December 20, 2025 • 36 mins
Sarah Ransome’s deposition offers a disturbing account of her exploitation by Jeffrey Epstein and Ghislaine Maxwell. She described being lured to New York under false pretenses and quickly forced into a world of manipulation and abuse. Ransome testified to being coerced into group sexual acts, including one incident involving a well-known attorney. She recounted life on Epstein’s private island and inside his New York mansion as being tightly controlled and openly sexual, where young women were “lent out” to powerful men and Maxwell ran the properties like a brothel. She spoke of being subjected to weight demands, emotionally broken down, and even attempting to escape by swimming away—only to be caught and returned.
Ransome also claimed Epstein kept extensive flight logs, took photos and videos of sexual encounters, and may have used them as leverage over high-profile associates. However, her credibility was later challenged after she sent emails alleging the existence of sex tapes involving major political and business figures—claims she later admitted were fabricated in a desperate attempt to draw attention to her situation. She expressed remorse for those statements and acknowledged that they were false. Still, her deposition remains one of the most revealing inside views of how Epstein’s trafficking operation functioned—highlighting both the calculated cruelty of the system and the lasting psychological toll it inflicted on its victims.
to contact me:
bobbycapucci@protonmail.com
source:
DE 701-1 — Sarah Ransome depo - DocumentCloud
Become a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/the-epstein-chronicles--5003294/support.
Ransome also claimed Epstein kept extensive flight logs, took photos and videos of sexual encounters, and may have used them as leverage over high-profile associates. However, her credibility was later challenged after she sent emails alleging the existence of sex tapes involving major political and business figures—claims she later admitted were fabricated in a desperate attempt to draw attention to her situation. She expressed remorse for those statements and acknowledged that they were false. Still, her deposition remains one of the most revealing inside views of how Epstein’s trafficking operation functioned—highlighting both the calculated cruelty of the system and the lasting psychological toll it inflicted on its victims.
to contact me:
bobbycapucci@protonmail.com
source:
DE 701-1 — Sarah Ransome depo - DocumentCloud
Become a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/the-epstein-chronicles--5003294/support.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
What's up everyone, and welcome back to the Epstein Chronicles.
This episode, we're gonna pick up where we left off
with this Sarah Ransom deposition. Menager who is redacted? Ransom.
She was an acquaintance that I met in New York? Manager,
Where did you meet her? Ransom? I think I met
her at a bar or something, Ransom? Manager? Was she
(00:21):
a friend of yours during this time period? Ransom? She
was an acquaintance. I would say friend is yeah, I
wouldn't say friend, I'd say acquaintance. Manager. So, on this
occasion where you met Elaine on the island and you
spoke to her about massage, did you ever have any
other sexual type interactions with her? McCauley. I didn't hear
the end of that. Did you say? Him? Manager repeats
(00:44):
it sexual type of interactions with her? Ransom with her
menager Glaine? Ransom, No, Menager. And do you recall if
she flew with you back on the plane, Ransom, I
can't remember. Manager. What's the next time you went to
the island, Ransom? Again, I don't remember specifically. I went
various several times during the durations, so I remember there
(01:06):
was a it was several times I can't remember the
next time I went to the island. I mean, it's
to this She's interrupted by manager. Was it before you
went back to South Africa to visit Ransom? Yes, Manager,
all the visits to the island were before that. McCauley objection, Ransom, Yes, Manager.
What's the next time you remember meeting Golaane? Ransom? I
(01:28):
met her at the office in New York? Manager. What's
the office, Ransom, Jeffrey's office the main office. Manager. Where
is that? Ransom? I don't remember the location. It's central.
It's got a courtyard, like when you walk in, there's
like a courtyard. Manager. What were you doing at Jeffrey's
office in New York? Ransom? We were preparing for my
(01:49):
college application. Jeffrey often wanted to see just how I
was doing, so I had regularly popins to see him
and Golaane. And Golane would often check how I was
doing and blah blah blah. Manager, what were you doing
to prepare for your college application? Ransom? I had to
write an essay? Manager, When did you Ransom? Also, I
(02:11):
had to do, like, you know, how to apply for
college applications. You've got your application forms and such so
it was more admin, Manager, and you were going to
Jeffrey's office to work on your forms? Ransom, Yes, and
to just say hi. I was well. I never went
on my own accord. I was either invited or told
to be there by either Glaine or Jeffrey. I also
(02:32):
went to the offices on a number of occasions for
a private legal matter. Manager. What's the private legal matter?
Gergis objection, I'm going to direct you to not answer
if it's unrelated to this case. Manager. Was there an
attorney president? Ransom? Yes? Manager. What was the name of
the attorney who was President? Ransom? Alan Dershowitz Manager. So
(02:54):
I was asking about the second time you met Alane.
It was at Jeffrey's office in New York. Ransom, Yes, Manager.
How did you come to be in Jeffrey's office in
New York where you met Glaine the second time? Ransom?
I was told to be there, Manager. And who told
you to be there? Ransom? I think it was Golaine. Manager.
How did Glaine tell you to be there? Ransom? I
(03:15):
can't remember if it was via telephone call. I can't
remember the exact communication that she used, but I was
told to regularly be there when they wanted me there
and just grabbed a taxi and arrived at the office. Manager, well,
asking you about the second time. So you met her
on the island and the next thing you know, you
have communication from her in New York. Ransom, Well, she
(03:38):
was always with Jeffrey in his office. So it's like, okay,
let me just explain it a bit. So you go
to an office and you see Jeffrey's office there and
Glane Glaine was always at Jeffrey's office, so I think
she had her own office there. So when you walk
in and you've met people before, you kind of say
hi to everyone. You know, you have a little chit chat.
(04:00):
Do you understand? You don't you don't you know? I
chatted with Glaine. I chatted with Jeffrey. It was a
super busy office. I can't remember specifically what was said.
It was just a check in kind of manager. So
you were going there to work on your college application
and you happen to see Golaine in the office's mcaulay objection. Ransom,
(04:21):
she you know, she participated in the you know a lot.
She was interested in me. I was, you know, she
had interacted with me menager, I know, I'm trying to
understand when you did this. When was it, Ransom, It
was the second time, the first time I went to
the office, the first time you went to the office,
the second time you met Colaine Ransom, yes, Menager. And
(04:47):
when was it relative to the first time that you
met Colaine Ransom? I can't remember if it was a
couple of weeks later. I don't remember the exact timeframe
of how many days or weeks there was between the
first trip and then when I went into the office. Manager,
But you recall going into the office to work on
your college application. McAuley objection, Ransom, Yes, well, I went
(05:09):
in a number of times to the office, so like
we regularly had to report to Jeffrey in the office.
It was a we were called all the time there, Menager.
What do you mean you had to report there, Ransom, Well,
Jeffrey liked to check in with all of us. Manager.
How was it communicated to you that you needed to
report to the office, Ransom, Jeffrey. I was just told
(05:33):
to be there. I had to be there, Ransom. Manager.
Who told you that? Ransom, Jeffrey and Golaine Manager, anyone else?
Ransom redacted redacted, and redacted. Manager. How did they communicate
to you Ransom by telephone call? Manager to your cell phone?
Ransom and BlackBerry which they provided me. Manager, So you
(05:56):
did not have a BlackBerry before you met Jeffrey Ransom? No, Manager,
Then you got a BlackBerry when you were Ransom interrupts her.
That's correct, Then Manager interrupts her. Acquainted with them? And
what happened with the phone you had before Ransom? It
got lost through translation. I have moved several times through
the years, so Manager, So you got messages or phone
(06:17):
calls Ransom, BBMS phone calls, text messages, all the emails
that they have sent me, I think you guys have.
There wasn't a lot of email correspondence. The majority of
it was done by phone call. Manager. Did you have
any emails with Glaine? Ransom? No, No email correspondence with Glaine? Manager.
Did you have her phone number? Ransom? I did at
(06:40):
the time. Yeah. Manager, Do you remember what it was? Ransom? No? Menager?
Do you remember what your number was? Ransom? No. Gurgis objection,
asked an answered Menager, tell me about any conversations you
have with Glaine that involved fit Gurgis objection. Beforem Ransom.
I can't remember this specific conversation. There were many conversations.
(07:03):
I was just applying, doing an application form and they
were trying to get me in they yeah. I can't
remember the exact I think Elaine also knew people there,
so they were basically trying to get me into fit Menager. Well,
tell me what you recall Golaine saying versus they, Ransom.
