The Class Play - NFL Draft Day 2 Preview

Sam Bruchhaus, Ben Brown and Tej Seth are live again from Detroit preview Day 2 of the NFL Draft talking about the top player remaining, how teams needs have changed and quarterbacks that might be taken the rest of the way.

Episode Transcript

(00:01):
Good morning everyone. The Class Playpodcast was after dark yesterday and now we're
back in the light another day atthe draft. Day two coming up,
a lot of great questions. I'mjoined here today by tays Cheth, Ben
Brown, Tje. How you doing. I'm doing great, you know,
I think we went late last nightbut had to come back on and talk

(00:22):
Day two preview today. We talkeda lot about Day one yesterday, did
an hour and a half. Youknow, we're up until I don't know
two thirty eight in the morning,still talking about the draft, but had
to get up early this morning againto do as well. Awesome and Ben
just got done with the radio hitout in Vegas. What were they asking?
What were some of the questions they'reexcited about? Yeah, I mean
it was a lot of you know, the discourse that we're obviously here and

(00:45):
here. I think, you know, my vikings had very much taken a
leading role in some of the analysistalk today, which is you know,
intriguing. The Falcons as well,very much are a heavily discussed team,
and I do think, you know, people are very much curious about some
more broad general analytic type type trendsor things that we can kind of glean
from how all these teams kind ofapproach the first round. I think all

(01:06):
of them make for some really interestingdiscussions as we head towards Day two for
sure, for sure, and soas discussed thirty two players off the board,
we now have a kind of afresh new outlook of teams having new
needs looking at players that potentially dropped, or are looking at players that they
potentially have a higher value than theleague on. And so this kind of

(01:29):
discussion gets interesting. At the firstpick of the second round, obviously,
with the Bills having traded Stephan Diggs, are probably in the market for a
wide receiver. Tage, what areyour thoughts on kind of what their options
are there and how they move forward. I do like some of the moves
that the Bills made yesterday to getback out of the first round and pick

(01:51):
up a couple of draft picks alongthe way. And you're right, like,
this is the spot where we wouldlike to take wide receivers. We
thought that there was a clear topthree, but then after that, all
these wide receivers are kind of mixedtogether, and it's really just the value
of the rookie contract that's going togenerate the surplus value for you, and
I think that the Bills are goingto get that here. I think when
you look at some of the receiversremaining, a Donnie Mitchell from Texas is

(02:13):
someone who wasn't super productive his lastyear but obviously tested very well, is
highly athletic, highly talented, Somaybe that's an option for them, someone
that can turn into a true numberone receiver for them. Lad McConkey,
I think, is also another optionbecause he would work really well with Khalios
Shakir in that offense where they areboth guys who should be able to separate,

(02:35):
work over the intermediate areas of thefield where Josh Allen can really get
to them, and then Kean Colemancan be your true big body X receiver,
not great separation wise, but reallygood contested catchability. And I think
that as the Bills continue to workon their wide receiver room building up in
the aggregate since the Stefan Diggs trade, one of these guys can be like
the start of that, and thenthey can move on and take another receiver

(02:58):
later in the draft. The Billsare name situation too, because you know
this is a team that's competed yearafter year after year and hasn't been able
to get over the hump they moveoff from a wide receiver generally viewed over
the past couple of years one ofthe better ones obviously now bringing in a
younger guy, they have Khalil Shakir, who you know, analytically looks like
a great wide receiver and is goingto get a lot more reps. Ben

(03:21):
We we had Arjan men On onyesterday Chargers super fan PFF analyst. He
was kind of pulling his hair outat the pick. But it seems as
if the Chargers are in a prettygood spot to get a wide receiver.
Who'd you'd like to see go there? Yeah, definitely obviously, you know,
within the first five picks. Basicallykind of like Tage, so like
there are a number of guys inthis like I would I would classify close

(03:43):
to maybe like the Borderline's second thirdtier of wide receiver prospects. Basically we
have, but it is very muchI would say flavor of the what you
what you really value, right,And I do think at least from the
bills standpoint, like I believe inKhalis Shakir, and I do think he
could be a really legitimate spot wesee. But not only do they have
to fill the stuff on digs roal, but they very much probably need to
get you know, a legitimate threatlike Gabe Davis or hopefully somebody better than

(04:08):
Gabe Davis, I think is likea key point of that offense. So
I would be surprised if they didn'tcome away in the next two days with
multiple receivers that can potentially fill thatposition. And I think the Chargers are
in a lot of ways, youknow, not necessarily in the same position,
because I actually don't think they havelike any real you know, strong
I would say presence at the widereceiver position that I'm really going to buy

(04:29):
into. I think, you know, Josh Palmer is obviously somebody that can
maybe bring you a little bit ofthat traditional X receiver type. Look all
the Gabe Davis, but they're ateam that I think at least needs to
go all in on the wide receiverposition here in day two and day three.
And I think overall, like tome, I would rather see a
guy like Ady Mitchell go to theChargers. I think, like, you

(04:50):
know, obviously his target share andhis you know, the things in which
he needs to do from like ayard per round perspective didn't really carry forward
at Texas, and I think that'sone of the main reasons why he was
doing so much. But obviously,you know, heavy, heavy competition for
targets in that offense. I stillthink he, at least from like a
measurement standpoint, has the capabilities ofactually leading in the NFL. You know,

(05:13):
wide receiver room at certain in certainstretches. So he would be the
guy that I'd be looking at apick thirty seven for the Los Angeles Chargers.
But kind of like Taysha, thereare a number of options, but
I think the charge in particular moreso need to go with like a traditional
wide receiver type look, and Ithink the Bills could maybe get away with
maybe taking more of the you knowa little bit of a different approach.

(05:33):
I have more options, I wouldsay, to really fill the void that
they have on the offense ode ofthe football for them. Right, we
were discussing prior to the show,how you know you go into the draft
and there are certain positions and widereceiver was one of one of them.
Miss here where you know you maybe able to wait until that second round.

(05:54):
I mean you look at the guyswho are still on the board,
ad Mitchell, Aladmakonkie, Keon Coleman. These are all guys who a lot
of people thought could go in thefirst round. I mean you look at
the dps respectively down that line edptwenty eight for eighty, Mitchell thirty two,
Lad McConkie thirty three, just outsideof the first round with Keon,
Coleman, and Taje had a goodpoint about you know, when you're evaluating

(06:15):
how these guys will actually fit in, there's a lot of target share questions,
there's a lot of quarterback questions.Can you walk the crowd through kind
of what your thought process was onthat and also how it deals in a
fantasy context. Yeah, so whenyou look at at these players, you
know in the types of situation thatthey might end up in, both from
how well they can actually develop oncethere, but also from fantasy standpoint.

(06:36):
We talked about this last night,but like Josh Palmer, is someone right
now that is projected to be topfive and target share next year by default,
mostly because the Chargers just haven't mademuch of an investment at wide receiver.
Draft position is the biggest predictor oftarget share your rookie season. But
when these players get taken at let'ssay number three or number thirty seven,

(06:58):
overall, there will be a prettystrong target share opportunity for them just because
of what was lost from both theBills and the Chargers last season. So
there will be room for them toget targets pretty early as a rookie as
long as they feel comfortable in thosesituations. So, like, that's why
I think it would be really excitingto see both the Bills and the Chargers
take receivers at thirty three and thirtyseven because that opportunity, all those targets

(07:23):
are available for them. And it'slike you think back to like the Moneyball
seeing like the famous one, Like, yeah, you want to build up
those targets in the aggregate with multiplereceivers that can really replace what Stefan Diggs
and Keen Allen were doing for theBills and Charges respectively. Yeah, and
Ben the question out for you.With both of these teams, they have
settled and pretty well proven quarterbacks withgood tackle situations, obviously the Chargers' main

(07:48):
investment even more at tackle. Likethese are offenses that are kind of set
and so just in general, kindof irrespective of who gets drafted, what
would you expect the better fantasy outcometo be if you're just looking at someone
tied to a Josh Allen or someonetied to Justin Herbert, Yeah, I
think, you know. And goingback to it, like, I think

(08:09):
both of both the landing spots aregoing to have a ton of upside and
appeal. And I do think likethere are certain guys that are if they
get drafted to either one of theseteams at thirty two or thirty seven,
are probably going to be more intriguingthan you know, what happens with Wicki
Piercell for San Francisco from a fantasyperspective, right, So, I think,
And to me, like the intriguingpart about what we're discussing is like

(08:33):
there are kind of still wide receiversthat kind of fill fit almost any mold,
and I think the direction in whicheach one of these teams go is
going to be a really interesting partof the top of the first round because
if you want a slack guy,like there are some slot guys maybe a
little bit further on down the draftboard, but those options still very much
exist in guys like Jacob Cowen.I think, you know, Roman Wilson
in particular is the guy that I'mintrigued where he actually ends up as well.

