Coaches Office with guest Coach Mike Marksbury

The coaches welcome Spencer County Coach Mike Marksbury

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:10):
Coach David Buchanan Coach Chuck Smith, two legendary high school
football coaches. This is the Coach's Office, a behind the

(00:33):
scenes look at Kentucky high school football.

Speaker 2 (00:42):
Welcome to the Coach's Office behind the Scenes with Chuck
Smith and David Buchanan. This is season four, episode seven,
So man, we're flying through this season. I'm Chuck Smith.
I'm joined by co hosts David Buchanan, and our podcast
editor slash storyteller is Mike Yoakam. Our YouTube version of

(01:03):
this podcast is at teacock like a subscribe If you
hit like and subscribe it, we really would appreciate it. It
helps us out quite a bit. Our show tonight, we
have another great show for you. Our guest is Mike Marksbury.
He's the head football coach and also the athletic director

(01:25):
at Spencer County High School. You know, leading a program
in a rural area brings a lot of challenges in
its own but coach Marksbury has a good program at
Spencer County that has found consistent success, you know, And
we're going to have him on here in just a
few minutes, and he is going to tell us how

(01:46):
he's been able to do that hopefully. Our tough topic
is from lmbkt on and he's from Bluegrass Preps, and
it's create a system where the Tuckey High School Athletic
Association moves teams either up or down based upon their success.

(02:08):
So you know, it's it's uh, whether they're struggling. You know,
it's a good question, and it's a it's a question.
It's that sometimes surfaces during the playoffs. We're getting closer
and closer to the playoffs, so it's a good question
to address. H David and I will talk a little
bit about that question as soon as we finished with

(02:28):
coach Marksbury. Our games of the week. We got rock
Castle in Bell County, two really good games. Those two
or two rivals, uh, two physical, tough, hard and those
football teams. That will be a really good game. Also,
we got Callaway and Franklin Simpson as our other game
of the week.

Speaker 3 (02:48):
Uh.

Speaker 2 (02:49):
Now, just talk a little bit about Mike before we
bring you one. As I said, he's the head football
coach of Spencer County High School. His first season at
Spencer would in twenty eleven, so he's been the head
football coach of Spencer. What going on, you know, fifteen
years and he's won ninety five games there. He is

(03:12):
currently four and two, got his team off to a
really nice start, and he's also the school's athletic director,
which is really interesting. I know some coaches do that.
I know it's pretty hard to juggle that. We're gonna
talk to Mike a little bit about that. As I said,
he's he's done a great job of taking a rule
program and finding that consistent success year after year and

(03:38):
also having the challenge of leading the entire athletic program
at Spencer County High School. So, David, would you like
to bring Mike on I will.

Speaker 4 (03:50):
I'd say I've enjoyed getting to know Mike since I've
been in Anderson County, where You've got a JV freshman
conference together and we started scrimmaging each other and they
do a.

Speaker 5 (04:00):
Really good job.

Speaker 4 (04:00):
And Mike, I don't know if this is a good
or bad thing about you, but Mike's one of the
last guys I can get along with, so you know
that that's how we sort of ended up, you know,
working together and so forth. But uh, but anyway, he
does a really really good job, and uh, I'm really
excited to have.

Speaker 5 (04:18):
Him on our podcast.

Speaker 4 (04:19):
I think our listeners are going to be impressed with
Mike and the job that he's done at Spencer County.

Speaker 5 (04:23):
I think it's gonna be really good.

Speaker 2 (04:25):
Thank you, Thank you Mike for joining us tonight.

Speaker 6 (04:28):
It's awesome to be here. It's Uh, I listened to
your All show. It's generally a Thursday ritual.

Speaker 2 (04:35):
Uh.

Speaker 3 (04:36):
He's in the barn for Friday night. You come home
and turn on a college or an NFL game and
listen to your Alls podcast. It's it's it's amazing school football.

Speaker 2 (04:47):
Well, we appreciate that. Hey, let me start you off
with the first question here. How do you balance being
both a hit football coach and the athletic director there
Spencer County High School? How do you how you how
you been able to on set?

Speaker 6 (05:00):
Well, I mean it's it's it's not easy, but fortunately
we have a great administration. We have a great principal
and very academic and athletic minded. I have two assistant
athletic directors that are also coaches there. And you know,
generally the toughest part of the season for me is

(05:21):
the fall season and uh sometimes uh. You know Stuart Peel,
who is our baseball coach Jason Burns, who is our
basketball coach. There are assistant a d SO on Fridays
game days, and I really have nothing to do. You know,
I'm a football coach and they really want me locked
in on football on Friday. So, uh, they take care

(05:43):
of everything. I help them with a little bit of
the setup during the day, but that's that's about it.
But uh, you know, I have a schedule during the
day that allows me. I have a couple of weightlifting
classes and then the rest of the day I'm able
to focus on my athletic director duties and football. So
you know, it's very fortunate that we have an administration
that provides us to support to make that make that happen.

(06:05):
And when I took that on, I don't know if
that's thirteen years ago. I took both duties on. I
told my principal at the time, I said, look, I'm
a football coach first. If it ever gets to where
there's conflicts, uh, the AD job will go. But look,
we're extremely competitive. I like I like all of our
programs to be successful. And uh, you know, two years

(06:26):
ago we went to Sweet sixteen in basketball. Last year
we went to state tournament, baseball. So you know, we've
had some success and uh we uh s a rural
community and a lot of support, uh and uh it
makes things fun.

Speaker 2 (06:41):
Hey, Mike, what's the biggest challenges that rural schools face,
you know when it comes to fundraising or funding or
funding for athletics. Does your Board of Education kick in
any money?

Speaker 3 (06:54):
Well, it's a little bit difficult in Spencer County because
you know, we don't have a lot of industry.

Speaker 6 (06:59):
I mean, actually the school district, which I guess that
could be the same in a lot of towns, but
it's the largest.

Speaker 3 (07:05):
Employers in the community.

Speaker 6 (07:06):
There's there's no uh factories or distilleries or anything like that.
So it's uh, it's it's a little bit it's a
little bit tough.

Speaker 3 (07:17):
Uh.

Speaker 6 (07:18):
Our uh school district supports, uh supports us.

Speaker 3 (07:24):
In what we need.

Speaker 6 (07:24):
There's not like that we go without anything for any
of our sports about the the rural community, you know,
it's just there's just not a lot of industry and
tax base there. So it's it's really difficult for for
you know, our school district and everything to generate the
funds necessary.

