Joe Munroe: Powerhouse Keys for the Ghost Hounds

Joe Munroe is the powerhouse behind the keys for Ghost Hounds, a blues-rock band that’s toured with legends like The Rolling Stones and ZZ Top. With four studio albums, including First Last Time (2023), Munroe helps drive their signature sound, proving rock ‘n’ roll is alive and thriving. 

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
God knows it. This is an n video and you
are oh, bless your heart. This is the Codd Podcast
chronically Pittsburgh's music scene, and welcome in. I'm Johnny heart

(00:20):
Well your host, along with Andy Pugar. So what is
it like to open up for the Rolling Stones? Let's
find out with Joe Monroe. A Hello, hey, hey, hello,
Joe testing. All right, Oh I can hear you know? Okay,
all right, all right, Joe, tell me every artist you've

(00:43):
ever worked with. Oh my gosh, I have a list.
It's quite a list.

Speaker 2 (00:49):
Well in the local vein. Uh worked going trying to
do it chronologically, but I probably won't. Eric Klass early
legendary blind sex player see Kenny Blake him. No band
called the Vibra Kings who are doing a concert or

(01:11):
a show here at stage AE I believe coming up
with the Clarks and it's a Fat Knicks Fat.

Speaker 3 (01:21):
It sounds like that show that.

Speaker 2 (01:22):
Yeah, so we're looking forward to that. Let's see. Uh
A band called this this is still a local band
called Satisfaction back in the early eighties something like that.
But one of the things that you know, was a
big thing for me in my musical career was I

(01:45):
became involved with the my music series TJ Johonna blank
on is He's on Channel thirteen. They did the PBS.
They started with do wop shows like raising money for Yeah,
Yeah Yeah, and those turned out to be really big.

(02:06):
So then they started branching forward in time in terms
of the music and the guy who was playing the
the do wop shows. That stuff's all kind of pretty much.
That's all the whole same thing for everybody.

Speaker 1 (02:23):
But they went to you were talking about the house band.

Speaker 2 (02:26):
I was the house band for That's the way they
work that stuff. They get the local guys to play,
bring the singers in for all these acts, and we
played for everybody.

Speaker 1 (02:37):
I always wondering how difficult that is? You said, everything is?
You make it so nonchalant, like everything is. It's not
that easy? Well, because you have you know, you know,
various styles and different harmonies and different things like that,
and how much preparation do you take to pull something

(02:59):
off like there?

Speaker 2 (03:00):
There was a lot. I mean, we you know, we
we had charts and rehearsals before before the actual date,
and then they would they would usually start rehearsing two
days before they're gonna tape, so we'd have two days
and they need two days to tape. There's so many
acts on one show.

Speaker 1 (03:19):
And I don't I don't mean to stop you, Joe,
But I don't know if you know this, but acts,
as you call them, can have a different temperaments. I
don't know if you know that. Really.

Speaker 2 (03:32):
Yeah, I've seen a little hint of that from time
to time. But honestly, most of these people were just
so happy. I mean, there, if you're a lifelong musician,
and I can vouch for this, you know, it's, uh,
it's kind of hard to not be just happy that
you're doing okay, you know.

Speaker 1 (03:51):
So most of most of them there were.

Speaker 2 (03:57):
Yeah. But the funny story on the way I got
involved in this to begin with, they had brought Jerry
Lee Lewis in on a show before I was involved
with the house band thing, And when he came and
sat down at the keyboard that he was at when
they were taping the live thing, he must have bumped

(04:18):
a button on the keyboard and instead of being a
piano sound, it was this harpsichord sound. So everything that
he played was just just sounded horrible, you know, because
a whole different.

Speaker 1 (04:30):
Sound sounds like from the atom.

Speaker 2 (04:32):
Yes, yes, exactly. So, uh, you know, I and somebody
knew of me that was involved in the recording end
of things, and uh they called and said, can you
maybe play what Jerry Lee was playing because he.

Speaker 4 (04:48):
Was gone long so you had to overdub him. So
on that show, Lewis, I don't have to die.

Speaker 2 (04:59):
I don't know. It was like I said, it was
before I was even involved in the show.

Speaker 1 (05:03):
Wait a minute, so Jerry didn't didn't understand. They didn't
hear that.

Speaker 2 (05:07):
Well, I don't know if he you know, I mean
an older guy in technology. It's not like you know,
it's not like this thing. Oh I pushed this, you know.

Speaker 1 (05:15):
You know, I played my two and a half minute
song I'm on here my paycheck, I'm out.

Speaker 2 (05:20):
Yeah. Well his VCR was flashing twelve o'clock the whole
time and he didn't know how to change it. So,
you know, but it was fun. It was an interesting
thing for me. I really enjoyed that. It was a
cool thing. But then after when I got involved was
in the they were doing seventies artists and soul and
that kind of thing, and the charts became more involved.

(05:40):
The songs became more involved than what they were originally
on the doop stuff. So uh, and the keyboard player
that was doing the other ones wasn't a great reader.
It wasn't his thing. But you know, you didn't have
to be on the doop stuff. You pretty much just
boom boom.

Speaker 1 (05:56):
Like I was saying, I do want to get into,
you know, your thoughts on production and that, you know,
I think music, I personally think music today is too
overly produced. When you know, you got some sound from
Sun Studios that still stand the test of time, and

(06:16):
then they have you know, pro tools and it takes
eighteen months to produce one song. It's a song and
a half minutes.

Speaker 2 (06:25):
But the reason is because you know, back in those
old days in Sun Studios, you know, oftentimes they would
put two or three microphones in the room and that
was it. You know, everybody just played together. And so
really in terms of like mixing the sound afterwards, there's
not much involved. It's like up and down, could we
hear this side of the room? Okay, turn that mic up?

(06:47):
You know. But you know, now with pro tools and
all that stuff, now you can.

Speaker 1 (06:51):
We're going to get into that. We're going to get
it take me, take me back, what is your earliest
music memory.

Speaker 2 (06:58):
Well, I started playing piano when I was four years old.
And I don't remember initially this story, but you know,
my mom and dad have told this countless time. So
my older brother was taking piano lessons and every year
they have a recital. So like a couple of months

(07:19):
before the recital, they're given what they're going to play,
and they played over and over and over because they
had to memorize the song. You know. So at four
years old, I guess I was watching my brother play
and he got up when he was done, and I
jumped up on the seat on top of a book
and I started playing the song that he was It
was for his recital piece.

Speaker 1 (07:40):
Did you come from a musical family?

Speaker 5 (07:42):
Not?

Speaker 2 (07:42):
You know, not really my mom very I think she
knew one song on the piano and just you know,
but yeah, I think I got it.

Speaker 1 (07:50):
You can attest to this time and time again. The
people that we interview, they just have this an.

Speaker 5 (07:55):
Agate talent that starts at a very young age.

Speaker 1 (07:59):
Yeah you remember the song that you play?

Speaker 2 (08:02):
I can, yeah, I can play it still today. Yes,
it was. It was called Rodeo Riders of All Things.
But you know it was pretty involved in for a
four year old.

Speaker 3 (08:11):
You know, now, were you watching his fingering or did
you hear it?

Speaker 2 (08:14):
And you know, I think it was both, you know
I because that's kind of my my strongest suit as
a musician now is the ear along with watching it.

Speaker 3 (08:24):
Happen, and you know that those senses yep.

Speaker 2 (08:30):
But yeah, So she called the piano teacher and said,
listen to this and she and the teacher said, oh,
Tom is really doing well on his recital piece. And
she said that's Joe and she said, bring him right over,
and you know so then I started, you know so,
and my entire musical education, aside from gigs.

Speaker 1 (08:49):
Of course, did your brother pursue music as well?

Speaker 2 (08:52):
He's playing trombone still in fact, but he quit piano
shortly after.

Speaker 3 (09:00):
Did you intimidate him?

Speaker 2 (09:02):
You ruined? I think so?

Speaker 1 (09:06):
Do you not have any respect?

Speaker 2 (09:09):
But he's still playing, you know, he's still playing trumpone
and he loves music too, Like you want to play,
you're not going to play, so you know that's all right.

Speaker 1 (09:20):
So you're four years old, you're playing the piano, you're
taking piano lessons. But what was what kind of music
was in the household. Wow, where did you grow up?

Speaker 2 (09:31):
By the way, Beaver, I went to Beaver High School,
Beaver County in Yeah. Yeah. And you know, I honestly
the music in our and I don't know if it's
because I got involved so young, but and my parents
weren't overly musical. In fact, didn't listen to a ton

(09:51):
of music. You know. It wasn't like a lot from
them playing. But in the in my we had eight
kids in our family, so a lot of I had
four older siblings or three older siblings, four younger siblings.

Speaker 1 (10:06):
Hey, when you have that many kids, you're somewhere in
the middle.