(08:54):
But I think overall, like thetalent at the wide receiver position is
so deep right now, and we'vekind of hit the maybe the starting to
the midpoint of that, but verymuch it's going to be at least the
fantasy success driven by that initial opportunity. And I'm not quite sure if I
believe that any one of these guysis like more NFL ready than anyone else.

(09:16):
I think obviously some are going tobe more of a development project.
But somebody who I think, canyou know, maybe come in and step
out right away, does seem likeit would be like more of a Lad
McConkie type. So I think ifhe ends up in one of those two
spots, that would be a caseto you know, potentially get a little
bit more excited from like a fantasystandpoint. Yeah, And to add on
to what you're saying, like wedo have alignment with data from stats Bomb,

(09:37):
and it's really interesting to look atlike how many yards are you away
from the ball with wise like fromthe ball to the sideline at the step,
and Ricky Piersoll is someone who hadthe lowest of the top sixteen receivers.
He was most often lined up closestto the ball. But then you
bring up some other options like MalachaiCorley from Western Kentucky with someone who lined

(09:58):
up in the slot a lot.Lad McConkey, you know, had the
fifth lowest alignment, and then youcan kind of go to the other end
with some of the receivers we mightbe taken today with Kean Coleman, who
is like basically a true X receiverlike lining up on the outside very often.
Ady Mitchell was somewhere in the middlethere where he was mostly lining up

(10:18):
on the inside but could could getclose to the ball eventually as well.
As so it's like, yeah,you're right, like, whatever flavor of
wide receiver you really want today atthe top of the draft, you should
be able to get it. AndI think that will continue all the way
through day two. Yeah, andI'm glad we're getting into some of these
other wide receivers as well. Itis such a deep position. Asa Arnold,
who recently contributed to Summer Sports,got to take kind of his victory

(10:39):
lap yesterday when Michael Lennox went eightbrought brings up Javon Baker from UCF.
There's just a lot of kind offlavors, as you kind of said,
of where people want to go withthat. Obviously there's some opportunities to trade
back perhaps depending on who you like. Just kind of close out the wide

(11:01):
receiver conversation here we have all thislong list of guys who do y'all think
is just from the data perspective,is the guy to look out for irrespective
of role tage? Yeah, Imean that that is a really good question.
I think. I think Ben mentionedit with Ladi McConkey, Like,
I think he's someone who can stepin day one and be a pretty good

(11:22):
option because of his versatility in alignmentwhere he can line up in the slot
and outside. And I think hewas probably the most liked and respected player
in this draft. Like maybe hedidn't have the high end talent to go
in the first round, but likeI rarely saw anything bad from him,
and he knocks on him like someof my other guys that I really liked
in this class, like Troy Franklin. You know, I film guys weren't

(11:43):
as high on because of his jobrate and his low contested catch rate.
Like I also really liked Jermaine Burdenfrom a data perspective, but there was
the character concerns, Like Ladi McConkeywas universally like really liked in this class,
and you know, if he doesn'tend up working on in the NFL,
I think both data people and filmpeople be surprised by that. Yeah,
that makes a lot of sense.I like that. You bring up
Jermaine Burton too. There's just alot of firepower here, Ben, Where

(12:07):
do you think the most firepower isconcentrated in one player? Yeah, I
mean I I personally like obviously JermaineBurton has some like off the field concerns,
but I do think he is likethe best option as far as like
a complete wide receiver that you canstill get right now. And I think
in a lot of ways he's he'slike, you know, kind of like

(12:28):
not I don't want to say,like a complete poor man's version of Marvin
Harrison Junior. But I think hedoes have like the top end talents basically
run almost every single round on thefootball field, and I think, you
know, obviously the off field concernsare are something, but that's the reason
why he did slide out of thefirst round and could even need to slide
out of the second round as well. So for Burton to me is like
a high upside case. I youknow, I obviously, like you know,

(12:48):
don't grind the film like a lotof other people, and I'm not
as concerned about drops. So Ido think Troy Franklin as well as at
least showed like legitimate separation type skills. Obviously you didn't get to showcase that
a lot in Oregon's offense in thelast season with a low a dot you
know, coming from bo Nix.But I think he has shown separation ability
at basically every single level. Ithink that's an intriguing case in the second

(13:09):
round, especially if he's a guythat you kind of need to build your
wide receiver room around. Yeah,and someone we haven't talked a ton about
is Keon Coleman. And if youwant to pinpoint at a time in which
Keon Coleman went from you know,certified first round player to all of a
sudden he's he's fallen back in thesecond was his four six poet forty Tay's

(13:31):
You've written an article about how muchthat kind of affects wide receivers at the
next level, or at least howmuch we can glean from it. Obviously,
he also had a tracking wise whenwhen he was running to grunt a
drill the fastest, you know,miles per hour there. So do you
think that Keon Coleman has maybe fallentoo far? I know that there was
a lot of scouting stuff as well, and and things like that describing,

(13:52):
you know, how he's generally notseparating. What does your data say about
Keon Coleman and how does that kindof show where he may go today and
how he may project into the NFL. Yeah, I mean you bring up
a lot of good points there.I think when you look at Kean Coleman,
his production was pretty low at FloridaState this past year, like fourteenth
and yards per run out of thetop sixteen receivers we had. But what

(14:16):
he did do pretty well was hewas targeted deep a lot from Jordan Travis,
and he was explosive on a lotof those those deep targets. So
he's really someone that when you watchhim, he looks a lot better than
the stats end up showing. AndI think that's reflective in some of the
film guys that I've talked to,like when they're looking at him, like
they're a lot higher on him thanthe data would show, you know,

(14:37):
just because of that. But hedid finish with a thirty eighth percent to
athleticism score, which is slightly predictive, but obviously, like when you bring
up tracking data, like I thinkhe's going to show up better in that,
And like despite his forty he stilldid really well in the broad jump
and vertical and he has the rightheight and weight that you kind of want
to see from a typical like biggerbody receiver in the NFL. So he's

(15:00):
someone that's gonna be a super interestingevaluation for me going forward because yeah,
like that there's a disparity between thedata and and what you see, you
know with him when you actually turnon the film, he probably ends up
somewhere in the middle, but Iwouldn't be surprised if he falls on either
end of the distribution. Yeah,I think for me, like and there
is I think there's been quite abit of pushback rightfully so on like the

(15:22):
contested catch artists. I do thinkKeen Coleman, like in particular has a
lot of like wow type plays thatjump off the page because of like that
contested catchability. And I do thinkit'll be really interesting to see kind of
where he lands, because I dothink he is, you know, better
from an overall wide receiver package thana guy like JJ rc A Whiteside who
very much had that similar, youknow, a similar contested catch knock.

(15:43):
I personally, you know, withKeen Coleman see like almost splashes with T
Higgins. That's very much like anupside case. But T Higgins was a
guy who fell to the thirty thirdpick in the second round as well because
of the overall I would say athleticprofile. But I very much think like
an upside case for Keen Coleman couldbe along that T Higgins type line.
Sure, yeah, And so tokind of close this conversation out, you
bring up T Higgins. There area lot of rumors going around about possibly

(16:06):
a wide receiver being traded a BrandonAyuk obviously came up yesterday saying texting the
to the front office and Kyle Shanahanthat the Ricky Peter saw tweet pick was
fire. You know Ayux possibly inthe mix. Are there any trades that
y'all expect coming up today, maybeor after the draft. I do think

(16:29):
Deebo Samuel has the highest chance ofthose three receivers of getting traded him.
I yuk in t Higgins just becauseI don't know if he necessarily fits with
the forty nine ers long term plan, and you're gonna start to get really
expensive. I think they're gonna haveeither five or six players that are getting
paid over twenty million dollars per yearonce i U gets his extension. So

(16:51):
I think Deebo Samuel might be theguy that's left out there where his production's
dropped a little bit. You know, he's not what he used to be
in twenty twenty one, but Ithink he's still someone that could be effective
for a team that is, likeis a little bit more desperate for receivers
as long as they're comfortable taking onthe cap hit. Like maybe you know,
the Commanders end up giving a fourthor fifth round pick for him and

(17:15):
kind of handling his cap hit becausethey have this space to do so,
because they really want to help Jaydenand Daniels get acclimated to the league.
Like I think I think those arethe types of teams we could watch for
as potential trade candidates for him,right, any trades that you expect then,
I mean, yeah, I'm I'mfully on with the Deebo Samuel.
I do think, just in general, like the compensation that fans and everyone

(17:36):
else have been kind of projecting fromthe wide receiver position, I think has
been very overblowing. I think,and you know a lot of ways,
maybe that doesn't carry with what StefanDiggs got from the Houston Texans, you
know, with the second round pick. But I do think just in general,
like Deebo getting moved for a thirdor fourth round pick wouldn't surprise me,
whatsoeveryone. I do think there area number of teams, even given
this contract, that would probably willto do it. So I think it's

(18:00):
probably maybe more of a likelihood thannot close to a coin filt that he
ends up getting moved, especially afterthe Ricky Piersoll move up for them or
move for them yesterday, I wouldsay, yeah. And one of the
things that really it seemed like fortynine ers life about Ricky pearsall was speed
and so Sean Sean donahue is jumpinginto the chat. Thanks longtime viewer Sean,

