July 17, 2025 • 31 mins
In this episode of Scream and Sugar, we’re heading back to the Wild West to uncover the infamous 1899 robbery of the Union Pacific Overland Flyer No. 1. Masterminded by the legendary Butch Cassidy and his gang, the Wild Bunch, this daring train heist near Wilcox, Wyoming, left railroad cars blown apart and lawmen scrambling across the frontier. With explosives, horses, and a disappearing act that would baffle authorities, this robbery became one of the most iconic crimes of the American West.
Join us as we explore how it happened, who was involved, and what came next in this dusty tale of outlaws and audacity. And remember, stay spooky, y'all!
Case References:
https://roamercoffeehouse.com/
Become a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/scream-and-sugar-true-crime-coffee-hour--6015946/support.
Join us as we explore how it happened, who was involved, and what came next in this dusty tale of outlaws and audacity. And remember, stay spooky, y'all!
Case References:
https://roamercoffeehouse.com/
Become a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/scream-and-sugar-true-crime-coffee-hour--6015946/support.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
Welcome back, everyone to another episode of Scream and Sugar,
the True Cramp podcast that dives into the darker side
of humanity while savoring a little sweetness on the side.
I'm your House, Candace, and I'm Sahara, and today we
are going to be talking about the eighteen ninety nine
robbery of the Union Pacific's Overlain flyer number one.
Speaker 2 (00:51):
Hi Saharah, Hi Hannas.
Speaker 1 (00:53):
How do you doing?
Speaker 2 (00:54):
I am doing? Okay, what are you doing?
Speaker 1 (00:58):
I'm I'm good.
Speaker 2 (01:01):
Tell me all about it.
Speaker 1 (01:03):
I uh, I don't know. Summer has been real nice.
It's been so weird not having any homework that I
sometimes find myself like, did you get anxious? Yeah, like
you forgot it anxious? Like what did I forget? Because
I had like that shorty summer class that was only
three weeks and there was literally shit do like every
single day, So for three weeks straight up, Like I
(01:27):
got through it, did well. But now I'm like, I
got the PTSD here all, Like wait a second, wait,
what else do I need to do?
Speaker 2 (01:34):
I forgetting love that.
Speaker 1 (01:37):
Other than that, summer has been great.
Speaker 2 (01:41):
Great.
Speaker 1 (01:42):
Yeah, y'all.
Speaker 2 (01:43):
Guess whose birthday is coming up?
Speaker 1 (01:45):
Guess who's back.
Speaker 2 (01:46):
It can probably.
Speaker 1 (01:49):
Air after that. But yeah, my birthday is on July seventh.
Speaker 2 (01:52):
So sunder Love celebrate extra hard for me.
Speaker 1 (01:56):
Yes, Today I want to talk about a little coffee
shop that we found has taken over the handcraft coffee
shop that we previously had reviewed. They still have like
a little ode to handcraft coffee in there, but it
is now Roamer Coffee House and super cute, super cute,
(02:21):
like it already was. Lots of plants, lots of really
cute Western paintings, and their merch is adorable, so cute.
Speaker 2 (02:31):
Love it.
Speaker 1 (02:32):
I got the Dolly parton mocha, so it was a
banana flavored mocha and it was fucking delicious. Love also
took a bite of William's hamgrew year and fig sandwich.
It was so fucking good, love God. He had it
all over his face and I.
Speaker 2 (02:48):
Was like, bro, that's my mustached man.
Speaker 1 (02:51):
Did you enjoy the funk out of that sandwich?
Speaker 2 (02:53):
He was hungry?
Speaker 1 (02:55):
How did you get to here?
Speaker 2 (02:56):
I had a turmeric merk work a turmeric latte with honey,
and oh I don't remember, I don't I definitely had
oat milk in it. I can't remember exactly what was
in it, but it's called the like Howdy latte or
something like that. They have actually sell it if you
(03:16):
want to take it home in like a little bag.
Speaker 1 (03:18):
Oh yeah, I saw they had their syrups for sale too.
They have little candles so cute.
Speaker 2 (03:23):
It was delicious, you guys, like actually really good. I
love turmeric. You guys may not know this about me,
but I once took a micro biology class where as
part of my end of the semester project, I took
multiple like natural what are considered like natural healing spices, and.
Speaker 1 (03:42):
I number one.
Speaker 2 (03:44):
Yeah, I put them on some little tiny circles of cloth,
and then I grew a bunch of me coal I
in the plate and right around where the turmeric was
there was no coal like growth. So very cool, actual remedy.
Speaker 1 (04:01):
Alex and I have be taking shots of like pure
turmeric likes not bad. Actually you'll have to try it
when you come over. But it's actually like really fucking good.
The only issue is that if he spills any of it,
then he uses like one of my nice fucking hand houls.
Speaker 2 (04:16):
To wipe it up. Oh that bastard, my God has.
Speaker 1 (04:21):
Also stained our counter. Yeah that is it takes a
little while for it to uh fade, but it's all
good because we're moving so true facts. Anyway, today's a
little different. I wanted to do another heist. I needed
a little breaky poo from all of the doom and gloom.
(04:45):
I love true crime truly, but I think when I
was writing up this case and researching, I was looking
into like one of the scheduled cases that we had
put in our little Google doc, and then I was like,
I think heist, So we're gonna gonna fucking do that today.
Love it, here for it, wild wild West for y'all.
Speaker 2 (05:07):
Welcome over, Butt is a wild wild West.
Speaker 1 (05:09):
That's the only part of the song I know.
Speaker 2 (05:11):
State that's a touch of bullock Elligott, Miss I'm not sure.
I did my best and it blows your chest.
Speaker 1 (05:18):
This is one of the most iconic train robberies in
American history.
Speaker 2 (05:23):
Take Me Back, Daddy.
Speaker 1 (05:24):
Also unsolved technically.
Speaker 2 (05:27):
Oh another onsolvert. Something to keep me up in.
Speaker 1 (05:33):
No, no, no, this one hopefully. I mean, it just
makes me want to go like treasure hunting and.
Speaker 2 (05:39):
Wyoming real bad that love it.
Speaker 1 (05:42):
I never really thought about going to Wyoming, but there's
gonna be some puns in.
Speaker 2 (05:46):
This love it puns intended. This wasn't a trigger warning,
puns intended.
Speaker 1 (05:54):
This wasn't a spur of the moment heist. It was
well thought out and executed with extreme precision. There's a
huge list of suspects, including Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid.
Uh huh, So we're setting stage taking you back. Just
(06:17):
after one am on June second, eighteen ninety nine, Yeah,
the Union Pacific's Overland Flyer number one, a passenger train
traveling through central Wyoming, was running smoothly through the night.
They were on time, you know, no hiccups so far
in their travels. And they were just outside the small
(06:41):
town of Wilcox, Wyoming, when a group of men started
flagging them down with lanterns. And they thought that this was,
you know, like some sort of train signaling, like actual
like train operators trying to make sure that they slowed down.
Maybe the track was off like off it's I don't know, off.
Speaker 2 (07:02):
Was off that rocker.
Speaker 1 (07:03):
Maybe they were thinking that they were going to be.
Speaker 2 (07:05):
Derailed, yeah, or something was on the tracks maybe yeah.
Speaker 1 (07:08):
Or something was on the tracks, so they slowed. The
train came to a halt, only to find that they
were actually being robbed.
Speaker 2 (07:19):
Mm hmmnds me of those boat parts.
Speaker 1 (07:22):
So the main engineer, Grindstone Jones.
Speaker 2 (07:26):
Grindstone Joneses, I guess fuck yeah, all right.
