ourselves. End of the day. Word And so I'm I'm curious to
know when we're talking about the decolonizationof sex and um King and I have
pulled stories from many different cultures wheretranspolkes, gay folks, um, just

(32:52):
all kinds of expressions of love andidentity have come across for you was at
what like your historical reference that givesyou pride, that lets you know like
you've been here long before a lawor a bill or what have you.
Honestly, I have to lean intolike the great Marcia like and not just

(33:15):
for Stonewall, like when I reallylike dug deep into Marcia. She was
that girl, like she went tothe rallies in the spaces, And what
people failed to realize about her wasthat before she threw that brick, she
was still dealing with the like theramifications of dealing with the white gaze and
then like the gaze of color inthe community, and then also the Harlem
Renaissance was happening when all of thatwas happening too, So as a black

(33:37):
person in America and one that wasliving in New York at the time,
she wasn't only dealing with that,but she's dealing with all these other things.
And she was still boisterous, andshe would show up to both spaces
knowing that she wasn't wanted because thegays didn't know how to deal with the
trans or a non binary expression atthe time. They were just like,
we're women who like women and menwho like, men, what the fuck

(33:58):
are you right if you weren't adrag queen or if that wasn't something that
you took off, They didn't understandhow to deal. And so while people
might revere her now, even inthat time, there's video footage of her
and Sylvia being booed at the Priderally right before Stonewall, and now that
same moment is solidified in history,and I just feel like to be somebody

(34:22):
that was a trailblazer in that timewhere literally there were actual laws that said
that you could not walk around likethat, and Marcia said, fuck that
shit, and I dare you tolock me the fuck up, and did
got locked up a bunch of timesfor the freedom of expression. But it
never stops her from coming out andnever stops her from doing it for the
community. The boys didn't fuck withher, the lesbians didn't fuck with her.

(34:43):
The only other people that bothered withher with maybe the drag queens on
a good day, but her andSylvia and people like us and Stormy and
all those folks, they had toget it out of the mud, and
they would still go and fight forthe people who didn't see it for them,
and I feel like for me,that's how I know I've been here
before, Like that's me. Idon't care how many six women have been
like, oh you a man likeyou. You're not about to talk about

(35:06):
black women in general, because,regardless of whether they acknowledge it, I'm
a black woman, and so I'mnot about to let you play in my
face or the faces of any blackwomen transources. You're not gonna come over
here and talk about trans people,white, black or indifferent. We're not
about to have those games and thesame thing. And all of my intersections
live at once over here. Soregardless of the miss or the transgressions of

(35:27):
a few people in my life,I'm still gonna go. And I feel
like Marsha was like the epitome ofthat, Like, I don't care how
many of y'all don't let me inthese little gay clubs. I don't care
how many of y'all throw tomatoes atus on these stages when it comes time
to stand up for the spaces thatwe feel safe, and I'm throwing the
first brick follow me, you know, And I just I really appreciate that
legacy. That's so beautiful, that'sso beautiful. I just it's it makes

(35:53):
me sad because like during Pride month, that is like the the posta child,
right, and then to think thatduring that time, but I can't
think of a leader that has sacrificeand wasn't like didn't have those experiences at
that time that now we're like tryingto have a holiday after Alca max on

(36:19):
the stamp, you know, Imean even if we want to be more
colloquial a little Kim right, Like, I mean, how long did it
take for us to like really acknowledgeher as an icon in the moment like
the fashion world and them white peoplewas like, yeah, we were the
ones leaning on our grandmas and themlike, oh like this is not respectable.
Now a little Kim as the queenbe iconic, fashion so and so

(36:42):
sexual liberator, there would be noMegan Cardi if there wasn't for Kim.
But it's just like where were herflowers when she was doing this? Yeah?
Like where were her flowers when shewas legitimately being iconic? And not
from them people like not for nothing, and this is so off topic,
but it's one of those things whereit's just like we as a community want
to vilify Kim and laugh at herfor all the changes that she made,

(37:02):
but we have to remember she's emulatingthe people that we're giving her love.
She was in the spaces with them, and so she wanted to be more
appealing to them because the black peoplewas telling you, oh, you're too
skinny to be in those poses.You're two X, Y and Z to
be dressed in like that. Youain't got enough booty to be doing what
Foxy doing. And so guess whatshe found her audience of people. And

(37:23):
unfortunately, along with finding that audienceof people, you still realize that they
still racist. They don't they nothere for you. They're using you for
your brand all of these things.And so there's also this need to be
bodied, and the boys want booty, and the boys want titties, and
the boys want this and that.But now you've already tried to do this
and at the same time, andnow we have this mixture of a person
that we don't even like visual recognize, and we want to blame it on

(37:45):
her, but like, honestly,it's the culture. The same culture we
go up for, is the sameculture that turns a lot of our grades
into people that we turn into memes. Unfortunately, and I think that that's
what happens for the trance community too. I love Little Kim and I was
drawing her flowers when I I fourteenthirteen years old. I just couldn't get

(38:07):
them to her. You know,I definitely had that that little post of
you was probably drawing one of theflowers. So yes, sort of off
topic, but you went into fashionand appearances and and beauty standards. One

(38:28):
of m one of our folks asked, let me let me get to it
directly so that every everybody listening inright now. We took some questions from
the BX team, the RFF team, and some fans. Okay, so
where did it go? Where didit get? Okay? You mentioned in
a post. Oh so they followingyour connection to your hair and sense of

(38:52):
identity. And for those of youif you're not following hope, follow hope
because you will figure out how tonot only gather the white folks, but
get your whole look every morning everymorning. Um, can you elaborate on
your evolution with various beauty standards?And this person I had a chat with
them. They were really pulled intoyour conversation about what we as women go

(39:15):
through with cutting our hair, changingour hair style, and then you know,
I remember when I when um,you and I took a picture and
you couldn't see the pony, soyou could just see the shave, and
people were like, um, thatlooked like a man. And I remember,
like, you know that comment couldI don't. I don't. I

(39:38):
will never know who that person was, where it came from, but I
remember it taking the air out ofyou. And I've had my hair cut.
It was just the idea of someoneperceiving me different than I am,
and therefore they must not think thatI am beautiful. So talk to us
about hair evolution of beauty standards andwhere you are with that. I mean

