Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:19):
I saw a Justice for Natalie Bollinger group and I
joined it, and there was only probably, like i'd say,
like five hundred members at the time, but at the
end of the day there was two thousand people in there,
and everyone's speculating, putting their theories out there, pointing fingers.
When you start looking at it, I mean, it just
(00:40):
there's something that's weird there.
Speaker 2 (00:44):
I'm so freaked out because, like, she's never done.
Speaker 3 (00:48):
Anything like this before, and I.
Speaker 4 (00:50):
Think something's wrong here.
Speaker 5 (00:53):
My guest says that this whole situation is off. Her
boyfriend called me and he goes, well, I can't find her.
Speaker 6 (01:01):
She's missing, So was my god.
Speaker 7 (01:08):
In the twenty first century, we leave behind the digital
story of our lives, chronicle of our greatest triumphs, but
also our darkest nightmares.
Speaker 8 (01:32):
So can you tell me a bit about Natalie?
Speaker 9 (01:34):
Can you like describe her? What does she look like like?
Speaker 1 (01:37):
What kind of girl is she?
Speaker 10 (01:40):
She was.
Speaker 9 (01:42):
Fantastic, She's very beautiful, gorgeous child.
Speaker 3 (01:58):
She was a twin.
Speaker 9 (02:00):
And Alicia. They're identical twins, but completely different people. Natalie,
she was definitely the anchor of the two. She would
always I'm the big sister I'm the oldest three whole minutes,
but those three minutes, she didn't let you forget it.
It was like a married couple. When they were babies,
(02:25):
they had you know, separate cribs, but they wouldn't sleep
unless they were together. And it was like that throughout
their lives. They used to call each other woom mates
because they shared an apartment from the very beginning. You know,
they both are very talented artists. It's like as soon
(02:49):
as Natalie picked up a cran and started drawing, it
just never stopped.
Speaker 11 (03:02):
She loved people.
Speaker 9 (03:03):
She was very empathetic, very right, yes, very very intelligent.
She wanted to be involved with helping disenfranchise people here
in our country, people who don't get a second look.
And then she had gotten into a really bad car
accident and she wanted to be a nurse after that.
Speaker 7 (03:26):
Because of the.
Speaker 9 (03:27):
Care that they give people, and so that's what she
was going to be going to college for. She graduated
a year early. It was the year before her sister,
because she was really just trying to start her life.
(04:01):
She ended up helping her grandfather in the last few
months of his life. She loved that man so much.
Speaker 12 (04:09):
That was her father figure. Yeah, I do love you
very much. Oh, can't hear you from habit.
Speaker 9 (04:24):
As anyone can imagine someone who is terminal their person
who's there taking care of them. It's a lot. I mean,
she's a nineteen year old girl, you know, she struggled
(04:44):
with her mental health, probably since she was about eleven
or twelve years old, and as much as she would
stand up for somebody else, she would be depressed and stuff.
She's been through counseling. They got engaged, and I was
(05:11):
concerned things that moms, you know, worry about and stuff,
but she said that she was having an extremely hard
time and that he really was there for her and
helped her through a lot of stuff that she struggled
with trying to find her way. Natalie facetimed me and
(05:33):
she pops the camera over to Joey and he's like hey, mom,
and I was like hey, and she's like, guess what
he surprised me with? And I was like what? And
it was a little apartment. I knew what she had
been dealing with with her grandfather, so making these moves
for her life, she was very excited. She saw this
(06:06):
man that was sitting on the street and people were
just passing him. She asked him if he was okay,
and he just talked to her, and she just listened
to him. She was like, you can add me on Facebook,
you know, like treated him like he was a human being.
And that's she carried on. It became where he was
(06:41):
inundating her. It was like a non stop with the messaging.
Speaker 13 (06:59):
I tried hard to make that work.
Speaker 14 (07:00):
I tried hard to be a good person, and you
know what happened.
Speaker 13 (07:05):
And I wasn't even more listening to He.
Speaker 9 (07:08):
Drove to Virginia a few days go by and I
hear this like honk, and it's not just like a beep,
it's like somebody's laid on the horn.
Speaker 15 (07:20):
Just wow.
Speaker 9 (07:23):
So I go and I look out my front door
and he's just laying on the horn because Natalie had
blocked him and wasn't talking to him.
Speaker 13 (07:39):
I didn't know what I had done wrong to her.
Speaker 16 (07:41):
I didn't more.
Speaker 14 (07:42):
All of the story is just because it's not your
fault doesn't mean it's not your fault.
Speaker 9 (07:48):
I go out the front and I'm like, I'm calling
the police, and he just kind of tips his hat
to me and is like, go ahead. They took him
to Virginia Beach psych and that was the last that
I had heard of him. And then she went back
to Colorado and he started again.
Speaker 17 (08:11):
You know.
Speaker 14 (08:12):
I mean, it was bad enough for La Virginia. With
my hero hating me, I'm not even worth listening.
Speaker 16 (08:24):
Yeah.
Speaker 14 (08:24):
No, at this point in my life, there is not
going to be good coming.
Speaker 9 (08:34):
She had even post on Facebook. She called me and
(09:08):
after she got the restraining order, she was super excited
about it because it was like giving her back some power.
I got a call from Joey saying that she was missing,
(09:32):
and he said, I just came home and she was gone.
Speaker 13 (09:34):
She wasn't here.
Speaker 9 (09:36):
I called Alicia and asked her if she had seen
her sister heard from her, and she hadn't.
Speaker 5 (09:47):
Her boyfriend called me, her phone is at the house.
Speaker 7 (09:51):
He was, and it's not like Natalie to just.
Speaker 5 (09:53):
Leave her phone somewhere. He asked if Natalie was with me.
I don't know, he said, If we were, who go.
Speaker 13 (10:00):
On a ride. But I never heard back from and.
Speaker 5 (10:02):
He goes, well, I can't find her.
Speaker 7 (10:05):
She's missing, and so was my death.
Speaker 6 (10:16):
Hey. So just a little bit ago, my girlfriend got
a protection order against this man who's been talking to
her for quite some time, and as I came home
and she's missing and all of her stuff here. I
don't understand it. It's not like her.
Speaker 7 (10:32):
She's supposed to be waiting for me. Tell me what's
her name?
Speaker 6 (10:37):
Natalie Bolinger. This man let me have the protection order
against the Shawn Schwartz, and he's been threatening to come
(11:00):
hunting for her and all that stay there.
Speaker 5 (11:03):
I haven't off on the way.
Speaker 4 (11:04):
Okay, So you guys talked today.
Speaker 14 (11:13):
Or no, mm hmm on your break I have break
in nine nine.
Speaker 7 (11:21):
And at one thirty and we're texting. I could have
sworn we talked on the phone, but it must have
just been a text.
Speaker 18 (11:28):
H been in contact with her all day until the
last test I got from her assemble at the door.
Speaker 4 (11:34):
Does now have any mental health issues?
Speaker 7 (11:38):
She's right to take a suicide spare of times.
Speaker 4 (11:42):
Okay, So she's singing that text message saying somebody's at.
Speaker 7 (11:44):
The front door.
Speaker 13 (11:45):
You haven't been able to get a hold of her since.
Speaker 19 (11:47):
Ye Hi is the SOLUTIONI Ali, my name is David Hydam.
Did you text about Drinkfield Police Department? I know it's
hasn't been that long time, but have you heard from
your sister at all? No, no, okay, any any thoughts
on where she is.
Speaker 6 (12:07):
Honestly, I'm really concerned about the person's shawn.
Speaker 2 (12:11):
I'm so freaked out because she's never done.
Speaker 7 (12:15):
Anything like this before, and I think something's wrong here.
Speaker 6 (12:18):
So I'm going to go look for her.
Speaker 13 (12:20):
I don't want to sit at.
Speaker 6 (12:21):
Home and wait.
Speaker 9 (12:29):
I live eighteen hundred miles away from where she was,
and I put it on Facebook that she was missing.
I was terrified of being so far away. I remember
calling the detective that had been assigned the case. I
just said to him, you need to take this seriously.
(12:49):
I flew across the country on a red eye. I
didn't get a wink a sleep that night.
Speaker 7 (13:08):
Did you leave the house at all for the rest
of Wednesday? No, I'm or a cruse. I'm scared. It's
a complete gift, not any one's stay there. People share
the Okay.
