Coaches Office with guest Coach Travis Burns

In this episode the coaches welcome up and coming young coach Travis Burns, the head coach fro the Pulaski County Maroons.

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:10):
Coach David Buchanan coach Chuck Smith, two legendary high school
football coaches. This is the Coach's Office, a behind the

(00:33):
scenes look at Kentucky high school football.

Speaker 2 (00:42):
Welcome to the Coach's Office, Behind the Scenes with Chuck
Smith and David Buchanan. This is Season four, Episode three.
I'm Chuck Smith. I'm joined by co host David Buchanan,
Podcast editor slash storyteller Mike Yokam. Our YouTube version of
this podcast is at teacop T dot C, dot O

(01:04):
dot P. If you hit like and subscribe, it helps
us out. We got a really exciting show tonight. We
have as our guest's coach, a promising new young coach.
He's the head football coach of Pulaski County, Travis Burns.
He's in this second season as the head football coach

(01:26):
of Pulaski County High School. So Travis is going to
come on. He's off to a great start, nice year
last year, so we'll go bring him on in just
a second, so just be patient. Our tough topic question
for tonight is from Center College Assistant ad Sports Performance

(01:47):
Jeremy Carlson, and it's a really good question. I really
liked it. It's general. Norman Schwartzkoff once said, leadership is
a popeent combination of strategy and care her But if
you must be without one, be without strategy, then I
really like that. I really like that. And he says,
what does that mean to us? And what does it

(02:10):
how does it apply to high school football either a
head coach or assistant coach. That's really a good question,
really deep, and I know we'll have a good response
for that. And then the games of the week this
week are Manual and Frederick Douglas and then we also
got Belfrey without Philip hay Wood and Johnson Central Okay

(02:35):
without Jim macney. So it's a pretty pretty historical deal there.
But a little bit about Travis before we bring you on.
As I said, he's the head football coach, Travis Burns.
He's the head football coach of Pulaski County High School.
He's beginning his second season as Pulaski County's head football coach.

(02:58):
He was an assistant it uh you know, at a
DC especialty for a specialty team coordinator at Boyle County
High School for I believe eight seasons. He was a
part of five state championships there. Dang, somebody knew what
they were doing when they hired that guy. All Right

(03:20):
was the line Uh. He was the linebacker coach at
George Rogers Clark for one season in twenty fifteen. He's
a graduate of South Laurel High School.

Speaker 3 (03:32):
Uh.

Speaker 2 (03:32):
He's an up and coming young coach in the state
of Kentucky. David, you want to bring Travis on?

Speaker 3 (03:38):
Yes, I do. Travis. It's an honor to have you.

Speaker 4 (03:41):
And congratulations, man, you you are off to a tremendous
start as a head coach, and I really appreciate you
taking time to visit with us tonight.

Speaker 3 (03:51):
And I think it's going to.

Speaker 4 (03:52):
Be a great show because the young guys assistant coaches
that are wanting to be a head coach. I think
I think you've blazed about as good a trail as
can be blazed. It's been impressive. So, hey, thank you
for making time for us tonight.

Speaker 5 (04:06):
Yeah, thanks for having me.

Speaker 2 (04:08):
Yeah, looking forward to a Travis. Let me start you
off with a question here. Making the jump from an
assistant to a head coach is always o opening. It's
just it's just different. It's a lot more responsibility, it's
oye opening. Now that you now that you're heading into
your two year too, your second year, what are some

(04:28):
of the things that you learned last season, you know
that are helping you become a better coach this season.

Speaker 5 (04:37):
Well, you know, when you're just an assistant or and
you kind of hit the nail on the head of
your question. When you're just an assistant or you're just
a coordinator, you know, you't you've got real narrow focus
on you know, your position or or the side of
the ball you're on. But as a head coach, it's
it's every little aspect. That was probably the most overwhelming

(04:58):
thing when I took over. You know, it's the little
stuff like bus request and booster club meetings and you know,
those things that you don't deal with as an assistant coach.
And you know, I was lucky towards the end of
my time at Bull coach Addicks really let me kind
of see the insides of that and how it all worked,
and because he knew that I eventually would want to

(05:20):
go along to being a head coach. But uh, it's
also the managing your you know, you're also having to
coach your coaches, make sure that everything is running smooth,
and from the youth league up to you know, through
the middle school into the high school. So I would say,
you know, just the overall job you have as a
head coach, it's really hard to understand until you're in

(05:42):
those shoes. And then just moving forward into this year,
it really prepared me because now I had a better
understanding of kind of what to do and how to
do it and when to do it.

Speaker 2 (05:53):
Yeah, did you what do you? What do you think
has been the most difficult thing and a head coach
versus being an assistant and once a thing is what
I'm asking.

Speaker 5 (06:06):
Yeah, I love the coach, you know, that's I like
to And I really enjoyed when I you know, I
was the D line coach at Well, I really enjoyed
that because you know, you just get the coach and
that's all you worried about. And as a head coach,
it's you know, I kind of tell people it's like
twenty percent coaching, uh, seventy percent management and then ten
percent politics, and that's really what it is.

Speaker 2 (06:29):
It really is. I mean, that was the thing that
It's interesting you said that because that was the thing
that I always said that I always had more fun
probably as an assistant with David and Larry and Jack
and all those guys at Mercer than I did as
a head coach, because, as you said, all you worried
about was getting your guys ready, and you didn't have

(06:51):
to worry about the parents and the organization and the
schedule in the field and the buses and all that
other stuff. So pretty interesting you.

Speaker 4 (07:01):
Said that, you know, I like how Travis answered that question,
and you know, along the lines of things that the
head coach deals with that the others don't. That I
actually really like about Anderson because it's pretty good, but
navigating and diminishing drama. I mean, that's to me, that's
been a big part of what I do. And and

(07:22):
you know, Anderson has been a very low drama place,
and I'm I'm very thankful for that. And I even
went to some of the like our our booster club
people and I said, look, I really appreciate how you
handled this, and I said, if you need me to
get involved, I said, I will. But you know, I
love it that you guys don't bring me drama. You
sort of squash it and we keep going. And uh,

(07:44):
when you're an assistant coach. You don't even know all
that stuff's going on. You know, you just don't have
to worry about it.

