August 20, 2025 • 34 mins
In this enlightening conversation, Jen Johnson, a veteran ER nurse, shares her journey of discovering the power of intuition in nursing. After years of experience on the front lines, she emphasizes the importance of listening to one's gut feelings and how it can guide critical decisions in patient care. Jen discusses the balance between intuition and evidence-based practice, the science supporting intuition in nursing, and how developing this skill can help nurses combat burnout and improve mental health. She also reflects on her career, sharing personal stories and lessons learned along the way, encouraging new nurses to trust their instincts and advocate for their patients.
Takeaways
Intuition can be a nurse's most trusted tool. Listening to your body can reveal important signals. Balancing intuition with evidence-based practice is crucial. There is scientific support for intuition in nursing. Advocating for patients often requires trusting your gut. Mistakes can lead to valuable lessons in nursing. Developing intuition can help prevent burnout. New nurses should be encouraged to trust their instincts. Intuition is applicable beyond nursing, in everyday life. Mental health is a critical aspect of nursing that needs attention.
Chapters
00:00 The Power of Intuition in Nursing
01:58 Recognizing Intuition in the ER
05:55 Listening to Your Body's Signals
09:46 Balancing Intuition and Evidence-Based Practice
14:25 The Science Behind Intuition
18:18 Advocating for Patients with Intuition
20:19 Learning from Mistakes
24:40 Intuition as a Tool for Mental Health
26:45 Developing Intuition in New Nurses
30:22 Reflections on Career and Growth
Connect with Jen Johnson
Website: www.nursejen.ca
Book: Nursing Intuition: How to Trust Your Gut, Save Your Sanity, and Survive Your Career (Available through her website and major booksellers)
Connect with Scott Allan
Website: mediumscottallan.com
Email: Scott@mediumscottallan.com
Phone: +1 978-488-0318
Book a Reading / Events / Podcast: All available at mediumscottallan.com
About Scott
WEB:
Want to connect with Spirit, get a private reading, or attend a live event? Visit mediumscottallan.com for bookings, event updates, and more.
PATREON:
If you love these stories and want to support more episodes, check out my Patreon for behind-the-scenes content, bonus Q&As, and special perks for supporters.
Scott's Patreon
Takeaways
Intuition can be a nurse's most trusted tool. Listening to your body can reveal important signals. Balancing intuition with evidence-based practice is crucial. There is scientific support for intuition in nursing. Advocating for patients often requires trusting your gut. Mistakes can lead to valuable lessons in nursing. Developing intuition can help prevent burnout. New nurses should be encouraged to trust their instincts. Intuition is applicable beyond nursing, in everyday life. Mental health is a critical aspect of nursing that needs attention.
Chapters
00:00 The Power of Intuition in Nursing
01:58 Recognizing Intuition in the ER
05:55 Listening to Your Body's Signals
09:46 Balancing Intuition and Evidence-Based Practice
14:25 The Science Behind Intuition
18:18 Advocating for Patients with Intuition
20:19 Learning from Mistakes
24:40 Intuition as a Tool for Mental Health
26:45 Developing Intuition in New Nurses
30:22 Reflections on Career and Growth
Connect with Jen Johnson
Website: www.nursejen.ca
Book: Nursing Intuition: How to Trust Your Gut, Save Your Sanity, and Survive Your Career (Available through her website and major booksellers)
Connect with Scott Allan
Website: mediumscottallan.com
Email: Scott@mediumscottallan.com
Phone: +1 978-488-0318
Book a Reading / Events / Podcast: All available at mediumscottallan.com
About Scott
WEB:
Want to connect with Spirit, get a private reading, or attend a live event? Visit mediumscottallan.com for bookings, event updates, and more.
PATREON:
If you love these stories and want to support more episodes, check out my Patreon for behind-the-scenes content, bonus Q&As, and special perks for supporters.
Scott's Patreon
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
I've ever wondered what it would be like to know,
truly know what's happening with someone, before the tests, before
the charts, before anyone else. My guest says, sometimes all
you need to do is listen not just to your patience,
but to the quiet.
Speaker 2 (00:16):
Voice inside yourself.
Speaker 1 (00:18):
Tonight we mean Jen Johnson, a wife, mother of two,
and a veteran er nurse from Ontario, Canada. After sixteen
years on the front lines, Jen found herself facing more
than just medical emergencies. She endured heartbreak, witnessed the best
and worst of humanity, and served the relentless pressure of
a global pandemic. Through it all, she discovered something unexpected,
(00:42):
the power of intuition. That gut feeling, the one that
whispers the warning or offers a nudge, became her most
trusted tool, often guiding her to act before the evidence
was clear. But intuition isn't just a hunch. Jen's here
to share the science behind it, how it changed her
own death nursing practice, and why she believes it could
(01:02):
say not just patience, but nurses themselves from burnout and despair.
Her new book, Nursing Intuition, How to Trust your Gut
save your sanity and survive your career is a rallying
cry for every nurse who's ever felt alone on the
darkest days. How do you find hope when the world
expects you to be unbreakable? And is it possible even
(01:23):
now to bring back the love of nursing? This is
the enlightened life. I'm Scott Allen, and tonight we listen
to the voice within.
Speaker 2 (01:43):
Jen.
Speaker 1 (01:43):
It is such a joy to have you here with
us today.
Speaker 2 (01:45):
Welcome to the show.
Speaker 3 (01:47):
Gosh, thank you so much for that intro. I'm like
riven in, I.
Speaker 2 (01:51):
Want to listen. What's next?
Speaker 3 (01:52):
I want to listen what's happening? Man?
Speaker 2 (01:55):
Awesome?
Speaker 1 (01:55):
You know, I'm hoping you can take us right back
to when you first realized your intuition was got you
in the er?
Speaker 2 (02:01):
What was that like? You know, how did you respond
to it?
Speaker 3 (02:04):
Yeah? I remember looking back, and you know, I'd gone
from my first job, which is a really small hospital
where it was just me in the er as the
nurse and then a physician too. We had moved and
then we'd moved into this very large at the center
and you know, you're seeing eighty to one hundred patients
in twelve hours, and I remember sitting at triage, and
(02:26):
you know, you're making life for death decisions within five
minutes for every single person that you're seeing. And so
I remember sitting there thinking, you know, I think I'm
going to play a game. I think I'm going to
just try and guess what people are coming in with,
just to see if I can keep myself a little
bit entertained, keep myself engaged, and goof.
Speaker 2 (02:47):
Off one hundred p before they actually showed up.
Speaker 3 (02:50):
This is before they well, so this would be they
were standing in the waiting room waiting to be triaged,
but they hadn't talked to me yet, I understand. So
I would see though, and I go, you know, someone's
clutching their chest. Oh, that's pretty obvious. It's chest pain.
Or they're holding their abdomen. You're like, okay, abdominal pain.
So I would try to guess just generically, you know,
(03:11):
what are they coming in with, just very maybe just
a system? Is it cardiac? Is it, lung? Is it
GI what is it? And it was enough to keep
me interested and going and to the point where then
I was excited to triage the next because I was
pretty right with that one. So let's triage the next
one and see what's happening there. And the more I
did it, the more it turned out to be, like, oh, okay,
(03:32):
I was pretty bang on with most of these, all right,
So let's up the ante a little bit. Let's get
a little bit more specific. You know, is it cardiac
chest pain or is it lung chest pain, or is
it you know, pregnancy related or is it maybe a
little bit more something rare. And again, I just thought
I was good at my job, and that's what was,
(03:53):
you know, the thing behind it. And so when you'd
come across people then who you're looking at them and
you're like not adding up, Like I'm not feeling great
about this, It's like, okay, let me just I'm going
to put in a little bit more blood work than
we typically would order. You know, I'm going to make
sure to follow you through your ear journey. I'm gonna
(04:13):
treas you as somebody who may be a little bit
sicker than I'm anticipating, just because I feel like there's
something missing. And the more I would get really good
at that feeling, then those are the people who turned
out to be really sick, like something was brewing. Then
a burst appendix, or pan grey titus that very quickly
(04:33):
turned septic, and or somebody had a seizure that they
weren't even there for a seizure like seizure complaints, they
had no serior history. And so I thought, Okay, I'm
just really good at my job, like, look at me, go,
I'm I've done some reading, I've I've gotten some extra certifications,
and here we are, So let me just do this.
