E16 - Our Latest Trip to Parkersburg

In this episode the team discusses the latest trip to Parkerburg. They also reveal audio of going and taking to certain individuals that might have information on Judy's case, then talk about what they think about it and some red flags they noticed.

Episode Transcript

(00:00):
M hey everyone, Welcome back toanother episode of Safe Haven. I am

(00:47):
joined tonight with Jen and Allen,And really this recording is about our trip
to Parkersburg Dot Allen and I madeabout two weeks ago now, So we
came back on this app so becausewe wanted to let you know what happened
when we went to Parkersburg. Soone of the things that we did was

(01:07):
just kind of start at ground zeroand Doug actually picked me up from the
airport. I was so honored andhe picked me up. I don't know
how he feels about it, butI was very happy he offered to pick
me up from the airport. Andthat was just an amazing feeling to have
such a great relationship with the investigativedetective on the case who really values what

(01:30):
we do. To even say wellI'll come pick you. Definitely that says
a lot. Yes, he reallyis. He really is. And so
one funny thing I'll tell you realquick, there's always funny stories when I'm
in Parkersburg. So I was textinghim and I was like, oh,
I'm here, I'm here, andhe's like, well, i'm here,
I'm over here. This you know, this car and I'm looking everywhere and

(01:52):
I'm like, I don't see you. He's like, I see you,
and I'm like, where are you? And he's like right in front of
and I go, oh, whata detective. I am right Like it
was so funny, like I couldnot find him. But anyway, so
he picked me up and on ThursdayI came. I flew in on Thursday
and we got to work right away. We ended up going to some local

(02:15):
stores to get some things that weneeded, and then of course he drove
me by the Petties and I wasable to see mister and Missus Petty and
all the Petty women and hugged themall and it was just so good to
be back. And of course gettingthe hugs and kisses from Mom and you
know, I call him mom andDad, but from you know, from
mister and Missus Petty are so pricelessand so good to see them. And

(02:38):
then we waited Alan, you drovein up from Arkansas and I think we
got there what about five thirties,that right, thirty something like that that
not, no, no, itwas like eight. Oh that's right,
it was yeah. I was thinking, yeah, I was starving, that's
right. It was it was.It was late because we had the GPS

(03:00):
in our car. Took me downthe scenic route and uh, we've drove
along the banks of the beautiful OhioRiver instead of going up the interstate.
And I'm not talking bad about it. I'm not talking about it. I
mean it was really a pretty drive, but it took us forever to get
there. But and your brother camewith Yeah, yeah, my brother,

(03:20):
Yeah, he rode up there withme. He's a he used to work
as a firefighter two but now he'sa he's a full time gun smith and
and uh has a little bit ofsheriff's background too. He worked in the
sheriff's office for a little while beforehe was a firefighter and then but he
just he wanted to ride up withme that way. Then I had to
come through by myself. And that'sa really really good drive. But we've

(03:43):
seen some seen some country instead ofcoming up the interstate. Did you tell
your brother that on a future casethat involves shooting, he's going to be
one of our experts. No,I mean, but he'll he's I think
he needs to be aware. Okay, I'll let him know. Uh.
May we had actually have another jobfor him as well. He's our Yes,

(04:03):
yeah, he may be finding allthis stuff out like right now,
so uh probably so yeah, no, no, we're not gonna We're not
gonna say anything until the podcast comesout and then let him hear it all
and then and then I love it. Yeah, yeah, that's what we'll
do. Yeah. Okay, Wellhe's making me a hat too, right,

(04:23):
Yeah, he's supposed to send mea safe haven hat. He does
that along with his gunsmith. Hebuilds I say gun smith. He's he
builds like custom guns and stuff thatare really high end guns. It's not
just your average run of the millgun smith. He I mean, he
does some of the most awesome workI've ever seen. And I'm not saying
it because he's my brother, buthe he really really does. I bet

(04:46):
he's got great ballistics insight. Hedoes. But anyways, that's a future
he does. Yeah, yes,yes, so he was great. So
I was waiting for Alan to getin. He was supposed to be there
around five thirty, six o'clock.I'm waiting for dinner. And finally at
seven o'clock, seven thirty and Dougleft me. Yeah, I said,
oh, I'm fine, Allen's comingeight thirty because Doug's dad actually had a

(05:10):
birthday, so we said, no, go have dinner with your dad.
You know, I guess that crackand barrel cracker barrel is that what it's
called? Crack cracker? So wesaid, I said, oh, Doug,
I'll be fine. Alan's coming inten o'clock. Alan shows up and
then Doug calls me at nine thirtyand I'm like, no one's here the

(05:33):
fitting I'm died and uh so,anyway, so we went out to eat,
all of us again. Doug joinedus. We went out to eat.
We kind of game plan for thenext day, which had been Friday.
And Friday we were at the prosecutingoffices or the prosecuting office again,
which I just love that office.Those ladies in that office are so friendly.

(05:58):
Everyone is so happy. We're likewe're back, you know, and
they're so great to us. Andwe hung out there all day. We
were conducting interviews, so we actuallyagain sat in interviews with Doug Ellen myself
as brother, and actually interviewed peoplewho have never been interviewed regarding Mitch and

(06:19):
Billy. So if you've listened toour previous episode, you know that Mitch
and Billy are persons of interest thatwe had gotten information on, and that
is why we went back to Parkersburgto re look at everything with a fresh
set of eyes, with these twonew names, which required us to interview
new people. So again Doug hadus be part of the process. We

(06:43):
sat there, we asked questions,we were just part of the whole thing,
and we walked away with some goodinformation, some things that we were
able to clear up, some thingsthat we had questions on. Some things
that we didn't know before regarding Mitchand Billy we learned about. So we
did that on Friday, and thenAlan, we took you to go meet

(07:04):
the Petties. Well was your impressionof that awesome family? It was,
Uh, mister Petty actually, Ithink meet him kind of hit it off
pretty well. He's he's got akind of the same sense of humor I
do. And uh, he remindedme a lot. I told my wife
when I got home. He remindedme a lot of my father in law

(07:24):
and uh, who was a greatguy too, But it's just the way
he acted and stuff. And itwas just and the sisters being there and
get to meet all of them andand and miss Petty and it was just,
uh, you can tell that theyare a really really close family,
and uh, it was it wasneat to see. Mister Petty has the
best hair. I just have tothrow that. I love his hair.