Speaker 2 (07:41):
Uh.

Speaker 3 (07:42):
Two Uh, you know.

Speaker 6 (07:45):
Probably give us everything we need, probably one of the
few schools that doesn't have turf turf football field.

Speaker 3 (07:51):
But you know, we have what we need necessary.

Speaker 2 (07:56):
Yeah. Well, but but it's pretty good that your your
board of education and is willing to provide the necessary
equipment and things that your athletic programs need.

Speaker 3 (08:07):
Absolutely.

Speaker 6 (08:08):
Our superintendent's a former football coach, doctor Foster, and our
board of education they do they do anything they can
to help support us. And you know it's not like
they just spent uh quite a bit of money redoing
our weight room and everything for us. This spreads, that's
that those are things you know, we have, we have
the tools necessary.

Speaker 3 (08:27):
It's uh again.

Speaker 6 (08:29):
Like we're probably one of the few schools in state
that doesn't have turf right now. Well David David doesn't
have turf either, so uh but yeah, but which I'm
fine with that.

Speaker 3 (08:38):
We have a nice commuted field, so I'm.

Speaker 5 (08:40):
Fine with Yeah, I am too.

Speaker 4 (08:44):
Hey, Mike, uh, I want to ask you something because
you know, we we scrimmaged you. You guys were a
little different maybe than we anticipated.

Speaker 5 (08:51):
Are you still truly running the wing tea or.

Speaker 4 (08:55):
Is it evolved so much that you think it's become
something different?

Speaker 6 (08:58):
What do you think, Well, I think we're you know,
I want to we're a wing tea team, but uh,
several you know, I don't know, four or five years ago,
we went to a clinic in Dublin, Georgia, and Roger
Holmes down there kind of we spoke with him and
he kind of we started incorporating the little bit of
the option uh into our offense. And uh this year

(09:23):
or two years ago we brought it. We were fortunate
to hire a coach, Zeke Eyer, who came from Whitley
County and he had a background in coaching the triple options.
So what we're trying to do is we're trying to
incorporate the triple option into uh, into our system. So
we're we're a buck suite.

Speaker 3 (09:42):
Uh.

Speaker 6 (09:43):
We like to attack the a gaps and we like
to attack the edge with rockets and jets and everything
like that.

Speaker 3 (09:50):
You're good, Yeah, we try to be.

Speaker 6 (09:52):
It's I mean, we're you know, we're not blessed with
a lot of athletes. We just have a bunch of
tough kids that go out there and they believe in
our system and uh, you know, we try.

Speaker 3 (10:05):
To uh try to build on it.

Speaker 6 (10:07):
And I do really feel like that once we incorporated
midline and the triple and everything into what we did,
it kind of made us some more uh dynamic offense.
I mean, I would hate to prepare for us, but
we do need to become a little bit more efficient
at throwing the ball.

Speaker 3 (10:27):
Uh, you know, we run it so much.

Speaker 6 (10:29):
We should be better than we have been throwing the
ball off of play action and whatnot.

Speaker 5 (10:35):
I gotcha.

Speaker 2 (10:36):
I know that he's got some good bloodline coming up
that system there, Smith. That's uh, that's distantly connected to me,
but really connected to My brother. Was one heck of
a football player, baseball. He did it all baseball, football, Uh,
and very very good in high school.

Speaker 6 (10:56):
Actually, Isaiah is really really Isaiah is a really really
good football player.

Speaker 3 (11:01):
He's a sophomore.

Speaker 6 (11:02):
Starting for us and now he's he's a really good
football player.

Speaker 2 (11:07):
He got a good bood line, you also got. You
also got a tammy in there.

Speaker 3 (11:12):
I got a tammy. It's a sophomore, and I got
a tammy that's an eighth grader. I'd say that's probably
pretty good.

Speaker 2 (11:19):
They got a good blood line. Hey, Mike, let me uh,
let me get to my next question. Here, says you
guys have got you. Guys have knocked on the door
some you really have. You've had a lot of success.
What do you think is going to take uh to
get your program to go from you know, better than
average to that next step elite.

Speaker 3 (11:40):
Well?

Speaker 6 (11:41):
I think the first thing that happened that has really
made a dramatic difference was this is our third year
within school weightlifting. So I had always heard coaches.

Speaker 3 (11:52):
Talk about in school weightlifting whatnot, and I was like, now,
is it that big of a deal. Well, it's a
big it's a big deal. Is a big deal, and
it has uh, it has our program. It has changed the.

Speaker 6 (12:03):
Way our look and UH, that's that's the first thing.

Speaker 3 (12:09):
And UH, I think we need to do a little
bit of a better job of getting youth league and
middle school aligned.

Speaker 1 (12:19):
Uh.

Speaker 6 (12:20):
Little school coaches do a really good job getting players out,
but we always had a little bit of a struggle
the uh with the with the youth league. And we've
just got to try to get all those guys, get
all that tied in.

Speaker 2 (12:36):
UH.

Speaker 6 (12:36):
You know the other thing is just having uh I
probably need to It would probably help us a little
bit if I could bring a strength coach.

Speaker 3 (12:45):
Into our program.

Speaker 6 (12:47):
Uh right now we do it as coaches and everything
like that with a lot of help from coach mcleoud.
And you know, he's he's a huge resource for me
as far as touching base with him and the information
that he's given me has just totally changed the way
our kids look, the way they moved, and we've had
a total shift of how we do things in the

(13:08):
weight room and it's made a huge difference.

Speaker 2 (13:11):
Yeah, Andrew talks highly of you. He doesn't have a
bad thing to say about you. He's always talking good
about you.

Speaker 3 (13:17):
I was very fortunate. I was very fortunate, you know,
my time at Mercer there.

Speaker 6 (13:22):
Uh you know, I had Todd Davis call me one
day and he said, I have somebody look for a
job and he said Andrew McLeod And I didn't even
know him, and I said, well come on. And I
think he was there for two years before he went
down to South Warren and look he was. Uh he
was good for our program and uh great, great person.
And like I said, as a coach, sometimes you just

(13:45):
have to realize that you need to keep learning. And
I think sometimes with there's certain coaches that feel like
they know everything and uh, you know for us, you know,
I love to talk. I love to off the coaches,
and there's been a lot of people that that I've
come in contact with that have been very very beneficial

(14:08):
for me. And uh, and I think that's how you
get better. And uh, you know that's and I think
our program will continue to grow because of that.

Speaker 2 (14:17):
Yeah, and he's Brandon's right hand made.