(04:55):
And it wasn't until pandemic hit I ended up right
down some stories for my kids to kind of you know,
heaven forbid, I passed during the pandemic. How do you
explain to kids that mom chose to continue to go
to work. I thought, let me just write down my stories.
And it was only after looking back at those stories,
going like my gut rang off and every single one
(05:16):
of those scenarios and here were the consequences. And so
I thought, I looked back, I'm like, I've been doing
this for years and just thinking it was a game.
It was just kind of the most fun revelation that
I thought, Yeah, let's see what happens.
Speaker 1 (05:34):
Yeah, so you've mentioned listening to your body, right, So
what are some of the physical signals or sensations that
tell you something might be off, even do with a
tester day to confirm it.
Speaker 3 (05:43):
Yeah. Usually the most obvious one is just a heaviness
in your gut, like a really true, all of a sudden,
just this really uncomfortable, heavy gut feeling that it just
makes you kind of stop and go like, oh, am
I nauseous? Am I not feeling well? Like if you
weren't understanding that this was your body just trying to
(06:03):
talk to you, you think, oh, maybe I'm coming down
with something. Maybe all of a sudden, Oh I'm not
feeling too well. Yeah, And so that's how it starts.
And I've found the more you go into it, you
don't have to wait for kind of such a big
signal then becomes you know, you're so. I'd be at
triage and questions would just kind of pop into my
(06:25):
head and I would find I would ask them without
even thinking, where it wasn't a conscious effort to you know,
this is the next question I want to ask, This
is the next question I want to ask. All of
a sudden, I'd go on a tangent with something where
I wouldn't These wouldn't be typical questions that I'd ask
at triage, you know, when you've got five minutes here,
I am going down into like family histories and you
(06:49):
know what about you know, social aspects and stress and
this kind of stuff going down on a side path.
I've had it where you know, an ear rings and
it's enough to kind of make you stop and go, okay,
like what's happening around me? That something's up? And I've
had it where I've been walking down the hallway there's
(07:10):
patients lined up in our hallways unfortunately, and I physically
stop in front of a patient where I wasn't meaning
to stop, and so I go, okay, why have I stopped?
And here's the patient. I'm going I don't like the
look of this, like what's happening here? And when you
actually stop and look a little closer, all their breathings
a little bit off, their color is not so great,
(07:32):
Like I don't know what's happening, but let me get
more information. And it turns into something where somebody has
a second set of eyes on them and we all go, oh, no,
this isn't right. This isn't where this person's supposed to be.
They're supposed to be on a cardiac motor and with
some oxygen, and they don't have that in the allway,
so let's move them.
Speaker 2 (07:53):
Yeah. Do you get that when you're not at work?
Do you get it?
Speaker 1 (07:58):
You know people ask me all the time, do you
see dead people in the grocery store? Do you get
that when you're out shopping or when you're just around
other people.
Speaker 3 (08:06):
I do, Yeah, It's it's less prominent. I feel like
it's it's because I'm kind of go into work mode
when you when you cross through the doors, it's almost like, Okay,
I'm allowing these things to happen. Here's my boundary. I'm
opening up a little bit. I choose to let this
in a bit. But there will be people or things
happening around me where you know, then my regular intuition
(08:29):
kicks in my You know, any woman over the age
of twelve knows this feeling intimately, as in, you walked
into a room, it's a party, a lot's going on,
but yet there's some guy in the corner and he's
kind of looking at you, and without saying one word
to this guy, you're like, absolutely not one hundred percent factor.
I'm at yeah, yeah, And you know that's that's more
(08:53):
related to just my safety, and that's why we trust
that aspect of.
Speaker 2 (08:57):
It, of course, but it's.
Speaker 3 (09:01):
Absolutely everybody has that. It's just unfortunately women are much
more attuned to it as we've been. You know, you're
always looking out for your personal safety, whether we realize
it or not.
Speaker 2 (09:11):
Well, and not just your personal safety. So let's just say,
I mean, you get children.
Speaker 1 (09:15):
Right, how do you differentiate between mom intuition and nurse intuition?
Speaker 2 (09:22):
You know, because sometimes.
Speaker 1 (09:24):
What you know or the feelings that you have for
people you love and care about are very similar. The
information is similar, so it's sometimes hard to decipher where
it's coming from.
Speaker 3 (09:35):
Yeah, and again it's just another level of you know,
that's the mom brain side. Not to say that my
judgment with my kids is one hundred percent medically, because
there have been times where I've something's happened and I go,
oh my gosh, we are a little hospital, and I go, okay,
wait a second. Let me imagine myself at triage somebody
(09:55):
else brings my child in. What would I do? You know,
if I was allowed to laugh them out of the er,
I'd laugh them out of the ear. Okay, Okay, I'm fine,
We're good. This is nothing like I actually have to
take myself as a mom situation right much and you
just go down a whole side path of really random things.
Speaker 1 (10:17):
So respective you understand what people are dealing with when
they come in absolutely huge. Yeah, how do you balance
trusting your intuition with the need for evidence based practice
in this, I mean, the emergency room is it's kind
of a high stakes environment, So how do you balance
the two?
Speaker 3 (10:36):
Yeah, I'm always taking it with a grain of salt.
I'm always going to act on it. But that doesn't
necessarily mean I'm always right. I could I could be
a little bit hyper sensitive to the situation. You know,
other people's emotions are maybe clouding my judgment just a
little bit, or their sense of urgency has somehow leaked
into my sense of urgency. And being aware of person
(11:00):
no bias. You always have to be aware of your
own personal biases and just make sure that that's not
something that's also clouding your judgment. You know, you're you're
not putting somebody off because of ingrained beliefs that you're
trying to change. But unfortunately it's hard. I get it.
Speaker 2 (11:17):
I get that it's just.
Speaker 3 (11:19):
You're you're being aware of it, you're acting on it.
Because I would rather act on it and be wrong
than not act on it and have been right in
the first place, because that's acting on it much sicker.
Speaker 2 (11:33):
I get that.
Speaker 1 (11:34):
Can you ever acting on it when you're wrong have
adverse reaction?
Speaker 3 (11:41):
No? So Funny enough, the science says that, So if
a if a nurse thinks that a patient is sick,
and maybe they're new, they're learning what's sick, not sick,
really sick looks like, and they get the physician to
take another touch point on that patient. Even if they're wrong,
the patient's not actually that's sick. You know, maybe there's
(12:01):
a minor tweak and care, but just that pain or
just that physician having another touch point on that patient
still improves patient outcomes regardless of whether they did anything
or not.
Speaker 2 (12:14):
I understand. Sure.
Speaker 3 (12:15):
Yeah, So it's like go ahead, I'm sorry, al right,
it's it's really you know, no harm, no foul, okay,
still improving even if you even if you're wrong and
still have the physician look at the patient, you're still
improving patient outcomes. So it's like why not, Yeah.
Speaker 1 (12:31):
Yeah, it's not like you're it's not like it's not
like I'm going to use an extreme case yet. But
it's not like you're taking the paddles to them when
they have a common cold and everything else's you know
what I mean, it's not like that kind of thing.
Speaker 3 (12:45):
Fun fact, we don't use paddles. Well, they're there, and
they're there in case of, you know, worst case emergency,
but we actually have huge stickers, size of like your palms.
One goes on the front, one goes on the back,
and it hooks up to the machine and you shock
them through there. So we don't typically use the paddles anymore.
I watched it paddles I always I'm like, I wonder
(13:06):
if I could use the paddles.
Speaker 2 (13:08):
Oh my god. So okay, so I'm going to plug
Devil's Advocate for a minute.