Speaker 3 (07:49):
Uh you don't want to know. Yeah, yeah, you don't.
You just you just want to coach. Uh.

Speaker 4 (07:56):
Hey, Travis, I really appreciate you being open about this.

Speaker 3 (07:59):
Uh.

Speaker 4 (08:00):
I think it's really critical to win. But it's one
of those topics that I'll tell you this. I've got
a lot of criticism over the years because I've been
very open encouraging families and kids to have their sons
start a senior year at eighteen. And I mean, people
get mad at me, David, that's not your visit, blah
blah blah. But I think that really makes a big difference.

(08:21):
And you know, I help both my sons back. They
were eighteen when they started their senior year. I think
it's been life changing for them that I made that decision.
For him, I think it really helped them. So thanks
for being open to answering this question. So, how many
eighteen year olds are on your team? How much of
a difference does that make? And how was PC Football

(08:42):
able to make that a trend in your community?

Speaker 3 (08:44):
How did you.

Speaker 4 (08:45):
Pull that off? Because I have never been able to
really get that the way that I thought would be best.

Speaker 5 (08:53):
Well, you know, I would say, you know, majority of
our kids, you know especially I would say probably twenty
of the junior and senior class are at least eighteen.
And you know that was something that was kind of
set before I took over. You know, that was a

(09:13):
trend that had started, you know, many years ago. But
like you said, I'm all for it. You know, I
have a two year old, well she'll be three here
in about two weeks, and then I have one on
the way, and you know, we're going to hold them back.
To me, there's nothing wrong with it. You know, they're
more mature. And like the program at Pulaska. You know,

(09:36):
one thing that when people see us and they talk
about it, you know, we only have about fifty five
kids for a five day program, and you know a
lot of kids, you know, they start playing freshman sophomore year,
which you don't like as a coach, but by them,
you know, holding back in middle school or you know,
kind of doing the holding back in elementary school, whatever
it might be, they're a lot more mature when they

(09:58):
come up and to play. You know, it's unfortunate, but
also you know, by being more mature there, they are
ready to play as a sophomore and and do that.
So you know, I'm all for it. But like you said,
that's a decision that you and your family have to make,
you know, you and and the parents, and you know,
if they ask my opinion, I'm always honest with them.

(10:20):
I think here since I've took over, where we've been
kind of more selective in you know, are you just
holding back to hold back or is it a maturity thing?
And so, uh, that's a decision between parents in the
in the player, and if they want my input, I'll
give it to them, and I support it full fullheartedly.
But you know, I just I just think that they're

(10:43):
more mature, and especially with the way today's kids are,
you know, it's just that much better.

Speaker 4 (10:50):
Yeah, I do agree today's kids, Uh, I mean, for
whatever reason, it does seem like, i mean almost more emotional.
They developed later. So I think it's a really good thing.
But I appreciate you answering that. You know, my oldest son,
he got after me one time because he's.

Speaker 3 (11:11):
Married to a wonderful young lady.

Speaker 4 (11:12):
And I told him one time, I said, Caroline wouldn't
have dated you if I hadn't have held you back.

Speaker 3 (11:17):
And he's like, nad, He's like, everything in my life
is good. It's not because you held me back, you know.

Speaker 4 (11:23):
And he would get mad at me, But I do.
I think it really helps males a lot. And I
appreciate you being open about that question.

Speaker 5 (11:28):
I mean, you see so many Like I think of
a kid when I was at Bull Josiah Richards. You know,
he plays for Kentucky State down He played linebacker forth
while we were there, and he graduated when he was
seventeen years old, and I just think about that, if
he had that other another year to mature, you know

(11:49):
how much greater of a high school football player he
could have been. You know you know those.

Speaker 4 (11:55):
Yeah, that reminds me of a story sitting when Chuck
was watching video of Josh Harris.

Speaker 3 (12:03):
He called me and he said no.

Speaker 4 (12:06):
I said no, sir, I said that's sophomore and he
said that changes everything and hung the phone up. I
mean it just it really did. It helped him a lot.

Speaker 3 (12:14):
And uh, you know again, he.

Speaker 4 (12:17):
Thank you for thank you for answering that. I appreciate you.
Go ahead, Chuck.

Speaker 2 (12:20):
I think what usually males are the ones who benefit
from the maturity thing. They seem to be more immature
than the females. And that's why I'm kind of in
favor of it, of you know, holding them back, letting
them or uh. Anyway, Travis, my next question for you is,
before landing your first head coaching job, how did you

(12:43):
prepare yourself? We have a lot of assistant coach listeners,
a young assistant coaches who are probably you know, thinking
about in the future being head football coaches. How did
you prepare yourself for that?

Speaker 3 (12:56):
Bro?

Speaker 2 (12:56):
Did you take notes, did you make a law, did
you do anything specific to get ready and prepare yourself
to be a head football coach?

Speaker 5 (13:06):
Well, you know, I will say one thing about you know,
my generation. I am a millennial, and you know I
get told that a lot, you know, especially those four
years I worked with Coach Smith about being a millennial.
But you know, I think young coaches try to get
into the coordinator positions and the head coach. I got

(13:28):
really lucky, you know, I got to work four years
with you, coach, and then I got to work four
years with Coach Haddocks. You know, all the guys, Coachester,
Jeff Hester, Chris Pardue. So I wasn't in a hurry.
I wanted to be one one day, but I wanted
to you know, I remember one of the things you told.