(18:22):
we very much appreciate you, Hesays, do you think teams will
prioritize speed because it fits a role? He also asked about Tesz Walker.
There tajun Ban any thoughts about howspeed may affect the draft order today for
the wide receivers. I do thinkthat's a that's a fair point to bring
up, right, because when welook at gms and some of their trends

(18:45):
in the draft, there's some gmswhere they will try to take premium positions
or we'll try to take best playeravailable on day one, but then day
two and day three is really aboutchasing highly athletic players that give yourself a
chance to have, you know,someone break out and really go past their
draft position. When you look attes Walker, you know, very weird

(19:07):
season where he had to wait fora decision from the NCAA to see if
he could play. You know,I'm sure that that affected him mentally,
and the production wasn't wasn't great,you know, despite Drake May throwing to
him, but he still had adecent amount of separation and a decent amount
of target share. So maybe hecan turn that into something at the next
level. But where he really shinedwas at the combine ninety seventh percentile predictive

(19:30):
athletics score. You know, despitebeing one hundred and ninety three pounds,
he still ran a four to threesix. He did he did very well
in the vertical, very well inthe broad jump. Things are both things
that are both predictive for wide receivers. So maybe a team does take a
chance on him today despite the productionbeing low, just because the athleticism is
there and he can run you know, a pretty pretty diverse route tree.

(19:52):
And I think that a team mightmight try to take advantage or or try
to take a chance on that andreally use them to their advantage. Yeah,
that sounds great. And also fromSean, we have shout out Mike
Ranner with our SA Whiteside drop.Then everybody's appreciating your deep knowledge of the
game knowledge, I mean yeah,And I think with the Walker thing in
particularly, like this is something thatI've personally been you know, like interested

(20:17):
in, like you know, wantingto research or something. But we do
see athletic profile carry out would say, and seemingly every single position right,
and and especially if a guy likeDevonte's walker is thought of as maybe struggling
from like a technique aspect, withthis route running ability, like, those
are things that I think NFL scoutsand evaluators believe that they can fix and

(20:38):
correct when they get that guy inthe building. And I think that's the
reason why we do see you know, the speed and the athleticism carries so
much from a draft signal standpoint,and I very much think that you know,
Walker in particularly kind of fits thatbill because if you have like a
route running technician without a lot ofspeed, like, there's not a lot
of like wiggle room. I wouldsay from that team actually being really successful

(20:59):
and bringing out the best to him, because a lot of that has already
been you know, showing on film. But I think from a Walker standpoint,
like Tag said, he missed alot of time, wasn't maybe in
the correct headspace when he was outthere, but he did have the flashes
very limited from a route tree standpoint, but I think if that can be
developed, he is somebody that couldbe you know, a very intriguing day
two prospect and could be a reallylegitimate, you know, wide receiver two

(21:22):
option on a good NFL offense forsure. Right And before we move on
off of wide receivers obviously one ofthe most important fantasy positions. I do
want to reiterate to the to thecrowd that we are partnering with Underdog Fantasy
for all of these streams. We'rebringing you stuff all week in long and
so you can use promo code sumerfor one hundred percent match up to one

(21:45):
hundred dollars on Underdog Fantasy. Sowe'll move to kind of back into the
trenches. There's a lot of greatd linemen right now that are still on
the board. Obviously one of myfavorite prospects of the whole drafts cycle with
Jorjeon Newton. Johnny Newton is stillon the board, and there's a lot
of kind of need at that atthat defensive line and position. We also

(22:07):
saw, you know, someone likeByron Murphy go ahead of Edges, and
now it seems like this interior defensiveline is now a standard premium position now.
So a couple other guys who areon the board Brandon fisk edp of
thirty one to and Andre Sweat muchlater edp of sixty one, But it's
just cratered after some off the fieldissues that a lot of guys think his
athletic profile is pretty good. Maybesomeone takes a jump on him. Ben,

(22:32):
what are your thoughts on kind ofthis D line group obviously the Vikings
may you know, dabble in thismarket in the next couple of rounds.
What are your thoughts? Yeah,I mean I very much agree with your
you know a synopsis basically that theinterior defensive line position has very much taken
hold as like a premium position,and although it maybe hasn't like completely front

(22:52):
run the cornerback position, Like teamsare moving in that direction because of you
know, the proliferation like the toohigh shell look and everything else, and
needing a guy that can play bothgaps you know, in the tiers and
defensive line. So I think bothcome off the board kind of like you
said, the defant Sweat obviously hassome you know, weight concerns and then

(23:12):
like the off the field stuff withthe dui. But he is a guy
if you can get him in thebuilding, Like there are very few people
that can move as quickly as hecan at the weight in which he actually
carries forward, and I think thatis an impact type player. And if
you can get those guys in thesecond round, like that's when you really
have, you know, a teambuilding momentum that can carry you to you

(23:33):
know, legitimate Super Bowl contender ifyou get enough guys and you hit on
enough of those picks. And we'veseen teams like you know, the Philadelphia
Eagles continuously, you know, makesome of those hits in the rounds past
the first round. So I dothink gravitating towards upside in the second and
third round it makes a lot ofsense. And I think, you know,
Sweat and Newton in particular have alot of that skill set already baked

(23:55):
in, and I think very muchwe'll be coming off the board outside relatively
quickly here on Friday. Right.So another interesting thing to note is Fisk
was kind of a combine riser.You know, we've written about combine risers
and how maybe that won't track exactlyto you know, an increased value and
approximate value as measured by Football Reference. And then you look at Devandre Sweat

(24:15):
and Jerge on Newton, Jersey onNewton, the medicals or a little strange
on Sweat obviously some character issue stuffhege. When you're looking at this market
in which number one it's it's kindof an upswing market, people are viewing
it as a premium position has beenhighlighted. And then you're also looking at
guys who are kind of drastically fallingfrom from you know, a twenty eedp

(24:37):
for Newton Sweat dropped weeks ago,or drastically rising like Brandon Fisk. What's
your kind of view of how toplay the middle and really reap value in
the draft and kind of reading thetea leads of the stands. That's a
really good question. I mean,I think your guys. An article on
combine risers and why we should sometimesbe of them is really spot on when

(25:02):
we look at all of this,because when you think about these evaluations,
the combine should mostly confirm what yousaw for most positions, right there are
exceptions, I think like tight end, for example, is a position where
the combine impacts how they're actually canperform in the NFL a lot because of
just like how highly athletic you haveto be to play tight end at a

(25:22):
high level in the league. Butfor most other positions, you shouldn't move
players up ten to fifteen spots onyour big board just because of the combine.
But there are certain things that canthat can help you think about what
you want to kind of what thetype of mold that you want for a
player to be in at the nextlevel. And I think when you look
at Tofandre Swett, removing some ofthe off field stuff and just focusing on

(25:45):
him as a player, Like Benmentioned, it's really hard to find someone
at that size that can move atthe speed that he moved on. He
had a ninety seventh percentile predictive athleticsscore from US. You know, he's
someone who is is really good atat wreaking havoc in the in the backfield,
had the fourth highest havoc rate amongthe top eight defensive tackles, had

(26:07):
the third highest or the third lowestdepth of tackle. So that's that's really
good. He's he's getting in thebackfield often playing next to Byron Murphy and
really making sure he's tackling rushers behindthe line of scrimmage. But again,
like you don't know about how he'sgoing to be able to sustain, you
know, a full game at theNFL level just because of his weight,
and it's it's really hard to do. So you know, kind of goes

(26:30):
back to the Jordan Davis thing whereI think Davis has had a fine NFL
career, but definitely not at theat the level that you wanted to.
I think Jalen Carter is someone who'shad already a good, a really good
NFL career because he's a little bitlighter, because he's a little bit more
more flexible. But I do wantto really hear from you on Johnny Newton
because he's someone who who got alot of pressure, got the pressure quickly,

(26:52):
you know, rushing from that defensivetackle spot. Had an EDP of
twenty four point five yesterday and hasfallen to the second round. Right.
It's interesting, and I think themedicals in this draft have played an interesting
role because obviously at the premium it'sthe most premium position quarterback. We have
Pennis Pop all the way up toeight. Obviously he hasn't been like overly

(27:17):
injured in the past couple of years. But then we see on the defensive
side of the ball, like DallasTurner fall a little bit to the Vikings
and then they trade up and gethim, and obviously we've seen Newton fall.
I also think there's just the greatertrend which I think we'll get into
later of these defensive players being draftedlater, and I I'm kind of still

(27:41):
working through and maybe by the endof the podcast I'll have a better view
of it, just after we continuetalking of what does this mean kind of
for the draft or for the leagueas a whole, that people are really
trying to jump up and reef valuefrom the quarterbacks. Maybe this is just
a class thing. I thought thiswas one of the better kind of but

