The Ones Who Live Episode 2_ Gone

In this The Ones Who Live Episode 2 review, we dive deep into the heart of Michonne's journey to find Rick with 'Gone', the latest thrilling installment of "The Ones Who Live".

Discover the untold stories, hidden secrets, and the emotional rollercoaster that our beloved characters endure in their fight for survival and to find each other. From breathtaking moments to shocking revelations, join us as we unpack every detail, theorize on future developments, and share insights that you won't find anywhere else.

Whether you're a die-hard fan or new to the series, this episode is a testament to the resilience and spirit of Rick Grimes and Michonne. Don't miss our comprehensive breakdown, complete with character analysis, plot predictions, and the subtle nuances that make The Ones Who Live a masterpiece of storytelling.

Subscribe for more exclusive content and become part of our growing community of survivors. Together, we'll explore the world of 'The Walking Dead' like never before.
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Episode Transcript

(00:01):
After Rick's sacrifice to save his group, everyone believed he was gone, apart
from a couple of people who dedicateda long time to search for their friend.
You're with the Ones Who Live podcastof the Gerald Dixon Podcast. Hello,

(00:35):
what is up everyone? I'm Kelly. I'm down high from Scotland.
But it's not the middle of himthe night this time. Yeah, it's
still pretty late over there for youthough. It's like my clock. Yeah,
we're back again. I fixed Michone'sface this time, so she's not

(00:58):
like down in the middle. It'slike the title, you know, where
you just see the rise, soit's yeah worse, Yeah exactly. I
I'm sorry for the sunglasses I have. I have an eye condition and it
acts up sometimes in the winter.Fortunately it's only in the winter, but

(01:19):
it's pretty bad today and so Ihave whenever acts up, I have to
wear sunglasses. So yeah, that'sthat's why I'm wearing them today. Please
no negative comments. I've gotten enoughof that on the sunglasses, so they're
necessary, Okay, prom just becauseyou're not cool exactly exactly, but uh

(01:46):
yeah we are back to cover episodetwo Gone, which I think is is
this your second favorite episode? Done? Yeah, definitely mine too. Yeah.
I think we were both kind ofwaiting for this one because we both

(02:06):
love Micheon a whole lot, andit was good to see her again,
and I told Don I'm going tohave some words. I was very happy
to see her again because, letme tell you something, there are a

(02:27):
couple of episodes of The Walking Deadthat I have a hard time rewatching.
One of them is the Kve episode, just because I can't. It was
horribly traumatizing for me. But theother episode is Micheone's final episode, and

(02:53):
I I think I may have actuallythrown something through the episode the first time
it aired. I am a hugefan of micheone. Carol is my favorite
character ever. But next to Carol, it's it's It was always kind of
a tie between Sasha and Micheone.And the way that the way that they

(03:23):
exited her character I thought was sodisrespectful. I didn't feel like it was
worthy of her character at all.First of all, she left her kids
behind, and a lot of there'sso much debate about this. People get
really mad when you criticize that,but so Michelle leaving her kids behind for

(03:51):
me was like Carol burning Karen andDavid, Like, those are the two
moments that made me so much inthe show because they were so out of
character. Micheane would not do that. I get she had a good reason,
you know, this is the fatherof her kids, but she would

(04:14):
not do that. She would gohome first. That was so out of
character. But even worse than that, that really bugged me is first of
all they've put through. They've putme shown through way too much on that
show, and I I mean,we've seen her just get the absolute shit

(04:36):
beat out of her, and itreally upset me that we had to sit
there and watch Darryl and her ownhusband Rick kill her and put her down.
I get it was like this youknow, whole what if scenario that

(04:59):
was kind of an interesting but thatwas just going way too far in my
opinion, and it was just grossand it just left a really bad taste
in my mouth. And I thoughtit was disrespectful and I absolutely hated it.
So I am so happy to seeher in a situation where her character

(05:25):
is being treated a lot better.And part of that is because she's writing.
Yes, I was going to saythat, yeah, yeah, Di
nai Carera is writing for the show, which helps a lot, But it's
just Micheone is a character that Ifeel was disrespected a lot on the walking
did by the writing, and it'sjust it's refreshing to not feel that way

(05:50):
on this show. So I'm I'mpretty I'm pretty happy about that. I'm
very happy to see her again.I think through as we said last week,
we've seen the first four episodes,and I think through all four episodes,
but especially through two and four,you can see Denai's influence completely in

(06:11):
how Mishone is presented. Shone isthe moral center as well as the emotional
center. And you know Rick isthis you know, he's been affected and
he's not cold, but he's traumatized. So he's got you know, a
brick wall up and things. Butit is Mishon who is pushing everything.

(06:34):
She is the driving force in thisseason, and it's so much better than,
as you say, season ten,but even not just season ten,
but other seasons in the main show. I just don't think they gave in
mis Shone enough story that wasn't justher being been up, you know,

(06:57):
that wasn't Yes, she's a badass, of course she's a bad but there
wasn't enough for her after season six. Once Rick and Machaone got together,
there wasn't a lot of exploration ofher as a character. Outside of that,
it was amazing as her, youknow, as a couple. But

(07:17):
and I think this show really fillsthat in. And as we say that
Deny's influence as a producer and awriter, this episode is written by Channing
Powell, who we know wrote forthe main sais but also Nana and Quetti.
I don't know if I'm proucing hername right, but she's I looked
her up and she's never written fortelevision before, but she was. She

(07:42):
was the winner of the Puitting FoundationAward. I think it was maybe last
year or twenty twenty two. Ican't remember which Deny was involved with.
So I suspect that's how she's cometo write for the show. I suspect
this is Deny's influence again American CameronCameronian, and she's written the book that

(08:05):
she won the award for. It'slike a collection of stories and it involves
horror. So I'm guessing that's whyyou know, did I saw hang on?
This is an amazing writer. Let'sget another black female voice on the
writing team, and you can tellyou know, last week's episode, we

(08:26):
both didn't love a lot about it, and that was you know, that
was a Scott Kimple episode written allover it. He denies influencing this episode
and that the writing is much more. I mean, last week's was emotional,
but this has a much more,much more of a heart to it

(08:50):
this episode, and I think that'sprobably why we both liked it more.
Yeah, yeah, definitely. Youknow, one one kind of funny thing
that I just wanted to share apersonal story, So I met to Nigeria
at Walker's Choker Cohn in twenty sixteen. I believe it was. She was

(09:16):
very sweet, very friendly, verysilly. But I one thing that I
observed about her that cracked me upso much is like many of the cast
they have, which is this wouldbe anybody. I mean, this would
definitely be me. You know theyall have they all have their photo op

(09:41):
smile. Yeah, it's it's notnecessarily all that genuine and it's like you
don't you know, your face hurts, like you know what I mean,
Like, so you have to learnhow to smile in a way that for
photos and in a way that's notgoing to like be killing your face muscles
all day, and so she wouldswitch into her photo op smile. But

(10:01):
what was hilarious about it is theentire time she's still like it was totally
unnecessary, because the entire time she'sjust like laughing and giggling and being like
super smiley with everybody, and it'slike she's trying to save her face muscles.