(07:48):
Just's fascinated by his hair and hisblack as. He's hilarious. He's a
character. He is hilarious, Iknow. And anyway, and when when
he when he when he starts talkingabout Judy, you could just tell that
he's he was very sincere. Imean, he kind of got all of
us whenever he started talking about her, and it was just it was something

(08:11):
something to see. Yeah, Andone of the things that is so important
in working cold cases like this thatwe always talk about is actually going to
meet the family and going back tothe scene of the crime and actually putting
yourself in that position, which isreally hard to do emotionally, but it's
what's needed. And so on Saturday, we actually went out to the property

(08:35):
again so that Alan could actually takea look at the property and see how
things looked, you know, asgood as they can. Back in two
thousand and eight, the family continuesto try to keep the property as maintained
as they can, but of coursemister Petty's older, so the kids do
help out. And this is thefirst time that we've ever tried to drive

(08:56):
up the driveway. That's good ifnow I got the pleasure of hiking y
even we drove it, did hockey. We we tried to drive it,
and it was It was a crazyride, I'll tell you that. So
mister Petty gave me the key,which that's a really big deal. So

(09:16):
his family couldn't believe he gave awaythe key, but he gave me the
key, and then I gave itto dog because if anything happens to it,
mister Petty can go after dog,not me. So we actually took
Doug's car up there and got aflat tire on the way up because the
terrain is so bad and the rocks, and it felt like you're on a
ride for a little bit, likedog is steering and everyone's like, oh,

(09:39):
left, go left, right,And all of a sudden we heard
this big like oooh, and we'relike oh, we weren't even halfway up
yet, and the tire wasn't flat, and so Doug's like, oh,
well it's not flat. Well,we made it all the way up and
then realized, oh no, it'sit's pretty flat. Yeah, so that
was a interesting but Ellen, youwant to kind of talk about what you

(10:03):
first, your initial thoughts about thewhole petty property, the driveway, the
seller. You want to take listenersthrough from an arson, you know,
perspective, what things stood on toyou. Yeah, And what's really cool
about it is the family has kindof kept everything pretty much the way it
was fifteen years ago. You know, everything's still kind of land where it
was after they removed her remains.And it was really neat to go to

(10:26):
get down in that cellar and actuallysee it, you know, face to
face instead of looking at it throughpictures and everything. So I got to
you know, get down in thereand look for things that I had curiosities
about. I guess you could saythat I couldn't see through the pictures and
to actually moved to Bria away ofwhere her body was actually laying and try

(10:48):
to look at the concrete and tryto look at you know, things there.
And it was just it was reallyreally neat. And it's a beautiful
property. I mean, he's gotan awesome farm up there, and and
uh, it's just sad that it'sard like it is with the with the
I remember you mentioning about seeing meltedglass. Yeah, can you explain a
significance. Yeah, When I wasgoing through the debris and looking for stuff,

(11:11):
I saw, I found a pile. And I had read and saw
in the reports from way back misterPetty describing to other UH investigators from from
the Wood County Shof's office, Sowhat all was in this in the cellar
and in the in the storage buildingabove the cellar and everything, And and
I remember him talking about a bunchof of mason jars if anybody, you

(11:35):
know, if people are not familiarwith a mason jar, that's what people
used to can foods and stuff inover, you know, over the years.
And but there I was sifting throughthere, and I started finding the
jar tops, and of course,me being a hillbilly myself, and being
from the backwoods myself where we grewup at my grandmad canned and stuff,
and I immediately recognized those jar tops. And I got to looking through,

(11:58):
looking through those miles, and itwas strange to me that all of it
was literally melted together. I gotto pull in those pieces out and looking
and it had gotten so hot inthe bottom of that cell or where those
jars were, that those jars literallyliquefied, and there was pieces of other

(12:18):
things encapsulated inside the glass, youknow, where it's kind of wrapped itself
around those things. And I couldn'tremember off the top of my head what
the temperatures were for that. SoI went back that night after we got
back to the hotel, I wentand kind of pulled some stuff out of
my database on my phone and someother places and looked and for glass to

(12:39):
melt, it's got to reach atemperature around twenty four to twenty six hundred
degrees, and that is I mean, that's super hot. It isn't that
hotter than the temperature they used tocream? Yes, yeah, yeah,
the temperature that they cremated bodies.That's around thirteen fourteen hundred degrees, so
they have to you know, it'saround thirteen fourteen hundred, so it's almost

(13:00):
doubled, you know, to whatwhat it needed to be to cremate that
body. But and the thing aboutit is something you got to remember too,
gen is at that thirteen fourteen hundreddegrees, that's spread out over you
know, a couple of three hoursand they have to kind of they have
to go in and kind of mixthings up a little bit, and you
know, to get it to tofully cremate down to the ashes, like

(13:24):
you know that you receive as afamily from the crematorium in the in the
funeral home. But in Judy's case, she laid there for two or three
days. You know, her bodydid for two or three days in that
temperature. Uh. And they didn'tpull their body out to what was it
Friday Saturday, after it had afterafter the fire had occurred on Wednesday night.

(13:46):
So you know you're talking at onepoint in time, somewhere in that
time frame that it got up totwenty four hundred degrees hot enough to melt
those those jars down to just pulledpull old glass and uh, you know,
and there was other things in theretoo. Mister Petty was he's he
liked to tinker with stuff, andthere was he had motorcycle and Volkswagen parts

(14:11):
in there. And one of thethings that Doug and I got to looking
at there was some it looked likespattered metal down in the bottom. That's
the best way I can explain it. But what it was was was a
engine parts from a Volkswagen and itwas a magnesium alloy. And once that
magnesium gets to burn, and itgets really hot as well, and and

(14:31):
it reacts violently with water when youstart putting water on those fires. And
so, I mean, you know, and I'm not I told them that
day. I didn't. I don'twant to sit back and you know,
point fingers, you know, beingfrom the fire Service myself especially, I
don't want to point fingers at otherfire departments. But you know, I
just feel like if they would havewent ahead and and maybe put some water

(14:52):
on that, you know, backthen we might have got more of her
body recovered. I guess you couldsay, and you know, and and
and again I don't. I don'tlike to sit back and point fingers at
people and say, well, thisis your fault, and that's your fault,
you know, and you did thiswrong. I'm not doing that.
I'm just you know, I wasn'tthere at the time of the fire.
And I do know that their situationswhere fire departments simply can't put water on

(15:16):
something at a certain point in time. And I mean, I've been on
train derailments before where we just hadto let things burn itself out. But
you know, and in their defenseas well, they had no idea that
her body was in there, right, So I was just thinking they didn't,
you know. So one of thethings that I found that is was

(15:37):
so hard, and you know,when we first saw the seller was to
actually be where her body was foundand to look around and say, how
did this happen? You know,who would have done this? And the
you can feel for Judy and herfamily is that's just a horrible way too.
I honestly got that feeling outside theceller because in my opinion, and

(16:02):
all three of us have talked aboutthis several times and at length before,
but I feel like the actual murderitself happened outside the cellar, and then
she was drug down in there.So you know, just to look at
where the house was and know thatthis is where this girl grew up at
and it was her family farm andyou know, and to know that that's

