Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:21):
Welcome back to SOCAW with Vell. Today's episode is incredibly
special as we have the privilege of sitting down with
one of California's most distinguished hospitality figures, Jonathan Rosenson. Jonathan
is a seasoned restauranteur, a somalier, a hotel, a hospitality
executive known for his incredible work managing boutique hotels like
(00:45):
Mirabel Inn and solving Chateau de Soiree in Oakhurst, the
Mansion on Sutter in San Francisco. He's also behind the
renowned fine dining establishments First then Oak and The Elder House,
both of which have earned prestigious accolades. In addition to
his ongoing ventures, Jonathan has now recently added something truly
(01:09):
exciting to his repertoire and that of him and his family,
The Mulholland in Calabasas, a brand new restaurant that promises
to redefine dining in that area. We've heard great things
about it, but let's not forget that. Jonathan is also
the creative mind and the proprietor of Cooke Klo Estate Vineyard,
(01:30):
a certified organic winery in the San Anez Valley. His
passion for food wine and exceptional guest experiences has definitely
made him a prominent figure in California's culinary and hospitality scenes. Jonathan,
thank you so much for joining us today. It is
truly an honor to have you here on so galat Val.
Speaker 2 (01:52):
Thanks Val. What an introduction.
Speaker 1 (01:55):
Well, I'm sure it's all well deserved. I think it's
fair to say from what I've heard and read that
your story begins actually a long time ago, and your
story really begins with your dad, and that seems pretty touching.
So tell us a little bit about him and his
journey here, how he got here, and what he did
(02:16):
once he arrived here, how that shaped you.
Speaker 2 (02:18):
Sure. Yeah, I've always admired him. He was a larger
than life person, and you know, I admired all the
hard work and success that he had throughout his career.
And you know, he immigrated to this country in the
nineteen fifties on the Queen Mary Wow, and they're all
(02:42):
World War Two survivors, so it was just incredible that
they were able to get to France. He grew up
in France and then in the fifties came over on
the Queen Mary and they settled in Brooklyn, and you
know his childhood, you know, he was always hungry to learn.
(03:02):
He put himself through school. You know, he tells a
story of having to borrow money from my mom to
pay for her wedding ring. You know, he told her
it was paying for books, but he was really getting
her engagement ring. It's just you know, it's like very
like it's this it's like sort of like that immigrants
(03:24):
tail where you feel like the American dream could kind
of be attainable. And so he moved in the seventies
to California for opportunity, and he started in healthcare and
he made a big splash in the retirement home community
and there he started he found a partner and that
(03:44):
they brought him in to help him then build their
their organization, and winded up at the Skyroom in Long
Beach because the building the Breakers was a retirement community.
And so I.
Speaker 1 (03:57):
Guess I didn't realize that. I mean, that really goes
back a lot, Yeah.
Speaker 2 (04:01):
For sure. So I was probably thirteen going to the restaurant,
and the Skyroom had a live music and a dance
floor bar, and it was just like a really high
energy place. And I remember going there and just feeling
the excitement and being really really like enamored by it.
And as I went through high school, I just kind
(04:23):
of knew that I was going to work with him
and continue that legacy that he started here. And so
I got my economics degree and I came back and
I started working with him and I started at the Skyroom,
and then that's when he encouraged me to become a Somalia.
And so when I was twenty two, I entered a program.
(04:47):
We ended up taking over the Wine Cask in Santa Barbara.
It had a random word wine list and it was
a wine shop, wine bar, fine dining restaurant, and I
really was experienced, like I really was. I met winemakers,
I met chefs that cooked in Michelle and star restaurants.
I mean it was really like a really an exceptional
(05:09):
place to like foster such a growing knowledge.
Speaker 1 (05:14):
So it was must have just been like you know,
starstruck every day.
Speaker 2 (05:19):
Yeah it was. It was fun. Yeah, yeah, there was
there was some interesting a lot of interesting, whether it
was celebrities or food critics coming through there. It was.
It was definitely a fun time.
Speaker 1 (05:34):
Yeah that's amazing. And so your dad and I was
arounding them, but I didn't remember that The Breakers was
a retirement home. That's a pretty amazing story. And your
dad was one of the owners.
Speaker 2 (05:46):
Yeah, so, so you would have never known from the
outside of the building and from the skyroom. So it
was the only fine dining restaurant in a retirement community
in the whole nation. And he got a special part
in from the state of California. So when he took
over the property, the restaurant was just kind of abandoned,
and so he sort of had this dream to recreate
(06:07):
that art Deco twenty supper club, and yeah, he was
a visionary. He put that together and from ninety seven
to twenty seventeen we ran it, and yeah, it was
a lot of fun. It was a really high energy restaurant.
It was sort of that Ybone era where people would
(06:28):
get dressed up and go out for a nice dinner
and there'd be entertainment and you know, you wouldn't be
on your phone, you would you would be engaged with
the experience.
Speaker 1 (06:37):
And it had music also, right, Yeah, there.
Speaker 2 (06:40):
Was a live band. There was. I had regulars that
came every week and danced. We had the Dancing of
the Star. All all the instructors from Dancing to the
Stars would bring their students and come, you know, because
it's one thing to learn in a ballroom, but to
come and actually have like practical like a place to
do it is more fun.
Speaker 1 (06:57):
Right, absolutely, Yeah, that's that's a great story. But tell
us more about your dad's time in Long Beach. I've
heard that he has a had a sentimental attraction to
something there. Tell us about it.
Speaker 2 (07:08):
So you know, you're you're overlooking the Queen Mary and
that was the ship that he immigrated on when he
was nine years old, and you know, he tells the
story of you know, when they saw land for the
first time in York at the Statue of Liberty, like
everyone just started crying and it was just like a
really joyous moment and it was an opportunity for them
(07:30):
to do something different and to you know, make a
new home. You know, while France was nice, they had
cousins there, that's how they got there, from from Poland
to France, but maybe it just wasn't their home, right,
so they had a new opportunity and the United States
just felt like this this hope for them.
Speaker 1 (07:51):
And did he come to Long Beach before the Queen Mary?
Speaker 2 (07:55):
Right, yeah, I believe. So, I'm not sure when the
Queen Mary arrived, but he was in he moved to
California in the seventies.
Speaker 1 (08:03):
Yeah, it was about the same time. I'm thinking that
it arrived in the early seventies. I don't remember exactly
how early, but sure that must have been really emotional
for him to think about being there and those when
he was so young and remember those times.
Speaker 2 (08:18):
Yeah, yeah, and I remember we went and toward we
went to the Queen Mary. We toward it, we had
brunch there. I mean, it was just one of those
We took my grandparents there. So it's just one of
those things to have that piece of history still existing.
Speaker 1 (08:32):
Yeah, and right there with him. Yeah, Yeah, it's incredible.
So you started at the Skyroom, So tell me what
happened after that.
Speaker 2 (08:41):
Yeah. So as soon as so my dad was making
a shift from health care to hospitality, I think he
just caught the winebug. He fell in love with it.
I think the excitement, and so we.
Speaker 1 (08:56):
Started all serving people but much different.
Speaker 2 (08:59):
It's different, yeah, exactly. So he fell in love with that,
and so that's when the next the next property we
took over was the Wine Cask, and that was up
in Santa Barbara, beautiful historic restaurant. My dad was like
an art antiqu collector from the time he was a
little boy. You know, they didn't have a lot of
money in France, but they could go to the museums
(09:21):
for free on Sundays, and so every weekend my grandfather
would take my dad to the Louver. And so I think,
like that whole, like Louis the thirteenth, eighteenth century art,
like all of that like probably really inspired him and
really shaped some of his his his passions in life.
(09:43):
So he always had this passion for like historic properties.
And so the wine cask was historic. We were in
we were you know when we ran that, it was
it was just a nice time. It was. It was
a different time, right, And then the eight crash hit,
So that was hard on restaurant. You know, restaurants are
we're like the beacon of a community, but we you know,
(10:06):
we're only as good as how strong the community is,
and oftentimes when things crash, it's hard to stay afloat
during those times. So fortunately we closed the wine cask
and you know, we're just picking up the pieces. I
went back to the skyroom, was running the skyroom probably
from nine to twenty fifteen. And then that's when we
(10:30):
invested in wine country at the mirrabell In. So we
were making wine since two thousand and six. So like
when I said my dad caught the wine bug, you know,
he got really did right home business. Yeah, he was
collecting wine and then he decided, you know what, let's
take over a vineyard and let's start producing wine ourselves.
(10:53):
So yeah, really like he was a big dreamer and
like a renaissance man. Right ever stopped, He never stopped.
He always was was going.
Speaker 1 (11:04):
And did you like that? Did you ever tell him
you shouldn't do this, you should just slow down? Or
did you always were you so excited by that that
you just loved being around him?
Speaker 2 (11:14):
You know, it's like fifty to fifty, right, Like the
winery and the restaurants were very exciting and they were fun,
and there were a lot of hard work, and I
think that, you know, while there were some things would
have been nice to maybe just slow down and focus
a bit. I also respected his vision and saw that
(11:36):
he's been doing this for a long time and he's
been able to be successful at it, and you know,
he he built up a well organized operation. So I
was excited, I would.
Speaker 1 (11:47):
Say, And you have two sisters, correct, I have two
older sisters. Yeah, And are you the one although I
think they're involved in the Mulholland with you, But are
you the one that really has that passion in your family?
Speaker 2 (12:02):
I would say we all were lucky enough to grow
up with that passion in the sense that because my
dad grew up with nothing, and when he achieved something,
he you know, we'd go on family vacations and we
always go back and stop in France because he had
this love, this like affinity and love.
Speaker 1 (12:20):
For who doesn't love France and going to the Louver totally.
Speaker 2 (12:24):
So you know, he took us around the world. He
took us around Europe. We would eat in nice restaurants,
We learned about things he taught us, We went to museums.
I mean, so I think we all kind of took
elements of that and that's what shaped us in where
we are today. And while you know, maybe my sisters
(12:45):
were raising their families, I was there helping him execute
a lot of these a lot of these operations.
Speaker 1 (12:53):
And I'm sure that you that now you don't regret
any time you spent with him.
Speaker 2 (12:58):
No, No, not at all. I have a lot of
fond memories him and I just traveling, whether it was
going to the Restaurant Show in Chicago or going back
to France and going through Bordeaux and tasting wine, going
to an expo. I mean that there was a lot
of like food and wine and a lot of really fun,
(13:18):
uh and educational things too. You know, it's when you're
able to do something you're passionate about and you're able
to go and visit places around the world that are
doing what you're doing, it's it's you know, it's priceless.
Speaker 1 (13:32):
Absolutely absolutely, and you can you know, I've said this
to Patrick, who we both know, and other people. Is
I certainly I am not a semi I'm certainly not
a wine expert. But what fascinates me about wine isn't
the red or the white. And I feel bad for
people who actually miss out on knowing all that there
(13:53):
really is to learn, like the the who was the
wine maker? What side of the hill was it? Where
the grapes from right? And Bordeaux right bank or left bank.
You listen to the guys at the Wine Exchange and
they're certainly experts on all of that, and there's so
much more to wine than just red or white or
(14:14):
even pino or cab right, totally, it's so fascinating. I
love it.
Speaker 2 (14:20):
I like to say that wine is the universal language. Right,
most people think it's mathematics. But like, if I pour
you a glass of wine, we don't need to have
a conversation. We can just sit there. If you spoke
Chinese and I spoke English, we could still enjoy and
tell you if it's good or bad.