Speaker 2 (10:11):
Yeah, yeah, I am unlike the break after the first
three me so. But my brother, my next older brother,
not the trombone player, but he was into all. I mean,
he had a great record collection, Motown and you know,
rock and roll and uh, you know, you name it.
He he had a bunch of stuff. And I wasn't

(10:33):
allowed to play his records, but when he would leave
the house and go somewhere, the first thing I'd do is,
you know, go over and put stuff on and be listening.
And and one of the albums that I remember being
influenced by in My earliest was this. It was the
soundtrack for Jesus Christ Superstar.

Speaker 1 (10:52):
And you know, we've had a lot of people mentioned
that to.

Speaker 2 (10:54):
The music in that it's just like wow, especially back
in that time.

Speaker 3 (10:59):
And you know, the the rock opera was a new idea.

Speaker 2 (11:03):
Yes, yes, and the you know the guy playing that
played Jesus is Ian Gillen from Deep Purple. I mean, like,
come on, you know, you can't. You don't get much
better than that. And uh so, you know, it was many,
many years after I first had experienced that record that
I even realized that it was a musical like a

(11:24):
from a play, like a you know, I just thought
it was a record of you know, just like putting
the Temptations on or you know whatever. Just h So,
you know, that music really connected with me for and
it wasn't just lyrically. It was musically like.

Speaker 1 (11:41):
Do you remember the first forty five or first album
you ever bought?

Speaker 2 (11:45):
First forty five? I do. I bought uh Reeling in
the years Steely Dan and you know, just to this
day they're one of them. They're one of my top
five bands of all time. Just love the that you know,
those guys too crazy good so but that, yeah, that

(12:06):
was kind of the start of the whole thing. And
you know, somehow, you know, my parents, my mom didn't work.
My dad was worked in the mill, and but he
also then, you know, with eight kids. When he'd come home,
he was really good at fixing like anything from cars,
to air conditioning, to to appliances to like you name it.

(12:27):
People would give it to them clocks, he'd take them
apart and figure out how to you know, fix things.
And so he did a lot of service calls like
that after he was home from work. And so, you know,
we didn't money was tight as it we would expect
with eight kids, and but still they managed to you know,
they had a piano for me. They bought me a

(12:48):
set of drums way back in the you know, just
like looking back at it, I it's like, wow, I
could they do that, you know, But yeah, so they
were very encouraged in that way. I guess I think
my payback was whenever family would come over to visit,
I had to perform, you know, which I you know,

(13:10):
I initially loved a lot and really all the whole time,
but it became a little more you know, it's like
here we go uncle Uncle Almer's coming. I got to
put this yet.

Speaker 1 (13:22):
So what kind of radio?

Speaker 3 (13:24):
What?

Speaker 1 (13:24):
What radio station did you listen?

Speaker 4 (13:26):
Ah?

Speaker 2 (13:26):
Man, I was, you know honestly DV, Like you know,
I remember that early.

Speaker 1 (13:32):
On that those classic rocks off.

Speaker 2 (13:35):
Yeah, classic rock, and you know, like I remember going
to you know, back in the day with albums. It
was just a special time. You know, there's so many
great artists back then, but you know, you remember the
event that it was when you hear, hey, this band's
coming out with a record, and when it finally arrives,
my friend and I would get there and would take
the record up in his third floor bedroom and just

(13:58):
put the record on.

Speaker 1 (13:59):
And was there a record store in Beaver? Yeah?

Speaker 2 (14:02):
Yeah, there was a guy named Tom Rinkenberger was his name,
but he was he was Rinky Dink. He was a DJ.
So he owned a record store in Beaver that, uh,
you know, we bought a lot of that stuff from.
And and of course back then was like National Records.

Speaker 1 (14:19):
That's not Ardy Summers though, is it. No? No, no, no, okay, no,
he was the original rinkydnk oh really.

Speaker 2 (14:25):
Yeah, okay, yeah Tom, because Rinkenberger, I think.

Speaker 1 (14:30):
Okay, So that kind of became his instead. Did you
just spend a lot of time at the record Oh.

Speaker 2 (14:34):
My gosh, yeah, yeah, it's I don't know if if
records got you know, less lucrative or he just was
trying to branch out. But at some point it became
record store slash fish store. So he had tanks. But
it was really a great you know, symmetry of that
whole thing when you got music here and you're watching
fish sure, yeah, interesting.

Speaker 1 (14:56):
But anyway to make the money dollar right? All right,
so you're more interested in in in music and you're
you're playing keyboards and drums and was there any other
instruments that you picked up?

Speaker 2 (15:10):
I had a banjo, which I could never really get
completely get the you know, the coordination of dexterity down
for that, but accordion, which piano related, you know, play
the whole this side is all just like a piano,
so you know, but uh, now I played guitar, played bass,
I played.

Speaker 1 (15:29):
Okay, Well I'm leading up to did you did you
ever form a band in high school?

Speaker 2 (15:36):
Just the year my senior year. Yeah, there was a
you know, Beaver and Rochester at that point where big rivals.
They would play each other at the end of the
year football, right, And you know, somehow through that I
met two guys, one played bass and one played guitar.
And then there was a guy in Beaver who played
drums and I played keyboards. So we put a band together.

(15:58):
And one of our first performances was the year after
I graduated. We played the talent show at the high school,
you know, and the kids.

Speaker 3 (16:06):
Just what was a big deal for the name of the.

Speaker 2 (16:10):
Band was after Forever, and we played We played a
Steely dance, and we played some Zeppelin, we played Skinnered,
you know, just did the whole thing. We did. And
my sister ended up marrying the guitar player. Oh yeah, So.

Speaker 1 (16:29):
All right, so where did you Where did you go
after high school?

Speaker 2 (16:35):
Well, you know, I so so real quick. Before, like,
I starting taking lessons at four years old. I took
from the same lady who was like literally a ten
or fifteen minute bike ride from my house. She was
very close to where we lived. I took from her
for twelve years, and so at the age of sixteen,
I stopped taking lessons. And after that, you know, no music,

(16:59):
formal music education. And I knew when I graduated that
I wanted to play, and that's what I didn't want
to go to college, like, let's spend the money on that.
And so I just started, you know, started playing in
bands almost immediately. I mean I think I probably I
did a handful of gigs before I even graduated. Locally

(17:21):
and just you know local.

Speaker 3 (17:22):
Have you always made a living for music?

Speaker 2 (17:24):
Nothing else I have except for uh, you know, I've
continued playing through that entire time. I worked for eight
and a half years at Hollywood Music so still musically, Yeah.

Speaker 1 (17:38):
Yeah, I think that counts. Yeah, I think that counts.

Speaker 2 (17:43):
And that's where I met Eric Klass. He had come
in to check out some keyboards and I was demonstrating
stuff for me. He's like, oh, you want to play
some gigs?

Speaker 3 (17:53):
What you know?

Speaker 1 (17:54):
That's funny? How you know people do get gigs in
just the y just stop, you know, you never know,
you never know? Absolutely yeah, all right, So after you,
after the glow of winning the battle of the talents,
the beau or whatever, you know, what happened.

Speaker 2 (18:14):
Then started playing. You know, this was the I graduated
in seventy seven, and back at that time, you could
make a living, as I'm sure you know with sunny
they had the They had this circuit of holiday inns
sharings that were you know, like various like go they

(18:35):
would go out as far as there was one in
Union Town, there was one in dow Boys, there's one
in Johnstown. There's kind of spread within a three hour
you know range some something like that, and you would
just go back. In those days, they had live entertainment
in their lounges and get there on Sunday, set up
all your stuff. You'd be at each place two weeks

(18:58):
at a time, didn't have to move anything.

Speaker 3 (19:00):
There's so much opportunity. Oh, it was live music.

Speaker 2 (19:02):
Think about that playing you know in two weeks could play.

Speaker 3 (19:06):
Yeah, you could play every day of the week.

Speaker 2 (19:07):
Yep.

Speaker 1 (19:08):
And did you stay at the holiday and yeah.

Speaker 2 (19:09):
They put you up and everything. I mean, you know,
that's that was all. Part of it was like the
greatest Like wow, all the money I make I get
to spend on booth. I mean, you know so and.

Speaker 1 (19:21):
Here I was thinking, hey, what a great experience, a
learning experience, and you're like it's a boozy.

Speaker 2 (19:28):
Well there was a little of that.

Speaker 1 (19:29):
It was a little both, but it.

Speaker 2 (19:30):
Really was like, I mean, it's the best musical education
because you're playing with musicians and you're doing it.

Speaker 3 (19:38):
The audience and you have to entertain.

Speaker 1 (19:40):
You have to entertain.

Speaker 2 (19:42):
Exactly exactly, and you learn that stuff. I feel bad
for you know, young guys now that don't have that available.

Speaker 3 (19:49):
Yeah, there's not as much opportunity.

Speaker 2 (19:51):
It's not in that range for sure. I mean you
could probably pick up three or four gigs a week somewhere.

Speaker 1 (19:57):
Maybe what to give us an example, maybe a playlist
that you played at the holidays?

