October 20, 2023 • 43 mins
In this episode; Justin and Melissa discuss the call that the team has had for six months. After this, it'll help you understand why the team went the route they did when it comes to people of interest.
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Episode Transcript
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(00:00):
Here on the safe Haven Podcast.Any names mentioned should not be considered as
suspects unless officially stated as such bylaw enforcement. Any opinions during interviews on
this podcast are the opinions of theinterviewee and don't reflect the opinions of the
safe Haven Podcast or the AMU ColdCase Team. Everyone is innocent until proven
(00:20):
guilty in a court of law.Welcome everybody to this episode of safe Haven,
(00:42):
the Unsolved Murder of Judath Petty.It is good to be back again.
It has been a minute since I'vebeen on an episode or an interview,
And yeah, I appreciate everybody nothating me for being absent, but
obviously I am joined by my deemedco host, Melissa, my partner in
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crime over here. And yeah,it's been a wild month or so.
Yeah, a lot of stuff goingon, a lot of stuff going on.
Yeah, this particular episode, though, is an interesting one because we
have been getting a lot of grief, accused of a lot of things,
including harassment, this, that andthe other, which I'm super glad that
(01:26):
some people don't understand the definition ofharassment because that's not what this is.
But I don't know. We talkedand it's we got this phone call in
what May or June, like superearly in the summer. I think,
yes, it was over the summer. I believe we got this phone call
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and it was a very exciting time. Well actually I made the phone call
and then we got the and thenwe followed back up with another phone call.
But I just want to say hieveryone, welcome back before we get
into it. And so Us andI we are here together, super excited.
We saw each other at crime Con. We know that all of you
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saw our pictures. We got newyou know crime you know wine in the
line fans here, and so we'reso excited that we got to meet you
at crime Con, that you've joinedour Facebook and follow our podcast. So
welcome. That was you. Thatwas your first year a crime Con.
It was yes, and I absolutelyloved it. I will be at Nashville
(02:28):
meet and country music in Nashville andcrime Con. It's a horrible mix,
but it'll be so much fun.I will be stalking Tim McGrath. Anybody
wants to come with me. Myrestraining order should be over by then and
then I could go stalk Tim McGrath. So it'll be a really good time.
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This episode is definitely. I don'twant to say a groundbreaking one,
but it's I think you guys willunderstand why we went the direction we went
when we did because we were holdingonto this audio for a long time and
we were were we vetted the person, we vetted a couple different people.
We went back and asked about thebackgrounds of the individuals mentioned in this phone
(03:15):
call. I think after listening tothis, I think you guys will have
a lot better understanding of why wewent the direction we did, Melissa,
what do you think? Absolutely,And from our last episode with Jennifer,
which we got a ton of feedbackon and really a lot of people really
enjoyed that episode with Jennifer, Soshout out to Jennifer for coming on and
(03:37):
doing that and going to visit Cam. That took a lot of courage,
and she continues to fight for usand for Judy, and so we wanted
to follow up and kind of pivota little bit in this episode, and
we thought that now is the perfecttime we have, you know, gong
through all of a few episodes reallyfocusing on Billy, and as we've mentioned
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before, for good reason, rightgiven Billy's history, given the flags,
the circumstantial evidence if you want to, that make him the more likely person
that was involved in Judy's murder.But now we wanted to pivot a bit
and focus on Mitchell, and theway that Mitchell comes into this is Billy
himself mentions what happened to Judy andmentions Mitchell was the one who killed her.
(04:25):
So you will hear in this recordingBilly's own words, of course,
coming from a second person. Right, we know it's here, say,
but I will tell the listeners thatthis is a trusted person in Billy's life.
So this was somebody that Billy trustedthat I don't believe. There's too
many details, and some of thedetails we're not going to share that makes
(04:49):
this credible. Right, you don'tjust call up somebody and say hey,
when you have no stake in thegame, Right, You're not going to
call somebody out and say, hey, Mitchell killed Judy and for shits and
giggles, Right, So there definitelyis something behind what Billy said, And
I will put this out there.The person that we're talking about is not
(05:12):
is not Billy's ex girlfriend. SoI know that there was some comments from
the right family. Kim Kansas,whoever may try to discredit this information thinking
that it came from Billy's ex girlfriend. It did not. So I wanted
to just make that clear so thatit can be like, oh, well,
she's just saying that it was nother. The thing about the Right
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family that cracks me up right now. And I'm not saying, obviously,
any of them are guilty. I'mnot saying any of them are innocent,
but as an observer, they goto extreme links to discredit any single,
tiny little thing, and they makea lot of assumptions. For a person
(05:56):
who investigates this stuff on the outsidelooking in, it's not a good look,
you know, It's it's not agood look at all. Right,
you guys will see why we heldon to this audio. Obviously, I
have taken measures to make sure thisperson stays anonymous. Their voice will be
(06:20):
changed because of the safety of thisperson. They are very concerned about their
safety because of what they were told. And like Melissa had mentioned earlier,
the reason we took this so seriouslyoff the bat is because of the information,
and we won't share all of it. We have given everything to the
(06:42):
prosecutor's office, obviously, but forthe listeners. There are some things that
we will hold back in this episodebecause some of the details that were given
are not publicly known, and itis very revealing and it'll knock you back
a little bit. And looking backafter Jennifer's interview and after our dealings with
(07:10):
some of the Right family or arenot dealings with them because they won't talk
to us, there's a few thingsthat are said in these phone calls where
this person told us six months agoexactly how it was going to turn out,
and that's how it turned out.Yes, Melissa, do you do
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you want to get us going onwhat we got going on here? Yeah,
So we're going to go ahead andstart. We're going to play clips
of the recording, and then Justinand I are going to talk about those
clips just to give you some moreinsight or maybe more discussion about what was
going on during that call or alittle bit more information, and then we'll
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continue on with the recording. So, like Justin said, we're going to
protect the identity of this person.I'm very excited to share this with everybody
so you can see and understand whywe've gone the way that we've gone.
And again, when you're listening tothis person. This is what Billy himself
had told somebody. Okay, goahead, justin, let's hear it.
(08:15):
Sure he said that to him,but he said, either who killed her
for at the on top of theheel with the He said that they went
up there with the one attractor andwhen they killed her, the John and
and uh Lon Wright came up thereand burned her in the corner. He
called us the corn crew. Butshe's actually burned underground, so nobody see
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it because it was at night.Let's see. Uh I don't know.
Bob Wright was also involved with thewhole situation up there. Let's see.
Also, he said if they weresawing meth and taming at the Austin Health
through the contest stand and they weretrying to be trying to to stop it,
(09:00):
and that's how he was in dangera lot with his life, and
that's how he lost his life.Now, as far as she goes,
he said, told me that shewent to a bar out by Reaches and
they picked her up, and thenthey went and prepared the problem. Obviously
she knew something. He didn't saywhat she knew that she obviously knew or
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found out something about what was goingon and with the methane better meat than
everything going on out in that area, and she found out something and they
killed her because of that. Andthe Wright brothers are the ones that covered
it all, but Mitchell and JohnnyWright most of the ones that actually did
(09:45):
actually killed her. When you heardthis on the phone call, what was
your initial reaction? Shock and reallyjust almost tearful if you will. It
sounds weird, but since we startedthis investigation in for fifteen years, right
(10:07):
that no one has ever said anybodyhas killed Judy. We've never heard for
sure, so and so killed Judy, right, And so to hear that
Billy said who killed her? Howthey killed her in the sense of,
you know, throwing her in thechicken coop, which he clarifies for everybody,
(10:28):
right, that's that's the cellar,the corn crib, thank you.
