BTVS S2E13 Surprise

What do you get the Slayer who has everything? Bad dreams that portend trouble for her boyfriend and a disembodied arm

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
Your WiFi is much better now. Oh my gosh, thank goodness.
I'm actually relieved.

Speaker 2 (00:03):
I don't know why my WiFi has been such ass recently.
I mean, it kind of always is in this apartment,
but it's been especially bad.

Speaker 1 (00:10):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (00:11):
I also think that we've been recording it like in
opportune times, like either late at night or early in
the morning.

Speaker 2 (00:20):
I think Tom Turkey ran away and he just came
home as a Thanksgiving miracle, we got the Wi fi back.

Speaker 1 (00:27):
It's okulucky time. Do's so cut in on me when
it just came home recovering.

Speaker 4 (00:34):
Gleek presents.

Speaker 3 (00:43):
A clear Buffy podcast.

Speaker 1 (00:48):
I'm Lena and I'm Ian and welcome to Slay a
queer Buffy podcast. I bet you're wondering what happened, y'all.
Giving miracle cat is by surprise every year. I like.
I like that wording Ian.

Speaker 2 (01:07):
It is a Thanksgiving miracle. I feel like often a
Thanksgiving body swap. At the end of the day, usually
people are like, oh, I've learned to walk in your
shoes and appreciate you more. But in the morning, I
think people are usually pretty frustrated by it and don't
be a good thing.

Speaker 1 (01:23):
Leena and I though, Ian and I though sorry I
had I stuttered. We all know me leading canetser. I
have famously have a stutter, and I see it sometimes
I do stare for sometimes you're right, Ian, Ian and
I though.

Speaker 2 (01:42):
We have bodies swapped so many times over the years
that now it's like a fun vacation.

Speaker 1 (01:47):
Yeah, yeah, I know, it's just see.

Speaker 2 (01:55):
And this is what's hard is because we're in each
other's bodies, we also are like so in sync that
we're talking at the same time.

Speaker 1 (02:01):
Exactly, Lena, what are your big New York plans today?

Speaker 2 (02:06):
Oh, my gosh, my big Nework plans today. Well, I'm
gonna go to your shift. Of course at your jobs
that you don't get fired, but then you are I know,
I'm the best friend of the world.

Speaker 3 (02:19):
I was really worried that you weren't going to go
to my shift.

Speaker 1 (02:22):
I know, Well, don't worry.

Speaker 2 (02:24):
And then I'm gonna I'm going to walk around Central Park.
I'm gonna look at the leaves changing. I'm gonna go
see a Broadway show. I'm gonna sail the Hudson River.
I'm gonna climb the.

Speaker 1 (02:38):
Statue of Liberty. I'm going to go to fight eye
and invest all my money. It's gonna be fabulous. And
it's all my money. You're saying it's my money while
I'm in your body. Who cares? Thanksgiving? You are your

(03:00):
plants in Utah.

Speaker 3 (03:01):
Well, you've got the day off today, so.

Speaker 1 (03:04):
I'm shout out. I mean Thanksgiving.

Speaker 3 (03:09):
I'm probably gonna go to Bogonio.

Speaker 1 (03:15):
Because I know you saw that movie last weekend and
you really enjoyed it. So that's what I enjoyed it twice.

Speaker 3 (03:19):
Yeah, to go again, Yes, I have to go again,
and I know.

Speaker 1 (03:21):
That has gone seen exactly. So I had to take
lean a body and.

Speaker 3 (03:30):
I'm gonna do some of your laundry. You're welcome as
a little Thanksgiving.

Speaker 1 (03:36):
Gifts for you, see. And I noticed.

Speaker 2 (03:38):
I woke up and I went, oh my gosh, Ian
has so much ready laundry. And then I was getting
dressed and I said, oh my gosh, he's down to
like one pair of under around one pair of socks.
And yet I'm still not going to do your laundry today.

Speaker 1 (03:47):
I'm sorry, but yeah, you're a bitch. You have to
do you have to do it tomorrow when you're attacking
your body. Yeah, but I a nice a nice young man. Well,
thank you so much. Welcome, You're welcome.

Speaker 3 (04:04):
Should we like maybe switch back just for the episode,
you and I since we have body swaps so many times,
we can do it a little bit at will, but
you know we can only like borrow a couple of hours.

Speaker 2 (04:15):
So true it is, we've done it so much that
you know how Yeah, this is a crazy.

Speaker 1 (04:24):
Maybe.

Speaker 2 (04:24):
And if you think of another analogy we use that
that might. The first thing that came to my mind is,
I'm like, you know, the more you like do drugs,
less effective they.

Speaker 1 (04:34):
Are, leanam, You're always talking about drugs apparently, gosh, totally.

Speaker 2 (04:42):
It's like the more that we body swap, the less
potent it is. So now it's like we can just
switch in and out.

Speaker 1 (04:47):
Yeah, and now we can drive when we're high on heroin. Thanks.

Speaker 2 (04:52):
And if you take anything away from this episode, it's
that a we both do heroin and b that we
then get.

Speaker 1 (04:59):
Behind the drive.

Speaker 3 (05:05):
Oh you know me, I'm always making silly jokes.

Speaker 1 (05:08):
Oh, we don't see that classic Ian, classic ian Ian.

Speaker 2 (05:14):
You were telling me that you saw bat Boy over
the weekend strength on Alex Newall.

Speaker 1 (05:19):
What'd you think? Loved it?

Speaker 3 (05:21):
Well, you know that I was in a production of
bat Boy with my two truest homies friend of the
podcast Tammy and ep Tiff.

Speaker 1 (05:30):
Hell yeah, my two truest homies.

Speaker 3 (05:32):
So we got to see it together and it felt
so special because it's been like, you know, more than
ten years, so it felt so crazy. And obviously Alex
Newell is the most talented person alive. I love that show.
People should know that show more. I had such a
blast with my homies, you know me. I love to
say the word homies.

Speaker 1 (05:52):
You do classic you classic you? All right, Lena? I
know that you caree over the weekend.

Speaker 3 (05:59):
How did im just going to cut that? Got that
cut that got that got that got that cut that?
Can you bleep that out?

Speaker 1 (06:18):
Ian? You're the editor, you you whatever you want it,
you will you want to bleep it, but keep the
rest of it only if I in the editing day.
I think it's funny, okay, because you also can cut
it if you want. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (06:36):
I just wanted to say something that would make you laugh, Lena,
it make you feel bad, Just kidding.

Speaker 1 (06:44):
All right? And should we switch back or should we stay?
We should switch back? Ah if you insist.

Speaker 3 (06:51):
Yeah, I really want to be My notes are over there,
and you famously don't take notes, so I can't work
in these conditions.

Speaker 1 (06:59):
We should switch Okay, do you want to sing the
song from Freaky Friday that makes them swift? Yeah? Absolutely?
What do they sing? Ian?

Speaker 2 (07:08):
I know that you famously know the bore than me, Lina. Yeah, okay,
I start hi, you start low. Let me look at
this lyric. We're gonna We're gonna do our special change.
Of course, would love to give a special shout out
to Tom kitt for writing this for us.

Speaker 1 (07:24):
Heidi Blicking Stuff for killing that show.

Speaker 2 (07:26):
Blick and Stuff for killing that ship, Brian Yorky as
well writing the lyrics.

Speaker 1 (07:31):
Let's go, Okay, we're just one just one day, for
just one.

Speaker 4 (07:35):
Day, just one.

Speaker 1 (07:45):
O my god, so gonna be back. Seriously, it was nuts,
my god, What have you done with my apartment? Not
your laundry?

Speaker 2 (07:57):
I was going to but then yeah, you said we
should switch back. Well, I mean I said we should
switch back.

Speaker 1 (08:03):
Pardon to me. Sorry, Well I wasn't gonna do your
laundry anyway, truewn, Oh my god? How are you everyone? Happy? Thanksgiving? Thanksgivings?
Lea a surprise to be talking about surprise on Thanksgiving
Surprise we body swapped class sic, I'm so silly and funny.

(08:26):
I was thinking.

Speaker 2 (08:29):
I was like, it's so interesting our episodes always come
out like at Thanksgiving, and then I went, oh, it's
famously always on a Thursday. Yeah, Like it's not like
Halloween where it's like, oh my gosh, Halloween's like six
days away. Like, no, it will always be the day
after the releases. That's kind of the whole gag with
the holiday surprise Surprise.

Speaker 1 (08:51):
We're here to talk about surprise. We're also in a
post wicked for Good world and everyone's okay, we haven't
seen it. We haven't. I mean, we're so you pre
wicked for good. It's still pre wicked for us, but
it is post work wicked for all of y'all, Wicked
too for good. Do that back to me? Wicked to
four Wicked good two four good. Oh you're doing a

(09:16):
w wicked to from someone else goode? Is it wicked
to for good? Yeah, but you kind of oh, you
got to be moving backwards and forwards Wicked too for
it's the same person who does that. Gunnar, You are
okay guy, Yes, of course of course, of course.

Speaker 3 (09:39):
Anyway, So yeah, we haven't seen it yet. How are
you guys feeling? What are you guys up to? Like,
I'm sure it's going to change literally everything.

Speaker 2 (09:48):
I'm sure you're all living in utopia right now. I'm
sure it brought world peace. Every person who is making
the world rough right now. They saw Wicked Wicked two
for good and they took a long look at the
mirror afterwards, and they said, I got to make some changes.

Speaker 1 (10:06):
I gotta make some choice. I do God, anything is
beautiful now.

Speaker 3 (10:10):
Donald Trump literally saw a production of Lames and then
said he like, like, liked the.

Speaker 1 (10:17):
Who did he say he liked I don't know the Thenardiers?

Speaker 3 (10:22):
No, I literally can't remember his name. This is this
is jever Ya Javert. He was like, I like dajavera guy.

Speaker 1 (10:29):
Of course I know.

Speaker 3 (10:30):
And I was like, oh my god, you have no
media literacy. You should have to pass a test.

Speaker 2 (10:35):
Well, that's like, and I'm not saying that Cats is deep.
And if you want to say that Cats is deep,
that's fine. Uh, but like he there was this story
for the longest time about how his favorite musicals Cats.

Speaker 1 (10:50):
And he loves Cat.

Speaker 2 (10:51):
God, you're kidding and I was like, this is incredibly
unexpected and odd that like he loves cats odd. And
then he was talking about it one time and he
was like, well, yeah, it was just so many beautiful
people in skin kai cat costumes. And I'm like, okay,
so it's because you were horny, like it's not anything
to do with although I personally.

Speaker 1 (11:11):
I'm not crazy about cats. So it's like you didn't
enjoy it because of anything about like the text. You
just were like, look at all those breasts and body suits.
I'm in what a fucking asshole? Listen?

Speaker 3 (11:26):
Did I tell you I saw like a production of
Cats recently. I must have talked about this on the podcast.

Speaker 1 (11:34):
It was in the round and I was like in,
like on the first row, and I felt like I
was I thought I was in the play.

Speaker 3 (11:39):
It really was wonderful. It was such a wonderful production. Bro,
I about did, I about did, but they didn't choose me.
But I really thought I was in the running.

Speaker 1 (11:47):
Damn. You know, I thought I was in the running. Yeah,
oh my god. So all this to say, I don't
know that Donald Trumpell.

Speaker 2 (11:57):
He would watch it and he'd be like, oh, that wizard.
He's really misunderstood.

Speaker 3 (12:01):
Exactly to Jesus. I'm like, oh, I welcome to surprise everyone. Surprise,
Happy birthday, Buffy, Happy seventeenth.

Speaker 1 (12:10):
Happy birthday, Buffy. Not happy birthday, Buffy, Happy birthday, Buffy
happy birth How crazy? And this is you know. I
do love when a show.