(10:22):
But she's just like she's just beamingthe whole time anyway, So cute.
This is obviously she knows, likeI know which which smile looks good
on camera and which smile is justher natural smile. So you know,
she knows, I've got to fuelthis one for the shot and then I

(10:43):
can just interact with you. Yeah. It's so funny because for the first
few seasons, of course, Micheanwas seen as such a serious character and
she never smiles whatever, and didI A is such a smiley person.
She really. It's just such adifference. And that's one of the things
I really enjoyed in this episode thatI noted, you know the first time

(11:07):
I was watching it, is howmuch Mahone smiles in it. And I
was like, Yay, Sean isgetting a chance to be smiley and happy
and talk to people in a youknow, in a normal human way,
the way she should be and notjust you know, like angst and combative

(11:30):
interactions. It's actually just you know, nice interactions which are just And I
think that is one of the thingsthat The Walking Dead didn't understand that they
lost, because you know, andthe thing is, I can't even blame
Scott Gimpo for this one, becausehe not clear and that she's so funny
and clear, and she has thisgreat sense of humor, but they just

(11:54):
seem to lose it and not focuson it at all, which was a
real shame because denies brilliant at itat that you know, seriousness, and
then you just and you can't andthen you have to have that second go
away a minute. She's being funny, you know. Yeah, she's so
good at it. So it's lovelyto see Micheau and smiling in this episode
for more than one reason. Yes, exactly, for sure, we should,

(12:20):
we should we jump into it.Yep. So this episode is called
Gone and as I say, it'sit's written by Channing Powell and Nana and
Quetti, and it opens up witha gas man walker who's he has gas
man let me help you and hisgas characters all over him, who's hit
by something and explodes. Very veryshort, cold open, but like the

(12:43):
first one, we revisit it laterin the episode, and immediately on the
screen we get something very controversial.Six years after the bridge, it says,
and that is when Mishaon left togo and find Rick. Now you

(13:05):
do the math, and apparently there'sa wiki page out there which has it
tracked brilliantly all the events that havehappened since the apocalypse happened, and you
know, the keeping track of it. We are way past six years when
we're showing lives. We should beabout nine years, So somebody has not

(13:26):
done the adding up the years,but we'll just pretend that. But we
see Michean is recounting her story,nice bit of exposition done in a clever
way, where she's telling the leaderof this new group about how she comes
to be there and how she cameto find the couple Aiden and Bailey that

(13:50):
we saw her help. At theend of what we become her last episode,
she has caught up with this community, very large community which it seems
to be quite nomadic, and sheis not happy because she's saying, you
left two of your high behind.And even worse than that, it turns

(14:11):
out that Aiden is the leader's sister, so that's not great that you're but
she says, you know, thisis how we do it, because we
could lose two hundred people trying togo back for two And Mishaan's like,
no, that that's not a communityif you're not going back for each other.
But all she wants is a horse. That's all she wants, so

(14:31):
she can go continue on our wayto find Rick. That's sorry, that's
all I want to but you're notgoing to find Rick. That's okay.

(14:52):
I didn't actually catch with the leader'sname is did they say her name is
al Well? That's right, okay, yeah, wh later it comes up
later, yes, and I wrotesome of the dinner about that. So
she's, you know, facing abrick wall here. She's not going to
get the horse. What even thoughAidan is trying to say to her,

(15:15):
yes, come on, and shesays, she's interrupted by an explosion of
a human being bursting into the roomfull of fury and it righteous agency,
you should have done that. You'veleft your to the leader to hear you've
left behind your sister? How couldyou do it? And this is not

(15:35):
played by Matt Jeffries. And youwill see on on if you're on any
social media, and our feeling isexactly the same. This is the best
character we have seen any long time. He lights up the screen as soon
as he comes into that scene.He's full of energy and he's just magnetic

(15:56):
as a character. Just yeah,we're just so excited to see him,
and he I think everybody you know, as a disabled person, I'm always
happy to see a disabled actor onthe screen too, you know. Yeah,
So they are people are during comparisonswith Tyrian from Game of Thrones,

(16:21):
which you know obviously you think,well that's not fair, just because they're
both small person actors. But thereis a similarity in the sense of that
same kind of spark, the samenot sarcasm, but with the same wit
about them. And so I cansee that there is a Tyrian this about

(16:44):
them. And he immediately realizes,oh, hang on, you've not left
them behind. Their here and theysay, yep, we're here because of
this lady was shown, so heimmediately wants to help her. He's saying,
give her our horse, but hewants to help pure a bit more
than that, and he says,we can't let you just go like this
on your you know. She tellsthem she's going what she's going to look

(17:07):
for, and he wants to giveher some of his screaming sticks, which
is like for they, and healso wants to equip her with her armor,
which we saw. I think thatwas the first photograph that came out
and promo was shown in her herarmor, which I know, you know,
it does look a bit mad boxor whatever. But I have said,

(17:30):
why didn't this happen years ago onThe Walking Dead? Why didn't we
see them start wearing leather neck youknow, I don't know what you call
them, a neck and shoulder protectorthings. You know, you get them
in a suit of armor. Myhusband would know. He knows all the
names and all the bits, ohsuits of ror and this protector. Sorry,

(17:52):
we joked about that before. Iremember about how we can because you
know, obviously we didn't know atthe time how she got this armor,
and we're like, so our jokewas that she because micheon is It's like
Mishone is one of the three smartestcharacters from The walk We did it's like
Micheone, Carroll and and Megan arelike the three smartest characters. And we

(18:18):
joked that Michone Macheone had to getaway from everybody else in order because they
were dragging her intelligence down. Shedidn't get away from everybody else before,
like she she thought, hey,I should get some armor, and it's
nice and if she meets not inthe place, yes, I show you

(18:42):
getting armor. I mean even yeah, because I remember we spoke about it
and we said, you know,even like sick Danum would protect people,
you know, oh why it's justto make life so difficult for themselves.
You know. In season three,Milton was using ducte that's right, yeah,
yeah. And you know, bythe way, guys, if there's

(19:04):
a zombie apocalypse, I will tellyou right now what you need to do.
Get some sweatpants, you know,make sure they're they're a little loose,
wrap duct tape all the way aroundthem, but make sure they're not
like make sure they're still loose onyour body, like not so loose that
they're hanging. But you know,you don't want to because if they're if

(19:26):
they're too tight, then you'll overheatand you'll you know, you'll you'll suffocate
yourself. Duct tape on sweatpants.That's how you survive a zombie apocalypse.
Yes, that's our tip. Numberone tip next podcast will be doing is
how to survive the zombie apocalypse ifyou two are disabled like we. As

(19:48):
soon as I leave the highest that'sit. I'm done for. I'm gonna
get eaten exactly. Yeah. Sothey not talks to mis Shone about the
fact that he has his red wagon, which is some kind of red like
flatbed truck kind of thing that hehas all of his goodies on. And

(20:10):
we discovered that that is a bitof a skillster when it comes he's a
bit of a Eugene. He likesto build things, but he's much more
destructive than Eugene with his builds.He likes to blow things up. So
he They convince Micheon to spend thenight because she wants to head north and

(20:32):
they know you can't head north becauseapparently there is a huge hoard of of
hundreds of thousands of walkers which forsome reason this time of year, it
would be in her way. Andthey say, if you just wait,
you know they'll pass, or they'llturn around and go back. But Mashone
isn't interested, but she has managedto convince to stay the night to get

(20:53):
all her everything she needs and sheoh, she doesn't say that at that
point to tell I know it's this? Is it the same day? Is
it? When she gets all herstuff and leaves anyway? She h yeah.
She gets her horse that she needs, and she gets all her stuff
and her that's because he says,we'll stay up all night and make her

(21:15):
We'll pull an all night to makeher armor suit of armor, and they
she she reluctantly parts with this coupleand NAT, and she says, you
know, you can come with meif you like, or you know,
she's told them about Alexandria. Theycan go there. But she rides off.