Speaker 2 (20:02):
We played like you know what, so this was we
had two girl singers in the band. Oh sorry, we
had two girl singers in the band, and one of
them turned out to be my wife, now who we
met in that situation. She auditioned for the band. So
you still her, I do. It's forty three years now, yeah, yeah, yeah,

(20:27):
but thank you. Yeah, I got lucky. She's she's great.
So but we you know, we did so having two girls,
we did a lot of heart we did, uh you
know we again. Zeppelin always one of my favorites. But
it was great because you could play whatever you wanted
to play, just what stuff appealed to you. So what

(20:49):
at the time we try to keep current on stuff.
So whatever was in the top you know fifty. At
that point, we'd pick out the stuff that we really
liked and that's that's what we played. But you could
if you look at the billboard charts in that time period,
you have a pretty good indication of what kind of
stuff we were doing, you know, and.

Speaker 1 (21:08):
Like, uh, well, because it was was you know, you
mentioned some of the rock songs, but yeah, you play
some of the pop songs too, did you what kind
of a r any dance songs?

Speaker 2 (21:19):
Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, sure, let's like I remember, you know,
in the genre, in the rock genre, we did uh
in Heart, we did Straight On, we did Barracuda, we
did Magic Man. You know, Skinnered, We've done probably every

(21:39):
every Skinnered song possible. Freebird before it became, uh, the
the overplayed song that it is today. But it was
a great song, you know, overplayed for a reason. I'm
sure that you know, Steely Dan, a lot of that stuff.
We would. We did Ricky Don't lose that number. We did,
you know, we did the Kids, Charlemagne, you know, people,

(22:03):
and it was a it was a time when people
were receptive to whatever. They didn't care quite as much
about what it was. You were playing, just how it sounded.

Speaker 3 (22:12):
And how it sounds.

Speaker 2 (22:13):
Yeah, yeah, so you know that that's another fortunate thing
from from coming around in.

Speaker 1 (22:20):
That did you ever write music?

Speaker 2 (22:23):
I have written a little, mostly lately. Nothing back then
that we we ever played, And you know, part of
it was because of I think for me, of just
being so busy playing and not really having anything that
I could, you know, back the technology maybe a handheld

(22:46):
little micro because recorder that you could just like more
for talking and leaving it like doctors would use, you know,
So it's not it didn't make for you know, the
best sounding thing to put things down. And I wish
now that I would have written more back in those days.
But you know I do write some now, Mu's more

(23:07):
than I did back then.

Speaker 1 (23:09):
And what what's what's the genre?

Speaker 2 (23:11):
But it was it's all over the place. Yes, some
you know, I guess some of it being a keyboard player,
you know, it's a lot of it's very piano heavy.
But all of my influences, you know, there's it's Elton, Johnny,
It's uh, it's like Steely Dan for sure. Deep Purple

(23:35):
was one of my favorites of all time.

Speaker 1 (23:37):
That whole John Lord is like, the greatest show I've
ever seen was the show with the Perfect Strangers show
at Civic Arena, and it's and John Lord is the
reason it blew me away because to have a keyboard
player take over a stage he did.

Speaker 2 (23:59):
Yeah, that's you know, it's one of my biggest regrets
that I never got to see them in the original
you know formation with Richie Blackmore and you know.

Speaker 1 (24:08):
That whole and I am more guitar centric, okay, but
I left having a deeper respect with John Lord because
he really was the show. Ye Now, Ian Gillan, like
you know when you talked about him, when you talk
about vocalist, you.

Speaker 2 (24:25):
Know, nobody better than that. Yeah, just just amazing. And
you know, you can hear all the influences in you know,
ten years or so after that band was in their prime,
just you can hear it in so many other bands.
It's like, well, like they liked the Deep Purple quite

(24:48):
a bit.

Speaker 1 (24:48):
You can who else influenced you? Well?

Speaker 2 (24:53):
You know, So this is like in my early stages
of playing the taking lessons and stuff, my teacher was like, honestly,
I believe if I would test out, if there's such
a thing, I'd probably have a PhD in theory too.
She was like, you know, we learned. I learned classical stuff.

(25:14):
And she had a great way of doing it where
she would she'd give me all the classical stuff as
the requirement, and if I did well on it, she
would give me a popular like sheet music for a
popular song. And that was in motivation for me to
make sure I did And it was a great way
of her working as I look back on it. But

(25:35):
you know, one of the things was reading everything back
in those days. You know, I'd hear songs on the
radio and it's like, man, I got to get the
music for that. I got to find the sheet music
for that. I love the song. I love this song.
And there was another kid in my grade that was
never took lessons in completely played by ear and he
would start playing this song and be like, where'd you

(25:55):
get the music for that? I've been looking at these
like I don't know the music, you know, like, oh,
how did you how did you play it? He's like
I just listened to it and figured it out. And
then this light bulb went off in my head and
like you can do that, like wow, And you know,
from that point is when I'm I really started developing
my ear. So that's you know, those things were were

(26:20):
the kind of thing where you just hear them and listening,
you know what you can hear what's going on and
where to play, and so you know, that's that. That
was one of the things that you know, along with
at that period, if you were playing piano, you were
generally speaking, you're either an Elton John guy or a

(26:40):
Billy Joel guy, same sort of era of you know,
and I just gravitated to Elton John. I think he
may have been a little bit earlier than Billy Joel
and that probably is the reason. But you know that's big, big.

Speaker 3 (26:56):
You always had the ear.

Speaker 1 (26:57):
You just didn't realize that's yeah, that's because.

Speaker 5 (27:00):
It's four years old. You heard a song, you were
able to play it, and you just didn't think that
that was I.

Speaker 2 (27:06):
Didn't use it that way. Yeah, after was like, oh wait,
I can just listen and play this. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (27:13):
Now did you play any Elton John songs when you
were at the holidays?

Speaker 2 (27:16):
Oh yeah, oh my god. Yes.

Speaker 1 (27:18):
Did you ever do any kind of dueling piano?

Speaker 2 (27:21):
Teal never did it as a like a on a
big scale, like a lot of guys you know, have
worked in those places just for a year or two years,
you know, but I've occasionally done a gig with Hermie
Granadi and Hermie's you know day he came from that,
you know era, he really is, and you know, he

(27:42):
first I think he called me because he needed a
sub to play with him, and I never I didn't
really even understand the concept, like what it was all
about and everything, but I thought, you know, I loved
Hermie and loved his playing, thought this'll be fun. Let's
just do it. And so you know, got a little
bit of little taste of that kind of thing, and

(28:03):
it's it's a cool, cool thing. I've always just been
more of an ensemble band type thing, but you know,
I just enjoy that more and the playing with several people,
because then the ear really becomes a thing where you're
listening to what this person plays and you try to
play something that that inspires something else. And then it's

(28:26):
it's constantly. You know, you got five guys playing, then
you have this constant back and forth. It's a it's
a special concept, it really is. Absolutely I think that's
where that where that came from quite a bit.

Speaker 1 (28:37):
So now did you dabble in. You mentioned that your
your piano teacher taught you classical, and did you delve
in any kind of classics or jazz or anything like that?

Speaker 2 (28:49):
Jazz for sure. I you know, when Eric Klaus had
asked me about doing the gig. At that point, I
never played any jazz out anywhere, and uh, you know,
I think I might have been I'm gonna guess twenty
one or two years old maybe something like that. You know,

(29:09):
and the band heat at that time. He think he
was maybe in his late forties or something, and you know,
the band was Ray to Fade Junior on drums, Dwayne
Dolphin was playing bass, Kenny Carson guitar, and and me
and I didn't know any of those guys. You know,
it's just like I should. He he asked me to
do it. I was like, yeah, sure, you know, I
show up. I was so nervous.

Speaker 1 (29:31):
Okay, yeah.

Speaker 2 (29:33):
It was you know, it was nerve wracking. But you know,
those those situations I found for me at least, and
when I started playing with Kenny Blake, same kind of thing.
You know, when you're the worst person in the band,
those are the times you learn the most like you
because it's like, I don't want to be the weak link.
I'm gonna do everything in my power, you know, And

(29:57):
but it's a it's it's a great looking back on
it was a great. I probably should strive for that
in every situation because you'll.

Speaker 3 (30:04):
Learn to leave your comfort zone.

Speaker 2 (30:05):
Yeah, yeah, you know it's ah, but you know that's
it's all accumulative thing. And you always learn something on
gigs and you know, with with people and how people
interact and play together and leaving room for somebody, and
you know, it's it's this long. I think one of

(30:26):
the inclination with a lot of most musicians probably is,
you know, to show everything you've gotten, always play these
crazy that you want people to always be like wow,
that guy is like amazing, you know. But for me,
I've learned over the years it's like about leaving space.
And one of the guys when I first started doing

(30:47):
recording sessions who pounded it into my head. It's he constantly.
I couldn't tell you how many times I heard him
say less is more, Less is more, Less.

Speaker 3 (30:55):
Is more, Yeah, and just important.

