August 3, 2023 • 43 mins
In this episode the team sits down with the Petty family to talk about the latest news. The team then discusses this news amonst themselves.
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Episode Transcript
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(00:52):
Hey, everyone, welcome back toanother episode of Safe Haven the Unsolved Murder
of Judith Petty, and I'm joiningwith Justin and Jen tonight. Justin was
able to make it on for thisepisode, so we're happy to have them
back a long time No friend,how are you well? I'm doing all
right. I've been pretty busy gettingready to move in like a month,
(01:14):
and got all this other stuff goingon, and oh, you know,
just life, kids, all thatgood stuff. And I'm actually on my
phone, so I apologize about myaudio if it's not up to par this
this this episode, but happy tobe back and in the conversation obviously,
I've been keeping up with everything andknow the ins and outs of what's going
(01:37):
on, and I am extremely happyto with the last two episodes. I
should say they turned out really goodand I think we presented them really well.
And but yeah, other than that, I'm all right. Melissa,
you did a good job without me, Oh, thank you, and you
know it definitely takes a team effort. And Jen, how are you?
(02:00):
I'm doing good. It's ninety degreeshere in Colorado, but I'm not complaining.
Yeah, after this, I'm gonnago sit out in our shop and
watch a sunset and probably drink aglass of wine. So yeah, now
I'm doing good. Thanks for havingme back, and I'm excited to talk
without everybody again. Yeah. Well, I want to first apologize for my
(02:22):
voice as I was at Disney thisweekend and went on the Guardians of the
Galaxy ride, which is just amazingguide. They should have a like a
warning you go on the ride,you're gonna lose your voice. So thank
you ahead of time everyone for yourunderstanding of my voice. But we are
joined tonight with our special and lovelyfamily, the Petty family. So we
(02:45):
have mister or missus Petty on tonightand Hi, Mom and dad, how
are you hello. We're doing fine, good good. It's so great to
see you and to talk to youagain. And so we wanted to get
back on this episode and just kindof talk about our last trip there in
Parkersburg and all the things that hashappened really over the last month and a
(03:09):
half. So we wanted the listenersto be able to hear from you and
hear about all the different things thathave happened and get your thoughts and feelings
on things. And so the firstquestion I want to ask you because I'm
always worried. We're always worried aboutthe both of you. Is how have
you both been feeling since we left? There? Could be better, could
(03:30):
be worse. It's been hard totake in all the utopis, but I
need to find out so I knowwasn't going to be easy. And that's
kind of the first thing I wantto go into. But for you know,
physically, are you both feeling okay? Yeah, we're both doing pretty
(03:53):
good. Good good. I alwaysworry, I always say every time we
come back, mister Petty ends upin the hospital. So it's like I'm
always wor you, like I don'twant to go and I haven't be up
in the hospital, but at thistime, so that's how far he's doing
pretty good this time good. Soone of the things I just want to
get right into the questions here isthat you know, when we were in
(04:16):
town a few weeks back, andyou know, the night that Alan and
I came over and talk to youall, you were sitting outside playing card
games. And I just love thatyour family is so close that way that
you sit outside on the picnic tableand play games and cards and the whole
family was there which is fantastic.Um, can you tell us and tell
(04:39):
the listeners after we shared all theinformation that we had with you all,
how how did you feel about thatinformation that we shared. I'll go with
you first, Missus Petty, howdid what did that? How did that
feel? What? It was?Very shelling. It was hard to take
in h It just can't say Iheard this rumors this situation several good little
(05:08):
while back. Only I heard adifferent way you got it. I heard
that really was gonna confess to thelaw and turn the rest of the men.
And he was murdering because of that, it was shocking. Evidently it
(05:33):
wasn't He wasn't murdered. He killedhimself. Yeah, And that was one
of the things I think we cankind of help. We have seen the
case fall four a Billy, andso based on everything we have, you
know, we're pretty confident in thathe you know, killed himself. But
you know, the question is whatwhat triggered that at that point in his
(05:56):
life that he felt that was hisway out where he needed to do.
And so, you know, whenwe shared the information with you regarding the
same thing we put on the podcast, right the flags of Mitch and Billy
did anything specifically stand out to youor surprise you that you thought, you
know what, that that actually makessense now? Or you know what,
(06:19):
I never even thought of that?Yeah, yes it did. What did
you think? What was it?I didn't. I didn't think it was
all neighborhood people involved, or sheknew who I thought was famous everybody else?
Did I think? I want topick her up? Right? Which
(06:40):
that not true? What mister Petty, what was it when you you heard
you said you heard rumors about Billywas going to confess to the law and
turn everybody in. What was itthat he was going to confess to being
with him when she was killed?Gotcha? Okay, I just want to
clarify that. Okay, being withthem is who's that? I can't remember
(07:01):
who told me? That's okay.It's been a long time. So one
of the things I wanted to getyour thoughts on is, you know,
in our last episode we share ourattempt to speak with Kim and Bob and
you heard that recording. What areyour thoughts on that and how did you
feel when you heard that recording ofthem not wanting to talk? Well,
(07:24):
I felt angry that they wouldn't talkat least that they should talk to you
and let you know. You thinkthey'd want to clear their family member.
How about you, mister petty,what was your thoughts when you heard that
recording? Better? Yeah, aboutthe ones it was? I didn't think
(07:46):
it would be that person. Ididn't know him that well. I noticed
some other ones it was been involvedin a lot of stuff around. Yeah,
yeah, basically stealing. When youheard that, When you heard Bob
and Kim and the messages and they'renot wanting to even just have a conversation,
(08:09):
you felt bitter. Yeah. Yeah, And I expected I expected out
of them. You expected that theywouldn't I expected they wouldn't say anything.
Really, why is that? It'sjust in her thoughts. I didn't think
(08:30):
that you get anything out of them, so Jill Moore and I thought you
get out of any again. Wow, well we didn't get much. So
that's you didn't get much, right, we didn't get much. You know
what. I what really bothers me, And this is what I want to
kind of talk about. So youknow, we have heard Kim does not
(08:50):
want to talk because it's too emotionallyhard for her to talk about Mitchell or
Billy in regards to this investigation,because again we're not talking about their deaths.
We're talking about two thousand and eight. They were both alive and you
know, we all know that Billycommitted suicide and Mitch died of an overdose.
Right. So one of the thingsI struggle with, and this is
(09:11):
what I want to ask you forthe listeners to understand. This is we
have asked you, mister missus Pettyand your family to relive the most like
horrific days of your life when Judywas missing in two thousand and eight,
when you discovered she was murdered,then you discovered that she was set on
(09:33):
fire. You have walked us throughthe day she left, the days of
searching for her, finding your safehaven, family, fire like farm on
fire, you finding out you havethe wrong remains, cremated remains back.
I mean, you talk about traumaand emotional you have lived through all of
(09:54):
this, and you get on ourpodcast and you open up these wounds.
And so when you here the reasonKim doesn't want to talk because it's too
emotionally hard for her, what wouldyou like to say to Kim Jang on
her I would have thought he wouldhave cared enough about my daughter and I
(10:18):
would think you'd want to clear herson or her brother, whoever it was.
It was what you told is wasso over a pick. Somebody would
do that to another person. It'shard to believe, right, And I
(10:39):
think that that's what our listeners needto understand and hear missus, buddy,
And that's why we wanted to talkto you, is because everything that we
have asked you to talk to usabout and walk us through is traumatic.
