Coaches Office Podcast with guest Coach Kenny Simpson

The coaches welcome Arkansas high school coach Kenny Simpson

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:10):
Coach David Buchanan coach Chuck Smith, two legendary high school
football coaches. This is the Coach's Office, a behind the

(00:33):
scenes look at Kentucky high school football.

Speaker 2 (00:42):
Welcome to the Coach's Office behind the Scenes with Chuck
Smith and David Buchanan. This is off season three, episode four.
I'm Chuck Smith. I'm joined by co coach David Buchannan
and podcast editor flashback.

Speaker 3 (00:57):
Storyteller Mike yoakum uh.

Speaker 2 (01:00):
Our YouTube version of this podcast is at UH at
teacop T, dot C, dot O, dot P. If you
get on there and and like it, hit, you know,
hit like and subscribe, it helps us out our show tonight.
You know, is we're really excited about We're going to

(01:20):
get into Arkansas high school football tonight. And we got
a very successful, innovating, driven head football coach Kenny Simpson.
UH at the UH he's at Southside Charter High School,
which is I believe in Batesville, Arkansas. Coach Simpson will

(01:43):
be a great guest with a lot of innovating information.

Speaker 4 (01:47):
UH.

Speaker 3 (01:47):
We'll bring a coach Simpson on here in just a second.
David will so be patient.

Speaker 4 (01:53):
Uh.

Speaker 2 (01:53):
Then we're going to address our tough topic. It's anonymous
and and the question is new to coordinating. You know,
what are some of the piece what are some pieces
of advice for new coordinators? You know, what is the
head football coach looking for when he hires a coordinator?

Speaker 3 (02:13):
The dudes and the don'ts.

Speaker 2 (02:15):
So that'll be a really good question for David and
I to address, you know, after our interview with with
coach Simpson. So hang in there, hang tight a little
bit about coach Simpson in his credentials before we get
before we get started, or before David brings him on.

Speaker 3 (02:33):
Coach Simpson, he's currently.

Speaker 2 (02:35):
The head football coach at Southside Charter High School.

Speaker 3 (02:40):
He served as a head football coach for.

Speaker 2 (02:42):
Three different schools. He's been in two different states. He's
had success in two different states. He was at Christian
Academy in Alabama as a head football coach. He was
at Southside Charter UH for the for two stony and
it's one of them. He's in the second stent now,

(03:03):
but he was there before. Then he went to I
believe Searcy High School, which is a six A football
program in Arkansas.

Speaker 3 (03:11):
And then he's come back and.

Speaker 2 (03:13):
He's currently the head football coach at Southside Charter for
the second time.

Speaker 4 (03:19):
You know.

Speaker 2 (03:20):
He'd been named the four A two Conference Coach of
the Year in twenty seventeen. Twenty twenty four, he was
a finalist for the Houghtons Coach of the Year award.

Speaker 3 (03:31):
He coached the Arkansas High School All Star Football.

Speaker 2 (03:36):
Game in twenty twenty three. I bet that was a
lot of fun to do that. And then he also
coached the first Texas Arkansas All Star Showdown in twenty
twenty one. I bet that was also a blast. He
wrote a book, Find a Way to Find a Way,
you know what I wish I'd known when I became

(03:59):
a head football coach. Coacht pretty exciting he did that
in twenty nineteen. Maybe if you wrote and maybe wrote
some other books too, but that's the one that that
I saw. He runs the gun tee offensive system, you know,
which is run you know, all over the world really
and and had a lot of success with that. He's

(04:23):
been featured, uh, you know, by a lot of or
had He's been featured or had a lot of interviews
from a different media outlets, you know, including the United
USA Football Titan, Under the Coaches podcast and now now
he can add the Coach's Office behind the scenes with

(04:47):
Chuck Smith and David Buchanan to that list of people
that have interviewed him and talked to him. David, you
want to bring on coach?

Speaker 4 (04:57):
Yeah, you know, you used to teach history and there
at the end in World Stiff, we'd always talk about
the world is flat the twenty first century, Coach, Simpson,
are you familiar with Thomas Friedman? Well, I just took
a shot there, But anyway, and uh, and really sort

(05:18):
of also how talent was going to sort of rise
to the top because of connectivity, you know, and I
just I think of you as a guest because you know,
with social media, Twitter and Internet and you've built a
very successful business. Uh that's how to high school coaches
the Kentucky found just because of Twitter and and it's
given you a platform to show. Uh. I mean, you've

(05:41):
you've got to You're you're very skilled football coach and
also a very skilled business owner. So it's really cool because, uh,
because the world is flat. Uh. We got Kenny Simpson
on tonight and I'm really excited about that. And you know,
Chuck did a great job with your intro. But coach.
We could spend all night on your intro, on the

(06:02):
clinics you offer your publications. It's it's really it's incredible.
And uh, hey, thank you so much. And I know
you're very busy. Thanks for making time for us tonight.

Speaker 5 (06:13):
No, man, it's it's always cool to talk bould and
that's always fun and it's always an honor to be
on a podcast. And I'm glad you guys found me
and looked me up and hit me up and making
you making you stay up past your bedtime tonight.

Speaker 3 (06:28):
You doing.

Speaker 4 (06:29):
Hey, Hey, you'll be old someday you've been watching on
those bedtime commys. Your day's coming, coach, your day's coming.

Speaker 2 (06:36):
Yeah, hey, coach, let me get started here. I've got
the first question up for you. Uh, tell me about
that gun tee offense. You know, why do you think
it's been so successful?

Speaker 4 (06:47):
Yeah?

Speaker 5 (06:48):
We we we kind of stumbled into it. You know,
that wasn't a goal of mine. I was a spread guy,
you know, early on in Alabama we had run the spread.
A big Tony Franklin fan. I still am a fan
of his stuff. We ran that and Montgomery and had
some success. You know, I was coaching the year we
won our conference, a lot of good stuff that happened. Well,
then we moved to Arkansas and just completely different demographics

(07:11):
of our kids and we didn't have the guys on
the edges that could really make it happen in the
spread offense. I remember I had been a defensive coordinator
early in my career and I always hated going against
the wing tea like I hated going against it every
time we go against it. Just was miserable trying to
get ready for it. So said, well, maybe we should

(07:32):
run that. But as well, I don't really want to
just sell out to the wing tea that that's wrong.
It's a good offense. I'd like to use some of
the other knowledge that I've learned in the spread world.
And with all the RPOs, we had really been pretty
decent in the RPOs at Arkansas run the spread. I
did that for about three or four years, and we
were not very good. You know, I was a young

(07:53):
coach and had to be humbled. You know, God tends
to do that to you when you need it, and
he definitely.

Speaker 6 (07:59):
Did for a couple of years there.