(28:02):
also more top heavy defensive tackle classes, and so I thought that there may
be people come up and trying tosnipe it as some of the later defensive
tackles aren't projected to be as goodin the NFL. But it seems like
maybe they're just slot in in theearly second round and the teams that needed
them obviously may have traded back orup or something like that, and we'll

(28:23):
see how it breaks down. Andkind of along this role as well,
Sean has another fantastic question for youguys. Do you think teams should prioritize
inside outside versatility or role players.I think this comes back a lot to
Johnny Newton, so I'll kind oflead it off. You know, Johnny
Newton does have that inside outside versatility, health notwithstanding, you'd expect him kind

(28:47):
of to be a guy much likea Byron Byron Murphy from Texas where I
thought they were kind of similar players. Bier Murphy obviously did at a higher
level. Some of the analytics aregreat, but you look at both of
them and they have that inside outsideversatility, and I think that's something that
means a lot in the first round. And I'd like to get a view
from y'all. Tay, you kindof just hit on it with the kind

(29:11):
of Jordan Davis breakdown. But isthis a place where you start looking for
a Jonah Ellis type DPR where they'rejust coming off the edge on you know,
second, third down passing downs orare you still looking for that all
in kind of home run player.Yeah, I mean, this is an
awesome question from Sean. I youknow, I think like that kind of

(29:33):
the cop out is like it reallydepends on your rotation, right, Like
there's teams like the Jets that rotatea ton of defensive linement through and they
can have someone like Bryce Huff who'splayed that role for them last year,
the designated pass presher role. Ithink like someone like James Houston did that
for the Lions, So that kindof depends on where you're at there,
or there's other teams that like toplay, you know, the defensive lineman
a ton on the field. Ithink we're about to see that with the

(29:55):
Raiders this year with Christian Wilkins andMat Crosby where they're going to on the
field and basically every single defensive snap. So it really depends on your defensive
philosophy. But I think from adraft perspective, early round two is still
where you want to try to findthat versatility. I think when you have
players that can line up from thethree technique to the five technique or you

(30:18):
know, you have a four Iout wide where they they can get flexed
out. I think we've seen howsuccessful the Chiefs have been where they can
move Chris Jones all over the place, and we saw him kind of move
in games like the Super Bowl wherehe can kind of find the weak link
on your offensive line and attack it. Miles Garrett has been very similar.
I think back to the Bengals gamefrom Week one where they had them lining

(30:41):
up over the center because that wasthe weak point of the Bengals offensive line
at the time. So that's reallylike the versatility you can get in the
top forty, top fifty picks iswhat you want to chase. And then
after a day three, go afteryour highly athletic guys, go after some
of the small school guys who rackedup double digit amount of sacks or high
end amount of pressures last year,because like, if they showed either production

(31:04):
and or athleticism, they can reallyfill one of the designated roles for you,
where either the designated pass rusher atedge or there's someone like Devandre Sweat
who's going to play early downs foryou, and really try to make it
where teams are playing in more thirdand sixes and less third and fours.
Right, And I think, Ben, you're close to the situation now.

(31:26):
Obviously you've added Dallas Turner, who'slooked at as you know, kind of
a kind of all around outside linebacker. Our our partner, Shan Sai ed
At Sayed Schemes, was in thepress conference and asking just great, fantastic
questions, and I'm glad that we'vegotten a lot of feedback, so huge
shout out to Sean. But heasked a question about Dallas Turner being comfortable

(31:48):
dropping you know, looking at thatversatility kind of a certified day one guy.
The Vikings also have I think it'sJonathan Greenard and Andrew Van Ginkel.
And so now that you're moving intoyour team, is your your favorite team
is moving into day two? Areyou looking for more of those guys that
taste just outlined of guys that areforcing you into the third and fix so

(32:12):
you can unleash a Turner, avanging coun or Greenard? Are you still
looking for like the hot shot guysthat can fit into floor as a scheme
and become absolutely dominant. Yeah,I'm still I'm still looking and gravitying towards
like the upside place. I think, obviously, you know what Taje said
carries. I also think it makesa lot of sense to me. I
think our projection and understanding of versatility, especially at the college level, maybe

(32:36):
needs to be correctly grounded in whatthat players actually has to do in the
and the situation in which he findshimself in at the college level as well,
right, Because I do think ina lot of ways, like guys
are asked to do certain things atthe college level more so out of need
than ability. And I think justyou know, separating those two things.
Like in a lot of situations,we look at the traditional base rates for

(33:00):
what that guy did in different schemesand maybe don't necessarily understand like the context
in which he arrived at that particularsituation, whether he's rushing from the inside
or the outside, and what thecontext of the game actually is. So
I do think it's a good questionto me if I was, you know,
rebuilding the you know, Vikings defensively, I do think they have a

(33:20):
decent amount of death depth at theedge rusher position now kind of like you
said with you know, Jonathan greenerdAndrew Van Ginkel. Obviously they have Dallas
Turner as well, they have acouple more depth pieces I think, you
know, specifically they have they haveHarrison Phillips as well, who I think
has been you know, relatively successfulcoming over to the Minnesota Vikings from the
Buffalo Bills. But I still thinkthey need you know, a legitimate run

(33:45):
stuffing nose tackle to operate in thisthree four scheme and allow the guys,
I would say, to kind ofget after the quarterback. So I do
think cornerback is still in some waysa need as well. They have set
spent a decent amount of draft capitaland prior season and haven't really had you
know, a ton of it.But I do think where their secondary is
at is concerning once they do endup moving on from Harrison Smith, like

(34:07):
they are going to have, Iwould say needs are basically every single one
of the secondary positions. So Ido think getting depth there, taking some
shots and then maybe getting the nosetackle and like you know, the rounds
four or later is maybe the moreso the correct approach. But the Vikings
just don't have a ton of youknow, draft capital type options coming up

(34:27):
here at all really over the nexttwo seasons. Yeah, and Asa kind
of kind of reiterates this point ofhe would have loved Minnesota trade it back
and took Newton late first. Obviouslythat's in our mock draft, That's how
I wrote it. I really liketo see him in a Vikings uniform and
playing for Flores, And so Ithink this is this is all interesting and

(34:52):
kind of great segue into kind ofour discussion of the secondary. One of
the more surprising things about from yesterdaywas basically how the corners just started dropping
into the twenties and then we kindof saw a little run on them,
and there was some expectation that maybewe'd see a kool aid McKinstry, who
you mentioned that, Nick Saban said, it's like with the one A with

(35:12):
Terry and Arnold, you know,Cooper Dejen and it's Rakeshaw. What's kind
of the overarching viewtage of how thesecorners drop? Do you think there's something
to glean for the future, youthink it's just something that's product of this
draft class. I do think it'sreally interesting because when I looked at how
draft capital has changed at a positionlevel over time, cornerback was the position

(35:35):
that has risen the most in termsof draft capital spent on it since twenty
eleven. Right, if you lookat just kind of the trend line for
corners, there's been more and moredraft capital spent on it. And I
thought that's kind of going was goingto be how this draft bore out.
Like I looked at teams like theRaiders at number thirteen, the Colts at
fifteen, even the Vikings when theywent up to seventeen, Like, I

(35:57):
looked at all of those teams aspossible and probable cornerback destinations. And that
isn't how it played out yesterday,so that was surprising to me to really
see, you know, the cornerruns start with the Eagles at twenty two,
and then the Lions taken you know, Terry and Arnold at at twenty
four, and now you have somecorners remaining here. It was it was

(36:20):
really interesting to see the Ravens gowith Nate Wiggins at thirty because maybe they
were a trade back candidate where theycould have traded back into the second round
and picked up either kool Aid mcinstryor Cooper to Gene. But Nate Wiggins
is the very high profile corner prospect. Obviously the only thing holding him back
was was his weight. So it'llbe interesting to follow today is maybe the

(36:42):
league wants to switch from taking someof these corners in the first round where
they might have to come out andguard wide receiver ones early on in their
process, and that might hinder thedevelopment to taking so many dart throws at
the position, like we saw theBuccaneers do when they won the Super Bowl.
Where would they they had multiple draftswhere they were spending three four you

(37:04):
know, day two, Day threepicks on cornerback, on defensive back in
general, the Bengals, I thinkhad a similar strategy. They just did
through free agency when their defense wasat their peak a couple of years ago.
So maybe that's how teams want towant to see corner now, like
where the draft capitol has risen somuch where now they think that it's too
pricey of a you know, adraft pick to pay to take them in

(37:24):
the top ten, top fifteen,and they want to wait a little bit
more on them now. Yeah,And that makes a lot of sense,
And so tays you've also done somework on you know, free agency in
the cornerback position obviously as well.And Shawn chimes in here. I believe
he's talking about the Vikings cover bearfor twenty five with the draft capital,
but they have a sizeable amount ofcap space in twenty five. Maybe they

(37:46):
are confident that they can pay forcertainty in the defensive backfield. What are
your thoughts on that? Yeah,I mean, I do think that's a
that's a good point to bring upthere where it was it ended up being
very very expensive to get up andget Dallas Turner for the Vikings yesterday just
because of it. It was adouble trade up. You had to pay
the trade tax twice. If DallasTurner's medicals are okay, we're talking about