Yeah. So, so this personwas saying how she was you know,
who killed her, and then alsogoing into how she was burned right into
the what do you call it?Justin the corn crib. The person does
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go in then and explain that that'swhat Billy called the seller, and it
talks about it being underground. SoI was really in shock and very tearful,
and I reached out to all ofyou like, oh my god,
this because I was aspecting this.I was just making phone calls like I
do, right, I'm just callingpeople hey, hey, hey, and
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then to get this phone call andthis person just flat outs us. Well
Billy told me Mitchell Kilder and Boband line through in the you know corn
crib or the Stellar. I waslike, We've never heard that at all.
Yeah, so that I couldn't believeit. I couldn't believe it when
(11:30):
I heard the recording because I rememberyou messaging us in our group chat in
real time as you're talking to thisperson. Yes, it was so funny
because me and jenneral like, calmdown, keep going, quit messaging us,
like, stop messaging us, concentrateon this looking back. That was
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one of the few amusing parts aboutthis phone call, because you lost your
mind. And then when the restof us heard it, we lost our
because we were like, oh mygod. This in the information, like
I said that this person provided,there's information that's not publicly known, and
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that's what all struck us. Ithink about the same. I don't want
to speak for jen and George andAllen. But I'm pretty sure we all
can agree that the information provided waspretty damning. Yeah it was. And
just like we were saying that,in all of our you know, year
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or so, a year and ahalf of investigation, even fifteen years,
you know, Billy's name, Mitchell'sname, Bob Right, nobody was listed
in the case file. These nameswere never mentioned as being involved at all
in Judy's case. So when youget on the phone and someone says,
well, Billy told me exactly whathappened, you're like, holy shit.
(12:54):
I mean, like I said earlier, you don't just say that if it's
not true. Right, And partof it, too, was that person
gave us the explanation as to whysome of that stuff was not in the
case file. That right there too, blew me away. Yes, it
made perfect sense. Yes, sowe'll get to that. Yeah, we'll
(13:16):
get to that. This was agreat conversation, So we will talk a
little bit more about Well, we'lljust keep playing clips. And I think
there's more in there about this walkor her being at the bar. Yes,
well, long right was the onecharge of the situation. Long Right
his brother, I think it's histwin brother, and Bob right, which
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this is his little brother. We'rethe ones that were running the whole situation
out there, and that long wasa control of all. That's what my
brother told me. I had thisdiscussion with Billy sometime and I think it
was twelve twelve because Hedia that's whenhe found out that he was in danger
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with his life. He couldn't moveout because they had some you know,
connections with Kimberly. He had aconnection in Kimberly. She was running all
the financials through the auction house,and that a lot of things were happening
at that time, like his housegot broken into and they sort of a
safe that was a five and ahalf with high four foot wide about two
(14:24):
and a half of picks had toput the wall out to get the safe
out. That's when that happened.In the round twelve is when we had
all these discussions. So justin whatdo you think about that clip? I
think it lets people, the listenersand everybody else know specifically a lot more
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of why we went the direction wewent, and the fact that we don't
go on unfounded quests to harass anybody. As we move on in this episode,
you were going to realize when weget in depth with the rest of
the call and the recording, Ithink you guys will get it. But
(15:11):
again, it makes sense like Billyhad called this person was in fear for
his life. He didn't want methbeing ran out of his auction house anymore.
He had had stuff stolen out ofhis house, and he specifically names
a certain family and several members inthat family. So that's what I think
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about it, and it's interesting,and we haven't gone too much into the
right family in regards to the dealingsof marijuana pills, you know, meth,
but we do know for sure thatyou know, we have heard people
have told me individually that they boughtpills from Kansas out of the auction house,
(16:00):
a couple of people who actually boughtfrom her. So we haven't gone
into too much down that role becausethat really wasn't in relation to Judy's murder,
right, So we were trying tofocus more on Judy's murder and did
any of us have any relation tothat? And what's interesting in this clip
is that you know, Billy himselfmentioned Laan and Bob and Lan running the
(16:25):
drug business, if you will,which we've heard before that they have a
lot of marijuana. It was,you know, state to state kind of
thing. They were providing plants.Mister Petty saw people saw plants, knew
that that was happening near their property. With Tom Sam's right, that's not
new information at all. But whatI find interesting is that you know,
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Billy mentioned this to this person intwenty twelve, and we know Billy committed
suicide in twenty fifteen. And I'vetalked to a few people who say Billy
was really afraid of Mitchell and hewas afraid to really make any moves in
regards to leaving the area, upsettingKim and because maybe he knew too much,
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right, and there was some concernsfinancially. So Kim managed all the
books, which I'm well aware ofthat she was kind of the decision maker
of money and decisions in the family, if you will. That's what they
would call the shot caller. Iwas just going to say that that's exactly
yea man, Yeah, yeah,she definitely was. And so you know,
(17:34):
there was fear that Billy had mentionedto a couple of people that he
bought a gun because he was afraidof Mitchell and Johnny. Foreshe who I
know that we've talked about before,which is Mitchell's cousin, because they would
always you know, back in twentytwelve, Mitchell was in math, so
we'll just say that in two thousandand eight, my understanding from Embro we
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talked to Mitchell was hadn't started themath yet. He was doing the pills,
but not math. And so bytwenty twelve, Mitchell is full blown
into meth, heroine, those kindsof things, so his personality is going
to be very different, and Billycould have been afraid of him. By
then. There was discussion that Billywas afraid of Mitchell because Mitchell was holding
(18:19):
things over his head, or therewas these secrets within this family. So
I found that all very interesting.And again I've heard many times that Billy
was out with Kim somewhere in Ohioand that's when his house got broken into
this big thing, this big eighth. Ironically enough, it is removed,
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and I think this person talks moreabout that later. So that's kind of
what I took away from the clip. It just kind of gives you an
idea of what was going on withinthis family and within Billy and Kim and
kind of this drug world that theylived in. Yeah, And I'll be
perfectly honest with everybody, Like whenit comes to like weed operations with decriminalization
(19:07):
and legalization, like I've been ahuge advocate for that for a long time.
So nobody gives a shit about weedor marijuana, all right. Meth
on the other hand, is waydifferent. What I do care about is
murder and pills meth amphetamine. Theycan alter your state, They can alter
your judgment, They can make youdo things that you would never normally do,
(19:30):
not at all. And I thinkthat's important to know, is that
you know, people had said,well, Mitchell just wasn't that kind of
person, right, He wasn't somebodywho was violent. He didn't fight,
he backed away, he ran,which is all very true. But when
you're on pills, of the numberof pills that Mitchell would take, I
think you have to take into considerations. He was been described as chewing them,
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which is a ton of one afteranother, one after another. At
that point, it is going toalter you, right and give you a
different personality. And we just don'tknow what happened. And so I take
what Billy is saying serious and intoconsideration, and we have to Yeah,
that stuff, that stuff will changea person for sure. Okay, did
(20:15):
anybody ever talk to Mitchell's wife?Came apparently Mitchell and then got divorced.
Mitchell and her got divorced. Shelived in intown. He said he lived
in town with the on Seventh Street. But as I recall her name to
come up when we were discussing stuff, I don't really know her name.