Speaker 5 (08:01):
So we had to find something because my wife told me,
you know, we'd had a kid at every stop, a
new job, new kid, new job, new kid, and I
don't get paid enough for that stuff. So We're going
to have to stop moving and start winning, you know.
And so that was the conversation we had. So we
wanted to blend the wing teat you know, the elements
of the wing tea that everyone hates. Everyone hates stopping

(08:23):
buck sweep and double hand off is hard, and misdirection
is difficult, and having a tight end wing surface is
just kind of a something you don't see. But we
wanted to keep RPOs from the spread world.

Speaker 6 (08:38):
We wanted to keep some of the screen game from.

Speaker 5 (08:41):
The spread world, and so, you you know, we tried
to make the best of both worlds, bring the spread
offense in with the RPO world.

Speaker 6 (08:49):
And it's been a process.

Speaker 5 (08:50):
We started it in twenty sixteen, actually twenty fifteen. We
put it in twenty sixteen, we went, we sold out
to it, and then we made the playoffs. School I
was at when I took the job, I had been
oh and twenty some odd. It had been like a
two and a half year losing streak, so it was
a it was a work in progress. I had contributed
to that with an O in ten season myself, so

(09:12):
we were nobody's blameless. We had a long way to go. Well,
twenty sixteen, we sell out to this. We maybe the playoffs.
I'm like, man, maybe there's something here, and make sure
we go ten and two, and then we win the
conference again and you're starting to go, man, I think
this actually is working. And then we put it out
twenty twenty COVID hits and so we put out the
gun tea kind of out for other people that might be.

Speaker 6 (09:35):
Interested in it.

Speaker 5 (09:36):
And anytime you do that, it's always nerve wracking because like,
you put something out there and people pay money for it,
and it sucks.

Speaker 6 (09:43):
You know, you're you're gonna you're gonna feel awful about that.

Speaker 5 (09:47):
So we put it out there, put our first playbook out,
and then it went crazy.

Speaker 6 (09:52):
My wife and I were at home, We're trying.

Speaker 5 (09:53):
To mail from the house, and we mailed out probably
several thousand of these, Like.

Speaker 6 (09:58):
You know, I was like, wow, and we're looking at you.

Speaker 5 (10:01):
You can see where you're mailing them, and you're going,
I think we've hit every state and we're hitting other countries,
and so I really hope this works.

Speaker 6 (10:08):
It worked for us, I hope it works for other people.

Speaker 3 (10:11):
Well.

Speaker 5 (10:11):
Now this year we had thirty eight schools that run
the gun Tea that I'm aware of. I have won
a state championship in the US at the high school level.

Speaker 4 (10:21):
I'm working with.

Speaker 5 (10:22):
A couple of college coaches that are using elements of
what we run and getting to travel around and work
with it, and it's been good. You know, we all
know as coaches, scheme is not good. That's not the
end all be all. You've got to have more than
the scheme.

Speaker 6 (10:37):
We all know that.

Speaker 5 (10:38):
But we also know that having good scheme gives you
a chance. And that's kind of what I try to
say with the gun Tea is when you're not very good,
you can slow it down and you can use the
run game, and you can use a little kind of
conservative formation type of things. When you are good, we've
been blessed to have some good athletes the last two

(10:58):
or three years here at south Side, you can be
really explosive. And I think that's why it works for
most schools is you don't have to send your offense.
You know, you don't have to go with what we're
not gonna be very good this year.

Speaker 6 (11:10):
Let's run this. We are gonna be good. Let's run this.
You can keep the same offense and adapt to your kids.
That's my hope.

Speaker 4 (11:18):
You know.

Speaker 5 (11:18):
I try to let guys that run and speak for themselves.
But for us, that's what's been good for us.

Speaker 4 (11:25):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (11:25):
I watched some of your clips, uh, you know, on
your website, and I thought of it. You know, you
mix that RPO in there with it, and which makes
it really really tough and then uh, but it was
really it was really effective for you. And now our
listeners they can they can access some of these videos
by getting on your YouTube account or how can you

(11:48):
tell them how they could possibly, you know, get to
some of your information.

Speaker 3 (11:53):
Is it through you or what?

Speaker 6 (11:54):
Yeah, they can go wherever they want to. I've got
to I've tried to put as many place as I could.
So YouTube's free.

Speaker 5 (11:59):
So man, if I the first time I'm listening, I'm
going to look for free before I as far I
spend any money. So go over to YouTube and check out.
Just look up my name Kenny Simpson and ought to
pull stuff up. Or if you put buck sweep or RPO,
it's probably going to pull something up.

Speaker 6 (12:13):
Check it out on YouTube. We've got Now I'll get
my own website Fbcochsimpson dot com.

Speaker 5 (12:20):
There's some free stuff on that, powerpoints and just general information.
And then if they want to get a book or
they want to dig deeper, there are other resources there
are that are available.

Speaker 3 (12:30):
Yeah.

Speaker 4 (12:30):
Yeah, Hey, so coach, you know you're talking about your
business and mailing your playbooks and your YouTube, and I mean, so,
how do you do this? How do you balance running
a very successful business while being also a very successful
head football coach? How do you making that go?

Speaker 5 (12:50):
Man? There's a secret weapon I have. And she's in
the office next door, and she's my wife. And so
when people that know me well know miss Jane, know
who she is. She's a graphic design major, and so
she can obviously make my stuff look good like you
see behind us.

Speaker 4 (13:08):
Uh.

Speaker 6 (13:08):
So she edits the books, she creates the.

Speaker 5 (13:11):
Covers, so that part's easy enough. You know, she does
a great job with that. But she also mails everything.
She's our accountant. She's the lady that kind of keeps
me on the straight and narrow. So I think a
lot of it is who you're married to. And I
try to work with a lot of young coaches on
that where you better have the misses better be in

(13:32):
the same boat with you, or or you're probably gonna
go separate directions. So one, yeah, that's a huge key,
and I think that's a big time key for us.
And then I've got a great staff, you know, I've
got a great staff of coaches that are you know,
I can be gone. But that was what scared me
the most was I have.

Speaker 6 (13:50):
My own team.

Speaker 5 (13:51):
I want to make sure we're prepared, but I've got
opportunities here to work with schools.

Speaker 6 (13:57):
We went nine different clinics, the nine different rent.

Speaker 5 (14:00):
Sites across the US, got to travel to which is awesome,
But you can't do that if you don't trust your
own coaching staff. So I'm extremely blessed that I've got
a great staff. I'm actually getting to take a few
of them with me to some of these installs and
it's really cool to watch them and watch.

Speaker 6 (14:19):
Them enjoy getting to.