Speaker 1 (14:35):
Yeah, absolutely absolutely, and you can talk about you know.
So the guys at the Wine Exchange, for example, send
on an email every day about something and they always
say Kyle always says at the andertriston and you need
to have this. I'm okay, I will. But we like
at our house, what we like to do is print
out their commentary and then when we drink it, then
we can look at what they said about it and
(14:56):
we can study it from that standpoint. So that's something
we like to do at our house.
Speaker 2 (15:01):
And you know, some of the best vacations I've ever
gone on have all been around wine regions or a
wine maker has told me like, hey, you should go
check out this place, and the next minute, we were
going to Maorica and having like an amazing trip. And
so I think winemakers travel a lot, and they like
food and they love people and experiences, and I feel
(15:25):
like they're really great. They would make if they if
they failed at making wine, they would make as a
good travel agent.
Speaker 1 (15:31):
Yeah, yeah, that's true. So that's one of the things
that happened when this radio station called me and said,
we would like a show on Friday afternoons for people
that are getting ready to leave town. And I happen
to have a vacation rental management company, so they said,
we thought of you, Valerie, so would you do it?
I said, gosh, yeah, I mean true. What can I
talk about? They said, to your show? I said done.
(15:53):
So I have a sub name called Vino Villa's and Vacations,
so that's our subtopic for our show. So you're certainly
the guy because you fit all of those things. You
have wine, you have villas, you have vacations, your everything.
So tell me what happened when you did you sell
the Breakers building? Then?
Speaker 2 (16:15):
Yeah, so in twenty seventeen we stole the building and
you know, it's really funny. In two thousand and seven
we went on a trip looking at Fairmont hotels up
in Canada. My dad wanted to turn the Breakers back
into a hotel and he wanted to fly the Fairmont flag.
(16:35):
And for whatever reason, it just didn't happen the Fairmont
maybe whether they weren't interested or they were doing other
projects and it just never it never, it never went
to the next level.
Speaker 1 (16:47):
They came together, huh.
Speaker 2 (16:48):
And we sold it to the group Pacific six, which
is one of the one of the sons of Malie
Healthcare and five others and they've been reconverting the building
back into a hotel. And it is it just opened,
you know, a few months ago, and it's now a
Fairmont hotel.
Speaker 1 (17:05):
Oh, it is.
Speaker 2 (17:08):
It is a Fairmont hotel. It's fortuitous that it is,
Like it's just.
Speaker 1 (17:12):
And that's just pure coincidence. Like your dad didn't sell
it to them, that they had to make it a
fair Mind.
Speaker 2 (17:17):
Oh no, no, And that just kind of goes back
to like the visionary right. Fairmonts are all in most
of them are in historic, beautiful properties as they are,
and that the Breakers is, you know, it's it's it's
a gem of Long Beach and now that it's back
as a hotel and the restaurant. I mean, the whole
building went through I don't know, one hundred million maybe
(17:39):
plus renovations.
Speaker 1 (17:41):
So sure, I'm sure, yeah.
Speaker 2 (17:42):
Yeah, I'm excited to go back and check it out.
Speaker 1 (17:44):
So I was going to ask you if you'd been
back yet, but you haven't.
Speaker 2 (17:47):
I haven't yet. I reached out to the general manager
when I go. So I used to live under the skyroom.
I lived on the twelve floor underneath the sky room,
and so I basically lived at work. But it was
it was like a really fun I was in my
twenties and it was an exciting time and.
Speaker 1 (18:04):
Right down there in the heart of Long Beach, right
there by the yeah, the boats, and yeah.
Speaker 2 (18:09):
It was amazing. And so I would love to like
get the like full tour, like I'd love to. You know,
there's boilers there from the nineteen thirties where you would
shovel I think there was a passageway where a coal
would be shoveled down, and there's all the old like
there's a lot of you look around, you'll see like
the call boxes that you know they're they're they're not
(18:30):
they're not wired electrically, they're just like like a I
don't even know what the apparatus is, but it's just
it's very interesting pulling.
Speaker 1 (18:38):
So they have they would think love. I would think
to have you toured them through and show them all
of those things.
Speaker 2 (18:44):
Yeah. Yeah, there's tunnels that go underground from there too.
I mean so I never I would make it like
maybe like thirty feet into the tunnel and we'd pitch black,
and I'd be like, you know what, this doesn't feel
like a smart idea. Maybe we had a little bit
too much to and we would venture back and I
wouldn't want to get stuck underground.
Speaker 1 (19:04):
Probably not a bad idea, Probably not a bad idea.
So then you you had already kind of left Long
Beach by going to the winecast, going to Santa Barbara.
Speaker 2 (19:13):
Right, So Santa Barbara was back in two thousand and seven,
two thousand and eight, so that my dad's had a
few exoduses from healthcare, and one was in six, one
was in like twenty seventeen, twenty fifteen, twenty seventeen, and
so some of those have turned into our hotels, right,
(19:34):
So in twenty seventeen we took over Chateau Duceerrou, which
is like a beautiful relay in chateau property right by
Yosemite near Bass Lake. And then a little bit later
we took over the mansion on Sutter, which is a
historic mansion. It's an old Victorian from eighteen eighty one.
(19:54):
It survived the earthquake and fires. It was someone's personal residence,
the Pain family mansion, and they made all their money
in the Silver Rush, and they built this beautiful twenty
thousand square foot Victorian mansion. And over the years it's
been multiple different things, but I think the best use
is a small boutique hotel. There's room for a restaurant below.
(20:18):
And we when we took it over in twenty eighteen,
we restored it. We painted all the ceiling, We gold
leaf and silver leafed all the ceilings and brought the
wood back, you know, all the re varnished all the
wood and just gave it like a really beautiful facelift.
And the bones are incredible, So there wasn't much you
(20:39):
needed to do, but it, you know, it's a really
exquisite property.
Speaker 1 (20:43):
There's some touchup, so then you had so let's go
back to the winery the grapes. Let's talk about your grapes.
You started, you bought a winery, you started growing grapes,
if you sell them or what did you do with them?
Speaker 2 (20:56):
So in two thousand and five we bought it was
called Mish in the States, and it was right below
the Mission in Sandy Ned's and so my dad said,
you know what, we'll call it Mission Estates. No problem,
it's it's it's all about the area. And when we
filed for our license, we got a cease and desist
(21:18):
letter from a very powerful chateau in Bordeaux called La
Mission Chateau Oprione. So Oprione is one of the one
of the first growths. Right, Sorry, I'm in the restaurant,
So I hope that noise too.
Speaker 1 (21:35):
You're fine, you're find I don't hear anything.
Speaker 2 (21:38):
And uh so the so it was the first growth
of Bordeaux. And we decided, you know what, we don't
need to fight one of the most powerful houses. Will
change name. And so my dad always remembered his childhood
in France and this love affair with French wine and
French food, and so coque co is the flower. It's
the French red poppy. And so that's what the label
(21:59):
can call. Yeah, Cochley coke flower, you.
Speaker 1 (22:01):
Know, and we just anybody who spells that correct or
who pronounces it correctly, must get a free glass of
wine or something.
Speaker 2 (22:09):
Right. We have some funny videos of people in the
taste room after a few glasses trying to pronounce it.
It's it's pretty commable. But yeah, So we turned the
vineyard organic and we applied for our certification, and so
it's certified organic. And we say we like to make
(22:30):
natural wine in the sense that Europe's been making natural
wine for hundreds of years. It's you know, don't use pesticides,
don't use herbicides. Let's let's do the wine making in
the vineyard and not manipulate the wine in the vineyard
in the winery. Right, So you know, there's over seventy
(22:50):
two chemicals you can add to wine.
Speaker 1 (22:52):
So let's take a break here in that. Let's tell
our listeners and our viewers what classifies a wine as
an organic wine?
Speaker 2 (23:00):
Sure, okay, so organic wines in order for in order
for your vineyard to be organic, you need to not
be spraying pesticides and herbicides like round up is a pesticide, right,
and so there's other ways to deal with pests or
there's other ways to just allow nature to be as
(23:22):
one right, and so like we don't necessarily do biodynamic farming,
but the idea is like if you're in a forest,
you don't go to the forest and start pulling the
weeds out of the forest. The forest does it. If
the forest will correct itself on its own right, trees
will grow, fires will start, Like you don't take you
(23:45):
don't get rid of one insect because it's eating the leaf. Here,
like everything has a symbiotic relationship and in the soil
you have micro organisms and everything adds elements to what
you're doing right, to growing process, so the whole ecology
of the farm. And so if you start spraying your
vineyards with really strong chemicals, you're going to change and
(24:08):
you're going to destroy all those micro organisms definitely. You
know the French call it terroir, right, it's the soil,
it's the aspect of how you grow it, it's the climate.
And so your soil is part of your terroir. And
if you if you disrupt all those micro organisms, you're
going to change. You're going to change your grapes in
(24:29):
many ways. And then we don't want to put harmful chemicals, Like, right,
wine is supposed to be enjoyable, celebratory. It shouldn't be
something that I have to worry about, like are these
are you ingesting chemicals that you shouldn't be ingested? Yeah,
And that's you know, that's the difference between conventional farming
and organic farming. And don't get me wrong, organic The
reason why you don't see a lot of I shouldn't
(24:52):
say we see organic farming, but the reason why you
see conventional farming is organic farming can cost thirty to
fifty percent more than conventional farming. So from an economic standpoint,
it's it's it's not, it's it's not. It's not a
lucrative business.
Speaker 1 (25:08):
And why does it cost more because it's just.
Speaker 2 (25:12):
It's more labor. Right, everything's done by hand. If you
want to get rid of the weeds, you're going to
do it by hand. You're going to set the machine
and go out and there's a it's called the Clemmens
and it you know, it's like a lawnmower for weeds.
And you go out there and it has a sensor
that makes it where it doesn't hit the vines. And
you've got to do that by hand. So it's manpower
woman power.
Speaker 1 (25:32):
Yeah, absolutely for both. And I think I understand, I
know the answer to this. But then the question would be,
so do you taste the difference? But I think with wine,
every little thing tastes different with wine, right.
Speaker 2 (25:44):
Totally, there's nuance to wine. And I'll tell you what,
Like you know, maybe if I was tasting organic grapes
orsus non or grand grapes, maybe I'm not going to
fully taste one hundred percent of the difference between the two.
But at least I know that I didn't have to
use chemicals on those, and then I know that they
won't be harmful to the people drinking it. But like
(26:08):
so like so that's that's growing organic, right. And then
when you make natural wine, and the reason why I
use the word natural wine, and I don't think we
should be scared of that term. Sometimes people think of
it like, oh, the wine's going to be very flawed.
That like, if you make wine correctly and you pick
on your acid levels and you make sure your pH
(26:29):
the grapes are in a good place, like so we
do use some science to navigate where the grapes are.
So acidity and pH are two things that go hand
in hand. You know, as one goes up up, one
one goes low. Like as acid rises, pH drops, and
the pH is important for preserving wine naturally, right, instead
(26:52):
of having to add preservatives to wine. And so I
feel like when you know, when people say, oh, I
go to Europe and I drink wine, I can drink
bottles of it and I don't get hungover, I don't
feel bad, it's because there's no chemicals in those wines.
A lot of you know, you know, you.
Speaker 1 (27:09):
Have as eating eating food in France, right.