(40:00):
hair for me, it's all expressive, it really is. It's a it's
a way that I expressed myself.It's or whether I expressed my vibe in
my mood. But I think atthe beginning of transition, hair was like
the saving gray child. Like beforethere was ever a stick of mac or
anything, there was always a goodpiece of hair. Like I would literally
go broke, refund checks would comeand like my whole refund check was good

(40:23):
wigs because I never wanted to bewhen I was growing up. My mama
is still very much so hood andit's slightly ignorant, okay. And my
mama used to always say, likethe one thing, you could be whatever
you want to be, but you'renot gonna be dusty for the ass punk
And if you're from Florida, youknow exactly what that mean, right,
And that always suck with me becauseI was just like, you know what,

(40:44):
you could say whatever you want tosay about me, but you're never
gonna say she's not put together.You're never gonna say the wig was redded
and maddened in the back, Likeyou're never gonna say any of those things.
And so for me, it waslike that armor because and it worked
because I didn't start transitioning until Iwas in college. And what I found
was that even if they giggled becauseI was this different looking, you know,

(41:06):
person trying to do their thing,they couldn't help but respect the fact
that I was always fly but thatbitch hair be laid though the shoes,
she be dressed, you know whatI'm saying. Like they had to give
it to me in one way oranother. And so I started to kind
of sort of like more from thehair, and I was like, Okay,
well, how do I pull allof this together? You know?
And then the makeup became a thing. And what I realized was that the

(41:30):
more I got into it, themore I got away from it. And
I realized that I was like,I'm going to work every day, I'm
painting on all of this clown assmakeup that I thought was so cute,
Like at one point I lived forlike a cut crease and like heavy blue
liner and like every blue liner,you know, all of the things.
And I just woke up one dayand I was like, you look like

(41:52):
a fucking clown. Like this ain'twhat you want, Like this is never
the version of a woman that yousaw for yourself being. You're hiding.
And I don't think I've ever feltugly or unattractive before transition. After transition,
I've always just felt judged. Andso there was a thing where it
was like I don't want to bejudged. So I'm gonna paint it on

(42:14):
and I'm gonna wick it up andI'm gonna do all the things because this
is gonna be how I live.And once I realized that I couldn't live
like that no more, I mademy first cut and probably like like twenty
eighteen or so, and I rememberI was on live and it was the
funniest thing but also the most traumaticthing because nobody really knows this. I
got on Facebook Live with the intentionto give myself a t WA. I

(42:37):
wanted just like a little teeny Winnieafro for those people that don't know speak
black Lady Harolingo, right, SoI wanted a teeny Winnie afro. And
I had just got these clippers frommy step mama. Didn't know what I
was doing. I didn't know whata guard was, okay, and so
I had these braids and they hadlike a good amount of new growth.
But when you don't know what you'redoing, touched the scalp because I thought

(43:01):
that I was gonna have a steadyenough hand to kind of like shape it
up, and literally on camera,I wanted to die because I was like,
you just cut bald. You're bald. And I didn't start in the
back or I started right here.I never I will never forget that first
cut. And I'm Facebook is watchingthis, and so as bad as I

(43:25):
want to cry, the person thatwants to be a social media influencer it's
like, bitch, you bet not, because if you do that then this
becomes embarrassing. And I was like, in a in a split moment,
I was like, how was thisempowering? And I just kept cutting and
I was just like, I feelfree and I feel this and I da

(43:45):
da da die. And as Iwas talking myself down from having a fucking
nervous breakdown live on Facebook, Istarted to believe what I was saying,
and it hit me and I waslike, you are all of these things
and this does look good and fuckthis hair, and who cares about you
know what these people are gonna think? And I went to work like that
ballhead and all at MAC just ballhead, bare face, just doing all.

(44:08):
And that was the beginning of meunderstanding that I didn't need those things.
I was made to believe that ifI didn't show up in this hyper feminine
way, that I was no longerdesirable. For years before that, in
college, dealing with these DL thugtrade niggas and telling you that you got
to have on a full face ifthey're gonna come over and fuck you,
why you're gonna shove my face inthe pillow For the next thirty minutes.

(44:29):
What is the point why? Like, what's the point? You don't want
to really look at me. Youjust can't get one of these little girls
on campus and here I am lowself esteem, like shit, and you
know it. So you really justcome over here to get your rocks off,
but you still have prerequisites for me, and all of that stuff carries
into the way that you handle life. And once I cut them off and

(44:51):
cut my hair off and let allof that trauma go, I realized,
like, girl, it could bewhatever I wanted to be. It could
be locked, it could be braided, it could be dreaded like I've been
short haired, don't care for thelongest. I was feeling a little,
you know. So we put alittle quoft on. But like right now,
my favorite look, it's my littleblonde short like it's it's my favorite
thing, and I feel powerful init. And I can tell that it

(45:13):
translates because I never get more attentionthan when I'm ballhead. I'm ballhead,
and when where most trans girls wouldcringe, that is when I feel the
most powerful, because that's when that'swhen the nexts are broken, like men,
women, everybody, the next arebroken. When I'm bald. When
I have on the armor that Ithink is saving me, that is actually
the thing that puts it in mymind that I need to be on alert

(45:36):
because now they can see me whenI don't have anything to hide, when
the when the when the bone structureis out, and I'm just like,
okay, y'all see it. Butwhen I think that I can tuck something
away, I'm kind of looking tosee if you see that I'm tucking.
And I had to get away fromthat. And that was what happened on
that live was like I was justreminding people, like, while I understand

(45:57):
that there's a privilege once again goingback into that like pretty privileged that that
whole thing. I understand that there'sa privilege to it, but there has
to be an acknowledgement of why.And if the answer is for anybody other
than you, it's wrong. AndI have been doing it for everybody,
but I'm talking about literally I wouldget home from work, wipe my face
off, realize that I needed togo grab groceries at the Walmart of all

(46:20):
places, and put it back onand put a whole face, not like
oh like a little no, afull face. I shadow lashes and all
to make a thirty minute trip tothe Walmart. No, ma'am, it
was horrible. That was horrible.But there are so many trans girls,
and especially like fresh new ones inthe transition, that will do that,
and people don't understand that if folksjust minded their own fucking business, like

(46:44):
the traumas that so many people areexperiencing, that then turn into nasty ass
trans girls online saying fucked up assshit. Because I'm not gonna act like
we all innocent. But I thinkthat a lot of that comes from the
trauma of having to constantly armor yourselfevery single day and it being valid because
even with the armor, they stillgot something in sac you know. So