Speaker 2 (30:58):
It's so important. And then when you start listening to
records that you really like, you start hearing those things
happen in those records and think, man, this is my
favorite part is when everything else is going silent, you know,
on the song Asia, for example, when Steve Gadd's playing
and do you hear the sticks click? And then there's
nothing else playing and it's like those little things like

(31:20):
are like wow, magic. You couldn't plan it just just happens.

Speaker 1 (31:25):
Let's get back to the narrative. So after after the
holiday in gigs, yes, what what's next?

Speaker 2 (31:32):
At that point it started being like more in the
rock club like the Vibra Kings thing was. Was that
way I played in for a short time in a band,
a country band in Beaver County and we you know,
we we did at that point we had worked ourselves
up to you know, we had roadies carrying our stuff.

(31:54):
It was like you know, a light show. I mean
it was like pretty big and we'd draw a lot
of people and making you know, top money for that day,
and you know, it felt really proud of that, you know,
being in that situation and what we built in those things.

Speaker 1 (32:12):
But stylistically, did you feel comfortable playing country?

Speaker 2 (32:15):
Yeah? Yeah, yeah it was. You know, it's it's there's
so many if when you listen to this stuff, you know,
you can hear the influences of you know, in country,
for example, you hear blues licks all the time. It's like, well,
it's just you know this guy or you know Floyd
Kramer playing those things. A lot of that stuff is
so bluesy. And so you learn it. As I said,

(32:38):
it's constant learning in that situation. So you learn how
to connect the things you know into another genre style
and you know, also kind of explore some of the
more traditional things in that genre too, And it's it's
a great, great learning thing. I mean, I enjoy that.

Speaker 1 (32:56):
Now were you playing original country songs or or was
it a cover?

Speaker 2 (33:01):
It was a cover band. I think we did maybe
four originals over that. I was with that band for
going to say six years or so something like that.

Speaker 1 (33:11):
What's the time span? Where are we now?

Speaker 2 (33:13):
Mid eighties somewhere in that vicinity, and uh, you know
it was.

Speaker 1 (33:19):
A that's actually before the country explosion would happen in
like nineteen ninety, right, So what.

Speaker 2 (33:24):
What the who were Let's see like the Kentucky Headhunters,
I know we did it was it was always smart
like artists on the on the rock end of things,
it seemed. But we did some Travis Tritt, we did
some early Vince Gil stuff, you know, just great music,
you know, all that stuff, and uh just uh, it

(33:48):
was a it was a fun, mostly energetic stuff. You know,
you do the occasional you got to have that EBB
and flow in your set list where you slow things
down here for us a little bit and then you
pick it back up. And but you know, our crowd
was like a dancing crowd, so we everything.

Speaker 1 (34:04):
We had to pick it up pretty dance.

Speaker 3 (34:06):
That's interesting. You played country Sonny in Los Angeles in
the eighties.

Speaker 1 (34:10):
Uh huh.

Speaker 5 (34:11):
He was with a country band called well country rock
called Elvis Montana and yeah, and he was he was
on that gig for a long time before I met him.

Speaker 3 (34:22):
But I wonder if that was an era when rock
and country were combining.

Speaker 2 (34:30):
I think so. I mean, you know, I always thought
of Travis.

Speaker 3 (34:33):
It sounds like what you were playing.

Speaker 2 (34:35):
Yeah, yeah, like that whole like you know, it's there's
a song, Travis Stritz song, Treble Trouble t r O
U B L. He would say in the lyric, and
you know, it just a rock and roll song. But
I guess because he had a little bit of a
southern drawl in his voice. It kind of leaned toward country.

(34:55):
But I mean it basically it was a rock song.

Speaker 1 (34:58):
Well, I mean in the in the seventies, you know
when Leonard Skinner and and uh, you know, you had
that that country rock explosion. You had Molly Hatchet right right,
and the Almond Brothers and you had and then that
splintered into a different yeah, yeah, different things. And then
then there was country, country blues, and there was a

(35:19):
little and so you played them all you play yeah.

Speaker 2 (35:22):
Yeah, that's you know, it's it's all in the in
the toolbox, so to speak.

Speaker 1 (35:27):
Now, did you do any studio recording at that time?

Speaker 2 (35:30):
I did a lot of session work early, I would
say through most of the eighties. Uh, and a lot
of it was.

Speaker 1 (35:39):
When did you start your session work and where did
you start?

Speaker 2 (35:43):
The first place I really got involved there was a
guy named Barney Lee who owned Aircraft Studios. It was
in Dormont.

Speaker 3 (35:50):
Yeah, I remember that by the track.

Speaker 2 (35:52):
Yeah, right by the yeah, And I you know, I
can't remember exactly how I got involved the first time.
I think I may have, you know, just come in
with a band playing to play on their stuff. They
they brought me in and you know, I became friends
with Barney and he started using me. I mean it

(36:15):
almost became literally like I just go there every day
and he'd have stuff, you know, to do. Remember I
remember taking my kids with me in fact, when they
were quite young, and they would just hang out in
the studio.

Speaker 1 (36:28):
And so you really didn't know what song or what
kind of song you were going to play from it.
What was that like?

Speaker 2 (36:34):
Oh, it's great. I mean for me, I love it
because you really let me my ear being my one
of my strong points. It's perfect because you know, you
listen to something and think what's missing or what would
sound good with this or you know, and you know,
as I said, the less is more thing makes it

(36:54):
a little easier. Actually, you know when you when you
start thinking that way. And I did some because of
working at Hollywood Music and working with electronics stuff. You know,
I was pretty good at like drum machine programming, so
I did some of that stuff early on for artists.
I think one of the one of my earliest references

(37:17):
of searching for yourself on online just to see if
your name comes up for things, was I played that
I forgot about. I played with on a programmed a
drum part for Djoe Gersheki on one of the house
rocker early songs that I completely forgot, really forgot about
yep so, and you know that was but but I

(37:38):
would say the ratio back at that point, you know,
when I first started it, even through the whole thing,
was probably seventy percent jingles and commercials and stuff like
that and thirty percent band stuff. It was just fun
because they're you know, those things are all over the place.
You know, you never know what you're gonna do.

Speaker 1 (38:00):
So you're listening to the radio and you hear a jingle,
You're like, oh, crack, I did that last year. And
it's never like right away, you don't like, you know,
do a jingle on on Saturday. And then the next
week it's like there's six months a little rag time
and so you totally you've done a million other different
projects and all of a sudden, some stupid jingle for

(38:22):
some restaurant sounds familiar.

Speaker 2 (38:26):
Really funny story. As I said, it brought my daughter
with me especially a lot. I think she was, you know,
two or three years old or something, maybe four, and
we were working on a commercial for Eaton Park and
it was D. C. Fitzgerald was this acoustic guitar player.

(38:47):
He kind of did that fingerpicking thing. And the jingle
we were working on was for the Smiley Cookie that
they had just come out with, and the commercial was
him playing guitar and I think that you probably it's
may ring a bell, I think, but it's he would sing,
uh what you smile? You know about Oh.

Speaker 3 (39:09):
Yeah, m.

Speaker 2 (39:14):
Eating books, loop plates. I mean it was back there right.
So they wanted it was like a claymation kind of
thing of the cookie, you know, like it rolled out
as a ball of dough and then it flattened, you know,
and they showed like kind of it's making itself into
a smiley cookie, and they wanted to have a little

(39:34):
kid giggling at this thing. They went. They called the
the what the clo and you know, the what is
the youth one and whatever in the in the downtown
thing for kids. They tried a bunch of different things.
It just didn't work. And my daughter was there. I said,

(39:55):
let me try this. So I took her into the
booth and just tickled her and she was like giggling, laughing.
Thought this is it so in you know, you get
a one time fee for recording. Typically when you're doing
a commercial, you know, it's page two hundred and fifty
bucks or whatever.

Speaker 1 (40:11):
Residuals for that.

Speaker 2 (40:12):
What she yeah, she got for I think five years.
She was like, I'm sitting them like thinking, man, I'm
in the wrong end of this.

Speaker 1 (40:21):
My daughters, you know, don't giggle for free.

Speaker 2 (40:30):
I want residual.

Speaker 1 (40:33):
This is kind of a sidebar. We're going to get
back to our you know, your narrative. But do your
kids playing instruments music?

Speaker 2 (40:38):
And you know what they do a little bit? I mean,
they're they're very musically. I told my wife, knowing how
tough the music business is, and you know, I'm uh,
I wasn't you know, certainly not the best musician in
town by any stretch, but you know, I had reached
a point where, you know, if somebody is looking for

(40:59):
a keyboard play, I'd be one of the first few
calls at least. You know, it's like can you do
the gig? And you know, so, I mean I was
at a point in a smaller market like this where
get a reasonable amount of that stuff. And even at
that it was really tough at times. So I told
my wife, I said, you know, these guys are going
to have to They're gonna have to beg me to,

(41:20):
you know, like consistently that they want to learn something.
And they they love music. They came to a lot
of gigs when they were a little but you know
they're they my my dad, Yeah, my oldest son is
a doctor. My daughter is a She wasn't teaching, but
she's in the in the management and of teaching now.