Speaker 5 (14:21):
Work with kids, you know, in Alabama or in Wisconsin
or wherever we're going, and watch my coaches get to
do that as well. And then I think a lot
of things is you know, we try to do things
the right way, you know, And I think that's kind
of what I've done. And so in the business world,
I don't know if I'm a good businessman at all. Like,
if somebody asked me for something they don't have money,

(14:42):
We're just going to give it to Like that's just
kind of I want to be a coach first, you know,
and then God has blessed us to be in a
place where, you know, if we can send my daughter
to college and help pay for some of that with this,
that's great. If it was free, I'd do it anyway,
because it's just something I'm passionate about, right Like you

(15:02):
guys with your podcast, If you make money on it,
that's awesome. If you don't, you're gonna have a lot
of fun doing it anyway.

Speaker 6 (15:08):
And that's kind of.

Speaker 5 (15:09):
The mindset I've taken into the business part of it.
And then I don't know why God has blessed quite
a bit, probably because I've got a really great lady
behind me kind of pushing the right.

Speaker 4 (15:21):
Buttons, you know. Coach, I wonder if you feel like
this as well, Like I think this podcast has made
me a much better hate coach. Do you feel like
your business has helped you be a better coach?

Speaker 6 (15:36):
One thousand percent.

Speaker 5 (15:37):
I mean think about it, like, you know, if a
coach has to present in front of other coaches, you
better know your stuff because like if I'm going to
go travel somewhere and somebody's paying to come hear me
talk and I don't know what I'm talking about, I
almost struggle. So I've learned more offense and have gotten
more in depth, and we've evolved our own offense because

(15:59):
of connect since we've made and end depth learning we've done,
and my coaches, I make them speak at our national clinic.
That's been a side benefit that I never saw coming.
Like I never saw coming, But I'm a much better
coach now than I was in twenty twenty.

Speaker 6 (16:16):
Twenty twenty is when kind of the business in from.

Speaker 5 (16:18):
He started, mainly because there's a bigger spotlight, so you
better know what you're doing. Every fan things you're an idiot,
that don't matter, but as far as their coaches, you know,
you better know what you're talking about.

Speaker 2 (16:33):
Yeah, any teacher that's worth the way that all knows
that the more you teach something to somebody else, the
better you're going to know it, the better you're going
to feel more confident. And every time you present it.
So that's really good stuff. That's a great idea too
to let you know your assistance to help you along

(16:55):
with that because it's going to it's definitely going to
help them feel more confident with them material.

Speaker 4 (17:01):
Uh.

Speaker 3 (17:01):
And I think Dave and I both will agree. We
both have got really.

Speaker 2 (17:06):
Solid wives that have been hung in there with us
over the years, been very supportive and uh. And you
said it yourself that if you don't have that, it's
probably not gonna work. It's not gonna last very long.
But Uh, anyway, coach, I got to my next question
is I know you said that earlier that you were

(17:29):
a defensive coordinator before, but you also on your your site,
you you you you know deal with the uh with
some defense uh the fit and Swarm thirty four defense?

Speaker 3 (17:41):
Could could you just briefly tell us, you.

Speaker 2 (17:43):
Know what the principles and philosophy behind uh that fit
and swarmed thirty four defensive years is sure?

Speaker 6 (17:50):
Absolutely?

Speaker 5 (17:51):
You know, when I was a defens of coordinator was
actually a forefront guy because in Alabama, defense alignment just
grow on trees.

Speaker 6 (17:57):
You just stick them down and stick them.

Speaker 4 (17:58):
You know.

Speaker 5 (17:59):
I get I get here to Arkansas, and that's not
the case. So we needed a way we were playing.

Speaker 6 (18:05):
We were playing a.

Speaker 5 (18:05):
Lot of spread offense Arkansas. I will say this about
the state, if you're not familiar with it, you have
some great offensive minds that have come out of Arkansas.
Gust Madleson has come out of Arkansas as a high
school coach. You've got head coach at UTSA right now,
head coach at Missouri. Those guys are all high school
type coaches of Arkansas that are now on a big,

(18:27):
big stage, and there's a lot of other coaches in
the state. Offensively, they know how to run an offense
and they were not to run a lot of spread stuff.
So that's kind of the elite teams in Arkansas usually
run some variation of spread, so we needed to match that.
And so the three four allowed us to put as

(18:48):
many athletes on the field as possible, and we've adapted
it each year. You have to adjust to your personnel.
But this year for us, you know, we made the
semi finals, we won thirteen games. We had one defensive
player over two hundred pounds one and we're playing at
the level where we're playing linemen that average to eighty
you know, in two ninety and so that was what

(19:10):
we had and we were able to be successful. A
couple of years ago we didn't have a ton of speed.
We had some thick kids, and so we could play
kind of that bear front, you know, those four eyes
and make everything spill. We can do it kind of
like the gun tea. You can do it all from
the same base.

Speaker 4 (19:26):
You know.

Speaker 5 (19:26):
On years where you have speed, we're gonna do a
lot of movement, a lot.

Speaker 6 (19:29):
Of blitzes, a lot of you know, a lot of stuff.

Speaker 5 (19:32):
On years we don't have that, we can get into
that four eye and kind of just plug and spill
everything to the sideline.

Speaker 6 (19:40):
When we have good.

Speaker 5 (19:41):
Dbs, you know, we're able to mix our coverages up.
We're not as good. We can play just quarters, you know.
So that's kind of the idea a lot like the
gun tea. Is it fit our kids. So we put
it out, same thing with the gun tea. And when
you put stuff out, man, I'm telling you, I'm nervous
that I put it out.

Speaker 6 (19:59):
Don't get it.

Speaker 5 (20:00):
You're like, man, it worked for me. So that's all
I ever say for us. Hope it works for you.
But fortunately for us, I think there was a twelve
or thirteen teams that are running our defense exactly our defense.
A lot of more people running three four I know,
running exactly our defense that want to stay championship this

(20:21):
year too, and so it's been cool to see that grow.
I've got a young defensive coordinator that's taken what we
did and man, he's made it unbelievable. And so we're
starting to put out new materials in that world. He's
doing a lot of it, so obviously we're compensating him
for whatever he's putting out, but he's done a great

(20:41):
job with it.

Speaker 6 (20:41):
So we just try to put it out for coaches.

Speaker 5 (20:44):
My mind is, I want to be a place where
a coach once learned football that they can go to
the website and then find something whether that's offense, defense,
fundraise and specialty whatever, they can find something can help them.
Because I'm a coach, I buy I go on websites
all the time and buy stuff to help me.

Speaker 6 (21:03):
So we want to try to do the same thing
for coaches.

Speaker 3 (21:05):
That's great.

Speaker 4 (21:06):
Yeah, So coach, you know, with your systems and your
business and so forth, you know you're seeing a lot
across the country. What trends do you see emerging in
high school football? And are those trends Are they different
from any trends you might be seeing at the collegiate
or the professional level.