(47:05):
yeah, yeah, damn, that'sreal. I think about when the time
that you shaved your head and wewent to the barber shop and do what
was trying to talk you like hewas about to jump off of a building.
He was like really trying to talkyou down off of that shit.
And I think about that, andI also think about what you just said
with with makeup. Men don't gottado shit nothing. Most men don't even

(47:32):
wash their ass, none of thatship. But there is so many levels
and I think you touched on theyou you said it perfectly about hyper femininity,
and this goes back to bills,it goes back to laws, it
goes back to all of these theseacceptance things of people having to hyper fucking

(47:55):
everything instead of just letting people be, you know, And it's like,
if you have to for in ourindustry, you know what I'm saying,
the backlash and this this has nothingto do with what you're attracted to or
any or physical care whatever. Butlike I see backlash on women for having

(48:15):
pubic hare or armpit hair, likenasty, mean fucking shit, people just
going off, and it's like,yo, if you don't like people care,
it's all a lot of point starswho who don't have that shit like
just move the fuck on, youknow what I'm saying. So it's it's
like, but I think that thewhat it comes down to is people define

(48:37):
themselves by these ideals of like,well, I'm attracted to this, so
that makes me this, right,But if I see you and I'm attracted
to you, or if I seeyou with cut in your hand, I'm
attracted, What the fuck does thatmake me? Now, you know what
I'm saying. It's like that's whyyou'll get the same people who are commenting

(48:57):
on your shit like that's a greatpoint. But now that you made that
point, because I notice extra shit, Oh shit, I fucking agree with
her. My whole fucking world isyou know what I'm saying. And people
are not open to having a greaterunderstanding. They're like, I need this
understanding as my whole fucking world isbased on this one understanding and anything that

(49:19):
rattles that destroys that shit, mwe're gonna be shattering a lot of people's
world Well, I know you've experiencedsome of of shattering people's worldview because you're
not a big before you could wehear from you all the time. You're

(49:42):
familiar with royal fetish friends. I'mfamiliar. Me and my roads are very
familiar, and Penelope the number one. But yes, we're familiar, so
you know, and if it doesn'tif it doesn't feel too awkward, we
could always kind if we need to, um, what was that like?
What was that experience? What isthat experience like? When you see someone

(50:06):
like King Noir, who was mostlyprominently known for being the like I'm trying
to talk about you, like likesex icon and in the porn world,
and you know, bringing up blackkink and UM and then his own growth
in development on camera at least UMand working with trans women in the way

(50:29):
that he does. UM. Firstof all, I found it was recent
for me. UM shouts out toNick erotic boudoir. Um, that's my
baby. But Nick and I arereally really good friends. I talked to
him every day. I'm going tocall her out to kids, UM.
But Nick was like, oh,did you And I was like, we

(50:52):
talked about the same king noir right, And she was like, yeah,
bitch, I didn't know. AndI was like, the link please,
And so I'm watching. And forme, and I think for a lot
of trans women, because I sentto do a bunch of people, I
needed the girls to know, noteven just for the fact that it was
sexy, but I need I neededthe girls to know. But it was

(51:13):
one of those things where like forme, I was so affirmed because a
lot of the time, what peoplewant to do is discredit the men that
are attracted to us. Yes andso and no, Tinoche, there's some
truth to some of it, right, Like some of the guys are definitely
given. Like I said at home, my mama's basement and you know,
antroll people, right, But forthe most part, there are plenty of

(51:36):
men that are attractive, well established, doing their own thing all of the
stuff, serving up the women,and are still attracted to us and willing
to say it. And I lovethe idea that it wasn't like no offense
but some classically unattractive person that wasmaking I don't even know if it was.
I don't even know if you wantto call it that like this stand.
I think that you were doing yourjob and you were doing what the
fuck you wanted, and that was, you know what it was in the

(51:58):
moment. But it was a standon my end to say, like,
I'm gonna do what I want todo because I'm gonna work with who I
want to work with. And justlike I choose the other people that I
want to have access to my body, I chose this person. And that's
just what it is. And therewas no at least not as far as
I know, there was no like, oh, I'm gonna make a grand
statement about it. It was justthis is my job, either gonna watch

(52:20):
it and like it or not,and I'm through with it. And I
just there was something really endearing aboutthat, and especially considering that it encompassed
sex. Most of the time,it's like these things where sex it's like
insinuated. Maybe they did, maybethey didn't, whatever the case may be,
you can retract the statement. Butwhen it's something that's so like here
it is and then I'm gonna followthat up with inclusive talking and language points

(52:43):
and not like a rebuttal as towho I am, but I'm just gonna
let y'all know that I'm not thisguy. Right. That was just really
great. And so many people whodo have a lot larger platforms that all
the girls know about, they're notdoing those things. And it's just like,
here we are having this person lowkey you beluse you could have lost
your whole career. They could havebeen like, oh, absolutely the fuck

(53:05):
not right. But you have peoplethat really don't stand and lose anything.
The people that run y'all pockets arepeople that don't give a fuck about who
you having sex with. Can't youdribble the ball? Can you wrap the
song? Can you do with thewhatever? Right? But these are people
that directly they stopped watching. Theypassed it around enough on black Twitter,
the sales go down and then Igotta go find something else to do.
And that to me just felt likethat's a black king right there, you

(53:30):
know. And I just really Ireally appreciated it. That's so awesome.
I'm hypeth the girls are watching it. Yeah, I mean they watching it.
I made sure and then I blockedthem. But the rest of my
stuff there was there was a conversationthat you had um on maybe it was

(53:53):
in your stories where you were talkingabout like, um, there's a lot
of people who don't want six womenand trans women to have a cover sation.
They don't want us to keep keyright, And I thought that that
was so funny because it's like,yeah, that's kind of like the same
the same thing that used women's assists, women assist women trans women, Like
it's always you know, divide andconqueror, like if you want to run

(54:14):
one over on us, keep usat odds with each other. And um,
and it's interesting because when I actuallyhave I shot with a trans woman
before you on camera, right,okay, and nobody nobody cared about my
scene. You liked it. It'sgood. It was really good. It

(54:40):
was my pre baby body for me, that's what deser it was a good
scene. But when King started toshoot, I started to get so many
messages like how do you you know? Like how do you feel about that?
Um? You know is how doyou Is it okay? Did I
give permission? Are things different inour relationship now? Like all of these

(55:00):
things where I know that everything wasfine between us and we discussed it.
We discussed it when I shot,like how we talk about everybody that we
discussed right, but it did.I was like, should I be feeling
different? Is this gonna change?Has something change? Is he looking at
me differently? Is he looking forsomething more? You know? Like all

(55:22):
of these things came out and wereally did have to have a conversation about
and then. And I also realizedthough that those same feelings were there about
other things. So when we firststarted shooting port, it's like, are
you okay that he's shooting with whitewomen? Are you okay that he's shooting
with it? So reality is there'sinsecurities everywhere. They see that we're thriving

(55:44):
as a couple as a business,and then we decide to do something.
We're literally doing what we tell peoplewe're gonna do. Explore our sex and
sexuality we're gonna do. That's amission. We want to do all the
kinky things and in the safest waypossible with all the types of people that
we can. We are literally doingthe thing that we incorporated this company for.