I can't remember specifically the conversation, so I would not
(07:24):
like to speculate, but I will give you the overall
conversation and what it was regarding as far as my
fit application, But I cannot remember the specific content or
the specific words used. But it was surrounding my fit
application and an essay I had to write, and they
both proof read my fit application as well. Menager. And
(07:46):
did they both read your essay? Ransom? Yes they did, Menager.
When did you write that essay? Ransom? I can't remember, Menager,
before you went to South Africa? Ransom? Yes, Menager. And
do you know what the application deadline was? Ransom? I
don't know. I don't I can't remember. Manager. When did
(08:08):
you meet Alan Dershowitz Ransom, I don't remember the specific
date it was a few months after I had been
here in New York. Manager. Was it after you had
gone to the island? Ransom? Yes? Manager. Do you know
what time of year Ransom, I mean I think it
was before winter. Manager. Well you were here in the fall, Ransom. Yeah, Manager,
(08:29):
and you left in the winter. Ransom. Yeah, I left
in May. Manager. So did you meet him before you
went to South Africa? Ransom? Yes. Manager. Well, let's be clear,
you were here until you went to South Africa, and
you left for a while, and then you came back
right Ransom. Mm hmm. Manager. And how long were you
(08:50):
gone for Ransom? I think about three weeks? Yeah, about
three weeks. Manager. So you met him before you went
to South Africa? Ransom, yes. Manager, And tell me about
when you met Allan Ransom. I first met Alan at
the offices Menager, and tell me what happened, Ransom. I
can't really tell you what happened because it's about a
legal matter. Manager. Was he your lawyer? Ransom? He was
(09:14):
going to be assigned to me to be my lawyer. Manager,
assigned to be your lawyer, Ransom through Jeffrey's instruction. Manager, okay,
was he your lawyer? McAuley objection asked. An answered, men,
I don't know if there's privilege, Gurgis, there's a privilege,
whether he was retained or not. Right. I mean, if
you're at a cocktail party and you speak to a lawyer,
(09:35):
you know that conversation is privileged. So Manager, well, I
don't actually, Gurgis, You're free to research it. Manager, I
will ask questions then to try to establish whether or
not there is a good faith basis. Manager, did you
approach Alan Dershowitz for the purpose of seeking legal advice? Ransom?
I was introduced to Alan manager by whom Ransom Jeffrey
(09:58):
Epstein on what day? Ransom? I don't recall what day, Manager,
Was it related to some event that had occurred just
before that? Ransom, Yes, that's correct, Menager, were you in
touch with any law enforcement authorities? Ransom? No, Menager, huh, Ransom, No. Manager.
Was Jeffrey in the room when you were speaking with
(10:19):
Alan Dershowitz? Ransom, yes. Manager. Did Jeffrey Epstein ever overhear
your conversation with Alan Dershowitz? Ransom, yes, Manager, What did
you talk about with Alan Dershowitz? Gurgis objection. Ransom begins
to answer, but Gergis objects again, I direct the witness,
not the answer. Manager. A third party was in the room.
(10:40):
You've heard that, Council, and you know that means that
that's a waiver. McCauley. No, I mean they would have
been involved. We don't know what the situation is. They
could have been involved together. There could be a number
of reasons why Jeffrey had some sort of common interest
with her with that manager. Did you sign a common
interest agreement with Jeffrey? Gurgis objection, Do not answer, Menager,
(11:03):
whether she had a common interest agreement with Jeffrey. You're
instructing her or not to answer. Is that right, counsel Gurgis?
Do you have real time in front of you, Council Menager,
I don't, Gergis, you don't. You can borrow mine, Menager,
I don't want it, thank you, Gergis, Okay, Menager? Anyone
else in the room when you spoke with mister Dershowitz, Ransom, No, Menager,
(11:26):
describe mister Dershowitz for me. Ransom. He old age, white,
pasty skin, not very attractive, wears glasses, A bit of
an ugly man, really, Meninger, did he have any facial hair, Ransom.
I can't recall at the time, No, Meninger mustache Ransom.
I can't remember, Menager beard Ransom. I can't remember Menainger.
(11:47):
You can't remember if he had a mustache or a beard.
Gurgis objection, asked An answered McAuley objection, Ransom. I don't
recall seeing a massage, sorry, a mustache on Alan Dershowitz.
I don't recall a massive amount of facial hair. I
recall Alan Dershowitz. Whether he had a subtle amount, I'm
not sure. Yeah, it's he didn't have a beard. I
(12:08):
don't think Meninger. All right, did you sign an AFFI
David that you submitted in this case? Ransom? Yes, Menager.
Did you make the allegation in your declaration that you
had a sexual relationship with Alan Dershowitz, Ransom, Yes, I
absolutely did. Meninger. When did you have sex with Alan
Dershowitz Ransom. I can't remember the exact time, but it
(12:30):
was in Jeffrey Epstein's New York apartment. Manager, we're in
the apartment, Ransom. It was in a bathroom. I can't remember, Menager.
Was it before or after you had this conversation that
you won't describe Ransom. It was after Menager. So do
you recall what month that was before you went to
South Africa or after you went to South Africa? Ransom,
(12:53):
I can't remember, Menainger. How long did you speak to
Alan Dershowitz during your first meeting with them? Ransom until
I was finished explaining what my legal matter was? Manager?
Did he believe you to be did he believe that
he was your lawyer during that conversation? Gurgis objection, McAuley objection, Pottinger,
please Pagliuca. All right, guys, you know, let's just do
(13:14):
the deposition here without the chorus over there, Gurgis, and
without the speeches as well. We agree, let's carry on
without asking ridiculous questions about what other people's mental state was.
I think that's a good idea. Let's carry on, counsel, Menager.
Did you ever sign a fear agreement with Alan Dershowitz Ransom? No, Manager.
(13:35):
Did you ever appear in court with Alan Dershowitz, Ransom, No, Menager?
Did you ever appear in court yourself? Ransom? No? Men
Did you ever have any contact with any law enforcement
officers while you were in New York Ransom, No, Menager,
any police Ransom, No, Menager. After you left that meeting
with Alan Dershowitz, when did you see him next? Ransom?
(13:57):
I can't remember. I think it was at dinner. There
was a dinner, yeah, Menager. And do you know whether
the dinner was before or after you went to South Africa? Ransom.
I can't remember the specific time period, so I don't
remember if it was before or if it was after,
but it was to this she's interrupted by Menager. Where
was the dinner, Ransom? It was in a restaurant in
(14:19):
New York, Menager. What restaurant Ransom, I can't remember, Menager.
Who else was there? Ransom? I remember Alan Jeffrey myself.
I can't remember if others, if there were other people there, Menager.
What type of restaurant was it? Ransom? It was a
nice restaurant. Manager. Do you remember the type of cuisine? Ransom, No, Menager.
(14:42):
What do you remember discussing at dinner? Ransom the legal
matter that I had. Manager. Did you consider him to
be your lawyer at that dinner? Ransom? Yes, I did, Menager.
What's the next time you saw Alan Dershowitz. Ransom at
Jeffrey Epstein's New York mansion. Menager, When was that, Ransom?
After the second time I had met Alan Meninger? Had
(15:03):
you been to South Africa? Ransom? I can't remember, Menainger.
Tell me what happened during that encounter, Ransom. I walked
in the room. I walked in the house. Jeffrey and
Redacted and Alan were there, Menainger, what happened after you
walked into the house, Ransom. It was really strange because
Redacted didn't like me, and so when I arrived, we
(15:24):
had I think, I can't remember if I had like
water or whatever. Redacted took me upstairs. I remember there
was a room. I didn't quite understand what was going
on at the time. I knew obviously something was going
on because I've never met Redacted socially. So Redacted started
undressing me in the room. She started undressing me by
the bed, and we got on the bed. I kind
(15:47):
of knew what was going on from that. The girls
were often forced to have sex with each other for
Jeffrey's pleasure, so it was just another occasion, I guess.
Jeffrey then walked in the room. He started masturbating under
his clothes. He put his hand in his trousers. A
few minutes later, Alan walked in the room, he started undressing.
He got on the bed with redacted at myself, and
(16:08):
we basically had a three way sexual interaction. Menager. Was
Alan fully clothed? Ransom daring when at what was specific?
He walked in with clothes, Menager, and he got fully undressed? Ransom? Yes? Manager,
So you saw his entire naked body? Ransom? Yes, Menager.
Did you notice anything specific about his body? Ransom? Not
(16:28):
that I recall. I mean, yeah, not that I can't
really remember. It was quite a It was a it
wasn't a pleasant experience, Menager. What did you do with Alan? Ransom?
