The Truth | With Wil Wheaton | TNG 5.19, "The First Duty" | T7R #346 - The 7th Rule -- A Star Trek Podcast with DS9's Cirroc Lofton

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Captain Picard is delivering this year's commencement address to Starfleet Academy.
Wesley Crusher is allergic to me. Torah pan treatments and
weeds keep popping up in the pittosporum. Hello, everybody, Welcome
to the Seventh Rule with sar rock Loften.

Speaker 2 (00:15):
Hello.

Speaker 1 (00:16):
Hello, my name is Ryan T. Huskin. Today we're doing
a review of Star Trek the Next Generation season five,
episode nineteen, The First Duty, written by Ronald D. Moore
and Narren Shanker, directed by Paul Lynch. This was March
twenty eighth, nineteen ninety two. We have a very special

(00:36):
guest today. We are so fortunate and excited to bring
to you Will Wheaton. How you doing well?

Speaker 3 (00:42):
Hello, I'm great?

Speaker 1 (00:44):
How are you awesome? Before we get started, though, we
want to give a very special thanks to Ryan Galloway
out in Canada, our favorite Canadian, Ryan Galloway, for sponsoring
this episode. Ryan, you picked an awesome one. Thanks very much.
All right, this was ran right, Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:06):
This was my first time watching this episode. Well, I
thought you were amazing in it. I mean yeah, I was,
you know, was happy to see you. I love seeing
your storyline, but also just getting into Starfleet Academy. This
is like a real like peak into Starfleet Academy. This
is a peek into your character being a little bit fallible,

(01:27):
you know, and a lot. Yeah, and I and I
thought that the way you portrayed it really embodied the
kind of peer pressures that young people feel in certain situations,
whether that's like not to tell something or to withhold
information or to cover for a friend, and in the

(01:47):
dilemma at.

Speaker 3 (01:48):
The moment where you feel caught in between doing the
right thing and not letting someone down, and it's awful
when those two things are in conflict. I think that
is a very relatable experience for people in their twenties,

(02:08):
which I was when we did this. Sarah, gets so
interesting to me to hear you say that, and thank
you very much, and I appreciate your perspective. I'm really
grateful that you could see all of that. I watched
it this morning before we got ready to do this,
and I actually don't like my performance at all. I

(02:30):
feel like I am where Yeah, I feel like I
am wearing my performance like it's someone else's suit. I
see a lot of I catch myself acting all over
the place in this episode. And I see myself playing
like the same chord the entire time, and I couldn't

(02:51):
really understand why that was until you said, Ryan that
this was directed by Paul Lynch. Oh. I I yeah,
so I don't dislike Paulynch at all. He is the
director who Brent Spiner famously tells this story about. We

(03:13):
had a director who before every take, whether it called
for a lot of energy or not, would go.

Speaker 2 (03:20):
Energy, energy, energy, energy, every single take.

Speaker 3 (03:26):
Did you ever direct you guys?

Speaker 2 (03:28):
Yeah?

Speaker 1 (03:28):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (03:30):
Can you remember that from you when you're saying this
story and starting to recall different memories.

Speaker 3 (03:37):
Yes, I don't think this came from a place that
was not filled with love. Love for the craft, love
for making television, love for communicating and inspiring actors. It
just did not work for me. It was very distracting
to me. I've realized that I always needed a director

(04:03):
to just clearly communicate to me, this is what I
want out of this scene. If I don't happen to
get there and rehearsal or on one of the takes,
I kind of expect a director to just nudge a
little bit and keep me going. That's the way I
work as an actor. There are actors who don't need that,

(04:25):
they can do it all on their own, and I've
just had to accept that I'm just not one of
those actors. And he wasn't helpful to me as an actor.
And when you said it was done in nineteen ninety two,
I was either twenty or twenty one years old, depending
on what time of year it was, and I was

(04:46):
in a real bad place in my life then it
was real, real hard. I was kind of in a
place similar to where Wesley was. You know, we have
this episode coming up where Wesley's like, dude, starveling an
academy is extremely not for me. Being in Starfleet is
all kinds of what I want to do, and I
thought it was, but it's not. And I was in
that place as an actor. I was really really feeling

(05:06):
like I don't know that this is what I want
to do. And when I was there on the set
in nineteen ninety two, oh, the incredible amount of sadness
and deep, deep, deep regret I was experiencing that I
wasn't there every day and it wasn't my regular job.
To me, going back there felt almost like an admission

(05:31):
of failure. That like the career I had hoped to
have when I stopped being a regular just hadn't worked.
And at the same time, I was just so grateful
to be in so many scenes with Patrick. Oh my god,
that was great, and I clearly remember how fun it

(05:53):
was to work with actors my own age for the
first and last time on Next Generation. That was incredible. Ever,
Robbie McNeil was then and still is one of my
absolute favorite colleagues I've ever worked with in the Star
Trek universe. You know, I'm one of those people who

(06:14):
very firmly believed that Nick Loperno just changed his name
and became Tom Parrish because I think it's the same.
I think it's the same character that just didn't want
to pay a licensing Moore, which is kind of fucked up,
but it gave us that great moment in Lower Decks.

(06:35):
So anyways, just as I was watching this what I
wrote that, I was like, I'm going to keep some
notes here and just see what it is. And all
I have is Wesley is saying, Wesley is said, Wesley
is sad, Wesley doesn't like this, Wesley is sad, and
I'm just like, dude, act better. There's so much in
the script that I just missed. What I am hearing

(06:56):
from you this morning is hey, Will, you're literally the
only in the world who sees it. Everybody else this
other thing.

Speaker 1 (07:05):
Yeah, I don't know that.

Speaker 2 (07:06):
It's just that's why what you're saying is like so
much news to me, because you know, my pushback on
what your experience of watching it is is Yeah. I
felt as somebody who signed up for a small lie. Right.
It's like your buddy calls you and says your buddy

(07:28):
calls you and says, hey, if my girl asked, I
was at your house?

Speaker 1 (07:32):
Is at your house all night? Okay? Cool?

Speaker 2 (07:35):
Yeah, yeah done, And that's like that's like, okay, that's
that's the small lie you signed up for. And then it.

Speaker 3 (07:41):
beIN out he was stealing eleven cars.

Speaker 1 (07:43):
The police are at your house.

Speaker 4 (07:45):
Yeah, the police are knocking at your door, your your
wife is asking you about something, and now now you
have to Now every it's like it's too much, it's
gotten too big, and so it's like I felt that
I felt.

Speaker 2 (07:59):
Like, oh, here's Wesley. He signed up his buddies to
asking him to cover for him. The only person who's
really gonna get thrown under the bus is somebody who's
not alive anymore. So it's not like he's gonna be,
you know, that damaged by this small little lie that
we're gonna tell. And then the lie goes to his dad,
and then it goes to your mom, and then it

(08:20):
goes to Captain Picard, and now it's like and then
the Academy judges don't believe, and it's like it's it's
spiraling in.

Speaker 3 (08:30):
You're watching it fall apart in real time. You're just
like trying to keep all that wet sand in your
hands and keep it shaped in the ball, and it's
not happening. And that scene where doctor Crusher and Wesley
are talking, I love that. I love that scene too.
Gates and I loved playing that scene because we I've
told you this, I am so envious of the scenes

(08:52):
you got with Avery, because I just didn't get those
scenes with Gates as much as I wanted to, as
much as either of us wanted to. Yeah, I know
I love and trust and believe my children. I love
and trust and know the men I raised. I know
that one of the foundational pillars of their existence is

(09:14):
you always tell the truth. You always tell the truth
no matter what. And that doesn't mean just to other people.
You tell the truth to yourself. You and you listen.
And if I were Doctor Crusher in that situation talking
to one of my kids, I would have the exact
same thing, this completely objective, neutral sensor data from something

(09:38):
that was not meant to be watching. You clearly made
a mistake. It's not that you're lying. It has to
be that all of these things that never fail, that
are made by the never failed company failed And it's
a moment that I feel I, as an actor, missed.
I would have loved to have seen and felt more

(10:00):
how insanely guilty that makes Leslie feel. I wish that
I had. I wish that I had just given myself
more layers. It is a thing that I really really
see in the salon and to see these movements where
like damn you missed it, like good enough, But I
can see and listen. I have the benefit of now
being thirty one years older than I was when we
did that.

Speaker 2 (10:22):
Yeah, but all that I got to push back. You
mentioned my scenes with Avery, A lot of my scenes.
I'd have to convey whatever message you was in a
one word, in a one word line which would be
dead right, and it would be how you say, dad,
yeah right, yeah, dad, And that would mean that would

(10:44):
mean everything. It would be like Dad, you're pushing too much,
you're pushing up on me too far, or Dad, you
know you're crossing the line here, or Dad, I need
your help, and it could be multiple tones of that Dad.
And I thought you'd nailed it with the mom and
this one because you did say to her at that scene, yeah,
she was like, oh my god, no, I'm going to

(11:05):
call the academy. This is ridiculous. And you looked at
her like mom, and it was like you got like
put like back up, Mom, Like you don't know all
you don't know everything, right, Yeah? And I felt that.
I felt that in that I mean it was that's
how that's the moment where a kid has to like,

(11:25):
you know, kind of put the fire extinguisher on their
parents that's about to go balls to the ball and
say no, this is my kid and there's no way
and you're like, mom, like, don't try to defend me,
I think, or you say, don't try to protect me.
And there was a realization in her moment like oh,
I'm going too far because there's something he's not telling me.

(11:46):
It was a great parent child moment. Yeah, it was.

Speaker 3 (11:51):
I thought it was one of the best written that
Gates and I got to have for sure. There's a similar,
very brief moment in me in the scene with Picard
in his ready room, where I love the choices Patrick
made in this scene where he is, you know, he's

(12:15):
just giving Wesley a really basic lesson, right, he's being
his dad, right and talking to him like that, and
Wesley's and he's like, I can see that as a parent.
He's like, I'm gonna talk to my kid and get
my kid to like, hey, fan people, I'm not saying
Picard is Wesley's father, okay.