(16:22):
where her life ended at. Itreally kind of it got to me and
thinking, you know, what canI do to find something here? And
hopefully we're fixing to solve this thing. And I know that Allen, you
were kind of upset with yourself orjust frustrated at feeling like you wish you
could do more. Where does thatcome from or what made you feel that

(16:44):
way? Not being there at thevery first to do a thorough investigation on
it. I just wish, Ijust wish I could have got, you
know, got in on the frontend of this instead of coming in fifteen
years later and do it through picturesand going through debris that's been laying there
in the weather for fifteen years.You know, when you see mister Petty
and you see the family and thesisters and miss Petty, and I mean,

(17:07):
I got a daughter, and Ithink that's where a lot of it
come from. Is my relationship betweenme and her. I mean we're tight,
real tight, And I just putmyself in that situation, and you
know, and that's what I've toldpeople, you know, whenever I first
got involved with this with you,guys are like, you know, it's
amazing that you guys are doing it, and I'm like, well, you
know, the way I look atit is I think about, you know,

(17:29):
me and my daughter, is somethinglike that happened to her. I
would hope that there'd be people likeus that would come in and say,
hey, you know I'm here tohelp you. That's That's where I'm at
with it, honestly, Melissa isI mean, we're coming in and you
guys know this as well as anybodyon a cold case. You're coming in
years later, and it's it's thetoughest thing to do is is to solve
a cold case. And I don'tthink people realize that. That's why we've

(17:52):
got We've got We've got all ofus together. You know. I bring
in the fireside of it, andMelissa you bring in the you know,
the psychology part of it and thesociology part of it, and Gen you
bring in your your background and youknow, in an investigation, and it
just and and all the other folksthat are that are working in with us
in this team that are it helps. I guess you could say, yeah,

(18:15):
for sure, if the case waseasy to solve, it wouldn't be
called so right. Old cases arethe hardest of the hardest. And then
when you throw when you throw anarson in with it too, I mean
arson cases. People don't realize this, but it's it is super super easy
to prove something's arson. I meanwe can sit back and look at this
and know for a fact that somebodyset this place on fire. We know

(18:38):
that, you know. And thenthey come back and say, okay,
well who did it? That's wherethe kickers at. And even even on
even on like a fresh fire,it's easy to prove Arson, but it's
super hard to prove who did it. Sure uh. And that's that's where
Arson's at. That's where we're atwith this, and that's why when when
you guys contacting me, I waslike, you bet, I'll be glad
to help. And here we are, we are, here we are.

(19:00):
I know. It's been a journey. So one of the things that a
lot of listeners are looking forward tois this episode where we talk about the
individuals who we went to go talkto regarding Mitch and Billy and to get
their side of the story. Sowe're going to play a clip for you
where we actually play our attempt tospeak with Bob Wright. And Bob Wright

(19:25):
is Mitchell Wright's dad, and hewould be the brother in law to Billy,
Shrek and Gass. And I'm goingto give a little disclaimer that West
Virginia is a one party recording state, so you do not need permission from
two or more people involved. Ina conversation to record that other person.
And also Doug was on site whenyou guys knocked on the door and talked
to this guy and gave us fullpermission to release it on the podcast.

(19:49):
So there's nothing illegal that's going onhere. And I would like to think
maybe if it had been Bob's childthat suffered this, he would have been
a little more cooperative and under standing. But not gonna judge, so we'll
play it. Hi, Hi,just right, Hi, my name is

(20:33):
Doug Starr. All right, let'ssay hidden we're looking to talk to you
about. We're looking into Judith Petty. Um, they're killing with Judith Petty.
Well, let me tell you rightnow before you get anywhere, sir.
I knew Judy when I was sixteenyears old. She was way younger

(20:53):
than me because she was one ofthe younger ones. I knew her two
sisters. I quit school when Ispen team, and I couldn't tell you
no more about her than than aman in the moon. Okay, now,
I'm just being straight up honest withyou. Wouldn't lie to you for
nothing in the world. Yeah,I haven't seen none of them, for
them kids since I quit school.Back in the sixties, and guys,

(21:15):
I don't. I don't mean tobe up right with you or nothing,
but I don't. I don't havea thing to say about anybody out there.
I lived out there, my exlives out there. I got divorced,
got my paperwork lass Thursday, I'mpartying, have good Evin. Is
Kim the one who lives out therenow? Yes? So you and Kim
just divorced, yes, okay?And then about Billy Billy lived out there,

(21:40):
Billy's did, Yes, I understand, but in two thousand and eight,
Hey, guys, you go outthere and talk to them. I
got nothing more to say. Ihaven't eye. Thanks sir. So you've

(22:02):
now listened to Bob's recording, andwhat jumps out at you, Jen,
Well, he seems he was superdefensive, I mean right off the bat.
And again it's like, can younot put yourself in the shoes a
little bit of this family and thisvictim that's have suffered so terribly, and
I mean, he loosely knows them, so why wouldn't you want to help?

(22:25):
And that always just really bothers mebecause the majority of people, and
you guys know this, like inthe cases we work. The majority of
people, I mean majority, youknock on their door and they're like,
what can I do to help you? I mean, and some really go
above and beyond, And then tohave someone give you a thirty second speel
that they've already I guess I'd preparedand have zero interest. That was my

(22:47):
thing, and trying to help.That was my thing with him is it
was almost he had a prepared He'dbeen sitting in there reading his reading script
before we got there. It seemedlike it right. One of the things
that jumped out to me right awaywas, first of all, set the
scene. So Doug's knocks sound likeyou're in big trouble. I mean,
he has like the cop or thedrug enforcement knock, like the and I'm

(23:11):
thinking, oh god, I wouldprobably crap my pants if he knocked on
my door. But you could hearBob back there rumbling about something. So
he shows up, opens the door. He's in shorts, no shirt,
and the whole place smells like marijuana. I don't know if I got high
just standing there in the doorway,but you know, he opens the door
and right out of his mouth,as you could hear, his first words

(23:33):
were, let me tell you rightaway, and that to me when we
break down what he's saying, thefact that he wanted to tell us right
away, he wanted to make surethat this is what I know, and
I'm just gonna tell you what Iwant to tell you. And the other
part of what he said that reallygot to me was the quote when he
said, straight up, I'm gonnabe honest with you, I wouldn't lie

(23:56):
to you. Yeah, Well,if you're gonna say, well, straight
up, you know, I'm goingto tell you this, but I'm not
gonna lie to you, you're lying. Yeah. I was just fixing say
if somebody says I'm telling you thetruth a rut, now, well probably
they're not. And it would havebeen a little more appropriate response like if
Douget said, are you gonna behonest with me? But nothing was asked

(24:18):
of him. He wasn't challenged aboutbeing honest or lying or an He just
like blurted that out and I'm like, okay, so then you probably are
going to lie about something. Andthat's the one of the things that really
got to me is just right offthe bat, like, straight up,
I'm gonna be honest with you.Well, no one thought that you weren't
being honest exactly if you if youlook at it that way. The other
part of what he said that gotto me is that he has nothing to

(24:41):
say. Well, you clearly do, and you know he would not take
any questions. He once he finishedwhat he wanted to say to us,
he was done. He shut thedoor. Yea. And you can see
me trying to ask some questions.And again when I bring up Billy,
it seems to trigger people, andyou'll hear that later in the other conversations.