Speaker 1 (13:14):
And trust me, I'm into the stuff because I do
what I do right. People look at me, you know,
like I have three heads. But you talk about the
science behind the intuition, has anyone actually done research or
created findings that support the idea that intuition is a
legitimate tool for nurses.
Speaker 3 (13:31):
So not only is there so much information on intuition,
but so much information specifically on intuition in nursing. It
is a very it's a very well known tool within nursing,
but it's very hush hush. It's very you know, twenty
(13:52):
years ago, we didn't have the science to support it.
I mean we had some, but not nearly to the
extent that we do now. And so you know, we
talk about it, but at three am on a night shift,
you know, you'd be finally get all your patients tucked in,
and then it's like, oh, hey, what happened that guy
last week with the chest paint? Oh my god? You
know how my got rang off about that? He went
(14:16):
and then we did da and you know, we actually
got him to the cath lab and Tom we saved
his life. It was he came back the other day
and thanked us and it's like, okay, well now I'm
getting goosebumps and and okay. So it's a very you know,
we just don't talk about it. And that's truly the problem.
You know, if I hadn't had one professor in university
(14:36):
say one time off hand to she said trust your gut,
and like that was it. It was totally off top,
and she didn't expand on it she went off onto
some other lesson, and had she not said that, I
don't know if I would have bit into this as
hard and as fast as I did. The more I
(15:03):
talk about it, the more people open up, the more
people have their own stories, and it's like, Okay, clearly
you know this was me meant to do this. The book,
at least the majority of the stories and most of
the basic information with intuition, it was written in six weeks.
I don't remember writing it, is that crazy. I remember
(15:25):
waking up really early and staying up really really late,
but I don't for the most part, remember writing any
of it. And again, most of it's my stories. So
it's it's trauma that I've one hundred percent blocked and
didn't deal with, but it's it was there and it
clearly needed to come out. And the more I do
(15:47):
go around and speak to it, when people say, well,
is there science background, like, yes, there is all this science,
and so we're taught. If there's science, we should be
teaching it. So if somebody's going to teach it, let
me teach it.
Speaker 2 (16:00):
So what do you say to skeptics who argue that
intuition is just hindsight? Or luck or whatever it is.
Speaker 1 (16:05):
They believe that it is, and this is no real
science that goes along with it.
Speaker 3 (16:11):
Sure, I mean you have your right to your opinion.
I'm not. I'm not here to persuade you one way
or the other. I can say, here's my book, read it,
have addr. I can say, here's like the twenty plus
peer reviewed within the last five years scientific evidence behind me.
(16:34):
You can talk to any other nurse who's been working statistically,
it's critical care that tends to trust their intuition more
for the simple fact that they just don't have time
to second guess themselves. Right. Of course, then they end
up being right, so then it becomes this tool that
they rely on. But talk to people. Talk to nurses,
anybody who's been in it more than five ten years.
Talk to them. You're like, hey, if you had an
(16:55):
instance where you've trusted your gut, you'll get stories. Go
to somebody else, you'll get stories. It's just something that
we all do that we just don't realize that we're doing.
Speaker 2 (17:06):
So it's going to ask you this, and and maybe
you just answered it.
Speaker 1 (17:09):
But do you have to convince colleagues or supervisors to
take intuition seriously, or it's.
Speaker 2 (17:13):
Just kind of that's just part of it.
Speaker 3 (17:15):
No, the toughest part usually is physicians. If there's a
physician that I don't know or is new to the department,
they don't know me, they don't know my background. You know,
it's you. You tend to say things a little bit differently.
So it's then it's oh, you know, I'm just advocating
for this patient, or I'm just not sure what's going on?
Could you help me out? You know, you change your
(17:39):
tune depending on who you're talking to. If it's one
of my regular docs that I've been working with for
years and like, hey, my gut screaming at me, I
don't want this person to die. Can we go? They
understand that I don't. I don't stand there and say
you got to see this person now unless I truly
mean it. They go okay. They don't even ask me
if I'm sure. It's just like, oh okay, and they
(17:59):
kind of stop whatever they're doing and they and we go.
They know and the docs, the docs call it spidey sense,
and that's acceptable. That's an acceptable call it. Yeah, yeah,
fighty cents. So you're like, well, if that's an acceptable term.
Why isn't like intuition or trusting my gut. So sometimes
(18:22):
it does take the new physician's time to learn because
again that's not being it's not being taught medical school either.
At least they're they're teaching, you know, trust the nurses.
But when when I've got a new doc that I'm saying, hey,
you got to come see this patient, They're like yeah, yeah, yeah,
in a minute, And I'm like, okay, I'm just gonna
(18:43):
chart MD notified no new orders received. And any nurse
who reads that in the chart knows exactly what that means.
It means I've advocated. I got put off, But I'm
charting to say that I advocated.
Speaker 2 (18:55):
That's right.
Speaker 1 (18:56):
Good for you. Wow.
Speaker 2 (18:58):
Have you ever had intuition lead you astray?
Speaker 3 (19:04):
I mean, there's been plenty of times where I thought,
you know what, I think there's you know, I just
there's something else going on kind of thing, and it
turns out that no, it's just your average complaint. There's
been one time where you know, I thought it's night shift,
this like sixteen year old comes in super drunk, just
(19:26):
so drunk, he's not even really responding to us. I'm
like Okay, here we go. It's Friday night whatever, so
we're we're getting them all hooked up. He's puked everywhere,
and I'm like, I'm going to leave you in your
puke clothes. You can have at it. This is going
to be a learning opportunity. Really gave him the gears,
like Super gave him the gears. I was horrible. I
was a nurse ratchet to the end degree. And the
(19:47):
brother comes in and they he starts giving it worse
to the kid than I did. I'm like, oh, thank god,
family's on board. Yes, fantastic. So the kid finally wakes up,
he's finally coherent, and he he goes, oh, well, what
time am I getting out of here. I'm like, dude,
it's like four in the morning. Stay put. You're not
you're not even walking steady just yet. Just hang on.
(20:07):
He goes, no, no, no, like I gotta I gotta go
to work and all these other things. I'm like, what
are you talking about. He's like, well, this isn't a
big deal. I've been drunker than this before. I'm like,
and that hit me. I was like, whoa, what do
you mean? Drunker than this? Before he goes I'm like,
I haven't seen somebody that's drunk in a long time.
He goes, oh, I've been drunk. Does this before all
the time? Like when was the last time? He's like,
(20:28):
I don't know, three days ago. I'm like three days ago.
Like how often he goes on a couple of times
a week? A couple of times a week. I'm like,
how long? Goes well? Three months? Six months? I'm like,
what happened three months ago? He goes, Oh, I uh,
I watched my dad die in our kitchen. Oh oh.
(20:51):
And so I finally it all clicks and I go,
holy crap, you've got PTSD. You can't sleep unless you
have unless you're blackout drunk, because you're getting nightmares and
you're waking up and you can't sleep and you're scared
to sleep unless you're you're you're blackout drunk. And I thought,
holy crap, it's awful. So I'm like, Okay, So now
(21:15):
our whole, my whole plan that I thought I had
about my patient, we're we're turning on its head. So
now all of a sudden, I'm like, man, we gotta
get social work involved, we gotta do all these things.
Excuse me, and so I go to my dock and
I'm like, hey, that that drunk kid. He goes, oh, yeah, yeah,
and he would say the same thing. I would, you know,
some offhand comment, and I said, ooh about that. We
(21:37):
gotta I'm like, here's what happened. This is what I
just figured out. The brother didn't know. The older brother
had kind of stepped into doubts foot footprints. It was
a larger family. Mom was struggling, the whole family was struggling,
and it was a culture where nobody was talking to
each other. Everybody was internalizing. So I'm like, oh, that's okay.
So I told my doc. I'm like, hey, can we
get X y Z blah blah blah all these people,
(21:59):
and especially because he's sixteen, he's still a kid, a
pediatric so we've got all this extra support. So let's
get them hooked up with. Everybody goes, yeah, yeah, we'll
do all the referrals. I said, perfect, go back in.