Speaker 11 (13:19):
So then you go to sleep at the apartment that night,
wake up Thursday morning at the apartment. Okay, let's talk
about Thursday when it goes on Thursday.
Speaker 7 (13:29):
The same thing. If you really didn't go anywhere, stay
to the apartment all day.
Speaker 20 (13:35):
I was there all day okay, said, I haven't lived
there except to go to the corners or to get.
Speaker 16 (13:42):
Stuff on Wednesday.
Speaker 20 (13:44):
I don't know what days, but everything pretty I there
might have been a purchaser or two I made with cash,
but I'm pretty sure all my purchasers were made on
my on my debit cards.
Speaker 7 (13:56):
Okay.
Speaker 11 (13:57):
And then today, tell me about your d day today.
Speaker 7 (14:03):
I've been drying on Natalie all day. Did you talk
to Natalie on riglar basis or has she talked to you?
Speaker 20 (14:14):
I wish if she talks to mean less cople the
day she'd do with her family already.
Speaker 7 (14:21):
I had thought she was in Virginia. I didn't even
know she was here. I just wish she didn't have
to waste your time on me. And we're only looking
to you for help. That's why we're here, so we
don't take your a waste because you know her. Thank goodness.
Speaker 9 (14:44):
Nine one.
Speaker 5 (14:47):
With a transfer of a possible be away at Riverdale
Road and Macintosh Farming.
Speaker 21 (14:54):
The Adams Cutting Sheriff's Office is working a homicide investigation
after someone found a dead body off for He Road.
The agency first labeled this as a death investigation, but
switched it over to a homicide.
Speaker 7 (15:09):
I saw it on TV that they found a female.
Speaker 9 (15:13):
I called and spoke with the detectives that were at
the scene and they asked me for some identifiers.
Speaker 22 (15:26):
Corner confirms the body found last Friday is that of
nineteen year old Natalie Ballinger.
Speaker 8 (15:30):
Natalie Bollinger's autopsy reports so she was shot in the head.
Speaker 13 (15:37):
I crumbled, Hi, we.
Speaker 23 (15:52):
Are still trying to follow up on any leads that
may be out there that's going to lead us to
the Natalie's killer.
Speaker 24 (16:02):
The last twenty six hours of nineteen year old Natalie
Bohlinger's life are a mystery.
Speaker 23 (16:09):
We don't have anybody who was either talking with her
through social media or through text, or in person or
on the telephone.
Speaker 5 (16:21):
My guest says that this whole situation is off. Days
after she gets a protection order, she's killed, and he is,
as far as I know of the only person who
actually threatened Natalie.
Speaker 23 (16:36):
We have talked to him and again, not ready to
call anybody a suspect, but certainly a piece of our investigation,
a piece of our timeline.
Speaker 20 (16:47):
Social media is swirling with theories about who killed Natalie.
Speaker 16 (16:50):
Some people believe Schwartz did. He replied in his own
Facebook page.
Speaker 13 (16:54):
Stop picking on me, stop blaming me. I should admit
the truth and take the punishment. Is that what you want?
Do you want to pretend like I'm some monster? Live
or die? This stuff needs to stop.
Speaker 3 (17:24):
Sean Schwartz thirty seven years old. Here's what we know,
according to the court documents. I want to be real
clear about him. He'd been making some posts on Facebook
that led the police to conduct that welfare check. Police
ultimately took him to the hospital, and that's where they
alleged that he became combative and violent. And now Sean
Schwartz is facing assault and resisting arrest.
Speaker 13 (18:01):
I've been instructed not to speak to y'all, but I
got a few more fingers for you.
Speaker 8 (18:06):
Well, do you know what happened to her?
Speaker 9 (18:09):
No?
Speaker 14 (18:10):
You know?
Speaker 13 (18:10):
Who does?
Speaker 10 (18:12):
Tell me?
Speaker 13 (18:14):
How would I know what happened to Natalie?
Speaker 14 (18:16):
What do you guys know?
Speaker 13 (18:17):
All I know is from Facebook messenger and I hate Facebook.
Speaker 8 (18:21):
What did Facebook messenger say?
Speaker 13 (18:22):
It doesn't matter.
Speaker 15 (18:23):
You need to get ahold of the police and talk
to them.
Speaker 13 (18:30):
So they took me to the hospital. They were telling
me that I was on a seventy two hour hold
because I was suicidal. Who wouldn't be. You guys have
been harassing me for a week straight. My best friend
is dead. I've been blamed for everything from stalking to rape,
the child molestation to murder over this. So when I
got out a Border County jail, they had painted me
(18:50):
as some sort.
Speaker 15 (18:51):
Of violent animal on the damn News.
Speaker 22 (19:02):
With Sean Schwartz, we were ninety eight percent sure he
had nothing to do with it.
Speaker 4 (19:07):
The time frames weren't adding up. Once we got into
a cell phone a computer. There was like nothing physical
evidence wise that was indicating and if he had any involvement. However,
thanks to social media that just continued to hamper the case.
Their web pages and their groups and their thoughts and
(19:29):
beliefs and just their constant tips coming in.
Speaker 1 (19:48):
I saw a Justice for Natalie Ballinger group and I
joined it, and there was only probably, like i'd say,
like five hundred members at the time, but at the
end of the day there was two thousand people in it.
And everyone's speculating, putting their theories out there, pointing fingers.
When you start looking at it, I mean, it just
(20:09):
there's something that's weird there.
Speaker 11 (20:11):
You know.
Speaker 1 (20:12):
You see this post and you're like, this guy did it.
Speaker 25 (20:14):
We know he did it back on the day that
Natalie went missing. Within three hours the family was calling
in and reporting her missing.
Speaker 16 (20:23):
She was a nineteen year old teenager.
Speaker 7 (20:25):
You wouldn't think.
Speaker 25 (20:26):
Someone would be surprised that they're gone for three hours
during the day.
Speaker 3 (20:31):
But if you look at it from the flip side,
if you wanted to do harm to Natalie Bolinger and
you found out she had a protective order against someone else,
isn't that a good opportunity or am I reaching?
Speaker 1 (20:42):
That is a great point.
Speaker 4 (20:53):
We're going to look at everybody that has those immediate
close ties.
Speaker 7 (20:58):
Like I said, you have this saying I'm not allowed
in her quote, he.
Speaker 4 (21:02):
Was cooperative with us the whole time. Luckily for us
that his business had video cameras, so we were able
to actually see him working when he said he was
working his.
Speaker 22 (21:12):
Phonees pinging over there, and you were able to clear
him pretty quick.
Speaker 4 (21:18):
You could see that like emotionally, he had just lost everything.
You know, his significant other is his to be wife
so to speak, and his dad hadn't been murdered.
Speaker 22 (21:29):
He was a victim in this too. There was a
vehicle with a group of people known to one another.
(21:50):
One of them ended up feeling disrespected, ended up shooting
someone in the back of that vehicle, dumping them out
as the vehicle drove away. It was very clear from
some of the witnesses that a very caring person in
the vehicle in the shooting had stuck their head out
and was looking back to see if this person was okay.
(22:11):
And the description fit nally to a t. So we
had shown pictures of Natalie to a witness to it
and they were like, oh, yeah, that was her.
Speaker 7 (22:21):
She was there.
Speaker 2 (22:24):
The shoot there form possible. I want to hear from
Markel what happened.
Speaker 7 (22:50):
You don't know who that is now? Yeah, I don't
want she goes down you're getting out of there. I
hit Riverdale, You hit Riverdale. What happened to them?
Speaker 13 (23:05):
Bro?
Speaker 7 (23:05):
I probably slip the bitch came back because I remember
driving right by here. Whatever goes down to the Dairity
Macintosh Dairity. So only know more happened down there.
Speaker 22 (23:14):
We thought they were trying to cover it up, that
maybe they had killed her. As a witness to this thing.
Speaker 7 (23:20):
There is another woman that was shot off of Riverdale.
I want you to find you come clean.
Speaker 16 (23:28):
It is what you saw.
Speaker 7 (23:30):
I don't know what you think you know, but I've
put that on my daughter's heart beat. I don't know
any girl that got shot. I don't know about any
girl that got shot.