(25:02):
When I mentioned Billy. You know, everyone tells me he's dead.
I'm well aware he's dead. Youknow that I'm not just fresh, you
know, looking at this case andhaven't done my read. We all know
he's dead. That's not the point. And once he finished what he wanted
to say to us, he wouldn'ttake any questions. I mean, he
was ready sunned the door, havea good day by and that was the

(25:23):
end of it. And you know, looking back, the interaction didn't take
more than two minutes. And tome, Judy's life is more than two
minutes. And the fact that youeven went to school with her, right
if you had nothing to do withthis and you have no information. How
come you just can't stand there andanswer some basic questions exactly? Yeah,

(25:45):
because you know, the rumor millin every town, in every case is
always there. I'm sure he's heardsomething through the years, even if it's
wrong, and he's related to them. This is a circle. It's true.
I mean, it's your son andyour brother in law. And it's
also just super disrespectful to you guys. And you know, dog as law
enforcement, it's like, you payyour taxpayer dollars to fund this law enforcement

(26:08):
agency. Who if you need help, I guarantee you're going to be calling
for help. But do you basicallykick him off your front porch when he's
just trying to solve a murder.He couldn't be bothered. He couldn't be
bothered, you know, as hesaid, he's divorced now from Kim and
he's partying it up. And itwas like why Jim kind of nailed it
a while ago when she said,you know, you would think that this

(26:30):
guy would have a little bit ofsympathy. I remember how you put it.
But you know, think about itif it was your kid. Thing
about it is he lost a child, you know, I mean you have,
that's true, have a little bitof courtesy to I mean, you
know what it's like to lose achild. Help these people out, you
know, don't just slam the doorin somebody's face. Yeah, And it's

(26:51):
interesting you mentioned that because I wasgoing to bring it up with the next
person we talked to, because againthat guy brought up as oh, well,
Mitch's dead and no one tried tohelp us, right, So the
next person we decided to go tryto talk to was Kim Right and Kansas
Right. So for reference, KimWright is Mitch's mom, but also Billy,

(27:11):
Shrek and Gas's sister, and Billyand Kim were pretty close. Billy
lived with Kim at some point.Kim was responsible for Billy's kind of overall
well being right. She would getgroceries for him, she would make sure
bills are paid. She's kind ofoversees like the mother hen of this whole
Right family. So who better thanto talk to than Kim and Kansas.

(27:34):
Kansas Right is Mitch's sister, andthen they would be Billy, Shrek and
niece. So we show up atKansas house, the address that we have.
We had heard that Kim was livingthere after the divorce, but she
might have moved into Billy's house.We're not quite sure, but she was
living with Kansas at some point.And we're going to play that clip for

(27:56):
you right now. Yeah. Him, I'm looking for cam Or Kansas.

(28:27):
Yeah, hold on him. Yeah, aren't you sweet? Hi? Hi?
Hi? Hi? Are you canNo? Oh? Are you Kansas?

(28:51):
Yes? Hi, I'm Melissa.Your dog is adorable. I'm working
on the safe Haven UM. I'mworking on the Safe Haven UM face with
Judith Petty, and so we're lookinginto people who lived out there Deer Walk
Highway. Yeah. So I washoping to speak to your mom or you
about two thousand and eight and ifyou guys remember anything from that period or

(29:12):
if you knew the Petties. Inever lived out there, okay, your
mom. I lived on Progress Rage. I don't know anything about who Judy
Petty. I've never met her.I don't know who she is. Yeah.
All I know is that I sawsigns yep, missing. I know
she's been missing or whatever happened toher for a long time, but I

(29:33):
don't know anything about that. Yeah, she was found in her cellar.
Actually, I don't even know.Yeah, yeah, and so we're talking
to everybody who lived right in thatarea because I know that Billy lived right
there in the property, and heknew the petties. So we're just talking
to I wanted to talk to Kimand see if she recalls anything, if
Billy talked to her about anything sheremembers or he saw her or knows anything.

(29:56):
So I was hoping to talk toyour mom. She's here. She's
definitely not here. Oh, yourmom's not here? No? Oh,
I thought your daughter? Is thatyour daughter said she was, I'm her
mom. I'm my daughter's mom,right right, I am. Oh,
where's your mom at? Is shegoing to be back soon? No?
I don't know where. Okay,does she live out in Billy at Billy's

(30:18):
house? No? Oh, okay, that was soul or rented out.
I'm not really comfortable giving you allthis information when it's irrelevant to your case.
My family doesn't really have anything todo with that, so I'm not
really comfortable giving you all that information. You don't need to know who owns
that house or who bought it orwhere it went. Yeah, my uncle

(30:41):
Bill's dead. You've been dead foryears. I know. I know everybody
actually stopped by and saw your dad. Yeah, so we're done. We
don't have anything else. Thick,I'm good. I think you do,
though, I think you do.So Wow, Ellen, what would take
you were there? Pretty blunt?I mean there's no doubt, no doubt

(31:03):
that that Kim was there. Imean, I think we all kind of
figured that. But you again,there's no sympathy, you know, no
sympathy for the family, no sympathyfor no compassion, nothing, and and
that, Uh, I don't knowit just that kind of stuff just drives
me crazy. You know, whynot help that, you know, you're
both these people are dead that we'reasking about. It's not it's not like

(31:26):
we're you know, going to arrestanybody or anything like that. Let us
know. The way the way Iwork an arson case or anything else is
is if somebody tells me something,what I'm doing is going out and trying
to prove that they're not, thatthey're innocent, or that they didn't do
it. Yeah, you know,I don't. I don't come out there
and say, well, I'm goingstraight into this and I'm I'm I'm finding

(31:48):
something to put these people in prison. That's not it's not what we do.
You know, you look at itas a as as what is what
look for all the accidental causes.I guess you could say. And if
you and if she don't find anyof that, then you've got to start
looking at what did and what WhatI took away from it, honestly,
Melissa, from from her and Bobwas the more you do what they're doing

(32:10):
and push away and say we're notdoing this and we're not helping you and
blah blah blah, I don't knowwhat you're talking about, the more it
makes you look guilty, and themore it makes you look like you know
more than what you're telling. That'swe're not putting words in their mouth.
I mean we're letting them put youknow, we put it off. They
didn't. We didn't even have achance to ask them a question. Well,