He just said that Mitchell's white knowsa lot of stuff because he got she
(20:37):
got divorced. Yeah, they gotdivorce knows and every thing that drove them
into the situation because she was directlyinvolved. From what he told me,
before Mitchell and her got divorced,that's when it all pretty much started.
I don't know exactly when they gotdivorced, but they were. They were
I know, they got two children, and they lived she lived in town.
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That's what he told me on SeventhStreet. I don't know if that's
factored or not, but that's exactlywhat he told me, that she was
involved. Also, he also toldme that Kim Believe was involved with a
lot of stuff that he couldn't nailit down, but she seems to know
a lot of things about what's wrong? Can I ask you when you when
you're talking about the first wife,is that Peggy? I, Like I
(21:22):
said, I don't remember her name. I really don't remember her name.
It was it was the first wifethat he had and they got divorced and
she moved in town with the twokids that I don't I forgive her name.
She know a lot about what wenton around that time with how Mitch
was and what was going on withthe family and everything else, and that
she had to get away from himbecause she was she just didn't want to
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be had parts of it anymore.This was really interesting and helpful when this
person mentioned Mitchell's first wife. Sowe've talked about this before. His first
wife is Peggy. They had twokids together, and they did end up
separating around this time, and Ithink we talked about that when we were
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looking at Billy Mitchell's red flags,if you will. And one of the
things that we have heard is thatshe ended up leaving Mitchell because his behavior
changed so significantly after Judy's murder,and so the question was did his drugs
increase in change because of what happenedout there? And this information solidified for
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me that there is a correlation.So before this phone call, we really
didn't have anything to kind of backup that Mitchell's behavior did change because of
Judy's murder. But now when youlook back and after many conversations, it
makes it very clear that the marriagewas falling apart. In Mitchell's behavior was
(22:57):
significantly different, and it wasn't afew months afterwards. It was pretty quick
afterwards. So Judy was murdered inFebruary, and it was not I think
his first wife left shortly by theend of February March. I mean,
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it was pretty quick. At thattime. He was popping pills and eating
them like candy and so I do, and stealing too. So we often
also for listeners who have to goback and reason or let me just kind
of let you know. Mitchell wouldsteal property at night, so he would
(23:40):
scope places out during the day andthen go up on properties even if people
live there, and steal things tohelp support his drug habit. And so
again you're talking about his uncle wholives, you know, very close to
the Petty farm. You can getthere from walking, you can get there
from ATVs, which we know Mitchellhad, and you have a subtle that
(24:00):
is underground. That is a greatplace to hang out and if you want
to do drugs, no one's upthere, right, And things were being
stolen from the petty property up untilafter Judy's death when it stops. So
what did you think from that one? From that, that one was interesting?
This person keeps giving as the phonecall progresses, this person keeps giving
(24:23):
more insight. Yes, it startsgetting more in depth. And that's what
we're going to start realizing as wego forward. So whether it's a person's
personality or what was going on intheir personal life around the time of Judy's
murder, it's it's all important.Like we have to take all of this
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into consideration. So that's pretty muchwhere I'm at with it and what I
take from it. Because when Iinitially heard these after after everything happened,
it took a lot to process.And I had these, like I said,
six months ago, you know,seven months ago we had these recordings.
It diverted our attention to where ourattention at is now. And when
(25:11):
we re listened to these just recentlywithin the last couple of weeks. Yes,
I was sitting there listening and Iremember I was texting you and I'm
like, I forgot so much ofthese conversations. Oh my god, you
know yeah, and you texted me. I was like, holy shit,
this is a fucking gold mine.I mean, it was so adorable because
(25:34):
and I was like, really,I have to listen to it because it's
been it has been forever. Butwhen I went back and listened to it,
it was like, we have towe have to put this out now.
And the other reason for us decidingto do this is because Billy also
deserves a voice, right, Sowe focused on Billy. Yes, we
each have our own personal opinion orand you'll hear that Billy was involved in
(25:56):
this murder somehow or another. Eitherhe was there or he knew about it
as he puts himself there. Andyou can hear if you if you hear
this person talking, this is Billy'swords. Okay, So this is you
have to keep that in mind.This is actually coming from Billy. So
I think it's important regardless of ifI believe Billy was responsible or not,
(26:19):
he still deserves a voice even afterdeath. And so I wanted just to
say that because we have a lotof criticism right of us focusing too much
on Billy or the poor the guy'sdad. He can't defend himself. Well,
that's what Kim's supposed to do,and she's not doing that. So
I won't go on that box,but we will get Billy a voice and
(26:41):
voice does her son kill them?Killed them? And it's consistent each phone
call. So yep. I talkedto this person two times actually three and
each time asking questions, same answers, same details. So that tells me,
right, when you talk about credibility, he's the person's not changing the
(27:02):
story, adding not taking away.When I ask questions and the person doesn't
know, they will say he didn'tsay that. I don't know. I
can't speculate, and that tells youit's a good yes person. So yes,
because this person does do that.Yes, Like we'll ask certain questions.
Melissa asks certain questions and this personstraight up will be like, I
(27:25):
don't know, I can't say anythingabout that. Billy never mentioned anything about
that, So that's part of itfor me too, So I'm right on
board with you. Awesome. Isay this was going on in my opinion,
but right around the time because hewas involved, not involved, he
was involved with the original things.I don't know exactly. When I say
(27:47):
it was closer to two thousand andfour is when things were really starting to
hit the fan, and then theyjust escalated into problems with you know,
Billy put me there were around fivepeople that were got killed around around that
time. But around five people gotkilled, I know, he didn't say
their names. He said it tothose around five people got killed about that
(28:07):
time, and that the uh,the one sheriff that was up there,
that lived up there on in deerWalk, that was handling all the intervention
for them, and that's why itwas so difficult for him to get out
of it or stop it or whatever, because he was really afraid because of
what was going on with the interventionwith the sheriff running everything, keeping everybody
(28:29):
so nobody'd ever would they ever getin trouble. He told him. Also,
how the real they said, Well, Bob told me, Bob told
me back in sixth that the friendthat was the comp to him, never
keep anything in the house. Alwayskeep it out in the corn crib.
Not excuse me, not scorn prip, but out in the shed out of
the house. That way, ifthey ever get busted. Somebody ever did
(28:52):
come in here, they couldn't taketheir property, took them to take their
home from them, and that's wherethey always keep things. They all have.
You really look, we're long rightand the port of John and Bob
right lived. They all got outbuildings out that's where they keep the That's
where they transport and keep and storeall the items that they don't want people
(29:12):
to know anything about. As longas you don't walk those buildings, he
said, Bob told me this foryourself. As long as you don't lock
the buildings, then they can't takemy house. That they that I get
blushed, So I can I doanything out here they want? And does
that My whole thing with that isI understand the legalities of what's going on
(29:33):
here because there's plausible deniability. Soif you do not keep your stash,
keep your guns, keep whatever insideyour home, and you have it in
and out building that is unlocked,you have plausible deniability. You can always
go back and say, well,I didn't put that stuff in there,
(29:55):
it was unlocked. Somebody else mighthave done it. Somebody else probably did
it. It came to growing weed. If people are growing weed ninety percent
of the time unless they have somekind of indoor operation. It's it's on
a property line, because you canalways go back and say that's not mine.
I'm not growing. It must bethem over there, you know.