Speaker 2 (12:21):
Canonizes when a character's birthday is and then they bring
it up every year. And I do think that Buffy
does it because sometimes the show will be like, one
time it's the character's birthday and then they never bring
it up again.

Speaker 1 (12:31):
Yeah, they like just like never have a birthday. Yeah,
it's like they only turned older that one time. And
actually we're moving on. I do feel like this show
is pretty faithful.

Speaker 2 (12:40):
It's not like every season we're having an episode dedicated
to it being Buffy's birthday. But I feel like, at
least near every season, when we get to the January
nineteenth episode, whatever is closest to that date, it will
be mentioned that it is Buffy's birthday. Yeah, which I appreciate.

Speaker 1 (12:59):
So it is we ken'te.

Speaker 2 (13:00):
January nineteenth, nineteen, nineteen ninety eight is her seventeenth birthday,
which means that she was born in what would that
be eighty one, Yeah, eighty one, and that makes her
a what Lena?

Speaker 1 (13:11):
What is that doing it? I think it's okay, a Capricornia.
She's a Capricorn. Tell us what that means.

Speaker 3 (13:16):
Well, it means she's incredibly headstrong, she's really hard working.
I feel like all the Capricorns I know are like
just like at their wits end with work, Like no
matter the time of year, they're at the wits end
with work. I also feel like they I just thinking
about like my mom my, mom, it worries about money
a lot, like even like in like you know, moments

(13:40):
where it's like not as much like a worry, she's
still worrying. Like she's like constantly worried about money. Which
I don't know that that's like, you know, straight up
a Capricornian thing. But I feel like I have heard
my other Capricorn friends talk about it, and they're really ambitious.
They are re stubborn again. Yeah, and really that stubborn, ambitious, hardworking.

Speaker 1 (14:08):
I would say that feels accurate to our girl, and
I agree. I think I might. You know, I very
likely could be mistaken on this. I think only canonized
birthday in the show. I don't know.

Speaker 3 (14:25):
I'm looking at Oh, I'm sure some people's are. Okay,
Buffy Canon birthdays. Oh people bringing up that it says
she was born in October.

Speaker 2 (14:39):
Girl, that was a fake ID okay, So yeah, the
info they had on the computer was falsified.

Speaker 1 (14:47):
What episode is that?

Speaker 2 (14:49):
I think that's I wrote about you, Jane, where we
like see her student record spaltified information. Well, happy birthday, Buffy,
No one else gets one. We're so happy for you.
Happy Birthday, Buffy.

Speaker 1 (15:01):
Should we get into some special things giving slacks?

Speaker 3 (15:04):
I would love that Gobble gobble?

Speaker 1 (15:07):
Here you go, gobble gobble. Oh yeah time.

Speaker 2 (15:11):
So surprise is season two, episode thirteen. It was a
twenty fifth episode overall above the Vampire third gobl Gobble.
It was written by you will never guess Marty knox In.
They brought her on and they said, now you get
to write every episode, every single one.

Speaker 1 (15:29):
This is what her third episode. She's been here for
five episodes. Oh my god, no crazy.

Speaker 2 (15:36):
I was looking at all the episodes that Marty Knoxon wrote,
and she does right across the entire show, and then
also famously becomes an executive producer of the show, but
specifically in seasons two were and three they were really
really running her ragged, making her write everything. So it
was written by Marty Knox and it was directed by
Michael Lange. As I mentioned, it canonizes that Buffy's birthday

(15:58):
is January nineteenth because this episode was released on January.

Speaker 1 (16:01):
Nineteenth, nineteen ninety eight.

Speaker 2 (16:04):
Now, this episode and the next episode, Innocence, were part
of a special two part event, and unlike in the
past with What's My Line? Part one and two, where
the two part episodes were had a week break in
between them, Surprise and Innocence were released on back to
back nights. So Surprise was released on January nineteenth and

(16:27):
Innocence was released on January twentieth. The reason they did
this is one these two episodes are kind of one
continuing story, but more than that. In two Up until
this point, Buffy had been airing on Mondays, and they
wanted to switch it to Tuesday nights, and so they
had Surprise release on a Monday, and then Innocence released
the next day on a Tuesday, and then from that

(16:49):
point forward the show was releasing on Tuesdays.

Speaker 1 (16:51):
So it's just a fun little let's change the day.

Speaker 2 (16:58):
In the dream sequence at the beginning of the episode,
when Willow is sitting at the table at the bronze
with the monkey in the bell hop suit, Willow says
in French, the hippo stole your pants. This is a
reference to Oz saying talking about in wes byline par
two saying why does only the monkey get to wear pants?
The hippo is probably all mad that the monkey gets

(17:19):
to wear pants and he doesn't. And then also she
says in French because monkey says it all Oz part
of me says that all monkeys speak French to the
character of the judge is played by the same actor
who played Freaky Luke in Welcome to the Hellmouth and
the Harvest.

Speaker 1 (17:32):
That is Brian Thompson. He is back one.

Speaker 2 (17:36):
Brian Thompson is just a good actor, and they want
to have him back. But then also they already had
prosthetics in his face shape from the Harvest, and so
they brought him back so it would be easier to
put the makeupon him.

Speaker 1 (17:46):
We've got a cast back there might as well exactly
exactly here is a thanksgiving tragedy. A moment of silence
for this.

Speaker 2 (17:55):
Mercedes McNab fully went to set and filmed a scene
for this episode. Mercedes McNab a famously plays Harmony Kendall.
That scene ended up cut everyone. Moment of silence, please,
that is so fucked up. Yeah, it's I've read the scene.

(18:15):
It's Cordelia talking to Harmony and saying something about like, oh,
doesn't like Xander's a kind of cute right, like you know,
I've never really noticed before, but like he's kind of
good looking. And they're like looking at Xander in the distance,
and then Xander starts acting all weird and then Harmony's like, yeah,
if I wanted to date a spazoid, and then Cordila's like, oh,
my gosh, you're right, he is so embarrassing. Just a

(18:36):
moment of Cordelia testing the waters to see if she
could get away with dating.

Speaker 1 (18:39):
Xander socially, and I got cut.

Speaker 2 (18:42):
In this episode, Angel gives Buffy a Clota ring to
symbolize that she's going steady with him. This is our
first indication that Angel is of Irish heritage, something we
will learn more about in the future, including learning that
he has an incredibly Irish birth name, Lean O'Malley. I'm
saying that because we've already said that on this podcast,

(19:03):
so it's already been spoiled. And when this episode aired
in England, they cut out the line of dialogue where
Spike refers to Dalton as a wanker. Hey, those are
your slacks? Gobble gobble, gob gobble love that.

Speaker 1 (19:27):
Would you like to hear a recap? I would love
to hear a recap.

Speaker 3 (19:32):
Previously on Buffy the Vampire Slayer, Happy Birthday Buffy, Buffy
is seventeen and she's having scary dreams about Angel being
killed by Drusilla and thinks in the dreams keep coming true.
The Scooby's plan a surprise party for Buffy. Jenny is
visited by her uncle, scolding her for not making sure
that Angel is suffering hard enough. Turns out she's basically

(19:53):
a secret agent. Oz asks out Willow. Willow invites Oz
to the surprise party and he says yes. Xander asks
Cordy out and she says no. Jenny suspiciously takes Buffy
to her party and they run into that nerd vampire
who reads with a big scary box. The surprise doesn't
work out, and they realize that vampires are trying to
put together a big scary guy named the Judge and

(20:14):
if they put all his pieces together, they're done for.
Jenny tells Angel he needs to jump on a boat
and get the hell at a dodge for maybe a year. Yeah, sure,
a year.

Speaker 1 (20:24):
Buffy is so sad obvy and they go to the
dock and she goes to the doc to see him off,
and Angel gives Buffy a clotter ring.

Speaker 3 (20:32):
And they they get ambushed. Buffy and Angels show up
to the Vampire Judge party and barely make it out alive,
and the only thing that's gonna make them feel better
is kissing and then some oh no, Angel's acting weird.

Speaker 1 (20:46):
To be continued, it's really hard to talk about this
episode without dying innocense, like even, we'll try our best,
We'll try our best, even they were released on back
to back nights, Like we are breaking tradition by waiting

(21:06):
a week to talk about each episode.

Speaker 3 (21:09):
Yeah yeah, yeah, yeah, but but heyry are talking about
surprise surprise. I still haven't even I like held myself,
I felt like a I felt like I was in
a cage. I was like I can't I was holding
myself back crazy from watching the next episode in.

Speaker 2 (21:22):
The same same, same and I'm excited that I can
finally watch it tonight. Well, le Canasta, what.

Speaker 1 (21:30):
Are your thoughts? How is surprise surprise surprise?

Speaker 3 (21:34):
Okay, listen, I like this episode. I and I especially
you know it again like you said, And it's different
than what's my line? Part one Part two because those
are like, those are sister episodes, but they definitely like
you know, are setting up things for each other, but
there's still complete thoughts. This one is just like like

(21:55):
you said earlier, it's just like essentially one long episode.
So I do like this episode, and I think about
these two episodes a lot, a lot, a lot a lot,
and I feel like what I love especially about this
episode is so many things are coming to the surface
that they have been like hinting at for a very

(22:16):
long time. And obviously we can talk more about that
in the next episode, but it's just like thrilling to
see all of these things come together.

Speaker 1 (22:24):
And I like this episode. I think this episode is nice. Heck, yeah,
what do you think?

Speaker 2 (22:29):
I like this episode a lot. Let's see, guys, what
do I say? This is when the big moves are happening.
This is when the writers say, Okay, we're really going
to kick it into high gear. We're entering Welcome to
Act three. We're entering act three of the season. We
have that massive reveal in your own words that Jenny

(22:52):
Calendar is a secret agent, which I do eat up
and I think is very interesting, and then adds are
really exciting, another layer to the Scooby Gang dynamic to
be like, oh, yes, she does. You know, she likes
Giles and she like sure cares about these kids enough.
But really why she's been here this whole time is

(23:13):
that she's actually just been watching Angel and actually she
actively has to make sure that Angel is being punished
at all times, Like she this whole time has yes,
been helping them save the world, but then also its
just keeping eyes on Angel and being like are you
being punished?

Speaker 1 (23:30):
Are you being punished?

Speaker 2 (23:32):
And this episode from the jump from that first dream
sequence is setting up a feeling of dread and that
something bad is going to happen, and it keeps leading
you to believe that different things are going to be
the bad thing. It keeps being like, oh, the bad

(23:55):
thing is oh, no, Angel has to leave, like we're
writing a out of the show. He is going to
go to Asia and be gone. You know, at least
until like season three, and then they go to the docks.
They do this whole long goodbye scene that they really
sit in, they really let you feel like this is
the be Angel goodbye, like he will no longer be

(24:16):
on the show. And then just before he says I
love you, they get ambushed, and then it's like, oh
my gosh, the bad thing is that, like Angel's gonna
get kidnapped and like we're gonna have to rescue him again.

Speaker 1 (24:28):
And then they get to, you know, they both get.

Speaker 2 (24:31):
Kidnapped by Spike and Drew and they're at the judge
party and the judge is there and it's like, okay,
maybe the bad thing is that the judge is going
to kill Angel. There's just so many different moments in
this episode that they keep poking at you and saying
something is happening, something, something big is about to happen,

(24:55):
and then every time they just narrowly escape it. Every
time they just narrowly escape it. Every time they just
narrowly escape it until we get to that last sequence
where Buffy says to Angel, I felt like I lost
you today, and we as the audience have been feeling
the same way. We as the audience have continually through
the entire episode been like, we are going to lose
Angel at some point and therefore feel the same way

(25:15):
that Buffy does. And then thank goodness, everything's okay. She
and Angel are fine and safe and they're together and
they're hidden. And then the episode of the very last
second pulls the rug out from under us by being like, okay, so,
actually something bad is happening. Angel's like losing his mind
screaming Buffy's name, but you will have to tune back
into the next episode to see what it actually is.