I gave him moral sex and masturbated him, Menager. Anything else? Ransom?
He did the same with redacted. He performed the same
on me, Menager. Did he ejaculate? Ransom? He did, yeah, Menager,
(16:52):
in your mouth? Ransom? No, Menager. Did you have intercourse
with him? Ransom? No? Not penetration, no, Menager. Did you
see him ejaculate more than once? Ransom? No? I didn't
see him ejaculate more than once, Menager. You didn't notice
any scars? Mcauleay objection, Ransom I don't recall specific markings
on every man I've been with body, So it's not
(17:14):
something I wasn't ravishing Alan's body. I was trying to
close my eyes and just get it done so I
could go home and watch TV. Really, so I really
wasn't aware. I don't really like kind of go whoo
his body. I don't recall his body at all, like
I don't make a mental note of every man's body
I've slept with, Menager other than Jeffrey Is. At the
(17:35):
first time you had sex with another man in his
home or on his property? Ransom? Sorry, can you just
repeat the question, Gurgis or rephrase it? Ransom. I'll just
read it, Gurgis if you understand it. Ransom. Yeah, he
was the only person Alan Dershowitz. Menager. Did you have
sex with him more than once? Ransom? No, Menager at
(17:57):
the occasion you just described. Did he have an erection? Ransom?
It was, it was, It wasn't particularly hard. It was
pretty disappointing, Menainger. And where did he ejaculate? Ransom? I
had given him oral sex, and well he ejaculated. He ejaculated.
I mean, there's only so many places a man can ejaculate.
(18:17):
He didn't ejaculate on me. He didn't ejaculate my mouth.
I gave him moral and I masturbated him and finished
them off. He ejaculated over himself me just there wasn't
a lot of ejaculation. I don't remember a lot of sperm.
I didn't see massive amounts of semen. But I just
remember him ejaculating. But it wasn't in my mouth, Menager.
And in terms of time frame, the best you can
(18:39):
say is that it was after you had been to
the island a few times, Ransom. That's correct, Menainger. And
you don't remember if it was before or after you
went to South Africa, Ransom, I can't remember specifically, no Menager.
Did you see Alan Dershowitz again after that occasion? Ransom, no, Menager.
(19:00):
So you saw him at the office, you say you
saw him at dinner, and you say you saw him
one time in the bedroom at Jeffrey's house, Ransom, that's correct, Menager.
It's one o'clock. I think we should take a small
lunch break. How anyone can even talk about eating lunch
after we just heard about Alan gross As Dershowitz ejaculating
is beyond me. But here we are, so we're gonna
(19:21):
take a break as well. That way we can all
go throw up, and then we'll pick up where we
left off in the next episode. All of the information
that goes with this episode can be found in the
description box. What's up, everyone, and welcome back to the
Epstein Chronicles. In this episode, we're gonna pick up where
we left off with a Sarah Ransom deposition, and in
(19:43):
that last episode we left off with Sarah Ransom talking
about Alan Dershowitz. So let's get back to it. Gergiz Council,
before you commence with your questioning, I think there's one
issue from this morning that the witness wants to correct
herself on, so just let her do that now, Ransom.
I said earlier that I would just like to correct
(20:04):
that my lawyers are paying for they are covering my
hotel expenses. Meninger, thank you for the clarification, Ransom, and
she's cut off by mister Gergis. Go ahead, Ransom and
my flight Menager, thank you. Now back to the questioning Menager,
going back to your first conversation with Alan Dershowitz. At
(20:24):
any point in that conversation had mister Dershowitz agreed to
act as your lawyer. Ransom, Yes, Menager. Did he do
anything in terms of contacting anyone on your behalf? Gurgis objection,
Do not answer, Menager. What was the specific legal matter
that you were seeking representation for? McCauley objection. Gurgis objection,
(20:45):
Do not answer, Menager. What did you understand the purpose
of Jeffrey Epstein being in that room for during that conversation? Ransom?
Jeffrey was there to support me, and Jeffrey was looking
after me. Menager. When you engaged in sexual conduct with
Alan Dershowitz, did you see any evidence on his body
of his surgical procedure? Ransom. I don't recall seeing anything.
(21:09):
I can't remember, Menager. Did you see any bandages? Ransom?
I can't remember. Menager. Did you see him bleed through
his penis? Ransom? Not that I recall, Menager. Do you
recall seeing mister Dershowitz bleed through his penis? Ms McCauley objection,
asked and answered, Ransom, not that I recall, Menager. When
(21:30):
you were on the island sometimes less than ten times,
you think, did you ever use any drugs? Ransom? No, Menager,
did you use cocaine Ransom, no Menager. Did you ever
get thrown off the island for using cocaine? Ransom? No, Menager.
Did you drink alcohol? Ransom? No, Menager. None. Ransom during
on the island, whenever I was around Jeffrey, Absolutely not, Menager.
(21:54):
Other than going to the island, did you travel anywhere
else with Jeffrey Ransom? No Menager. Did you ever travel
anywhere with Glenn Maxwell Ransom? No Menager. Did you ever
fly on an airplane with Glenn Maxwell Ransom? I don't remember, Menainger.
You don't remember any time you flew on a plane
with Glen Maxwell Ransom? No, I don't remember. There were
(22:17):
always many people on the plane, Meninger. When you refer
to the plane, you're referring to a private plane, Ransom,
Jeffreys plane, yes, Menainger. Did you travel on more than
one plane of Jeffries Ransom? Not that I know. I
don't remember. I don't remember, Menager. Can you visualize in
your head any other layout of a different type of
(22:39):
plane than the one you drew in Defendants Exhibit number one? Ransom? No, Menager.
Why did you go to South Africa in early two
thousand and seven. Ransom to visit my family Menainger And
which family members did you visit? Ransom my father and
my stepmother, Meninger, anyone else? Ransom, no Mener Any siblings, Ransom,
(23:01):
My younger brother and my sister lived with my parents.
My dad and my stepmom and their two younger children. Menager.
Did you see any school friends there? Ransom? No? Menager?
Who paid for your plane ticket to go to South Africa? Ransom?
Jeffrey did? Menager? How did that come about? Ransom? I
wanted to see my family, and he funded the plane
(23:23):
ticket because he was funding everything else at that time. Menager?
What else was he funding at that time? Ransom? Accommodation, travel,
taxis food? My prescription that I had to pay for
for the prescription that prescription drugs? Menager? Had you taken
any prescriptions for mental health disorders before October two thousand
(23:43):
and six? Ransom? No, Menager? Have you taken any since
May of two thousand and seven? Ransom? Yes, I have? Menager?
Which ones? Ransom? Paroxetine? Menager? Anything else? McAuley, I'm going
to object there's no timeframe on this. You're talking about
one year, all the years from two thousand and seven
(24:04):
to twenty fifteen, which I would say is inappropriate for
a non party witness to talk about her. If you're
talking generally about prescriptions, then this whole next section is
completely redacted. The next section completely redacted, next section completely redacted.
Back to Ransom, I had been prescribed were incorrect, Menager?
(24:25):
Those are the ones you mentioned earlier in your testimony, Ransom. Yeah,
I had to stop and change medication because I was
first started on lithium, and the lithium made me put
on weight at quite a rapid rate. So I was
put on so many different types of medication because I
didn't Not everyone agrees with you. Weight was a massive
issue for Glen and Jeffrey, So the lithium just didn't
(24:47):
work for me. I mean I put on weight quite quickly. Menager.
What did Glen Maxwell say to you about weight? Ransom? Well,
what did she not say? She bullied me massively about
my weight, Menager? What did she say? Ransom? I was
told that I would lose Jeffrey's financing if I didn't
lose weight, and I would not they would not help
(25:07):
me get into fit, Menager, Who were you told that
by Ransom? Glaine and Jeffrey Menager in the same conversation, Ransom,
various conversations. Menager. Tell me your conversations with Golaine. When
did she say that to you, Ransom on the island
Menager before you went to South Africa. Ransom, yes, Menager.
(25:29):
And was that in person? Ransom, yes, Menager. Who else
was present? Ransom redacted, redacted, redacted, and redacted, a girl
name redacted, and a girl name redacted. Sorry, I just
remembered a name, a girl name redacted, and a girl
named redacted. Manager. So they were all present when you
had a discussion with Golaine about your weight on the island. Ransom, yes, Menager.