(32:31):
we're here to we want to askyou about Billy or ask you about
Mitch. And they started, wedon't know nothing, you know, we
didn't. What I want to knowis what he had for launch that day?
You know, you know, Imean, who knows what we're going
to ask? But they know.So she contradicted herself because she said referring
to Judy, I don't know whoshe is. But then she in the

(32:52):
next sentence is talking about seeing theposters and the reward posters or whatever is
that around town, And I'm like, okay, well you would do.
You may not know her personally,but you do know who she is because
you just said you've seen the informationon the posters, so you definitely know
who she is and what happened.You'd have to or that she was killed.
Sorry, I'm not saying she knowsexactly right, And for her not
to know anything about the case,she had to be living under a rock

(33:15):
for the last fifteen years, correct, especially the last like eight months.
Yeah, right, right, forsure, since we put this pressure on.
But the other thing to notice,you know, to know about this.
And we walk up there and Igo ahead and knock on the door,
and there's a young girl answers thedoor, and again I don't know
who's who, right, The familykind of all looks similar. So I

(33:36):
asked, is Kim or Kansas here? And they said yes, as you
heard. And then it took along time. It took a long time
for someone else to come to thedoor. Someone else came to the door.
I didn't know if it was Camor Kansas, but it wasn't.
It was somebody else. And thenfinally Kansas comes to the door. She
confirms she's Kansas, and she doesn'topen up the door ever. She's talking
through the door, the screen door, and I'm like, I'm like,

(34:00):
can you hear me? And thenI as you heard, I introduced myself.
And the thing that gets me aboutKansas very defensive, very rude,
just right off the bat. Butwhat I found interesting is when she said,
especially when I mentioned about Billy,it's all irrelevant to your case in
my family and we talked about this. How do you know it's irrelevant?

(34:22):
You don't know supposedly right, Youdon't know Judy. You know she's missing,
but you're already determining that this isirrelevant to you and your family.
How do you even know that is? Yah, we'll make that determination,
thank you, right right, Doug, Right, But it's you know,
it's interesting that you're already saying it'sirrelevant, but you don't supposedly know Judy
or anything about it. So yeah, and that goes back to not knowing

(34:45):
what we're going to ask. Billylive next door to the thing we could
have been asking did he ever sayanything to you about knowing or saying anything
that night? Or you know,they don't know what we were going to
ask, you know, when theywere just automatically turning it off, right,
And I did ask that I'm tryingto talk to Kim. I'm not
so interested in Kansas. I wantto talk to Kim, given that Kim
and Billy were super close. Kimand Billy, you know, they lived

(35:08):
out there, So I want toget to Kim, and Kansas is blocking
it. And when I asked ifher mom's there, definitely no, Okay,
I call BS. And then whenI'm like, well when whence she
be back? I don't know orwill she be back soon? No,
like okay, how do you know? Just so rude. And then of

(35:30):
course, right when I start talkingabout Billy and the property and all of
that, we have nothing left tosay, have you know, slams the
door goodbye? And I'm sure Kimwas there because you asked if she was
there, which is a yes noquestion. Like this is where my language
analysis nerdy side comes in. Yep, all she had to say it was
like, no, she's not here, She blurts out she's definitely not here.

(35:52):
And it's like, you're way overselling that lie. There's no reason
to say it. The jan ifyou'll back up whenever Lissa asked the daughter,
the young girl, Kansas here,yeah, just a minute, yes,
So, I mean if it wouldhave been just Kansas here, she
said, well, Kansas is here, but no, right, she didn't

(36:12):
say anything. She said, yeah, yes, And you guys had not
mentioned Mitch or Billy right before,like publicly, No, before you went
to these two people's houses. Now, so it's not like you put that
other podcast episode out where you mentionedtheir names and all this. They're super
defensive about that. No. No, they've never been named as suspects.
No, so why are they beingso defensive to you guys? Right,

(36:36):
we had and that's that was apurpose We did that purposely is because we
didn't want to put this out thereuntil we were have the chance to get
out there and actually talk to themand give them an opportunity to help us
and answer some questions. And Ididn't even mention Mitch's name to Kansas,
and I've mentioned Billy's And again it'sthat snap response like Bob gave the shutdown,

(36:58):
you know, as you can hearin the record, I was very
frustrated, and as we're leaving,and she's like, you know, we
don't know anything, and you canhear me get very aggressive, and I'm
like, no, you I thinkyou do. I think you do.
What are the odds that we showup? You have no idea we're looking
into Judy Petty case so that there'sany correlation. And this is the response

(37:19):
that we get. And as weare walking away, and I wish I
didn't turn off the recorder. Butthe funny thing for the listeners is she
left the adorable dog out there,and we love the dog. The dog
was adorable. She did not likethat Doug was petting the dog. So
during this whole thing, you canhear her in the interview called the dog
over, like right away, Doug'spetting the dog, and it was like

(37:43):
a quick response on hers. Butso she slams the door and leaves a
dog outside, and as we're walkingaway, because I'm angry, I'm like,
you've left your dog out here,And then I turned a dog and
I'm going I'm gonna steal her dog. And he was like in all of
my years of enforcement and detective.I've never had anyone say they're going to
steal their dogs like that is pricelessand laughing so hard, and he's like,

(38:08):
wow, don't piss you off.And because I was so frustrated,
like yeah, you know, howcan you act this way? It was
very frustrating that those two interactions,and I want to say, go ahead,
go ahead, go ahead. Iknow I know that those two probably
don't know you guys's backgrounds or muchabout the team or whatever. But Melissa,

(38:29):
like, you got on an airplane, which you hate flying, but
you've done it four times now sinceI've known you. All for casework out
of your own pocket. You payfor your tickets. You guys pay for
your hotel. Alan and his brotherdrove twelve hours or whatever it is,
paid for their own gas, theirmeals, like everything out of pocket.
I guarantee it cost all of youat least probably a thousand dollars each.
And then that's and I'm not Ican't totally blame Bob in Kansas on this

(38:52):
aspect, but it's like if theywould have just talked with you for a
few minutes and understood the level ofeffort that you guys go to and cost
to try to bring justice to aninnocent woman. I don't know. And
then that, you know, that'sthe response. It's just it's infuriating and
so and anyways, the response indicatesthat they have their own suspicions about Billy.
There's no other way to interpret thatbecause he was never a named suspect.