Speaker 3 (25:36):
I so agree with what you said, Like, especially with
all of the dreaming, this is a feeling of dread
and to like watch this character who you know, everyone
genuinely really cares about you and I are bitches. Well,
people love Angel, and you know, to watch him like
and especially we know that Buffy loves him so much,

(25:57):
to watch him like die in these dreams over and
over and then like extra stuff is also like coming true.
Also Darla throwing a big party for.

Speaker 1 (26:07):
Buffy's birthday, Lla, I wish it was Darla.

Speaker 3 (26:12):
Oh damn these d names. Sorry, Drusilla, excuse me. I
Also I love that you know, in these dreams, like
Drusilla and Buffy are like really aligned, like they're like
walking in tandem and they're wearing the same outfit or
like you know, like you can just see the parallel

(26:33):
between them, like they're like also some like just psychically
linked in this way. And then we learn later that
Drusilla's been having the same dreams, Like, oh my god,
freaky deeky.

Speaker 1 (26:44):
I love that.

Speaker 2 (26:45):
You bring up an excellent point about the Drew Buffy
parallels and Drusilla. Back when Angel didn't have a soul,
Drusilla was like his paramour. Am I using that term properly?
No one google it, just assume that I am. But
Drusilla was, you know, his wars. She was the woman

(27:07):
that he was obsessed with. And we know that they
like had a sexual relationship, like she is by all
intents and purposes, Angel's X, Like that's his like former
love is Drusilla, and then we have Buffy, who is
his current love. And it is the parallels of these

(27:29):
two women that Angel has been obsessed with at some
point in his life and has been so dedicated to.
And then we see what has become of Drusilla and
what she is like as a result of Angel, and
I think you are correct, this whole episode is holding
them up as near as to each other by showing
something bad is about to happen, something as bad as
going to happen, like regarding to Angel specifically, and much

(27:53):
like how Drusilla has never been the same because she
crosspaths with Angel, Buffy is never going to be the
same for that exact same reason. Like this man, despite
his intention, despite his intentions, is a chaos bringer like breeds.

Speaker 1 (28:11):
Destruction everywhere he goes.

Speaker 2 (28:14):
Yeah, and I think that the writers of this show
have a master plan. Obviously, like things get tweaked along
the way, but they very clearly throughout the show have
plans in place that they are building over a long
periods of time. This dream sequence, a lot of it

(28:36):
is coming true in this exact same episode, So it's
not really like WHOA so much foreshadowing. But I do
love a Buffy dream sequence. I love their balance because
this is you know, we had one a prophecy girl,
but the prophecy girl want's pretty straightforward. From here on out,
we will have multiple Buffy dream sequences and.

Speaker 1 (28:56):
They get more.

Speaker 2 (28:57):
Abstract, and I love every time the show is a
dream sequence that it is kind of like fifty percent
foreshadowing and hinting at future things and then fifty percent
nonsense that's just there to confuse you.

Speaker 1 (29:12):
Like Willow just being at the table with the monkey
and speaking French is just a reference to what we
did and what's my line? Part two?

Speaker 2 (29:19):
H And I love that the show does that because
they know the fans are going to go over these
sequences of the Fine tooth Comb, So they are putting
just enough hints as to what's to come that you like,
have something to hold on to, and then they're putting
other hints just to fuck with you and be like,
you think this is important, but it's actually just you know,
when you dream and something nonsensical appears in your dream

(29:39):
that has no significance. And we talked about this a
little bit in Bad Eggs. In this master plan, these
writers have really especially I would say what's my line
Part one onward, have really been hammering home how important
Angel is to Buffy and how important.

Speaker 1 (29:57):
This relationship is to her.

Speaker 2 (29:59):
Yes, and then in Bad agg specifically, it is like
a pretty healthy Bangel episode. You know, there's no like
arguing or fighting, there's just a lot of making out,
and we have Buffy saying all I want for my
future is for you to be there. Like we it
has been built up to us how important this guy

(30:19):
is to hear that this relationship is kind of the
be all and end all, and then this entire episode
is just teasing of that be all and end all
is going to be changed, like something's going to happen.
He is going to leave, he is going to be killed,
like something is going to happen that is going to
completely shift this dynamic.

Speaker 1 (30:39):
And it's stressful and very exciting.

Speaker 3 (30:43):
We really have talked a big game about not liking Angel.
I don't know that I dislike I'm not a Angel shipper,
but I don't know that I dislike Bangel straight up,
and I especially appreciate it for what it is.

Speaker 1 (30:57):
Especially I know that a lot of.

Speaker 3 (30:58):
People in terms of loving rum ants, love angsty stuff
like love and angsty romance, and shout out to that.
I think that's wonderful and like, if you like that,
then you will love Angel. So all this to say,
I see the merit and to give it its flowers,
Like I know I love Buffy and Buffy loves this guy,

(31:20):
so much. I also, I mean it is commonly known
in like the in the Buffy world that like the
layer is like becoming an adult. And I feel like,
you know, adding in like having sex for the first time,
like how that complicates everything but also like fulfills so

(31:43):
many portents and prophecies that have been laid out for
us for a long time. And we'll see what this
brings next episode, but like, you know, it's incredibly important,
and like Buffy expressing to Willow that she feels ready,
and then Buffy's mom like asking her if she knows
she's ready, and like, you know, I don't know, Like

(32:03):
I just feel like it's an incredibly important part of
this episode and an incredibly important part for so many
people of growing up is like deciding when you're ready
and what that the chaos that that sometimes brings into
your world. I remember watching this episode when.

Speaker 1 (32:22):
I was younger.

Speaker 3 (32:23):
I never had like a TV show that I think
talked about sex like this, so I remember feeling like
really appreciative of it. Like I feel like Buffy, you know,
obviously doesn't feel safe in general with Angel because they
just got like ambushed, but she loves Angel very much.
She like you know, you know, I feel like, in

(32:46):
a very clear way, was like ready to do this
and it was like a positive thing in her life,
and like coming from like a purity culture background like mine,
it really wasn't sold to me like this. And obviously
we don't know what happens next, but I feel like
this episode was really important to me as a kid
and like my purity culture world.

Speaker 1 (33:08):
Hell, you know what I mean. Yeah, the virginity of
it all.

Speaker 2 (33:13):
There's obviously like Buffy loses her virginity at the end
of this episode, but there's a lot leading up to that.
There is the dream that she has where she's at
Drusilla's party in the factory and she is wearing a
white gown and Drusilla's wearing a white gown, which, you know,
white gown is synonymous with being a virgin, with being
quote unquote pure. Also at the beginning, when Joyce says,

(33:37):
are you sure that you're ready and then drops the
plate and the plate shatters, that mimics a huge object
lesson in purity culture, where it's like you can unchew
the gum, like you can.

Speaker 1 (33:48):
Break the plate like once again broken. Yeah, it's always
going to be broken.

Speaker 2 (33:52):
I know there's a lot of intentional imagery around virginity
in this episod, and I agree with you in especially America,
I mean like and I think just human culture, but
I'll speak to American culture because that's where we grew up.
Losing your virginity is viewed as like the step into adulthood.

Speaker 1 (34:16):
You know, quote unquote, like I'm gonna make you a man?
Is like what?

Speaker 2 (34:21):
What is like an older woman will say that to
a younger guy in movies when she's gonna sleep with them. Yeah,
and this entire show is about is about growing up
and entering adulthood, and this is a very biddle step
in doing that that Buffy is experiencing. We will see
how she deals with having lost it next episode. But

(34:42):
uh yes, it is like we have kind of the
signs have been there for a few episodes, like last
week goodness, she was in heat girl wanted to get
some bad last episode, and then this episode, like you said,
she has the conversation with Buffy with Buffy has a
conversation with Willow pardon me, where she talks about how

(35:04):
she's like, no, I like feel like I am ready.
I also love that conversation, Buffy mentions that she said
to Angel something like.

Speaker 1 (35:16):
I would like to see you. I love seeing you
at bedtime. Yeah, yeah, I love seeing you at bedtime.
That's what it is.

Speaker 2 (35:23):
And Buffy's like, should I be embarrassed that I said that?
And Willa says, no, that's I don't know, that's moxy
or something. I love that Buffy. This whole episode talks
about how she feels. She feels she's ready, you know,
she says to Willow, Angel is not the kind who's

(35:43):
ever gonna push, like, he's very respectful. I really trust him,
I really believe him.

Speaker 1 (35:49):
But then we have.

Speaker 2 (35:51):
The doubt in her mind, which I think is a
doubt that kind of at least most people have before
their first time of Joyce saying are you sure you're ready?
Once again, this is half an episode, and I feel
like we're talking like it's a Buffy dream sequence and
we're being really cryptic, but also like we kind of

(36:13):
have to be cryptic.

Speaker 1 (36:14):
So those are the end of my thoughts. Subject if
I'm not cryptical, spoil it exactly. If I'm not cryptic,
I'll spoil it.

Speaker 2 (36:23):
Something we can talk about fully in this episode alone
is that Drusilla throwing a vampire gala for the judge
to be born is amazing, is fantastic. She has She
makes all of the vampires in full vamp face make

(36:46):
flower arrangements, which that is campus hell. I'm obsessed with that.
She has a punch bowl full of blood. She is
playing the song Transylvanian Concubine. That is the song she
has playing at her party. I'm obsessed with her. She's
a party planner, stop.

Speaker 1 (37:04):
I love her. She has a theme and the theme
is bloodshed.

Speaker 3 (37:07):
I love her so much and to like watch her
be the She's like, mom, music, let's dance, and she's
like the only one dancing as well.

Speaker 1 (37:15):
Oh my god, this one. I seriously love her.

Speaker 3 (37:17):
I'm so glad that she like is back like healthy
and like ready to party, and like that's the first
thing she does. Like when she is back healthy, She's like, Okay, great,
let's throw a party and let's like reunite a big guy.

Speaker 2 (37:31):
I love having Drusilla at full health. This is why Drusilla,
when I was a kid, was the one who really
spoke to me. And I love, love, love Spike, but
like Drusilla's insane energy in this episode is This is
why I was like, who's this girl?

Speaker 1 (37:46):
I love her so much?

Speaker 2 (37:48):
Her when the judge kills Dalton and she's like, do
it again, do it again, and then her like going
to stab at Dalton's eyes, pulling off his glasses, stamping down,
and then being like, oh, actually, you know, I'll let
you keep your eyes, puts his glasses back on even
though they're completely shattered, and then pats them on the head.

Speaker 1 (38:08):
I love it, you know.

Speaker 2 (38:09):
She was fun when she was just kind of like, oh,
I'm so weakned, I need to talk to missy Edith
like that was like interesting enough, but her being at
full strength completely eleven out of ten doesn't have a
grip on reality.

Speaker 1 (38:24):
Yeah. I really really.

Speaker 2 (38:26):
Enjoy and I like the dynamic of Spike who actually
has some sense to him not being able to control
her at all because he is fully incapacitated. I think
this dynamic is very, very fun.

Speaker 3 (38:39):
I think it's just such a fun reversal as well,
like having Darla like take center stage and like run
this whole party. I love these two. I'm so glad
they're still alive. I think they are such a fun
energy in this in this show and obviously, like you
know Angel's plans, I mean not Angel, well, Spike's plans

(39:01):
have like never gone off, like they've never really worked out.
So having Darla in here to like do a new thing,
and then Spike be the one who's like, god, I
just got to get the fuck out of here. But
like Darla has decided it, she wants to do this,
so here we go, like I'm I'm.

Speaker 2 (39:19):
Here with her Ian from the future here. I think
this is pretty self explanatory, but just in case, every
time we say Darla we mean Drusilla.