(25:54):
And what did Glaine say to you about your weight
when you were on the island in front of all
those people, Ransom, You can't remember the specific conversation how
it went. We got into an argument about my weight,
quite a heated argument, Menager. What do you recall about
the argument, Ransom. I recall it got so heated that
I ran off and tried to swim off the island.
(26:14):
I wanted to get as far away from Jeffrey and
Golaane as possible Menager. Okay, and then what happened, Ransom.
I left the main house. I took there's like a
buggy thing. It was evening. I drove to a particular
spot on the island. It was so Jeffrey's Island is
quite rocky around the edges, so and it's not really
(26:34):
you can't just go into the water. It was quite
steep and well, I didn't really know how to swim anyway.
I didn't know how to escape, but I wanted to
at that precise moment get as far away from him
as possible. Menager. So you had a heated argument about
your weight with Golaane, Ransom Glaine and Jeffrey Menager. They
were both there. Ransom, yes, Menager, and do you remember
(26:58):
anything that was said during that argument? Ransom? It was
basically an ultimatum that I either lose weight or or
that's it. Ransom, sorry, can I sorry, I need to
get a headache tablet if you don't mind. Meninger go
off the record for a second. So they go off
the record real quick. They have some discussions that were
held off the record. Then they're back on. Meninger, go
(27:20):
back on, Menager. You were given an ultimatum to lose
weight or what Ransom, they wouldn't help me get into fit,
and that my time with Jeffrey would be over. It
would end. Meninger who said that, Ransom, Well, they both
they both said it in not so many words. I
can't remember the exact conversation. I remember it being heated.
(27:42):
I remember them giving me the ultimatum. I think a
few curse words were shared. I can't it was very heated.
I can't remember the exact words. Meninger was redacted there. Ransom, No,
I don't recall her being there, Menager. Were you taking
the medication that you talked about earlier during this time period? Ransom? Yes, Menager?
(28:03):
Had you put on weight since taking those medications? Ransom, yes,
I had. And I had also put on weight because
I wasn't allowed to smoke any cigarettes at all with
Jeffrey on the island or anywhere near Jeffrey. Jeffrey wasn't
allowed to know that we smoked, so I put on
also a lot of weight as well, in conjuncture with
the lithium. So yeah, Menager. How did the topic of
(28:26):
your weight come up? Ransom? Well, I wasn't as skinny
as the other girls, and Jeffrey liked his girls very thin? Menager?
Were you interested in modeling at that point in time? Ransom?
I was doing freelance modeling at the time, But I
mean I wasn't exactly going to be Kate Moss, and
the modeling agency thought I wasn't bateited enough for them either.
I would like to clarify that I wasn't actually fat.
(28:48):
I was a normal weight, by the way, just to
make that clear. I'm sixty four sixty five kilograms at
that time. Menager. What did you understand that Jeffrey and
galand wanted you to lose weight? Ransom? I was one
of the girls that Jeffrey has sexual encounters with regularly.
He liked his girl's thin. Menager. Did you ask Jeffrey
(29:09):
to help you become a model? Ransom? No. I wanted
to get a degree and an education, Menager. So you
were not attempting to become a model at this point
in time, Ransom. No, I wanted to get an education
as opposed to being a model me. Did you talk
to or redacted and redacted about becoming a model? Ransom? I,
(29:30):
as I was freelancing during that time, or trying to
get freelancing work. Jeffrey kept us on a little string
with his massage payments. So I wanted to earn a
separate income while I was doing my education to fund
my living expenses. So you know, I wanted to potentially
increase my jobs. But no, my job was not to
be a high fashion model. I wanted to get my degree,
(29:52):
get my education, and work in the fashion industry. Menager,
you had worked as a model during college earlier, correct, yes, manager,
and you saved up money from that job, correct Ransom, Yes, manager,
and you had used that money to fly to New
York at some point, correct Ransom. Yes, Manager, And what
(30:12):
you're saying now is you would also potentially do modeling
while you were studying in the future. Mister gergis objection.
That's not at all what she's saying, Ransom as in future,
as in would I do modeling now? Manager, No, I'll
rephrase the question, Ransom, please, Manager, let's take a break,
go off the record, and when you finish the salad,
(30:33):
we'll proceed. They get back on the record and manager
starts with the questions once again. At the time, you
were having a discussion with Jeffrey and Glen about your
weight when you were on the island, did you have
any intention of being a model at that time? Ransom,
I was a freelance model. I wanted to increase my
workload to help fund my living expenses, So it was
(30:54):
not my intention to be a full time model, because
I quite clearly applied to a college to get an
education that I was promised by Jeffrey Epstein. Menager. Between
January of two thousand and seven and today, have you
worked as a model? Ransom? No, Menager when you left
for South Africa? Did you have a ticket to return
to the US? Ransom At that time a return ticket
(31:17):
hadn't been booked by Jeffrey yet. Manager. You traveled to
South Africa to visit your family without a return ticket? Ransom, yes, Manager.
Did anyone travel with you to South Africa? Ransom no, Menager,
your mother was not in South Africa when you went
to South Africa on that occasion in two thousand and seven. Correct, Ransom, correct, Menager.
(31:40):
What did you do while you were in South Africa
in February of two thousand and seven? Ransom, spend time
with my family? Menager. Did you visit any modeling agencies? Ransom, Yes,
I did visit some modeling agencies. Menager. Which modeling agencies
did you visit? Ransom? I can't remember the exact names.
The modeling agencies were Online Street in Cape Town. I
(32:01):
visited several modeling agencies on Long Street and Bree Street
as well Bree Street and Longstreet and a few others
in central Cape Town, So I visited a few. Actually, Manager,
had you worked with any of those modeling agencies in
the past? Ransom? No, Manager, Did you have any connection
with any of those modeling agencies? Ransom, no, Menager? What
(32:24):
did you do when you visited the modeling agencies in
Cape Town in February of two thousand and seven, Ransom,
I was requested to look for a PA for mister
Epstein Menager. What does that mean? Ransom? It means that
he told me he would pay me a certain amount
of money to find him a PA in South Africa? Manager,
what do you understand the initials PA to stand for Ransom?
(32:49):
Personal assistant manager? What are the job requirements of a
personal assistant Ransom to book flights type, do faxes? Basically,
a PA is or a CEO's right hand man of
you know, companies, anything business wise. They do everything really
for that person. Manager, when did Jeffrey ask you to
(33:09):
find him a PA while in South Africa? Ransom? Before
I went Menager, did you agree to do that? Ransom? Yes? Manager,
And you did go to the modeling agencies, Ransom? I
told Jeffrey I did, but actually I went to a
couple and then I just it wasn't right. My gut
instinct was, yeah, Menager. What happened when you went inside
(33:31):
the modeling agency in Cape Town, Ransom? I was humiliated.
I was completely embarrassed. I couldn't even ask them what
Jeffrey was wanting. I mean, it was so absolutely ridiculous
his request of me finding him a PA. Menager. So
what happened? Ransom? So I asked if they had any
girls that would want to travel, that they would be
(33:53):
put up in accommodation and they would be a PA.
And when I actually spoke to the modeling agencies, they
actually laughed at me because it was quite ridiculous that
a young twenty two year old was asking a modeling
agency for an eighteen year old PA for a multi
billionaire who had several already Menager. So you recall a
conversation where the person you were speaking to started laughing Ransom, yes, Menager.
(34:18):
What type of person were you describing that you were
looking for Ransom? The same specifications that Jeffrey told me.
She had to be eighteen, thin, very young looking and
pretty Menager? Anything else Ransom, well, bright and be able
to type Meninger. Did you go on a diet while
you were in South Africa? Ransom? I was forced to
(34:39):
go on a diet, Meninger, Tell me what you mean,
forced to go on a diet? Ransom. After that incident
on the island in it was December when Glane brought
me back to the main house after she she sent
a search party. She led a search party to find
me on the island and bring me back. Meninger. Glane
led a search party, Ransom, Yeah, yeah, she got everyone
(35:00):
together and they all went looking for me when I disappeared. Menager.
Who went looking for you Ransom redacted, redacted? Jeffrey, the
girls Golaine manager, which girls Ransom redacted and redacted? The
girl name redacted? Ransom. Did Jeffrey go searching for you? Ransom? Yes, Menager.
(35:20):
How do you know that Ransom? I was told Menager
about whom Ransom by redacted and the other girls. Menager
Where were you located, Ransom on the island? Menager? Where
on the island, Ransom, A corner of the island, Menager?