Speaker 2 (27:12):
Same as you ask the farmeries when his neighbor starts
to pick grapes and he knows his neighbor makes good wine,
and then he starts to pick grapes. You know, like
they're not often doing as much like technical they're not
using technology and science often at the level of like
maybe we do in the States. So then when you're
making the wine, you're not adding chemicals. You can add
(27:33):
like seventy two different chemicals to the wine, and you
can manipulate the wine and you can change you can
add tannins, you can add acidity, you can make it softer,
you can make it more. You know, there's there's so
many things you can do. And so for me, when
you taste wine like that, I kind of call him
Frankenstein wines. Or you're just like piecemealing this this thing
(27:54):
that you're trying to maybe you're searching for scores or
accolades or whatever it is, and I feel like you
can taste that wine when people are doing too much
to the to the wine. Once the wine gets into
the in the winery, the majority of what we're doing
is topping up the wine, making sure that you know,
(28:16):
the wine doesn't oxidizing barrel. And then when the wine
starts to get reductive. So reductive means that sometimes you
get that like that that egg smell, like sulfur smell
sort of. And so that's like a note when we
know that we need to take the the we need
to rack the wine. So that means you take wine
(28:37):
from one barrel and you move it into a clean barrel,
and what's leftover is like the sediment. It's the lees,
and if it spends too much time on the lees,
the wine could be reductive. And so that's when we know, okay,
let's take it off, let's let's rack that wine. Put
it into new barrels and then you know, plug it
back up and then we'll clean out the old barrels.
(28:58):
We clean it with like citric acid, which is you know,
not harmful at.
Speaker 1 (29:02):
All, and then you're able to reuse them the barrels.
Speaker 2 (29:05):
Oh yeah, yeah, yeah. We So the type of wine
that we make, we're not we're not typically making. So
our whites are like refreshing, they're crisp, they're high in acid.
And the reds we're making are soft and velvety. And
so with the reds, the we use French oak, and
we use predominantly neutral French oaks, so that means the
(29:27):
barrel has been used enough where you're not gonna have
flavors of the oak. And so maybe it's like three
or four times they've been used, so every season that
they get used, like a bit of that wood strips
off of it. And so maybe like we make some
reserve wines and maybe like maybe we'll pick five of
our favorite barrels and we'll do one of those barrels
(29:47):
in new oak and the other four, so it's about
twenty percent new oak for those and those are wines
that we're going to age a little longer. Because remember,
so oak has tannins, and tannins are what dry out
your mouth. And we're we're drinking cabernet right, let's say,
and cabernet has really aggressive, strong tannons. So you're taking
oak tannins and wine tannins, you're mixing them together, and
(30:08):
the wine is just like super astringent. It's like biting
into unripe per Simon. And so those wines when you
bottle them, they need time and bottle to soften and
have all the cell walls break down, and the tannin
is not so a stringent. So I'm not that patient.
(30:28):
I don't think most people are that patient. So why
add the oak tannons if we're going to drink the
wine within five years of it being bottled. So we
like to make a lot of our reds like soft, juicy,
easy to drink, a little bit lower in alcohol. So
we use like acidity and pH to help preserve our wines.
Speaker 1 (30:50):
And are your wines made from grapes that you you raise?
I mean you grow those grapes. You don't buy any
other wine other grapes make your wine with.
Speaker 2 (31:01):
Like ninety eight percent of the wine that we make
is from grapes that we grow, and so Cokeley Co.
To give you like a depth scale. The whole property
itself is just shy of one hundred acres and we
have about fifty eight acres planted with thirteen different varietals.
So you know, with thirteen bridles, it means we make
(31:25):
probably thirty different wines. I feel like we're always adding
a skew each year, like, oh, let's try this out.
Speaker 1 (31:32):
Yeah, sure, of course, of course you do.
Speaker 2 (31:35):
Yeah, you know that's the fun part, a little bit
of experimentation, you know, match with We've been doing it
long enough. So we've been making wine since O six
What is that it's almost twenty years? Is you know?
Nineteen years? I'm doing the math right.
Speaker 1 (31:52):
And your bottles are labeled Cokeleico Estate.
Speaker 2 (31:56):
Vineyard, Yes, correct, Cocleco Estate, and you'll see all the
red poppies on it, and they always say made with
organic grapes in the front label.
Speaker 1 (32:03):
How much competition is there in the organic market? Are
you one of five thousand or even? How do other
people do it?
Speaker 2 (32:11):
I couldn't give you the exact number, but I think
when I was studying to be as simile aim, I
think this is the statistic, the statistic that I was given.
The wine that we make as far as like independent
small production wine only represents about ten percent of the
(32:32):
wine produced in the world or the United States. Let's
say the other ninety percent is attributed to companies like
Constellation Wine Rands, Gallo and so forth. And I think
it's I think the stat goes Gallo makes enough wine
for California to be the fourth largest producing wine region
in the world. So it's usually it's like a jocking
(32:56):
position between France, Spain, and Italy for one, two, three,
depending on the I think Spain has been making more,
and then California comes in at four, specifically because of Gallo.
There's a lot of bulk wine out there, you know,
which is fine.
Speaker 1 (33:13):
Everything they bought a lot of They bought a lot
of wineries. At a certain point, didn't they start.
Speaker 2 (33:19):
Totally It's a little bit of everything, right. You're sort
of just acquiring juice from lots. You know. There was
a time where we sold some of our juice and
some bigger companies would absorb it because they're they're looking
for one hundred tons of murlow or cab or whatever. Sure,
and some of them put up the would put them
under an organic label too, Like some of those companies
(33:40):
do make an organic label as well. But like when
you're making things at such scale, it's really you're really
at that point. It becomes a chemistry equation. You're trying
to make sure everything is at this level to homogenize it,
to make it all taste the same year in at
after a year, because you're building this brand, and that's
(34:02):
just kind of not what wine is. Wine changes, it
evolves every year, it's different. The excitement is to taste
that producer's next vintage and roll kind of roll ride
the wave, right, because every year there might be years
that are better than other years. It's natural to have that.
Speaker 1 (34:23):
And what's the tasting range of your wines? Are they
good for five years, twenty years? You should they be
consumed in three years?
Speaker 2 (34:32):
Well, so it comes down to a few things, right,
like what's preserving the wine? Acidity? pH Tannin's preserved wine.
So that's why like a lot of red wine can
age longer. The tannins come from the skins, the seeds,
and the stems. While white wine is typically like you
pick it, you press it, and you separate the skin,
(34:53):
seeds and stems. Red wine. You ferment on the skins,
sometimes on the stems too, but you definite you know
all the color comforts and the skins. So you know, I've
I've had wines going back to our first intig six
oh seven. They were very good. Yeah, you know, I
opened a twenty eleven word o blend and it was delicious.
(35:14):
It was still drinking nicely. So yeah, I think agibilities
five to twenty years for sure.
Speaker 1 (35:21):
Well, that's good to know. We'll have to we'll have
to try that here. So we've talked about your wines
a little bit, and I really hope that you'll come
back again because we have too much to talk about
for just one episode. But let's talk about your time
in the restaurant industry. How did that start?
Speaker 2 (35:36):
Yeah?
Speaker 1 (35:37):
Sorry, back to the sky.
Speaker 2 (35:40):
The skyroom was the incubator, and the experiences that I
had with my dad opened up my eyes to like,
what what are the possibilities? And we visited many Michelin
Star restaurants. We had meals that were performances and so
(36:03):
beautifully orchestrated that we really fell in love with this
industry and what it can be done. And so the
restaurant that we opened up in Calabassis. You know, every
every one of our every one of our projects has
always been like rooted in fine dining. And I love
fine dining. I think it's amazing. But when we came
(36:23):
up with the idea of this restaurant, the idea was accessibility. Right,
fine dining maybe you maybe it's once a year, maybe
it's once every few years, or maybe for some of
the lucky ones, it's once a month, you know, but
it's not a meal you can eat on a daily basis.
And so we wanted to create a restaurant that felt
like your neighborhood gem restaurant that made everything from scratch,
(36:47):
that was delicious, that was fresh, that was seasonal, that
focused on seafood and vegetables, and also like sourcing really
great quality products, you know. And so we brought on
a chef that came out of a three Michelin star
restaurant out of New York City. He was part of
(37:08):
the Make It Nice group, which is eleven Madison Park.
He moved to LA to open up the Nomad Hotel. Unfortunately,
the Nomad did not make it and and.
Speaker 1 (37:18):
He happened to be available when and you found him, right, Yeah,
we found him, Yeah, after he left Curtis Stone after
the pandemic and we found him.
Speaker 2 (37:27):
And so he's been our culinary director. He oversees all
three of our restaurants. And his counterpart, So his name
is chef Chris Flint, and his counterpart is Michelle Carter.
She worked in Boston at at some really famous restaurants
James Beard worn winning chef. Of course at the moment
(37:50):
I'm neglecting, I'll remember this name, but she worked at
really incredible restaurants out of Boston. So the two of
them at the Helm here and we created this really
beautiful restaurant for the namehood Calabasas the San Fernando Valley.
I feel like, you know, in a world of strip
(38:11):
malls and chain restaurants, our idea was, okay, how can
we create something that's that that cares about every little element,
but without it being fine dining. So it's like all
the elements that you would think about for fine dining,
but in a you know, a casual, elegant setting, right,
almost like an oxymoron on.
Speaker 1 (38:31):
So if we come to the mulholland, what what we see?
What kind of a meal will we have.
Speaker 2 (38:36):
Okay, so if you come here, we're going to give
you the best meal.
Speaker 1 (38:40):
Now I'm probably going to come there.
Speaker 2 (38:42):
So we bake our own faicasha, so you're gonna have
to their ficasha. And so the faicasha come. It could
come with pizza butter, which I say is my retirement plan.
Or it can come with cheese fondue if you're feeling naughty,
cheese fondo with red wine braised onions. It's amazing. It's
(39:04):
a blend of aplas and some potato puree and it's
out of this world. And then so we'll move to
some vegetables. The chef makes these tempora mushrooms from my
taki mushrooms with a noriaoli. That's incredible. We make an
incredible caesar salad with chickor eats. We also have a
(39:28):
raw bar. You're gonna want to get our scallop crudo
or maybe our hamachi crudo. And then chef makes pasta's
in house. We do some Tortellini's, We do a Capitelli pasta,
and then the signature entres I would say is our chicken.
I normally tell people like you don't go out to
(39:49):
a restaurant to order a chicken. But this is a
special chicken. It takes three days to make. We source
it from Petaluma, we take pig meat, we cure it,
we won't feed it in duck fat. We turn it
into a jew. That takes about three days for that
proper process, you know. So when I say fine dining,
that's what they would do.
Speaker 1 (40:07):
In a fine dining restaurant, definitely.
Speaker 2 (40:10):
And then the breast is brine, subeede and roasted crispy,
so it's moist and delicious. And then I would say,
like our scalops, we do it with kind of like
a Tai curry with carrots and bitted rice and it's
like really really delicious. Those are probably the two entrees
that I haven't had the heart to change.
Speaker 1 (40:30):
But the chicken just has the jew.
Speaker 2 (40:35):
And then like the creamiest mashed potatoes you've ever had,
very like Joel Roboshone inspired.
Speaker 1 (40:41):
And I'm and I happen to be a mashed potatoes girl.
I was born and raised in the Midwest. It's my
I've got to have it meat and potatoes.
