Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
I got an email this week asking the question that
I know is on the minds and the hearts of
a lot of people. Are Christians required by God to
support the modern nation of Israel. That question came to
me through Hey pastor beIN, which is an open email
series where any of you, anyone can write in and
ask hard questions, no matter what the subject matter is.
(00:21):
Most questions don't require as much as we're going to
give this particular question to answer, But this one required
everything that we had because it's not just about one
verse or one conflict or one nation. It's about what
we think a blessing is. It's about whether we've confused
obedience to Jesus with allegiance to a government. And it's
(00:44):
about whether our theology still knows how to recognize the oppressed,
or if we've accidentally, or intentionally, for that matter, built
a gospel that always takes the side of Pharaoh instead
of the children of Israel. So in this video, we're
going to walk through the twelve most urgent questions, including
is the state of Israel a fulfillment of prophecy or
(01:07):
a product of politics? Who is actually closer to Abraham?
Those in power are those being occupied. Does the Bible
really require us to bless a government no matter what
it does? And what does it actually mean to be
faithful to Christ when missiles are flying? Now, if you've
(01:30):
got a question of your own, I want you to
write me at Haypastorbin at gmail dot com. I'll be
here and I'll tell you the truth no matter what.
So let's get into it. Hey, Pastor Ben, are Christians
required by God to support the modern nation of Israel?
Speaker 2 (01:48):
God?
Speaker 1 (01:49):
I thank you for this opportunity to share a word
with your people. The grass withers and the flower phase,
but thy word stands forever. Here's the email. Hey Pastor Ben,
I hope you doing well. I recently saw you on
The Pascal Show and really appreciated the conversation. It gave
me the sense that you might be someone I could
ask an honest question without judgment. All my life, I've
(02:12):
heard in church that Christians must support Israel, that if
we want it to be blessed, if we want our
families and our country blessed, we have to stand with them.
But I've been wrestling with that lately. I saw Senator
Ted Kruz on Tucker Carlson say he supports Israel because
that's what he was taught in Sunday School.
Speaker 2 (02:32):
Growing up in Sunday School, I was taught from the Bible,
those who bless Israel will be blessed, and those who
curse Israel will be cursed. And from my perspective, I
want to be on the blessing side of the things.
Speaker 1 (02:43):
But something about that doesn't sit well with me. With
everything happening in Gaza and now the escalation with Iran,
I'm struggling to understand what exactly I'm supposed to be supporting.
From what I can see, Israel often seems to be
the one escola these situations. Yet I keep being told
to quote pray for Israel. I find myself wondering should
(03:07):
I also be praying for Iran? Just for context, I'm
a white Evangelical Christian. I voted for Trump in twenty sixteen,
but I couldn't do it in twenty twenty or twenty
twenty four. Something changed in me, and I've been trying
to sort it out ever since. So I guess I'm
just asking, is it really required for Christians to support
(03:28):
Israel no matter what they do? Or is their room
for us to question to look at what's happening and
still be faithful, concerned, and confused Christian. Obviously, I changed
the name to protect this individual, but I want to
get right to it, because this one's going to be
pretty long. We have to answer this with a series
(03:50):
of follow up questions. The first question you need to
ask yourself is this number one is the current state
of Israel, the same as the biblical Israel. Christians are
told that supporting modern day Israel brings blessings because Israel
is the fulfillment of biblical prophecy. But the state of
Israel was created by a United Nations vote in nineteen
(04:14):
forty seven, not a divine command. That vote you in
Resolution oneint eighty one partitioned the land against the will
of its Palestinian inhabitants and triggered the Nakba, a mass
expulsion of over seven hundred thousand people. When Theodore Herzel,
the founder of political Zionism, launched his movement in eighteen
(04:37):
ninety seven, he wasn't invoking Moses. He was negotiating with
European powers. Now, to confuse these events with the Abrahamic
Covenant is to sanctify colonialism and to rename it as
something righteous. Genesis twelve, where God bless this is Abraham
(05:01):
contains no reference whatsoever to a state, a flag, a
specific nation, or an army, only a call to be
a blessing to all people, not just Jewish people, but
all people. Jesus fulfills this promise not by claiming territory,
(05:24):
but by redefining blessing as mercy, not domination, not colonization.