On the water? Ransom, No, it was quite a long
drop off. It was like a cliff type. I wasn't
(35:42):
able to jump to get in the water. Meninger, your
intent was to swim off the island, but you didn't
make it into the water, Ransom, No, because I would
have killed myself, so it wasn't safe, Menager. So who
located you on this corner of the island, Ransom? I
can't remember who got to me first. I remember, I
can't remember who found me first. Manager. Do you remember
(36:03):
anyone who found you? Ransom? Yes, I definitely found because
I didn't have enough time to find a different location
on the island so I could get off and swim
away from Jeffrey and Glane. Manager. Once they found you,
what happened, Ransom? I was brought back to the main house. Manager.
How were you brought back? Ransom the same way that
(36:23):
I got there? On the beach buggy black four by four? Not?
What are they quad things? McCauley quad bikes? Ransom quad bikes? Yeah? Manager,
did you bike back Ransom, Yes Manager, accompanied by some people.
Ransom I was accompanied back Yes Manager by whom Ransom
I can't remember specifically who it was. All right, folks,
(36:46):
we're gonna wrap this part up here, and then the
next episode we'll pick up where we left off. All
of the information that goes with this episode can be
found in the description box.
What's up everyone, and welcome back to the Epstein Chronicles.
This episode, we're gonna pick up where we left off
with this Sarah Ransom deposition. Menager who is redacted? Ransom.
She was an acquaintance that I met in New York? Manager,
Where did you meet her? Ransom? I think I met
her at a bar or something, Ransom? Manager? Was she
(00:21):
a friend of yours during this time period? Ransom? She
was an acquaintance. I would say friend is yeah, I
wouldn't say friend, I'd say acquaintance. Manager. So, on this
occasion where you met Elaine on the island and you
spoke to her about massage, did you ever have any
other sexual type interactions with her? McCauley. I didn't hear
the end of that. Did you say? Him? Manager repeats
(00:44):
it sexual type of interactions with her? Ransom with her
menager Glaine? Ransom, No, Menager. And do you recall if
she flew with you back on the plane, Ransom, I
can't remember. Manager. What's the next time you went to
the island, Ransom? Again, I don't remember specifically. I went
various several times during the durations, so I remember there
(01:06):
was a it was several times I can't remember the
next time I went to the island. I mean, it's
to this She's interrupted by manager. Was it before you
went back to South Africa to visit Ransom? Yes, Manager,
all the visits to the island were before that. McCauley objection, Ransom, Yes, Manager.
What's the next time you remember meeting Golaane? Ransom? I
(01:28):
met her at the office in New York? Manager. What's
the office, Ransom, Jeffrey's office the main office. Manager. Where
is that? Ransom? I don't remember the location. It's central.
It's got a courtyard, like when you walk in, there's
like a courtyard. Manager. What were you doing at Jeffrey's
office in New York? Ransom? We were preparing for my
(01:49):
college application. Jeffrey often wanted to see just how I
was doing, so I had regularly popins to see him
and Golaane. And Golane would often check how I was
doing and blah blah blah. Manager, what were you doing
to prepare for your college application? Ransom? I had to
write an essay? Manager, When did you Ransom? Also, I
(02:11):
had to do, like, you know, how to apply for
college applications. You've got your application forms and such so
it was more admin, Manager, and you were going to
Jeffrey's office to work on your forms? Ransom, Yes, and
to just say hi. I was well. I never went
on my own accord. I was either invited or told
to be there by either Glaine or Jeffrey. I also
(02:32):
went to the offices on a number of occasions for
a private legal matter. Manager. What's the private legal matter?
Gergis objection, I'm going to direct you to not answer
if it's unrelated to this case. Manager. Was there an
attorney president? Ransom? Yes? Manager. What was the name of
the attorney who was President? Ransom? Alan Dershowitz Manager. So
(02:54):
I was asking about the second time you met Alane.
It was at Jeffrey's office in New York. Ransom, Yes, Manager.
How did you come to be in Jeffrey's office in
New York where you met Glaine the second time? Ransom?
I was told to be there, Manager. And who told
you to be there? Ransom? I think it was Golaine. Manager.
How did Glaine tell you to be there? Ransom? I
(03:15):
can't remember if it was via telephone call. I can't
remember the exact communication that she used, but I was
told to regularly be there when they wanted me there
and just grabbed a taxi and arrived at the office. Manager, well,
asking you about the second time. So you met her
on the island and the next thing you know, you
have communication from her in New York. Ransom, Well, she
(03:38):
was always with Jeffrey in his office. So it's like, okay,
let me just explain it a bit. So you go
to an office and you see Jeffrey's office there and
Glane Glaine was always at Jeffrey's office, so I think
she had her own office there. So when you walk
in and you've met people before, you kind of say
hi to everyone. You know, you have a little chit chat.
(04:00):
Do you understand? You don't you don't you know? I
chatted with Glaine. I chatted with Jeffrey. It was a
super busy office. I can't remember specifically what was said.
It was just a check in kind of manager. So
you were going there to work on your college application
and you happen to see Golaine in the office's mcaulay objection. Ransom,
(04:21):
she you know, she participated in the you know a lot.
She was interested in me. I was, you know, she
had interacted with me menager, I know, I'm trying to
understand when you did this. When was it, Ransom, It
was the second time, the first time I went to
the office, the first time you went to the office,
the second time you met Colaine Ransom, yes, Menager. And
(04:47):
when was it relative to the first time that you
met Colaine Ransom? I can't remember if it was a
couple of weeks later. I don't remember the exact timeframe
of how many days or weeks there was between the
first trip and then when I went into the office. Manager,
But you recall going into the office to work on
your college application. McAuley objection, Ransom, Yes, well, I went
(05:09):
in a number of times to the office, so like
we regularly had to report to Jeffrey in the office.
It was a we were called all the time there, Menager.
What do you mean you had to report there, Ransom, Well,
Jeffrey liked to check in with all of us. Manager.
How was it communicated to you that you needed to
report to the office, Ransom, Jeffrey. I was just told
(05:33):
to be there. I had to be there, Ransom. Manager.
Who told you that? Ransom, Jeffrey and Golaine Manager, anyone else?
Ransom redacted redacted, and redacted. Manager. How did they communicate
to you Ransom by telephone call? Manager to your cell phone?
Ransom and BlackBerry which they provided me. Manager, So you
(05:56):
did not have a BlackBerry before you met Jeffrey Ransom? No, Manager,
Then you got a BlackBerry when you were Ransom interrupts her.
That's correct, Then Manager interrupts her. Acquainted with them? And
what happened with the phone you had before Ransom? It
got lost through translation. I have moved several times through
the years, so Manager, So you got messages or phone
(06:17):
calls Ransom, BBMS phone calls, text messages, all the emails
that they have sent me, I think you guys have.
There wasn't a lot of email correspondence. The majority of
it was done by phone call. Manager. Did you have
any emails with Glaine? Ransom? No, No email correspondence with Glaine? Manager.
Did you have her phone number? Ransom? I did at
(06:40):
the time. Yeah. Manager, Do you remember what it was? Ransom? No? Menager?
Do you remember what your number was? Ransom? No. Gurgis objection,
asked an answered Menager, tell me about any conversations you
have with Glaine that involved fit Gurgis objection. Beforem Ransom.
I can't remember this specific conversation. There were many conversations.
(07:03):
I was just applying, doing an application form and they
were trying to get me in they yeah. I can't
remember the exact I think Elaine also knew people there,
so they were basically trying to get me into fit Menager. Well,
tell me what you recall Golaine saying versus they, Ransom.
I can't remember specifically the conversation, so I would not
(07:24):
like to speculate, but I will give you the overall
conversation and what it was regarding as far as my
fit application, But I cannot remember the specific content or
the specific words used. But it was surrounding my fit
application and an essay I had to write, and they
both proof read my fit application as well. Menager. And
(07:46):
did they both read your essay? Ransom? Yes they did, Menager.