The kid still wants to leave and all this, and
I'm like, well, you know, okay, now you're kind of
walking a bit better, and you're a little bit more coherent,
and now that I know exactly what's going on, I
(22:20):
said okay, And to the brother, I said, did you
know that this was going on? And goes I had
no idea, I said, okay, So I said, I've never
done this before. I said, here's my number. Call me,
text me if you need anything please, I'm here. Please,
(22:41):
I'll just make sure that I can support you and
whatever you need. So they never ended up calling, they
never end up texting. It was just one of those
things where I'm like, right place, right time, but I
came at it from the absolute wrong angle to start.
So it was a good life lesson that again. And
you never know what somebody's going through.
Speaker 1 (23:03):
Yeah, But you know, talking about situations like this, burnout,
I'm sure is a huge issue for nurses. I know
it was for me in the funeral business. How do
you think or do you think that developing intuition can
help nurses preserve their mental health?
Speaker 3 (23:16):
One hundred percent? If you could, if you could put
a stop to the situation that potentially will live rent
free in your head for an entire career, if you
don't have to carry that patient because you acted, because
you intervened, because you didn't, you didn't let the docs
say no, and you avoided a traumatic, awful scenario. If
(23:42):
that's one less patient you have to carry, I'm in
because I'm carrying carrying at least for at least four,
if not more, on a daily basis. Was there anything
I could do for most of those?
Speaker 2 (23:55):
Know?
Speaker 3 (23:55):
But if I don't have to add to it, that
would be fantastic.
Speaker 1 (24:00):
Ye. So if nurses already when I say buy in,
I can't get a better word, buy into intuition, understand
that that's that's that's a it's a part of it.
Speaker 2 (24:10):
Who is the book for?
Speaker 3 (24:13):
The book is for newer nurses, especially those coming in
the learning curve from degree to department is just one
hundred percent straight up. They focus more on kind of
bringing you into the language of medicine and what your
role is without them giving you a lot of the
(24:33):
support systems that you actually need to last grief. We
never talk about grief. I grieve my patients. How can
you not. We don't talk about therapy or how important
it is. We don't talk about just all the soft
skills that can help you really not be swallowed whole
(24:54):
by your career.
Speaker 2 (24:55):
Yeah, I get that. I get that. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (25:00):
For those coming in that want to develop throw an intuition.
Where can they start I mean obviously your book, right,
but beyond that, where can they start it out?
Speaker 3 (25:07):
A great plug? I love it.
Speaker 2 (25:12):
Tameless.
Speaker 3 (25:14):
They can start just by you know, there's really only
two steps. There's really just figuring out that your body
is telling you something. So be a little bit more
open to when something feels off. You know, if you're
getting that feeling that you would in a party when
you're you know, the creep factors up and you just
(25:36):
you're just not into it. If that kind of sensation
is coming around but you're at work and there's nobody
really around you that you would kind of have that
feeling about, then just just give it a minute. Just
give it five seconds. Instead of immediately dismissing it, just
give it five seconds just to say, Okay, I understand
that this is happening. What is it trying to tell me?
(26:00):
And take a look around, like physically look around. What
is it about my environment that is causing my body
to ping me and to say you better, like heads up,
you're missing something, pay attention, and to kind of always work,
I mean, especially in the er, like I operate on
the fact that I'm always missing at least five to
(26:21):
ten percent of the story, if not more, for a
variety of reasons. But you know, people lie, and it
may be an omission, it may be overt It may
just be that they don't know what medications they're taking
or what time they took them, or or what's happening.
So you're you're always missing something. So to operate on
(26:42):
that basis is a great place to start. And then
when you get that twine and you say, okay, here's
the five seconds, what am I doing with this? You know,
just look around and see if there's anything or anybody
that you don't feel great about, Like, is it a situation?
Is it patient scenario? Is how a patient looks? So
(27:03):
you know, you can kind of get as you know, gray,
waxy green, kind of coloring, purple. You know, maybe the
skin tone has changed and it's very subtle, but your
your gut's picking it up before you do because your
mind's constantly processing. So it's processed that and said, holy crap,
(27:25):
something's changing and is letting you know. So once you
figured out what's going on, it's just a matter of
are you going to do anything about it or not?
Right and just being very intentional about being open to
fail and saying that, you know, I have to be
okay with failing because this is another tool. It's another
skill that takes time to learn and takes time to hone.
(27:50):
If you don't want to go straight to the dock, cool,
not a problem. Go to your charge nurse or somebody
else who's got ten fifteen years in Go to them
and somebody you trust and say, hey, I just don't
know what's happening with mister X over here. Could you
come and take a look. We do that all the time.
I do that all the time, where it's just like
I just don't know if I'm missing something or if
(28:10):
I'm being overly sensitive, let me know. And so somebody
else comes in. SE's a patient who they pretty they
probably haven't seen already, and then they've got a clean slate.
They go ooh, now don't like the scenario. Let's get
the doc, let's do this, that and the other. And
you're like, okay, I was on the right track. Let's
go with that.
Speaker 2 (28:29):
Yeah. One last question. Yeah, when it comes to trusting yourself.
Speaker 1 (28:36):
Looking back now, looking back on your career, is there
anything you wish you would have done differently.
Speaker 3 (28:48):
I know that there was, you know, one of the
first patients who died that was actually under my care
that we're pretty sure it was a pancreat itis that
perforated and they went septic very very quickly. They died
within five hours, and they'd already been admitted onto the floor.
They were there, and I had pushed for the doc
(29:10):
to come because I thought something was up, the vital
signs were changing. The patient suddenly ground out in pain.
But I was so new, and the doc kept putting
me off and putting me off and putting me off,
and it took them hours to come in. By the
time they came in, they still kind of dragged their
feet on seeing my patient. And by the time they
saw them, they're like, oh my god, Yeah he's sick.
(29:32):
Let's move them into the cardiac room and we'll work
them all up. And then within an hour he's on
medications to bring up his blood pressure, which is never
a good sign. Within another hour we're doing chest compressions.
Within the next hour, he's dead. So I took that
one to heart, Like I didn't, I didn't push hard enough,
(29:54):
knowing what I know now, I did push hard enough.
I called the doc like four times as a brand
new which is a lot. Yeah, And you know, it
wasn't until I quit that job five years later that
that doc kind of said to me, like, oh, don't
let anybody tell you that you don't know what you're
doing and without contact, and I thought, I know exactly
(30:15):
what you're talking about. And I can't believe that you
waited five years and for me to leave to tell
me this, because I've been in my head for the
last five years about what I could have done better.
Speaker 2 (30:24):
It's got to be hard, you know, it's got to.
Speaker 3 (30:27):
Be so awful. I wished that at the time I
would have had the guts to say to the dock
after everything was said and done, before the end of
the shift, this is on you. I wish I would
have had the guts to do it. Would it have
changed anything?
Speaker 2 (30:44):
No?
Speaker 3 (30:46):
Did I have the balls to do it?
Speaker 2 (30:47):
No?
Speaker 3 (30:48):
Would it have changed anything? No. I wish that I
would have pushed so that I would have potentially gotten
that validation earlier, because that would have changed a lot
for me in those first five years. Like the first
five years, I would imagine awful like to start, but yeah,
it was pretty pissed.
Speaker 2 (31:10):
Yeah, I would imagine what else would you like to
shoot with our listeners? Anything we haven't talked about. This
is your time.
Speaker 3 (31:16):
Oh my gosh, I'm proud of you forgetting through the pandemic.
You did it. We're working our way through. It's time
that we all take a really serious look at how
much damage it did mentally, because again, we've pushed it
off and we haven't dealt So I challenge you to
go find a therapist or see the one you're seeing,
(31:37):
and just dive into it just a little bit, just
to take a little bit of the edge off, because
I know as nurses we all put it off. I
can't even imagine what the general public did to cope.