Speaker 1 (07:29):
Jones assume this was a legitimate signaling stop the train,
and immediately they were boarded. Armed men swarmed the locomotive
and they separated the engine and the express cars from
the passenger cars and forced Jones and the firemen to
move the front section of the train about a mile
down the line. What they didn't know was that these
(07:52):
outlaws had also rigged the wooden Trustle bridge that they
had just crossed with dynamite. Wow. As soon as the
main section of the train was clear, they detonated the dynamite,
destroying the bridge and effectively cut themselves off from any
pursuit by rail wild That was smart. So I'm saying
(08:14):
they plant this bitch. Not a spur of the moment.
Speaker 2 (08:17):
No, clearly, no spur, no spur. Here.
Speaker 1 (08:28):
With the train split and the tracks destroyed, the robbers
had all the time they needed to break into the
express car, which housed a heavily guarded safe. They demanded
that the express messenger open it, but he refused, so
instead they used some more dynamite to blow the car open.
They apparently used too much fucking dynamite because they like
(08:52):
obliterated the fucking car, injured the messenger, and also sent
fucking bills flying into the air.
Speaker 2 (08:59):
Oh my god, like a cartoon.
Speaker 1 (09:01):
Yeah. Basically, in the end, they made off with about
thirty thousand dollars to five fifty thousand dollars. So in
today's money that amount would be roughly one million, six
hundred thousand dollars.
Speaker 2 (09:14):
Holy shit.
Speaker 1 (09:15):
So it's a pretty good score on a train on
a train, Yeah, because I guess that's how they would
transport money to money stuff to banks throughout the West.
Speaker 2 (09:25):
Wow.
Speaker 1 (09:26):
So they knew this was a fucking thing. And this
obviously happened several times during this time period where these bandits,
these mass bandits, would hijack a train and fucking steal
all still them.
Speaker 2 (09:41):
That explains a lot why there were so many train
robberies and crustians. I feel like I'm getting it now.
Was really.
Speaker 1 (09:48):
So they escaped at this money. Some of the bills
were scorched, and so it made it easier for them
to track or trace. But the a group of robbers
didn't stick around and spend that money in the area
because they probably knew better. They were not They weren't
(10:08):
complete idiots. They mounted up and disappeared into the Wyoming wilderness.
By morning, law enforcement had launched a massive man hunt.
The Union Pacific Railroad pulled out all the stops. They
hired the Pinkerton Detective Agency still around to day, enlisted
local sheriffs, US Army troops from Fort was Shaky, and
(10:30):
even brought in Native American scouts and bloodhounds. So they
were on the hunt for these fuckers.
Speaker 2 (10:36):
Damn.
Speaker 1 (10:37):
Okay, the train in that part of Wyoming is wide open,
but there's also tons of canyons, caves, and outposts which
make it ideal for these outlaws. In fact, many believe
the gang fled to Hole in the Wall, a remote
outlaw hideout with natural defenses and a long history of protecting.
Speaker 2 (10:59):
Criminals in the walls, called Hole.
Speaker 1 (11:01):
In the Wall. It's in Wyoming, Okay, cool, because I
want to go there, I know saying so. It's a
known It was a known refuge for a group called
the Wild Bunch, which I don't know if you've heard
of the Wild bunch, but they're pretty infamous. Authorities never
(11:26):
formally charged anyone for the Billcock shrobbery, but most signs
pointed to the Wild Bunch, specifically Harry Kid Curry, Logan,
his brother Lonnie Curry, George Curry, who was not related
to them, just had the same last name It's Ironic,
and a few other known associates. It's often believed that
Butch Cassidy may have also been involved, although he was
(11:48):
not ever tied to the scene. They think that maybe
he just helped plan out this heist.
Speaker 2 (11:53):
Wow, dude, that said kid Curry was.
Speaker 1 (11:57):
A known explosives expert and well apparently not, because he
blew that fucking I.
Speaker 2 (12:02):
Think he overdid it a little.
Speaker 1 (12:03):
I wouldn't say expert, but at least they you know,
the trestle bridge was a little bit.
Speaker 2 (12:08):
He knew how to make things.
Speaker 1 (12:09):
He was an explosives dabbler. He dabbled in explosives.
Speaker 2 (12:16):
He was an explosives intermediate.
Speaker 1 (12:20):
Dabbler, known to blow some shit up. He dabbles the
dynamite dabbler.
Speaker 2 (12:25):
Oh my god, that's the name.
Speaker 1 (12:34):
He was later linked to other train robberies using similar methods,
and were portedly admitted to being involved in Wilcox so
Kid Curry was likely a.
Speaker 2 (12:43):
Part of this host The Dynamite Dabbler.
Speaker 1 (12:45):
The Dynamite Dabbler, Kid Curry was likely involved. Not long
after the heist, Kid Curry and George Curry were seen
with large amounts of money, and both were later involved
in deadly shootouts with lawman. Sheriff Joe Hayes of Converse
County was killed in one such encounter just weeks after
the robbery.
Speaker 2 (13:05):
Damn.
Speaker 1 (13:05):
So, they probably likely try to take them in for questioning,
and they were like, this is the wild wild West.
Let me just buckle up to your.
Speaker 2 (13:13):
Buthole, grind onto your but hoole, baby, We're out.
Speaker 1 (13:19):
Despite the scale of the search, dozens of lawmen, hundreds
of miles of train covered, none of the stolen money
was ever recovered, and no one ever stood trial for
the crime. Getting scattered, some were killed in later gunfights,
and others, like Cassidy and the Sundance Kid, are believed
to have fled to South America.
Speaker 2 (13:36):
Wow.
Speaker 1 (13:38):
The Wilcox train robbery was a turning point. After this,
the Union, Pacific and other railroads started to upgrade their security.
They reinforced the cars had armed guards posted, and they
used tighter procedures to make sure that the train made
it to its destination.
Speaker 2 (13:53):
Holy shit.
Speaker 1 (13:54):
Train robberies didn't stop overnight, obviously, but the wild West
was slowly.
Speaker 2 (13:59):
Closing closing in what I don't know, closing in on
the trains.
Speaker 1 (14:05):
I think it's mostly the like the wild West was
slowly starting to be more populated, so there was likely
that I see, trains were going to be robbed because.
Speaker 2 (14:14):
The wild West was slowly becoming disappearing. We'll say, yeah,
there's still aspects of it here disappeared right. What makes
this case so interesting, though, is how professional the job was.
Minus upliterating the fucking yeah, it's crazy.
Speaker 1 (14:31):
They don't think it was just a band of drifters
trying their luck with this train. They are fairly certain
that it was obviously planned for weeks, if not months,
and they got away without a trace for the most part.
And they think this is because the money they spent
probably small amounts of money and spread it out, or
(14:53):
they might have traded it for horses or other goods.
And also if they had gone down to South America
or some shit, then.
Speaker 2 (15:00):
Yeah, how would you how it would be very difficult to.
Speaker 1 (15:03):
Trace, especially in this that time period.
Speaker 2 (15:07):
Who takes that hit the bank?
Speaker 1 (15:11):
I would have seen they probably have fucking insurance, though
with who other banks?
Speaker 2 (15:18):
I don't fucking know how this works. Excuse me. Financial
officers helped me understand in the eighteen hundreds who ensured
the banks? That's crazy, dude, what a wild story.
Speaker 1 (15:29):
Mm hm. So I'm going to run down some of
the suspects, now, yes, ma'am. So obviously, like I had mentioned,
the wild Bunch is one of the first and like
foremost of the list of suspects. Harry kid Curry.