Speaker 2 (40:48):
Yeah. But yeah, so like that's the type of meal
it's going to be a journey it's gonna be. I
always find like layers of flavors, unexpected flavors, textures, all
of that's so important. Kind of like in my mindset,
like we look at I like to look at a
dish like almost like a triangle, like there's three points
on it, and you have to all three points for
(41:11):
it to really go over the top, you know, and
make you want to come back for another bite.
Speaker 1 (41:17):
Absolutely, it sounds pretty decadent. And I'm sure then that
there's desserts and wine to go along.
Speaker 2 (41:24):
So I think the house favorite dessert it's a chocolate
moose with a passion fruit caramel inside the moose, and
then it's got a passion fruit for a moo on
top and passion fruit sorbet. There's just this like I
love passion fruit, and I think when you mix it
with chocolate, it's really fun. The other one would be
probably our lemon curve. So we we we dipped a
(41:50):
lemon curd into liquid shortbread and then we freeze it
to set it, and then we serve that with homade
and ricotta ice cream. And that one's also so I
don't think we've had the heart to take that off
the menu and the chef. Because I'm gluten free. For
my fortieth birthday, they made me that and they made
(42:10):
it gluten free, and the rest of them came out
so good that you couldn't tell the difference that we
just make it gluten free now. So, if you are
gluten green and you want short red lemon curd, I
got you.
Speaker 1 (42:23):
Well, you certainly have delved into two of the most
challenging industries there are, which is food and hospitality. You
know those, And how do you keep the I know
everyone months to know is how do you keep the
quality and the passion alive in your dining establishments.
Speaker 2 (42:46):
Well, I think it's important to inspire your team. I
think it's important to lead by example. Coming to work
doesn't feel like work. We've fostered this culture and this
community around us, and then it doesn't hurt to have
a really good bottle of tequila behind the bar.
Speaker 1 (43:06):
It doesn't.
Speaker 2 (43:08):
Or a few Yeah. You know, when you're around passionate people,
you're always pushing each other to do something exciting and fun.
And so while I'm not a chef, I look at
flavor the same way, like through the same lens, like
I think maybe in another world. If I could do
both like run a dining room, cook and be the
(43:32):
same way or all three, I would. I would do it.
But you kind of have to allow others to do things.
And you know the three Michelin star chef that works
with us, Chef Chris, Like we went and brought him
on board. If I can't cook better than he can,
but it's fun to like bounce ideas and flavors off
of each other. And and so I think that's like,
(43:53):
that's exciting to me.
Speaker 1 (43:55):
I'm sure that he probably comes to you with some
ideas and says, you know, I saw this, or I
thought of this, or can I do this, and ask
permission to do some fun and exciting things.
Speaker 2 (44:06):
You know, we're sending each other like reds on Instagram
back and forth.
Speaker 1 (44:10):
Tell you this, Yeah, I know, I know. I do
that with my team from time to time. So tell me,
is it at this restaurant that I heard that you
have an exciting bar?
Speaker 2 (44:22):
They're also, uh, yes, I could not forget our bar program.
So you know, don't you hate it when like you
redid the house, but like, oh, you should have changed
those old curtains and you didn't change the curtains and
they just don't look right. Yep. The bar can't be
the old curtains. They need to be exciting too. So
(44:42):
if you've got good food and great service, your drinks
have to match. We brought Chad austin In. Chad was
our bar manager. He has since moved on to another project,
but he still consults with us, so he's still making
all of our menus. And Chad is like he's an
almanac for spirits.
Speaker 1 (45:02):
Uh.
Speaker 2 (45:03):
He knows the flavor profiles of every spirit. It's incredible
how good his palette is. And he brings together like
unexpected things, whether it's like bell pepper or tomato or saffron,
or we have a pea cocktail or white like white
chocolate and peas. I mean we like And that's an
(45:23):
homage to Jeremy Fox and so like. He's very tapped
into the community. He's he's mixing nuances together. I have
a cocktail called the Moholland Drive. It is our signature
jin Martini. I will tell I challenge all of Los
Angeles to a Martini duel. I think this is the
best martini in LA I've had a lot of them.
(45:45):
Vodka or gin based. It's it's a olive leaf gin
that's been fat washed with avocado oil, Uzu gin, a
blend of revermooths basil o de vee shaken up. Actually
it's stirred with some basil oil, and it is the
most nuanced, beautiful. Like even if you don't like gin,
(46:09):
you'll you'll then like have an appreciation to be like,
oh my god, I should I should drink more gin
because this is really interesting.
Speaker 1 (46:17):
It sounds amazing, and I would love to. I need
to come there.
Speaker 2 (46:22):
You have to, because now I put the challenge out there,
so I.
Speaker 1 (46:25):
Have absolutely and I do want to take a few
minutes because again I'm I know hopefully you'll come back
to us again, but talk to us about your hospitality.
So you have three boutique hotels. Is that what you
call them?
Speaker 2 (46:42):
Yeah, they're they're bed and breakfast or yeah. I like
the word boutique hotel because I don't want to like,
you know, your weird aunt wakes up and cooks eggs
for you in the morning and you're like tiptoeing around
her house. That's the vibe I get with the like
bed and breakfast. Maybe that's a bad vision, but they're
(47:02):
all about twelve bedrooms on average. The Mirabelle has first
oak for snook is Michelin recognized we do a three
course or a five horse tasting menu. Chef Chris oversees
that menu. They do weddings and catering up in Wine Country.
I mean, it's just this quaint little like you know,
in the town of Solving. All the all the properties
(47:24):
look like you're in Copenhagen, you know, in Denmark. So
it's just this cute, little four story building. It's very intimate.
We get a lot of weddings that will buy the
whole place out, and the whole family stays there and
that's really fun. And then especially when we're cooking their
their welcome reception and their and their wedding dinner, it's
really like special to be a part of those celebrations
(47:45):
with people like these light these momentous life milestones. So
I really love that. As I said, I was, I
was catering a wedding yesterday and.
Speaker 1 (47:56):
I heard that, tell us about it, tell us about.
Speaker 2 (47:58):
And we were at the Sunstone Bill and this couple
wanted a very fine dining, very well put together, beautiful menu,
and yeah, we went out there and we served this
beautiful meal and it's like overlooking the hills and I
think there was maybe like ten thousand flowers all over
the place. I mean, it was gorgeous. We'll post some
(48:21):
photos on our social media because it And then you know,
up in Yosemite, I mean that that is a Chateau
Deucero is a ten bedroom castle with a two bedroom villa,
a fine dining restaurant and a spa. And if you
want to like go to Europe, but you don't want
to hop on a ten hour flight or maybe it's
(48:42):
a little too expensive if you go there. The original
owners from Austria, she went and hand sourced all the furniture, doors, fixtures,
everything from Europe. You feel like you're in a hundred
year old castle. Really gorgeous, it's really well put together.
The service is so warm and just different. You're not
going to find surface quite like that. It's so personal.
(49:05):
Our concierge team will set you up on tours to
Yosemite or if you want to go fly fishing or
any other outdoor adventures. And then the restaurant, I mean, like, look,
it's a sleepy town. You're gonna go hiking or you're
gonna go out and do some nature elements or go
get a massage, and then your dinner is the show.
And they do a beautiful five course tasting menu there
(49:26):
that like we went out and our chef foraged wood
bark from trees, and we blaze that ourselves and the
boosh comes on a piece of wood that comes from
the forest and it's decorated with all the all the
pine needles, and it's just like that comes and it
(49:49):
sets the tone for like what that night's going to
be like. And you know, it's when dining is an
experience a show, just like a beautiful memory. And so
they do a lot of events and weddings and anniversaries
and celebrations and it's just you feel like you're in
a completely different place. You feel like you're in Europe
for a minute, and and it's like a for me,
(50:14):
it's like connecting with nature and getting off your phone,
Like we need more of that and this this gives
that that that opportunity for our guests.
Speaker 1 (50:24):
That is amazing. So now I've found three places I
need to visit for housing, for for hospitality and new
restaurants and wine. So everybody on this call or who's
been listening to this program day of this episode. We've
we've certainly got you covered. So tell us what are
the trends, what's happening in dining? What's next for you?
(50:45):
What is there something what is something you haven't done
yet or you want to do.
Speaker 2 (50:51):
Trends? Okay, so one thing I want to do here
at the mall halland we do want to like kind
of set up like a secret dinner clubs. So so,
like I said, we're like fine dining incognito, but it's
casual enough, like there's a burger on the menu, Like
we want people to come every week and it shouldn't
feel too happy to do that, but once a month,
(51:12):
we would love to do these really beautiful orchestrated like
ten course tasting menus and just kind of flex that
muscle a little bit with wine pairings and just like
an exquisite experience. That would be fun. I think as
far as like trends go, I see people doing mini cocktails.
I think that's kind of fun where people don't want
(51:32):
to drink as much, but they want to be able
to taste through more cocktails. That could be kind of interesting.
We're doing a Majong Night where groups will come and
sit outside on our beautiful patio and you come as
a team of four and they're playing Ma genres.
Speaker 1 (51:48):
I want to do that. I wanted to do that
with someone here in Orange County, and now you've inspired
me to go back to them and say they're doing
that at the Mala Island one hundred percent.
Speaker 2 (51:57):
Yeah. Yeah, my sister got into it and they all
have such a great time. So we're opening up to
like ten teams of four. We're going to put a
little buffet out there so they can in the middle
take a break. So I love I love events.
Speaker 1 (52:09):
Have friends who live in Newbury Park, so I'm we're going.
Speaker 2 (52:12):
To do that June seventeenth to do that and we're
I love events. I love sharing new flavor profiles with people.
So for me, it's always trying to turn people on
to an maybe alternatives to like the conventionally farmed wine
or the tequila that might have a lot of additives.
(52:32):
So I really love to like show people like new
different things. So that's that's a lot of fun, like
exciting events that that's going to be the friend for
the next year for us.
Speaker 1 (52:44):
So tell people, tell our viewers and our listeners who
have loved this episode. How to find you if they
wanted you to cater an event or how to find
you just to look at your history and look at
all of the places that you manage and involved with.
Speaker 2 (52:57):
Sure, so you can find us at the Mulholland La
is our handle for Instagram and Mulholland dot com is
our restaurant in Calabassis. I feel like that's the easiest
one to get to. And if you want to go
up to Chateau Ducero, same thing at Chateau Ducero and
(53:18):
first no Oak is at first and Oak so uh
and then Cochlico. Yeah, all of ours. If you go
find just our names, you'll you'll find our handles pretty easily.
Speaker 1 (53:30):
That's that's going to be a great So many people
I know are going to want to follow you, and
what a great episode. We're so glad to have you
on so cal with Valve all the things that I
pictured when I started this show, I knew these are
the elements that I would have to have. Our vino
and our villas and our vacations. And you certainly you,
certainly to some of us, you live the dream you
(53:52):
are what we all want to be, so thank you
so much for being with us, and please say you'll
come back, because we haven't even touched on some of
the subjects.
Speaker 2 (54:01):
Totally would love to come back. Thank you so much
for your time today.
Speaker 1 (54:04):
Now, yeah, thank you for sharing your remarkable journey and
your wisdom. Your passion for hospitality and wine and exceptional
service not only inspiring, but it's a true testament to
your family, your dedication to excellence. It's been a real
privilege to have you, so to all of our listeners
and viewers, please follow him, go to the mulholland go
(54:25):
to all of his establishments, and thank you for tuning
into Socoa with Vel. We will see you next week
with more stories, insights, and adventures from the heart of California.