(30:15):
It's the possession is nine tenths ofthe law. And when he said that,
when I was listening to that,I was just holy shit. If
you think about it, how manyrandom everyday people know that. Not many,
No, But I can guarantee youcops know that. You know,
yeah, or people who are friendswith cops. So this whole section blew
(30:41):
my mind. And let's explain alittle bit for context. So the sheriff
or the cop that this person's referringto is our good old friend west Fall
yep. And west Fall absolutely wasthe main detective on Judy's case in two
(31:02):
thousand and eight. West Fall livedout there. According to this person,
as we get into west Fall wasin the rights pocket in regards to marijuana
and pills selling, and that Westfallwould protect the rights for kickback. So
(31:22):
when you hear this information from Billy, and he has this information, it
is mind boggling, and it makescomplete sense to me why Billy, Bob,
Mitchell, Lawn John are nowhere inJudy's case file. Crazy how that
(31:45):
works. It's interesting because I remembertalking to west Fall and he specifically told
me that they and his deputies wentdoor to door when Judy was and when
she was found. And where arethose notes. There's no notes in the
(32:06):
case file that they went knocking doorto door and who lives two houses away
from the petty property? Billy?So why is there no interview with Billy
as to did you hear anything?Do you see anything? And I spoke
to many many people out there onDeer Walk Highway who said nobody ever came
(32:30):
to our door. We're actually shockedno one came and talked to us at
all. So it asked me wonderingwhy why did west Fall not fully investigate
this as he should have? Andhe gave us the excuse. And I'll
admit it. I'll give people thebenefit of the doubt until proven wrong.
And it's probably a weak thing thatI have in me. But he fled
(32:52):
out lied and he said, I'mnot a detective, I'm just a road
cop. I really don't know.And I was like, that makes sense
to me, right, I mean, had no idea the level of corruption.
But the other thing I found interestingon this is when he's talking about
the property and not locked and keepit outside. Where's the perfect place for
(33:15):
that, the seller? Yep,you have right there. You have our
property. That is. Nobody livesthere. The putties aren't up there at
night. You know it's underground.Yeah, and it's not just you given
somebody the benefited doubt. We alldid. That's true, all right,
(33:35):
because he was the first person whoresponded, who got in contact with us
and tried diverting us on a differentpath after hearing that information. When we
did it kind of clicked in allof our brains like, okay, well
now we kind of know why thathappened the way it happened. Yeah,
(33:57):
and that's why we cannot stress enough. Like you don't. We don't try
to get tunnel vision. Like wehave a list of people of interest.
We grade them on percentages. Youhave a certain list of people. Some
percentages are higher than others. Youknow, Westfall was not on top of
the list. But we I thinkwe all kind of inadvertently was like,
(34:21):
man, he's really willing to talkto us, and you know he's leading
us down this way or diverting attentionor whatever. But when we got this
call. It really sunk if theysunk in And it made perfect sense though,
it really did, because we neverheard any of these names in the
case file or never read any ofthe names. No, and then you
(34:43):
put two and two together. Andthen I actually heard from you know,
Billy's ex girlfriend again who said sheremembers the one time Billy, well,
not the one time, I takethat back, but the time he slapped
her in the face or punched herin the face driving down the road and
Billy Senior and Billy and her werein the car. She got out of
(35:05):
the car and started to walk in. A sheriff or cop picked her up
and was like, he's a goodperson. It'll be fine, you know,
walk off. I'll take you rightthere. Like he never asked her,
do you want to follow a report? Like it was more like and
she knew at that point, shesaid to me, I knew I couldn't
call the cops because it was kindof and we hear that unfortunately all the
(35:28):
time. Unfortunately with victims of domesticviolence are things of people not believing,
right. And I got some feedbackabout how do you know that she was
actually raped? Well, because Ibelieve her, because you don't just you
know, have those details and talkabout it in that way still be traumatized.
(35:49):
And you can tell when somebody's traumatizedby the situation, right right,
right right, and so you know, so that was interesting, and then
it started all clicking. And thenyou look and you're like, Westfall did
have a mom who lived out thereon Deerwalk Highway. Holy shit. And
then you have these specific details ofBilly saying, hey, we were told
this, don't keep your stuff herehere, here, here, the Petty
(36:12):
farm is the perfect place to keepshit. Nobody's there. Like I said,
it's plausible deniability, man, andthe property is huge everybody. So
I'm not saying like the Petties couldcome up and not know that shit's still
going on. I mean, Mitchellhimself is making meth out of you know,
in bottles. That doesn't take alot of shit to make it where
you don't even know what's happening,right, So you need a backpack and
(36:36):
a Gator eight bombs and that's howhe made it, and that's how he
made it. So you know,it's freaking method. Yeah, I'm learning
a lot. It was. Itwas interesting. So that clip right there
again validated that this person talking tous had information that only Billy would know
because this person does not live inBarbersburg, yep, so they're not going
(37:00):
to know. And I don't knowif we get to the cliff or not.
But he didn't even know. Thisperson didn't even know west Fall's name
until I mentioned it. So thatjust shows this person's not from the area.
So not would they get this informationunless Billy said it himself. Absolutely,
the cop that we were talking aboutlast time was was Westfall? Correct?
(37:24):
I recall something like that. Ithink that's the name, but I'm
not quite. Billy told me thathe lived out there on Route thirty one
in deer Wall in that area,close the Bull Run Road, so that
he could always be in interference forany situation that popped up, maybe the
(37:45):
first one, or he would beable to take over and sit any investigation
to run interference for those guys.Definitely, Billy was running all the stuff
coming in from He would go getthe stuff from up the yard sales and
the state sales and a hall ifhe had some guy. He had some
(38:06):
guy that worked with him and theyhad a truck, and he said that
they picked up up I got abig load today and you know, we
got was over here. Then hetakes it through, cleans it up,
priced it and put it out.He's getting ready for an auction. And
that's what he had said. Andthat's but as far as all the finances,
Kimberly did all the banking, andKimbridge did all the the concession and
(38:30):
all the wins. An item wassold, what item was that item one
oh one? She would write downitem one o one who bought it,
whoever bought it for how much,because then she would, you know,
calculate how much their money would beor percentat whatever they got. Whatever they
would take was from each item thatwas sold. As far as as seen
(38:52):
too much or knowing too much oranything about, you don't know exactly what
that would mean. As far asshootings ind of it. My opinion is
Billy said she found out and nowshe knows she knew too much. That's
always said. That was it.And they killed her. Mitchell killker And
(39:13):
that was all he said to me. And I said, well, were
you there? Did you do it? And then he didn't say he was
there, but he said they wentup there and a tracker and you know,
and they I don't know how youfigured out what John and Lan and
them were the one to burn herup. But he he knows more.
He knew more than what it was. And I feel that he he wouldn't
tell He didn't tell me, butI'm pretty sure he knew more of what
(39:35):
he was letting on. Just likeMitchell. They all they all know everything.
And the thing is everything funneled throughKimberly, because Kimberly was the is
the the ears in the mouth ofthe whole situation. It's a miracle that
you know she's still she's still ticking. So as far as Billy's telling you
this, he never explained how heknew this or he just said she found
(40:00):
out and knew too much. That'swhite, that's white A kure. That
was it. That that's that wasit, And that's when he told me
that that's that was it. Asfar as anything else, no, are
you aware of any other people duringthis timeframe that we're running with this group?
Was no? I know Billy wasthe only one that that told me.