(56:04):
People are like, are you sure, are you okay? Are you
okay? Are things okay? Youknow, so you have some thoughts about
that. It's interesting though, becauseI think anything with porn it and it
goes back to that same point ofwhere people are, like, some people
don't like to admit it, butthey vicariously live through poorn stars the same

(56:25):
way they do with actors and actressesof other sorts or athletes or whatever.
It is, just this is wherethey vicariously live their sex lives. So
it's like, if you fall downa rabbit hole in any particular direction,
you're gonna wind up in some differentshit, whether it's different people, whether
it's different sexual acts or whatever.But the thing is, if you're on

(56:47):
even X videos or porn hub,that shit does give you categories in regards
to gender. So if you're crossingover that shit, mad at me for
you know what I'm saying, like, because I know because it's it's I
have to be in the back endof these things, posting my shit to

(57:07):
specific shits, and personally, Idon't think it should be like that.
Like for me, it's easy whenI see the little fucking box, if
it's some shit that I'm not into, I must keep scrolling. And if
I watch it and it has someshit I'm not into, I stop the
fucking video and go fucking put abetter searching for what I'm looking for.
And that doesn't bother me. Likeif I see two people doing something that

(57:29):
I'm not particularly into, good forthem, let me move on to the
next thing. So I think someof the backlash and some of the things
that I've received in that way,the way people come at me with it,
I'm always like this, should ithurt you? And wanting like you
feel more of a way about thisthan I do. So this ain't really

(57:52):
a conversation between me and you.There's a conversation you need to have with
yourself. Yeah, you know.And and I think that it's that way
too, Like I've it's interesting,like you said, the oh he worked
with white women, Like I've hadlike crazy insane racist who I think is
possibly it's it's white men messaging me. You know what I'm saying, like

(58:13):
coming from that particular thing where it'slike you also need to have this that
like that racism is a problem withyou. Fashion is not mine. And
I feel like it's the same kindof thing with all the all the phobias
and regards to gender and sex.It's like if you really don't fuck with
it, just let it go,let it go and go watch your own

(58:35):
shit. So but as for like, actually the shoots that we have done
for me has always been like Idon't like the same way when we have
started Royal Fetish films were like blackpeople are not shot well in this industry.
Black people are not treated well inthis industry, and specifically in regards
to seeing passion beauty and some likeKinky Ship where where we're not the fetish

(59:02):
Yes, And I felt like whenit came to me shooting with transperformers as
well, like I'm not trying tofetishize other performers I'm with regardless of their
gender. So like when people willhit me up and they'll say those derogatory
words, even if they're saying theylike that shit, correct that shit,

(59:22):
because it' be the same as ifyou hit me up, like for working
with a Spanish person and you're like, why are you working with that spic
or something like w with you don'tcall me no nigger, like you know
what I'm saying, like, don'tdo that shit, you know. So
it's it's it's to me that partis almost as important as making a beautiful,

(59:44):
enjoyable, passionate, kinky fucking scenewith another talented performer, you know,
because it's like the back end andwhether it's the hate or even the
love where people need to understand likeyeah you can, you can love people
of all types, but you shouldn'tdisrespect them because then it's not love anymore.
You're fetishizing this person. So likethose those parts have been like the

(01:00:05):
important part. And for you wehave the question of sin since we did
kind of delve into poem right now. And I'll even extend this for mainstream
romantic films. Okay, how doyou think those of us who also work
behind the camera can better portray transfolkon camera know how or get to know

(01:00:28):
how the girls want to be seen? Because I think that is the same
thing for photography, and like yousaid, even with mainstream movies, because
even in watching pose, what Ifound colorism Okay, double with me,
okay, because that just made methink of something. But my first point
is get to know how the girlswant to be seen. I hate doing

(01:00:49):
photoshoots or like anything where I'm oncamera and I can tell that the person
is just doing their job, butthey don't like because it's one thing where
you don't give a about this talenton a regular basis, But it's another
thing when you don't give a fuckabout the talent because you know that I'm
trans, because then they shoot youhow they feel about you. The angle
is off, the lighting is dark. They come from an angle that make

(01:01:13):
your jaw look like quagmire, like, they accentuate your muscle like all type
of stuff. And it's just likeif you have conversations with most of the
binary trans girls, at least we'dbe trying to look as soft and as
feminine as all of it. Likeyou put all of this time and effort
and money, you know, intothis look, and then a person will
bypass all of this shit that youdid to like accentuate the one thing that

(01:01:35):
you left out or the one thingthat you can't afford to get fixed or
whatever the case may be, andit's just like those are things that I
hate to see, like imporn.Like that was why that scene was also
so pivotal for me, because Ifelt like she looked beautiful, like a
lot of the people like they justlook beautiful. I see them as women
who happen to have this little thingright, but right, this big thing,

(01:01:57):
but like you you forget it untillike there's something that's overtly happening,
but you just you forget it.It's like any other sex scene. And
I commend you all for that,like a thousand percent because most of the
other point that I watch with transgirls, I can't stomach it because it
looks real rock'm sock'm robote it.Like at certain points, I'm like,
is this giving gay porn? Becausenot because she looks any type of way,

(01:02:21):
but because of the way that theyshoot it. And it's just like
no, like we still want tolook and appear and be soft and feminine,
but also like don't fuck us,like you fucking your homeboy that you're
trying to get in before your mamacome home from work. Like that's the
other thing too. I think thatit's not just about like how do you
make them look good, like cinematically, but how do you make them feel
good and rest in their femininity whilethey are doing this act or this thing,

