September 1, 2024 • 13 mins
In this podcast-only version of S640, the panel discuss Donald Trump’s reversal on abortion in Florida and Kamala Harris’ change in policy on key issues. Do people really care if politicians change their minds, or is it simply obvious pandering to a segment of the population that’s undecided? This week’s panel includes Erick Trevino from the University of Southern California, Olivia Madera from California Lutheran University, and Cameron Hughes from Chapman University.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Okay, So we just wrapped up taping the radio show.
This is Studio six forty plus. This is the podcast
only version of our program, and as we do, the
panelists have submitted three topics that they brought to the table.
And I'm looking at the three now and I think
the one that we'll discuss very interesting. Former President Trump
(00:21):
has suggested that he'd be supporting Florida's pro choice amendment,
but it seems as if he can't decide which stance
to take on abortion, just as Kamala Harris's Kamala Harris
has changed her position on key issues brought up in
her recent interview. So how does flip flopping effect a
politician's legitimacy? Whose idea is that? Whose topic is that? Yours? Cameron,
(00:42):
So I'll let you start the conversation.
Speaker 2 (00:45):
So I was listening to a podcast and I heard
that Trump had been interviewed and he stated that he
would be supporting a policy that effectively is pro choice.
I don't know the nitty gritty of exactly what legislation is.
It says he comes out against Florida's abortion rights ballot measure,
(01:08):
and a lot of people, a lot of his supporters
are bashing him for it, saying that, you know, he's
betraying their values, especially the evangelical Christians. And in the past,
I mean even before the days of politics, I believe
Trump's been supportive of planned parenthood, and you know he's
flipped flopped. Is that's why I use the phrase flip flopping.
(01:32):
And then likewise, in the interview, obviously we heard Kamala
being confronted about her stance changing on issues, and I
think this brings up an interesting topic because you know,
if you'd asked a bunch of Republicans a week ago
what they thought Trump was going to go into the campaign,
you know, saying about abortion, I'm sure they would have
(01:53):
told you, well, obviously he's pro life, as are we,
and what's coming out, you know, that might not be
the case. So if you don't know what to expect
from a politician and what they're how their beliefs might
change over time, even when according to Kamala her values
stay the same. You know, how can you know what
you're really supporting and how does that maybe take away
(02:16):
from the legitimacy of the figure that they are.
Speaker 1 (02:19):
You mean to tell me if I understand this correctly,
you don't really know whether or not to trust a politician.
Speaker 2 (02:25):
Yeah, you got me again.
Speaker 1 (02:26):
That is that kind of where you're at here. What
are the rest of you think?
Speaker 2 (02:31):
I don't know.
Speaker 3 (02:31):
I think it's kind of good.
Speaker 1 (02:33):
I don't think flip flops good. I was gonna say.
Speaker 3 (02:36):
Let me clarify, I don't think it's good that these
politicians are flip flopping because it makes me a little
bit insecure. Like, Okay, do not stand by what you said,
but I think in the overall scheme, I do like that.
You know, Kamada has also become like a little bit
more like partisan like as like she's been rolling out
like her presidential campaign. So I kind of like this
idea where things aren't as polarized and maybe we meet
(02:59):
somewhere in the middle in terms of things. But it
is it does make me very insecure when I've been
supporting or like you know, looking up to like someone's
like political beliefs and then all of a sudden they
switch on it.
Speaker 1 (03:10):
What do you think, Olivia? Do you think that a
politician changing their position is just more pandering or do
you think that a politician is allowed to change their position?
Speaker 4 (03:23):
I think I mean what politicians think, Like, they're not
set in stone, they're not rules that they absolutely have
to follow. You know, I think they can flip flop
to an extent. You know, I remember like Kamala President
Kamala Harrish or president.
Speaker 1 (03:40):
Oh good wow. I think we don't And by the way,
we don't edit the podcast. We're not editing the podcast.
This is what goes on in a podcast.
Speaker 2 (03:53):
She's forgot the vice.
Speaker 1 (03:54):
Yeah yeah, ba.
Speaker 4 (03:58):
First she had she said, uh, how her values had changed,
and you had mentioned that there was a part where she.