Speaker 3 (14:20):
Oh yeah, no, he does a really good job.

Speaker 2 (14:22):
Hey, that that weightlifting in the school is a game changer, doubt.

Speaker 6 (14:28):
The two most important things that have allowed us to
kind of get our program trending in the different directions.
First of all is the end school weightlifting. And the
second thing was we started filming our practices. And you know,
this was three or four but look, I just it
was just something we didn't have the resources to do it.

Speaker 3 (14:48):
You didn't have a camera person to do it or whatever.

Speaker 6 (14:51):
And now we've got people are out there flying the
drone filming our and it's just, look.

Speaker 3 (14:55):
It's game changer, game changer.

Speaker 6 (14:58):
It's uh, it's just it's just a difference maker. And
you know, probably the other thing too that could help
us take our program just another step further is is
you know, probably need to add a couple of more coaches,
but it's got to be the right coaches. And we're
very fortunate a lot of our staff is in our building,

(15:20):
you know, So it's uh, you know.

Speaker 3 (15:24):
It's huge. It's it's huge, and uh you know, it's
uh you know to the.

Speaker 6 (15:29):
Point that we have a nice staff, and I want
to make sure that when we're adding people, it kind
of fits what we're fits what we're looking for, and
kind of fits with our staff and everything like that.
So I really feel like we're trending in the right direction.

Speaker 3 (15:44):
We're just we're I look at us and look at
us as a program. We don't beat ourselves. When you
play us, you're gonna have to beat us, and.

Speaker 6 (15:53):
We're not gonna gonna try to help you out. And
uh uh I think that's a good model. And and
our kids believe. We spend a lot of time on defense,
a lot of time on defense, special teams, fundamentals.

Speaker 2 (16:05):
Yeah, hey, hey, Mike, what kind of crowd y'all have
for your games?

Speaker 3 (16:09):
Oh it's huge, it's uh yeah, No, it's.

Speaker 2 (16:12):
In a small rural community.

Speaker 3 (16:13):
They just come. It's it's a big deal.

Speaker 6 (16:16):
I mean we uh uh you know, it's yeah, I
don't know how many people that are there, but I mean, look.

Speaker 3 (16:22):
It's it's many people. It's as many people.

Speaker 6 (16:25):
It's it's a uh it's a really really nice environment.
And uh it's a one horse town. You can go
down to the youth league or to the middle school
and you can see those kids down there and you
know they're coming to you, and uh, you can get
to know those kids and uh, you know, I didn't
know when I came there in twenty eleven, fifteen years
later i'd still be there. But they they've been really

(16:47):
good to me and very supportive.

Speaker 2 (16:51):
Awesome.

Speaker 4 (16:52):
But you know, Mike, you were talking about you know,
you like talking about football and learning and so forth,
and Mike, you've become one of those guys that we
can all learn from. I think you've proven yourself at
Spencer County. So I'm going to put you on the spot.
If a growing rural county wanted to start and build
a football program, what three things would you say are

(17:14):
most important or are non negotiables that they've got to
do these things if they want to have success.

Speaker 5 (17:20):
What would you say those three things are?

Speaker 6 (17:23):
Well, I mean it really the end school weightlifting is
if I were to ever leave Spencer County and I
was going somewhere and they said, you don't have in
school weightlifting. I'm drawing, it's not even something. It's not
even something.

Speaker 3 (17:38):
Believe me. I had no idea how big of a
deal it was.

Speaker 6 (17:42):
It just and my coaching staff didn't because we didn't
know any different. We just knew after school you went
out there and you got in the weight room stuff.
Now it's just like these kids, we work on so
much stuff, but that's the first thing you have to
have in school weightlifting, and I think the other thing too.
You can get a pretty good idea when you're talking
to your principal.

Speaker 3 (18:03):
Uh, you know how committed are they? Uh? I really believe.

Speaker 7 (18:08):
Uh.

Speaker 3 (18:09):
One horse Town is a big deal.

Speaker 2 (18:12):
Uh.

Speaker 6 (18:12):
When you're out there and and you're having to fight kids,
it's just like it's Spencer County. If I have an issue,
like in my complex, let's just say my ice machine
goes down, I text the maintenance guy and probably within thirty.

Speaker 3 (18:24):
Minutes it's fixed.

Speaker 6 (18:26):
You know, it's just the way, you know, it's that's
just our community, that's our school district. It's it's a
one it's a one school. District and I think that
makes a difference. I think that I think that makes
jobs more appealing when they're in a one horse town.
And uh, you know, the other thing is is having
a community that's bought in. And facilities are important too,

(18:50):
but uh, you know, the facilities are important, but it's
the people, the community, Uh, the parents, the you know,
it's just it's uh, the in school weightlifting and the
administration is extremely important and uh you know, uh being
able to recruit staff and you know, like for us,

(19:10):
you know, getting teachers coaches that are in our building,
that's that's not an issue. And our coaches are some
of the best teachers. And we believe in it. We
believe in the whole that we believe in the whole thing.
It's Spencer County and uh, you know, I really do
think it's a it's a hidden gym. And you know,

(19:32):
it's taken fifteen years. You know, I've been there fifteen years,
and you know, I think we have it trending in
the right direction.

Speaker 3 (19:41):
Our numbers are up.

Speaker 6 (19:42):
We have about sixty sixty four kids in our program.
And I will say this, sixty three of the sixty
four from Spencer County.

Speaker 3 (19:50):
So you know, through our middle school everything like that.

Speaker 6 (19:54):
So you know, but it's a you know, we play
tough schedule this year we are to Losses or the
Collins and kc D. So it's, uh, you got to
challenge yourself and uh, you know it's it's fun.

Speaker 3 (20:07):
I enjoy it. But here's the other thing too, and.

Speaker 6 (20:09):
You both know this. It is a lot of work. Yeah,
you know, it is a lot of work. And I
just think, you know, there's no shortcuts to it.

Speaker 2 (20:22):
Hey, hey, Mike, you know in rural communities, you know,
depth uh could be you know, could could be an issue,
you know, quality depth. How have you been able to
maximize you know, the players that you have that do you?
In other words, you think you've got a lot going
both ways?

Speaker 6 (20:40):
Well, we were very Usually what we we have a
process that we try to follow, Like when our kids
come to us, you know, we see them as eighth graders.

Speaker 3 (20:48):
They come over and.