Speaker 2 (15:46):
Thinking you're saying kid Cutty and it's.
Speaker 1 (15:48):
Like Harry kid Cutty Logan. So kid Curry or Harry
Logan shows up time and time again when you research
this case. Known for him, his violent tendencies and his
dabbling with explosives. It says skill, but we'll just say
she dabbled. He was the dabbler.
Speaker 2 (16:06):
He's the dabbling.
Speaker 1 (16:07):
He did a long criminal record and was already being
pursued for other train robberies, so he was suspecting other robberies.
Speaker 2 (16:14):
So he's Pinkerton.
Speaker 1 (16:16):
De Texas suspected him early on, and he was later
connected to a shootout near Tipton, Wyoming, just a couple
of months after the Wilcox robbery, where more stolen money
may have been spent. Some reports say that kid Curry
later confessed to being involved at Wilcox, but there is
not an official record of that. George Curry, no relation
(16:38):
to Kid Curry, like I had mentioned before, was killed
in nineteen hundred, so a year after this robbery, during
a confrontation with law enforcement in Utah.
Speaker 2 (16:49):
Wow.
Speaker 1 (16:50):
George is believed to be one of the writers spotted
fleeing the Wilcox scene, so somebody had identified him fleeing
the scene after the robbery occurred, but obviously he died
so they weren't able to question him about it.
Speaker 2 (17:01):
That's wild.
Speaker 1 (17:02):
Lonnie Curry, kid Curry's younger brother, was also implicated, though
his exact role in the robbery remains uncertain. He was
later captured and died by suicide in jail while awaiting
extradition for unrelated crimes.
Speaker 2 (17:15):
Oh damn, he said, you'll never get me a lot
of coppers, But then they did, and then he was
like reverse the reverse.
Speaker 1 (17:23):
I yeah, kill myself. You can't hang me.
Speaker 3 (17:25):
Uh.
Speaker 1 (17:26):
There's also a speculation that el Z Lay, one of
Butch Cassidy's most trusted partners, may have been involved. He
had a military style organizational skills he had hold on.
Let's rephrase that Lay had military style organizational skills, so
he likely was the mastermind behind it, and he also
(17:49):
helped plan other Wild Bunch robberies, including the tip and
heist that happened just a year later. After being captured
in New Mexico in eighteen ninety nine, Lay served time
in prison, but there's some speculation that his arrest might
have been connected to the fallout from Wilcox.
Speaker 2 (18:06):
Interesting, Okay, ask.
Speaker 1 (18:08):
For Butcher Cassidy himself. It also, his name comes up
a lot when talking about this case this heist because
of his association with the Wild Bunch, but there's no
solid evidence, like I had mentioned before, linking him to
this robbery. In fact, a lot of people speculate that
(18:29):
he was distancing himself from criminal activity like this and
just trying to lay low and live out the rest
of his life without having.
Speaker 2 (18:36):
To yeah crazy exactly.
Speaker 1 (18:41):
It's likely that he knew about it, maybe helped plan,
but he wasn't there himself. So what happened to the money.
You ask, but I do ask.
Speaker 2 (18:49):
No one knows it's out in circulation today, people.
Speaker 1 (18:53):
That have been exploring areas of Wilcox, Wyoming have a
luxedly supposedly that they have stumbled across jars or cans
stuffed with old bills.
Speaker 2 (19:05):
You guys, the eyes the money, we can find it all,
We can find it all.
Speaker 1 (19:12):
So they think that maybe the money was divided between
all of the people that had participated in the heist,
and a lot of it was hidden in the bad lands,
especially around areas like Hole in the Wall where you
know it was an outlaw haven. But it's never been confirmed.
And like I said, I probably left the country. So
(19:35):
they likely headed to Mexico and down into South America
where they were able to kind of lay low and
spend that money without being caught.
Speaker 2 (19:47):
What are you doing right now, I'm asking chat gipt
to tell me where it thinks that the money.
Speaker 1 (19:55):
They also think that there's a possibility that some of
the money was laundered through friendly or saloons. That makes
sense in outlaw friendly areas, so places like Brown's Park,
Robbers Roost, and parts of northern Colorado that were known
to harbor the wild bunch and associates. What does it
say to you.
Speaker 2 (20:15):
If only it were that easy. There's verified hidden treasure,
and they.
Speaker 1 (20:23):
Also had different networks. So assuming you are dealing with
just a bunch of outlaws, you're, like I said, trading
that shit for goods, services or horses and the like,
or loot. I don't know, weapons of mass destruction. Just kidding. Sorry,
(20:43):
But in the end, it's still one of the biggest
train heist in in what in the United States, and
it is also that's.
Speaker 2 (20:54):
Gide up, he says. Doctor Chat says, if you're asking
as part of a mystery, scavenger hunt or true crime
story setup, feel pretty give me more contest. Otherwise, if
you're actually packing a shovel, maybe don't quit your day
job just yet. Why does why does have so much sass?
What the fuck?
Speaker 1 (21:11):
It's so sassy?
Speaker 2 (21:12):
Rude? I'm just gonna say, rude. I'm not all right.
Speaker 1 (21:15):
So that wraps up my little story.
Speaker 2 (21:17):
Still unsolved, Still too crazy, dude, and still.
Speaker 1 (21:21):
Raising questions about the outlaws that pulled the shit off.
Speaker 2 (21:24):
That's a lot of outlaws.
Speaker 1 (21:25):
Yeah, And if you're ever out in Wyoming near wal Wilcox,
maybe just keep your eye on the ground.
Speaker 2 (21:31):
Yeah, you never know, bust in some old ass sellars.
Speaker 1 (21:33):
Which you might fucking stumble up. Chawgy.
Speaker 2 (21:36):
But he doesn't think it exists, But I do.
Speaker 1 (21:39):
I think that money is long gone and if it
was buried somewhere, it's probably disintegrated. His book. No, it's
jars money. I mean it's been it's one hundred and
twenty six years now. It's in jars, awesome jars.
Speaker 2 (21:52):
That's crazy little treasure chest. Wow, dude. Yeah, I mean, honestly,
I can't see why you wouldn't just keep the money them, Like,
why hide the money?
Speaker 1 (22:03):
Take the money?
Speaker 2 (22:04):
If I had the money.
Speaker 1 (22:05):
It was a very high profile heist, and it was
like scorched bills, and I assume at that point there
had probably been so many robberies that they were marking
bills that would have been traceable. Yeah, that's true to
an extent.
Speaker 2 (22:19):
They'd still love to catch me, Catch me if you can.
Speaker 1 (22:22):
What the fuckers take that?
Speaker 2 (22:24):
Coppers take that, coppers.
Speaker 1 (22:27):
If you have any if you have any knowledge of
this case, or if you want to chime in with
another heisty heist. I love researching these ones.
Speaker 2 (22:38):
Cannas loves a heist it was a little shorty.
Speaker 1 (22:40):
We did a little half calf on that one, but
uh yellow, it's kind of I guess we could have
deep dived into the characters.
Speaker 2 (22:48):
But that was lovely. I think we needed a little
palate cleanser.
Speaker 1 (22:53):
Yeah, Like I had mentioned, I need a little breaky
break from murder, especially after your fucking Ian parent or
Elaine parents.
Speaker 2 (23:03):
Helen Hornos Elaine parent.
Speaker 1 (23:07):
That's been happening lately in our world world. Yeah, yeah,
it's been a little doomer gloomy and a little.
Speaker 2 (23:14):
Demom and gloomy.
Speaker 1 (23:14):
It's like, you know what, I need a little Yeah,
how do partners?
Speaker 2 (23:20):
I've actually been thinking about taking a horseback riding again.