Until then, remember to embrace the journey and always live
fully
Welcome back to SOCAW with Vell. Today's episode is incredibly
special as we have the privilege of sitting down with
one of California's most distinguished hospitality figures, Jonathan Rosenson. Jonathan
is a seasoned restauranteur, a somalier, a hotel, a hospitality
executive known for his incredible work managing boutique hotels like
(00:45):
Mirabel Inn and solving Chateau de Soiree in Oakhurst, the
Mansion on Sutter in San Francisco. He's also behind the
renowned fine dining establishments First then Oak and The Elder House,
both of which have earned prestigious accolades. In addition to
his ongoing ventures, Jonathan has now recently added something truly
(01:09):
exciting to his repertoire and that of him and his family,
The Mulholland in Calabasas, a brand new restaurant that promises
to redefine dining in that area. We've heard great things
about it, but let's not forget that. Jonathan is also
the creative mind and the proprietor of Cooke Klo Estate Vineyard,
(01:30):
a certified organic winery in the San Anez Valley. His
passion for food wine and exceptional guest experiences has definitely
made him a prominent figure in California's culinary and hospitality scenes. Jonathan,
thank you so much for joining us today. It is
truly an honor to have you here on so galat Val.
Speaker 2 (01:52):
Thanks Val. What an introduction.
Speaker 1 (01:55):
Well, I'm sure it's all well deserved. I think it's
fair to say from what I've heard and read that
your story begins actually a long time ago, and your
story really begins with your dad, and that seems pretty touching.
So tell us a little bit about him and his
journey here, how he got here, and what he did
(02:16):
once he arrived here, how that shaped you.
Speaker 2 (02:18):
Sure. Yeah, I've always admired him. He was a larger
than life person, and you know, I admired all the
hard work and success that he had throughout his career.
And you know, he immigrated to this country in the
nineteen fifties on the Queen Mary Wow, and they're all
(02:42):
World War Two survivors, so it was just incredible that
they were able to get to France. He grew up
in France and then in the fifties came over on
the Queen Mary and they settled in Brooklyn, and you
know his childhood, you know, he was always hungry to learn.
(03:02):
He put himself through school. You know, he tells a
story of having to borrow money from my mom to
pay for her wedding ring. You know, he told her
it was paying for books, but he was really getting
her engagement ring. It's just you know, it's like very
like it's this it's like sort of like that immigrants
(03:24):
tail where you feel like the American dream could kind
of be attainable. And so he moved in the seventies
to California for opportunity, and he started in healthcare and
he made a big splash in the retirement home community
and there he started he found a partner and that
(03:44):
they brought him in to help him then build their
their organization, and winded up at the Skyroom in Long
Beach because the building the Breakers was a retirement community.
And so I.
Speaker 1 (03:57):
Guess I didn't realize that. I mean, that really goes
back a lot, Yeah.
Speaker 2 (04:01):
For sure. So I was probably thirteen going to the restaurant,
and the Skyroom had a live music and a dance
floor bar, and it was just like a really high
energy place. And I remember going there and just feeling
the excitement and being really really like enamored by it.
And as I went through high school, I just kind
(04:23):
of knew that I was going to work with him
and continue that legacy that he started here. And so
I got my economics degree and I came back and
I started working with him and I started at the Skyroom,
and then that's when he encouraged me to become a Somalia.
And so when I was twenty two, I entered a program.
(04:47):
We ended up taking over the Wine Cask in Santa Barbara.
It had a random word wine list and it was
a wine shop, wine bar, fine dining restaurant, and I
really was experienced, like I really was. I met winemakers,
I met chefs that cooked in Michelle and star restaurants.
I mean it was really like a really an exceptional
(05:09):
place to like foster such a growing knowledge.
Speaker 1 (05:14):
So it was must have just been like you know,
starstruck every day.
Speaker 2 (05:19):
Yeah it was. It was fun. Yeah, yeah, there was
there was some interesting a lot of interesting, whether it
was celebrities or food critics coming through there. It was.
It was definitely a fun time.
Speaker 1 (05:34):
Yeah that's amazing. And so your dad and I was
arounding them, but I didn't remember that The Breakers was
a retirement home. That's a pretty amazing story. And your
dad was one of the owners.
Speaker 2 (05:46):
Yeah, so, so you would have never known from the
outside of the building and from the skyroom. So it
was the only fine dining restaurant in a retirement community
in the whole nation. And he got a special part
in from the state of California. So when he took
over the property, the restaurant was just kind of abandoned,
and so he sort of had this dream to recreate
(06:07):
that art Deco twenty supper club, and yeah, he was
a visionary. He put that together and from ninety seven
to twenty seventeen we ran it, and yeah, it was
a lot of fun. It was a really high energy restaurant.
It was sort of that Ybone era where people would
(06:28):
get dressed up and go out for a nice dinner
and there'd be entertainment and you know, you wouldn't be
on your phone, you would you would be engaged with
the experience.
Speaker 1 (06:37):
And it had music also, right, Yeah, there.
Speaker 2 (06:40):
Was a live band. There was. I had regulars that
came every week and danced. We had the Dancing of
the Star. All all the instructors from Dancing to the
Stars would bring their students and come, you know, because
it's one thing to learn in a ballroom, but to
come and actually have like practical like a place to
do it is more fun.
Speaker 1 (06:57):
Right, absolutely, Yeah, that's that's a great story. But tell
us more about your dad's time in Long Beach. I've
heard that he has a had a sentimental attraction to
something there. Tell us about it.
Speaker 2 (07:08):
So you know, you're you're overlooking the Queen Mary and
that was the ship that he immigrated on when he
was nine years old, and you know, he tells the
story of you know, when they saw land for the
first time in York at the Statue of Liberty, like
everyone just started crying and it was just like a
really joyous moment and it was an opportunity for them
(07:30):
to do something different and to you know, make a
new home. You know, while France was nice, they had
cousins there, that's how they got there, from from Poland
to France, but maybe it just wasn't their home, right,
so they had a new opportunity and the United States
just felt like this this hope for them.
Speaker 1 (07:51):
And did he come to Long Beach before the Queen Mary?
Speaker 2 (07:55):
Right, yeah, I believe. So, I'm not sure when the
Queen Mary arrived, but he was in he moved to
California in the seventies.
Speaker 1 (08:03):
Yeah, it was about the same time. I'm thinking that
it arrived in the early seventies. I don't remember exactly
how early, but sure that must have been really emotional
for him to think about being there and those when
he was so young and remember those times.
Speaker 2 (08:18):
Yeah, yeah, and I remember we went and toward we
went to the Queen Mary. We toward it, we had
brunch there. I mean, it was just one of those
We took my grandparents there. So it's just one of
those things to have that piece of history still existing.
Speaker 1 (08:32):
Yeah, and right there with him. Yeah, Yeah, it's incredible.
So you started at the Skyroom, So tell me what
happened after that.
Speaker 2 (08:41):
Yeah. So as soon as so my dad was making
a shift from health care to hospitality, I think he
just caught the winebug. He fell in love with it.
I think the excitement, and so we.
Speaker 1 (08:56):
Started all serving people but much different.
Speaker 2 (08:59):
It's different, yeah, exactly. So he fell in love with that,
and so that's when the next the next property we
took over was the Wine Cask, and that was up
in Santa Barbara, beautiful historic restaurant. My dad was like
an art antiqu collector from the time he was a
little boy. You know, they didn't have a lot of
money in France, but they could go to the museums
(09:21):
for free on Sundays, and so every weekend my grandfather
would take my dad to the Louver. And so I think,
like that whole, like Louis the thirteenth, eighteenth century art,
like all of that like probably really inspired him and
really shaped some of his his his passions in life.
(09:43):
So he always had this passion for like historic properties.
And so the wine cask was historic. We were in
we were you know when we ran that, it was
it was just a nice time. It was. It was
a different time, right, And then the eight crash hit,
So that was hard on restaurant. You know, restaurants are
we're like the beacon of a community, but we you know,
(10:06):
we're only as good as how strong the community is,
and oftentimes when things crash, it's hard to stay afloat
during those times. So fortunately we closed the wine cask
and you know, we're just picking up the pieces. I
went back to the skyroom, was running the skyroom probably
from nine to twenty fifteen. And then that's when we
(10:30):
invested in wine country at the mirrabell In. So we
were making wine since two thousand and six. So like
when I said my dad caught the wine bug, you know,
he got really did right home business. Yeah, he was
collecting wine and then he decided, you know what, let's
take over a vineyard and let's start producing wine ourselves.
(10:53):
So yeah, really like he was a big dreamer and
like a renaissance man. Right ever stopped, He never stopped.
He always was was going.
Speaker 1 (11:04):
And did you like that? Did you ever tell him
you shouldn't do this, you should just slow down? Or
did you always were you so excited by that that
you just loved being around him?
Speaker 2 (11:14):
You know, it's like fifty to fifty, right, Like the
winery and the restaurants were very exciting and they were fun,
and there were a lot of hard work, and I
think that, you know, while there were some things would
have been nice to maybe just slow down and focus
a bit. I also respected his vision and saw that
(11:36):
he's been doing this for a long time and he's
been able to be successful at it, and you know,
he he built up a well organized operation. So I
was excited, I would.
Speaker 1 (11:47):
Say, And you have two sisters, correct, I have two
older sisters. Yeah, And are you the one although I
think they're involved in the Mulholland with you, But are
you the one that really has that passion in your family?
Speaker 2 (12:02):
I would say we all were lucky enough to grow
up with that passion in the sense that because my
dad grew up with nothing, and when he achieved something,
he you know, we'd go on family vacations and we
always go back and stop in France because he had
this love, this like affinity and love.
Speaker 1 (12:20):
For who doesn't love France and going to the Louver totally.
Speaker 2 (12:24):
So you know, he took us around the world. He
took us around Europe. We would eat in nice restaurants,
We learned about things he taught us, We went to museums.
I mean, so I think we all kind of took
elements of that and that's what shaped us in where
we are today. And while you know, maybe my sisters
(12:45):
were raising their families, I was there helping him execute
a lot of these a lot of these operations.
Speaker 1 (12:53):
And I'm sure that you that now you don't regret
any time you spent with him.
Speaker 2 (12:58):
No, No, not at all. I have a lot of
fond memories him and I just traveling, whether it was
going to the Restaurant Show in Chicago or going back
to France and going through Bordeaux and tasting wine, going
to an expo. I mean that there was a lot
of like food and wine and a lot of really fun,
(13:18):
uh and educational things too. You know, it's when you're
able to do something you're passionate about and you're able
to go and visit places around the world that are
doing what you're doing, it's it's you know, it's priceless.
Speaker 1 (13:32):
Absolutely absolutely, and you can you know, I've said this
to Patrick, who we both know, and other people. Is
I certainly I am not a semi I'm certainly not
a wine expert. But what fascinates me about wine isn't
the red or the white. And I feel bad for
people who actually miss out on knowing all that there
(13:53):
really is to learn, like the the who was the
wine maker? What side of the hill was it? Where
the grapes from right? And Bordeaux right bank or left bank.
You listen to the guys at the Wine Exchange and
they're certainly experts on all of that, and there's so
much more to wine than just red or white or
(14:14):
even pino or cab right, totally, it's so fascinating. I
love it.
Speaker 2 (14:20):
I like to say that wine is the universal language. Right,
most people think it's mathematics. But like, if I pour
you a glass of wine, we don't need to have
a conversation. We can just sit there. If you spoke
Chinese and I spoke English, we could still enjoy and
tell you if it's good or bad.