Speaker 2 (12:32):
But yeah, of course.

Speaker 3 (12:36):
And you're like talking to your kid and.

Speaker 2 (12:41):
The first place.

Speaker 3 (12:42):
You're gonna go is I love you, buddy, and everybody
fucks up, and it's okay, we're gonna get through this,
but you gotta do the right thing. And Wesley just like,
that's a test. And Wesley fails the test, and Picard
you can see him get disappointed, so he tries a

(13:03):
different tack, tries to bring him around that way, and
Wesley just like will not give it, Like will not answer,
and will not like, will not like, He's not gonna
rise to the moment. And that's what Picard loses patience
with him and gets mad. And you see that for Wesley,

(13:23):
he could live with disappointing Picard, he could live with
Picard never knowing the truth. He absolutely cannot live with
Oh he knows, he absolutely knows, and he's mad at
me about it. And now it's really and that's the
moment where Wesley, I think, decides, Okay, I have to
come clean. And it is one word when his Wesley's

(13:48):
entire everything changes and he tries to like he's been
trying to manage the captain, he's been trying to like
keep him he Wesley's been thinking about Nick and trying
to manage the captain and keep him away from the
scene of the crime. And in that moment, in that
one word, you see Wesley saying, I am in so

(14:12):
far over my head. I don't want to do any
of this. I desperately need your help. But you've just
yelled at me and you're angry at me. And now
I'm a twenty year old man and I'm prideful and
I absolutely am going to take that risk, I guess
I've kind of made my bed and I'm very uncomfortably
lying in it. And it all happens with just that

(14:32):
one word, and that.

Speaker 2 (14:36):
It's captain.

Speaker 3 (14:37):
He says at the end of that scene, he's like captain,
and in all of that is like I need help please,
like like like don't don't wrap me out, like like
you know, he's just like I'm so screwed, right, And
I I think that just this sort of reinforces what

(15:04):
you're saying. As actors, we can do a lot with
one word.

Speaker 5 (15:11):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (15:12):
Absolutely, And then let me piggyback on what you just
said about that scene with you and Patrick Stewart. It
gave you, It gave him the opportunity to give one
of the best monologues I've seen our speeches when he
defines what being a star Fleet officer is about, what
wearing that uniform really is about, and that is standing

(15:34):
for truth, right, and he talks about we're standing for
truth all kinds of truths, historical truths and scientific truth.
But he mentions that and it really embodies, you know,
one of the long lasting principles of what Star Trek
is about. So I thought that was an opportunity you
gave him in that moment, the opportunity in his scolding

(15:54):
of you, to actually lay out some of what we
watched the show for. It's like, this is why I
watched the show.

Speaker 3 (16:03):
Yeah. I love that he's telling you these are Starfleet values.
And it reminds me of a line in the pilot
when Q puts humanity on trial, and by the way,
it turns out that Q wasn't wrong. But there's that
moment right where Picard said, if you had earned that
uniform you're wearing, you would know these things. If you

(16:26):
had the privilege of wearing that uniform instead of being
a coseplaye dickhead, you would know this is how it goes.
You're you're not even you're not wearing a uniform. You've
got a bunch of spandex on you. It doesn't mean anything.
And for Wesley to hear that, that admonition and that

(16:51):
reminder that you're not just wearing a costume, dude, that
is a big, big, big moment for him. And I
think that in a larger character arc way. Now, I
didn't know this at the time, and I wonder if
Ron Moore knew this because he also wrote, I think
the title is Journey's End, where Wesley leaves with the traveler.

(17:14):
Ron had said, you know, I had been feeling for
years that Wesley wasn't a person who wanted to be
in Starfleet, and we had kind of seen that happen
over the years, and I thought this was a really
wonderful way to kind of like wrap up his character.
And I can see that a seed is planted in

(17:35):
this episode. I can imagine Wesley getting through all of
this and it's all, you know, when it's all done,
and Picard tells him like, look, you knew the right
thing to do. I just had to remind you or
whatever it is he says. I can see Wesley walking
out of that conversation and asking himself for the very

(17:57):
first time, do I want to wear this uniform?

Speaker 2 (18:02):
Yeah?

Speaker 3 (18:03):
Well, which is just such an ye.

Speaker 1 (18:05):
Sorry, go ahead.

Speaker 2 (18:08):
That's an interesting question. I never thought about the moment
after where once you know, Will walking away thinking yeah,
I mean I can understand that, does Wesley want to
be in starfle And you know, but obviously you excelled
really well because you made it part of the Nova squadron,

(18:29):
so you're in a high level we know that you've
served on the Enterprise, so we've seen you in motion,
and you know, I just think that you played this
great the moment where you talk about data and when
you find out data and the Forge we're working on
their data, trying to reconstruct the data, and you you
you kind of panic like.

Speaker 1 (18:51):
Oh sh like they're gonna figure it out.

Speaker 3 (18:54):
I'm extraordinarily out.

Speaker 2 (18:56):
Yeah, yes, wait a minute.

Speaker 3 (18:58):
Maybe I can go turn data off.

Speaker 2 (19:01):
Yeah, So the panic in your voice is great there.
I just felt like you were the lynchpin to all
of the scenes because there were great scenes and the
guest actors were fantastic. You mentioned Robbie McNeil, you meant
the woman who played the Admiral brand I thought she
did a fantastic job. The other cadets were great, and
so were the you know, the regular actors of course

(19:23):
Patrick Stewart. But the lynchpin of all of that was
your performance with each actor, and so we got to
see you you know, your vulnerabilities here, but you're also
protectiveness here, your defensiveness here. So you know, as much
as you think you played one tone, I think you
played several tones. And I actually saw the nuance there.

(19:44):
I saw you trying to be part of the group here,
being defensive here, being protective here, and then being you know,
exposed in some moments here and there, and then you
had a redemption quality. I wish that Picard at the
end kind of gave me more of a pat on
the back, like you did the right thing, type of

(20:04):
I'm proud of you type of thing for standing up
and saying that I missed that, And I felt like
it would have been a good push in the back
for your character to say, you know what, I did
do the right thing at the end of the day,
you know, and if the car could have said, don't
worry about this this will you know, you'll you'll go
on to to forget about this, uh, you know in

(20:25):
your career. I think he could have given a more
optimistic outlook for Will, for your character, for Wesley. But
you know, at the end of the day, he did
give that great speech, and I thought your performance was fantastic.

Speaker 3 (20:42):
Agree, I really appreciate that.

Speaker 1 (20:44):
And you know, I want to tell you very quickly
that we only have you for another minute here.

Speaker 3 (20:49):
Already got me as long as you want, I've got
nothing to do. You want to keep me a little
bit longer.

Speaker 1 (20:53):
We know Trek, But really, I mean personally, this is
one of my favorite and most iconic Next Generation episodes.
It's certainly my favorite Wesley Crusher episode. And I feel
like I first started watching The Next Generation in season five,
So I remember thinking, Wow, this Wesley Crusher guys awesome.
Maybe I said radical. Yeah, I was like, I Nova Squadron,

(21:16):
He's going to be a lieutenant one of these days. Wow,
it's so cool.

Speaker 2 (21:19):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (21:20):
So you know, I know we're all our own worst critics.
But before we go, can you tell us what you
hope people get from this episode? If there was one
wish you could have, what could what could be people's
takeaway from this episode?

Speaker 3 (21:34):
How you deal with peer pressure really really matters. There's
a lot of different lessons that we can take out
of this. We can look at the way Nick treats
Wesley and the other cadets and how he manipulates all
of them to try to save himself. That tells me
that Nick Lacarno's gonna would be a bad star Pleet officer.

(21:57):
He would he will never be the head of anything,
like the captain always takes responsibility for the entire crew
and if you're the leader of the squadron and your
choice is to let the tragic loss of one of
your friends be pinned on that person just to protect

(22:17):
your career because you're ambitious, it just says to me
like you're unfit. You're absolutely unfit for duty. And there's
a real important lesson there about when you are given
a leadership position, what do you do with it. You
see Picard's leadership encouraging Wesley to tell the truth. You

(22:40):
see Wesley's eventual leadership wrestling with this very difficult choice
that he has to make where he knows what the
right thing to do is, but he just feels like,
I'm going to disappoint somebody here. Who's it going to be?
And what kind of disappointment can I live with?

Speaker 2 (23:01):
Yeah?

Speaker 3 (23:02):
I think this is very much about the choices we
make and the long lasting consequences of those choices, way
beyond the immediacy of what is happening like immediately after
the choice is made. And in a meta sense, I

(23:24):
think it's a terrific reminder and it serves this way
for me as a person as I look at the
way my life mirrors Wesley Crusher's life, right where we're like,
we both grow up thinking this is what we're meant
to do, and then we get to a point where
we're doing it. We just doesn't feel right. It's not
really what we want to do. And then there is

(23:45):
an opportunity to wildly change directions and go after what
feels right to me, not what I've been told is
right for me. You can see that in this moment,
and then it finally pays off in You're. As I said,
I could talk about this forever and ever and ever,
and I know I'm not the only person you're talking to.

Speaker 2 (24:06):
Today, So we would love to have you.

Speaker 3 (24:11):
Any time, buddy, any time. It is it's it's absolutely,
it's always rockets, always my pleasure and my privilege to
sit down and talk about this with you. And I
never feel like we have enough time.

Speaker 1 (24:25):
You give the most thoughtful answers to I swear it's awesome.
We asked you a little question. There is one let
me tell you.