Speaker 2 (23:38):
You're there Thursday night, Friday morning, midday Friday.
Speaker 7 (23:44):
Find the body?
Speaker 16 (23:46):
No no no no no no no no no no no.
I don't know who that is.
Speaker 2 (23:51):
Then what is her body? Where you said you turned
around and she's been positively ideas being in your car.
Speaker 16 (23:59):
Sure, I'm not lying to you.
Speaker 2 (24:01):
I just want to figure this out because this girl's
got a family. I'm not gonna who's trying to figure
out what happened to their to their family members.
Speaker 7 (24:14):
Dude, right now, the evidence says that you killed this girl.
Speaker 22 (24:19):
We were kind of like on the brink of solving it.
We're like, okay, if we've got this thing with our
beata solved this shooting and possibly Natalie's there, and it
just completely fell apart.
Speaker 7 (24:35):
Is Avenue. I don't know who that is.
Speaker 22 (24:41):
Miss esco Bell was able to tell me who this
other person was.
Speaker 16 (24:46):
She's alive and well, she confirms your story. That proves
that she confirms my story with I mean, she said, yeah,
I was with him.
Speaker 7 (24:53):
When when he shot camera, scared to shoot out of me?
How can I get ahold of Anthony? Like mom?
Speaker 22 (25:02):
We looked into it more and found Miss Shabez looked
just like Natalie, very very similar features, very similar hyper Ultimately,
Miss chaff As she was the one that had stuck
(25:24):
her head out and was looking at this person and
had nothing whatsoever to do with this case.
Speaker 4 (25:29):
It's almost like a mistaken identity kind of led them
to think that they were helping us out. Ultimately had
nothing to do with our case, but we ended up
helping them with theirs. In the end, we're like, there
you go, are about it. We just solved your case
for you, and they're like, cool, thanks for all, and
then we were back to square one again.
Speaker 16 (25:47):
Who's devastating.
Speaker 22 (25:55):
In this entire time, the phone company still was not
giving us the records have I think, what is it
thirty days to.
Speaker 4 (26:01):
Come by, very frustrating. Immediately we saw that she was
communicating with a phone number that was not listed on
any of her contacts. There was one hundred and eleven
text messages back and forth between them that started up
about five o'clock in the morning on the day she
(26:24):
went missing, until right around the noon, and then there's
just absolutely zero communication after that.
Speaker 22 (26:43):
The first time I ever saw him, I parked down
the street from his house just to kind of do
some surveillance and see what he was doing. He was
just such a meek, kind of nerdy person.
Speaker 4 (26:54):
No criminal history. He had a seatbelt ticket, yeah all
he had.
Speaker 22 (26:58):
He worked at Domino's p and he had called in
sick for like two or three straight days after Natalie's death.
Speaker 4 (27:06):
Which, as Mayer said, it was very like unusual for me.
Speaker 16 (27:11):
I got my glasses so I can see what I'm
saying here.
Speaker 26 (27:20):
I thank you for coming here, right, you know, we're
just going down the list here, Bill, you know what
I mean. So, and unfortunately you never was there, so
that's why we had to come in and talk to you.
Speaker 16 (27:28):
You're free to leave it anytime, you know that, right.
Speaker 18 (27:30):
Yes, So, what I'm thinking this is all about is
someone I was talking to overall exlist. I was just
on there, you know, looking for like pin pals, and
who would that be.
Speaker 7 (27:41):
I don't know her name.
Speaker 18 (27:42):
I never asked, But what drew me to what she
had posted was it was very weird.
Speaker 7 (27:50):
Do you recall kind of what that said? To get
your attention.
Speaker 18 (27:53):
Well, the title itself just said I'm thinking about putting
a hit on myself.
Speaker 7 (28:01):
I believe that's what it said. I am.
Speaker 18 (28:05):
So my first thought was, okay, well, someone obviously needs help.
Speaker 7 (28:10):
It hasn't been getting the help that they need.
Speaker 18 (28:12):
You know, I stuffer from depression and I've tried to
feel myself a few times and I ended up in
the mental hospital because of it. And wow, you know,
being the type of person that I am, I'm you know,
I will do anything to help someone at least stay alive.
You know, my first thought was, I I really want
to help this girl. So after a little bit, I
(28:33):
was like, you know, it's I'm not getting anywhere, you know,
Let's see if I can convince her to meet up
with me and see what happens. So I acted as
though I was responding to her, ad well, if she
asking you a little text. She was asking me like,
you know, how do you wanna do it? Where do
you want to go?
Speaker 7 (28:50):
And stuff?
Speaker 18 (28:51):
And I didn't really give her an answer, you know,
I w it was just real general cause you know.
Speaker 7 (28:57):
I wasn't really thinking about it.
Speaker 18 (28:58):
You know, I convinced her to, you know, meet up
with me, so I went to her place and I
picked her up and we went for a drive. And
during that drive, I and you know, I wanted to
learn what was going on and what was going on
with her life and why she was so depressed and sad.
And she's just real quiet and timid, you know, And
I don't wanna, you know, force her to talk too much,
cause you know, then it kind of gives away what I'm.
Speaker 7 (29:23):
Actually trying to do.
Speaker 26 (29:24):
You know, what did she think you were there for?
She thought I was reponding to the ADDA in what
ru in what way? Like she thought I was going
to be the one to do it, to take her out.
Speaker 10 (29:39):
Uh.
Speaker 18 (29:40):
We drove around for a little bit and you know,
like she was three hours, I can't remember exactly, and
we just talked. Eventually, I think she either got fed
up with me, you know, cause I guess she was
pretty serious about what was going on, and you know,
there was nothing much more we could talk about. And
we went back to the direction where she was living,
(30:00):
and she said, you know, just drop me after.
Speaker 7 (30:02):
That's the last time I saw her. Really, it's that
it turned out the way it did.
Speaker 4 (30:18):
Said, you're a swamper, you want to take breaks out
and swamp I would love one. Because we didn't have
enough to say he was a suspect. We actually didn't
read him was rights. It wasn't until as we start
speaking to him and he starts omitting that he was
at our house and he picked her up and then
he was driving her around. It was kind of at
that point where we're like, hey, we need to take
(30:38):
a break, mirandize this.
Speaker 7 (30:39):
Guy a cigarette.
Speaker 4 (30:46):
So you should understand your rights. You have the right
for me in silent. Anything you say can be used
against you in court. You have the right to talk
to an attorney for advice before I ask you any questions.
If you cannot afford an attorney, I want to be provided
for you before any questioning. Okay, and do you understand
I need you right?
Speaker 7 (31:01):
Yes?
Speaker 16 (31:03):
How long were you guys communicating on Craigslist?
Speaker 7 (31:06):
I know it was really early in the morning.
Speaker 26 (31:09):
That same day. Yeah, so you have no contact with
her before? This was just and it just kind of
went yeah, wow.
Speaker 7 (31:17):
Okay, still doing that whole time talking to she would
tell you her name or anything. I never asked.
Speaker 18 (31:24):
I initially went in, you know, thinking, you know, I
just want to talk to her, you know, see what's
going on, find out what exactly is happening. But I
knew if the way I worded it, she wouldn't talk
to me at all, talk about how what.
Speaker 26 (31:36):
You're talking to her about, because she thinks you're legit
because you're probably you're feeding into it, talk about how
you're feeding into it.
Speaker 18 (31:42):
So I mainly ask her what her plan would be and.
Speaker 7 (31:49):
How she wanted it to get to go, and what
is she saying?
Speaker 16 (31:52):
When you say how do you want to do it?
Speaker 18 (31:54):
That's when she tells me that she was thinking about
just doing an execution style you know, she does don't
want to see it.
Speaker 7 (32:04):
Do you own any guns?
Speaker 22 (32:05):
No?
Speaker 7 (32:05):
Okay, So then you let her know that and then
she says, I have a gun. Well I told her.
Speaker 18 (32:10):
That that I wouldn't be able to get one anytime Sam,
And that's.
Speaker 7 (32:16):
When she brought it up. She said she had one.
Speaker 18 (32:19):
She starts asking about like how much it would cost,
you know, and I'm like, well, usually it's like hundreds
of thousands of dollars or things that could be sold
for you know, value, and she says, you know, the
gun's worth money.