(21:36):
She's still trying to speak to Judithon the radio, but the NAT
let her know that she's probably outof the area now. If not,
she won't, which will be prettysoon. And she rides off and pretty
quickly comes across this horde that they'vebeen talking about, and she rides up
with her horse, but she's gotNAT's screaming, which are like little rockets,

(22:03):
many rockets that she fired fantastic blowsup some She goes to do another
one, and that's when she seesthe gas man. He's on fire and
he's walking towards her, and beforeshe has time to react, he explodes.
His head flies through the air andknocks her from her horse. That
was pretty amusing, actually, shejust gets knocked off by a head and

(22:30):
the horse bolts. She's so she'sleft on the ground and we see her.
I thought, oh, that's veryI wonder if that was denies input
that when we're shown has lost herhorse or whatever. She could run away
because she's still quite a bit awayfrom the most of them, but she
doesn't. She just draws her sword, like, oh, well, I'm
just I'm going down, so I'llgo down fighting. But she's at that

(22:52):
point she is saved by two massiveexplosions behind the hoard of walkers which are
slow burning, and the walker's partlike the red Sea, which I thought
was a brilliant effect, and youknow, you just see them parting as
if she could she could walk throughthe middle. And she looks back and

(23:12):
she discovers this has been that hehas come back along with Bailey and Eden,
and they have brought more people withthem because it turns out that they're
right. You know that she's rightthat she said, you know, this
isn't a community if you're leaving peoplebehind. And it turns out there's quite

(23:33):
a lot of them had felt thatbut just didn't have the courage. At
this point, we won't call itthe Rick curse. She's aspiring people to
leave with her, you know,just it's a bit like the Rick curse,
but different at this point, themore positive. And so there's a

(23:55):
big group of them. They wantto leave with her, and they'll follow
her, and she says she'll takethe Alexandria or whatever. But when they
speak to suspend the night stop forthe night, she discovers that Dan is
pregnant and they have a conversation aboutabout that that you know, how she
how she realized she was pregnant andthat was why her partner was out there,

(24:19):
and how he hurt his his ankle, and why Mishowne came up to
them, because she'd been craving honeyand he'd gone to get her some and
so she'd felt responsible. So that'swhy she'd gone after him, and that's
why they were left behind. Andit's she also learns a little bit about
Nat. That's when he talks abouthis his you know, things that he

(24:41):
likes to build and likes to burn. And so when they're on the move,
they arrive in a city and atown anyway built up area, and
that's telling her about his childhood,that he was a troubled cared it was
him and his mom and he likedto burn things and and got into a
lot of trouble and his dad hadleft because he couldn't handle his disability,

(25:04):
and his mum made a man namedDanger. It just makes me think of
Roger Danger Danefield. And he tookon Nat and gave him things to do,
he says, you know, hehe made me. He told me
he needed to help the thing thathe needed help to load his truck,

(25:26):
he needed help to remind him toturn the stove off. Things. And
of course, looking back, Natrealized that the Danger had made this up
to try and direct NAT's passion forbuilding and burn it into something positive instead
of destructive, which I thought wasreally a really nice backstory, and I'm

(25:47):
glad we got that from him.And he carries a lighter which he's constantly
toying with and flicking, which wasdangerous lighter and it says danger on it,
which comes up later in the episode. But just as they're walking through
the this built up area, theysee a heliculter and it's the CRM the

(26:12):
hell out. I forgot if Iasked you this before. But do you
watch Handmaid's Tail? I have seensome of Hans made Steale, but I
haven't seen it all. Okay,because I was going to say, there's
this scene reminded me so much ofa scene in Handmaid's Tale where June and

(26:34):
well, I don't want to spoilit for anybody who hasn't seen it,
but there's a scene in Chicago,which is Chicago. It's like the Chicago
was kind of like the last citystanding, or like one of the last
that hasn't been taken over, andso everyone's trying to get to Chicago and
that's where the Canadians are going tohelp rescue people. And there's a scene

(26:56):
in Chicago that this reminded me somuch of, where like you know,
everyone's like basically just dodging the armsand stuff from the points going overhead.
It's I have to say this scenethat well, the upcoming scenes that that
covers this time period of the helicopterdrops chlorine gas and how it affects them,

(27:23):
and I found that incredibly distressing andvery hard to watch. I have
a thing. It's stupid to say, I'm here on a walktead podcast to
say, but I have a thingabout apocalypse. I really enjoy post apocalyptic

(27:45):
stuff, but the act when yousee the apocalypse happening, I find that
really really hard to watch. Andthis reminded me of British people will know
of this. There was a Ithink it was a film, a TV
film or a mini series from theeighties called Threads, which was about what
would happen if a nuclear bomb wasdropped on a built up area in the

(28:07):
UK and I saw it when Iwas ten and it traumatized me because it
was really, you know, explicitin showing what would happen. And this
reminded me of it so much.The gas falling, everybody running trying to
get in, and it's not thatmoment, you know, because obviously quite

(28:27):
a few of them die immediately.It's that drawn out illness of what happens
afterwards. Hard to watch, butI give them total credit for the fact
that they stuck with that. Youknow they showed us. Yeah, it
was so many times in The WalkingDead, somebody gets injured, like when

(28:48):
Darryl gets his thigh, you know, stabbed by Alpha and it's like supposed
to be one of his main veinsand he's like nearly bleeding out and then
he's like, hey find two dayslater running. Yeah. Yeah, no,
I really I really appreciated how theydid this. I thought it was
I thought it was very well done. Yeah. The seeing them all,

(29:11):
you know, scatter and then buthow quickly, you know, Micheon says,
no, tire to the bed anddon't fall asleep righter because she knows
just going to die. And thefact that they very sadly they both die
and only Shone and that survive ina a department store, of course,
which made me think of the Dayof the Dead where they're when they're in

(29:33):
the mall, shopping mall of thatfilm, and Shone and Nat recoop over
the period of a year and wesee her Micheon build her strength up and
they they have oxygen to heal theirlungs. And when she first met Nat

(29:53):
and he'd said, you know,you're you you can't contact your daughter,
You're you're too far out range.He gave her a journal and said,
you know, you can write downeverything and you can read it afterwards.
So we see we get voiceover ofthings that Macheone has written in her diary
through it, and I really likeit so an interesting way compared to you

(30:18):
know, obviously Rick was doing itas well in his with his letters to
Mason that he eventually destroys. ButI think it worked better in this episode
because there was less of it.It was less frequent and less exposition.
It was just more about Shone.Yeah. Yeah, I think seeing that
the fact that these they spent ayear does take us closer to the real

(30:44):
timeline, but not completely. Yeah, we're still is still going like this
in age yet excuse me. Soone day the Michean says, no,

(31:06):
we're strong enough now, and shegives that a map and says, you
go back to Alexandria. I'm goingto go on and that's like, no,
you're the only person I have leftin the world. I'm going with
you. You know all I've got. And Michean says to are you just
going to come with me because youwant to see how it ends? And

(31:27):
he says, no, I knowhow it ends, and that is the
halfway point of the episode. Conveniently. Yeah that I I really I really
liked that scene a lot. Yeah, I mean it showed just how close
they got, and you know,it's like I just I really I really

(31:51):
love I really love Matchuppers acting.You know, it's funny because I I
I don't know if the actor becausethere's another actor, Matthew Jeffery, Matthew
Jefferies, So I don't know ifthe actor actually if his real name is
Matthew Jeffries, and he changed hisname when he came on the show because

(32:12):
it was a bigger show. ButI have seen his name written everywhere as
as Matt Jeffery, as Matt Jefferies, and I'm just now seeing it as
Matt Jeffers. So I don't knowif if, like if I saw if
a bunch of people were misprinting it, or if he actually changed his last

(32:34):
name to like, yeah, distablishedhimself from the other actor, Matthew Jefferies.
I think in the titles, justlet me look up and check.
I think of the titles, heused August Jeffers. He used his middle
name. Oh, okay, sothat might that might explain that he had
to change his name if he's usinghis middle name, that does to jaste

(32:57):
and let me just look it upand see. No, yeah, see
walking Day. So it does comeup as the first choice, it's and
then Matt Jefers. Yeah, definitelyMott Jay first. That's strange, isn't
it. Yeah? Yeah, that'sit's it's interesting. I mean, hey,

(33:21):
I changed my name for the showbecause my my my maiden name is
much my maid name, Keene ismuch more common than my married name.
I changed it because I don't needeverybody finding out every single thing in the
world about me because I'm the onlyperson named that. But fun fact,

(33:43):
did you know that? Did youknow that? I that Christian? Why
am I drawing? Oh my god, this is the second time I've drawn
a blank on her last names?Yeah, Christian Serratus. Fun fact about
Christian Seratos. She also changed herher last name. Oh really, Serratos
is her I believe it's her mom'sname, and she's Christian. Her last

(34:12):
name is so her mom her momis Torottos, and her dad is her
dad's Italian. He's got an Italianname, but her name. There's there's
a soccer player, I think withthe exact same first and last name.
Okay, so she changed so shewould be Ronaldo Christian Real Rinaldoti or something.