Speaker 3 (24:31):
There's there's wait, wait, there's there's there's one thing that
I put on my notes that I really wanted to
call out because I thought it was a lovely, lovely,
lovely moment that I had missed every other time I've
seen this episode, I thought it was wonderful that Picard
has these scenes with booth b where he is like

(24:53):
kind of trying to get both be to sort of
like just talk to me about these kids on campus
right now. And what Boothbye is essentially saying is you
already know the answers to all of this. It's always
the same. This is where you are at this moment
in your life, and these kids are no different from you.
Love that Booty calls Picard son. He talks to Picard

(25:20):
like Picard is still that kid who knew Boothbye however
many years ago, And god, it was this beautiful moment
where we get to see Picard, who is always larger
than life, who is always on a pedestal, who is
so much taller and bigger than all of us. It
is this moment where Picard is like with the guy

(25:43):
who knew him before and doesn't have to do any
of this right, and he's like, dude, I remember when
you were so wasted under this tree and they couldn't
find your shoes and you were so worried that you
were going to blow that tag and I helped you
out of it. Like, I don't even want to tell

(26:04):
you how many times this pressure kid has just gotten
out and got out and gotten wrecked. I've lost his
way back to the dorms. I loved that moment, and
I loved that it just going back to nineteen ninety
two and episodic storytelling moments like that build the background
of our world in a way that we didn't get

(26:26):
to do that an ongoing storyline does today. And I
just really love that moment. I thought Ray Wilston was fantastic.
We were so lucky to have him for the episodes
that that we did. He was lovely too. I was
so intimidated by him that I literally just showed up
and shut up and just did my line. And when

(26:47):
I had sees it and I did not try to
engage them in conversation. That would have been like.

Speaker 2 (26:51):
So heay on my favorite merchant, did you listen to
joy division?

Speaker 3 (26:56):
Make sense?

Speaker 2 (26:57):
Right?

Speaker 3 (26:57):
And it doesn't make any sense at all?

Speaker 6 (26:59):
Right?

Speaker 3 (27:00):
I even just Transformers, like, I don't know you do
the things?

Speaker 7 (27:07):
Yeah, it was it was.

Speaker 3 (27:09):
It turns out that Ray Wilson's Transformers.

Speaker 2 (27:13):
Another another great performer in this episode. I mean, this
episode had a lot of great guest stars that delivered
on this episode. I thought they were just phenomenal. I
love the cadets, I love uh the judges, you know,
and and like you said, Ray Wilson was amazing, totally.

Speaker 1 (27:32):
Well, will this has been.

Speaker 3 (27:33):
A special feature. I'll just tell you, I don't know,
you're trying to get rid of me, and I'm gonna go.
There's a special feature on the Lower Decks DVD set
where we do it's it's in Uh. There's a flashback
to the Academy where we find out that Wesley and
Mariner were at the Academy together and marriage was just
totally a nerd and like him. And there's a really

(27:56):
funny moment like it's right more they're gonna go of
a Star Wars thing and they kid that place. This
is great.

Speaker 1 (28:08):
They cut that out.

Speaker 3 (28:09):
Anyway, they got Robbie and me and Shannon Phil all
together in a group chat to talk about working on
the First Duty. So if anyone wants to hear more
about this episode, track that down however one would go
about doing. And I think that I really think that

(28:30):
you'll enjoy it.

Speaker 1 (28:31):
Wow, that's definitely something we'll thank you well, thank you.
This has been the coolest thing ever. We really appreciate
you and your time and your incredibly thoughtful answers. Well,
thank you so much. Everybody stick around, you know we
got way more for you. We'll be right back on
the Seventh Rule. Hey, everybody, welcome back to the seventh

(28:54):
Rule with Sarrock frickin' lofton. Hello. All right, here are
the trivialids of the week. People have been clamoring for them.
Captain Picard is delivering this year's commencement address to Starfleet Academy.
Having a Vulcan superintendent is like having your parents around
all the time. Wesley Crusher is allergic to Mematorapan treatments.

(29:17):
Wesley's arm is a little sore. Captain Picard caught a
Ligonian with the reverse body lift and pinned him in
the first fourteen seconds of a match. Wesley went to
Calgary with Joshua Albert and weeds keep popping up in
the pitasporium. Oh and a lie of emission is still
a lie, all right, lots of good stuff there.

Speaker 2 (29:37):
A mouthful right there.

Speaker 1 (29:39):
Okay, I know, a lot of weeds in the pitasporium
always that is just a problem. Okay, So as I
may have mentioned in the first segment. Who knows, I
do remember this episode very well, but this was your
first time watching this episode. I really feel feel like

(30:00):
I first started watching Star Trek the Next Generation in
the fifth season in syndication, you know, like whatever was running,
it was in the fifth season when it was running,
because these are all episodes that I remember watching. These
last handful of episodes were the ones that I remember
watching as like the first episodes, this one Cause an
Effect and Conspiracy, No Conundrum, the one where there's like

(30:26):
the imposter guy. Anyway, So this is a very memorable
episode to me. I know, it's one of the episodes
that people talk about a lot. What do you think
about it?

Speaker 2 (30:38):
Well, you know some of the thoughts that I got
because I'm watching Star Trek and reverse having watched each
Base nine first and now going back to Next Generation.
It's interesting what correlates with my mind? And this made
me think of the Red Squad Valiant episode of Me
to Base nine and amazing right.

Speaker 1 (31:01):
Similar name right right Squad Nova Squadron, I get confused.

Speaker 2 (31:07):
So it was actually it brought me back to that,
you know, just the idea of an elite group of
Starfleet Academy students that have essentially broken off to do
something on their own of some sort right to take
initiative on their own because they have this status of

(31:29):
elite you know, qualifications, and because of that, they also
have arrogance, right, and the arrogance that causes them to
make miscalculations in bad judgment calls, you know, And I
feel like, wow, this felt like a little bit of
the Red Squad episode. And also in that episode, Nog

(31:53):
was conflicted with the you know, having to choose between
his allegiance to the squad right and his allegiance overall
to me, his friend, and you know, his other family
and what.

Speaker 1 (32:09):
He believed to be right right.

Speaker 2 (32:11):
So here here it goes this episode, and I thought, well,
Wheaton did a fantastic job of playing the note of
the conflict, because I think that's something that maybe is
more often experienced for young people who feel peer pressure,
maybe more so than adults would, but it still happens

(32:33):
even in the situation with adults and co workers, and
you know, being amongst a group of like minded adults,
you know, if there's some kind of like code of
honor that we don't rat on each other we don't
dis we don't that, right, and you know, and there's
always that kind of code of conduct amongst any kind

(32:54):
of group that you see, right, there's some kind of
unifying factor that, hey, look, we stand on these principles
and you know, we don't do this to each other.
And so I felt like that was played heavily in
this episode and well done as far as the peer
pressure of kind of not trying to rat somebody out,

(33:16):
but also remain truthful to your morality and your upbringing
and what you are about, and so will lead. And
I thought did a fantastic job of like trying to
straddle the line of you know, basically having two masters.
You know, they say you can't obey two masters, right,

(33:37):
and so in this case, he had two masters. Picard
was his original, you know, sense master. And then here
comes this Nick Lucarno guy, who I really was endearing,
Like it seemed like he was a guy you would
like and hang out with. And he was just basically saying,
cover for me. It kind of you know, cover for me,

(33:59):
you know what I mean? And all of us have
covered for friends in different ways, you know, and sometimes
to our own detriments. Sometimes we cross our own principles,
and sometimes we have to tell a lie. But to
cover for a friend is kind of a normal thing
to do, except when it now has all of this

(34:22):
weight of consequence on it about you know, possibly getting expelled,
possibly getting reprimanded, and you know and finding your future
you know, slip away in front of your eyes. So
a lot of those things could be the consequences of
those kinds of decisions.

Speaker 1 (34:40):
Yeah, you know, I really love this episode too. You know,
I've seen it a bunch of times, and it's just
such a memorable and iconic Next Generation episodes. When I
think of Star Trek the Next Generation, this is one
of the episodes that pops up one of the ten
or twenty. You know, there's some real iconic ones, and
part of what makes this so good Number one is

(35:01):
the evolution of the relationship between Picard and Wesley Crusher.
It really has evolved, and it even gets highlighted when
Picard says, you know, when you first came on my ship, boy,
I was you know, yeah, and all that kind of stuff,
but also this moral, you know, play of do you

(35:21):
do what's best for not just your friends, but your team,
your unit, whether that's the Enterprise, you know, is you
know Captain Picard's face with that too. Do I save
the Enterprise and everybody on it? Or do I save
this planet and everybody on it? You know what I mean?
Like there you're always do you save that the group

(35:43):
that you're loyal to or the bigger picture, you know,
And so it has that kind of theme. But then
also what makes this episode really great is actually this
picture the guest stars. It's such a good guest star crew.
You know, like there aren't a you know, what was

(36:06):
her name, Jean something, Jeane Hajar right here. She doesn't
have that many lines, but you get an idea of
the kind of character she is. Cido Jackson, the Bajoran.
She doesn't have a ton of lines, but you get
a really good sense an idea of who she is
and what she's like. Nickolcrno has a few more. He

(36:28):
was such a good character played so well that Tom
Parris was based off of that on Voyager, and.

Speaker 2 (36:38):
I thought I recognized that guy.

Speaker 1 (36:40):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, So that is Robbie Duncan McNeil,
and legend has it that that is the character in Voyager.
But as Star Trek does you know there's all like
the rights to the writer that created it and this
and that they don't want to pay the royalties, so
they really I'm sure it was when it was originally written,

(37:02):
you know, the concept for Voyager, they said Nick Locrno,
Nicholas Carno, but then at the end, you know, they
changed the name. But that make no mistake. Tom Parris
is this guy. This is Tom Parris in Voyager that
it even picks up, you know, where he's been kicked
out a Starfleet academy. He's kind of shunned by by

(37:23):
the Federation and Jane Way wants to give him a
chance because he's the best pilot out there. It's this character,
you know, like.