(13:48):
You asked me one time coach if I wanted to
be head coach, and you said yes, and I said yes,
and then you said, you know, well you need to
know everything because they're going to come to you for answers,
you know, And that just stuck with me. About learning.
I wanted to learn and soak up all the knowledge
I could, and you know, how how did people react
to different situations and different things. And then you know,

(14:11):
I you know, one thing that I learned from Haddocks
and he always he put it in the office, was like,
when you're through learning, you're through. You know your time
is up. You don't need to be coaching anymore. And
so I took that and you know, I tried to
soak up all the knowledge I could, and then I
really focused on doing the best job I could do
in the position I was. And you know, I took

(14:34):
a little piece of of everything from those coaches, you know,
you know, with like Jeff Hester for example, you know,
coaching with passion and energy, and you know, having you know,
just showing the kids that it can be done in
one way. You know, from you coach about being organized
and running a program, uh and holding everybody to the

(14:56):
same standard and everybody understood, you know in that office
that you know what the standard was and what the
expectation was. Uh. And then you know, from coach Haddocks,
I learned about building relationships. You know, he's one of
the best relationship builders with kids I've seen. And you know,
having that relationship will ultimately, you know, push on that

(15:17):
much more. And so I just tried to soak up
and you know, I read books, you know, I read
Nick Saban's book, I read Urban Meyer's book. I read
Lou Holt's book. That was probably my favorite book I
read of coaching. And so I just wanted to soak
up the knowledge and prepare myself as much as I
could before I took the job.

Speaker 2 (15:37):
Yeah, it's it's kind of unusual really for a millennial
to uh pay his dues, you know, And actually that's
what we're saying. You paid your dues. You spent eight
years of learning and and learning from others and being
uh you know, uh accepted, accepting coaching and accepting knowledge

(15:59):
and and and paying your dues to be ahead football coach.
And it's kind of unusual, kind of the most millennials
kind of want it now seems like.

Speaker 5 (16:07):
It, and I agree with you. I'm a I'm a millennial.
I'm in that generation, and you know they want they want,
you know that now, and they they don't take criticism
or constructive criticismism very well. And you know I wasn't.
I didn't want to be like that. I wanted to
learn and grow and to be the best I could,
you know, And that's kind of like it was. I
wanted to be the best coach I could be for

(16:29):
those kids that I was coaching, and you know I wasn't.
I'm not the same coach. I wasn't my first year coaching,
and I'm not the same. So I've learned and I'm
going to keep growing and you know, paying my dues
and you know, we were very successful at Bull but
you know, my first year of coaching, we went oh
and eleven. I thought, man, do I really want to

(16:49):
do this? I hate losing something. But it worked out.

Speaker 2 (16:54):
It's a good thing that you didn't have to experience
there that constructive criticism when you were coaching there at Boiler.

Speaker 5 (17:02):
None at all, not at all.

Speaker 3 (17:03):
Yeah, you got to get you got to have a
thick skin to work for that cat.

Speaker 4 (17:07):
Hey, you rantioned some elite coaches, Chuck Smith, Jeff Hester,
Justin Haddocks. I want to take a little different approach here, though.
What's one thing you've done at Pulaski County that's different
from Boyle County that you think has major program better
and more successful?

Speaker 3 (17:23):
That it's different? And I know, I know we don't
like to make it about.

Speaker 4 (17:27):
Us, but I'm sort of saying, hey, what's a Travis
Burns thing that sort of Hey, I wanted to try
something out and I have and I really like it
and it's been good.

Speaker 3 (17:36):
What do you think, Travis?

Speaker 5 (17:38):
Well, so you know, I'm a big believer, and you
know your methods might change, but the message stays the same.
So you know, the goal is always you know that
those high standards and those kinds of expectations, and you
know I was lucky enough to learn you know that
bull kind of those things. And but one thing I
really believe in is ownership. That players need to take

(17:59):
ownership of the program. And so one thing we do
is we vote you know, we go to camp and
we allow the kids to vote for an offensive captain
and a defensive captain, and we we really coach them
up on you know, what's a good leader, you know,
because a lot of kids, you know, have bad experiences
with leadership, you know, throughout their years and you know,

(18:22):
whether playing sports and this and that and the other.
And so I started to allow them to vote for
their cap for one captain, and then we vote for
the other captains as coaches each week. So it's kind
of that, you know, here's your leaders of your team.
You get to decide that who they are. And you know,
I think our kids really appreciate that, you know that

(18:43):
we did it again this year. And then one thing
that they kind of did at Pulaski that I kept,
and it's very similar to what we did at Bowl
is uh, you know, when we go to camp, you know,
they kind of the seniors get to do their all
in speech and they get to talk about it. But
one thing that they do is they take their eye
on you know, kind of that you throw in at

(19:05):
the end of camp and they bury it on the
hillside at Pulaski as a reminder, you know, every time
you're out there at practice or in the game. You know,
you can look at that hillside and it's assemble the
commitment that you made for the team. And I kept that.
I think that was a great tradition.

Speaker 3 (19:21):
Yeah, that's good.

Speaker 2 (19:22):
I love that kind of stuff.

Speaker 3 (19:24):
Yeah, that's good. That's really good.

Speaker 2 (19:26):
It's hey, Travisa. The last question I have for you is, again,
as I said, you know, you're an upcoming young coach
and you've you've gotten there, You've gotten you know, the
head coaching job, and so there's so there's a lot
of young coaches that are assistant coaches that are listening
to the program and want to be what what is

(19:48):
a young coach with a family like your pelf? How
do you balance the football with family time?

Speaker 3 (19:55):
You know what?

Speaker 2 (19:56):
Can you kind of walk us through what a typical
week looks like during the season in terms of you know,
really windy you fit your family in.

Speaker 5 (20:04):
Basically, you know, yeah, so you know, I got lucky
my wife, Chelsea and coach Smith. You know Chelse, you've
met her. Uh, she's a Bull County girl. So she
understands kind of the expectation and the commitment that it takes,
and she's a. She's a great coach herself. She coaches
girls soccer here at Bull and and uh and she

(20:29):
coaches a club team, and so she understands, you know,
what it takes to be a coach, because that's like
right now, she's a practice herself. But uh, you know,
it takes a lot of commitment and uh just organization.
You know, I have a I have a three year old,
and then I have one on the way.

Speaker 3 (20:47):
And coming in graduations.