Speaker 1 (04:11):
The policies have changed, but her values have not.
Speaker 4 (04:15):
Yes, And you were like, that's kind of like interesting.
You know, you're kind of we're kind of like thinking
into that. I think just in general, like people have
to have just when you're in like running for political whatever.
Who I don't know, but you know what, I'm just
(04:37):
gonna say, I think it's fine to have different stances
and go a couple terms or life like with I don't.
Speaker 1 (04:46):
Well if you here's the thing though, I mean, people
were pulling out stuff that Joe Biden said thirty years
ago and they're holding to task on on that. There's
they're pulling stuff out that Trump said thirty years ago
when he was a private citizen, never even thought about
running for office, and they're holding him against they're holding
things against him from thirty years ago that he said.
(05:09):
And then when you look at what Harris was talking
about in the number one topic she's getting beat up
on a little bit too is immigration because she was
supposed to be the borders are under the Biden administration,
and she only visited the border once. I remember Lester
holt Outinger on his interview, and she finally came out
and said, listen, I also haven't been to Europe. I
(05:33):
was like, was, what does that have to do with anything.
You're not the Europe's are, You're the borders are. So
now her immigration stance is people who come here illegally
should face consequences. That's the first time she's ever said
anything like that. But that's because she knows immigration is
(05:54):
one of the hot button issues for this election. So
now she's changing her position to fit what the public wants.
But in reality, shouldn't that be what she should have
been doing all along? I mean, so, I'm sorry, So
when she's flipping, as you suggest, Olivia that you think
it's Okay in some cases you said, right, So if
(06:17):
she's flipping her position, now, is she doing it because
that's how she genuinely feels, or is she doing it
because she thinks that's what's going to get her in
the White House.
Speaker 4 (06:28):
I want to say that it's how she genuinely feels,
you know, based on what based on I don't know,
just like experience and thinking about how is she actually
going to like run a whole country, you know. And
you know, you might say some things while you're campaigning,
(06:50):
and it's like if you were campaigning like for like
shooting council or something, and you say, well, hey, I'm
gonna like make pizza Fridays every Friday, it free pizza.
And then I get in office and I go to
the board and they're like, oh, we don't have the
budget for that. I'd be like, oh, I promise pizza
to everyone, you know. And so I don't want to
(07:14):
like personally say like I'm for flip flopping at all.
Speaker 1 (07:17):
But then let's say, on that analogy, which is kind
of interesting, Let's say that you go back to your
voters now that have all been upset at you because
you didn't give them their free pizza, and you're saying, well,
upon further examination, I realize pizza is not really good
for you. So I want to help save your life,
but not giving you free pizza or also is that
flip flopping or just making up an excuse?
Speaker 4 (07:38):
I think that's telling the truth. And I think that's like,
you know, I'm just telling them like hey, like you know,
just because like we have presidents or politicians or whoever,
they're not always going to do the right thing. We have.
Like I don't know if that makes sense, but you know.
Speaker 2 (07:56):
The whole conversation I like about whether this is right
or wrong. I kind of just want to talk about
how confusing it is that Trump would come out and
say he is opposed to Florida's ban on abortions after
six weeks gestation. What does he have to gain from that?
Is he assuming that the middle of the road voters
who might be swayed to vote for him based on that,
(08:22):
I don't know. I mean, I realistically, I don't know
how many people he's gonna gonna win over, and he
seems like he's losing a lot of people.
Speaker 1 (08:30):
And then making that claim. Didney Also he's also talking
about how he would have the federal government government play
for pay for IVF too. Yes, that's right, and so
that's an interesting But I think finally because one thing's
for sure that I've heard from people in the know
is that he does not take direction well from his
own advisors. He's very tough that way, because you can
(08:52):
always tell you goes kind of off the rails. But
I'm curious to find out whether that was something an
advisor told him or if that's something he came up with.
But that goes back. Do you think that Do you
suppose that Trump is just pandering? Do you think he
realizes he's got to grab those those undecided and that's
one of the ways.