(01:02:45):
like if they are topping, howdo you reassure her that you're still
the man in the situation. I'mjust giving you what you want, right,
and not make her feel like thisis your masculine thing and this is
the thing like that fetish, thefetishizing of it. And then to talk
about the colorism, the thing thatI do notice is that oftentime, when
I do see videos of white orLatina trans women, they don't have no

(01:03:08):
problem but them making them look femininethem. They look real cut and fish
untill they turn around right. Andfor me, what I see is like,
even when the black girls do professionalwork, it don't matter how beautiful,
how stunning. And I'm talking aboutno filter, no makeup, no
lash, no nothing. They willget on that camera and somehow you will

(01:03:28):
see a whole different side of thisworld that you've never seen before. Makeup,
no makeup, filter, no filter. All of a sudden, she
looked like DeAndre from up the block, And people like, how did they
even accomplish this? Like this girlis gorgeous, and it's just it sucks
because I feel like, even whentrans, you can't escape the idea that
it's more desirable to be anything buta dark skinned black person. And I

(01:03:52):
just I think that that's the thingtoo, is like understanding how to light
black bodies and understanding how to likereally feel the face without making her look
like the biggest person in the room, because oftentimes we are larger than the
person that we're you know, with, and it's just like make me look
big and powerful the way that youdo those dominatrixes. Like when I watch
don porn, like them bitches don'tlook masculine, they look like powerful women.

(01:04:15):
And it's like, why can't youtake that same approach when you're doing
those things with trans women? Andit almost feels like it's sometimes it feels
like it's ta cater to the peoplethat have that fetish for you know,
because some people only like trans womenfor the sake of being able to see
that she's optically trans, right,Like some of them don't care for the
girls that pass and just have astick. But it's one of those things
where it's just like when you docertain things in certain angles, it makes

(01:04:42):
me feel like you're trying to likealmost knock her down a peg. Like
when she sees this, I knowshe's not gonna like. She don't look
like that in her Instagram pictures,like I'm show her like, but you're
still a man like. And I'vehad to like check certain photographers about that,
Like I have a whole photo shoetand like the whole time is given.
Oh my god, I hope yes, beautiful. I get the edits
back and I'm like, why yougot my box up popping like that?

(01:05:04):
Like why would you choose that angleand why did you go from that direction?
Like you what? Like what isthis? Like I have on a
chiffon gown and you're making this seemlike I'm stuffed in this thing that fits
me perfectly, but you're catching allthe angles where it looks like I've thrown
myself and my little sister's clothes andit feels purposeful because it feels like I

(01:05:25):
don't really want to do this,but your money green, and I just
I those are the things that Idon't like. I see that also with
pouring that features trans men as well, where it's like they're trying to feminize
them either feminize them or be like, but this is a real man,
you know what I'm saying, Likethe way that they're shooting. Yeah,

(01:05:48):
it's it's very interesting to see howthat's shot as well. And I feel
you when it's trans women because it'sit's interesting because person it's my art form.
So like I watch all different typesof porn to see how people are
shooting shit, and I think withwith depending on the gay porn, you

(01:06:11):
find it's either like wild brutal orit's the opportunity to see men in a
softer way, right, And thenit's like lesbian porn for the most part,
is always shot like it's a BarbaraWalter special, you know what I'm
saying, Like from back in theday with the Vassoline, you know what

(01:06:32):
I'm saying, Like, it's it'salways shot like or what was her name,
Carrie Lake, that lady that wasrunning a shot like like a campaign
commercial for her and shit. Butit's like, you know, I think
when it comes to and then alsothen when you get to the intersection of
black and all of that, blackporn always was like why are they in
jail? You know what I mean? Same the tropes that they use it

(01:06:56):
in transport. It's like like thetrickery. I had to turn down a
shoot actually because they were like,we want you to be in a scene
where it is like you're married andthen it's a trans a trans person who
comes over, and then like itwas like some somewhere there was like a
trick like tricking my wife. No, we can't do that. And it's

(01:07:21):
like, yo, people literally knowme for being in a relationship, right
and they also now know that Iwork with all different performers. Why I
like, I don't want to bein that. I don't I don't like
those kind of scenes in that sense, because it's like that's what they're literally
trying to tell us about transfer everywhere, which kind of leads into my other

(01:07:43):
question about sports right now. Itis like one of the ways that they're
getting all of these laws passed acrossthe states right now, it's like people
are transitioning to join their little leagueteam. But that's I mean, that's
what that's how they're presenting it first, like first and foremost, it's like

(01:08:09):
this child and and also this goesto the other point of like they don't
talk about trans boys or young transmen at all in these situations because of
that, we're real men, right. But in regards to trans women being
involved in any kind of sports,then it's this whole insane conversation that's going

(01:08:30):
on right now. And I'm veryinterested on your takes to sports. Yeah,
I do fun with sports at all. Um, I don't like fuck
with sports as in like watch themlike you can't pay me to watch too
much of nothing. Um But likegrowing up I did. I grew to
enjoy football after being forced to play. Um But like the first year I

(01:08:54):
was forced to play, and likethat pissed me off. The second year
I wanted to Like I was doingthat whole like parental, I want you
to love me, So I'm gonnabe the boy that you want me to
be this year. And so Iwent to my mom and I was like,
I want to play, you know, and she was all excited and
I was good. It wasn't likeI was bad. I wasn't like I
was a bench rider. Like Iwas good. And my mom came to

(01:09:15):
one game the entire season, andthat broke me. But it also reminded
me that it wasn't about me actuallyplaying, It was about her being able
to say that I play right,versus not being able to say much when
other people ask, especially because Iwas I was visibly. I've always been

(01:09:35):
queer in some sort of way,and so I think that that was the
thing that really like irked me aboutit. But I enjoyed it because it
was a way to get rid ofby aggression and my anger. Like I
wasn't really the kid that wanted tofight everybody or do the things, and
so I would let a lot ofsubslide, but I would be able to
go on the football field and Rickshop and I did, and it was

(01:09:57):
so bad to the point where Igot the nickname of physic. We had
this one game and when I telly'all, like, I don't know where
these boys came from. They werenot our age. I don't care what
nobody says, Like there was noway. It was a group of white
boys and they were all big asshit. And I think we all had
to be like maybe like twelve thirteen, and these boys were huge, and