(41:41):
So you know, it's I feel like.

Speaker 1 (41:43):
They they chose wise, yes, yes, and you.

Speaker 2 (41:46):
Know they still enjoy music and enjoy it a lot
more because I'm involved in it.

Speaker 1 (41:51):
So yeah, okay, that's all right. So let's get back
to where are we in the middle eighties, mid eighties.
We're playing some country band. We're also you know, doing
some session work, you know, getting back to session work.
I don't know if you ever saw the documentary on
the Wrecking Crew. Oh yeah, it's so fascinating that it is.

Speaker 2 (42:13):
It really is. I'm like, that is probably my I've
seen all of those things. There's the Wrecking Crew on,
there's the Muscle Shoals.

Speaker 1 (42:23):
Yes, which is just another great one.

Speaker 2 (42:25):
Yeah, standing in the Shadows of Motown with the Funk Brothers.
I mean, you know, and it's just and now there's
just I think in the last year one called the
group of guys called the Immediate Family, this which is
these are all James Taylor's probably my all time favorite artist,
just always loved him, you know. But his band back

(42:48):
in those days was Lee Sklar on bass, Russ Konko
on drums, Danny Korchmore on guitar. Those and those three
guys are.

Speaker 1 (42:57):
Part of the Wrecking Crew.

Speaker 2 (42:58):
Well they're immediate family, but they're like the Wrecking Crew.
And so in the new documentary, you know, aside from
those three, there's also Waddy walk Tel who played with
Linda ron Staton.

Speaker 1 (43:12):
Nisy Everybody and you name it right.

Speaker 2 (43:15):
All those guys were on like they were in I
think the Laurel Canyon era area and they played on
a lot of those things. Jackson Brown and you know,
various artists that you know. But that's I'm addicted to
that stuff.

Speaker 1 (43:29):
You could be in any era if you let's let's say,
let's say you know you made it the Hollywood. To me,
I think that that Laurel Canyon period where you know,
Crosby Stills now young Mitchell and yes, you got Frank
Zappa down over here, Jim Morrison up over there, and.

Speaker 2 (43:50):
Yeah, yeah that just yeah, that would be I think
that would be my choice for sure.

Speaker 5 (43:55):
You know, that's such an era of creativity, quality of music.

Speaker 2 (44:01):
Right right, and everyone knew each other. They all hung
out together, and the communal style of you know, of
hanging out together, and it's like man drugs, lots of
six drugs and rock and.

Speaker 1 (44:14):
There was a lot of it. Yes, getting back to
all right. Usually I'm bringing the the you know, the
whoever I'm in it, I'm trying to bring them back
to the narrow. I'm the one doing this, all right.
So mid eighties we're doing some session work and some
country thing and what's next? What are we doing?

Speaker 2 (44:35):
I guess, you know, keeping I'm still playing. There was
an era I guess after those steady bands that I
you know, was mostly with that band, A band after
that kind of when it went the wayside. I did
a lot of I never had my own band, actually,

(44:57):
which is why I think maybe for six months I
did in Beaver County we played and but but it
was you.

Speaker 1 (45:04):
Know, very sure, why not? Why not?

Speaker 2 (45:07):
You know, I guess because I, you know, I didn't
have first of all much original music that I wanted
to do, and I enjoyed playing with various people. And
then that's kind of what happened at that point, was,
you know, I would get calls from people you know
to sub in, so in like in a month's period

(45:29):
of time, I'd play with, you know, ten different bands
in that month, you know, and it's just a you
know that that variety is really cool.

Speaker 1 (45:39):
What was the need? What what niche did you feel
that you could play in ten different bands?

Speaker 2 (45:45):
Well, you know, I think it's the ear if you
can jump, because you know, if you can't, A lot
of it's last minute. Like I would look at my
schedule and say, oh, next week, I got one gig,
you know, and then by the time that week's over,
I played five, you know, so literally that quickly, Hey
can you play Tuesday? Yes, you know, And so just
being I don't know if it's I don't know if

(46:06):
it's being able to or not being afraid to just
jump into something, you know, and do a lot of
guys now that I play with on occasion, h you know,
they don't like if you call them for a gig.
They want a list of every song they want to
be able to. Like we wou never ask that. It
was just like, where's the gig? What time? You know,

(46:28):
so you just show up and use your ears.

Speaker 1 (46:30):
No prep, no prep, no, no, no, no no. Didn't
even look at a playlist.

Speaker 2 (46:34):
Not really no. I mean some gigs you know.

Speaker 1 (46:37):
Were playing halfway oh I know this song.

Speaker 2 (46:41):
Literally, that would happen sometimes, you know, somebody would mention
a song and I don't know a by the title,
but I know the song I've heard of, you know,
a thousand times.

Speaker 5 (46:49):
But well you get your cues too a lot of
times from other musicians, and absolutely they'll turn and look
at you and whatever signal.

Speaker 2 (46:56):
Your guys, yeah you know this is they want something
for me here, or or that I'm seeing looking at
somebody else, it's like that it's that guy's turn, you know.
So and then and besides the uh less is more idiom.
I think one of the one of my other big
times is uh And especially for somebody who plays those
kind of gigs where you're just jumping into a thing

(47:18):
when in doubt layout you know, if you if you
don't know, don't play.

Speaker 1 (47:23):
Well, Okay now, I want to put it in a
historical perspective. So you're still playing you know a lot
of cover songs and things like that, mostly cover all right,
So if they are looking to you to do something
and you don't know the song, what do you? What
do you do?

Speaker 2 (47:39):
You while you that's layout until you hear what the
groove is like? You know a lot of I mean,
some songs can be more jazz.

Speaker 1 (47:47):
You can probably intervise, okay, but you know, if you're playing, like,
you know, a well known band but maybe not a
well known song, right, what do you do, Joe?

Speaker 2 (47:56):
There's you know, there's times where I've you know, probably
not played the right stuff for a song. But also
there's times, you know, and this is the magic of it,
where you play something that's not what the original had,
but that's a really cool different thing. And those are
the moments when you know, somebody hears that the guitar

(48:17):
player here is that it's like, oh man, I didn't
even think of this, and then you know, things go
off in their own kind of direction and that that's
my favorite, And that's one of the reasons I really
enjoyed taking those gigs with various people all the time,
you know.

Speaker 1 (48:30):
And obviously you did it well enough, you kept getting it.

Speaker 2 (48:34):
Well, I can I fooled most of the people most
of it.

Speaker 1 (48:38):
Yes, all right. Any any spectacular moments or any disastrous
moment that you can remember well from that era, not really.

Speaker 2 (48:49):
I mean, you know that, I think one of my strengths,
but you know also is that I have the ability
to kind of tie sew things together and keep you know,
I guess because I know what I would want to
see from somebody when I was learning that stuff, and
like what kind of cues, what I look for that
would tell me things and start to pick up on

(49:10):
that stuff and then give those to other people at
the same time. So things kind of you know, it
may be rough in a patch here or there in
the song or something, but generally speaking, you know, it
would be you know, perceived by people in the audience
as a good quality.

Speaker 3 (49:28):
You know, doesn't hear a lot of those things in
musicians here.

Speaker 2 (49:32):
They don't, they don't, thankfully.

Speaker 1 (49:37):
All Right, we're moving into the nineties now, So what
are we doing? What is Joe oh Man?

Speaker 2 (49:45):
You know, less session work, but still some and in
some different studios, you know, moving around a little bit
somebody hears about something I or heard something I did
and liked it and once me to play on this
or that. But really more, I mean that the entire

(50:07):
nineties almost was at least the first half was still
doing those you know, freelance kind of gigs where somebody
would just call you and it's like hey, and and
as I said, most of it was last minute, but
there were you know things where hey, I got a
gig at this place in August, can you do it?

(50:29):
And you know, so keep track of it that way.

Speaker 1 (50:31):
So you're married, you have kids, yes, and you're still
a hired gun, and you don't really know if you
have one good.

Speaker 2 (50:40):
Right well at that point, so my wife had gone
back to school and because she wasn't working really the
first like through the I guess the eighties up in
that period of time, but she went to nursing school
and thank god, she became a nurse and had as
you know, so she said them we had hospitalization, you know,

(51:02):
and a steady Yeah. I know, isn't that crazy, but
you know then we you know, it was it was
you know, allowed me a little freedom to to be
able to not have to just go out and make
sure I worked as many days as I possibly could,
and uh, those are kind of things where I started

(51:26):
having done all the sessions and loved recording. Uh, and
I paid close attention as through the years on all
the sessions of what the engineer was doing, and picked
up a lot of stuff and just in the recording end,
you know, the technical aspect of recording, and uh, you know,
got some got the software when it first became available

(51:48):
and started messing with it. And so I started doing
some stuff at home like that, and.

Speaker 1 (51:54):
You're recording yourself where you're recording other people.