If the land is taken by force and defended with missiles,
it could be many things, but it is not based
on Covenant Question number two, Who are we actually supporting
(05:47):
and which people are closer to Abraham? Christian Zionists, you
may not know who they are, but will define them
in a moment. They often claim that we must support
Israel because it's people are the bloodlined descendants of Abraham,
but modern genetic studies complicate that claim. Doron Behar, a geneticist,
(06:09):
found in twenty ten that Ashkenazi Jews, who make up
the majority of Israeli Jews, carry a significant European ancestry.
In twenty thirteen, a study led by Mark Haber revealed
that Palestinians today are genetically closer to the ancient Israelites
than most modern Israeli citizens. This means that if the
(06:29):
Covenant were based on blood, which the apostle Paul denies
in the Book of Galatians chapter three, verse seven, calling
faith the only inheritance, then the people being occupied are
more Abrahamic than those doing the occupying. Christians aren't being
asked to bless a people of covenant. They're being asked
(06:51):
to bless the more powerful side of a political conflict,
often at the expense of the actual descendants. But even
if ancestry did matter, our loyalty still would not belonged
to genetics. It would belong to justice. Romans Chapter two,
verse twenty eight and twenty nine makes it clear that
(07:11):
true a true Jewish person is one inwardly, and that
the Covenant is of the heart. A blessing is tied
to choosing sides in a blood feud that we've already abandoned.
The Gospel of Jesus Christ. Number three is opposing Zionism
the same as opposing Judaism. Many Christians are afraid that
(07:34):
if they question Israel's actions, they are rejecting the Jewish people.
But Zionism is not Judaism, and the two are not
the same. Zionism is a nineteenth century political movement that
sought to create a Jewish nation, often by partnering with empires,
(07:54):
while Judaism is a three thousand year old faith rooted
in the Torah, in exile, in covenant, and in monotheism.
The Bible is self affirms that non Jews, like Ruth
the Moabite, could be fully included in Israel by loyalty
and love, not blood Ruth one and sixteen. In Galatians
(08:17):
three twenty eight, Paul says there is no Jew or
Greek in Christ, meaning the dividing line is no longer
ethnicity but faith. There are many Jews, including Orthodox groups,
who believe Zionism violates the very heart of the Torah
by displacing others in the name of God is called Zionism.
Speaker 3 (08:47):
Zionism designs to transform the Jewish people body and soul.
Speaker 1 (08:53):
It's something similar to those anti Semites well. So if
christ support for Israel is rooted in honoring the Jewish people,
then that support must also include listening to the voices
who say, not in our name you can bless the
(09:13):
people of God without blessing their governments or their militaries,
and if our theology cannot make that distinction, then maybe
what we're calling a blessing is nothing more than imperialism.
Rapped in Scripture number four, What does Israel actually mean
(09:34):
in the New Covenant. Many Christians equate the word Israel
in the Bible with the modern state of Israel, but
the apostle Paul breaks that link in Romans ninety six,
saying not all are descended from Israel, are Israel and
Galatians three twenty nine, he expands the Covenant to all
who are in Christ, declaring, if you belong to Christ,
(09:56):
then you are Abraham Seed. That means that the New
test sestimate redefines Israel, but not by race, location, or statehood,
but by faith. The idea that blessings come from aligning
with the specific government was already dismantled when Jesus rejected
the zealous nationalistic hopes and declared, My Kingdom is not
(10:19):
of this world John eighteen thirty six. If Christians believe
they must support modern Israel to be part of God's plans,
then they've replaced the Cross with the passport and the
Church with the foreign policy. Scripture never calls us to
defend a state. It calls us to embody a people
(10:44):
and a principle, and that people includes Palestinians who follow Jesus,
Jews who reject Zionism, and anyone who bears the fruit
of justice. If you think blessings flow through a border,
checkpoint or a wall owned the border, you've misunderstood what
(11:04):
Jesus died to create. Number five. What is the biblical
story of Israel? One of empire or deliverance from empire?
Some Christians believe that to bless Israel means supporting its
wars and borders, but the Bible tells the opposite story.
(11:25):
It stands with the enslaved, the exiled, and the occupied,
not their rulers. From Egypt to Babylon to Rome, the
people of God are called to resist empire, not imitated.
When Jesus entered Jerusalem on a donkey instead of a
war horse, he rejected the messianic nationalism of his day
(11:50):
and wept over the city's future destruction. According to Luke
nineteen forty one through forty four, Senator Ted Cruz publicly
stated that he's, of course Israel, because that's what he
was taught in Sunday school. Prove that the Empire has
inherited our theology.