(39:12):
So now, and that's that's agood point, and that's a real
good point that they again, hewas never named, he never was even
questioned, he never was even broughtup, you know, and now fifteen
sixteen years later, when we startlooking into it, oh no, he
didn't do it. I don't havenothing to say. He's dead, he's
been dead. Leave him dead,you know. So you know, it's

(39:34):
just it's just crazy and it is. And I think you're absolutely right,
John, because I think that's partof my frustration on Saturday, was again,
we do this because we're passionate aboutit, we love it. But
yeah, this all comes out ofour own pocket. And we all have
families, we all have things.And you know, for me, the
flying, which I swear to God, I keep saying I'm never flying again,

(39:58):
and now I have to take twoflights to Parkersburg, which is an
issue for me. But anyway,and that we do all this and to
get this kind of response, itboils my blood. It makes me even
more pissed off. I was soirate. It's that kind of frustration and
I get so mad and then itonly feels me more. And that's the
thing they should know, is Boband Kansas, You've just pissed the wrong

(40:22):
person off. Because I went backto my hotel room, me dog,
Allen. We all talked, weall debriefed, and you know, kind
of like damn right, Well,we went back to Doug's office. I
mean we went back to Doug's officeand talked about it, and we wrote
stuff down on the board and weI mean we we were just sitting there
blowing off steam, trying to getand look at each other like did this
really just happen? I mean,dude, we really just and just a

(40:45):
put a disclaimer out there for thelisteners. We would never steal somebody's dog.
That was just I think we allhave a dog, our dog to
be stolen, and we're trying tosolve crimes, not admit them. So
I've got too and I don't needanother one. So we're good. Yeah,

(41:07):
that too. We should probably George. Anyone has been listening to this
podcast, they know we joke aroundand frustrated and that was something I obviously
said, but you know, Ican't guarantee I wouldn't know, just kidding.
So so after that on Saturday,yes, we all debrief. We
all went back to the prosecuting attorney'soffice. We wrote things down and you

(41:30):
know, that feels me and I'msure the rest of the team to the
point where now you've really pissed meoff and I'm gonna go come harder at
you because the fact that you justwouldn't answer questions and we're so rude,
and we had a meeting and wewill actually talk about this in a second,
but you know, we decided whatdo we do now? Right,

(41:51):
We've given them an opportunity to answerquestions, to speak, and they did
it. So we all decided thatthe next best thing would be to go
talk to the petties and Doug jenAllen, we all got on the phone
and we all talked about is thisthe right thing to do? So we
went ahead and went over to thepetties and we can play a few clips

(42:12):
of that and their reaction, andwe wanted to tell them listen, we
as we've said on here, wecannot say that Billy or Mitch had anything
to do with Judy's murder. Buthere's all the flags, here's all the
things that we have on Billy andwe have on Mitch, and based on
everything that we've gathered so far asthe team in almost a year, we're

(42:34):
looking really hard at Billy. Wewent to their houses, We gave his
family an opportunity to speak, theydidn't, and we just wanted to let
you know where we're at. Andtheir response it brings me to tears.
They were so appreciative that we cameback. First of all, that we're
working on this so hard, thatwe have given up, and they have
so much hope right now and theyknow that we can't say it's either or

(43:00):
Billy, Mitch or someone else,but everything that we've shared on the podcast
and even some more things they nowhave and that empowers them. This family
are fighters. They are they willfight, fight, fight, fight,
and now that they have this,they're they're renewed. You know, they're
going out, they're they're helping asmuch as they can to help us and

(43:21):
missus Petty. I was sitting nextto her when we talked about all of
these things, and she started tocry, and she said, why would
anyone do this to Judy? Shewas so sweet and the nicest person,
and it hurts to know that thisis what happened, or what possibly happened.

(43:42):
And she told me that she criedherself to sleep. She cried and
cried and cried to sleep. Butat least she now has an idea of
what we have so far properly investigated. Right, Alan, do you want
to say what mister petty saidea?Because I'll start ball. I know.
Uh. We were we were allstanding there talking, and I don't know

(44:05):
people, the guys out there listeningto this. I'll appreciate what I'm fixing
to say. But you can tella lot by a person by their handshake.
We were standing there talking and likeI said, me and me and
me and him hit it off prettygood. And he turned to me and
he grabbed my elbow with one handand shook shook the same arm, same
show, shook my hand with hishand and he said, you know,

(44:29):
he said, now I can sleep. He said, I can sleep better
now, And uh, it meanta lot because you know, now they
just said to like, for thelast fifteen years, you know, he
they hadn't been able to sleep becauseyou know, and not sleep well,
you know, put it that way. But it's like I told them,
you know, when we were sittingthere talking, they said, they said,
it really hurts to hear all this, but we needed it, and

(44:52):
and they're right, it hurts tohear that stuff. But now they can
start the healing process that's taking themfifteen years to get there, because now
they've got an idea and they canget through the mad and the sad and
then back to the mad and youknow, until they get to a point
at they're a piece with it andhopefully we can have a definitive answer and

(45:15):
uh they can put it to bedor we can put it to bed,
and they can, uh, youknow, get by with what the best
way they can. And uh,it was. It was pretty powerful,
the whole that whole evening that Melissaand I spent with the Petties there because
all the sisters were there, oneof the one of their husbands was there,

(45:35):
Mister and Miss Petty were there,and they were all outside playing playing
games on you know, on aon a picnic table, and it was
just it was just really neat,you know, to get there and talk
to them. And then and thenI don't think there was a dry around
to you, Melissa, whenever allthat was going on when we were talking
to them, it was just reallysomething. Well and then you guys called
me and I started crying, Butit was emotional. It's emotional for everybody

(45:59):
like you put they've suffered so horribly. And then the amount of effort that
as investigators, you know, youand we put into a case, like
you become very bonded, usually withthe family and certain friends of the victim,
and you start you almost feel likeyou knew the victim at this point.
And it's emotional for you guys too, And that's okay. I mean
I think that's what helps drive yourpassion, you know, to get to

(46:21):
the answer. Absolutely. Yeah.And I can tell you, Jed,
if you were there and mister Pyesaid that we would be a right,
yeah, we would drink a wholebottle of wine together. I was like,
I was crying last time when Iwas there with you guys. With
lasses Petty, She's just so sweetand I'll chime in on one relevant topic
about our team in general. Butjust so listeners understand the families that we

(46:44):
work for or that we do thisfor it they are not privy to a
lot of the information that we collectbehind the scenes. Obviously, they know
the stuff that we publicize like onpodcasts and through articles or whatever, but
a majority of the stuff that wedo behind the scenes in private and secrecy
don't tell the family. So theywere not aware that Billy Emge's names were

(47:04):
brought to you guys know a whileback, and all the work that you
did to find other people that couldmaybe confirm and so this was I just
wanted to explain that process because andwhy they were so yeah, we've been
digging on these two for quite awhile. Yeah, and they had no
idea And so that's so I thinkobviously why it was so emotional for them
because you were you were finally ableto fill them in on some of the

(47:27):
background and stuff, so right,and it was before we get to Sunday.
It was really emotional, I foundyou all know. I struggled with
this for myself to be able totell mister and missus Petty just our theory
what we have so far, becauseas we've talked about, they're older,
and I have a piece within myselfthat if you know, something should happen

(47:50):
and mister and missus petty you know, are no longer here in you know,
a year from now, that atleast we had this moment and at
least they have something to be hopefulfor and to me that and we got
to do it in person, andthat was a really a really big thing
for me. Yeah, that wasthat was one of our biggest concerns is
we don't want to get you know, a week or two out and come

(48:12):
up with some more items that spurnedsome red flags. We didn't want to
get on a tell them this overa zoom meeting. You know. Of
course, it needed to be somethingface to face. And I think that's
why we all ultimately come to thedecision, Yeah, let's go ahead and
tell them this stuff. And Ithink it was an awesome thing for them,
and I think that they well,I know, there's no thinking.
I know they were appreciative because youknow, they looked at us and you

(48:36):
know, one of the husband lookedat me and said, you know,
or looked at us and said,there's no words that we can come up
with to say things. You know, it was there's no words that we
can give you other than thanks andthe listeners, ain't you know people out
there, when you get into thistype of business, that means more to
you than any dollar amount is athank you. I mean it really does.