(34:42):
All right, yeah like that.Yeah, that's her, that's her,
that's her legal last name. Butand of course Andrew Lincoln changed his
mister, I don't believe him,such a such a such a such an
English last name, clutter books.But uh yeah. So we then see

(35:12):
the screen. Oh wait, no, no, I'm jumping ahead. I'm
sorry, I'm sorry. So yeah, so you know, they're they're getting
ready to leave. They finally makeit to mahone is officially done enough push
ups to uh so they can leave. They make it to Bridgers Terminal and
holy crap, this cruise ship thatthey come across there is a giant cruise

(35:38):
ship and it says safe harbor,and it is completely destroyed. I mean
that thing was obviously bombed. Yeah, it's it's in bad shape and all
around the area or a whole bunchof burned bodies. So it's it's a

(35:58):
it's a really disturbing sun. Andthen we see Micheone just searching all of
the bodies for you know, she'sclearly looking for traces of Rick and this
this was I got teary eyed duringthe vaccine. They're sitting, Michone and

(36:22):
Nat are sitting by a fire,and she's just kind of hugging his boots
and he says that. Nat tellsher that Bridgish Terminal is the last place
that the boat where she found Rick'sboots, Bridgish Terminal was the last place
of that boat was at, andthat most of the bodies they found don't

(36:43):
have shoes. So Nat is clearlythinking he's dead. And he tells Michone
what the writing on the phone says, which is believe a little while longer.
And Micheone at this point is finallyaccepting the idea that he's dead,

(37:09):
and she says, if he werealive, he would have found his way,
and she's just she's crying and she'syou can tell she's convinced that he's
dead. But Nat, this,I just thought this was so beautiful.
Nat is like basically trying to gether to to accept this idea, but

(37:36):
at the same time not completely giveup. Hope. Yeah, and he
tells her, you can still gohome to your kids and still believe a
little a little longer. And I'lldo it with you. And he turns
on he turns on the walkie andhe's comforting her and we hear some static

(37:57):
on the wacke and Micheude just startsobbing, and it was it was just
a really sad It was a reallysad scene. Yeah, because you know
you saw her like I mean,this is you know, she was pretty
much just accepting like, Okay,he's gone, but I'm going to keep
going. But yeah, like Ilike the idea that he's saying, you

(38:20):
can go home and be with yourkids and still believe he's alive. You
know, but we as an audienceknow that Micheone couldn't live like that.
She couldn't. Yeah, you know, as much as I do think it
was, I didn't agree with herleaving her kids, her knowing that Rick
was alive. She couldn't not dosomething. You know, I do agree

(38:44):
with that that she absolutely couldn't havelived with herself just going oh, well
he's out there. She would havehad to do something. And that's that's
what she can't live with, isthat, yes, she wants to go
home with her kids. And beforebefore they died, you know, the
couple, they were they were saying, go home to your kids. So
it's it's something that's come up,comes up several times in this episode that

(39:06):
she's told go home to your children. But yeah, she can't bring herself
to do that because there's a chancethat Rick's out there. Yeah, and
she's I mean, she's come allthis way and yeah, you know already
already left for so long, andit's like it's yeah, she she would
she would never be able to dothat. There's no way. No,

(39:29):
it was not a character for herto leave her kids behind in the first
place, but it would be outof charture at this point for her to
just give up, especially because allthose people have died that yeah, left
their group because of her, becauseshe you know, they were inspired to
follow her, and she it's nother fault they're dead because it was them

(39:49):
killed them. But she would feelthat they would be with the group if
it wasn't if it hadn't been forher. So when they're saying if they
die, if she goes home,then they've all died for nothing, yeah,
yeah, definitely. So yeah,So they're walking and she's she's trying
to reach Judith I Milwaukee, andthey spot a helicopter and they both agree

(40:14):
they're not they're not going to runfrom them, and so Nat gets his
his missile launcher ready, just justbadass, and they start shooting at the
helicopter and the helicopter crashes. Thesoldiers get out obviously we know, you

(40:38):
know, one of them is Rick. He starts firing missiles at them,
and you know they're they're ducking becausethey're the soldiers are are shooting back.
And then we see Micheon approaching thethe soldiers on the ground that are still
alive, and she's just grabbing themand slashing their throats and she find and

(41:05):
then she finally finds Rick. Sowe saw this obviously, this is how
episode one ended, but you knowit picked up here again. It was
cool that we got to see itfrom her perspective. Yeah, but then
we got but then we got likethe full thing. You know, it
continued and they just they see eachother and there's just a moment where they're

(41:34):
just stunned, and then they're justcrying and hugging. Rick immediately asks about
Judith and he tells her that he'snot with them, and she says,
I know, and they start kissing. Rick here's Rick. Here's another helicopter.

(42:00):
He tells me shown they're coming.He tells her she needs to make
up a name and say that she'sfrom a community that fell, and she
can't let them know that she's strong. So basically he's trying to he's trying
to get her too into the Bcategory clearly, so they don't kill her,

(42:24):
and they you know, he uh. Nat then then sees sees them
and you know, enter the RickGrinds death curse bom. Nat Nat has
survived all this time. The secondhe sees Rick, that him and then

(42:49):
he gets shot. Like my god, this man has a death person following.
I shoved it down the screen withand I was just like, oh,
come on. And he was sogood, so interesting. I know,
first Oka four and and then Nat. You know, obviously obviously Oka

(43:10):
four wasn't necessarily like it's likable character, but he was super interesting. Yeah,
but that was just likable and soyeah, that was that was really
heartbreaking. Yeah. I can seewhy they did it that they don't want

(43:31):
any baggage for Micheon, but youknow, they could have just had them
see like Ricky, you've got toleave tonight, you know, you can't
be here. They'll take you in, and Micheon says, hey, go
to Alexandria. This is the map. Cool and not leave. I would
have I could have lived with that. I would pretend that's what happened that.

(43:52):
Yeah, I know, I know, I'm I'm so sad about it,
but uh yeah, Rick, youknow, as nad is dying,
he tells her you can still believeand know when and then he and then
he dies, you know, andthen no one to go. This was

(44:14):
kind of the full thought there.And Rick Asthma shone if she has anything
on her that ties her to Alexandria, and he tells her she needs to
give it all to him, youknow. She gives him the sword and
he tells her they'll be separated,but he'll find her as soon as it's
safe, and he needs to havehis gun on her, and she needs

(44:37):
to surrender. They need to seethat, he says. But he says,
but he promises, he'll make itso they can get away, He
promises her, and he'll make itso they get away. Let's just remember
that, Okay, yes, let'sremember that promise. He makes that promise

(44:57):
like probably three times in the scene, so her in this episode, at
least so we uh. So,we then see her talking to some people.
She's being kind of interrogated. Shesays her name is Dana, which
I thought was funny because it's kindyou know, it's similar to Deny.

(45:20):
Yeah, I felt that, andshe was alone for a long time.
She said that she was in Georgiawith some leaders who turned out to be
bad people, and she had asister named el El who was the leader
of NAT's group. She did areally good job of kind of, you

(45:44):
know, creating this believable Dana persona. I thought, I, well,
I've watched it and thought would havekilled them to see Andrea, you know,
such a cool thing for her tosee. And you know how they
always see the easiest way to lieis to be in truth. So she
had said, I was out therewith my sister Andrea, and we went

(46:07):
to this place in Georgia where therewas a leader called the Governor, and
you know, I knew he wasbad news, but I didn't leave,
and you know, it all wentwrong, and so I've been out there
on my own ever since. Thereyou go, nice little callback to Andrea.
Yeah. But you know what though, I think if she had said
something like that. I think sheprobably would have worried that something like that

(46:31):
might have come up in conversation withRick and yeah and other rights. Yeah,
that's a good point, I concedethat. Yeah. Yeah, although
I was surprised that she mentioned Georgiathough, because yeah, Rick has that
Southern accent. I'm sure he willprobably asked him, you know, where

(46:51):
are you from? Yeah, andyou know, he he may he may
have lied, or he may havesaid him from Georgia. So I mean,
it would be kind of a littlesuspicious if she's also from Georgia.
Yeah, Yeah, so I waskind of surprised by that, but we