Speaker 7 (32:34):
So you know, I went along with the role because
I'm a very avid.
Speaker 18 (32:40):
I mean what alone, I'm a very avid role player online.
Speaker 16 (32:44):
How do you go about taking the persona of a hitman?
Speaker 10 (32:47):
Though?
Speaker 18 (32:47):
How do you take that role off? It really fascinates
me as a writer. I have a character that's for
the horror genre. His name is Aki. He's also just
a psychon, you.
Speaker 7 (32:57):
Know, like he'll lure you in and I him. Yeah,
all right.
Speaker 18 (33:02):
My last year in high school, I was writing down
a rough draft for something I wanted to experiment on,
and I left it in class and ended up getting
any trouble because they thought that I was actually going
to hurt someone.
Speaker 7 (33:15):
Well that's interesting, man, What would make you kid in trouble?
Speaker 18 (33:19):
Well, it was basically like a journal entry, like dear Diary,
I've been stocking this person for this long and these
are what my plans for that person. It was like
kidnapping and then eventually, you know, murder after torture, just
because this person was supposed to be extremely psychotic to.
Speaker 4 (33:38):
Watch that he had all these altered egos that he
went in a great detail telling me about that were
killing and raping and torturing women. And it was at
the point where we continued on just confronting him with
new stuff.
Speaker 16 (33:52):
How long do you take us in your car?
Speaker 7 (33:55):
Maybe you want a half three hours ish, because you
guys are cruising around for a good bit of amount
of time. Couldn't bet him hot time? Did you take
the highway the same way? Did you get her back home?
Speaker 22 (34:07):
No?
Speaker 18 (34:07):
I used a GPS to take side roads back up.
Speaker 7 (34:12):
And then I just went to work. He never went
down Riverdale and went time. You just got the shops
straight up, not that I remember.
Speaker 26 (34:20):
So you had your phone with you the whole time, right, Yes,
nobody ever used your phone, just your just me.
Speaker 7 (34:26):
Okay, we have.
Speaker 16 (34:29):
Mapped out basically right he what he's holding right there.
Speaker 7 (34:31):
I'll show you.
Speaker 22 (34:34):
The GPS coordinates show him leaving his house. It pings
right at to Natalie's apartment, It drives around, and then eventually,
within I believe five yards of accuracy, he's at the
murder scene.
Speaker 4 (34:49):
So your phone's going and picking off these towers. It
shows us that you went to one hundred and sixteenth
in Riverdale.
Speaker 7 (34:54):
I want to tell you she was found sixteenth and
Riverdale in that area.
Speaker 4 (35:00):
We're just starting to catch him in lie after lie after.
Speaker 17 (35:02):
While we're here to try to figure out what happened
to her, all right, and I think that you're not
There are some.
Speaker 7 (35:09):
Things I think you're living now for. Okay, just ask
right now that you've just come forward, go, can you
get everything off your chest? Okay?
Speaker 16 (35:16):
Did everything? Get it all out right now?
Speaker 7 (35:18):
Buddy?
Speaker 27 (35:19):
Wad think you're telling? At some point she just got
really frustrated. She told me to pull over him.
Speaker 28 (35:45):
Yeah, she didn't shoot herself, and I freaked out.
Speaker 7 (36:04):
So obviously we're gonna wanna talk now about how it
really went.
Speaker 10 (36:07):
Okay, you know what's true, then what was not true?
Speaker 7 (36:18):
Kay, let's start there. And so we did drive around
for a little bit, and you know, she was looking
for places to to do it now for me to
kill her.
Speaker 18 (36:32):
She just gets out of my car and I get
out and I start talking to her, but she's over
by the tree.
Speaker 7 (36:39):
I want you to get down that I actually showed
me girl, because I was not there.
Speaker 16 (36:41):
You were the only one that was there.
Speaker 7 (36:44):
So she's like this a little bit while I'm trying
to talk to her.
Speaker 18 (36:48):
I'm not too far from her, and I'm maybe like
this pretty close to her, and I was just trying
to talk her out of it, and she shoots herself
before I can try to reach and grab the guy.
Speaker 16 (37:02):
You say, the gun was like this.
Speaker 7 (37:05):
Or hell, and she just sat down and she put
it like this.
Speaker 4 (37:09):
Then she hired the corners told us that it wasn't
a contact wound. She couldn't have shot herself. And we're like,
you said, you watch the first forty eight hours all
the time. I said, so you know, if we're asking questions,
we already know the answer. On top, she shows the
gud was at least three feet away, so we know
that didn't happen.
Speaker 7 (37:28):
But she didn't shoot herself. Did she give you the
gun when you guys weren wing down? Let it out, bro,
you gotta get off your chest out, get it out.
She asked you to do it, or what you say now,
she was begging for you to do it.
Speaker 17 (37:56):
There's the good it's outside, Sit in your car, it's
in my trump. Her person was in there too, and
bag Stilia.
Speaker 18 (38:08):
Eventually, I just you know, I didn't want it to
affect me anymore, so I decided just to forget about it.
Speaker 13 (38:19):
I ge.
Speaker 3 (38:20):
No, Well, nobody saw this coming.
Speaker 24 (38:22):
At least did not arrest Sewn Schwartz, that man who
had the restraining order, taken out on him, but they
did arrest somebody else, and now they have charged that
somebody else with the murder of Natalie Bolinscher.
Speaker 2 (38:34):
The sheriff says they developed Lopez as a suspect as
a results of quote mining Natalie's social media and phone records.
Speaker 8 (38:41):
Lopez says he contacted Natalie after seeing a Craigslist ad
titled thumping to the effect of I want to put
a hit on myself. It states he used a fake
hitman persona and he agreed to meet her and kill
her with her own gun execution style.
Speaker 9 (38:58):
Detective Peterson let me know that they had caught the
person responsible for this, and he got real, real serious,
and he said, do you think that she would have
posted an ad or something along those lines? And so
I just was kind of like, maybe you replay life
(39:26):
while you're grieving conversations and should have, could have, would have?
She struggled a lot, you know, she took a lot
on but she was definitely taken advantage of.
Speaker 4 (39:47):
It was posted. He answered it two minutes later, and
then like two minutes after he answered that somebody had
saw it and reported it and it was taken down,
so literally, like within that two minute timeframe made the
whole difference in this entire thing. There was no questioning
of why do you want to do this or what's
going on? Instantly it was, Oh, yeah, I'm a hit man.
Speaker 13 (40:08):
I do this.
Speaker 4 (40:09):
This is my price, this is what I normally charge.
And it was early kind of a fantasy in that
journal that he had ever since he was in high school.
Speaker 22 (40:18):
This was a desire of his to do for a
long time.
Speaker 4 (40:24):
We'll never know and be able to prove it, but
I definitely think Natalie would have accepted help if somebody
would have pushed her to it that day.
Speaker 29 (40:39):
She had her entire life ahead of her until that
December day. Natalie was my daughter, my firstborn child, a twin,
a sister, a granddaughter, a niece, and a friend. She
was loved beyond measure As her mother, I loved her
first before anyone saw her face, before Natalie was her name,
(41:05):
before she was her own.
Speaker 2 (41:06):
She we were three.
Speaker 6 (41:09):
Where's my two?
Speaker 30 (41:12):
Mister Lopez fulfilled a fantasy he had cultivated for years
when he carried out the murder of my daughter. The wounded,
grieving hearts of this family will be carried for the
rest of our lives even worse, I think than my
own sorrow is that of Natalie's twin sister, Alicia.
Speaker 9 (41:33):
They equate twin loss the same as a mother losing
her child. It was a devastating jolt for her.
Speaker 31 (41:42):
After several emotional statements from Natalie's family, the judge gave
Lopez the maximum sentence under his plea deal, forty eight
years in prison with five years parole. Natalie's maternal side
of the family says they're at peace with the sentence.
Speaker 9 (42:01):
She's not a character from some show that somebody somewhere
scripts and writes. This is a real human being who
was taken from.
Speaker 7 (42:14):
Us and.
Speaker 9 (42:17):
Will never be the same without her. She was young, beautiful,
and had her future ahead of her.
Speaker 4 (42:29):
Hey, Grylla, happen.
