Beth Barnard & Vivienne Cameron

Small island big problems! Girl slain, wife most likely did it but where is she? Join us as we dive into the murder on Phillipe Island Australia 1986

Episode Transcript

(00:17):
What's happened to everybody? A littlebit of a delayed intro there, but
no big deal. Welcome back toJG's Lounge with another episode of sind At
Eye Sockets. A couple of bigannouncements here. We did break one k
subscribers on YouTube after like four monthsof just like hustling for it. I
think we're like a oneenty twelve rightnow, which is great. Eighty two

(00:39):
thousand monthly listeners last month. Imean we're just we're slaying it. We
are. And when I say we, I mean my guests with me who
are also hosts on shows on JD'sLounge next to me. We've got evolution.
Man. How you doing? Heyman, I'm doing a lot better.
I know we were talking before westarted. Some type of craziness in

(01:00):
a virus or bug or whatever isgoing around and looks like it's not missing
too many people. But yeah,everything's great, man. I'm having a
good time now back and back inaction, so ready to go. Yeah
man, Yeah, I think whathappened was the last show we did together.
I coughed on you and then youcoughed on Sean. Somehow this was

(01:23):
a computer virus. Yeah, exactly. You got it? What happened?
Uh? Like you guys much betterman, you know, five days later
and I'm coming out of the funk, which is nice. So the only

(01:45):
bugs I think any of us aresuffering or the cicadas down south? How's
that going for you guys? Man? I mean, we're not really that
south, I don't think so.It's more Georgia ish Florida area, Louisiana
like we. I haven't no sayingreally because they I think they hit Chicago
and stuff. So I thought therewas an arm of it that was around

(02:06):
you. Actually, I heard therewas a big cicada event in Saint Louis,
so it might have just missed usby that much. I heard they
taste like lobster when Yeah, butyou know what, I'm redneck, but
I am not so redneck where I'mgoing to look at you know what I

(02:30):
mean? A tree crawd ad thatlooks tasty. Yeah, not trying to
do that. It's funny, allright. How familiar are you guys with
the Australia area. I haven't reallytraveled a lot. I haven't been there

(02:52):
yet. Yeah, you travel alot. I've traveled quite a bit in
my time, but I've never beendown on that, but do have a
koala tattoo. My might as wellbe an Australian citizen. Dude, I

(03:13):
know, I I belong down therewith all the Kroi k's and you know
False Starts, by which Fosters.I don't even think is really an Australian
beer. It's not. I knowthere's an effort down there where they like
they slam it down and go FalseStars. I'm pretty sure that it's portrayed

(03:35):
as an Australian beer, but it'snot actually an Australian beer. I want
to look into it later. Mywhole life is a lie. I wonder
what it's like for foster children inAustralia, or like False Stars children.
So you think that's dark. Ifyou checked out our show last night,

(03:59):
I mean I think even evolution wouldhave backed out of it. It was
pretty rough. Wow. That's that'sthat's something for everybody to check out later.
So we're discussing a murder on PhillipIsland, Australia, nineteen eighty six,
and the only thing to connect theisland with the mainland is this bridge.

(04:19):
And on the other side of thebridge, there's like a beach in
like parking area, a little busstop kind of transport people back and forth.
So that's the only way on andoff the island. That's already a
note for me, and gentlemen can'tdo it. Well. Look, man,
you're you're already starting out with someof the basics of a water based

(04:43):
horror story. Okay, isolated island, creepy ass bridge. I bet that
bridge is like going over the MackinawBridge where it's just like it is nail
biting the entire time. And I'msure some species of flying spider snake or
some shit over there. That's right, this is already all bad. It's

(05:03):
already bad. Actually, it's probablyone of the suspects was the flying spider
snake movie Alien. You can createa spoil a snake. Nice. So
Phillip Island is just south of Melbourne, so main city Melbourne. Then you

(05:28):
have the suburbs and you have thisisland. In nineteen ninety two, the
population was five five and fifty twopeople, so very small community on this
island. Everybody knows everybody, andyou have the sheriff that just gets off
vacation on September twenty second of nineteeneighty six. He's getting back into his
job and at seven forty five inthe morning, Don Cameron and Ian,

(05:54):
his brother in law, come infrantic talking about how is unwell and they
need to go check on her,which you guys don't know who that is
yet, but you know how thisshow works, I kind of place.
So the Cameron are three siblings.You got Don Cameron, Fergus Cameron,

(06:14):
Arnie Cameron. They run family farmon the island, and they all live
on the farm on the same street, a little bit down the street from
each other, so very close family. And they also own this like racetrack.
The racetrack really doesn't have relevance,but I want to throw it anyways,

(06:36):
but they're very well known in thecommunity. Like they're more of the
higher end of the families on theproperty or on the island. So a
little bit of jump back here.You got Don Fergus and Marnie Fergus gets

(06:57):
married in nineteen seventy six. He'sone of the main characters in this this
case, to Vivian Cameron. Uhand they have two children, two sons.
They both work on the farm andtheir marriage was never really like a
solid marriage. I mean their communicationwas always kind of poor. She did

(07:17):
the best she could, you know. She was a great mother, took
care of the kids, and Fergusworked two jobs. He helped run the
farm. And then there's something calledthe penguin Parade on the on Philip Island.
They have like they have the largestpopulation of this species of penguin,
and there's a certain time of yearwhere basically everybody gets together and watches them

(07:41):
make baby penguin. So yeah,wow, that says a lot about this
this area. Yes, they actuallyhave a whole like business of people at
work on this penguin parade. Imean I was like, ohhet, my

(08:03):
penguin fucking hat watch the penguins.Fuck yeah, that's that's. What are
they faring? What what are theyfarming? I don't that's a good question,
okay, I mean, do yousee the island. It's not very