So so take the time to celebrate the fact that
you got through it and that you did what needed
(31:58):
to be done, and just yeah, trust your gut. It's
it's not just nursing. It's not just you know, in
a bar, it's it's every day. It's in business, it's
in deals. You know, if you don't feel great about
a business deal it's about to go through, Well why not.
(32:20):
There's multitude. There's a multitude a way of doing things,
and sometimes we just have to pick our head up
and out of our phone to figure out that there's
a lot more going on.
Speaker 2 (32:33):
Beautiful.
Speaker 1 (32:34):
Thank you Jen for a pleasure having you on, and
I want to thank all of you for joining us
on this heartfelt conversation with Jen Johnson. If Jen's story
resonated with you, I encourage you to visit her website
at www dot Nurse Jen dot c A and that's
j E n n to learn more about her work
(32:55):
and her new book, Nursing Intuition, How to trust your gut, savior, sanity,
and Survive your career.
Speaker 2 (33:02):
If you enjoyed this.
Speaker 1 (33:03):
Episode, I'd love you to check out our other conversations
on the Enlightened Life.
Speaker 2 (33:07):
You can find past episodes on my.
Speaker 1 (33:09):
Website at www. Mediumscott Allen dot com, on YouTube and
everywhere that podcasts are shared. And if you're curious to
see more, you can now watch me on Dark Echoes,
streaming on Amazon Prime Video and coming to Apple twenty
TV in twenty twenty six.
Speaker 2 (33:26):
So for those seeking comfort, connection or clarity.
Speaker 1 (33:28):
I offer private readings and public events. All the details
are on my website. You'll also find information about my
book In the Presence of Light, a funeral director's journey
from morning to Mediumship, which shares my personal story and
the lessons I've learned along the way. So thank you
all for listening, for your openness, and for being part
(33:49):
of this community. Until next time, take care of yourself
and keep seeking the light.
Speaker 2 (33:53):
We'll see you next time.
I've ever wondered what it would be like to know,
truly know what's happening with someone, before the tests, before
the charts, before anyone else. My guest says, sometimes all
you need to do is listen not just to your patience,
but to the quiet.
Speaker 2 (00:16):
Voice inside yourself.
Speaker 1 (00:18):
Tonight we mean Jen Johnson, a wife, mother of two,
and a veteran er nurse from Ontario, Canada. After sixteen
years on the front lines, Jen found herself facing more
than just medical emergencies. She endured heartbreak, witnessed the best
and worst of humanity, and served the relentless pressure of
a global pandemic. Through it all, she discovered something unexpected,
(00:42):
the power of intuition. That gut feeling, the one that
whispers the warning or offers a nudge, became her most
trusted tool, often guiding her to act before the evidence
was clear. But intuition isn't just a hunch. Jen's here
to share the science behind it, how it changed her
own death nursing practice, and why she believes it could
(01:02):
say not just patience, but nurses themselves from burnout and despair.
Her new book, Nursing Intuition, How to Trust your Gut
save your sanity and survive your career is a rallying
cry for every nurse who's ever felt alone on the
darkest days. How do you find hope when the world
expects you to be unbreakable? And is it possible even
(01:23):
now to bring back the love of nursing? This is
the enlightened life. I'm Scott Allen, and tonight we listen
to the voice within.
Speaker 2 (01:43):
Jen.
Speaker 1 (01:43):
It is such a joy to have you here with
us today.
Speaker 2 (01:45):
Welcome to the show.
Speaker 3 (01:47):
Gosh, thank you so much for that intro. I'm like
riven in, I.
Speaker 2 (01:51):
Want to listen. What's next?
Speaker 3 (01:52):
I want to listen what's happening? Man?
Speaker 2 (01:55):
Awesome?
Speaker 1 (01:55):
You know, I'm hoping you can take us right back
to when you first realized your intuition was got you
in the er?
Speaker 2 (02:01):
What was that like? You know, how did you respond
to it?
Speaker 3 (02:04):
Yeah? I remember looking back, and you know, I'd gone
from my first job, which is a really small hospital
where it was just me in the er as the
nurse and then a physician too. We had moved and
then we'd moved into this very large at the center
and you know, you're seeing eighty to one hundred patients
in twelve hours, and I remember sitting at triage, and
(02:26):
you know, you're making life for death decisions within five
minutes for every single person that you're seeing. And so
I remember sitting there thinking, you know, I think I'm
going to play a game. I think I'm going to
just try and guess what people are coming in with,
just to see if I can keep myself a little
bit entertained, keep myself engaged, and goof.
Speaker 2 (02:47):
Off one hundred p before they actually showed up.
Speaker 3 (02:50):
This is before they well, so this would be they
were standing in the waiting room waiting to be triaged,
but they hadn't talked to me yet, I understand. So
I would see though, and I go, you know, someone's
clutching their chest. Oh, that's pretty obvious. It's chest pain.
Or they're holding their abdomen. You're like, okay, abdominal pain.
So I would try to guess just generically, you know,
(03:11):
what are they coming in with, just very maybe just
a system? Is it cardiac? Is it, lung? Is it
GI what is it? And it was enough to keep
me interested and going and to the point where then
I was excited to triage the next because I was
pretty right with that one. So let's triage the next
one and see what's happening there. And the more I
did it, the more it turned out to be, like, oh, okay,
(03:32):
I was pretty bang on with most of these, all right,
So let's up the ante a little bit. Let's get
a little bit more specific. You know, is it cardiac
chest pain or is it lung chest pain, or is
it you know, pregnancy related or is it maybe a
little bit more something rare. And again, I just thought
I was good at my job, and that's what was,
(03:53):
you know, the thing behind it. And so when you'd
come across people then who you're looking at them and
you're like not adding up, Like I'm not feeling great
about this, It's like, okay, let me just I'm going
to put in a little bit more blood work than
we typically would order. You know, I'm going to make
sure to follow you through your ear journey. I'm gonna
(04:13):
treas you as somebody who may be a little bit
sicker than I'm anticipating, just because I feel like there's
something missing. And the more I would get really good
at that feeling, then those are the people who turned
out to be really sick, like something was brewing. Then
a burst appendix, or pan grey titus that very quickly
(04:33):
turned septic, and or somebody had a seizure that they
weren't even there for a seizure like seizure complaints, they
had no serior history. And so I thought, Okay, I'm
just really good at my job, like, look at me, go,
I'm I've done some reading, I've I've gotten some extra certifications,
and here we are, So let me just do this.
(04:55):
And it wasn't until pandemic hit I ended up right
down some stories for my kids to kind of you know,
heaven forbid, I passed during the pandemic. How do you
explain to kids that mom chose to continue to go
to work. I thought, let me just write down my stories.
And it was only after looking back at those stories,
going like my gut rang off and every single one
(05:16):
of those scenarios and here were the consequences. And so
I thought, I looked back, I'm like, I've been doing
this for years and just thinking it was a game.
It was just kind of the most fun revelation that
I thought, Yeah, let's see what happens.
Speaker 1 (05:34):
Yeah, so you've mentioned listening to your body, right, So
what are some of the physical signals or sensations that
tell you something might be off, even do with a
tester day to confirm it.
Speaker 3 (05:43):
Yeah. Usually the most obvious one is just a heaviness
in your gut, like a really true, all of a sudden,
just this really uncomfortable, heavy gut feeling that it just
makes you kind of stop and go like, oh, am
I nauseous? Am I not feeling well? Like if you
weren't understanding that this was your body just trying to
(06:03):
talk to you, you think, oh, maybe I'm coming down
with something. Maybe all of a sudden, Oh I'm not
feeling too well. Yeah, And so that's how it starts.
And I've found the more you go into it, you
don't have to wait for kind of such a big
signal then becomes you know, you're so. I'd be at
triage and questions would just kind of pop into my
(06:25):
head and I would find I would ask them without
even thinking, where it wasn't a conscious effort to you know,
this is the next question I want to ask, This
is the next question I want to ask. All of
a sudden, I'd go on a tangent with something where
I wouldn't These wouldn't be typical questions that I'd ask
at triage, you know, when you've got five minutes here,
I am going down into like family histories and you
(06:49):
know what about you know, social aspects and stress and
this kind of stuff going down on a side path.