Speaker 22 (42:35):
Merry Christmas, Eve, and I love you a bunch, And
if you still want us to come over tomorrow, I
love you great
I saw a Justice for Natalie Bollinger group and I
joined it, and there was only probably, like i'd say,
like five hundred members at the time, but at the
end of the day there was two thousand people in there,
and everyone's speculating, putting their theories out there, pointing fingers.
When you start looking at it, I mean, it just
(00:40):
there's something that's weird there.
Speaker 2 (00:44):
I'm so freaked out because, like, she's never done.
Speaker 3 (00:48):
Anything like this before, and I.
Speaker 4 (00:50):
Think something's wrong here.
Speaker 5 (00:53):
My guest says that this whole situation is off. Her
boyfriend called me and he goes, well, I can't find her.
Speaker 6 (01:01):
She's missing, So was my god.
Speaker 7 (01:08):
In the twenty first century, we leave behind the digital
story of our lives, chronicle of our greatest triumphs, but
also our darkest nightmares.
Speaker 8 (01:32):
So can you tell me a bit about Natalie?
Speaker 9 (01:34):
Can you like describe her? What does she look like like?
Speaker 1 (01:37):
What kind of girl is she?
Speaker 10 (01:40):
She was.
Speaker 9 (01:42):
Fantastic, She's very beautiful, gorgeous child.
Speaker 3 (01:58):
She was a twin.
Speaker 9 (02:00):
And Alicia. They're identical twins, but completely different people. Natalie,
she was definitely the anchor of the two. She would
always I'm the big sister I'm the oldest three whole minutes,
but those three minutes, she didn't let you forget it.
It was like a married couple. When they were babies,
(02:25):
they had you know, separate cribs, but they wouldn't sleep
unless they were together. And it was like that throughout
their lives. They used to call each other woom mates
because they shared an apartment from the very beginning. You know,
they both are very talented artists. It's like as soon
(02:49):
as Natalie picked up a cran and started drawing, it
just never stopped.
Speaker 11 (03:02):
She loved people.
Speaker 9 (03:03):
She was very empathetic, very right, yes, very very intelligent.
She wanted to be involved with helping disenfranchise people here
in our country, people who don't get a second look.
And then she had gotten into a really bad car
accident and she wanted to be a nurse after that.
Speaker 7 (03:26):
Because of the.
Speaker 9 (03:27):
Care that they give people, and so that's what she
was going to be going to college for. She graduated
a year early. It was the year before her sister,
because she was really just trying to start her life.
(04:01):
She ended up helping her grandfather in the last few
months of his life. She loved that man so much.
Speaker 12 (04:09):
That was her father figure. Yeah, I do love you
very much. Oh, can't hear you from habit.
Speaker 9 (04:24):
As anyone can imagine someone who is terminal their person
who's there taking care of them. It's a lot. I mean,
she's a nineteen year old girl, you know, she struggled
(04:44):
with her mental health, probably since she was about eleven
or twelve years old, and as much as she would
stand up for somebody else, she would be depressed and stuff.
She's been through counseling. They got engaged, and I was
(05:11):
concerned things that moms, you know, worry about and stuff,
but she said that she was having an extremely hard
time and that he really was there for her and
helped her through a lot of stuff that she struggled
with trying to find her way. Natalie facetimed me and
(05:33):
she pops the camera over to Joey and he's like hey, mom,
and I was like hey, and she's like, guess what
he surprised me with? And I was like what? And
it was a little apartment. I knew what she had
been dealing with with her grandfather, so making these moves
for her life, she was very excited. She saw this
(06:06):
man that was sitting on the street and people were
just passing him. She asked him if he was okay,
and he just talked to her, and she just listened
to him. She was like, you can add me on Facebook,
you know, like treated him like he was a human being.
And that's she carried on. It became where he was
(06:41):
inundating her. It was like a non stop with the messaging.
Speaker 13 (06:59):
I tried hard to make that work.
Speaker 14 (07:00):
I tried hard to be a good person, and you
know what happened.
Speaker 13 (07:05):
And I wasn't even more listening to He.
Speaker 9 (07:08):
Drove to Virginia a few days go by and I
hear this like honk, and it's not just like a beep,
it's like somebody's laid on the horn.
Speaker 15 (07:20):
Just wow.
Speaker 9 (07:23):
So I go and I look out my front door
and he's just laying on the horn because Natalie had
blocked him and wasn't talking to him.
Speaker 13 (07:39):
I didn't know what I had done wrong to her.
Speaker 16 (07:41):
I didn't more.
Speaker 14 (07:42):
All of the story is just because it's not your
fault doesn't mean it's not your fault.
Speaker 9 (07:48):
I go out the front and I'm like, I'm calling
the police, and he just kind of tips his hat
to me and is like, go ahead. They took him
to Virginia Beach psych and that was the last that
I had heard of him. And then she went back
to Colorado and he started again.
Speaker 17 (08:11):
You know.
Speaker 14 (08:12):
I mean, it was bad enough for La Virginia. With
my hero hating me, I'm not even worth listening.
Speaker 16 (08:24):
Yeah.
Speaker 14 (08:24):
No, at this point in my life, there is not
going to be good coming.
Speaker 9 (08:34):
She had even post on Facebook. She called me and
(09:08):
after she got the restraining order, she was super excited
about it because it was like giving her back some power.
I got a call from Joey saying that she was missing,
(09:32):
and he said, I just came home and she was gone.
Speaker 13 (09:34):
She wasn't here.
Speaker 9 (09:36):
I called Alicia and asked her if she had seen
her sister heard from her, and she hadn't.
Speaker 5 (09:47):
Her boyfriend called me, her phone is at the house.
Speaker 7 (09:51):
He was, and it's not like Natalie to just.
Speaker 5 (09:53):
Leave her phone somewhere. He asked if Natalie was with me.
I don't know, he said, If we were, who go.
Speaker 13 (10:00):
On a ride. But I never heard back from and.
Speaker 5 (10:02):
He goes, well, I can't find her.
Speaker 7 (10:05):
She's missing, and so was my death.
Speaker 6 (10:16):
Hey. So just a little bit ago, my girlfriend got
a protection order against this man who's been talking to
her for quite some time, and as I came home
and she's missing and all of her stuff here. I
don't understand it. It's not like her.
Speaker 7 (10:32):
She's supposed to be waiting for me. Tell me what's
her name?
Speaker 6 (10:37):
Natalie Bolinger. This man let me have the protection order
against the Shawn Schwartz, and he's been threatening to come
(11:00):
hunting for her and all that stay there.
Speaker 5 (11:03):
I haven't off on the way.
Speaker 4 (11:04):
Okay, So you guys talked today.
Speaker 14 (11:13):
Or no, mm hmm on your break I have break
in nine nine.
Speaker 7 (11:21):
And at one thirty and we're texting. I could have
sworn we talked on the phone, but it must have
just been a text.
Speaker 18 (11:28):
H been in contact with her all day until the
last test I got from her assemble at the door.
Speaker 4 (11:34):
Does now have any mental health issues?
Speaker 7 (11:38):
She's right to take a suicide spare of times.
Speaker 4 (11:42):
Okay, So she's singing that text message saying somebody's at.
Speaker 7 (11:44):
The front door.
Speaker 13 (11:45):
You haven't been able to get a hold of her since.
Speaker 19 (11:47):
Ye Hi is the SOLUTIONI Ali, my name is David Hydam.
Did you text about Drinkfield Police Department? I know it's
hasn't been that long time, but have you heard from
your sister at all? No, no, okay, any any thoughts
on where she is.
Speaker 6 (12:07):
Honestly, I'm really concerned about the person's shawn.
Speaker 2 (12:11):
I'm so freaked out because she's never done.
Speaker 7 (12:15):
Anything like this before, and I think something's wrong here.
Speaker 6 (12:18):
So I'm going to go look for her.
Speaker 13 (12:20):
I don't want to sit at.
Speaker 6 (12:21):
Home and wait.
Speaker 9 (12:29):
I live eighteen hundred miles away from where she was,
and I put it on Facebook that she was missing.
I was terrified of being so far away. I remember
calling the detective that had been assigned the case. I
just said to him, you need to take this seriously.
(12:49):
I flew across the country on a red eye. I
didn't get a wink a sleep that night.
Speaker 7 (13:08):
Did you leave the house at all for the rest
of Wednesday? No, I'm or a cruse. I'm scared. It's
a complete gift, not any one's stay there. People share
the Okay.