(08:26):
big island. It's a small island. I'm not sure. I don't know
what they were farming, whether Iknew or not. Let's just say they
were farming. I don't know,what's something really interesting that they could be
farming? Turnips? Sure, they'return up, they're turnip foreigner farmers.
So we're gonna just make them turnup foreigners farmers for this episode, even

(08:48):
though not matter. No, it'sperfect. This is this is great.
Okay. So fast forward a fewyears. It's nineteen eighty four and a
new girl, Beth Barnard start movesto the island. She's working at the
Penguin Parade. So this is howher and Fergus meet. And I'm sure

(09:13):
you guys can kind of get anidea of where this is going. Fergus
is thirty two and she is twentythree. Wow. Yeah, so it
is let's see here, December No, not December one. I'm kind of
jumping around here. Okay, It'snineteen eighty five and she is now working

(09:39):
on their farm. So the timelapse here is a little all over the
place. But so she starts workingon the farm. Beth is just a
farm maid. She actually gets alongwith the kids really well. Her and
viv are fine. I wouldn't saythey're like friends or anything, but they're
fine. And so her and Fergusare, you know, they're friends at

(10:01):
the time. And then she decidesto throw a party for everybody at the
penguin Parade. This is Beth.She invites everybody from work to her house
for a party one night, andguess who shows up only Fergus. Wow.
Yes. So they're talking and onething leads to another, they hook

(10:26):
up. They end up deciding thatit was a bad idea and they shouldn't
keep doing this, but that doesn'thappen. They continue to sleep together and
this is yeah, I mean,yep, this is in May, so
they're you know, they're starting tohook up in May of nineteen eighty five,

(10:48):
and this continues for quite some time. In December, Vivian walks in
on them in the in a barnand he's got his arm around her,
and she questions him and says,you know, are you sleeping with her?
And he denies it. Of course, Oh yeah, why wouldn't he?
I mean, if you can keepit under wraps for this long,

(11:11):
why not try to keep doing it? And obviously viv starts having her her
ideas of what's going on. She'ssuspicious, and so she wants her and
Fergus to start having a marriage counselingand he denies it or he refuses to

(11:33):
do it, and she's upset withit, and they start to kind of
get more and more just kind ofisolated from each other. And their communication
is already shitty, it only getsworse. So after she gets spot they
get spotted hugging. Beth says,you know, I can't do this anymore.

(11:54):
I'm gonna quit. So she quitsboth jobs and decides she's moving back
to Melbourn, where her family's at. And obviously Fergus is not happy with
this idea, so he talks herinto staying, and she does. She
doesn't. They continue sleeping together.Shocking. Let's see already touch based on

(12:22):
that, Let's fast forward to Augustof nineteen eighty six. Now, people
who are listening to this, Iwant you to understand that I actually had
to take notes for this one,and so I am trying to peer over
here, which this is why Idon't like taking notes. Evolution. You
can do this on your show,but for me it's harder because my notes

(12:43):
are like chicken scratch and I'm tryingto go to them. But I want
everybody on here that's listening to makesure that they're getting all the little details,
which is why I keep kind ofjumping back and forth. So it's
August of nineteen eighty six and Vivianfans that they fixed their marriage or she's

(13:03):
you know, things are just notgoing to work for the two of them.
So he still refuses to do it, but she goes by herself.
She decides, you know, I'mgonna work on myself. I'm gonna start
getting fit. Her friends say thatshe's you know, losing weight, trying
to get back into shape to kindof obviously to probably impress him, because
she's pretty sure she's sleeping he's sleepingaround. Yeah, yeah, there they

(13:28):
are the signs. The signs arethere. The signs are for sure there,
so wait, go ahead, thesigns. So he was hugging another
woman, I mean as far asshe knows, and he won't do marriage
counseling, right, and he washugging her in a barn, in a

(13:48):
barn, and she quit her jobon the farm and then comes back.
I mean obviously I don't the detailsaren't there as far as like did he
leave and come back to who knows? Well? Got okay, all right,
I just you know, like Iget that it's suspect and I know
obviously you're gonna drop some nuggetive knowledge, you know, where you're gonna reveal

(14:11):
this thing. And I'm like,oh, this is a stupid comment from
earlier, but it just I getit. But at the same time,
it's like, you know, thisis a small, incestuous island where they
they have parades where they watch penguinshave sex, which it turns into parties
which makes them have sex. Huggingin a barn is kind of low on

(14:33):
the scale for me, right now, Okay, So okay, So it's
September twenty first, nineteen eighty six, and the penguin Parade's overhead, Marty

(14:54):
Marti, who as I talked aboutat the beginning, is the sister of
Fergus, needs to talk some businesswith Fergus about the family farm. So
she calls the Penguin Parade and says, hey, is he there, and
they go no, this is eightpm at night, right, and they

(15:16):
said he had already left. Soshe goes to his house, which again
they live on the farm together.There are only a few minutes down the
road from each other, and he'snot there. But Vivian is now,
mind you that the parade site isonly about fifteen minutes from where their home
is. So Marnie shows up.He's not there. Vivi is. They're

(15:37):
chatting, and she obviously tells her, well, he thought he was gonna
be here, he wasn't at work, and so she's cracking open a bottle
of wine sipping on it, andthey're there for about an hour, hour
and fifteen minutes waiting on him toget home. He shows up, Vis
been drinking. Marni's clearly like notsure what the hell's going on. He

(16:03):
shows up, he gets a phonecall, like right away, so he
steps away for about forty minutes todo a phone call, and when he
comes back, Marning and him todiscuss her business. She leaves and viv
asks where he was, and headmits that he was at Beth's house,
but just to talk. They werejust talking. She flips out. She

(16:26):
flips out. She breaks the bottleof wine over his head, which cuts
his ear open, and he turnsaway to get away from her, and
she ends up hitting him in theback with this broken wine bottle and cutting
him open three times. So hegoes to the bathroom to you know,

(16:47):
try to clean up a little bit. She's yelling at him and arguing,
and she realizes how bad his injuriesare and she's like, Okay, we
need to get you to the hospital. So she kind of puts things down
a halt and they get in thecar. They get they head to the
hospital by this time, so thisis about a time span between nine fifteen

(17:07):
and ten pm at night, andright away he gets that phone call,
So this all happened after he tossedthe morning and she leaves, so within
a few minutes this all goes down, and a lot of this is confirmed
from the hospital staff that they werethere around this time frame as well,
and even the hospital staff discussed howlike Vivian seemed actually concerned about Fergus.