And the loss of your daughter andyour daughter was murdered. And yet you
sit here today and you walk usthrough and you talk about that. Right.
(11:05):
Is it easy for you to do? No, it is, but
you do it. But I wishshe would talk to you, right,
I would like to him, Pleasetalk to him, let him know what
app But what you know? Imean, seriously, of all the people,
(11:26):
the dozens are probably beyond a hundredpeople that you guys have talked to
by now, Kim should be oneof the few that can actually relate to
what the Petties have gone through.Because am I incorrect in saying that?
Like they still believe Billy was killed. Okay, so you know what it
feels like for a family member tobe murdered even if he wasn't right,
(11:48):
but she believes he was right,and she can't have enough compassion, like
you said, to just have afew minute conversation with Melissa or Justin or
Alan. Yeah. And I thinkyou know. And as a mom,
missus Petty, that is where Ithink it's I want her to hear from
a mom to mom. Right,you have lost your daughter, and your
(12:13):
daughter was murdered and I mean seton fire, and you have stood up
here fifteen sixteen years now and youwill continue to talk about Judy and her
story and what happened for justice.That's right, and we're not going to
go away until it is. That'sright and heard to talk to you,
(12:37):
right, and I and I agree, And I think that's what's so frustrating
is you know, we're not askingabout their their their situation, right.
We want to know did Billy eventalk to him about anything? Maybe he
heard something, maybe he saw something, maybe not saying he had anything to
do with it. But the factthat she won't even talk because it's too
(12:58):
emotion hard for her, you know, I just think is crap. When
you look at your situation in yourfamily and how much you all continue to
relive the most horrific time in yourlife and continue, right mister, mister
Petty, do you have anything tosay to that. I can't want to
(13:20):
talk about it. It's maddening,I know, right, I blame myself
part of this. I did.She was killed. Yeah, and yet
mister Petty, you continue to fightas well and talk about all of your
(13:41):
efforts and all the things you've doneand trying and driving around trying to find
your daughter. And that's not anythingeasy to talk about or relive right,
no part the day. So everyoneneeds to understand and listen to. We
want you to hear from mister andmissus Petty, and you can hear in
(14:03):
their voices and they still show upand they're still The bottom line is the
rights straight up just pulled a stupidexcuse as to not to talk about anything.
And the fact of the matter isif, if, even if they
believe that their family member is killedwhatever, that's understandable. I get that
(14:24):
you would want justice too, butto if you don't have anything to hide,
and you think that you're relative orwhatever the case is, is innocent,
then there's really no reason to justsit and have a conversation, you
know, they him to please pleasehelp, do you where Judy's sake?
(14:46):
Thank you? And I hope shedoes. I hope she does. And
you know, since we left there, you know, Kelly and Wanda and
You're and everyone has really it seemslike been energized, been creating more yard
signs and banners and so how areyou feeling at this point? There's others
probably can say more if they will, hmm, yeah, I definitely feel
(15:11):
you know, there's we definitely feelthat like more than one person knows or
suspects what happened to Judy, rightand so right, you kind of already
said this, missus petty. Butif they're listening, what's your message to
them? Please tell what you know? Yeah, And to be clear,
if anybody in that family does haveknowledge if Billy was involved, that doesn't
(15:35):
reflect on them. I mean,we're all separate human beings, no matter
how we're brought up, right,who our family members are like, If
he's involved, he made that choice. It's not a reflection on anybody else
in his family. No one's goingto be charged if they do have some
information and they didn't come forward likethe Statute of Limitations has passed on that.
But I guarantee if someone does havethis information like there, it's going
(15:58):
to be cathartic for them to tellit to you guys and get it off
their chest, because even if theyobviously weren't directly involved, like they've been
carrying another type of burden around forall these years. So do write by
this family and by Judy and justcome forward with what you know. I
just beg them to please, please, Kim, please up to the team
(16:25):
that we know the truth of whathappened and that that could, you know,
help help us regardless. Right,So, if this family really doesn't
want to talk, they're not feelinglike talking, and you know, this
excuse of being you know, toosick and all of this other kind of
stuff that they are throwing at us, they could definitely just have information that
(16:47):
says we got to move on.And the fact that she's not willing is
the frustrating part. So, youknow, as we were kind of coming
up to the one year mark sincewe took on this case, can you
believe it? No, it's reallygone fast. I know, I'm We're
so blessed to have met you andwork you know, with your family and
(17:08):
try to find out what happened toJudy and bring justice. But how do
you feel overall that the team hasdone. Of course, with Doug Um,
how do you feel the investigation hashas gone so far? I feel
you who have been amazing. We'vedefinitely come a long way, haven't we.
(17:29):
Yes. I don't want anybody that'sand it's to be her, I
want it to but I do wantsomebody it did it to her to have
to pay Yeah, as I should, yep. And that's definitely our our
goal here, right and so right, the reason that we've gotten this far
(17:53):
in a year is because of everyonerelating to you know, having compassion and
knowing Judy's story and hearing from yourwonderful family and seeing you all and the
work that's gone into this. Youknow, it's because of people falling along
and helping us and connecting us tothe right people and people finally coming forward.
(18:17):
And you know, I felt thatit's important for for us to you
know, kind of just do thisepisode and for people to actually hear from
you both as to how this hasimpacted you over the last sixteen years and
kind of where we're at today.So I thank you, you know,
(18:37):
for coming on again and talking aboutthis. And I know it's really hard
to keep talking about it, butit's important that we do it to keep
her case moving forward. Yeah,and I'll just go ahead and add to
that the work that we've done.Aside from what we've done as a team
(18:59):
or whatnot, I gotta give ahuge shout out and a lot of credit
to the people of Parkersburg who arein the Facebook group, who have contributed,
who show up when we're out there, who answered questions, who always
help us out. Huge thank youto them because the work that we might
do is only relevant because of theinformation that they give us because they're in
(19:22):
Parkersburg every single day, you know, and they know these people, they've
lived there for years and years.So I want to give a huge thank
you to them too. Absolutely,mister and missus Patty, thank you so
much again for coming on and sharing. Jenn or Justin. Do you have
any other questions for mister or missusPetty, No, I'm pretty good.
(19:44):
Just want to say that I missyou guys, and I'm sorry I couldn't
make it out there on the lasttrip. Well, what we've missed you
too, don't you know what.Don't tug at my heartstrings, Joan,
Don't tug at my heartstrings because Imissed the hugs, and I missed hanging
out with Marvin after everybody leaves,just hanging out and talking with him.