(40:21):
Mitchell was a bult and that wasit. He. I don't know
anything about what anybody else was doingbecause I wasn't there I didn't hear anything U
Here on the safe Haven Podcast.Any names mentioned should not be considered as
suspects unless officially stated as such bylaw enforcement. Any opinions during interviews on
this podcast are the opinions of theinterviewee and don't reflect the opinions of the
safe Haven Podcast or the AMU ColdCase Team. Everyone is innocent until proven
(00:20):
guilty in a court of law.Welcome everybody to this episode of safe Haven,
(00:42):
the Unsolved Murder of Judath Petty.It is good to be back again.
It has been a minute since I'vebeen on an episode or an interview,
And yeah, I appreciate everybody nothating me for being absent, but
obviously I am joined by my deemedco host, Melissa, my partner in
(01:03):
crime over here. And yeah,it's been a wild month or so.
Yeah, a lot of stuff goingon, a lot of stuff going on.
Yeah, this particular episode, though, is an interesting one because we
have been getting a lot of grief, accused of a lot of things,
including harassment, this, that andthe other, which I'm super glad that
(01:26):
some people don't understand the definition ofharassment because that's not what this is.
But I don't know. We talkedand it's we got this phone call in
what May or June, like superearly in the summer. I think,
yes, it was over the summer. I believe we got this phone call
(01:46):
and it was a very exciting time. Well actually I made the phone call
and then we got the and thenwe followed back up with another phone call.
But I just want to say hieveryone, welcome back before we get
into it. And so Us andI we are here together, super excited.
We saw each other at crime Con. We know that all of you
(02:06):
saw our pictures. We got newyou know crime you know wine in the
line fans here, and so we'reso excited that we got to meet you
at crime Con, that you've joinedour Facebook and follow our podcast. So
welcome. That was you. Thatwas your first year a crime Con.
It was yes, and I absolutelyloved it. I will be at Nashville
(02:28):
meet and country music in Nashville andcrime Con. It's a horrible mix,
but it'll be so much fun.I will be stalking Tim McGrath. Anybody
wants to come with me. Myrestraining order should be over by then and
then I could go stalk Tim McGrath. So it'll be a really good time.
(02:49):
This episode is definitely. I don'twant to say a groundbreaking one,
but it's I think you guys willunderstand why we went the direction we went
when we did because we were holdingonto this audio for a long time and
we were were we vetted the person, we vetted a couple different people.
We went back and asked about thebackgrounds of the individuals mentioned in this phone
(03:15):
call. I think after listening tothis, I think you guys will have
a lot better understanding of why wewent the direction we did, Melissa,
what do you think? Absolutely,And from our last episode with Jennifer,
which we got a ton of feedbackon and really a lot of people really
enjoyed that episode with Jennifer, Soshout out to Jennifer for coming on and
(03:37):
doing that and going to visit Cam. That took a lot of courage,
and she continues to fight for usand for Judy, and so we wanted
to follow up and kind of pivota little bit in this episode, and
we thought that now is the perfecttime we have, you know, gong
through all of a few episodes reallyfocusing on Billy, and as we've mentioned
(03:58):
before, for good reason, rightgiven Billy's history, given the flags,
the circumstantial evidence if you want to, that make him the more likely person
that was involved in Judy's murder.But now we wanted to pivot a bit
and focus on Mitchell, and theway that Mitchell comes into this is Billy
himself mentions what happened to Judy andmentions Mitchell was the one who killed her.
(04:25):
So you will hear in this recordingBilly's own words, of course,
coming from a second person. Right, we know it's here, say,
but I will tell the listeners thatthis is a trusted person in Billy's life.
So this was somebody that Billy trustedthat I don't believe. There's too
many details, and some of thedetails we're not going to share that makes
(04:49):
this credible. Right, you don'tjust call up somebody and say hey,
when you have no stake in thegame, Right, You're not going to
call somebody out and say, hey, Mitchell killed Judy and for shits and
giggles, Right, So there definitelyis something behind what Billy said, And
I will put this out there.The person that we're talking about is not
(05:12):
is not Billy's ex girlfriend. SoI know that there was some comments from
the right family. Kim Kansas,whoever may try to discredit this information thinking
that it came from Billy's ex girlfriend. It did not. So I wanted
to just make that clear so thatit can be like, oh, well,
she's just saying that it was nother. The thing about the Right
(05:35):
family that cracks me up right now. And I'm not saying, obviously,
any of them are guilty. I'mnot saying any of them are innocent,
but as an observer, they goto extreme links to discredit any single,
tiny little thing, and they makea lot of assumptions. For a person
(05:56):
who investigates this stuff on the outsidelooking in, it's not a good look,
you know, It's it's not agood look at all. Right,
you guys will see why we heldon to this audio. Obviously, I
have taken measures to make sure thisperson stays anonymous. Their voice will be
(06:20):
changed because of the safety of thisperson. They are very concerned about their
safety because of what they were told. And like Melissa had mentioned earlier,
the reason we took this so seriouslyoff the bat is because of the information,
and we won't share all of it. We have given everything to the
(06:42):
prosecutor's office, obviously, but forthe listeners. There are some things that
we will hold back in this episodebecause some of the details that were given
are not publicly known, and itis very revealing and it'll knock you back
a little bit. And looking backafter Jennifer's interview and after our dealings with
(07:10):
some of the Right family or arenot dealings with them because they won't talk
to us, there's a few thingsthat are said in these phone calls where
this person told us six months agoexactly how it was going to turn out,
and that's how it turned out.Yes, Melissa, do you do
(07:32):
you want to get us going onwhat we got going on here? Yeah,
So we're going to go ahead andstart. We're going to play clips
of the recording, and then Justinand I are going to talk about those
clips just to give you some moreinsight or maybe more discussion about what was
going on during that call or alittle bit more information, and then we'll
(07:53):
continue on with the recording. So, like Justin said, we're going to
protect the identity of this person.I'm very excited to share this with everybody
so you can see and understand whywe've gone the way that we've gone.
And again, when you're listening tothis person. This is what Billy himself
had told somebody. Okay, goahead, justin, let's hear it.
(08:15):
Sure he said that to him,but he said, either who killed her
for at the on top of theheel with the He said that they went
up there with the one attractor andwhen they killed her, the John and
and uh Lon Wright came up thereand burned her in the corner. He
called us the corn crew. Butshe's actually burned underground, so nobody see
(08:39):
it because it was at night.Let's see. Uh I don't know.
Bob Wright was also involved with thewhole situation up there. Let's see.
Also, he said if they weresawing meth and taming at the Austin Health
through the contest stand and they weretrying to be trying to to stop it,
(09:00):
and that's how he was in dangera lot with his life, and
that's how he lost his life.Now, as far as she goes,
he said, told me that shewent to a bar out by Reaches and
they picked her up, and thenthey went and prepared the problem. Obviously
she knew something. He didn't saywhat she knew that she obviously knew or
(09:22):
found out something about what was goingon and with the methane better meat than
everything going on out in that area, and she found out something and they
killed her because of that. Andthe Wright brothers are the ones that covered
it all, but Mitchell and JohnnyWright most of the ones that actually did
(09:45):
actually killed her. When you heardthis on the phone call, what was
your initial reaction? Shock and reallyjust almost tearful if you will. It
sounds weird, but since we startedthis investigation in for fifteen years, right
(10:07):
that no one has ever said anybodyhas killed Judy. We've never heard for
sure, so and so killed Judy, right, And so to hear that
Billy said who killed her? Howthey killed her in the sense of,
you know, throwing her in thechicken coop, which he clarifies for everybody,
(10:28):
right, that's that's the cellar,the corn crib, thank you.