(47:12):
but yeah, she does. Shedoes a pretty good job of kind of,
you know, faking being this otherperson. We see her walking and
she's got her consigning jacket on,and Rick approaches her in uniform and leads
her into this vehicle storage. Theystart making out, and she feels his

(47:37):
big hand and so she knows aboutshe knows he lost his hand down.
He tells her that it was youknow, he tells her that it happened
when one of the last times thathe tried to get away, and he
tells her that they've had him trapped, but they don't have him, they

(47:57):
don't have him anymore that they willget away. She is about to tell
him about r Jan and I wantto know what you think about this.
So she's about to about RJ,like you know, he says, Judith's
okay, and she says, shesays yeah she and and you could tell

(48:20):
she's about to mention RJ. Andthen she stops herself and she says the
rest when we get back, Sowhat did you What did you think about
her decision to not tell him?Yeah, I don't. I don't know
what they process is meant to be. Why we're meant to think she doesn't
tell him because they both want toleave, and you know, if anything,

(48:45):
she needs to insanctivize him to leave. But she doesn't know that.
But you know, she can seethat he's part of this and so telling
him she has a son would notmake him want to leave more. And
you know, get back to Wow, I've got two kids, I've got
a child I've never met. Idon't understand why she holds it back at

(49:07):
that point, and she only wantsto tell them when they're safe, unless
because he has said to her,you know, make sure you've got nothing
about you that can identify you York, and don't use your name. She
knows that they know a lot abouther or about Michelle and you know,
the person, and maybe she thinksif she tells Rick that somehow it could

(49:30):
be used against them. I don'tknow. I really don't understand. Do
you have an idea of what theyyou think? The thinking My thinking was
that, like, Okay, firstof all, I was I was disappointed
because I just one of the thingsthat I was really excited about was was

(49:51):
Rick finding out that he has ason. Yeah, so I was bummed.
But I understood it because I thinkher rea is that she doesn't know
what's going on at home. Backat home, I mean, they're still
living in dangerous times. What ifthey get back and RJ's dead? That

(50:12):
is a great point. Yeah,I never thought of that. You're totally
right. Yeah, what's the pointin telling him just for him tough de
grieve the loss of a child he'snever known. Yeah, yeah, yeah,
exactly, dude's thinking. So sheprobably like, yeah, she probably
figured you know, I yeah,she doesn't want to, Yeah, I
mean, she doesn't want to tellhim that he has a son back home,

(50:36):
and then he gets back home andand then like you know, has
to deal with that. So it'swhich And I think if they I had
bands falling off, I think ifso, I mean I think like if
they get back, like okay,let's say let's say they did get back,
and let's say something had happened rJ. Yeah, I think she

(50:57):
would still tell him. Obviously,of course would, but had J.
But it would be less devastating forRick to find out about our Jay's existence
after he's gone, then to findout about him ahead of time and be

(51:17):
so anxious to meet his son,and then to find out that he's done.
Yeah. Yeah, It's it's likewhat happened with Maggie and Beth,
you know, at the hospital,Like if she didn't know that Beth was
there, and she just thought,well, Beth's gone, I may see
her again, I may never seeher again, but she's got her hopes
up. Best there oh no,best dead, you know. And I

(51:40):
can understand that that thought process ofnot wanting to do that. It totally
makes sense. I really look forwardto seeing the posts episode interviews with Deny
about this episode and see what shesays about it. But yeah, that
that explains it. Yeah, yeah, definitely, that's that's what I thought

(52:00):
anyway. But uh, yeah,this there's some interesting stuff regarding that later
on, which I thought was reallycompelling. But yeah, so you know,
she she kind of covers it andshe tells Rick, you know,

(52:22):
like the people like his people havekilled a lot of people, and you
know, she she asks him,like if he's had to do that,
and he he says no, buthe says, the ones in red go
out sometimes and come back covered inblood. Who are the ones in red?

(52:42):
Yeah, I'm totally lost. Idon't know, have you seen that?
I don't think we have that reallyconfused me. He says, the
ones in red go out sometimes andcome back covered in blood, and no
one, no one knows what theydo what he does. And he says

(53:07):
that they can't stop them and ifthey tried, they would never get back
home. And then he tells herthat, you know, he's sorry about
her friend, and he gives hernat slighter. But uh, okay,
so I want to I want toget your take on this. So we

(53:29):
see somebody watching Micheon's tape, didyou realize right away that this was jadas
I did? Only because at thestart of the episode, says Polone I
can talk to. I was like, don't you know why I knew this
was Jadas. I don't know ifit's because I saw bits and pieces of

(53:50):
world Beyond and so I saw likewhat she was wearing and stuff. But
I saw like the black with thechain and everything, like I feel like
I'd seen Jadas wearing that before.Yeah, it's weird because when I rewatched
this episode to take my notes forit for today, I was like,
oh, it's a mystery. We'renot supposed to know that's Jadis. At

(54:14):
first, because I had just gone, oh, yeah, it's Jesus.
I kind of felt like we've seenher in the first episode, and then
I realized, oh no, wedidn't. Yeah, it just you know,
yeah, I just knew that thatwas Jadas and knew what was going
on there because obviously she knows Michauand so she you know, she would
watch it with interest. But it'sweird her. Yeah, I felt as

(54:37):
if I'd already seen her but wehadn't at that point. Yeah, yeah,
definitely, I okay, you know, I will I will say that
my too big, my two biggestwell, oh god, I can't even
say. Okay, now, mybiggest complain about Walking Down, ever,

(54:59):
is is them killing off Carl.That's the worst thing that I ever did.
But the the other two biggest mistakesin my opinion were the reapers and
the garbage people. Yes, Imean it was the garbage people were so
ridiculous they never should have existed.But but I found, but I always

(55:23):
found Jada's kind of compelling. KeleiannaMcIntosh is a good actor. I think
I've seen her and other stuff too. I've seen her in movies and I've
always really liked her. But butyeah, so I'm not entirely mad that

(55:44):
they that they kept her around becauseI think she actually like adds some interest.
I but yeah, the garbage peoplein general. But uh so we
so, yeah, we see herwatching Mishon's tape, and then we see

(56:06):
kind of like a back and forthbetween micheon is exploring the place and you
see her go up on the topof like a trailer or something, and
she's she's looking and she gets shesees like just how stacked their military is.
I mean it's it's it's over thetop. I mean it just planes

(56:31):
and tanks, and I mean,it's it's like there, you can't like
get away from these people. Imean, these people are this military is
huge. And then what with that, We see somebody pouring a glass of
whiskey and Rick gets home to ashitty apartment, but his apartment is Oh

(56:58):
my god, those walls man withavocado green walls. Oh god, how
awful. He gets home to ashitty apartment and finds Jadis there, you
know, drinking, drinking his whiskey. And I I really liked her acting

(57:22):
a lot in this scene. Yeah, I thought she was I thought she
was really good. And she's freakingthe fuck out that mahone found him,
and she's like and she promises himthat if they try to escape together,

(57:44):
she'll make sure that all the peoplehe loves back home will die, including
some that she likes very much.Yeah. Yeah, yeah. She apparently
liked Gabriel enough that she took hislast name. Yeah yeah, For those
who don't know, apparently Jadas's lastname is Stokes, which is Gabriel's last

(58:07):
name, So that's kind of interesting. But uh. And the episode closes
with her just asking Rick, whatthe fuck, what the fuck are you
doing? It's not I'm a bitconfused about why she cares so much if

(58:32):
Rick escapes or not. I again, maybe I should have watched the World
Beyond to understand this. But isit going to come back to her if
he escapes? Is it because shebrought him in? Is is it an
alleged bbe turned out to be anap which, by the way, I
got completely wrong last week. Butyeah, I don't understand why it's such

(58:55):
a personal thing to her that ifyou escape, you know she's going to
kill absolutely everyone he's ever loved.And why why is that important? I
mean, I think I'm assuming thatif that, whatever trouble he causes will
get put back on her. Yeah, that's what I'm assuming, And you