And yeah, I really do appreciatethat time. And me and Kelly had
(20:07):
a good poem conversation last weekend.And you know, I really really miss
you guys, and I'm sorry thatI couldn't be there. We appreciate everything
you've been doing. Well. I'lltell you what, Marvin, maybe I'll
stop out there during squirrel season.Me and You'll just have to go out
in the woods for a few hours, get some food, run talking about
(20:36):
happy season, mister Patty. Um, so thank you both for coming on
and you know, hopefully we'll beback in Parkersburg soon and you know we're
just going to keep moving forward.But you know, big hugs to both
of you. Is so great tosee you again and also just get a
(20:56):
chance to talk to you. Soum, thank you again and we'll talk
to you soon. Okay, allright, all right, thank you for
so that was mister and missus Petty, you know, getting on here and
being able to talk about how theythinks, you know, how they think
(21:17):
things are growing so far, andtheir message to the community. And I
just want to spend some time intalking with Jen and Justin now about some
of the concerns or questions or ourapproach from the last episode. Majority overwhelming,
got tons of great feedback, lotsof private messages, lots of information,
(21:37):
but we did have some people whohad some concerns about our approach,
and well, the people were justone person. It was one person,
That's what it was. And I'mglad. I'm glad that was addressed before
I got I got I got achance to see it, because my responses
would have been a lot different thanyour guys, because as we all know,
I'm a little less professional than Melissaand Jen. But I just want
(22:00):
to point out the fact when you'reinvestigating an unsolved case, Okay, so
you have your facts that are setin stone, that we know our facts,
and then you have rumors and youhave speculation. Right, So the
way that I go into this,and I know Jen is familiar with the
(22:22):
kind of method that I go with. When you go into this, let's
say you hear you talk to fiftypeople all right, and forty nine of
them tell you one thing, andyou have one person that tells you something
else and then starts attacking you.That right, there is a red flag
one ten percent. It's like,are you going to believe those forty nine
(22:45):
people who told you all the samething? Are you going to believe that
one person who tells you the exactopposite and then gets defensive about it.
It's not even you know, academic, it's just common sense logic at that
point. It's like, you haveto go with what you hear the most
of whether it is rumor speculation,and you have to set that aside.
(23:07):
Obviously we all know that, butthat was a situation that we ran into.
I know, you know, meand Gen we have our little um,
you know, group chat, andwe had all talked about this and
stuff, and I just I couldn'tbelieve it. I could believe when I
was reading. I don't know,I don't know, how do you guys
feel about that. I'm not surprisedby it because it happens in every single
(23:32):
case where someone just wants to lashout and they really have no basis.
And yeah, well the other thingis like, I mean, me and
George say this all the time.We probably put out when a case is
ongoing and we're investigating it, likewe put out maybe like thirty percent of
the information we've been told, andso the public has no idea about what
the other sent percent is that we'velearned behind the scenes. And it's like,
(23:55):
keep that in mind, people.Yeah, and you guys, don't
you know our team would never justthrow out something that's been told to us
as a rumor by like one personand try to state it as fact.
Not at all. Yeah, Imean we listen to rumors because a lot
of times there can be some truthin rumors. But I know that.
I mean, our teams again,our methodology is like you you take the
(24:18):
rumor and then try to either substantiateit or parts of it or whatever,
or refute it or be able tothrow it out, you know. And
so we're not out you're not outjust throwing rumors out there exactly. Like
all information comes into us. Andlike Melissa said on one of the past
episodes that I wasn't on, she'slike, we vet these people pretty hard
(24:41):
before we take it seriously. Andwhen a certain rumor or a certain theory
is like prominent. You have togive it a little bit more credence than
just one random person told you thatexactly. Yeah, and Wes I know
that. Yeah, So I knowthat I kind of took the brunt of
(25:04):
it in the sense of my responseto Kansas and saying yeah, I think
you know more in my kind ofaggressiveness or when I get pissed off.
But here's the thing with that isI, you know, I attempted to
reach Bob and Kim multiple times beforeshowing up on their doorstep. So I
(25:26):
left messages both for Bob and Kimover a month ago. I've facebooked them
Bob doesn't but Kim does. I'vealso reached out to family and friends who
are familiar to Bob and Kim toget ahold of Bob and Cam. So
this wasn't you know, a thingwe did for the podcast ratings or for
(25:47):
dramatic journalism or whatever it's called.Like, I had given them multiple opportunities
just to kind of have a conversation. And that is really why we showed
up that day, is because basedon this particular family and things that we
know. Again, we were withDoug, who is the lead detective on
this case, it didn't make senseto call and try to bring them in,
(26:10):
and we did not feel that wasgoing to work. So it was
let's go knock on their door andsee if that would put them less on
the defense. Because this family,they're not new to law enforcement, they're
not new to having, you know, things go on with the legal system.
So we felt as a team callingthem in so for an interview or
(26:32):
to talk to us, they wouldhang up the phone. Yeah, I
will say this on a side note, Melissa, I am so proud of
you for finally getting mad because andI'm pretty sure I even told you that
in the messages. I was like, I am so proud of you for
finally getting to that point where you'rejust you've just had enough, because I
mean, unfortunately, like I likeI stated before, I obviously am very
(26:57):
invested in what I do and I'vebeen doing in this for a long time
and everything like that. And mypatience is way thinner than Melissa's is.
She is way nicer than I amabout certain things. So I'm happy that
you finally that you finally got mad. But with that being said, people
(27:18):
have to understand, man, Billy'sbeen on or radar since day one,
literally day one, but we couldcorroborate any information that was given to us,
Like we had heard it from maybeone or two people at the beginning
about you know, the fact thathe had a crush on Judy and he
did this and he did that,and everybody in town is like, oh,
(27:41):
he was crazy, but you knowhe was he was still kind of
smart and he was there. Andwhen we got that information that we got
with Melissa's phone call, that wasthe that was a kicker because that person
provided information that we haven't released tothe public. And like, like Jim
said, the public only knows aboutthirty percent, maybe fifty percent of the
(28:06):
information that we have, and wedo that and law enforcement does that to
corroborate information, so like you know, anybody ten years down the road can
go like, oh yeah, I'mthe one who did it, blahah blah
blah, and it's like all publicinformation, and it's like, oh,
yeah, of course you got allthe information. You know. It was
just interesting to see how all thatpanned out because once we got that information
(28:29):
in Melissa and Alan went back toParker's heart, we corroborated a lot of
that and that was a huge,huge, step for us personally, I
think, what do you guys thinkabout that? Well, going back to
something you said, I totally blewthe story about Billy off in the very
beginning. I still remember it.I think I remember so distinctly because I
(28:51):
can still can't pronounce his last nameand I was like, what is this
last name? Anyways? But Ijust remember hearing almost a year ago like,
oh, this guy will wander atnight in the dark, and I'm
like, no way, you know, like even before we went there,
I was like, that's impossible,Like who would do that? And so
I blew it off. But thenwe I mean, we caught the same
information from so many people in thepast year. And then when I learned
(29:17):
and then when I learned his proximityto where the Petty farm is, I'm
like, oh, well, hewould have all the inside knowledge that this
killer needed to commit this crime,you know, and he was so close.
And then learning from multiple people thatit wasn't him wandering around really the
streets, but he would like wanderthrough the trees and the forest right and
(29:38):
stuff like that, I'm like,oh, well, that is making more
sense because he could totally do thatright behind his house. And it connects
to the Petty farm. Yeah,and our first trip to Parkersburg. That's
what we heard when we were hackingon doors, like and we thought,
I'll be honest, I thought peoplewere trying to throw red Harry. I'm
like, they're just trying to throwus off track, blah blah blah.
(30:00):
And once we start to get moreinformation in the last month or two,
it's like, oh, maybe they'renot. Maybe they're you know, they're
they're all pretty genuine when they weretelling us that. It was just it's
weird because I strongly feel that it'sit's tribal knowledge, so to speak.
(30:22):
So like the small community knows,but nobody really says much. You know,
I don't know. That's kind ofwhere I was at with it.