(38:09):
a player who a lot of peopleexpected to go in the top ten,
top twelve, that you got atnumber seventeen. Is it still probably an
overpay in the grand scheme of things. Yeah, But like it goes back
to what the Texans were trying todo last year, where you need to
build your core before you can fillin some of the outside pieces. And
I think when we look at tradecharts, they are really good at usually

(38:30):
projecting value. I think there's beenso much research done on why the benefits
of trading back and not reaching areimportant. But you're trying to build a
young core of players, and Ithink that's what the Vikings are trying to
do, where they're hoping that onoffense their core is JJ Mccartithy Thrown and
Justin Jefferson, Jordans and TJ.Hogginson and their two tackles. They're hoping

(38:53):
on defense that their core is JonathanGreenard and Dallas Turner and they and you
know, even Ivan Pace maybe youcan throw in there. And they're going
to try to fill in the piecesaround that. In twenty twenty five,
in the free agency class because ofthe lack of draft capital, right and
and so moving on from some ofthe corners, you know, Cooper de

(39:13):
Gene and sticking in this idea ofyou know, building cores and who we
can who has predictive measures, whatwe can glean. Cooper Jane's a player
that obviously plays corner. A lotof people, for better or worse,
think he probably projects out more ofa safety ben. Do you think that
maybe bumps him off of that EDP, given that teams may look at him,

(39:37):
it's kind of in a position thatis less has less value. What
are your kind of thoughts there?Yeah, I very much think that that
is the signal that we got fromhim not going in the first round.
I think it is interesting because ifyou look at it like a sportsbook like
DraftKings right now, his odds togo ahead of kool Ad McKenzie McKinstry,
who is like very much the traditionalcornerback prospect, like Cooper Jean's out of

(39:59):
minus one six one sixty five priceto cool A m chmistry being plus one
twenty five. Like. The expectation, at least from the betting market is
that the Gene is still going tocome off the board before him, So
I'm I tend to I would say, probably lead in the other direction I
personally and kind of going back toa taste suggested with like the Tampa Bay
Buccaneers like to round out that secondaryto actually be I would say, like

(40:22):
a bona fide the Jimit unit likethey brought in Antoine Winfield Junior, is
like a second round pick. Andalthough the safety position isn't necessarily thought of
as all that premium, like thatis kind of like the glue piece in
the secondary. And I very muchthink that, you know, from the
Viking standpoint, like losing Harrison Smith, they're going to miss out on a
lot more than what just losing ormissing out on Harrison Smith would actually entail

(40:45):
for that secondary. And I dothink like maybe going at a less valuable
premium position, but solidifying, youknow, the safety position with the guy
like Tyler Nubin, you know,is it maybe a decently sound approach or
maybe getting Cooper Gene and kind ofswitching into that safety position, like there
is some value I would say indoing that. In the second and third

(41:05):
round, we have seen teams atleast have some success in doing that and
routing out their secondary and being ableto kind of compete for a Super Bowl.
And I think that has to bethe mindset with how you're kind of
approaching both the safety versus cornerback positioncoming up here on day two, right,
that makes a lot of sense.And Ben, I think that's some
great insight into if you're approaching someof these odds on on Cooper Dejen or

(41:29):
kool Aid McKinstry. I think that'ssome great insight about you know, baking
in the positional versus versatil or moreof the positional importance. And so I
just want to remind all of ouraudience, you know, we're working with
Underdog Fantasy here use promo code sumerfor a one match up to one hundred
dollars. Great deal for all ofour loyal audience. We have a bunch

(41:51):
of great people in the chat rightnow, and we're talking about positional importance.
I think there was a lot ofguys you know, edps and and
top ranking players. We have JacksonPowers Johnson a center number one. We
have Edrian Cooper linebacker number one,Jonathan Brooks, who a lot of people
are kind of seeing going to Cowboysrunning back number one Tyler nub and safety

(42:13):
number one. It really wasn't ashock to see and if these guys go
round one. So just as wekind of close out our view of the
players who are still on the board, walk me through tage how kind of
teams are probably approaching these positions,given that you know, Fred Warner is
one of the bigger stars in theleague. However, he does play at
a non premium position. We alllove running backs, but a non premium

(42:37):
position that's difficult to project out pastyou know, two three years. Walk
us through kind of your view ofsome of these players and how they may
end up, you know, goingplaying out today. Yeah, I mean,
you're definitely right, Like it wasn'ta surprise to see, you know,
all of those guys not go onround one. I think the only
one was a little bit surprised aboutwas Jackson Powers Johnson, but I think

(42:57):
he's another guy where his medicals areare more of a concern then we probably
knows, as you know, justjust fans where I think when when you
looked at these players bout the youknow, the highest center, the highest
linebacker, highest running back, andhighest safety, it was both the combination
of them being non premium positions,but also the class of these players just

(43:19):
not being as high as it wasin the past. I think, like
you take someone like Jonathan Brooks forexample, where he's a very good running
back prospect coming off of twenty aclnot as high end as Bijon Robinson Jamior
Gid last year, who both wonin the top twelve, So like he
doesn't get that kind of of youknow, draft capital spent on him,
but like someone like Kim or TreyBenson could go pretty early on Day two

(43:42):
because now teams feel more comfortable usingyou know, a pick like that on
a running back. And Edrin Cooperis also someone who shows up really well
in the data that we have fromstats Bomb, you know as both a
linebacker that can do well in therun game but also be used off the
edge when when blitz thing and gettingpressure on the quarterback. And like he's

(44:02):
not as high of a linebacker prospectas we've seen in recent years, but
still someone that teams will now feelmore comfortable using a Day two pick on
him than being the only team yesterdaythat would would have drafted someone like a
linebacker because the draft yesterday, wesaw so many premium positions go, and
we saw so many offensive players go. So today maybe teams start to fill

(44:25):
in a little bit more on theirdefense, right and looking at Jonathan Brooks,
I mean at that running back position, I think the Cowboys are kind
of getting a lot of flak cominginto the the draft, given some of
the comments from Jerry Jones, andobviously they've been one of the teams who
you know, invented the trade chartat the first thing. I think they've

(44:45):
done a great job in the draftand refilling their coffers in the specifically in
the past couple of years, alot of people wanted him to go running
back in their first round. Theymade kind of the classic Cowboys pick of
going with the high potential, highupside tackle in guiding from Oklahoma. I
believe, and really go kind ofchalk to what the analytics would have said

(45:08):
to do. You know, youlose a long time premium position guy on
one of an offensive line that's typicallylooked at, it's pretty good you kind
of fill that need at the position. Obviously they don't need a quarterback.
Dack had a great year last yearkind of in terms of just sheer positional

(45:28):
importance or market value. You fillthat role with a tackle, and now
Ben tell us about how that maybefrees them up to address some of these
needs that they need at the lastpremium positions. Yeah, definitely, I
think, you know, to behonest with you, like the Cowboys,
I don't want to say they havea complete roster, but like you know,
they have guys at premium positions thatmatter a lot. And I think,

(45:50):
you know, like you said,the guiton might be more rad than
the other prospects. I think insome ways Cowboys fans might be frustrated as
well because they moved down four spotsand I think two tackles that came out
off the board in that move downsort of situation. But there's obviously a
benefit to them moving down. ButI think, you know, I know,
they don't have a lot on theroster. From a running back standpoint,
we go doubt gott Dowdell and youknow dou Spawn who very much.

(46:13):
I would say, the expectation can'tbe that he could carry you know,
the lion's share of a load foran NFL offense. So I would expect
them to address the position. Butthe lot, Like the question becomes like,
how much different of a of aprospect is Jonathan Brooks as compared to
like, you know, any othernumber of the of the running back prospects
that are available, And what dothey also tokin to try and emphasize,

(46:36):
right, because I do think duSpan is like a legitimate pass catching running
back obviously, you know, similarto like a scap back type option,
a lot of sweeps, you know, jet sweeps, those sorts of things.
They need somebody that can run betweenthe tackles. To me, you
know, maybe a guy like BlakeCore makes more sense than the Jonathan Brooks
from that angle, but I dothink they have like probably their biggest gap
is at the middle linebacker position.So I do think Cooper coming off the

(47:00):
here at some point in the secondround, specifically the Dallas does make a
lot of sense. And I dothink, you know, our discussion around
the draft is always around premium positionsversus not, But once we move past
the first round, like, thereis like some opportunities to be had in
surplus value if you do hit ona guy, even at a non premium

(47:22):
position given the rookie contract scale,So I would be surprised if we don't
see Edern Cooper come off the boardrelatively quickly, because I do think there's
a clear distinction between him and therest of the inside. I think the
Dallas Cowboys, if if we canbelieve Jerry Jones, et cetera, and
their win now mentality, like Ithink Edrian Cooper is very much the answer