Speaker 5 (21:28):
Now and maybe, and I know I want to show
you all might agree with me. But if I said
this like to a professional coach, he probably kicked me
off the podcast.

Speaker 6 (21:36):
I think innovation trickles up.

Speaker 5 (21:39):
I think it starts at high school and the last
people who run innovative offenses are at the NFL.

Speaker 6 (21:45):
Like when you watch new things, if you really.

Speaker 5 (21:48):
Watch it, it tends to happen to the high school
a little first, then the colleges kind of adapt to it.
Then all of a sudden, you see the NFL in
it and they're running. You know, you can watch I
can watch RPOs we're running and they're running them, you know.

Speaker 6 (22:02):
The Super Bowl or NFC Championship game.

Speaker 5 (22:04):
So I'm a big believer that most innovation happens at
the high school level first because we have to because
we have to adapt to what we have. We don't
get to go cherry pick our players, and so that
forces you to do unorthodox or new things. So that
being said, high school level, for me, I'm starting to

(22:26):
see a lot more. You know, we put out tight
end wing. When we first did it in twenty sixteen,
twenty seventeen, not a lot of people were doing that.
Now a lot of people are showing that tight end
like twenty one personnel, twelve personnel. You're starting to see
a ton of that in the shotgun. I think that's
not because of me, but just because you see at

(22:49):
the NFL level. Now you're seeing it at the college
level now where those tight end h backs because most
high school teams you don't really unless you're blessed, you
don't have four guys at receiver. You can't go two
by two and all four of those guys are really good.
But probably you're going to have that h back looking
type kid. You may not be perfect, but he's going

(23:09):
to be able to block a little bit and catch
a little bit. You know, he's not really a running back,
he's not really a receiver. You're seeing those type of bodies.
So to me, that's what I'm seeing at the high
school level. There's a lot of twelve twenty one personnel
moving guys around. RPO has been around forever but is
expanding more and more every year, and you're seeing that

(23:32):
now at every single level, and so for that on
the defensive side of the wall, we're seeing a lot
more man. I think you're starting to see a lot
more man to man principles and the defense because you
have to take the RPOs away and the easiest way
to do that is going man. If you don't go man,
you got to spin coverage and hide different things. So

(23:54):
most high school level coaches are doing some version of
man more than I saw before, like teams that you
wouldn't normally see. Second thing I'm seeing that we're starting
to do with our own program is we're tightening up
coverages even with lesser athletes. Because the old school thought
was play off, make them drive the field.

Speaker 6 (24:16):
You know, play off, make them drive the field. High
schools are too good for that now, like the quarterbacks
and receivers are.

Speaker 5 (24:21):
If you give them five yard inch, they'll take it
all the way down the field, or they'll throw a
screen to their five star and you can't tackle them.
So we're seeing and we're doing much more. Have our
corners at three or four yards, you know, and have
our safeties at seven to eight yards, where we're trying
to make you throw the vertical ball where that was traditional,

(24:44):
so you had a lot of athletes. It was not
traditional if you did it't have as many athletes. But
I'm starting to see teams defenses that we're seeing are
trying to take away the easy balls and make you
go over the top to beat them.

Speaker 6 (24:58):
And that was to me.

Speaker 5 (25:00):
You know, five years ago, teams are just sitting and
cover four and let you throw screens all day long.
And now they're kind of taking that stuff away.

Speaker 4 (25:09):
So go ahead. Ye well, I was gonna say, right,
So if you're seeing more man that I that's also
then where more of these condensed formations are coming from,
because that's making it tougher. Uh. And this goes back
to learning from Homer Smith. His Homer Smith manuals Guys,

(25:34):
you're so young, you may not even know who I'm
talking about. But he was, yeah, I didn't know, because
I mean again, I'm old. But you know, Homer Smith
is where we saw the first time we saw the
condensed coverages for or condensed sets for man coverage, and
it worked great. It was really good. And now it's
like I see when I watch a lot of football,

(25:55):
I see a lot of condensed sets and and I
sort of think, like what you've just said that condensed
sets our reaction to the man coverage, which is a
response to the r p O.

Speaker 5 (26:08):
I agree, and then tighten hbax man, how are you
gonna man them up? You're gonna man them up with
a corner, you know, and then let the body you
And so it's all cyclical. Like he says, a flat
would you say at the time, was a flat surf
or whatever it was, it's the same idea.

Speaker 4 (26:23):
Yes, yes, sir, yes, sir. So I appreciate that. And uh, look,
I'll just you know, Chuck don't worry about it as much.
He's he's got a lot better self esteem. But I'm
getting edgy about getting old. So I love having you
on here just as sort of like, hey, I want
to hear what a young guys seeing. You know, I
sometimes I worry about it, but he am I really

(26:45):
seeing it like I think I am. But hey, I'm
gonna let Chuck go ahead. Hit you with the next one.
Go ahead for Chuck.

Speaker 5 (26:51):
I'm gonna say this. So yesterday I got to play
flag football.

Speaker 6 (26:54):
I'm at the.

Speaker 5 (26:56):
Age of almost retirement for still playing active sports. So
I appreciate you calling me young all day yesterday. I
was twice the age of the guys out there playing
in that league, So it was I appreciate that.

Speaker 4 (27:09):
Hey, what I got to ask you then? Because I
was playing flagged football probably up to about twenty years ago.
I'm wondering, though, have you popped a hamstring and got
home with the back of your leg purple yet? Because
I don't know that you're really old and you're really
playing hard if you're not walking around the next day
at school with a big purple hamstring on the back
of your leg. And so what teles coach did you?

(27:31):
Did you come home with that or die?

Speaker 2 (27:34):
No?

Speaker 5 (27:34):
Unfortunately, offensively, I'm just a quarterback most weeks. Most weeks
I just play quarterback because I'm forty five.

Speaker 6 (27:42):
I can't run like I used to.

Speaker 5 (27:44):
But yesterday we had a kid, and I'll be able
to show up. I say, kid, he's twenty four years old,
but he couldn't come, so I guess it was out
there chasing guys around it inside there you go.

Speaker 6 (27:55):
Hey, unlike you, I don't play hard enough to pull anything.

Speaker 4 (27:59):
Here's the thing I'm going to warn you. I was
playing quarterback when I would pop my handstring. It was
because I would tug it and try and try to run,
even though the high school coach told me to never
run the ball. I would tug it and try to run.
But hey, you you keep playing that flag for both
of us. All right, I'm trying to get hurt. There

(28:20):
you go.

Speaker 2 (28:20):
Hey, hey, coach Simpson, let me finish up with this
this last question. Here is I read where you raise
one point five million dollars for south Side, you know,
the school that you're at.

Speaker 4 (28:32):
Now.