Speaker 3 (39:28):
I also love the moment where they meet the judge
and the judge is like, you guys stink of like
jealousy and like care for each other, and.

Speaker 1 (39:35):
Spike goes, yeah, love it. I love that part. God
freaking Luca's back. I love him. Mm hmm. I like
what you said that Drusilla.

Speaker 2 (39:48):
Spike has been gotten his ass beaten every step of
the way the entire first half of the season, and
then like the first episode where Drusilla has her strength again,
her plan works out.

Speaker 1 (40:01):
Like obviously exactly obviously she.

Speaker 2 (40:04):
Wanted to kill Angel and Buffy and they did get away,
so like there was a snack there, but she did
fully get the judge reassembled.

Speaker 1 (40:13):
She did fully throw the vampire social event of the season.

Speaker 3 (40:18):
I loved watching Angel and Buffy watching the party from
above because it's like dead quiet and everyone's just kind
of standing there, like I'm like, okay, so the judge
came in and really ruined the vibe of this party,
like Drusale needs to turn the music back on and
get this guy dancing. It's also like, could you imagine

(40:38):
being the judge and like, you know, being like apart
from yourself for like god, I mean, how long did
they say, like hundreds and hundreds of years? Yeah, and
finally you're back together and you get invited to this
really god awful weird party.

Speaker 1 (40:51):
I got a fall. I think it's a slam dung.

Speaker 3 (40:55):
I'm I think it's a slam dunk until he arrives
and then everyone gets weird.

Speaker 1 (40:59):
Yeah, that's his own fault. That's he He entered an
incredibly fun party and he was the wet blanket and
he was just like his vibe was all weird.

Speaker 2 (41:09):
He was just kind of standing there. He tried to
kill the host, and I think that is the major problem.
That's like major party foul. You show up to a
party and your first instinct is to kill the host.

Speaker 1 (41:20):
No, no, no, you kill it exactly like, sorry, we
reassembled you ungrateful much? I know you're You're welcome.

Speaker 3 (41:32):
Yeah, And sometimes when you go to parties and you
realize that everyone's being weird at every party you go to,
you kind of have to look inward. To look inward,
you're like, what am I doing is making everyone be
weird at this party?

Speaker 2 (41:43):
If all your exes were crazy, maybe you're crazy. If
every party you went to is weird, and maybe you're weird,
And it's.

Speaker 1 (41:50):
A tough lesson to learn. It's a tough lesson to learn.

Speaker 2 (41:54):
Freaky Luke, Freaky Luke, Judge, I need you to look
in the mirror and go, maybe my that vibe is rancid.
Maybe maybe I really suck the fun out of every
situation I go to. Yeah, I mean every person he
talks to, he's like, you wreak of humanity, Like, damn,
ask him where they're from, asking what they do for work?
Try an icebreaker?

Speaker 1 (42:15):
The hell are you doing? I know?

Speaker 3 (42:16):
It's also like homie, like you just went to a
vampire party, Like of course they wreak of humanity. They
are they were humans.

Speaker 1 (42:22):
Yeah, that's like, you can't just ask people why they
wreak of humanity exactly.

Speaker 2 (42:26):
It's like, that's actually my trauma. That's actually my own
past that I don't want to relive. You can't come
in here and ask me to divulge my humanity to you.
That's I tried not to be barely met.

Speaker 1 (42:43):
I don't like to sit in that.

Speaker 3 (42:45):
Like picking the guy who like reads because you can
tell he like feels a bunch because he loves he
loves to read. It's like, damn, fuck you, a vampire
hundreds and hundreds of years old has a fucking hobby.

Speaker 2 (43:00):
G seriously, seriously, Oh my gosh, it's fucked up. Now
talking about parties, we want talk about Buffy's party, the
parallel parties. Obviously Drusilla and Buffy parallel girls having parallel parties.
It is so special to me how badly Giles wants

(43:25):
this party to happen, and no matter what snag they hit,
no matter what goes wrong, He's like, no, Buffy will
be having a birthday party, like she turned seventeen once,
she has given us so much.

Speaker 1 (43:38):
We will be having this party.

Speaker 2 (43:40):
Even when we find out that Drusilla likely is still alive,
doesn't matter.

Speaker 1 (43:45):
We're having a birthday party for Buffy. I just really
really love it.

Speaker 2 (43:48):
And obviously the party turns south pretty quick, but thankfully
we get like probably two.

Speaker 1 (43:54):
Minutes where it's sweet and happy. So I'm glad that
our girl got those two minutes.

Speaker 3 (43:59):
And you know who is the real vibes are of
that party? Cordelia Chase, the only one.

Speaker 1 (44:06):
To scream happy birthday and to suggest cake. Hello, yeah,
and she made the dip.

Speaker 3 (44:12):
Come on, she's like the and she made the dip
and she shopped for it, and she's the exact opposite
of the judge, Like she's like trying to get the
party back on track exactly.

Speaker 2 (44:22):
She showed up and the vibes were rancid, and she went, uh, surprise,
is anyone's gonna have cake? Come on, you, guys, I
know that hand just trying to choke out our girl,
But like, isn't this supposed to be a party?

Speaker 1 (44:35):
Like happy birthday? Buy Buffy, let's have some cakes? Like
does anyone in here read? I think that makes you
cool and I don't want to kill you.

Speaker 3 (44:45):
This party, And I love that all of her friends
are like and especially Giles are so you know, excited
to celebrate her and know how hard she's worked, and like,
you know, rent out the bronze for her.

Speaker 1 (44:57):
It's really it's really wonderful. It's crazy to me.

Speaker 2 (45:00):
If they wrenched out the bronze, I feel like, I
guess we've talked about that. It's like kind of a
community center too. It's like that would be difficult and expensive.

Speaker 3 (45:10):
Probably definitely expensive, especially like I mean, if her birthday
was on a Monday, I guess maybe it was wouldn't
be too expensive. And maybe they do like you know,
our rentals or something, but I don't know.

Speaker 1 (45:21):
But then they shout out the Giles. Yeah she has
like Giles, so watch your credit card, God, I hope. So, yeah,
he's like, put on the company card. Don't worry, my god,
put her salary on the company card. Next, I'm begging you.

Speaker 2 (45:37):
Here's my other question. Bad Eggs ended on Buffy being
so grounded. She was confined to her room, and then
this episode she is just walking free everywhere. She is
just out and about Joyce.

Speaker 1 (45:50):
Make up your mind.

Speaker 3 (45:51):
I was thinking this too, and I have to say
every time I was grounded. I feel like my mom forgot,
you know what I mean, Like I was grounded for
a few days and then like my mom like forgot
to enforce it or maybe.

Speaker 1 (46:03):
Just got sick of it. And I also understand like
it is her birth like, okay, I'm going to Rachel's house. Yeah.

Speaker 2 (46:09):
I can see Joyce being like, okay, so actually, since
it's your birthday, you're not grounded anymore. Yeah, you only
turned seventeen once.

Speaker 3 (46:17):
And I mean, and maybe she's like she gets like
a week off before her birthday and then she's back
to being grounded.

Speaker 2 (46:23):
I wouldn't be surprised if, like Giles was coordinating this
with Joyce to some degree, to be like, hey, we
want to throw a party for your I mean, it
would be kind of weird that you're like your teacher's
party with you.

Speaker 1 (46:35):
So maybe Willow is coordinating Willow Joyce. Yeah maybe maybe
maybe maybe maybe.

Speaker 2 (46:43):
So Joyce is like, okay that one night, she's fine,
she'll go out and she'll go to the birthday party,
and then her boyfriend will get kidnapped and then they'll
have sex in his underground layer. That's all right, it's
her birthday. She should have an exciting day.

Speaker 1 (46:57):
I guess it's her birthday.

Speaker 2 (46:59):
You want to have sex with your two do your
old boyfriend in his underground layer because it's your birthday,
I'll look the other way.

Speaker 3 (47:05):
Goodness, fine, my god, have you ever been thrown a
surprise party?

Speaker 1 (47:10):
I have? Have you? Okay? Yes? How was it? It
was tough? Okay.

Speaker 3 (47:19):
So I think I've told the story before, so if
you remember it, don't stop me because someone hasn't heard it.

Speaker 1 (47:25):
Okay. I remember, in like.

Speaker 3 (47:28):
Junior high, my good friend Bailey, her birthday was a
round mine, and so I was like, let's plan her
a whole thing, Like let's like take her Like I
have a family friend who has a cabin, So I
was like, let's take all the girls like up to
the cabin for the weekend and we'll like play games
and like have a photo shoot because that's what you

(47:48):
do when you're in eighth grade and like, you know,
hang out and play mermaid play like Fairies in the woods.
So I plan this whole thing, like plan the entire thing, like, oh,
all the meals were like her favorite meals, and like
the cake was her favorite cake. And then when I
got there, Yeah, when I got there, I learned that

(48:08):
she was in the in on it the whole time
and that it was then a surprise birthday party for
both of us, and I was so.

Speaker 1 (48:20):
I and I feel so bad, and.

Speaker 3 (48:22):
Like thinking back, I'm like this was probably like my
mom or like you know, my other friends really wanted
to like include me because my birthday was like close behind.

Speaker 1 (48:32):
But it stressed me out so bad.

Speaker 3 (48:34):
And I was like, you mean that I've been like
desperately trying to keep this secret for days or for weeks,
and like she knew and I just planned my own
surprise birthday party, Like what what the fuck? Like just
because you one ad did on me does not mean
that like you put the thought in. So it really

(48:55):
stressed me out and like the pressure and like the
attention so quick like gave me, like I mean a
monumental panic attack in my life. Like I think about
that panic attack all the time. And I remember one
of the moms, not my mom, had to come down
and really talk me through it, and she was like
it's like okay, like you know, like uh uh, I

(49:15):
don't know. I think my mom got mad that I
was so upset. Anyway, So yeah, not my favorite not
my favorite birthday party of mine. But I mean it
turned out okay. I just was like, I get so
stressed in situations like that. I don't know, and I
didn't think that I would be that stressed.

Speaker 1 (49:34):
I wasn't prepared. I do understand that, Like, yeah, planning
your own surprise party, it's like the fun of a
surprise parties. I didn't know I plan it and I
still did, so what was the point?

Speaker 3 (49:48):
I know? And I was also like, okay, just because
you put my name on a banner does not mean
that it's your party, Like no, I know. So yeah,
surprise birthday parties not my favorite day. I already get
really stressed around my birthday and that one is. But
I mean maybe it would be different if like something
else happened. But it was really tough.

Speaker 1 (50:08):
Yeah yeah, yeah, yeah, what about you? Mine was weird.
So it was just like a group of friends of
mine through a party for me, and it was really
like it was very sweet. Than was really nice.

Speaker 2 (50:22):
It was just weird because my one friend like chose
that moment to reveal that they were like leaving for
months at a time. It was actually the person I
was dating at the time. They were like oh, actually
I have to leave, and so I was like you
and they literally were like, I'm leaving tonight and I
was like, but it's my birthday.

Speaker 1 (50:40):
They just like I know. It was so weird. To
give you context, was like, oh my god, wow, this
was shortly after a present I received tried to kill
me and that's why they were leaving.

Speaker 2 (50:55):
But I did have another one, and the other one
was some people might like not like this. I thought
it was very fun, which was I got home from school,
walked in my front door, bag over my head, and
then I'm put into a car.

Speaker 1 (51:13):
But like I could hear the voice. It napping was
huge when we were teenagers, and obviously like like, well,
first I walked, yeah, yeah, I walked in my front door,
and I saw my mom like she was standing in
my house, and then the bag was over my head.

Speaker 2 (51:28):
And my mom wasn't screaming, so I was like, okay,
I'm safe. And then I also could fully hear my
friends being like make sure're holding his hand, like don't
let him pint anything.