(01:10:18):
all of us were like the whowas this college? Him? Like we
where did they come from? AndI just remember on my way to the
field, there was an older womanand her husband and like I walked by
and I heard go, like,what I know, he not playing twisting,
Like no little city like that.They definitely not go something to that

(01:10:40):
effect. And baby, why shedid that? She sent that battery.
And I got up there and thiswhite boy went to talking shit and before
I knew it, he was onhis back and I was standing over him
spitting, and I just was like, oh my god, And like,
my coach pulls me out of thegame and he's like, what were you

(01:11:00):
doing. I was like, becausehe mustn't. And they were just like,
you get physical when you get upset, and so they nickname me the
phism. So like, I dohave a good relationship, I guess in
that way to it, but nowadaysI'm just like whatever, I don't really
care. But as it pretends to, like the entire topic of trans people
in sports, they don't talk abouttrans men, but trans men are dominating

(01:11:24):
all the sports that they're in,and let's be very clear about this,
and one of the major ones isboxing, which is the most hands on
physical mma all of that stuff,and transmen are in there kicking the shit
out of sis gender men every othermatch, and nobody's talking about it.
And it's because it's an embarrassment,right because in your mind it's a woman,
and so we don't want to publicizethat because this big assish gender man

(01:11:45):
that's been boxing for the last seventeenyears got taken down by this woman who's
only been boxing for the last twoyears and she's only been on whatever they
take for like six months. Howyou let this woman beat you up?
Dog? That's that headline don't readas well. But the headline that does
read well is six foot seven highschool student beats out all of these young

(01:12:09):
girls after seven years of failing inthe male categories. Like the way that
they it's crazy. But to me, to be perfectly honest with you,
I don't have a say so inthe sports because I'm not playing. Most
of the girls, when you askthem outside of CNN and Fox and all

(01:12:30):
the fake newspeople, most of themgirls don't care, and they get on
social media to tell you that theydon't care. And it's just like,
we read these headlines. But thenwhen I get on social media and you
see the girls from the team actuallycommenting like, mm, this ain't really
what it was. We was madat her because actually she said this thing
in the sands and that's why,you know. And then they took it
and ran with it. Now youhave some parents that will force their children

(01:12:54):
to get up here and propagate like, oh, I'm so sad that I
lost, Oh my god. Butthat's that's it's really not it. But
I think as it pertains to thetopic of whether or not, it's not
up to me. I'm not aCIS girl that has to run against her.
But I feel like what I willsay and what does bother me is
you knew she was trans before y'allstarted running. So why am I not

(01:13:16):
seeing more articles where it says CISrunner refuses to run because of the unfair
conditions of having to compete against aman, Right, I'm not seeing that.
Y'all don't bitch a complaint until yourun in lou lose. And so
that's my whole thing is you gotup there, you accepted the challenge,
and now you're gonna complain and useas an excuse because you lost. No,

(01:13:40):
Cis, go back to the drawingboard and do better. That's where
I stand on that. If you'regoing to accept the challenge, then be
ready. But especially when it comesdown the track, and field. I
think like that one really touches me. And that's the one that always comes
up for whatever reason. But it'slike when we were kids, we would
be out in the field running againsteach other, boys, girls, and
you would live to be a girlthat beat the boys back in the day

(01:14:00):
because it meant something like I don'tknow what it meant, but you know,
we thought that it meant something likeshe smoked y'all. Now it's oh
my god, I don't want torun against this, Like what really?
I think it's it's for me.The part that that fucks me up is
like men's perception that no matter what, a man is more athletically gifted than

(01:14:28):
a woman. No matter what,most of y'all fucking men out there is
gonna get smoked by a woman,whether it's assists woman, a trans woman,
or whatever, you know what I'msaying. Or can't swim or can't
catch or can't shoot a fucking basketball. Like if you put most of them,
if you put Round DeSantis on abasketball court against oh what's what's this

(01:14:53):
name from LSU? That was dominatingbecause he's a man or she's a woman,
but because she's more skilled, ityou know what I'm saying, And
I think we have as a societylike they separate and sports women sports.
I remember there was like this younggirl in Texas that was like trying to

(01:15:15):
play football and people were making thiswhole big stink about it if she could
ball, let her ball and ifand I think that if I can understand
for people if they want to havecertain separations and this, that and the
other. But if somebody good enough, like personally, I would have loved
to have seen um Cheryl Miller inthe NBA. She'd have been fucking dominating,

(01:15:39):
you know what I'm saying. Likethere's there's times and I always tell
you this story, like one timewe used to go ball at this spot
in Jersey and assist from w NBAshowed up and motherfucker's was talking wild shit
like I'm fuck yo. She wasn'teven trying hard just on basketball IQ.
She was fucking people up, makinga right path little. She wasn't even

(01:16:00):
exerting and crazy amount of energy tomake people look stupid, like, dude,
she's a fucking professional, right regardlessyou're not you out here on weekends,
you're not fucking you know what I'msaying, but like, there is
this this thing that men have that'sjust automatically like, dude, you're not
beating up round the Roussie. Shutthe fuck off, right, You're not

(01:16:24):
gonna beat up Leila Alie. Youknow what I'm saying. And I think
that that hierarchy, that there isthis perception that men are supposed to always
physically dominate women fuck shit up onthat level. And then it goes to
what you just said also about youknow, about trans men fucking people up
too, and it's like that shitis fucking up all the things. I

(01:16:49):
want to go. I want togo into that. I want to become
a super fan. I want tolook here. There's like one there was
like one article that really like madethe headline, and after it did,
like the comments were all just like, oh but he went easy on her
and all of it like na,no, like you got your ass beat.
And I think that that's why theystopped focusing on trans men in sports,

(01:17:13):
because they realized that trans men wereexcelling, which did which completely then
and the gainst the other argument.But it's also like they like to pick
and choose which parts of the storythey want to tell, like even with
the swimmer Mia, right, Sowhat's really interesting is that Mia lost every
other race that she swam that daydrastically, not even like oh buy a

(01:17:34):
hair, No, she lost drastically. And there were seven. So mind
you, this woman swam seven othertimes, lost seven other times, and
then this one race, this onerace is the race that they're like,
oh, she went in and dominated. No. Six was like idun lost
all day, I need one andeverybody else was tired, everybody else from

(01:18:00):
women from well, I think that'sI mean, that's kind of like the
same, the same argument that comesdown to things like with the bathroom.
I mean, like at home,my bathroom doesn't have a well, let
me tell you a woman sign onthe bathroom. Let me tell you about