Speaker 2 (09:08):
To do it, I would probably say so. I mean,
going on the other side of the aisle. One thing
I was thinking of is Kamala got she kind of
got drilled on fracking and how she changed her stances. Good, yeah,
you got it. But because during the Democratic primaries she
said she was anti fracking, right, and then she's now
(09:32):
changed her stance and says, well, fracking we can, we
can pursue a more green earth and not ban fracking.
And if you I feel like as an American citizen.
If you can't see through the facade of that she's
just being bought out to say that.
Speaker 1 (09:50):
You know, it's well, Eric's kind of sad, yeah, do
you well, Eric, So, do you think it erodes a
politician's credibility when they flip like this.
Speaker 3 (10:00):
One hundred percent? And I think, you know, when she
said like, well, my values haven't changed, like, okay, I
can if you explain it to me. I don't know something.
It depends on how they explain it. But I can't
imagine a scenario where Trump would explain, like, my values
are still the same after I supported this, you know,
like in regards to the Florida he said it was
(10:20):
a bill.
Speaker 2 (10:22):
It looks like Florida is trying to ban abortion after
six weeks gestation, and Trump said he would not be
supporting that bill.
Speaker 3 (10:30):
So it makes me question, like, okay, like obviously it's
been you know, you can go back and a politician
might have said very different things, and you know, I
think you can account that for like it's a different
time and thing. But like Kamalaa wants to swear that
her values are still the same, But I can't see
how that would play out for Trump and I'm not
saying like Kamala like when she says her values are
still the same, she has a point, you know, I
(10:52):
think she definitely is pandering one hundred percent.
Speaker 1 (10:54):
Do you think the public is voting for values or
voting for policy?
Speaker 3 (10:58):
I think they're voting for policy. They should be voting
for policy.
Speaker 1 (11:01):
But isn't it interesting if you're talking about my values
haven't changed, but my policies have, my position on policies
have changed. What happens if your values are like, you know,
I'm honest and transparent, but then my policies are all
over the place. Do you are you more inclined to
vote for that emotional vote or because you want money
(11:27):
in your pocket and you want medical insurance and you
want secure borders? I mean, what is it that drives
you to vote? Is it values or policy?
Speaker 2 (11:36):
The thing that I am dumb struck by is people
she really thought that saying my values haven't changed. Is
you know, some sort of beacon of brightness when coming
out and saying, actually, my values have changed. How is
that a bad thing?
Speaker 1 (11:53):
Right?
Speaker 2 (11:55):
I feel like it's just a deflection of trying to
blame this shift in policy as coming from some place
of you know, personal you know, personal change as opposed
to what it probably is, which is pandering an optics.
Really on both sides of the aisle. That's the political game,
isn't it.
Speaker 1 (12:16):
Yeah. I mean her vice presidential pick was because of
his connection to the swing states, right. I think I
think people were like, that's really the only reason she
selected him. That's what a lot of people have said,
really because he's got really ultra progressive ideas. And I
think that was a bit of a of a nerve
(12:36):
racking thing for Harris to sort of juggle because that's
going to be a lot of criticism. But that was
a move to grab those undecided voters, just like Trump
would appear to be doing the same thing with this
issue on abortion. But I'll leave you with this. I
(12:57):
remember a politician, a senator, State senator I interviewed one time,
and I asked her the kind of the same question
about well, now you know, ten years ago you were
all pro this and now you're anti And she looked
at me she said, well, yeah, she says, my views
have evolved much like our society has. My ideals in
(13:19):
my position on certain things have evolved along with society.
So society's views of this particular issue have also evolved,
so must my position. I thought that was interesting.
Speaker 2 (13:33):
That I think is a lot better way to explain it.
Speaker 1 (13:36):
See, and I don't get paid nearly the money that
these political people get paid, and I could be telling
them to use the word evolved, don't say changed values.
So anyway, always a pleasure. Thank you for the Studio
six forty plus topic and we'll see on the next one.
Speaker 3 (13:49):
Thank you.
Speaker 1 (13:49):
Thanks Gan,
Okay, So we just wrapped up taping the radio show.
This is Studio six forty plus. This is the podcast
only version of our program, and as we do, the
panelists have submitted three topics that they brought to the table.