Speaker 1 (51:36):
So like I knew that it was my friend. No,
you definitely knew.

Speaker 2 (51:39):
Yeah, I didn't feel like I was in danger, but
it was so fun. They put a bag over my
head and they drove me to a trampoline park and
then we went to trampoline park and.

Speaker 1 (51:48):
It was a great time. I loved it. That is
so fun.

Speaker 2 (51:53):
Yeah, there is a picture my sister because obviously, like
my family was in on it. They let my friend
in so that they could be in the house to
kidnap me. There is a picture that my sister took
where I just walked in the front door and she
was like, Ian, smile, happy birthday. And it's me looking
at the camera and smiling as the bag is like
descending on my head. It's top ten moments just before disaster.

(52:18):
It's a very it's a very funny picture.

Speaker 1 (52:22):
Anyways, I would love to see it.

Speaker 2 (52:24):
So, hey, hey, surprise parties and very It is the
great tragedy to me of this episode that Buffy did
not get a good surprise party because Giles really wanted
it for her, and I wanted it for her, and
I also wanted it for Giles. And it's just a
few minutes and I wish, you know, in my perfect world,

(52:45):
it would have been that she arrived, she had that
sweet moment and then we jump forward in time we
do like a cut. So it's like an hour later,
and then they noticed the box with the arm in it.
So she could have at least like had a decent
party before things went south. But you know, she can't
ever catch a break. She can't have a moment of happiness, apparently, and.

Speaker 3 (53:04):
Especially like you know, she God, that's Buffy's no good,
very bad day. Like at the end of the day,
she literally is like feeling all of this these feelings
that like, like she tells Angel, I feel like I
lost you, Like so many things went so wrong this
day that she like her body feels like, you know,

(53:26):
everything bad that could happen when like happened, And damn,
she doesn't even get to like enjoy her surprise, Like
did she get a slice of cake?

Speaker 1 (53:35):
I don't think so. She did not, absolutely did not.
So fucked up.

Speaker 2 (53:38):
I know it's awful. That's why Cardelia was like, is
anyone else gonna have cake? She said, I know, I
know that I'm just trying to kill you. I know
that Angel were taking him to the dogs. He's gonna
be gone for a long time. But before you go,
am I the only one who's gonna have cake?

Speaker 1 (53:53):
Come on, that's some cake.

Speaker 3 (53:56):
Who cares serious? It's like, this is like, girl, I've
spin a charter choke dip in the back, get into
some I just warmed it up.

Speaker 1 (54:05):
Seriously, I purchased these dips. They better be eaten.

Speaker 2 (54:07):
Do you think after Angel and Buffy and Jenny left,
do we think that, like Oz had some cake.

Speaker 1 (54:17):
One hundred it's here, of course we might as well,
And it's like, what are we gonna do? Chuck it?

Speaker 3 (54:27):
It's also like maybe they'll just maybe they just assume that,
like Buffy will come back, We'll make her a plate,
it'll be good. But like, let's not you know, we've
got the bronze for another.

Speaker 1 (54:37):
Hour, Like let's have some dip, yes, exactly.

Speaker 3 (54:41):
And I would want my friends to to have some
dip if I had to leave.

Speaker 2 (54:45):
Buffy as she was leaving with the Angel, she was like,
please eat some dip, Please have some cake, please eat
me please. Just because my birthday turned out really shit
doesn't mean it has to be bad for you guys too.

Speaker 1 (54:56):
I want you to have some dip. Yeah, And honestly
I would feel worse sip the dip one to waste exactly.
That's Corty's money. She picked that out. I know, yeah,
she literally picked it out. What do you like dip?
I love dip? I do love dip.

Speaker 2 (55:13):
Daniel Osbourne has now knows that Buffy is a slayer
in the Vampires are real. We really are just telling
anybody at this point. I do like, obviously, you know
he saw the guy turned to Dust. I kind of
had to tell him. I am a little bit like,
why was he there?

Speaker 1 (55:31):
If I was.

Speaker 2 (55:32):
Throwing a surprise party for my friend, I certainly would
not invite my crush. I'm just like, this is about
and it's not like it was Buffy's birthday party and
Buffy was like, no, bring Oz, I think it'd be fun.

Speaker 1 (55:46):
No, Buffy didn't know the party was happening. Period.

Speaker 2 (55:50):
I feel like it's a it's very bold Willow to
be like, well, I have a crush on this guy.
I'd say, I'm gonna bring him to Buffy's surprise party,
which has a guest list of like five people. It'd
be different if it was like a thirty person party,
Like there's like five of you there and now there's.

Speaker 1 (56:09):
A ton of friends.

Speaker 3 (56:10):
No, it's very seriously, No, I know I feel like
I have like so many pictures from the college parties
where like people had brought people that they were sort
of seeing and I'm like, oh, and there's that one
guy that you like kind of were trying to see
and now he's gone, but he's immortalized in this picture

(56:30):
the photos.

Speaker 2 (56:31):
Well, that was the thing is that Buffy said, Okay, Oz,
can you take a picture for us? She made sure
he was on the other side of the camera. She said, now,
Bruce Seth Green, I know you have a lot of
experience behind the camera, so get back behind it.

Speaker 1 (56:42):
You're taking the picture exactly. He put on his Bruce
hat and said, I've got this exactly exactly.

Speaker 3 (56:51):
Yeah, definitely weird. I mean, obviously, like Buffy was really
encouraging of Willow and and Oz's like budding romance, so
I'm sure she like, I wouldn't care that much, but
I do think it is a party foul to bring
your crush an intimate gathering.

Speaker 2 (57:11):
Party fouls one in two showing up to a party
and immediately trying to kill the host. Party foul number two.
Oh yeah, planning a party for your friend that is
your friend's party. Yeah, but then bringing your crush that
your friend doesn't really know, those are the two cardinals
are going to a.

Speaker 3 (57:30):
By If Oz was like Willow's boyfriend, I do think
it is kind of a party foul to bring, you know,
someone that Buffy like the.

Speaker 1 (57:40):
Yeah, I think Honor doesn't know super well.

Speaker 2 (57:42):
Yeah, I think it's all what is Buffy's relationship to
this person? If it was like Willow and all are
dating and Buffy and us have a great relationship. Yeah,
but like at the end of the day, it's a
Buffy's surprise party has a very intimate guest list. This
is your first date with him, Willow, this was a mess.

Speaker 3 (58:00):
Apologize, especially when Buffy has this huge ass secret that
then they have to let go Willy Nilly, and luckily
Oz isn't slayer phobic.

Speaker 2 (58:09):
Her vampire boyfriend is going to be there. Willow, Let's
think about this for a second. He's going to find out.

Speaker 3 (58:15):
I know, and I'm I'm of course, and of course
you know, Oz takes it well, but god forbid, like
Willow and Oz don't work out, and then there's just
someone walking around who knows.

Speaker 1 (58:29):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (58:30):
Thankfully, thankfully for Willow, the party turned to shit because
now Buffy has bigger fish to fry.

Speaker 1 (58:36):
And isn't mad at her anymore. But if the party
had gone well, she would have been. I know, I know, Willow,
You're lucky that everything went so poorly. You are so
lucky that Drusilla was up to her antics. It saved
your ass. You bet you're writing her thank you know,
goodness sakes Tansylvania's concubine. That's the thing.

Speaker 2 (59:02):
I love you, Giles, But who is winning in a
party off between Giles and Drusilla, Drew Scilla.

Speaker 1 (59:08):
That's the party that Buffy deserves. Hello, come on, especially
like you.

Speaker 3 (59:12):
Know, the party like this, like the table scope of
it all, this table scape of it all. Excuse me,
where she's like, she's really particular about the flowers, the
blood that and everything.

Speaker 1 (59:25):
On the blood punch bowl. Yeah yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly.
She's got vision. She's got vision.

Speaker 3 (59:32):
She should really like if being like an evil vampire
doesn't work out for her, I think she could go
into party planning.

Speaker 1 (59:37):
I agree.

Speaker 2 (59:38):
It's a shame that, like when she was a human,
it was kind of pre party planning being a career
because she really missed her calling.

Speaker 3 (59:45):
I know, but honestly, I have seen recently, I saw
this woman on my on my FYP, being like I've
realized that party planning is my hobby. She's like, I
don't need to do it professionally. I just know that
I love inviting people over and hosting, and that's my hobby.
My hobby is having homies over. And I was like,
oh my god, that's true.

Speaker 1 (01:00:02):
So wonderful. I wish I had that.

Speaker 2 (01:00:04):
She's like, I realized that my life, my career, my
life in my career is trying to kill the slayer,
and party planning is just a hobby.

Speaker 1 (01:00:12):
I try to make it work. I try to make
it my mains. It's never gonna happen. Yep.

Speaker 2 (01:00:17):
It's just what I do to fill my life. Yeah,
and it's also like to pay my bills. I try
to kill a slayer.

Speaker 3 (01:00:23):
And it's a tough lesson to learn that. Like not
every like passion and hobby and like you know, uh
you have like should you know you don't have.

Speaker 1 (01:00:32):
To monetize everything. Yeah, and like Drew Hasten me just
for you, Drew, you know, she was like she had
an Etsy shop where she was selling dolls with blindfolds,
and like that didn't take off. She was doing she
really tried to do like a poetry.

Speaker 2 (01:00:48):
She worked so hard to she released a book of
poetry and people were like, this is literally fucking nonsense,
Like what are you talking about?

Speaker 1 (01:00:55):
They used to eat milk and honey, what does that
even mean? And now she's trying to do her party
for me? Now she's trying to do her party planning.

Speaker 2 (01:01:04):
She also like she worked as like a dominatrix, like
for pay, She's like BDSM for pay, Like.

Speaker 1 (01:01:10):
She no, seriously, she tried that for that was like
the best one. But I'm sure it took a lot
out of her. Yeah, and it just and it reached
a point.

Speaker 2 (01:01:17):
The hard thing with like trying to monetize all your
passions is then where does it reach a point where
it's no longer feeding you, Like, because you're so concerned
about whether it's making money, it's no longer filling your soul.

Speaker 1 (01:01:29):
It's like I used to.

Speaker 2 (01:01:30):
Really love tying up men and pouring holy water on them,
and now like I'm just stressed because like, is he
going to leave me a big enough tip that I'm
going to be able to, you know, have a good
time tonight. And I know, yeah, ultimately, like you are
who you are. Ultimately you're a crazy vampire and there's
a slayer in the hell mouth and you have to
kill her, and like that's what's really going to make.

Speaker 1 (01:01:51):
Ends meet for you.

Speaker 2 (01:01:52):
And you can do BDSM on your own time and
it will still fill your days and it will still
be happy. You know, you still have the blindfold of dolls.
You still make zero sense every time you talk. You
don't need to be like putting a price tag on everything.

Speaker 3 (01:02:06):
No, And that's the thing is you you, especially with yeah,
and especially with like being a dominatrix. Like if you're
not doing it because you love it, like the people,
they can tell your heart you're just there to cash
a check.

Speaker 1 (01:02:17):
Yeah, exactly.

Speaker 3 (01:02:18):
It's like when you're pouring holy water on me, I
can tell that you're like thinking about what you're gonna
have for dinner and not like thinking about pouring holy
water on me, and that and that doesn't make me
feel good.

Speaker 2 (01:02:28):
When you're naming all of all of your family members
that I killed, I can see in your eyes that
you're checked out.

Speaker 1 (01:02:33):
You're somewhere else.

Speaker 2 (01:02:34):
It's like I really want you to feel the loss
of your uncle, but you're just saying his name. Yeah,
you're just worried about if when rent is due.

Speaker 1 (01:02:46):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:02:48):
Yeah, it's tough. It's really tough. It's really tough, and
you really you don't want it to become just like
you're after the check. You got to be in it
for the love of the game. And then maybe a
check comes in.