Speaker 11 (13:19):
So then you go to sleep at the apartment that night,
wake up Thursday morning at the apartment. Okay, let's talk
about Thursday when it goes on Thursday.
Speaker 7 (13:29):
The same thing. If you really didn't go anywhere, stay
to the apartment all day.
Speaker 20 (13:35):
I was there all day okay, said, I haven't lived
there except to go to the corners or to get.
Speaker 16 (13:42):
Stuff on Wednesday.
Speaker 20 (13:44):
I don't know what days, but everything pretty I there
might have been a purchaser or two I made with cash,
but I'm pretty sure all my purchasers were made on
my on my debit cards.
Speaker 7 (13:56):
Okay.
Speaker 11 (13:57):
And then today, tell me about your d day today.
Speaker 7 (14:03):
I've been drying on Natalie all day. Did you talk
to Natalie on riglar basis or has she talked to you?
Speaker 20 (14:14):
I wish if she talks to mean less cople the
day she'd do with her family already.
Speaker 7 (14:21):
I had thought she was in Virginia. I didn't even
know she was here. I just wish she didn't have
to waste your time on me. And we're only looking
to you for help. That's why we're here, so we
don't take your a waste because you know her. Thank goodness.
Speaker 9 (14:44):
Nine one.
Speaker 5 (14:47):
With a transfer of a possible be away at Riverdale
Road and Macintosh Farming.
Speaker 21 (14:54):
The Adams Cutting Sheriff's Office is working a homicide investigation
after someone found a dead body off for He Road.
The agency first labeled this as a death investigation, but
switched it over to a homicide.
Speaker 7 (15:09):
I saw it on TV that they found a female.
Speaker 9 (15:13):
I called and spoke with the detectives that were at
the scene and they asked me for some identifiers.
Speaker 22 (15:26):
Corner confirms the body found last Friday is that of
nineteen year old Natalie Ballinger.
Speaker 8 (15:30):
Natalie Bollinger's autopsy reports so she was shot in the head.
Speaker 13 (15:37):
I crumbled, Hi, we.
Speaker 23 (15:52):
Are still trying to follow up on any leads that
may be out there that's going to lead us to
the Natalie's killer.
Speaker 24 (16:02):
The last twenty six hours of nineteen year old Natalie
Bohlinger's life are a mystery.
Speaker 23 (16:09):
We don't have anybody who was either talking with her
through social media or through text, or in person or
on the telephone.
Speaker 5 (16:21):
My guest says that this whole situation is off. Days
after she gets a protection order, she's killed, and he is,
as far as I know of the only person who
actually threatened Natalie.
Speaker 23 (16:36):
We have talked to him and again, not ready to
call anybody a suspect, but certainly a piece of our investigation,
a piece of our timeline.
Speaker 20 (16:47):
Social media is swirling with theories about who killed Natalie.
Speaker 16 (16:50):
Some people believe Schwartz did. He replied in his own
Facebook page.
Speaker 13 (16:54):
Stop picking on me, stop blaming me. I should admit
the truth and take the punishment. Is that what you want?
Do you want to pretend like I'm some monster? Live
or die? This stuff needs to stop.
Speaker 3 (17:24):
Sean Schwartz thirty seven years old. Here's what we know,
according to the court documents. I want to be real
clear about him. He'd been making some posts on Facebook
that led the police to conduct that welfare check. Police
ultimately took him to the hospital, and that's where they
alleged that he became combative and violent. And now Sean
Schwartz is facing assault and resisting arrest.
Speaker 13 (18:01):
I've been instructed not to speak to y'all, but I
got a few more fingers for you.
Speaker 8 (18:06):
Well, do you know what happened to her?
Speaker 9 (18:09):
No?
Speaker 14 (18:10):
You know?
Speaker 13 (18:10):
Who does?
Speaker 10 (18:12):
Tell me?
Speaker 13 (18:14):
How would I know what happened to Natalie?
Speaker 14 (18:16):
What do you guys know?
Speaker 13 (18:17):
All I know is from Facebook messenger and I hate Facebook.
Speaker 8 (18:21):
What did Facebook messenger say?
Speaker 13 (18:22):
It doesn't matter.
Speaker 15 (18:23):
You need to get ahold of the police and talk
to them.
Speaker 13 (18:30):
So they took me to the hospital. They were telling
me that I was on a seventy two hour hold
because I was suicidal. Who wouldn't be. You guys have
been harassing me for a week straight. My best friend
is dead. I've been blamed for everything from stalking to rape,
the child molestation to murder over this. So when I
got out a Border County jail, they had painted me
(18:50):
as some sort.
Speaker 15 (18:51):
Of violent animal on the damn News.
Speaker 22 (19:02):
With Sean Schwartz, we were ninety eight percent sure he
had nothing to do with it.
Speaker 4 (19:07):
The time frames weren't adding up. Once we got into
a cell phone a computer. There was like nothing physical
evidence wise that was indicating and if he had any involvement. However,
thanks to social media that just continued to hamper the case.
Their web pages and their groups and their thoughts and
(19:29):
beliefs and just their constant tips coming in.
Speaker 1 (19:48):
I saw a Justice for Natalie Ballinger group and I
joined it, and there was only probably, like i'd say,
like five hundred members at the time, but at the
end of the day there was two thousand people in it.
And everyone's speculating, putting their theories out there, pointing fingers.
When you start looking at it, I mean, it just
(20:09):
there's something that's weird there.
Speaker 11 (20:11):
You know.
Speaker 1 (20:12):
You see this post and you're like, this guy did it.
Speaker 25 (20:14):
We know he did it back on the day that
Natalie went missing. Within three hours the family was calling
in and reporting her missing.
Speaker 16 (20:23):
She was a nineteen year old teenager.
Speaker 7 (20:25):
You wouldn't think.
Speaker 25 (20:26):
Someone would be surprised that they're gone for three hours
during the day.
Speaker 3 (20:31):
But if you look at it from the flip side,
if you wanted to do harm to Natalie Bolinger and
you found out she had a protective order against someone else,
isn't that a good opportunity or am I reaching?
Speaker 1 (20:42):
That is a great point.
Speaker 4 (20:53):
We're going to look at everybody that has those immediate
close ties.
Speaker 7 (20:58):
Like I said, you have this saying I'm not allowed
in her quote, he.
Speaker 4 (21:02):
Was cooperative with us the whole time. Luckily for us
that his business had video cameras, so we were able
to actually see him working when he said he was
working his.
Speaker 22 (21:12):
Phonees pinging over there, and you were able to clear
him pretty quick.
Speaker 4 (21:18):
You could see that like emotionally, he had just lost everything.
You know, his significant other is his to be wife
so to speak, and his dad hadn't been murdered.
Speaker 22 (21:29):
He was a victim in this too. There was a
vehicle with a group of people known to one another.
(21:50):
One of them ended up feeling disrespected, ended up shooting
someone in the back of that vehicle, dumping them out
as the vehicle drove away. It was very clear from
some of the witnesses that a very caring person in
the vehicle in the shooting had stuck their head out
and was looking back to see if this person was okay.
(22:11):
And the description fit nally to a t. So we
had shown pictures of Natalie to a witness to it
and they were like, oh, yeah, that was her.
Speaker 7 (22:21):
She was there.
Speaker 2 (22:24):
The shoot there form possible. I want to hear from
Markel what happened.
Speaker 7 (22:50):
You don't know who that is now? Yeah, I don't
want she goes down you're getting out of there. I
hit Riverdale, You hit Riverdale. What happened to them?
Speaker 13 (23:05):
Bro?
Speaker 7 (23:05):
I probably slip the bitch came back because I remember
driving right by here. Whatever goes down to the Dairity
Macintosh Dairity. So only know more happened down there.
Speaker 22 (23:14):
We thought they were trying to cover it up, that
maybe they had killed her. As a witness to this thing.
Speaker 7 (23:20):
There is another woman that was shot off of Riverdale.
I want you to find you come clean.
Speaker 16 (23:28):
It is what you saw.
Speaker 7 (23:30):
I don't know what you think you know, but I've
put that on my daughter's heart beat. I don't know
any girl that got shot. I don't know about any
girl that got shot.