(01:18:21):
well, none of our bathrooms yoursincluded. It's here. But I want
to get away from the topic fora second to talk about you k So
King showers in one bathroom, heshaves in another one, and I believe
he does his business about men dominating. I feel like you do the same

(01:18:44):
thing with all the mean, whenyou have more than the call out for
the call out, it like whenyou got I always had more than one
bathroom now that I got more thanone, I want to use all of
the make sure that they all geta little loved in one bathroom setting.
But no, I think like withwith the with the same thing though with
with bathrooms, like there are thecases they're not making a case. There's

(01:19:12):
it's always like, well, ifpeople go into the bathroom and then they
see somebody who has different parts,what the fuck? Oh my god?
First of all, in any bathroom, why are you when they stall?
But then also if you're talking aboutthe safety of people, oh men,

(01:19:33):
you're not trying to just keep menfrom are you trying to keep men from
raping other men in the bathroom too? Like? What y'all not caring about
people's safety. You're just using thisas something that some people are gonna get
nervous about or gonna cringe about forwhatever fucking reason, and then using that
shit to be really fucking hateful.Yes, I saw this thing. It

(01:19:58):
said I don't care about trans womenin bathroom, I care about men in
my uterus, And I was justlike, yeah, exactly, that is
exactly how I feel. I don'tcare what's happening in the stalls next to
me. I care if it's clean, right, but you're worried about so

(01:20:19):
oh, this is a lot.And I know we covered so much ground,
and I know that you are notthe representative of all all black trans
women across the land, but supersuper appreciate you being here, um and
being here for this reason to actuallytalk about these topics, because oftentimes people

(01:20:41):
get pulled into topics or two discussionsthat they need to pass the mic for
right, or people are inappropriate justbecause like when we're on set or um
in our spaces, just because someoneis there representing any community, it doesn't
mean that they're there to educate usor entertain us or you know. So
I really appreciate us having this carvedout time to have this conversation in this

(01:21:04):
space. But can we talk aboutthe cool things that are happening in our
lives that there will be hopefully nocrazy headlines attached to it, no motherfucker's
comments and all of this other shit. Just like of all the stuff that's
going on, all we want todo is live our happy lives with our
family and friends. And you havea beautiful engagement and that has Like I

(01:21:30):
saw the pre pictures of the prepictures of prepictures. I'm like, God,
damn with the Weddingna, all thewedding is gonna be crazy congratulation,
thank y'all. I'm really I'm excited. He's so he's just dope. He's
really like my best friend and likemy little piece of advil and and the
little angel on the shoulder, likehe's he's all of the things. He's

(01:21:53):
just he means the world to me, and especially for somebody who really had
I didn't. I don't think Ihave ever given up on love, right.
I think I would have settled fora certain type of love that I
did not deserve. But um,he just he made it make sense in
a lot of ways that things didn'tmake sense. And he reminds me.

(01:22:15):
He reminded me of my first lovein the way that, like James was
very peace and love. And Imet James when I was like a freshman
in high school and he was myhigh school sweetheart all four years. And
he taught me so much because Iwas always angry because I felt like I
had to be. It was likeit's always a month saying some shit about
me. I just want to goto class, you know. And he
was just like baby, peace oflove, like your love calm down.

(01:22:39):
But to the antithesis, I wouldadd like, like her, you need
to say something like that, ain'tyou know, don't And I feel like
I get that same feeling. Wasmy partner now I call him my pumpkin
man, and you know, likehe came in and he just he knows
how to level me, and heknows how to level with me, and

(01:23:00):
there's this sense of not being able, like you, I can't even stay
mad. We'll be in the middleof an argument. I can't stay mad
because he's so aloof like that's justnot his thing. Like I'll be yelling
and screaming at the top of mylungs and he'll be like, when you're
done, because I'm not doing whateverthis is. So when you're done,
we can talk. And I'm justlike, don't be all emotionally mature right

(01:23:24):
now, because I want to beimmature and I want to yell and I
want the neighbors to be like,what's going on and he's not here.
He is not here for it.But it reminds me and like what I
noticed is that like those things thatdon't happen is often because now I'm just
like he's not gonna listen if Ido that, So I have to figure
out another way to communicate my feelingsthat don't involve me yelling and screaming.

(01:23:45):
Now I'm still gonna be hope,I'm gonna speak the way I need to
speak, but I also have learnedthat, like conversations can't always just result
in you piss me off, andI don't feel like I'm being listened to.
So now I'm just gonna yell,you know, And that just feels
really good. And it reminds meof that like the reason why I fell
in love with James all those yearsago, because he reminded me like some

(01:24:05):
stuff really ain't it's not deserving ofthat energy, Like sometimes you do have
to go there, but most ofthe time you don't, and you be
exerting all with this energy for whatyou could use that to go do something
better. And after that argument,I'm tired, I'm whatever, I'm all
of these things and Pumpkin Man beyondthe couch, chilling heart, heart race

(01:24:26):
steady. I need at least agood thirty forty five more minutes and a
talk with my girlfriend. You knowwhat I'm saying to be like, Okay,
now I'm good, and I justlove him for it. That sounds
like such a perfect match, especiallyfor somebody who's out here fighting baby and
he gets the worst of it.And I think that that's the thing too
that I appreciate because he sees allof it. Like when I get off

(01:24:47):
Live and I take that deep breathand start crying after I just ministered to
a bunch of people and like it'snot easy, like people think that it's
easy, and like I used tohave to do it by myself, and
so just like doing all of thisshit and then turning the camera off and
it's just you in your room,and then you like you sit with your
thoughts, Like now I sit withmy future husband and we talk through the

(01:25:10):
things and he affirms me or checksme right, Like, actually, I
listened to that baby, and Isee why that person commented that, and
I think that you blew over thatyou might want to go and apologize,
right, And it's the accountability factor, And it's never letting me think that
I'm always right because oftentimes, likewhen you get to the point that I
am in any particular community, butspecifically for me in my community, the

(01:25:30):
girls a lot of them. Itdon't matter whether I'm right or wrong.
They're just like yep, whatever.Hope that and having somebody that reminds you
like, nah, they I heardwhat they said, but I'm telling you
how it felt. And I knowthat there's going to be people that are
not going to say it because theylove you, but I need you to
know like they that didn't that didn'tsit well. And it's just it feels