Yeah. So, so this personwas saying how she was you know,
who killed her, and then alsogoing into how she was burned right into
the what do you call it?Justin the corn crib. The person does
(10:48):
go in then and explain that that'swhat Billy called the seller, and it
talks about it being underground. SoI was really in shock and very tearful,
and I reached out to all ofyou like, oh my god,
this because I was aspecting this.I was just making phone calls like I
do, right, I'm just callingpeople hey, hey, hey, and
(11:09):
then to get this phone call andthis person just flat outs us. Well
Billy told me Mitchell Kilder and Boband line through in the you know corn
crib or the Stellar. I waslike, We've never heard that at all.
Yeah, so that I couldn't believeit. I couldn't believe it when
(11:30):
I heard the recording because I rememberyou messaging us in our group chat in
real time as you're talking to thisperson. Yes, it was so funny
because me and jenneral like, calmdown, keep going, quit messaging us,
like, stop messaging us, concentrateon this looking back. That was
(11:50):
one of the few amusing parts aboutthis phone call, because you lost your
mind. And then when the restof us heard it, we lost our
because we were like, oh mygod. This in the information, like
I said that this person provided,there's information that's not publicly known, and
(12:13):
that's what all struck us. Ithink about the same. I don't want
to speak for jen and George andAllen. But I'm pretty sure we all
can agree that the information provided waspretty damning. Yeah it was. And
just like we were saying that,in all of our you know, year
(12:33):
or so, a year and ahalf of investigation, even fifteen years,
you know, Billy's name, Mitchell'sname, Bob Right, nobody was listed
in the case file. These nameswere never mentioned as being involved at all
in Judy's case. So when youget on the phone and someone says,
well, Billy told me exactly whathappened, you're like, holy shit.
(12:54):
I mean, like I said earlier, you don't just say that if it's
not true. Right, And partof it, too, was that person
gave us the explanation as to whysome of that stuff was not in the
case file. That right there too, blew me away. Yes, it
made perfect sense. Yes, sowe'll get to that. Yeah, we'll
(13:16):
get to that. This was agreat conversation, So we will talk a
little bit more about Well, we'lljust keep playing clips. And I think
there's more in there about this walkor her being at the bar. Yes,
well, long right was the onecharge of the situation. Long Right
his brother, I think it's histwin brother, and Bob right, which
(13:39):
this is his little brother. We'rethe ones that were running the whole situation
out there, and that long wasa control of all. That's what my
brother told me. I had thisdiscussion with Billy sometime and I think it
was twelve twelve because Hedia that's whenhe found out that he was in danger
(14:01):
with his life. He couldn't moveout because they had some you know,
connections with Kimberly. He had aconnection in Kimberly. She was running all
the financials through the auction house,and that a lot of things were happening
at that time, like his housegot broken into and they sort of a
safe that was a five and ahalf with high four foot wide about two
(14:24):
and a half of picks had toput the wall out to get the safe
out. That's when that happened.In the round twelve is when we had
all these discussions. So justin whatdo you think about that clip? I
think it lets people, the listenersand everybody else know specifically a lot more
(14:48):
of why we went the direction wewent, and the fact that we don't
go on unfounded quests to harass anybody. As we move on in this episode,
you were going to realize when weget in depth with the rest of
the call and the recording, Ithink you guys will get it. But
(15:11):
again, it makes sense like Billyhad called this person was in fear for
his life. He didn't want methbeing ran out of his auction house anymore.
He had had stuff stolen out ofhis house, and he specifically names
a certain family and several members inthat family. So that's what I think
(15:35):
about it, and it's interesting,and we haven't gone too much into the
right family in regards to the dealingsof marijuana pills, you know, meth,
but we do know for sure thatyou know, we have heard people
have told me individually that they boughtpills from Kansas out of the auction house,
(16:00):
a couple of people who actually boughtfrom her. So we haven't gone
into too much down that role becausethat really wasn't in relation to Judy's murder,
right, So we were trying tofocus more on Judy's murder and did
any of us have any relation tothat? And what's interesting in this clip
is that you know, Billy himselfmentioned Laan and Bob and Lan running the
(16:25):
drug business, if you will,which we've heard before that they have a
lot of marijuana. It was,you know, state to state kind of
thing. They were providing plants.Mister Petty saw people saw plants, knew
that that was happening near their property. With Tom Sam's right, that's not
new information at all. But whatI find interesting is that you know,
(16:48):
Billy mentioned this to this person intwenty twelve, and we know Billy committed
suicide in twenty fifteen. And I'vetalked to a few people who say Billy
was really afraid of Mitchell and hewas afraid to really make any moves in
regards to leaving the area, upsettingKim and because maybe he knew too much,
(17:11):
right, and there was some concernsfinancially. So Kim managed all the
books, which I'm well aware ofthat she was kind of the decision maker
of money and decisions in the family, if you will. That's what they
would call the shot caller. Iwas just going to say that that's exactly
yea man, Yeah, yeah,she definitely was. And so you know,
(17:34):
there was fear that Billy had mentionedto a couple of people that he
bought a gun because he was afraidof Mitchell and Johnny. Foreshe who I
know that we've talked about before,which is Mitchell's cousin, because they would
always you know, back in twentytwelve, Mitchell was in math, so
we'll just say that in two thousandand eight, my understanding from Embro we
(17:55):
talked to Mitchell was hadn't started themath yet. He was doing the pills,
but not math. And so bytwenty twelve, Mitchell is full blown
into meth, heroine, those kindsof things, so his personality is going
to be very different, and Billycould have been afraid of him. By
then. There was discussion that Billywas afraid of Mitchell because Mitchell was holding
(18:19):
things over his head, or therewas these secrets within this family. So
I found that all very interesting.And again I've heard many times that Billy
was out with Kim somewhere in Ohioand that's when his house got broken into
this big thing, this big eighth. Ironically enough, it is removed,
(18:42):
and I think this person talks moreabout that later. So that's kind of
what I took away from the clip. It just kind of gives you an
idea of what was going on withinthis family and within Billy and Kim and
kind of this drug world that theylived in. Yeah, And I'll be
perfectly honest with everybody, Like whenit comes to like weed operations with decriminalization
(19:07):
and legalization, like I've been ahuge advocate for that for a long time.
So nobody gives a shit about weedor marijuana, all right. Meth
on the other hand, is waydifferent. What I do care about is
murder and pills meth amphetamine. Theycan alter your state, They can alter
your judgment, They can make youdo things that you would never normally do,
(19:30):
not at all. And I thinkthat's important to know, is that
you know, people had said,well, Mitchell just wasn't that kind of
person, right, He wasn't somebodywho was violent. He didn't fight,
he backed away, he ran,which is all very true. But when
you're on pills, of the numberof pills that Mitchell would take, I
think you have to take into considerations. He was been described as chewing them,
(19:52):
which is a ton of one afteranother, one after another. At
that point, it is going toalter you, right and give you a
different personality. And we just don'tknow what happened. And so I take
what Billy is saying serious and intoconsideration, and we have to Yeah,
that stuff, that stuff will changea person for sure. Okay, did
(20:15):
anybody ever talk to Mitchell's wife?Came apparently Mitchell and then got divorced.
Mitchell and her got divorced. Shelived in intown. He said he lived
in town with the on Seventh Street. But as I recall her name to
come up when we were discussing stuff, I don't really know her name.