I've had it where you know, an ear rings and
it's enough to kind of make you stop and go, okay,
like what's happening around me? That something's up? And I've
had it where I've been walking down the hallway there's
(07:10):
patients lined up in our hallways unfortunately, and I physically
stop in front of a patient where I wasn't meaning
to stop, and so I go, okay, why have I stopped?
And here's the patient. I'm going I don't like the
look of this, like what's happening here? And when you
actually stop and look a little closer, all their breathings
a little bit off, their color is not so great,
(07:32):
Like I don't know what's happening, but let me get
more information. And it turns into something where somebody has
a second set of eyes on them and we all go, oh, no,
this isn't right. This isn't where this person's supposed to be.
They're supposed to be on a cardiac motor and with
some oxygen, and they don't have that in the allway,
so let's move them.
Speaker 2 (07:53):
Yeah. Do you get that when you're not at work?
Do you get it?
Speaker 1 (07:58):
You know people ask me all the time, do you
see dead people in the grocery store? Do you get
that when you're out shopping or when you're just around
other people.
Speaker 3 (08:06):
I do, Yeah, It's it's less prominent. I feel like
it's it's because I'm kind of go into work mode
when you when you cross through the doors, it's almost like, Okay,
I'm allowing these things to happen. Here's my boundary. I'm
opening up a little bit. I choose to let this
in a bit. But there will be people or things
happening around me where you know, then my regular intuition
(08:29):
kicks in my You know, any woman over the age
of twelve knows this feeling intimately, as in, you walked
into a room, it's a party, a lot's going on,
but yet there's some guy in the corner and he's
kind of looking at you, and without saying one word
to this guy, you're like, absolutely not one hundred percent factor.
I'm at yeah, yeah, And you know that's that's more
(08:53):
related to just my safety, and that's why we trust
that aspect of.
Speaker 2 (08:57):
It, of course, but it's.
Speaker 3 (09:01):
Absolutely everybody has that. It's just unfortunately women are much
more attuned to it as we've been. You know, you're
always looking out for your personal safety, whether we realize
it or not.
Speaker 2 (09:11):
Well, and not just your personal safety. So let's just say,
I mean, you get children.
Speaker 1 (09:15):
Right, how do you differentiate between mom intuition and nurse intuition?
Speaker 2 (09:22):
You know, because sometimes.
Speaker 1 (09:24):
What you know or the feelings that you have for
people you love and care about are very similar. The
information is similar, so it's sometimes hard to decipher where
it's coming from.
Speaker 3 (09:35):
Yeah, and again it's just another level of you know,
that's the mom brain side. Not to say that my
judgment with my kids is one hundred percent medically, because
there have been times where I've something's happened and I go,
oh my gosh, we are a little hospital, and I go, okay,
wait a second. Let me imagine myself at triage somebody
(09:55):
else brings my child in. What would I do? You know,
if I was allowed to laugh them out of the er,
I'd laugh them out of the ear. Okay, Okay, I'm fine,
We're good. This is nothing like I actually have to
take myself as a mom situation right much and you
just go down a whole side path of really random things.
Speaker 1 (10:17):
So respective you understand what people are dealing with when
they come in absolutely huge. Yeah, how do you balance
trusting your intuition with the need for evidence based practice
in this, I mean, the emergency room is it's kind
of a high stakes environment, So how do you balance
the two?
Speaker 3 (10:36):
Yeah, I'm always taking it with a grain of salt.
I'm always going to act on it. But that doesn't
necessarily mean I'm always right. I could I could be
a little bit hyper sensitive to the situation. You know,
other people's emotions are maybe clouding my judgment just a
little bit, or their sense of urgency has somehow leaked
into my sense of urgency. And being aware of person
(11:00):
no bias. You always have to be aware of your
own personal biases and just make sure that that's not
something that's also clouding your judgment. You know, you're you're
not putting somebody off because of ingrained beliefs that you're
trying to change. But unfortunately it's hard. I get it.
Speaker 2 (11:17):
I get that it's just.
Speaker 3 (11:19):
You're you're being aware of it, you're acting on it.
Because I would rather act on it and be wrong
than not act on it and have been right in
the first place, because that's acting on it much sicker.
Speaker 2 (11:33):
I get that.
Speaker 1 (11:34):
Can you ever acting on it when you're wrong have
adverse reaction?
Speaker 3 (11:41):
No? So Funny enough, the science says that, So if
a if a nurse thinks that a patient is sick,
and maybe they're new, they're learning what's sick, not sick,
really sick looks like, and they get the physician to
take another touch point on that patient. Even if they're wrong,
the patient's not actually that's sick. You know, maybe there's
(12:01):
a minor tweak and care, but just that pain or
just that physician having another touch point on that patient
still improves patient outcomes regardless of whether they did anything
or not.
Speaker 2 (12:14):
I understand. Sure.
Speaker 3 (12:15):
Yeah, So it's like go ahead, I'm sorry, al right,
it's it's really you know, no harm, no foul, okay,
still improving even if you even if you're wrong and
still have the physician look at the patient, you're still
improving patient outcomes. So it's like why not, Yeah.
Speaker 1 (12:31):
Yeah, it's not like you're it's not like it's not
like I'm going to use an extreme case yet. But
it's not like you're taking the paddles to them when
they have a common cold and everything else's you know
what I mean, it's not like that kind of thing.
Speaker 3 (12:45):
Fun fact, we don't use paddles. Well, they're there, and
they're there in case of, you know, worst case emergency,
but we actually have huge stickers, size of like your palms.
One goes on the front, one goes on the back,
and it hooks up to the machine and you shock
them through there. So we don't typically use the paddles anymore.
I watched it paddles I always I'm like, I wonder
(13:06):
if I could use the paddles.
Speaker 2 (13:08):
Oh my god. So okay, so I'm going to plug
Devil's Advocate for a minute.
Speaker 1 (13:14):
And trust me, I'm into the stuff because I do
what I do right. People look at me, you know,
like I have three heads. But you talk about the
science behind the intuition, has anyone actually done research or
created findings that support the idea that intuition is a
legitimate tool for nurses.
Speaker 3 (13:31):
So not only is there so much information on intuition,
but so much information specifically on intuition in nursing. It
is a very it's a very well known tool within nursing,
but it's very hush hush. It's very you know, twenty
(13:52):
years ago, we didn't have the science to support it.
I mean we had some, but not nearly to the
extent that we do now. And so you know, we
talk about it, but at three am on a night shift,
you know, you'd be finally get all your patients tucked in,
and then it's like, oh, hey, what happened that guy
last week with the chest paint? Oh my god? You
know how my got rang off about that? He went
(14:16):
and then we did da and you know, we actually
got him to the cath lab and Tom we saved
his life. It was he came back the other day
and thanked us and it's like, okay, well now I'm
getting goosebumps and and okay. So it's a very you know,
we just don't talk about it. And that's truly the problem.
You know, if I hadn't had one professor in university
(14:36):
say one time off hand to she said trust your gut,
and like that was it. It was totally off top,
and she didn't expand on it she went off onto
some other lesson, and had she not said that, I
don't know if I would have bit into this as
hard and as fast as I did. The more I
(15:03):
talk about it, the more people open up, the more
people have their own stories, and it's like, Okay, clearly
you know this was me meant to do this. The book,
at least the majority of the stories and most of
the basic information with intuition, it was written in six weeks.
I don't remember writing it, is that crazy. I remember
(15:25):
waking up really early and staying up really really late,
but I don't for the most part, remember writing any
of it. And again, most of it's my stories. So
it's it's trauma that I've one hundred percent blocked and
didn't deal with, but it's it was there and it
clearly needed to come out. And the more I do
(15:47):
go around and speak to it, when people say, well,
is there science background, like, yes, there is all this science,
and so we're taught. If there's science, we should be
teaching it. So if somebody's going to teach it, let
me teach it.