Oh yeah, because I don't know if you know this,
but I was a horse girl. I didn't know that
little redheaded headgear ass horse girl.
Speaker 1 (23:30):
Dude, fucking precious as fucking I need to see pictures immediately,
stat if you will.
Speaker 2 (23:35):
It was probably one of the most ugly duckling esque
aspects of my life.
Speaker 1 (23:45):
Embrace it for Like Tina Belcher, I was like, Hey,
I love harsish, harsish.
Speaker 2 (23:52):
I'm writing a book about horses. I love the smell
of horses. We should go horseback riding. We should get
good at so when we go to Wyoming to look
for the treasure, it will.
Speaker 1 (24:02):
Be yes, bitch, Okay, there we go. You already got
the stands down. I for some reason, came across this
reel and it was like showing this lady on like
a stimulated horse, and they were like trying to like
get her to ride it properly. I don't know if
it was for Lord of the Rings, but they were
just trying to like emulate like how a proper rider
(24:25):
rides in the saddle. Yeah, how you're supposed to. It
probably was Lord of the Rings related. I don't know
why that came up. But my mom used to work
for the r ranch and she broke horses. Uh cool,
and also did like barrel racing and ship tea wild
(24:45):
And then my great aunt, which is her birthday today,
Happy birthday. And I never listened to this, but she
also worked at the r ranch like her whole life
and married a cowboy when she was like in her forties.
Yeah yeah, wow, cool.
Speaker 2 (25:00):
You come from a rest and peace, you come from
horse people. I do, but I never, like I rode
horses a couple of times, but I feel like it's
not no.
Speaker 1 (25:09):
I mean no, I just think we moved so much
so like getting involved with the community like that, and
it's just like the number of other things that I
wanted to do when I was growing up just wasn't.
Speaker 2 (25:18):
Also, horses are expensive. It's not like you can just
own one, you know, right, you can't just own a horse.
I mean he can.
Speaker 1 (25:23):
You can rent them. I've heard that you can rent
like a stable and keep your horse there and then
abort it and take care of it and then you
can go.
Speaker 2 (25:31):
But that's like, fucking that's a rich people shit, very.
Speaker 1 (25:34):
Rich people shit. Did you know Codin O'Brian has horse?
Speaker 2 (25:37):
Did he get it from Lord of the race at all?
Speaker 1 (25:40):
No, he got it from who Did he get it from? Somebody?
I think it was Steve Martin sent him a horse.
Speaker 2 (25:46):
He's like happy bird.
Speaker 1 (25:49):
Gifted.
Speaker 2 (25:51):
He's all, you're home like a horse man. Hey, all,
Brian a horse.
Speaker 1 (26:03):
David Letterman gave him a fucking horse.
Speaker 2 (26:05):
That's ridiculous. Oh my god.
Speaker 1 (26:07):
I'm like, you're listening to all the Codon brand needs
of friends at episodes, because I like got up to
date with the most recent ones. I've already like updates.
I've gone back into them. And yeah, David Letterman, Letterman
gifts gifted my god, David Letterman gifted Conan a horse.
Speaker 2 (26:23):
That's crazy, no, but kind of cool.
Speaker 1 (26:27):
It is really cool.
Speaker 2 (26:28):
I don't know if he takes care of it.
Speaker 1 (26:30):
Yeah, absolutely, yeah.
Speaker 2 (26:32):
No, No, I mean David Letterman wants to give me
a horse but also rent the stable and stuff. That
would be cool.
Speaker 1 (26:39):
Beck as fuck wouldn't be sad about it, you know
me either. I think horses are cool. I always like
to drive by the horse sanctuary all the way out
to Pyramid and I'll stop in there. But I feel
like they have more and more horses every time I
drive by. It's insane.
Speaker 2 (26:55):
They're probably like, oh God, what have we done? What
are we gonna do? I don't know, I don't know.
The horse population is pretty pretty rough.
Speaker 1 (27:03):
It is insane here.
Speaker 2 (27:04):
Yeah, we have a lot of laws in Nevada that
protect horses. Yes, but they are also, you know, not
a native species, so they eat a lot of the
groundcover and we kind of have a problem with them
taking over.
Speaker 1 (27:18):
Doesn't that isn't that kind of what William.
Speaker 2 (27:20):
Does not kind of sort of he he looks like Yeah,
he does look at range animals, so he looks more
like the plant side of things. But he believes that
horses are a problem. Don't kill him. Don't kill him.
He's just a little guy. But I'm like, I love horses.
I'm like, well, then maybe we should all just invest
in horse birth control if we're so upset about it.
Speaker 1 (27:41):
It's like we do with cats and still the cat population.
Speaker 2 (27:43):
Yeah, exactly. Like they apparently can shoot horses like with
like a like a blow dart, with a blow dart,
but like with a gun.
Speaker 1 (27:52):
Okay, so like a tranquilizer.
Speaker 2 (27:53):
Yeah, but instead of a tranquilizer, it's birth control. Oh
but it's expensive.
Speaker 1 (27:58):
Bitch, Yeah, I bet you borce control. Borce control, birth
control for horses is probably a pretty penny, but.
Speaker 2 (28:06):
It would help all of everybody's problems control. Okay, done,
And now that I'm getting off my soapbox.
Speaker 1 (28:16):
Uh you undercover horse girl, It's truth comes out. You
heard it here first?
Speaker 2 (28:26):
Ding dong, that's me coming in with your horsebacks horse
fact queen.
Speaker 1 (28:33):
I didn't know they shoot horses with birth control. I'm
gonna have to.
Speaker 2 (28:36):
Yeah, it's like a really uncommon way of maintaining the
worst population.
Speaker 1 (28:39):
Couldn't they just like trank them and fix pix them.
I'm sure that's expensive too.
Speaker 2 (28:44):
Yeah, I'm sure. I don't know. It's hard because like
they traveled herds, so.
Speaker 1 (28:48):
I like to separate the female from Yeah, and right now,
I think they.
Speaker 2 (28:52):
Just round them up with like helicopters and ship. Yeah,
they go out of them, round them up, and then
they put them in these like areas and they try
to find them homes. But then the areas are so
overburdened that they just get sick and die. It's actually
really sad. But they're not supposed to kill them because.
Speaker 1 (29:07):
We have a lot of laws and they protect them. Yeah,
it's just like a whole thing. I get really excited
when I see them up on the hillside.
Speaker 2 (29:14):
Me too, I always get I'm like horse.
Speaker 1 (29:19):
Like you always see like big piles of horse poop poo,
and some people, some people like have horses. But I've
also like driven by a house and there's like a
whole herd like fucking in their just poop and all. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (29:33):
Man, my dad lives up off like Virginia, the Virginia
Fa Hills there and there's just wild horses just walking
up and down their streets and ship just shitting' yep,
they just.
Speaker 1 (29:41):
Just be pooping as they walk in.
Speaker 2 (29:43):
Poop's gotta come out, man, I know, crazy wear another grat, fertilizer.
Speaker 1 (29:47):
A bit, probably.
Speaker 2 (29:50):
Fucking horses man.
Speaker 1 (29:51):
Man, we went on a fucking tangent. Anyway, if you
have any case correction suggestions, if you have coffee shops
that we should buck out, or like sweet treats, ice
cream shops, fucking pastry places.
Speaker 3 (30:06):
Uh, cocktail lounges, I don't know somewhere where you go
to get your sweet treats, hit us up on the
old Instagram.
Speaker 2 (30:18):
Scream dot and Dot Sugar, dot podcast, Facebook, Scream and Sugar,
Trough Crime Coffee Hour, Tiki Talk, Scream Dot and Dot Sugar,
or you can email us at Scream and Sugar Reno
at gmail dot com.