(01:25:51):
good to have a partner and notsomebody that just wants to be attached to
the brand, like he don't careif he get posted, he don't care
if he goes to the award,like he just wants to support whatever it
is that I have going on,and vice versa. And I think that
the thing that I've learned in thisrelationship too is that my help isn't considered

(01:26:13):
a demasculator, because I mean ina lot of the relationships, especially with
the work that we do, likeI know that y'all have y'all other stuff,
but like this social media stuff,it pays like and if you do
it right, it pays well.And so it's one of those things where
it's just like I've always made moremoney than most of the partners that I
have because I haven't had a lot. So by the time I started like
really getting into the ship I wasdoing, and there would be times where

(01:26:35):
like I would help a partner andthey would like be like, I didn't
ask you for that, Yeah,but you don't have light bill money,
Like what are you gonna be inhere with the lights off? No?
But it just makes me feel likea girlfriend. I don't so I can't
help you. But if I don'thelp you, but I'm over here buying
lu Baton's and Louis Baton like,then then I'm a weak ass? Bits

(01:26:58):
like what kind of partners? AndI love the fact that like when I
see something doesn't hurt his problem forme to say something and for me to
do that thing because I and positionthat he's like and while he takes care
of a man like I ain't sayinglike you just living off me, you
know what, I'm allows me thatspace when and my femininity which means taking

(01:27:26):
care of in a way that youcan't take off, and that means so
good, that's so full. Yeahsounds to me. So we got a
wedding plan or planning a wedding camefrom a wedding. Well before we get
is I've asked a lot of aswe're planning a way well planning her,

(01:27:50):
but we're happy. What is theone if it's one part of it that
you are mostly my dress, that'sit. It's all about the dress already
picked out, the entrance, that'sthose Tony or the first first time?

(01:28:14):
Okay, yeah that you like thinggoes brother, Look that those are my
two It's it's really for me.It's it's the dress and those are my
two things. I have styles.My good girlfriend, she's uh, the
impersonator, one of the number oneperson is in the world. He's made

(01:28:35):
a lot of the I've been wearing. She made the in my engagement photo
I was actually made by a woman. So she's and that was actually her
first look. She was so likeand I was like girls and everything,
but her work to collaborate on engitimately customed. Way about it. Don't

(01:28:58):
let that. Yeah, everybody that'sgonna be appending this wedding, do not
fuck that moment. This dress wascustomized and well thought out and ship look
here. Look now, I'm like, oh god, she's gonna hear this
episode and be like we're gonna saythis episode, Yeah, it's funny because
also, um, the that's gonnabe editing this shout out to to ur

(01:29:24):
Vanilla citizen or he's actually getting marriedcoming up soon. Also, so it's
like it's I guess, but it'slike so many people I'm either that I
know or whatever. So we actuallyjust came from some of our wedding performer
friends and co star um Day,Jake and Dylon just went today wedding that

(01:29:47):
she was late. That was fun. It was um, it was really
interesting to be like industry people thereand family there and so it was a
black gay porn wedding. So butit was it was good. It was
so great. People was trying tohit on you. The groom. Ye

(01:30:08):
yo, yeah, how you gonnaask the groom about the about a guest
talk about I see I see oneof your guests where he got in his
pants. I'm like so and andgood in good sex worker fashion, Dylan
did put out came through like yo, you can buy probably like don't go

(01:30:29):
up to the table. I doneed to buy that. Nick took me.
It was too fun because after wesaid there was a long conversation about
these videos. Nick was like,you know, we got to I was
like what because I saw yours becauseTahoe like did the but like I had
no idea, so I was likewhat. She was like, yeah,
you can have whatever you want.This is so awkward but not really um

(01:30:54):
but yeah, She's like, howyou grabbing whatever you want to? I
was like, oh, say,it's gonna be purchased. I love,
we gotta get the wedding come witha special cockering on it, like a
diamond joint. And Okay, that'sthat's all we trying to do. All
we trying to do is love eachother, have good set creation. That's

(01:31:18):
it, So leave us alone.I thought I thought that was the stamp
right there, that was the one. But let's um and and then this
would be the bonus. Hope,where can people find you? So you
can find me everywhere at Hope jiselle. Literally every handle is my name spelled

(01:31:38):
the way that it sounds. Well, no, that's a lot because people
will be spelling with a J.So it's Hope hpe just so g I
S E L l E. Theonly thing that's different is TikTok is hopejiselle
one. But everything else has literallyhope zell or if you google me,
all of that stuff will come up, as well as some dope resources.
So if you heard some things thatyou're not sure about and you want them

(01:31:59):
explained, it's very likely that they'llbe explained in my website or on my
social channels. And can you tellus the name of your merch when should
we all be wearing? Yeah?So, actually one of my best sellers
is the fem Queen Realness shirt,but the merch is called Functional Misfit,
so it's Functional Misfit dot com andI have like right now, it's just
a bunch of like different teas withinspirational messaging. My favorite T shirt is

(01:32:24):
the insearch or Inspirational Shit Here shirtthat it was a gag my friend who
did the graphic for me, LikeI told him. I was like,
oh, I'm gonna put something there, just like do a filler for me,
and he literally put in search orinspirational shit here, and I was
like, I like that. Ilike that. We're gonna go with that,
and it actually is another really goodseller, and the rest of them
are just like, um, hopefor merch or like really deep quotes or

(01:32:46):
something like that. But I wantedto keep it black. I wanted to
keep it nice and black. Soyou'll notice, like the insearch or inspirational
shit here is actually like my bookcover, but it's like the outline of
my book cover, and so it'sreal AFO centric and all that stuff.
And it was really funny because thiswoman, uh who h'all romain nameless and
boxed me. It was just likeI wouldn't have bought this short if I

(01:33:08):
would have known that it was ayou know, on the front, like
chitchen, bitch, get out ofhere, look here, But you bought
it and I got my look here. I collected my coins this but I'm
really happy with it and I'm gonnado some expansion for the summer. So
I'm really excited, so wonderful.Thank you so much for being here,
y'all for having me. I'm soexcited, y'all. Hey, y'all already

(01:33:30):
know where to find the rest ofour good rap at him Pacts to Give,
And I probably right

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}2023 Ep. 9: Hope Giselle

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.css-r6mb8g{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:1;overflow:hidden;}CrimeLess: Hillbilly Heist

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2023 Ep. 9: Hope Giselle

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