Speaker 2 (28:33):
Most Kentucky high school football programs they have to fundraise
to supplement their football budget. You know, could you share
with the listeners any advice or tips on fundraising?

Speaker 4 (28:46):
Sure?

Speaker 6 (28:47):
Man, sure, no. We we kind of put fundraising in
really kind of two major buckets.

Speaker 5 (28:52):
So one major bucket is your year to year stuff
like you're talking about. You got to supplement things, and
so we do a couple of different funds raising events,
and there are things that anybody can do. But a
couple of rules we try to abide by is we
don't sell crap. Nobody wants like that's rule number one.
Nobody wants to buy sheets or beef jerky sticks or

(29:14):
whatever else. So we try not to sell all that stuff.
Everything we do is just basically going to be one
hundred percent profit. So we do the cars like everybody
else does. But why am I going to pay a
company when I can go out to five restaurants and
get them to agree to do something, So we prouse
our own little car. We do that every year, so
that money generally we kind of use that fundraiser mainly

(29:36):
for our junior high kids. It kind of funds our
junior high programs because those are the kids who are
excited about AY and we do it real simple. If
you sell cards five bucks, you sell five cars, we
give you five dollars. So the kids are like, give
me five bucks, so they do that.

Speaker 6 (29:53):
For our junior high program.

Speaker 5 (29:54):
We do a lot of sponsorships with companies, local companies
on T shirts that are raising money to get gear
for our kids, and then we just go directly to
the company and say, hey, it's five hundred bucks, we'll
put you on the back of a T shirt and
we'll put your ad in our media guide. And it
costs five hundred dollars to get the shirts. So we

(30:15):
just are basically trading and kind of moving money from
there to there. And so I tell our kids, says,
help me get these companies. As many companies you get,
as many shirts as we get, And I think they
didn't think I was telling the truth.

Speaker 6 (30:27):
One year if we had eleven So we had eleven shirts, but.

Speaker 5 (30:31):
That money came from then, and we just kind of
a would hand them out one at a time as
a week would go by. So there's some easy things
there we'll do. We'll do signage around our facilities, like
I'm sure everybody does, but all of those what they
have in common profit, Like every dollar you make is profit.
So if you go to a company, hey we want

(30:52):
to a sign but we can't do money. Can we
trade you? Yes, yeah, of course we'll take whatever you
want to feed our kids and we'll trade you for
a sign deal.

Speaker 6 (31:03):
But big money. So the other bucket of that is
big money. That's facilities.

Speaker 5 (31:08):
It's like we had field turf and we had an
indoor I'm sorry, a video board I'm trying to right now.
To raise money for an indoor stor that money you
have to go to big companies. And it was explaining
to me a few different ways. Every one of you
your school has an account with a bank, everybody has one,
and it's probably a large account.

Speaker 6 (31:29):
The bank can borrow.

Speaker 5 (31:31):
I think it's eight to ten times the amount of
money that's in the account.

Speaker 6 (31:35):
So if you have a.

Speaker 5 (31:37):
Million dollars in a bank account, they can leverage that
million dollars to get eight to ten million.

Speaker 6 (31:43):
So you can follow along with me on that.

Speaker 5 (31:44):
So if your school has ten million, they're not going
to blink when you ask them to give you fifty
thousand dollars to put a patch on your turf because
they don't want to lose your account. So and the
other banks want your account, so you start looking at okay,
that's one way we can go. Use advertising and we

(32:05):
will put your your logo of your company on our
turf or on our video board or whatever it is.
And the same deal there. You don't want to give money,
but you want to trade. You know, a couple of
years ago, I was riding around a nice little truck
because they wanted to trade, and our superintendent green light
of that thing, and I was like, yes, sir, so
you can trade there too. But the other thing you

(32:28):
can do is a lot of your local We try
to with the banks. We'll take a big project and
stretch the payments. So you're going to do turf, well,
it's six hundred thousand dollars whatever it is, that's a
lot of money. But if you're doing it over ten years.
So part of what one of the bank's gifts was
was it like a one percent interest loan. So now

(32:51):
we're going to do it over ten years. Sixty thousand
a year. That's doable. Like that's a doable number. You
go hit up ten or twelve businesses at five grand
a year and now you can reach that.

Speaker 6 (33:05):
So that's a couple of different things we've done.

Speaker 5 (33:07):
I think schools underestimate the power of advertising out their school.
When you think about how businesses operate. You know, everybody
wants to be the first car you buy because you're
going to be loyal to that brand. So car companies
they're going to want to be on your campus, so
they're going to be willing to get money to be there.
Banks want you to use their credit card, they're going

(33:29):
to be there. Restaurants want you to they're going to
be there.

Speaker 6 (33:32):
So I think a lot.

Speaker 5 (33:33):
Of times we undersell the value of being visible at
our campus. But basically that's all we did is we took. Okay,
this video board is gonna cost us three hundred thousand.
We're going to do it over five years. I can
have this much. And that's how I would pick out
how much it costs to advertise on there. So we're

(33:53):
actually at We're actually one point eight million now and
I'm working to do an indoor so if that happens,
we'll it three million over the last time. So and
I'm We're in a small, rural, sixty poverty area, so
we can do it.

Speaker 6 (34:11):
It is doable. We did put a book out, So I've.

Speaker 5 (34:14):
Got a book called Fun Athletic Fundraising and which that book, Yeah,
well basically that when I write stuff, guys, I try
to just meet potatoes, like no fluff, meet potatoes. So
it's got it. Here's our exact campaign we used, here's
our rules we used, here's how we did it. And
so that book could be a good resource that people

(34:34):
are looking.

Speaker 3 (34:35):
That's awesome stuff, I do.

Speaker 2 (34:37):
I know that Davis trying to get the indoor too,
So I bet he's up there tomorrow talking to the
bank that has the account to Anderson County.

Speaker 3 (34:45):
High School and he will be figuring out how to
get some of that money.

Speaker 4 (34:50):
That's right. That's that's why I got That's why I
got Kenny's book so I can get that done. And
it is a really good book. Kenny, Kenny does a
nice job. And uh, I think I think there's when
I when I when I've when I've purchased this stuff.
There's two things. I think it's great for an older
coach like me to sort of check yourself. I think

(35:13):
it's also a really good resource for a young guy.
You know, Kenny's already done a lot and he's figured
out the way that things will really work. And uh,
I think I think wherever you are on the spectrum
of being a football coach, Kenny Simpson's materials are are
going to benefit you. They're going to help you.

Speaker 2 (35:30):
Appreciate it some great information tonight, coach. We really appreciate it.
We really appreciate you taking the time to share some
of that information. I think our listeners will be checking
into your websites and and uh, it.

Speaker 3 (35:44):
Was really good stuff. We can't thank you enough.