Speaker 2 (51:57):
Myself and uh, you know, started writing more at that point,
so you know, that's when I really started writing more.
But then she you know, I then halfway through the
nineties started playing in a wedding band. I did a
few pick up gigs like where again it was, hey,
this guy canceled. Can you just like my regular gigs,

(52:20):
except it was at a wedding and I had to
wear tuxedo and you know, the whole, the whole thing.
But so those gigs were, you know, interesting to me
because you play one night and make what you'd maybe
make in clubs playing four, three or four nights. So
it was, and then it gave me even more freedom
to do anything that I wanted to do. I could

(52:43):
be a little more particular about what, you know, who
I played with, and what the gig was and all
that kind of thing, because I knew I had the
high paying gig on the weekend, and I did that
for oh good ten or fifteen years something like that,
and still playing, still playing club gigs in that same

(53:04):
span of time and everything, but probably till the you know,
mid two thousand, in the two thousand and five to
two thousand and nine in show.

Speaker 1 (53:15):
To really succeed, to make some coin, you really had
to be a hustler.

Speaker 2 (53:18):
Oh you did, yeah, yeah, And honestly, you know, the
music is my strong point. But man, when I look
back on my career of doing that, and the weakest
point in my whole thing was keeping track basically, like
I can't tell you how many times I'd be double
booked on a guests, Like I told this person I'd
do it, and I told this one. It's like, oh man,

(53:41):
I've had that nightmare numerous times.

Speaker 1 (53:44):
You're good, that good?

Speaker 2 (53:46):
Right? Yeah, Yeah, it's rough, but thankfully, all you know,
my musician friends are very forgiving and and pull an
unreliable musician, but usually unreliable is just not showing up right. Yeah, yeah,
I would call them the day of the game.

Speaker 1 (54:07):
All right. So now we're in mid two thousands, what
are we doing.

Speaker 2 (54:13):
A little less weddings that that that kind.

Speaker 1 (54:17):
Of like what kind of wedding music did you play?

Speaker 2 (54:19):
Oh man, I mean it's fun stuff like that. You
know some of the weddings we played. We have a
string section with us, and so we do like we do. Uh.
I remember doing Tiny Dancer with strings like, oh man,
it's you feel like you're at Heinz Hall, you know,
just like it's just a it's goosebumps when you're when

(54:41):
you get to play in that situation, I don't think
a lot of people get to experience that. No.

Speaker 1 (54:46):
I really miss bands at weddings. And that's that. That
was that I actually crashed a wedding in Eerie one time,
you know, the way before the wedding crashers. Oh real
wedding band. We dance And I'm not a dancer, but
I would. Back then it was and then college I
was a drinker, and so when you drink your dan
you have to do and the band like we're like

(55:07):
you're great, like no, we love you guys, like you
are you part of the bride or the groom? Like
we don't know anybody right right, just came to party.

Speaker 2 (55:16):
Well, the standard operation was, you know, the first set
was dinner music yep, so that's you know, mostly instrumental stuff,
but you know, occasional ballads and different things like that.
And then you know, once you start, I mean, motown
is a like my Girl would be our first song.

Speaker 3 (55:31):
That everybody's on the floor.

Speaker 2 (55:33):
And man, the people immediate. It's like a magnet, you know.
And when you play like you know, play like September,
you know, all the all the y yeah. Yeah, the
people just they can't keep off the dance floor. So
it was fun. I enjoyed that a lot.

Speaker 1 (55:48):
And weddings are still playing the same songs. Yeah, all right,
So two thousand and five, you're you're still doing a
few weddings. You you're are you? Are you the recording things?
Are you still you're doing more or less? You're you're
dabbling with technology? Are you getting more in depth with that?

Speaker 2 (56:05):
I'm getting yeah, more in depth. So I'm doing less
sessions in terms of like going to a studio somewhere
and playing on a jingle or like jingles kind of
got phased out of this town at least, not a
lot of local things. There's still some on occasion, but
you know so but luckily, as that session work was

(56:27):
starting to decrease, you know, I had my own stuff
in the in the basement working on that and figuring
that out, and that is still a learning process and
you know, constantly working on those kind of things. But
I guess that's where I kind of morphed towards more

(56:49):
still doing a little bit of I think that was
about the era of the last PBS show that I
was involved with. And it's funny, like, I.

Speaker 1 (56:57):
When did you start with the PBS shows?

Speaker 2 (57:00):
I think it was mid eighties to late eighties, something
like that. And we used to joke about the uh
it was we do this show and uh record the
show in April, and you know, it just took forever
to get paid for some reason with those things. And

(57:20):
we'd all be sitting around and uh, you know, sex
Player would go, Man, this money's gonna come really come
in handy this Christmas, you know, and it was literally
like that, you know, play the thing and it's on
TV and you're watching it and you still haven't gotten
paid for it, so you know, but we we did eventually.
It just but so that that was mid eighties to late.

Speaker 1 (57:42):
And you're still showing those programs they are I.

Speaker 2 (57:44):
Get people all the time. I was watching you on
TV last night, you know, and the first time I
heard that, I didn't know what they were. I didn't relate.
You know, now when I hear it, I know immediately
what they're talking about. But I guess, uh at that
point then trying to think played with played with a

(58:07):
band that played in dormont at at The band was
called sold Out s O U l.

Speaker 5 (58:17):
At that place, car Hops, Yeah, car Hops, I remember
Bruce Slogan's.

Speaker 2 (58:23):
Yeah. We were there every Friday, two horns, you know, uh,
five players and an a front man and just playing
all the stuff we loved and you know, bus gags
and you know, tower of Power and just great fun
stuff to play and uh how the crowd there, people
loved dancing, and you know it was and that was

(58:46):
that was for seven years that we we did that
every Friday, with very few exceptions. Usually would be like
getting snowed out, you know.

Speaker 1 (58:56):
And what did you call yourself sold out?

Speaker 2 (58:58):
S o U L so U L.

Speaker 1 (59:00):
Ed Okay, in your career, how many bands?

Speaker 2 (59:06):
Oh my god, if I had a guess, even if
it was one night, it has to be it's over
one hundred at least. I think, yeah, that for me,
and I think that's rare. I mean, you know, most musicians,
you know, you get one in your you might go
like every bands, Well, bands don't last too long, you know,

(59:27):
that's the thing. So even if you're in just the
same band for a period of time, it's usually two
or three years at the most. But you know, yeah,
I've just in my life of playing over one hundred
for sure.

Speaker 1 (59:41):
Do you still love it?

Speaker 2 (59:42):
Oh? I there's never a bad day. And I always say, like,
it sure beats digging ditches man, that's that's for sure.
I you play every day, not quite every day, but almost. Yeah. Yeah,
some days. You know, if I'm in the studio a
lot of times it'll be just like editing and stuff

(01:00:03):
like that. So I'm not necessarily playing, but.

Speaker 1 (01:00:05):
You know, you're involved.

Speaker 2 (01:00:06):
I'm around it. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:00:08):
Yeah, all right, So let's so let's let's get into
the studio work. Okay, So what's uh where are we
when you you know, you started recording.

Speaker 2 (01:00:21):
Early pro tools. I think the the version I had
was at that point was version five. I think something
like that, five or six. So it was pretty early
in that process. You know. My basement was we had
just bought our house and you know, it was one
of those typical basements with the dark wood paneling that

(01:00:44):
was you know, dark because it was cheapest and plus
probably because smoking in the house and things, you know,
things got.

Speaker 1 (01:00:52):
Every Pittsburgh basement had the Please tell me I had
a Pittsburgh.

Speaker 2 (01:00:56):
Pod of course, even though I'm in b Coounty. Yes,
they migrated to that area. I love it. Yeah, So
that you know, that's when I got way more involved
in the whole production end of things. And I had

(01:01:18):
friends that, you know, some friends that were songwritering like
just on a you know, amateur level for them, and uh,
I started, uh, you know, knowing that I want to
try different things. Is like I'd invite them, you know,
come on over, I'll record you and just we'll mess

(01:01:38):
with stuff and see what we can come up with.
And so I dove a lot more into the recording
thing at that point. So and you know, still pretty
immersed in it today, you know, to this day.

Speaker 1 (01:01:52):
So do you enjoy that as much as playing I do?

Speaker 2 (01:01:55):
I do, and and it it's pretty much for me,
it's probably probably fifty to fifty. Like I don't think
I could. I don't think i'd survive or be happy
doing just one of those things. Like I love the
recording thing, and I love I love being put on
the spot, like you know you were asking about. You
go and you have no idea what you're playing on

(01:02:17):
and you listen to it, and you know, I think
what makes a good studio musician is that he can
come up with a bunch of different things. So you say, well,
hearing this first, and you play it and if they
say no, that's not what we're looking for, it's like, okay,
try this boom and it's like a whole different kind
of thing. And you know that's a strong point because

(01:02:37):
then you know, you just keep cycling until you find
what it is you're liking. Or you might say, take
part of what that first one was and part of
the second one and put them together.