Speaker 1 (30:29):
And thanks for sticking around and we'll see you next time.
Speaker 2 (30:34):
Hell yeah, and by the way, we have merch. We
have merch on print to five. It's on our on
our on our social meds social medis, so check it
out right, we'll look it. Yeah, big in until next time,
Say spooky
Speaker 1 (31:31):
Do doo doo doo dooo doo okay so
Welcome back, everyone to another episode of Scream and Sugar,
the True Cramp podcast that dives into the darker side
of humanity while savoring a little sweetness on the side.
I'm your House, Candace, and I'm Sahara, and today we
are going to be talking about the eighteen ninety nine
robbery of the Union Pacific's Overlain flyer number one.
Speaker 2 (00:51):
Hi Saharah, Hi Hannas.
Speaker 1 (00:53):
How do you doing?
Speaker 2 (00:54):
I am doing? Okay, what are you doing?
Speaker 1 (00:58):
I'm I'm good.
Speaker 2 (01:01):
Tell me all about it.
Speaker 1 (01:03):
I uh, I don't know. Summer has been real nice.
It's been so weird not having any homework that I
sometimes find myself like, did you get anxious? Yeah, like
you forgot it anxious? Like what did I forget? Because
I had like that shorty summer class that was only
three weeks and there was literally shit do like every
single day, So for three weeks straight up, Like I
(01:27):
got through it, did well. But now I'm like, I
got the PTSD here all, Like wait a second, wait,
what else do I need to do?
Speaker 2 (01:34):
I forgetting love that.
Speaker 1 (01:37):
Other than that, summer has been great.
Speaker 2 (01:41):
Great.
Speaker 1 (01:42):
Yeah, y'all.
Speaker 2 (01:43):
Guess whose birthday is coming up?
Speaker 1 (01:45):
Guess who's back.
Speaker 2 (01:46):
It can probably.
Speaker 1 (01:49):
Air after that. But yeah, my birthday is on July seventh.
Speaker 2 (01:52):
So sunder Love celebrate extra hard for me.
Speaker 1 (01:56):
Yes, Today I want to talk about a little coffee
shop that we found has taken over the handcraft coffee
shop that we previously had reviewed. They still have like
a little ode to handcraft coffee in there, but it
is now Roamer Coffee House and super cute, super cute,
(02:21):
like it already was. Lots of plants, lots of really
cute Western paintings, and their merch is adorable, so cute.
Speaker 2 (02:31):
Love it.
Speaker 1 (02:32):
I got the Dolly parton mocha, so it was a
banana flavored mocha and it was fucking delicious. Love also
took a bite of William's hamgrew year and fig sandwich.
It was so fucking good, love God. He had it
all over his face and I.
Speaker 2 (02:48):
Was like, bro, that's my mustached man.
Speaker 1 (02:51):
Did you enjoy the funk out of that sandwich?
Speaker 2 (02:53):
He was hungry?
Speaker 1 (02:55):
How did you get to here?
Speaker 2 (02:56):
I had a turmeric merk work a turmeric latte with honey,
and oh I don't remember, I don't I definitely had
oat milk in it. I can't remember exactly what was
in it, but it's called the like Howdy latte or
something like that. They have actually sell it if you
(03:16):
want to take it home in like a little bag.
Speaker 1 (03:18):
Oh yeah, I saw they had their syrups for sale too.
They have little candles so cute.
Speaker 2 (03:23):
It was delicious, you guys, like actually really good. I
love turmeric. You guys may not know this about me,
but I once took a micro biology class where as
part of my end of the semester project, I took
multiple like natural what are considered like natural healing spices, and.
Speaker 1 (03:42):
I number one.
Speaker 2 (03:44):
Yeah, I put them on some little tiny circles of cloth,
and then I grew a bunch of me coal I
in the plate and right around where the turmeric was
there was no coal like growth. So very cool, actual remedy.
Speaker 1 (04:01):
Alex and I have be taking shots of like pure
turmeric likes not bad. Actually you'll have to try it
when you come over. But it's actually like really fucking good.
The only issue is that if he spills any of it,
then he uses like one of my nice fucking hand houls.
Speaker 2 (04:16):
To wipe it up. Oh that bastard, my God has.
Speaker 1 (04:21):
Also stained our counter. Yeah that is it takes a
little while for it to uh fade, but it's all
good because we're moving so true facts. Anyway, today's a
little different. I wanted to do another heist. I needed
a little breaky poo from all of the doom and gloom.
(04:45):
I love true crime truly, but I think when I
was writing up this case and researching, I was looking
into like one of the scheduled cases that we had
put in our little Google doc, and then I was like,
I think heist, So we're gonna gonna fucking do that today.
Love it, here for it, wild wild West for y'all.
Speaker 2 (05:07):
Welcome over, Butt is a wild wild West.
Speaker 1 (05:09):
That's the only part of the song I know.
Speaker 2 (05:11):
State that's a touch of bullock Elligott, Miss I'm not sure.
I did my best and it blows your chest.
Speaker 1 (05:18):
This is one of the most iconic train robberies in
American history.
Speaker 2 (05:23):
Take Me Back, Daddy.
Speaker 1 (05:24):
Also unsolved technically.
Speaker 2 (05:27):
Oh another onsolvert. Something to keep me up in.
Speaker 1 (05:33):
No, no, no, this one hopefully. I mean, it just
makes me want to go like treasure hunting and.
Speaker 2 (05:39):
Wyoming real bad that love it.
Speaker 1 (05:42):
I never really thought about going to Wyoming, but there's
gonna be some puns in.
Speaker 2 (05:46):
This love it puns intended. This wasn't a trigger warning,
puns intended.
Speaker 1 (05:54):
This wasn't a spur of the moment heist. It was
well thought out and executed with extreme precision. There's a
huge list of suspects, including Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid.
Uh huh, So we're setting stage taking you back. Just
(06:17):
after one am on June second, eighteen ninety nine, Yeah,
the Union Pacific's Overland Flyer number one, a passenger train
traveling through central Wyoming, was running smoothly through the night.
They were on time, you know, no hiccups so far
in their travels. And they were just outside the small
(06:41):
town of Wilcox, Wyoming, when a group of men started
flagging them down with lanterns. And they thought that this was,
you know, like some sort of train signaling, like actual
like train operators trying to make sure that they slowed down.
Maybe the track was off like off it's I don't know, off.
Speaker 2 (07:02):
Was off that rocker.
Speaker 1 (07:03):
Maybe they were thinking that they were going to be.
Speaker 2 (07:05):
Derailed, yeah, or something was on the tracks maybe yeah.
Speaker 1 (07:08):
Or something was on the tracks, so they slowed. The
train came to a halt, only to find that they
were actually being robbed.
Speaker 2 (07:19):
Mm hmmnds me of those boat parts.
Speaker 1 (07:22):
So the main engineer, Grindstone Jones.
Speaker 2 (07:26):
Grindstone Joneses, I guess fuck yeah, all right.
Speaker 1 (07:29):
Jones assume this was a legitimate signaling stop the train,
and immediately they were boarded. Armed men swarmed the locomotive
and they separated the engine and the express cars from
the passenger cars and forced Jones and the firemen to
move the front section of the train about a mile
down the line. What they didn't know was that these
(07:52):
outlaws had also rigged the wooden Trustle bridge that they
had just crossed with dynamite. Wow. As soon as the
main section of the train was clear, they detonated the dynamite,
destroying the bridge and effectively cut themselves off from any
pursuit by rail wild That was smart. So I'm saying
(08:14):
they plant this bitch. Not a spur of the moment.