Speaker 1 (14:35):
Yeah, absolutely absolutely, and you can talk about you know.
So the guys at the Wine Exchange, for example, send
on an email every day about something and they always
say Kyle always says at the andertriston and you need
to have this. I'm okay, I will. But we like
at our house, what we like to do is print
out their commentary and then when we drink it, then
we can look at what they said about it and
(14:56):
we can study it from that standpoint. So that's something
we like to do at our house.
Speaker 2 (15:01):
And you know, some of the best vacations I've ever
gone on have all been around wine regions or a
wine maker has told me like, hey, you should go
check out this place, and the next minute, we were
going to Maorica and having like an amazing trip. And
so I think winemakers travel a lot, and they like
food and they love people and experiences, and I feel
(15:25):
like they're really great. They would make if they if
they failed at making wine, they would make as a
good travel agent.
Speaker 1 (15:31):
Yeah, yeah, that's true. So that's one of the things
that happened when this radio station called me and said,
we would like a show on Friday afternoons for people
that are getting ready to leave town. And I happen
to have a vacation rental management company, so they said,
we thought of you, Valerie, so would you do it?
I said, gosh, yeah, I mean true. What can I
talk about? They said, to your show? I said done.
(15:53):
So I have a sub name called Vino Villa's and Vacations,
so that's our subtopic for our show. So you're certainly
the guy because you fit all of those things. You
have wine, you have villas, you have vacations, your everything.
So tell me what happened when you did you sell
the Breakers building? Then?
Speaker 2 (16:15):
Yeah, so in twenty seventeen we stole the building and
you know, it's really funny. In two thousand and seven
we went on a trip looking at Fairmont hotels up
in Canada. My dad wanted to turn the Breakers back
into a hotel and he wanted to fly the Fairmont flag.
(16:35):
And for whatever reason, it just didn't happen the Fairmont
maybe whether they weren't interested or they were doing other
projects and it just never it never, it never went
to the next level.
Speaker 1 (16:47):
They came together, huh.
Speaker 2 (16:48):
And we sold it to the group Pacific six, which
is one of the one of the sons of Malie
Healthcare and five others and they've been reconverting the building
back into a hotel. And it is it just opened,
you know, a few months ago, and it's now a
Fairmont hotel.
Speaker 1 (17:05):
Oh, it is.
Speaker 2 (17:08):
It is a Fairmont hotel. It's fortuitous that it is,
Like it's just.
Speaker 1 (17:12):
And that's just pure coincidence. Like your dad didn't sell
it to them, that they had to make it a
fair Mind.
Speaker 2 (17:17):
Oh no, no, And that just kind of goes back
to like the visionary right. Fairmonts are all in most
of them are in historic, beautiful properties as they are,
and that the Breakers is, you know, it's it's it's
a gem of Long Beach and now that it's back
as a hotel and the restaurant. I mean, the whole
building went through I don't know, one hundred million maybe
(17:39):
plus renovations.
Speaker 1 (17:41):
So sure, I'm sure, yeah.
Speaker 2 (17:42):
Yeah, I'm excited to go back and check it out.
Speaker 1 (17:44):
So I was going to ask you if you'd been
back yet, but you haven't.
Speaker 2 (17:47):
I haven't yet. I reached out to the general manager
when I go. So I used to live under the skyroom.
I lived on the twelve floor underneath the sky room,
and so I basically lived at work. But it was
it was like a really fun I was in my
twenties and it was an exciting time and.
Speaker 1 (18:04):
Right down there in the heart of Long Beach, right
there by the yeah, the boats, and yeah.
Speaker 2 (18:09):
It was amazing. And so I would love to like
get the like full tour, like I'd love to. You know,
there's boilers there from the nineteen thirties where you would
shovel I think there was a passageway where a coal
would be shoveled down, and there's all the old like
there's a lot of you look around, you'll see like
the call boxes that you know they're they're they're not
(18:30):
they're not wired electrically, they're just like like a I
don't even know what the apparatus is, but it's just
it's very interesting pulling.
Speaker 1 (18:38):
So they have they would think love. I would think
to have you toured them through and show them all
of those things.
Speaker 2 (18:44):
Yeah. Yeah, there's tunnels that go underground from there too.
I mean so I never I would make it like
maybe like thirty feet into the tunnel and we'd pitch black,
and I'd be like, you know what, this doesn't feel
like a smart idea. Maybe we had a little bit
too much to and we would venture back and I
wouldn't want to get stuck underground.
Speaker 1 (19:04):
Probably not a bad idea, Probably not a bad idea.
So then you you had already kind of left Long
Beach by going to the winecast, going to Santa Barbara.
Speaker 2 (19:13):
Right, So Santa Barbara was back in two thousand and seven,
two thousand and eight, so that my dad's had a
few exoduses from healthcare, and one was in six, one
was in like twenty seventeen, twenty fifteen, twenty seventeen, and
so some of those have turned into our hotels, right,
(19:34):
So in twenty seventeen we took over Chateau Duceerrou, which
is like a beautiful relay in chateau property right by
Yosemite near Bass Lake. And then a little bit later
we took over the mansion on Sutter, which is a
historic mansion. It's an old Victorian from eighteen eighty one.
(19:54):
It survived the earthquake and fires. It was someone's personal residence,
the Pain family mansion, and they made all their money
in the Silver Rush, and they built this beautiful twenty
thousand square foot Victorian mansion. And over the years it's
been multiple different things, but I think the best use
is a small boutique hotel. There's room for a restaurant below.
(20:18):
And we when we took it over in twenty eighteen,
we restored it. We painted all the ceiling, We gold
leaf and silver leafed all the ceilings and brought the
wood back, you know, all the re varnished all the
wood and just gave it like a really beautiful facelift.
And the bones are incredible, So there wasn't much you
(20:39):
needed to do, but it, you know, it's a really
exquisite property.
Speaker 1 (20:43):
There's some touchup, so then you had so let's go
back to the winery the grapes. Let's talk about your grapes.
You started, you bought a winery, you started growing grapes,
if you sell them or what did you do with them?
Speaker 2 (20:56):
So in two thousand and five we bought it was
called Mish in the States, and it was right below
the Mission in Sandy Ned's and so my dad said,
you know what, we'll call it Mission Estates. No problem,
it's it's it's all about the area. And when we
filed for our license, we got a cease and desist
(21:18):
letter from a very powerful chateau in Bordeaux called La
Mission Chateau Oprione. So Oprione is one of the one
of the first growths. Right, Sorry, I'm in the restaurant,
So I hope that noise too.
Speaker 1 (21:35):
You're fine, you're find I don't hear anything.
Speaker 2 (21:38):
And uh so the so it was the first growth
of Bordeaux. And we decided, you know what, we don't
need to fight one of the most powerful houses. Will
change name. And so my dad always remembered his childhood
in France and this love affair with French wine and
French food, and so coque co is the flower. It's
the French red poppy. And so that's what the label
(21:59):
can call. Yeah, Cochley coke flower, you.
Speaker 1 (22:01):
Know, and we just anybody who spells that correct or
who pronounces it correctly, must get a free glass of
wine or something.
Speaker 2 (22:09):
Right. We have some funny videos of people in the
taste room after a few glasses trying to pronounce it.
It's it's pretty commable. But yeah, So we turned the
vineyard organic and we applied for our certification, and so
it's certified organic. And we say we like to make
(22:30):
natural wine in the sense that Europe's been making natural
wine for hundreds of years. It's you know, don't use pesticides,
don't use herbicides. Let's let's do the wine making in
the vineyard and not manipulate the wine in the vineyard
in the winery. Right, So you know, there's over seventy
(22:50):
two chemicals you can add to wine.
Speaker 1 (22:52):
So let's take a break here in that. Let's tell
our listeners and our viewers what classifies a wine as
an organic wine?
Speaker 2 (23:00):
Sure, okay, so organic wines in order for in order
for your vineyard to be organic, you need to not
be spraying pesticides and herbicides like round up is a pesticide, right,
and so there's other ways to deal with pests or
there's other ways to just allow nature to be as
(23:22):
one right, and so like we don't necessarily do biodynamic farming,
but the idea is like if you're in a forest,
you don't go to the forest and start pulling the
weeds out of the forest. The forest does it. If
the forest will correct itself on its own right, trees
will grow, fires will start, Like you don't take you
(23:45):
don't get rid of one insect because it's eating the leaf. Here,
like everything has a symbiotic relationship and in the soil
you have micro organisms and everything adds elements to what
you're doing right, to growing process, so the whole ecology
of the farm. And so if you start spraying your
vineyards with really strong chemicals, you're going to change and
(24:08):
you're going to destroy all those micro organisms definitely. You
know the French call it terroir, right, it's the soil,
it's the aspect of how you grow it, it's the climate.
And so your soil is part of your terroir. And
if you if you disrupt all those micro organisms, you're
going to change. You're going to change your grapes in
(24:29):
many ways. And then we don't want to put harmful chemicals, Like, right,
wine is supposed to be enjoyable, celebratory. It shouldn't be
something that I have to worry about, like are these
are you ingesting chemicals that you shouldn't be ingested? Yeah,
And that's you know, that's the difference between conventional farming
and organic farming. And don't get me wrong, organic The
reason why you don't see a lot of I shouldn't
(24:52):
say we see organic farming, but the reason why you
see conventional farming is organic farming can cost thirty to
fifty percent more than conventional farming. So from an economic standpoint,
it's it's it's not, it's it's not. It's not a
lucrative business.
Speaker 1 (25:08):
And why does it cost more because it's just.
Speaker 2 (25:12):
It's more labor. Right, everything's done by hand. If you
want to get rid of the weeds, you're going to
do it by hand. You're going to set the machine
and go out and there's a it's called the Clemmens
and it you know, it's like a lawnmower for weeds.
And you go out there and it has a sensor
that makes it where it doesn't hit the vines. And
you've got to do that by hand. So it's manpower
woman power.
Speaker 1 (25:32):
Yeah, absolutely for both. And I think I understand, I
know the answer to this. But then the question would be,
so do you taste the difference? But I think with wine,
every little thing tastes different with wine, right.
Speaker 2 (25:44):
Totally, there's nuance to wine. And I'll tell you what,
Like you know, maybe if I was tasting organic grapes
orsus non or grand grapes, maybe I'm not going to
fully taste one hundred percent of the difference between the two.
But at least I know that I didn't have to
use chemicals on those, and then I know that they
won't be harmful to the people drinking it. But like
(26:08):
so like so that's that's growing organic, right. And then
when you make natural wine, and the reason why I
use the word natural wine, and I don't think we
should be scared of that term. Sometimes people think of
it like, oh, the wine's going to be very flawed.
That like, if you make wine correctly and you pick
on your acid levels and you make sure your pH
(26:29):
the grapes are in a good place, like so we
do use some science to navigate where the grapes are.
So acidity and pH are two things that go hand
in hand. You know, as one goes up up, one
one goes low. Like as acid rises, pH drops, and
the pH is important for preserving wine naturally, right, instead
(26:52):
of having to add preservatives to wine. And so I
feel like when you know, when people say, oh, I
go to Europe and I drink wine, I can drink
bottles of it and I don't get hungover, I don't
feel bad, it's because there's no chemicals in those wines.
A lot of you know, you know, you.
Speaker 1 (27:09):
Have as eating eating food in France, right.