Speaker 5 (20:50):
Thank you. Yeah, I tell my assistance, I have a
knack for having children during the football season. I just
just happens. And so but uh, you know, we just
have to commit. You know, Saturday, we play the game
on Friday. Saturday is our day. You know, that's kind
of my day to take off. I don't ever watch
film when when my daughter's awake. I always do it

(21:13):
when she's asleep. So, you know, I'm losing sleep, But
to me, that family time is more important than watching
the film time. You know, I can do that and
lose some sleep, but that's okay. So I always do
my breakdowns and stuff. I either wake up early or
stay up late to do those. And then on Sunday,

(21:33):
you know, it's you know, we go to church. You
go to church as a family. We'll come back and
then on Sunday we go one to five. So that's
kind of how we do. So the coaches come in
at one, we give our kind of breakdown of the game,
looking forward to the next opponent. The kids come in
at three, we lift and run them. We'll watch film

(21:54):
with the game four to five, and then everybody's out
at five and then you know, we have Sunday dinner
with family, so we go to my mother in law's
house and eat and eat dinner on Sundays and then
on Mondays. Ultimately, what we do is, you know, or
throughout the week, I get my daughter ready in the

(22:15):
morning before I have to leave, so I make a breakfast,
you know, spend time with her, make sure you know,
but I'm always you know, intentional about that's her time
for me. And then when I come home, it's the
same thing. You know, I'm I'm done with football for
the day. It's I'm being intentional. Thursday is a lighter day,
so we usually typically try to do something Thursday evening

(22:38):
after we get out of practice. And then Friday, you know,
obviously it's game day, so it is a lot. You know,
it's a big commitment and the expectation. But you know,
also in my mind, you know I'm gonna be there
for them when I can be. And I think that's
one advice, you know, we talk about young coaches. If
I could give to young coaches like you can make time.

(22:58):
You know, you might have to sacrifice some sleep, but
you know those kids eventually, you know, you get eighteen
summers with them, so make the best of it.

Speaker 4 (23:08):
Travis, you you really hit on some good stuff there.
I've said there's really two things. If you're going to
be a dad, try to work as much as you
can when your family's asleep. That is so good and
I'm glad you said that. The other thing, too, is
man starting in January, be really really analytical in it.
Do as many things as you can ahead of time,

(23:31):
because if you can get things done ahead of time,
it'll really help.

Speaker 3 (23:35):
You when you're in those time crunches.

Speaker 4 (23:37):
And I mean that's besides the fact that I married
an incredible wife and she's absolutely wonderful. Those two things
I think have really sort of helped, and I appreciate
you sharing that.

Speaker 3 (23:49):
I hope the young young coaches listening is.

Speaker 4 (23:52):
I think my favorite part was man, you're working with
the family, sleeping and a good for you and that textcellent.

Speaker 3 (24:00):
That's that's that's big stuff. Very well, you know, go ahead.

Speaker 5 (24:04):
I was just saying, you know, my wife's a coach,
so like, uh, they have a game tomorrow, you know,
so I'll leave practice and go and I'll pick up
my daughter and we'll go to her game because they're
usually there on Friday night, so we want to make
sure we're there.

Speaker 3 (24:19):
You know.

Speaker 5 (24:20):
It's a huge commendment. But you know, when you're done
and retired and everything's gone, you know you'll be wanting
those times with your children back.

Speaker 3 (24:29):
Yeah. Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 4 (24:32):
We'll look at each other and I'll say, did we
even have three kids?

Speaker 3 (24:36):
Did that even happen?

Speaker 4 (24:38):
So you're smart because it it does you before you
know it. It's like that time of your life's over.
And I don't get all go down the throat too much,
but I think that's the best time of life is
when your kids are little in their home.

Speaker 3 (24:51):
That was that was for me.

Speaker 2 (24:53):
That's for me too. It's a lot of fun. And
I think that's some really good advice. Travis. I think
you'll save a lot of marriag the coaching.

Speaker 5 (25:04):
And Nora will come. That's my daughter's named Nora. She'll
come to practice with man. You know, there's some days
she loves the boys. You know. I'm not gonna name
the favorites, but she's got two favorites on there because
they played with there, you know, and they'll come in
the office and play with her. But she'll come to
the practice with me and she'll sit on the golf
card and so she has a blast with it. And

(25:25):
it's time, you know that I'm getting to share with her.
So it's it's a great time.

Speaker 4 (25:31):
Yeah, hey, I don't warn you about this. And that
turned out great. My daughter married Josy Robbins, who's absolutely phenomenal.
I mean, I love him and I couldn't have a
better son in law. But when she was growing up
something that made me nervous. She was way too comfortable
around males. When having two brothers and being a coach's daughter,

(25:53):
she was I did not like her comfort.

Speaker 3 (25:55):
Level around males.

Speaker 4 (25:57):
But hey, just Si Robbins came along, so it turned
out great.

Speaker 2 (26:01):
Yeah, Brandon brings his little girls over to practice too,
and they loved being around the boys and playing.

Speaker 5 (26:08):
Yeah, the other day we stuffed over there. He brought
his daughter with him.

Speaker 2 (26:12):
Yeah. And Travis's wife, Chelsea is a good one. She's uh.
And you know, if it wasn't for the probably the
coaches and the coaches office guiding Travis along through that process,
he probably would have fumbled that away. But we we
got him on the right track.

Speaker 3 (26:30):
Oh man, I don't know.

Speaker 4 (26:32):
Getting the Maryland advice from those cats, I'm not sure
that was that was a good I don't I can't
give you stories on those guys. I'm like, but hey,
do this though, Hey, Chuck and Chris Pardue did this
and I did it one time.

Speaker 3 (26:45):
INSTEADY put a stop to it.

Speaker 4 (26:47):
Do not spray round up around the fence to kill
all the weeds, so you gonna have to weed eat.
I did that one time and she never let me
do it again. But I think Pardue he kept on
doing it, didn't he.

Speaker 2 (26:56):
I still do it, that's a.

Speaker 5 (27:01):
I do.

Speaker 3 (27:04):
Come on now, all right, guys, all right.

Speaker 2 (27:08):
Travis, we appreciate you being one.

Speaker 5 (27:11):
Yeah, thanks for having me, David.

Speaker 2 (27:13):
We got the tough topic.

Speaker 3 (27:17):
What's a good one?

Speaker 2 (27:18):
What a question it is?

Speaker 3 (27:19):
I really like it.