Speaker 2 (08:17):
No, clearly, no spur, no spur. Here.
Speaker 1 (08:28):
With the train split and the tracks destroyed, the robbers
had all the time they needed to break into the
express car, which housed a heavily guarded safe. They demanded
that the express messenger open it, but he refused, so
instead they used some more dynamite to blow the car open.
They apparently used too much fucking dynamite because they like
(08:52):
obliterated the fucking car, injured the messenger, and also sent
fucking bills flying into the air.
Speaker 2 (08:59):
Oh my god, like a cartoon.
Speaker 1 (09:01):
Yeah. Basically, in the end, they made off with about
thirty thousand dollars to five fifty thousand dollars. So in
today's money that amount would be roughly one million, six
hundred thousand dollars.
Speaker 2 (09:14):
Holy shit.
Speaker 1 (09:15):
So it's a pretty good score on a train on
a train, Yeah, because I guess that's how they would
transport money to money stuff to banks throughout the West.
Speaker 2 (09:25):
Wow.
Speaker 1 (09:26):
So they knew this was a fucking thing. And this
obviously happened several times during this time period where these bandits,
these mass bandits, would hijack a train and fucking steal
all still them.
Speaker 2 (09:41):
That explains a lot why there were so many train
robberies and crustians. I feel like I'm getting it now.
Was really.
Speaker 1 (09:48):
So they escaped at this money. Some of the bills
were scorched, and so it made it easier for them
to track or trace. But the a group of robbers
didn't stick around and spend that money in the area
because they probably knew better. They were not They weren't
(10:08):
complete idiots. They mounted up and disappeared into the Wyoming wilderness.
By morning, law enforcement had launched a massive man hunt.
The Union Pacific Railroad pulled out all the stops. They
hired the Pinkerton Detective Agency still around to day, enlisted
local sheriffs, US Army troops from Fort was Shaky, and
(10:30):
even brought in Native American scouts and bloodhounds. So they
were on the hunt for these fuckers.
Speaker 2 (10:36):
Damn.
Speaker 1 (10:37):
Okay, the train in that part of Wyoming is wide open,
but there's also tons of canyons, caves, and outposts which
make it ideal for these outlaws. In fact, many believe
the gang fled to Hole in the Wall, a remote
outlaw hideout with natural defenses and a long history of protecting.
Speaker 2 (10:59):
Criminals in the walls, called Hole.
Speaker 1 (11:01):
In the Wall. It's in Wyoming, Okay, cool, because I
want to go there, I know saying so. It's a
known It was a known refuge for a group called
the Wild Bunch, which I don't know if you've heard
of the Wild bunch, but they're pretty infamous. Authorities never
(11:26):
formally charged anyone for the Billcock shrobbery, but most signs
pointed to the Wild Bunch, specifically Harry Kid Curry, Logan,
his brother Lonnie Curry, George Curry, who was not related
to them, just had the same last name It's Ironic,
and a few other known associates. It's often believed that
Butch Cassidy may have also been involved, although he was
(11:48):
not ever tied to the scene. They think that maybe
he just helped plan out this heist.
Speaker 2 (11:53):
Wow, dude, that said kid Curry was.
Speaker 1 (11:57):
A known explosives expert and well apparently not, because he
blew that fucking I.
Speaker 2 (12:02):
Think he overdid it a little.
Speaker 1 (12:03):
I wouldn't say expert, but at least they you know,
the trestle bridge was a little bit.
Speaker 2 (12:08):
He knew how to make things.
Speaker 1 (12:09):
He was an explosives dabbler. He dabbled in explosives.
Speaker 2 (12:16):
He was an explosives intermediate.
Speaker 1 (12:20):
Dabbler, known to blow some shit up. He dabbles the
dynamite dabbler.
Speaker 2 (12:25):
Oh my god, that's the name.
Speaker 1 (12:34):
He was later linked to other train robberies using similar methods,
and were portedly admitted to being involved in Wilcox so
Kid Curry was likely a.
Speaker 2 (12:43):
Part of this host The Dynamite Dabbler.
Speaker 1 (12:45):
The Dynamite Dabbler, Kid Curry was likely involved. Not long
after the heist, Kid Curry and George Curry were seen
with large amounts of money, and both were later involved
in deadly shootouts with lawman. Sheriff Joe Hayes of Converse
County was killed in one such encounter just weeks after
the robbery.
Speaker 2 (13:05):
Damn.
Speaker 1 (13:05):
So, they probably likely try to take them in for questioning,
and they were like, this is the wild wild West.
Let me just buckle up to your.
Speaker 2 (13:13):
Buthole, grind onto your but hoole, baby, We're out.
Speaker 1 (13:19):
Despite the scale of the search, dozens of lawmen, hundreds
of miles of train covered, none of the stolen money
was ever recovered, and no one ever stood trial for
the crime. Getting scattered, some were killed in later gunfights,
and others, like Cassidy and the Sundance Kid, are believed
to have fled to South America.
Speaker 2 (13:36):
Wow.
Speaker 1 (13:38):
The Wilcox train robbery was a turning point. After this,
the Union, Pacific and other railroads started to upgrade their security.
They reinforced the cars had armed guards posted, and they
used tighter procedures to make sure that the train made
it to its destination.
Speaker 2 (13:53):
Holy shit.
Speaker 1 (13:54):
Train robberies didn't stop overnight, obviously, but the wild West
was slowly.
Speaker 2 (13:59):
Closing closing in what I don't know, closing in on
the trains.
Speaker 1 (14:05):
I think it's mostly the like the wild West was
slowly starting to be more populated, so there was likely
that I see, trains were going to be robbed because.
Speaker 2 (14:14):
The wild West was slowly becoming disappearing. We'll say, yeah,
there's still aspects of it here disappeared right. What makes
this case so interesting, though, is how professional the job was.
Minus upliterating the fucking yeah, it's crazy.
Speaker 1 (14:31):
They don't think it was just a band of drifters
trying their luck with this train. They are fairly certain
that it was obviously planned for weeks, if not months,
and they got away without a trace for the most part.
And they think this is because the money they spent
probably small amounts of money and spread it out, or
(14:53):
they might have traded it for horses or other goods.
And also if they had gone down to South America
or some shit, then.
Speaker 2 (15:00):
Yeah, how would you how it would be very difficult to.
Speaker 1 (15:03):
Trace, especially in this that time period.
Speaker 2 (15:07):
Who takes that hit the bank?
Speaker 1 (15:11):
I would have seen they probably have fucking insurance, though
with who other banks?
Speaker 2 (15:18):
I don't fucking know how this works. Excuse me. Financial
officers helped me understand in the eighteen hundreds who ensured
the banks? That's crazy, dude, what a wild story.
Speaker 1 (15:29):
Mm hm. So I'm going to run down some of
the suspects, now, yes, ma'am. So obviously, like I had mentioned,
the wild Bunch is one of the first and like
foremost of the list of suspects. Harry kid Curry.
Speaker 2 (15:46):
Thinking you're saying kid Cutty and it's.
Speaker 1 (15:48):
Like Harry kid Cutty Logan. So kid Curry or Harry
Logan shows up time and time again when you research
this case. Known for him, his violent tendencies and his
dabbling with explosives. It says skill, but we'll just say
she dabbled. He was the dabbler.
Speaker 2 (16:06):
He's the dabbling.
Speaker 1 (16:07):
He did a long criminal record and was already being
pursued for other train robberies, so he was suspecting other robberies.