When did you write that essay? Ransom? I can't remember, Menager,
before you went to South Africa? Ransom? Yes, Menager. And
do you know what the application deadline was? Ransom? I
don't know. I don't I can't remember. Manager. When did
(08:08):
you meet Alan Dershowitz Ransom, I don't remember the specific
date it was a few months after I had been
here in New York. Manager. Was it after you had
gone to the island? Ransom? Yes? Manager. Do you know
what time of year Ransom, I mean I think it
was before winter. Manager. Well you were here in the fall, Ransom. Yeah, Manager,
(08:29):
and you left in the winter. Ransom. Yeah, I left
in May. Manager. So did you meet him before you
went to South Africa? Ransom? Yes. Manager. Well, let's be clear,
you were here until you went to South Africa, and
you left for a while, and then you came back
right Ransom. Mm hmm. Manager. And how long were you
(08:50):
gone for Ransom? I think about three weeks? Yeah, about
three weeks. Manager. So you met him before you went
to South Africa? Ransom, yes. Manager, And tell me about
when you met Allan Ransom. I first met Alan at
the offices Menager, and tell me what happened, Ransom. I
can't really tell you what happened because it's about a
legal matter. Manager. Was he your lawyer? Ransom? He was
(09:14):
going to be assigned to me to be my lawyer. Manager,
assigned to be your lawyer, Ransom through Jeffrey's instruction. Manager, okay,
was he your lawyer? McAuley objection asked. An answered, men,
I don't know if there's privilege, Gurgis, there's a privilege,
whether he was retained or not. Right. I mean, if
you're at a cocktail party and you speak to a lawyer,
(09:35):
you know that conversation is privileged. So Manager, well, I
don't actually, Gurgis, You're free to research it. Manager, I
will ask questions then to try to establish whether or
not there is a good faith basis. Manager, did you
approach Alan Dershowitz for the purpose of seeking legal advice? Ransom?
I was introduced to Alan manager by whom Ransom Jeffrey
(09:58):
Epstein on what day? Ransom? I don't recall what day, Manager,
Was it related to some event that had occurred just
before that? Ransom, Yes, that's correct, Menager, were you in
touch with any law enforcement authorities? Ransom? No, Menager, huh, Ransom, No. Manager.
Was Jeffrey in the room when you were speaking with
(10:19):
Alan Dershowitz? Ransom, yes. Manager. Did Jeffrey Epstein ever overhear
your conversation with Alan Dershowitz? Ransom, yes, Manager, What did
you talk about with Alan Dershowitz? Gurgis objection. Ransom begins
to answer, but Gergis objects again, I direct the witness,
not the answer. Manager. A third party was in the room.
(10:40):
You've heard that, Council, and you know that means that
that's a waiver. McCauley. No, I mean they would have
been involved. We don't know what the situation is. They
could have been involved together. There could be a number
of reasons why Jeffrey had some sort of common interest
with her with that manager. Did you sign a common
interest agreement with Jeffrey? Gurgis objection, Do not answer, Menager,
(11:03):
whether she had a common interest agreement with Jeffrey. You're
instructing her or not to answer. Is that right, counsel Gurgis?
Do you have real time in front of you, Council Menager,
I don't, Gergis, you don't. You can borrow mine, Menager,
I don't want it, thank you, Gergis, Okay, Menager? Anyone
else in the room when you spoke with mister Dershowitz, Ransom, No, Menager,
(11:26):
describe mister Dershowitz for me. Ransom. He old age, white,
pasty skin, not very attractive, wears glasses, A bit of
an ugly man, really, Meninger, did he have any facial hair, Ransom.
I can't recall at the time, No, Meninger mustache Ransom.
I can't remember, Menager beard Ransom. I can't remember Menainger.
(11:47):
You can't remember if he had a mustache or a beard.
Gurgis objection, asked An answered McAuley objection, Ransom. I don't
recall seeing a massage, sorry, a mustache on Alan Dershowitz.
I don't recall a massive amount of facial hair. I
recall Alan Dershowitz. Whether he had a subtle amount, I'm
not sure. Yeah, it's he didn't have a beard. I
(12:08):
don't think Meninger. All right, did you sign an AFFI
David that you submitted in this case? Ransom? Yes, Menager.
Did you make the allegation in your declaration that you
had a sexual relationship with Alan Dershowitz, Ransom, Yes, I
absolutely did. Meninger. When did you have sex with Alan
Dershowitz Ransom. I can't remember the exact time, but it
(12:30):
was in Jeffrey Epstein's New York apartment. Manager, we're in
the apartment, Ransom. It was in a bathroom. I can't remember, Menager.
Was it before or after you had this conversation that
you won't describe Ransom. It was after Menager. So do
you recall what month that was before you went to
South Africa or after you went to South Africa? Ransom,
(12:53):
I can't remember, Menainger. How long did you speak to
Alan Dershowitz during your first meeting with them? Ransom until
I was finished explaining what my legal matter was? Manager?
Did he believe you to be did he believe that
he was your lawyer during that conversation? Gurgis objection, McAuley objection, Pottinger,
please Pagliuca. All right, guys, you know, let's just do
(13:14):
the deposition here without the chorus over there, Gurgis, and
without the speeches as well. We agree, let's carry on
without asking ridiculous questions about what other people's mental state was.
I think that's a good idea. Let's carry on, counsel, Menager.
Did you ever sign a fear agreement with Alan Dershowitz Ransom? No, Manager.
(13:35):
Did you ever appear in court with Alan Dershowitz, Ransom, No, Menager?
Did you ever appear in court yourself? Ransom? No? Men
Did you ever have any contact with any law enforcement
officers while you were in New York Ransom, No, Menager,
any police Ransom, No, Menager. After you left that meeting
with Alan Dershowitz, when did you see him next? Ransom?
(13:57):
I can't remember. I think it was at dinner. There
was a dinner, yeah, Menager. And do you know whether
the dinner was before or after you went to South Africa? Ransom.
I can't remember the specific time period, so I don't
remember if it was before or if it was after,
but it was to this she's interrupted by Menager. Where
was the dinner, Ransom? It was in a restaurant in
(14:19):
New York, Menager. What restaurant Ransom, I can't remember, Menager.
Who else was there? Ransom? I remember Alan Jeffrey myself.
I can't remember if others, if there were other people there, Menager.
What type of restaurant was it? Ransom? It was a
nice restaurant. Manager. Do you remember the type of cuisine? Ransom, No, Menager.
(14:42):
What do you remember discussing at dinner? Ransom the legal
matter that I had. Manager. Did you consider him to
be your lawyer at that dinner? Ransom? Yes, I did, Menager.
What's the next time you saw Alan Dershowitz. Ransom at
Jeffrey Epstein's New York mansion. Menager, When was that, Ransom?
After the second time I had met Alan Meninger? Had
(15:03):
you been to South Africa? Ransom? I can't remember, Menainger.
Tell me what happened during that encounter, Ransom. I walked
in the room. I walked in the house. Jeffrey and
Redacted and Alan were there, Menainger, what happened after you
walked into the house, Ransom. It was really strange because
Redacted didn't like me, and so when I arrived, we
(15:24):
had I think, I can't remember if I had like
water or whatever. Redacted took me upstairs. I remember there
was a room. I didn't quite understand what was going
on at the time. I knew obviously something was going
on because I've never met Redacted socially. So Redacted started
undressing me in the room. She started undressing me by
the bed, and we got on the bed. I kind
(15:47):
of knew what was going on from that. The girls
were often forced to have sex with each other for
Jeffrey's pleasure, so it was just another occasion, I guess.
Jeffrey then walked in the room. He started masturbating under
his clothes. He put his hand in his trousers. A
few minutes later, Alan walked in the room, he started undressing.
He got on the bed with redacted at myself, and
(16:08):
we basically had a three way sexual interaction. Menager. Was
Alan fully clothed? Ransom daring when at what was specific?
He walked in with clothes, Menager, and he got fully undressed? Ransom? Yes? Manager,
So you saw his entire naked body? Ransom? Yes, Menager.
Did you notice anything specific about his body? Ransom? Not
(16:28):
that I recall. I mean, yeah, not that I can't
really remember. It was quite a It was a it
wasn't a pleasant experience, Menager. What did you do with Alan? Ransom?
I gave him moral sex and masturbated him, Menager. Anything else? Ransom?
He did the same with redacted. He performed the same
on me, Menager. Did he ejaculate? Ransom? He did, yeah, Menager,
(16:52):
in your mouth? Ransom? No, Menager. Did you have intercourse
with him? Ransom? No? Not penetration, no, Menager. Did you
see him ejaculate more than once? Ransom? No? I didn't
see him ejaculate more than once, Menager. You didn't notice
any scars? Mcauleay objection, Ransom I don't recall specific markings
on every man I've been with body, So it's not
(17:14):
something I wasn't ravishing Alan's body. I was trying to
close my eyes and just get it done so I
could go home and watch TV. Really, so I really
wasn't aware. I don't really like kind of go whoo
his body. I don't recall his body at all, like
I don't make a mental note of every man's body
I've slept with, Menager other than Jeffrey Is. At the
(17:35):
first time you had sex with another man in his
home or on his property? Ransom? Sorry, can you just
repeat the question, Gurgis or rephrase it? Ransom. I'll just
read it, Gurgis if you understand it. Ransom. Yeah, he
was the only person Alan Dershowitz. Menager. Did you have
sex with him more than once? Ransom? No, Menager at
(17:57):
the occasion you just described. Did he have an erection? Ransom?