Speaker 2 (27:20):
Uh, it's a different kind of question for us, and uh,
something I really like. I like this kind of stuff anyway.
But anyway, the question is again from Center College assistant
A D and sports performance guy Jeremy Carlson Norman General
Norman Schwartzkoff once said leadership is a popeent combination of

(27:44):
strategy and character. But if you must be without one,
be without strategy, what does that mean to us? And
what do you think how's it applied to high school football?

Speaker 3 (27:55):
Well?

Speaker 4 (27:56):
Uh, I think it's a great question, and it really
when I first read, I didn't like it because I
think the strategy's got to be part of it.

Speaker 3 (28:05):
But who am I to argue with General schwartz Coop?

Speaker 4 (28:09):
And so I kept thinking about it and thinking about it,
and here's where I came up. This is where I
landed on this thing, which may be totally different from you.
I think what he's saying, which I do agree with this,
I think character matters more than strategy. And you know,
I think we've all seen guys in coaching that maybe
schematically ETX and O wise, you know, it might not

(28:33):
have been as good as it could be, but the
way they did their business was important. And I thought
about this too. You know, I'll tell my players all
the time. I'll say, you know, what you do matters,
how you do it matters even more. And to me,
the character piece goes back to how I do my business.
So you know, we may have disagreement on what's the

(28:56):
best defense or offense or RPOs and things.

Speaker 3 (29:00):
Like that, but.

Speaker 4 (29:02):
How you do your business going back to your character,
how you treat others, how you communicate. That's where it
came down to me, is that how you do your
business is more important than maybe some of the details
of the business that you're doing. And then when I
look at how that applies to all, you know, I

(29:24):
don't know that I see a big difference in the
head coach or assistant coach. I think being a leader
is being a leader. A character is character, and you know,
I just that's where I landed on It is just
that it matters more my character and how I treat
people and how how I do my business instead of

(29:47):
I get locked in on a you know, we made
a major blocking adjustment this morning, and you know, thinking
about it last night and working on it, and you know,
I think strategically it's thematically it's going to really help us,
but that's minimal compared to how I interact and how
I treat my players and coaches. That's the best answer

(30:10):
I can give.

Speaker 2 (30:11):
Well, I think it's a good answer, and I think
you hit the nail on the head. I think what
he's saying is that and as you said, that character
is more important, is the more important part. It's kind
of the foundation of what real leadership is all about.
I think that's what General Sowurzkoff is probably trying to
say there, even if the strategy is is not perfect,

(30:33):
then they can still or they will still follow because
of the trust and the support.

Speaker 3 (30:40):
You know.

Speaker 2 (30:41):
So you know, if a leader without character can't he
can't even earn their trust, nor can he inspire loyalty,
even if they are brilliant. In other words, even if
they're the best player. So if you have the best player,
if he doesn't display that character, that he's not going
to be, you know, the best leader. And you know,

(31:05):
just because you are a leader or you're in position
of leadership doesn't mean you're a good leader. You know,
you can have leaders on your team, but they can
be bad leaders. How many teams if you had that
have had leaders, but they weren't good leaders. I've had
a few, and I'm going to tell you this, we
were never successful. We never reached our potential. When you

(31:27):
have those leaders that are bad leaders, and if they
don't have that character, they don't have that trust and
support of their followers, and you know, it's it's not
going to work out. It really isn't. They can bad leaders.
You know, they can do more harm than the good
leaders can do good. I really believe that.

Speaker 4 (31:48):
And you know, but I think that's a great point,
and I maybe you've got an answer. The best answer
I've got for this is that it's easier. It's an
easier path to follow up. But I agree with you.
Bad leaders seem to get followers easier.

Speaker 3 (32:05):
Than the good ones today, and I guess it's.

Speaker 4 (32:07):
Because the good ones are doing what's hard. The bad
ones you're doing what's.

Speaker 2 (32:11):
Easy, exactly. And so you, as a head football coach,
you've got to monitor that. You have to monitor that
if you have a lot of high character kids on
your team, even if you don't have any leaders in
the bunch, you still have a chance. Okay, But if
you have a team of bad leaders, you won't have
a chance, even if they're the best players, because you'll

(32:35):
never win the big one. And I'll guarantee you that
all the head coaches that are listening to this, I'll
bet you most of them agree with me. You know,
and uh that you know or have it, I'm sorry
that they've had an experience with having a team that
is led by bad leaders. And it's just it's hard
to do, it's hard to overcome, and it's usually never

(32:56):
fun as a head coach to coach a team that
have any leaders or leaders that are bad leaders. I
think as a coach, it's really important, as we talked about,
to identify your character and leadership players early, okay, and
then you've got a guide and develop them and monitor
and develop them along and try to guide them in

(33:18):
the right direction and kind of push them to be
the leaders of the team. I know I always did that.
I always in the going into the before the fall
season ever started, I would know who I wanted my
leaders to be, and I would kind of push them along.
I'd give them praise. I'd over exaggerate the praise in

(33:39):
front of the team because I wanted the team to
rally around them. And then you know, the best players.
If they didn't have those leadership skills or they I
knew they weren't good character kids, I would try to
keep them in the back a little bit. You can
only do that so much because they are the best
players that everybody the field knows they're the best players.

(34:02):
But you've got to you've got a guy, you know,
I know, and I know Travis mentioned earlier, you know,
when he was talking that he lets the players vote
for the captains. I never did that, and this is
kind of the reason why I didn't, and I didn't
want to take because a lot of times the popular

(34:24):
kid gets voted as captain, and a lot of times
he may not because he might be the popular kid
because he's the best player, but doesn't make him the
best leader. And if he's not a good leader and
it turns out to be a bad leader, and then
your football team is in trouble. You know, plans can
fail and be rebuilt, but character is the foundation of

(34:44):
real leadership. It really is.

Speaker 4 (34:47):
Hey, I love how you summed it up there at
the end, And I do want to give Jeremy a
shout out. He was our strength and conditioning coach my
last season at Mercer County, and you know a lot
of times a soccer guy and a football guy don't mess.

Speaker 3 (35:00):
But Jeremy was really good at his business.