He just said that Mitchell's white knowsa lot of stuff because he got she
(20:37):
got divorced. Yeah, they gotdivorce knows and every thing that drove them
into the situation because she was directlyinvolved. From what he told me,
before Mitchell and her got divorced,that's when it all pretty much started.
I don't know exactly when they gotdivorced, but they were. They were
I know, they got two children, and they lived she lived in town.
(21:00):
That's what he told me on SeventhStreet. I don't know if that's
factored or not, but that's exactlywhat he told me, that she was
involved. Also, he also toldme that Kim Believe was involved with a
lot of stuff that he couldn't nailit down, but she seems to know
a lot of things about what's wrong? Can I ask you when you when
you're talking about the first wife,is that Peggy? I, Like I
(21:22):
said, I don't remember her name. I really don't remember her name.
It was it was the first wifethat he had and they got divorced and
she moved in town with the twokids that I don't I forgive her name.
She know a lot about what wenton around that time with how Mitch
was and what was going on withthe family and everything else, and that
she had to get away from himbecause she was she just didn't want to
(21:45):
be had parts of it anymore.This was really interesting and helpful when this
person mentioned Mitchell's first wife. Sowe've talked about this before. His first
wife is Peggy. They had twokids together, and they did end up
separating around this time, and Ithink we talked about that when we were
(22:06):
looking at Billy Mitchell's red flags,if you will. And one of the
things that we have heard is thatshe ended up leaving Mitchell because his behavior
changed so significantly after Judy's murder,and so the question was did his drugs
increase in change because of what happenedout there? And this information solidified for
(22:32):
me that there is a correlation.So before this phone call, we really
didn't have anything to kind of backup that Mitchell's behavior did change because of
Judy's murder. But now when youlook back and after many conversations, it
makes it very clear that the marriagewas falling apart. In Mitchell's behavior was
(22:57):
significantly different, and it wasn't afew months afterwards. It was pretty quick
afterwards. So Judy was murdered inFebruary, and it was not I think
his first wife left shortly by theend of February March. I mean,
(23:19):
it was pretty quick. At thattime. He was popping pills and eating
them like candy and so I do, and stealing too. So we often
also for listeners who have to goback and reason or let me just kind
of let you know. Mitchell wouldsteal property at night, so he would
(23:40):
scope places out during the day andthen go up on properties even if people
live there, and steal things tohelp support his drug habit. And so
again you're talking about his uncle wholives, you know, very close to
the Petty farm. You can getthere from walking, you can get there
from ATVs, which we know Mitchellhad, and you have a subtle that
(24:00):
is underground. That is a greatplace to hang out and if you want
to do drugs, no one's upthere, right, And things were being
stolen from the petty property up untilafter Judy's death when it stops. So
what did you think from that one? From that, that one was interesting?
This person keeps giving as the phonecall progresses, this person keeps giving
(24:23):
more insight. Yes, it startsgetting more in depth. And that's what
we're going to start realizing as wego forward. So whether it's a person's
personality or what was going on intheir personal life around the time of Judy's
murder, it's it's all important.Like we have to take all of this
(24:45):
into consideration. So that's pretty muchwhere I'm at with it and what I
take from it. Because when Iinitially heard these after after everything happened,
it took a lot to process.And I had these, like I said,
six months ago, you know,seven months ago we had these recordings.
It diverted our attention to where ourattention at is now. And when
(25:11):
we re listened to these just recentlywithin the last couple of weeks. Yes,
I was sitting there listening and Iremember I was texting you and I'm
like, I forgot so much ofthese conversations. Oh my god, you
know yeah, and you texted me. I was like, holy shit,
this is a fucking gold mine.I mean, it was so adorable because
(25:34):
and I was like, really,I have to listen to it because it's
been it has been forever. Butwhen I went back and listened to it,
it was like, we have towe have to put this out now.
And the other reason for us decidingto do this is because Billy also
deserves a voice, right, Sowe focused on Billy. Yes, we
each have our own personal opinion orand you'll hear that Billy was involved in
(25:56):
this murder somehow or another. Eitherhe was there or he knew about it
as he puts himself there. Andyou can hear if you if you hear
this person talking, this is Billy'swords. Okay, So this is you
have to keep that in mind.This is actually coming from Billy. So
I think it's important regardless of ifI believe Billy was responsible or not,
(26:19):
he still deserves a voice even afterdeath. And so I wanted just to
say that because we have a lotof criticism right of us focusing too much
on Billy or the poor the guy'sdad. He can't defend himself. Well,
that's what Kim's supposed to do,and she's not doing that. So
I won't go on that box,but we will get Billy a voice and
(26:41):
voice does her son kill them?Killed them? And it's consistent each phone
call. So yep. I talkedto this person two times actually three and
each time asking questions, same answers, same details. So that tells me,
right, when you talk about credibility, he's the person's not changing the
(27:02):
story, adding not taking away.When I ask questions and the person doesn't
know, they will say he didn'tsay that. I don't know. I
can't speculate, and that tells youit's a good yes person. So yes,
because this person does do that.Yes, Like we'll ask certain questions.
Melissa asks certain questions and this personstraight up will be like, I
(27:25):
don't know, I can't say anythingabout that. Billy never mentioned anything about
that, So that's part of itfor me too, So I'm right on
board with you. Awesome. Isay this was going on in my opinion,
but right around the time because hewas involved, not involved, he
was involved with the original things.I don't know exactly. When I say
(27:47):
it was closer to two thousand andfour is when things were really starting to
hit the fan, and then theyjust escalated into problems with you know,
Billy put me there were around fivepeople that were got killed around around that
time. But around five people gotkilled, I know, he didn't say
their names. He said it tothose around five people got killed about that
(28:07):
time, and that the uh,the one sheriff that was up there,
that lived up there on in deerWalk, that was handling all the intervention
for them, and that's why itwas so difficult for him to get out
of it or stop it or whatever, because he was really afraid because of
what was going on with the interventionwith the sheriff running everything, keeping everybody
(28:29):
so nobody'd ever would they ever getin trouble. He told him. Also,
how the real they said, Well, Bob told me, Bob told
me back in sixth that the friendthat was the comp to him, never
keep anything in the house. Alwayskeep it out in the corn crib.
Not excuse me, not scorn prip, but out in the shed out of
the house. That way, ifthey ever get busted. Somebody ever did
(28:52):
come in here, they couldn't taketheir property, took them to take their
home from them, and that's wherethey always keep things. They all have.
You really look, we're long rightand the port of John and Bob
right lived. They all got outbuildings out that's where they keep the That's
where they transport and keep and storeall the items that they don't want people
(29:12):
to know anything about. As longas you don't walk those buildings, he
said, Bob told me this foryourself. As long as you don't lock
the buildings, then they can't takemy house. That they that I get
blushed, So I can I doanything out here they want? And does
that My whole thing with that isI understand the legalities of what's going on
(29:33):
here because there's plausible deniability. Soif you do not keep your stash,
keep your guns, keep whatever insideyour home, and you have it in
and out building that is unlocked,you have plausible deniability. You can always
go back and say, well,I didn't put that stuff in there,
(29:55):
it was unlocked. Somebody else mighthave done it. Somebody else probably did
it. It came to growing weed. If people are growing weed ninety percent
of the time unless they have somekind of indoor operation. It's it's on
a property line, because you canalways go back and say that's not mine.
I'm not growing. It must bethem over there, you know.