Speaker 1 (01:02:47):
And you know you hear time and time again. Producer
is another member of the band.

Speaker 2 (01:02:53):
Yeah, yeah, absolutely, yeah. George Martin is evidence number one
of that.

Speaker 1 (01:02:59):
Yeah, okay, we talk about so many of your influences
when it comes to keyboards. What about producers? What are
some producers?

Speaker 2 (01:03:06):
Oh my god, Well, George is absolutely you know, the
fifth the term Fifth Beatle you hear in a lot
of different with a lot of different people's names mentioned.
And you know, some people will say George Martin, but
other people won't say George Martin because he wasn't playing
necessarily on that kind of thing. Even though he did

(01:03:27):
play some stuff, he wasn't like a regular, not like
say Billy Preston. Yeah, like Billy Preston that. So you'll
hear that as a you know, a name for the
Fifth Beatle a lot, and I see the correlation with that.

Speaker 1 (01:03:41):
But uh, well, I think you hear John and Paul
talk about like we didn't know what we didn't know, right.
He knew what we didn't know, right, and so he.

Speaker 2 (01:03:55):
Taught us that and showed it to them.

Speaker 1 (01:03:57):
Yes, we had a lot of ideas, we just didn't
know how to put them together. Where George was had
that mindset where okay, I know where you want to go, right,
this is how you He was so good at it,
and do you do you see yourself doing that?

Speaker 2 (01:04:12):
Yeah, I do that a lot. And you know the
stuff that I'm recording now, you know, I produce most
of it, some stuff if the artist knows exactly what
they want. You know, I'm perfectly happy being the engineer.

Speaker 1 (01:04:26):
Okay, all right, okay, you're perfectly But do you ever like, go.

Speaker 2 (01:04:31):
Well, if I have an idea, if I hear something,
I always tell them. And you know, my kind of
motto is, you know, if you don't, I'd rather try
more things than not enough things. If you think like, oh,
like years later after the record's been I was like,
oh we should have done this here, It's like those

(01:04:52):
are the things like what didn't I think of that?
You know? So yeah, I'm you know, I guess I'm good.
I think I'm good at uh, you know, presenting ideas
without being like pushy and you know, insistent. But figure, hey, listen,
you you're you're the arbiter. You know, I'll play this
thing or I'll show you what I'm talking about. If

(01:05:13):
you don't like it, we'll we'll do something else. You know,
I'm finding to hurt my feelings.

Speaker 1 (01:05:17):
So but do you enjoy that collaboration?

Speaker 2 (01:05:22):
Absolutely? Yeah, yeah, it's great. And most times I hear,
you know, a pretty high percentage of what the things
that I hear first, which people at least they say
they actually they really like and like, you know, more
times than not, I get that that's exactly what I
was hearing. And you know, so, I mean, you know,

(01:05:43):
when you have a a library of music from when
you started to now, you know, there's a pretty wide
range of stuff that you're you know, using as you're.

Speaker 1 (01:05:55):
The people that you record. Are they younger than you
or do they they don't have the they are, but
they don't have that well, they don't.

Speaker 2 (01:06:04):
Have quite the span of musical influence, you know. I mean,
certainly there are guys who weren't around in the seventies, say,
but they still know that music, you know, especially that
era being as strong as it was musically and you know,
those influences. Today you hear in all kinds of stuff.
So yeah, I think that that helps. But I was there,

(01:06:26):
so you know, I feel like I know it a
little more.

Speaker 1 (01:06:30):
All right. I promised that we would get back to
the discussion of production compared to you know, Sun Studio
and then today, so is there am I off base?
And thinking that you know that the Sun Studios brought

(01:06:51):
us some classics. George Martin, you know that was you know,
four channel recorder was, yes, was groundbreaking for the Beatles, right,
and now you have unlimited tracks.

Speaker 2 (01:07:05):
Well if you tried, you know, as anyone that knows
even a little bit about recording and how that works,
particularly with the four track tape machine, you know, and
getting a bunch of parts on there. When you think
about some of these classic great songs that were made
on a four track recorder and what they had to

(01:07:28):
do to make that happen, you know, it's something you got,
like you got three tracks, you've got recorded, then you're
bouncing those over to the fourth track while you record
another track onto that. Then you reuse those first three tracks.
You know, it's just like now you know, it doesn't matter,
you have as many tracks as you want. You need

(01:07:49):
another track, new track, boom, it's you.

Speaker 1 (01:07:51):
Know, fifty yeah, sixty hundreds.

Speaker 2 (01:07:54):
I've seen I've seen sessions with one hundred and fifty tracks.

Speaker 1 (01:07:58):
A whole lot of love. How many uh probably four yeah,
And to have all those sounds and swirling and the
drum thing.

Speaker 2 (01:08:09):
It's a it's amazing some of the things. If you
look at one of my favorite books is uh, here, there,
and everywhere, it's Jeff Emrick's the engineer from the Abbey
Roads stuff, and you know, he talks about how they
would coordinate. They had multiple tape machines and they coordinate
the tape loop things that where you had those sound

(01:08:30):
effects or backwards loops and stuff. You know, you got
they're like, literally, guys that they're they're like musicians playing
the tape machine. You know, it's just like and then
you hear the final product and go, that is insane,
Like how they pulled that?

Speaker 1 (01:08:46):
Yes, what the the vocal the simplest of songs and
if you knew what what went into that production exact.

Speaker 2 (01:08:54):
Mind, that is so true. Yeah, yeah, and I just literally,
I'd say in the last two years was when I
first saw the detailed explanation that it would just blew
my mind. You know how they did that?

Speaker 1 (01:09:06):
But you had such limitations, but they wanted to get
the most out of that, and so they use their
musical creativity to produce something on four tracks or eight
tracks or something like that, whereas you don't you're not
encumbered by tracks. Now now you can do anything you want.
But is it better now?

Speaker 2 (01:09:27):
Well, I mean, I guess it depends on the definition
of better. You know. If you know, one of the
good things of the before is that it required imagination
to figure out how you're going to do these things
and what you know. I think it also probably put

(01:09:48):
a uh, a little bit lower ceiling on when you're
done with a song. That's one of the hard things
of recording is like, what are you done? How do
you know you're done? Like, and you know, you listen
to some the didn't think, well, I don't hear anything else.
You know.

Speaker 1 (01:10:03):
I heard a great story just the other day since
Quincy Jones just passed away. Yeah. Yeah, So Michael was
recording Billy Jean okay, and he had the musicians over
and over and over and over and over, and they
were up to like thirty two takes and Quincy was

(01:10:23):
was gone. Came in and they said, we're not sure
what one. He goes play cut two. He played cut
two and he goes, yeah, that's the why.

Speaker 2 (01:10:35):
Wow man. Yeah, that dude was otherworldly. I mean he's
one of the you were asking about influences like production wise,
he's definitely one.

Speaker 1 (01:10:45):
He's done it all.

Speaker 2 (01:10:46):
Yeah, yeah, so many great things, just staggering and the ideas.
You know, thank thank goodness we got him for a bit.
You know, all the music, think about what wouldn't be
here if he wasn't you.

Speaker 1 (01:10:59):
Know, Sinatra and Jackson. But what he did in between
is staggering.

Speaker 2 (01:11:07):
It is, it really is. Yeah, thankfully the you know.

Speaker 1 (01:11:10):
I love talking music. All right, I've kept you.

Speaker 2 (01:11:15):
Wow, this is what I got to just give you
the quick lowdown on my current Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:11:21):
Yeah, let's talk about that.

Speaker 2 (01:11:23):
So had my sixtieth Do you mean you're not done? No,
I'm not not quite. I'm going as long as I can.
At my sixtieth birthday, my wife threw a surprise party
for me. And you know, sixty is kind of a
pretty round number, and you know, you start thinking about
I don't think I always said, I don't think I'll
over retire from playing music. I just will get too

(01:11:47):
old to carry my stuff to the gig anymore. You know,
I just love it and I can't imagine doing anything else.
But at sixty, you think, just thinking back on things,
it's like, you know, I've had a really interesting I'm
so lucky to have this life that I've had because
I feel like I've cheated life. I always love going

(01:12:07):
to work, and that's a huge thing that most people don't,
you know. Get So then two years after my sixtieth birthday,
I'm sitting at home in the studio and I get
a phone call that says from a from a fellow

(01:12:28):
studio guy that I've known for years. He worked we
worked together at Hollywood's and he said, hey, man, one
of my A list clients is going to be giving
you a call in the next fifteen minutes, and if
you can, I would suggest you do whatever you can
to be available to do this thing. And I had

(01:12:48):
no idea, really, that was my entire explanation about it.
So hang the phone up. Ten minutes later, get a
phone call. They said, Hey, we're recording. We're going to
record a record. We had a whole band together. Keyboard
player at the last minute said I can't do it.
Something came up. I had to back out. So we're
starting today to rehearse for two weeks and then record

(01:13:10):
the record. Would you be able to come down and
just even just play something till we find somebody you know?
And you know, I said, well, what time? And he said,
we're starting at four point thirty. It was quarter to
four at that point, and well he said, so, well

(01:13:31):
where is it, you know, and it was he said, swickly,
which for me takes me twelve minutes. Yeah close. I thought, okay, yeah,
I can be there, you know, And he sent me
a Google drive link to the demos, which were just
acoustic guitar and vocal just for the songs, you know,
and so on my way to the studio, I just

(01:13:52):
put them in and listened to them, got the gist
of what kind of stuff it was, and you know,
it's stuff that I was. It felt like to me,
felt like new old songs, like they were songs that
I've heard a thousand times and dipped by different artists
kind of things. But they are new songs, you know.
And so I go to the go to the thing.