Speaker 2 (37:29):
The through and that.

Speaker 1 (37:30):
So it's a really good redemption story for him, and
he plays it the same. It's it's that character, you know.
So we also no spoilers, but we may or may not,
in a future episode see another character from this episode.
So it actually really is a good touchstone or jumping

(37:51):
off point for a lot more of star Trek lore.
So it's just a great episode all around. I really
liked it a lot.

Speaker 2 (38:00):
Yeah, and I want to speak to the fact why
Robbie Duncan McNeil was, so you know why his performance
eventually led to the kind of you know, rebirth of
the character and voyager. And this is something that we
see on Star Trek. You know, we've seen on Star
Trek before with several other characters, you know, that have

(38:21):
become instrumental in developing future characters. I think Rollerin is
also one of those characters as well, right, kind of
same kind of thing. So and and I like and
what what I think lends to that because I've heard
this in the profession of acting before, just in just

(38:42):
in general and without Star Trek. Uh, you know, name
attached to it. A friend of mine was on a show.
Guest starred on a show. The show was called Family Matters. Okay,
and he gets starred in one episode.

Speaker 1 (39:03):
You are so right, Jalil White?

Speaker 2 (39:05):
Yeah, yeah, Jalil White, who eventually became Erkele, who eventually
became the star of the show Family Matters is Synochico brcle. Yeah,
But Family Matters existed prior to Rkele existing. There was
a Family Matters show.

Speaker 1 (39:20):
But he did this. He made the ratings go like that.

Speaker 2 (39:25):
Yes, he made the ratings go like that. He made
the executives go like that. You know, those sick situation
comedies are done in front of a life studio audience,
so you get to hear right away if the if
the audience likes it or not right, and aside from
laugh tracks, when they really really like it, you can tell,

(39:46):
and executives are always president there so they'll know, Hey,
this guy right here is getting a crazy response from
the crowd. And that happened to Julia White. After the
filming of that episode, they do like a curtain call
in front of the audience and the audience again went
crazy for his ercle character and performance. So what I'm

(40:09):
saying for actors is there's no small role. And that's
why when you do have an opportunity to get a role,
to guest star in something or to feature in something,
you have to make the most of that chance because
you don't know what that opportunity could possibly lead to
down the road. I'm sure, one hundred percent sure that

(40:30):
Robbie Duncan McNeill did not think he would be a
series regular on another show several years later. It was
a job, ye yes, yeah, because you go in there
and knock it out the park and you deliver such
a great performance like he did with this Nick Locarno character.
What I liked about his performance was that he delivered
it with a sensitivity that didn't make me hate him

(40:52):
and think he was a bad guy totally. I was like,
you know what, this guy's not.

Speaker 3 (40:56):
A bad guy.

Speaker 2 (40:57):
He's you know, he believes in his squad. These other
two people, the you know, Gene and Cido, they're willing
to go to bad for this guy. They think he's
just you know, they think it's worth going to bat
fo and so it must be something about it. He
seemed like a good leader. He gave words of encouragement,
He analyzed situations very well. When he talked about you

(41:18):
know what, the car probably gave you the speech about yeah,
you know, yeah, it was very good.

Speaker 1 (41:24):
Yeah good. And he walked the walk. He didn't just
talk to talk. When it was his time to sacrifice
himself for the good of the team, he did do it.
So it's one of those rare occasions where you know,
they they make it impossible to dislike almost the villain
type of character. He's almost like the antagonist character in

(41:47):
a way, but he ended up being almost the most
moral besides Wesley Crusher because he said, okay, let me
take the whole fall. I was their boss. They're only
following my orders. And you know that's a very redeeming
quality for him. And just to your point earlier, you're right,
that happens all the time. Like Roe Laren. Who's to

(42:08):
say Roe Laren was ever going to be more than
one or two episodes. Jeffrey Combs playing wayun remember he
was only supposed to be one episode, and Ira Stephen
Baerr of course, was like, what have we done? He
was so good and we killed the character. So they
just kept bringing him back. Like if you're so good,
make just be so. It's like a basketball player, right,

(42:31):
just be so good that the coach can't afford to
take you off. Yes, and that's what this is. Frasier.
There's a story about Kelsey Grammer, speaking of cause and effect.
Who he There's a story where he went to a
bar and he was super excited. He's like, I just
got a four episode deal on Cheers, Like not a
lot of lines, but he was gonna get four episodes

(42:52):
and that was gonna be like the big thing because
he's dating Diane. But they just kept bringing him back
bringing him back. Then he got his own show, and
then he got another one of his own shows a
little more recently. So yeah, it just it always happens
where if you're look at Chief O'Brien, same thing Chief
O'Brien was, he didn't didn't even have a name in
the first episode of the pilot episode. He was like

(43:14):
Battlebridge Lieutenant. I think his name was Battlebridge Lieutenant. And
then they just liked him so much they brought him back,
brought him back, and then made him a lead in
the next series.

Speaker 2 (43:24):
So yeah, I agree, And yeah, so make the most
of your opportunity. When you have an opportunity as an actor,
don't look at it and say, well, you know, I'm
not the star of the show, or I'm just just
a guest star role, or don't minimize whatever that thing
is because you don't know what it will lead to.
And not only that, but remember Ira Bear speaking of

(43:45):
Ira mentioned hiring actors from something they had He had
seen them do in something else all the time, and
you go and it might be the most obscure thing
you know, and here you are getting hired again based on,
you know, something else, And that's what.

Speaker 1 (44:05):
He got the job was because they saw him in
a play exactly exactly.

Speaker 2 (44:09):
So basically, always give me your best always, you know,
do your best to perform, and if you leave the
lasting impression like uh, these examples, you're going to get
an opportunity to shine, and you never know how big
that shining opportunity is going to be. Like in the
case of Kelsey Grammar, who totally turned four episodes into

(44:33):
probably four hundred.

Speaker 1 (44:34):
Yeah, and I wanted to point out Commander Albert. You
know that the dead guy's dad, he really had some
good moments, Like they picked a great actor for him
because I was able to feel his pain and his
shame and his you know, regret, Like through his performance,

(45:02):
he would just like look like a man that was
carrying this heavy burden of like oh, my son wasn't
good enough and he almost killed these other people, like
not only just losing his son, but also like, oh
my god, he could have killed more like that guy.
I felt so bad for that guy. Like this guy
is performing the hell out of this. They picked the

(45:25):
right guy, said shout out to that actor. Let me
get his name actually real quick. His name is uh
Ed Louder. Ed Louder, great actor.

Speaker 2 (45:41):
Yeah, he was fantastic, and the way the dialogue was
written for him was really great. You know, when he says,
you know, I'm sorry that he lets you down, he said,
you know, he tells, well, he tells crusher, you know,
I'm sorry that he lets you down, you know, And

(46:04):
I'm like, here, it is this guy lost his son
apologizing to the guy that's lying about it. And you know,
that also speaks volumes to what everybody wants in life,
and that is some closure, you know. And in this
particular father's case, the closure was going to be that

(46:24):
his son was negligent and the acting, you know, irresponsibly,
flying irresponsibly prior to that. So it would have been
a poor reflection on his end days, which made it
look like he was somebody that he wasn't, which was
not responsible or negligent or acting inappropriately or not capable

(46:51):
of you know, flying formations or whatnot. And so that
kind of thing would have reflected poorly on the legacy
of his son's life. And I thought that also kind
of had a tone that was highly emphasized when the
when the father apologized, because it showed that their father
had integrity, It showed that he came from a family

(47:14):
that had this kind of integrity that they were, you know,
willing to even apologize that there was a possibility that
somebody else could have gotten hurt, right, So that lets
you know the upbringing of this Joseph Albert guy. So
I thought that that was well written. Well, I did
feel the sensitivity of the moment by the father's portrayal.

Speaker 1 (47:34):
Yeah, and another great performance. They're just everywhere. This whole
episode is just great performances. And that's a big shout
out to director Paul Lynch, you know, to be able
to extract that, and to the writers Ronald D. Moore
and Narren Shanker who were able to you know, write
these words that that inspire these performances. But it was

(47:59):
Gates mcph as Beverly Crusher when she was kind of
in denial in a way when she found out that
Wes almost died, but she was he was okay, he
had some burns, he had a fractured arm, you know,
in a couple of places, and she just kind of
it felt so human of her to just say, oh,
he's allergic to this medicine, but they probably would end

(48:21):
up using this, but I better send them you know this,
and that it was just like, you know, she's almost
protecting herself by getting clinical, you know, and that is
so much more interesting writing than oh my god, Wesley,
are you okay, I'm so sad, I'm so scared. Like maybe,
I mean, that's realistic too, but it's much more interesting

(48:44):
to see somebody fighting their emotions and struggling with them
rather than just blurting them out, you know, like if somebody.

Speaker 2 (48:53):
Speaks to her level of professionals and what we've come
to know is her character. She's somebody who deals with trauma.
She deals in emergency room situations where you have to
be cool and level headed in the face of Gorey,
you know, things that you see, and I just think
it speaks to who she is as a character. Well
we already know that she is. I also thought she

(49:14):
gave a great performance when she had her moment with
her son and she was saying I'm gonna I'm gonna
protest this and I'm gonna do that, and Will looked
at her was like, h like mom, like you know,
don't do this, don't go to bed.

Speaker 1 (49:28):
That was a sting situation for him where he's like, oh, please, please,
please are just making me feel worse.

Speaker 3 (49:33):
Right, Yeah, He's like, well, please don't stop, and then
he says to her, don't try to protect me, and
she kind of looks like the look she has on her.