Speaker 2 (12:09):
Growing up in Sunday School, I was taught from the
Bible those who bless Israel will be blessed, and those
who curse Israel will be cursed. And from my perspective,
I want to be on the blessing side of the
things of those who bless the government of Israel, those
who bless Israel is what it says, done say the
government of It says the nation of Israel. So that's
in the Bible. As a Christian, I believe that where
(12:30):
is that? I can find it to you. I don't
have the scripture off the tip of mine. You pull
out the phone and use it's it's in Genesis.
Speaker 1 (12:37):
When Christian politicians quote Genesis to justify airstrikes, we have
not only reversed the Exodus story. We have anointed Pharaoh Michael.
Chapter six, verse eight commands us not to secure borders,
but to do justice, love mercy, and walk humbly. Blessings
(12:57):
don't flow from backing the show strongest army. It flows
from siding with the people who are bleeding and oppressed
by that army. Number six is Zionism prophetic fulfillment or
(13:44):
political empire. Zionism is often framed as the fulfillment of
God's promises, but it began in eighteen ninety seven as
a political response to European anti Semitism, launched by Theodore Herzel,
a second Austrian journalists, not a prophet or a priest.
Herzel sought protection, not coveted, and what began as survival
(14:08):
quickly became expansion, militarization, and occupation. Today, the idea of
greater Israel fuel settlement in the West Bank and displaces
families in East Jerusalem, all under the language of divine right.
In churches and conferences across America, Zionism is preached not
(14:29):
as a political ideology, which it is, but as a
holy obligation, something to defend at all costs, even when
it violates the very ethics of the Gospel. When Christians
echoed that when they say stuff like that, they're no
longer proclaiming the Gospel of Jesus Christ. They're preaching empire
(14:50):
with the cross around their necks. Prophets like Amos in
the fifth Chapter in the twenty fourth verse and Isaiah
in Chapter fifty eight, verses sixty seven never blessed walls
or weapons. They called for broken yokes, loose chains, and
justice rolling down like a river. Jesus never said build
a greater Israel. He said, my kingdom is not of
(15:14):
this world. And then he let the powers of Empire
crucify him to prove that if Zionism is empire baptized
in scripture, then Christians are not called to bless it.
We are called to expose it. Hallelujah. Hey everybody, this
(15:39):
is pastor Ben and I just want to jump in
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(16:02):
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(16:49):
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Show to support our work as well as dollar Sign
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Speaker 3 (17:57):
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(19:36):
God to support the modern nation of Israel Number seven?
It's Christian Zionism about love or power and apocalypse. Christians
are told that we must bless Israel to receive blessing,
but what many are actually blessing is a theology of
apocalyptic domination, not covenant. Modern Christian Zionism is rooted in dispensationalism,
(20:03):
a nineteenth century theological invention popularized by John Nelson Darby
not Jesus. This theology claims that Israel must be restored
as a nation so that it can be the stage
for the end of the world, not for peace, but
for armageddon. Pastor John Hagen, who I grew up watching
(20:25):
every single Sunday and founder of Christians United for Israel,
has said plainly that Israeli's survival is central to the
Rapture timeline, not because he loves Jews, but because he
sees them as characters in a divine countdown. The result
is that millions of Christians give money and political cover
(20:47):
to a nation state not to support its people, but
to fulfill a violent reading of revelation, and in doing
so they ignored the Jesus who said, blessed are the
peace made makers Matthew five, verse nine, not blessed are
the arms dealers. If blessing comes by funding war in
(21:07):
the name of prophecy, then we are not waiting for Christ.
We are subsidizing Babylon. Supporting Israel as a means to
fast track the end times is not faith. It's not
support for the Jewish people. It is religious imperialism dressed
in biblical drag. Number eight Does God live in a
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place or in a people. Some Christians believe supporting Israel
means defending the holiness of its land, but Jesus explicitly
deconstructed the idea of sacred geography. In John four twenty one,
he tells the Samaritan woman, the time is coming when
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you will worship neither on this mountain nor in Jerusalem.
In Luke twenty one, chapter six, he prophesies the destruction
of the Temple itself, not to curse Israel, but to
shift the focus from place and location to presence and people.
God's presence is no longer tied to buildings, temples, mosque borders,
(22:20):
or ethnic claims. It now lives in the body, the Spirit,
and the fruit of mercy. When the Israeli government uses
claims to the Temple mount to justify force and exclusion,
they are echoing the same theology Jesus overturned. Christians are
not called to defend plots of lands and shovels of dirt.