Speaker 2 (16:00):
So what do you say to skeptics who argue that
intuition is just hindsight? Or luck or whatever it is.
Speaker 1 (16:05):
They believe that it is, and this is no real
science that goes along with it.
Speaker 3 (16:11):
Sure, I mean you have your right to your opinion.
I'm not. I'm not here to persuade you one way
or the other. I can say, here's my book, read it,
have addr. I can say, here's like the twenty plus
peer reviewed within the last five years scientific evidence behind me.
(16:34):
You can talk to any other nurse who's been working statistically,
it's critical care that tends to trust their intuition more
for the simple fact that they just don't have time
to second guess themselves. Right. Of course, then they end
up being right, so then it becomes this tool that
they rely on. But talk to people. Talk to nurses,
anybody who's been in it more than five ten years.
Talk to them. You're like, hey, if you had an
(16:55):
instance where you've trusted your gut, you'll get stories. Go
to somebody else, you'll get stories. It's just something that
we all do that we just don't realize that we're doing.
Speaker 2 (17:06):
So it's going to ask you this, and and maybe
you just answered it.
Speaker 1 (17:09):
But do you have to convince colleagues or supervisors to
take intuition seriously, or it's.
Speaker 2 (17:13):
Just kind of that's just part of it.
Speaker 3 (17:15):
No, the toughest part usually is physicians. If there's a
physician that I don't know or is new to the department,
they don't know me, they don't know my background. You know,
it's you. You tend to say things a little bit differently.
So it's then it's oh, you know, I'm just advocating
for this patient, or I'm just not sure what's going on?
Could you help me out? You know, you change your
(17:39):
tune depending on who you're talking to. If it's one
of my regular docs that I've been working with for
years and like, hey, my gut screaming at me, I
don't want this person to die. Can we go? They
understand that I don't. I don't stand there and say
you got to see this person now unless I truly
mean it. They go okay. They don't even ask me
if I'm sure. It's just like, oh okay, and they
(17:59):
kind of stop whatever they're doing and they and we go.
They know and the docs, the docs call it spidey sense,
and that's acceptable. That's an acceptable call it. Yeah, yeah,
fighty cents. So you're like, well, if that's an acceptable term.
Why isn't like intuition or trusting my gut. So sometimes
(18:22):
it does take the new physician's time to learn because
again that's not being it's not being taught medical school either.
At least they're they're teaching, you know, trust the nurses.
But when when I've got a new doc that I'm saying, hey,
you got to come see this patient, They're like yeah, yeah, yeah,
in a minute, And I'm like, okay, I'm just gonna
(18:43):
chart MD notified no new orders received. And any nurse
who reads that in the chart knows exactly what that means.
It means I've advocated. I got put off, But I'm
charting to say that I advocated.
Speaker 2 (18:55):
That's right.
Speaker 1 (18:56):
Good for you. Wow.
Speaker 2 (18:58):
Have you ever had intuition lead you astray?
Speaker 3 (19:04):
I mean, there's been plenty of times where I thought,
you know what, I think there's you know, I just
there's something else going on kind of thing, and it
turns out that no, it's just your average complaint. There's
been one time where you know, I thought it's night shift,
this like sixteen year old comes in super drunk, just
(19:26):
so drunk, he's not even really responding to us. I'm
like Okay, here we go. It's Friday night whatever, so
we're we're getting them all hooked up. He's puked everywhere,
and I'm like, I'm going to leave you in your
puke clothes. You can have at it. This is going
to be a learning opportunity. Really gave him the gears,
like Super gave him the gears. I was horrible. I
was a nurse ratchet to the end degree. And the
(19:47):
brother comes in and they he starts giving it worse
to the kid than I did. I'm like, oh, thank god,
family's on board. Yes, fantastic. So the kid finally wakes up,
he's finally coherent, and he he goes, oh, well, what
time am I getting out of here. I'm like, dude,
it's like four in the morning. Stay put. You're not
you're not even walking steady just yet. Just hang on.
(20:07):
He goes, no, no, no, like I gotta I gotta go
to work and all these other things. I'm like, what
are you talking about. He's like, well, this isn't a
big deal. I've been drunker than this before. I'm like,
and that hit me. I was like, whoa, what do
you mean? Drunker than this? Before he goes I'm like,
I haven't seen somebody that's drunk in a long time.
He goes, oh, I've been drunk. Does this before all
the time? Like when was the last time? He's like,
(20:28):
I don't know, three days ago. I'm like three days ago.
Like how often he goes on a couple of times
a week? A couple of times a week. I'm like,
how long? Goes well? Three months? Six months? I'm like,
what happened three months ago? He goes, Oh, I uh,
I watched my dad die in our kitchen. Oh oh.
(20:51):
And so I finally it all clicks and I go,
holy crap, you've got PTSD. You can't sleep unless you
have unless you're blackout drunk, because you're getting nightmares and
you're waking up and you can't sleep and you're scared
to sleep unless you're you're you're blackout drunk. And I thought,
holy crap, it's awful. So I'm like, Okay, So now
(21:15):
our whole, my whole plan that I thought I had
about my patient, we're we're turning on its head. So
now all of a sudden, I'm like, man, we gotta
get social work involved, we gotta do all these things.
Excuse me, and so I go to my dock and
I'm like, hey, that that drunk kid. He goes, oh, yeah, yeah,
and he would say the same thing. I would, you know,
some offhand comment, and I said, ooh about that. We
(21:37):
gotta I'm like, here's what happened. This is what I
just figured out. The brother didn't know. The older brother
had kind of stepped into doubts foot footprints. It was
a larger family. Mom was struggling, the whole family was struggling,
and it was a culture where nobody was talking to
each other. Everybody was internalizing. So I'm like, oh, that's okay.
So I told my doc. I'm like, hey, can we
get X y Z blah blah blah all these people,
(21:59):
and especially because he's sixteen, he's still a kid, a
pediatric so we've got all this extra support. So let's
get them hooked up with. Everybody goes, yeah, yeah, we'll
do all the referrals. I said, perfect, go back in.
The kid still wants to leave and all this, and
I'm like, well, you know, okay, now you're kind of
walking a bit better, and you're a little bit more coherent,
and now that I know exactly what's going on, I
(22:20):
said okay, And to the brother, I said, did you
know that this was going on? And goes I had
no idea, I said, okay, So I said, I've never
done this before. I said, here's my number. Call me,
text me if you need anything please, I'm here. Please,
(22:41):
I'll just make sure that I can support you and
whatever you need. So they never ended up calling, they
never end up texting. It was just one of those
things where I'm like, right place, right time, but I
came at it from the absolute wrong angle to start.
So it was a good life lesson that again. And
you never know what somebody's going through.
Speaker 1 (23:03):
Yeah, But you know, talking about situations like this, burnout,
I'm sure is a huge issue for nurses. I know
it was for me in the funeral business. How do
you think or do you think that developing intuition can
help nurses preserve their mental health?
Speaker 3 (23:16):
One hundred percent? If you could, if you could put
a stop to the situation that potentially will live rent
free in your head for an entire career, if you
don't have to carry that patient because you acted, because
you intervened, because you didn't, you didn't let the docs
say no, and you avoided a traumatic, awful scenario. If
(23:42):
that's one less patient you have to carry, I'm in
because I'm carrying carrying at least for at least four,
if not more, on a daily basis. Was there anything
I could do for most of those?
Speaker 2 (23:55):
Know?
Speaker 3 (23:55):
But if I don't have to add to it, that
would be fantastic.
Speaker 1 (24:00):
Ye. So if nurses already when I say buy in,
I can't get a better word, buy into intuition, understand
that that's that's that's a it's a part of it.
Speaker 2 (24:10):
Who is the book for?