Speaker 2 (23:38):
You're there Thursday night, Friday morning, midday Friday.
Speaker 7 (23:44):
Find the body?
Speaker 16 (23:46):
No no no no no no no no no no no.
I don't know who that is.
Speaker 2 (23:51):
Then what is her body? Where you said you turned
around and she's been positively ideas being in your car.
Speaker 16 (23:59):
Sure, I'm not lying to you.
Speaker 2 (24:01):
I just want to figure this out because this girl's
got a family. I'm not gonna who's trying to figure
out what happened to their to their family members.
Speaker 7 (24:14):
Dude, right now, the evidence says that you killed this girl.
Speaker 22 (24:19):
We were kind of like on the brink of solving it.
We're like, okay, if we've got this thing with our
beata solved this shooting and possibly Natalie's there, and it
just completely fell apart.
Speaker 7 (24:35):
Is Avenue. I don't know who that is.
Speaker 22 (24:41):
Miss esco Bell was able to tell me who this
other person was.
Speaker 16 (24:46):
She's alive and well, she confirms your story. That proves
that she confirms my story with I mean, she said, yeah,
I was with him.
Speaker 7 (24:53):
When when he shot camera, scared to shoot out of me?
How can I get ahold of Anthony? Like mom?
Speaker 22 (25:02):
We looked into it more and found Miss Shabez looked
just like Natalie, very very similar features, very similar hyper Ultimately,
Miss chaff As she was the one that had stuck
(25:24):
her head out and was looking at this person and
had nothing whatsoever to do with this case.
Speaker 4 (25:29):
It's almost like a mistaken identity kind of led them
to think that they were helping us out. Ultimately had
nothing to do with our case, but we ended up
helping them with theirs. In the end, we're like, there
you go, are about it. We just solved your case
for you, and they're like, cool, thanks for all, and
then we were back to square one again.
Speaker 16 (25:47):
Who's devastating.
Speaker 22 (25:55):
In this entire time, the phone company still was not
giving us the records have I think, what is it
thirty days to.
Speaker 4 (26:01):
Come by, very frustrating. Immediately we saw that she was
communicating with a phone number that was not listed on
any of her contacts. There was one hundred and eleven
text messages back and forth between them that started up
about five o'clock in the morning on the day she
(26:24):
went missing, until right around the noon, and then there's
just absolutely zero communication after that.
Speaker 22 (26:43):
The first time I ever saw him, I parked down
the street from his house just to kind of do
some surveillance and see what he was doing. He was
just such a meek, kind of nerdy person.
Speaker 4 (26:54):
No criminal history. He had a seatbelt ticket, yeah all
he had.
Speaker 22 (26:58):
He worked at Domino's p and he had called in
sick for like two or three straight days after Natalie's death.
Speaker 4 (27:06):
Which, as Mayer said, it was very like unusual for me.
Speaker 16 (27:11):
I got my glasses so I can see what I'm
saying here.
Speaker 26 (27:20):
I thank you for coming here, right, you know, we're
just going down the list here, Bill, you know what
I mean. So, and unfortunately you never was there, so
that's why we had to come in and talk to you.
Speaker 16 (27:28):
You're free to leave it anytime, you know that, right.
Speaker 18 (27:30):
Yes, So, what I'm thinking this is all about is
someone I was talking to overall exlist. I was just
on there, you know, looking for like pin pals, and
who would that be.
Speaker 7 (27:41):
I don't know her name.
Speaker 18 (27:42):
I never asked, But what drew me to what she
had posted was it was very weird.
Speaker 7 (27:50):
Do you recall kind of what that said? To get
your attention.
Speaker 18 (27:53):
Well, the title itself just said I'm thinking about putting
a hit on myself.
Speaker 7 (28:01):
I believe that's what it said. I am.
Speaker 18 (28:05):
So my first thought was, okay, well, someone obviously needs help.
Speaker 7 (28:10):
It hasn't been getting the help that they need.
Speaker 18 (28:12):
You know, I stuffer from depression and I've tried to
feel myself a few times and I ended up in
the mental hospital because of it. And wow, you know,
being the type of person that I am, I'm you know,
I will do anything to help someone at least stay alive.
You know, my first thought was, I I really want
to help this girl. So after a little bit, I
(28:33):
was like, you know, it's I'm not getting anywhere, you know,
Let's see if I can convince her to meet up
with me and see what happens. So I acted as
though I was responding to her, ad well, if she
asking you a little text. She was asking me like,
you know, how do you wanna do it? Where do
you want to go?
Speaker 7 (28:50):
And stuff?
Speaker 18 (28:51):
And I didn't really give her an answer, you know,
I w it was just real general cause you know.
Speaker 7 (28:57):
I wasn't really thinking about it.
Speaker 18 (28:58):
You know, I convinced her to, you know, meet up
with me, so I went to her place and I
picked her up and we went for a drive. And
during that drive, I and you know, I wanted to
learn what was going on and what was going on
with her life and why she was so depressed and sad.
And she's just real quiet and timid, you know, And
I don't wanna, you know, force her to talk too much,
cause you know, then it kind of gives away what I'm.
Speaker 7 (29:23):
Actually trying to do.
Speaker 26 (29:24):
You know, what did she think you were there for?
She thought I was reponding to the ADDA in what
ru in what way? Like she thought I was going
to be the one to do it, to take her out.
Speaker 10 (29:39):
Uh.
Speaker 18 (29:40):
We drove around for a little bit and you know,
like she was three hours, I can't remember exactly, and
we just talked. Eventually, I think she either got fed
up with me, you know, cause I guess she was
pretty serious about what was going on, and you know,
there was nothing much more we could talk about. And
we went back to the direction where she was living,
(30:00):
and she said, you know, just drop me after.
Speaker 7 (30:02):
That's the last time I saw her. Really, it's that
it turned out the way it did.
Speaker 4 (30:18):
Said, you're a swamper, you want to take breaks out
and swamp I would love one. Because we didn't have
enough to say he was a suspect. We actually didn't
read him was rights. It wasn't until as we start
speaking to him and he starts omitting that he was
at our house and he picked her up and then
he was driving her around. It was kind of at
that point where we're like, hey, we need to take
(30:38):
a break, mirandize this.
Speaker 7 (30:39):
Guy a cigarette.
Speaker 4 (30:46):
So you should understand your rights. You have the right
for me in silent. Anything you say can be used
against you in court. You have the right to talk
to an attorney for advice before I ask you any questions.
If you cannot afford an attorney, I want to be provided
for you before any questioning. Okay, and do you understand
I need you right?
Speaker 7 (31:01):
Yes?
Speaker 16 (31:03):
How long were you guys communicating on Craigslist?
Speaker 7 (31:06):
I know it was really early in the morning.
Speaker 26 (31:09):
That same day. Yeah, so you have no contact with
her before? This was just and it just kind of
went yeah, wow.
Speaker 7 (31:17):
Okay, still doing that whole time talking to she would
tell you her name or anything. I never asked.
Speaker 18 (31:24):
I initially went in, you know, thinking, you know, I
just want to talk to her, you know, see what's
going on, find out what exactly is happening. But I
knew if the way I worded it, she wouldn't talk
to me at all, talk about how what.
Speaker 26 (31:36):
You're talking to her about, because she thinks you're legit
because you're probably you're feeding into it, talk about how
you're feeding into it.
Speaker 18 (31:42):
So I mainly ask her what her plan would be and.
Speaker 7 (31:49):
How she wanted it to get to go, and what
is she saying?
Speaker 16 (31:52):
When you say how do you want to do it?
Speaker 18 (31:54):
That's when she tells me that she was thinking about
just doing an execution style you know, she does don't
want to see it.
Speaker 7 (32:04):
Do you own any guns?
Speaker 22 (32:05):
No?
Speaker 7 (32:05):
Okay, So then you let her know that and then
she says, I have a gun. Well I told her.
Speaker 18 (32:10):
That that I wouldn't be able to get one anytime Sam,
And that's.
Speaker 7 (32:16):
When she brought it up. She said she had one.
Speaker 18 (32:19):
She starts asking about like how much it would cost,
you know, and I'm like, well, usually it's like hundreds
of thousands of dollars or things that could be sold
for you know, value, and she says, you know, the
gun's worth money.
Speaker 7 (32:34):
So you know, I went along with the role because
I'm a very avid.