(59:22):
know she doesn't. She clearly doesn'twant that happening. That's I mean,
that's just what I'm assuming because shenot only if they find all this out,
not only is it a case ofof her lying that that he really

(59:43):
wasn't a but it's more like shebrought this guy in potentially knowing how dangerous
he could be. Yeah, yeah, and you know she doesn't, so
she doesn't want that coming back onher. No, But I'm so curious

(01:00:08):
about I'm so curious about her name, like, why did she go back
to Jadas instead of Anne? Whydoes she why why does she have Gabriel's
last name. I wonder if shewent back to Jadis because that persona,

(01:00:29):
because obviously it is a persona.And she slips into Jadis's speech pattern in
this scene, which I love theway she just said yes, this is
and yeah and then twitches off again. That's it shows Polly's amazing acting.
But I assume she realized that tosurvive in the CRM, or to get
anywhere, she had to create acertain kind of person to, you know,

(01:00:53):
an image of a certain kind ofperson that she was, and that
Jadis was that persona of you,cold and detached and determined to get ahead,
you know, And that is closerto It's not the same as the
dadis from the junk yard, butit is closer, you know, than

(01:01:14):
Anne, who was soft and anartist. And but why she kept Stokes
as a as a sort of vestigeof that persona, I don't know.
It's an interesting psychological thing if it'sthere's still a part of her who is
like that, who is like Anne? You know, who is who is
Anne? Who is a person whowants to be part of a community and

(01:01:37):
have close bonds and not just havepeople fear her. But I love the
chemistry she has with Andrew Lincoln inthat scene. It's so electric, and
it's that immediately she's she's almost likesleezing on him a bit. She's like,

(01:02:00):
oh, you look good, andyou know, it's such an interesting
dynamic that she is in power overhim, whereas you know, at one
point they were sort of equals whenthey were both leaders, and then she
joined his community, so she washis you know, a member of his
community, so he was above her, and now she's got the power over

(01:02:21):
him. So I love that,you know, she's playing with that dynamic
and she's toying with him in adifferent way to Nigan ever did, but
it's the same kind of principle.And it's always interesting to see Rick put
on his back foot like that andhow he copes with it. Not well

(01:02:42):
answer, yeah, definitely, Ireally I feel like I really need to
watch the World Beyond just just tosee more about more her role. You
know. Yeah, yeah, maybewe just need to watch the second season
when they're actually at the CRM base. I'm going to try and see if

(01:03:04):
I can find find the time thisweek and then try and watch some of
it anyway, so I can,because I rewatched Mashon's last episode this week
to prepare for this, So Ithink I should definitely do something, do
a bit of homework, watch theWorld Beyond, so we know as we
get further into as we can onlyassume it's not really it's not a spoiler
to say as we go into it, I'm sure we're going to learn more

(01:03:27):
about the CRM and it'll be moreimportant as the season goes on. So
yeah, maybe you should. Yeah, yeah, it's I found I just
in this one scene, I foundJadas more interesting I think than I've ever
found her. Yeah. Yeah,Like she really seemed like a compelling villain

(01:03:50):
in the scene. Now, Iwas just going to say, I also
think that what I liked is that, you know, they have put Rick
and Machown a little at odds herein a way that's very fitting to them.
That because Micheone immediately says, youknow, can we take down the

(01:04:11):
CRM? Basically can we destroy them? And Rick's like, no, we
can't, and he's six years aheadin his journey with him. Then she
is He's you know, he's like, I've lost my hand and I've gone
to I have tried. And it'sinteresting that that the push and pull,
you know what that said is aboutyou know when to go, and that's

(01:04:35):
what they are going to be dealingwith. They have to know when to
go and know when to go homeand and and you know, as as
he was saying to her, gohome to your kids, they have to
know when to go home and giveup trying to do something to the CRM,
to try and change them or ordestroy them or whatever. And obviously

(01:04:59):
the that micheone knows is the Rickwho constantly fought against Nagan, who you
know, fought the governor, whojust took no shit from anybody. And
to see this Rick that's like,no, we can't do anything about this.
That's so alien to her because that'snot the Rick she knew and married.

(01:05:19):
You know, that's a completely differentperson. But he's he's tried for
six years and got you nowhere.That's longer than they were fighting against Nagan.
And it's as you say, whenshe sees the scope of how much
power this military has, but she'sstill it's shone and she still believes we

(01:05:39):
can do something about this. SoI think that's a really interesting push pull
dynamic they've got that's believable and notjust stupid relationship nonsense that you get in
other shows where it's like, oh, miscommunication or whatever. This is something
really at the core of who theyare that she believes that Rick would always

(01:06:00):
try to help others before himself.And as we spoke about last week,
this is the same thing that Darylgoes through as well, is that do
you help others or do you justhave a nice life? You know,
you save yourself first and worry anddon't worry about everybody else. And that's
Michuan's like, no, we can'tjust leave. We have to leave and

(01:06:21):
do something else. So it's goingto be really interesting to watch that gather
momentum as it goes through the seasonand and how Rick can explain why he
doesn't think they can do anything,and if he changes his mind and realizes
no, they do have to dosomething, or they just cut and run.

(01:06:43):
Yeah, now this is this isthis is not really a spoiler.
I mean it's kind of a spoilerif you if you don't want to know
anything that has been put out thereofficially, then go ahead and tune out
now. But an article came outrecently. It was like an article or

(01:07:06):
an excerpt from an interview or somethingwhere Deny Careira was was talking about she
mentions, she meant, she mentionsthat there's some conflict between Rick and Yeah.
Yeah. An article this week hadan interview. Yeah, and I

(01:07:26):
you know, obviously I'm not gonnaI'm not gonna comment too much on that
because we've seen the first four episodes, but I will say that this conflict
that she is referring to is verycompelling. Yeah, that that's all I'll
say about it. It's very compelling, and I don't think anybody is going
to I don't think that there aregoing to people. There will be complaints

(01:07:48):
about it, but I don't thinkthat the complaints will have anything to do
with like the writing or no.I was going to see, it's not
conflict for conflicts sake, which alwaexactly. Yeah, it is an important
conflict on a vital to how theyprogress as people and as a couple.

(01:08:09):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, it'syeah, it's it's it's definitely very compelling.
One thing I want to get yourtake on, So Robbie uh t
W wait is it? What?What's Robbie these handled tw Daily Daily.
Yeah, I'm so sorry if Imentioned earlier this week, so they the

(01:08:42):
title of the finale came out andthe title is the Last Time m HM.
And Robbie put forth a theory thatthat could be a hint to maybe
an appearance from Morgan. What whatdo you think about that? Because I
think it was kind of an interestingtheory. I of all the people who

(01:09:06):
might show up, you know that, I think Scott gimple it was that
said, you know, we'll seesomebody from from the Walking Dead in it,
somebody from the main show in thisother than Rick and Sean and Jadis.
And I think of all the people, Morgan is the most likely because
of where we left him. Youknow, he was going looking for Rick,

(01:09:30):
so I would think he would beand he is the sort of seal
I want to say, the sealthat would take it full circle, that
takes Rick back to the very start. And if this is a show that
is concluding in a way, I'mnot saying we'll never see them again.