It was, it was, It wasn't particularly hard. It was
pretty disappointing, Menainger. And where did he ejaculate? Ransom? I
had given him oral sex, and well he ejaculated. He ejaculated.
I mean, there's only so many places a man can ejaculate.
(18:17):
He didn't ejaculate on me. He didn't ejaculate my mouth.
I gave him moral and I masturbated him and finished
them off. He ejaculated over himself me just there wasn't
a lot of ejaculation. I don't remember a lot of sperm.
I didn't see massive amounts of semen. But I just
remember him ejaculating. But it wasn't in my mouth, Menager.
And in terms of time frame, the best you can
(18:39):
say is that it was after you had been to
the island a few times, Ransom. That's correct, Menainger. And
you don't remember if it was before or after you
went to South Africa, Ransom, I can't remember specifically, no Menager.
Did you see Alan Dershowitz again after that occasion? Ransom, no, Menager.
(19:00):
So you saw him at the office, you say you
saw him at dinner, and you say you saw him
one time in the bedroom at Jeffrey's house, Ransom, that's correct, Menager.
It's one o'clock. I think we should take a small
lunch break. How anyone can even talk about eating lunch
after we just heard about Alan gross As Dershowitz ejaculating
is beyond me. But here we are, so we're gonna
(19:21):
take a break as well. That way we can all
go throw up, and then we'll pick up where we
left off in the next episode. All of the information
that goes with this episode can be found in the
description box. What's up, everyone, and welcome back to the
Epstein Chronicles. In this episode, we're gonna pick up where
we left off with a Sarah Ransom deposition, and in
(19:43):
that last episode we left off with Sarah Ransom talking
about Alan Dershowitz. So let's get back to it. Gergiz Council,
before you commence with your questioning, I think there's one
issue from this morning that the witness wants to correct
herself on, so just let her do that now, Ransom.
I said earlier that I would just like to correct
(20:04):
that my lawyers are paying for they are covering my
hotel expenses. Meninger, thank you for the clarification, Ransom, and
she's cut off by mister Gergis. Go ahead, Ransom and
my flight Menager, thank you. Now back to the questioning Menager,
going back to your first conversation with Alan Dershowitz. At
(20:24):
any point in that conversation had mister Dershowitz agreed to
act as your lawyer. Ransom, Yes, Menager. Did he do
anything in terms of contacting anyone on your behalf? Gurgis objection,
Do not answer, Menager. What was the specific legal matter
that you were seeking representation for? McCauley objection. Gurgis objection,
(20:45):
Do not answer, Menager. What did you understand the purpose
of Jeffrey Epstein being in that room for during that conversation? Ransom?
Jeffrey was there to support me, and Jeffrey was looking
after me. Menager. When you engaged in sexual conduct with
Alan Dershowitz, did you see any evidence on his body
of his surgical procedure? Ransom. I don't recall seeing anything.
(21:09):
I can't remember, Menager. Did you see any bandages? Ransom?
I can't remember. Menager. Did you see him bleed through
his penis? Ransom? Not that I recall, Menager. Do you
recall seeing mister Dershowitz bleed through his penis? Ms McCauley objection,
asked and answered, Ransom, not that I recall, Menager. When
(21:30):
you were on the island sometimes less than ten times,
you think, did you ever use any drugs? Ransom? No, Menager,
did you use cocaine Ransom, no Menager. Did you ever
get thrown off the island for using cocaine? Ransom? No, Menager.
Did you drink alcohol? Ransom? No, Menager. None. Ransom during
on the island, whenever I was around Jeffrey, Absolutely not, Menager.
(21:54):
Other than going to the island, did you travel anywhere
else with Jeffrey Ransom? No Menager. Did you ever travel
anywhere with Glenn Maxwell Ransom? No Menager. Did you ever
fly on an airplane with Glenn Maxwell Ransom? I don't remember, Menainger.
You don't remember any time you flew on a plane
with Glen Maxwell Ransom? No, I don't remember. There were
(22:17):
always many people on the plane, Meninger. When you refer
to the plane, you're referring to a private plane, Ransom,
Jeffreys plane, yes, Menainger. Did you travel on more than
one plane of Jeffries Ransom? Not that I know. I
don't remember. I don't remember, Menager. Can you visualize in
your head any other layout of a different type of
(22:39):
plane than the one you drew in Defendants Exhibit number one? Ransom? No, Menager.
Why did you go to South Africa in early two
thousand and seven. Ransom to visit my family Menainger And
which family members did you visit? Ransom my father and
my stepmother, Meninger, anyone else? Ransom, no Mener Any siblings, Ransom,
(23:01):
My younger brother and my sister lived with my parents.
My dad and my stepmom and their two younger children. Menager.
Did you see any school friends there? Ransom? No? Menager?
Who paid for your plane ticket to go to South Africa? Ransom?
Jeffrey did? Menager? How did that come about? Ransom? I
wanted to see my family, and he funded the plane
(23:23):
ticket because he was funding everything else at that time. Menager?
What else was he funding at that time? Ransom? Accommodation, travel,
taxis food? My prescription that I had to pay for
for the prescription that prescription drugs? Menager? Had you taken
any prescriptions for mental health disorders before October two thousand
(23:43):
and six? Ransom? No, Menager? Have you taken any since
May of two thousand and seven? Ransom? Yes, I have? Menager?
Which ones? Ransom? Paroxetine? Menager? Anything else? McAuley, I'm going
to object there's no timeframe on this. You're talking about
one year, all the years from two thousand and seven
(24:04):
to twenty fifteen, which I would say is inappropriate for
a non party witness to talk about her. If you're
talking generally about prescriptions, then this whole next section is
completely redacted. The next section completely redacted, next section completely redacted.
Back to Ransom, I had been prescribed were incorrect, Menager?
(24:25):
Those are the ones you mentioned earlier in your testimony, Ransom. Yeah,
I had to stop and change medication because I was
first started on lithium, and the lithium made me put
on weight at quite a rapid rate. So I was
put on so many different types of medication because I
didn't Not everyone agrees with you. Weight was a massive
issue for Glen and Jeffrey, So the lithium just didn't
(24:47):
work for me. I mean I put on weight quite quickly. Menager.
What did Glen Maxwell say to you about weight? Ransom? Well,
what did she not say? She bullied me massively about
my weight, Menager? What did she say? Ransom? I was
told that I would lose Jeffrey's financing if I didn't
lose weight, and I would not they would not help
(25:07):
me get into fit, Menager, Who were you told that
by Ransom? Glaine and Jeffrey Menager in the same conversation, Ransom,
various conversations. Menager. Tell me your conversations with Golaine. When
did she say that to you, Ransom on the island
Menager before you went to South Africa. Ransom, yes, Menager.
(25:29):
And was that in person? Ransom, yes, Menager. Who else
was present? Ransom redacted, redacted, redacted, and redacted, a girl
name redacted, and a girl name redacted. Sorry, I just
remembered a name, a girl name redacted, and a girl
named redacted. Manager. So they were all present when you
had a discussion with Golaine about your weight on the island. Ransom, yes, Menager.
(25:54):
And what did Glaine say to you about your weight
when you were on the island in front of all
those people, Ransom, You can't remember the specific conversation how
it went. We got into an argument about my weight,
quite a heated argument, Menager. What do you recall about
the argument, Ransom. I recall it got so heated that
I ran off and tried to swim off the island.
(26:14):
I wanted to get as far away from Jeffrey and
Golaane as possible Menager. Okay, and then what happened, Ransom.
I left the main house. I took there's like a
buggy thing. It was evening. I drove to a particular
spot on the island. It was so Jeffrey's Island is
quite rocky around the edges, so and it's not really
(26:34):
you can't just go into the water. It was quite
steep and well, I didn't really know how to swim anyway.
I didn't know how to escape, but I wanted to
at that precise moment get as far away from him
as possible. Menager. So you had a heated argument about
your weight with Golaane, Ransom Glaine and Jeffrey Menager. They
were both there. Ransom, yes, Menager, and do you remember
(26:58):
anything that was said during that argument? Ransom? It was
basically an ultimatum that I either lose weight or or
that's it. Ransom, sorry, can I sorry, I need to
get a headache tablet if you don't mind. Meninger go
off the record for a second. So they go off
the record real quick. They have some discussions that were
held off the record. Then they're back on. Meninger, go
(27:20):
back on, Menager. You were given an ultimatum to lose
weight or what Ransom, they wouldn't help me get into fit,
and that my time with Jeffrey would be over. It
would end. Meninger who said that, Ransom, Well, they both
they both said it in not so many words. I
can't remember the exact conversation. I remember it being heated.