Speaker 6 (20:49):
Generally we bring our eighth graders over after spring break
of their eighth grade year and we get them in
the weight room and they come in two days a
week and we're just teaching them the fundamentals. And usually
we try to identify our kids when they come in
as eighth graders, as freshmens, and we try to say, Okay,
this guy's a defensive end, this kid's an interior defensive lineman,

(21:11):
this kid's a linebacker dB, and you know, we try
to work on the techniques that are going to be
necessary for those kids. Now, last year, we had four
defensive linemen that for two years played nothing but defensive line.

Speaker 3 (21:28):
Basically every day.

Speaker 6 (21:30):
You know, we had we had about six or seven
defensive linemen that we were that's all they did was
defensive line play. We try to get our linemen to
play one side of the ball. It's not always this
year we've got one. We've got a couple that are
having to play both ways.

Speaker 3 (21:47):
But we split time.

Speaker 6 (21:48):
And we had nine seniors, we had ten juniors, and
then we have about twenty two or twenty three sophomore
in about twenty three or twenty four freshmen. So our
numbers are trending upward in our lower classes. So you know,
we we feel really good about our numbers. And uh again,

(22:11):
I think we're big on multi sport athletes. You know,
my son played three sports. We're big on that. We
encourage our kids to play basketball, run track, play baseball.
Our quarterback last year pitched our baseball team to the
state tournament. So I mean it's I think that's big too.
And uh again, in school, weightlifting helps for those kids
are able to go do those things. And you know,

(22:33):
it's just it's a neat place. And again I think
it's a little bit under the radar. But uh, you know,
the last three playoffs we've lost to Franklin, Paduca and Franklin.

Speaker 3 (22:44):
So that back this south.

Speaker 6 (22:46):
So you know, we got Franklin this week, so they're bears.
So but we're we're excited to go play.

Speaker 2 (22:54):
Hey, when I was, you know, when I always had been,
we were somewhat ruled at Boyle County and I always
had a hard time finding a good bus driver. Have
you have you had.

Speaker 3 (23:05):
Any success that we have the best. Let me just
tell you, hey, hey, hey, let me just tell you
right now. All hey, all he talks about is being physical.
He tells.

Speaker 6 (23:18):
Us he fist buffs him, he says, get after him.
And uh, you know he always talks about we're not
physical enough. We need to get more physical, we need
to Uh no, that's uh, that's that's another thing right there.
Uh you know, uh, we have great kids. A lot
of the bus. Ronnie has been our bus driver for

(23:39):
for many many years, and.

Speaker 2 (23:41):
Uh, Ronnie is my brother for the inside.

Speaker 6 (23:45):
Yeah, he is a he is a good, good human being,
a good person. And uh, you know the bus drivers
they fight to drive the football team. They all want
to do it, but he's been doing it, and uh,
you know it's uh it's it's pretty awesome and uh
you know, those.

Speaker 3 (24:04):
Those are just special things.

Speaker 6 (24:06):
I sat on the front right seat of the bus
and me and him talk and uh, you know, the
way of the game.

Speaker 2 (24:12):
And uh but really you find that in those rural communities,
you know, you really do.

Speaker 3 (24:16):
Oh no, absolutely, I mean things that happened.

Speaker 6 (24:22):
You know, I kind of look at it and it's
kind of it's kind of like a throwback. You know,
it's kind of like it's like it was twenty years ago.
And I mean it's sometimes it's not complicated. It's just
how everybody's wanting to come out of the game. You're
it's just you know, it's it's kind of old school.
And you know I am old school, so uh you

(24:42):
know that's uh good. Yeah, yeah, but it's a good
it's a good place and they they've treated me well,
and uh, you know, you're just always trying to improve
and you.

Speaker 3 (24:53):
Know, uh you know, and I know you know this.

Speaker 6 (24:56):
I don't know you're aware of this, but I'm sure
you know. Tom Brown, Oh yeah, he was my he
was my high school coach. So uh yeah, that's that's
Those are just all all kinds of connections. And when
we were at Nelson County, I know you all talked
about coach French all the time. Coaching job at Nelson
are at Spencer County. The first the first thing that

(25:20):
I told our kids, I said, we want to emulate
Mead County. So when Larry was over there, they were tough,
and I said, we want to emulate Boyle County. Those
are the two that's who it now. Of course those
are high high marks to get to. But when Larry
was at me and I was an assistant at Nelson,
we would always play them and they were tough and
they were get after you. And I don't know him personally,

(25:43):
but I have some friends that know him, and I
always admired the way his teams played. And those are
just things that I think you just have when you're
in coaching. It's you don't know everything, and you always
kind of uh watch other people and try to learn
and and uh, you know, I think whether you're in
education or you're in coaching, if you're not, if you're

(26:05):
not out there trying to get better, you're doing your
kids at this service.

Speaker 2 (26:08):
And you were at the Nelton with Bill Mason.

Speaker 3 (26:12):
With Bill Mason.

Speaker 6 (26:12):
Yeah, Bill Mason's a good one. He's a good guy. Hey,
he helps us right now.

Speaker 3 (26:17):
I mean he he was a good coach. Oh No,
he's a really really good and really getting very helpful
to us.

Speaker 6 (26:23):
And he watches some of our stuff on huddle and
gives us some pointers and stuff like that. And like
I said, him and Jeff uh came down this winter
and we had a little clinic that day and just
kind of trying to reinforce how you do things, things
you can do better and yeah, kids in better spots.

Speaker 2 (26:43):
Yeah, Mike, we sure do appreciate it.

Speaker 4 (26:47):
Yeah, you've been super Mike, And I'm really glad we
had John here and I'm glad. I'm glad we get
to work together a lot. You're the best bike. Thank
you so much.

Speaker 3 (26:56):
All right, thank you guys, Appreciate it, Appreciate you.

Speaker 2 (27:00):
Go into our new segment, and of course that's the
tough topic. It's a I think it's a really good question, David.
It's it's a I know you've got some ideas too,
and I think we'll address them maybe next week. But
this is an idea that comes up quite a bit,
and it's from uh uh m b k t on
Bluegrass Preps. Create a system where the Kentucky High School

(27:23):
Athletic Association moves up the teams that have success and
moves down the teams that are struggling in classification. You
want to you wanna take this one first?

Speaker 5 (27:35):
Sure, I'll take it. You know, here's that thing.

Speaker 4 (27:40):
I mean, we see the we see the crazy scores
regular season in our districts, and then, to be quite honest,
we see them in the playoffs, and it seems like,
you know, used to the life sided scores for really
more first maybe second round. Now they're sort of happening.