(48:58):
And I know in the fire service, you know that was always a
great thing, is to have somebodycompany and say thanks for this or thanks
for that, or that's that's whatit's all about. And we're trying to
trying to help them out. Sonow we'll get to the fun part.
So on Sunday, you know,Alan and his brother had to head back.
They had their their scenic route todrive back and wait, wait,

(49:19):
wait wait, we went a differentroute and waited at home faster. Yeah
you did. And so I,of course, as I mentioned, fired
up from Saturday. So I,after we talked and we told the Patties,
were like, okay, well,well now we're gonna put it on
the podcast. We're gonna everybody know. We're gonna put Mitch and Billy's name
out there, and also Kansas andBob Wright recording. So I gave Kansas

(49:42):
another opportunity for her to talk,but really her mom, I really you
know, interested in talking to Kim. So I reached out to Kansas on
Facebook messenger and said, hey,I just want to let you know the
reason we stopped by was to giveyou an opportunity to for you or your
mom to you know, talk aboutJudy Petty because Mitch and Billy's name were
brought up as being responsible for Judy'smurder. And her response was immediate of

(50:09):
you know, they had nothing todo with it. Who told you that
people are wrong? You know,my brother's dead and my uncle's dead.
Oh and her mom is in thisreally bad health and she doesn't need this
kind of stress. And she justkind of went on and on, and
I said, Billy actually told someonethat Mitch killed Judy and we're just after

(50:29):
justice for Judy, and she youknow that's not the truth. We how
dare you do this? What kindof people are you that would talk about
people who are dead they are innocent? You know, it was great because
I was able to say, well, you are so the fact that family
are not willing to talk about Mitchor Billy and just answer basic questions that

(50:51):
you don't even have an idea ofwhat we're going to ask you, Like
Alan said, you're already clamming up. So you're the ones who could defend
Mitch and Billy, but you're choosingto not even talk. I know they
could alibuy them, or maybe theycould alibuy them, you know, and
if she okay, wait, sheI thought she knew nothing about the case,
So how does she know neither oneof them had anything to do with
the murder? Right? Am?I am I misremembering? I don't think

(51:13):
I am? I thought she saidshe didn't know, didn't known anything about
Judy or the case, but yetknows for sure that her two relatives weren't
involved, right, yeah, Andthen she accused me of slandering, Like
what kind of events do you have? Someone is saying Billy said that to
them, they're lying. She wenton and on, and I said,
well that is why I'm reaching outto you, right, I'm giving you
an opportunity to help clear their name, and by cooperating, we can move

(51:39):
on. And I said, listen, you're the only family, you and
your dad who have not cooperated withthis investigation or with us in a year.
Now. What does that say aboutyou and your family? You're the
only one. I mean, yeah, you got Chris Cutt right willing to
take a what was a third orfourth polygraph, and I mean talk to
us for hours, right, Andhe and he even knew he was the

(52:00):
top side suspect he was there.He himself was like, I know,
people suspect me and I and Ihate it. Of anybody, he was
the first one they got looked athard because he was the last wife.
And it's crazy to me that thatKansas all of a sudden took this huge

(52:22):
stance, right, And I'm givingher an opportunity to finally talk. And
then of course she brings out,well, my brother's dad and nobody helped
us. And I said, well, isn't wouldn't that be great if you
could help somebody else? And Isaid, I know what happened to your
brother. I saw his case foulher brother overmost. And she's like,
well, now, since you knowthe case foule, you know he was
a drug addict. And I waslike, yeah, but I'm still asking

(52:43):
you to get on the phone,get your mom on the phone, and
be able to have a conversation.And she she then says, oh,
this is even great. We aredone talking, don't come back to my
house or my mom's or my dad's. This is harassment. Leave us alone.
So a door knock and a Facebookmessenger is harassment. She might want
to look up the legal definition ofthat. So I'll just put that out

(53:07):
there, because that's harassment has toinvolve a threat of physical harm to the
person and obviously have not threatened herin any former fashion. No, it
was ludicrous. And then she says, you know, after that, I
said, that's fine, We'll continueto push forward and we'll put their names
out there. And Higer family hasnot cooperated. And she says, well,

(53:29):
I called the police and they said, you guys are full of shit,
so take your slander in deformation ofcharacter elsewhere. I'd like to know
which police department she called or whoshe talked to. But that's weird because
you know, Doug was at thedoor with you, right, yeah,
and then and then Pat the daright, he gave a quote for the

(53:51):
recent article on your guys's work,So yeah, okay, yeah, yeah,
that was after I think she calledParkersburg PD, who would not know
that they're working with us, becausewe're working with the prosecuting attorney's office where
we're going. You do know chiefdeam put Doug chief team does. Yeah,
they know, they know. Iguarantee they know. Yeah. So
then when she said that, andI said, it was so funny.

(54:13):
I mean, I have to talkabout this because it was this back and
forth. And I said, well, did you not see Doug. He
was the one petting your dog?Oh? Yeah, did you not see
his badge? And I said,let me show you a picture of him
picking me up from the airport.And here's his phone number and you see
his email address there it says WoodCounty, PA. Go ahead. And
then it all turned around. Thenshe says, I have cooperated with you.