Speaker 4 (35:02):
He was an excellent communicator, a high character guy. And
we've stayed friends. We stayed in touch and talk about
a young guy that's got a bright future. And he
won me over. He won me over really pretty quickly.
And I'm like, hey, Jeremy, you got it. Let's go
always go back to this like week nine or ten
prosper b Buken and had a thirty inch vertical.

Speaker 3 (35:25):
Now if you can.

Speaker 4 (35:26):
Take you can in DNA and get a thirty inch
vertical at the end of a football season where he's
the starting quarterback. To me, that's all you got to
put on your resume because you're the best there is it.
There ain't nobody else gonna pull that off.

Speaker 3 (35:38):
That was insane.

Speaker 2 (35:40):
Well, Jeremy, I love the question. I like those kind
of things.

Speaker 3 (35:43):
He did good. It was a good one. I agree.
I agree, Hey, David bad to the game.

Speaker 2 (35:48):
Games of the week. Okay, we got two games with
Daniel and Frederick Douglass off take manual, You'll take Frederick Douglass.
And then we got Belfrey and Johnson Central and then
talk a little bit about a rapid fire.

Speaker 3 (36:02):
I got you.

Speaker 4 (36:03):
It sounds good. You want to go first on Douglas. Okay, Hey,
now they've started off Owen two, but they've lost to
what maybe the four A and the six A State
Champs Islands and Trinity. I mean, hey, and the Highway's
game was a really good game. So I wouldn't I

(36:24):
wouldn't put a lot of faith in the O and
two that they've got. I think they're really really good. Hey,
listen to the guys that have offers, and I won't.
I don't even know if I get all of them
to Corey Field's got an offer from Louisville, uh sewn A.
Kahn has got an offer from Marshall, Eastern and Southern Miss.
Jakarie Talvert's got offers from Marshall, Southern, Miss, Eastern, Grambling,

(36:45):
and more. Thurman Wade has got an offer from Grambling
and UT Martin Raision. Gillespie's got an offer from Eastern
Southern Miss, U T. Martin, DeMont Green's got an offer
from ken State and Acrons. So I mean they've got
some players and no wonder he's no wonder he's playing
such a good schedule. I mean, that's a that's an

(37:06):
impressive list.

Speaker 3 (37:07):
So I'll tell you what I well, hey, you go,
you talk about Manuel and then we'll make our pitch.
My bad Go ahead. What do you think about Manuel? Well?

Speaker 2 (37:16):
I know a lot about Manuel actually, because you know,
I'm part of the souphomorean group and we just finished
playing them, and they got a really good, really nice
football team. Their head football coach is Keith Etclock. I
hope I say that name right. But as he's in
his second season there, he's done a really nice job.
He's off to one to one start, but he also

(37:38):
plays a difficult schedule there. You know, they always play
a good schedule. His twenty twenty fourteen was first season there,
was ten and two. He made it to the second
round of the playoffs. He's got a really he does
a really nice job of coaching. Their teams really organized
and they do a lot of really good things. He's
got some good players too.

Speaker 1 (37:59):
Now.

Speaker 2 (38:00):
His running back number thirty four, Garyan a trainer I
think the trainer I think is his last name, but
I know who he is because he is the realpel
at running back. You know, the first game of the
season against Louisville Central, who's always really good, went he
rushed the ball twelve times for one hundred and sixty

(38:20):
eight yards and three touchdowns. You know, he rushed for
like eighty yards last week, so he is really a
really good football players. He's mentioned a couple of times
I know from people as being a part of the
mister football talk and discussion, and he's legit. He's he
deserves that that recognition. Their quarterback is Cayden Mack. First

(38:45):
game he was four for seven for sixty three yards
and two touchdowns. I think last week against South Morny
through for over two hundred yards, So he is and
he's really dangerous as a scrambler and a runner, very fast, quick, athletic.
Nice football team, and their offense and defensive lines are

(39:08):
really and linebackers are really aggressive, I mean really fit, physical,
They like physical play. They get after you. They got
two top notch receivers in Braylan Miles and Noah Price.
I really like their team. I think they got a
really nice team and I guess I don't know if

(39:30):
I'm picking. I know that they play away. They play
at Frederick Douglass would be the hesitation I have of
picking them to win is they're going away to Frederick Douglas.
Frederick Douglas as oh to two, so I know they're
in the in the uh you know, I wouldn't say
panic stage, but they're in the sense of urgency stage

(39:53):
to get it right. So I guess if all that said,
I'd probably picked Frederick Douglass only before those two.

Speaker 4 (40:00):
Reasons I got you and I should have mentioned the
head coach at Douglas is Nate mcpete. They've already won
a state title there. We've had him on our show
and and Nate's Nate's done a great job at Frederick Douglass.
They got him a nice team. I think I'm gonna
go with Manuel, And I tell you a lot of
it goes back to the one fall that I helped,
uh the one fall that I helped coach Wallace at

(40:23):
Saint X. You know what I what I really I
didn't understand and realize is how good Louisville Manuel was.
And I saw them play at least once in person.
I saw him play Ballard, and then I'd watch a
lot of video of Manual and I was really impressed
with him. I mean, I think it's I think it's
one of the best places in Kentucky. I really do so.

(40:46):
I think it's gonna be a great game. You're talking
about too well coach great programs, but with Manuel, Yeah,
I'm gonna go with Manuel on this one.

Speaker 3 (40:54):
I think they got the edge.

Speaker 2 (40:56):
Yeah, they really do. Their offensive line is the real deal.
Defenses is pretty dog on aggressive. So yeah, they're going
to it to be a toss up really anyway. The
next game is Belfrey and Johnson Central. I'll go first
this time if you'd like, I've got David. This is
the first year in forty one years that someone other

(41:20):
than Philip Haywood is going to be leading or it
is leading Belfrey as the head football coach. Wow, forty
one years.

Speaker 4 (41:31):
That's crazy a life. That's great. Yeah, it really is
very impressive.