(17:32):
So after they're there for about twohours and don Don's wife, I believe
Robin is her name. Yeah,Robin is watching their boys. She's just
at their house kind of watching theboys while they're at the hospital. He
on the way after they leave thehospital and he gets stitched up. It's

(17:52):
about twelve o'clock. They discussed thatokay, their marriage, their marriage is
done. You know that they're notgonna fix it. And Fergus's side of
the story is that she is gonnago move back to Melbourne with her family
and the kids will stay on thefarm with him, and that for the

(18:12):
night he should probably stay at hissister Marny's house. So he takes her
to Marny's and again confirmed by multipleof the witnesses that this is the time
lapse that all this goes down.So it's twelve thirty one o'clock in the
morning. He drops she drops himoff and leaves. Marnie and Fergus stay

(18:33):
up for a little while to talkabout things, and he kind of fills
her in on how everything's going.And at three am, no sorry,
seven am, my apologies, alady named Pam calls Marnie. This is
a friend of the family. CallsMarnie at seven forty five saying, hey,

(19:00):
I don't know where viv or Fergusare. I can't get a hold
of them, but I have theirboys and I gotta get to work.
I can't get a hold of anybody. Can somebody come and get them now?
They ask Martie asked, what's goingon? Why why do you have
the boys? And she said,well, I get a call from vividt
three in the morning saying she needsto take Fergus to the hospital. There's

(19:22):
there's an issue with this is becausethey went to the hospital earlier in the
night at ten pm. So Fergusand Martie are both on the phone talking
to this lady and she's just tellinghim how you know, it's just frantic.
Call it three in the morning fromViv saying she needs to take Fergus
to the hospital because he needs somestitches. And Fergus gets nervous. He's

(19:42):
like, Okay, something's up.I think there's something wrong. And he
asked Don and Ian. So Donis his brother, Ian is his brother
in law. Hey, can yougo check on Beth? And they're little
confused as to why, but hesays, you know, I'm worried that
something might have happened. So theysay sure, and they meet up at

(20:03):
Fergus's house. You guys, understandwhy I had to write some of this
down. There's so many freaking namesin here. Absolutely. So they go
to Fergus's house. They see theyhad two vehicles. They had the farm
vehicle and they had a sedan.The sedan is one that Viv typically drive.
That's still on the driveway, butViv's not home, so they continue
on to Beth's house. First thingthey notice is it's morning, the sun's

(20:27):
coming out. This is after sevenforty five, probably eight am, and
her front porch light's still on,and they notice that her back door is
open, and they go inside andthe very first room off to the side
is one of the bedrooms which isopen, and they notice a body on
the floor. They go in andit's Beth, Beth this, laying on

(20:49):
the floor with a quilt over herup to her nose. And they notice
a pull of blood around a body. So they leave. They immediately,
Yeah, they immediately leave, andthey go straight to the sheriff's office and
go ahead. All right, Soa contextual clue, and I know this

(21:11):
one from watching way too many murderporn shows with my wife. But if
somebody put like a quilt or acover over them, that is a sign
of they're trying to care for Now. I may be way off on this,
but I mean I'm also been afterPhD in psychology, so you know

(21:34):
a little bit of knowledge this way. But they if they're doing that,
it's like one of those things wherethey see what they've done, but they're
still trying to cover up the persontake care of them. Do you see
what I'm saying, yes, thereis an attachment there. So this tells
me obviously somebody or I'm guessing somebodyvery very close to them did this thing.

(21:57):
Yep, yes, yeah, it'sdefinitely somebody that's close. And the
investigators to do they all are prettysure that Vivian has done this, but
they don't want to. You know, I'll give away more as we go
here. During the time that donand Ian are doing this, by the

(22:18):
time they get to the police,everybody else is caught up as to their
marriage, about the affair with BethForgaus, you know, they all are
now aware of what's going on.So they get to the sheriff's department,
they tell him he calls her backup, which is from the mainland, and
because it's a small island, theywhenever they need back up. The good
thing is there's a bridge, soit doesn't take very long for them to

(22:40):
get there. But as soon ashe makes a phone call, they go
straight to Beth's house and the sheriffenters before the backup shows up. Donnie
and they're like, are you gonnawait? He's more worried about Beth and
her safety because as far as he'saware, all they've said, is Beth
is not okay, he didn't theymentioned that she was dead because they didn't

(23:02):
really know. All I knew wasblood quilt. He goes, and he
pulls the quote back just enough toreveal her mouth, which has several wounds
on him. Her upper lip isstabbed and one of her teeth are missing.
And then yes, train of herthroat is slit all the way down
to the bone. Several cuts tothe throat all the way down the bone.