Speaker 2 (01:02:57):
Yeah, and maybe if you're like it, chuck comes in.
But if you know, it's a noble life to be
hunting this layer. Now, speaking of people with the side hustle,
is a time to talk about Yana of the Caldorage people.

Speaker 1 (01:03:10):
Yeah, that's the bitch with the side hustle. That is
a bit with a side hustle. Oh my god. Jenny, Jenny, Jenny, Jenny, Jenny, Jenny, Jenny, Jenny, Yanna.

Speaker 2 (01:03:24):
Turns out So yeah, turns out, so Jenny is she's
having a night alone in the computer lab and this
older gentleman walks in. Turns out it's her uncle en Yos.
I don't know if uncle is like, that's my actual
like my mother's brother, or if uncle is just like
this is an older member of my social circle that

(01:03:45):
we just like affectionately call uncle, and we also don't
really need to know, but yeah, uncle En Yos comes
in and we get the big reveal, which is Jenny
is actually Yana of the Caldorage people. She belonged to
the group that puts the curse on Angel in the
first place, and she has been placed in sunny Dale

(01:04:05):
specifically to keep an eye on Angel, make sure the
curse is holding and make sure that he's being punished.

Speaker 1 (01:04:12):
And Uncle Anyos is like, you, what do you think
you're Jenny Calendar? Now you are not.

Speaker 2 (01:04:18):
You're young of the Calderash people. I see you getting
a boyfriend. Yeah, I see you getting pretty invested in
these students. That's not why you're here. You're here to
keep an eye on public enemy number one and Jealous
the vampire.

Speaker 3 (01:04:33):
And we also see that Angel is getting close to
this young girl and feeling feeling positive feelings and that
uh huh, that's not.

Speaker 1 (01:04:42):
Going to work. Mm hmm.

Speaker 3 (01:04:45):
This is earth shattering, obviously, Like I love Jenny so
much and to learn that maybe you know, you know,
she's here for like alternative reasons, Like I don't know,
it's pretty scary because I'm like, I just ship Jenny.

Speaker 1 (01:05:03):
And Giles so much.

Speaker 3 (01:05:04):
Like what's Gile's going to say when he finds this out.
But it's honestly thrilling to see. I love that, you know,
like other things are at play, and especially with Angel's curse,
Like his curse is like to like suffer, Like he
has his humanity back, so he knows that in order

(01:05:27):
for him to live, he has to you know, take
life away from others. That's incredibly heavy on the mind
and soul, I'm sure. And also like you know that
he's got people in his life that are, like Jenny
is praying for his downfall, and I love that. But yeah,
I just think, like, you know, I'm excited to see
what happens next with this. It's obviously very complicated, and

(01:05:51):
you know, we don't know what's I don't know.

Speaker 2 (01:05:54):
I think the same way that there is a parallel
between Buffy Andrew, I think there's also an intentional parallel
between Buffy, Drew, and the Calderash girl. It is these
are all three young women, yeah that Angel entered their
lives and changed their lives forever, and it's like Buffy,
you know, we're experiencing it in real time with Buffy,

(01:06:14):
but she has these two portends. Hello, she has these
two cautionary tales of like, this is what happened to
the previous two young girls who Angel entered their lives.
Is Drew was driven insane. This other girl was killed
and like completely wrecked her entire society. And Buffy has
had all these warning signs and there's all of these parallels,

(01:06:37):
and yet she doesn't believe them because she loves Angel
so much and is certain that it is going to
work out and it will be okay between the two
of them. I love the Jenny double agent reveal. I
think it's very exciting. I think it is so much
more interesting to find out that our our the person

(01:07:01):
who is like keeping an eye on Angel is someone
who is in the Scooby Gang already, as opposed to
like this outside force has been watching. It's like, no,
this character that we have known and loved for a
year has actually been playing both sides. Is a strong word,
because she's not like working against the Scoobies. She just
has a different.

Speaker 1 (01:07:22):
Donative than what they have.

Speaker 2 (01:07:23):
But she still wants to destroy vampires just in a yeah.
She just also on the Angel front is has a
different out a goal in the mind.

Speaker 3 (01:07:33):
And we also, I mean we know that she's not
really doing anything to like make anything actively at this
moment to like put Angel in harm's way. She's just
watching him, you know, and like, you know, so we
know that she's just been keeping an eye on him.

Speaker 1 (01:07:54):
So she's definitely not against them.

Speaker 2 (01:07:56):
But Uncle Eno specifically is like, he's not suffering enough
with this girl. You have to separate them.

Speaker 1 (01:08:02):
Yeah, so now she is.

Speaker 3 (01:08:03):
And then I love the misdirect of Yeah, now she's
actively and she she's the one who is like, Angel,
you have got to go to Asia, like you are
the only one who can do it. Buffy has to
stay here and like take care of the hell mouth
like you are the only one to do it, which
is true. I think all of this is true.

Speaker 1 (01:08:20):
And like, oh my god, I bet, I bet.

Speaker 3 (01:08:22):
Jenny's like, oh thank god, I was looking for someone.

Speaker 1 (01:08:25):
To get him the fuck out of here. She really
got out on this.

Speaker 2 (01:08:29):
She was like, thank goodness that that arm tried to
choke out Buffy. That is manna from heaven for me. Angel,
take that arm and get to Asia by me a
few more months.

Speaker 1 (01:08:42):
I know, I know.

Speaker 3 (01:08:45):
I love the misdirect of we know that. You know,
Jenny is resigned to split up Angel and Buffy, like
she's like, you know, she tells Uncle aunt An yos
that and that it's done, like she'll do like she knows,
you know that this is like her role. And then

(01:09:05):
Jenny being the one to pick her up for the
party is so scary, and every time I feel like
I fall for it, I'm like, oh my god, Jenny,
what are you gonna do with her? And that she
just genuinely is just trying. She is the party, taking
Buffy to the party. Oh, I love that misdirect.

Speaker 1 (01:09:19):
It's so fun. I agree.

Speaker 2 (01:09:21):
I think that's very fun as well, and especially like
they're driving to the Bronze and then there's like a
vampire fight outside and it's like, what's going on? And
it turns out, no, the vampire fight literally is a coincidence,
Like it's not some grand plan that Jenny has. Yeah,
they were just trying to get to the Bronx to
the party and there happened to be vampires outside. I agree,
I think it's fun.

Speaker 3 (01:09:41):
Thank bro I bet Jenny was just like she like
walked out of the Bronze, kicked her heels together.

Speaker 1 (01:09:46):
Seriously, thank God. It was like, hell, yes, everything works out. Seriously.
Everyone else is so devastrated, like, this is how could
this happen? He has to leave?

Speaker 2 (01:09:57):
This is so sad, and Jenny's like, oh, best of
my life, so sad, Like it's so nice to know
that sometimes things really do just work out.

Speaker 1 (01:10:04):
That's the best. Yeah, it is the best. Oh that's
so funny. Oh my god. Now addressing the.

Speaker 2 (01:10:17):
Romani representation in the room, as usual, we this is
our own perspectives. I did like do some reading, you know,
I was like specifically looking online like Romani representation in Buffy. Yeah,
the big obvious one is that they're using the g
Sler constantly.

Speaker 1 (01:10:36):
I did. Actually the main paper that I read, and
this is just.

Speaker 2 (01:10:44):
Spoke very positively about Jenny because it was saying, like, yes,
obviously the Caldarash people set this curse on Angel, and
that is playing into the stereotype of Romani people being
mystic and having these special powers. And also like the
idea of a curse can be offensive. But the paper

(01:11:04):
was saying, but Jenny specifically is actually a very positive
representation because she is a three dimensional character. She is
not just this like mystic, other strange woman, Like we
know her, we know her wants, we know her desires,
she has a job, she's friends with, these characters want

(01:11:25):
she's someone's love interest, Like she's a very fully realized,
multifaceted person instead of just being this one dimensional stereotype.
So that paper that I read spoke incredibly highly of
Jenny Calendar Azramani representation in this show.

Speaker 3 (01:11:42):
I hear you, Yeah, I mean, obviously, Jenny is straight
up one of my favorite, very very favorite characters on
the show. I feel a lot of positive feelings towards
this woman.

Speaker 1 (01:11:52):
I love her down.

Speaker 3 (01:11:53):
I obviously would love to hear from other people how
they feel about it, and like this is ongoing obviously,
so we'll see what happens next, and I agree.

Speaker 1 (01:12:03):
I just feel like.

Speaker 3 (01:12:04):
Jenny is such a wonderful, fully realized character.

Speaker 1 (01:12:10):
I love her so much.

Speaker 3 (01:12:11):
She's one of my very Also, her hair in this
episode is so goddamn good. I literally I was like,
I need to cut my hair now. I need to
cut my hair now. She looks so gorgeous. I also
feel like she's got some of my favorite like nineties
fashion I've ever seen. I'm like, I need to ugh
like she it like where we meet Uncle Annie. She's

(01:12:32):
got like half a plf down, fuck ass Bob. She
looks good as fuck and it's like, you know, like
claw clipped half up, like it's so good. And she's
wearing this like sheath skirt and this little oh my god,
one of my favorite outfits on this all show.

Speaker 1 (01:12:48):
I love that bitch.

Speaker 2 (01:12:49):
Oh yeah, I love Jenny Calendar. To compare her to
Kendra once again, maybe this isn't like the conversation for
us to be having as two white people. Yeah, so
maybe I cut this out.

Speaker 1 (01:13:02):
I don't know. I just felt weird about ending that
with just being like and so yeah, it's better. Yeah yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:13:10):
But to compare her to Kendra, like Kendro we met
and What's My Lane? Part one and part two, we
have not seen heydenr heir her. Since I love Kendra,
I also have very positive feelings towards Kendra as a character.
But Kendra was kind of used explicitly just to be
a mirror of Buffy, like she had a Yeah, she

(01:13:32):
was a less a fully realized character and more a
tool to make Buffy have some self reflection, whereas Jenny
is like a fully realized character, has been a fully
realized character, has an identity independent of all these other characters,
has her own inner life and has had storylines with

(01:13:54):
multiple different characters over multiple episodes.

Speaker 1 (01:13:58):
Yeah, yeah, and do I keep that, I think you can.

Speaker 3 (01:14:07):
I think that's wonderful. I think that's I'm I think
that's a wonderful comparison, you know.

Speaker 1 (01:14:13):
Like, yeah, and I guess the period is.

Speaker 2 (01:14:18):
We would love to hear listener thoughts, if you got
listener thoughts, and like I said, being Yana of the
Calderash people, you know where to send them recovering Gleiga
deal dot com.

Speaker 3 (01:14:31):
I would love to hear from other people and you know,
amplify some voices who matter in this.

Speaker 1 (01:14:40):
Oh yeah, oh yeah, but.

Speaker 2 (01:14:43):
I think that this revealed, as I've said ten times
already in this episode. Yeah, ad, it's a very exciting
dynamic to the Scooby Gang. Yeah, I agree, and excited
to see where it takes us next week. Do what
are final thoughts? Do you have other thoughts about this episode?
Any big ideas ruining your brain?

Speaker 1 (01:15:07):
Any big ideas? Mm hmmm.

Speaker 3 (01:15:19):
Now, I just think I love this episode and I
love especially these two episodes together, So I'm excited to
talk more about we think we are being cryptic about
next week.

Speaker 2 (01:15:29):
We actually have to get to innocence. This has been
one of the hardest episodes to record from me personally,
because it is so just like I can't say anything
that I'm thinking, Oh.

Speaker 1 (01:15:40):
I know, very rarely in this show.

Speaker 3 (01:15:45):
I think it speaks to you know, this show, especially
this season, has been so well planned out that like
there are things coming to Fruition actively, and so it's
hard to like finished the thoughts about like everything, like
the show has been so cryptic, so we have to
be so cryptic.