(30:15):
It's the possession is nine tenths ofthe law. And when he said that,
when I was listening to that,I was just holy shit. If
you think about it, how manyrandom everyday people know that. Not many,
No, But I can guarantee youcops know that. You know,
yeah, or people who are friendswith cops. So this whole section blew
(30:41):
my mind. And let's explain alittle bit for context. So the sheriff
or the cop that this person's referringto is our good old friend west Fall
yep. And west Fall absolutely wasthe main detective on Judy's case in two
(31:02):
thousand and eight. West Fall livedout there. According to this person,
as we get into west Fall wasin the rights pocket in regards to marijuana
and pills selling, and that Westfallwould protect the rights for kickback. So
(31:22):
when you hear this information from Billy, and he has this information, it
is mind boggling, and it makescomplete sense to me why Billy, Bob,
Mitchell, Lawn John are nowhere inJudy's case file. Crazy how that
(31:45):
works. It's interesting because I remembertalking to west Fall and he specifically told
me that they and his deputies wentdoor to door when Judy was and when
she was found. And where arethose notes. There's no notes in the
(32:06):
case file that they went knocking doorto door and who lives two houses away
from the petty property? Billy?So why is there no interview with Billy
as to did you hear anything?Do you see anything? And I spoke
to many many people out there onDeer Walk Highway who said nobody ever came
(32:30):
to our door. We're actually shockedno one came and talked to us at
all. So it asked me wonderingwhy why did west Fall not fully investigate
this as he should have? Andhe gave us the excuse. And I'll
admit it. I'll give people thebenefit of the doubt until proven wrong.
And it's probably a weak thing thatI have in me. But he fled
(32:52):
out lied and he said, I'mnot a detective, I'm just a road
cop. I really don't know.And I was like, that makes sense
to me, right, I mean, had no idea the level of corruption.
But the other thing I found interestingon this is when he's talking about
the property and not locked and keepit outside. Where's the perfect place for
(33:15):
that, the seller? Yep,you have right there. You have our
property. That is. Nobody livesthere. The putties aren't up there at
night. You know it's underground.Yeah, and it's not just you given
somebody the benefited doubt. We alldid. That's true, all right,
(33:35):
because he was the first person whoresponded, who got in contact with us
and tried diverting us on a differentpath after hearing that information. When we
did it kind of clicked in allof our brains like, okay, well
now we kind of know why thathappened the way it happened. Yeah,
(33:57):
and that's why we cannot stress enough. Like you don't. We don't try
to get tunnel vision. Like wehave a list of people of interest.
We grade them on percentages. Youhave a certain list of people. Some
percentages are higher than others. Youknow, Westfall was not on top of
the list. But we I thinkwe all kind of inadvertently was like,
(34:21):
man, he's really willing to talkto us, and you know he's leading
us down this way or diverting attentionor whatever. But when we got this
call. It really sunk if theysunk in And it made perfect sense though,
it really did, because we neverheard any of these names in the
case file or never read any ofthe names. No, and then you
(34:43):
put two and two together. Andthen I actually heard from you know,
Billy's ex girlfriend again who said sheremembers the one time Billy, well,
not the one time, I takethat back, but the time he slapped
her in the face or punched herin the face driving down the road and
Billy Senior and Billy and her werein the car. She got out of
(35:05):
the car and started to walk in. A sheriff or cop picked her up
and was like, he's a goodperson. It'll be fine, you know,
walk off. I'll take you rightthere. Like he never asked her,
do you want to follow a report? Like it was more like and
she knew at that point, shesaid to me, I knew I couldn't
call the cops because it was kindof and we hear that unfortunately all the
(35:28):
time. Unfortunately with victims of domesticviolence are things of people not believing,
right. And I got some feedbackabout how do you know that she was
actually raped? Well, because Ibelieve her, because you don't just you
know, have those details and talkabout it in that way still be traumatized.
(35:49):
And you can tell when somebody's traumatizedby the situation, right right,
right right, and so you know, so that was interesting, and then
it started all clicking. And thenyou look and you're like, Westfall did
have a mom who lived out thereon Deerwalk Highway. Holy shit. And
then you have these specific details ofBilly saying, hey, we were told
this, don't keep your stuff herehere, here, here, the Petty
(36:12):
farm is the perfect place to keepshit. Nobody's there. Like I said,
it's plausible deniability, man, andthe property is huge everybody. So
I'm not saying like the Petties couldcome up and not know that shit's still
going on. I mean, Mitchellhimself is making meth out of you know,
in bottles. That doesn't take alot of shit to make it where
you don't even know what's happening,right, So you need a backpack and
(36:36):
a Gator eight bombs and that's howhe made it, and that's how he
made it. So you know,it's freaking method. Yeah, I'm learning
a lot. It was. Itwas interesting. So that clip right there
again validated that this person talking tous had information that only Billy would know
because this person does not live inBarbersburg, yep, so they're not going
(37:00):
to know. And I don't knowif we get to the cliff or not.
But he didn't even know. Thisperson didn't even know west Fall's name
until I mentioned it. So thatjust shows this person's not from the area.
So not would they get this informationunless Billy said it himself. Absolutely,
the cop that we were talking aboutlast time was was Westfall? Correct?
(37:24):
I recall something like that. Ithink that's the name, but I'm
not quite. Billy told me thathe lived out there on Route thirty one
in deer Wall in that area,close the Bull Run Road, so that
he could always be in interference forany situation that popped up, maybe the
(37:45):
first one, or he would beable to take over and sit any investigation
to run interference for those guys.Definitely, Billy was running all the stuff
coming in from He would go getthe stuff from up the yard sales and
the state sales and a hall ifhe had some guy. He had some
(38:06):
guy that worked with him and theyhad a truck, and he said that
they picked up up I got abig load today and you know, we
got was over here. Then hetakes it through, cleans it up,
priced it and put it out.He's getting ready for an auction. And
that's what he had said. Andthat's but as far as all the finances,
Kimberly did all the banking, andKimbridge did all the the concession and
(38:30):
all the wins. An item wassold, what item was that item one
oh one? She would write downitem one o one who bought it,
whoever bought it for how much,because then she would, you know,
calculate how much their money would beor percentat whatever they got. Whatever they
would take was from each item thatwas sold. As far as as seen
(38:52):
too much or knowing too much oranything about, you don't know exactly what
that would mean. As far asshootings ind of it. My opinion is
Billy said she found out and nowshe knows she knew too much. That's
always said. That was it.And they killed her. Mitchell killker And
(39:13):
that was all he said to me. And I said, well, were
you there? Did you do it? And then he didn't say he was
there, but he said they wentup there and a tracker and you know,
and they I don't know how youfigured out what John and Lan and
them were the one to burn herup. But he he knows more.
He knew more than what it was. And I feel that he he wouldn't
tell He didn't tell me, butI'm pretty sure he knew more of what
(39:35):
he was letting on. Just likeMitchell. They all they all know everything.
And the thing is everything funneled throughKimberly, because Kimberly was the is
the the ears in the mouth ofthe whole situation. It's a miracle that
you know she's still she's still ticking. So as far as Billy's telling you
this, he never explained how heknew this or he just said she found
(40:00):
out and knew too much. That'swhite, that's white A kure. That
was it. That that's that wasit, And that's when he told me
that that's that was it. Asfar as anything else, no, are
you aware of any other people duringthis timeframe that we're running with this group?
Was no? I know Billy wasthe only one that that told me.
(40:21):
Mitchell was a bult and that wasit. He. I don't know
anything about what anybody else was doingbecause I wasn't there I didn't hear anything U
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