(27:42):
I remember them giving me the ultimatum. I think a
few curse words were shared. I can't it was very heated.
I can't remember the exact words. Meninger was redacted there. Ransom, No,
I don't recall her being there, Menager. Were you taking
the medication that you talked about earlier during this time period? Ransom? Yes, Menager?
(28:03):
Had you put on weight since taking those medications? Ransom, yes,
I had. And I had also put on weight because
I wasn't allowed to smoke any cigarettes at all with
Jeffrey on the island or anywhere near Jeffrey. Jeffrey wasn't
allowed to know that we smoked, so I put on
also a lot of weight as well, in conjuncture with
the lithium. So yeah, Menager. How did the topic of
(28:26):
your weight come up? Ransom? Well, I wasn't as skinny
as the other girls, and Jeffrey liked his girls very thin? Menager?
Were you interested in modeling at that point in time? Ransom?
I was doing freelance modeling at the time, But I
mean I wasn't exactly going to be Kate Moss, and
the modeling agency thought I wasn't bateited enough for them either.
I would like to clarify that I wasn't actually fat.
(28:48):
I was a normal weight, by the way, just to
make that clear. I'm sixty four sixty five kilograms at
that time. Menager. What did you understand that Jeffrey and
galand wanted you to lose weight? Ransom? I was one
of the girls that Jeffrey has sexual encounters with regularly.
He liked his girl's thin. Menager. Did you ask Jeffrey
(29:09):
to help you become a model? Ransom? No. I wanted
to get a degree and an education, Menager. So you
were not attempting to become a model at this point
in time, Ransom. No, I wanted to get an education
as opposed to being a model me. Did you talk
to or redacted and redacted about becoming a model? Ransom? I,
(29:30):
as I was freelancing during that time, or trying to
get freelancing work. Jeffrey kept us on a little string
with his massage payments. So I wanted to earn a
separate income while I was doing my education to fund
my living expenses. So you know, I wanted to potentially
increase my jobs. But no, my job was not to
be a high fashion model. I wanted to get my degree,
(29:52):
get my education, and work in the fashion industry. Menager,
you had worked as a model during college earlier, correct, yes, manager,
and you saved up money from that job, correct Ransom, Yes, manager,
and you had used that money to fly to New
York at some point, correct Ransom. Yes, Manager, And what
(30:12):
you're saying now is you would also potentially do modeling
while you were studying in the future. Mister gergis objection.
That's not at all what she's saying, Ransom as in future,
as in would I do modeling now? Manager, No, I'll
rephrase the question, Ransom, please, Manager, let's take a break,
go off the record, and when you finish the salad,
(30:33):
we'll proceed. They get back on the record and manager
starts with the questions once again. At the time, you
were having a discussion with Jeffrey and Glen about your
weight when you were on the island, did you have
any intention of being a model at that time? Ransom,
I was a freelance model. I wanted to increase my
workload to help fund my living expenses, So it was
(30:54):
not my intention to be a full time model, because
I quite clearly applied to a college to get an
education that I was promised by Jeffrey Epstein. Menager. Between
January of two thousand and seven and today, have you
worked as a model? Ransom? No, Menager when you left
for South Africa? Did you have a ticket to return
to the US? Ransom At that time a return ticket
(31:17):
hadn't been booked by Jeffrey yet. Manager. You traveled to
South Africa to visit your family without a return ticket? Ransom, yes, Manager.
Did anyone travel with you to South Africa? Ransom no, Menager,
your mother was not in South Africa when you went
to South Africa on that occasion in two thousand and seven. Correct, Ransom, correct, Menager.
(31:40):
What did you do while you were in South Africa
in February of two thousand and seven? Ransom, spend time
with my family? Menager. Did you visit any modeling agencies? Ransom, Yes,
I did visit some modeling agencies. Menager. Which modeling agencies
did you visit? Ransom? I can't remember the exact names.
The modeling agencies were Online Street in Cape Town. I
(32:01):
visited several modeling agencies on Long Street and Bree Street
as well Bree Street and Longstreet and a few others
in central Cape Town, So I visited a few. Actually, Manager,
had you worked with any of those modeling agencies in
the past? Ransom? No, Manager, Did you have any connection
with any of those modeling agencies? Ransom, no, Menager? What
(32:24):
did you do when you visited the modeling agencies in
Cape Town in February of two thousand and seven, Ransom,
I was requested to look for a PA for mister
Epstein Menager. What does that mean? Ransom? It means that
he told me he would pay me a certain amount
of money to find him a PA in South Africa? Manager,
what do you understand the initials PA to stand for Ransom?
(32:49):
Personal assistant manager? What are the job requirements of a
personal assistant Ransom to book flights type, do faxes? Basically,
a PA is or a CEO's right hand man of
you know, companies, anything business wise. They do everything really
for that person. Manager, when did Jeffrey ask you to
(33:09):
find him a PA while in South Africa? Ransom? Before
I went Menager, did you agree to do that? Ransom? Yes? Manager,
And you did go to the modeling agencies, Ransom? I
told Jeffrey I did, but actually I went to a
couple and then I just it wasn't right. My gut
instinct was, yeah, Menager. What happened when you went inside
(33:31):
the modeling agency in Cape Town, Ransom? I was humiliated.
I was completely embarrassed. I couldn't even ask them what
Jeffrey was wanting. I mean, it was so absolutely ridiculous
his request of me finding him a PA. Menager. So
what happened? Ransom? So I asked if they had any
girls that would want to travel, that they would be
(33:53):
put up in accommodation and they would be a PA.
And when I actually spoke to the modeling agencies, they
actually laughed at me because it was quite ridiculous that
a young twenty two year old was asking a modeling
agency for an eighteen year old PA for a multi
billionaire who had several already Menager. So you recall a
conversation where the person you were speaking to started laughing Ransom, yes, Menager.
(34:18):
What type of person were you describing that you were
looking for Ransom? The same specifications that Jeffrey told me.
She had to be eighteen, thin, very young looking and
pretty Menager? Anything else Ransom, well, bright and be able
to type Meninger. Did you go on a diet while
you were in South Africa? Ransom? I was forced to
(34:39):
go on a diet, Meninger, Tell me what you mean,
forced to go on a diet? Ransom. After that incident
on the island in it was December when Glane brought
me back to the main house after she she sent
a search party. She led a search party to find
me on the island and bring me back. Meninger. Glane
led a search party, Ransom, Yeah, yeah, she got everyone
(35:00):
together and they all went looking for me when I disappeared. Menager.
Who went looking for you Ransom redacted, redacted? Jeffrey, the
girls Golaine manager, which girls Ransom redacted and redacted? The
girl name redacted? Ransom. Did Jeffrey go searching for you? Ransom? Yes, Menager.
(35:20):
How do you know that Ransom? I was told Menager
about whom Ransom by redacted and the other girls. Menager
Where were you located, Ransom on the island? Menager? Where
on the island, Ransom, A corner of the island, Menager?
On the water? Ransom, No, it was quite a long
drop off. It was like a cliff type. I wasn't
(35:42):
able to jump to get in the water. Meninger, your
intent was to swim off the island, but you didn't
make it into the water, Ransom, No, because I would
have killed myself, so it wasn't safe, Menager. So who
located you on this corner of the island, Ransom? I
can't remember who got to me first. I remember, I
can't remember who found me first. Manager. Do you remember
(36:03):
anyone who found you? Ransom? Yes, I definitely found because
I didn't have enough time to find a different location
on the island so I could get off and swim
away from Jeffrey and Glane. Manager. Once they found you,
what happened, Ransom? I was brought back to the main house. Manager.
How were you brought back? Ransom the same way that
(36:23):
I got there? On the beach buggy black four by four? Not?
What are they quad things? McCauley quad bikes? Ransom quad bikes? Yeah? Manager,
did you bike back Ransom, Yes Manager, accompanied by some people.
Ransom I was accompanied back Yes Manager by whom Ransom
I can't remember specifically who it was. All right, folks,
(36:46):
we're gonna wrap this part up here, and then the
next episode we'll pick up where we left off. All
of the information that goes with this episode can be
found in the description box.
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