Speaker 5 (35:47):
I appreciate having me on and for doing the podcast
and giving back to coaches.

Speaker 6 (35:51):
I think it's really cool.

Speaker 5 (35:52):
Anytime I get a chance to visit the coaches that
are doing this kind of stuff where you're trying to
help other people and man, if I can never do
it to help, I will and just appreciate you all
for having me on.

Speaker 4 (36:04):
Hey, thank you coach, and a good luck to you
this fall, and best wisions for continued to continued success
with your business. That's wonderful. Thank you, sir.

Speaker 3 (36:14):
Have a good night, David.

Speaker 2 (36:21):
We're gonna move on to our tough topic, which it's uh,
who did you say, the anonymous tough topic.

Speaker 3 (36:31):
Well it wasn't.

Speaker 4 (36:33):
He's this from George Bowen, who is uh he is
the O C at Woodford County and sort of cool
because I went up to watch UK practice Saturday and
George was there. In fact, uh, hey, he gave me
a book to read. I started, I got it. I
started reading it. It's uh, guys, I think all so

(36:59):
I believe, but it's a out Kyle Shanahan and all
those guys, the coach together, Sean McVay, Michael McDonald, all
that stuff. So I started looking at that. But anyways,
comes from George Bowen, and I'll let you you read
it and then we'll jump into it.

Speaker 2 (37:14):
It's a great question. It's Uh, yes, the question is
new to coordinating. What are some piece of pieces of
advice we would have for new coordinators? And then you
know what's the hit football coach looking for? Because we
both have hired coordinators in our experiences, you know what's
some of the dudes and the don'ts. So you usually

(37:37):
go first, don't you? Or I can go first.

Speaker 4 (37:39):
It don't make any difference. Hey, it's totally up to you.
I'm good with either one.

Speaker 3 (37:44):
Yeah, we'll go ahead.

Speaker 6 (37:45):
All right?

Speaker 4 (37:46):
Then, well, okay, uh, you know, I think a lot
of people I think maybe sometimes you and I take
it for granted, but I'm not sure everybody does. But
I think the first thing you got to do is
you got to get really organized. If you're gonna to
be a coordinator somewhere, you've got to you've got to
be organized with what you want to do. And you know,

(38:06):
and always go back to this. I think about like
our game planning, our scripting and call sheet stuff and
all that, but I think you've got to take something
that is infinite. I mean, you can do anything, you
really can on either side of the ball. You've got
to make that finite. You've got to sort of get
that under control and show that you've got to plan.

(38:29):
I think you've got to make a detailed install plan
for your coach. You know, you've got to show him
step by step that you're you're going to know how
to put this in. You've got to be able to
mesh what you know that best schemes that will fit
what your players can do. You know, he talked a

(38:49):
little bit about that tonight and I thought that was
really good. And I really think that he's got a
good approach and it's an approach that we've really tried
to follow, which is, yes, there is a base offense
and there's a base defense, but you can emphasize different
skill sets from year to year. And I thought that

(39:10):
he taught in the gun tee. I thought coach Coach
Simpson did a good job talking about that. I think
that you've got to prep for situational football, but I've
got to make your base has got to be able
to adapt to those situations. I don't think situational football
can be a complete abandoning of the base. It's got

(39:31):
to be somehow connected to the base. I think you're
at watch a lot of video because you have to
be able to execute and stop what your key opponents
can do. And I think that when you build, if
you want to be a coordinator, when you're building your
base offense and defense, I think one of the factors
needs to be who have we got to be to

(39:51):
win our district, win our region, win our state championship.
I think that's got to be part of your plan.
And I know if I'm wanting to hire a coordinator,
I want to hear a guy that's going to be
able to help us be the toughest opponents on our schedule.
And I think this too. I think if you want
to be a coordinator, you need to talk to a

(40:13):
guy that has built a program and has had success,
because I don't think that what works at the blue
blood programs will always work well in a new situation.
And I think that if you can talk to somebody
that sort of had to build it, and you know
that's why I think, you know, Coach Simpson, I think

(40:33):
part of why his plan, you know, he sort of
had to adjust when his personnel changed and things were tough.
But I think I think if you can talk to
a guy that's built a program and had success planning
your offense and your defense. I just think they're going
to have some insights and they will have had to
solve some problems that there's probably a good chance you're

(40:54):
going to be facing.

Speaker 3 (40:57):
That's a great question. I'm in great answer, David, real,
very good, very thorough. I really like that.

Speaker 2 (41:02):
I mean, I agree with everything that you said. I
have a couple of things I'll add, uh, you know,
to it somewhat.

Speaker 3 (41:10):
And it's if.

Speaker 2 (41:12):
You know, if I'm if I'm looking, you know, to
be a coordinator, then I obviously I want to be confident,
you know, if I'm hired to come in and be
a coordinator, uh at somebody, you know, somebody school that's
already got assistant coaches there, and I'm going to be
the coordinator that I want to be confident in what
I'm doing, not cocky or arrogant, though I think there's

(41:34):
a difference. Not cocky or arrogant, but being confident you
will because you're going to need those assistant coaches, you know,
to buy into what you're what you want them to do.

Speaker 4 (41:44):
Uh.

Speaker 2 (41:44):
You know they're needed you you need their help to
sell that system, uh and that plan you know, to
the players. So being arrogant and being cocky isn't going
to convince those other assistant coaches that are going to
be working under you.

Speaker 4 (42:02):
Uh.

Speaker 3 (42:02):
You know, it's not going to convent.

Speaker 2 (42:04):
You know, it's not going to They're not going to
buy into it if if they don't like your approach.
I think, uh, communication, I think if you communicate it well,
then that kind of gives them knowledge and them as
in the other assistance that are working for you, it
gives them knowledge and power, uh, and the confidence to

(42:27):
be able to to.

Speaker 3 (42:29):
Sell it to the players. Okay.

Speaker 2 (42:31):
Uh, And I think, uh it takes leadership, you know
from this coordinator. Uh, he's gonna have to have some
leadership skills because ultimately the goal is to bring everybody
on your side of the ball together buying into the
system and to the plan. You cannot You can't do
it by yourself.

Speaker 3 (42:52):
I don't.

Speaker 2 (42:53):
If you think you can, then you we're going to
go back to that cocky and arrogant comment that I
made earlier.

Speaker 3 (42:59):
You're not it's not going to work for you. You're not.

Speaker 2 (43:02):
It's not You're not going to have any success because
you can't do it by yourself.

Speaker 3 (43:05):
Nobody can't.

Speaker 2 (43:06):
So I think confidence, communication, knowledge, leadership. I also think
that skills are important. I also think that you want
to keep and you address some of these things that
you want to keep it simple.

Speaker 3 (43:22):
You know, if the players don't.