(23:26):
And he also notices a knife layingnext to the body, but he
is suspicious stepping, he is suspiciousthat the knife is even the knife that
did the wounds. Go ahead,John, which cut Just sorry, I'm
so sorry. Usually I'm so seriouson these investigator coming in and going that's

(23:48):
not a knife. Well, there'san issue because the knife is a single
blade knife and he's what he reportsis that the wounds look like two slices.
And I don't know if you guyshave ever looked at some of the
different types of kitchen knives. There'ssome that have like the two prongs on

(24:10):
the end of it mm hmm,that are like serrated and they have like
the two prongs on the very endhe said, yes, like like when
you cut the meat and then youstab it like that. Oh wow,
okay, I just want to throwthat in there because those there are different
types of knives. So people whoare listening, you know, if you're
like, well, what do youmean two slices? It has there's one

(24:32):
knife. No, there are differenttypes of knife. Some do actually have
more than one, you know,way to stab something. And so he
is suspicious. He's worried that thatmight not even be the knife that did
this. By this time, theinvestigators show up and they pulled the quilte
down the rest of the way andthey realize that her torso has an A

(24:56):
carved into it and the scarlet letter. Yes, yes, Sean, do
you want to fill people in onwhat the A stands for? Adult tree?
Yes? Wow, that's if you'venot. Okay, so to the
folks listening if you've not. Andthis is a classic the scarlet letter.

(25:18):
Uh this I can't remember name.It was like something goody do good or
something, you know. We hadaccusations of sleeping around and this is back
in oldie timey pilgrim days, andshe had to wear the scarlet letter.
A big a on her chest,which let everybody know that, you know,
she was the town pump, right, So yeah, it's like wearing
a sandwich board saying I'm a whore. Right, that's oh my god,

(25:42):
that's yeah. So this is nineteeneighty six, but that book is actually
very popular. Yeah, now shewasn't the one committing the adultery, but
I mean, in a fit ofrage, who's really going to be thinking
that far into details. So rightaway they're pretty hard set on viv being

(26:03):
the main suspect of this based onthat. Now there is blood smeared all
over Beth's body, which they takesamples of. There is a towel,
like a hand towel in the bathroomcovered in blood which they'd taken to for
investigation, and obviously there's blood allover the room. One thing that the

(26:23):
investigators do know is that there's nota lot of struggle in the room.
There's not stuff broken everywhere, there'snot you know, stuff off the desks.
They said there was some blood onthe bed, which they think Beth
was probably sleeping during the time ofthe attack, wakes up during and there's
a struggle because her body ends upon the floor and that's pretty much the

(26:45):
full extent where she ends up dying, So there's not too much of a
struggle in the house and the onlyother drops of blood they find are by
the back door, like from theperson leaving. Now, I mentioned that
the sedan was left to go ahead. Okay, So there's something called arterial
spray. And you said the neckwas cut down to like the bone and

(27:11):
wherever she was murdered, like,there should be blood just everywhere. Yeah,
oh, like sprayed out you mean, yeah, like any wound that
is here and up bleeds profusely.Yeah. Right. That's why head wounds
are so bad in car accidents andthings, because they may be minor,
but blood just right. Yeah,you're saying somebody hacked down. I mean

(27:36):
you're it's okay, But if youhave that massive of a womb, would
it spray or would it just pullout? Well, I'll give you an
example. When I was an aprology technician, which is dialysis you know,
for those that are not aware,there was somebody that I had the
stint was in their neck and Ihad to put like a heavy gauge needle
into their neck and I made themistake of I put it in and it

(28:00):
didn't feel right, and instead oftrying to keep it in an advance it,
I pulled it out like an idiotand literally, what Yeah, it
hit the ceiling. The blood isspray hit the ceiling like in the scener
is probably a easily because I watchedit and I went, oh shit,
and then you know, clamped themdown. But you're telling me that somebody

(28:25):
act that much and there wasn't justa massive pool of I mean, they
should be able to determine very easily. Yes, so they do to.
Yeah, so they do take inin the samples. Now that the blood
on Beth's body that smeared all overher is her blood. It's nobody else's.
They only find her blood on her. Now, the hand towel in

(28:48):
the bathroom has a Vivian's blood onit, but it does not have best.
But it doesn't have Beth's blood onit. It's only Vivian's blood,
which is very confusing. VIVI actuallyactually not because the knife beside Beth probably
get uh, Vivian Vivian. It'spossible. The only thing I could think

(29:12):
of is that maybe Vivian cleaned herhands off well prior to drying her hands
off, but there, which meansshe would have a wound on her.
Yeah, but there's no other bloodin the house besides on the handtawel that
is hers. Even the drops ofblood heading out of the house are Beths.

(29:33):
What if she got a bloody nose? What if in the struggle she
got cracked in the face, right, that that would make the assumption that
bet Oh you mean viv. Yeah, that's possible. I mean, okay,
so if she all right, soin the struggle, she may have
been scrapped. If you're not sayinganything about DNA and with the fingernails,

(29:55):
WHI, you're probably gonna drops onit on us soon, I don't,
okay. So if there's with theirsigns except for blood on a towel,
and you're talking a struggle and she'sgot the bud. If I get cracked
in the face, my first youknow thing is boom, like, yeah,
I'm covering up any of us wouldIt's just a human reaction, right,

(30:15):
right, So she goes and getsa towel, right, And but
she's in such a painting she'd probablyeven think about it. You know,
it's like blood has stopped. Shedrops it right, So that's my I
don't know, it's just this iswhat that's kind of saying to me right
now, right, Okay, Ilike that. That's that's that's a good
idea, good good assumption. Imean, I guess I could see that.

(30:37):
I can definitely see that again.So they never the sedan was was
still at the Ferguson in Vivian's house, the only other vehicle that she could
have taken as a farm vehicle.So they're looking for a land cruiser with
a bed in the back that's gota bed. Now, like I did
say that, they had to callback up from the mainland, so they

(30:57):
came across that bridge. There's novehicle there. Un tell about four pm
when Pam, which is Don's wife, calls Don and says, hey,
you know, I just passed overthe bridge and the land cruiser is right
here next to the bridge at fourpm. Over the course of the day,

(31:19):
nobody can find viv but the vehicle, the land Cruiser, is right
there with cops going back and forthlooking for Vivian, and all of a
sudden it's it's there. I mean. So if that, with that being
said, that means if viv hadto have been there during the day,
you would think. So Pam pullsover. She looks in the car.