Speaker 2 (41:35):
The new head coach there is pretty familiar. He was
an assistant there for Philip is Matt Varney, and well
he got him off to a two and oh start.
I mean, wow, it's it's a pretty good start. Again,
he's worked with with coach Heywood for all those years.
I know that they had a great relationship and he's doing,

(41:57):
probably doing a lot of he learned a lot of
things from coach Hayward. But they got they got a
very nice football team. The quarterback is Chase Barney, and
I'm assuming that's his son. I don't know, but I'm
assuming that's his son. Got to be some kind of
kN uh he's He was five of eight in that
first game. He threw for two hundred yards and two touchdowns.

(42:20):
So you know, you'd say, well, could could they be
a passing threat? They've always been a running threat. Well
sounds to me like they got a guy that can
throw the ball pretty good. But the running back, Jeremiah
Austin was had seventeen carries for one hundred and forty
seven yards and two touchdowns. And that's the Belfrey we

(42:41):
all know and love. And the receiver was JB.

Speaker 3 (42:47):
Woollhom.

Speaker 2 (42:47):
He had three receptions for one hundred and three yards.
They're going to be playing at home and Bellfree would
be really had if you've I've coached there one time,
and that was always kind of a bucket list, was
to go and h and coach at their stadium at
their place with Philip on the other sideline, and it

(43:09):
I mean it is an electric atmosphere. It is it
sets down. They're up on the side up there. I
mean it's just the place is packed. I mean in
Johnson Central gonna bring their sphere of people too. Don't
think they're not. So it's gonna be one that came.

Speaker 4 (43:26):
Yeah, I agree with you. Hey, Johnson Central is coached
by Jesse Peck. Their linebackers leading the team are Dylan Lamaster.

Speaker 3 (43:38):
And here's a familiar name, Dalton Matney.

Speaker 4 (43:41):
We know who his dad is and Dalton's also I
believe Dalton is a state champion wrestler. I should have
checked on that before the show. I had another old
Johnson Central name here, Logan Music. In the backfield and
Braxton Perry's factor as well as you would expect they've got.
They've got a nice backfield, a nice running game. So

(44:03):
far this season, if these stats are accurate, they were
one of five passing for thirteen yards. Okay, so they're
they're doing an overwhelming amount of their bulk of their
work on the ground, which is not a surprise. They
defeated let Your Central week one. They played a very
good Madison Central team last week and beat them fifteen

(44:24):
to fourteen. And we scrimmaged Madison Central. I thought they
were really good. I think William Blair is doing a
super job with them, So I think it's gonna be
a great game almost, I tell you what. Though, I
think Johnson Central is gonna pull it off. I just
I think at this point Belfrey usually is a little

(44:45):
bit more of a late bloomer as the season goes on.
And I think, even though I know people will see
it as emotional, I may be completely wrong. I just
I think they're I think it's I think the first
game without Philip there at home is.

Speaker 3 (45:02):
Going to be tough.

Speaker 4 (45:03):
And I don't know, maybe it's not the first game.
Maybe I'm wrong about that. Yeah, yeah, I don't know that.
But I just think Johnson Central is a little better.
And I think if they played in October, at the
end of October, I might pick Belfrey. But I just
think Johnson Central seems to start a little faster than Belfrey.

Speaker 2 (45:22):
I'm going with Belfrey. I think that the playing at home,
it's a tough place to play, and I know one thing,
it's going to be one physical game.

Speaker 3 (45:31):
Yeah you're not kidd and.

Speaker 4 (45:34):
No wonder they're playing each other because nobody else wants
to play it because they're getting.

Speaker 3 (45:38):
Beat to death.

Speaker 4 (45:39):
Lee, that would not be a good good deal. So hey,
so what you got on the rapid fire.

Speaker 2 (45:45):
Let's go to the rapid fire? Hey, listen to this
rapid fire Week one. David Ukennon with ten out of thirteen.

Speaker 3 (45:55):
Wow, you do?

Speaker 2 (45:58):
I did nine out of thirteen, not out of Okay,
So no discuss. We're gonna wrap it. We're gonna rap it.

Speaker 3 (46:06):
Yeah. Last time I tried to talk, I gotta shut
up this.

Speaker 2 (46:10):
Here we go.

Speaker 3 (46:11):
Here's the game.

Speaker 2 (46:12):
Bowling Green versus Scott County, Scott County, whoa, uh, I'll
go with I'm gonna go with Bowling Green, Okay. And
then I got Boyle versus Lexington Catholic Boil County. I'll
go with boll County as well. How about Bullet East versus.

Speaker 3 (46:36):
North Bullet Bullet East.

Speaker 2 (46:39):
I'll go with Bullet East. It's kind of an easy one.

Speaker 5 (46:43):
Uh.

Speaker 2 (46:44):
Campbellsville versus Russell County Campbellsville. Really, I'm gonna go with
Russell County on that one, okay? And how about Cow?
This is what a game? This is gonna be? Cow
versus l C. A like Christian.

Speaker 3 (47:02):
Uh this time of year, I'm gonna go with LCA.

Speaker 4 (47:05):
If it were later down the year, I would I
would probably flip and go with Cal.

Speaker 2 (47:11):
I'm going with Cal. Flip, I listen to this. This
is really You're gonna be the expert on this one.
Flemming versus the Mason County.

Speaker 4 (47:20):
You know, you know I gotta pick Mason County. Hey,
my old cornerback is the head coach, Bradley Boone, so
uh yeah, I Hey, I know those guys at Flemming.

Speaker 3 (47:30):
I'm crazy about him.

Speaker 4 (47:31):
But I gotta go with Bradley Boone and Harry Lewis
and the Hey, Harry Lewis is the Mason County offensive coordinator.
How cool is that? Yes, I'm going with the Royals.
I'm going with the Royals.

Speaker 2 (47:43):
Well, if I'd known that before I made my pick,
I would have picked because I love Harry Lewis. But
I'm gonna I already had picked Fleming County. And don't
be mad the Mason County people. All right, here we
go with Hazard and Prestonsburg.

Speaker 3 (47:57):
Another route, I'm going with Hazzard.

Speaker 2 (48:00):
Okay, I think that's who I'm going with, too, has it?
And then how about listen to this one Mail and Saint.

Speaker 3 (48:07):
X Saint X.