Speaker 2 (16:14):
So he's Pinkerton.
Speaker 1 (16:16):
De Texas suspected him early on, and he was later
connected to a shootout near Tipton, Wyoming, just a couple
of months after the Wilcox robbery, where more stolen money
may have been spent. Some reports say that kid Curry
later confessed to being involved at Wilcox, but there is
not an official record of that. George Curry, no relation
(16:38):
to Kid Curry, like I had mentioned before, was killed
in nineteen hundred, so a year after this robbery, during
a confrontation with law enforcement in Utah.
Speaker 2 (16:49):
Wow.
Speaker 1 (16:50):
George is believed to be one of the writers spotted
fleeing the Wilcox scene, so somebody had identified him fleeing
the scene after the robbery occurred, but obviously he died
so they weren't able to question him about it.
Speaker 2 (17:01):
That's wild.
Speaker 1 (17:02):
Lonnie Curry, kid Curry's younger brother, was also implicated, though
his exact role in the robbery remains uncertain. He was
later captured and died by suicide in jail while awaiting
extradition for unrelated crimes.
Speaker 2 (17:15):
Oh damn, he said, you'll never get me a lot
of coppers, But then they did, and then he was
like reverse the reverse.
Speaker 1 (17:23):
I yeah, kill myself. You can't hang me.
Speaker 3 (17:25):
Uh.
Speaker 1 (17:26):
There's also a speculation that el Z Lay, one of
Butch Cassidy's most trusted partners, may have been involved. He
had a military style organizational skills he had hold on.
Let's rephrase that Lay had military style organizational skills, so
he likely was the mastermind behind it, and he also
(17:49):
helped plan other Wild Bunch robberies, including the tip and
heist that happened just a year later. After being captured
in New Mexico in eighteen ninety nine, Lay served time
in prison, but there's some speculation that his arrest might
have been connected to the fallout from Wilcox.
Speaker 2 (18:06):
Interesting, Okay, ask.
Speaker 1 (18:08):
For Butcher Cassidy himself. It also, his name comes up
a lot when talking about this case this heist because
of his association with the Wild Bunch, but there's no
solid evidence, like I had mentioned before, linking him to
this robbery. In fact, a lot of people speculate that
(18:29):
he was distancing himself from criminal activity like this and
just trying to lay low and live out the rest
of his life without having.
Speaker 2 (18:36):
To yeah crazy exactly.
Speaker 1 (18:41):
It's likely that he knew about it, maybe helped plan,
but he wasn't there himself. So what happened to the money.
You ask, but I do ask.
Speaker 2 (18:49):
No one knows it's out in circulation today, people.
Speaker 1 (18:53):
That have been exploring areas of Wilcox, Wyoming have a
luxedly supposedly that they have stumbled across jars or cans
stuffed with old bills.
Speaker 2 (19:05):
You guys, the eyes the money, we can find it all,
We can find it all.
Speaker 1 (19:12):
So they think that maybe the money was divided between
all of the people that had participated in the heist,
and a lot of it was hidden in the bad lands,
especially around areas like Hole in the Wall where you
know it was an outlaw haven. But it's never been confirmed.
And like I said, I probably left the country. So
(19:35):
they likely headed to Mexico and down into South America
where they were able to kind of lay low and
spend that money without being caught.
Speaker 2 (19:47):
What are you doing right now, I'm asking chat gipt
to tell me where it thinks that the money.
Speaker 1 (19:55):
They also think that there's a possibility that some of
the money was laundered through friendly or saloons. That makes
sense in outlaw friendly areas, so places like Brown's Park,
Robbers Roost, and parts of northern Colorado that were known
to harbor the wild bunch and associates. What does it
say to you.
Speaker 2 (20:15):
If only it were that easy. There's verified hidden treasure,
and they.
Speaker 1 (20:23):
Also had different networks. So assuming you are dealing with
just a bunch of outlaws, you're, like I said, trading
that shit for goods, services or horses and the like,
or loot. I don't know, weapons of mass destruction. Just kidding. Sorry,
(20:43):
But in the end, it's still one of the biggest
train heist in in what in the United States, and
it is also that's.
Speaker 2 (20:54):
Gide up, he says. Doctor Chat says, if you're asking
as part of a mystery, scavenger hunt or true crime
story setup, feel pretty give me more contest. Otherwise, if
you're actually packing a shovel, maybe don't quit your day
job just yet. Why does why does have so much sass?
What the fuck?
Speaker 1 (21:11):
It's so sassy?
Speaker 2 (21:12):
Rude? I'm just gonna say, rude. I'm not all right.
Speaker 1 (21:15):
So that wraps up my little story.
Speaker 2 (21:17):
Still unsolved, Still too crazy, dude, and still.
Speaker 1 (21:21):
Raising questions about the outlaws that pulled the shit off.
Speaker 2 (21:24):
That's a lot of outlaws.
Speaker 1 (21:25):
Yeah, And if you're ever out in Wyoming near wal Wilcox,
maybe just keep your eye on the ground.
Speaker 2 (21:31):
Yeah, you never know, bust in some old ass sellars.
Speaker 1 (21:33):
Which you might fucking stumble up. Chawgy.
Speaker 2 (21:36):
But he doesn't think it exists, But I do.
Speaker 1 (21:39):
I think that money is long gone and if it
was buried somewhere, it's probably disintegrated. His book. No, it's
jars money. I mean it's been it's one hundred and
twenty six years now. It's in jars, awesome jars.
Speaker 2 (21:52):
That's crazy little treasure chest. Wow, dude. Yeah, I mean, honestly,
I can't see why you wouldn't just keep the money them, Like,
why hide the money?
Speaker 1 (22:03):
Take the money?
Speaker 2 (22:04):
If I had the money.
Speaker 1 (22:05):
It was a very high profile heist, and it was
like scorched bills, and I assume at that point there
had probably been so many robberies that they were marking
bills that would have been traceable. Yeah, that's true to
an extent.
Speaker 2 (22:19):
They'd still love to catch me, Catch me if you can.
Speaker 1 (22:22):
What the fuckers take that?
Speaker 2 (22:24):
Coppers take that, coppers.
Speaker 1 (22:27):
If you have any if you have any knowledge of
this case, or if you want to chime in with
another heisty heist. I love researching these ones.
Speaker 2 (22:38):
Cannas loves a heist it was a little shorty.
Speaker 1 (22:40):
We did a little half calf on that one, but
uh yellow, it's kind of I guess we could have
deep dived into the characters.
Speaker 2 (22:48):
But that was lovely. I think we needed a little
palate cleanser.
Speaker 1 (22:53):
Yeah, Like I had mentioned, I need a little breaky
break from murder, especially after your fucking Ian parent or
Elaine parents.
Speaker 2 (23:03):
Helen Hornos Elaine parent.
Speaker 1 (23:07):
That's been happening lately in our world world. Yeah, yeah,
it's been a little doomer gloomy and a little.
Speaker 2 (23:14):
Demom and gloomy.
Speaker 1 (23:14):
It's like, you know what, I need a little Yeah,
how do partners?
Speaker 2 (23:20):
I've actually been thinking about taking a horseback riding again.
Oh yeah, because I don't know if you know this,
but I was a horse girl. I didn't know that
little redheaded headgear ass horse girl.
Speaker 1 (23:30):
Dude, fucking precious as fucking I need to see pictures immediately,
stat if you will.
Speaker 2 (23:35):
It was probably one of the most ugly duckling esque
aspects of my life.
Speaker 1 (23:45):
Embrace it for Like Tina Belcher, I was like, Hey,
I love harsish, harsish.