(31:42):
The keys are still in the ignition, the door is unlatched. Her purse
is still in the passenger seat,along with the knife on the floorboard.
But it's a clean knife. Hyeah. So yeah, you guys know
how these episodes go. They getreally weird. There's when the investigators come
to the vehicle. They notice thatthere are bales of hay in the back

(32:05):
of the land cruiser. You wouldn'tthink this is a lot of details,
but there was no hay at Beth'shouse. Now, Sean, you come
from a farm or have lived onfarms, So I mean have you ever
have you ever had hay in theback of your vehicle? Yes at all?
Or do you know hey typically goeswhen the wind's blowing and you lose

(32:30):
them hay right, yeah, okay, yes, absolutely. But I mean
if you have like a you know, like a truck with a cap on
it, you know, or anold trailblazer or something, I mean you'll
throw a couple of bales in there. If you're not because sometimes you don't
get like huge this is very country, but you won't get a bunch of
bales. You might be using themto throw in the bottom of an animal's

(32:51):
pin. You might be putting themaround the house to insulate a water pump
or something like that. So you'renot gonna like bust out a trailer to
bring hay. But as you state, if you have it in the back
of the car and the windows aredown, dude, that stuff is everywhere.
It's like, so this is aflatbed blank cruiser. There's a flatbed
lank cruiser. So with that beingsaid, you the investigators are like suspicious

(33:14):
that. So they call in andsay, hey, you know, the
people who are at best house lookfor Hey, there's no hay. There's
no hay anywhere on the property.Mm hm okay, which would which traces
yeah yeah something, yeah, yeah, agreed, And so that would have
made the assumption that after she murderedBeth she went and got bales of hay

(33:37):
before she decided to just dip out. It does doesn't really make sense.
Well, unless she was trying tocreate an alibi, like she went to
the farm. Oh, like shewas she was going somewhere and picking up
the hay for like, yeah,this is where I was and at this

(33:59):
particular time. Man, how couldit be at two places at one time.
So the investigators are pretty sure it'sViv, but they can't find her.
Over the next two days, they'reinterviewing family and friends, and a
lady named Glinda says that at tenam that day she had a call with

(34:19):
Viv and she sounded perfectly normal,and they discussed getting a gift for one
of their friends. And this isconfirmed with a friend of Glinda's who's there
with her when she's taking the phonecall, who is an out of town
friend, who says, I,you know. She even told the investigators
no, I was leaving that day, so it had to be that day
that she had the phone call.So this is at ten am. There

(34:42):
is no record of this phone callbecause back in the eighty six the only
records that were kept on phone callswere of anything that had to be paid,
so any long distance phone calls.So it had to be a local
call, which means that Viv wasstill on the island at ten am when
all this was going on. Butshe even two days later, she's just

(35:05):
disappeared. Today she's still disappeared.Nobody knows where she is. So the
investigators make the assumption that at somepoint in the day she drove to the
spot where she left the land Cruiserand then committed suicide on the bridge.
However, of course kids use thisbridge to jump off on during the summertimes

(35:28):
to swim and they have a goodtime. Low tide not an issue.
It's not like a spot that peoplego and kill themselves. And there's a
ledge on the edge of the bridgethat has a film of sand that would
build up and would have been noticeablytouched in order for viv to even get
over to commit suicide, she wouldhave had to climb over it. There
was no there's no no suspected likemarkings of her committing suicide. They even

(35:54):
like trolled the waters and couldn't findany clues that she killed herself. H
what do you guys thinking so far? Go ahead evolution. I'm thinking there
was another person involved. Uh,maybe Vivian decided to have a little flinger

(36:15):
of her own, maybe the sheriff, I don't know. But for that
vehicle to get to where it was, if she didn't commit suicide on the
bridge, then there was another vehiclefollowing her to help her get away.

(36:36):
That's what I'm thinking. Now.There is a bus stop there, so
they were. They did check thebus drivers for the day, they did
check even some taxi drivers at workin the area during the day, and
nobody had seen Beth, so nobodyacknowledged that they had driven her off the
island. Vivian, Sorry, Okay, So here's here's the thing. Now,

(37:05):
growing up, you know in theHauller as I did, near a
farm, we used to have thisplace called Green Bridge that we would jump
off when we were kids. Andit was nuts because there was just one
specific spot that you could jump andyou were free and clear right if you
hit the spot, and it wasprobably like a six by eight area.

(37:28):
On all sides around it massive rocks, so if you didn't hit the spot
just right, you could have killedyourself easily, right, right, So
she if she jumped off, it'squite possible if she, I mean,
growing up there, you think shewould know about the spot. But maybe
she didn't jumped off in the wrongplace, cracked her skull. And if

(37:52):
this is an island, I'm assumingit's attached to the ocean somehow, so
she's you know, she's gone,she's fish food, right, But if
there were no indications, you know, on either side of where she could
have jumped off, then I gottaI gotta give a nod to evolution here,
man, Like it really sounds likethe hey, thing's a little weird,

(38:15):
you know, that doesn't really justadds. It just adds like more
of like the weird details. Youknow. Yeah, that's very strange because
when you start talking about a gift, my first thought was, well,
maybe you know there's you know,there's farming and stuff, so they have
access to hay bails that if she'sgoing to this you're talking about this friend

(38:36):
out of town, maybe she's cityfolk, you know, they don't have
access to hay, and then shemight want to do some crafty thing.
They sell that shit at hobby lobby. Right for me, So the friend
out of town was Glinda's friend,not not visus No, but okay,
so well then makes even less sense. I mean, I gotta I get
get to evolution. I think there'ssomebody, because here's the thing it too