(22:44):
We are called to recognize where God has pitched his tent.
God has pitched his tent with the poems, with the disinherited,
with the oppressed, with the crush. And holiness is not
about where you build, It's about who, oh you welcome.
And if you think defending a location brings blessings, that
(23:05):
you've missed the God who tore the veil in the
temple in the first place. Hallelujas, my good God today.
Number nine. What does the Book of Revelation actually reveal?
(23:27):
Many Christians are taught that the Book of Revelations demands
support for Israel in the last days, but the actual
text tells a very different story. Revelation eighteen describes the
fall of Babylon, which is a metaphor for empire, all empires,
every empire, because of its greed, bloodshed, and exploitation of
(23:52):
the vulnerable. Nowhere in the Bible does it command loyalty
to a nation. Instead, it warns that the powers of
this world will masquerade as holy while doing violence in
God's name. If modern Israel acts like Babylon, hoarding weapons,
silencing prophets, crushing the poor, then blessing it is not obedience,
(24:17):
it is complicity. The Lamb, who is slain in Revelation
chapter five, verse six, is the only one worthy, and
he conquers not with force, but by suffering. The final
judgment is not about rewarding states, but exposing systems. Blessings
don't come from aligning with the empire. It comes from
(24:38):
standing with the oppressed. And if you read Revelation as
a military playbook instead of prophetic mirror. Then Babylon already
has your heart number ten. Does Israel have the right
to exist? Does Israel have the right to defend itself?
The question does Israel have the right to exist? Sounds
(25:01):
like a fair question, doesn't it. But it's actually a
rhetorical trap because when it's asked in this context, it's
not really about whether Jewish people deserve safety or dignity.
It's a demand to legitimize a regime built through forced displacement,
sustained through apartheid, and defend it with theology wrapped around drones.
(25:27):
And no, Christians are not obligated to bless that, no
matter how many times Genesis twelve gets quoted on cable news.
The Jewish people absolutely have the right to live and
to flourish, just like the Palestinians, just like anyone else
made in the image of God. But states are not sacred.
(25:47):
Nations are not sacred. They are to be held accountable.
No nation, no states, not Israel, not America, not the
Roman Empire gets to baptize its borders in blood and
call it self defense. The moment you bulldoz someone's home
and call it a right. The moment you bomb a
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refugee camp and call it security, you stopped talking about
self defense and it started performing idolatry. Jesus wept over
Jerusalem not because it lacked firepower, but because it chose
domination over peace, and it refused to recognize the very
(26:31):
things that make peace possible. So let's be clear. Blessings
do not come through allegiance to a flag. It comes
through justice for the people who are trampled underneath it.
(26:52):
Christians are not called to support governments. We are called
to follow Jesus. And following Jesus means the oppressed and
the wounded, not the oppressors and the ones who did
the wounding. If your theology led you to bless a
government that bombs refugee camps, imprisons, and kills children, annexes
(27:14):
villages and calls it all self defense, then it is
not Christ who you are following. It is empire dressed
up in scripture, and the only way back is through repentance,
not polite disagreement, but a full reversal of allegiance. The
Kingdom of God does not build settlements, It does not
(27:38):
justify sieges, It does not baptize nationalism. The Kingdom of
God lifts the oppressed, it lifts the crust, it lifts
the marginalized. To the emailer who sent me this question,
I want to thank you. I do apologize for getting
this bombostic around this issue, but as you can tell,
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it is a critical issue that is on the hearts
of millions of Christians all over this country. And to
answer you very directly, no, we are not required as
Christians to support the state of Israel. We are required
as Christians to stand for the oppressed, no matter where
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we find the oppressed, and no matter who the oppressors are.
That is our call as Christians. And for anyone who
is still confused and not certain about whether or not
you should support Israel, whether or not you should support Zionism,
I want to leave you with a prayer for Zionism.
(28:43):
That's right. I want to leave you with a prayer
for Zionism. Here's the prayer. May God be as merciful
to Zionists as Zionists have been merciful to the children
of Gaza. May God be as merciful to Zionists as
Zionists have been merciful to the children of Gaza. And
(29:07):
if that prayer sounds more like a curse to you
than a blessing. Then perhaps you found your answer of
whether or not you, as a Christian, are required to
support the state of Israel.