(28:00):
I mean, they're happening a lot now. And so where
I'm going with this is, even though I thought, obviously
I thought about this, I don't like this idea. And
I don't because I almost feel like it's a punishment
for doing a good job I think it can lend

(28:24):
itself to manipulation, you know, where people you know, it's
like being in the NFL and it's like, Okay, we're
going to take this game so we get the number
one draft pick, you know, that.

Speaker 5 (28:32):
Type of stuff. I don't like that.

Speaker 7 (28:36):
Do.

Speaker 4 (28:36):
I think they need to look at some things and
reevaluate because of some of the scores, like I saw
I don't remember what the score was the other night,
but you know, like Beachwood and Owen County had a
district game the other night, and it was, you know,
it was really out of hand, and I think it
got out of hand really early. I think I saw
something where like it was twenty one to nothing before
Beachwood even got a possession or they even got the ball.

(28:59):
And I think we've got to look at it. And
the other thing, too, is that I've learned working with
our coaches and stuff that I think is a really
big deal that people miss. You know, you and I
have talked over the years about well, I think we
should do this, or I think we should do that,
and we'll still have those conversations, but anymore, I don't

(29:24):
know that that's really the issue of we should do
this or that. I think what the issue is, what
can we get all the coaches to agree upon that
we can all move forward together, because what's really hurt
us in the past is we can't agree on anything,
and we fight amongst each other, and we have no
credibility as Kentucky high school football coaches because we got

(29:47):
one group saying one thing, we got another saying something else.
And you know, I hope that you know, our KFC
elected council, you know, can be the legitimate voice for
the high school football coach But you know, so the
bottom line in is do I like this idea? I'm
not a fan of it. Do I agree that we've
got to figure something out? Yes, I do agree with that,

(30:08):
But I would say that the most important piece of
this whole thing is we have got to get the
coaches all on the same page because if we don't,
we're not going to make any progress. And you know,
I've seen a lot of wasted time and fighting amongst
ourselves that you know, I just think, whatever we decide
we need to do, we got to get everybody on

(30:30):
the same page like we did with COVID in twenty twenty.
That was that was our guys did a great job
with that.

Speaker 5 (30:36):
That's my answer.

Speaker 2 (30:37):
Yeah, but this is a little different than COVID. This
is a I mean, everybody is going to pull for
their own school. It's going to be hard for them
to put aside and say, hey, what's the best for
Kentucky High School Athletic Association. Everybody's going to say, well,
what's the best way? And it's the truth, it really is.

Speaker 5 (30:57):
Yes, it is.

Speaker 2 (30:58):
It'd be hard to get everybody together. But just to
clarify a few things here as I get into my
you know, my answer is, you know, most states, if
you don't know, most states, uh classify high school football
by student enrollment. You know. That's how you get into
a classification. Most states do that.

Speaker 7 (31:17):
Uh.

Speaker 2 (31:18):
The and the idea is to group schools together with
similar numbers, uh you know, in enrollment, uh, similar depth,
you know, resources and participate participation. That that's the theory
behind it. If you have a larger school than they,
the theory is that you should have you know, more depth,

(31:38):
more resources, more uh you know, uh participation into your sports,
and the lower numbers you have, then you should have less.

Speaker 3 (31:48):
You know.

Speaker 2 (31:48):
That's the reasoning behind classifying. You know, these football programs
in these schools into you know, classifications, you know, based
upon your your high school or your numbers, your enrollment numbers.
But but we know right now, we know that that's
not always the case. You know, some uh, you know,

(32:10):
smaller enrollments have great resources and better resources than the
larger enrollment schools. That's that's quite common. I can name
them off right now, some of the schools that have
better resources, better depth, better participation than the schools that
have a larger enrollment. So that theory of why you

(32:32):
classify schools based upoint the numbers, your enrollment numbers is
I don't know if it's uh, if it's you know,
justifiable anymore. I think that that idea is ballid anymore.

Speaker 4 (32:46):
Yeah, and I agree with you, and I know when
we talked about this earlier, Mack hat done some research
on this, and I absolutely agree with what you're saying.
I didn't go down that road on this particular question,
but I do think that resource versus need to be
part of the equation when we're trying to get people
matched up to play people like themselves.

Speaker 5 (33:07):
Absolutely, yes, sir, Yeah, Well.

Speaker 8 (33:09):
That leads to the idea of this question if if
that is the case, if if some of the schools
with less numbers, less enrollment numbers have better resources and
better participation, then that leads to this question.

Speaker 2 (33:27):
You know why all right, if these school are continuing
to have success, then why not move them up a
classification you know as an answer. You know, like a
few states now have already done this, and they call
it the success factor or a competitive balance rule, and

(33:48):
you know that they adjust the classification based upon you know,
your success rate. You know, how much success have you had,
you know, not just your enrollment, but what kind of
success you're having it in playoff or state tiving. You know,
like for example, here Ohio has the competitive balance formula

(34:08):
you know, and it all it considers UH enrollment versus
the success or along with the success you haven't in
the playoffs. UH. Indiana has the success factor. You know,
if you win, if you went a lot, then you
are probably going to be moved up in classification. You know, UH,

(34:30):
Missouri has success a success factor for private schools. You know,
private schools, if you success, you've got to move up.
That would that would involve you know, people like L. C. A.
Coven Dion Catholic you know, Uh, Kentucky Country Days had

(34:50):
a lot of success, you know, just I can't. I'm
gonna miss a bunch. I'm not going to try to
name all of them. But that's just some some examples
of schools that would probably have to move up based
upon one of being a private school and having using
that success factor. New Jersey uses a multiplier for private schools,

(35:12):
you know, I think Kentucky even does.

Speaker 5 (35:14):
That, don't they or do that they do not.

Speaker 4 (35:16):
It's been discussed frequently, but it's never done multiplied.

Speaker 2 (35:20):
Okay, New Jersey and Georgia both used, I think, use
a multiplier for private schools, and they also are debating
that competitive balance for so you know, uh, you know,
if you look at it, you know, if you look
at the beach Woods, the Pipos, you know they went
state championship at the LCAs, the Mayfields, Boyle, the Highlands, Comington,

(35:44):
Catholic Bowling, Green Owensborough. These guys are winning state championships
every year. They're going all the way to the state championship.
You know, they would be directly involved in some sort
of success factor. You know, is it a good thing
that a bad thing? You know, I don't know, I
kind of agree with you. I think the original reason

(36:07):
for a grouping schools together based upon enrollment was the
theory that you know, they would you know, have equal
equal you know, patient, equal facilities, equal resources. But we
all know that's not that's not true. So is there

(36:28):
another way to do it? You know, this is a
this is a suggestive way, and again, I don't know
if it would ever fly. I don't know if people
would support it. They probably wouldn't support it. And the
reason why is because the schools that I mentioned are
some of the top dogs and they're going to have
some pool and they're going to have some influence, and

(36:51):
they're not going to do it. You know, they're not going.