What do you think, Melissa,Well, I don't think anyone really wants
to know what I think. Butlike, you know, I think one
of the things too, I wasjust going back and not to keep harping
(30:45):
on this, but when you listento the recordings, and people thought that
we went, you know, inblazing and put them on the defense,
if you actually listen to the recordingsagain, I'm like, the nicest you
could like, Hi, that likesuper nice, not defensive, petting a
dog, talking to the dog,like there's no aggression coming out of us
(31:08):
at all. There was nothing toshow, like to put them on the
defense the way that we got it. So, you know, I stand
by how I approached it, butI think that people just needed to know
we did attempt to get a holdof them before we showed up, and
again even when showed up, I'mall friendly smiles, laughing. Sure,
it was nothing to say that wewere coming at them by any meat.
(31:33):
So I just want to say that. I'll actually second that, because like
if I showed up at somebody's doorlooking the way I look, just heavily
tattooed and never ever clean shave andshaggy hair, I could see somebody getting
defensive, like, hey bro,why are you petting my dog? And
why are you on my doorstep?But when it's Melissa and Doug showing up,
(31:56):
you know, it's like, howdo you not know who Doug is?
First off? Off? Yeah,that was interesting. Yeah, it's
just like the whole scenario. WhenI listen to the recordings, I'm like,
oh, come on, man,are these people serious? Right now?
That's crazy? But what I dowant to say as we wrap up
is, you know, as Justinsaid earlier, we have gotten a ton
(32:20):
of new members to the Facebook groupand people are continuing to share it.
In Parkersburg, everybody that we havemet, minus you know, this particular
family, has been amazing and gratefuland helpful in connecting us with people helping
us with boots on the ground doingstuff. Since we don't live there,
so I don't for one minute believethat Parkersburg is this you know town that
(32:44):
you know doesn't accept strangers or doesn'ttalk to anybody, or that it's not
been an experience at all. Andwe're also with Doug, who lives in
Parkersburg, and everybody knows Doug.I mean, we were walking the street
back from lunch and we're waiting tocross the road, and these guys in
the truck are like goople to workDrum and you know, actually apologize.
(33:04):
I keep saying his last name wrong. It's not like I haven't talked to
the guy so much. I keepcalling. I keep saying his last name
is Drum and it's not. Ithink it's Storm. Yeah, I know,
so Doug, my apologize. He'snot He's not a guy that gets
easily offended. So no, andto to um continue your point there.
(33:29):
So I got an email last weekend, I Camber, I remember I told
you guys this. Anyways, Igot an email from the Parkersburg Library from
the librarian because George gave that presentationin February when we were in town before
you guys did the fundraiser and themeet and greet and everything, and they
were like, we saw the teamon the news, we saw there's updates
in Judy's case. Are you guysgoing to be back in town anytime soon?
(33:51):
Because we want you to come toanother presentation. You had such a
good turnout, We'll reserve the roomanytime for you. And I'm like,
yeah, this isn't a town thathate strangers. Yeah, so that was
a stupid claim of whoever said thatin the Facebook group Like we're outside no,
sorry to interrupt, Jen, Iagree. It's like when we showed
(34:12):
up to a bar literally nobody knewwho we were and we start having a
couple of beers and everybody is like, oh, where are you guys from
You're not from here, and theyjust would sit down and have beers with
us and we're just talking and itvery welcoming community, so lots of love.
J Parkersburg. I'm from one ofthose small communities and farmland northern Indiana,
(34:37):
so I totally understand all that.And for the people who are saying,
oh, it's a closed down communitythey don't like outsiders, I don't
know. I'm not buying. Ihaven't had that experience. I haven't either,
and we've been there. We've beenthere more than once, you know.
So what was the other accusation?Dramatic journalism? Is that the phrase,
(34:58):
oh I think it would Yeah,and harap don't forget harassment? Okay,
we talked about that one, likethey need to look up the threshold
for her. But delicious, we'renot actually journalists. I mean we should
be now we should just consider ourselvesjournalists. But like, we didn't do
this to make a podcast. Yeah, George is definitely journalist, but we
(35:21):
didn't take this case or any ofour others in order to make a podcast.
The podcast is just a very usefultool and people love investigated podcasts and
so it's really really helpful. That'sI mean, we don't get paid for
the podcast, and justin my god, how many hours is it take to
edit one episode. I edited onefor you and it took me about seven
hours. It depends how it dependson how many ransom Melissa goes on.
(35:46):
I'll be honest, I'm just joking. I'm just I'm giving Melissa a hard
time right now. No, that'swhy. Hey, all I did was
produced the last episode and it tookabout an hour or so. But generally,
when you do a podcast, usuallyif however many hours or how much
(36:07):
time you have of raw audio,you multiply that by at least three,
if not four, and that's usuallyhow long it takes to edit and put
it out and everything like that.And we don't have to do this,
like we do this to get theword out. And I've been doing you
(36:28):
know, podcasting and stuff for years, whether it be cases or whatever,
and it's it's not an easy job. And my other podcast, yeah,
I do get paid, I makemoney, I have sponsors and it's great.
But at the end of the day, we all joined this team,
and same with me and Jen onthe Case Breakers too. We join that
team to make a difference. Andwith Amu, it's like we just want
(36:53):
to help people. We don't wantcredit. We don't want money, we
don't want attention. We just wantto get answers for families who have been
trying for years and years. AndI don't think a lot of people realize
that, Like, we don't needto put ourselves out here like this.
And the best part is I havefriends from England who listen to the podcast
(37:15):
and they're following along too, andthey they don't even know where West Virginia
is, you know what I mean. It's because of the information, the
story, the unsolved case, andthey are very passionate about justice as well,
and that's what it comes down to, Yeah, exactly. So I
(37:36):
just have to laugh, Like whenanyone's like, yeah, yeah, you're
you know, oh, you're justtrying to make a name for yourself through
a podcast or writing a book,I'm like, you, go write a
book and come back in four yearsand tell me how many hours you spent
writing that book and editing it.Go make a podcast and see how easy
it is. Y' also mean aboutI found in two thousand dollars. If
you want to start it up rightwith equipment and one of us money for
(38:01):
that, Yeah, we have togo to our regular jobs to earn the
money exactly. That's the best way. It's like, if I want attention,
I'll just go to work tomorrow.Yeah, I'll get enough attention there.
It's fine. Anyways, I'll getoff the soapbox. No, no,
I'm with you on that. Andit's like, I hate I hate
(38:22):
being that way about it, andI know it sounds kind of descending,
but at the end of the day, you know, lots of us have
We have our own lives, youknow, we have kids, we have
families and all that stuff, andbut it's like it's a good media tool.
It's an outlet and helps get thecase out there. And with when
you're doing a crowdsourced real time investigation, the more outlets that you have for
(38:46):
media, the better. Yeah,that's how it works. Melissa. What
would you like to say from yoursoapbox? Sorry for You'll get more.