Speaker 2 (01:16:06):
Yeah, yeah, and very rarely, very rarely in this show.
Is there a situation where there's such a huge turning
point that takes place over two episodes. I don't know,
because What's My Line was very before and after as
well that things really changed during What's My Line? But

(01:16:28):
I feel like in What's My Line, we get all
the information in part one, and then part two is
just like, Okay, what do we do with this information?
Whereas in Surprise we're not getting information in part one, Well,
we're not getting information in Surprise, and so we can't
be like, here's the big thing and then next week

(01:16:51):
we'll talk about the fallout. It's just like this is
all set up and then we will see what happens
for the rest of the season after this.

Speaker 1 (01:17:00):
I don't know. It's just all this to say.

Speaker 2 (01:17:03):
If this was like a weird, bumbling, awkward episode, it
has truly been fun to talk about it. I love
this episode, but it's also been incredibly difficult to like
articulate thoughts that only have to do with this episode.
That being said, I do have some miscellaneous ones. One
when they round Robin to call their parents to be like,
we're all sleeping at each other's houses, Xander says, Mom, Hi.

(01:17:27):
Xander clearly his mom did not know who was on
the phone, which one is like a funny enough joke,
but also is just another reflection of Xander has a
bad home life. Him calling one she didn't recognize his
voice unto he literally said Mom, hi, and she's like,
who's calling. I also love after Buffy gets thrown into

(01:17:47):
the water at the dock and then she shows up
to the library and she mentions like, oh, we had
to change, we had to go home and get some clothes,
and Sander goes and we need a close because we
got wet, and then Xander's face is very funny.

Speaker 3 (01:18:05):
They're yeah, yeah, I also have to shout out obviously
the moment where the titular you know Angel, I mean
Buffy is at Angel's apartment. They're together and she's like
freezing because it's raining. He like gives her clothes and

(01:18:25):
he's like put these on and get it of the covers.

Speaker 1 (01:18:28):
Just for warmth. It's like, you fucking freak, you know
what you're doing. You know what you're doing.

Speaker 3 (01:18:35):
Does that line work for you before, asshole?

Speaker 1 (01:18:38):
I as a certified angel hate or hater hater hater,
I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I
don't know. I do feel like the episode tries very
hard to make it clear that it's Buffy's decision when
they do sleep together. No, I so agree.

Speaker 3 (01:18:56):
It's just like it's it's just it's definitely like a
put my arm over your shoulder while we're at the movies.
It's like she definitely wants to have his arm over
her shoulder at the movies. But it's just like how
they get there.

Speaker 1 (01:19:09):
Is so funny.

Speaker 2 (01:19:12):
There's all this talk in this episode about like we
think Drusilla is dead, and we're sure that Drusilla is dead,
but then they never found a body, so is she dead,
but like she's a vampire, so they would not have
found a body. And also, if I did not physically
see a body turned to dust, I would not assume

(01:19:33):
that she was dead. I would not assume that she
was dead. Yeah, so that was very presumptuous to me.
And then my final thought is Buffy and Angela. You
know they do the Beasts of the two backs, they
do the they do the horizontal tango.

Speaker 1 (01:19:52):
You know, they get some.

Speaker 2 (01:19:55):
This is famously something you usually do naked, and we
do see at the end the episode when Angel wakes
up afterwards, he is he did do it naked. You
heard it here first it is fact checked he did
it naked because he's naked at the end. Yet when
he runs outside and he's like ooh ah, Buffy, he
is fully dressed, not like the sheets around him, not

(01:20:17):
like he's in a robe, like he is pants, shirt,
just pants, socks, shoes.

Speaker 1 (01:20:22):
Yeah, he is shirt, shoes, pants, best. Can't go out
there underdressed, color pressed, look your best and want to
be impressed. Like he's fully dressed to the nines. Which
is very funny to me because when he wakes up naked,
he's clearly already in agony.

Speaker 2 (01:20:38):
So why if I woke up and I was having,
you know, a panic attack I was having, I was
in massive physical pain whatever's going on with him, and
I was going for a run, I a might just
run outside naked, but b if I don't want to
be naked outside, I would at most grab a rope,

(01:21:00):
grab sweatpants and a robe, and outside I would not
be taking the time to button up my shirt, to
put on socks and shoes, get a jacket on. He's
got too much presence of mind for the amount of
pain I'm supposed to believe he's in.

Speaker 3 (01:21:16):
Oh, I didn't notice this at all. I think that's
crazy wild.

Speaker 1 (01:21:22):
I think it's crazy.

Speaker 3 (01:21:24):
Could you imagine like something is happening to your your
bod and you're having a panic attack and you're like
freaking the fuck out, but you stop to put several
like socks one crazy fucking way. It's also like, sure,
like give him some pants. He's been shirtless on the
show before.

Speaker 2 (01:21:40):
Yes, I also think it reads is more dramatic if
he goes outside and he's just like shirtless.

Speaker 1 (01:21:47):
Yeah, if he's like I even like like if it's
just pants, no shoes, no shirt. Yes, I understand that too.

Speaker 3 (01:21:58):
It's also like there's something dram about like a half
naked man screaming at this.

Speaker 1 (01:22:03):
I write so much pain, I can't even have cloth
on my shoulders exactly.

Speaker 3 (01:22:08):
No, exactly, And I get like, if you're running outside,
and I think, especially like I feel like I know
a lot of men who like have sweatpants near the
bed and can throw those on to like run and
do something like.

Speaker 1 (01:22:19):
That's not crazy of men, that's nuts.

Speaker 2 (01:22:23):
You know a lot of men who are like I
constantly wake up in the middle of the night in
severe emotional distress and I have to run outside and scream.

Speaker 1 (01:22:32):
So they have oh no, girl, that's me. Oh no, girl,
that's me, not men me, I apologize.

Speaker 3 (01:22:45):
Also, okay, so weird too, he like runs outside, I
understand this, Sure, run outside, scream for Buffy.

Speaker 1 (01:22:53):
You were just with her dog. I do wake her up, bring.

Speaker 2 (01:22:59):
Her with I do feel like I have been in
that situation where like I immediately am in an intense
emotional distress and I'm.

Speaker 1 (01:23:09):
Like, I need to be alone. I got to get
the fuck out of here.

Speaker 2 (01:23:12):
Yeah, and then I am alone and then I'm like, wait, actually,
this was a mistake, and I'm like.

Speaker 1 (01:23:16):
Wait, actually, someone please help me. So I do.

Speaker 2 (01:23:19):
I do see where he's coming from on that one.
Sure you know this girl, it's her birthday. He doesn't
want to wake her up, he doesn't want to say
something's wrong. He's like, I can power through this on
my own. And then he gets outside and he's like,
oh fuck, actually, I super can't Buffy, Buffy.

Speaker 1 (01:23:36):
He broke Buffy's plate. I can't, And he's if you
are having a pan attack it, then you have cloth
on your shoulders. It's over. Pro tip take it off.
Uh huh they call me down, or just don't put
it on. Oh my god, Wow, that is so funny.
I didn't notice that at all. That surprise, surprise, that

(01:23:59):
surprise worst part?

Speaker 3 (01:24:04):
Ian, What is your best part of this episode? Or actually,
but I think and reverse it, what's your worst part?

Speaker 1 (01:24:11):
Thank you, missy. What is my worst part this episode is?

Speaker 2 (01:24:18):
It's hard because this episode is like a good standalone episode.
This episode is really excellent when you have the larger context. Yeah, Like,
if I was like I'm going to get someone hooked
on Buffy by showing them just one episode, I certainly
would not show them surprise But if I was like

(01:24:38):
I want to get someone hooked on Buffy by showing
them a stretch of like ten episodes, I would say,
watch the back half season two. Let's see what is
my worst part. This is kind of silly, but I
don't think I have a serious one, which is Buffy
walks into the surprise party and it's like, oh my gosh,

(01:24:58):
you guys did all this for me, and they're like, yes,
we did. And then she turns only to Angel and
she says, that's so sweet, bitch. He didn't do anything.

Speaker 1 (01:25:08):
If I know one thing, it is that the people
who spearheaded this party are Rupert Giles and Cordelia Chase.
You need to be saying thank you to them, not
to Angel who just shown up. He didn't do anything,
Come on whatever, Oh my god.

Speaker 2 (01:25:24):
And this is and this is something I know to
be true about Buffy Summers, which is I think she
is an amazing, phenomenal person. What keeps her from being
like an annoyingly perfect character, you know, when like a
character has no flaws and therefore you can't relate, is
that she does have a massive flaw. And that massive
flaw is she has such blinders on for Angel. She
thinks he is the bee's knees. Anything good that happens,

(01:25:48):
she's like, well, this is because of Angel. This birthday party,
that's because of Angel.

Speaker 1 (01:25:52):
Yeah, my figure, her whole friend group is working exactly. Yeah,
Oh you're so right. What's your worst part?

Speaker 3 (01:26:02):
I think that, And obviously, like I like Oz so
much and we'll we'll continue to get to know Oz
a lot.

Speaker 1 (01:26:09):
I think it is.

Speaker 3 (01:26:10):
Major party foul vibes for to bring Oz. Yeah number two,
Come on, you can't do that, Willow, you cannot do that.
And luckily like Oz took it all very well, but like,
shit literally went so wrong. And if this was like
a guy who turned out to be less awesome than
he is, then we'd be fucked. So, Willow, I want

(01:26:32):
you to think about that.

Speaker 2 (01:26:33):
I do also think in the same way that like Buffy,
giving all the credit of the party to Angel is
an in character flaw. I do think this is an
in character flaw about Willow. I love Willow Rosenberg, yeah
so much. I do think that Willow she is an
interesting character because she is like such a social outcast

(01:26:56):
that I think most of the time she just assumed like, well,
I don't really know what's going on, and like other
people know best and I'm just kind of here in
the backseat. But also this is the girl that like
willingly turns a blind eye to the law and like
hacks into police records in the Pentagon to like get
the information she needs, and thank goodness she does it, yeah,

(01:27:18):
because she's helping save the day. But I do think
there Willow has a side to her where she's like, yeah,
but if I need to achieve this goal, since I
want the goal, like I'm going to do what it
takes to get the goal, and she's like, well, I
want to get on a date with Yeah. She does
have this view of like I'm above the law that

(01:27:38):
you can't hunk into police records and I'm above the
social faux pav like don't invite a crush to your
friend party, where she's like, well, my goal is to
date this guy, and he asked me out, and he
asked me out for the night of my friend's party. Yeah,
So she's like, clearly I know best, I'll just bring him.

Speaker 1 (01:27:56):
Like, I do think this is kind of a Willow Rose.

Speaker 3 (01:27:59):
You got some interesting thoughts over there. Should we start
a podcast?

Speaker 1 (01:28:05):
I think we might.

Speaker 3 (01:28:06):
I would also love to hear what your best part
of this episode is?

Speaker 2 (01:28:10):
Okay, fantastic. My best part of this episode maybe Drusilla
at full strength.

Speaker 1 (01:28:18):
She I knew it, I knew it.

Speaker 2 (01:28:20):
Really fun in this episode, Oh my gosh, truly a blast.
Juliet Landau is I equal parts terrifying and also funny
in this episode.

Speaker 1 (01:28:31):
I just am a big fan. I'm glad she's on
her own two feet now. Shout out Drew Silla, my girl.
I love that bitch. I love that bitch. What's your
best part? Oh my god, what is my best part?

Speaker 3 (01:28:45):
I'm I'm probably gonna say, and I like so much
of this episode it's hard to pick, but I will
probably pick.

Speaker 1 (01:28:52):
The moment with.