Speaker 2 (27:12):
Same as you ask the farmeries when his neighbor starts
to pick grapes and he knows his neighbor makes good wine,
and then he starts to pick grapes. You know, like
they're not often doing as much like technical they're not
using technology and science often at the level of like
maybe we do in the States. So then when you're
making the wine, you're not adding chemicals. You can add
(27:33):
like seventy two different chemicals to the wine, and you
can manipulate the wine and you can change you can
add tannins, you can add acidity, you can make it softer,
you can make it more. You know, there's there's so
many things you can do. And so for me, when
you taste wine like that, I kind of call him
Frankenstein wines. Or you're just like piecemealing this this thing
(27:54):
that you're trying to maybe you're searching for scores or
accolades or whatever it is, and I feel like you
can taste that wine when people are doing too much
to the to the wine. Once the wine gets into
the in the winery, the majority of what we're doing
is topping up the wine, making sure that you know,
(28:16):
the wine doesn't oxidizing barrel. And then when the wine
starts to get reductive. So reductive means that sometimes you
get that like that that egg smell, like sulfur smell
sort of. And so that's like a note when we
know that we need to take the the we need
to rack the wine. So that means you take wine
(28:37):
from one barrel and you move it into a clean barrel,
and what's leftover is like the sediment. It's the lees,
and if it spends too much time on the lees,
the wine could be reductive. And so that's when we know, okay,
let's take it off, let's let's rack that wine. Put
it into new barrels and then you know, plug it
back up and then we'll clean out the old barrels.
(28:58):
We clean it with like citric acid, which is you know,
not harmful at.
Speaker 1 (29:02):
All, and then you're able to reuse them the barrels.
Speaker 2 (29:05):
Oh yeah, yeah, yeah. We So the type of wine
that we make, we're not we're not typically making. So
our whites are like refreshing, they're crisp, they're high in acid.
And the reds we're making are soft and velvety. And
so with the reds, the we use French oak, and
we use predominantly neutral French oaks, so that means the
(29:27):
barrel has been used enough where you're not gonna have
flavors of the oak. And so maybe it's like three
or four times they've been used, so every season that
they get used, like a bit of that wood strips
off of it. And so maybe like we make some
reserve wines and maybe like maybe we'll pick five of
our favorite barrels and we'll do one of those barrels
(29:47):
in new oak and the other four, so it's about
twenty percent new oak for those and those are wines
that we're going to age a little longer. Because remember,
so oak has tannins, and tannins are what dry out
your mouth. And we're we're drinking cabernet right, let's say,
and cabernet has really aggressive, strong tannons. So you're taking
oak tannins and wine tannins, you're mixing them together, and
(30:08):
the wine is just like super astringent. It's like biting
into unripe per Simon. And so those wines when you
bottle them, they need time and bottle to soften and
have all the cell walls break down, and the tannin
is not so a stringent. So I'm not that patient.
(30:28):
I don't think most people are that patient. So why
add the oak tannons if we're going to drink the
wine within five years of it being bottled. So we
like to make a lot of our reds like soft, juicy,
easy to drink, a little bit lower in alcohol. So
we use like acidity and pH to help preserve our wines.
Speaker 1 (30:50):
And are your wines made from grapes that you you raise?
I mean you grow those grapes. You don't buy any
other wine other grapes make your wine with.
Speaker 2 (31:01):
Like ninety eight percent of the wine that we make
is from grapes that we grow, and so Cokeley Co.
To give you like a depth scale. The whole property
itself is just shy of one hundred acres and we
have about fifty eight acres planted with thirteen different varietals.
So you know, with thirteen bridles, it means we make
(31:25):
probably thirty different wines. I feel like we're always adding
a skew each year, like, oh, let's try this out.
Speaker 1 (31:32):
Yeah, sure, of course, of course you do.
Speaker 2 (31:35):
Yeah, you know that's the fun part, a little bit
of experimentation, you know, match with We've been doing it
long enough. So we've been making wine since O six
What is that it's almost twenty years? Is you know?
Nineteen years? I'm doing the math right.
Speaker 1 (31:52):
And your bottles are labeled Cokeleico Estate.
Speaker 2 (31:56):
Vineyard, Yes, correct, Cocleco Estate, and you'll see all the
red poppies on it, and they always say made with
organic grapes in the front label.
Speaker 1 (32:03):
How much competition is there in the organic market? Are
you one of five thousand or even? How do other
people do it?
Speaker 2 (32:11):
I couldn't give you the exact number, but I think
when I was studying to be as simile aim, I
think this is the statistic, the statistic that I was given.
The wine that we make as far as like independent
small production wine only represents about ten percent of the
(32:32):
wine produced in the world or the United States. Let's
say the other ninety percent is attributed to companies like
Constellation Wine Rands, Gallo and so forth. And I think
it's I think the stat goes Gallo makes enough wine
for California to be the fourth largest producing wine region
in the world. So it's usually it's like a jocking
(32:56):
position between France, Spain, and Italy for one, two, three,
depending on the I think Spain has been making more,
and then California comes in at four, specifically because of Gallo.
There's a lot of bulk wine out there, you know,
which is fine.
Speaker 1 (33:13):
Everything they bought a lot of They bought a lot
of wineries. At a certain point, didn't they start.
Speaker 2 (33:19):
Totally It's a little bit of everything, right. You're sort
of just acquiring juice from lots. You know. There was
a time where we sold some of our juice and
some bigger companies would absorb it because they're they're looking
for one hundred tons of murlow or cab or whatever. Sure,
and some of them put up the would put them
under an organic label too, Like some of those companies
(33:40):
do make an organic label as well. But like when
you're making things at such scale, it's really you're really
at that point. It becomes a chemistry equation. You're trying
to make sure everything is at this level to homogenize it,
to make it all taste the same year in at
after a year, because you're building this brand, and that's
(34:02):
just kind of not what wine is. Wine changes, it
evolves every year, it's different. The excitement is to taste
that producer's next vintage and roll kind of roll ride
the wave, right, because every year there might be years
that are better than other years. It's natural to have that.
Speaker 1 (34:23):
And what's the tasting range of your wines? Are they
good for five years, twenty years? You should they be
consumed in three years?
Speaker 2 (34:32):
Well, so it comes down to a few things, right,
like what's preserving the wine? Acidity? pH Tannin's preserved wine.
So that's why like a lot of red wine can
age longer. The tannins come from the skins, the seeds,
and the stems. While white wine is typically like you
pick it, you press it, and you separate the skin,
(34:53):
seeds and stems. Red wine. You ferment on the skins,
sometimes on the stems too, but you definite you know
all the color comforts and the skins. So you know, I've
I've had wines going back to our first intig six
oh seven. They were very good. Yeah, you know, I
opened a twenty eleven word o blend and it was delicious.
(35:14):
It was still drinking nicely. So yeah, I think agibilities
five to twenty years for sure.
Speaker 1 (35:21):
Well, that's good to know. We'll have to we'll have
to try that here. So we've talked about your wines
a little bit, and I really hope that you'll come
back again because we have too much to talk about
for just one episode. But let's talk about your time
in the restaurant industry. How did that start?
Speaker 2 (35:36):
Yeah?
Speaker 1 (35:37):
Sorry, back to the sky.
Speaker 2 (35:40):
The skyroom was the incubator, and the experiences that I
had with my dad opened up my eyes to like,
what what are the possibilities? And we visited many Michelin
Star restaurants. We had meals that were performances and so
(36:03):
beautifully orchestrated that we really fell in love with this
industry and what it can be done. And so the
restaurant that we opened up in Calabassis. You know, every
every one of our every one of our projects has
always been like rooted in fine dining. And I love
fine dining. I think it's amazing. But when we came
(36:23):
up with the idea of this restaurant, the idea was accessibility. Right,
fine dining maybe you maybe it's once a year, maybe
it's once every few years, or maybe for some of
the lucky ones, it's once a month, you know, but
it's not a meal you can eat on a daily basis.
And so we wanted to create a restaurant that felt
like your neighborhood gem restaurant that made everything from scratch,
(36:47):
that was delicious, that was fresh, that was seasonal, that
focused on seafood and vegetables, and also like sourcing really
great quality products, you know. And so we brought on
a chef that came out of a three Michelin star
restaurant out of New York City. He was part of
(37:08):
the Make It Nice group, which is eleven Madison Park.
He moved to LA to open up the Nomad Hotel. Unfortunately,
the Nomad did not make it and and.
Speaker 1 (37:18):
He happened to be available when and you found him, right, Yeah,
we found him, Yeah, after he left Curtis Stone after
the pandemic and we found him.
Speaker 2 (37:27):
And so he's been our culinary director. He oversees all
three of our restaurants. And his counterpart, So his name
is chef Chris Flint, and his counterpart is Michelle Carter.
She worked in Boston at at some really famous restaurants
James Beard worn winning chef. Of course at the moment
(37:50):
I'm neglecting, I'll remember this name, but she worked at
really incredible restaurants out of Boston. So the two of
them at the Helm here and we created this really
beautiful restaurant for the namehood Calabasas the San Fernando Valley.
I feel like, you know, in a world of strip
(38:11):
malls and chain restaurants, our idea was, okay, how can
we create something that's that that cares about every little element,
but without it being fine dining. So it's like all
the elements that you would think about for fine dining,
but in a you know, a casual, elegant setting, right,
almost like an oxymoron on.
Speaker 1 (38:31):
So if we come to the mulholland, what what we see?
What kind of a meal will we have.
Speaker 2 (38:36):
Okay, so if you come here, we're going to give
you the best meal.
Speaker 1 (38:40):
Now I'm probably going to come there.
Speaker 2 (38:42):
So we bake our own faicasha, so you're gonna have
to their ficasha. And so the faicasha come. It could
come with pizza butter, which I say is my retirement plan.
Or it can come with cheese fondue if you're feeling naughty,
cheese fondo with red wine braised onions. It's amazing. It's
(39:04):
a blend of aplas and some potato puree and it's
out of this world. And then so we'll move to
some vegetables. The chef makes these tempora mushrooms from my
taki mushrooms with a noriaoli. That's incredible. We make an
incredible caesar salad with chickor eats. We also have a
(39:28):
raw bar. You're gonna want to get our scallop crudo
or maybe our hamachi crudo. And then chef makes pasta's
in house. We do some Tortellini's, We do a Capitelli pasta,
and then the signature entres I would say is our chicken.
I normally tell people like you don't go out to
(39:49):
a restaurant to order a chicken. But this is a
special chicken. It takes three days to make. We source
it from Petaluma, we take pig meat, we cure it,
we won't feed it in duck fat. We turn it
into a jew. That takes about three days for that
proper process, you know. So when I say fine dining,
that's what they would do.
Speaker 1 (40:07):
In a fine dining restaurant, definitely.
Speaker 2 (40:10):
And then the breast is brine, subeede and roasted crispy,
so it's moist and delicious. And then I would say,
like our scalops, we do it with kind of like
a Tai curry with carrots and bitted rice and it's
like really really delicious. Those are probably the two entrees
that I haven't had the heart to change.
Speaker 1 (40:30):
But the chicken just has the jew.
Speaker 2 (40:35):
And then like the creamiest mashed potatoes you've ever had,
very like Joel Roboshone inspired.
Speaker 1 (40:41):
And I'm and I happen to be a mashed potatoes girl.
I was born and raised in the Midwest. It's my
I've got to have it meat and potatoes.