I know you will. Oh yeah, I'm sure. I'm sure. Well,
(39:07):
it was so good to touch basewith both of you again tonight and
be able to another episode and kindof I really wanted to address, you
know, some of those things onour process and why we did what we
did and you know how that cameabout. And I think it's important that
people understand that, so definitely.Um. Anyways, all right, well,
(39:28):
I guess we'll talk to you allsoon, yep, I'm sure of
it, probably tonight, all right, all right, keep the information coming,
we'll talk to everyone against Yeah.Thanks everybody out there listening, and
for your support and your help.Yes, and if you're in the group,
keep contributing and keeping in that information. Yeah. All right, great,
so next time, have a goodnight, ye
Hey, everyone, welcome back toanother episode of Safe Haven the Unsolved Murder
of Judith Petty, and I'm joiningwith Justin and Jen tonight. Justin was
able to make it on for thisepisode, so we're happy to have them
back a long time No friend,how are you well? I'm doing all
right. I've been pretty busy gettingready to move in like a month,
(01:14):
and got all this other stuff goingon, and oh, you know,
just life, kids, all thatgood stuff. And I'm actually on my
phone, so I apologize about myaudio if it's not up to par this
this this episode, but happy tobe back and in the conversation obviously,
I've been keeping up with everything andknow the ins and outs of what's going
(01:37):
on, and I am extremely happyto with the last two episodes. I
should say they turned out really goodand I think we presented them really well.
And but yeah, other than that, I'm all right. Melissa,
you did a good job without me, Oh, thank you, and you
know it definitely takes a team effort. And Jen, how are you?
(02:00):
I'm doing good. It's ninety degreeshere in Colorado, but I'm not complaining.
Yeah, after this, I'm gonnago sit out in our shop and
watch a sunset and probably drink aglass of wine. So yeah, now
I'm doing good. Thanks for havingme back, and I'm excited to talk
without everybody again. Yeah. Well, I want to first apologize for my
(02:22):
voice as I was at Disney thisweekend and went on the Guardians of the
Galaxy ride, which is just amazingguide. They should have a like a
warning you go on the ride,you're gonna lose your voice. So thank
you ahead of time everyone for yourunderstanding of my voice. But we are
joined tonight with our special and lovelyfamily, the Petty family. So we
(02:45):
have mister or missus Petty on tonightand Hi, Mom and dad, how
are you hello. We're doing fine, good good. It's so great to
see you and to talk to youagain. And so we wanted to get
back on this episode and just kindof talk about our last trip there in
Parkersburg and all the things that hashappened really over the last month and a
(03:09):
half. So we wanted the listenersto be able to hear from you and
hear about all the different things thathave happened and get your thoughts and feelings
on things. And so the firstquestion I want to ask you because I'm
always worried. We're always worried aboutthe both of you. Is how have
you both been feeling since we left? There? Could be better, could
(03:30):
be worse. It's been hard totake in all the utopis, but I
need to find out so I knowwasn't going to be easy. And that's
kind of the first thing I wantto go into. But for you know,
physically, are you both feeling okay? Yeah, we're both doing pretty
(03:53):
good. Good good. I alwaysworry, I always say every time we
come back, mister Petty ends upin the hospital. So it's like I'm
always wor you, like I don'twant to go and I haven't be up
in the hospital, but at thistime, so that's how far he's doing
pretty good this time good. Soone of the things I just want to
get right into the questions here isthat you know, when we were in
(04:16):
town a few weeks back, andyou know, the night that Alan and
I came over and talk to youall, you were sitting outside playing card
games. And I just love thatyour family is so close that way that
you sit outside on the picnic tableand play games and cards and the whole
family was there which is fantastic.Um, can you tell us and tell
(04:39):
the listeners after we shared all theinformation that we had with you all,
how how did you feel about thatinformation that we shared. I'll go with
you first, Missus Petty, howdid what did that? How did that
feel? What? It was?Very shelling. It was hard to take
in h It just can't say Iheard this rumors this situation several good little
(05:08):
while back. Only I heard adifferent way you got it. I heard
that really was gonna confess to thelaw and turn the rest of the men.
And he was murdering because of that, it was shocking. Evidently it
(05:33):
wasn't He wasn't murdered. He killedhimself. Yeah, And that was one
of the things I think we cankind of help. We have seen the
case fall four a Billy, andso based on everything we have, you
know, we're pretty confident in thathe you know, killed himself. But
you know, the question is whatwhat triggered that at that point in his
(05:56):
life that he felt that was hisway out where he needed to do.
And so, you know, whenwe shared the information with you regarding the
same thing we put on the podcast, right the flags of Mitch and Billy
did anything specifically stand out to youor surprise you that you thought, you
know what, that that actually makessense now? Or you know what,
(06:19):
I never even thought of that?Yeah, yes it did. What did
you think? What was it?I didn't. I didn't think it was
all neighborhood people involved, or sheknew who I thought was famous everybody else?
Did I think? I want topick her up? Right? Which
(06:40):
that not true? What mister Petty, what was it when you you heard
you said you heard rumors about Billywas going to confess to the law and
turn everybody in. What was itthat he was going to confess to being
with him when she was killed?Gotcha? Okay, I just want to
clarify that. Okay, being withthem is who's that? I can't remember
(07:01):
who told me? That's okay.It's been a long time. So one
of the things I wanted to getyour thoughts on is, you know,
in our last episode we share ourattempt to speak with Kim and Bob and
you heard that recording. What areyour thoughts on that and how did you
feel when you heard that recording ofthem not wanting to talk? Well,
(07:24):
I felt angry that they wouldn't talkat least that they should talk to you
and let you know. You thinkthey'd want to clear their family member.
How about you, mister petty,what was your thoughts when you heard that
recording? Better? Yeah, aboutthe ones it was? I didn't think
(07:46):
it would be that person. Ididn't know him that well. I noticed
some other ones it was been involvedin a lot of stuff around. Yeah,
yeah, basically stealing. When youheard that, When you heard Bob
and Kim and the messages and they'renot wanting to even just have a conversation,
(08:09):
you felt bitter. Yeah. Yeah, And I expected I expected out
of them. You expected that theywouldn't I expected they wouldn't say anything.
Really, why is that? It'sjust in her thoughts. I didn't think
(08:30):
that you get anything out of them, so Jill Moore and I thought you
get out of any again. Wow, well we didn't get much. So
that's you didn't get much, right, we didn't get much. You know
what. I what really bothers me, And this is what I want to
kind of talk about. So youknow, we have heard Kim does not
(08:50):
want to talk because it's too emotionallyhard for her to talk about Mitchell or
Billy in regards to this investigation,because again we're not talking about their deaths.
We're talking about two thousand and eight. They were both alive and you
know, we all know that Billycommitted suicide and Mitch died of an overdose.
Right. So one of the thingsI struggle with, and this is
(09:11):
what I want to ask you forthe listeners to understand. This is we
have asked you, mister missus Pettyand your family to relive the most like
horrific days of your life when Judywas missing in two thousand and eight,
when you discovered she was murdered,then you discovered that she was set on
(09:33):
fire. You have walked us throughthe day she left, the days of
searching for her, finding your safehaven, family, fire like farm on
fire, you finding out you havethe wrong remains, cremated remains back.
I mean, you talk about traumaand emotional you have lived through all of
(09:54):
this, and you get on ourpodcast and you open up these wounds.
And so when you here the reasonKim doesn't want to talk because it's too
emotionally hard for her, what wouldyou like to say to Kim Jang on
her I would have thought he wouldhave cared enough about my daughter and I
(10:18):
would think you'd want to clear herson or her brother, whoever it was.
It was what you told is wasso over a pick. Somebody would
do that to another person. It'shard to believe, right, And I
(10:39):
think that that's what our listeners needto understand and hear missus, buddy,
And that's why we wanted to talkto you, is because everything that we
have asked you to talk to usabout and walk us through is traumatic.