(47:43):
to that question as they move intothe second round for sure, right and
we're starting to get into that teamcontext. But before we do that,
I just want to highlight for theaudience out there. You know, yesterday
was a big quarterbacks and all thesebig names coming off the board, and
we covered that and I'm glad itworked out with some of our tour the
top four stuff, But I wasjust making notes here about how some of

(48:06):
that evergreen stuff just about the philosophyof the draft, the philosophy of the
combine, the philosophy philosophy of freeagency really makes a huge, huge difference
in the second, third, fourth, fifth rounds. And so for all
the audience out there, Summer Sportsdot Com, if you want to get
a sense of what some of theseteams might do based off what they did
in free agency, based off kindof the theory of the draft or looking

(48:30):
at athletic guys with the combine.Taj and Ben have done a great job
of summarizing some of that, andI'm really glad that that some of that
is coming to roost and I'm excitedthat that that's out in the public.
Now. I got a shout outSean before moving to the next to the
next unit. Here Ben talking aboutDoucevann like he's a young Malieldeymore. He's

(48:55):
playing on like all like this manknows how to get on the show here
because he's talking about duce Vaughn.You know, tu Lane played against Dusban
Cowboys guy, Melelde Moore, Twulaneguy played at Tulane, the Vikings legend.
Congratulations Sean. Sean is like thealgorithm hacker. Yeah, I appreciate

(49:15):
the support man. So let's moveforward. You know, we're kind of
stuck in this defensive veine, andI think given that defense has fallen so
much, that's going to be thename of the game kind of day Day
two and then a little bit lessso as people try to find value in
Day three. But tash I wantedto focus in on one team who is

(49:35):
in an interesting place to add aplayer who can really go big in fantasy,
And that's with the Indianapolis Colts.Yesterday they went with lay two,
who obviously edge rusher, adding toa pretty stout defensive line. And now
they're in the position to give AnthonyRichardson some help. You know, so

(49:57):
they have Josh Downs. Do youthink they add in a wide receiver here?
And what do you think that widereceiver in terms of the numbers that
you've looked at, What is thatthat wide receiver's opportunity in fantasy? And
what does that say about Anthony Richardsonwho in a few games that he really
popped off last year he was onone of my teams, really was an
impact player in fantasy. Yeah,I mean I think the Colts were a

(50:22):
team I thought might take powers ifhe was available to them that you know,
ended up not end up being takena couple of picks ahead of where
they were drafting. But you lookat the Colts from both the fantasy standpoint
and just a pass catching group standpoint, like Michael Pittman Junior is going to
be a true wide receiver one,you know, great player, high end
target share, with both Anthony Richardsonand Gardner Minshew at quarterback last year,

(50:45):
So that tells me Shane Syken reallytrust Michael Pittman Jr. And Josh Downs
is also someone in there as wellwho can be a decent wide receiver two
for you. And then the Coltshave been really interesting with the way they've
they've invested in their tight They've doneit the right way from my perspective.
Jelani Woods, highly athletic guy.Moeli Cox, highly athletic guy. Maybe

(51:07):
they add someone like a Bensonatt aJahem Bell today, Like I could see
that as an option, give themthat personnel diversity that I'm sure Shane Stiken
would be really interested on. ButI would love to see them take a
receiver today just because supplementing your secondaryreceiving group that's really just right now Alec
Pierce and then like sometimes Jonathan Taylorif he comes out in the backfield,

(51:30):
like giving yourself some extra juice therewould really be helpful for Anthony Richardson as
he develops. I think that he'ssomeone that the rushing ability, the scramble
ability was obviously there last year.I think he ranked seventeenth or eighteenth in
an EPA per play on a verylimited sample size. Was the best quarterback
in the league when pressured last year. But still someone who's going to figure

(51:52):
out how to work in structure.So given him someone who can get open
quickly produce yards have to catch forhim, I think would be a really
great option for them today. AndI think they shored up one of their
holes yesterday ed Drusher, and Iwould like to see them really add to
it today when they're taking a passcatcher on day two, right'll that'll be
interesting. And obviously the pass catchers, you know, there's still a couple

(52:15):
of teams of very few given thecrazy run on quarterbacks that happened yesterday,
who are in the market for aquarterback, and one of those obviously been
Is the Giants a couple of quarterbackson the board? You know, what
do you think kind of how doyou think the pick yesterday of adding neighbors
tasted a really good job of summarizing. You know, they have a lot

(52:37):
of speed guys, or speed isthe name of the game. They have
you know, a Jenlen Hyatt.They leak neighbors. Now, what do
you think the Giants kind of planfor today is Yeah, I think it's
really interesting. I think you know, most you know, you know,
Giants fans shut out Pat Poling.He's the best of the best from a
Giants fan standpoint, Like, theywant at least a longer term solution the

(53:00):
quarterback position, and I think thedirection in which they go is going to
signal how much they actually buy intoDaniel Jones. I do think at some
point they are going to address theposition. To me, although you know,
we all are are fully on boardwith the rat pack and everything else,
Like, I don't think he isprobably the correct fit for the New
York Giants to back up a guylike Daniel Jones. I think, like

(53:22):
from a fundamentally like, I thinkthere's a case to be made for your
guy Michael Pratt to potentially be apretty good backup for a guy like Daniel
Jones. You know, similar rushingability, kind of similar similarly throwing capabilities
as well. And I don't know, if you know, as like maybe
a long term starting solution Michael Prattcould at least develop into a decent use

(53:45):
case there. I think with aguy like Brian the Bowl like that would
be an intriguing pairying that I thinkactually makes a lot of sense, and
maybe they could wait a little bitlonger at the quarterback position because because kind
of like you know, Page mentionedwith the Indianapolis Colts. I I do
think the Giants in particular, youknow, are sitting as like the third
or fourth best team in the NFCWest right now and do have a number

(54:07):
of holes. So going in andjust like asking a guy to sit for
a couple of seasons, even ifhe is, you know, a second
round pick, you know, whenthey do, I would say, probably
need to you know, figure outwhat they have, you know, at
the tight end position. I'm notsure what's transpiring with Darren Waller right now,
but I do think they in particularas well, it could be a
team that would at these benefit frommaybe adding one more weapon as well offensively

(54:30):
in the way in which that lookslike, I'm not quite sure, but
I also think they probably are inthe market for a tight end or running
back here, maybe not in thesecond round, but later on in the
draft, I think they're very muchgoing to add it to those position groups,
right And so speaking of that quarterbackposition, you know, you look
at a team like the Raiders andI was kind of talking with Tage beforehand.

(54:52):
I also like Michael Pratt potentially asa fit for the Raiders. And
also, you know, kind ofa more general thing that's going on is
for years and years and years,the analyst community has been advocating for adding
talent at the quarterback position, givenit is such a valuable position. If
you can lock that down, youcan lock down all these other things we

(55:14):
see. We talked about how theCowboys have done that. You see how
the Chiefs can do that year afteryear after year, and so to a
certain point, the Falcons have donethat. Now they've probably spent perhaps the
most capital off any team ever inone single year on a quarterback. You
see, to a certain point aswell, the Broncos doing that though in

(55:35):
the free agency trade market side that'sa little less capital, but they've added
us several players with Zach Wilson.There also the Pittsburgh Steelers doing that.
So yeah, so another team inkind of that market to do that is
the Raiders adding Gardner Minshew drafting AidanO'Connell last year. Taje, do you
think they're in the market for thequarterback and guys like DeVante Adams. How

(55:57):
do you think that affects their fantasyprofile? Yeah, I mean, I
think that's a great point you bringup. Like I'm sure when the Raiders
were planning out their draft, theyassumed Michael Penick Junior would be there often
for them at thirteen, and I'msure in a lot of their run throughs
they even went through and ended uppicking Michael Pennock Junr. Just to kind
of see like what their roster wouldlook like with that, because they you
know, again like didn't really needto take Rock Bowers yesterday. It does

(56:20):
give them that personnel diversity we talkedabout last night, But like they already
took Michael Mayett last year as morejust a best player available pick. There's
probably a pick where they didn't reallyknow what to do after Penix was off
the board. So maybe they're ateam that does take a quarterback today just
to give them another chance to havethat. I think An O'Connell was obviously
not You're not gonna expect much froma Day three pick, and he was

(56:42):
someone that didn't really do much lastyear. I think Gardner Minshew is going
to be someone who can give youbetween the twenty fifth and thirty fifth best
quarterback play in the league. Somaybe you want that for a year as
you figure out where the other holesare on your offense. And I still
think that they could be someone thattake a quarterback, you know why,
whether it's today or tomorrow, whetherit is Michael Pratt, or maybe you

(57:05):
take like the complete long shot onsomeone like Joe Milton on day three.
Yeah, and it's it's fun tokind of have these discussions. And we're
still far way out from even rookiecamp training camp, but it's really starting
to become real and and and forall of our audience who are big fantasy
players, I think some of theseinsights may give you a jump, especially
if you're in a dynasty league ofof looking looking forward to the to the