Speaker 4 (48:09):
I think Kevin Wallace is like he's besides the fact
that he's a tremendous football coach, I just I think
he's got a different mojo this year, and I I'm.

Speaker 3 (48:20):
Not sure they ain't gonna win at all and have
the best team in the state.

Speaker 2 (48:23):
Well, I want to go with Mail and I got you.
I got listen to this rival. Now, this is a
long time rival, Mayfield versus.

Speaker 3 (48:32):
Paducah, I'm going with I'm going with the Blue Tornado.

Speaker 2 (48:38):
That's who I went with. Yeah, and then, uh, listen
to this rival, Racelin versus pipe Bull.

Speaker 3 (48:46):
Whoa man, that's a good one. I'm going with Pipeville.

Speaker 2 (48:51):
I'm going for Racelin. That's it. That's it.

Speaker 3 (48:55):
I got you. We'll fight. Hey, we'll find we'll find
out next week. Who got him.

Speaker 4 (48:59):
I even though I got ten out of thirteen, you're good. Hey,
I'll tell you this though I blew it on Alabama
Florida State.

Speaker 3 (49:07):
Good grief. I'm glad we didn't pick that one last week.

Speaker 2 (49:11):
Well, I'll tell you what he's I ain't gonna work
in Alabama now.

Speaker 3 (49:17):
No, I like him.

Speaker 4 (49:19):
I think he's a good coach. I hope it works out,
but I was feeling for him, but.

Speaker 3 (49:26):
I don't know.

Speaker 2 (49:27):
Got anything for next week.

Speaker 4 (49:29):
Yeah, we're gonna have coach Dane damer And from Paris
really excited about. Dane was a national championship quarterback at Georgetown.
He was the head coach at Boyd County back when
I was at Mason. We had those really good teams.
We had some great battles with Dane's teams. And then
our tough topic is from Dave Burnwarth and he says

(49:52):
he says wise attendance down at games, and I mean,
I haven't done any research to see if that's the case,
but he's got a theory on it. We'll talk about
it and we'll see if that's the case. We've got
our home opener with Danville is undefeated and we're looking
forward to that and I'll be curious to see what
our gate's like. But I got a good feeling about it.

(50:14):
I think Danvill's gonna bring a lot of people. I
think our people are excited and I'll be really disappointed
if we don't have a packed house at Bob Ware Stadium.
About Bob Wir Field Friday Night. I think it's gonna
be good.

Speaker 2 (50:26):
I'll be surprised too. I think you will as well.
Hey David, another good show. I think Travis did a
good job. We appreciate the listener tuning in and we'll
see you next week.

Speaker 6 (50:37):
Welcome to this episode of Forgotten Heroes. I'm your host,
Mack Yoakam. Besides integrating Major League Baseball, Jackie Robinson also
integrated Minor League Baseball's International League. But there were still
fifty two different minor leagues then, and that means fifty

(50:57):
one more courageous black men had to step up and
integrate the other leagues. In one of our recent episodes,
we told you about Bob Bowman, who had integrated the
Mountain States League. This time we take a look at
the Kentucky Illinois Tennessee League, or as it was known,
the Kittie League and another of those courageous black men,

(51:22):
Mickey Stubblefield from Mayfield, Kentucky Wilkers. Stubblefield graduated from Mayfield's
Dunbar High the school for African Americans. He became known
as Mickey because of the hand me down big shoes
he had to wear. Reminded everyone of Mickey Mouse. Mickey

(51:42):
was orphaned as a child and was passed around from
relative to relative. The only constant in his life was baseball.
When World War II broke out, Mickey joined the Navy.
When he was discharged in nineteen forty six, he had
no family and no job to return to. A Navy
buddy wrote about a barnstorming baseball team in Nebraska. His

(52:05):
buddy sent him money for a train ticket, and Mickey.

Speaker 1 (52:09):
Was off to Omaha.

Speaker 6 (52:11):
He joined the Omaha Rockets, one of the last great
barnstorming teams in the Midwest. After Jackie Robinson had joined
the Dodgers. Other African American players followed, and the Negro
leagues were searching for new talent, and Mickey Stubblefield found
himself playing for the Great Kansas City Monarchs, winners of

(52:33):
over ten Negro League titles. On the Monarchs, Mickey became
the protege of the legendary Satchel Page, earning him the
nickname Little Satch. Mickey left the Monarchs late in nineteen
forty nine and played for the McCook Cats in the
Nebraska Independent League. Mickey was now twenty four and married

(52:55):
with children. He thought of his future and returned home
to Mayfield, Kentucky. He still played semi pro ball for
the Doctor Pepper Plant, where he worked. The Mayfield Clothiers
were in the Kittie League at this time and were
part of the Pittsburgh Pirates organization. Branch Rickey, who was

(53:16):
the mastermind behind the Dodgers, was now with the Pirates
and he signed Mickey Stubblefield to a Pirates minor league contract.
Until June twenty sixth, nineteen fifty two, the Kittie League
was very much an all white affair, but Mickey Stubblefield

(53:39):
was about to change that. The Graves County War Memorial
Park was sold out. Mickey ran out to the mound
to start the game against the Paducah Indians. Over fifteen
hundred white and black fans gave Mickey Stubblefield a standing ovation.

(54:00):
Crowe ruled the South at the time, but that day
Mickey Stubblefield struck out Old Jim Crow. He won the
game five to four. Sadly, only Paduka would allow Mickey
to play in their stadium. No other Kittie League town
would allow an African American player in their stadium. After

(54:24):
that season, the Kittie League agreed to not sign any
other African American players because the league towns weren't quite
ready to give up their Jim Crow laws. Mickey Stubblefield
had been a racial pioneer, and four years later, in

(54:44):
nineteen fifty six, the ripple effect of his one season
in the Kittie League became evident as ten African American
students in Mayfield enrolled at Mayfield High, dead of the
all black Dunbar High. Join us next time for another

(55:07):
story of Kentucky's forgotten heroes. Forgotten Heroes can be found
at most podcast outlets.

Speaker 5 (56:41):
Ok ok

Speaker 6 (57:00):
To Think to un