And the loss of your daughter andyour daughter was murdered. And yet you
sit here today and you walk usthrough and you talk about that. Right.
(11:05):
Is it easy for you to do? No, it is, but
you do it. But I wishshe would talk to you, right,
I would like to him, Pleasetalk to him, let him know what
app But what you know? Imean, seriously, of all the people,
(11:26):
the dozens are probably beyond a hundredpeople that you guys have talked to
by now, Kim should be oneof the few that can actually relate to
what the Petties have gone through.Because am I incorrect in saying that?
Like they still believe Billy was killed. Okay, so you know what it
feels like for a family member tobe murdered even if he wasn't right,
(11:48):
but she believes he was right,and she can't have enough compassion, like
you said, to just have afew minute conversation with Melissa or Justin or
Alan. Yeah. And I thinkyou know. And as a mom,
missus Petty, that is where Ithink it's I want her to hear from
a mom to mom. Right,you have lost your daughter, and your
(12:13):
daughter was murdered and I mean seton fire, and you have stood up
here fifteen sixteen years now and youwill continue to talk about Judy and her
story and what happened for justice.That's right, and we're not going to
go away until it is. That'sright and heard to talk to you,
(12:37):
right, and I and I agree, And I think that's what's so frustrating
is you know, we're not askingabout their their their situation, right.
We want to know did Billy eventalk to him about anything? Maybe he
heard something, maybe he saw something, maybe not saying he had anything to
do with it. But the factthat she won't even talk because it's too
(12:58):
emotion hard for her, you know, I just think is crap. When
you look at your situation in yourfamily and how much you all continue to
relive the most horrific time in yourlife and continue, right mister, mister
Petty, do you have anything tosay to that. I can't want to
(13:20):
talk about it. It's maddening,I know, right, I blame myself
part of this. I did.She was killed. Yeah, and yet
mister Petty, you continue to fightas well and talk about all of your
(13:41):
efforts and all the things you've doneand trying and driving around trying to find
your daughter. And that's not anythingeasy to talk about or relive right,
no part the day. So everyoneneeds to understand and listen to. We
want you to hear from mister andmissus Petty, and you can hear in
(14:03):
their voices and they still show upand they're still The bottom line is the
rights straight up just pulled a stupidexcuse as to not to talk about anything.
And the fact of the matter isif, if, even if they
believe that their family member is killedwhatever, that's understandable. I get that
(14:24):
you would want justice too, butto if you don't have anything to hide,
and you think that you're relative orwhatever the case is, is innocent,
then there's really no reason to justsit and have a conversation, you
know, they him to please pleasehelp, do you where Judy's sake?
(14:46):
Thank you? And I hope shedoes. I hope she does. And
you know, since we left there, you know, Kelly and Wanda and
You're and everyone has really it seemslike been energized, been creating more yard
signs and banners and so how areyou feeling at this point? There's others
probably can say more if they will, hmm, yeah, I definitely feel
(15:11):
you know, there's we definitely feelthat like more than one person knows or
suspects what happened to Judy, rightand so right, you kind of already
said this, missus petty. Butif they're listening, what's your message to
them? Please tell what you know? Yeah, And to be clear,
if anybody in that family does haveknowledge if Billy was involved, that doesn't
(15:35):
reflect on them. I mean,we're all separate human beings, no matter
how we're brought up, right,who our family members are like, If
he's involved, he made that choice. It's not a reflection on anybody else
in his family. No one's goingto be charged if they do have some
information and they didn't come forward likethe Statute of Limitations has passed on that.
But I guarantee if someone does havethis information like there, it's going
(15:58):
to be cathartic for them to tellit to you guys and get it off
their chest, because even if theyobviously weren't directly involved, like they've been
carrying another type of burden around forall these years. So do write by
this family and by Judy and justcome forward with what you know. I
just beg them to please, please, Kim, please up to the team
(16:25):
that we know the truth of whathappened and that that could, you know,
help help us regardless. Right,So, if this family really doesn't
want to talk, they're not feelinglike talking, and you know, this
excuse of being you know, toosick and all of this other kind of
stuff that they are throwing at us, they could definitely just have information that
(16:47):
says we got to move on.And the fact that she's not willing is
the frustrating part. So, youknow, as we were kind of coming
up to the one year mark sincewe took on this case, can you
believe it? No, it's reallygone fast. I know, I'm We're
so blessed to have met you andwork you know, with your family and
(17:08):
try to find out what happened toJudy and bring justice. But how do
you feel overall that the team hasdone. Of course, with Doug Um,
how do you feel the investigation hashas gone so far? I feel
you who have been amazing. We'vedefinitely come a long way, haven't we.
(17:29):
Yes. I don't want anybody that'sand it's to be her, I
want it to but I do wantsomebody it did it to her to have
to pay Yeah, as I should, yep. And that's definitely our our
goal here, right and so right, the reason that we've gotten this far
(17:53):
in a year is because of everyonerelating to you know, having compassion and
knowing Judy's story and hearing from yourwonderful family and seeing you all and the
work that's gone into this. Youknow, it's because of people falling along
and helping us and connecting us tothe right people and people finally coming forward.
(18:17):
And you know, I felt thatit's important for for us to you
know, kind of just do thisepisode and for people to actually hear from
you both as to how this hasimpacted you over the last sixteen years and
kind of where we're at today.So I thank you, you know,
(18:37):
for coming on again and talking aboutthis. And I know it's really hard
to keep talking about it, butit's important that we do it to keep
her case moving forward. Yeah,and I'll just go ahead and add to
that the work that we've done.Aside from what we've done as a team
(18:59):
or whatnot, I gotta give ahuge shout out and a lot of credit
to the people of Parkersburg who arein the Facebook group, who have contributed,
who show up when we're out there, who answered questions, who always
help us out. Huge thank youto them because the work that we might
do is only relevant because of theinformation that they give us because they're in
(19:22):
Parkersburg every single day, you know, and they know these people, they've
lived there for years and years.So I want to give a huge thank
you to them too. Absolutely,mister and missus Patty, thank you so
much again for coming on and sharing. Jenn or Justin. Do you have
any other questions for mister or missusPetty, No, I'm pretty good.
(19:44):
Just want to say that I missyou guys, and I'm sorry I couldn't
make it out there on the lasttrip. Well, what we've missed you
too, don't you know what.Don't tug at my heartstrings, Joan,
Don't tug at my heartstrings because Imissed the hugs, and I missed hanging
out with Marvin after everybody leaves,just hanging out and talking with him.