Speaker 2 (43:24):
Understand it, then it's not it's it's probably not going
to work. I think you want to use as a
young or as a coach in today's world. I think
you want to use technology to help you and uh,
you know, I think it is the future. You know,
don't fight it. Use that technology that you have available.

(43:46):
It's out there, you know. Uh, it was simply just
use a huddle to make your life easier.

Speaker 6 (43:55):
You know.

Speaker 3 (43:56):
Uh, what would would be.

Speaker 2 (43:57):
One example of using technologlogy? You know that that I'm
speaking of. I think you got to be a good teacher.
I do it doesn't it doesn't matter what you know,
if if if, if you don't have the skills to
teach it to others, then uh, you're you're going to fall.

Speaker 3 (44:17):
In your face, you know. I think you got to
be a good teacher.

Speaker 2 (44:20):
And and and and and be able to present materials
so that people can understand it.

Speaker 4 (44:27):
Uh.

Speaker 2 (44:27):
I think you want to demonstrate a hard work and
commitment by always being prepared and organized as you. As
you mentioned, I think you got to have your players
ready practice situational football, whether it's you know, third downs,
short downs, red zones, two minutest, et cetera. No matter
what side of the ball you're on. You know, that's

(44:49):
all part of practicing and preparing. I think you got
to be able to do that. Fundamentals. You know you can't,
you can't. You know, UH under estimate the power of fundamentals.

Speaker 3 (45:02):
I have.

Speaker 2 (45:03):
Hung my hat on my entire career on the philosophy
that and I truly believe it with all my heart
that it's it's not what you do, but how.

Speaker 3 (45:13):
You do it. And I really believe that.

Speaker 2 (45:15):
I believe you can run any offense, any defense if
you focus on the fundamentals, then you'll you'll figure out
how to make it work.

Speaker 3 (45:24):
It's not what you do, but it's how you do it.

Speaker 4 (45:26):
And that's that's why we were doing those technique practices,
weren't we.

Speaker 3 (45:30):
That's exactly right, exactly right.

Speaker 2 (45:33):
And then David uh as far as the head coach,
you know what he what he's looking for. I can
speak for myself, you know, besides the obvious.

Speaker 3 (45:42):
When I was hiring a coordinator.

Speaker 2 (45:44):
Uh, you know the obvious, like does he have communication skills,
does he have the confidence?

Speaker 3 (45:51):
Does he have the knowledge?

Speaker 4 (45:52):
You know?

Speaker 2 (45:52):
Besides the obvious, there were two things that I was
looking for, and uh those two.

Speaker 3 (45:58):
One of those two things is, uh, do we.

Speaker 2 (46:01):
Share the same philosophy or at least a similar philosophy.

Speaker 3 (46:06):
If not, then it's probably not gonna work.

Speaker 2 (46:09):
If he has a completely different philosophy coming in as
a coordinator, then then what my philosophy is, it's probably
not gonna work. So it's got to be similar or
familiar or similar or or you know, uh, for the
same philosophy for it, I think, for it to work.
And then the second thing is really big as well
as do I trust him? I mean, it's a it's

(46:31):
a big deal. It's a big deal. If if I
don't trust you, I'm not going to hire you. I'm
not gonna let you do it.

Speaker 3 (46:40):
I've got to trust you.

Speaker 2 (46:42):
It's at the end of the day, it's my neck
that's on the line. And I think, if you're a
coordinator and you're coming in, uh, it's not.

Speaker 3 (46:52):
My job to trust you.

Speaker 2 (46:53):
Is your job to earn my trust as at being
as me being the head coach, and I think you
got to earn his trust.

Speaker 4 (47:02):
Uh.

Speaker 3 (47:02):
And it's a never.

Speaker 2 (47:03):
Ending uh uh, you know job, continuing to earn my
trust over and over and over again. And I was,
you know, privileged and honored to have some great, great
coordinators in my career and they I trusted. I trusted
them for with with anything, you know, I really would.

(47:27):
Chris Purdue was, you know, as good.

Speaker 3 (47:29):
As they come. He was my right hand man.

Speaker 2 (47:32):
He's he was with me, you know, at Boyle County,
And I mean I trusted Chris. I didn't even worry
about that side of the ball when Chris was because
I knew he was going to outwork everybody. I knew
he was gonna be prepared. I knew he was going
to be ready to go. He's gonna have the players
ready to go. I trusted, you know. And Perry Thomas.

(47:53):
I had Perry Thomas, you know that as a coordinator
when I was at Campbell's Bee Harry was in the
same mode as Chris, you know, earned my trust over
and over and over again by by outworking everybody, by
by being a hard worker. Jeff Hester falls into that category.

(48:14):
Chris Mason falls into that category.

Speaker 4 (48:17):
You know.

Speaker 2 (48:18):
I mean I trusted those guys and and uh, you know,
I think that you know, I take a bullet for them,
and I think they take a bullet from me. And
that's the kind of relationship that I want from my coordinators.

Speaker 4 (48:31):
Yeah, that's good. I feel bad I didn't name any
of my guys that I've had some great ones, I
tell you what, though, it's still without getting Indy any names.
You sort of made me think of a couple of things. Uh,
you know, when you're talking about you know, you got
to have a similar philosophy. I agree with that. And
once you're at that point, the next thing I would say,

(48:54):
is a guy, this got initiative. I mean, you didn't
have to tell those coordinators what to do. They were
doing the job. And I've even had to tell coaches
sometimes say, look, I hope in the next year I
get mad at you because you did something I wish
you hadn't. I said, but go ahead and do it.
You know, I just I think it's easier to drag

(49:15):
him off the pile than to drag him to it.
And you know, fortunately, like our DC right now at
Anderson County, Chris Crawley Goodman, I mean, he's doing a
super jib and man, I don't have to hold his
hand at all. He's very aggressive, he brings a lot
to the table and basically he just keeps going unless
I step in his way and stopping and he's doing

(49:37):
a super job.

Speaker 3 (49:38):
You don't do that because you trust him.

Speaker 4 (49:40):
Right Amen. That's a great point. And then along with
that whole trust in him. I thought about this. I
think one of the best things you can get to
as a head coach is like and I had this
with William Harris more than once. I wasn't really quite
sold exactly on what you were doing or why, but

(50:02):
I would go along with it because I knew that
he knew more about the problem than I knew about him.
And I would say, well, I'm not exactly sure how
this is going to play out, but say, you know
more about this than I do, so we're going with
your playing. And man, when you can say that as
a head coach, that's a great feeling. That is a
great feeling.

Speaker 3 (50:22):
Yeah, yeah, it really is.