(39:00):
to do that amount of damage.I mean, it's very possible that Vivian
did it. Very possible, yes, but to saw a neck all the
way through, it's like as softas we are as humans, we are
incredibly durable, and to do thosekind of things to that level where you're

(39:21):
all the way back here, thatdude, that is some huge effort.
So good. No, I wasgonna say, I think if there is
somebody else involved, then the redflag that's popping up in my head earlier
when you told me about the damageto the body, that fits if somebody

(39:42):
else was involved that you took herrise surprise. Maybe she held her down
while the other person was on theneck, right, and she's just more
carving doing all this other stuff postmortem or right when it's happening, and
she drives, dumps the car off, you know, and this person that

(40:05):
was with her, they go offinto the sunset. I mean that that
is very plausible. So so here'sthe go ahead. I'm gonna throw ahead,
Okay. I also I want topoint out that her tooth was missing,
right, I was missing. Itwas knocked out, but it was
still exactly So that's a heck ofa blow to the mouth for a tooth

(40:30):
to get knocked out. Yeah,So I just wanted to make that point.
Yeah, yeah, So whoever anotherperson was might have been a guy,
right, you know now, withthis being said, this family is
in Melbourne, not far away,so they do actually have cops post up

(40:50):
there for several days waiting for Vivto show up. She never does because
I was under the assumption, oh, maybe one of her family members came
and grabbed her, but she nevershows that any of that anybody's house.
Now, I told you the nightbefore the murder, while Marnie and Viv
are having their conversations, that Ferguswent to see Beth. The reason why
is because Beth was done. She'sdone with the relationship, She's done with

(41:15):
what they're doing. She says,either we're confronting Viv or I'm leaving,
and he refuses to tell her,so she's like, all right, I'm
leaving tomorrow morning. I'm going backto the mainland. So my theory on
this, and this doesn't come upin any of this research I've done,
is that Viv and Fergus killed her. What if during their argument they decide

(41:45):
she's like, okay, you're donewith her, let's fucking kill the bitch
sat part of my language. Whatif that happened? What if after the
hospital, before they go take himto Marny's they go to Death's and kill
her. He was in bed shapethough, people being conditioned to do anything.
It's like sliced uff and bottle,you know. I mean, okay,

(42:07):
so trut, all right, I'mgonna break some of the fourth wall
with Hollywood stuff. Here. Awine bottle over the skull is a massive
blunt force hit. In Hollywood,they use what they call sugar glass.
Right, that's why it breaks soeasily, Like you could just like this

(42:27):
and bust it, right, awine bottle to break. The amount of
force required would cause trauma for onelike Evo saying, man like he's not
going to be in a great condition. Dan sliced up his ear and his
back and now he's gonna go getall murdery. I mean, you're talking
about farm You're talking about farm folk. And if that's the case, if

(42:47):
Viv strong enough to break that bottleover his head, then she is strong
enough to knock that tooth out.I mean, the farm people are pretty
strong. And I haven't seen apicture. She might be thicker than a
snicker my friend, right right,I'm just saying, like she's a farm
bell, then yeah, I could. I could see it because I've I've

(43:07):
I grew up with ladies that were, you know, could wrestle Hoggs.
Yeah. I didn't even consider thataspect of it, because the way you're
describing these people, I'm just picturinga frail old, you know, little
mousey farm wife. But I meanshe she is Australian. She might be
built like a rugby player. Whoknows true. Let me see you here,

(43:30):
let me see if I can findsome photos of them here. All
right, that's interesting. That's interestingthat they would do it together. If
I mean, it's just a theory, I mean, if they're both,
I like it. I like itas a theory. M h. All
right. So on the left youhave This isn't much of detail because all
it is is the upper side.So left is Vivian. On the right

(43:52):
you got Bath. Yeah, she'sshe looks like she comes from party stock,
yeah, I would say. Andand Beth looks kind of young and
fragile. Yeah yeah, yeah,she's kind of got that Dolores Claiborne like

(44:17):
misery. Yeah yeah. Oh man. So it's not much. I mean,
there's not much for photos of them, but you know, there's that,
so it's possible. But I don'tknow, I mean I do think
that this very I when we mentionedthere being a second person when I during
my research, that's the only thingthat made sense to me. But you

(44:43):
know, there's not any details onit. There's other farm workers, like
how closely Viv's always on the farmand and Fergus is leaving. Is there
somebody on the farm that vives closeenough with that she's like, hey,
I want to do this, Likebut none of that shows up in any
of the research. So well,I mean, is it is a small
town and everybody knows everybody. Uh, she could have just picked somebody random

(45:06):
in town who was outside the circle. You know, there is there is
note during the research that I did, and it's possible. But there was
a guy that was into Beth thatalso worked at the parade and Beth was
not into him at all, andhe always brought her gifts and things and
came over in motor yard even thoughshe didn't want him to. And she
talks about it, But what washis name? Uh, it's not even

(45:31):
it doesn't even come up during anyof the researcher. His name doesn't show
up because if it's like Alan,it's like a pretty obvious tell But I
mean it's possible that you know,if if Beth is complaining about this on
the farm and Viv overhears it,maybe she partners with this dude and does

(45:53):
it. Yeah, because he's notinto he's not it, or she's into
her, but she's not an mshe's also sleeping with Fergus, So I
mean, I don't it's possible thatit was this guy. It could be,
Okay, so if you go downthat rabbit hole, that that makes
a lot of sense actually, becauseif he finds out that Beth is doing

(46:15):
that and she won't give him thismystery dude the time of day, right,
not only is he pissed off aboutthe fact that he's getting a play,
but he's also pissed off that youknow, you know, you're you're
willing to sleep with this married dudebut not me. So yeah, he
might have just lost his ship andthen just cut that aid into a chest.