And yeah, I really do appreciatethat time. And me and Kelly had
(20:07):
a good poem conversation last weekend.And you know, I really really miss
you guys, and I'm sorry thatI couldn't be there. We appreciate everything
you've been doing. Well. I'lltell you what, Marvin, maybe I'll
stop out there during squirrel season.Me and You'll just have to go out
in the woods for a few hours, get some food, run talking about
(20:36):
happy season, mister Patty. Um, so thank you both for coming on
and you know, hopefully we'll beback in Parkersburg soon and you know we're
just going to keep moving forward.But you know, big hugs to both
of you. Is so great tosee you again and also just get a
(20:56):
chance to talk to you. Soum, thank you again and we'll talk
to you soon. Okay, allright, all right, thank you for
so that was mister and missus Petty, you know, getting on here and
being able to talk about how theythinks, you know, how they think
(21:17):
things are growing so far, andtheir message to the community. And I
just want to spend some time intalking with Jen and Justin now about some
of the concerns or questions or ourapproach from the last episode. Majority overwhelming,
got tons of great feedback, lotsof private messages, lots of information,
(21:37):
but we did have some people whohad some concerns about our approach,
and well, the people were justone person. It was one person,
That's what it was. And I'mglad. I'm glad that was addressed before
I got I got I got achance to see it, because my responses
would have been a lot different thanyour guys, because as we all know,
I'm a little less professional than Melissaand Jen. But I just want
(22:00):
to point out the fact when you'reinvestigating an unsolved case, Okay, so
you have your facts that are setin stone, that we know our facts,
and then you have rumors and youhave speculation. Right, So the
way that I go into this,and I know Jen is familiar with the
(22:22):
kind of method that I go with. When you go into this, let's
say you hear you talk to fiftypeople all right, and forty nine of
them tell you one thing, andyou have one person that tells you something
else and then starts attacking you.That right, there is a red flag
one ten percent. It's like,are you going to believe those forty nine
(22:45):
people who told you all the samething? Are you going to believe that
one person who tells you the exactopposite and then gets defensive about it.
It's not even you know, academic, it's just common sense logic at that
point. It's like, you haveto go with what you hear the most
of whether it is rumor speculation,and you have to set that aside.
(23:07):
Obviously we all know that, butthat was a situation that we ran into.
I know, you know, meand Gen we have our little um,
you know, group chat, andwe had all talked about this and
stuff, and I just I couldn'tbelieve it. I could believe when I
was reading. I don't know,I don't know, how do you guys
feel about that. I'm not surprisedby it because it happens in every single
(23:32):
case where someone just wants to lashout and they really have no basis.
And yeah, well the other thingis like, I mean, me and
George say this all the time.We probably put out when a case is
ongoing and we're investigating it, likewe put out maybe like thirty percent of
the information we've been told, andso the public has no idea about what
the other sent percent is that we'velearned behind the scenes. And it's like,
(23:55):
keep that in mind, people.Yeah, and you guys, don't
you know our team would never justthrow out something that's been told to us
as a rumor by like one personand try to state it as fact.
Not at all. Yeah, Imean we listen to rumors because a lot
of times there can be some truthin rumors. But I know that.
I mean, our teams again,our methodology is like you you take the
(24:18):
rumor and then try to either substantiateit or parts of it or whatever,
or refute it or be able tothrow it out, you know. And
so we're not out you're not outjust throwing rumors out there exactly. Like
all information comes into us. Andlike Melissa said on one of the past
episodes that I wasn't on, she'slike, we vet these people pretty hard
(24:41):
before we take it seriously. Andwhen a certain rumor or a certain theory
is like prominent. You have togive it a little bit more credence than
just one random person told you thatexactly. Yeah, and Wes I know
that. Yeah, So I knowthat I kind of took the brunt of
(25:04):
it in the sense of my responseto Kansas and saying yeah, I think
you know more in my kind ofaggressiveness or when I get pissed off.
But here's the thing with that isI, you know, I attempted to
reach Bob and Kim multiple times beforeshowing up on their doorstep. So I
(25:26):
left messages both for Bob and Kimover a month ago. I've facebooked them
Bob doesn't but Kim does. I'vealso reached out to family and friends who
are familiar to Bob and Kim toget ahold of Bob and Cam. So
this wasn't you know, a thingwe did for the podcast ratings or for
(25:47):
dramatic journalism or whatever it's called.Like, I had given them multiple opportunities
just to kind of have a conversation. And that is really why we showed
up that day, is because basedon this particular family and things that we
know. Again, we were withDoug, who is the lead detective on
this case, it didn't make senseto call and try to bring them in,
(26:10):
and we did not feel that wasgoing to work. So it was
let's go knock on their door andsee if that would put them less on
the defense. Because this family,they're not new to law enforcement, they're
not new to having, you know, things go on with the legal system.
So we felt as a team callingthem in so for an interview or
(26:32):
to talk to us, they wouldhang up the phone. Yeah, I
will say this on a side note, Melissa, I am so proud of
you for finally getting mad because andI'm pretty sure I even told you that
in the messages. I was like, I am so proud of you for
finally getting to that point where you'rejust you've just had enough, because I
mean, unfortunately, like I likeI stated before, I obviously am very
(26:57):
invested in what I do and I'vebeen doing in this for a long time
and everything like that. And mypatience is way thinner than Melissa's is.
She is way nicer than I amabout certain things. So I'm happy that
you finally that you finally got mad. But with that being said, people
(27:18):
have to understand, man, Billy'sbeen on or radar since day one,
literally day one, but we couldcorroborate any information that was given to us,
Like we had heard it from maybeone or two people at the beginning
about you know, the fact thathe had a crush on Judy and he
did this and he did that,and everybody in town is like, oh,
(27:41):
he was crazy, but you knowhe was he was still kind of
smart and he was there. Andwhen we got that information that we got
with Melissa's phone call, that wasthe that was a kicker because that person
provided information that we haven't released tothe public. And like, like Jim
said, the public only knows aboutthirty percent, maybe fifty percent of the
(28:06):
information that we have, and wedo that and law enforcement does that to
corroborate information, so like you know, anybody ten years down the road can
go like, oh yeah, I'mthe one who did it, blahah blah
blah, and it's like all publicinformation, and it's like, oh,
yeah, of course you got allthe information. You know. It was
just interesting to see how all thatpanned out because once we got that information
(28:29):
in Melissa and Alan went back toParker's heart, we corroborated a lot of
that and that was a huge,huge, step for us personally, I
think, what do you guys thinkabout that? Well, going back to
something you said, I totally blewthe story about Billy off in the very
beginning. I still remember it.I think I remember so distinctly because I
(28:51):
can still can't pronounce his last nameand I was like, what is this
last name? Anyways? But Ijust remember hearing almost a year ago like,
oh, this guy will wander atnight in the dark, and I'm
like, no way, you know, like even before we went there,
I was like, that's impossible,Like who would do that? And so
I blew it off. But thenwe I mean, we caught the same
information from so many people in thepast year. And then when I learned
(29:17):
and then when I learned his proximityto where the Petty farm is, I'm
like, oh, well, hewould have all the inside knowledge that this
killer needed to commit this crime,you know, and he was so close.
And then learning from multiple people thatit wasn't him wandering around really the
streets, but he would like wanderthrough the trees and the forest right and
(29:38):
stuff like that, I'm like,oh, well, that is making more
sense because he could totally do thatright behind his house. And it connects
to the Petty farm. Yeah,and our first trip to Parkersburg. That's
what we heard when we were hackingon doors, like and we thought,
I'll be honest, I thought peoplewere trying to throw red Harry. I'm
like, they're just trying to throwus off track, blah blah blah.
(30:00):
And once we start to get moreinformation in the last month or two,
it's like, oh, maybe they'renot. Maybe they're you know, they're
they're all pretty genuine when they weretelling us that. It was just it's
weird because I strongly feel that it'sit's tribal knowledge, so to speak.
(30:22):
So like the small community knows,but nobody really says much. You know,
I don't know. That's kind ofwhere I was at with it.