Speaker 2 (50:24):
And you know, like I said, it just kind of
goes back to trusting somebody in and from a head
coaching standpoint, you know you've got a lot going on,
and you got a lot of pressure on you, and
it's your at the end of the day, it's your
it's your Necknu's on the line. So that's why I
say it's important that that coordinator takes the philosophy that hey,

(50:48):
I've got to earn his trust every single day, and
I got to do that by performing out working, producing
over and over and over again. And uh, when that happens,
you got something special going on. And I was privileged
and honor to have some really really good guys that
work that I worked with that earned my trust all

(51:10):
the time.

Speaker 4 (51:11):
Well, hey, you're right about those guys. And uh, I
tell you what to of mine or three of mine
at Mason that really tore it up, Chris Solery. I
found Sean Thompson because not just so much you. He
was in Jackie Study's school class, and I found that
Sean did a great job. And then Larry Harris was excellent.
But you're right, though, and when you when you got

(51:34):
those pieces in place, boys, shure us make a big difference.
And hey, David, it was a great show.

Speaker 3 (51:41):
It was a great show tonight.

Speaker 4 (51:42):
Yeah, it was George. I appreciate George's thought and I
really like uh. I thought coach Simpson was really good,
and I thought he drought a lot to the table.
He did, not just from the football piece of it,
from running a program, piece of you and they go
to get other they really do.

Speaker 2 (52:01):
Yeah, so I want to ask them to hold on now,
you guys, hold on and listen to that historical segment
at the end.

Speaker 3 (52:09):
Mike does a great job with that.

Speaker 4 (52:12):
He does. And our next episode will be Thursday, May
the first at seven thirty, and that will be our
last episode of season three. So I'll just talk our listeners.
What's that every off season three and we're already working
our tails off to make sure season four is going

(52:33):
to be a good one. So we'll be back with
you on Thursday, May first at seven thirty. And as
Chuck said, be sure to listen to Matt check you
on GWe and close us out there.

Speaker 2 (52:45):
Yeah, thank you guys for tuning in. We always appreciate it.
I think you've got a lot of good information tonight,
and we'll get you back next time.

Speaker 3 (52:53):
Thank you.

Speaker 7 (52:55):
Sports, and in particular, high school sports, are woven into
the fabric of Americana. High school sports are part of
the DNA of communities across the country, and that is
certainly true in Kentucky. Fans know the stories of the
big names, but there are many names and many stories
that have been lost to history. This series highlights those

(53:20):
forgotten heroes. Welcome to this edition of Forgotten Heroes. I'm
your host, Mack Yoakum. Let's talk basketball, specifically how a
boy from Kentucky revolutionized the game. John Miller Cooper grew
up in the tiny Henderson County, Kentucky community of Cordon.

(53:40):
There must be something about Cordon because it was the
birthplace of Basketball Hall of Famer Frank Ramsey, the NBA's
first grade six man, and Cordon was also the birthplace
of ab Happy Chandler, the Kentucky governor who became the
Commissioner of Baseball who was responsible for Jackie Robinson breaking
the color barrier. But back to John Miller Cooper. John

(54:02):
Miller Cooper played his first three years of high school
basketball at Corydon High. One day, when he was shooting
on the outdoor court at Corydon, the school didn't have
a gym. A college player from Chicago happened to be there.
John saw him jumping up and throwing the ball toward
the goal. He found that interesting and started trying it himself.

(54:23):
He practiced and practiced in the family smokehouse that his
father had let him convert into his own gym. Little
did anyone in the tiny town of Coridon know that
John Miller Cooper was about to forever change doctor Na
Smith's game. His senior year, the family moved to Hopkinsville, Kentucky,
and he joined the team at Hopkinsville High. With Cooper,

(54:46):
Hopkinsville was a regional favorite. The Paduca's Son newspaper said
this in the March eleventh, nineteen thirty edition. Cooper has
a style of shooting that is particularly difficult to guard
into the air with every shot, making it a real
task for a guard to get high enough to stop
one of his attempts at the basket. John Miller Cooper

(55:09):
took his new fangled jump shot to the University of Missouri.
The first time he tried it in a college game,
his coach told him to never do that again. At Missouri,
he lettered in three sports. He was an all conference
performer for the Tigers, leading them in scoring for three years,
and he also won a conference track title in the

(55:30):
quarter mile. The Missouri students called him jump Shot Cooper.
He is in the Missouri Athletics Hall of Fame. John
Miller Cooper is sometimes lost in the annals of basketball
history because he chose not to go the professional basketball route. Instead,
he chose academia. He earned three degrees at Missouri. It

(55:53):
would only be fitting that the inventor of the jump
shot would find his place in the world of a
new science, biomechanics and kinesiology. John Miller Cooper is considered
the father of modern biomechanics and human movement. During his
time teaching at Southern cal and Indiana University, he wrote

(56:15):
the textbooks used in the field. Among the other books
he wrote was The Theory and Science of Basketball and
Basketball Player Movement Skills. He won multiple academic awards. The
National Academy of Kinesiology sponsors a national lecture series in
his name, and the graduate program in kinesiology at Indiana

(56:37):
University is named in his honor. Basketball and track coaches
across the country regularly called him for help with the
mechanics of their athletes performances. While he was teaching at Indiana,
Bobby Knight came to him with a problem that one
of his star players had trouble pivoting. John Miller Cooper

(56:57):
surveyed the problem and he put a lift in the
toe of the shoe, and coach Knight never had another
problem with that player again. Others have led claim to
inventing the jump shot. Across the Kentucky state line in Pound, Virginia,
a young man named Glenn Roberts had started using the
jump shot around the same time as Cooper, but because

(57:20):
Roberts had joined a barnstorming team, more people saw his
new jump shot. Some credit Kenny Sailors or Hank Lucetti,
but they really only popularized the shot on the college level,
and that was years after John Miller Cooper was at Missouri.
Some even credit Kutawa, Kentucky native jumping Joe Fulkes with
the invention of the jump shot, but really he just

(57:42):
used it to set more scoring records and making it
a useful tool in the NBA. The NCAA, though, credits
John Miller Cooper with the invention of the jump shot
because his coach at Missouri was the president of the
College Basketball Coaches Association and he asked at the annual
meeting if anyone had ever seen a player jump to shoot.

(58:04):
When the delegates all answered no, it was placed in
the record that John Miller Cooper was using the jump shot,
thereby making him the first in their records. John Miller Cooper,
a kid from rural western Kentucky with outstanding athletic abilities

(58:24):
and a fascination for human movement, transformed the game of
basketball and made a lasting mark in the academic world
through the mechanics of sport. John Miller Cooper passed away
at the age of ninety eight in twenty ten. Join
us next time for another edition of Forgotten Heroes. Forgotten

(58:46):
Heroes is available at most podcast outlets.

Speaker 6 (59:30):
Think the

Speaker 5 (01:00:01):
Three da