And I'm looking at the three now and I think
the one that we'll discuss very interesting. Former President Trump
(00:21):
has suggested that he'd be supporting Florida's pro choice amendment,
but it seems as if he can't decide which stance
to take on abortion, just as Kamala Harris's Kamala Harris
has changed her position on key issues brought up in
her recent interview. So how does flip flopping effect a
politician's legitimacy? Whose idea is that? Whose topic is that? Yours? Cameron,
(00:42):
So I'll let you start the conversation.
Speaker 2 (00:45):
So I was listening to a podcast and I heard
that Trump had been interviewed and he stated that he
would be supporting a policy that effectively is pro choice.
I don't know the nitty gritty of exactly what legislation is.
It says he comes out against Florida's abortion rights ballot measure,
(01:08):
and a lot of people, a lot of his supporters
are bashing him for it, saying that, you know, he's
betraying their values, especially the evangelical Christians. And in the past,
I mean even before the days of politics, I believe
Trump's been supportive of planned parenthood, and you know he's
flipped flopped. Is that's why I use the phrase flip flopping.
(01:32):
And then likewise, in the interview, obviously we heard Kamala
being confronted about her stance changing on issues, and I
think this brings up an interesting topic because you know,
if you'd asked a bunch of Republicans a week ago
what they thought Trump was going to go into the campaign,
you know, saying about abortion, I'm sure they would have
(01:53):
told you, well, obviously he's pro life, as are we,
and what's coming out, you know, that might not be
the case. So if you don't know what to expect
from a politician and what they're how their beliefs might
change over time, even when according to Kamala her values
stay the same. You know, how can you know what
you're really supporting and how does that maybe take away
(02:16):
from the legitimacy of the figure that they are.
Speaker 1 (02:19):
You mean to tell me if I understand this correctly,
you don't really know whether or not to trust a politician.
Speaker 2 (02:25):
Yeah, you got me again.
Speaker 1 (02:26):
That is that kind of where you're at here. What
are the rest of you think?
Speaker 2 (02:31):
I don't know.
Speaker 3 (02:31):
I think it's kind of good.
Speaker 1 (02:33):
I don't think flip flops good. I was gonna say.
Speaker 3 (02:36):
Let me clarify, I don't think it's good that these
politicians are flip flopping because it makes me a little
bit insecure. Like, Okay, do not stand by what you said,
but I think in the overall scheme, I do like that.
You know, Kamada has also become like a little bit
more like partisan like as like she's been rolling out
like her presidential campaign. So I kind of like this
idea where things aren't as polarized and maybe we meet
(02:59):
somewhere in the middle in terms of things. But it
is it does make me very insecure when I've been
supporting or like you know, looking up to like someone's
like political beliefs and then all of a sudden they
switch on it.
Speaker 1 (03:10):
What do you think, Olivia? Do you think that a
politician changing their position is just more pandering or do
you think that a politician is allowed to change their position?
Speaker 4 (03:23):
I think I mean what politicians think, Like, they're not
set in stone, they're not rules that they absolutely have
to follow. You know, I think they can flip flop
to an extent. You know, I remember like Kamala President
Kamala Harrish or president.
Speaker 1 (03:40):
Oh good wow. I think we don't And by the way,
we don't edit the podcast. We're not editing the podcast.
This is what goes on in a podcast.
Speaker 2 (03:53):
She's forgot the vice.
Speaker 1 (03:54):
Yeah yeah, ba.
Speaker 4 (03:58):
First she had she said, uh, how her values had changed,
and you had mentioned that there was a part where she.
Speaker 1 (04:11):
The policies have changed, but her values have not.
Speaker 4 (04:15):
Yes, And you were like, that's kind of like interesting.
You know, you're kind of we're kind of like thinking
into that. I think just in general, like people have
to have just when you're in like running for political whatever.
Who I don't know, but you know what, I'm just
(04:37):
gonna say, I think it's fine to have different stances
and go a couple terms or life like with I don't.
Speaker 1 (04:46):
Well if you here's the thing though, I mean, people
were pulling out stuff that Joe Biden said thirty years
ago and they're holding to task on on that. There's
they're pulling stuff out that Trump said thirty years ago
when he was a private citizen, never even thought about
running for office, and they're holding him against they're holding
things against him from thirty years ago that he said.