(57:29):
upcoming year. And so again Ijust want to say thank you to Underdog
Fantasy for supporting us. Use promocode sumer for one hundred percent match on
up to one hundred dollars. Let'smove into kind of the nuts and bolts
of the teams before we kind offinish off with a with a quarterback conversation.
Tayge, what are some teams thatyou thinks you know situation may be

(57:51):
changed after round one or in agood position to make some moves today.
Yeah, So the one I reallywant to talk about is the Chargers,
and you touched on this earlier inthe show, but like I think,
think we can really go into detailhair when you look at the Chargers and
what they did taking Joell at numberfive overall and kind of like how they
can shuffle some of their offensive lineto get up to having a top ten,
maybe top five O line in theNFL. That works well if you

(58:15):
supplement that with a wide receiver atthirty seven today. Because we talk about
positional scarcity after the first round,there's a pretty significant drop off in tackle
talent. I think, you know, there's there's a little bit of tackle
options today, but clearly not asmuch as it was yesterday. There's so
many wide receiver options today. Youknow, we went through a lot of

(58:37):
them earlier. And like, Ithink that if the Chargers do end up
taking a receiver today, I cansee their vision for their decisions. Obviously
I still would have gone with thebleak Neighbors because I was that high on
him as a prospect. But maybeyou say, like you're getting you know,
sixty percent of Molik neighbors Is productiontoday at thirty seven, and you're

(59:00):
getting one hundred percent of the tackleproduction, Whereas if you flip that,
Malie Neighbors obviously gives you one hundredpercent of the receiver production or ninety five
compared to Marvis and Harrison Junior,but like you're only getting forty percent of
the tackle production that you would havegot in So so maybe they're they're kind
of playing that that that positional scarcitycard today. So that's definitely one I'm

(59:20):
gonna watch. Another team that thatI really have my eye on today is
the Cardinals, you know, andwhat they're gonna do on defense. I
think the Bears are also in thisboat. Both teams walked out with very
high end wide receivers last night,but still have needs at at edge and
at defensive tackles. So I thinkI think, you know, maybe they

(59:43):
maybe the Cardinals go with another edgehere because they got someone in Darius Robinson
who can kind of play both,and they signed two defensive tackles. I
think the Bears could go either optionas well, because we know Matt Eberflus
really wants a three technique that hecan work with you know, I still
think that they could add one moreedge to supplement Montes sweat on the other
side. So those are also teamsI'm watching to take defensive linemen today,

(01:00:06):
right. I love that you bringup that tackle point because you look at
kind of the scene today and there'sreally only one great tackle of note that
is still available. That's Kingsley sudManta and and there's there's not a lot
left there, you know, butthe wide receivers which we've kind of labored
over over today, which is reallyexciting I think for some of our audience

(01:00:29):
who's who's involved in fantasy, areinvolved in betting, and there's a lot
of odds that that that that thatBen went over, But you're really kind
of stuck with a prospect. AndI helped cover for ESPN seven hundred.
It's been check. It's out therein Salt Lake. You know. Kingsley
Matia is probably a two three yearproject where Joe alt the numbers, the

(01:00:51):
combine. Uh you look at kindof his full profile and he really fits
in probably today one starter. Andso Ben, what are what are your
kind of thoughts on on where teamsmay go with some of these positions and
maybe there's trade backs. What areyou kind of expecting from today? Yeah,
I think in a lot of wayswe do. We do project,
you know, the the trades tohappen, I would say, more so

(01:01:13):
than what they're actually going to tome, the development of trades from actual
NFL players, I think is goingto be the thing that might surprise people
and probably going to be like themain talking point as far as like what
NFL players are getting traded for someof these draft picks, how does that
kind of develop? But I doagree with Tage's point, like we all
understood the depth that the wide receiverposition and I do. I don't want

(01:01:37):
to say I completely agree with theChargers going in the direction because I do
think Joel was is in a lotof ways. You know, the quote
unquote generational type at left tackle position. Moving them to right tackle is obviously
a question. But I do agreelike with how the scarcity at each position
was going to play out, Thispath for the Chargers is becoming more clear

(01:01:58):
to me than what it was evenYes, yes today and and I do
definitely agree with it, So Ithink it'll be interesting. I do think,
you know, obviously the premium positionscome off the board relatively quickly.
I do agree that we are goingto see non premium positions have some some
sort of sway in how this secondday of the draft plays out. But
I still think, you know,the guys that we see come off board

(01:02:21):
in the second round are going tohave that athletic upside type profile if they
are at a premium position, forsure. Right and and and so we
kind of touched on it. Ithink we've done a good job of summarizing
what to expect for the teams,and so let's let's kind of move into
kind of our our final segment here, and that is focusing on the quarterbacks.

(01:02:43):
We've done a lot of focusing onthe quarterbacks in the pre draft.
Of those top quarterbacks, they're allgone. Now I'm excited to spend a
little more time on this. Anotherquestion from ASA, which will start with
the rat Pack. I think allthree of us enjoy Spencer Rattler and think
that he made kind of the JalenHurts Dak Prescott of this class. I
think there's a lot of names onhere that could be in that mold.

(01:03:06):
You look at Michael Pratt obviously,I've been around very closely, has an
NFL profile. You look at JordanTravis, who who I've talked about in
some of the podcasts, in thatin that Florida State team, which I
think maybe like you know, theVillanova that we saw play last the Villanova
quote unquote team we saw with theKnicks, now that that is playing where
it's a bunch of guys who arewho are people we're low on and then

(01:03:29):
all of a sudden they're all NFLguys. You have Joe Milton, who
obviously is is almost kind of likeJaMarcus Russell light where we didn't really see
a lot of things in college,but he has the booming NFL arm and
the booming NFL prospects. And solet's start with Spencer Rattler. Tage,

(01:03:50):
what do you think the best spotfor him is and how early do you
think he goes? Yeah, soI think when you look at this quarterback
class, you look at every singlequarterback that's going to be taken over the
course of this weekend, if theyall hit their fiftieth percentile median outcomes,
Spencer Ratler doesn't really become much inthe league, right, Like I think
maybe he's a backup, he kindof moves around. If they hit their

(01:04:10):
eightieth, eighty fifth percentile outcomes allof them, Spencer Rattler might be the
QB three QB two in this classjust because, like he would have so
much talent and his arm strength andhis ability to maneuver the pocket is like
something that it's much harder to developonce you're in the NFL. So,
like they if he hits his highend outcome, that high end outcome is

(01:04:32):
a lot higher than I think,you know, someone like Michael Penicks or
Bo Nix would would have just becauseof the tools that he has available to
him, being a five star recruit, overcoming some of his offensive line woes
and scheme woes last year. Sothat's why, like I'm excited about him
if if a team like the Ramstakes him, I think the Rams would
be perfect for him because he cansit behind Matthew Stafford for a year or

(01:04:56):
two, he can really learn agreat offensive system from Sean McVay, and
then you'll have him step into asituation where he'll be throwing to Poqua Nakula
and you assume that the Rams willladd weapons over time. They obviously made
a lot of investment in their interioroffensive line this year, and I don't
know if if Matthew Stafford at hisage can play a full seventeen like he

(01:05:17):
used to be able to when heplayed basically every game from twenty eleven until
twenty nineteen for the Lions, wherehe did miss a couple of games.
Last year, Rams offense was awfulwithout him, so you really saw his
impact. So maybe Rattler can comein those games and at least, you
know, give a little bit ofover half of what Matthew Stafford provides to
the Rams right now, right that'sgreat insight, and I think there's talking

(01:05:41):
about this kind of accumulation of quarterbackcapital. If the Rams are able to
add someone who they like, andif that person is a Rattler or a
Proud or someone like that, isit's going to be very interesting to see.
You know that pukuin Nakua, KirenWilliams. They have kind of the
build and they have definitely the coachwho we've seen developed Jared Golf. We've
seen when a suit poer bowl withwith matt Stafford. I think there's a

(01:06:02):
lot of good situations that are possiblyout there in that vein Ben, what
are what are your kind of thoughtson where some of these quarterbacks may play
out? And and how is adeveloped situation? Is it a start now
situation? I know we had Seanin here saying that you know, Pratt
gives the Giants as good, ifnot a better chance than Daniel Jones in

(01:06:26):
twenty twenty four. Is that somethingyou agree with? How do you think
it plays out? I think it'sa good question to me. I would
want to see it in training campin the preseason before really making that sort
of decision. But I do thinkit's a reason why you should get the
guy in the building, right ifI have any any of those thoughts in
mind, Like, that's a reasonwhy you should go up and draft him.
So I do you know, goingback to it, I do think

(01:06:48):
the Giants with Michael Pratt in particular, are a really good fit, a
fit for me for Spencer rather,I think it kind of going to your
team, Sam is the New OrleansSaints and pick forty five basically, like
I think obviously Derek Carr is inthe building right now. What he provides
to the Saints is you know,still in some ways up in the air,