Speaker 2 (49:42):
Face is great. It's just amazing. It's like it's like, oh,
there's more to this than I think I know, and
something's wrong here, and it just was amazing how she
just the look she gave as a performer in that
moment I thought was fantastic. So yes, kudos to her.
This whole thing was great, great acting performances. I think

(50:04):
Picard was a fantastic I think, you know, Patrick Stewart
was amazing in this episode. I loved his I loved
his investigatory not moments. I loved his booth Be, Like
booth B was great, he.

Speaker 1 (50:17):
Was awesome too. Yeah, you know, such a great character actor,
that guy.

Speaker 2 (50:21):
That guy was amazing. I love the scenes with booth B.
And I loved when Picard actually showed some humility and
began to thank booth Be for the things that he
had said to him and the advice he gave them
while he was a student that he didn't appreciate at
the time because he thought he was a mean old man,
and I thought, that's that's great writing because that's kind

(50:46):
of the karmic cycle that Wesley is now caught into. Right.

Speaker 1 (50:49):
But the worst was when he said I was a
mean old man and I'm the same age that you
are now. Oh nobody was, because we know that when
we when we were we remember being kids watching a
show and be like, that was the old guy on
the show, and we're that age or older than the
old guy on the show. Nobody wants to hear that
mass Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 2 (51:11):
He got him right back with that. It was great.
It was a great come Back's great scene.

Speaker 1 (51:14):
And Boothby actually comes back for two more episodes in
Voyager actually as Boothby, so that's really cool. Very likable
and charming actor Ray Walston, who passed away twenty four
years ago. Actually, boy, how did he squeeze in Voyager?

Speaker 2 (51:31):
Yeah?

Speaker 1 (51:32):
I guess a couple of years before. So that was great.
But speaking of great performances, I think we are already
if you can believe that, Oh my god, the admiral
what was her name, Admiral Brand She did this amazing
perform like, not just the character she was playing, but

(51:55):
when she realized they were lying to her when they
said when he said like, I choose not to answer,
and she was just like like she almost had like
that quiver in her voice where she's like so mad
and so disappointed and so hurt and discuss that She's

(52:15):
just like man, I could feel it, I could hear
it in her voice. I was like, Wow, what an
amazing actress. Unbelievable.

Speaker 2 (52:23):
And when she was grilling you know, one of those cadets,
Jeane Arcito, I forgot and she says to her, I
didn't ask you that quite like like she gave me
an answer that I didn't. You know, you just went
off and flew off and just went off and gave
me an answer to something that I trying to excuse,
something that I didn't ask you about. So it looks

(52:46):
very guilty on your part. And Cita was like, oh shit,
I'm kind of you know, let me correct, yes, sir, No, sir,
you're right, sir, and and corrected the way she was
communicating the information. But yeah, I love the way the
admiral was like, hold on a second, I didn't ask you.

Speaker 1 (53:01):
That, unbelievable actress. I was like blown away by her
at first. I just thought, Okay, you know, standard hard
ass admiral character. But as the episode progressed, I was like,
oh boy, she's got layers in there. She's really good.
But speaking of all that, God and we could talk
about this episode forever. It's already time for the home
run of the episode. Good luck on this one, Sarrac

(53:22):
who gets the home run of today's episode.

Speaker 2 (53:27):
Look, I think everybody really is fantastic in this episode.
I'm going to give it to Will Wheaton. I just
think that, you know, he was the lynchpin of this.
He had to balance a performance with his mother, He

(53:48):
had to balance the performance with his cadet squad leader,
and he also had to balance his performance with Picard,
and I thought, and also be the judges that were,
you know, on trial. So I thought he gave such
a subtle nuance. Each one of them got a little
bit of Will Wheaton that was slightly altered for that

(54:12):
moment that I get that. It was just enough differences
there where he talks to his mom, you can see
in a different way he has the respect for Picard.
He looked at, you know, Lacarno as somebody he wanted
to be emulated, be like, but he also felt like
there was a character flaw in him because he was

(54:35):
willing to cover up so bad. So all of that
processing and uh, Wesley Crusher's head, I thought was done well.

Speaker 3 (54:43):
It was.

Speaker 2 (54:44):
It was amazing for me, and I think he deserves
the home run as the main guests are in.

Speaker 1 (54:50):
Yeah, I agree, you know that he's got an amazing
performance when I can't stop blathering about how many all
these guest stars are and he still is the easy
choice for me in a lot of ways, Like it's
just kind of like he just also had an amazing performance,
but he had a much bigger load to Carrie, So, uh, superstar,

(55:14):
maybe his best performance of the series possibly. You know,
they certainly gave him more to work with in this episode.
So definitely will Wheaton home run of the episode. And
here are some people that also know about performing Doctor Anne,
Marie Siegal, Eve England Out in Wales, Ivette Blackman, Tom TJ.
Jackson bay Out Missouri, Titus Moller, doctor Mohammad nor anil

(55:37):
oh A Lot Joe Balsaradi, Mike Goo, doctor Stephanie Baker,
Carrie Schwent, Faith Howell, Edward Foltz aka Crewman Guy, the
Matt Boardman, Chris McGee, Jake Barrett, Henry Hunger, Allison leech Hide,
Julie Manasfi, Jed Thompson, doctor, Susan V. Gruner. Who's gallivanting

(55:58):
around Italy right now? Glenn Iverson, Dave Gregory, Chris Sternitt,
Greg k Wickstrom, Cassandra Gerrard, Chuck A, Chris Garris and
of course Jason m oakin. All right, everybody, stick around
like Thorn Oakenshield of the Hobbit Lord. Stick around, everybody.

(56:20):
We'll be right back with the Free for All on
the Seventh Rule. Well, Hi, everybody, welcome back to the
seventh Roule with sarrock lofton. This is the Free for
All with Melissa Alongo Hello, Hello, and Jason m oakin
cool background.

Speaker 8 (56:39):
Hi, everybody.

Speaker 1 (56:40):
Eve England is back in town. Well her town, she's here.
Faith Howel is on the bridge of the Enterprise d.
Nineteen ninety seven. Altered Beast Champion Greg Kenzo is here.
It's a video game. Chuck A has the cool awesome

(57:02):
tons of stuff on his wall.

Speaker 3 (57:04):
Hello.

Speaker 1 (57:06):
Alison leech Hide sporting the acting Ensign awesome shirt. Carrie
Schwentz got an awesome shirt. Of her own aka Crafty Bear,
and Chris McGee reminds us to lay low and what
is the prosperous Okay, great walking out made by Melissa?
So is Greg Kenzo's all right? Jake Cisco guesses the

(57:27):
IMDb score.

Speaker 2 (57:33):
This might be like an eight point one.

Speaker 1 (57:40):
Does anybody else have any guesses that doesn't already know before?
I think this is the one. It's going to be
a tea. It's out there, seven nine in there eight

(58:01):
point five?

Speaker 2 (58:03):
Bate says a ten.

Speaker 1 (58:06):
I think you guys tickled all around the perimeter but
didn't quite nail it unless I missed.

Speaker 2 (58:13):
It, all right, it's nutty. What are we talking about?
Ryan numbers?

Speaker 1 (58:22):
What do we ever talk about numbers? Cold hard numbers
with a decimal point in between them.

Speaker 2 (58:32):
What's the number? Then?

Speaker 1 (58:34):
Well, the number is a seven point eight?

Speaker 2 (58:40):
Oh?

Speaker 1 (58:41):
Oh, I heard seven seven seven nine?

Speaker 2 (58:44):
Right?

Speaker 1 (58:44):
We were all over the place, all right? Oh? Did
we have any non appearance mentions? What do you guys
think of Joshua Albert as a non appearance mentioned? Because
did we see him in the Lower Decks episode?

Speaker 9 (59:02):
We did see him.

Speaker 2 (59:04):
Nailed it.

Speaker 9 (59:07):
I did a little digging. He didn't say anything before
he was there.

Speaker 1 (59:12):
Yes, yes, and that was an appearance non mention on
lower decks. Wow, that is a cool one. So let
me confirm that. Okay, even Jason's impressed by that one. Uh,
do we have any others? That was the only one
I could think of.

Speaker 8 (59:32):
There was one in the script that I'll mention later
that did not make it onto the screen.

Speaker 1 (59:38):
You mean like next week you'll tell us her Okay,
any some kinds of or some sorts of Chris McGhee.

Speaker 7 (59:49):
For the fourth episode in a row.

Speaker 1 (59:51):
No, all right, Well, Malisse Alongo, please get a start
off on the right track by letting us know what
you th out of this particular episode.

Speaker 9 (01:00:02):
I thought it was definitely higher than a seven point eight.
I was a pretty good episode. And I like that
they had doors that opened. Oh, I just noticed that.
I was like it, Well, he's opening the door. But
and we get our first look at the Japanese gardens,

(01:00:26):
and we get our first taste of both the woo.
They're so excited to see him. And I loved his
advice to Pocard because it felt like a passing down
of wisdom. So booth be In exposed her. No, I

(01:00:50):
losing the words gave his little kernels of wisdom to Picard,
and then Picard in turn gave his kernels of wisdom
to Wesley, which was wonderful. And I like that this
episode highlights how easily it is to get taken in
by someone who is charming and really nice, and even

(01:01:15):
the smartest people can be, you know, taken in by
a somebody who who may not have the best of intentions.
When there's many examples of this in the world, but

(01:01:36):
it's easy to do. And and I do like that
at the end, there was a twist to Nikolkrno's character
as far as taking responsibility for being the leader of
his group and and you know, taking the full brunt

(01:01:58):
of the punishment really and getting expelled. That surprised me
because when he was when he was talking to Wesley
and he said, I would take one for the team,
I would go down with the ship. I would I
was like, no.

Speaker 2 (01:02:14):
You wouldn't.

Speaker 9 (01:02:15):
And then I heard and then I heard that he didn't.
I was like, well, I'm so glad that I was wrong,
because you never know about people. And then my favorite
line in this was from Boothby when he said to Pocard,
what happened to your hair.