Speaker 5 (36:54):
To do it well.

Speaker 4 (36:56):
And I won't get it. All of you're aware of
this because I had you on this text message looking
at another solution, and you know it was talking to
some of the coaches at more successful programs and they,
you know, they didn't want to do it, and I
you know, like what you're saying, finding a plan that
you can get everybody to support, and especially those that

(37:18):
are the most influential and are in a place of power.

Speaker 5 (37:21):
You know, if you're at the top of the food chain.

Speaker 4 (37:23):
You don't really want things to change, you know, you
like being at the top of the food chain.

Speaker 5 (37:28):
That's a good spot to be. So I don't know.
I mean, you know.

Speaker 4 (37:33):
If you're yeah, yeah, exactly, So, you know, I don't
know what the answer is. I definitely think that this
is something that needs to be explored going forward with
the Kentucky Askell Athletic Association. I I think I definitely
think there's there's some issues. I think it can be

(37:55):
made better and uh, but I don't have all the answers.
I don't want Julian attack its job. You know, it's
a tough one, the boarder control. I mean, these are
not easy answers.

Speaker 5 (38:06):
But I do I do like this that we have.

Speaker 4 (38:09):
This is a tough topic and we're having this conversation
because I do think this is an issue right now,
the lack of competitive balance.

Speaker 5 (38:18):
Uh.

Speaker 4 (38:19):
I think I think the successful programs it's more type
heavy right now than it's ever been.

Speaker 5 (38:25):
I really do.

Speaker 4 (38:26):
And I think I think you've gotta you've got to
look at that and say, is there is there a
way that we can do this that would be better,
It'd be more equitable and would help kids have a better.

Speaker 5 (38:39):
Experience in high school.

Speaker 4 (38:41):
I think I think that's a legitimate question right now.
I really do, And I think.

Speaker 2 (38:45):
Next week will address to the idea that you have.
You can spell it out for us. Yeah, well that
a little bit.

Speaker 4 (38:53):
Yeah yeah, hey, And it's actually I got it. It's
I can't claim it. It's from the guru of Bluegrass
Preps and I've been used in a lot their stuff
lately because they talk about these things and it's a
good source for kentuckyis Scholl football?

Speaker 5 (39:06):
It really is.

Speaker 2 (39:08):
Okay, David, let's get into the games of the week
and we have first game. We have rock Castle and
Bell County. I usually go first on this one. I
have rock Castle County and their head football coach is
Chris Larky, the son of the legendary Tom Blarker, coach
at rock Castle County, took Rockcastle County to the only

(39:32):
state championships they've ever been. He went to a couple
in a row, and he and I both had some
really competitive battles over the years. Chris took over in
twenty twenty one. That was his first year there. He
currently has his team at six and zero. Listen to
this though. I mean he has hit the ground running there.

(39:53):
The program took a little bit of a dip. He's
kind of brought it back. Twenty twenty three they were
eleven and two, twenty twenty four they were ten and two,
and now in twenty twenty five he's already six and zero.
H He's he's got him rocking and rolling. His quarterback
is Camden Larkie. I'm assuming that's that's Chris's son and

(40:18):
he anyway, he's been having a fantastic season. The running
back position has been anchored by Isaiah Jackson and Xavier Leger,
and then the receiving position has been held down and
and and been. The top target has been Blake Mullets.
So you know they've they've got some really good players.

(40:38):
They've got a nice football team. But David, listen to this.
Bell County has dominated this series with them, They've dominated.
Have they have won? Well, put it this way, rock
cast was only won two times over the last sixteen games.

(41:00):
Oh County has really dominated the game. You know what,
it's rock Castle's year.

Speaker 5 (41:06):
I'm one.

Speaker 2 (41:08):
Third year.

Speaker 5 (41:10):
I got you well, all right?

Speaker 4 (41:13):
My team is Bell County with Dudley Hilton as their
head coach or six and oh Blake Burnette their quarterback.
He's a dual threat guy. He's also playing defense. He's
got five interceptions this season. Helen Miller leads the rushing attack.
Joseph Brigman is their top receiver, and their defenses led
by Josh Owens and Hunter fusion, which I wonder is

(41:37):
related to Egg and ug fusion from Middlesbrough who played
at Tennessee. Remember that was one of max historical segments
back in the very beginning. So I now I see
that name, I see these names out, I start thinking
about stuff I heard Mac talk about. So you know,

(41:58):
I saw Isaiah Jackson in person. We opened up with
rock Castle last year. He is a really, really, really
good football player.

Speaker 5 (42:05):
Excellent. But I still think that right now.

Speaker 4 (42:10):
I mean I know a little bit about Blake Burnett.
I think Bell County has and it's a Bell County,
and I think that's gonna help him.

Speaker 5 (42:20):
So I'm gonna go with Bell County on this one.

Speaker 2 (42:23):
Okay, Bell County is undefeated too, so it's the battle
of the undefeated.

Speaker 4 (42:27):
Yeah, and you know, I love when I see this
game because you know, when we were in three A
in two thousand and three through six at Mason County,
and we were opposite of that district with Bell and
rock Castle, and we even got to play rock Castle
in that Bowl game in Damble in two thousand and two.
And there's a Jason Ledger was a really good defensive tackle.

(42:50):
I think you hit the I think he went to
the University of Kentucky. It was a great player. So
you know, I love how this I always knew was October.
I get a phone call teaching history and it's this
real low voice talking about how I'll send you our
three blah blah blah blah blah, I want your And
it was Tony Sailor. That's that's how I didn't need

(43:13):
a calendar. I just knew when Tony Sailor called, it's October.
Here we go, and I would look forward to that.
But but oh, he's a great coach. And I tell
you what, I think people discounted a little bit.

Speaker 5 (43:28):
I don't think they appreciate it.

Speaker 4 (43:30):
But what he would do on defense and how they
would cut legs, there's a lot more to it than
just hey, we're cutting legs.

Speaker 5 (43:38):
There's a lot more to it. And they're really, really
good at it.