(01:07:09):
but I think they have intriguing pieces, you know, offensively, Chris
Alave seemed, you know, maybetook a little bit of a step back
last year, but in his rookieseason looked like he could easily develop into
one of the best ride receivers infootball. I think Rashid Shaheed as well,
like deep receiving threat, could bekind of a perfect compliment with the
Spencer rather in that sort of offense. So I think, based on just

(01:07:30):
like team need where they sit atin the NFC South as well, I
think taking a shot on Spencer Ratleris going to provide one of the best
situations for him to develop into atleast a somewhat productive, longer term starter.
So I do think the New OrleansSaints, you know, I think
it's pick forty five that they havetoday. It is very much like the
spot that I would be looking forwith Spencer Raley to come off the board
early in day two. Right now, especially, they're bringing in a new

(01:07:54):
offensive coordinator Klink Kubiak, and youhave Derek Carr kind of locked up for
you know, two three years nowthat there's a restructure. That's the expectation,
at least it could be very similar, you know, to where the
Falcons are now that they have Pinnix, except you use that two to two
day two, day three draft capitalon or second or third round obviously in

(01:08:17):
day two and there's less of youknow, the media pressure which people say
they ignore but definitely does make adifference in the decision making to play that
guy immediately. And then even tothe point, you know, Jordan Love
was a late first round draft pickand there was still even pressure there.
But you know, they have JayCayner in the building. This is something

(01:08:38):
that they've done the drafted a Ianbook years ago with the with the Saints,
and they've typically had pretty good backupquarterbacks in the in the building and
it's not been looked at the threador a major media issue. Sad James
has left, but but hopefully hegoes to greener pastors and at the Brown.
Yeah, if if Spencer Ratler cancome in and give the just sheer

(01:09:00):
vibes and just here quote culture guyto be in the room and you know,
preach into the choir, fishing andthe Gulf and all that stuff.
Spencer Ratler may become my favorite player, but it'll be it'll be interesting to
see how the Saints play out andso to kind of in this segment,
guys I've lived, I've listed outsome of these names, you know,

(01:09:20):
Spencer Rattler, Michael Pratt, JordanTravis, Joe Milton, maybe even a
Sam Hartman, maybe someone we haven'teven considered yet. If you're a dynasty
player and in a in a toughleague, who is someone you're keeping keeping
an eye on as someone who maybe an impact player this year or in
the future in that dynasty league tation. That's that is a really good question.

(01:09:44):
I think it's Jordan Travis. Erichas talked about him before too on
on some of these other shows,Like I am a little surprised no one's
talked about Jordan Travis this entire draftprospss or process. I get. You
know, I love your analogy aboutabout Villanova and like now we see it
with the Nova Knicks and how wellso many of those guys have done from
in basketball. And when you lookat at Jordan Travis, like highly productive,

(01:10:08):
pretty athletic, you know, obviouslycoming off a major, major injury
and then that might be affecting him. But like it is a little strange
that someone that led a Florida Stateteam to an undefeated season and you know,
unfortunately didn't get to see the endof that. Like it just hasn't
been talked about in this draft.So like, that's someone I would look
at as someone maybe who could comein and be like a Toushbush guy for

(01:10:30):
a team where you know you're maybegetting half a rushing touchdown from him every
week or something like, I thinkhe'll be really interesting to follow in this
draft. Joe Milton. Again,like if everyone hits their median outcomes,
he's probably not gonna last in theleague that long. If there is a
scenario where he hits his ninety fifthpercentile outcome, you are looking at at

(01:10:51):
a at a top end quarterback inthe league. It's just that window is
so small for him. It's sonarrow because of how poor his accuracy is.
But he obviously has all the talentin the world. So maybe a
team, you know, I thinkthat was just to me on Twitter by
someone was like, maybe the Chiefstake him in the sixth or seventh,

(01:11:11):
try to develop him a little bit. You play like a Week eighteen game
when they've already locked up their seed, and like they try to flip him
for like a third or fourth,like maybe that's an option. Like I
don't really know where a good spotfor him to go would be because he's
like probably not gonna be starting,but like it'll be interesting to see how
the league views him, Yeah,for sure. And and Ben, what
are your thoughts about what kind ofthe best players are there? Yeah,

(01:11:33):
I think I think for me,and especially if you're on a dynasty perspective
and you play you know, superflex basically so you can start two quarterbacks,
like you are very much gravitating towardsupside with some of your later dart
throws at the in the fantasy draft. And obviously guys like Joe Milton Spencer
Radley like very much going to bein that third fourth round of rookie drafts,

(01:11:56):
and I think there's a case tobe made for catering to upside in
those particular their situations. Obviously dependingon the situation that they arrive in,
but I think taking a couple ofthose dart throws is the correct approach to
me, I don't think there's likea ton else from this quarterback class that
could really have that sort of upsidecase to gravitate towards. I do kind

(01:12:17):
of you know, I do think, you know, Tage is kind of
along the light right tracks with JordanTravis. But to me, like there's
just not the upside case of himbeing a starter at the NFL level for
eighteen, you know, seventeen gamesa season of being you know, a
top twenty quarterback, and I thinkthere's at least a scenario where that could
maybe happen for both Spencer Rather andJoe Milton maybe, But yeah, that's

(01:12:42):
kind of my evaluation of I thinkif you just you know, along those
lines, going back to a guyto discuss earlier, but Jermaine Burton as
well, towards the end of yourdynasty drafts, I think is somebody who
could develop into a pretty decent NFLwide receiver and would be the spot i'd
gravitate towards with those you know,third and fourth round draft picks. Right
again, I think that's great fantasyinsight. For the final time. Just

(01:13:03):
want to plug our sponsor, ourpartner in this whole endeavor of being in
Detroit covering each analytical element of thedraft very tightly, and that's Underdog Fantasy
use promo code sumer s U ME R for one hundred percent match up
to one hundred dollars. And guys, now I'm going to do what I've

(01:13:23):
been waiting to do for about twodays, and that is just cut a
promo against New York Pizza in favorof Detroit Pizza. It's almost lunchtime.
You have New York. You haveNew York Pizza, you have the triangular
slice, you have the crispiness,and it's on every corner, but unfortunately
the quality is just not there.You get a great Detroit pizza in that
lovely square pan, and it's crispy, it's a little dowe, you get

(01:13:45):
that little spicy Detroit seasoning on it, great pepperoni cheese. You can't beat
it. And so, guys,the question to close this where are we
going to lunch? Buddy's pizza?But I mean the way that you've just
broke down the the two different typesof pizza, like the draft prospects,
this entire show. Yeah, now, I mean I wrote this where should
we go for lunch? In thedoc just because I was really hungry,

(01:14:09):
and now now I think I'm evenhungrier after hearing your evaluation. There we
have been on the grind, thedraft grind. I haven't eaten in twenty
four hours. Definite ready for yeah, and definitely for anyone in the audience
who may be in Detroit, whomay know Detroit. We are all.
We all love food or we allhave to have fun. If there's some
great things that you'd like to seeus go to and maybe we'll tweet about

(01:14:30):
it or something, let us knowin the comments, in the replies,
tell us what we have coming up, and we have more shows, tage
and tell us what we have comingup. Well, I think everyone should
check out what our colleague Sean Sayedis doing right now. Sure he's doing
five to ten minute hits with differentmedia or fans of teams all across the

(01:14:53):
league, really hearing their thoughts afterDay one and the draft what it can
mean for Day two. He wasphenomenal in the interview room yesterday. For
someone who was trained to be alawyer and for him to have as good
of a journalistic instinct as he doesis super impressive to me, you know,
I thought his content was awesome.And then we'll be back tomorrow really

(01:15:14):
recapping the draft. I think that'llbe a lot of fun to talk about
our winners of the draft. Youknow, I've definitely thought about that a
lot over the past couple of drafts, like how we want to sign winners,
whether it's analytically, whether it's anecdotally. I think we can do a
combination of both. So I thinkthat we can have a lot of fun
tomorrow night after the draft wraps up. We'll probably go live sometime during round

(01:15:38):
six, round seven and really justrecap some of our favorite picks, our
favorite drafts. Yeah, we're crossingthat our fifteen mark here. Guys,
if you're not following or subscribed tosumer Sports on YouTube on Twitter, make
sure you do that, because Ithink, obviously I'm biased hosting a podcast

(01:15:59):
and working with these absolutely brilliant datascientists and content contributors next to me,
and obviously Sean who's grinding right now. I think it's one of the best
views of really all sides of thedraft, as well as just some fun
and and and some comedy and somefun stuff that we're doing here. And
so subscribe, like follow all ofall the guys up here and Sean,

(01:16:21):
who's delivering some great content. Ericand Thomas did a great job yesterday four
hours. They hung in there likeprize fighters, breaking some some breaking down
some awesome picks. Obviously a hugethanks to our friends at Underdog Fantasy and
from Tayseep, Ben Brown, Sambrook House. Stay tuned. We will

(01:16:41):
be back, but thank you fortoday and we hope we helped you out
a little bit. Have a goodone.