(01:09:53):
I don't think this is not aspoiler because I don't know, but I'm
pretty sure we're never going to seeeither Michau or Rick Dye because they'll want
they always want the chance to bringthem back somehow or other in a film
or whatever. But I think ifif this is sort of concluding their main
story, then it would be fittingfor Rick to see Morgan again. And

(01:10:15):
I think of all the people heshould see, and you know, I
think I would. I know alot of people desperately want Rick to see
Darryl again, to have reunion.And and that's fitting because as the intro
said, you know, there weretwo people who didn't give up looking for
Rick. That was Micheaun and Darryl. But somehow I feel it's more fitting

(01:10:38):
if it would be Morgan. Butwhat do you think? I I liked
that theory. Like, by theway, it's it's t W D wait
tw did daily It's because that Dand t W B always because yes,
is Robbie Turdle is t W didSo. I don't know if I said

(01:11:01):
that correctly or not, but that'sthat's Robbie's handle. But I did think
it was interesting. It's it Iliked the theory. I hadn't. It's
something that hadn't crossed my mind.But I'm thinking about the titles about the
you know, so the pilot episodeis called uh, days gone by,
Yeah, and last week's episode iscalled years years Yeah, this one was

(01:11:27):
gone and then by so days goneby versus years gone by? And then
what was the reference to Morgan forthe first time the first time? Oh,
there was a reference Morgan reference withthe first the first time, there
was like some line I can't remember, I'll have to I'll have to look

(01:11:48):
up, but yes, I knowthe first time and repeated it back to
him. Rick repeated that line whenMorgan showed up at Alexandria. Yuh yeah.
So the last time I thought,when Robbie brought that up, you
know, I thought that kind ofan interesting parallel to the you know,

(01:12:14):
days gone by, years gone bya thing. Yeah, let me see
first time Morgan first time again.No, that's nothing season Yeah, that's
the title of the episode. Yeah, first time again in season six.

(01:12:34):
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Itkind of sounds like if that is a
reference to Morgan, it almost kindof sounds like Morgan might show up and
then die. Yeah. No,let's hope not. Let's he survived the
Rick curse this long. I know. Morgan is Morgan's character I've always found

(01:12:58):
super compelling. Yeah, yeah,and I'm a huge fan of Lenny James.
I oh absolutely loved Batman so much. But yeah, I just thought
that was a really interesting theory.I liked it a lot. I thought
it was clever. I've seen peoplesaying, you know, the last time

(01:13:19):
might not be like, oh,the last time in a negative way.
It could be the last time we'veever leave home, the last time we're
parted from each other, you know, that kind of thing, which,
yeah, is nice. So let'shope it's that kind of meaning and it's
not a negative one. I can'timagine it would be. I have to

(01:13:42):
say one of the things that Iwatched a bit of the panel with Scott
Gimp and Deny and Andrew Lincoln,and they all talked about the fact that
AMC wanted to wait till episode fivefor them to have their reunion, and
they thought, and you just think, AMC, have you learned nothing in

(01:14:05):
thirteen years or whatever it is it'sbeen going now, The fact that they
thought they could just keep viewers waitingfor five episodes, and I'm sure they
could have done it in a waythat worked or were believable to me but
it's ridiculous. That's not what anaudience is tuning in for. They want

(01:14:25):
to see the reunion. They wantto see their interaction, and it's not
satisfying for it to come at theend of episode five. So my reason
for bringing this up is I hopethat that same influence that they have had
on the plot will go to rightto the last minute of this show and
that they won't allow it to bea really downbeat ending because you know,

(01:14:50):
I think they believe that these charactersdeserve something better than that. You know,
they deserve some happiness, hoping thattheir influence will continue on and that's
it's something positive. Yes, yeah, same, Yeah, I mean it's
one thing to you know. Soobviously we're really excited about Book of Carol

(01:15:15):
and we're looking forward to that reunion. It's one thing to drag to drag
that out, but when you're talkingabout a series that is supposed to be
a limited series six episodes, that'sthe key. I mean, not reuniting
them until episode five would before it. Yeah, So I'm glad that.

(01:15:39):
I'm glad den I put it thetalk to that because that would not have
been cool. Yes, oh god, no, I mean, we might
have gotten a little more bit moreof that, which well, but still,
yeah, nobody wants to see that, and I'm glad that. I'm

(01:16:00):
glad that didn't happen because what wegot was really good in episode four is
so so good, so so good. I sobbed hysterically during episode four.
It was and I'm sure you probablyknow what part I'm talking. Yes,
I oh my god, I lostit. Ah. It's such a step

(01:16:25):
up from any other Walking Dead episodein terms of writing of characters. You
know, there have been great WalkingDead episodes like the Grove and is one
of the best episodes, and itis magnificent, and you know clear as
well, and one of my favoritesis in the same boat. But in
terms of character interactions, Episode fourand the dialogue and you know that's all

(01:16:51):
written by Deny is just another level. And you're like, yes, this
is an award winning writer here,and you know that the dialogue is yes,
it really is. Yep. It'sjust so much better than And that's
not to put down all the otherWalking Dead writers, because I know they

(01:17:13):
are limited by the showrunner and theand AMC. As we you know,
we just discussed EMC's influences pervasive.But whatever the reason was there, writing
in The Walking Dead, for forcharacter dialogue was always so obtuse and obscure

(01:17:33):
and vague, and I hated it. I still will never forget. I
will never ever as long as Ilive, forgive. She's just gone,
yeah, Yes, one of theworst lines of the series. Yes,

(01:17:58):
And you know the number of Rickmonologues that were just said nothing that we're
just words like no, let Ricktalk like a human being, please,
And Nasha's dialogue in Always Accountable,Yes are you? Are you? Because

(01:18:23):
you get a hold of virtils gimpsand we talking about oh my god.
But no, I mean there there'sa there's Yeah, there's a conversation in
episode four where it's like if somebody, if it was if it was written,

(01:18:45):
if the dialogue was written, it'san important conversation. And if the
dialogue was written in the same mannerthat dialogue has been written on the walk
in the Walking Dead universe before,it would have killed it. And it
was perfect. It was it wasjust the phenomenal, phenomenal. It was

(01:19:11):
just the dialogue was just fucking phenomenal. That's awesome To get to episode three
before we kick it, you know, And I'm telling you right now,
I cry when we talk about ittoo. I'm not gonna be able to
get through it without crying. No, that's fair enough. Yeah. This

(01:19:33):
is not to say the episode threeis terrible. It's not. I think
we both put above episode one.It's just the episode four is so good
it makes something else like really badin comparison. Yeah, yeah, for
sure, but uh yeah, sothat that's it for episode two. I

(01:19:53):
loved this episode. It's my secondfavorite. Who is your Who is your
m v P? It's got tobe Nat? How can we pick anybody
other than that? He's just heis the MVP of the show. Like
oh, and it's so rare tosee on social media everybody agreeing because you
know, it's social media. Andevery comment I've seen says how amazing that

(01:20:17):
character was, how he let upthe screen and you know, they wanted
more of them, and he justas an actor he was brilliant, but
as a character he was so goodtoo, And we got so much meat
from him in a handful of sceneslike Ravo. Yeah, and he shown
so much, gave her her ourarmor, gave her her screaming sticks,

(01:20:43):
and took down the helicopter that heliterally he was like, you know what,
I just realized he was cupid.He shot his arrow into the helicopter
so she would get Rick back.Thank god he didn't hit Rick. Yeah,

(01:21:04):
no, it's it's it's yeah,it's obviously Nat. And I wish
that we I wish we could havegotten more of him. I mean,
what, just what a great characterto have with you in the apocalypse.
Oh yeah, I mean, youknow, just what a what an absolute
badass and and just such a loyalfriend and and just like just such a

(01:21:28):
great character. What about uh,what about your l v P. Well,
I think it's gonna have to beAl. But she's she's leading this
community, but they don't care aboutstopping for people that they you know,
they leave people behind and it withoutblinking an eye, even if it's her
own sister. Like, come on, I know, I could see Jesus,
but I quite I quite like hermotive in the sense of, you

(01:21:54):
know, I know what she's doing, que as queen as Al. I'm
like, you're in charge of allthese people, and you're you're not kidding
about them emotionally, that's just noton you. Can't lead the community like
that or it just becomes a life'sa culture of one month firm self,
and then what's the point of beinga community? So yeah, what about

(01:22:17):
you? Yeah, I you knowwhat, I think I would have to
agree with you because I I can'treally say Jada's just because she drives so
much of the story, her character, so much of the story from this
point on, So I can't reallylike, if I say she's the l
VP, then I'm kind of shittingon the whole season. I feel like,

(01:22:38):
you know, yeah, because herI mean, she's she's the she's
the antagonist, you know, exactly. Yeah, so it's so yeah,
I would say I would have togo with l And like, Okay,
Plus, it was super shady howshe thanked Mishon for saving her sister's boyfriend

(01:23:02):
and my sister, Like wow,wow, her sister is just an afterthought.
H that's so true. That's supersuper shady. But yeah, so
i'd have to agree with you.My my second, I do have a

(01:23:24):
backup for m v P, andthat's and that's gas man. Hey,
I mean, you know what aguy out there helping people trying to get
gas and now he's a walker andhe's a convenient walker because he helps blow
sh it up. Yes, soit's he's uh, yeah, he was.