Speaker 18 (32:40):
I mean what alone, I'm a very avid role player online.
Speaker 16 (32:44):
How do you go about taking the persona of a hitman?
Speaker 10 (32:47):
Though?
Speaker 18 (32:47):
How do you take that role off? It really fascinates
me as a writer. I have a character that's for
the horror genre. His name is Aki. He's also just
a psychon, you.
Speaker 7 (32:57):
Know, like he'll lure you in and I him. Yeah,
all right.
Speaker 18 (33:02):
My last year in high school, I was writing down
a rough draft for something I wanted to experiment on,
and I left it in class and ended up getting
any trouble because they thought that I was actually going
to hurt someone.
Speaker 7 (33:15):
Well that's interesting, man, What would make you kid in trouble?
Speaker 18 (33:19):
Well, it was basically like a journal entry, like dear Diary,
I've been stocking this person for this long and these
are what my plans for that person. It was like
kidnapping and then eventually, you know, murder after torture, just
because this person was supposed to be extremely psychotic to.
Speaker 4 (33:38):
Watch that he had all these altered egos that he
went in a great detail telling me about that were
killing and raping and torturing women. And it was at
the point where we continued on just confronting him with
new stuff.
Speaker 16 (33:52):
How long do you take us in your car?
Speaker 7 (33:55):
Maybe you want a half three hours ish, because you
guys are cruising around for a good bit of amount
of time. Couldn't bet him hot time? Did you take
the highway the same way? Did you get her back home?
Speaker 22 (34:07):
No?
Speaker 18 (34:07):
I used a GPS to take side roads back up.
Speaker 7 (34:12):
And then I just went to work. He never went
down Riverdale and went time. You just got the shops
straight up, not that I remember.
Speaker 26 (34:20):
So you had your phone with you the whole time, right, Yes,
nobody ever used your phone, just your just me.
Speaker 7 (34:26):
Okay, we have.
Speaker 16 (34:29):
Mapped out basically right he what he's holding right there.
Speaker 7 (34:31):
I'll show you.
Speaker 22 (34:34):
The GPS coordinates show him leaving his house. It pings
right at to Natalie's apartment, It drives around, and then eventually,
within I believe five yards of accuracy, he's at the
murder scene.
Speaker 4 (34:49):
So your phone's going and picking off these towers. It
shows us that you went to one hundred and sixteenth
in Riverdale.
Speaker 7 (34:54):
I want to tell you she was found sixteenth and
Riverdale in that area.
Speaker 4 (35:00):
We're just starting to catch him in lie after lie after.
Speaker 17 (35:02):
While we're here to try to figure out what happened
to her, all right, and I think that you're not
There are some.
Speaker 7 (35:09):
Things I think you're living now for. Okay, just ask
right now that you've just come forward, go, can you
get everything off your chest? Okay?
Speaker 16 (35:16):
Did everything? Get it all out right now?
Speaker 7 (35:18):
Buddy?
Speaker 27 (35:19):
Wad think you're telling? At some point she just got
really frustrated. She told me to pull over him.
Speaker 28 (35:45):
Yeah, she didn't shoot herself, and I freaked out.
Speaker 7 (36:04):
So obviously we're gonna wanna talk now about how it
really went.
Speaker 10 (36:07):
Okay, you know what's true, then what was not true?
Speaker 7 (36:18):
Kay, let's start there. And so we did drive around
for a little bit, and you know, she was looking
for places to to do it now for me to
kill her.
Speaker 18 (36:32):
She just gets out of my car and I get
out and I start talking to her, but she's over
by the tree.
Speaker 7 (36:39):
I want you to get down that I actually showed
me girl, because I was not there.
Speaker 16 (36:41):
You were the only one that was there.
Speaker 7 (36:44):
So she's like this a little bit while I'm trying
to talk to her.
Speaker 18 (36:48):
I'm not too far from her, and I'm maybe like
this pretty close to her, and I was just trying
to talk her out of it, and she shoots herself
before I can try to reach and grab the guy.
Speaker 16 (37:02):
You say, the gun was like this.
Speaker 7 (37:05):
Or hell, and she just sat down and she put
it like this.
Speaker 4 (37:09):
Then she hired the corners told us that it wasn't
a contact wound. She couldn't have shot herself. And we're like,
you said, you watch the first forty eight hours all
the time. I said, so you know, if we're asking questions,
we already know the answer. On top, she shows the
gud was at least three feet away, so we know
that didn't happen.
Speaker 7 (37:28):
But she didn't shoot herself. Did she give you the
gun when you guys weren wing down? Let it out, bro,
you gotta get off your chest out, get it out.
She asked you to do it, or what you say now,
she was begging for you to do it.
Speaker 17 (37:56):
There's the good it's outside, Sit in your car, it's
in my trump. Her person was in there too, and
bag Stilia.
Speaker 18 (38:08):
Eventually, I just you know, I didn't want it to
affect me anymore, so I decided just to forget about it.
Speaker 13 (38:19):
I ge.
Speaker 3 (38:20):
No, Well, nobody saw this coming.
Speaker 24 (38:22):
At least did not arrest Sewn Schwartz, that man who
had the restraining order, taken out on him, but they
did arrest somebody else, and now they have charged that
somebody else with the murder of Natalie Bolinscher.
Speaker 2 (38:34):
The sheriff says they developed Lopez as a suspect as
a results of quote mining Natalie's social media and phone records.
Speaker 8 (38:41):
Lopez says he contacted Natalie after seeing a Craigslist ad
titled thumping to the effect of I want to put
a hit on myself. It states he used a fake
hitman persona and he agreed to meet her and kill
her with her own gun execution style.
Speaker 9 (38:58):
Detective Peterson let me know that they had caught the
person responsible for this, and he got real, real serious,
and he said, do you think that she would have
posted an ad or something along those lines? And so
I just was kind of like, maybe you replay life
(39:26):
while you're grieving conversations and should have, could have, would have?
She struggled a lot, you know, she took a lot
on but she was definitely taken advantage of.
Speaker 4 (39:47):
It was posted. He answered it two minutes later, and
then like two minutes after he answered that somebody had
saw it and reported it and it was taken down,
so literally, like within that two minute timeframe made the
whole difference in this entire thing. There was no questioning
of why do you want to do this or what's
going on? Instantly it was, Oh, yeah, I'm a hit man.
Speaker 13 (40:08):
I do this.
Speaker 4 (40:09):
This is my price, this is what I normally charge.
And it was early kind of a fantasy in that
journal that he had ever since he was in high school.
Speaker 22 (40:18):
This was a desire of his to do for a
long time.
Speaker 4 (40:24):
We'll never know and be able to prove it, but
I definitely think Natalie would have accepted help if somebody
would have pushed her to it that day.
Speaker 29 (40:39):
She had her entire life ahead of her until that
December day. Natalie was my daughter, my firstborn child, a twin,
a sister, a granddaughter, a niece, and a friend. She
was loved beyond measure As her mother, I loved her
first before anyone saw her face, before Natalie was her name,
(41:05):
before she was her own.
Speaker 2 (41:06):
She we were three.
Speaker 6 (41:09):
Where's my two?
Speaker 30 (41:12):
Mister Lopez fulfilled a fantasy he had cultivated for years
when he carried out the murder of my daughter. The wounded,
grieving hearts of this family will be carried for the
rest of our lives even worse, I think than my
own sorrow is that of Natalie's twin sister, Alicia.
Speaker 9 (41:33):
They equate twin loss the same as a mother losing
her child. It was a devastating jolt for her.
Speaker 31 (41:42):
After several emotional statements from Natalie's family, the judge gave
Lopez the maximum sentence under his plea deal, forty eight
years in prison with five years parole. Natalie's maternal side
of the family says they're at peace with the sentence.
Speaker 9 (42:01):
She's not a character from some show that somebody somewhere
scripts and writes. This is a real human being who
was taken from.
Speaker 7 (42:14):
Us and.
Speaker 9 (42:17):
Will never be the same without her. She was young, beautiful,
and had her future ahead of her.
Speaker 4 (42:29):
Hey, Grylla, happen.
Speaker 22 (42:35):
Merry Christmas, Eve, and I love you a bunch, And
if you still want us to come over tomorrow, I
love you great
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