Speaker 2 (40:48):
Yeah. But yeah, so like that's the type of meal
it's going to be a journey it's gonna be. I
always find like layers of flavors, unexpected flavors, textures, all
of that's so important. Kind of like in my mindset,
like we look at I like to look at a
dish like almost like a triangle, like there's three points
on it, and you have to all three points for
(41:11):
it to really go over the top, you know, and
make you want to come back for another bite.
Speaker 1 (41:17):
Absolutely, it sounds pretty decadent. And I'm sure then that
there's desserts and wine to go along.
Speaker 2 (41:24):
So I think the house favorite dessert it's a chocolate
moose with a passion fruit caramel inside the moose, and
then it's got a passion fruit for a moo on
top and passion fruit sorbet. There's just this like I
love passion fruit, and I think when you mix it
with chocolate, it's really fun. The other one would be
probably our lemon curve. So we we we dipped a
(41:50):
lemon curd into liquid shortbread and then we freeze it
to set it, and then we serve that with homade
and ricotta ice cream. And that one's also so I
don't think we've had the heart to take that off
the menu and the chef. Because I'm gluten free. For
my fortieth birthday, they made me that and they made
(42:10):
it gluten free, and the rest of them came out
so good that you couldn't tell the difference that we
just make it gluten free now. So, if you are
gluten green and you want short red lemon curd, I
got you.
Speaker 1 (42:23):
Well, you certainly have delved into two of the most
challenging industries there are, which is food and hospitality. You
know those, And how do you keep the I know
everyone months to know is how do you keep the
quality and the passion alive in your dining establishments.
Speaker 2 (42:46):
Well, I think it's important to inspire your team. I
think it's important to lead by example. Coming to work
doesn't feel like work. We've fostered this culture and this
community around us, and then it doesn't hurt to have
a really good bottle of tequila behind the bar.
Speaker 1 (43:06):
It doesn't.
Speaker 2 (43:08):
Or a few Yeah. You know, when you're around passionate people,
you're always pushing each other to do something exciting and fun.
And so while I'm not a chef, I look at
flavor the same way, like through the same lens, like
I think maybe in another world. If I could do
both like run a dining room, cook and be the
(43:32):
same way or all three, I would. I would do it.
But you kind of have to allow others to do things.
And you know the three Michelin star chef that works
with us, Chef Chris, Like we went and brought him
on board. If I can't cook better than he can,
but it's fun to like bounce ideas and flavors off
of each other. And and so I think that's like,
(43:53):
that's exciting to me.
Speaker 1 (43:55):
I'm sure that he probably comes to you with some
ideas and says, you know, I saw this, or I
thought of this, or can I do this, and ask
permission to do some fun and exciting things.
Speaker 2 (44:06):
You know, we're sending each other like reds on Instagram
back and forth.
Speaker 1 (44:10):
Tell you this, Yeah, I know, I know. I do
that with my team from time to time. So tell me,
is it at this restaurant that I heard that you
have an exciting bar?
Speaker 2 (44:22):
They're also, uh, yes, I could not forget our bar program.
So you know, don't you hate it when like you
redid the house, but like, oh, you should have changed
those old curtains and you didn't change the curtains and
they just don't look right. Yep. The bar can't be
the old curtains. They need to be exciting too. So
(44:42):
if you've got good food and great service, your drinks
have to match. We brought Chad austin In. Chad was
our bar manager. He has since moved on to another project,
but he still consults with us, so he's still making
all of our menus. And Chad is like he's an
almanac for spirits.
Speaker 1 (45:02):
Uh.
Speaker 2 (45:03):
He knows the flavor profiles of every spirit. It's incredible
how good his palette is. And he brings together like
unexpected things, whether it's like bell pepper or tomato or saffron,
or we have a pea cocktail or white like white
chocolate and peas. I mean we like And that's an
(45:23):
homage to Jeremy Fox and so like. He's very tapped
into the community. He's he's mixing nuances together. I have
a cocktail called the Moholland Drive. It is our signature
jin Martini. I will tell I challenge all of Los
Angeles to a Martini duel. I think this is the
best martini in LA I've had a lot of them.
(45:45):
Vodka or gin based. It's it's a olive leaf gin
that's been fat washed with avocado oil, Uzu gin, a
blend of revermooths basil o de vee shaken up. Actually
it's stirred with some basil oil, and it is the
most nuanced, beautiful. Like even if you don't like gin,
(46:09):
you'll you'll then like have an appreciation to be like,
oh my god, I should I should drink more gin
because this is really interesting.
Speaker 1 (46:17):
It sounds amazing, and I would love to. I need
to come there.
Speaker 2 (46:22):
You have to, because now I put the challenge out there,
so I.
Speaker 1 (46:25):
Have absolutely and I do want to take a few
minutes because again I'm I know hopefully you'll come back
to us again, but talk to us about your hospitality.
So you have three boutique hotels. Is that what you
call them?
Speaker 2 (46:42):
Yeah, they're they're bed and breakfast or yeah. I like
the word boutique hotel because I don't want to like,
you know, your weird aunt wakes up and cooks eggs
for you in the morning and you're like tiptoeing around
her house. That's the vibe I get with the like
bed and breakfast. Maybe that's a bad vision, but they're
(47:02):
all about twelve bedrooms on average. The Mirabelle has first
oak for snook is Michelin recognized we do a three
course or a five horse tasting menu. Chef Chris oversees
that menu. They do weddings and catering up in Wine Country.
I mean, it's just this quaint little like you know,
in the town of Solving. All the all the properties
(47:24):
look like you're in Copenhagen, you know, in Denmark. So
it's just this cute, little four story building. It's very intimate.
We get a lot of weddings that will buy the
whole place out, and the whole family stays there and
that's really fun. And then especially when we're cooking their
their welcome reception and their and their wedding dinner, it's
really like special to be a part of those celebrations
(47:45):
with people like these light these momentous life milestones. So
I really love that. As I said, I was, I
was catering a wedding yesterday and.
Speaker 1 (47:56):
I heard that, tell us about it, tell us about.
Speaker 2 (47:58):
And we were at the Sunstone Bill and this couple
wanted a very fine dining, very well put together, beautiful menu,
and yeah, we went out there and we served this
beautiful meal and it's like overlooking the hills and I
think there was maybe like ten thousand flowers all over
the place. I mean, it was gorgeous. We'll post some
(48:21):
photos on our social media because it And then you know,
up in Yosemite, I mean that that is a Chateau
Deucero is a ten bedroom castle with a two bedroom villa,
a fine dining restaurant and a spa. And if you
want to like go to Europe, but you don't want
to hop on a ten hour flight or maybe it's
(48:42):
a little too expensive if you go there. The original
owners from Austria, she went and hand sourced all the furniture, doors, fixtures,
everything from Europe. You feel like you're in a hundred
year old castle. Really gorgeous, it's really well put together.
The service is so warm and just different. You're not
going to find surface quite like that. It's so personal.
(49:05):
Our concierge team will set you up on tours to
Yosemite or if you want to go fly fishing or
any other outdoor adventures. And then the restaurant, I mean, like, look,
it's a sleepy town. You're gonna go hiking or you're
gonna go out and do some nature elements or go
get a massage, and then your dinner is the show.
And they do a beautiful five course tasting menu there
(49:26):
that like we went out and our chef foraged wood
bark from trees, and we blaze that ourselves and the
boosh comes on a piece of wood that comes from
the forest and it's decorated with all the all the
pine needles, and it's just like that comes and it
(49:49):
sets the tone for like what that night's going to
be like. And you know, it's when dining is an
experience a show, just like a beautiful memory. And so
they do a lot of events and weddings and anniversaries
and celebrations and it's just you feel like you're in
a completely different place. You feel like you're in Europe
for a minute, and and it's like a for me,
(50:14):
it's like connecting with nature and getting off your phone,
Like we need more of that and this this gives
that that that opportunity for our guests.
Speaker 1 (50:24):
That is amazing. So now I've found three places I
need to visit for housing, for for hospitality and new
restaurants and wine. So everybody on this call or who's
been listening to this program day of this episode. We've
we've certainly got you covered. So tell us what are
the trends, what's happening in dining? What's next for you?
(50:45):
What is there something what is something you haven't done
yet or you want to do.
Speaker 2 (50:51):
Trends? Okay, so one thing I want to do here
at the mall halland we do want to like kind
of set up like a secret dinner clubs. So so,
like I said, we're like fine dining incognito, but it's
casual enough, like there's a burger on the menu, Like
we want people to come every week and it shouldn't
feel too happy to do that, but once a month,
(51:12):
we would love to do these really beautiful orchestrated like
ten course tasting menus and just kind of flex that
muscle a little bit with wine pairings and just like
an exquisite experience. That would be fun. I think as
far as like trends go, I see people doing mini cocktails.
I think that's kind of fun where people don't want
(51:32):
to drink as much, but they want to be able
to taste through more cocktails. That could be kind of interesting.
We're doing a Majong Night where groups will come and
sit outside on our beautiful patio and you come as
a team of four and they're playing Ma genres.
Speaker 1 (51:48):
I want to do that. I wanted to do that
with someone here in Orange County, and now you've inspired
me to go back to them and say they're doing
that at the Mala Island one hundred percent.
Speaker 2 (51:57):
Yeah. Yeah, my sister got into it and they all
have such a great time. So we're opening up to
like ten teams of four. We're going to put a
little buffet out there so they can in the middle
take a break. So I love I love events.
Speaker 1 (52:09):
Have friends who live in Newbury Park, so I'm we're going.
Speaker 2 (52:12):
To do that June seventeenth to do that and we're
I love events. I love sharing new flavor profiles with people.
So for me, it's always trying to turn people on
to an maybe alternatives to like the conventionally farmed wine
or the tequila that might have a lot of additives.
(52:32):
So I really love to like show people like new
different things. So that's that's a lot of fun, like
exciting events that that's going to be the friend for
the next year for us.
Speaker 1 (52:44):
So tell people, tell our viewers and our listeners who
have loved this episode. How to find you if they
wanted you to cater an event or how to find
you just to look at your history and look at
all of the places that you manage and involved with.
Speaker 2 (52:57):
Sure, so you can find us at the Mulholland La
is our handle for Instagram and Mulholland dot com is
our restaurant in Calabassis. I feel like that's the easiest
one to get to. And if you want to go
up to Chateau Ducero, same thing at Chateau Ducero and
(53:18):
first no Oak is at first and Oak so uh
and then Cochlico. Yeah, all of ours. If you go
find just our names, you'll you'll find our handles pretty easily.
Speaker 1 (53:30):
That's that's going to be a great So many people
I know are going to want to follow you, and
what a great episode. We're so glad to have you
on so cal with Valve all the things that I
pictured when I started this show, I knew these are
the elements that I would have to have. Our vino
and our villas and our vacations. And you certainly you,
certainly to some of us, you live the dream you
(53:52):
are what we all want to be, so thank you
so much for being with us, and please say you'll
come back, because we haven't even touched on some of
the subjects.
Speaker 2 (54:01):
Totally would love to come back. Thank you so much
for your time today.
Speaker 1 (54:04):
Now, yeah, thank you for sharing your remarkable journey and
your wisdom. Your passion for hospitality and wine and exceptional
service not only inspiring, but it's a true testament to
your family, your dedication to excellence. It's been a real
privilege to have you, so to all of our listeners
and viewers, please follow him, go to the mulholland go
(54:25):
to all of his establishments, and thank you for tuning
into Socoa with Vel. We will see you next week
with more stories, insights, and adventures from the heart of California.
Until then, remember to embrace the journey and always live
fully
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