(01:23:49):
He was useful in life and usefulin death. This is a nice
hot yes, yes, exactly.It was. Yeah, it was oh
god, what was it? Itwas it was a I mean it was
it was like it was a gasbrand. It was a yeah. Yeah,

(01:24:12):
so I think he probably like owneda gas station or something or worked
at But yeah, it was reallycool, like this guy was just out
there, you know, like likejust trying to bring people gasoline. That
was really that's that's really sweet.I kind of I really, I really
liked that and I liked I likedthe visual to how it opened just on

(01:24:32):
and it was it was it wasa cool visual. I liked it a
lot. But uh yeah, soI am yeah, I'm I'm excited to
uh to see more of Pollyanna Macintosh. Yes, as as the antagonist,

(01:24:55):
I'm I'm interested in Uh, I'minterested to see like what more will learn
about Bell. Yes, you knowwe didn't we didn't see Belle at all
in this, and I'm really interestedto see what his rule is going to
be going forwards. In terms ofRick and and how he sees Rick.

(01:25:15):
Does he know that he's he was, you know, oka for hut him
as an insider man to change fromthe inside, or does he just think,
you know, Rick could be thenext guy to step up and lead
the CRM, so that'll be justyeah, yeah, I'm still thinking he's
I'm still thinking he's going to bekind of a kind of a Commander Lawrence

(01:25:42):
type character from Handmaid's Tail, Like, yeah, it's Commander Lawrence, the
architect of Gilead who kind of triesto go tries to destroy it from the
inside because it got out of hand, but then he does a bunch of
shady ship. Don't really know wherehis head's at and is he evil?

(01:26:03):
Is he not evil? It's like, I'm kind of you know, that's
that's where I'm kind of what I'mkind of thinking with Bill. But but
I like the actor a lot TerryO'Quinn, so it's it's cool that he's
on the show. One more questionfor you. Yeah, so you know,
getting back to uh, the DaraldDickson has been off. Darryl had

(01:26:29):
that phone call with Carol, yes, and you know it broke up and
he said, who's back? Anddo you do you have any new ideas
on that or what what are youthinking right now at this point? Like
I think it's possible, but it'snot. It's neither Rick nor Ma sewn,

(01:26:54):
but that t is connected with them, like you know more for instance,
if it's Morgan, that Morgan's comeback and has met Rick, you
know, because Carol was not happy. She wasn't just like hey, Rick's
back. You know, it wassomething she didn't really want to say.
She was trying to avoid saying,and she was didn't sound happy. She

(01:27:18):
sounded distressed that you know, andDaryl could pick that up. So I'm
wondering if someone has come back andtold them about the CRM, because they
don't know about it at all,do they. They haven't the slightest clue
that the CRM exists. So itcould be that someone's come back and said,

(01:27:38):
look, this is where Rick's been, this is you know, this
is what's been going on, andyou know, you know, it could
be Jedis. It could be thatJesus has come back and said, hey,
Rick and was showing her here,you know, for good or evils
reasons. We don't know, becauseyou know it's Jadis she could flip on
the on a on a i'me asthey say, and she could come back

(01:28:01):
and say, hey, there's theCRM and you have to all come and
help get them. I think it'ssomething to do with letting them know,
you know, that the CRM existsand that that is where Rick has been.
But who the actual person is that'sback, I don't know, but

(01:28:23):
I think so. I think becausein the little sort of diary thing where
Melissa McBride was talking about it,she said Carol has a secret or something
like that, or Carol's keeping somethingto herself, so that it's possible she's
maybe not going to say to Darryl, hey, Rick's alive and he's in

(01:28:45):
trouble or whatever, you know,because then they're across the world. What
they're they're going to do about it? There's nothing you can do about it
from that far away. So yeah, I'm super interested to see that at
the end of this season and howthat segues into into the Book of Carol
and how much it is to dowith it. I know a lot of

(01:29:08):
people wouldn't want Rick to be themotive for Darryl trying to get home,
but that you know, his motive. He does want to get home.
It doesn't matter what the motive is. And if Rick is alive and he
wants to it's even more reason togo home, you know. Yeah,
So I'm really interested to see wherethat where that connection is. Do you

(01:29:31):
think we'll see that on the showor do you think it won't be shown
until Book of Carol. I thinkit might. I think we might see
it. It really depends six episodes. Because we've seen four episodes, we
know at what point the story isat in four episodes, which is two
thirds of the way through, andthere is a lot still of story to

(01:29:53):
tell. It's hard to imagine whatthey're going to do in two episodes.
So you may be could wait untiluntil Book of Carol and we see it
from her point of view, sowe maybe see before she leaves, before
that little coda that we saw whereshe, you know, she's looking for
Darryl. Maybe we'll see before sheleaves that moment. I would love it

(01:30:16):
to be. I would love tosee a conversation with Mishaan and Carol where
Mashawan is like I found Rick,you know, and off you go,
you go and find Daryl. Ibelieve you could do it. I did
it, you could do it.I would love Oh that would be the
dream. That would be the dreamI would I would love that. Another

(01:30:40):
scene with Mashone and Carol would makeme so happy, because like, they
were so criminally ignored together. Itwas horrifically bad how little they enter.
In season six, they were inthe same scene and I think had two
lines, you know, where theyinteracted. The fact that they hadn't had

(01:31:01):
a word to each other before thatis awful. How could they have let
that happen season three, four orfive, you know, three whole season
because they were together in close proximityfor a lot of it and they didn't
interact. It's just so fruating.Yeah, it really, it really is.

(01:31:21):
I mean because it's you know,when we got that scene of them
together in season ten, it wassuch a great scene and it showed that,
you know, their family, theyreally care about each other, and
and the way mahone talked about Caroland and it's just, you know,

(01:31:45):
they were so good together that eventhough you never saw them together, you
still you still accept it, youstill believed that these are two people who
really care a lot about each other. Yeah, totally, Yeah, and
we just we didn't. They werejust so criminally ignored. It's just it's
sad, like it's just oh mygod, you know, it's like my
two favorite characters. It just makesme so mad. Like I I felt

(01:32:11):
that way about Sasha too. Iwanted to her to have more scenes with
more people because she was my She'sSasha was my second favorite character while tame.
So that's why we're saying, yeah, yeah, exactly, I'll never
forget that, Like I'll never forgetthem for killing off Carl, but Sasha

(01:32:31):
is the next one that I'll neverforget them for. Well, it worked
out great for Sniego Martin Green.Oh yeah, yeah, she didn't do
live, but she's staying great.Y. Yeah, so you know,
I'm so I'm glad that something goodcame out of it for her. But
it's yeah, I'll never forgive themfor deciding to kill her off because she
was she was just she was mygirl. I loved her. But all

(01:32:57):
right, well, everybody, thankyou for joining us. If you're watching
this, if you are listening tothis, make sure you check out our
YouTube channel because we go live everySunday after the episode. Not don because
she's in Scotland, but don willbe You're gonna join us for the finale,
right, definitely awesome. We'll doa pajama party again and maybe we'll

(01:33:19):
maybe we'll get some folks to showup on camera and their pajamas. But
uh yeah, I'm going live everySunday. My my friend Trisha was with
me last week. She'll be withme again this week. And I also
believe my friend Uri Show will bejoining us. So it's it's a big
party. If you want to joinus on camera, feel free. It's

(01:33:45):
it's it's an open invitation. It'sjust a laid back party. We're just
a bunch of friends just gavin aboutthe show. So join us every Sunday
immediately following new episodes, and lookfor mine and John's reach caps every Monday
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(01:34:06):
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(01:34:29):
joining us, everybody, and wewill see you guys, really see goy
bye. We have a little Gli