Speaker 4 (43:41):
It's not Tony's. Tony's a pretty dang shark football coach.

Speaker 5 (43:46):
He knows stuff.

Speaker 4 (43:49):
He'd get mad at me for say this because he
probably don't want to tell everybody how they cut legs.
But they were really good at it. And you know,
this game brings up back a lot of good memories.
So when we got Callaway County versus Franklin Simpson, I've
got Franklin Simpson max change their head coach.

Speaker 5 (44:09):
They are four and two.

Speaker 4 (44:11):
This is the home of Joker Phillips, formerly of the
University Kentucky and the head football coach at the University Kentucky.
They are led by Blake McPherson on both sides of
the ball. Now, the Warren East game, Warren East got
after him and.

Speaker 5 (44:28):
Moved the ball and scored some points.

Speaker 4 (44:30):
But before that, in the first five games, they only
gave up three hundred and twenty five yards rushing. I
mean they are playing some really good defense. Now, I
would anticipate Callaway County got that Warren East video and
they have broke that sucker down like a shotgun. And
I'll be surprised if Callaway County doesn't try to throw

(44:51):
some of the same wrinkles they saw Warren East throw
because Warren East had a lot of success, they really did.

Speaker 2 (44:57):
Yeah, let me tell you, calloway count the job that
Kobe Lewis has done there. They're head football coach. He
took over a team that did not win a game,
didn't win a game in twenty twenty four, and he's
got them currently four and two. So I mean, what
a job. I mean if you don't you come off
of the season that where you take a bunch of

(45:19):
kids that you never don't even know or haven't been
the head coach, and you they haven't won a game.
It's a major culture change.

Speaker 5 (45:28):
Yes, he's a job.

Speaker 2 (45:33):
Their quarterback is Matthew Bradwell. And listen to this, David
against Ballard Memorial, he went twenty two of twenty eight
for three hundred and seventy eight yards and six touchdowns.
For goodness sakes, but listen to this. They're running back
Logan Smith. He went against Warren East. He went, he

(45:56):
carried the ball forty times for three hundred and twenty
one yards and five touchdowns. And then he went on
defense and made twelve tackles, two of them are losses
and then David against Fulton County he went four rushes
for three hundred and fourteen yards in six touchdowns, So
he's got two three hundred yard rushing games this season. Hey,

(46:21):
Franklin Simpson better have a good run stop in defense.
My golly, this guy knows how to run the football
and they can't. They can't stack the box because the
quarterback evidently can throw the ball pretty good.

Speaker 5 (46:36):
But hey, I will go ahead. I'm sorry, but the.

Speaker 2 (46:40):
Thing that I'm worried about here is I'm is that
Franklin Simpson in the last six meetings have not has
dominated this series. They've won all but one in the
last six seams. So that really words me a lot.
I don't know if you can come off at a
winless season and then I get it turned. But I

(47:02):
don't know if you can get a turn that fast
to be able to beat a team like Franklin Simpson.
I guess I'm probably going to pick Franklin Simpson.

Speaker 5 (47:10):
I got you.

Speaker 4 (47:11):
I'm going to pick him too, because it is at
Franklin Simpson. But I tell you what, I like your
point two things. Hey, you don't why there's so good
on offense? They buy a team issue football, So he
give them a thumbs up on that. But ay the
other thing too though. I'm really proud of my old dad.
You know, Boyle didn't win a game for two years,
and then his first year they turned the round and

(47:33):
they beat Daanvill at Center College. And I agree with
you at that time, Clip, that is a hard, hard
thing to do.

Speaker 5 (47:40):
That is a tough flip. Tough flip.

Speaker 2 (47:42):
It's not so much physical, it isn't mental.

Speaker 5 (47:45):
Absolutely, yes, sir, David, let's talk a.

Speaker 2 (47:48):
Little bit about wrapping fire. You want to. I know
you after your week, David. Last week on Rapid Flop Fire,
he went ten out of ten. For godness, that's all
he needs is for me to tell you that he
was one hundred percent last week, ten out.

Speaker 4 (48:09):
I've got I've got my teeth kicked into lot the
last thirty three years, I think Maye goes fine, I
really do.

Speaker 5 (48:16):
I got hey, let me adking out of ten all right?

Speaker 2 (48:19):
Anyway, he's fifty four out of I'm sorry, forty four
out of fifty four for the season. That's eighty percent.
Now I'm gonna take him to Vegas with me, then
me myself, Chuck. He was six out of ten last week,
which that's where I've been hanging around sixty percent out
of fifty four for the year. It's been fun. Let's

(48:43):
get this week's games in David rapid fire. Here we
go Greenwood and Bearing Barron County.

Speaker 5 (48:53):
Man. Boy, yeah, that's a tough one right off the bat.
I'm gonna go Barron County.

Speaker 2 (48:58):
Baron are right. Well, I haven't seen Baron, but I
have played against Greenwood and I'm gonna go with Greenwood.
And uh, how about listen to this game? Woa Covington
Catholic in Highlands Man, flip a coin.

Speaker 4 (49:15):
Yeah, I'm gonna go Highlands Islands.

Speaker 2 (49:18):
Wow, I'm gonna go with Covington Catholic. Man, you're not
gonna we might not agree on anything, and that's not
a good because you've got the track. Hey here, Frederick
Douglas and male.

Speaker 5 (49:33):
I got I'm gonna go fick Frederick Douglas.

Speaker 2 (49:36):
Frederick Douglas, you know what I am too, because Mail
has nothing been I don't know. They haven't got it,
they haven't found their groove yet. How about Jeffersontown, my
old school and Bullet Central.

Speaker 5 (49:55):
I'm gonna go Jaytown.

Speaker 2 (49:57):
I gotta go with jay Town. That's my alma manel
uh huh, that's my school, the Chargers, that's right. How
about John Harden and Markstown Bethel.

Speaker 4 (50:09):
I'm going Giant Harden, bet lamb They're they're hey, they've
got a wonderful coach, Tim Maddeley. But there I think
I think they're a little thin this season.

Speaker 2 (50:20):
I'm gonna go with Bethel. Bethlam had a big win
here recently, a nice win. How about here's another good
one that coin toss Johnson Central and Corbin.

Speaker 5 (50:34):
I'm going Johnson Central on this one.

Speaker 2 (50:37):
I tell you, man, Johnson Central has been really good.
Ah Man, I'll tell you what. I'm gonna go with Corbin,
though Corbyn has not been that good. But and they
got to get a turn some point.