(46:37):
True. He also he also couldhave been on the property spine on
her when Viv shows up and thenjust decides to help her out, and
he could have helped her get ridof her. He could have drove her
off the island. Yeah, it'sit's entirely possible. Man, This is
messed up, man, because there'syeah and without and Viv is still missing.

(47:00):
Viv never. Nobody knows what happenedto Viv. She was never.
So how about this, Okay,the husband if he can't have Beth or
no, let's backtrack a bit.Vivian kills Beth right, Okay, husband
finds out about it, smokes herass. So he lost both of them

(47:23):
revenge killing. But he's much betterat, you know, getting rid of
evidence, so to speak. Butat what point would he have gotten rid
of Viv? Because Viv dropped himoff at Marnie's. So if they did
it before that, who knows?Maybe I don't know. One of those

(47:45):
things where there's like any theory mightkind of work. It's true because there's
plenty of details, there's just noconcrete because Viv's not there. Viv's just
gone. The Hayes what's sucking meup? You know? How? I
get the same here? Yes?Yeah, I mean doesn't that evolution the

(48:06):
hey? I mean, does thatis that sticking in your brain? Or
is there something else? Yeah?Absolutely, I think that hay is the
clue to the missing whatever it iswhere did he come from? Why is
it there? You know? What? What what pictures? Is that?

(48:27):
Like? Yeah? Yeah? Yeah. So I think that Hay is actually
the clue that leads to the missinginformation of the story. It'll probably uh
link link the person that might havebeen helping Vivian and you know, tell
what's what's missing. I just thinkthat Hay is actually the biggest clue.

(48:52):
H there. I mean, it'svery clear that she was there during the
murder. I mean it's very obvious. But again, you can't you can't
put her on the crime because there'sno evidence that she actually did do it.
What's up? Sounds got it?Sean's got it? I think I
have it. Let's see, allright, so peak this out. So

(49:15):
Vivian did do it, all right, but if your theory about the husband
and her doing it, I thinksee how this plays out. So they
kill her right in the struggle,all right, she gets Vivian gets clocked

(49:42):
in the nose. She runs offto the bathroom, right and it is
like doing this number. So she'sbleeding all over that towel. A husband
all right, and what's his nameagain? Fergus? Yeah, Fergus,
because he still loves Beth is theone that puts the quilt over because he

(50:04):
can't stand to see her like that, so he covers her up. All
right, They get out of there, and then Vivian disappears because one she
did it, and two maybe afterall the stuff is done in you know,
the hospital and everything, he's talkingto to Vivany, He's like,

(50:25):
oh you left that town. Yeah, but yeah, and so they're like,
you got to get the fuck outof Dodge, all right, and
so then they disappear that way orshe does get conscript this this uh you
know, you know, admirer ofBeth's same thing, and they get out

(50:51):
of town. I got a differenttheory I was thinking about as you were
talking. There were three siblings,right, yes, who was then Done?
Was the brother, right yep?So Done is pissed about all this
crap that he found out about what'sgoing on with his brother and sister in

(51:12):
law. And Don never liked Bethbecause of you know, all the all
the whatever. And then when hefinds out that she was actually with his
brother and causing all this crab andthen his brother ends up getting smacked in
the head with a bottle and stabbed. He's like, oh, you know,

(51:37):
I'm pissed now. You know,hey, Vivian, you know,
if you want to do something,I'm down, go ahead. But if
they both hate her, who putthe quilt on her? Right? The
only person who would have put thequilt over is somebody who actually had sympathy
for Beth Well, either then orthey just couldn't stand a sight. Yeah,

(51:59):
I mean, I mean, canyou can you imagine seeing something that
gory like a throat slit. Idon't think that I would have taken the
time to put the quilt over.I would have done the ship and left,
yeah, because that so one ofthe things about stabbings, and you'll
hear this from police and investigators allthe time, is that stabbing is very

(52:21):
personal. It's very personal. It'sit's close up, and then when you
have multiple stab wounds, it isincredibly personal. So they always look at
people very close to them. Stabwounds and an a carved into the chest
with a near decapitation is incredibly personal. So, and I'm sure that was
Vivian that did that. But toadd to your experience and your comment about

(52:45):
the spray, Yeah, the quipwas up to the neck, so maybe
it was to keep the blood fromspraying everywhere. I mean, yeah,
because the god the spray evidence wouldbe yeah it that doesn't show up in
any of the Yeah, that doesn'tshow up in any of the documents.

(53:06):
He just said the blood was allover her body. Yeah. Yeah.
If you ever see an arterials likespray, if you just look up arterial
spray patterns, you know, justgoogle it, you'll see what I'm talking
about. Somebody just like you know, unless unless she was already dead and

(53:27):
then as a final coop de gracie, they fuck you, stupid bitch,
you know, and cut Yeah,I mean, had they cut the throat
after the a carved into the torso, yes, then the blood probably would
not have splattered everywhere, right,that that does make sense? Yeah,
that tracks okay, So that couldhave been the last thing. That could

(53:47):
have been the last thing either way. I mean this I see, and
I'm more leaning towards Sean's side onthis, that the quilt was placed after
So that's just my sign and Ithink that you're onto something that there had
to be some sort of like asympathy. So if it was Fergus or
this guy that was into her,I could see them doing it like I

(54:10):
could either one of them. Buthow much pain bits, Man, what
a twist of emotions. Think aboutthat, like Vivian sitting there going kill
hold her down, you know,and doing this, and how either Fergus
or this you know, wishful Paramoreis on the other, you know,

(54:30):
watching this happen. But there's youknow, Fergus feels you know what I
mean, it's just like and thisis her sympathy is for Beth. But
it's just you see what I'm saying, like, man, So this lady,
so this lady. Robin calls aseven forty five to Marnia's house asking

(54:51):
about who's company of the kids mAnd this is when Fergus says, oh,
man, you know, I thinkthere's something wrong with Beth. So
what if he knew? I mean, he could have already known that she
was done and he's just trying tocover it up to help viv get out
of town to kind of give him, give her that time buying time.