Speaker 2 (01:02:39):
Yeah, great, what happened to your hair.

Speaker 6 (01:02:54):
Anyway?

Speaker 10 (01:02:55):
Yeah?

Speaker 2 (01:02:56):
Picard didn't like that that much.

Speaker 1 (01:03:00):
It didn't laugh for some reason.

Speaker 2 (01:03:01):
I don't know, did.

Speaker 3 (01:03:05):
Well.

Speaker 1 (01:03:05):
Great stuff is always Melissa making us laugh, that's for sure.
Jason m oaken is here, no laughing aloud? What do
you got for us today, Jason?

Speaker 8 (01:03:14):
Well, I mean, you know, the First Duty is probably
the most grounded episode of the Next Generation, maybe the
most grounded episode certainly one of the most grounded episodes
of Star Trek literally because pretty much it takes place
on Earth. It's it's almost like a procedural that could
have been done outside of the Star Trek context. It
is something that relates and applies to everyday lives, and

(01:03:37):
I understand it's been used as a teaching tool in
terms of showing what you should do and and you know,
in honesty and truth in making hard choices. I mean
the fact that Wesley as a character has been put
in this position and is not sort of this for
the first time we see him as not necessarily this
pristine character, that there's certain shades of gray to him.

(01:04:02):
You know, does the character some you know favors, especially
you know, with the reputation that the character developed as
a regular end the series, and I think it certainly
gave Will Wheaton something to you know, something to chew
on as an actor, and I think he did a
marvelous job. I think it was again, visually, there's not
a lot here, so it's carried by the story. It's
carried by by the acting. And I think, you know, again,

(01:04:24):
Will Wheaton, Robbie, I think did a wonderful job, and
so did Patrick. There were a few choices that they
made that Patrick made that were a little bit different
than scripted, but they certainly came out on top. I'll
just give you one example. I mean, so the main
speech of the episode that comes toward the end, where
Picard basically lectures Wesley in your ready room about the

(01:04:45):
the duty, the first duty of every stuff for the
officer is the truth. The way it's scripted, Patrick's supposed
to come very close to Will and just almost whisper this.
That's not how it was delivered. It was delivered sort
of a powerful speech, and I think it's it's a
much better choice. It came off very well, and you
basically stop and you listen because the command in Patrick's
voice is something that.

Speaker 5 (01:05:07):
Captivates you.

Speaker 8 (01:05:08):
That's what, may you know, makes them such a great actor.
And it's a lesson I think that everybody should learn.
Sometimes we do have to make some very very hard choices,
and I think this episode stands out for that, and
you know, kind of overall, I think it's the best
use of booth b Frankly in the series. In Star
Trek he appears a couple of more times, but this
is exactly I think, Frankly, where should they should have

(01:05:31):
left him, because he's used to perfection. He's he's, he's,
it's you know, it's sort of how the next generations
he has used guy and in little sort of spots
where it belongs to kind of make a point too
much and it's way too much. But this is just right.
So it's a wonderful episode beginning to end. There's a
lot more to talk about, anything from those wonderful doors

(01:05:55):
to some things that didn't make it under the screen bill.
Save that for later.

Speaker 1 (01:05:59):
What keeping us in suspense a little longer?

Speaker 3 (01:06:02):
Even?

Speaker 1 (01:06:03):
Thank you very much, Jason m Oaken. All Right, Eve
England is out in Wales, she loves baseball and Barry Bonds.
What do you think of this episode.

Speaker 11 (01:06:13):
Yeah, I mean this was really really good. I mean
I just felt felt like I was the last couple
of episodes have just been pretty mediocre. I was getting
a bit fed up with some of the recent episodes,
but this one really really wasn't It just had jumped
out as being a much better episode. I mean it was.
It just shows how they do the sort of the

(01:06:35):
courtroom sort of morality play really really well. That's where
everything shines, all the different characters shine, the story, there's
sort of the ethics, all of that stuff just comes together,
and I just just thought it was a gripping episode.
You were just enthralled by it from start to finish.
As Jason just kind of mentioned, I mean again, similar point. Again,

(01:06:56):
it was really interesting to see Wesley in this shocking
city situation where he was involved in this cover up,
where he'd been this golden boy for as long as
we've known him, and I think it was just really
interesting to use this episode then as a sort of
showing how Wesley's kind of had to mature, had to
take a step back, look at his actions, take responsibility
for its actions, and try and make the right decision.

(01:07:18):
And then it was a perfect way, I think with
Booth b to bring Picard into it, because otherwise I'm
not sure how Picard coming into it would have kind
of worked in a sort of sort of seamless natural way.
But I thought, you know, the way that they used
Picard as this sort of father figure and guidance figure
for Wesley, and we sort of see that full cycle

(01:07:38):
of when he was first then and how we have
Picard at the start, and we all know how I
really hate to Picard at stuff. You know, he was
just shouty all the time. He was just well I think,
you know, he he has that tone and that sort
of really powerful speech, and it really that that's really
what I was expecting to see from Picard as opposed

(01:07:59):
to what we saw the starf He was just always
shouting at someone, and that just made it so powerful.
You know, his disappointment in Westley was just palpable and
that I thought that was a really really good scene
and I just it sort of brought everything to life.
One final point that I really found interesting is the
Lacano character. I found was interesting because, like Melissa said,

(01:08:21):
it was interesting. I wasn't expecting him to do the
right thing at the end and help his classmates, and
it was I just kind of thought it'd be interesting.

Speaker 3 (01:08:30):
Though.

Speaker 11 (01:08:31):
The question that we now get from lower decks is, okay, well,
what might have happened had Wesley not done the right thing?
What would have actually happened to Lacano then, because it
obviously spirals and goes out of control, whereas actually maybe
he would have ended up being I don't know or
whether his you know, his faults might have made him
not to be the sort of optimum officer ultimately, but

(01:08:54):
I thought, I think the Lower Dex episode has kind
of given a different perspective to his character than probably
what we come away from by just watching this episode.
But yeah, overall, I felt this certainly should have been
in the high eight or nines because it seemed to
be a really well contained episode based on what we've
seen over the last couple of episodes.

Speaker 1 (01:09:14):
Especially Wow, high praise. That's really cool. It's always great
to hear your perspective as a first time viewer. So
maybe that means, uh, this is an episode that deserves
a little more love nowadays, Thank you very much, Eve
England out in Wales. Faith Howell doesn't need to give
it more love. She's been telling us this since the
beginning of the season. She's like, you, guys, there's good

(01:09:36):
stuff here. What do you think of this one?

Speaker 12 (01:09:37):
Now, Eve, when you said the last few have been mediocre,
you're not actually watching all the episodes with us, right,
because this is like clearly the best season Golden Age.

Speaker 11 (01:09:48):
Well, what was expecting the last few have been I'm
not going to say what I what I was thinking.

Speaker 2 (01:09:55):
We need you back.

Speaker 1 (01:09:56):
I need to hear these opinions.

Speaker 3 (01:09:57):
Games said, you can argue about it.

Speaker 12 (01:10:01):
So yeah, again, I think this continues our streak of
fantastic fifth season episodes. I love how we basically have
Tom Parris's backstory in a nutshell. I know it's not
Tom Paris, but you know it's.

Speaker 2 (01:10:22):
I actually.

Speaker 12 (01:10:25):
Since you know, we're all going to say about the
same thing about how awesome this episode is. I was
watching after work, so I made sure I got it
in before the boys started jumping on me. And one
of my coworkers came in and she's like, oh, can
I watch it with you? And I'm like, oh, yeah,
of course, and so I did, like the last quarter

(01:10:46):
of the episode, so I had to back it up
and tell her explain how how it goes, and I
didn't realize how many plug points I had to go
into about the Maquis and you know, the beginning of
Voyager and all of the different things that this connects
to in explaining to her what's going on just in
this one little snippet of episode. So I really enjoy that.

(01:11:08):
And you know, we've got Pido Jackson introduced here and
just a lot of really fun things happening in this
episode beyond just what we see for this week. So yeah,
definitely one of my favorite episodes.

Speaker 1 (01:11:25):
Love it. Thank you very much. Faith how we can
always count on you to praise season five or almost
to the end of it, though unfortunately Greg Kenzo hates
season five. But what do you think of this episode?

Speaker 5 (01:11:39):
I definitely don't hate season five. There are pretty bad
episodes in it, but this one was amazing. I have
to say. This one was, like you said, a morality
play that was so well played, and it didn't come
off as a morality play. It was more like a

(01:12:01):
law procedural almost.

Speaker 3 (01:12:04):
You had.

Speaker 5 (01:12:06):
Wesley dealing with all these emotions. I do have a
couple of things I wanted to add because the philosophies
I took away. Our mistakes don't define us. Honesty is
the best policy, and the truth will out always. It
might not be when you want it to be, but

(01:12:27):
in the end truth Willow. I didn't always think this way,
and I think it's episodes that like this that made
me start thinking this way, you know, that taught me.
When I was younger, I was reckless like these cadets
in this episode, like the card used to be. I
think kids should actually make mistakes, not at the expense

(01:12:50):
of people's lives, like what happened here. But ego gets
in the way and makes us do crazy things, especially
when we're younger. Hormones and all that stuff. So my
hot take here is Locarno shouldn't have been expelled from Starfleet,
suspended for a couple of years, or maybe four years whatever.

(01:13:11):
I think what happens to Paris is what you know.
But it shouldn't take those circumstances for Paris's reinstatement. Like
an admirable father and you know Jane Way coming to
see Paris to get him back. It shouldn't take that
much for a good officer, you know, someone that's essentially
good at heart to get back into Starfleet. Forgiveness should

(01:13:36):
be just as important as truth, and that's our duty
should be too, forgiveness as well as truth. Yeah, so
Locarno uh deserved a little better. I think.