Speaker 5 (50:49):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (50:49):
How about Logan and Paducah Tillman. Logan's undefeated, by the.

Speaker 5 (50:53):
Way, Yeah, they really are.

Speaker 4 (50:55):
That's that's a little sneak here a game than you
would think. Uh, I'm gonna go with Tilman. And here's
why They've already lost the game, so I think they
had their wake up call. I think it's gonna be Tillman,
but I think Logan's very good.

Speaker 2 (51:08):
I'll tell you what. I'm gonna go with Logan County.

Speaker 5 (51:10):
I am there you go.

Speaker 2 (51:13):
I don't know where it's played at.

Speaker 5 (51:15):
I don't know. I don't know. I should but I don't.

Speaker 2 (51:17):
I should have looked at up. But anyway, I'm gonna
go with Logan. How about Prestonsburg and not County Central. Hey,
Prestonsburg is five and zero in not County Central is
five and one.

Speaker 5 (51:30):
That's that's a good one. I'm gonna go Prestonsburg Prestinsburg.

Speaker 2 (51:35):
Yeah, okay, I'm gonna go with Prestsburg as well.

Speaker 5 (51:39):
I got you.

Speaker 2 (51:41):
And here we go Spencer and Franklin County.

Speaker 4 (51:46):
Hey, I love Mike, he's doing a great job. I'm
going Franklin County on this one. I think Franklin County
is gonna have too much for him.

Speaker 2 (51:54):
Yeah, I'm gonna have to go with Franklin as well.
And how about help listen to this one? Sat X
and Boyle County.

Speaker 4 (52:06):
I tell you what, After Catholic got him, I would
have been slammed unk Saint X, but I'm not so
sure now.

Speaker 5 (52:12):
Plus, I don't know about the quarterback situation at Saint X,
but I think I'm still going to go st X
I do.

Speaker 2 (52:22):
I'm gonna go in Boyle County.

Speaker 5 (52:24):
I got you.

Speaker 2 (52:25):
I gotta go up my rebels.

Speaker 5 (52:27):
Well, sure you do.

Speaker 4 (52:28):
And that's not a that's not a bad pick. That's
never a bad pick.

Speaker 2 (52:33):
No, they're pretty good. Uh, that's it. That's all I
got for the rapid Fire. I hope I do a
little better job and be a little more competitive with
you this week to give you at least some kind
of a little bit of a sweat that I might
be on your heels of catching you.

Speaker 4 (52:51):
Well, I've got a coach to eighty to have any
prayer catching you on state titles. So if we get,
if we can, I'll give you the rapid Fire pick
and I'll take the state titles.

Speaker 5 (53:04):
So it's all right.

Speaker 4 (53:05):
But anyway, I do want to tell our listeners next week,
our guest is Bert Batiani from Moeler, and I coached
against Burt. He played at Highlands that night in the
snow when you guys were at Tillman in two thousand
and three. So he's Burt's coached collegiate Leedsman, the head

(53:26):
coach at Leason Katholic.

Speaker 5 (53:27):
He's now the head coach of Moeller's man, his career
is on fire.

Speaker 4 (53:30):
He's doing great. And our tough topic will be from
the Guru. He advocates doing away with districts, allow teams
to schedule as they see best. And the question we've
got is RPI, but it's really sort of changed a
little bit.

Speaker 5 (53:46):
There's not a lot of support for the RPI.

Speaker 4 (53:48):
It's more so let's see it based on cowpreps, because
the cow preps usually is better than the RPI. So
we're going to talk about that, and I like, you know,
I sort of like direction we're going right now, because
as much as I love Kentucky high school football, I
do think the competitive imbalance is not good for our game.

(54:10):
And man, if we can find some solutions there, I
think that'd be great.

Speaker 2 (54:14):
Yeah, and that'll be our next week's discussion. Looking forward
to it. Thanks for tuning in and listening. We'll see
you next week.

Speaker 7 (54:21):
This has Forgotten Heroes. I'm your host, Mack Yoakum, and
I have a story to tell you. During the nineteen fifties,
few schools black or white were as successful as Owensboro Western.
Owensboro Western had begun in the eighteen nineties, graduating its
first class in eighteen ninety seven. The Bulldogs in nineteen

(54:44):
twenty eight won the state football title for black schools
in Kentucky when they knocked off Louisville Central and then
claimed the national title with a shutout of Chicago Phillips.
Owensboro Western played all of the top teams in the
Midwest and the South. That nineteen twenty eighteen was led

(55:04):
by the great Tarzan Joe Kendall, who we profiled several
episodes ago. By the nineteen fifties, Joe Kendall had made
his way back to Owensboro and he took over coaching
the Western Bulldogs. His nineteen fifty one team went eight
oh to one they upset mighty Louisville Central. In nineteen

(55:25):
fifty two, the Bulldogs went ten and two, and in
nineteen fifty five, coach Kendall led Western to a ten
and o mark, winning their third straight conference title. Joe
Kendall was long considered Owensboro Western's best athlete, but the
star of his teams from nineteen fifty two to nineteen

(55:47):
fifty five might have surpassed him. His quarterback during those
years was a flashy young man named Charles Wimsatt, but
it was a two sports standout named Waylan Coleman, who
coach Kendall said was the best in school history. He
was six foot two and was a star wide receiver

(56:09):
on the gridiron, but it was on the hardwood that
Whalon Coleman made his mark. In college, Coleman went across
the country to the University of Idaho to play for
four seasons. Whalon Coleman starred for the Vandals. At the time,
Idaho was in the Pacific Coast Conference along with Oregon, UCLA,

(56:31):
cal USC Stanford, Washington State, and others. As a junior,
he led Idaho to wins over all of those named schools,
and the Vandals finished fourth in the league. Whalon Coleman
was named to the All Pacific Coast Conference team. He
scored eight hundred and six points in his Idaho career,

(56:55):
and he was the first African American to be a
captain of a varsity sports team in University of Idaho history.
He is in the University of Idaho Athletics Hall of Fame,
the Idaho Legends Hall of Fame, and the Owensboro High
School Hall of Achievement. He received his bachelor's degree from

(57:18):
Idaho and his master's in rank one from Western Kentucky University,
Wayland Coleman, another forgotten hero from Kentucky's era of segregation.
This episode was inspired by the book Shadows of the
Past by the late KHSAA Commissioner Lewis Stout. Join us

(57:40):
next time for another story of forgotten heroes from yester
year in Kentucky.