(55:14):
Yeah wow, And Beth or Vivianprobably told him, if you don't do
this, I'm taking it all down. Well, and think about nobody and
even Marnie the night before didn't knowthat he was sleeping with Beth, so
the none of the family knew forsure that he was sleeping with Beth until
this time. It's I mean,it's got to I mean, without having

(55:44):
more evidence on this unknown dude,right, I mean, it's so much
as leaning towards that scenario. ButI mean, this could just be some
weird coincidence of a I mean,again, it's just as much possible that
it was him that it would havebeen fergus Am I I guess the only

(56:07):
difference is that this dude has lessof a leg as far as a suspect
because of the fact that he's notreally mentioned very often. Mhm, yeah.
And he could have left with Viv, but I don't know if he
was still thereafter. I don't know, you know, I don't I don't
know. That's not in the details. What if, man, what if
this goes down like the psycho hole, right, and Viv actually had started

(56:32):
an affair with this unknown guy,Like that's the thing that brought me.
That's what I was saying, That'sexactly what I was saying. And now
and do you see, yeah,like that's entirely possible. A thing that
maybe people just really aren't kind offocusing on that Viv because you know,
it's it's one of those things inlike mysteries where if you're writing a mystery,

(56:54):
you misdirect away from you if youmake somebody overly innocent or give them
a just cause that it's like,oh, well it can't possibly beat them,
right. But if Viv is youknow, just like, oh,
she's so mad about the adultry,but she's doing it her fucking self,
right, So if she's doing itwith that guy, they're not people aren't

(57:15):
going to think about that because they'reso focused on Fergus and Beth doing what
they did. So now she's orshe's doing it to be vengeful, right,
but now this guy in it.Go ahead? Yeah, And so
it's December nineteen eighty five when shestarts her suspicion, when she catches them
in the barn. September eighty sixis when this all goes down. So

(57:36):
there's definitely a time span where shecould have done a little bit of research,
found out about this guy and theykind of meet up and plant it
out. I mean, it's definitelypossible. Yeah, However, I guess
we need to find that. I'lllook into it and maybe on the next
episode I can kind of touch backon it just to kind of confirm whether

(57:59):
this guy was still on the eyeor not, because if there are any
details, yeah, because that's ahuge unknown. But if he is also
missing, then that's that's a hugejust like of course it was this guy.
Yeah, because if I'm writing thescreenplay, I'm having like this guy
sitting at a counter drinking, youknow, a cup of coffee at the

(58:19):
diner and she shows up and she'slike Billy Phil Thompson. He looks up
and he's like, yeah, wehave somebody in common. And then that's
how that whole thing starts right absand he drives her away. So does
the say what this guy did fora living? He works at the parade

(58:40):
and he just likes he likes Yeah, this Penguin Parade just makes this whole
thing comical. Man, it reallydoes. I watched I watch Penguin's you
know, is there a connection withand hey is its? And hey pro

(59:06):
all the hey for the pluck.She like goes to grab him and he's
got like a bail in his hands. He's like, well, I gotta
put this somewhere. I just throwthe back of your truck. I can't

(59:27):
definitely plenty of theories here, that'scrazy, plenty of rooms. I obviously,
I'm pretty sure everybody would assume thatViv did it, But I do
agree that there's probably somebody else thathelped her. Mm hmm. Yeah,
and they're both and they're both missing. Yeah. That again, that's that's
the only thing that I could see. So if if Fergus did help,

(59:53):
then it would had to be betweenleaving the hospital and going to Barnie.
So that's that's the thing. ButMarnie never says that Viv's got a bloody
nose or anything either or busted upor that she was in bad shape.
I mean, Fergus, who caresbecause he just got a wine bottle broken
over his stitches, So you know, if he's beat up, who they're

(01:00:15):
not going to think anything of it, right, But I don't know,
I don't know. If not,then if it's the other guy, they
had plenty of time to make thishappen. So I agree. It's interesting,
man, And I think, youknow, I think that's a good
idea for future podcasts, if wehave updates that come in like the Frozen

(01:00:36):
Beer drinkers and stuff like that,Like, oh, they they found this
thing out. It might be agood idea of like to harken back to
past episodes. I mean, onthat note, I do think Gypsy Roses
mom might be involved. God,she was actually death and you know then

(01:01:00):
she she just disappeared. Oh no, I will not besmirch Beth's good name,
but trying to liken her to thattrain wreck. All right, guys.
As always, these these episodes arealways a blast. Man. This
this episode I did a lot ofresearch on and good job. It was

(01:01:23):
hard because there's so many names involvedand the details, but it was good.
I liked the episode. I likewhere the show's going. Anybody who
wasn't a part of the last episode, we had a live interview with a
Jeff Deskovic was a great interview aswell. And evolution. Sorry he had

(01:01:45):
to work, but you know,things happened, right, So yep.
Check out all the shows on JJ'sLounge. Check out Shaun shank prediction podcast,
check out That's Life, about that, What's going on Blurred Line.
I mean, there's so much contenton Jaju's Lounge. And actually I want
to say that the guests that you'retalking about. That was on the last

(01:02:07):
episode. It's going to be onmy show Dests Life is coming Sunday,
so I wanted to point that out. Yes, then next Thursday he'll be
on my show The Comedy Podcast.So he wanted to be on everything,
so we're gonna get him on everything. Hey, all right, Hey until

(01:02:29):
next time, everybody, We'll seeyou around. Take care.