Speaker 3 (01:28:56):
Willow and Buffy when Buffy is telling her all about
how they were like together that morning and how things
are progressing with them, and how she tells her friend
that she is she feels like she's ready to take
it to the next step, and her friend is like
so excited and like supportive of her. I just think, like,
you know, and this is just my my perspective, Like

(01:29:19):
I mean, it was like so taboo to like talk
to your friends about about these feelings where I'm from personally,
and I remember like the moment that I realized like
that I was in a room full of people who
have had like nearly the exact same experiences that I have,

(01:29:40):
and where we could talk and be like open and
honest with each other, especially about sex.

Speaker 1 (01:29:44):
It was like a huge deal for me.

Speaker 3 (01:29:47):
And so like to watch these two girls be like
so supportive and lovely and loving to each other like this,
and I just like, heals a part of my soul.

Speaker 1 (01:29:56):
I really love it. Heck, yeah, that's great.

Speaker 3 (01:30:00):
Yeah, okay, thanks, And now I want to know what's
your gayest part of the episode.

Speaker 1 (01:30:08):
I've got one. Oh what's yours?

Speaker 3 (01:30:12):
It's Jenny motherfucking Calendars bi sexual bob. She looks good
as fucks in this episode.

Speaker 1 (01:30:19):
And a woman in a power bob that's bisexual and
she looks good as shit. What about you? Do you
have Drusilla throwing a themed party? Yep?

Speaker 3 (01:30:31):
I think probably that on like another girl's birthday faller.

Speaker 1 (01:30:35):
Jusilla doing a morp for Buffy's birthday. Yes, oh my god,
it's so morp.

Speaker 2 (01:30:43):
Yes, that and like she really she had she curated
a vibe, she cured an aesthetic. They got blood on
the table. We're playing Transylvanian Concubine. Her like really jiving
and dancing, having a good time at your own party
when everyone else is being a killjoy.

Speaker 1 (01:30:58):
And that's very gay. So oh true. My grandma always
said you make your own good time. And I see
Drusilla doing this.

Speaker 3 (01:31:04):
She's like, I don't give a shit that all these
weird vampires aren't dancing with me.

Speaker 1 (01:31:07):
I'm dancing turn on Translvanian Concubine. I'm dancing cube of
Transylvanian Concubine. This is my birthday party. I love you, Drew,
I love you Drew. Oh my god, all right, death
count we got uh.

Speaker 2 (01:31:22):
There's a vampire who is with Dalton outside the bronze
that Buffy steaks and kills Rip. Then there's a vampire
that breaks through the window and gets staked by the drumstick,
the one that Oz sees and goes.

Speaker 1 (01:31:36):
Did everyone see that? I turned to dust? And then Dalton,
I know, really sad about I love you, Dalton, you
were too good for this world.

Speaker 3 (01:31:47):
Also, like I can't believe that he is a vampire
who wears glasses, like in my mind, like your eyesight like,
your stigmatism gets fixed when you become a vampire. But
it didn't work on him.

Speaker 1 (01:31:57):
Is that nerdy?

Speaker 3 (01:31:58):
But like the vampire juice didn't work on his a stigmatism? Well,
it's because he reads I love him down exactly. It
was like you got too much humanity, your eyes are
so fucked up.

Speaker 1 (01:32:09):
Another like like weird side character vamps that we love
that is that's a club. I'm sad he's gone. I
love him.

Speaker 3 (01:32:16):
So their forces are dwindling? And where are all the girls?

Speaker 1 (01:32:20):
What happened to that? What happened? What happened to bring her?
What happened to miss Blonde? I know, I miss her?
There was a lady vampire at the party though, that
was helping set up? There set up? Was she at
the party? Party? I don't remember.

Speaker 2 (01:32:36):
Drew said, you can help set up, but this is
a sausage fest. I'm sorry you're not invited, she said,
all eyes on me.

Speaker 1 (01:32:43):
Sorry.

Speaker 2 (01:32:44):
This episode officially takes our kill count. I did update
it finally. It takes our kill count up to thirty
eight so far this season.

Speaker 1 (01:32:52):
Who rah.

Speaker 2 (01:32:55):
Brah rah, Well that surprise surprise. Send us your thoughts
recovering Gleek at Giva dot com. Have you Thanksgiving Thanksgiving.

Speaker 3 (01:33:08):
Online if you want, We're at recovering gleek Underscore podcast
nowhere where already presents Underscore podcast. I have a freaking liar,
but you can yeah follow us there. We're on TikTok
and Instagram, if unacity. It's your turn to do the
to shout out to our patrons, because if you want

(01:33:29):
to support our podcast monetarily, you can do so on Patreon.
We have bonus episodes, we have ad free listening, lots
of fun stuff there and you get a little shout out.
So this is a shout out portion. If you don't
have money that you want to give to us, that's
okay too. And you want to support us, that's okay too.

Speaker 1 (01:33:48):
You can do it. You can leave us a review on.

Speaker 3 (01:33:52):
Apple Podcasts and also Spotify or wherever you're listening. I'm
sure that you can leave a review there. That helps
us a ton, And I feel like podcasters are always
saying that, but it's genuinely true that it does help
us a ton. So love you guys, thanks for being here,
and let's shout out our top tier patrons, our best
friends the podcast.

Speaker 1 (01:34:10):
Your turn, all right?

Speaker 4 (01:34:12):
It is literally two in the morning, so this is
a special late night patron shout out a big, late,
heartfelt thank you too. Natalie, skailn Natasha, s Celia, Vanessa,
Emily Sonia, Aaron, Olivia morgs Ida, Jack Karros, Eliazavie, Depress,
Bubbles Eating, Brianna, JP, Tania, Katherine, Shannon and Rachel Drew, Christine, Kayleen, Rachel, Alison, Megan, Audrey, Alexandra, Kylie, Dustin,

(01:34:37):
Asa Jadon and Paul, Julia, Vicki Keeley, Jasmine Well, Danna, Kishlaine, Diagne,
tost K, Reagan, bb Poopo, Josette, Joe, Lo, Madelina, al Lani,
Alise Blanton, Alice Page, Nadia, Nicole Lobby, Christen Story, Eileen Mallory, Amantha, Rebecca, Leila,
Ari b Versa, Taylor, Frankie, Margaret, Tupina, Emily, Phoebe, Aria,
Eva Haley, Emily, Jacqueline, Elsie, Laslo, Ray, Ama, Steph Charlie, Kelsey, Thomas, Chuco,

(01:34:59):
Prittney Ca, Michael, Katie, Elizabeth, Freddie, Thank you and sleep well.

Speaker 2 (01:35:06):
Gobble gobble how any thanksgiving everyone, may all your body
swapping be positive and fun and edifying. Instrengthen in your
relationship with each other.

Speaker 1 (01:35:17):
Go watch props. Yeah, Season three, episode twenty one of Glee. Yeah,
go watch props. And this Thanksgiving, I'm thankful for you,
and I'm thankful this thing's giving.

Speaker 3 (01:35:32):
I'm thankful for you, I really am. I'm really thankful
for Buffy this Thanksgiving. And should we swap back so
we can finish out our day?

Speaker 1 (01:35:42):
Yeah? Well, of course I know that you were going
to see I was excited.

Speaker 3 (01:35:46):
I was excited to go to your shift, and I
was excited to walk through Central Park and like be melancholic,
you know what I mean, like like a tree lined
street hates to see me come in.

Speaker 1 (01:35:55):
So here I go. And I was excited to do
your laundry. So let's go for just one day. Come on,
just one day, just one day, just one day. Ian,
I think you made up the harmony on that and

(01:36:17):
you got it wrong. Yeah, I'm sorry. I know you panicked.
I know you got scared and you panicked and you
picked a note. I don't think the note was in
the chord, but it worked anyway. Thank you, Tom Turkey.

Speaker 3 (01:36:29):
I forgive myself. I forgive myself, and I'm gonna let.

Speaker 1 (01:36:33):
It be what it is. I love myself.

Speaker 2 (01:36:36):
Well, have any thanksgiving everyone? Uh go watch Innocence. We're
gonna talk about next week. Uh truly everything change.

Speaker 3 (01:36:45):
Jays curiously, you guys, buckle up, buckle up.

Speaker 1 (01:36:51):
God. This bunch of episodes that we're about to hit,
we've hit, We've hit. Yeah, it's crazy. Oh girl, it's crazy.
Love you guys.

Speaker 3 (01:37:00):
Have a great rest of your day, and pleaders, I
want to get.

Speaker 1 (01:37:05):
A kiss on your forehead if you accept. Bye bye.
Thank you for listening. Follow us at Recovering Gleek undersmore podcast.
Email us at Recovering Gleek at giba dot com, join
our Patreon patreon dot com, slash Recovering Gleek, rate and
review us and tell your friends please.

Speaker 2 (01:37:28):
So the other day I was walking around in Utah,
where I live famously and you're never gonna believe this.

Speaker 1 (01:37:34):
In I ran into Heather Gay and she recognized me.
She went, oh my gosh, I know you.

Speaker 2 (01:37:43):
You're your LPC And I said, what it turns out,
Heather Gay, I Leana Kannancer and I will testify to
this in court. If there's any lawyers listening, you can
bring me to court.

Speaker 1 (01:37:51):
I will swear on this.

Speaker 2 (01:37:53):
Heather Gay is a big fan of the podcast. She
invited me over I met all. The real houseis at
Salt Lake City.

Speaker 1 (01:38:01):
And g was there famously there was a sprinter van. Yeah,
oh yes, I told you the story already. I'll tell
I'm just telling the listeners now. And she was there.
She did my hair because she famously owns a hair salon.

Speaker 3 (01:38:15):
Oh my god.

Speaker 1 (01:38:16):
Yes.

Speaker 2 (01:38:18):
And we called the one who's in jail. We talked
to Chaw Genshaw. We called Genshaw, we talked to her. Also,
Lisa Barlow was there, but I don't like Lisa Barlow.

Speaker 1 (01:38:35):
Lena, you love Lisa Barlow. I don't like Lisa Barlow.
I love Lisa Barlow.

Speaker 2 (01:38:40):
And so she and I really hit it off, and
it was just what I was really exciting. It was
the best day of my Lena Knnouncer's life. I absolutely
loved it.

Speaker 3 (01:38:50):
So I just thought, I'd oh my god, oh my god, Lena,
you know so much about that show that I ian
already have never seen before. It was really surprising.

Speaker 1 (01:39:03):
I just that you and I watched you the whole
thing in a few weeks. Best show ever, best soever,
best showever. I Ian alread vow to the listeners. I'm
going to watch every episode and I'm gonna love it.

Speaker 2 (01:39:21):
Hey, and and and Ian, if you decide to go
back on that vow, no one would hold it against you.

Speaker 3 (01:39:29):
But I Ian already know that it would make my
life so much more fun and better and like it
would be so awesome.

Speaker 1 (01:39:36):
Yeah, and you know what, and you're really inspiring me.

Speaker 2 (01:39:40):
And so I feel like I should finally watch Veronica
Mars because I just keep hearing about how it was
written by people who wrote Buffy and it's about a
blonde girl who gets underestimated, and it is very capable,
and it's also an ensemble show and it basically just
is Buffy without the supernatural element.

Speaker 1 (01:39:55):
So I think it is you love stuff like that. Yeah,
I do.

Speaker 3 (01:39:59):
Famous Honestly, if I watch Real Housewives of Salt Lake City,
you will watch Veronica Mars.

Speaker 1 (01:40:06):
We can make this vow to each other. But Ian,
is that worth it? This a that show ever? Veronica Mars. Wow,
I didn't realize you were such a Mars marshmallow. Dang
that Kristen Bals. I love her down, that is true,

(01:40:27):
you do?

Speaker 3 (01:40:28):
I do?

Speaker 1 (01:40:28):
You know what I do? Well? Happy Thanksgiving, me Ian
Hatter again. It is my center again.