Speaker 2 (23:52):
I'm writing a book about horses. I love the smell
of horses. We should go horseback riding. We should get
good at so when we go to Wyoming to look
for the treasure, it will.
Speaker 1 (24:02):
Be yes, bitch, Okay, there we go. You already got
the stands down. I for some reason, came across this
reel and it was like showing this lady on like
a stimulated horse, and they were like trying to like
get her to ride it properly. I don't know if
it was for Lord of the Rings, but they were
just trying to like emulate like how a proper rider
(24:25):
rides in the saddle. Yeah, how you're supposed to. It
probably was Lord of the Rings related. I don't know
why that came up. But my mom used to work
for the r ranch and she broke horses. Uh cool,
and also did like barrel racing and ship tea wild
(24:45):
And then my great aunt, which is her birthday today,
Happy birthday. And I never listened to this, but she
also worked at the r ranch like her whole life
and married a cowboy when she was like in her forties.
Yeah yeah, wow, cool.
Speaker 2 (25:00):
You come from a rest and peace, you come from
horse people. I do, but I never, like I rode
horses a couple of times, but I feel like it's
not no.
Speaker 1 (25:09):
I mean no, I just think we moved so much
so like getting involved with the community like that, and
it's just like the number of other things that I
wanted to do when I was growing up just wasn't.
Speaker 2 (25:18):
Also, horses are expensive. It's not like you can just
own one, you know, right, you can't just own a horse.
I mean he can.
Speaker 1 (25:23):
You can rent them. I've heard that you can rent
like a stable and keep your horse there and then
abort it and take care of it and then you
can go.
Speaker 2 (25:31):
But that's like, fucking that's a rich people shit, very.
Speaker 1 (25:34):
Rich people shit. Did you know Codin O'Brian has horse?
Speaker 2 (25:37):
Did he get it from Lord of the race at all?
Speaker 1 (25:40):
No, he got it from who Did he get it from? Somebody?
I think it was Steve Martin sent him a horse.
Speaker 2 (25:46):
He's like happy bird.
Speaker 1 (25:49):
Gifted.
Speaker 2 (25:51):
He's all, you're home like a horse man. Hey, all,
Brian a horse.
Speaker 1 (26:03):
David Letterman gave him a fucking horse.
Speaker 2 (26:05):
That's ridiculous. Oh my god.
Speaker 1 (26:07):
I'm like, you're listening to all the Codon brand needs
of friends at episodes, because I like got up to
date with the most recent ones. I've already like updates.
I've gone back into them. And yeah, David Letterman, Letterman
gifts gifted my god, David Letterman gifted Conan a horse.
Speaker 2 (26:23):
That's crazy, no, but kind of cool.
Speaker 1 (26:27):
It is really cool.
Speaker 2 (26:28):
I don't know if he takes care of it.
Speaker 1 (26:30):
Yeah, absolutely, yeah.
Speaker 2 (26:32):
No, No, I mean David Letterman wants to give me
a horse but also rent the stable and stuff. That
would be cool.
Speaker 1 (26:39):
Beck as fuck wouldn't be sad about it, you know
me either. I think horses are cool. I always like
to drive by the horse sanctuary all the way out
to Pyramid and I'll stop in there. But I feel
like they have more and more horses every time I
drive by. It's insane.
Speaker 2 (26:55):
They're probably like, oh God, what have we done? What
are we gonna do? I don't know, I don't know.
The horse population is pretty pretty rough.
Speaker 1 (27:03):
It is insane here.
Speaker 2 (27:04):
Yeah, we have a lot of laws in Nevada that
protect horses. Yes, but they are also, you know, not
a native species, so they eat a lot of the
groundcover and we kind of have a problem with them
taking over.
Speaker 1 (27:18):
Doesn't that isn't that kind of what William.
Speaker 2 (27:20):
Does not kind of sort of he he looks like Yeah,
he does look at range animals, so he looks more
like the plant side of things. But he believes that
horses are a problem. Don't kill him. Don't kill him.
He's just a little guy. But I'm like, I love horses.
I'm like, well, then maybe we should all just invest
in horse birth control if we're so upset about it.
Speaker 1 (27:41):
It's like we do with cats and still the cat population.
Speaker 2 (27:43):
Yeah, exactly. Like they apparently can shoot horses like with
like a like a blow dart, with a blow dart,
but like with a gun.
Speaker 1 (27:52):
Okay, so like a tranquilizer.
Speaker 2 (27:53):
Yeah, but instead of a tranquilizer, it's birth control. Oh
but it's expensive.
Speaker 1 (27:58):
Bitch, Yeah, I bet you borce control. Borce control, birth
control for horses is probably a pretty penny, but.
Speaker 2 (28:06):
It would help all of everybody's problems control. Okay, done,
And now that I'm getting off my soapbox.
Speaker 1 (28:16):
Uh you undercover horse girl, It's truth comes out. You
heard it here first?
Speaker 2 (28:26):
Ding dong, that's me coming in with your horsebacks horse
fact queen.
Speaker 1 (28:33):
I didn't know they shoot horses with birth control. I'm
gonna have to.
Speaker 2 (28:36):
Yeah, it's like a really uncommon way of maintaining the
worst population.
Speaker 1 (28:39):
Couldn't they just like trank them and fix pix them.
I'm sure that's expensive too.
Speaker 2 (28:44):
Yeah, I'm sure. I don't know. It's hard because like
they traveled herds, so.
Speaker 1 (28:48):
I like to separate the female from Yeah, and right now,
I think they.
Speaker 2 (28:52):
Just round them up with like helicopters and ship. Yeah,
they go out of them, round them up, and then
they put them in these like areas and they try
to find them homes. But then the areas are so
overburdened that they just get sick and die. It's actually
really sad. But they're not supposed to kill them because.
Speaker 1 (29:07):
We have a lot of laws and they protect them. Yeah,
it's just like a whole thing. I get really excited
when I see them up on the hillside.
Speaker 2 (29:14):
Me too, I always get I'm like horse.
Speaker 1 (29:19):
Like you always see like big piles of horse poop poo,
and some people, some people like have horses. But I've
also like driven by a house and there's like a
whole herd like fucking in their just poop and all. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (29:33):
Man, my dad lives up off like Virginia, the Virginia
Fa Hills there and there's just wild horses just walking
up and down their streets and ship just shitting' yep,
they just.
Speaker 1 (29:41):
Just be pooping as they walk in.
Speaker 2 (29:43):
Poop's gotta come out, man, I know, crazy wear another grat, fertilizer.
Speaker 1 (29:47):
A bit, probably.
Speaker 2 (29:50):
Fucking horses man.
Speaker 1 (29:51):
Man, we went on a fucking tangent. Anyway, if you
have any case correction suggestions, if you have coffee shops
that we should buck out, or like sweet treats, ice
cream shops, fucking pastry places.
Speaker 3 (30:06):
Uh, cocktail lounges, I don't know somewhere where you go
to get your sweet treats, hit us up on the
old Instagram.
Speaker 2 (30:18):
Scream dot and Dot Sugar, dot podcast, Facebook, Scream and Sugar,
Trough Crime Coffee Hour, Tiki Talk, Scream Dot and Dot Sugar,
or you can email us at Scream and Sugar Reno
at gmail dot com.
Speaker 1 (30:29):
And thanks for sticking around and we'll see you next time.
Speaker 2 (30:34):
Hell yeah, and by the way, we have merch. We
have merch on print to five. It's on our on
our on our social meds social medis, so check it
out right, we'll look it. Yeah, big in until next time,
Say spooky
Speaker 1 (31:31):
Do doo doo doo dooo doo okay so
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