(54:37):
I told you I knew nothing.She knows nothing other than her two
relatives were did not do it right, right, that's irressible. That's cooperation,
and it's irrevalent. But she doesn'tknow anything. But she's cooperated.
Its irrelevant to your case. Butwe're looking at your uncle and your nephew
or your brother, yeah right right. And she just wouldn't talk. So

(54:59):
I kept going back to her,like, I want to talk to your
mom. I want to talk toKim. Yeah, Because again I don't
think Kansas may or may not,but her mom, Kim definitely does.
And so I said, will yourmom not get on the phone, and
she kept saying, my mom knowsnothing. She's in bad health. Get
this, she's starting with some dementia. She's medically fragile. The listeners are

(55:20):
going to love this. Kimp wasactually on WTAP talking about how great she
got this new air conditioner. Imentioned that to her after she says that,
because I'm thinking, Okay, Sowhat you're telling me is your mom
is so sick, has so muchstress, has starting to get some dementia.
But she's willing to go on thenews on WTAP a week prior and
talk about air conditioning. But yetshe won't get on the phone with me

(55:45):
to talk about her brother and son'sname being mentioned as possible suspects, persons
of interest and Judy's murder. Doesthat make sense? And you mentioned this
they had the news interview was aweek prior to us being there, right,
yes, wow, yes, butshe's so bad that she can't get

(56:05):
on the phone. And then shesaid, well, I've been asking and
questioning her, and she broke downcrying about how much she misses them,
because they're gone. Okay, Ican understand that, but why would you
not just get on the phone andanswer questions. The petties have answered questions
and they're crying. They don't initiallycry when you bring up Judy. They're
able to talk to you. Soyour son who overdoes and your brother who

(56:28):
killed them killed themselves. You're notable to just get on the phone and
answer questions. You're so emotionally distraughtit could mean emotional events. But yeah,
that's a little preposterous. Yeah,I get it, you're sad.
But at the same point, Imean, you're gonna all of a sudden
breakdown like that for just getting askedsome questions. Yeah, and I know

(56:49):
you guys put out you know,these two short clips of these doorknocks of
these people, which again is totallyillegal, but you haven't. You're not
looking to do that with Kim,Like I know, if she'll talk to
you, guys aren't gonna like recordher or put anything out. You're not
gonna put her voice out there orwhatever. If she'll help you out,
you know, like hey, Chris, we have Chris's whole interview recorded.
I could put the whole thing outon YouTube if I want, we don't.

(57:12):
That's not what we do. Butwhen you force the team's hand and
there's no other choice to get tothe bottom of this, then this is
how it has to go. Wellit again, I mean, they don't
know what we're going to ask.They could come forward with the information that
would completely exonerate both of those twoyes, and if they did, it
might be something that would point usin the right direction. Correct. So

(57:35):
it just it makes absolutely no sensefor them to act like they act.
Like you said earlier, Alan,we don't get a name and then try
to make everything fit that person's name, right, we actually try to clear
them or I'll buy them or provethey were somewhere, you know, because
if we can, like you justsaid, if we can prove that they
weren't involved, that's very very helpfulto the team because now we can cross
them off the list and move on. And it's interesting because you know,

(57:58):
she's making claims, you know atthis point that you know she hopes that
they get answers, but it's notwith her family. You know, it's
unfair to pin this on people whoare unable to defend themselves. And again,
it's that's what you're there for,right, That's what your mom Kim
can do, is get on thephone and answer some damn questions about it
or just them in general. Yeah, right, but you're choosing not to

(58:20):
defend them. We're not saying theydid it or didn't do it. We're
saying, hey, here's this information. We would love to talk to you
to either move them up, movethem down. And the fact that you
won't even consider getting on the phoneis a big red flag for me.
Yeah, how do you want usto interpret that? Yeah? And and
moving moving up and down on thescale thing or the slide. The more
they act like this, the morethe higher up on the scale, these

(58:44):
people go as far as being guiltyin my opinion, I don't know how
you guys feel about it, butit's just it's just showing stuff to me
that they're they're trying to either hidesomething or they just whatever. I mean,
it's it's it gets me mad.But well, it was fun.
And what was so funny about thisis you can imagine I'm getting ready to
go fly away, right and I'min the front yard and again, the

(59:07):
petties had this big birthday and theyhave so much family I mean, I
can't believe all the family they have. And so everyone's in and knocketting ready
for his birthday party. Me andKansas are going back and forth on this
and I'm outside like boxing, likeI'm ready, ready, moving around and
they're like, look at her go, you know, And Doug calls me
and he's like, hey, areyou gonna, you know, get back

(59:27):
to the airport. Okay, doyou need me to come get you?
And I said, Doug, I'mmaking friends before I leave. You might
get a contact from Kansas who thinksthat, you know, we're full of
shit. And you know, goingback to what we were just saying,
if they would have talked, wewould never air this out. If you
really had nothing to do with it, why wouldn't you want to clear it?
Am I rock exactly. That's howmost people respond. Yeah, but

(59:50):
no, my person. I know, my person didn't do this, and
this is why I know that.Obviously what you got no except for the
fact like somebody didn't like shooting deerwas the reason she came. Okay,
I don't know how that relates toJudy's murder, but yeah, so what's
next, Well, so what's nextis we have actually gotten I've gotten some

(01:00:12):
messages from people who listened to thepodcast. We're really with the news article
and the newspaper. Thank you tothe Sentinel again to Jess Mancini, who
again has been amazing and getting thestory of Judy out and following the case.
We have gained more listeners, morepeople on the Facebook, and people
are reaching out to me saying,hey, I have information, and so

(01:00:36):
we are following those leads and talkingto people and it's it's opened updoors and
the dominoes are falling. And soif Kim, if Bob, if any
of the rights are listening to this, you know how to reach us.
We're open to talking. Give usa call. It's just a phone call,
and we would love to talk toyou and clear this up. We're

(01:00:57):
not going to stop. No,that's true. You guys are doing great
things. We are. We are. We're kicking, we're taking names.
You know what's the an alga kickingand taking names. Yes, but we're
also like one of some of themaround here you use is we're here to
kick ass and chew bubble gum,and we're all out of bubble gum.

(01:01:19):
No, what did you say toallan the other day about the rumor mill
Hell and Holler. Hill and HollerFax machine is working hard and steady up
there right now and that and welove it. And I can I can
say that because I'm from Hill andHoller, so I know what's going on.
So if anybody gets mad at mefor saying that, I'm a hill

(01:01:42):
billy from way back, so askedGeorge, he'll tell you, yeah,
yeah, sure, yes, Well, we want to thank everyone for listening
it again, But like we said, we're not done investigating. If anything,
we are full force ahead. Wewill continue to provide up dates as
we learn more, which I anticipatewill be the case. So continue to

(01:02:05):
reach out to us. You canstay anonymous. Again, there is a
reward if you know it brings usto a resolution of who killed Judy.
But again, people are reaching outand they're staying anonymous, and that's absolutely
fine with us. We're not goingto out you. We're just looking for
people to help us. That's it, So all right, anything help people
know that, like we said earlier, we're not stopping and we're coming.

(01:02:30):
If you know something, like Melissasaid, let us know, because you
don't want to go down with thisship, come forward, let us know
what's going on. And again,if you've got information that will exonerate either
one of these two, let ushave it. I mean, please,
let us have it. We don'twant to waste resources looking in the wrong
direction. That we'll leave with that, But it was great getting on with

(01:02:52):
you both again tonight, and I'mexcited to see what this episode brings us.
Yeah, thanks for including me thatquestion, you bet, yeah,
of course. All right, wellyou have a good night. All right,
sirst night Bye. Time to