Speaker 1 (01:13:52):
Yeah, that is good stuff. Is that it is a
hot take. Thank you very much. Greg Kenzo out in Hawaii,
all right, Chuck a nowhere near Hawaii, but still chilling.
What do you think of this episode?

Speaker 13 (01:14:07):
Well, it was interesting the way the episode started, because
well they they were headed towards the U to Earth
and they were he was going to do the commencement
speech and then it turned into this another court room episode.
I really loved the the interplay with Admiral Brand and

(01:14:34):
Wesley and Beverly getting his mother getting back together and
trying to tell him everything's going to be okay, and
then of course Picard convincing him to uh to tell
the truth at the end the one uh I like,
Malise was saying, I really loved Boothby and his talk

(01:14:58):
with Picard and what happened to your hair deal? But
that was played by Ray Walston, who was the Martian
and my favorite martian in the sixties TV where he
was in the show with Bill Bixby of course Bill
Bixby went on to The Incredible Hulk, one of my

(01:15:20):
favorite shows.

Speaker 2 (01:15:21):
Of you know, of that era.

Speaker 13 (01:15:24):
And Ray Walston also had a movie career. I believe
he was in the movie Damn Yankees, which was like
a musical. But the the episode really came to the
point at the end where Wesley at the very last
second decided to own up on a on a mistake

(01:15:46):
and then uh, Tom Parrish, excuse me, Nick Locarno, uh
it finally admitted it at the end. So really one
of my favorite episodes, especially being one of the best
episodes when Will came back to the show.

Speaker 1 (01:16:04):
M great stuff there, Thank you very much, Chuck A
and the slip of the tongue. Oops, yeah, Alison Leech
hide is here in the heart of New Mexico. What
do you think of this one?

Speaker 14 (01:16:19):
I like this episode. It's it's a good story. It
is a good morality play. Everyone acts very very well
in it, so it's an easy one to watch. You
get sucked in, like you're like, okay, you know from
the beginning that Wesley is is kind of hiding something
when you know, when Beverly and Picard walk into his room,
because like he's not behaving like our Wesley and yeah,

(01:16:43):
his friend died, but he's not particularly behaving sad. He's
more you know, like, oh God, what have I done?

Speaker 4 (01:16:50):
You know?

Speaker 14 (01:16:51):
So I thought that was really well done. I have
a little nitpick that I'm sharing right now because it's
been bothering me since the start of the episode, is
why I did the superintendent called Pacard and not Beverly
when Wesley was I'm like, no, no, no, no, no, he's
not contact.

Speaker 9 (01:17:09):
That's the mom.

Speaker 14 (01:17:10):
So that's like that just put me on edge, Like
the like in the beginning, I'm like, why is she
calling up a card and going you're a family friend, right,
I'm like, no, call the mom. They could have just
switched those scenes around, like have the admiral call Beverly
and then Beverly go and tell Picard what happened, Like
should have been switched. So I had the mom hackles

(01:17:32):
raised right there.

Speaker 2 (01:17:33):
So I have to get that out.

Speaker 14 (01:17:34):
And I love that Beverly is like there for her son,
like we're going to fix this. This is great, this
is not the end of the world, Like you're okay,
yes it's sad, But also I thought her going, well,
you never lie I'm like, oh, well, now we know
he's lying because you just said it in the show.
And as as a mom of children, yeah, they are

(01:17:55):
going to lie at some point, but you're still there
to not because they're never gonna lie. You're there because
you're their parent and you want to help them through
a situation. So those are like my little nitpicks about this.
But it is very well acted. I barely took any
notes because I was just sucked into the story. So
never skip this one.

Speaker 1 (01:18:15):
Excellent as always, Alison Leech Hide. All right, Carrie Schwent,
you are on the bay at UH in San Francisco.
Explain yourself and how are you would you think of
this one?

Speaker 6 (01:18:29):
This is a fantastic episode. And I had it's it's
baseball season and the episode is set in San Francisco,
and I've been to the Giants Park, so I'm like, okay,
I know exactly what my background is going to be.

Speaker 2 (01:18:42):
And I love the coke bottle.

Speaker 6 (01:18:44):
Which night games is all lit up and there are
entrances inside of it. If he's even really close, there
are like slides for kids to slide down on, and
apparently they used to They told us they used to
let adults go down the side, but they don't let
adults anymore, so just the kids. Unfortunately, Earls, I probably
would have gone down that slide. But yeah, that park

(01:19:06):
is very very cool and we all know I love
but was a kusher. I am a member of the
unofficial you know fan club, and yeah, I love yeah what.
Wesley is a great character in this episode, in particular,
I know, shows that yes, he's he's smart, he's talented,

(01:19:28):
but he's also a teenager and like Alison was a teenagers,
you know, make mistakes. And my son, who's now twenty
fourth his his teenage years at about the age Wesley
is in this episode aren't all that all that long ago,
so I still sort of remember that, and that's what. Yeah,
this episode definitely hits differently as as a mom who's

(01:19:51):
yeah kid was was a teenager, not not all that
all that long ago. And you can see how she's
he loves her kids. So she's m desperate to the
point of almost from my perspective, guest lighting herself, like no,
you Yeah, she's desperate for any explanation other than that
her her kid lied. He doesn't want to believe to

(01:20:13):
believe it, But yeah, I thought I thought she was
the little peck on the cheek when when when she's leaving,
I just thought on his on his forehead, I thought
was just super super super sweet. And speaking of that
of that bedroom, like like Melissa was pointing out with
with with the door, it's a good thing Wharf didn't

(01:20:33):
accompany them to visit because as we all know, and
I've pointed out before, manual doors are one of Wharf's
myrtal enemies. They they flummoxed him every single time he
comes across one. I had to point it out, but
it wouldn't be me if I didn't gush on the
guest stars a little bit. The Vulcan Admiral. I recognized

(01:20:59):
he about twenty years ago. He spent a couple of
years on General Hospital and he's yeah, he was find
a fairly minor recurring role, but he was very very
good in it. And he is also in an episode
of My My Comfort Food television wise Gilmore Girls in
the fun, fun, little fun little Christmas episode, and we had,

(01:21:21):
of course are our beloved Robert Robert Duncan McNeil, and
this this past cruise, we finally got him on the
cruise and I was actually able to thank him in
person for inspiring the the idea to do the Who's
to start off with, and and.

Speaker 2 (01:21:39):
Now the Limericks.

Speaker 6 (01:21:40):
I've gotten to talk to Garrett about it a couple
of times, and I finally got to got to tell
Rob Robbie in person. So that was a great, great,
great moment for me. But yeah, I'm very glad that
they changed the the traits and and created Tom Parris, because,

(01:22:01):
as presented between this episode and in Lower Decks, Nick
Lacarno isn't necessarily someone I want around our Ballonataurres, although
if he tried anything, she would absolutely kick his fanny
all the way back to the Alpha alpha quadrant. And
also Eric noticed, because we watched the Lower Decks episode two,

(01:22:23):
the jacket he's Lacarano is wearing, there's a pattern on
it that is the pattern of the the starburst.

Speaker 1 (01:22:33):
Starburst.

Speaker 6 (01:22:35):
Yeah cool. I keep thinking I know how to how
to pronounce that word, and every time I try to
say it, I'm like, Okay, how do I say it again?
But yeah, and you've heard You've all heard me mention
the X a time or two. And the gas lighting
that Lacarno was shining all around at everybody is the

(01:22:57):
kind of thing. The other guy was very, very good.
It hit a little bit differently differently this time. Every
scene he's in, I'm like, just stop, Okay.

Speaker 2 (01:23:12):
Yeah, I don't. I don't like Lecarano at all.

Speaker 6 (01:23:14):
I love Tom Parris much much, much, much more. But
last one, I'll mention before I get which will lead
into the Limerick is Ray Wilson. I adore him. I
think he's adorably grouchy. Boothby is adorably grouchy. The character
he plays in the miniseries the original mini series for

(01:23:37):
Stephen King's The Stand. That character is a slightly lesser
degree of adorably grouchy. And I also remembered and IMDb
confirmed that he is in one episode of Ryan Can
you guess what? Show him about to.

Speaker 1 (01:23:52):
Mention, Yeah, you're gonna say doctor Quinn medicine woman precisely.
Oh my goodness, I must be psychic.

Speaker 3 (01:23:59):
I know, all right.

Speaker 6 (01:24:01):
That character, Yeah, that character, he's got a little he's
a little bit not quite dementia, but kind of something
similar to like Alzheimer's, and doctor Mike ends up helping him.
He ends up turns out he's the dad of the
guy who runs Runs Runs the Barbers up sweet sweet character,
but yeah, right is adorably grouchy. And when I pointed

(01:24:24):
out to to Eric that he was in my Favorite Martian,
he had the same look on his face, Ryan, that
that you had when when when when Chuck Matcha did
he goes, Oh, yeah, I've never watched my favorite Marchion,
but from what I've heard it's it's a fun show.
And I think I saw Peacock ads it, so I
might get around to watching that every now and then.

(01:24:47):
I've got one thing for things left unsaid. But obviously
for the Limerick, I had to go with with Boothby
and his awesome sagely wisdom, and he's like the bartender
of Starfleet Academy. Every goes to him for advice, So
here it goes. I do so much more than just

(01:25:08):
ten the grounds. There have been many of whom I
am proud. A few just needed a nudge. It was
not my place to judge. I help them see the
right path can be found.

Speaker 1 (01:25:21):
Great, beautiful, Thank you very much. Carrie Squint aka Crafty Bear.
All right, dark lord Chris McGee is here, lay low
and prosper. What'd you think of this?

Speaker 2 (01:25:31):
One.