Speaker 3 (24:13):
The book is for newer nurses, especially those coming in
the learning curve from degree to department is just one
hundred percent straight up. They focus more on kind of
bringing you into the language of medicine and what your
role is without them giving you a lot of the
(24:33):
support systems that you actually need to last grief. We
never talk about grief. I grieve my patients. How can
you not. We don't talk about therapy or how important
it is. We don't talk about just all the soft
skills that can help you really not be swallowed whole
(24:54):
by your career.
Speaker 2 (24:55):
Yeah, I get that. I get that. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (25:00):
For those coming in that want to develop throw an intuition.
Where can they start I mean obviously your book, right,
but beyond that, where can they start it out?
Speaker 3 (25:07):
A great plug? I love it.
Speaker 2 (25:12):
Tameless.
Speaker 3 (25:14):
They can start just by you know, there's really only
two steps. There's really just figuring out that your body
is telling you something. So be a little bit more
open to when something feels off. You know, if you're
getting that feeling that you would in a party when
you're you know, the creep factors up and you just
(25:36):
you're just not into it. If that kind of sensation
is coming around but you're at work and there's nobody
really around you that you would kind of have that
feeling about, then just just give it a minute. Just
give it five seconds. Instead of immediately dismissing it, just
give it five seconds just to say, Okay, I understand
that this is happening. What is it trying to tell me?
(26:00):
And take a look around, like physically look around. What
is it about my environment that is causing my body
to ping me and to say you better, like heads up,
you're missing something, pay attention, and to kind of always work,
I mean, especially in the er, like I operate on
the fact that I'm always missing at least five to
(26:21):
ten percent of the story, if not more, for a
variety of reasons. But you know, people lie, and it
may be an omission, it may be overt It may
just be that they don't know what medications they're taking
or what time they took them, or or what's happening.
So you're you're always missing something. So to operate on
(26:42):
that basis is a great place to start. And then
when you get that twine and you say, okay, here's
the five seconds, what am I doing with this? You know,
just look around and see if there's anything or anybody
that you don't feel great about, Like, is it a situation?
Is it patient scenario? Is how a patient looks? So
(27:03):
you know, you can kind of get as you know, gray,
waxy green, kind of coloring, purple. You know, maybe the
skin tone has changed and it's very subtle, but your
your gut's picking it up before you do because your
mind's constantly processing. So it's processed that and said, holy crap,
(27:25):
something's changing and is letting you know. So once you
figured out what's going on, it's just a matter of
are you going to do anything about it or not?
Right and just being very intentional about being open to
fail and saying that, you know, I have to be
okay with failing because this is another tool. It's another
skill that takes time to learn and takes time to hone.
(27:50):
If you don't want to go straight to the dock, cool,
not a problem. Go to your charge nurse or somebody
else who's got ten fifteen years in Go to them
and somebody you trust and say, hey, I just don't
know what's happening with mister X over here. Could you
come and take a look. We do that all the time.
I do that all the time, where it's just like
I just don't know if I'm missing something or if
(28:10):
I'm being overly sensitive, let me know. And so somebody
else comes in. SE's a patient who they pretty they
probably haven't seen already, and then they've got a clean slate.
They go ooh, now don't like the scenario. Let's get
the doc, let's do this, that and the other. And
you're like, okay, I was on the right track. Let's
go with that.
Speaker 2 (28:29):
Yeah. One last question. Yeah, when it comes to trusting yourself.
Speaker 1 (28:36):
Looking back now, looking back on your career, is there
anything you wish you would have done differently.
Speaker 3 (28:48):
I know that there was, you know, one of the
first patients who died that was actually under my care
that we're pretty sure it was a pancreat itis that
perforated and they went septic very very quickly. They died
within five hours, and they'd already been admitted onto the floor.
They were there, and I had pushed for the doc
(29:10):
to come because I thought something was up, the vital
signs were changing. The patient suddenly ground out in pain.
But I was so new, and the doc kept putting
me off and putting me off and putting me off,
and it took them hours to come in. By the
time they came in, they still kind of dragged their
feet on seeing my patient. And by the time they
saw them, they're like, oh my god, Yeah he's sick.
(29:32):
Let's move them into the cardiac room and we'll work
them all up. And then within an hour he's on
medications to bring up his blood pressure, which is never
a good sign. Within another hour we're doing chest compressions.
Within the next hour, he's dead. So I took that
one to heart, Like I didn't, I didn't push hard enough,
(29:54):
knowing what I know now, I did push hard enough.
I called the doc like four times as a brand
new which is a lot. Yeah, And you know, it
wasn't until I quit that job five years later that
that doc kind of said to me, like, oh, don't
let anybody tell you that you don't know what you're
doing and without contact, and I thought, I know exactly
(30:15):
what you're talking about. And I can't believe that you
waited five years and for me to leave to tell
me this, because I've been in my head for the
last five years about what I could have done better.
Speaker 2 (30:24):
It's got to be hard, you know, it's got to.
Speaker 3 (30:27):
Be so awful. I wished that at the time I
would have had the guts to say to the dock
after everything was said and done, before the end of
the shift, this is on you. I wish I would
have had the guts to do it. Would it have
changed anything?
Speaker 2 (30:44):
No?
Speaker 3 (30:46):
Did I have the balls to do it?
Speaker 2 (30:47):
No?
Speaker 3 (30:48):
Would it have changed anything? No. I wish that I
would have pushed so that I would have potentially gotten
that validation earlier, because that would have changed a lot
for me in those first five years. Like the first
five years, I would imagine awful like to start, but yeah,
it was pretty pissed.
Speaker 2 (31:10):
Yeah, I would imagine what else would you like to
shoot with our listeners? Anything we haven't talked about. This
is your time.
Speaker 3 (31:16):
Oh my gosh, I'm proud of you forgetting through the pandemic.
You did it. We're working our way through. It's time
that we all take a really serious look at how
much damage it did mentally, because again, we've pushed it
off and we haven't dealt So I challenge you to
go find a therapist or see the one you're seeing,
(31:37):
and just dive into it just a little bit, just
to take a little bit of the edge off, because
I know as nurses we all put it off. I
can't even imagine what the general public did to cope.
So so take the time to celebrate the fact that
you got through it and that you did what needed
(31:58):
to be done, and just yeah, trust your gut. It's
it's not just nursing. It's not just you know, in
a bar, it's it's every day. It's in business, it's
in deals. You know, if you don't feel great about
a business deal it's about to go through, Well why not.
(32:20):
There's multitude. There's a multitude a way of doing things,
and sometimes we just have to pick our head up
and out of our phone to figure out that there's
a lot more going on.
Speaker 2 (32:33):
Beautiful.
Speaker 1 (32:34):
Thank you Jen for a pleasure having you on, and
I want to thank all of you for joining us
on this heartfelt conversation with Jen Johnson. If Jen's story
resonated with you, I encourage you to visit her website
at www dot Nurse Jen dot c A and that's
j E n n to learn more about her work
(32:55):
and her new book, Nursing Intuition, How to trust your gut, savior, sanity,
and Survive your career.
Speaker 2 (33:02):
If you enjoyed this.
Speaker 1 (33:03):
Episode, I'd love you to check out our other conversations
on the Enlightened Life.
Speaker 2 (33:07):
You can find past episodes on my.
Speaker 1 (33:09):
Website at www. Mediumscott Allen dot com, on YouTube and
everywhere that podcasts are shared. And if you're curious to
see more, you can now watch me on Dark Echoes,
streaming on Amazon Prime Video and coming to Apple twenty
TV in twenty twenty six.
Speaker 2 (33:26):
So for those seeking comfort, connection or clarity.
Speaker 1 (33:28):
I offer private readings and public events. All the details
are on my website. You'll also find information about my
book In the Presence of Light, a funeral director's journey
from morning to Mediumship, which shares my personal story and
the lessons I've learned along the way. So thank you
all for listening, for your openness, and for being part
(33:49):
of this community. Until next time, take care of yourself
and keep seeking the light.
Speaker 2 (33:53):
We'll see you next time.
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