(05:09):
And then when you look at what Harris was talking
about in the number one topic she's getting beat up
on a little bit too is immigration because she was
supposed to be the borders are under the Biden administration,
and she only visited the border once. I remember Lester
holt Outinger on his interview, and she finally came out
and said, listen, I also haven't been to Europe. I
(05:33):
was like, was, what does that have to do with anything.
You're not the Europe's are, You're the borders are. So
now her immigration stance is people who come here illegally
should face consequences. That's the first time she's ever said
anything like that. But that's because she knows immigration is
(05:54):
one of the hot button issues for this election. So
now she's changing her position to fit what the public wants.
But in reality, shouldn't that be what she should have
been doing all along? I mean, so, I'm sorry, So
when she's flipping, as you suggest, Olivia that you think
it's Okay in some cases you said, right, So if
(06:17):
she's flipping her position, now, is she doing it because
that's how she genuinely feels, or is she doing it
because she thinks that's what's going to get her in
the White House.
Speaker 4 (06:28):
I want to say that it's how she genuinely feels,
you know, based on what based on I don't know,
just like experience and thinking about how is she actually
going to like run a whole country, you know. And
you know, you might say some things while you're campaigning,
(06:50):
and it's like if you were campaigning like for like
shooting council or something, and you say, well, hey, I'm
gonna like make pizza Fridays every Friday, it free pizza.
And then I get in office and I go to
the board and they're like, oh, we don't have the
budget for that. I'd be like, oh, I promise pizza
to everyone, you know. And so I don't want to
(07:14):
like personally say like I'm for flip flopping at all.
Speaker 1 (07:17):
But then let's say, on that analogy, which is kind
of interesting, Let's say that you go back to your
voters now that have all been upset at you because
you didn't give them their free pizza, and you're saying, well,
upon further examination, I realize pizza is not really good
for you. So I want to help save your life,
but not giving you free pizza or also is that
flip flopping or just making up an excuse?
Speaker 4 (07:38):
I think that's telling the truth. And I think that's like,
you know, I'm just telling them like hey, like you know,
just because like we have presidents or politicians or whoever,
they're not always going to do the right thing. We have.
Like I don't know if that makes sense, but you know.
Speaker 2 (07:56):
The whole conversation I like about whether this is right
or wrong. I kind of just want to talk about
how confusing it is that Trump would come out and
say he is opposed to Florida's ban on abortions after
six weeks gestation. What does he have to gain from that?
Is he assuming that the middle of the road voters
who might be swayed to vote for him based on that,
(08:22):
I don't know. I mean, I realistically, I don't know
how many people he's gonna gonna win over, and he
seems like he's losing a lot of people.
Speaker 1 (08:30):
And then making that claim. Didney Also he's also talking
about how he would have the federal government government play
for pay for IVF too. Yes, that's right, and so
that's an interesting But I think finally because one thing's
for sure that I've heard from people in the know
is that he does not take direction well from his
own advisors. He's very tough that way, because you can
(08:52):
always tell you goes kind of off the rails. But
I'm curious to find out whether that was something an
advisor told him or if that's something he came up with.
But that goes back. Do you think that Do you
suppose that Trump is just pandering? Do you think he
realizes he's got to grab those those undecided and that's
one of the ways.
Speaker 2 (09:08):
To do it, I would probably say so. I mean,
going on the other side of the aisle. One thing
I was thinking of is Kamala got she kind of
got drilled on fracking and how she changed her stances. Good, yeah,
you got it. But because during the Democratic primaries she
said she was anti fracking, right, and then she's now
(09:32):
changed her stance and says, well, fracking we can, we
can pursue a more green earth and not ban fracking.
And if you I feel like as an American citizen.
If you can't see through the facade of that she's
just being bought out to say that.
Speaker 1 (09:50):
You know, it's well, Eric's kind of sad, yeah, do
you well, Eric, So, do you think it erodes a
politician's credibility when they flip like this.
Speaker 3 (10:00):
One hundred percent? And I think, you know, when she
said like, well, my values haven't changed, like, okay, I
can if you explain it to me. I don't know something.