Speaker 7 (01:25:33):
Well, I agree with everyone else. This is a fantastic
episode and it's an important keystone moment in the next generation.
But I won't say any more about that. I'm sure
everyone here and those watching and listening already know by
now the story of how Nicholas Krno character was originally
slated to here on Star Trek Voyders, so I won't
retell that story. It's a good thing mister Lecarano doesn't

(01:25:56):
reappear as a super villain in a later Star Trek
show or anything. Like everyone else, I thought it was
interesting that the dormitories don't appear to have the budget
for automatic sliding doors, and after hearing about Boothby and
last season's episode Final Mission, we finally get to see him.
Turns out he's sort of like the Guynan of Starfleet Academy,

(01:26:17):
the card is really lucky, and that he's befriended two
wise old people. We did get a brief Jay siding
in engineering, hooray. And I have a couple of quotes
from Nicholas that stood out to me. At one point
Nicholas the Carno, that is, at one point, Nicholas says
that all of the flight recorded data they recovered was

(01:26:38):
before the collision. Well, yeah, I would imagine the data
after the collision, if it even survived, would be kind
of pointless, wouldn't it. Maybe not, I don't know. Then
later on, Nick says to Wesley, we have to hang
on just a little bit longer. Then this will all
be over. What he fails to account for or is

(01:27:00):
that Wesley's relationship with the car, Jordie data and even
his own mother would be irreparably damaged and a guilty
conscience will never be over. Lacarna even says that he
has no moral difficulties about it, which just goes to
prove that he's a high functioning sociopath. The memorable quote

(01:27:21):
of the episode it have to go with Boothby. Of course,
on this one, you knew what you had to do.
I just made sure that you listened to yourself.

Speaker 1 (01:27:32):
Excellent, So good that the card repeated it later. Great stuff.
Thank you very much, dark Lord Chris McGee, we are
also joined, Thank goodness, Southeast Texas own Chris Garris, what'd
you think of this one?

Speaker 9 (01:27:46):
Oh?

Speaker 10 (01:27:46):
This is one of the best. This is one of
the great episodes of the series, especially if season five,
you know it. You know, it's hard to see Wesley
be to lie because you know it's Wes. I know
we're talking. He doesn't lie any but he's he was,
you know, he's like a young man. So but it

(01:28:09):
is hard to see that he actually went along with
Nick's you know, scheme, and that it took Picard to
finally basically beat you know, not beat about beating about
on him, but you know, really brown beat him and
make him honestly, just make him feel like crap too,
to finally confess, you know. But also I still want

(01:28:34):
to know. I love the banner at the beginning between
Ryker and Picard when they're talking about you know this
their superintendents and you know how Riker had a booking
and you know, Picard had a beta's head at Betazod,
And I kind of wonder, though it might be a
little illegal for him to be reading your mind already
when you come in, because like you said, he didn't

(01:28:56):
have to tell you what he did because he already knew.
And actually, as I was listeningerbody, I hadn't actually we
thought about the whole you know, Admiral calling Picard instead
of doctor Crusher and I see what y'all are saying now,
it kind of yeah, it makes more, it doesn't make sense,

(01:29:17):
you know, and I it was interesting. Of course, as
soon as he told her, she went straight to a
little bit of mom mode and doctor mode.

Speaker 1 (01:29:25):
Because she's like, okay, well he's allergic to this.

Speaker 10 (01:29:28):
You know, they should have it on a file, but
oh wait, maybe I should send.

Speaker 2 (01:29:30):
It anyway, you know.

Speaker 10 (01:29:32):
So that was she was full mom there. And I
know he's not Tom, but I had said, we have
a young Tom Parris, but I just can't unsee that
no matter what. And I really did love the the
interaction between booth Be and Picard. Of course, I know

(01:29:52):
y'all already talk about you know, he gives me a
hard time about no hair, and I want to know
what he did and they don't ever say. And I
didn't look up. No, this should have been back in
like season two, so this wouldn't be a spoiler. I
just wondered if it might have something to do with

(01:30:13):
what caused them get his artificial heart. I don't know
if that's what they're talking about, but you know, who's
to say so anyway, you know, I don't know why
they thought they'd be able to cover this up.

Speaker 2 (01:30:28):
There's no way.

Speaker 10 (01:30:29):
There's always going to be a censor somewhere that's going
to you know, find, you know, see what they did.
And I like, I remember I liked people. They're like,
are you sure that's what really happened? And they're like yeah,
and then click and you know, oh, so explain that

(01:30:51):
and they were caught. One thing I will say that
I and I'd kind of forgotten about it until watch
it again. I think it's just kind of crap. It
was really crappy for them to blame the other teammate
for causing the accident. That's I don't think I could
have gone with gone on with that because that's just

(01:31:12):
a bunch of malarkey. And so I'm just gonna leave
it for that for now. But it's a great episode.
It's definitely one that you do not skip. There's others
you can skip. This isn't it.

Speaker 1 (01:31:26):
Oh I'd like to find out what those episodes are
on the other side and things left unsaid, but for now.
Jake's final take, What did you think of this episode?
Final thoughts?

Speaker 2 (01:31:37):
Rock Well, I was gonna say I didn't get a
chance to really give Ronald Moore credit, because I think
Ronald Moore writes some really amazing episodes, and this is
another evidence of that. This is just well written and
the story really uses a lot of character as well,

(01:31:59):
and so we got some good performances in this. I
kind of wanted to see a little bit more congratulations
from Picard when Wesley actually did kind of come up
and speak the truth. He didn't really give them like,
you know, I'm proud of you, Wesley for doing that.
You know you did the right thing. I didn't hear

(01:32:21):
enough of that too, kind of positively reaffirm that you
know you did the right thing. Instead, it was more like,
you know the punishment is going to be this, and
that there wasn't much there to Wesley, like I'm proud
of you, you did the right thing, don't worry about it.

(01:32:41):
You know things are going to work out. This blemish
on your record will one day move on and people
will forget about it. There are elements of this episode
that remind me of nor the Battle to the Straw
in the fact that you know, just being conflicted with
what really happened and what people perceive happened. So I

(01:33:05):
think that was one of the things that I liked.
You know, Lacarno might actually given other circumstances. You know,
I know that this was a kind of a big showmanship,
kind of ego play, but there were elements of his

(01:33:26):
character that would make him a great leader. And I
think both be articulated that when he said that these
guys would follow him and they would do anything for him,
and I mean, so there were leadership qualities about him,
I think, and elements of the way he performed the
character that were kind of likable. It was like, just

(01:33:50):
tell this little lie and while you know, nobody will
be hurt except for somebody who's dead, and you know,
I can see young people trying to do that, so
it's not outside of the realm of you know, it
doesn't make him a bad person, is what I'm saying.
It makes him make it's a person. He just made
a bad decision, but he's not necessarily a bad person.

(01:34:16):
This also episode kind of touched upon something that you know,
growing up, we always used to believe that if you
don't tell the truth, if you don't say anything about it,
then it's not technically lying, right. It's like we're just
omitting what happened I'm not telling you exactly everything. So
unless you happen to ask the exact, perfect right question,

(01:34:38):
you're not going to get the truth out of me.
And that is, you know, the lie by omission is
still a lie. Yeah, that's one of the great things
that they touched upon in this episode. And you can
see who that lie would hurt. It hurt the legacy
of this kid who passed away, and it would also
hurt the father who has to live carry on the

(01:35:02):
memory of his son and now and with this lie
would be his incompetence as opposed to, you know, being
put in some kind of harmful, dangerous position. So I
think that was a great subject matter to exploring this episode.
And then lastly for me was the speech that Picard gave.

(01:35:25):
It thought was one of the greatest speeches I've heard
in this show and certainly a lasting memory for me
as far as identifying what star Trek values are about,
and I think he meant he defines that very well
in this speech. The first duty of every Starfleet officer

(01:35:50):
is to the truth, whether it's scientific truth, historical truth,
or personal truth. It is the guiding principle on which
Starfleet is based. And then he goes on to say, now,
if you can't find it in yourself to stand up
and tell the truth about what happened, you don't deserve

(01:36:11):
to wear that uniform. And that's why I wanted to
see Picard at the end kind of give him a
pad on the back and say, you do deserve to
wear the uniform. You did the right thing, and you know,
let this go behind you and move forward. So a

(01:36:32):
little bit more of that would have been great, but
I definitely like to see Picard acknowledge his own character
flaws when he said, you know, when I first met you,
you annoyed me and I couldn't stand you. Perfect great
finally admit you know, he'd admitting his own thing that
I didn't like about him, but he admits it, and
I thought that was great. And to see the evolution

(01:36:53):
of where he's come to talk about how you know,
I haven't been disappointed in you, but now I'm I
am had to put the pressure of that moment on him.
So all around, really great acting I thought by Patrick Stewart,
and of course Will Wheaton played a lot of moments

(01:37:14):
very well, some nonverbal moments, for example, when the other
cadets were testifying and he knew that they were lying.
He had the look on his face like, oh God, like,
who're really trying to get away with this? And I
felt his kind of tension and his anxiety really well
expressed in that those scenes. So overall, I really liked

(01:37:37):
this episode. I think it's a classic episode of It's
one of the best episodes out there, top tier episode
and definitely worth a rewatch.

Speaker 1 (01:37:46):
Nice, very good, very high praise. All Right, everybody, that's
it for us, unless you're going over to the things
left and said, then we'll see you there. If we don't, however,
thanks so much for hanging out with this, and thank
you to Chris Garris, Chris McGhee, Carrie Schwent, Allison Leech, Hide,
Chuck a, Greg Kenzo, Faith how Eve England, Jason m Oak,

(01:38:10):
and Melissa Longo. For myself, Sarak, Melissa Mister, Aaron Eisenberg,
we want to thank you all very much for partying
with us. It's time to go to bed, though, We'll
see you next time, and until then, always remember the
seventh Rule.

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The Truth | With Wil Wheaton | TNG 5.19, "The First Duty" | T7R #346

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}The Truth | With Wil Wheaton | TNG 5.19, "The First Duty" | T7R #346