What do you think, Melissa,Well, I don't think anyone really wants
to know what I think. Butlike, you know, I think one
of the things too, I wasjust going back and not to keep harping
(30:45):
on this, but when you listento the recordings, and people thought that
we went, you know, inblazing and put them on the defense,
if you actually listen to the recordingsagain, I'm like, the nicest you
could like, Hi, that likesuper nice, not defensive, petting a
dog, talking to the dog,like there's no aggression coming out of us
(31:08):
at all. There was nothing toshow, like to put them on the
defense the way that we got it. So, you know, I stand
by how I approached it, butI think that people just needed to know
we did attempt to get a holdof them before we showed up, and
again even when showed up, I'mall friendly smiles, laughing. Sure,
it was nothing to say that wewere coming at them by any meat.
(31:33):
So I just want to say that. I'll actually second that, because like
if I showed up at somebody's doorlooking the way I look, just heavily
tattooed and never ever clean shave andshaggy hair, I could see somebody getting
defensive, like, hey bro,why are you petting my dog? And
why are you on my doorstep?But when it's Melissa and Doug showing up,
(31:56):
you know, it's like, howdo you not know who Doug is?
First off? Off? Yeah,that was interesting. Yeah, it's
just like the whole scenario. WhenI listen to the recordings, I'm like,
oh, come on, man,are these people serious? Right now?
That's crazy? But what I dowant to say as we wrap up
is, you know, as Justinsaid earlier, we have gotten a ton
(32:20):
of new members to the Facebook groupand people are continuing to share it.
In Parkersburg, everybody that we havemet, minus you know, this particular
family, has been amazing and gratefuland helpful in connecting us with people helping
us with boots on the ground doingstuff. Since we don't live there,
so I don't for one minute believethat Parkersburg is this you know town that
(32:44):
you know doesn't accept strangers or doesn'ttalk to anybody, or that it's not
been an experience at all. Andwe're also with Doug, who lives in
Parkersburg, and everybody knows Doug.I mean, we were walking the street
back from lunch and we're waiting tocross the road, and these guys in
the truck are like goople to workDrum and you know, actually apologize.
(33:04):
I keep saying his last name wrong. It's not like I haven't talked to
the guy so much. I keepcalling. I keep saying his last name
is Drum and it's not. Ithink it's Storm. Yeah, I know,
so Doug, my apologize. He'snot He's not a guy that gets
easily offended. So no, andto to um continue your point there.
(33:29):
So I got an email last weekend, I Camber, I remember I told
you guys this. Anyways, Igot an email from the Parkersburg Library from
the librarian because George gave that presentationin February when we were in town before
you guys did the fundraiser and themeet and greet and everything, and they
were like, we saw the teamon the news, we saw there's updates
in Judy's case. Are you guysgoing to be back in town anytime soon?
(33:51):
Because we want you to come toanother presentation. You had such a
good turnout, We'll reserve the roomanytime for you. And I'm like,
yeah, this isn't a town thathate strangers. Yeah, so that was
a stupid claim of whoever said thatin the Facebook group Like we're outside no,
sorry to interrupt, Jen, Iagree. It's like when we showed
(34:12):
up to a bar literally nobody knewwho we were and we start having a
couple of beers and everybody is like, oh, where are you guys from
You're not from here, and theyjust would sit down and have beers with
us and we're just talking and itvery welcoming community, so lots of love.
J Parkersburg. I'm from one ofthose small communities and farmland northern Indiana,
(34:37):
so I totally understand all that.And for the people who are saying,
oh, it's a closed down communitythey don't like outsiders, I don't
know. I'm not buying. Ihaven't had that experience. I haven't either,
and we've been there. We've beenthere more than once, you know.
So what was the other accusation?Dramatic journalism? Is that the phrase,
(34:58):
oh I think it would Yeah,and harap don't forget harassment? Okay,
we talked about that one, likethey need to look up the threshold
for her. But delicious, we'renot actually journalists. I mean we should
be now we should just consider ourselvesjournalists. But like, we didn't do
this to make a podcast. Yeah, George is definitely journalist, but we
(35:21):
didn't take this case or any ofour others in order to make a podcast.
The podcast is just a very usefultool and people love investigated podcasts and
so it's really really helpful. That'sI mean, we don't get paid for
the podcast, and justin my god, how many hours is it take to
edit one episode. I edited onefor you and it took me about seven
hours. It depends how it dependson how many ransom Melissa goes on.
(35:46):
I'll be honest, I'm just joking. I'm just I'm giving Melissa a hard
time right now. No, that'swhy. Hey, all I did was
produced the last episode and it tookabout an hour or so. But generally,
when you do a podcast, usuallyif however many hours or how much
(36:07):
time you have of raw audio,you multiply that by at least three,
if not four, and that's usuallyhow long it takes to edit and put
it out and everything like that.And we don't have to do this,
like we do this to get theword out. And I've been doing you
(36:28):
know, podcasting and stuff for years, whether it be cases or whatever,
and it's it's not an easy job. And my other podcast, yeah,
I do get paid, I makemoney, I have sponsors and it's great.
But at the end of the day, we all joined this team,
and same with me and Jen onthe Case Breakers too. We join that
team to make a difference. Andwith Amu, it's like we just want
(36:53):
to help people. We don't wantcredit. We don't want money, we
don't want attention. We just wantto get answers for families who have been
trying for years and years. AndI don't think a lot of people realize
that, Like, we don't needto put ourselves out here like this.
And the best part is I havefriends from England who listen to the podcast
(37:15):
and they're following along too, andthey they don't even know where West Virginia
is, you know what I mean. It's because of the information, the
story, the unsolved case, andthey are very passionate about justice as well,
and that's what it comes down to, Yeah, exactly. So I
(37:36):
just have to laugh, Like whenanyone's like, yeah, yeah, you're
you know, oh, you're justtrying to make a name for yourself through
a podcast or writing a book,I'm like, you, go write a
book and come back in four yearsand tell me how many hours you spent
writing that book and editing it.Go make a podcast and see how easy
it is. Y' also mean aboutI found in two thousand dollars. If
you want to start it up rightwith equipment and one of us money for
(38:01):
that, Yeah, we have togo to our regular jobs to earn the
money exactly. That's the best way. It's like, if I want attention,
I'll just go to work tomorrow.Yeah, I'll get enough attention there.
It's fine. Anyways, I'll getoff the soapbox. No, no,
I'm with you on that. Andit's like, I hate I hate
(38:22):
being that way about it, andI know it sounds kind of descending,
but at the end of the day, you know, lots of us have
We have our own lives, youknow, we have kids, we have
families and all that stuff, andbut it's like it's a good media tool.
It's an outlet and helps get thecase out there. And with when
you're doing a crowdsourced real time investigation, the more outlets that you have for
(38:46):
media, the better. Yeah,that's how it works. Melissa. What
would you like to say from yoursoapbox? Sorry for You'll get more.
I know you will. Oh yeah, I'm sure. I'm sure. Well,
(39:07):
it was so good to touch basewith both of you again tonight and
be able to another episode and kindof I really wanted to address, you
know, some of those things onour process and why we did what we
did and you know how that cameabout. And I think it's important that
people understand that, so definitely.Um. Anyways, all right, well,
(39:28):
I guess we'll talk to you allsoon, yep, I'm sure of
it, probably tonight, all right, all right, keep the information coming,
we'll talk to everyone against Yeah.Thanks everybody out there listening, and
for your support and your help.Yes, and if you're in the group,
keep contributing and keeping in that information. Yeah. All right, great,
so next time, have a goodnight, ye
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