(01:14:14):
I get there, walking around there's this old British guy
with a goateee and he's hooking things up and he,
you know, through the day, I'm playing some stuff and
he'll be like, love what you're playing, mate, sounds great,
you know. It's like, so I get through the end
of the day, they said that was great. Can you

(01:14:34):
come back tomorrow and let's let's you know. It's like, yeah, yeah,
no problem. So I go home and I look and
they were calling him Eddie all day and he looked familiar.
I couldn't quite place him. Then it hit me, Eddie Kramer.
So I look on the web and this he's a
guy who everything. He recorded everything, Jimmy Hendrick's ever regarded everything.

(01:14:59):
He worked with the Stones, he worked with Bowie, he
worked with Zeppelin. I mean, like, talk about a resume
and this guy's walking. I'm thankful I didn't know it
at it's time, because I probably want to.

Speaker 1 (01:15:10):
But what is he doing in Swiftly a well place?

Speaker 5 (01:15:13):
You know?

Speaker 2 (01:15:13):
He got hired to come there and consult on the
studio and you know, help design the thing, and was
was engineering some of the record.

Speaker 1 (01:15:22):
So who's the record? Though?

Speaker 2 (01:15:24):
Well, so that's that's the thing. It turns out, So
so the rest I'll get I'll give it one second.
It's so I get to come back the next day.
They say we're going to keep looking. Could you come
just the rest of this week? And I'm like, yeah,
no problems. Get to the end of the week they
still haven't found anybody. It's like, can you come next
week and sure, so I get there and it's nearing

(01:15:46):
the end of the second week. They said, you just
want to play on the record because we love what
you're doing and you know it feels great, So like sure,
you know.

Speaker 1 (01:15:54):
So then.

Speaker 2 (01:15:57):
Then like a week later, they do, you want to
be in the band, Like we've looked and can't find
anybody at all. You want we love what you're playing,
you want to be in the band. And you know
it's younger guys, because I mean, you know, like I said,
I was sixty two I think at that point, and
so I get I joined the band. I'm like, sure, yeah,
this is great, I mean doing this. Then two weeks

(01:16:20):
after that at rehearsal, I walk in and there they say,
by the way, we're going to open for the Rolling
Stones in UH in Washington, d C. On July third.
I'm like what, like, you know, at sixty now this
happens to me, Like what is this? So you know,

(01:16:41):
it just kind of goes to show you if you
hang in there.

Speaker 3 (01:16:43):
And and the name of the band.

Speaker 2 (01:16:45):
The name of the band is Ghost Hounds Ghost Yes, yeah,
And we've been getting some airplay on dB quite a bit,
and UH like I said, we did the we we
played the stage here shortly after. We were one of
the earlier all.

Speaker 1 (01:17:00):
Right, and my friend Bonnie Diver post your stuff on Yeah, yeah, okay,
that's great. So you can't just say, oh, we had
a chance to open for the Rolling Stones and not
tell us what it's like.

Speaker 2 (01:17:14):
Oh my god, well it's crazy. I mean, the biggest
thing is the size of the crowds. You know, you're
playing in arenas and you know, as it turned out,
we also did like ten dates with zz Top. We
did uh, we did that one which was right before
COVID with the Stones, and so there was a little

(01:17:35):
gap in there where they weren't touring, not many people
were playing out, but we so we did uh the
zz Top openings. We did two with Bob Seeger. We
ended up total. Now so far we've done fifteen days
with the Stones, three of them in Europe.

Speaker 5 (01:17:51):
Really yep, I remember you posted all that. Yeah, yeah,
that was interesting following.

Speaker 1 (01:17:57):
See, that's what I love when I when I I
come from the Larry King school of broadcasting, I want
to know a little bit. I don't want too much, right,
but that's the little like pearl at the end this
this thing open and you're like.

Speaker 2 (01:18:13):
So I'll give you my favorite story with the whole thing,
which just amuses me. But uh, we you know, when
we were doing after that first show, when we started,
they started touring again and we did I think ten
dates with them here in the States and uh no Pittsburgh,
well not we did the first time we did Carol,

(01:18:35):
uh what was it, Charlotte, Pittsburgh, Nashville, we did the
first one that they played in because they they initially
had Pittsburgh listed when we did that show in d C.
And it was listed as part of the tour. But
that tour got you know, because of COVID, and we
had our fingers crossed, like, man, you know we get

(01:18:58):
some more of these shows. I hope they do Pittsburgh.
And they ended up the first time they did do Pittsburgh.
Now last year wasn't they didn't do Pittsburgh. So but
but during these openings, and you know, you don't get
to spend a whole lot of time with those guys
to speak of. But Ronnie Wood, we did get to
hang a little bit with that guy, and he is
such a great, great dude. He at the time is

(01:19:21):
in his seventies, I don't know, mid seventies, somewhere in there.
He had four year old twin girls. So and the
funny thing was held. He told us. His story is,
you know when they soundcheck, they do it before the
show and before anyone's in the place. They don't know people,
you know, come in they're doing their soundcheck. So the

(01:19:43):
kids there, the twins, would come out and watch them soundcheck,
and then after they were done, we did our soundcheck.
Then the girls would stay. They would watch from a
like a box somewhere with him and his wife, and
they would watched our are set and they he said,
they were going, Daddy, how come these how come you

(01:20:06):
guys don't get any people at your shows and these
guys get so many things.

Speaker 1 (01:20:13):
Yeah, so you're right, Yeah, nobody knows who I am.

Speaker 2 (01:20:19):
I just love that though. I think it's great all.

Speaker 1 (01:20:21):
Right now, do you know being close to that, I'll
never get that close to the backstand with her. Uh,
you know the you know the Mick and Keith do
they have separate do they not associated? Listen? They they
don't need to necessarily.

Speaker 2 (01:20:38):
I'm not sure honestly, Like they're you know, they're very
it's I don't know if I think part of it
was because COVID was still a thing even when we
did those ten shows with them here, Like, you know,
you had to have a One of the stressful things
was we had to have a negative PCR test forty

(01:20:58):
eight hours before every show, and all the whole band,
you know, they wanted to see all that stuff. And
you know, I mean, those guys are older and more susceptible,
and but you know, so I don't know if it's
because it was during that kind of time, but we
didn't get to hang too much with them at that point.

(01:21:19):
But I think they're like you see them in their
cars riding in and out of the show. We would
see them and you know, they's I think they're each
in their own car. Yeah, but you know that's to
be expected, I guess.

Speaker 1 (01:21:31):
But Nick's he's what eighty one? Yeah, yeah, still got it.

Speaker 2 (01:21:35):
Listen. They they sound better now than I've ever heard
them in my life. They just sound amazing. It's it's unbelievable.

Speaker 1 (01:21:44):
I think Keith Richards is my favorite guitar player.

Speaker 2 (01:21:47):
Oh yeah, well that dude is.

Speaker 1 (01:21:49):
You know, I you know, I love the you know,
the the intricacies and respect Eric Clapton and Jimmy Page
and Eddie Van Halen. But there's something about Keith Richards
that is a guitar player.

Speaker 2 (01:22:02):
He's the king of the riff man. He comes like this.
It's when you play that first chord and you know
the song right away.

Speaker 1 (01:22:09):
It's like you know the song, you know the group,
and you know everything. You don't even know.

Speaker 2 (01:22:13):
You know it's a special thing. Yeah, you just.

Speaker 1 (01:22:16):
Even know how many children were born from.

Speaker 2 (01:22:18):
That pretty good idea.

Speaker 1 (01:22:21):
This has been an absolute blast, Joe. It was a
pleasure meeting you. Thank you so. Oh well we always
do that last one, all right. What is Joe Monroe's legacy?

Speaker 2 (01:22:32):
Oh? Man, Well, I guess I hope it's you know,
enjoy your life and be nice to people.

Speaker 1 (01:22:43):
That's on That is you. I try You're such a gentleman.

Speaker 4 (01:22:48):
Are.

Speaker 2 (01:22:50):
Well, That's what I've tried to live by. And my dad,
you know, instilled that in us and so you know,
and hey, it's working for me so far into in
terms of you know results. I'm loving my life and
having a blast.

Speaker 4 (01:23:05):
So