It depends on how they explain it. But I can't
imagine a scenario where Trump would explain, like, my values
are still the same after I supported this, you know,
like in regards to the Florida he said it was
(10:20):
a bill.
Speaker 2 (10:22):
It looks like Florida is trying to ban abortion after
six weeks gestation, and Trump said he would not be
supporting that bill.
Speaker 3 (10:30):
So it makes me question, like, okay, like obviously it's
been you know, you can go back and a politician
might have said very different things, and you know, I
think you can account that for like it's a different
time and thing. But like Kamalaa wants to swear that
her values are still the same, But I can't see
how that would play out for Trump and I'm not
saying like Kamala like when she says her values are
still the same, she has a point, you know, I
(10:52):
think she definitely is pandering one hundred percent.
Speaker 1 (10:54):
Do you think the public is voting for values or
voting for policy?
Speaker 3 (10:58):
I think they're voting for policy. They should be voting
for policy.
Speaker 1 (11:01):
But isn't it interesting if you're talking about my values
haven't changed, but my policies have, my position on policies
have changed. What happens if your values are like, you know,
I'm honest and transparent, but then my policies are all
over the place. Do you are you more inclined to
vote for that emotional vote or because you want money
(11:27):
in your pocket and you want medical insurance and you
want secure borders? I mean, what is it that drives
you to vote? Is it values or policy?
Speaker 2 (11:36):
The thing that I am dumb struck by is people
she really thought that saying my values haven't changed. Is
you know, some sort of beacon of brightness when coming
out and saying, actually, my values have changed. How is
that a bad thing?
Speaker 1 (11:53):
Right?
Speaker 2 (11:55):
I feel like it's just a deflection of trying to
blame this shift in policy as coming from some place
of you know, personal you know, personal change as opposed
to what it probably is, which is pandering an optics.
Really on both sides of the aisle. That's the political game,
isn't it.
Speaker 1 (12:16):
Yeah. I mean her vice presidential pick was because of
his connection to the swing states, right. I think I
think people were like, that's really the only reason she
selected him. That's what a lot of people have said,
really because he's got really ultra progressive ideas. And I
think that was a bit of a of a nerve
(12:36):
racking thing for Harris to sort of juggle because that's
going to be a lot of criticism. But that was
a move to grab those undecided voters, just like Trump
would appear to be doing the same thing with this
issue on abortion. But I'll leave you with this. I
(12:57):
remember a politician, a senator, State senator I interviewed one time,
and I asked her the kind of the same question
about well, now you know, ten years ago you were
all pro this and now you're anti And she looked
at me she said, well, yeah, she says, my views
have evolved much like our society has. My ideals in
(13:19):
my position on certain things have evolved along with society.
So society's views of this particular issue have also evolved,
so must my position. I thought that was interesting.
Speaker 2 (13:33):
That I think is a lot better way to explain it.
Speaker 1 (13:36):
See, and I don't get paid nearly the money that
these political people get paid, and I could be telling
them to use the word evolved, don't say changed values.
So anyway, always a pleasure. Thank you for the Studio
six forty plus topic and we'll see on the next one.
Speaker 3 (13:49):
Thank you.
Speaker 1 (13:49):
Thanks Gan,
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I’m Jay Shetty host of On Purpose the worlds #1 Mental Health podcast and I’m so grateful you found us. I started this podcast 5 years ago to invite you into conversations and workshops that are designed to help make you happier, healthier and more healed. I believe that when you (yes you) feel seen, heard and understood you’re able to deal with relationship struggles, work challenges and life’s ups and downs with more ease and grace. I interview experts, celebrities, thought leaders and athletes so that we can grow our mindset, build better habits and uncover a side of them we’ve never seen before. New episodes every Monday and Friday. Your support means the world to me and I don’t take it for granted — click the follow button and leave a review to help us spread the love with On Purpose. I can’t wait for you to listen to your first or 500th episode!
The Breakfast Club
The World's Most Dangerous Morning Show, The Breakfast Club, With DJ Envy And Charlamagne Tha God!
The Joe Rogan Experience
The official podcast of comedian Joe Rogan.